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"Why Does Nobody See My Content?" | 1 Hour of Alex Hormozi — Transcript

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0:00You mentioned that it's something like
0:0120 30% of the businesses coming to you,
0:03they make content in some way. Yeah.
0:05>> Do you think that those businesses
0:08because a lot of people talk about
0:09creator creator economy? Are they better
0:11than those that don't grow and have con
0:13as part of their workflow?
0:14>> Really interesting question. Um I think
0:16it's a it's a double-edged sword.
0:18>> So what makes them great also makes them
0:20risky. So they will typically have very
0:23low cost to acquire customers because
0:24it's organic. And so it's just
0:27>> some Yeah, it's some star or whatever.
0:28or I'll call it a star, right? Um who's
0:30who's good on camera, good in whatever
0:32format they they advertise in. Um so
0:34they acquire customers cheaply. Uh the
0:36other pro is that typically if someone
0:38starts with an organic audience, they
0:41really care about product because being
0:43a creator like your media is a product
0:45in a way and so they have the right
0:46perspective on like this has to be
0:48really good or I'm going to lose my
0:50reputation because the whole an organic
0:51brand is built off reputation. And so I
0:54think they're more obsessive about
0:55product which I think that's a huge
0:57plus. the the downsides for the business
0:59obviously is that they have massive
1:00keyman risk. So now I think where where
1:02you get really smart about it is if you
1:05can gain enough influence where you can
1:06develop an affiliate network um of
1:09businesses like somebody who's done
1:10really well is um Derek from uh Derek
1:12more plates more dates uh the fitness
1:15guy um he has I think an affiliate base
1:18of four or 5,000 affiliates that promote
1:20his fitness products and so he's become
1:22such an authority that people are
1:24willing to say well I don't want to
1:25remake what he's made I'll just promote
1:27his stuff and I think he has a good you
1:28know a good program there and so he's
1:30he's paying down his keyman risk by
1:32getting larger and larger percentage of
1:34the business. And so I think that the
1:35way to really scale an organic creator
1:40business is you launch it with the
1:42personal brand
1:43>> and then over time you backfill with
1:46other faces that you have to approve and
1:48that's the key part. You have to approve
1:50that are on brand with your values and
1:52your message and are authentic to the
1:53product that you have and are attracting
1:55the audiences that you want to go after.
1:57And then they over time become bigger
1:59than you and you kind of like Homer
2:01Simpson into the into the bushes.
2:03>> Oh yeah. You recede.
2:04>> Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Exactly. And
2:05you recede into the bushes until
2:06eventually people associate you with the
2:09brand but the brand outgrows you.
2:10>> It's fascinating because well two
2:12questions immediately come to mind. The
2:13first is on key man this is what you and
2:15Ila have. Are you thinking about
2:16bringing a roster of folks to slowly
2:18took for the faces of even the content
2:20side of your business?
2:21>> So two answers. First, we're not
2:24planning on selling acquisition and on
2:26any time price and that's useful. Um,
2:29and so I like I see Elon as keyman to
2:32SpaceX and Tesla.
2:33>> Yeah.
2:34>> And so what if you have the desire to
2:35exit a business then keyman risk becomes
2:37a problem. If you want to go public or
2:39you want to hold,
2:40>> it's really who cares?
2:42>> And so it's kind of a who cares issue.
2:44Um, that being said, the second answer
2:46is uh yes because I do like having fewer
2:49single points of failure in general. So
2:51despite the fact that I don't think we
2:52necessarily need it, I still like to
2:54build businesses that way in general and
2:56we have plans for what we're going to do
2:57over the next 24 months and beyond to
2:59build out ACQ's brand.
3:00>> Makes sense. Yeah. The second question I
3:02had related to that was when I look at
3:04creation space who've successfully
3:05executed on this is actually very
3:07minimal.
3:08>> Oh yeah, I can tell you one who I look
3:09at
3:09>> who
3:10>> Dave Ramsey. So
3:12>> that's right. He's brought in George.
3:13He's brought in other people under him.
3:14>> He's got Rachel who's his daughter, but
3:15like he's got Rachel. Um he's got John.
3:19Um he's got um group. Yeah, he's got
3:22nine I think channels for example just
3:24on YouTube that are associated with the
3:26primary. And what's interesting is that
3:28they basically run the same playbook.
3:31>> Um it's daily call-in show and clips and
3:35full episodes
3:36>> basically are are the channel. And so
3:38they clip each episode into like four or
3:41five 10 minute clips. Uh and they put
3:44each of those out. So that's like that
3:45gives them tons of good like mid-length
3:48clips. They get the one full episodes
3:50and then short clips get taken and
3:52become shorts. I study Ramsay a lot.
3:55>> Um one because I like Dave, but secondly
3:58because the amount of creators that get
4:00quote creator burnout
4:02>> is really high.
4:04>> Yeah.
4:04>> Um or we're talking like Shelby Church,
4:06right? She's kind of shifted to I would
4:09say a sustainable uh content model,
4:12right? But it's it doesn't really
4:14acquire new viewership anymore. Like you
4:16only care about a vlog if you care about
4:17the person.
4:18>> Yeah. It's you're maintaining or some
4:19creator OG on YouTube now they shift to
4:21a podcast,
4:22>> right? And it's because it's a quote
4:24easier format, but it doesn't really
4:24grow the audience. It just kind of like
4:26maintains the audience that you have.
4:27And again, to be clear, nothing wrong
4:29with that.
4:29>> Totally.
4:29>> But I look at somebody like Dave and I
4:32think he's been making content for 40
4:34years.
4:35>> Like there's something to be learned
4:36from. I sell online programs. Um, US
4:42>> tax free
4:42>> USD. I actually have a tax incentives.
4:45>> There you go.
4:46>> Um, so I sell online fitness programs
4:49for SP Spanish speaking customers.
4:51>> Uh, I've been doing around $300,000 a
4:53year. I've been on that threshold since
4:57the pandemic.
4:58>> Okay. Um, I can generate viral content
5:02and engaging content, but I still don't
5:04have like a clear framework on turning
5:07those eyes into sales. I do get
5:12messaging and I do get sales from the
5:14messages, but I just don't have like a
5:17clear framework to grow more
5:20organically. I make more sales
5:23organically.
5:24>> Do you use a chatfunnel?
5:26>> Uh, what
5:27>> do you use? Many chat or what do you
5:28>> I I actually use ManyHat for lead
5:30generation
5:31>> and I also we retarget um I think my ad
5:36manager he doesn't uh push to cold
5:39audience. I've been kind of like
5:40>> So you said you make viral content
5:42though, right?
5:42>> Yeah.
5:43>> Okay. So you make viral content, you
5:44make fitness content, you sell content,
5:45you sell um personal online fitness to
5:48to Spanish speakers. Okay. So why are
5:50you running ads if you're making viral
5:51content?
5:52>> Well, because they're not converting.
5:55So, I'm trying to because I know I know
5:57what can go viral, but I don't know how
6:00to turn that viral into conversion.
6:03>> Yeah. Do you have a CTA inside of the
6:04viral content to like comment to get a
6:06thing?
6:07>> Yes, in some of them. Yeah. Okay. Not in
6:09all.
6:09>> Do you get people to comment to get a
6:10thing?
6:11>> Yeah.
6:11>> Okay. When they comment to get the
6:13thing, do you have a sorting question?
6:15>> Uh,
6:15>> are you here for the free thing or do
6:16you want help?
6:18>> Well, it usually is free freebies. So,
6:20>> right. Do you want the free thing or do
6:22you want lasting results?
6:23>> Okay. I was that a question?
6:26>> No, I'm saying that's what you should
6:27ask them.
6:28>> Oh,
6:29>> so they'll comment.
6:30>> It's a low. So I'm sorry.
6:31>> The first question. You're good. They'll
6:32comment. The first question that they'll
6:34ask is, "Hey, you here for the free
6:35thing or do you want lasting results?"
6:36Every like not everyone, but many people
6:38say like, "I want help or I want lasting
6:39results."
6:40>> So I pushed them to my landing page and
6:41it's a so
6:47it's a low ticket product. It's been a
6:49low ticket product for quite a bit.
6:52Seven years I've been running it.
6:53>> Yeah.
6:54>> And
6:54>> do you want to make more money?
6:55>> Huh?
6:55>> Do you want to make more money?
6:56>> I do.
6:57>> Okay. Do you want to call those people
6:58that bought the thing and offer them a
6:59more expensive thing?
7:03>> No.
7:03>> You don't want to do that?
7:04>> No.
7:05>> Okay.
7:08because [laughter]
7:10>> because I don't want to invest my time
7:13in that specifically because that would
7:15require me to uh do a high ticket
7:18product
7:18>> which I don't want to do because I have
7:22real estate properties and that's my
7:24high ticket over there.
7:25>> All right, we got Tammy here.
7:26>> Yeah,
7:27>> I just want to know a way where I can
7:30scale what I currently have because it's
7:33pretty automated, requires less people.
7:35I don't know if I should hire other
7:37people. Um I'm kind of stuck.
7:40>> Well,
7:41>> even with ad creation, I create about 30
7:43ads per month.
7:45>> Yeah, that's not a lot. Yeah. So, um
7:50I mean, if if the entire conversion
7:52process right now is automated, which is
7:53what it sounds like,
7:55>> right? How many impressions are you
7:56getting a month or a week?
7:57>> Uh
7:58>> are you doing Instagram
7:59>> in in just Instagram this last month?
8:01Probably like 5 million.
8:03>> Okay. And then the the other platforms
8:04you're advertising on
8:06>> uh Facebook
8:08uh about the same.
8:09>> Okay.
8:10>> Five to seven.
8:10>> And it's all Many chat to a landing page
8:12that then on the landing page they buy
8:13the digital product. What's the price
8:15point?
8:17>> Say $30 a month.
8:19>> Okay. So it's continuity.
8:21>> Yeah. And LTV
8:22>> is what?
8:23>> Uh right now 140 140.
8:26>> Okay. Um I mean you have a fundamentally
8:29you only have one constraint to the
8:30business which is advertising. assuming
8:32the conversion process is good. Um, so
8:35your issue is that you're making viral
8:37content that doesn't create buyers.
8:39>> Yeah.
8:39>> Correct. And then when you make ads,
8:41they're not as profitable.
8:44>> They are through the beginning, maybe
8:47for a month or less.
8:48>> Uh-huh.
8:50>> Well, yeah. I mean, that's how ads work.
8:52>> Well, it's after July, I kind of had a
8:55big dip.
8:56>> Okay.
8:57>> With ads. So, now I'm creating more.
8:59>> Okay. Um, now I guess I have to create
9:01more.
9:03And
9:04>> you're making you're just making no ads,
9:06dude. 30 ads a month is nothing.
9:09>> How much would you say?
9:11>> I mean, go to like 100 a week, you'll
9:13make way more.
9:14>> 100 ads a week without content.
9:19>> That's not What about content?
9:21>> Yeah, what about content?
9:22>> I mean, of course you keep making
9:23content.
9:26How would you frame the
9:28>> If you want to get weird with it, take
9:29your viral content, put a CTA at the end
9:31that's more direct. As long as the viral
9:33content that you're making is about is
9:35the stuff you're making about like
9:36fitness stuff or is it just like memes?
9:39>> A little bit of both. I'm trying to find
9:41uh like a happy medium between Yeah.
9:44>> one and the other.
9:46>> If I make content So who So, anyone here
9:49watch my YouTube at all? Okay. So, I
9:52want to do like a quick poll. Um,
9:55favorite. So, I'm gonna I'm gonna give
9:56you four different types of content.
9:58Just vote for your favorite one. Um,
10:01cash cows, which is me interviewing an
10:03entrepreneur doing like a deep
10:04breakdown. Okay, so that's
10:07>> h Oh, you want to know what the four
10:08are? Fair. That was a blind survey. I
10:11can appreciate that. Okay, so cash cows
10:13is one. Uh, the second is like brutally
10:15honest, kind of like life, mindset, etc.
10:18Uh, number three is kind of like the
10:20more live stream, quick Q&A, kind of
10:22more I mean me answering a call and
10:25answering that question. So tighter than
10:26the cash cow thing. Um and then four
10:28would just be like direct to camera
10:29training on whatever.
10:32So one so one is cash cows. Can I get
10:34hands for cash cows? Okay. Can I get um
10:39life advice for honest stuff?
10:42Interesting. Okay. Um the kind of like
10:45the live stream style like short hit
10:48phone call type stuff. Okay. Got one or
10:51a couple. Um, and then direct to camera
10:53training style. Oh, interesting. Good to
10:56know. Okay. So, um, if we take that,
11:00then when we're thinking about your
11:02content, that was partially just for me.
11:04Um,
11:06but when we're thinking about your
11:07content, uh, we need to make sure that
11:09the stuff that we're making is on what's
11:12what is what is going to attract buyers,
11:14>> right? So, you getting lots, right? You
11:16Well, yeah. you getting lots of views
11:19means very little if the views are not
11:21the people who buy.
11:22>> Yeah.
11:23>> And so right now you have an advertising
11:25problem. The content that you do that
11:26gets lots of views is not the one that
11:28people who buy watch. I think when you
11:30find the ones that are organic that pop
11:32off that do actually generate buyers,
11:33those you repurpose into ads, add a CTA
11:36and at the end drive those through your
11:38funnel, but fundamentally you're just
11:39not doing nearly enough advertising for
11:41how big you want to be.
11:43>> Okay. So you so you'd really say a
11:45100red a week,
11:46>> dude. Hundreds. Yeah. Yes.
11:47>> And that in that's both videos and
11:49images or just videos
11:50>> total.
11:52>> Okay.
11:54>> All right. Thank you.
11:55>> Yeah. You bet.
11:59[applause]
12:01>> What's your advice for dental clinic
12:03marketing since I had an agency and
12:05we're working abroad for patients using
12:07lower prices in their country? Okay. So,
12:10uh I would say right now, I mean, I've
12:12seen this all over the place, but you
12:14can advertise in any way, right? You
12:15could do outbound, you could do content,
12:16you could do ads. My bet given what
12:18you're what you're talking about is I
12:20would probably do this as a content
12:22strategy. Like I don't know if you guys
12:23have seen this, like the the Turkish
12:24hair, like they've got like there's like
12:27a whole industry in Turkey around like
12:28guys who are bald getting like their
12:29hair back. Um, and the doctors who are
12:34over there just post before and afters
12:35left and right all day long on
12:37Instagram, on Tik Tok, and that's how
12:40they're generating inbound demand. Uh,
12:42so I would say that's like number one.
12:43But the way to operationalize that is
12:45you have to build it into the the the
12:46customer journey. So like when they come
12:48in immediate picture, you know, day 30,
12:51day 60, it's like we have to go collect
12:52these pictures and if you want you can
12:54give rebates for it. Most time you don't
12:55have to. Um and then by doing that it's
12:57like every single person who comes in
12:59the door is a potential before and
13:01after. So it's like you can get 20
13:03figuratively 20 posts a day. Uh or I
13:05don't know how many how many teeth
13:06you're doing, right? But maybe it's two
13:08posts a day, right? That you can source
13:10directly from your existing customers
13:11and you don't have to do anything else.
13:12And then you can explain just like do
13:14the before and after and then do like a
13:16quick 30 second like hey this is you
13:17don't have to say their name you can put
13:19cover the eyes if you have to like this
13:20was a unique case and if you're
13:21struggling with XYZ pain-based hook um
13:24you know this is something we do all the
13:25time at our you know at our clinic right
13:28that's thing one um thing two is I don't
13:30love winning on price but it is
13:32sometimes just like some of the strategy
13:33and that's okay. Um you could just
13:37experiment with running ads. My bet
13:38though, I'm just saying because anything
13:40that's like
13:42I mean they are I guess they are bargain
13:44hunting but people kind of want the best
13:45of both. It's like they want it to be
13:46good and they want it to be cheap. And
13:47so like I would lead with content first.
13:48I would take the best performing content
13:50and then I would run that as ads uh with
13:52the offer. So content first, find
13:55winner, put a CTA on the end of the
13:57winner, and then drive paid uh to that.
14:00That's what I would do. I'm a pro
14:01volleyball player and I have 150,000
14:04followers across platforms. Any tips for
14:06monetizing my audience?
14:08Yes, I have tips. So many tips. Many,
14:11many tips. The frosted the most frosted
14:13of tips. Uh right now only taking oneoff
14:16brand deals. Well, dude, um
14:21a couple things. So, I think one of the
14:25things hard for a lot of uh kind of like
14:27celebrity or sports people is
14:29understanding what business they're
14:30really in. So if you want to be like
14:33basically you are a media company like
14:35fun like fundamentally what are what
14:38like what are what are pro sports and
14:40sports in general? They're
14:41entertainment. That's what they are
14:43right. So they entertain people. What is
14:45the point of entertainment? To get
14:46people to continue to watch. That is
14:47what the point of entertainment is. And
14:48so really good entertainment gets lots
14:49of people to keep watching. That's what
14:51good entertainment is by the way. That's
14:52what the news is too. Crazy. Anyways, so
14:56if that's the business that you're in,
14:58you need to make the decision. Okay. So,
14:59first off, you're in the media business
15:00more than it's and it's like you are a
15:02performer. You perform a specific skill.
15:03People watch you and that's how the game
15:05works. Okay. Now, from there, you kind
15:07of have two paths. Path one is you keep
15:10going in the entertainment direction.
15:11Um, which you can do by just showing
15:13more and more clips of you playing you
15:15spiking and doing all sorts of stuff and
15:17probably interweaving stuff about you,
15:18which will then kind of build some depth
15:20to the audience rather than you just
15:21being some trickshot guy. Right? That's
15:23path one. And the primary way that
15:26you're probably going to monetize is the
15:28way you currently are, which is that
15:28you're going to have to do outbound via
15:30sponsorships. Um, but I see that as
15:33relatively limited.
15:35The alternative path um is to become
15:39more of an education business. And so I
15:40I'll give you a shout out to Trevor
15:42Bower. Um he uh he was, if you don't
15:46know who he is, he was one of the best
15:47pitchers of all time and had a really
15:48unfortunate situation that came up where
15:51a girl lied and whatever. I don't want
15:53to get into it, but um and I'm saying
15:55that because she came out later and said
15:56she would. Um but it ruined his career
15:58and he basically wasn't allowed to play
15:59pro anymore. So what did he do? He
16:01couldn't he couldn't play pro anymore.
16:05Uh and so he had to find another way to
16:07monetize. And so uh one is he shows
16:10people how to pitch. So I think you
16:12showing people how to do volleyball
16:14stuff and do it the way that you do it
16:16is a really good one. So, it's like, can
16:18we develop an app or training program um
16:21that you could sell digitally to show
16:24people how to jump higher, spike more,
16:26run faster, the workouts associated with
16:29volleyball, all that stuff would totally
16:30work. The second is that you can sell
16:33kind of like high like it depends how
16:35much clout you have in the space but
16:36like you signing balls, you signing
16:39shorts, you signing shirts or having
16:41merch associated with a brand uh that
16:43you want to maybe it's like you know
16:45high level spike or maybe you're a
16:46serving specialist whatever your thing
16:48is right um I would have training around
16:50that and I would have merch around that.
16:51Now when you do that you kind of
16:53transition more into an educator uh and
16:55less of a entertainer but from a
16:58monetization perspective I would be
17:00strongly looking at that. Now door three
17:03is that you just find a company that you
17:04really like a lot and see if you can
17:06negotiate a deal where you can get a
17:09percentage of the company from an equity
17:11perspective and maybe even a tiny slice
17:13of a royalty based on the traffic that
17:15you send. um where you become a brand
17:17spokesperson and then you hope that that
17:18business eventually, you know, exits and
17:19whatnot and you just focus on making
17:21content and playing. So um sponsorships
17:24is going to be more passive obviously
17:25you just have to sell and then keep
17:26making content. Uh when you become an
17:28educator, you have to do more work
17:29because you have delivery. Now you could
17:31just sell pure digital um that would
17:33make you less money but it would be less
17:34work. Uh if you sold digital and then
17:36also services in terms of you looking at
17:38people spiking, giving them feedback. Um
17:40that's like basically a personal
17:41training business that's that's focused
17:43on volleyball. So, uh, that works for
17:45any kind of creator that's kind of in
17:46any of those niches, but those are kind
17:47of the paths that I would be looking at.
17:49Um, and all of those are different ways
17:50that you can monetize.
17:54>> In 2024, you started working with
17:56school. Yeah.
17:57>> And so, I think it's an interesting
17:58question using yourself as a case study.
17:59Number one, the product that you're
18:01associating with, it's not one that you
18:03like built it all nuts and bolts
18:04yourself. It was very much here's an
18:07existing company, but I can grow it.
18:09Mhm.
18:10>> And so it come kind of comes down for
18:11creators the question of hey like do you
18:14really want to lean into being an
18:16entrepreneur and do it yourself or do
18:18you just want to do a brand deal?
18:20>> This is going to be really interesting.
18:21So cuz I've given a huge amount of
18:22thought to this. So I uh I'll see if I
18:25can get the number right. But the
18:27creator paths exist on a spectrum
18:29basically five paths of monet
18:31monetization for a creator. So and they
18:34exist on an axis of control. And so at
18:38the lowest amount of control, you have
18:40sponsorships, right? Like people just
18:42pay you money. You give basically you're
18:43an advertiser.
18:44>> And so you promote their stuff, you read
18:46an ad, whatever.
18:48>> That's that one degree. Next to that,
18:50you have being an affiliate, uh, which
18:52is just like, you know, getting sponsors
18:54except you're paying performance. Cuz
18:55what we do when you do an affiliate
18:57deal, uh, or a performance-based deal,
19:00you're saying, I would like a larger
19:02percentage of the upside if I can prove
19:04that I can generate it. And so what
19:06you're essentially doing is shifting the
19:07risk from them to you. And the more risk
19:10you're willing to take on, the greater
19:11percentage of the upside. And so winners
19:13always work on performance. No one
19:14should be able to as accurately estimate
19:16how much you can drive.
19:17>> No one knows better than you do,
19:18>> right? You're the seller. So like in M&A
19:21terms, uh the seller of a business, the
19:23person who owns the business you're
19:24selling to somebody else, always has an
19:25information advantage because they
19:27always know more about the business than
19:28the person buying, right? And so you are
19:30the seller of attention. So you should
19:32always know the value of your attention
19:33better than someone else. Now, if you
19:35know that your attention's [ __ ] um and
19:37doesn't actually convert at all, then
19:38maybe you should just do the
19:39>> sponsor brand. It's the brand value.
19:42>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We're just It's
19:43It's overall the impression.
19:46>> Now, you've got me on board.
19:47>> Yeah. Yeah. It's going to change
19:48everything. So, yeah. Anyway, so you've
19:50got you've got uh sponsorships here.
19:52You've got kind of affiliates and
19:53performance deals here. Then you've got
19:54kind of the the next uh path, which is
19:57what I what I did with school, which is
20:00um you promote
20:02and you So, I put capital in the deal,
20:04too. So it wasn't just uh
20:05>> you also invested I wrote too. Yeah.
20:09Yeah. It was a big deal. Yeah.
20:10>> Um and so we invested capital in the
20:13company and we invested resources and we
20:15invested brand. So it's we did all so I
20:17think about them in terms of like what
20:18are the buckets that create an
20:20investment. So there's work and for me
20:22there's brand. Some people don't have
20:23that but like there's work, there's
20:25brand and then there's capital.
20:26>> And so we put all three into the
20:28business. I think there's a really nice
20:30sweet spot there because what you can do
20:32is rather than try and go through all
20:34the iterations, I say, "Hey, let's do a
20:37deal. It has to be significant enough
20:38for me to like make it worth using what
20:41I would consider a brand bullet on and
20:43let's let's get carrot into every
20:46business in the US, not just creators."
20:47And then if like if that's compelling,
20:49then then you get to just do what you're
20:51good at as a creator. Um, this is me
20:53talking to creators and let the business
20:56do what they've already proven. And this
20:57is the key point that they've already
20:58proven they are good at. And so this is
21:01where a little bit of business acumen
21:02comes comes into play. Um this is where
21:05like understanding what revenue
21:06retention is, looking at churn, looking
21:07at user acquisition, looking at
21:09engagement rates, look at activation
21:10points, whatever that you want to look
21:11at a business to understand, okay, is
21:13this actually is the product good?
21:15Because what you want as a creator, like
21:16the perfect nirvana situation is
21:18unbelievable product compounding on its
21:21own from word of mouth
21:22>> for 12 to 24 months in a market that's
21:27like very similar to your audience and
21:29that you know that you can 10x in a
21:31year. That's where the magic happens for
21:32both parties.
21:33>> Yeah.
21:34>> They have an amazing product that could
21:35grow without you,
21:37>> but with you it just grows that much
21:38faster. And so fundamentally all you're
21:40doing is pulling the future forward by
21:42like four years. you're cutting the
21:44compounding curve and just basically
21:46step step-wise increasing in a straight
21:47line up and then saying okay we're just
21:49going to pull year four forward and now
21:50we're going to compound starting next
21:52month at year four to five rather than
21:55year 2 to three right and that's
21:56fundamentally what I was doing with
21:57school and I mean think about the amount
21:58of deals that we look at school was the
22:00only deal that I've done since that time
22:02period it was because it hit all of
22:04those things
22:04>> now next on so that's like third stop on
22:06our creator world here the next is that
22:09you can white label so you can drop ship
22:12stuff which is pretty common um that I
22:16see as the simplest way of this is like
22:18you don't manufacture t-shirts you find
22:19a t-shirt manufacturer you slap your
22:21logo on it and you ship it pretty
22:23straightforward and then the final
22:24version final boss of this is that you
22:26create a product from scr from scratch
22:28or service from scratch
22:29>> and you market and sell it and uh those
22:33are degrees of control that exist on
22:35that spectrum. there is a right path for
22:37everyone and you just have to have some
22:40level of awareness to know which path is
22:42yours. Now, which of these can create
22:44the most enterprise value? The further
22:46on the right you are, right?
22:48>> Uh the more enterprise value you have.
22:50Um if you are doing sponsorships or
22:52affiliate deals, which is the first two
22:53categories that I talked about, those
22:56two can create enterprise value in of
22:58themselves if you consider yourself a
23:00media business, which is so funny. I was
23:02talking to a Mondo creator, so like 20
23:04million plus subscribers, and it was so
23:06funny. He was like, "Dude, what we're
23:08doing, like no one's ever done this
23:10before. Like have a business around like
23:12making videos." And I was like,
23:14>> "So, you know, media's existed for a
23:16long time, right?" And I was [laughter]
23:17like,
23:18>> and when I when I told him, I was like,
23:19"Dude, med like you should just look at
23:21existing media businesses." And it was
23:22like this big light bulb. I was like,
23:23"All we're doing is taking an old
23:25business model and just doing it in a
23:26new medium. Like that's all it is,
23:27right?" The difference though is if you
23:29look at like a great media business of
23:30the new age is like bar stool sports.
23:32>> Right.
23:32>> Right. And Dave Portoi is sort of now a
23:36creator. I would say he is a creator
23:38now, but it wasn't started that way. He
23:39just saw the arbitrage that existed for
23:40all these impressions properties.
23:42>> Yeah. Exactly. And he built a network
23:44and so that he could sell impressions
23:45across a specific demo um to
23:49advertisers. And if that's the business,
23:52I just have yet to see. I think YM Your
23:54mom's House for Comedy. I think they
23:56have a handful of productions. that
23:57they're kind of becoming a media.
23:58>> Zack Justice is trying to do this too,
24:00right? Y
24:00>> you have to talk to Zach. It's tough
24:02though, especially if you're the primary
24:04like bread winner kind of for the media
24:06business. I would say it's it's almost
24:08simpler to be like, "Hey, I know a ton
24:10of advertisers, right?
24:11>> Let me sell your ad space." And I think
24:14you could far more easily acquire
24:17>> a big network from that perspective,
24:19which is basically what Portway did.
24:20>> Interesting. So for your POV, if you've
24:22successfully built the media side of
24:24your business, like that's a win, but
24:26the upside according to your degrees of
24:28control, it's very limited. And as you
24:30mentioned, I was trying to think of
24:31people who I think have built these
24:33successful media empires. So there have
24:34been many who failed like Buzzfeed. It's
24:36a great example.
24:37>> Many have failed. Yeah.
24:38>> Many, many have failed. We're going to
24:39reinvent the game. It's like, well,
24:41you're just doing newspapers did, I'll
24:42be on a new medium, the internet. There
24:43are some creators who have succeeded in
24:45building.
24:46>> Yeah. Exactly. Right. Yeah. Daily Mail.
24:48And there are some creators who've gone
24:50they've taken steps in this direction
24:51where they've almost scaled their
24:53content. So one that comes to mind Linus
24:54Tech Tips is a very good example where
24:56Linus Tech Tips started with just Linus
24:58and over the time he's brought in other
24:59creators to be on his channel instead of
25:01himself. And then you also have creators
25:03like I think MKBHD is a great example
25:05too. MKBHD I still think of as primarily
25:07as a media business. Mhm.
25:08>> He doesn't do that much with products
25:10and well he actually tried one a
25:13wallpaper app that got a lot of backlash
25:14which I you know if I were MKBH I feel
25:17like I would be like yeah I know you
25:18know what I'll just stay and do content
25:20over here because whenever I sort of go
25:21over there people get mad at me.
25:22>> Yeah.
25:23>> Now it sounds like you're saying though
25:24from your POV this is
25:26>> Can we hit on this real quick before we
25:27we we switch? Um
25:30>> so I want to say this mostly to the the
25:33creators or people who have started from
25:34organic and like built an audience and
25:36whatnot. There there's two types of
25:37angry. [laughter]
25:39So there are there's angry because you
25:42have done something that you said you
25:44wouldn't do or that is against your
25:46brand or purported values,
25:48>> right?
25:49>> Then there is people who think that
25:51everything in the world should be free.
25:53>> And I find that YouTube or really across
25:56all platforms, these people exist and
25:58you can by and large ignore them. And so
26:01I think that when people promote
26:03anything um they get backlash because
26:05anything that you give me that is not
26:07free [ __ ] you die. Yeah.
26:08>> I think on some level you just got to be
26:10like okay anything worth doing is going
26:13to get lashed back and there's like show
26:16me one ultra famous person because this
26:18is all we're talking about creators and
26:20influence and audiences who doesn't have
26:21haters,
26:22>> right?
26:22>> And so if you're going to get hate
26:24regardless,
26:26you might as well also accomplish your
26:27objectives. M
26:29>> so that's just my two cents on now
26:31betraying the brand that you have. No, I
26:33think that's dumb. Um so like if you
26:34have for example a naturopathic brand of
26:36weight loss, don't push a ZIC. That's
26:38probably a bad idea. At the same time,
26:40if you said, "Hey, I've got these
26:41supplements that help you do that or I
26:43have this, you know, uh nutrition
26:45program that I'm, you know, you do a
26:46retreat with me three times a year."
26:48>> Seems of course I'm thinking of liver
26:50king because the whole premise was his
26:51gains came from his diet, not from other
26:53things.
26:53>> 100%. If
26:54>> you've been honest, I think it would
26:55have been fine.
26:55>> I think Yeah. Um, it would have been
26:57interesting for sure.
26:58>> Yeah, fine. Maybe not fine. It would
27:00have been interesting.
27:00>> Oh, yeah. I eat I eat, you know, goat
27:02nuts, but I also inject uh Tren. Um,
27:05like people were like, "So, is it the
27:06goat nuts or is it Tren?"
27:08>> Well, it's actually both. It's the
27:09interaction between the two. [laughter]
27:11>> That's where the magic happens, right?
27:12Like,
27:13>> um, yeah. So I that's that's yeah, but
27:15he actually I think he's uh it's it's
27:17it's a worthwhile example to pull that
27:19up because so obviously there was a
27:21moment where in time where he went super
27:23viral and then it peaked and then Derek
27:26as a call back to earlier uh ended up
27:28being the one who outed him.
27:29>> He exposed him. I remember
27:30>> he exposed it. Here's the thing.
27:32>> Liver King still makes content
27:34>> and I would imagine that he probably
27:37still makes good money.
27:38>> Yep. And so I would see what happened to
27:41Liver King as close to a quote brand
27:42suicide moment as you can get.
27:46And yet,
27:47>> yeah,
27:47>> he keeps going. And so here's the here's
27:49the real real I don't think you can get
27:51cancelled. And so a lot of people have
27:54this fear of making a mistake that's
27:56going to end their career. And
27:58no mistake ends your career unless you
28:00choose to end it.
28:02>> And so you can always get back up and
28:03keep going. The only way that you can
28:05actually get canceled is if you get
28:07prevented from distribution, right?
28:09>> So if all platforms deplatform you, if
28:11every platform did that, then yeah, you
28:13are canceled, right? Like R. Kelly is in
28:15jail
28:16>> and can't make content.
28:17>> He cannot make content. So like he has
28:19been he has been effectively canceled.
28:20>> On the flip side, how many times has
28:22Chappelle been cancelled? I'll put that
28:24in quotes here, right?
28:25>> He's not canceled. He just keeps going,
28:27right? Um, and so in the same light, uh,
28:29to to further hopefully put a stake
28:31through this thing, your assumption that
28:33you have killed your career assumes that
28:35everyone in the world knows who you are.
28:37>> And the vast majority of the world
28:38doesn't even know you exist, nor do they
28:40really care. Um, subtext. And so, like,
28:44let's say you have a million person
28:45audience. Okay, you mess up. Just go get
28:49another million. You're not dead. And if
28:52anything, you start having learned a
28:53lesson and you just keep going. It's
28:55interesting because like I think the
28:56poster childs for this in some ways are
28:58like Jake and Logan Paul.
29:00>> Dude, the Suicide Forest thing.
29:02>> Yeah.
29:02>> Like here he is on WWE or whatever
29:05whatever they're doing now. I don't
29:06follow as as tightly as I probably
29:08should to be uh you know in this world.
29:10But um
29:11>> he's still around and he's quote bigger
29:13than Yeah. And so like
29:16>> he also Jake Paul also has a VC fund
29:18now.
29:18>> Yeah. Well, there you go. There are so
29:19many examples of quote career-ending
29:21moves that didn't actually end the
29:23career. What you have to be able to deal
29:24with, and this is the real hard part, is
29:26that you have to be you have to be able
29:28to handle hate for a week
29:30>> because the news cycle is about a week.
29:32And so you have to be able to just be
29:34hated. And it's very against our human
29:37wiring to receive that much hatred and
29:39continue onward,
29:40>> especially online. It's amplified.
29:42>> It's impossible to fathom a million
29:44people telling you that you suck.
29:45>> Have you gone through that yourself?
29:47>> Um, I mean, I've had my moments of
29:49people hating on stuff that I that I put
29:50out. Um, usually it's just stuff that I
29:52put out that just triggers people in
29:54general. And I would say that part of it
29:55is intended to do that. Like because I
29:57have relatively extreme views um on life
29:59and death and things like that. And um I
30:02make those because those are the views
30:04that helped me free myself and made life
30:06a lot more palatable for me. I've always
30:08been like and if it helps you, use it.
30:09And if it doesn't, don't worry about it.
30:11Use whatever you're doing.
30:11>> This is not me trying to procelitize.
30:13This is me sharing what's worked for me.
30:14But of course, people see it and they're
30:15triggered because this conflicts with
30:17their worldview.
30:18>> My content is a documentary, not a
30:19sermon. H when you think about the
30:23different axes of control, the different
30:25models you've said, what's interesting
30:27is I've seen a lot of creators stay in
30:29the media emperor side. I've seen a good
30:31number of creators make money via their
30:32own products.
30:33>> Like obviously there's festivals. The
30:35middle area what you've done is actually
30:37very very rare.
30:38>> That's the advantage of if you
30:40understand the business game, you can do
30:42nasty things cuz I remember so there's I
30:44I can't wait for this to get the call
30:46back. Um, but one of my very first
30:48podcasts I ever did was on Ice Coffee
30:50Hour,
30:51>> um, with Graham Stefen and on the show,
30:56uh, I said if I had your size audience,
30:58I would already be a billionaire. I'm
31:00excited for when we cross that cuz I
31:01think it'll be pretty close.
31:02>> You have the audience now, Alex. So, is
31:05he say put up or shut up?
31:06>> Yeah. I mean, we've grown a ton. I'll
31:09just leave it at that. I'll say this for
31:10anybody who's who's listening to this.
31:11So, the problem with me claiming
31:12something, I would like to have a third
31:14party substantiate. Um, and so like I
31:17could say, well, if if you know what our
31:19revenue is, right? And you put any kind
31:22of IBIDA on that, that would be
31:24reasonable, especially in a business
31:26that has low CAC,
31:27>> right?
31:27>> Uh, you would probably imagine that it
31:29would be decent. And you put any kind of
31:31multiple on that, it would be a pretty
31:33large number.
31:33>> Yeah.
31:34>> And so we have things that are going for
31:36us, and we've had uh conversations with
31:38companies that said we would value in
31:40this in this range. But those are things
31:42that I wouldn't if I claim it, I want to
31:45be rock solid.
31:46>> Absolutely.
31:47>> Right. And so that's why I haven't. But
31:48that being said, um obviously we've
31:49grown a lot um in that period of time
31:52and uh I I'm excited for whenever that
31:54call back comes because he still has
31:55more YouTube people. So I'm using that
31:56as mine as my
31:57>> You're saying we haven't quite reached
31:58your audience yet?
31:59>> Yeah. On YouTube. Yeah. I'm still I'm
32:00still I'm still uh behind his audience
32:02on YouTube.
32:02>> It's actually another good point though.
32:03You said multiple, right? The multiple
32:05that you would get on what you've built
32:06is going to be higher than say a pure
32:08YouTuber.
32:08>> Yeah.
32:09>> Here's your question. when you look at
32:10say like what Jimmy Mr. Beast has built.
32:12>> Yeah. Oh, perfect. I was going to come
32:13back to that. Yes. Okay.
32:14>> Is that a business you'd want to invest
32:16in yourself?
32:17>> So, I think I'd probably take Chamath's
32:19angle which is like you just you're
32:20basically betting on Jimmy
32:22>> and I think um Yeah, I would take that
32:23bet,
32:23>> right?
32:24>> Cuz I think Jimmy will just die or he'll
32:26win.
32:26>> Yep.
32:26>> And that's kind of you just want to find
32:28people like that. When your distribution
32:30base is the world, uh it's hard to lose.
32:32Yeah. I'll just I'll leave it at that.
32:34But what you brought up though, like
32:35Prime for example.
32:36>> Yeah. So, Prime is actually the
32:38identical to a school deal
32:40>> because he didn't build the product,
32:41>> right? It was Congo Brands is another
32:43company that previously had worked with
32:44other creators to do other drinks as
32:45well.
32:46>> Yeah. And so, they promoted it.
32:47>> Right.
32:47>> Right. But they put I don't know if they
32:49put cash in. I don't know if they did,
32:50but I'm assuming they put some money in
32:51cuz they have the capital. Why not to
32:52get more leverage on on the ultimate
32:53deal or joint venture? Was Logan going
32:56to learn the drink business and get the
32:58and get brickandmortar distri? Like
32:59maybe. But it's also the question is how
33:01much is your time worth? And I don't
33:02mean like
33:03>> dollars per hour or anything like that.
33:06You absolutely can do it. And when I say
33:07time is like how much is the next five
33:08years worth to you, right?
33:10>> Because if you can pull five years of
33:12knowledge forward and then grow for five
33:15years rather than learn for 5 years then
33:17begin growing because you're if you have
33:19an audience of their size, your
33:20constraint is going to be delivery.
33:22>> It's not distribut like
33:23>> Yeah. It's not it's not media
33:25distribution. It's going to be product
33:26distribution.
33:27>> Prime. Yes.
33:28>> Yeah. It's going to be product
33:28distribution. And so to to build out the
33:30kind of infrastructure and knowledge
33:32base uh to satisfy the demand
33:36internationally, not just nationally,
33:37internet because they're in the UK too.
33:39>> Um
33:40>> you need you need deep expertise and
33:43large existing infrastructure and so
33:45Cong.
33:47And so I would probably lean more
33:48towards that type of model.
33:50>> I'm curious like there's me, there's Sir
33:52Jimmy I think with Feastables is the
33:54only person who is building things truly
33:56from scratch.
33:56>> Yeah.
33:56>> Has hired his own team and everything.
33:58>> Yeah. And I don't know if if you were to
33:59ask Jimmy again today uh if he could go
34:02back in time if he would have
34:05>> just if he would have done it the same
34:07way.
34:07>> We talked about how stressful it is on
34:08your podcast.
34:09>> Well and we can and we can already say
34:11uh he launched Lunchly,
34:12>> right? And well what did he do with
34:14Lunchly that he didn't do with
34:15Fastables? He didn't build it from
34:17scratch,
34:17>> right? And so I think part of that is
34:20there is a desire that I totally
34:22understand as a creator/ entrepreneur to
34:25control everything.
34:27And if you look at the people who are
34:29the wealthiest in the world, almost none
34:31of them own 100% of the companies that
34:33they have made their wealth on.
34:35>> So you look at Jensen Wang from Nvidia
34:37owns 4%. You look at Elon, he owns
34:40whatever it is whatever small percentage
34:42of Tesla that he owns. Um and with
34:44SpaceX, he's not the majority owner.
34:46know he might have voting rights,
34:47whatever. That's a different different
34:48question. Basos owns 9% of of Amazon.
34:51Like I could go down the list. Warren
34:53Buffett, I think, doesn't own more than
34:5440% of Berkshire Hathway and we could
34:57keep going. And so the idea is to build
34:59something really really big. In my
35:00opinion, need multiple lifetimes
35:03>> and you can either live all of those
35:05lifetimes uh in sequence chronologically
35:08yourself and then take a lifetime to
35:10finally learn how to do everything or
35:12you can get three people's lifetimes.
35:15You all start together. you divvy up the
35:16pie and then you can build something way
35:18bigger, way faster. The longer I've been
35:20doing business, the more I value time
35:22and speed because also we have the
35:24assumption that these things will not
35:27change in 10 years. So maybe it does
35:28take you 10 years to learn everything.
35:30>> Who here uses Instagram as one of their
35:32primary ways of getting customers?
35:33>> By the way, most of our traffic to about
35:35pages comes from Instagram.
35:37>> So I would imagine most people
35:39>> Okay.
35:39>> Yeah.
35:40>> Um same same hands. Who here uses Many
35:43Chat?
35:45>> Okay. I just want to like right now I
35:46think it's the most I think it's the
35:47most efficient conversion of eyeball to
35:50CTA just like get the thing I'll send
35:53you the link and then
35:54>> do you guys use that to promote your
35:55school mini chat plus Instagram?
35:57>> Yes.
35:58>> Yeah. So we've done many chat now on 500
36:00posts of our last posts. Um and what we
36:03found is that people just like sending a
36:06link is the easiest thing to do. So,
36:07what we've done is we've gone a step
36:09further and we create a PDF document
36:10with actionable resources in it with a
36:13hyperlink to whatever it is you're
36:15trying to sell. And then that does way
36:16better than just a link. So, that's like
36:19killing it.
36:20>> So, I'll say this back for for everyone
36:22at home.
36:24>> So, so you say get my widget and they
36:27comment widget and then you send them
36:28link to widget which is a PDF that's
36:30hosted on drive or whatever and then
36:32inside of the widget is want more stuff
36:34like this widget go here.
36:36>> Yeah. So we run a creative AI education
36:38company and we will give people the
36:41images and prompts that we use for
36:42example in the video so they can access
36:44that and then at the bottom it's like
36:46check out our school for more education.
36:48>> Great.
36:50>> I am getting quite a lot of customers
36:52from YouTube. Um and I want to start
36:55really pushing that. I'm not posting at
36:56all enough. And it really interested me
36:58what you said about lives. What's I have
37:01a choice to make now where I spend my
37:02time making videos. What's the the logic
37:05of spending three hours once a week on
37:07lives as instead of planning uh a more
37:10sort of polished video in that three
37:13hours?
37:14>> Well, my actual recording session is the
37:16same.
37:18So, imagine you're going to do a
37:20formalized, you know, polished recording
37:22session. I just go live. And so if you
37:26want to see me record polished, so like
37:28they take that live and then if I do
37:30three YouTube videos in that live, those
37:32are three other polished posts that are
37:34going out. So it's not that those have
37:36stopped, it's just that I have I have a
37:38fourth asset that gets created where I
37:40get deeper involvement, I get
37:41Parasocial, I get a free video that
37:43gives usually around 100,000 views
37:45without me doing anything and then I
37:47still get the three videos plus my
37:48shorts. So, it's just like it creates
37:50another asset number one. And number
37:52two, I think there's a different dynamic
37:53of live for the people who are live.
37:56Third, I think I show up better when I
37:59feel like there's people who are
38:01watching rather than just like the three
38:0320-year-olds behind the camera. Uh cuz
38:06because in a real way, like probably one
38:08of the biggest like um I don't know
38:10belief shifts that I had around making
38:12content is that the people behind the
38:14camera matter a ton. And so some of my
38:17earlier content was a little bit more
38:19hardcore than I am in reality because I
38:21was just yelling at the 20-year-olds
38:22behind the camera because I felt like I
38:25was talking to them because they were
38:26the only people in the room. If I had
38:28all women in the room, my content would
38:30have been significantly different even
38:32though might have had the same packaging
38:33or same title or whatever, but like what
38:35I was going to say was different. And so
38:36the live has kind of like uh rounded off
38:40that edge for me because I see girl,
38:42guy, person in Algeria, person here,
38:45person in Australia, person UK. And so
38:46it reminds me kind of like in real time
38:48that like there's a lot of different
38:50people who are consuming that. And so my
38:51examples are different. Uh the energy I
38:53bring to is different. And then um the
38:56the last piece that um I I like about
38:59the lives um no I think that's called I
39:01had one more. I can't remember what it
39:02was, but those are those.
39:03>> You also find there's something just
39:04about being live where it's like,
39:06>> oh, I'm live. Whereas a camera, if it's
39:08just rolling, you're like,
39:10>> yeah,
39:10>> cuz you're actually live. You
39:12[clears throat] can't just be like,
39:13screw this. Yeah. Like, I'm done.
39:15There's some It gives me energy. At
39:17least if unless I'm doing it live, I
39:19don't want to do it basically.
39:20>> Yeah.
39:21>> I haven't seen your lives. You have
39:22questions on. Are people asking you
39:24questions while you So, you have to you
39:26get interrupted quite a lot.
39:27>> No. So, yes and no. So, I have my So, I
39:30don't think about as interruptions. I
39:32think about is them asking questions
39:34while I make a point that if I don't
39:37answer it, they would I'd lose that in
39:40the video.
39:40>> So, it adds more value.
39:42>> Exactly. So, I don't answer every
39:43question, but I'll I'll like I'll keep
39:45an eye on it and the guys can cut out
39:47like a gap of me reading the comments in
39:49between and then I'll address it. So
39:52before we had this, the way I did the
39:54videos is I would go record the video,
39:55the guys would write down questions they
39:57had and then they would ask the
39:59questions after and then they would
40:00slice those in. Uh so I'd be like, so I
40:03make my point like so for example, if
40:05you're one of these people, which I
40:06didn't say at the moment because they're
40:08like, well, what if this? I' like, it's
40:09a good point. Didn't think about that.
40:10And so then I'll I'll interject it,
40:12which then makes it a more complete
40:13video.
40:13>> Do you go live on several platforms at
40:16the same time? Like
40:16>> I just do YouTube, but I'm sure I could.
40:18I just
40:19>> haven't. Cool.
40:21>> I also just wanted to thank uh Andrew
40:23Kirby over there because I heard about
40:24school from videos he made on YouTube.
40:26And
40:29>> you [applause] know what you do is very
40:30similar to the Twitch some of the Twitch
40:32streamers. Have you heard them talk
40:33about it?
40:35>> Yeah. The the best ones are very good at
40:37making one live and then repurposing it
40:39for everything. Yeah.
40:41>> The key was like I still make my three
40:44YouTube videos a week or whatever from
40:46like that's happens in the live. So, but
40:49the thing that you'll find is that the
40:52live is totally okay with one, they want
40:55to see what how you actually make these
40:57videos. They're just curious. And then
40:59number two, if you say, "Hey guys, I'm
41:01going to do this intro real quick and
41:03then I just do the intro." No one's
41:04like, "Oh, [ __ ] this guy." I mean,
41:06because fundamentally, if if the hook is
41:08interesting, it will make them want to
41:10watch more.
41:11>> But it feels so raw and live that it's
41:13that's what happens on a Twitch stream,
41:15right? That's why Yeah.
41:17Sorry, I don't have the mic. You
41:19actually say, "Hang on, guys. I'm doing
41:20an intro now."
41:21>> Yeah.
41:22>> I was like, "All right, so I'm going to
41:23three videos today. First video is going
41:24to be on this. Second video is on this.
41:26Third video is on this." So, I'll do a
41:27little Q&A 5 minutes and I'll be like,
41:28"All right, I'm going to rip." So, uh,
41:31you're poor and that sucks. And so, we
41:34need to fix that. And here's, you know,
41:36seven ways that I don't kill myself from
41:37saying this, right? And the big thing
41:39that everyone misses is people try and
41:40dissect my content. The message is 10%
41:44of how people consume it. 90% is the
41:47context around the message. So Elon Musk
41:50can tweet on the toilet and be like,
41:51"I'm on the throne taking a shit." And
41:53it'll get a million likes. Why? Because
41:56it's Elon Musk, he's the richest man in
41:57the world and owns three of the biggest
41:59companies that are most innovative of
42:00all time. I don't kid myself and think
42:02that like my content is so much better
42:03than other people. There's plenty of
42:04people with better content than me that
42:05don't get the same views. And the
42:07[music] reason is because they don't
42:07have the context. They don't have the
42:09proof. and solve for the proof and then
42:11the content will take care of itself
42:13because one, you will know what you're
42:15talking about because you have proof
42:16that you know what you're talking about
42:18and people will believe you. Which is
42:20why you should solve for evidence above
42:22everything else. Like evidence gives you
42:24the confidence. If someone says, "Alex,
42:25I don't think you know [ __ ] about
42:26business." I'd be like, "Okay, it
42:28doesn't really affect me." I do know we
42:29crossed $100 million in net worth at age
42:31[music] 32. I know that. But if someone
42:33said that to you and you haven't
42:34accomplished anything, you don't have
42:36anything to stand back on and it hurts
42:37you more. But I have proof. So, it's
42:39like you can just deflect it towards the
42:41proof and keep living your life. The
42:42secret to longevity is, especially in
42:44the content game, but really in any game
42:45that you're trying to at least help
42:46other people with, is that if you've
42:49done the thing, you can be certain
42:51rather than confident. Be certain based
42:53on what you've done, not based on
42:54>> There's a big difference between
42:56becoming known and becoming respected.
42:59Don't let an algorithm convince you
43:01otherwise.
43:05I mean, I think this is probably super
43:07pertinent for for people in our
43:08position. Um, but
43:12I'll go from the internet perspective
43:14and we can circle back to IRL. Um, but I
43:16mean a lot of people will make content.
43:18Obviously, I make stuff for me too. Like
43:20talk about artists making things for
43:21themselves. Like I make most of my
43:22tweets are just like notes to self. Um,
43:25but like if I ever feel like I have to
43:26sacrifice who I am or the values that I
43:28believe in in order to like get more
43:30views or something like that, I see it
43:32happen more times than not because the
43:34algorithm and the views and the likes
43:36become kind of a proxy for conforming in
43:39in their own way. Like everyone likes
43:41this type of thing.
43:42>> Do more of that. And that makes me feel
43:44very like dance monkey dance.
43:46>> And um I think there's there's few
43:48things that kill my soul more than that.
43:50And so I would rather, you know, I would
43:52rather the algorithm shut me off
43:54tomorrow and I continue to make stuff
43:55that I find interesting that 10 people
43:57find interesting that is actually the
43:58same stuff as me than just have these
44:02viral hits that I feel like I'm Ronald
44:03McDonald in. Um, and just feel like I've
44:06completely lost my soul. And I I do
44:09think as a side note that if you do the
44:11first one where your intention is to
44:13maybe help find the 10 people who are
44:14really interested in your thing, you
44:16probably will create more of the viral
44:18hits. But when you solve for the other
44:19way, I think you accomplish neither.
44:22>> I have this theory that more creators
44:24fall out of favor because they become
44:27cringe than because they become
44:28irrelevant.
44:28>> I love that you Yeah, I love that.
44:31>> I think it's I think it's true. I think
44:35if you think about the thing that you
44:36do, almost anything that anybody is
44:38creating is public facing because if it
44:40wasn't public facing, it would just be a
44:42hobby.
44:44Doing your painting because you love
44:45painting is a hobby. doing your painting
44:48to try and sell it is something that you
44:50do as a business or as a a public
44:53project.
44:55The flywheel is so vicious in the
44:58positive direction and even more vicious
45:00in the negative direction. If it becomes
45:05cancerous or uncool or untrendy or
45:08catastrophic or cringe to be seen to be
45:10watching or listening to or consuming
45:12the thing that you make, it is you are
45:15permanently going to be swimming
45:16upstream and it is only going to get
45:18worse. Which is why you look at Shane
45:21Gillis is a really great example of this
45:23at the moment. He's someone who is great
45:25at his craft, big platform, moved to
45:27Austin, got all of the multipliers in
45:30place,
45:31>> but he isn't cringe.
45:33>> And because he's not cringe, if you've
45:35watched Beautiful Dogs, his Netflix
45:38special,
45:39>> it's not uncool. It's like there's this
45:42idea in publishing, so I've been doing
45:43my research ahead of the book. There's
45:45this idea in publishing called the
45:46subway test,
45:47>> right? Would someone be prepared to have
45:50the full dust jacket version of your
45:52book out on the subway?
45:54>> Okay.
45:54>> And if your book is like stop erectile
45:57dysfunction the erection problem, right?
45:59>> Like Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
46:01Yeah. Like like no more flatulence today
46:03or something like if that's if that's
46:05your book, it's going to be very
46:06difficult. Or if it's written by
46:08somebody where it's like, oh, really
46:10don't want to do that. So, and and this
46:12is the point where
46:15there are tons and tons and tons of
46:16people on the planet who have huge
46:18platforms that nobody respects.
46:21>> Mhm.
46:23>> And I've seen even within my 7-year
46:26career of doing this, the arc of people
46:29trade integrity for exposure and not be
46:34able to buy it back.
46:35>> Yeah.
46:36because there is no return policy on
46:38your integrity,
46:39>> on your reputation,
46:40>> and those people would give anything to
46:44be back in the cool kids club.
46:48>> I I mean, this is a like I love this
46:50entire train. Um,
46:55I was thinking like what what creates
46:56like what's what's timelessly not
46:58cringe, right? Like so like if cringe is
47:00the ultimate like what we don't want
47:02then like what would what is forever not
47:04cringe? And the only thing that I can
47:06like really think of is is just true
47:09authenticity, which is an overused word,
47:11but
47:13again, easy to say, hard to do. I think
47:16what is what is forever cringe on the
47:18equal opposite side is is pandering.
47:21Like whenever you're seen as someone
47:23who's only doing stuff for other
47:24people's opinion, approval, likes,
47:26whatever, especially double cringe when
47:29it's for your own personal gain. And so
47:32if the equal opposite of that is uh
47:34something that is to my personal
47:35detriment um that is truly something
47:38that I believe in, it honestly doesn't
47:40matter what it is because there are some
47:42people that probably believe things that
47:44I don't believe. But I genuinely think
47:47based on what I see that they genuinely
47:49believe it and it's and they don't
47:51really stand to gain much for believing
47:53it.
47:53>> Yeah.
47:54>> There's no cringe there. It's just like
47:56that fan that man [ __ ] believes that.
47:58And I think that um some of the you know
48:01some of the characters in our current
48:02you know politere and things like that
48:04like many people you know you say the
48:06word Trump and you have half the pe you
48:07know people who hate you and the other
48:08half that love you it's like I think
48:10most people agree that he believes what
48:13he says now whether you believe the
48:16content of what he's saying is a
48:17different story but mo like I don't
48:19think many people have called him as
48:21somebody who's like I think he's he
48:22doesn't really think that about himself
48:24like no I think he I think he really
48:25does and even I'm just going to push the
48:27edges because that's where you have to
48:28like explore the fringe. Look at someone
48:31like Kanye who's been borderline
48:33canceled for I mean multiple times,
48:35right? But like why is Kanye quote
48:38uncancellable? Cuz he hasn't been,
48:40right? Not really. Like if he came out
48:42tomorrow with a hits a hit album, I'll
48:44bet you it would [ __ ] sell because I
48:47think that at least for me, from what I
48:49see, I think he does what he believes.
48:52And people might be like he's mentally
48:54unstable. there's all these other but
48:55like no one thinks he's being fake and I
48:58think that like if that becomes the
49:00northstar of like I just never want to
49:02become cringe then it's just never be
49:05fake.
49:05>> What's next? What can people expect from
49:08you next few months?
49:09>> Um well all my effort is in the the
49:12school games. So we're uh I mean I can
49:14talk about them. I cannot talk about
49:15them. Yeah. Um so yeah. So I I just made
49:18the biggest investment of my life. I'm
49:19now co-owner of school.com. Um, it's a
49:22platform where you can build what you
49:23want to build, learn what you want to
49:24learn, and uh, schools will give you the
49:27tools, the community, and the education
49:28to help you. And so, we've actually
49:29created a whole thing where people can
49:32start all this stuff for free. Um,
49:34because I just I believe my whole
49:36platform has been education. That's what
49:37I believe in. Um, I think the education
49:39system is broken and um, teachers don't
49:42get paid or given the resources to
49:44actually teach students and, you know,
49:47they're supposed to teach tests that
49:49they know don't help students. Students
49:52get educated on stuff that doesn't
49:54matter in the real world and they go
49:55into amounts of debt for a piece of
49:56paper that doesn't make them anything to
49:58pay off the debt that they're in for the
49:59rest of their lives. And I just I hate
50:01all of it, which is why we started
50:02making the content that we do. And so,
50:04um, this is one big investment that I'm
50:06doing to try and make my small dent
50:08towards helping fix that. And I don't
50:10like I obviously talk about business.
50:12That's what I know. Okay. Um,
50:16but one person can't can't do that. Like
50:18I can't change I mean I can try, you
50:19know, but like I I don't I don't think
50:21one one person is going to change the
50:22world. And so um I wanted to invest in a
50:25platform that would help other people do
50:27that for one another. And so whether
50:29it's like you know how to paint and you
50:32want to teach people to paint, you know
50:33how to fix Hondas and you want to teach
50:35people to do that, like there are so
50:36many more useful skills that we can
50:37trade with one another. And I think Ben
50:38Franklin said there's no more high
50:40there's no more noble a deed than to
50:42help another know more
50:45to educate and I I wholeheartedly
50:48believe that. And so um I mean that's
50:50what I'm investing my my dollars and my
50:52time into. And so, um, yeah, that's
50:56that's the that's like my whole next
50:58year.
50:58>> Let's talk about experiential marketing.
51:00You're doing 13 million topline, 15
51:02million, uh, 50 million is the goal, and
51:05the thing that is holding you back is
51:07marketing, ironically. Uh,
51:13so, um,
51:14>> yeah, this is good.
51:15>> Yeah.
51:15>> Got [laughter] it.
51:16>> Helpful.
51:17>> Very helpful.
51:17>> Okay, cool. So, um, what do you do to
51:20get customers?
51:22Uh right now we're waiting for the phone
51:24to ring. Uh and we're doing paid search.
51:28>> Okay.
51:29>> Spending about $13,000
51:31uh a month, I believe.
51:33>> Okay. Just on keyword.
51:35>> I to be honest, I don't know because I
51:37don't have any metrics.
51:38>> Okay.
51:38>> So, we're posting and praying
51:40>> and and we are we're doing a ton of
51:41posting on social.
51:43>> Okay.
51:43>> We finally got to a point where we know
51:44how to create social.
51:45>> Okay.
51:46>> But nobody's looking at the result.
51:48>> Okay. And so I mean through the past day
51:51and two or two I've kind of figured out
51:53what we need to do.
51:54>> Okay.
51:55>> And we need to I think we have to go
51:57back and put some metrics together and
52:01uh really measure what it is that we're
52:02doing and and figure out
52:05>> how to do better.
52:06>> How many customers do you have right
52:07now?
52:07>> Uh we do about 20 to 25 a year.
52:10>> New?
52:11>> Uh I would say probably about 80% are
52:14new. 85% are new.
52:15>> Okay. So is it 80% churn? Is it a
52:17onetime thing?
52:18>> A lot of our stuff is one time.
52:20>> When you say experiential, is this like
52:21booth set events and things like that?
52:23>> Yeah, we do big mobile tours for like
52:25eBay. We're doing eBay live right now
52:26for them.
52:28>> Um,
52:29okay. So,
52:33yeah. I mean, for sure we need we need
52:34them just like because the first
52:36question be like, why can't we do more
52:37we're currently doing? You're like, I
52:38don't know what we're currently doing.
52:38So, it's like all right.
52:39>> We also have a bunch of mobile podcast
52:41studios. If you ever need them,
52:43>> you can use them. I let you let you use
52:45them for free. I wouldn't charge it.
52:46[laughter] Free of charge.
52:48>> Thank you. Yeah. Um, okay. So, uh, 13
52:53million a year, you got 20 to 25
52:55customers. 80% of the renew, so call it
52:5620 or new.
52:58>> Um, so you're selling like two customers
52:59a month, call it roughly. That's a
53:00little bit over, but something in there.
53:02So, every every two weeks you have a
53:03sale. How many conversations does it
53:05take you to get a sale?
53:06>> Again, I I don't have the metrics.
53:07>> Word.
53:08>> Okay.
53:08>> And another [laughter] thing another
53:10thing that's a little difficult for us
53:11is a lot of our customers are agencies,
53:13marketing agencies. They come up with
53:15the idea. Some of them don't even have
53:16the job yet.
53:17>> So, we're waiting on them to close the
53:18deal. And once they close the deal, they
53:19come to us and we produce it for them.
53:22>> So, they include you as a part of their
53:24package.
53:25>> Yes. Sometimes white labelled and
53:28sometimes they bring us to the table.
53:29>> Got it. Got it.
53:32>> So, I'll give you a frame of a different
53:34way to think about the business that
53:35might be higher leverage.
53:37>> Okay. So I would instead of thinking
53:39about acquiring the customers because
53:40you do have somewhat I would call it
53:42episodic work I would chunk up a level
53:45to thinking about the number of agencies
53:48that you onboard and then thinking of
53:51them as a distribution layer. And so the
53:53idea would be okay I know that this
53:56particular type of agency or style of
53:58agency should be able to net me five 10
54:01customers a year whatever the number is
54:02right. Um, and so then what we have is
54:06the cost of acquiring a node of
54:08distribution. And so if that agency, so
54:12it might be that your strategy should be
54:13outreach to agency owners and then
54:16showing them how much more money they
54:18make when they bundle your thing into
54:19their services. Um, and then as a
54:22result, they're going to b, you know,
54:24they'll sell they'll be your
54:25distribution layer for you. But where
54:27the issue that the business at least in
54:29my opinion one of the things that
54:30frightens me about the business and
54:31maybe keeps you up at night is that 80
54:33you have to sell 80% of the customers
54:35every single year just to you know just
54:37to get to where you were last year right
54:38and then you have 20% that renew and you
54:40have you have to grow from there. I I
54:42hate that right. Um and so I'd rather
54:45think like can I get every month one new
54:48agency that's going to send me one new
54:50customer a month. And so even though the
54:52logos are different at the at the
54:54customer level, at the distributor level
54:56it stays the same. And so they become my
54:58true real new customer. And so I create
55:00my customer journey around them making
55:02their lives easier. And then I just let
55:04them go bring the customers to me. And
55:06then that gives you another level of
55:07leverage, too. Because if I acquire, you
55:09know, let's simple math. Let's say each
55:11one of these agencies bring me one
55:12customer a month. If I can get one
55:13agency a month, by the end of the year,
55:15I have 12 new customers per month that
55:17I'm just doing some sort of re some sort
55:19of deal with them on. And then next
55:20month I'm at 13 and then 14. And so that
55:23stacks. Now obviously part of that's
55:24going to be how do we activate them?
55:26What is the affiliate journey or the
55:27distributor journey? Do we have a
55:29distributor churn? Um but just like a
55:31customer if we can get 80% of them
55:33activated and still referring us
55:34business next year that creates a
55:37stackable compounding business that
55:39makes the business valuable even though
55:41the nature of the work itself is one
55:43time.
55:44>> There's only one issue with that.
55:46>> Sure. is that um
55:47>> you let me go through the whole thing
55:48just for [laughter]
55:49>> is is no no you said some uh interesting
55:53things that I'm gonna think about um
55:56>> the agency since co now um are
55:59distributed all over the country
56:01>> and really our true customer is the
56:04producer for the agency
56:06>> right so the producer just got a job for
56:08Coca-Cola and need somebody to produce
56:09it for them that's when they call us
56:12>> so a lot of those people aren't
56:13full-time and a lot of a lot of my
56:15relationship ships really aren't with
56:17the agency, it's with that producer or
56:19the account team.
56:20>> I think it works the exact same way.
56:21Just swap agency for producer, but okay.
56:22Same same.
56:23>> Yeah. Cool. Thanks. Yeah.
56:25>> What's working right now?
56:29[sighs and gasps]
56:31>> Is that that depressing?
56:33>> Yeah. Right. [laughter]
56:34Um,
56:36I'll say
56:38on the content side, I'll go I'll go
56:40longs and shorts. I'll just kind of go
56:42by category. So from the long
56:44perspective, I still think idea is the
56:47the biggest arbitrage in terms of like
56:49what is the actual thing about um is
56:52still the number one thing like what's
56:54the what's the unique insight that you
56:56have is it'll it trumps the packaging it
56:59trumps the headline like if the thing
57:01like I I love this saying like you ever
57:03heard um too big to fail some like talk
57:05about the banking system I believe
57:07there's like a parallel one within
57:08content which is too good to fail like
57:11if the content is just except
57:12exceptional. Like if you look at the
57:14original Peterson clip that went like
57:16super viral, it's not like what's the
57:18hook and like what's the finish of the
57:20production on this thing. It's like a
57:21shitty iPhone angled while he's like
57:23having a debate with some students and
57:25it's got a gazillion views, right? And
57:28so I think the the elements that we're
57:31talking about earlier in terms of
57:32exceptionalism and to Sam's point about
57:35that engineer, I'm like, man, I could
57:36just listen to this guy talk about
57:37engines all day. There's it's like
57:39peeling back the layers. And so I I
57:43think about this a lot actually because
57:44it's like what's the real truth. So I I
57:48recently did the podcast with Tony
57:49Robbins, right? And I think that there's
57:52there's layers, right? And if you peel
57:55two or three layers back, then you get
57:57to like the real the real truth. Um
58:00which is like yes, as a force I want to
58:02make an impact and I want to help all
58:03these people and all stuff. It's like I
58:06also feel somewhat disconnected from it
58:08because it happens a lot. I get a lot of
58:09people come up and say like, "I made my
58:11first million dollars because of you or
58:12I changed my business, changed my life,
58:13I moved." And um and you do get hydonic
58:16adaptation. Like you just it just
58:17eventually is like, "Yeah, I mean, you
58:19followed the steps, man." Like, great. I
58:22mean, sell [ __ ] for more money, tell
58:23people about it, do a good job. Like, it
58:25works. Um but but just talking about
58:29that, I think
58:32people have some fear around like what's
58:34the truth below the truth. It's not like
58:35the thing above wasn't true. of course I
58:37want to make an impact but like what's
58:39the next level truth and maybe even the
58:41truth below that and I think that's
58:43where and that can be the truth I visit
58:45like from a philosophical personal level
58:47but there's also that that that depth of
58:49truth within making content or that
58:51depth of truth in terms of engineering
58:53like well let me tell you what I really
58:55had to think about I really had to think
58:57about the airflow versus the like and
58:59you just get layers and layers deeper
59:01and you're like man I never thought
59:03about that and you can only get that
59:05level of thinking with kind surface area
59:08of time on problem. And so in some ways
59:12you can demonstrate your expertise in a
59:14given domain based on the level of
59:16questions and the depth of the questions
59:18you have around it. Like if you just get
59:20into the pickup space or I don't want to
59:22say that the relationship space, excuse
59:23me. Um into the relationship, [laughter]
59:26they're like we're artists. Um,
59:29so [laughter] if you get in there like
59:31and you read a cursory like your your
59:32your your insights are going to be
59:34service level, but it's the two or three
59:37levels underneath of that where you get
59:38the kind of the unique insights where
59:39it's like I've really had some time to
59:41think about this when I traveled and I
59:42thought about it in different countries
59:43and I thought about it in different time
59:44periods of my life and you only get that
59:46surface area by sitting with some stuff.
59:48And I'll say that for me like the like
59:52do some of you guys have those moment
59:54like I'll call them inspired moments
59:55because who here makes content as your
59:57prime okay most of you guys. So, I'm
1:00:00sure there's there's kind of like 80% of
1:00:03the content you make, you're like, I
1:00:04have to feed the machine, right? Like,
1:00:06what's an interesting thing? I'll feed
1:00:07the machine. But then there's like 20%
1:00:09of the content you're like, I really I'm
1:00:12going to curse, but like I really [ __ ]
1:00:13with this right now. Like, this is very
1:00:15like I am actually very like not I think
1:00:17this would be interesting to other
1:00:19people, but like I am interested in
1:00:21this. And I think that that flip and it
1:00:24doesn't happen all the time, right? Cuz
1:00:25that one like you can't always pick when
1:00:26you're going to be like really into
1:00:28something. and it doesn't it doesn't uh
1:00:30coordinate with your Monday, Wednesday,
1:00:31Friday posting cadence at 10 a.m.,
1:00:34right? And so it's like you'll have
1:00:35these moments and I would just like
1:00:36encourage you that when those when those
1:00:38happen to try and recreate the
1:00:40conditions for it to occur. Not to say
1:00:42like oh I must become interested in
1:00:44something at 9:00 a.m. but just like
1:00:45what were the things that were common
1:00:47there like did I sleep well? Like these
1:00:49sounds like really basic stuff but I
1:00:51find them to be really important at the
1:00:53kind of high higher and higher levels of
1:00:54like creativity. It's like you got to
1:00:55sleep well, eat, you know, not worry
1:00:57about these other things. And I think
1:00:59Sam said earlier like I'm trying to
1:01:01eliminate things from my life. And it's
1:01:03like so you have space to think like you
1:01:05have to have capacity. You have to have
1:01:06excess capacity in order to create
1:01:08insights. Like you cannot create
1:01:10insights and be busy all the time. It
1:01:12just doesn't work.
1:01:12>> Yeah. Stephen King said he could never
1:01:14write a book unless all the drawers in
1:01:17his desk were clean. So it's he couldn't
1:01:20even see them. But it's like a unless
1:01:22all the little things that will nag you
1:01:24when you're in focus are like kind of
1:01:26taken care of, it's hard to get deep
1:01:28into that space. I'm kind of the same. I
1:01:31got to I got to do a lot of things
1:01:33before I can do something good
1:01:36basically. Um
1:01:39and that's the creative thing, right?
1:01:40Yeah.
1:01:41>> Has any have you guys uh watched the
1:01:43video I made of maker versus manager?
1:01:46Okay. I would like I live by that. So
1:01:48that has not changed. Like right now
1:01:50still four or five days a week of mine
1:01:53have no meetings whatsoever on them. So
1:01:56I can have time to like think of [ __ ]
1:01:59Um and sometimes that comes from like
1:02:01phone calls, conversations, just like
1:02:03just something that and that's where
1:02:05like all the big gains that I've had
1:02:06even in business have come from like
1:02:08insights during those moments. But like
1:02:09you have to create space
1:02:10>> exploring.
1:02:11>> Yeah. Just wandering like
1:02:12>> Yeah, exploring is key. Like sometimes
1:02:14when I get those things done, I'll just
1:02:17just browse around all kinds of random
1:02:20stuff.
1:02:20>> Yeah.
1:02:20>> And then some little spark happens and
1:02:23then you follow it a bit and Yeah.
1:02:26>> And you have to have time to follow it
1:02:28because if you like find it and then
1:02:29you're like, "Oh [ __ ] I'm I'm I'm now
1:02:31booked again." It's like it it vanishes.
1:02:33It like it goes away and it finds
1:02:34another person who can go pursue it. But
1:02:36that was the Sorry, that was real. But
1:02:38that's the that's the long stuff because
1:02:39I think that's the idea is the thing
1:02:41that matters the most and like you being
1:02:42interested in it. So I would just if you
1:02:44ever have to pick so like I think the
1:02:46Tony interview is just it's just an easy
1:02:47simple example because it just happened
1:02:49but like I did have that option in the
1:02:51beginning. I was like do I want to make
1:02:52this an algorithm headline driven like
1:02:55what are the 10 things that people find
1:02:57most interesting about Tony and then
1:02:59I'll just ask those in that order and
1:03:01whatever and it'll perform. And what was
1:03:03interesting is that he he's doing like
1:03:05five he does like five podcasts a year,
1:03:06I think, and he does them around his
1:03:08next event. That's that's his
1:03:09promotional schedule. And and this is no
1:03:12zero. Well, I won't even say it. I just
1:03:15think if you watch the other podcast,
1:03:16they look different. I'll just say that.
1:03:18Um
1:03:19>> was this intentional? Did you think
1:03:21about how this thing should go or did
1:03:24that was that an accident?
1:03:25>> No, I thought about it.
1:03:26>> Okay. I thought so. Yeah. So, right
1:03:28before I went up, Ila was like, and so
1:03:30this is my my wife inspired and she was
1:03:33like, I think you should just ask Tony
1:03:34whatever you want to talk ask him about.
1:03:37And so, I was I thought about it. I was
1:03:39like, "Fuck it." Yeah, let's do that.
1:03:42And so, it ended and then obviously the
1:03:43podcast is I've had more texts about
1:03:45that podcast than besides my launches.
1:03:47I've had more messages about that of
1:03:50than anything else, any other piece of
1:03:51content that I've made. Um, but I think
1:03:54it was just because like I was
1:03:55interested and I think just just that.
1:03:58So that's my that's my absolute essence
1:03:59of
1:04:00>> So we sell magic mushroom products
1:04:02online uh e-commerce.
1:04:04>> Okay.
1:04:05>> Um we do
1:04:06>> like drug mushrooms.
1:04:08>> Yeah, the psychedelic kind. Yeah.
1:04:09>> Cool.
1:04:10>> Uh we did about 650,000 in revenue last
1:04:13year.
1:04:13>> That was kind of our first big
1:04:14>> Is that legal?
1:04:16>> Uh it's it's a kind of a gray area. It
1:04:18depends where you're selling it.
1:04:19[laughter]
1:04:21Yeah. So
1:04:25[laughter]
1:04:27>> um
1:04:30>> it's [laughter] Yeah,
1:04:32>> you're good, dude. Don't worry about it.
1:04:33I'll help you out. That's fine.
1:04:35>> So we'd like to Yeah. grow the business
1:04:37to 3 million, 5 million.
1:04:39>> Have more people get high. I love the
1:04:40impact.
1:04:41>> Yeah,
1:04:42>> I'm I'm just kidding.
1:04:43>> I know it is. Yeah.
1:04:44>> Um so what what's stopping us? Uh it's
1:04:47basically um marketing. We have um
1:04:50[clears throat]
1:04:50>> social media. We got most of our
1:04:53>> um from Instagram most of our clients.
1:04:56Um
1:04:57>> do you make content or someone else make
1:04:58content?
1:04:58>> We make content.
1:04:59>> Okay. Is it you or is it just
1:05:00>> It's me and my business partner.
1:05:02>> Okay. Got it.
1:05:02>> Yeah. We make part
1:05:04>> medicine.
1:05:05>> Yes. Yeah.
1:05:05>> That's right.
1:05:06>> Yeah. So that was you know we were
1:05:08trying different things. Um last
1:05:10December we kind of had a few pieces of
1:05:11content that went viral. Um started
1:05:15getting a lot of uh a lot more customers
1:05:18from that. Okay. Um it's been a bit of a
1:05:21struggle just because of the the nature
1:05:22of the products, you know, getting
1:05:24strikes and flagged and account shut
1:05:26down
1:05:27>> even on the organic side.
1:05:29>> Yeah.
1:05:29>> So, yeah, you can't run ads, I'm
1:05:30guessing.
1:05:31>> Yeah. Okay.
1:05:33>> Yeah. I don't Yeah, we might be able to
1:05:34run ads. We just have to be careful
1:05:36language. Yeah. Yeah. [laughter]
1:05:37Exactly.
1:05:38>> Um so, we kind of Yeah, it's it's kind
1:05:41of like skating on thin ice. We want to
1:05:42diversify
1:05:43>> our marketing. Um, you know, we have a
1:05:46lot of good months and then dips down
1:05:48and depends on the content.
1:05:50>> So, yeah, [clears throat] we're trying
1:05:52to
1:05:54>> sell more [ __ ]
1:05:54>> Yeah. Sell more [ __ ] Exactly.
1:05:56>> Got it.
1:05:56>> So, uh, I mean, fundamentally, the thing
1:05:58that you're fighting against is
1:05:59irrelevance, right? So, just just to
1:06:00name the enemy is that no one knows you
1:06:02exist.
1:06:03>> And so, we just need to advertise more.
1:06:05That's literally it. Like, this is the
1:06:06lead's book, A Toz. And so, uh, of the
1:06:09core four, um, I'm assuming that the
1:06:12delivery of this is probably not that
1:06:13complex.
1:06:14>> No.
1:06:14>> Right. And so, what are you guys
1:06:16spending your time doing all day?
1:06:19>> We do make content. Uh, we also do all
1:06:21the day-to-day stuff. Uh, recently, we
1:06:23got a partner that's taking care of a
1:06:25lot of a lot of that now, so we have
1:06:26more time freed up.
1:06:28>> Um,
1:06:30>> but yeah, we
1:06:32>> make content.
1:06:33>> How much content do you make on what
1:06:34platforms? Uh just basically Instagram
1:06:37right now is is mostly um we don't we
1:06:40don't do a ton about content. We we post
1:06:43one reel a day, a couple stories.
1:06:45>> Um
1:06:46>> Uhhuh.
1:06:46>> So our plan is to make more content and
1:06:48go. Yeah. Yeah.
1:06:50>> I like that. It's a good plan.
1:06:51>> Yeah.
1:06:53>> Um how many hours per day are you
1:06:56spending on advertising? And I say that
1:06:58in the formal sense.
1:06:59>> Zero. We don't do any
1:07:00>> Well, yeah. Content being advertising.
1:07:02>> So um hours a day. Mhm.
1:07:06>> Probably three to four hours a day
1:07:08>> and you're making one real
1:07:09>> Well, okay. Maybe. Yeah, maybe it's not
1:07:11that much. [laughter]
1:07:14>> I'm just think we're we're figuring out
1:07:15like
1:07:16>> I'm only smoking one cigarette a day,
1:07:17doc. [laughter] Like I don't know where
1:07:19this black lung came from.
1:07:20>> Yeah. Yeah.
1:07:22>> Um yeah, we're just in the middle of
1:07:24like reorganizing how we do content,
1:07:26figuring out systems to do more,
1:07:28generating more ideas. Um, so, so yeah,
1:07:31>> if we were actually just making content
1:07:343, four hours a day, yeah, we'd have a
1:07:35lot more
1:07:36>> content.
1:07:37>> What are you doing
1:07:40>> that is more important than that now?
1:07:45>> Cuz that's obviously we should do. So
1:07:46like I'm trying like why is he not doing
1:07:48this?
1:07:48>> Yeah. Nothing.
1:07:49>> Okay.
1:07:50>> Yeah.
1:07:50>> Great. Told you one out of like three or
1:07:53four.
1:07:58>> Yeah. Yeah. That's [laughter] what I
1:08:00figured. Yeah.
1:08:00>> So, let's just do quick levels for you
1:08:02cuz I want you to have like some some
1:08:03easy takeaways. All right. So, number
1:08:04one is like you should be crossplatform
1:08:06on everything. All right. So, all the
1:08:07real should be Tik Tok, YouTube shorts,
1:08:09uh Instagram. Um, so that's like when
1:08:13you Facebook, uh, Facebook's huge by the
1:08:15way. Um, Facebook, LinkedIn video is
1:08:18blowing up right now. So, there's
1:08:20there's five that you should be X
1:08:22actually video is big there too. So,
1:08:23there's six.
1:08:24>> Mhm.
1:08:25>> Seven, whatever that this many, right?
1:08:28Uh so that's number one. Number two, um
1:08:32take the transcriptions of those, those
1:08:34become posts in of themselves.
1:08:36>> Take those transcriptions, make them
1:08:37into infographics, those become posts.
1:08:40>> All right, so we just went 7* 3 with 21x
1:08:43output. That's that's first lever,
1:08:45>> right?
1:08:46>> Second lever is on the production side.
1:08:48You guys are doing, you know, however
1:08:50much per day, one reel per day. I'm
1:08:51guessing you're like making it and
1:08:52posting it and making it and posting it.
1:08:54Does that sound about right? Okay. So
1:08:55here's this idea. We're gonna plan uh
1:08:58and so we're gonna plan the week and
1:09:00we're gonna think we're going to spend
1:09:02like two days just planning what we're
1:09:04going to make and then we're going to
1:09:05spend one day recording all of it
1:09:09>> and then you can just edit and then you
1:09:11can just get into a cadence that now you
1:09:13can post way more because I promise if
1:09:15you plan it out and you chunk the work
1:09:17because you're just going like going end
1:09:19to end is the most inefficient way to
1:09:21produce anything. Mhm. And so it's like
1:09:23it's much easier to say, "I'm in idea
1:09:25mode. Let me research hooks. Let me
1:09:27research trending topics. Let me uh
1:09:29memes and formats. Great. I've got all
1:09:31these ideas in. Here's all the the
1:09:33shorts that I want to make."
1:09:35>> Now, okay, now that I have those ideas,
1:09:37I'm going to go film them. Now, we're
1:09:38going to go edit them right
1:09:41>> and so that's like I mean, honestly, if
1:09:42you just do that, you'll probably
1:09:44triple.
1:09:44>> Yeah. Yeah.
1:09:46>> And your conversion is what? They hit
1:09:48your link and then go buy.
1:09:49>> Yeah.
1:09:50>> Yeah. Yeah. So, add a CTA at the end of
1:09:51your organics, go to Many Chat.
1:09:53>> Yeah. The thing about CTAs is that we
1:09:56don't really do CTAs just because we
1:09:58don't want to get flagged and things
1:10:00like that. So, a lot of our content is,
1:10:03you know, it's we grow our own
1:10:04mushrooms, so we post mushroom content
1:10:06that way. We do fun
1:10:07>> fun videos, you know, recipes.
1:10:09>> The CTA is going to change whether or
1:10:11not you
1:10:12>> I mean, you're talking about mushrooms,
1:10:13man.
1:10:15>> I think if you're like, "Hey, here's a
1:10:16free mushroom guide to figure out how,
1:10:17you know, which one's the best for your
1:10:18high or whatever." Yeah. [clears throat]
1:10:21>> Okay.
1:10:21>> You know, I think like I like
1:10:22diagnostics as a as a lead magnet
1:10:25because
1:10:25>> it helps people figure out where they're
1:10:27at, but it it it gives you like endless
1:10:29hooks on the front end because I don't
1:10:30want to have I don't have to create a
1:10:31new lead mag for every piece of content,
1:10:32right? I want to make one hero piece,
1:10:34scaling road map, etc. that all you do
1:10:38is you chunk in, chunk out. So, what I
1:10:39mean is like this applies for everybody.
1:10:42Uh it's like this is what you This is
1:10:45like just go really deep on like the
1:10:46flower. I don't know [ __ ] about
1:10:48mushrooms, but like the flower head or
1:10:50whatever is inside mushrooms, [laughter]
1:10:51right?
1:10:51>> Fruing body.
1:10:52>> Yeah. The fruit of the butt. Is that
1:10:53what you just said?
1:10:54>> The fruing body.
1:10:55>> The fruing body.
1:10:56>> It's called That's what it's called.
1:10:58>> So, if it's got if this thing's got a
1:10:59good-look body, right? And it's fruity,
1:11:01right? And [laughter]
1:11:04it's like I just talked about this one
1:11:05element, but there's 16 other things
1:11:07that you have to think about when you're
1:11:09looking for your first high, right? And
1:11:11so, and so download the thing and then
1:11:13we'll send it to you. And then obviously
1:11:15inside of there, all of that's going to
1:11:16be hyperl to your store,
1:11:18>> right?
1:11:19>> Or you can have the the link just go
1:11:20straight to your store to an article
1:11:21that then links to the shop. Either way
1:11:23works,
1:11:24>> uh, what do you think about doing more
1:11:26long form content like podcast?
1:11:28>> But right now, you're not making short
1:11:29form. So, let's do that.
1:11:30>> Okay. Just do that. Yeah. Okay.
1:11:32>> Do the first thing.
1:11:32>> Do the first thing
1:11:33>> and then do the second.
1:11:34>> Okay.
1:11:35>> Because the thing is is it's harder to
1:11:37make longs than it's just make short.
1:11:38And so once you learn how to make
1:11:39shorts, longs is just many of those
1:11:41together on a theme.
1:11:42>> Mhm. It's all
1:11:44>> What about uh live and interactive? I I
1:11:46know you mentioned that recently. Doing
1:11:48more of that.
1:11:48>> You're doing one short a day. Yeah.
1:11:50>> I say we go way more than that.
1:11:52>> Yeah. [laughter]
1:11:54>> I I mean just do that. Just do that.
1:11:58>> Okay.
1:11:58>> If once you do that consistently for
1:12:00like 3 to 6 months, then like that's
1:12:02systematized. We'll do something else on
1:12:04top. It's just layers.
1:12:05>> Layers. Yeah.
1:12:06>> Because one of the big things, this
1:12:07happens for everybody is like once you
1:12:08get good at some advertising channel, if
1:12:10you're the one who's leading it and
1:12:10you're like, "Oh, I'm gonna try this
1:12:11live stream thing." All of a sudden,
1:12:12these ones like bomb. So, in order to
1:12:15truly scale advertising over a long
1:12:16period of time,
1:12:17>> you have to literally lay this brick
1:12:19foundation and then it's working.
1:12:22>> Then you lay the next one. And most
1:12:23people just they jump from brick to
1:12:24brick and they never actually get any
1:12:26foundation. So, it never stacks.
1:12:27>> Okay, that makes sense.
1:12:28>> Cool.
1:12:29>> Okay.
1:12:29>> Appreciate you.
1:12:30>> Thank you. If you like this video and
1:12:31you're a business owner who wants to
1:12:32break through your current revenue
1:12:33ceiling, I distilled every lesson from
1:12:35scaling 10 businesses past 10 million
1:12:37and three businesses past 100 million
1:12:38into a completely free scaling road map
1:12:40that I've used to go from 0 to 1, 0 to
1:12:4210, and 0 to 100 plus. And so you can
1:12:45click here and you can check it out.
1:12:46Again, absolutely free. And since you're
1:12:48a business owner, appreciate you and uh
1:12:49enjoy.

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