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What The Neighbors Saw | Full Episode — Transcript

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0:00♪♪
0:09-As a career detective, this case is very unique.
0:13Little did I know that this would lead
0:16to one of the most fascinating cold case homicides
0:20that I'd ever been a part of.
0:22-How did this case begin for you?
0:25-So on December 3rd of 2017,
0:28the sheriff's department received a 911 call
0:32from a homeowner reporting
0:34that their family dog brought back a human skull.
0:39-It came back with a human skull?
0:40-Yes.
0:43And it had an obvious gunshot wound
0:46to the back of the head.
0:50We kind of organized a grid search,
0:52and within minutes,
0:53located the clandestine grave
0:56right off in this area.
1:01So, Peter, this is the area right up here.
1:03-I'll follow you.
1:05Now, this is quite a thicket, isn't it?
1:07-It's a little thicket.
1:09If you see this little indention in the soil right here,
1:13that's where the skeletal remains were found.
1:16-We had a very circumstantial case.
1:18We literally have human bones,
1:21human remains with a gunshot wound to the head.
1:24And at that point, is this a murder or is this a suicide?
1:28-We have a model of a human skull.
1:30Can you show us where that wound was?
1:32-It's pretty much, uh, towards the back rear of the skull.
1:38-When you look at these scattered bones,
1:40are they telling you a story? -Yes.
1:43It tells me that it's most likely the story of murder.
1:47We were reviewing missing persons cases
1:49throughout the Midwest,
1:51but nothing was definitive to who this victim was.
1:58-When the cases come to the DNA Doe Project,
2:01everything's already been exhausted.
2:03Genetic genealogy is the last resort.
2:06So we use the DNA to look at the matches,
2:10and we can build family trees that way
2:12and figure out the identities of people.
2:16In this case, that person is Gary Albert Herbst.
2:23-The victim, Gary, was from Scott County, Minnesota.
2:26We located the home where Gary had last lived.
2:32Some of the neighbors who still lived in the neighborhood
2:35had reported some --
2:37remembering some activity back in 2013
2:42that they found suspicious.
2:45-It's pouring down rain.
2:47It's probably 11:30 at night.
2:49Pitch black, dark.
2:51-Something catches your eye across the Herbst house.
2:55Chad, what do you see?
2:56-I see the neighbors scrubbing the floors.
2:59I see them scrubbing the walls.
3:02-We saw them bringing out black garbage bags.
3:04They eventually brought out a rolled up carpet.
3:07I didn't know what I was looking at.
3:09I had no idea.
3:12And I turned to Chad
3:14and I was like, "What is going on?"
3:16And Chad looked at me and he said,
3:19"Kaia, I think they finally killed him."
3:22♪♪
3:28♪♪
3:34♪♪
3:40♪♪
3:46♪♪
3:53♪♪
3:59♪♪
4:03♪♪
4:11-It was in June of 2020,
4:13when Linda Dane learned the disturbing circumstances
4:17of how her long lost brother Gary's skull
4:20had been found by a dog
4:22in rural Barron County, Wisconsin.
4:25-Yeah, it's kind of a... eerie-type thing to think of,
4:30but it still led to finding out what happened,
4:34the truth.
4:37-Linda says Gary, who was 57 when he went missing,
4:40was a loner with a difficult personality
4:43who rarely saw his own extended family,
4:46which is why pictures that exist of him
4:49are from his younger years.
4:51Seen here with his wife Connie.
4:53-He could be stubborn. He could be crabby.
4:56-It had been years since Linda and Gary had spoken,
4:59and in 2013,
5:01she learned from Connie that he had vanished
5:04walking out on her and their son Austin,
5:06seen here as a teenager.
5:09What did you think of that? -I was shocked.
5:10I -- I didn't know what to think.
5:12-Linda says she found it strange
5:15that Connie had not reported his disappearance to police.
5:19-And it's like, okay, did you file a missing person's report?
5:22Did you report it? Did you do anything?
5:24And they did nothing.
5:26-What was her reason for not reporting
5:27that her husband was missing? -She didn't --
5:29she didn't give us a reason.
5:30-At Linda and her family's urging,
5:33Connie filed this missing person's report
5:36with the Elko New Market Police Department in Minnesota,
5:39where the Herbsts lived.
5:41In the report, Connie said Gary "grabbed a suitcase"
5:45and left in an "older gray Honda vehicle,"
5:48but she claimed
5:49she "did not get a look at who was driving."
5:54Six years would pass
5:56before an investigative genetic genealogist, Robin Espensen,
6:00would be able to construct a family tree
6:03that led to identifying the skull.
6:06-We knew that we had found the identity of our Doe
6:09as Gary Albert Herbst.
6:12-Gary Herbst was originally born in North-Central Wisconsin.
6:17We located family members of his in South-Central Minnesota.
6:22-That's when Detective Jeff Nelson
6:24from the Barron County Sheriff's Office
6:27tracked down Austin and Connie
6:29at the retirement community where they both worked.
6:32-I think it was a little bit of a surprise to them,
6:34because we actually found out that both Connie Herbst
6:37and her son, Austin, worked at a nursing home.
6:41We basically walked in unannounced
6:43and met with both Connie and Austin.
6:47-When you told Connie that you had found her missing husband,
6:52likely had found him,
6:54was she excited about the news or was she stoic about it?
6:56-Both of them were very stoic.
6:58Never -- never even commented,
7:00"Well, at least we know it's him."
7:03It's like they just glassed over it.
7:07-Brent Peterson, a special agent
7:09with the Minnesota Bureau of Criminal Apprehension,
7:13joined Jeff Nelson to interview Connie.
7:16-She was not uncooperative.
7:17She was just trying to be helpful.
7:20Um, at least that was the appearance.
7:22-Did you get into the issue about why she didn't report
7:24her husband as being missing?
7:27-Yeah, that -- that was, um, a red flag from the beginning.
7:31-Here's Connie's answer about why she didn't report it.
7:35-...because he left on his own, I said I didn't think I had to.
7:38-Connie told investigators she wasn't surprised
7:41Gary walked out on them
7:43because he had a troubled lifestyle.
7:46-She described Gary as a drug user.
7:49He would use drugs and spend all their money.
7:52He just was described to us
7:54as just being generally kind of a...volatile,
7:57angry, unpleasant person.
7:59How was he with Austin?
8:02-Um, up until the age of 10, great.
8:06But at the age of 10, when Gary would start
8:09his yelling and screaming at me...
8:11Austin would step in between.
8:13-Okay. -"Don't you yell at my mom."
8:16-Did he ever hit you
8:17in the 30 plus years you guys were married?
8:20-Once or twice. -Yeah.
8:23-One time he hit me pretty hard,
8:24black and blue on my shoulder.
8:27The other time, he actually didn't hit me.
8:28He pushed me and I broke my toe.
8:31-In his interview, Austin told investigators
8:34his father had become enraged the day he left
8:38and later learned he had stolen $5,000 in cash
8:42and his mother's wedding ring.
8:44-I heard him banging around in the master bedroom.
8:47I'm like, okay, what's going on?
8:49Looked in. He was packing a suitcase.
8:51He's like, "I'm leaving."
8:53And yeah, he got in --
8:54some guy pulled up, picked him up.
8:56-Connie told investigators she was at the library that day
9:00and remembered getting a frantic call from her son.
9:04-...he goes, "Dad left! Dad left!
9:06He got in a vehicle with somebody."
9:08-Investigators soon realized
9:10that Connie may have lied to them.
9:13Why?
9:15Because in her missing person's report,
9:16Connie had said she was home when Gary walked out.
9:20-We're suspicious of their stories right away.
9:24So there was a lot of things -- this didn't match up.
9:26-Connie added to investigators' suspicions
9:29when she gave yet another new detail.
9:32-...the 40 caliber gun was gone...
9:36and that was mine.
9:37-Connie had never mentioned Gary had stolen her gun
9:41when she first reported him missing.
9:44-So there's a lot of oddities that she's telling.
9:46-Had she said something, in your mind,
9:47that was particularly incriminating?
9:50-I wouldn't say incriminating, but...
9:53I strongly felt she had...
9:56certainly knowledge of his murder.
9:59I figured she had some form of involvement.
10:02-So investigators redoubled their efforts
10:05to try to learn more.
10:07-So there's a lot of working pieces going on.
10:09-Several months passed before investigators were ready
10:12to interview Connie and Austin a second time.
10:16This time, they dug deeper into Connie's claims of abuse.
10:21-So, you know,
10:23your mom talked of some abuse issues
10:25in the family,
10:26uh, how you were very protective of her.
10:31-Yeah. -And -- it, we understand that.
10:34-But it was more the fact that I hated
10:36when he would sit there and yell at her,
10:37and would upset her.
10:39-And the more investigators questioned Austin,
10:42the more he began to blame his father
10:44for his own demise.
10:46-Yeah. He was an angry guy and stuff, but
10:48I never expected that to get to the point
10:49where someone would want to kill him.
10:52-Directing attention toward a mysterious man with tattoos
10:56he says his father drove away with.
10:59-...you remember a guy with a black shirt and tattoos.
11:02-That's about it. That's as far as I can get.
11:04And that I got a really uneasy sense about him.
11:06That was it.
11:07♪♪
11:16♪♪
11:20-Gary Herbst went missing in 2013,
11:23a dog found his skull in 2017,
11:26and by June of 2020,
11:28investigators suspected his own family,
11:31his wife Connie and son Austin Herbst,
11:34were somehow involved in Gary's disappearance and murder.
11:39-...there's some -- some follow up questions
11:42and information we -- we need to gather
11:44to try to piece all this together.
11:46-And during their second interview,
11:48they consented to a polygraph.
11:51-The investigators from Wisconsin
11:52had arranged with the FBI.
11:54They both agreed to take polygraphs.
11:58-Lie detector tests
11:59are generally not admissible in court,
12:01but investigators will use them as a tool
12:04to judge an individual's credibility.
12:07What were the results?
12:09-Connie did not show any signs of deception,
12:11but Austin did.
12:13-An investigator from the FBI confronted Austin.
12:17-So I'm -- I'm very convinced...
12:19that you clearly know what happened.
12:22-I don't. I'm telling you... -Austin.
12:24You can't walk away here saying you don't know anything
12:28because you clearly... know something.
12:32-No.
12:34-Whatever it is, you gotta tell me.
12:36-I suspect that the guy in the truck
12:38wasn't exactly...friendly.
12:40I just -- The look I got from him...
12:41He was a little sketchy.
12:43-Either you're involved with your mom
12:45in killing your father,
12:47or you're involved with someone else
12:49in killing your father.
12:51-I'm not involved with it.
12:52I'm just going to tell you getting my mom involved,
12:54that is pretty out of this world.
12:57-Detectives say Austin continued
12:59to draw the investigators' attention
13:01toward the man with tattoos
13:04he says picked up his father that day.
13:06-...tell me what -- describe what you're talking about
13:09when you talk about the look of him.
13:11-Tats, came out with a black h-shirt
13:14that was all ripped up.
13:15-Doesn't make sense. None of this makes sense.
13:19-The first interview, he recalls his dad
13:21getting into a vehicle and leaving.
13:23Then that changed to
13:25he remembered some heavily tattooed man
13:28that looked, in his words, to be some sort of criminal
13:31that was the driver of a vehicle that his dad got into.
13:34So the story changed and morphed each time you talked with him.
13:38-Investigators suspected Austin's story was pure fiction.
13:43-I just find way too many inconsistencies
13:46in your stories.
13:48I mean, with your story, with your mom's story...
13:51-And did you feel that the story was rehearsed?
13:55-Certainly.
13:56-That he was trying to recall a script.
13:58-Script.
14:02-But a feeling isn't evidence.
14:04And investigators had no choice but to let Connie and Austin go.
14:10Next, they headed to the family's old neighborhood
14:13and former home.
14:15-Ironically, to a T,
14:17all the neighbors remembered Gary very well.
14:20-Detective Nelson says that, to a person,
14:22they described Gary as a mean, horrible human being.
14:27-We repeatedly heard the term
14:30"the biggest [Bleep] that you'll ever meet."
14:32If he was mad at a neighbor,
14:34apparently he had a pipe organ,
14:36and he would set up big speakers in the windows,
14:39and he would blast pipe organ music
14:42into the neighbor's house.
14:43In the wintertime,
14:44when he would get mad at a neighbor,
14:46he would take his snowblower over
14:48and purposely blow and fill people's yards up
14:50in the middle of the night. -With snow?
14:52-With snow.
14:56-He was...just an evil person.
15:00-Neighbors Kaia and Chad Kraml's house
15:03was right behind the Herbst house.
15:07They say Gary often yelled at their two daughters
15:10and was caught secretly recording them on video.
15:17-I looked, and in their back window
15:19you could see the red light from the camera on,
15:21and I walked out there and I could see the camera
15:24and Gary behind the camera. -This is a video camera?
15:27-A video camera. Like, a camcorder.
15:28And he was just staring at me blatantly, like, on purpose,
15:33wanting to, you know, almost show me up
15:36and be like, "Yeah, I'm recording."
15:37And I sat there and I was raising my hand like,
15:39are you kidding me?
15:41-Chad filed an incident report with police.
15:43It sounds like this has a psychological component to it.
15:47Like he was messing with your mind.
15:49-Absolutely. I feel like he wanted power,
15:52and he wanted everyone to know that he had that power.
15:55He most definitely tried to exercise that power
15:58by messing with people, neighbors...
16:03-Another neighbor, Jason Grimm,
16:05says he experienced that firsthand
16:08when Gary complained about the time he was snow blowing.
16:12-He came out and started screaming and shouting at me,
16:15telling me I was going to flood his basement.
16:18-Did you feel like he was a little dangerous?
16:21-I never feared him,
16:23just surely because it was all bark and no bite.
16:27-Did you feel he was a dangerous man?
16:29-Absolutely. -And did you, the same way?
16:32-Absolutely.
16:34-And when investigators interviewed Dee Hamlin,
16:37the new owner of the house where Gary and his family lived,
16:41they learned something that would confirm
16:43their suspicions about Connie and Austin.
16:47-Over in this area right here,
16:49before the closets were put in,
16:51somewhere over here,
16:53there was a big red stain.
16:55♪♪
17:05♪♪
17:08-When investigators canvassed Gary Herbst's old neighborhood,
17:11they uncovered a trove of new clues
17:14from the time around his disappearance.
17:17-People didn't like him, were afraid
17:19because he was very confrontational.
17:23-Neighbors Chad and Kaia Kraml recalled a storm.
17:28-Thunder, lightning, everything. Like, it was crazy.
17:32-And unusual activity in Gary's backyard.
17:37-It was maybe midnight-ish and we looked out the window.
17:40-I see a truck backed in the backyard.
17:45-The truck was pulled right up to the sliding glass door,
17:49which we knew was super strange
17:51because Gary was very particular with his yard.
17:55He did not like anything out of order.
17:59-Chad and Kaia told investigators
18:02they remembered seeing Austin and Connie
18:04scrubbing the floors in the middle of the night.
18:07You could see directly from those windows into their house?
18:11-Absolutely.
18:12-And loading large garbage bags into Gary's truck.
18:16-They were also carrying out a carpet or some sort of rug
18:20and also throwing it in the back of the truck.
18:22So we were watching the scene
18:25and I turned to Chad
18:26and I was like, "What is going on?"
18:29And Chad looked at me and he said,
18:32"Kaia, I think they finally killed him."
18:36-And did the two of you ever think, "We should share
18:39what we've witnessed with the police?"
18:41-Absolutely not. -No.
18:42And as a matter of fact -- -Because?
18:44-He was horrible.
18:45-And soon after that night,
18:47they say Connie and Austin seemed completely different.
18:51-It was good.
18:52It was fun to see them actually happy.
18:54-A few weeks later, their neighbors saw them
18:57setting up a yard sale.
18:59-So everybody started filtering over there,
19:03myself included,
19:04and we were looking at all of the things
19:07that they had for sale.
19:08-And what was for sale?
19:10-Men's clothing, men's shoes,
19:13um, there were tools, ammo boxes.
19:17-Now, did you ask her, "Where's Gary?"
19:20-Yes, and the answer was
19:23that he didn't want to be married anymore,
19:25and he left.
19:26-Jason says he scored a bargain.
19:29-I did. I bought a riding lawn tractor.
19:32-Neighbors say Austin and Connie
19:34began happily walking the neighborhood,
19:36offering up baked cookies.
19:39And do you think his disappearance
19:41in some ways liberated their lives?
19:43-Absolutely. Their steps were lighter.
19:47It was nice not to have him around.
19:49-All of a sudden, Connie and Austin
19:50would be out in the yard stopping and greeting people
19:53where none of that happened prior to the date
19:56that Gary allegedly left.
19:59[ Train horn blares ]
20:01-The next break in the case
20:02came when investigators obtained a search warrant
20:05for the former Herbst house
20:07and notified the new owner, Dee Hamlin,
20:09that they would be bringing in a cadaver dog
20:12along with her handler, police officer Dan Moldenhauer,
20:16to see if she could detect the scent of human remains.
20:19So this officer said
20:21there may have been someone killed inside the house...
20:22-Yeah. -...and they wanted
20:23a dog to come in to see if they picked up any...
20:26-Yeah. Exactly. -...odor of death.
20:27-I go, "Absolutely."
20:30-When you got that call and you brought Radar out here,
20:33this is the very house you came to, correct?
20:35-Correct. -Radar is the cadaver dog
20:38who searched Dee's house.
20:40She came back to the scene along with her handler
20:43to show us what she did that day.
20:46-Boy, Radar wants to get inside, I'll tell you.
20:49And I follow her.
20:50[ Bells jingling ]
20:53-I was present when the dog originally came in.
20:56I was there for the first sniff around.
21:00-Hamlin says something in the garage
21:02caught Radar's attention.
21:04-Radar concentrated heavily against this wall
21:08and on the brick behind the drywall pieces and the boxes.
21:13-Radar, find it.
21:14-Radar's search continued inside the house.
21:17-Radar would run
21:20from space to space and room to room,
21:22almost like he had a pattern.
21:24And then we went downstairs and that's where he slowed down.
21:30-According to Radar's handler,
21:32the dog detected the odor of human remains
21:35around that red stain Dee had seen.
21:38-She went straight to this room,
21:40ignored every other thing else, came back,
21:42went along the wall, and then came to the corner
21:44where that closet door is.
21:46-That wasn't the only area that Radar was interested in.
21:50-She had a lot of odor here.
21:51I mean, she checked all the walls
21:54before she came back and sat.
21:57-So there was definitely
21:59a presence of some sort of material,
22:02the guess is blood,
22:03around this sliding door? -Yes.
22:05-Crime scene investigators tested the spots with luminol,
22:09which indicated the presence of blood
22:11in the areas where the cadaver dog alerted.
22:14When you have luminol literally lighting up,
22:16what is it suggesting to you?
22:18-Well, it's certainly consistent
22:20and corroborates what the neighbors saw.
22:22We believed Gary was most likely murdered
22:25inside that particular house.
22:27-That's when they called Connie and Austin in
22:30for a third interview.
22:32-So we went to your old house on Wagner Way...
22:37and just had a look...
22:39trying to piece together Gary's kind of last movements.
22:44And, um, there was some blood. -Okay.
22:48-Connie said Gary, who was a machinist,
22:50often worked on projects
22:52and sometimes accidentally cut himself.
22:56-Usually it was his fingers.
22:57-This blood that we're finding, um, is a bit more significant
23:02than just a little cut on the finger.
23:04-Oh, that I wouldn't know.
23:06-Investigators also questioned Connie
23:09about what the neighbors reported seeing.
23:12-Some witnesses saw what they thought
23:13was a rolled up rug
23:15being loaded in the back of the pickup.
23:17-Um, no. I don't know.
23:21We didn't have any carpet, just up in the living room.
23:24-Her body language was -- to me, was like she was defeated.
23:28-Phil Nawrocki,
23:29a captain with the Scott County Sheriff's Office,
23:32was also present at the interrogation.
23:35-Like, as long as I can continue to deny everything,
23:39I'm going to be okay.
23:41Um, but she didn't get rattled.
23:44Very soft spoken.
23:45-Did she sense she was in real trouble,
23:48do you think? -Yes.
23:49I think she knew at that point
23:51that all the evidence
23:52was starting to gather up against her and Austin.
23:56-Investigators continued to press Connie.
24:00-So it sounds like Gary
24:04was a little psychologically abusive with you guys.
24:09-Yeah. -What about physical abuse?
24:12-One time, he, um -- well, he hit me.
24:16-Yeah.
24:17-Not that I didn't probably deserve it.
24:19'Cause I got pushed too far.
24:21-For Austin's interview, cameras were rolling
24:25as he was grilled by Detective Jeff Nelson.
24:28-Do you feel that he was the husband
24:30that he should have been to your mother?
24:31-No.
24:33-And you stepped in and intervened several times,
24:34did you not? -Yeah.
24:36-Okay. You became her protector?
24:38-Yep. -Okay.
24:40Which I would have to believe culminated in July of 2013,
24:43Will you took action to protect your mom.
24:46Did you pull the trigger and put the round
24:49in the back of your father's head?
24:51-But no matter how many times Austin was asked that question,
24:54he never answered it.
24:57Once again, Connie and Austin
24:59were allowed to leave the police station.
25:02-And that was a strategic plan that we had come up with,
25:05knowing full well that if we needed to arrest them,
25:08we'd be able to find them later.
25:09-Now, investigators believed they had enough evidence
25:13to bring the case to prosecutors.
25:16-There was some reluctance. There was no confession.
25:19It's simply a circumstantial case,
25:21albeit we felt it was a very good one.
25:27-And on November 19th, 2020, around 7 a.m.,
25:31Connie, then 62 years old, and Austin, 26,
25:36were taken into custody.
25:39-I tell Austin that he is under arrest
25:42for the murder of his father.
25:44-The two would eventually be charged
25:46with second-degree murder.
25:48-Connie had already declined the final interview with us
25:52and had been taken away to the jail.
25:55-But this time, Austin was ready
25:57to explain everything to investigators...
26:00-Do you remember where you shot him?
26:03-Yeah.
26:05-...and later, to "48 Hours."
26:07And what do you do with his body?
26:09-I sling him over my shoulder and I walk into the forest.
26:12♪♪
26:22♪♪
26:29-Was it you or your mom who pulled the trigger?
26:32-For more than four hours, Austin Herbst was grilled
26:36about his role in his father's murder.
26:38-What's it gonna be, Austin?
26:42Was it you or your mom?
26:44-Did you get the gun, Austin? Yes or no?
26:48Is that fair to say that you think that you protected her
26:50and you feel that you protected her that day?
26:54Yes or no? -Finally, Austin broke.
26:57-He said something to the effect of,
26:59"I might as well tell you what I did."
27:01I said, "Austin, that's what we've been asking for."
27:04-On that day, when my mom came home,
27:06he flew off the handle.
27:08So I grabbed the gun and ended the problem.
27:13-Austin would tell investigators
27:14all about what happened that day.
27:16And now, for the first time,
27:19he is sharing his story with "48 Hours."
27:23-My father, Gary Herbst, was vindictive
27:26to an extreme that I have never seen
27:30in anybody else.
27:33He was cruel. He was petty. He was violent.
27:38-Did you reach an age in which you came to fear your father,
27:42or you felt like you were walking on eggshells?
27:45-Very early -- I'd say by six or seven years old,
27:48that fear was present.
27:50-Austin says the emotional road he traveled
27:53that led to killing his own father
27:55was filled with acts of violence and abuse,
27:58beginning when he was a boy,
28:01details he didn't share in earlier interviews
28:04with investigators.
28:06-He proceeded to put a cigarette out on my arm
28:08and I screamed and cried and ran.
28:10I did something wrong, picked me up by my throat
28:13and threw me, like, down a flight of stairs.
28:17-Austin says his mother was treated even more brutally.
28:22-Terribly. Unbelievably so.
28:24Physical abuse on a weekly, sometimes daily basis.
28:29Uh, always demeaning, always negative.
28:32-Did you ever see a time in which he drew blood
28:34from your mother?
28:36From striking her?
28:37-Yes.
28:38He punched her right in the face.
28:39Pure black and blue.
28:41The next day, she had blood leaking from her mouth.
28:43-Psychological abuse, physical abuse?
28:46-Yep.
28:47-You swear on everything you believe in
28:48you're telling me the truth?
28:50-Absolutely.
28:51-Austin, just 19 years old when he murdered his father,
28:55recalls that tragic day,
28:57July 8th, 2013.
29:00-The start of the day seemed very normal to me.
29:03-Austin remembers playing video games that afternoon
29:06when his dad returned home from work.
29:09Had he been drinking that day? -Yeah.
29:11He drank regularly.
29:13Around about, I'd say --
29:15I think it was, like, 2:00 or 3:00,
29:16my mom came home and...
29:20she and him got into an argument about money.
29:23There was yelling. I tried my best to protect her.
29:28I am a wall. I will not let this continue.
29:31-Austin says his mom went to the public library.
29:34-My father at this point was laying on the couch,
29:36half asleep.
29:38and as I walked out,
29:39I noticed that that skirting was, like, crumpled up.
29:42I lifted up the skirting and I saw the firearm.
29:46-It's a pistol. -Yes.
29:47-Austin says his father had never brought a gun
29:50into the living room before.
29:52-In my heart of hearts,
29:54I knew that my mother's life was in danger
29:56and, by extension, my own.
29:58It all just culminated, like, oh my God,
30:00he's going to kill her.
30:03All these thoughts ran through my head
30:05almost instantaneously
30:06and I reached underneath the couch,
30:09I grabbed the gun,
30:11I pointed it at him and I pulled the trigger.
30:14You know, it was surreal almost, right?
30:17Like, the bang went off, my hearing popped and...
30:23...it was just immediately --
30:24there was almost, like, a numbness.
30:25-I've never asked this question
30:27in all my years on "48 Hours."
30:30What was it like to pick up that pistol,
30:33point it at your father's head and pull the trigger?
30:39-It broke me.
30:41It -- it changed who I am irrevocably.
30:43I can never be the person I was
30:45or even the person I would have become
30:48had that never happened.
30:49-At that moment, are you anguished
30:52over what you had done?
30:53Are you horrified?
30:55-I -- There was a level of relief,
30:57knowing that I would never again have to have that fear,
31:01having to worry about my mother's life,
31:03having to worry about my life.
31:05-Austin says he called his mother at the library
31:07and told her to come home.
31:09And how does your mom react to this scene?
31:13-Sort of the same way I did.
31:15Sort of just stunned.
31:17-Austin says he placed his father's body,
31:20wrapped in a rug, in the trunk of their car.
31:23They drove into neighboring Wisconsin.
31:25What are you and your mom talking about?
31:29-We aren't.
31:30At that point, you know, the adrenaline's still rushing.
31:33It's still fear.
31:36-About two hours later,
31:38Austin and his mom pulled onto a field
31:41next to a patch of trees.
31:43He says they dumped Gary's body at this spot and then fled.
31:48-I figured that wildlife would take care of the rest.
31:51-What do you mean, wildlife take care of --
31:54-Bears, foxes, they would devour the body.
31:56The bones would be scattered.
31:58Nobody would know.
31:59-That seems a bit barbaric. -Absolutely.
32:02I was not in the state of mind that I ever want to revisit.
32:08I was at the lowest I'd ever been,
32:11both in my emotions and in my humanity.
32:16-We do have information
32:18that he was not a pleasant person to be around,
32:20but being an unpleasant person
32:22does not rise to the level of being a domestic abuser.
32:26-With no evidence Austin acted in self-defense,
32:30prosecutors Mike Groh and Sarah Wendorf
32:33said Austin and Connie would be charged
32:36with second-degree murder.
32:38-What Austin described as happening
32:42was not an emergency situation.
32:44It did not rise to a self-defense offense.
32:48-Your life, while he was sleeping there on the couch,
32:52was not under imminent threat.
32:54You didn't have to shoot him.
32:57This wasn't legally self-defense.
33:01-Correct. -This was murder.
33:02-Correct.
33:04-And as prosecutors prepared for trial,
33:06they questioned whether there was more to Connie's role
33:09in Gary's killing
33:11than Austin had admitted.
33:13Do you at times wonder to yourself,
33:15could Connie have pulled that trigger?
33:17-As a prosecutor, of course I wonder about that.
33:20♪♪
33:28♪♪
33:35-I shot my father because
33:37if I hadn't, I would have been dead.
33:40My mother would have been dead.
33:44-What are the options that his son could have done
33:48other than kill Gary?
33:51-He could have grabbed the gun and left the house
33:53and told the police what had been going on.
33:55-Prosecutor Mike Groh.
33:57-All of those things are possible and very doable,
34:01except shooting him in the head,
34:03which is the last thing that a civilized person
34:06would supposedly do.
34:08-Once Austin Herbst confessed to killing his father,
34:11he agreed to plead guilty to second-degree murder.
34:15-It was what we call a straight plea,
34:17which means there was no promises made by the state
34:20as to what you would get.
34:22-Connie Herbst pleaded guilty
34:24to aiding an offender, accomplice after the fact.
34:28-Austin said, "Yes, I was the one that killed my dad."
34:32And then that's when we decided Connie would be charged
34:35with the aiding an offender after the fact.
34:39-Without a trial, Prosecutor Sarah Wendorf says
34:42there were many unanswered questions
34:45about Austin and Connie's claims of physical abuse.
34:49-We have never seen any information to suggest
34:52that there was any abuse
34:54that Gary had committed against Austin or his wife.
34:57-They never said anything until they were in trouble,
35:01and then they told these reasons why they were abused.
35:06-The prosecutors in this case say, "Well,
35:08there's no real evidence that any of this happened."
35:11-Of course. And I can't -- I can't refute that.
35:15I can't refute that there is no evidence that it occurred.
35:17It is all hearsay.
35:19-Austin told "48 Hours"
35:21he and his mom had never reported abuse to the police,
35:24friends or extended family members
35:27because they feared for their lives
35:29at the hands of Gary.
35:31-I'd been told, "If you try to have me arrested,
35:34if you try to flee,
35:36if you try to, you know, go your own way,
35:39I will find you and kill you."
35:43-Another question for prosecutors
35:45involves Connie's whereabouts on the day of the murder.
35:49You said that your mom was at the library
35:51at the time that your father was shot, correct?
35:54-Yes. -Well, prosecutors say
35:56investigators were never able to find evidence
35:59that that's true, that she was there.
36:01And they wonder if your mother
36:04was the one who killed your father
36:08and that you, as her protector,
36:10have told a story where you're taking the responsibility
36:14for something that she did.
36:16-My mom would never allow me to take a fall like that
36:21if she had done that.
36:22-I need to ask you that question.
36:24Did your mother, Connie, shoot and kill your father?
36:28-I'm telling you right now, on everything I hold dear,
36:32my mother did not shoot my father.
36:36-Prosecutors said
36:38a potential motive for Gary's murder was hate,
36:41illustrated by how Austin left his father's corpse
36:44in these woods to be eaten.
36:48That is inhumane. -Absolutely.
36:49-That is barbaric.
36:50Inhumanity that, at the time,
36:53seemed to have left Austin overjoyed.
36:56-I experienced more happiness afterwards
36:59than I had for my entire 18 years of living with him.
37:02-You're having cookies with the neighbors
37:06while your father's corpse is being eaten by animals.
37:10-Yeah. It was -- it was a strange dichotomy.
37:13It actually brought me a sense of almost shame
37:18that my happiness
37:21is on the -- on the feet of the ultimate act of violence.
37:26It still makes me wonder what kind of person I am
37:28that that could have happened.
37:30-At Austin Herbst's June 2021 sentencing hearing
37:34at the Scott County District Court in Minnesota,
37:37prosecutors asked that he be sentenced
37:40to 30 years in prison.
37:44-I made it clear to the judge
37:46that he deserved the highest sentence
37:49because of the callous way that he was killed
37:52and the body was treated.
37:54-But Judge Caroline Lennon said
37:56she found Austin's claims believable.
37:59In her ruling, she said, "I find it credible
38:02that you believed that he was going to kill your mom,"
38:05and later said Austin "felt an underlying obligation
38:09to protect his mother."
38:11He was sentenced to 12 years, six months
38:14and will be eligible for release in 2029.
38:18-It's horrendous because
38:20if we allow that kind of justice to go,
38:23nobody's safe,
38:24because they'll say that I have been abused.
38:27That's why I did this.
38:30-Gary Herbst's sister Linda seemed a bit overwhelmed.
38:36-12. Yeah.
38:38That does not seem very relevant to someone's life.
38:42It seems very -- very light.
38:44-Eight months later, Connie Herbst was back in court
38:48for her sentencing.
38:50-We also recommended for Connie, um,
38:52the highest end of the guideline sentence,
38:55which was 57 months.
38:57-That would have been almost five years in prison?
38:59-Yes. -But the judge decided
39:01Connie would get two years and three months.
39:04Under Minnesota's sentencing guidelines,
39:07she served just three months behind bars
39:09and was released in May of 2022.
39:13-I think that he was psychotic.
39:19-And back in the small town of Elko New Market, Minnesota,
39:22where the murder took place,
39:24a few of Gary Herbst's former neighbors
39:27had hoped Austin and his mother, Connie,
39:29wouldn't do any hard time
39:31for eliminating a man they considered a monster.
39:36-I felt sad because
39:39I didn't really want them to be caught.
39:42-I don't feel that they were a danger to society.
39:44-Jason Grimm even had a message for Austin.
39:48-I hope he's doing well,
39:49and when he gets out, please look us up.
39:51I'd like to help him in any way I can.
39:53-Really? -Yeah.
39:55-Do you feel in a way, though,
39:57he got a 12-and-a-half-year sentence,
39:58was that too much?
40:00-I think it's a little bit excessive.
40:02Hopefully, he can pick up the pieces
40:04and move on with his life.
40:05-Do you believe that what you did was justified?
40:08-I believe that there are a lot of reasons
40:12why...the act was justifiable.
40:17-So under the same circumstances,
40:19you would still shoot him again?
40:21-I believe so.
40:22♪♪
40:27-And when you get out,
40:30what do you want people to know
40:32about whether you will be a potential danger to society
40:35or a contributor to society?
40:38-My only goal in life
40:41is to leave something behind that's worth remembering.
40:43This isn't it. This isn't it.
40:47I want to leave behind a legacy other than I killed my father.
40:52♪♪
41:17♪♪

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