Why Slay The Spire 2 is Being Review Bombed — Transcript

Full transcript

1. 0:00So, let's talk about Slay the Spire 2
2. 0:03and the massive review bombing hitting
3. 0:05the game right now. I want to get
4. 0:07straight into what the heck is even
5. 0:10happening here, why it's happening, and
6. 0:12why there is such a massive divide
7. 0:16between the Chinese audience and the
8. 0:18West when it comes to this game. And why
9. 0:21does it seem like the Chinese player
10. 0:24base is being overly negative? I think
11. 0:26that long story short, spoiler alert,
12. 0:29whatever, comes down to two entirely
13. 0:32different gaming cultures. People need
14. 0:34to understand that before they write
15. 0:37this off as just more toxic gamers
16. 0:39complaining.
17. 0:42You guys are so gullible. So, the first
18. 0:45thing that we're going to look at is the
19. 0:47beta patch notes for version 104.0,
20. 0:51but to be clear, the update that
21. 0:53actually started this fire was 103.2,
22. 0:57and that was their first major update.
23. 0:59That was when we saw a ton of card
24. 1:01rebalances, and more importantly, the
25. 1:04rework of the Donut Maker boss. That
26. 1:07rework became a massive wall for certain
27. 1:10decks. Specifically, it heavily nerfed
28. 1:13decks built around infinite cycling,
29. 1:15[music]
30. 1:15and these are decks designed to just
31. 1:17continuously draw cards, play zero cost
32. 1:20cards, generate block, and deal damage.
33. 1:23Basically, in one big looping turn. Now,
34. 1:26a lot of people in the community were
35. 1:28waiting for Mega Crit to walk this back.
36. 1:31We were hoping that they would un-nerf
37. 1:33some of the cards, or nerf or rework the
38. 1:36Donut Maker. Instead, we got the 104
39. 1:39patch notes, and I'll go ahead and just
40. 1:41read here what they said about the Donut
41. 1:43Maker because, honestly, they didn't say
42. 1:46much. It reads, "We are currently
43. 1:48monitoring the Donut Maker and looking
44. 1:50at a combination of in-game feedback,
45. 1:52social media posts, and metrics. We want
46. 1:55to give players time to adjust a bit.
47. 1:57Otherwise, we'll be balancing around
48. 1:59knee-jerk reactions. Currently, from
49. 2:01looking at millions of runs, Donut
50. 2:04Maker's overall win rate {slash}
51. 2:06difficulty is in a good place, slightly
52. 2:09weaker than the other Act 3 bosses, both
53. 2:12in kill rate and damage dealt. However,
54. 2:14we do want to ensure that its mechanics
55. 2:17aren't too abrasive against certain play
56. 2:19styles, and and that's it. That's all
57. 2:22they said. Honestly, I'm as surprised as
58. 2:24you were. What does this actually mean?
59. 2:26It means that they are not touching
60. 2:28Donut Maker. They're basically telling
61. 2:30us that the spreadsheets look fine. So,
62. 2:32we're just going to let it fly. And
63. 2:33don't get me wrong, I understand the
64. 2:36concept of letting the meta simmer
65. 2:38before you step in, but I think that it
66. 2:40is fair to acknowledge when something is
67. 2:42just a little too punishing on a
68. 2:44specific deck archetype. And I know what
69. 2:47you're thinking, just don't play that
70. 2:49[music] specific deck archetype, but I
71. 2:51think the problem goes beyond just one
72. 2:53specific build here. The real issue is
73. 2:56that you don't know which Act 3 boss
74. 2:59you're fighting when you start a run.
75. 3:01And if the Donut Maker fundamentally
76. 3:03one-shots cycling decks, then the first
77. 3:06two acts that you do kind of feel like a
78. 3:09waste of time. By the time you reach Act
79. 3:113 and you see that you're against the
80. 3:13Donut Maker, the chances that you can
81. 3:15pivot your infinite cycling deck into a
82. 3:18standard deck with a bunch of cards in
83. 3:20it that could potentially counter that,
84. 3:22let's just say the odds don't look good.
85. 3:24>> Oh, no. What's this doing here? This
86. 3:27patty should be cremated. And let's say,
87. 3:29okay. So, once in a while you get to Act
88. 3:313 and your run is bricked. That's not
89. 3:34really a big deal, right? You just
90. 3:35restart and play again. It is a game
91. 3:37after all, but it actually matters a lot
92. 3:39more than you'd think. More on that
93. 3:41later. If you guys are enjoying this
94. 3:42video so far, give the video a like. It
95. 3:44helps the channel out a lot, and
96. 3:46subscribe if you want to see videos like
97. 3:48this in the future. Now, back to the
98. 3:49video. Moving on, we have this Kotaku
99. 3:52article talking about the exact same
100. 3:54thing. And what this article is trying
101. 3:56to say is pretty simple, Slay the Spire
102. 3:582 is pulling in hundreds of thousands of
103. 4:01concurrent players. And for how long
104. 4:02it's been out, you'd expect it to drop
105. 4:05off, but really, it's not. People are
106. 4:07still spamming this game. So, how on
107. 4:09earth is a game this successful suddenly
108. 4:12being hit with these mostly negative
109. 4:15reviews? And the answer is simple, it is
110. 4:17a coordinated review bomb. And it
111. 4:19started exactly on April 17th, the day
112. 4:23after Donut Maker was reworked and
113. 4:25infinite cycling decks were nerfed. The
114. 4:27primary grievance here is that Donut
115. 4:30Maker is ruining player agency. So,
116. 4:32after that patch went down and there was
117. 4:34the initial review bomb from the
118. 4:36Chinese, about a week later, the only
119. 4:39thing the devs have to say for
120. 4:40themselves is that the stats say you're
121. 4:42wrong and this boss is fair. But there
122. 4:44is obviously a problem with citing raw
123. 4:47stats and win rates like Mega Crit did
124. 4:50in their patch notes. Maybe they don't
125. 4:52realize it, or maybe they don't care, or
126. 4:54maybe they're just so confident that
127. 4:55what they're doing is correct. But
128. 4:57sometimes, perception is greater than
129. 5:00reality. Mega Crit is an amazing indie
130. 5:03studio, but they are not Riot Games.
131. 5:06They haven't quite grasped how to manage
132. 5:08data and community perception
133. 5:11simultaneously. I'm going to explain
134. 5:12really quick how League of Legends
135. 5:15handles their balance usually. Riot does
136. 5:17not look at a flat 55% win rate and
137. 5:21blanket nerf something. They dig deeper
138. 5:23into the stats. They look at things
139. 5:25like, are the people losing games just
140. 5:28new to their high skill champion? Do one
141. 5:31tricks have a 60% win rate while casuals
142. 5:34are at 40%? Riot even looks at ban
143. 5:36rates. If a champion is perceived as
144. 5:39incredibly broken and gets banned
145. 5:41>> [music]
146. 5:41>> every game, Riot will sometimes issue a
147. 5:44cosmetic nerf, a nerf that barely
148. 5:46affects the math and whether that
149. 5:48character has a higher or lower win
150. 5:50rate, but it makes the community feel
151. 5:52like the champion is weaker, so they
152. 5:54stop banning it. And maybe they're just
153. 5:56not revealing their power level with
154. 5:58that post, but it was so short and it
155. 6:00felt dismissive. If you're someone who
156. 6:03had your entire play style ruined, it
157. 6:05just seems like they're like, "The stats
158. 6:07are fine, dude. Get over it." I think it
159. 6:09would have been fine if this didn't
160. 6:11affect a play style that is so heavily
161. 6:14segmented to one population of people,
162. 6:17but it has. So, now we have a problem.
163. 6:19And that brings us to who exactly is
164. 6:22feeling [music] ignored. And that is
165. 6:23where I go undercover. I become an
166. 6:27American spy. Here we have the Steam
167. 6:29review page for Slay the Spire 2, and
168. 6:31you can see that there are some negative
169. 6:33reviews here, but if you look at the
170. 6:35English reviews right now, they are very
171. 6:38positive. But if you sort by language,
172. 6:40the Chinese reviews have a lot of
173. 6:43negatives. And no surprises here, it is
174. 6:45pretty much entirely focused on the
175. 6:47Donut Maker. That and some other cards
176. 6:49that were also nerfed, leading to
177. 6:51cycling decks being nerfed hard. And
178. 6:53with the power of automatically
179. 6:56translating, I can complete my mission
180. 6:58as a spy, and we can take a look at what
181. 7:00are they actually complaining about.
182. 7:02They are arguing that the patch ruined
183. 7:05the core appeal of the rogue-like genre.
184. 7:07And really, to understand why, [music]
185. 7:09we have to look at how oppressive this
186. 7:11boss actually is. Like, are they just
187. 7:13complaining, or is this something that
188. 7:15actually deletes cycling builds and
189. 7:18ruins the infinite loop? So, the Donut
190. 7:20Maker is a three-phase fight, and as
191. 7:22you'll see soon, uh it perfectly
192. 7:25counters the standard cycling deck.
193. 7:28Phase one forces people to exhaust their
194. 7:31cards. If you play a card during that
195. 7:33phase, it is gone for the rest of
196. 7:35combat. So, if you draw a key part of
197. 7:37your combo during this phase, you are
198. 7:39pretty much screwed. You either play
199. 7:41that card and brick your deck, or you
200. 7:43skip it and fall behind on tempo. And
201. 7:45the boss does so much damage that you
202. 7:47actually can't afford to not defend when
203. 7:50it's attacking. So, you can pretty much
204. 7:51say goodbye to any cards that are giving
205. 7:53you block if you draw them during this
206. 7:55phase. Phase two completely disables
207. 7:58card draw. And the thing people don't
208. 7:59get about this, and why it's so [music]
209. 8:01bad, is that when you're crafting a
210. 8:03deck, making sure you have enough card
211. 8:05draw in your deck is how you make your
212. 8:07deck consistent without making it a
213. 8:11super mini infinite cycling deck.
214. 8:13Because the more cards you have, the
215. 8:15less consistent your deck is going to
216. 8:17be. So, you spend the first two acts
217. 8:19making sure that your deck has enough
218. 8:21card draw and is is well-balanced,
219. 8:23dotting your eyes, crossing your T's,
220. 8:26suddenly, this boss has a phase where
221. 8:28that consistency doesn't matter. And God
222. 8:31forbid you draw every single card draw
223. 8:33you have during that turn, which usually
224. 8:35wouldn't be the worst thing, but during
225. 8:38that turn, they won't do anything. And
226. 8:39then phase three drains energy. Every
227. 8:42time you play a card, your energy goes
228. 8:44down by one. And if you have a zero cost
229. 8:46deck, you pretty much survive this phase
230. 8:48more or less because you'll just be
231. 8:49playing cards that cost zero. But for
232. 8:52decks that use one cost cards and two
233. 8:54cost cards, you're basically playing
234. 8:56like one or two cards that turn max. And
235. 8:59again, this is all when the boss is
236. 9:01doing 30 to 35 damage to you every turn.
237. 9:04Extremely punishing. And this boss is
238. 9:06definitely one of the hardest bosses, if
239. 9:09not just the hardest boss, period. Now,
240. 9:11this GamesRadar article brings up a very
241. 9:15important piece of the puzzle. Why are
242. 9:17the Chinese players taking it to Steam
243. 9:19reviews specifically? It's because of
244. 9:21the Great Chinese Firewall. They can't
245. 9:24easily jump onto Twitter or Discord to
246. 9:27yell at devs. The in-game feedback tool
247. 9:29kind of feels like they're talking into
248. 9:31the void anyway. So, it feels like the
249. 9:33Steam review page is the only place
250. 9:34where if they say something, maybe
251. 9:36something will happen. And naturally,
252. 9:39Western players are incredibly confused
253. 9:41[music] at why they are just review
254. 9:43bombing. We have this Reddit post asking
255. 9:45what the heck is even going on. And the
256. 9:48top comments are honestly largely
257. 9:50dismissive. I mean, not that I blame
258. 9:52them, it's just people are saying the
259. 9:53game is in early access and balance
260. 9:55changes are expected. You play at your
261. 9:58own peril. And I think comments like
262. 9:59this completely miss the point. You also
263. 10:02release your game at your own peril. I
264. 10:05think we are all tired of games
265. 10:06releasing in early access just as a
266. 10:09shield to do whatever they want. And I'm
267. 10:11not saying that Slay the Spire does
268. 10:12this. I'm just saying that the early
269. 10:14access tag is not a magic shield against
270. 10:18valid criticism. If a player invest
271. 10:20dozens of hours in your game and
272. 10:22suddenly feels like their time is being
273. 10:24[music] disrespected by a hard counter
274. 10:26mechanic that they added, by the way,
275. 10:29then I think that player has the right
276. 10:31to leave a negative review. That's just
277. 10:33a system functioning as intended. And
278. 10:35it's not even the first time that this
279. 10:37has happened in Slay the Spire 2. If we
280. 10:39look at this post from a Chinese player
281. 10:42from a month ago, back during the beta
282. 10:44update, they explain exactly what is
283. 10:47going on. They basically predicted this
284. 10:49and they warned Mega Crit that this
285. 10:51would happen. The Chinese community
286. 10:53actively values the infinite strategy
287. 10:55that we've been talking about. It's not
288. 10:57like that is just a strategy over there.
289. 11:00It's basically the entire point of them
290. 11:02playing the game at all. The play style
291. 11:04is kind of
292. 11:05>> [music]
293. 11:05>> actively struggling through the early
294. 11:07game and maybe even the mid game, making
295. 11:09your deck smaller and just barely
296. 11:11surviving as much as you can. And then
297. 11:13eventually, when you cross that barrier
298. 11:15and get the infinite loop, you are
299. 11:17rewarded by being able to smash the rest
300. 11:19of the game. And I think their statement
301. 11:21at the end of this kind of sums up the
302. 11:23mindset of Chinese players, at least the
303. 11:26ones that have a problem with this. They
304. 11:27say that if they knew that Slay the
305. 11:29Spire 2 was going to actively punish
306. 11:32that play style with a hard filter boss,
307. 11:35they wouldn't have bought the game at
308. 11:36all. Which means that every other type
309. 11:39of build Chinese players just don't even
310. 11:41really want to play it. And I know I'm
311. 11:43generalizing here. I'm just saying the
312. 11:45I'm referring to the ones that actually
313. 11:46have [music] a problem with this Door
314. 11:48Maker thing. It's pretty much, if I
315. 11:50can't infinite cycle, what is the point
316. 11:52of me playing this roguelike? And I'll
317. 11:53tell you this, that mindset alone is
318. 11:55baffling [music] to Western players.
319. 11:58They do not understand it because
320. 11:59they're not playing the game in the same
321. 12:01way. And the thing is, it gets even
322. 12:03deeper than that. This Reddit post here
323. 12:05gives us the super sauce of context on
324. 12:09what is actually happening here. And you
325. 12:11can put the pieces together yourself.
326. 12:12But in the Chinese community, if you
327. 12:15aren't playing on Ascension 10, your
328. 12:17opinion basically doesn't matter. They
329. 12:19value high-level challenge and more
330. 12:22importantly, they value stability. They
331. 12:25value consistency. We're talking about
332. 12:27players who grind out 500 win streaks on
333. 12:31max Ascension. That is their social
334. 12:33credit. That is how you prove in the
335. 12:35Chinese community that you are a good
336. 12:37player. And how do you get these massive
337. 12:40win streaks in a heavily RNG-dependent
338. 12:43roguelike? You build infinites.
339. 12:45Infinites remove the RNG of bad card
340. 12:48draw. And here is where it all clicks
341. 12:50together. The highly influential content
342. 12:52creators in China, they're the ones that
343. 12:54hold these win streaks. Their
344. 12:55communities expect them to have these
345. 12:58win streaks. And when Mega Crit
346. 13:00announces a boss that specifically puts
347. 13:02a lot of RNG into these infinite decks
348. 13:05and kind of makes it impossible to
349. 13:07guarantee these win streaks, those
350. 13:09creators complained. And through their
351. 13:11complaints, they rallied the entire
352. 13:13Chinese player base to review bomb the
353. 13:15game. And I doubt they did it on
354. 13:17purpose. It's just the community looks
355. 13:19up to these people and one day hope that
356. 13:21they can be like them. So when Mega Crit
357. 13:24does something that basically means that
358. 13:26no one else can achieve that, everyone
359. 13:28feels like their purpose for playing the
360. 13:30game is just gone. And on top of that,
361. 13:32they feel like the developers are just
362. 13:33forcing some clever boss design onto us.
363. 13:37Because objectively, that boss is just
364. 13:39weird and frustrating to play against. I
365. 13:41feel like I'm just praying that the next
366. 13:43hand isn't countered by that phase
367. 13:46because it feels really bad to draw card
368. 13:47draw on the anti-card draw phase. And it
369. 13:50feels really bad to draw card you need
370. 13:53for the rest of the game on the exhaust
371. 13:55phase. I get it. So what is the takeaway
372. 13:57here? No developer should ever have to
373. 14:01capitulate to community bullying,
374. 14:03basically. But at the same time, I think
375. 14:05developers need to understand when a
376. 14:07mechanic that they newly introduced
377. 14:10completely alienates a massive,
378. 14:13dedicated portion of their player base.
379. 14:15I mean, these are people trying to push
380. 14:17the game to [music] its absolute limits.
381. 14:19Which, if that's not what a roguelike is
382. 14:21for, what is? But honestly, I don't
383. 14:23think that Mega Crit intended to [music]
384. 14:26absolutely destroy cycling builds. But
385. 14:28the fact remains that if you spend
386. 14:30[music] two acts heavily investing into
387. 14:33a specific, fun build, you shouldn't be
388. 14:36walled off entirely from beating the run
389. 14:39as soon as you get to Act 3 and you see
390. 14:40that you're against a certain boss. I
391. 14:42think every type of build should have a
392. 14:44chance against every type of boss with
393. 14:46some variations. And I think the clean
394. 14:48solution here is really simple, too.
395. 14:50Just give us more info on what bosses we
396. 14:54are fighting at the very start of the
397. 14:55run or much earlier in the run. And if
398. 14:58we see that we have a Door Maker for Act
399. 15:003, then the player has a lot more agency
400. 15:02to switch up how they're building in
401. 15:04order to defeat that boss. At that
402. 15:06point, if you still play an infinite
403. 15:08deck into Door Maker, that's kind of
404. 15:10your fault and that's a skill diff. You
405. 15:12can't really complain about that and
406. 15:14you're not going to feel cheated by RNG.
407. 15:16So what do you guys think? Are the
408. 15:17Chinese players completely justified?
409. 15:19Are they kind of justified? Or is the
410. 15:21Western
411. 15:27Let me know in the comments. I am
412. 15:29curious to see where you guys land on
413. 15:30this one. And if you enjoy content like
414. 15:32this, give the video a like. It helps
415. 15:34out the channel a ton. And as always, I
416. 15:36will see you guys next time.
417. 15:39>> [music]