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Top Corporate Executive:Steal The Strategy Private Equity Uses To Build Real Wealth | Darnell Phelps — Transcript

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0:00I grew up in the hood. Me and my older
0:01brother got in a fight over the last
0:02king of spaghetti in the house. My
0:04mindset was I never will experience that
0:07again. I went and interviewed for this
0:09tech sales position with no tech
0:11background, no college degree, and no
0:14connections within that business. I
0:16always multiplied my quota by 10 and
0:20operated from a perspective of that's
0:22what I needed to hit. The big tech boys,
0:25you heard of Oracle. You don't see
0:26Oracle commercials. You can scale 3 to 5
0:29years in one transaction without raising
0:32capital, without hiring a team, and
0:35without marketing. I can give you
0:36$50,000 to help your company grow, but I
0:39can also help you leverage another
0:41company and you will jump seven or eight
0:44figures. If you have an existing
0:46business and you're trying to build
0:48wealth, start
0:50>> Welcome to the Building Wealth Without
0:52Borders podcast with me, Lambday
0:53Elizabeth, where I'll be bringing you
0:54guests from around the world to share
0:56their strategies on building wealth. And
0:58today we are in Austin with the CEO of
1:00DNA consulting enterprise, investor, and
1:03strategic AI growth partner, Darnell
1:06Phelps. Welcome to the podcast.
1:07>> Thank you.
1:08>> So, good, good, good. I'm excited. I
1:11will let you introduce yourself for
1:13those who may not know who you are.
1:15>> Okay. Well, I'm Darnell Phelps, business
1:18investor, entrepreneur, and of course,
1:20CEO of DNA Consultants. What I like to
1:24start with when I do talk to clients is
1:26I let them know that they're doing it
1:28wrong.
1:29>> It's very controversial, but it's based
1:32on experience and history and my 20 plus
1:35years in big tech of helping companies
1:37innovate and grow. Three things, three
1:40epiphanies I uncovered
1:43around that time frame is that
1:46you can scale three to five years in one
1:51transaction
1:52without raising capital, without hiring
1:57a team, and without marketing. The
2:00second epiphany is that you can scale
2:03your company to eight or nine figures in
2:06a shorter period of time than it takes
2:09for you to try to make it to seven
2:11figures.
2:13>> And then the third is that it's a lot
2:17easier than you think.
2:18>> So that's how you like to introduce
2:20yourself.
2:20>> I do.
2:22>> I love it. Um, so anyways, I'm I'm
2:24really excited to bring you on to the
2:26podcast because last year you sent me a
2:27message on LinkedIn. Um and I guess it
2:30was very pivotal for the place I was in
2:34my business at the time um with what I
2:36was doing. Um and it really did help to
2:39you know shape how this platform has
2:42changed and how I look at business. So
2:44um very very grateful for that. So I do
2:46know you have a wealth of knowledge as
2:48it comes to business and enterprising
2:50etc. But we always like to start the
2:52podcast with understanding a little bit
2:54more about our guests in terms of how
2:56they grew up. Um especially in relation
2:58to like money and wealth etc. So if you
3:01could share a little bit about you know
3:02how you grew up that would be a great
3:05start.
3:05>> Yeah sure. So um I grew up in a hood. Uh
3:09it was uh pretty well when you're
3:12growing up in a hood you don't see it as
3:14bad but once you get older you you
3:17reflect and look back it's like oh my
3:18god that's how we lived right
3:21>> so I grew up in a hood and
3:23>> what hood was it
3:25>> uh it's Hickory North Carolina
3:27>> okay
3:28>> it's um
3:30most well let me rephrase that a lot of
3:34towns with black communities have a hood
3:37M
3:38>> and a lot of times it's uniquely
3:41different from the rest of the
3:42community.
3:44>> So you have to do things differently if
3:46you don't have access to resources
3:50or capabilities like the average
3:53neighborhood has. right now. As I got
3:57older, I realized that the more action
4:03you take and the more people you talk
4:07to, you end up growing a lot uh faster
4:12and better than your individual
4:15circumstances. Right.
4:17>> So, two years I mean two days after I
4:21graduated high school, I had my first
4:23son. Oh, really?
4:25>> So, even though I was pretty
4:28>> How old is that? 16.
4:30>> I was uh 18.
4:31>> 18. Okay.
4:32>> Yeah. And when that happened, I was
4:35like, "Oh my god, I can't go to college.
4:37My life is over."
4:40>> But having children changed my mindset
4:42and made me think more about them than
4:46me. M
4:47>> so it gave me the hustle mindset to
4:52always do more, always provide more
4:55value and make bigger things happen. So
4:59that was a transition in my life and and
5:02I had a few mentors along the way.
5:05>> Wow. That's I didn't know. First of all,
5:06I didn't know you had kids. Yeah.
5:08>> That's crazy. It's probably older than
5:09me. Older than you?
5:10>> Yes.
5:11>> Yeah.
5:11>> My daughter is now uh a doctor.
5:15>> Amazing. at Emory.
5:17>> Wow, that's amazing.
5:18>> And a funny thing is I've been saying
5:20I'm 21 for the longest and now I tell
5:23them they're a little bit older than I
5:24am now.
5:26>> Um, okay, so let's take it back. So,
5:28you're growing up in North Carolina in
5:31the hood. What was the like? What what
5:33job did your parents do? Um, did you
5:36live with both of your parents? What was
5:37that sort of like? Well, unfortunately,
5:40uh, my father, uh, papa was a rolling
5:43stone, so it's 11 of us.
5:46Yeah. And my father and mother, they
5:51were not married. So, we was raised in
5:53um, one parent.
5:55>> Mhm.
5:55>> And again, unfortunately, my mother
5:58passed away when I was 12 years old.
6:01>> Oh, sorry to hear that. So when I say we
6:04went from the coolest kids in the hood
6:06to the poorest c kids in the hood,
6:09>> now she helped build a foundation of
6:13learning and that's one thing I got from
6:17her was constant and neverending
6:20improvement because being a single mom
6:23you have to do a lot of things and you
6:25have to do a lot of things to take care
6:26of your children. So my mindset was
6:30always learn something. If I need
6:32something, learn it to get it.
6:36>> So,
6:38>> oh my god. 11. So, you grew up with 10
6:40other siblings under the same roof?
6:42>> No. Uh, three. Three. Okay.
6:44>> Three. Uh, my older brother and my
6:48younger brother is through my mom. Okay.
6:52>> But because of my pops, you know,
6:55>> we uh lots of pops.
6:57>> We taking over the world.
7:00>> Okay. And then so at in school,
7:02>> now by the way, we're all close though.
7:04My even even though like half brothers,
7:07we never say half brothers or half
7:08sisters. We are brothers. We're sisters.
7:10>> I love that.
7:11>> And we're all pretty successful uh in
7:15our own way. So
7:16>> amazing. And is that who do you who
7:18would you attribute that to?
7:21>> Well, again, you have to end up doing
7:24certain things different ways. And my
7:27mindset, I always read. So Tony Robbins
7:31was a big influence in my mindset
7:34because back then we had cassette tapes,
7:36not uh you know those little things that
7:39you listen put in the thing. But uh I
7:41would always listen to uh Tony Robbins
7:44on on around um constant never in
7:47improvement taking massive action and
7:50even uh neural linguistic programming
7:53that's um thing where you basically
7:56associate a certain feeling like
7:59confidence to uh a anchor and when
8:03you're in certain settings if you feel
8:05nervous or
8:07need to feel confident you just trigger
8:09that anchor. then that's how you end up
8:11presenting yourself.
8:13>> But how did you because is it normal I I
8:16wouldn't suspect that it's normal for a
8:19kid in the hood who's grown up in a
8:21single parent household to just want to
8:25listen to Tony Robin. So what led you
8:28that way? Um what were you like in
8:31school? Like where did this where did
8:32that sort of drive come from?
8:34>> So a few things that led me that way.
8:38When my mom passed,
8:42me and my older brother got in a fight
8:45over the last can of spaghetti in the
8:46house.
8:48>> So my mindset was I'm never will
8:51experience that again.
8:54>> So I had to grow up pretty fast.
8:56>> Now in school I'm very competitive. And
9:00where we grew up, they ship the black
9:03kids to the white schools.
9:05>> Okay. So fortunately, and I'm thankful
9:10that the classes I was in, I was always
9:13the only black person in my class, but
9:15these were like AP classes. So my
9:18mindset was to show the people that I
9:20was around that I am as smart or smarter
9:25than them.
9:27>> And
9:28that mindset led me to always think,
9:31hey, let me go the extra mile. Let me
9:33study more. Let me do more. M.
9:35>> So I I always had good grades in school.
9:38>> Okay. So you were like maybe
9:39academically gifted a little bit. Yeah.
9:41So what did you want to be then?
9:43>> Well,
9:45right before
9:47my first child, I wanted to be an
9:49architect. So I was in um I was pretty
9:52talented far as uh drawing an artist.
9:56And I love history and I love
9:59literature. So I combined my art skills,
10:03history and literature into
10:04architectural drafting.
10:06>> So I took drafting in the ninth grade
10:09and I even designed a few things for
10:11different schools and got paid for that.
10:14So I thought I was going to be a
10:16architect. So I'm kind of in a similar
10:19position now
10:20>> because I design businesses,
10:23>> you know, I bring puzzle pieces together
10:25and make those businesses more
10:27profitable.
10:27>> So what happened? Why did it change from
10:29architect to then going to study
10:32computer learning in the late '9s?
10:35>> Well, it changed mainly because I had
10:37children,
10:38>> meaning I had to get a job. I was
10:40working in the restaurant industry for
10:42seven years before I got into the
10:44computer industry.
10:45>> Oh, really?
10:46>> Yeah. So, and u
10:49>> that kind of tweaked my values on making
10:53sure we were one of 16 in the restaurant
10:58chain. And my goal was to make that
11:02restaurant we worked for the number one
11:03in the chain, which we did. And one of
11:05my mentors, he did say, "Hey, you need
11:08to, you know, jump into sales or some
11:12other type of business based on your
11:14drive and how you do things because
11:16working in, you know, 12-hour days in a
11:19restaurant field is not going to cut cut
11:21it."
11:22>> So, if I'm like painting the picture, so
11:24you, you know, were a gifted child,
11:27probably quite smart. Um, you lost your
11:30mom quite young, so that gave you a bit
11:31of a drive. You wanted to be an
11:33architect but then you had a son so
11:34obviously you had to provide. So you go
11:37to work for a restaurant. Are you just
11:38waitering?
11:40>> No, I started uh cooking.
11:43>> Cooking,
11:44>> right?
11:44>> Okay.
11:45>> So was cooking and then
11:48being a cook lead and then cooking
11:51manager and then running the restaurant.
11:54>> So you worked your way up. What were you
11:56thinking like mentally? Where was your
11:59headspace at the time? Because there
12:01could be someone watching this, right,
12:02who felt like, you know what, I had so
12:05much or I felt like I had so much
12:07potential. I have so much potential, but
12:09what I'm currently doing in life is not
12:12reflecting the potential that I know
12:13that I have, right? And you're sitting
12:15here super successful, had a very
12:17successful career that I didn't even
12:19know that that was part of your story.
12:21If someone was where you were when you
12:23were 18 till 25, right? What would you
12:27say to them? Where was your headsp space
12:28at? And how did you like stay afloat?
12:30Yeah, my headsp space was all about
12:32learning the business.
12:33>> Okay.
12:34>> And the the one concept of growth is
12:38providing value.
12:41>> The more value you provide,
12:45I really think your income increases. So
12:48in the restaurant industry, it was more
12:51of me adding more value, but learning
12:53the business, learning the processes,
12:55learning the system. And I've always
12:58been good with people. So, I really
12:59thought that was the easiest part, but
13:02as I got older, a lot of people would
13:04say, "Hey, that's kind of the most
13:05challenging, like managing and relating
13:08or rapport with people." But I think
13:11it's pretty easy with me. But it was it
13:14was then my mentor taught me to focus on
13:17systems and processes, right? So once I
13:20realize how to um and I should have
13:24brought this up before, I like to
13:26associate things that I'm good at to
13:30learn a different skill.
13:32>> So when I was in the restaurant
13:34industry, it was all about associating
13:36football um positions
13:39>> within how we were doing things in the
13:42kitchen, for example.
13:44>> Okay. So I use associations to manage
13:46things like a football team in scale. So
13:51that's kind of parlaying into how did I
13:53get into the tech field.
13:55So I went and interviewed for this tech
13:58position, this tech sales position with
14:01no tech background,
14:03no college degree
14:06>> and no connections within that business.
14:09But what I did was I interviewed and I
14:12associated football to the different
14:15types of tech solutions that they were
14:18offering at the time. And that's how I
14:21was able to understand what the tech was
14:23at the time and how I sold myself into
14:26getting a position there with that
14:28company. And
14:29>> within six months, I was a top dog in
14:32the whole field.
14:33>> Did you ever go back to uni to college?
14:36>> No.
14:37>> Oh, you didn't? Oh, interesting. Okay.
14:40Um, I just wanted to come back. Where
14:42did you find that mentor?
14:44>> Mentor?
14:44>> Yeah. The mentor that you keep referring
14:46to when you were young.
14:47>> Um, I've always reached out to older
14:50people cuz I'm very curious. like I read
14:53a lot and I'm curious on how things work
14:54and I always would reach out to people
14:56in the community if they are successful
14:59or if I'm working with someone in
15:02business I would reach out to them the
15:04top dog or the CEO the leader or the
15:06president or the person that's making
15:08the most money I would always reach out
15:10and have conversations with them so at a
15:13very young age I would I read think and
15:16grow rich right and it also mentions uh
15:19masterminds
15:21So in the ninth grade, I attended well I
15:25snuck in a mastermind group of my in my
15:28church community and I was just
15:31listening to those guys talk about you
15:34got people in the real estate of course
15:36you have the pastor, you got um it's a
15:40different people were basically sharing
15:41their experiences and everything, right?
15:43So I realized listening to different
15:46people will help you grow. Even if
15:50you're not in a certain field, you can
15:52apply certain things. So one of the
15:55people in that mastermind saw me peeping
15:58in and he brought me in and I started
16:00sitting in with them like every two
16:02weeks and I realized that hey every step
16:06I take I need to find a mentor.
16:08>> So you were very desperate for success
16:10or desperate to get out. not desperate.
16:13I'm curious. I like to learn.
16:16>> So, I don't see it as I gotta have it. I
16:19see it as I want to learn it. I want to
16:21know it.
16:23>> And even I know I'm jumping the gun. I I
16:25realize that the private equity world
16:27and the big tech world, they do things
16:29differently. Like a lot of startups
16:32think they gotta raise money to start a
16:35business or they gotta spend a lot of
16:39money on marketing. The big tech boys,
16:42you you heard of Oracle, right? You
16:44don't see Oracle commercials.
16:46>> They don't spend money on marketing,
16:49right?
16:50>> They don't you don't hear about them.
16:52Well, other than now because Larry got
16:54the 500 billion data center thing.
16:56They're raising money on that now. But
16:58they
17:00They merge companies together. They
17:03bring other companies with unique
17:05capabilities
17:07and a client base and bring them up
17:09under one umbrella.
17:13>> What I talk to smaller business owners,
17:15smaller level business owners is that
17:17think about the ecosystem first. Don't
17:19think about the capital. Think about how
17:21you want to be three to five years from
17:22now and try to pull in the missing
17:24pieces
17:25>> and that will and if you end up going to
17:28different uh mastermind groups, you will
17:31start hearing different things on how
17:33people do things and then you can take
17:35the shortcuts without the trial and
17:38error of wasting money.
17:39>> So to circle back, that's part of
17:43mentorship. you know, reach out to other
17:45leaders that are doing things
17:46differently and then see how you can
17:48apply it in your specific environment.
17:50>> And on that note of mentorship, how do
17:53you get a mentor to say yes? How do you
17:57become someone that someone wants to
17:59mentor?
18:00>> It's funny because
18:03it's not me getting them to say yes.
18:06It's me
18:08bugging them with questions
18:10>> and they automatically start being my
18:14mentor. It's not like
18:18when you get to a certain level and you
18:21have skills that you know you can help
18:23other people. When you got one or two
18:25people that's curious about how you got
18:27there, you're gonna share that knowledge
18:30because you want to give it to that
18:33individual that's hungry, right? So, a
18:36lot of times when I meet people, it's
18:38just me asking questions.
18:40>> Like when I worked at Dale, my first six
18:43months, I was sitting in on some
18:45meetings that I wasn't supposed to be in
18:47those rooms.
18:48>> I was in a meeting one time where they
18:51was like, "Hey, what's what's this guy
18:52doing here?" here and he's like, "Oh,
18:53Phelps just like to learn. He just want
18:55to listen in." And the crazy part of
18:58this particular meeting I was listening
19:00to helped me, and I didn't know this was
19:03going to happen, but helped me create a
19:07nonfigure business unit within that tech
19:10company. It was an accident. I didn't
19:12get credit for it, but I created it. I
19:15didn't get credit because I was labeled
19:16a individual sales rep sales rep. But
19:21because of the information I was in in
19:24that room helped me have an idea on how
19:27to pull something together
19:30and have a bigger outcome.
19:34That's I I I like that because I think
19:36the reason why I'm asking is because a
19:38lot of people will ask how do I get a
19:42mentor? How do I get a mentor? And
19:44usually even I get like people
19:45approaching me saying can you be my
19:47mentor and it's very rare for me at
19:51least to say yes.
19:52>> Yeah.
19:53>> Um but I think the question angle is
19:57very different because if someone just
19:59says but I but I but don't you think
20:01that there is an element that is also
20:03about the person who is asking because
20:05it's not necessarily everyone that you
20:06would say yes to answering their
20:08questions.
20:09>> That's absolutely true. Uh, for example,
20:11on my LinkedIn, I get hit up by 10 to 15
20:16people a day,
20:17>> either trying to raise money or want you
20:21to give them money or want you to view
20:25their startup.
20:27>> And
20:29the I have a unique way of looking at
20:32business and it's because of my
20:34background in big tech. So, a lot of
20:36times when people are coming up to me on
20:38LinkedIn about their startup and what
20:41they're trying to do
20:43and the fact that I've talked to so many
20:45businesses on a regular basis, a lot of
20:47these startups are just reinventing the
20:50wheel.
20:51>> So, when they do reach out to me, most
20:54of the time it is a no. Meaning, I will
20:58not share. Sometimes I say, "Hey, this
21:00other company is doing XYZ.
21:03What what makes you different?" Right?
21:05So a lot of times it is most of the time
21:07it is a no.
21:08>> Right? But then there are times where if
21:11people reached out and they didn't ask
21:13for money, but they have a unique uh
21:16business that they're doing or trying to
21:18get done. And if I know of another
21:21business that's similar or adjacent,
21:25I can put them together
21:27>> and then this company here and this
21:29company here can be a lot worth more in
21:32value,
21:33>> which I've done that with an AI startup
21:36and um an AI cyber security company and
21:40a MSP, managed service provider company,
21:42>> where this managed service provider
21:45company,
21:47>> Bob, he was looking to retire 22 to your
21:49business, but he's looking to retire
21:51because of the pandemic and AI. He was
21:53frustrated, but he couldn't get the
21:55money he wanted for his company. And
21:58then Mark, the AI cyber security guy, he
22:00just want to scale his his company like
22:0350% within the next two years. But I'm
22:06like, "Hey, Bob, meet Mark. Y'all come
22:09together. Mark, you're going to have a
22:10$10 million company instead of $5
22:12million company in one transaction." And
22:14you get the team, the resources and
22:16client base from Bob
22:18>> by merging that into one company. And
22:21then Bob just went off into the sunset
22:23receiving monthly installments of the
22:26combined entity.
22:27>> And Mark went from 5 million to 10
22:29million in one transaction. M
22:33>> so it went from Mark actually reached
22:36out to me because he was trying to raise
22:382 million
22:40and Bob reached out because hey I'm
22:43trying to sell my company. So I saw the
22:46synergies off that and it it's rare when
22:49you got someone reaching out and another
22:50person reaching out but it is rare when
22:52you can just see the bigger puzzle piece
22:55to bring them together. So long story
22:58short, most of the time I do say no to
23:01mentorship.
23:02>> Uh most of the time I do say no to
23:05giving another company capital because a
23:07lot of times that what they would use
23:09with the money is like burning putting
23:11water into a leaky bucket.
23:14>> All right, we're going to get into the
23:15company stuff because I think that would
23:17be interesting. But as you mentioned,
23:19you did spend quite a bit of time at
23:21Dell, so almost 9 years. Um and I picked
23:26up that you increased sales like 536%
23:3030% increase in annual revenue um
23:33exceptional performance rating for 16
23:35quarters in 7 years. What was your
23:38driving force during your time in
23:40corporate to be exceptional?
23:43>> A few things. Um, the fact that I don't
23:46have a college degree,
23:48>> it's more of me proving in corporate
23:51America that I can excel without having
23:56a college degree or MBA.
23:59And one thing I learned
24:02in my teenage years is most people only
24:07do average things.
24:10meaning they want they do average things
24:12but they want more
24:15and I realize that
24:17>> they want more or they won't do more.
24:18>> They want more but they won't do more.
24:20Right?
24:22>> So I realize in a corporate world you
24:24got people that they're making decent
24:27money but they're making the money only
24:29to get by.
24:30>> My whole mindset is blow it out the
24:34water. And I'm saying that in a in a
24:37sales perspective. Meaning if you are in
24:40technology and your quota is 2 million,
24:42your goal should be to close 5 million
24:45that year.
24:47>> So what made me successful
24:51when I was working at Dell and other
24:53companies is that I always multiplied my
24:56quota by 10 and operated from a
24:59perspective of that's what I needed to
25:02hit.
25:04Um, one particular time at Dale where we
25:09were doing a certain strategy, I
25:12perfected that strategy where my quota
25:15was 2 million
25:18and the last week of the quarter when
25:21you're trying to close all the deals,
25:24the strategy I used, almost every single
25:27account I had was saying yes to my offer
25:31where I was capped at 200%. sent and the
25:34POS kept purchase orders kept coming in
25:37where I was not getting paid and I'm
25:39sitting there trying to tell the client,
25:40"Stop sending the money. Stop sending
25:42the POS. I'm not getting paid. Stop.
25:44Stop." But that's one of the examples
25:47where I hit like 500 and something
25:48percent. But only got paid for 200.
25:51>> So yeah,
25:53>> whenever there's uncertainty in the
25:54market, there's always a window of
25:56opportunity. And we are starting to see
25:59that right now with Dubai real estate.
26:01So, if you were thinking about getting
26:03into the market before and were
26:04wondering whether now is the right time,
26:07why not book a call using the link in
26:08the description box and let's find out.
26:10I think it's it's really interesting
26:13because one, I feel like for everything
26:16that you have been saying, that's that's
26:19some of the stuff that you've been
26:20trying to drill into me like you have to
26:21operate from a$und00 million company.
26:23So, if you guys go my LinkedIn and you
26:25see that it says building a $100 million
26:28empire, that's because Darnell basically
26:30forced me to put that there. No, but
26:32it's been good to sort of, you know, get
26:34my mind to think about things from a
26:36higher perspective.
26:38>> Let's talk about that real quick.
26:39>> We got to talk about that real quick.
26:41>> Okay,
26:42>> so if you guys been following her, she
26:45has an awesome podcast. She has all
26:48these people on, you know, YouTube,
26:50LinkedIn, Instagram, right?
26:53When I started following you, I saw you
26:56as a mini Oprah.
26:58>> So Oprah has her own empire
27:02and she's a little bit older.
27:04>> Mhm.
27:05>> So now it's time for someone else to
27:08take that spot.
27:10>> And I know that you have been
27:14interviewing, you know, high netw worth
27:16individuals.
27:18I see your podcast as a mini Oprah
27:24empire.
27:25So instead of operating from a sevenf
27:30figureure mindset,
27:32you can operate like Oprah, even though
27:35she's, you know, multi-billionaire.
27:38You can operate from a nonfigure
27:42mindset and your resources and
27:45capabilities will come to you a lot
27:46faster compared to only working from a
27:50sevenfigure mindset.
27:51>> Because if if folks if you folks are
27:54familiar with uh Benjamin Hardy,
27:57he had he wrote a book called 10x is
27:59easier than 2x.
28:02From a 2x mindset, you're only trying to
28:05grow 10 or 20% and you're just going to
28:08keep doing the same things you did last
28:10year or year before, but you're going to
28:12end up trying to put in more effort to
28:15do that.
28:16>> But if you work from a 10x
28:19mindset, you will do things a lot
28:23different compared to a 2x. And that
28:27difference that you do, it will be one
28:30or two or three things that's going to
28:32give you a bigger outcome compared to
28:35working from 2x. So in the my early tech
28:39career, a lot of people were focusing on
28:42closing one or two deals with an
28:45account. My mindset was closing five to
28:5010 deals within one account where I
28:53would say, "Hey, what type of projects
28:55are you working on next year?
28:58>> Let's bring that forward and I give you
29:00a bigger discount where you're going to
29:02save millions and millions of dollars
29:04compared to if you don't move forward."
29:07So, I show them how they're going to
29:08save money, but the opportunity to me
29:11and the company I'm working for is a lot
29:13bigger at that one time. So when you
29:16have multiple accounts doing that,
29:18>> you're going to close bigger deals.
29:21>> So
29:23what you're doing, you can partner with
29:26a lot of these these people that you're
29:29interviewing. You can get I'm just
29:31throwing names out there. Bob that's in
29:34real estate that does thing uniquely
29:37different here and then Mary that works
29:41in uh investment banking that have
29:44assets and resources that she can
29:48probably help Bob. Did I say Bob? Did I
29:51give him the name? Bob can probably give
29:53him more resources to scale a lot
29:56faster. But the benefit with Mary is
30:00create some type of joint venture or
30:02merger where she gets a piece of that
30:04action that Bob is doing
30:07and she can still do what she does and
30:09Bob still do what he does but now bigger
30:13and she's getting a piece of that. So in
30:16your world, you can help a lot of p uh
30:20businesses get there faster and in turn
30:23you can also benefit from that cuz you
30:25have access like Oprah.
30:29>> This that's a little
30:30>> that's Oprah guys.
30:33>> That's a little peak for you guys into
30:35into some of our mentoring sessions. But
30:38thank you. I appreciate that. It it I I
30:41think it's really really good and we
30:42we'll we'll talk more about that. Um but
30:45I think something that you mentioned
30:47right that I think it's important to
30:49sort of address is there are a lot of
30:51people in you know working corporate who
30:55just want to get by um just want to be
30:58average and sometimes it's because they
31:00feel like if you go the extra mile right
31:03as you were saying with the you've
31:06actually mentioned two instances
31:08since you've you've started talking like
31:10sometimes it feels like if you go the
31:11extra mile you won't be rewarded in the
31:15mile that you went.
31:16>> Mhm.
31:16>> So, let's say you're going to go five
31:18extra miles, but corporate, it feels
31:20like corporate will only reward you for
31:22a quarter of one mile that you went.
31:25>> How if someone is sort of watching this
31:27and dealing with that sort of mindset
31:29where it's like what's the point of me
31:31doing more if I'm not even really going
31:33to get like the effort that I need to
31:35put in to to do more? It feels like it's
31:37going to outweigh any reward that I can
31:39get. What would you say to that person?
31:42I would say this and I'm going to give
31:43an example.
31:46Always do more.
31:48>> Always do more because if you don't do
31:52more, you won't get rewarded. Period.
31:55>> Right?
31:56>> So the example I used earlier where I
32:00did more brought in 500 and something%
32:04but only got paid 200%.
32:08So, I did more
32:11and I got rewarded at 200%.
32:14>> If I did not do more, I probably only
32:19barely hit 100%.
32:22>> So, the more actions you take, the more
32:25value you provide, you will get
32:28rewarded. It may not be in a way that
32:30you expect. It may not be in that moment
32:32that you get it done, but you will feel
32:36a lot better about yourself by doing
32:40more compared to how you feel if you did
32:43less.
32:44>> Because if you did less, you're going to
32:46think, man, I should have did this. I
32:48should have did that. But if you do
32:50more, you're going to say, well, I know
32:52I gave it my all. M
32:55>> and then if you end up going to another
32:57company,
32:59you know that you have a skill set that
33:01most people only try to be average.
33:04>> And then at your company that you with
33:07now, you might get promoted.
33:11>> So always do more.
33:13>> I like that. That's actually very
33:15similar to we had another guest on the
33:17podcast, um Jude, who had a very similar
33:21similar sentiment as well. Um and he
33:23like yourself has gone on to do amazing
33:25things as an entrepreneur but that
33:27exceptionalism was birthed whilst he was
33:30still working in corporate. So um seems
33:33to be like a a theme. Um
33:35>> well look at it like this. If you're
33:37playing basketball, you want to score
33:38more points than the average
33:41than the average person or the person on
33:43the other team or the team, right?
33:45>> So it's all about numbers. And if you're
33:48the one that's always putting in the
33:49numbers,
33:51you will always be the one at the top.
33:53You're going to always be successful
33:55most of the time.
33:57>> What if someone is saying, "Okay, cool."
33:59Like my my job though is not really what
34:02I want to do. I'm not really enjoying my
34:05job and let's say for example, they have
34:07a side hustle on the side and that's
34:09what they're actually passionate about.
34:10So their strategy whilst working
34:12corporate is I'm just going to do enough
34:14to get by so that all of that extra
34:16energy or effort that it will take for
34:18me to do more at my job, I'm actually
34:20going to take that and put that into a
34:22side hustle, for example.
34:23>> That's that's a good question. So I
34:26would say to that person, look at the
34:30current position that you're in. Be
34:33curious on how that company got to where
34:36it is. learn the processes, procedures,
34:39and systems and see if you can apply a
34:43few of those things to your side hustle.
34:47>> Meaning, you can end up being excited in
34:51your current position because you're
34:53telling yourself, I'm learning how to
34:56run a business or understand the
34:58business to apply to my future
35:03non-figure company.
35:05So, your current situation, learn,
35:10ask questions, talk to leadership, see
35:13how that company got to where it is, and
35:15see if you can apply certain systems and
35:17procedures to your company or your
35:21hustle, your side hustle that you're
35:22trying to start. And I guarantee that
35:24you'll get there a lot further compared
35:26to, I hate my job. I want to focus on
35:29this. Most people hate their jobs, but
35:32learn from your job so that you can
35:34apply it in another position or your own
35:37company.
35:38>> That that's really really good advice
35:40and I can yeah I think when you switch
35:42your perspective of the work that you're
35:44doing to what can I learn from this role
35:47to help me in what I want to do next. It
35:50does it makes a massive massive massive
35:52difference. So we definitely would agree
35:54on that. Um so then you moved to Oracle.
35:58Um what was that experience like?
36:00>> It's similar to Dale. Uh my mindset in
36:03corporate America
36:04>> is the same.
36:06>> Uh
36:08especially in tech, more specifically
36:10tech.
36:11>> Okay.
36:11>> Tech is all about providing enabling
36:14another company to lower risk and make
36:19more profits. So in the tech world,
36:22you're all about trying to get a system,
36:26software, solution to enable another
36:30company to shrink time, so to speak,
36:33right? And the biggest thing I've
36:36learned in tech is integration. M
36:40>> so I was always in situations where
36:42we're trying to integrate things and the
36:45common denominator with growth with big
36:49companies integration. So what is it why
36:53all these companies always have these
36:54integration challenges? So I started
36:56asking those questions. Come to find
36:58out,
37:00they had these challenges because they
37:02were trying to take their proprietary
37:05system or another company system that
37:09they acquired or that they merged
37:13>> or business unit to bring it together so
37:16that the data and information can be
37:19centralized
37:20and their processes and procedures can
37:22be smooth. So the common denom the
37:25common denom common denominator with a
37:29lot of tech is integration and what is
37:31the integration a lot of these companies
37:33are merging or acquiring other
37:34companies. So then I said hey let me
37:38study how Oracle became successful. Let
37:42me study how Microsoft became
37:44successful. So let me just address
37:47Oracle real quick.
37:49Larry Ellison started Oracle
37:53based on a database. So his first
37:56solution was a database system, right?
38:00He became successful in the 80s that
38:02company started making a lot of money,
38:04right? Well, in the late 90s and early
38:082000s,
38:10because of um a little bit of the issue
38:13with the uh bubble bursts in uh 2000s, a
38:18lot of companies started looking at
38:19other ways getting away from inflated um
38:24budgets or inflated capital, so to
38:26speak. So Larry Ellison
38:30started acquiring
38:33other companies that had tech
38:35capabilities,
38:37teams and existing client base. So it
38:41was a database company. He acquired an
38:44ERP company. He acquired a CRM company.
38:49He acquired an HR company. Well, let me
38:52say they acquired an hardware company.
38:56They acquired a SAS company. They
38:58acquired an AI company. They acquired um
39:03health company.
39:05Oracle is worth over I mean the biggest
39:08it was valued at 700 billion. I know
39:10it's a little bit lower than that now,
39:12but instead of starting from scratch, he
39:16acquired other companies that were
39:19adjacent or complimentary to his
39:21database. M
39:24>> Oracle is a combination of over 100
39:26companies under one working as one.
39:28>> Microsoft is a combination of over 100
39:31companies working as one. Microsoft has
39:35GitHub, has LinkedIn, has Xbox and the
39:40360 and other companies up under the
39:43umbrella. So let me shrink it all up
39:46into one. Open AI is AI
39:49>> chat GBT. That's what that's how chat
39:52GBT was started. Open AAI partnered with
39:57Microsoft first.
40:00Open AAI use Microsoft's infrastructure
40:03to train their AI.
40:06>> Then Microsoft gave Open AI $13 billion.
40:12So OpenAI did not raise money first.
40:14they partner with an existing company
40:16that already had the resources and
40:19technology it needed to hit the ground
40:21running.
40:23>> So
40:26dealing with Oracle, dealing with the
40:28tech world, I learned that integration
40:30is the challenge and merging the
40:32companies are the backbone to growth. M
40:38>> it's interesting cuz I I can see how
40:41the companies that you have worked at
40:43how that how the way that they grew has
40:46shaped what you do now and how you see
40:48business. But in general, speaking about
40:51tech and working in tech, a lot of
40:53people see it as a way to sort of build
40:57wealth because generally the idea is
40:59that if you're working for a tech
41:01company and they'll give you shares and
41:02so if you have a little bit of ownership
41:04then you know that's better than working
41:06at a job where you just get a salary.
41:08What would your thoughts be on that in
41:10terms of just working in tech as an
41:12employee and your ability to build
41:14wealth by doing so? Well, one thing
41:16about working in tech, you you're making
41:19more money than the average person,
41:21>> right? So, use the extra money to
41:25reinvest in stock, reinvest in the
41:27company that you're working for, but
41:29more specifically,
41:31start looking at other companies that
41:35you can use your money to get a piece of
41:38the pie. Meaning, if you're making
41:41$200,000 a year or $300,000 a year, you
41:45can use $50,000 of that and invest in
41:49another company that probably needs
41:52capital to to grow. Now, there's a is a
41:55catch 22 in my mind, though.
41:57>> Mhm.
41:58>> My mind is I'm not going to use my
42:00$50,000 to help that other company grow.
42:02My mind is, hey, I can help you. I can
42:05give you $50,000 to help your company
42:08grow, but I can also help you leverage
42:12another company and you will jump seven
42:14or eight figures. So, what would you
42:17rather have, the leverage of seven or
42:18eight figures or the 50,000?
42:21>> I love that you love this world of M&A.
42:24You're always thinking about it. Um, so
42:26>> well, I don't I don't call it M&A when I
42:27talk to people. I I just say hey
42:29ecosystems
42:30>> cuz if you think of M&A it's very
42:34complicated
42:36>> but if you think of ecosystems what
42:38other companies have the client base the
42:42technology the resources and
42:44infrastructure I need to grow my
42:46company. When you think that way it
42:48simplifies your thoughts and actions of
42:51helping your company grow compared to
42:54M&A. Do I need to talk to a private
42:56equity investor? Do I need to talk to
42:59someone in M&A where they got to do all
43:01this multiple arbitrage and Ibida and
43:04and
43:05you know all this complicated jargon
43:08that investment banking world where you
43:11from
43:11>> uses a lot. But when you simplify things
43:14and make things more clear, you're able
43:17to make better decisions.
43:19>> So I talk about ecosystems,
43:22>> not M&A.
43:24>> Okay. Um, what prompted you to leave
43:26your very successful career in tech to
43:29then start your own business?
43:31>> Two things. One, uh, I was working in
43:34tech world about to close this big deal,
43:36$5 million deal, and was bumping heads
43:39with my boss at the time.
43:42>> So, it made me realize,
43:44>> well, he did not want me to own a I
43:50shouldn't say this cuz I don't want to
43:51get back to the people I work with. We
43:54had disagreements on how the deal should
43:55get done.
43:56>> Okay.
43:57>> But the customer was saying, "Hey, they
43:59they're ready to send in a PO.
44:01>> A PO is
44:02>> purchase order."
44:03>> Okay.
44:04>> But my boss was p pushing back at the
44:06time. We need more information. I'm
44:07like, "No, we don't."
44:08>> Okay.
44:09>> They need we need to move forward. But
44:11that's not the first time that's
44:12happened in my career.
44:14>> So, it made me realize that, hey, it's
44:16time for me to branch out. So at the
44:18same time I also
44:20attended an investment
44:23um dinner and I was sitting with seven
44:27founders at the time and all of them
44:31needed money. They basically was needing
44:34money to improve their company, right?
44:37>> But while I was sitting at the table, I
44:39realized that it
44:41>> it it's not the money they need. They
44:43need a strategic way of seeing things
44:46and doing things. And all seven of those
44:48founders,
44:50long story short, I helped them merge
44:52into one where their company ended up
44:54being worth 75 million. And we did that
44:57less than 6 months.
45:00>> Uh, in terms of Okay, so let's just talk
45:01about that transition from, you know,
45:04working in tech to doing your own your
45:06your consulting business. How did you
45:08prepare for that transition? Did you
45:10prepare? It wasn't like a short thing.
45:14It was over my career of
45:19I started seeing things differently with
45:21businesses and how they grow.
45:25>> And a lot of times it's me having
45:27conversations with other business owners
45:29and say, "Hey,
45:31>> why don't you try XYZ because this
45:33company I was working with at Oracle,
45:36they did this. I think you can do the
45:38same." Mhm.
45:39>> So, one of my mentors told me instead of
45:43saying, "Hey, instead of you giving this
45:44free advice, why don't you just get
45:47equity in these companies that you're
45:48helping on the side?"
45:50>> So, he helped me see that, hey, you can
45:54one get equity in companies and help
45:56them grow. In addition, you can also
46:00apply your tech background and knowledge
46:03and do that without giving your money.
46:06Because when you raise money, when you
46:08raise capital, that money is used to go
46:11buy the resource. That money is used to
46:14go higher. That money is used to um go
46:17marketing, right? But if you have the
46:20skill set to shrink that time and pull
46:23it together, why not get equity? Why not
46:26get paid to do it? So if you I mean you
46:29you've alluded to it a lot you know
46:31during the podcast but if you were to
46:33explain what exactly it is you do now
46:36what would you say what do you do
46:38>> we engineer eight figure outcomes eight
46:40to nine figure outcomes
46:42>> so in essence we do come in as an
46:46investors
46:48but because of our background we know
46:51that we have access to capabilities
46:53resources and connections that can
46:57shrink time. So, we engineer eight
46:59figure outcomes in months compared to
47:03years.
47:04>> And how big is your how big is your
47:06team?
47:07>> It's only five of us.
47:09>> Did you take anyone from Oracle with
47:11you?
47:12>> There is a person that works at Oracle
47:14now. That's part of it.
47:15>> Okay. Um,
47:16>> as a person that works at Oracle, person
47:18at Microsoft,
47:20>> Oracle,
47:21>> and I'm trying to I'm trying to reel in
47:23my brother. He works for AWS, the tech
47:26company. in finance.
47:29>> AWS, that's Amazon, right?
47:30>> Yeah.
47:32>> What's one deal or company that you've
47:35worked on that has really challenged the
47:37way you think about business? You've
47:38kind of shared a couple, but you have
47:40another.
47:40>> I don't see it as challenging, but the
47:43biggest benefit is the one that I
47:45mentioned uh a few minutes ago is that I
47:49didn't know when we put those companies
47:51together, I didn't know it was going to
47:52be valued at 75 million. I thought it
47:54was going to be at most around 30
47:56million, but I
47:58>> it was the shortest time and the biggest
48:02profitable outcome that I've had.
48:06And I did it all behind a Zoom.
48:09>> I never attended those. I never stepped
48:13foot at any one of those locations of
48:15those businesses.
48:16>> It was all over Zoom.
48:18>> That's amazing. And what qualities do
48:20you look for in founders or businesses
48:23that you believe would create like
48:25significant opportunity?
48:27>> Ambition.
48:28You got to be very ambitious.
48:31And
48:32they have to already have things moving
48:36forward.
48:37>> They have to have the traction. They
48:38have to have
48:40things moving compared to, hey, I got an
48:43idea. I'm trying to raise money.
48:46Like if I got paid off all my ideas,
48:50I'll be hanging out with Elon Musk.
48:53>> That's a fair point. So in these um
48:56these merging of these ecosystems,
49:00>> there you go.
49:02>> My mind might just emanate, but merging
49:03of these ecosystems. So let's say you
49:06have Bob and whatever other name you
49:08mentioned before. When you are merging,
49:10how is there usually a leading? How do
49:13you determine whether there's like a
49:15leading company versus like who's let's
49:19say for example
49:19>> who's going to be the CEO?
49:21>> Yeah. Who's going to be the CEO? Whose
49:22names gets taken on? How does company A,
49:25Bob's company position itself to company
49:29B in a way that's attractive? If you're
49:31not giving them money um directly, how
49:34do you engineer that that it's
49:36attractive to whoever you're proposing
49:39it to?
49:40>> Okay. So, I'm gonna keep it simple.
49:43We're going to use Bob, Mark, Frank,
49:46Stephen. We're going to use five
49:48companies.
49:48>> Okay.
49:49>> Okay.
49:51Out of those five founders,
49:54>> you merge them together. One or two of
49:57those founders are looking to retire.
50:00>> Okay.
50:02>> So, now that leaves you with three,
50:05three founders.
50:06>> Mhm.
50:07>> Now, when you merge those five founders
50:09together, it's a bigger entity. It's a
50:10bigger ecosystem operating as one. You
50:13can still have these individual business
50:16units operating as one. The business
50:18unit, a founder can be a marketing
50:21agency, founder one,
50:24uh small tech company, MSP, founder two,
50:29uh CPA firm, founder three, uh
50:33>> CPA is
50:35>> uh accounting.
50:36>> Okay.
50:37um an AI startup founder for uh what
50:42else we want to throw in there? Uh some
50:44type of um business development guy,
50:48founder company, engineering company,
50:50right?
50:52>> Those are all founders and like say
50:54they're business the AI startup has just
50:56started. Let's say that's just started,
50:58right? I would approach the AI startup
51:00and say, "Hey, you can merge with a
51:02group of companies and get hit the
51:04ground running without raising capital
51:08and giving up all of your equity in your
51:11company to do it. What you do is you
51:14exchange your equity into a bigger
51:17portion of this ecosystem of companies,
51:21right? Then you tell all these other
51:23founders, hey Bob and Leroy, you you
51:26want to um exit. Right now your company
51:29is only worth three times multiple, but
51:32if you merge your company with a bigger
51:34entity, your company is worth 10 times
51:37multiple and you're able to exit at a 10
51:40times multiple compared to three times.
51:43>> So now you still have three other
51:45founders, right?
51:46>> Mhm.
51:47>> You can tell those founders, hey, you
51:49can be president of this business unit.
51:51you can be vice president of this
51:53business unit
51:54>> because um
51:57the engineering company is worth more
51:59money. We're going to have Stephen as
52:01the CEO.
52:03And if these other guys are saying,
52:05"Hey, wait. I want to be CEO." And this
52:08is what this is. I didn't learn this. I
52:10got this from someone else listening to
52:11a podcast and I thought it was
52:13brilliant. If you have a bigger company
52:15and you want to sell it, nine times out
52:18of 10, if a private equity company
52:19acquires that company,
52:22everyone else will get bought out but
52:24the CEO.
52:26>> The CEO will stay on and grow with that
52:29private equity company. So, I would tell
52:31these other founders, you can end up
52:34getting bought out at a 10x multiple
52:37compared to a 3x
52:39and you don't have to run anything. you
52:42will get cashed out and let Stephen the
52:45CEO keep running the company with the
52:47private equity company. So there's
52:49incentives of you can exit at a higher
52:51multiple, you can be labeled as a
52:55business unit. Now keep in mind when
52:57those companies come together now you're
52:59able to raise money based on the total
53:01value of the company compared to the
53:05individual companies. M
53:07>> so if your company's worth 3x and you're
53:10trying to raise money, you're risky. But
53:12when you bring five companies together,
53:14you derisk
53:16the whole entity and now each 3x company
53:19is worth 10x. You raise capital based on
53:23the 75 million value of the company. I'm
53:28going back to a previous company we did.
53:30>> So now the company is worth 75 million.
53:32You're probably going to easily get
53:34investors begging to give you money. M
53:36>> and when you get that money, fix some
53:39things, add AI or cash out some of the
53:41founders.
53:42>> So on that then because the five
53:45different companies that you've
53:47mentioned are very different. So,
53:48usually when people are thinking um I
53:51guess from what I've seen when people
53:52are thinking about mergers and
53:54acquisition, it might be what I what I
53:57see is let's say it's like a big shoe
53:59company maybe that only does trainers
54:03for I don't know hiking and then they
54:05buy another company that still does
54:07trainers but it's trainers for running
54:10for example and there's very clear
54:13>> you can see very clear synergities
54:15although the businesses that are merging
54:17together are very similar but in some of
54:19the examples that you were giving the
54:20businesses are very different an AI
54:23business a accounting business it
54:25doesn't seem like these would it doesn't
54:30automatically or initially make sense as
54:32to why these companies would merge
54:33together and you know result in such a
54:36higher valuation as opposed to if you're
54:38just like consolidating right you know
54:40you have fragmented industries but
54:42they're all doing the same thing and
54:43then you consolidate into one so what's
54:45the rationale behind that because From
54:47my investment banking mindset, if you
54:49see if we see a company that has so many
54:52operations and a lot of it is different
54:54to what we would say is its core
54:55business, we would say you need to sell
54:57XY Z portion because it's not really
55:00making sense as to why this is your
55:02business, but you've got all of these
55:03other different arms.
55:04>> Okay, so um go back to Oracle.
55:07>> Oracle was a database company
55:09>> and it acquired an ERP company,
55:13>> enterprise resource planning and that's
55:15dealing with finance. So it acquired a
55:17company that was already working with
55:21other
55:22companies.
55:24>> So that separate thing is database, but
55:28ERP
55:29uses a database.
55:32So those two companies can merge
55:34together as one and cross-ell and upsell
55:38within the individual sphere without
55:42marketing, without hiring another team.
55:46>> So you're saving money that way. So, the
55:48example I gave you dealing with those
55:50different uh businesses, you cross-ell
55:53and upsell, you're going to make the
55:55company more valuable and you're doing
55:57it without spending any money on
55:59marketing because you cross-ell and
56:01upsell. Now, in your example about the
56:03shoe company,
56:05you can acquire an adjacent or similar
56:08company. You can acquire a manufacturing
56:10company. You can acquire another company
56:13like say if you the company's in New
56:15York, you can acquire um a similar
56:18company in California or similar company
56:21in the UK,
56:23>> right? You just change the brand. Mhm.
56:25>> So now you're rebranding those companies
56:27that you acquire and even though they're
56:30doing something different, they're up
56:31under your same umbrella and now you can
56:34market
56:35like crossell and upsell the hiking gear
56:38or the running gear within the same
56:40umbrella without
56:44external marketing.
56:46>> Okay, that makes sense. That makes a lot
56:47of sense. That's quite cool. Um, so
56:50>> you're getting your crash course on how
56:53to make this happen. And really, it is a
56:56lot easier than you think. We overthink
56:58it. You start with one or two are there
57:01synergies and let's have a conversation,
57:03meaning founder to founder, let's have a
57:05conversation and see if it will work.
57:07>> And so in your opinion then, because you
57:09previously said smart mergers will build
57:11the next generation of eight figureure
57:13businesses. That's what you meaning.
57:15That's what you're meaning by smart
57:16mergers.
57:17>> Yeah. I I I don't still I don't I don't
57:20like to use the word mergers or
57:21acquisitions.
57:23>> I will say well I did coin this merge to
57:27grow, merge to exit.
57:28>> So I guess I need to
57:30>> rethink that
57:32>> phrase there. But it just more of uh
57:35thinking about ecosystems
57:37>> cuz everything is ecosystems. Every
57:39single thing on this planet is
57:41ecosystems. If it's not business
57:42related, it can be organic plants and
57:44all that stuff. But if you think in an
57:46ecosystem mindset, that's where the
57:48synergies and everything can grow.
57:50>> Okay, I like that. So to round up before
57:52we go to our final section or to our
57:55next section, um one of the I guess
57:59issues that you see a lot of people talk
58:01about as it pertains to black
58:03entrepreneurs is the struggle for
58:05funding and to find capital etc. Um from
58:09your perspective as an investor um as
58:13someone who has who has seen companies
58:15grows grow in different ways, what are
58:18what is your opinion on that? Cuz I feel
58:20like my prediction of what you will say
58:24is that you know instead of looking for
58:27money, you should consider partnering
58:30with other businesses as a way to grow
58:33and then maybe then ask for money. uh
58:35looking at that issue, what would your
58:37advice be?
58:38>> Well, you said it, but let's let's spin
58:41it like this. Okay.
58:42>> Okay.
58:43>> Yes, that's how I look at it. But let me
58:46put it in the contents where especially
58:48black Americans can understand.
58:50>> Okay.
58:52>> In the hip-hop world,
58:54>> we are all about collaborating. getting
58:57on someone's track, getting on someone's
59:00album,
59:01coming together, making their hit
59:05better.
59:06It works. And in in the hip-hop world,
59:09that's business. If we can if you can
59:12get Eminem and Tupac, that's my
59:16favorite. Yeah, he's not here. But we
59:18put those two together, it's going to be
59:20a hit.
59:21Eminem got with Dre
59:25hits or Dre got Eminem. Dre got Snoop
59:28Dogg. Dre used to be part of NWA.
59:33Dr. Dre. Like
59:37now, now look at Jay-Z. Beyonce. There
59:41those are two different businesses.
59:43>> Beyonce is a business. Jay-Z is a
59:45business. They got married.
59:48They still awesome. They worth two,
59:51three billion, right? In the hip-hop
59:54world, we are all about collaborating on
59:56tracks. Why in the world can we not
59:59collaborate on businesses? When we
1:00:02collaborate on businesses, we are bigger
1:00:04and more valuable. Therefore, we can
1:00:07easily raise funds when we come together
1:00:09working as a team. And I'm getting
1:00:12passionate because I have more of my
1:00:15people
1:00:17are not willing to
1:00:19follow or work this advice that I'm
1:00:23sharing. And it baffles me because the
1:00:27most successful businesses in the world
1:00:29are doing this model.
1:00:31>> Microsoft is doing it. Oracle is doing
1:00:32it. Elon Musk has eight different
1:00:36industries he's in and his industries
1:00:39are working in ecosystems together.
1:00:44>> So what I say to the black community, my
1:00:46people or can I look at the camera?
1:00:48>> This one. This is your one
1:00:49>> man. Let's work together.
1:00:52Create ecosystems. Work as a
1:00:54partnership. Like everyone has unique
1:00:56skills, unique capabilities. It's all
1:00:59about merging those capabilities
1:01:00together as one, operating as one. Then
1:01:04you become more valuable. Your business
1:01:07become more valuable. And that is
1:01:10exactly how you create
1:01:13generation generational wealth.
1:01:16>> Why? So we can say that, right? Why do
1:01:19you think is the underlying what is the
1:01:21underlying issue as to why our community
1:01:25whether it's black Americans or black
1:01:26people in general aren't working
1:01:28together as much as we should?
1:01:32>> That's another subject that here it
1:01:35goes. And by the way, boys and girls,
1:01:38these are my thoughts and opinion and I
1:01:41love history. So we going in history,
1:01:44>> okay? The reason why we're in a
1:01:46situation we're in and we don't trust
1:01:48each other is how we were taught during
1:01:49slavery.
1:01:51>> We were taught to be separate. We were
1:01:53taught to light-kinned folks is in a big
1:01:56house and the black folks are in the in
1:01:57the field.
1:01:58>> And it's more of hey don't work with
1:02:02that person but listen to master.
1:02:05>> So we rather listen to master
1:02:07>> and get advice and and help compared to
1:02:11helping each other. But when we based on
1:02:14history before slavery when we work as
1:02:17community in a community we're pharaohs
1:02:21we're kings we are the originals of a
1:02:25lot of things in this world civilization
1:02:28we are the the originals of mathematics
1:02:32art if you listen to Plato Plato studied
1:02:36in Egypt
1:02:37>> and boys and girls Egypt is in Africa
1:02:40boys and girls Egypt is KT
1:02:42KT means black land, not the sand, but
1:02:47black land of the people. So we are the
1:02:52original folks that were the catalyst of
1:02:55all this growth throughout the world.
1:02:57>> So if we can go back and believe who we
1:03:00were, we can channel that and become
1:03:03more and be more by working together.
1:03:08Is there a world, not a world, but is
1:03:11there an argument for as a black person,
1:03:14given the difficulties that you face, if
1:03:16you are to partner, partner with someone
1:03:19outside of your race because they will
1:03:21have some advantages that you don't
1:03:23have?
1:03:23>> What's the first part of that question?
1:03:25>> Is there a way
1:03:26>> is like what do you think about that
1:03:27that idea? Whereas like if you are going
1:03:29to partner, partner with someone who you
1:03:31know like if you're looking at two
1:03:32founders, right? You want them to have
1:03:34two different skill sets. Mhm.
1:03:36>> Um, from a race perspective, is there
1:03:39any benefit to that?
1:03:40>> There's a major benefit based on how
1:03:43society sees sees things.
1:03:45>> Uh, I forgot the name of this movie, but
1:03:47and it's based on a true story.
1:03:49>> This guy was um in finance and he
1:03:54started buying real estate, but he made
1:03:56a white man as the face. And the white
1:03:59man, he taught the white man his skills.
1:04:01and the white man would go in and start
1:04:04buying the real estate, but the black
1:04:06man was the engine to that growth.
1:04:10>> Um, there's a guy called Robert Smith.
1:04:14He's one of the most successful
1:04:16>> Yeah.
1:04:16>> He has the biggest private equity firm
1:04:19in the world far as tech.
1:04:22In the beginning, he had a face man,
1:04:24which was a white man.
1:04:26>> So, it's all about using capabilities
1:04:30and resources. So, if if you have a if
1:04:32you're a black man and if you're trying
1:04:37to get resources and assets, then it
1:04:40might be to your benefit to partner with
1:04:42someone. Even if that someone has lower
1:04:46skills, you can still give that person
1:04:485% or 10% of your business, let him be
1:04:52the face man
1:04:54>> and use that to take advantage. Um,
1:04:59there's a person I know that has a
1:05:01successful tech business and he just
1:05:04hired a white CEO as the face of his
1:05:08business, but he still owned his
1:05:10business.
1:05:12>> Got to get crafty sometimes. Okay,
1:05:13>> I want to go back to the question about
1:05:15the Oprah thing. So,
1:05:17>> you want to go back to the question
1:05:18about Oprah? Okay. So based on the
1:05:20conversation we had in what routes have
1:05:24you gone with your nonfigure enterprise?
1:05:29>> You want me to answer that empire?
1:05:30>> You want me to answer that on the
1:05:31podcast?
1:05:32>> I want Yes. I want you to share where
1:05:35you were going and where you're heading
1:05:37now.
1:05:38>> Okay. Okay. I'll I'll I'll share some of
1:05:40the Don't give away the goodies since we
1:05:43met. Okay. So before um Donna sent me
1:05:46this like incredible message, I think it
1:05:49was very timely for like because I was
1:05:50very much like I'm doing this whole I'm
1:05:53doing this whole podcast. Like I think
1:05:55initially um I really liked working in
1:05:59banking because it had this very it was
1:06:02very respectable working in in banking.
1:06:04It has a lot of prestige, whatever,
1:06:05whatever. I really liked it. But I knew
1:06:07that that wasn't the field that I wanted
1:06:09to exist in. I knew that all of my skill
1:06:10set didn't align to what I was doing at
1:06:13the time. and there was no other there
1:06:14was nowhere in the bank that would suit
1:06:16who I was. So then I started the whole
1:06:18creator thing and the content thing, but
1:06:20I never wanted to just be a content
1:06:23creator um and to just be looked at as a
1:06:25content creator or a podcaster. I didn't
1:06:27really like that, but I was like, "Okay,
1:06:29well, I don't know what it is that I
1:06:31want to do, but let me start there
1:06:33because I think this is getting me
1:06:34closer um to what it is that I do want
1:06:37to do." And but I think one of the
1:06:39things that you you know really
1:06:41challenged me or what you sort of
1:06:43brought the clarity to is to stop
1:06:46looking at myself as just having a
1:06:48podcast or um being a creator and start
1:06:51thinking like a media company. And I
1:06:54think that was probably one of the
1:06:55biggest changes because when you when I
1:06:58started viewing what I was doing as a
1:07:00media company changed everything. It
1:07:01changed the name of my business like we
1:07:03turned it into a group. We started
1:07:05looking at the different verticals that
1:07:07like it was doing like stuff here and
1:07:08there. Yeah. Property stuff here and
1:07:09there. But then I started treating it as
1:07:11no this is actually a business vertical.
1:07:12We have the real estate arm. We have the
1:07:14media arm and then we have the the
1:07:16capital arm where you know we're doing
1:07:18different things. So I think even just
1:07:20that alone mentally when you're not
1:07:23thinking oh I'm just a podcast or I'm
1:07:25just a creator. When I introduce myself
1:07:26I can say you know I run a a media
1:07:29powered investment company. It's a very
1:07:31different it's a it's just very very
1:07:33different. And even just in saying that,
1:07:35then I know that I have to look at
1:07:37everything differently, employees
1:07:38differently, the trajectory differently.
1:07:41If I'm running a media company, then
1:07:43it's got to be more than just the
1:07:44podcast. What else are we doing? So, I
1:07:46think that really, really, really helped
1:07:48to just change the direction of the
1:07:52business. Um, and even just other little
1:07:54things that you've got me to do like
1:07:55creating the databases of all the guests
1:07:57that we've had and just seeing that it's
1:08:00there's there's been a lot.
1:08:01>> Looking for those synergies.
1:08:02>> Yeah, exactly.
1:08:03Yeah. Yeah. And even there's a lot of
1:08:05stuff that Darn has got me to do behind
1:08:08the scenes that has really helped um to
1:08:11sort of build out the things that we
1:08:13have done already and the things that
1:08:15are to come. Um just in terms of even
1:08:17partnering with the guests, we have a
1:08:19call this week to finalize a new um
1:08:22segment of the business where we're
1:08:23going to be um doing advisory for
1:08:27pensions and um pensions, tax advisory,
1:08:30stuff like that. But we're partnering
1:08:32with someone who was a guest on a
1:08:33business their someone who was a guest
1:08:35on a podcast their business. So we're
1:08:36picking an advisory an adviser from
1:08:38there and they're going to be the
1:08:40building wealth without borders
1:08:41consultant for people from our community
1:08:44um who want those services. So those are
1:08:46just little things that are happening.
1:08:48So thank you Darnell for your
1:08:51>> and you know what that simple simple
1:08:52thing is
1:08:53>> 10x is easier than 2x.
1:08:56>> Yeah. Because from a creator's
1:08:57perspective or podcast, you it was a lot
1:09:00of work on the incremental things,
1:09:03right?
1:09:04>> Granted, you are doing operating from a
1:09:0710x perspective of of a non-figure
1:09:09company. Yeah. You're still doing a lot,
1:09:12but it's higher leaps, right?
1:09:15>> For sure.
1:09:16>> And you feel a lot better, right?
1:09:18>> Definitely. Definitely. Okay.
1:09:22>> That's that should be for you. Either
1:09:23ways, if you want to speak to a
1:09:25professional about your current wealth
1:09:26situation, whether you're in Europe,
1:09:28you're in the UK, or the Americas, you
1:09:30can book a free consultation with our
1:09:32team, and we'll match you with a
1:09:34specialist based on your needs. Whether
1:09:36that's getting clarity on your
1:09:37investment portfolio, optimizing your
1:09:39pensions, or making sure that your
1:09:41financial plan actually aligns with your
1:09:43long-term goals, it is worth having a
1:09:45proper review. And if you've worked
1:09:47across multiple countries or companies,
1:09:50this is especially important for you
1:09:51because you should definitely be
1:09:53thinking about consolidating your
1:09:54pensions and speaking to a tax
1:09:57specialist. So, if this is you, book a
1:09:59free consultation using the link in the
1:10:00description box. So, we are going to be
1:10:02moving on to the wealth segment, which
1:10:04is where we read out a dilemma and the
1:10:06listeners want to hear what you have to
1:10:07say. So, you ready?
1:10:08>> Let's go for it.
1:10:09>> Cool. So, this is a bit of a long one.
1:10:12Um, but I can read it twice if if if we
1:10:14don't get it. So, this person says, "I'm
1:10:16dealing with a financial decision in my
1:10:17business that I can't take lightly.
1:10:19We've had a strong quarter and there's
1:10:21some extra cash in the company. Part of
1:10:23me wants to reinvest it straight back
1:10:25into the business, hire more people,
1:10:26improve systems, and push for more
1:10:28growth. But at the same time, the team
1:10:30has worked incredibly hard to get us
1:10:32here, and I know bonuses or salary
1:10:34increases would go a long way in keeping
1:10:35morale high and retaining key people.
1:10:38The problem is, I can't fully do both at
1:10:40the level I'd like. If I prioritize
1:10:42growth, the team might feel overlooked.
1:10:44If I prioritize rewarding the team, we
1:10:47might slow down at momentum and miss
1:10:49opportunity to scale. Do I reinvest most
1:10:51of the money back into growing the
1:10:53business or use a significant portion to
1:10:55reward the team now and strengthen
1:10:57loyalty?
1:10:59>> Okay, it's a good question.
1:11:01>> Well, this is how I view business.
1:11:03Businesses are like puzzle pieces. And
1:11:06once you understand where the puzzle
1:11:09pieces go, then you're able to make a
1:11:12more strategic decision on what you
1:11:16should do as far as allocating your
1:11:17funds or expanding your business. Most
1:11:22of the time when I do talk to founders,
1:11:25they the issue is capital,
1:11:28>> but I redirect their mindset and have
1:11:30them think about business as an
1:11:32ecosystem, the puzzle pieces. M
1:11:36>> so what are your goals for the next 3 to
1:11:385 years?
1:11:41Work from that perspective
1:11:44backwards.
1:11:46So if you're a $5 million company and
1:11:49you want to scale it to 10 million,
1:11:52I would say do not invest your cash flow
1:11:55or funds back into the business. I would
1:11:58say look at a complimentary company that
1:12:03has the capabilities,
1:12:05the infrastructure or even the team that
1:12:08you need and work out some type of
1:12:11mutual
1:12:13joint venture or even a merger where you
1:12:16can end up being 5 to10 million company
1:12:20in one transaction. That's actually what
1:12:22we've done with uh a few of our
1:12:24companies.
1:12:25So you your advice would be so for the
1:12:28extra cash that they have to look at
1:12:30acquiring another business if that's the
1:12:32goal. If the goal is
1:12:33>> do not use the cash to acquire another
1:12:35business.
1:12:36>> Do not use the cash to hire teams.
1:12:41Hold the cash in the business. But the
1:12:43focus is look at capabilities and work
1:12:46out some type of joint venture or mutual
1:12:49agreement with another company that has
1:12:52the assets, the client base, the
1:12:53resources you need to expand and grow.
1:12:57For example, if you an AI startup
1:13:00>> and you want to grow your company 50%
1:13:04instead of putting money back into the
1:13:06business, find an existing company that
1:13:09already has your client base already has
1:13:12the infrastructure and then hey John,
1:13:16you got a 20- year old company. I'm
1:13:18pretty sure you want to modernize. If we
1:13:20merge our companies together, you would
1:13:22have AI, so therefore your company will
1:13:25innovate.
1:13:26and vice versa, your company has the
1:13:28clientele that we need, so we can work
1:13:30out some type of agreement and we can
1:13:32end up being bigger and stronger
1:13:34together instead of separately.
1:13:35>> What if the person feels like they're
1:13:37not in a position to do that?
1:13:40>> Well,
1:13:40>> yeah,
1:13:41>> it's not being in a position, it's more
1:13:44of perspective
1:13:45>> because we are taught that we need
1:13:47capital to grow a business. M
1:13:50>> a lot of folks if they do research on
1:13:52how Bill Gates got started, how Larry
1:13:55Ellison got started, Bill Gates
1:13:57leveraged his
1:14:00OS system with IBM. IBM already had the
1:14:04infrastructure, the client base. So,
1:14:07Bill Gates merged, well, not merged, he
1:14:10partnered with IBM and that's how he
1:14:13generated revenue. Then he was able to
1:14:15raise money more for his company. Larry
1:14:19Ellison,
1:14:20he leveraged the CIA. The CIA had issues
1:14:25with their data. Larry Ellison said,
1:14:28"Hey, I have a solution that can fix
1:14:30that." Even though he didn't have the
1:14:31solution, he won the contract with the
1:14:34CIA. He leveraged the contract with the
1:14:36CIA and won other government contracts.
1:14:39That's how Larry Ellison's Oracle got
1:14:42started from contracts. and he didn't
1:14:45have a software yet, but when he got the
1:14:47money, that's when he ended up getting
1:14:48the team to build the software.
1:14:52>> So, it's it's a matter of perspective,
1:14:55not, hey, I'm not ready for it. It's
1:14:58what can I do differently to get there
1:15:01faster with less risk and effort.
1:15:04>> Some entrepreneurs are very big on like
1:15:07the most important part to scaling is
1:15:10the team um and the people that you
1:15:12bring on. And for example, I know Steven
1:15:14Bartlett talks a lot about like, you
1:15:16know, every every CEO, every
1:15:19entrepreneur should be spending X amount
1:15:21of time on hiring on a weekly basis
1:15:23because that's how you, you know, build
1:15:25an an incredible company by getting
1:15:27incredible people to work for you. So in
1:15:29this case where this person is thinking
1:15:31about rewarding their team members to
1:15:33increase loyalty or satisfaction, what
1:15:37then would be what would you say to
1:15:39that?
1:15:40Well, if they got the money, I would
1:15:44give out bonuses.
1:15:46>> Uh, reward them because especially in
1:15:48sales and in a growth company, you want
1:15:51to go ahead and show your team that
1:15:54they're worth value, right? And you do
1:15:56that by rewarding with trips, gifts, and
1:16:00of course, money. Now, again, when it
1:16:03comes to hiring, a lot of people do not
1:16:06have the funds to do that. M
1:16:08>> so again a shortcut could be partnering
1:16:12with an existing company that already
1:16:15has that team
1:16:17>> and then if that partnership works you
1:16:19can go ahead and merge the company
1:16:21together as one. So that is the quickest
1:16:24way that you can get a skilled team
1:16:28without straining your cash flow.
1:16:31>> Okay, that's interesting. I think that
1:16:34should answer that person's questions.
1:16:35All right, let's move on to the
1:16:36quickfire money questions. First
1:16:38question is, what is the best investment
1:16:40you've ever made?
1:16:41>> The 75 mil,
1:16:43>> the merging of that business.
1:16:45>> Mhm.
1:16:45>> Why do you say it's your best
1:16:46investment?
1:16:47>> Shortest time, biggest profits,
1:16:50>> and least effort.
1:16:53>> Because again, it was all over Zoom and
1:16:55forwarding over contracts
1:16:58and signatures.
1:17:00>> That's good. What is the biggest money
1:17:02mistake you've made? The biggest money
1:17:05mistake
1:17:07it well is dealing with that $5 million
1:17:11deal that we didn't get to close when a
1:17:15client was saying, "Hey, I want to send
1:17:17in the PO."
1:17:18>> Because when we did not accept that PO,
1:17:22when a client say, "Hey, I want to send
1:17:23you money. Take the money." Well, when
1:17:25we didn't accept that PO, 3 weeks later,
1:17:27cuz we was going to talk to the client
1:17:29in 6 weeks. Three weeks later after that
1:17:32phone call, that company got hacked
1:17:34where it lost 72 million in
1:17:40I think it was a total of four four
1:17:43weeks.
1:17:45And if they would had our services, they
1:17:46would had our our um we had part of the
1:17:50deal was database, the part of the deal
1:17:53was the cloud infrastructure and all
1:17:54that good stuff, but more specifically
1:17:56advanced security where it encrypts the
1:17:58data. So if it was get hacked, they
1:18:01would only see encrypted information. If
1:18:03they would have had that information,
1:18:05>> then they wouldn't have to shut down
1:18:07their whole company and they wouldn't
1:18:10have lost all that money.
1:18:12>> Oh wow, that's
1:18:14>> So to me it I lost $200,000.
1:18:18>> The company lost $5 million. Our company
1:18:21lost 5 million. I lost 200,000. And the
1:18:24company we worked for lost 72 million.
1:18:28or that we was trying to close a deal
1:18:29with.
1:18:30>> Yeah, that's kind of deep. All right,
1:18:32final one is what is one piece of advice
1:18:34you would give to someone who is trying
1:18:35to build wealth?
1:18:37>> Ecosystems.
1:18:40Uh, one advice if you have an existing
1:18:45business and you're trying to build
1:18:47wealth,
1:18:49start with value.
1:18:52And even tell you what, your listeners,
1:18:54they can give me a call and or reach out
1:18:57to me on LinkedIn and I can probably
1:19:00have a 30 minute conversation and if
1:19:02there's something that I can help them
1:19:04with, we can go from there.
1:19:06>> You know, a lot of people will take that
1:19:07up. So,
1:19:08>> I know.
1:19:08>> Okay.
1:19:09>> Now, uh when you do reach out, make sure
1:19:12you say it's because of this podcast.
1:19:15Lead with that in the subject line.
1:19:19>> Okay. Okay. Let me know how that goes.
1:19:22But thank you so much, Darnell. Um, if
1:19:25they want to find you to reach out for,
1:19:28you know, whatever it is, advice that
1:19:30they want, where should they find you? I
1:19:32will link everything in the description
1:19:34box, but if you just want to
1:19:35>> Yeah, just keep it simple. LinkedIn.
1:19:37>> LinkedIn. Darnell Phelps on LinkedIn
1:19:39>> because I got too many other avenues for
1:19:41people to reach out and it's getting to
1:19:43a point where
1:19:45>> you're losing track. too too many
1:19:46emails, too many text messages.
1:19:50>> Fair. All right, we will link uh
1:19:51Darnell's um LinkedIn in the description
1:19:54box. We are now going to move on to I'm
1:19:56going to ask you a couple more juicy
1:19:58questions, but in our membersonly
1:19:59section. So, if you want to watch that,
1:20:01then join and we'll continue the
1:20:04conversation. Thank you. Thank you.

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