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Top 10 TE Rankings + Most Improved Offenses | Fantasy Football 2026 - Ep. 1943 — Transcript

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0:05[music] Welcome to the Fantasy
0:08Footballers podcast with your hosts Andy
0:11Holloway, Jason Moore, and Mike Wright.
0:17[music]
0:23Welcome in
0:31Not yet, Tracy. Not yet. Not yet.
0:35Wednesday, August 5th, [music] the
0:38fantasy football. The the the what?
0:43Tight end ranking show, NFL news,
0:46talking improved offenses, talking
0:49fantasy
0:50insights to help you on draft day.
0:53That's the goal each and every day. help
0:56you prepare for your draft and for the
0:58season. Jason has been smirking for a
1:01minute,
1:02>> maybe longer. Are you in a good mood?
1:03>> I'm in a great mood. We golfed this
1:05morning.
1:06>> That put you in a good mood?
1:07>> No, sir. No, sir. I got a new high
1:10score, which is Yes. Which is great.
1:13Plus 27 through 9.
1:15>> No. No, that's real.
1:16>> That is real. That is absolutely real.
1:19>> Saying it out loud.
1:20>> No, it's not real. I am not counting a
1:24mulligan. So
1:26technically it would be 28, but I'm I'm
1:28going to give myself
1:29>> plus 30-ish.
1:30>> I mean, the Falcon was out there with a
1:32camera today. That
1:33>> I'm sure there's got some bad shots in
1:35there.
1:36>> I'm sure he does.
1:37>> Well, he was following you. So,
1:39>> does he have any good ones
1:41>> of Andy? Yeah, for sure.
1:43>> No, but I'm I'm fine, man. I I will say
1:45this. When I started golfing and I was
1:47really really bad, which I have stayed
1:49at least consistent. Um I I was breaking
1:53clubs. I was that guy. That guy on the
1:55course.
1:55>> This has been a a mental Yeah. change.
1:58>> This is This has been something where
1:59it's like, grow up. Golf's hard. You You
2:02suck.
2:03>> Yeah. The tumor is not operable.
2:04>> You don't want to be out here.
2:05[laughter]
2:06>> Yeah. Exactly. The tumor is unoperable.
2:09>> It's not the tumor.
2:10>> Just deal with it. Okay. So sad. Okay.
2:13[laughter] There's nothing you can do,
2:14so just like get over it. Good point,
2:17Andy. Um, yeah. But no, I'm I'm in a
2:20good mood. I'm I'm really really excited
2:22about football. I'm really excited about
2:24August being here.
2:24>> Get the golf off the back screen.
2:26>> Yeah. [laughter] Um and and and me being
2:29a horrifically bad golfer will not get
2:32in my way.
2:33>> There's there's a decent chance that we
2:35do some work on that. You know, we get
2:37>> Yeah. Yeah. I think we're going to
2:39genuinely
2:39>> get some lessons, you know, get get
2:41better. Um but this is not a golf show.
2:44It sometimes feels like it.
2:46>> We have a giveaway. A big giveaway.
2:48>> That's cool.
2:50>> What are we giving away, Andy? We are
2:52giving away a signed Bejian Robinson
2:55jersey in honor of
2:57>> Bejon
2:58>> Bjan Robinson's new contract. No, we're
3:00giving away an autographed Bjon jersey.
3:03Free to enter footclangiveaway.com if
3:05you're interested in that. We like
3:06giving away some stuff in August. It's
3:08always fun. So, we're going to start
3:10with that doesn't mean it'll be the only
3:11giveaway in August, but uh we'll start
3:13with a signed bjan robinson jersey
3:17footclan giveaway.com for that. You guys
3:20know the UDK. It's available right now
3:22at ultimatraftkit.com if you want to
3:24prepare for your draft in the best
3:25possible way. Check that out. And um
3:29yeah, I'm excited too, Jay. It's time to
3:31get into it. Quick question of the day
3:33comes in from Billy. Which bottom 10
3:35offense from 2025
3:38do you believe will outperform their
3:40touchdown total by 13 plus? And the
3:42reason uh he's asking 13 plus is because
3:45last year, Mike, on your on the tips and
3:48tricks show, you talked about
3:50anticipating offensive systems and
3:53their, you know, basically them
3:55improving because over the last decade,
3:57at least three teams, uh, mind you, it
4:00was six last year. At least three teams
4:02every year jump 13 plus total
4:04touchdowns.
4:05>> Yep. And figuring out who it is can
4:08really, really help you.
4:09>> Yeah. I mean, because we've said this
4:11about rookies going to bad destinations.
4:13It's not always bad. You think it's bad,
4:16but things change in the NFL so quickly.
4:18Just for context, last year's touchdown
4:20leaders, the Rams, New England, Seattle,
4:22Buffalo, Detroit, the basement was New
4:25Orleans, New York, the Jets, that is
4:27Tennessee, Cleveland, and Las Vegas.
4:29Those were and you're talking the Rams,
4:32just for just for like to see the
4:34difference, the Rams scored 65 total
4:36touchdowns. The Raiders scored 25 total
4:38touchdowns.
4:39>> Oh man. So, uh, but it happens every
4:42year. Um, most of the time it's more
4:44than three. Six teams. Last year, the
4:46Rams jumped more than 13 touchdowns. New
4:49England jumped more than 13.
4:50Jacksonville, Dallas, New York, and
4:51Indianapolis. So, what's the team for
4:54this year? Mike, why don't you start?
4:58Uh the the amount of chips that I have
5:01been pushing into the table on the New
5:03Orleans Saints is uh we are we're not
5:07approaching inappropriate.
5:09>> Now you're almost all in.
5:10>> We're we are inappropriate and now we're
5:13borderline just terrifying of how much I
5:16believe in in what they are about to do.
5:20Uh, so I I think with with Shuck and Co
5:23uh down there in New Orleans and with
5:25Kell Moore, you know, calling calling
5:27the plays, getting everything going for
5:28the offense. I think that they are what
5:30they are the team to watch to make, you
5:33know, a a New England style jump.
5:37>> I guess one thing I hadn't thought
5:38about, I didn't realized how low they
5:39were last year because Shuck did play
5:41over a great part of the year. He didn't
5:42have a lot of passing touchdowns.
5:44>> Correct. tons of yardage and but a uh
5:47like a average or below average
5:49touchdown.
5:49>> I imagine Kell Moore is not proud of
5:51that number. That 31 number was nearly
5:53the bottom of the NFL and he has a a
5:56resume that you know he can call plays
5:58and and get it into the end zone.
6:00They're definitely a great candidate for
6:02that. I I'm going to go with the Titans.
6:04I've been kind of in their corner
6:07>> this off season.
6:08>> Not to the I I think you believe that
6:11the Saints can compete in a big way.
6:13make the playoffs, win the division.
6:14>> Saints winning the division. Yeah,
6:16>> I don't I don't think the Titans can win
6:17their division, but I think the
6:18difference in their offense um could be
6:21significant. I mean, the
6:23>> the Giants last year were one of the
6:25teams that jumped up 13 touchdowns just
6:28with Jackson Dart coming in and then
6:30adding Cam Scataboo. The difference
6:32that, you know, some pass catchers are
6:34going to make in Tennessee, the fact
6:35that they were at the the bottom of the
6:37league last year, I think that Cam
6:40Ward's going to take a step forward. Uh,
6:42I'm pretty excited about Carnell Tate.
6:44Juan Dale's there. They've got the
6:47weapons and they got the play caller.
6:48Brian Dable coming in. So, um, I I'm
6:51going to go with the Titans.
6:52>> Yeah, I think uh play caller makes a big
6:55impact. That is probably the number one
6:57reason for my team. They were the bottom
6:59of the barrel, the the lowest scoring
7:02team in the league. The Raiders last
7:03year, obviously, you you had Brock
7:06Bowers injured. You had a terrible
7:07offensive line. And genuinely, I think
7:10that the biggest issue with the Raiders
7:12offense last year was the
7:14>> Pete Carol nepatism on the offensive
7:18line. You know, the the the offensive
7:20line coach being his son. Everyone said
7:22it was a a problem, a mistake when they
7:24fired their staff and didn't retain him.
7:26It was like,
7:27>> what's going on here? I think Clint
7:30Kubiaak coming in, bringing in Rick
7:32Dennison, a really good offensive line
7:34coach, going out and getting Tyler
7:36Lindenbomb, a great center, and then you
7:38get Brock back. Now you've got Kirk
7:40Cousins in and you know, we don't know
7:42what Mendoza will do. Obviously,
7:43Mendoza, rookie quarterbacks don't
7:45usually have a high touchdown number,
7:48but when you only scored 25 touchdowns
7:51last year, like the bar is
7:53>> pretty easy to step over. That 13 more
7:56touchdown number, they could still be in
7:58the bottom half of offenses and score 13
8:00more touchdowns than they did last year.
8:02>> Rick Dennison not being a private
8:04investigator. I think
8:06>> I've been I was trying to figure out
8:07what that name like. He's either a
8:09sheriff in a wild west town. Rick
8:11Dennison. Yeah. On the case
8:13>> or or a detective. Yeah. But you're not
8:15talking like current era.
8:17>> Oh, like a film. Oh, no. This is old.
8:19He's like, "Of all the places in all the
8:21world, she had to walk into mine. What a
8:24dame. [laughter]
8:26>> There's just
8:29like a car cigarette smoke floating in
8:32the air.
8:33>> Um,
8:34beige trim.
8:35>> A powerful name. It is.
8:37>> Uh, all right. We will jump into the
8:39news
8:42>> news and notes from around the league.
8:45[music]
8:48>> Okay. Is this news NFL network I rapport
8:52believes to uh will likely start week
8:55one? This is not news.
8:57>> Hold on. Don't be surprised.
9:00>> This is an This is a thought.
9:01>> That's a thought that is and the thought
9:03was has a [laughter] equivocator in it,
9:06>> right? It's not even a strong thought.
9:08It's just like I think maybe
9:09>> right
9:10>> I think I think maybe the two will
9:12start.
9:12>> What's the line that you're bringing up
9:14before?
9:14>> Yeah, just the don't be surprised.
9:15>> Don't be surprised if I get it.
9:18>> We we do these things. Sometimes you're
9:20talking and then you're trying to gather
9:23your thoughts at the exact same time as
9:25you're thinking. Sometimes one of those
9:26thoughts comes out and you're like,
9:27"Ooh, I got to I got to I got to soften
9:30that one."
9:31>> I believe most people's expectation here
9:34is that Tua is going to start. Tua is
9:36banged up right now, but PennX is even
9:38further away from getting on the field.
9:40>> Tua's just
9:41>> and he's better. Tua was not good, but
9:44>> But he is better.
9:44>> He was better. Pennix was so I man, when
9:47I watched the film last year, I was
9:48like, I did not remember him being this
9:50bad. He was very, very not good.
9:53>> Eight hours ago, a tongue of training
9:55camp with Michael Penn, quote, "It's
9:57definitely a competition."
9:59>> Yeah. Well,
10:00>> this is what you'd say if it wasn't one.
10:02But no, I I noticed that on Sleeper, one
10:04of the uh most added players in Dynasty
10:06Leagues was their third string
10:08quarterback.
10:10>> Oh my god.
10:10>> For the Falcons. All right, Bucks wide
10:12receivers. We don't know what's going
10:14on. Tess Johnson left with a groin
10:15injury. Jaylen McMillan didn't practice
10:17after banging his knee a couple days ago
10:19and Godwin and Ibuka were given a
10:20maintenance day. So, they they were
10:22like, nah. It's worth noting Tez Johnson
10:24has gotten a lot of buzz of being like
10:27the star of camp, you know, when it
10:30comes to
10:30>> he's the star of groin index.com right
10:32now.
10:32>> It it it does stink that he
10:34>> What about me, Jason? Yeah. [laughter]
10:37>> Oh,
10:37>> it's 1999. Oh, there I am.
10:40>> Oh, that's a Ted Hurst reference.
10:42>> Yeah, that is a Ted Hurst.
10:43>> Now, this Durst Fred Durst [laughter]
10:46>> ridiculous Travis uh a champ.
10:50>> Come on. He'll get he'll get an
10:52opportunity with TZ injured.
10:53>> Has taken most of the early down reps at
10:55training camp. Alvin Chimera getting
10:57third down reps.
10:58>> Rut row.
10:59>> Yeah, I mean we we say it all the time.
11:01Targets are worth more than a rushing
11:04attempt for fantasy football. If you
11:05look at
11:06>> a That's what Han's much better at
11:08receiving than he is at running.
11:10>> When you look is much better at
11:11receiving than a problem. That is that
11:13is a problem. That's what I've said
11:15since they signed was originally when it
11:17was signed it was like, "Oh, Chimera is
11:18not going to be on the team. He's
11:19clearly not only going to be on the
11:21team, he's going to be part of this
11:22backfield. And I think right now ADP
11:24says that Travis ETN is like just he is
11:27guaranteed to be a three down workhorse
11:29back. I don't think that's happening.
11:31>> The name it's it's we're still trying to
11:34figure it out.
11:34>> ETN
11:36Junior I don't know. We're trying our
11:37best. We're going to find out real soon.
11:39>> We have you know it's August so you got
11:41people coming back to football and they
11:42they might not have any idea but
11:45>> we petition him.
11:46>> I know. We need to talk. We need to talk
11:47to
11:48>> Pat Bryant in line for a bigger slice of
11:50the pie in there is Denver, which would
11:52be good because Denver
11:54>> um they need something different on the
11:56offensive side of the ball. I mean, they
11:58were one of the teams, like for me,
11:59Denver is the team that jumps out as a
12:01potential 13 plus touchdown jump. I
12:04mean, Denver only had 45 touchdowns last
12:06year.
12:07>> It was middle of the pack.
12:09>> You know, you had Bryant
12:11>> being the wide receiver three doesn't
12:13make me think there's going to be any
12:14regular fantasy value, but no. But do
12:16you think it's great for I mean I mean
12:18it if he establishes himself as the wide
12:21receiver three in camp and it's like not
12:23just this committee cuz right now I'm
12:24projecting the third to be a committee.
12:26You're going to have Mims involved.
12:27You're going to have Troy Franklin
12:28involved. You're going to have Pat
12:29Bryant maybe leading the three. But if
12:31he fully establishes himself as the
12:34third, do you think there's a chance as
12:36a young player he can usurp
12:38>> Courtland Sutton this year and and
12:41become the wide receiver too for the
12:42offense? Like is that in the range of
12:44realistic outcomes? I would I would I
12:47would say that's not impossible, but
12:50this is more of a like
12:51>> But you wouldn't be surprised.
12:53>> I actually would I would be surprised.
12:55What I would not be surprised of is if
12:58heading into next year they are like
13:01we're going to move on from Sutton and
13:03it's going to be Jaylen Waddle and Pat
13:04Bryant.
13:06>> Yeah. Yeah. I I think that that whole
13:08offense is going to be very very
13:09interesting to watch this year with
13:10Waddles addition with the ensemble of
13:13running backs.
13:15Like seems like Dobbins is the guy.
13:17>> Oh yeah.
13:18>> But then it seems like Harvey might get
13:19third downs and Jonah Coleman's just
13:21around.
13:22>> The uh
13:23>> Gofflin is just around.
13:24>> And a last piece of news real quick,
13:26Andy. This cuz this is just this is
13:28great news. It's fun.
13:30>> Tank Dell
13:32>> of the Houston Texans.
13:33>> Yeah.
13:34>> Is practicing
13:35>> with pad's first year. This is This is
13:38awesome. We haven't seen him what in
13:40like over a calendar year since the
13:42>> Oh, yeah. It's been basically two years.
13:44>> Horrific injury two seasons ago. He
13:46missed all of last year.
13:48>> Was that the Just correct me because
13:50it's a long time ago.
13:51>> Yeah.
13:51>> That injury was that on the block?
13:53>> Yes. He was in line goal line block.
13:56Yeah.
13:57>> Cuz Or was that a previous other injury?
13:58>> No, no, no. I'm [laughter]
14:01on the same one.
14:02>> I thought it was on a catch.
14:02>> I thought it was on a catch on the back
14:03of the end zone.
14:04>> Yeah. I thought I thought it was a
14:05touchdown
14:06>> cuz he uh
14:07>> That was so long ago.
14:09>> Yeah. cuz the year before I had traded
14:12for him
14:13>> and he was left in on a blocking down,
14:16went in and then was knocked out for the
14:17the rest of the year
14:19>> and that was um
14:20>> I forget that that was
14:21>> I mean he's had injury issues throughout
14:23his career but when he's been on the
14:24field he's been awesome.
14:26>> It's really tough for
14:27>> and Strad was much better with him.
14:29>> Yeah. A guy that's 165 pounds. I mean we
14:32we gave him guff when he was in line
14:33block like what is he going to do as a
14:35blocker? He's not really changing things
14:36to the team. So he he broke his fibula
14:39on that block in 2023,
14:41>> missed five games, ended his season, and
14:44then the dislocated kneecap was the the
14:46full season. So
14:48>> there you go. But
14:49>> if man, if the NFL and the Texans are
14:52better if Tanktell is playing at a high
14:54level.
14:55>> Yeah, absolutely. We'll take a quick
14:56break and then get into the countdown.
15:02>> [music]
15:07>> tight ends.
15:10>> All right, guys. We are jumping into our
15:12tight end rankings countdown. The top
15:1410, looking at positives, negatives of
15:18these players. Obviously, the tight end
15:20position is well, it's a polarizing
15:22spot. I mean, you have these high
15:24performers, difference makers at a
15:26onesie position.
15:28If you have one of those top guys and
15:29somebody else is out there streaming the
15:31position, it can be a huge advantage on
15:33a week in weekout basis. Problem is
15:36identifying the sleeper ones that can
15:38perform out of nowhere and making sure
15:40that you're draft if you're going to
15:42spend high draft capital. That guy is an
15:43every week start.
15:45>> So we'll also look at the beginning
15:46schedules for these guys a little bit.
15:48So let's start counting it down.
15:50>> Number 10.
15:53Uh, number 10, Travis Kelce going on 37
15:57years old. I have him ranked the lowest.
15:59I've talked about him recently.
16:01>> I'm pretty out on Kelsey is just not.
16:04>> One thing I wanted to do and maybe Kyle
16:05while we're talking about Kelsey briefly
16:09>> final seasons for some of the greats.
16:10I'm just kind of curious where
16:12>> Antonio Gates
16:12>> like Antonio Gates, Tony Gonzalez, uh,
16:15Jason Whitten, you know, Jimmy Graham,
16:18like most of those guys from my
16:19recollection, like I remember Jimmy
16:21Graham being pretty irrelevant at the
16:22end. Uh yeah, I mean he had the uh
16:24>> he came back and had a bunch of
16:25touchdowns, right, in one of those.
16:27>> Well, he I'm just saying he had the
16:28patella tendant tendon tear.
16:31>> That was a different word.
16:32>> Yes. But um but look, it it is, you
16:35know, whether you believe he can
16:36contribute this year or not, he'll
16:39Antonio Gates final year, final two
16:42years, he was 37 and 38 years old. He
16:44caught 30 passes each year. They were
16:46basically irrelevant years. his last
16:48good season, 36 years old, 53 for 5,48
16:52and seven. We know the trajectory right
16:54now on Kelsey is it's going down. It's
16:56just a matter of how low does it go.
16:58>> He tends to be out there.
17:00>> But if he gives you if he gives you six,
17:02seven points a game, you're not going to
17:03be happy.
17:04>> No. No, you won't. Uh the thing is is
17:06right now you've got a tight end who
17:08last year had over a 100 targets. You've
17:10got an offense that I think should be
17:13better than last year. not necessarily a
17:15a old school great Kansas City offense,
17:18but adding Kenneth Walker I think really
17:20does help the offense in general. If you
17:23have someone that's going to catch 80
17:25passes, they're not going to be bad for
17:27where he's being drafted. But the upside
17:29is gone. You're not having a player
17:31who's making a difference at the
17:33position. You're just simply trying to
17:34say I think when you draft Kelsey,
17:36you're taking your your the approach of
17:38I punted the position, but I don't want
17:41to stream and I'm just gonna try to be
17:43okay
17:45>> with whatever mediocrity he provides.
17:48And maybe that's the wrong maybe that's
17:50the lazy way and streaming like the the
17:52question should be asked here. Would it
17:55be more valuable? Will you score more
17:56fantasy points if you're streaming off
17:57the waiverwire this season or if you
17:59just play Travis Kelce every game?
18:02I think I think once we establish
18:04matchups about halfway through the year,
18:05you can stream it better than Kelsey
18:06personally,
18:07>> but I think that's up for debate. Fair.
18:09I mean, it's fairly up for debate. I
18:11think you're going to find yourself
18:13thinking, this is where I think you're
18:14going to end up. You're going to think
18:15you can start him every week
18:16>> because of the name.
18:17>> Because you drafted Travis Kelce and I
18:20think you're going to not know when to
18:21pull the trigger on changing that out.
18:22Now, your point about the offense being
18:25better, I think that's well within the
18:27realm. I mean, the Giants scored seven
18:29more touchdowns than the Chiefs did last
18:31year. The Pittsburgh Steelers, did you
18:33like that offense?
18:34>> No. Vomit.
18:35>> Seven more touchdowns than the Kansas
18:37City Chiefs last year. Patrick Mahomes
18:40is coming off a serious injury. The
18:42identity of this team is going to be the
18:44running game. Rashi Rice is coming off a
18:46serious injury. And I I'm not so certain
18:49that this offense is going to be
18:51significantly better. I think their
18:53defense is outstanding. and they spent
18:55all of their draft capital and trades on
18:57making that defense top in the league.
19:00I'm not sure you're going to have it
19:01opened up enough for you to be happy
19:02because all of his targets now are close
19:04to the line of scrimmage.
19:05>> Then that's why I I'm still okay with
19:07Kelsey as if I'm as the tight end punt
19:10of I I feel pretty confident that Kelsey
19:13will he will finish in the top 10.
19:15That's not always great for your fantasy
19:18team or making a difference, but they
19:22he's going to be the number two target.
19:24He will have a 100 targets again if he
19:25plays in all 17 games and he'll he'll
19:28give you roughly
19:30>> nine points a week.
19:32>> You think he's the number two target?
19:33Cuz I think that they're going to have
19:34to make a transition at some point in
19:36time.
19:37>> But to who?
19:37>> Yeah. I mean, whether Cyrus Allen or
19:40Xavier Worthy can step up, I I don't
19:42know.
19:43>> I just think tight end snaps may come
19:44down. I think you're going to manage him
19:46a little.
19:46>> It's possible.
19:47>> Yeah. I will say that older players, you
19:50know, we've seen this with Keenan Allen
19:51recently, like
19:53>> sometimes they get off to a decent start
19:56to the year. Sure.
19:57>> Uh the first month of the schedule is,
19:59you know, they're favored in all four
20:00games. First week's a little hard at
20:02home against Denver, but then
20:03Indianapolis, Miami, Las Vegas, those
20:05are great matchups. And then they go on
20:06their bye-week. So maybe you're right,
20:08the second half of the year, you stream,
20:09you grab Kelsey, play him for a month,
20:11and then start knowing what the matchups
20:13are. And
20:14>> shout out to Tony Gonzalez who at 37
20:15years old had 121 targets 83 for 859 and
20:18eight.
20:19>> I think I think Kelsey that seems it
20:22right in the range.
20:22>> Yeah, it's possible.
20:23>> That's the upper range.
20:25>> Number nine,
20:26>> it's Kyle Pittz coming in at our
20:28consensus number nine. Jason and I have
20:30him at eight.
20:31>> This is the man of
20:34What do you possibly do with this? What
20:36do you do with Kyle Pittz? I mean, Kyle
20:38Pittz is going to be on the field for
20:4190% of snaps.
20:44Kyle Pittz is the second best pass
20:46catcher on the team.
20:48And Kyle Pittz is 25 years old.
20:52I don't know where the confidence is in
20:55Tua, but I think it's higher than Penn.
20:59Um, I don't know if it's higher than
21:00where you thought Cousins was last year.
21:03>> It's probably pretty neutral. Maybe a
21:05little lower. I just I I find myself in
21:08a tough spot like all of us forever and
21:11we will forever be I think with Kyle
21:13Pittz here. I mean he was a monster over
21:15the final six weeks. It's been brought
21:16up adnauseium that Drake London wasn't
21:20there.
21:22>> Yeah. I mean obviously you do have that
21:24built-in upside.
21:25>> They said he looks like he's running
21:26better than he's ever before.
21:27>> I've I've seen that a lot that his this
21:29offseason he looks athletically like
21:32kind of the the player they drafted. has
21:33been a problem like we've said like for
21:36years when you're watching Kyle Pittz
21:38>> where
21:39>> the rookie year the the touchdowns were
21:41disappointing but to have over thousand
21:42year thousand yards as a rookie at the
21:45tight end position is that's very
21:47impressive and then kind of since then
21:50we've been watching him saying this
21:51doesn't look like that doesn't look like
21:54the same player. So
21:55>> after
21:57maybe he had long injuries that just
21:59were
22:00>> they they wouldn't clear up. Maybe
22:02they're cleared up, but he is
22:04>> they paid him a lot.
22:05>> I'm not drafting him.
22:06>> I'm not either. Um I But I think it's
22:09worth noting that he does have built-in
22:11upside of should Drake London get
22:13injured. We saw him truly dominate when
22:16he became the de facto one. So we know
22:19he can do it. And so there is that kind
22:21of built-in that's not built in with
22:24everyone else. Like like right after him
22:25is going Sam Laaporta. I if if Jameson
22:29Williams goes down, we've seen the
22:30splits. Leaporta is the same with and
22:32without Jameson Williams.
22:34>> Um, however, the guys around him like
22:38Leaporta, I better offense, more
22:41expected touchdowns. Tucker Craft.
22:43>> Mhm.
22:43>> You know, when we've seen him, much
22:45higher upside. Harold Fannon,
22:47>> I'm going to say it out. I'm in on cops.
22:49>> I'm in on copy.
22:51>> They just paid him a ton of money to
22:54stick around.
22:55>> No, I don't need the camera.
22:57>> In fact, hold on. No, no, no, no. Put
22:59the camera. Put the camera on Jason. Oh,
23:00what?
23:01>> Put the C I'm in on Kyle Pittz.
23:03[laughter]
23:04>> No, that's me. I'm saying it. I just
23:06>> I don't want the the camera.
23:08>> I'm listen [clears throat]
23:12giving us
23:14success at the tight end position.
23:15>> No, I'm I'm in. I I'm going to I'm going
23:17to wipe the slate clean each and every
23:19year. And I'm looking at the contract,
23:21the roster, the offense. Kyle Pittz is
23:24going to be a focal point. Year six
23:26breakout.
23:28>> It's happened before at the tight end
23:30position.
23:30>> Quote I'd use.
23:31>> Wait, is this year six?
23:33>> Is it? Wow.
23:35>> Crazy. Um, okay. So, let me ask you this
23:37cuz the next tight end we're talking
23:38about here is Sam Leaporta.
23:40>> Wait for the number eight.
23:42>> I was putting on
23:44give the name. No, wait.
23:46>> Normally reveal before the number, but
23:48it's fine.
23:49>> They're going right next to each other
23:51in drafts. So right now the the what I'm
23:53seeing 704 706 they're they're basically
23:56you're picking one of these two players.
23:58So you are picking Kyle Pittz.
24:01[laughter]
24:01>> Yes.
24:01>> Because you are in UNC. So you will take
24:03him over Leaporta. Okay. I just wanted
24:05that established.
24:07>> Yeah I will. I I think that Kyle Pittz
24:09is going to be a focal point of the
24:10offense on a regular basis.
24:12So I I'm not I'm not proud [laughter] of
24:15it.
24:16I'm not I wouldn't tell anybody.
24:18>> I mean we have them ranked identical. We
24:20both have him as our tight end eight.
24:22Obviously last year he was the tight end
24:24too. That's a little bit
24:25>> here. Here's a real question for you.
24:27>> Okay.
24:27>> If you think I mean are you are you just
24:29drafting Craft and KD automatically
24:32assuming they'll be fine ahead of Kyle
24:34Pittz?
24:35>> I am not. I believe Mike is
24:37>> I would. Yes.
24:37>> So you know are you drafting Fannon
24:40automatically ahead of Pitts? Probably
24:42right.
24:42>> Yes. I I if if the cost was the same I
24:45would much rather have Fannon.
24:46>> All right. Sam Sam Leaport is who we're
24:48talking about now. Um, nobody knows this
24:51man better than Jason Moore. [laughter]
24:54Uh, he's been on his team in a bunch of
24:55mocks in a row. I got him at nine, Mike
24:57at eight, Jason at seven. I mean, Sam
24:59Leaporta, he's a he's a great tight end.
25:02He's going to be out there every snap
25:03for the most part. There the team has an
25:06incredible schedule. They're favored in
25:0814 of the first 15 games.
25:10>> They also have a ton of weapons. Jir
25:11Gibbs, Alman Ron St. Brown, Jameson
25:13Williams. There will be I think games
25:16where you're gonna end up with the short
25:19end of the stick. He can make big plays.
25:21He has a chance of double digit
25:22touchdowns,
25:24but we have seen, you know, I mean,
25:27Leaporta is a pretty safe pick, I think.
25:29>> Yeah. I mean, that's what it is. I I
25:30don't see Leaporta like he can't
25:33differentiate himself from the other
25:36target monsters at the position. He's
25:37never going to have 140 targets the way
25:40that a McBride or Bowowers or some of
25:42these secondyear tight ends might get
25:44to, but the touchdown upside is clearly
25:48there. He's already had double- digit
25:50touchdowns in his career as a rookie.
25:51He's on a team that is expected to score
25:53a ton of points. And I think this is
25:55just a player where you're going to have
25:58consistency. When he doesn't score a
26:00touchdown, it's not like he just
26:01disappears,
26:03but you're going to have a lot of
26:04touchdowns. But if you end up with,
26:06let's say, nine touchdowns this season,
26:08very reasonable for him, that means
26:11there's I mean, when your tight end
26:13scores a touchdown
26:14>> every other game at least
26:15>> that week, you have a good chance of
26:17winning. And and so I would rather have
26:19a guy who can get in the end zone. Like
26:21I I think Leaporta has way more
26:25touchdown opportunities than Pitts.
26:28Pitts might have more targets, but I'll
26:29take the touchdowns at the tight end
26:30position. personally last year in his
26:33nine games, you know, Leaporta had four
26:36of them were over 10 points. It it like
26:40Yeah, I I would rather I would rather
26:43hitch my wagon to Leaporta.
26:45>> All right,
26:46>> number seven.
26:47>> Tucker Craft comes in at number seven. I
26:50got him at five, so that's
26:53>> I thought this was only Mike's dude.
26:56>> No, I I have him ranked at five,
26:57>> right? team Tucker,
26:59>> which means he is above Fannon in my
27:02rankings and below Bowowers, McBride,
27:04Lovelin, and Warren right now. I do
27:06think he'll be there from week one. I
27:08think that look, I think their offense
27:10is interesting top to bottom. I I think
27:13you have players that we're excited
27:15about. Christian Watson,
27:17>> yeah,
27:18>> you know, Jaden Reed getting some talk
27:19about some two wide receiver sets. all
27:21the all the feedback. I know we're
27:22bitter towards Matthew Golden, but all
27:24the camp talk has been very positive
27:26around Matthew Golden. Uh it's an
27:29interesting offense, but Craft was kind
27:30of what made it go last year. And I do
27:33think he's going to be back and healthy.
27:34He was the tight end two in fantasy
27:35points per game, so I don't think
27:36ranking him at five is insane.
27:38>> No.
27:39>> Um and this is not a one-hit wonder
27:42either. You you have the breakout from
27:43last season that was at, you know, it
27:45was a handful of games where he was
27:48upper echelon, top tier. But you go back
27:50a season, this was the tight end nine
27:53with 8.1 points per game the year
27:56before. They already knew what they had
27:58in in Tucker Craft and just built him
28:00into the offense a little bit more. He's
28:02a complete bully in man-to-man coverage.
28:05Um, you know, tore the ACL. That's the
28:08the whole storyline. But I think I think
28:10he's going to be good. They're favored
28:12in their first six games of the year.
28:14It's a nice slate for him to come out
28:15and get acclimated. I'm pretty in on
28:18Tucker Craft. Consensus wise, we have
28:20him at seven. Jason, you're the mo most
28:22bearish.
28:23>> Yeah. So, to speak to that, it's really
28:27injury and ADP. So, he's coming off of
28:31an injury where the expectation early in
28:34the offseason was he'll start the season
28:35on the pup. Then, as time went on, it
28:37got more and more positive. We've seen
28:39him at camp now. He's looking great. If
28:41he's running straight, he looks amazing.
28:43>> He's running straight. He's looking
28:44great.
28:44>> He, you know, he should be there for
28:46week one.
28:47>> And Tucker Craft
28:49>> straight is enough. Yeah. Just
28:50>> that's all I need.
28:51>> Pull people over. Hey, inline run a seam
28:54route and then run
28:55>> in line feeling fine.
28:57>> Well, the nice thing is even even with
28:58that, you've got [laughter] you you have
29:00a lot
29:01>> bars for TK.
29:02>> You have a lot of plays that the Packers
29:04set up like play action where they kind
29:07of leak craft out. You don't have to be
29:10cutting these amazing routes to catch
29:12the little dump off in the flat and then
29:14just go mow guys down. It's It's almost
29:16unfair to talk about his points per game
29:18because his last game he got injured and
29:20and wasn't really involved. He was 14
29:22points per game in the game, you know,
29:24full games that he started on pace for
29:261139 yards. So, I don't blame either of
29:28you guys for just taking the shot, the
29:30swing of saying if he is healthy, he is
29:34going to he was truly dominating.
29:36However, for me, like he's going right
29:39next to Harold Fannon if I wanted to
29:42take a tight end. He's healthy and and
29:45looked great and scored more fantasy
29:47points last year, but he's also going
29:49next to other guys at other positions
29:50like Jordan Tyson
29:52>> than the guy who played in eight games.
29:53>> I mean, availability is the is the best
29:55ability.
29:56>> Oh gosh.
29:57>> But Jordan Tyson is right next to him.
30:02Okay, whatever. People do not like that.
30:07Is it? Do you think
30:09>> he scored more than Tank Dell, too?
30:10>> Do you think if Tucker Craft
30:12>> Yeah.
30:13>> plays 17 games that he definitely scores
30:16more points than Harold Fannon?
30:18>> If Tucker Craft
30:21>> plays a full season, yes, he will score
30:23more points than Harold Fannon.
30:24>> Yeah, the the difference in that offense
30:26is just going to be pretty large. I
30:28mean, Fannon's going to be great, but
30:32you did add a couple more weapons in
30:34that offense and our quarterback. Uh,
30:36you know, that's the differential to me.
30:37The quarterback's the offensive system.
30:39I still love Fannon. That's why he comes
30:41in at
30:42>> number six,
30:43>> Harold Fannon, 22 years young and the
30:46tight end five last year in Cleveland
30:48with shared time with Ninjoku with no
30:50wide receivers, with no quarterback. Um,
30:52this is only one of two rookie tight
30:54ends to go 70 for 706. See, he is an
30:59electric player. Harold Fannon is
31:01awesome. And if they were smart, which
31:03it seems like Monin's going to do,
31:05>> oh yeah,
31:06>> he's going to use Fannon a ton. So, if
31:08you want to hedge against injury, these
31:10guys are back to back in my rankings. I
31:13don't blame you at all. If you have a,
31:15you know, this is where um this is where
31:18I think for you where you have like a
31:20tier of superstars, right? So, you've
31:21got McBride, Bowers, you've got Warren,
31:24and Lovelin, and that's your core four.
31:25>> That is my core four. And I can kind of
31:27see that where it's like then you can
31:29make some really different decisions
31:31with like Fannon and Craft KD if he's
31:33healthy to start the year. Um you can
31:35throw Leapora or Pitts into that group.
31:37It it becomes more muddy. It becomes
31:39more plant your flag on the offense that
31:41you like a little bit. You know, you
31:42talked about a reason to like Laora over
31:44Pitts is they're going to score a lot
31:45more touchdowns in Detroit than they
31:46will in Atlanta.
31:48>> You can make that. That's part of the
31:50craft call over Fannon, I think, is that
31:52I think Green Bay is going to be a great
31:53offense on a great, you know, great
31:55team. I think Cleveland is going to be
31:57better than people expect, but
31:58offensively not a top, you know, 20
32:01team.
32:01>> None of us picked them to be the team to
32:03score 13. I didn't think about it. I
32:05mean, they improved their offensive line
32:07in the draft. Um, they've got, you know,
32:09an offensive-minded head coach now and
32:12>> some good rookie wide receivers.
32:14>> Yeah, I I think that they could be a
32:16surprisingly, you know, much better
32:18offense. To me, Fannon is the one player
32:21I am very fearful of getting wrong
32:24because I'm pretty much out on sixth
32:26round tight ends. So, like if and that's
32:29what it is for me because I don't have
32:31Craft and Fannon in the tier of the
32:33elites. I don't think they are. Do I
32:35think they're better than the other
32:36tight ends I'm going to get later?
32:37Absolutely. But I think it's a point a
32:39game. I think it's irrelevant for
32:41winning and losing in fantasy. This was
32:43one of my 10 things to remember is that
32:45the difference between the tight end two
32:46last year and the tight end 12 was
32:48pretty meaningless last year. And so if
32:51you're not one of the elites,
32:53I would rather have a fifth round, a
32:55sixth round, a seventh round pick of the
32:57running backs and wide receivers there.
32:58Take the shot of those guys. But Fannon,
33:01what he did in college was so
33:04productive. And then to come in rookie
33:06year and be that productive is like, oh,
33:08maybe he is just that dude. But on the
33:11offense,
33:11>> can he finish top three?
33:13>> No.
33:14>> No, I don't think so.
33:15>> No. And I'm my the argument against
33:20Fannon is just the Cleveland Browns.
33:22Like I I'm with you guys of He is an
33:25awesome player, but looking at the the
33:28the competition for Harold Fannon last
33:30year was Jerry Judy. I know he had to,
33:33you know, he had to overtake David
33:34Njoku, but it's like Judy had a 20%
33:38target share. The next highest wide
33:40receiver target share would have been
33:42Cedric Tilman or I'm sorry, Isaiah Bond
33:45at 8% and then Tilman Njoku's at 9%. So
33:49it's like these
33:50>> a first round wide receiver, a second
33:52round wide receiver.
33:55>> Let let me give you the counter argument
33:56there. The counterargument is the
33:58Cardinals.
33:59>> Okay,
33:59>> the Cardinals have Michael Wilson,
34:01Marvin Harrison Jr. as part of that
34:02offense, but Trey McBride is the
34:04bonafide number one guaranteed target in
34:06that offense. Yes. I I wonder if because
34:08when I see Fannon, the part I'm worried
34:10about getting wrong is that this guy
34:12could lead the league in receptions at
34:14tight end. That's my worry is from a
34:16quantity. I mean, he had 107 targets
34:18last year as a rookie. That's the part
34:21I'm worried about getting wrong is that
34:22he is the PPR winner of the year.
34:24>> It's actually better than the 107
34:26targets. If you look at when Shadur took
34:27over in week 12 and you take out the
34:29injury game at the very end of the
34:30season, he was on pace for 142 targets
34:33with Shadur. So,
34:35>> and McBride like those guys don't take
34:37away from McBride leading the league in
34:38receptions at tight end.
34:39>> Yeah.
34:40>> So, rookies are not going to be
34:42>> these are but these are unknowns where
34:45it's like Marv and Michael Wilson there
34:47there's some unknown about them of where
34:51they could end up this year. But we have
34:53no idea how Conpsion and Boston are
34:57going to factor into taking away from
34:58the target if those
34:59>> Is there any chance he has fewer than
35:01100 targets on this offense though?
35:02>> I don't think so. I don't think so.
35:03Okay. So, at least that's built in as a
35:05floor for Harold Fannon, I think.
35:07>> Yeah. I mean, I love Harold Fannon. When
35:09I say I'm not drafting him, it's really
35:10just draft price. If he was in the ninth
35:12round, and I'm giving up a a mediocre
35:15sixth, I believe, right now.
35:17>> Okay. Yeah, that that'll be a tough
35:19decision, I think, for where people want
35:21to tear him mentally because of the
35:24Brown situation. And, um, I'm curious.
35:27I'm going to have Kyle pull some data on
35:29top three tight ends over the last
35:32decade or so and how many of them are on
35:34sub 500 teams because I'm very curious
35:37about that. So, I'll give you that
35:38information shortly.
35:40>> Number five.
35:41>> Well, I can tell you last year
35:43>> he was on a sub 500 team in Trey
35:45McBride.
35:47>> You're talking about the number one
35:48title.
35:48>> Yeah. Yeah. Yep. George KD.
35:52>> Come on. George
35:53>> comes in at five. We all got him right
35:55there. Mike at five. We're at six. This
35:58one's been evolving.
35:59>> It's going to continue to evolve over
36:01the course of this month. Major injury.
36:04>> Not a spring chicken. George KD almost
36:0633 years old.
36:08Also not as old as Travis Kelce by any
36:10stretch. And um you know the touchdowns
36:13with Brock Party have been there. That
36:15was a early career situation with KD
36:18where you're like he's going to catch a
36:19bunch of passes. He can make a big play
36:20but he's probably going to end up with
36:21five or six touchdowns. He's got higher
36:23upside now in this offense. And for
36:25goodness sakes, they don't have any they
36:27don't have any wide receivers that are
36:28healthy.
36:29>> No, George KD is
36:32the the entire the entirety of the bet
36:35for George KD is is health. And so it's
36:40like there is no there is no doubts of
36:43of how dominant George KD can be for for
36:46the NFL, for fantasy football. You know,
36:48his his rookie year wasn't great. 5.7
36:52points per game, but since then his
36:55lowest is 10.7.
36:57>> That's huge.
36:57>> Like he's he's a double digit point
37:00machine at the tight end position. And I
37:02and things like the ceiling that the
37:05connection he has with Brock Purie,
37:07[clears throat]
37:08it raises the stakes even more in in my
37:10opinion. So everything is just do you
37:13think George could be healthy? We have
37:14him at five, which is way above market
37:17and like my bet is a seasonl long bet.
37:20it. I think it starts slower for George
37:23KD, but he over the course of the
37:25season, I think he returns to form and
37:27becomes the true dominator that that we
37:30have seen every year. And it's tight end
37:3210. So if if you want to protect
37:35yourself, you know, if you want to take
37:36George KD and then
37:38>> Dallas Goddard
37:39>> and then Dallas Goddard or one of the
37:41you're like likely or
37:43>> Kelsey
37:43>> or or or even Travis Kelce because
37:46Kelsey will give you a floor and that's
37:48a draft strategy that is plausible
37:50taking KD in the ninth or tth round and
37:53then coming back and taking Travis
37:54Kelce. It's I think it's an interesting
37:57strategy for this year. the splits with
37:59Brock Pury over four years. If you
38:01spread them out over a season, it would
38:02be 81 catches on 106 targets for 1145
38:08yards and 11 touchdowns. That has been
38:10the, you know, that's much better than
38:12his splits with a different quarterback
38:13in San Francisco. Now, Mike, you did
38:15read the tea leaves on CMC's health last
38:17year. Yeah. Would you mind
38:20>> letting us know the exact
38:21>> It's pretty important
38:22>> situation for George.
38:24>> I actually would mind.
38:25>> Oh, you would?
38:26>> Oh, darn. I thought we were going to get
38:27the answer. I No, I am I am much more
38:30worried about the injury. I
38:31>> mean, my my ranking says how I believe.
38:34>> Yeah, your ranking says you believe he's
38:35going to be there for for 17 pretty darn
38:37healthy games. I do think second half of
38:40the year he might be good. He's a human.
38:43And while he's unbelievable, he's 33
38:45years.
38:47>> He's a dog.
38:47>> He's a dog.
38:49>> Uh he's 33 years.
38:50>> He's a man.
38:52>> He's not a human. He's a man. old for a
38:55football player coming off of a very
38:57difficult injury. And I know it was a
38:59better version like the, you know, we
39:01keep hearing like, oh, it's the Achilles
39:03tore at the right spot. It's like, well,
39:05there's no good spot for the Achilles to
39:07tear.
39:08>> There's worse spots.
39:09>> There are worse spots, but he still tore
39:11his Achilles and is coming back. The
39:13last video that I saw of him, he's out
39:15on the sideline. He's he's working, but
39:17he looks to me like he's a ways away.
39:19So, I'm I'm a little bit more skeptical
39:21that you will like holding on to him for
39:23the first half of the year.
39:24>> All right, we'll take a break and come
39:26back with our top four and some sleeper
39:27picks.
39:34>> All right, I do have that information
39:36for you before we move on to our top
39:38four, which we'll we'll probably get
39:39through them pretty quick. You guys know
39:40the names. Top three tight ends over the
39:43last five years, six of 15 were sub 500
39:45teams. So, it does lower your odds
39:49certainly. You want to be around the end
39:50zone, right? Um
39:52>> just I was curious about that. You know,
39:54Bowers, McBride twice.
39:57>> Some of that's tough because like Travis
39:58Kelce is every year, you know, pretty
40:01much o over the last decade been in the
40:03top three and he's always going to be on
40:04a winning team prior to this year.
40:07Um, I think it's like the you're either
40:11a dominant player at the tight end
40:13position, which there's very few of
40:15those if you're talking uh guys who are
40:18getting it done in the passing game. The
40:20guys who can rise are that's the offense
40:23is going to carry him.
40:24>> Yep. Makes sense.
40:26>> Number four,
40:27>> Tyler Warren comes in at number four. Uh
40:30Jason just talked extensively about
40:31Tyler Warren on our Fire and Ice
40:33episode. Um, but the TLDDR of that is
40:37great. It was a great rookie season when
40:40Daniel Jones was healthy, focal point of
40:42the offense. You lose Michael Pitman,
40:44beneficiary of those low, you know, the
40:46intermediate targets that Pitman was
40:47great at. And, you know, Alec Pierce,
40:50Josh DS on the outside. You know, DS is
40:52unproven out there. They want to try him
40:55out, give him more opportunities. Pierce
40:57got paid all that money, but he's been a
40:58deep threat most of his career. Warren's
41:00going to soak up the middle of the
41:01field. benefit from Jonathan Taylor
41:03pulling up defenses. So, I think we're
41:06all very comfortable with Tyler Warren.
41:08Jason's got him at three. Mike and I at
41:09four. That's the only difference. Jason
41:11has him ahead of Loveland and we have
41:13him behind, meaning number three.
41:17>> Number three,
41:18>> Mr. Loveland.
41:19>> Mr. Loveland.
41:20>> It is Mr. Loveland. Um,
41:23>> 22 years old. Mike and I have him at
41:25three, Jason at four. Finished 11 last
41:27year. Came on like gang busters at the
41:30end of the season.
41:31>> [clears throat]
41:31>> uh a chess piece for Ben Johnson in line
41:3456% of the time but then in the slot 22%
41:37of the time out wide completely 18% of
41:40the time
41:41you know the debates around burden
41:44odunay how valuable are they know is
41:48going to be a focal point
41:49>> yeah the the quote that we have gotten
41:51recently and I I don't I don't have this
41:54>> well it it's from an ESPN article
41:55>> okay from ESPN was that loveland is the
41:58son of the bears solar system of
42:01receivers [laughter]
42:03and that feels like kind of how we
42:05anticipate this going. Um we we have the
42:09fight of I love Rome, you love Burden
42:11and I I've I've certainly warmed more
42:13and more on Burton. I still don't like
42:14his draft price, but um
42:16>> and that's all right.
42:17>> We universally come to the same
42:19agreement that is the best weapon on
42:22this team and I think the I personally
42:24have it now as the target leader for
42:26this team is Coulson Loveland. The issue
42:29is that there are other really good
42:32targets. So if if Caleb is throwing for
42:36sub 4,000 yards and you have three
42:39really good options, is the consistency
42:42going to be there for Loveland if oh,
42:45Luther Burton went off for these four
42:47games and and Rome went off for these
42:50three games or whatever. Um will we be
42:53disappointed in the price of Loveland
42:56>> because of those weapons? That's my only
42:58concern cuz I think the tape showed and
43:00the playoffs showed that he can be a a
43:03dominant top end force.
43:05>> Yeah. I think the interesting thing is
43:06looking at the the final three weeks of
43:08the year in the playoffs when he was
43:09really a part of the offense, seeing
43:11that playoff target share at 28% in an
43:14offense that had DJ Moore at 17% at the
43:16time. I feel like there'll be plenty of
43:19weekly upside combined with I think a
43:23good floor for Coulson Love and that's
43:24why I have him ahead of War and I just
43:26like that offensive system better.
43:28>> Um
43:28>> yeah, I would expect I would expect the
43:30Bears just to outscore the Colts. I mean
43:34when we were preparing for the show and
43:36going through our UDK stats and we were
43:38looking because free rankings kind of
43:40disagreed with the UDK rankings because
43:42one is done by stat projections, one is
43:44just done by linear rank. And we took a
43:46look at these two guys, Lovelin and
43:47Warren. I I don't even know if you know
43:49this, Andy, because it was Mike and I
43:51looking at it.
43:52>> I probably don't then.
43:53>> We were almost identical. I mean, the
43:56points between Lovelin and Warren for
43:58all three of us are like flip a coin as
44:02far as total fantasy value. I do think
44:04>> it's a one round difference.
44:06>> Yeah. I mean, that's why I like Warren
44:08more. It's cheaper and I think his floor
44:11might be higher. But when we're trying
44:13to win this championship, the ceiling is
44:15higher on Love 100%. So the the like if
44:18both of these guys go off this year,
44:20Loveland will be the winner.
44:21>> I think about it the exact same way. I
44:23think Warren is probably a a safer pick
44:28for Look, this is going to be a top five
44:30tight end. It's just if if Loveland hits
44:34the way that the the all the chatter is
44:37from this from training camp and the off
44:39season, he was the number 10 overall
44:42pick. You know, we have the the
44:44anecdotes of phones were ringing off the
44:46hook during the NFL draft.
44:49Coloulston Lovelin gets drafted by the
44:50Bears, which was a little bit of a
44:52surprise per the mock drafters. And then
44:54all of a sudden, the phone stopped
44:55ringing because people were trying to
44:57move up to go get Lovelin. He is. I
45:01think he will be the the focal part of
45:02the Bears offense. The ceiling is
45:04>> he's a more athletically gifted player
45:07than Warren is. And Warren's very good.
45:10It's just
45:10>> Lovelin is just much more of a
45:12>> if you want to break away touchdown,
45:14that's not going to be Warren. Warren's
45:15going to break some tackles and get you
45:1720 yards on a cool catch. Lovelin's
45:19going to take it to the house behind the
45:21back.
45:22The chance of Loveland usurping Brock
45:25Bowers as the number one tight end at
45:27the end of this season to me is much
45:28higher than Warren Duke.
45:29>> Yeah, I think that's a good way to put
45:30it.
45:31>> Um, what about
45:32>> number two?
45:33>> Nope. No more.
45:34>> Let's go to the next player. [laughter]
45:36>> Trey McBride.
45:38Did you if you want to I could talk
45:40Lovelin all day.
45:41>> I was I was just going to bring up the
45:42negative quote of the the fact that uh
45:45he's been seen as a dynamic pass
45:47catcher, but he is rapidly improving as
45:49a blocker. That's is that scary for
45:51fantasy?
45:52>> No, not with because you know who's a
45:53great blocker?
45:55>> George KD.
45:56>> Okay.
45:57>> Like I I think there is some value to We
46:00love our our tight ends that aren't, you
46:02know, the Jimmy Grahams. They don't
46:03actually play the tight end position.
46:05They play wide receiver. But there is
46:07definitely value of the I'm in line. I'm
46:10looking like I'm going to block, but I'm
46:12just a chip and then I leak out for the
46:13play action and then hit a big play.
46:15>> Number two,
46:16>> you sound like Strong Pat. You checking
46:19out the emails? [laughter]
46:22>> Oh,
46:24is that home stuck?
46:26>> Trey McBride comes in at number two. Is
46:29that disrespectful? This was the first
46:31tight end in history to have 100 plus
46:32catches in back-to-back seasons. He has
46:34Jacobe Brassette. Fresh off of that
46:37sweet $15 million check they're writing
46:39him. Completely uh dominant last year
46:42with Brassette, number one overall
46:45fantasy tight end. and yet he comes in
46:46at two at our consensus rankings.
46:48>> That is not an insult to Trey McBride.
46:51That is simply a belief in Brock Bowers.
46:54Trey McBride there. The only negative
46:56thing you could possibly say about his
46:58outlook is that it is
47:02somewhat probable that during the
47:03fantasy playoffs he has a third round
47:06rookie quarterback slinging him the
47:07ball. That's the only fear I have. I
47:09mean, Trey McBride is the leader of this
47:11offense. You know, the the questions of
47:13will is is Marv good? Did the Michael
47:16Wil all that's irrelevant. Those guys
47:18are so far behind in the pecking order
47:20of McBride. The offense runs through
47:22him. Um he will be awesome again.
47:26>> Much better play caller. You know, you
47:28talk about the
47:29>> you know the situation for Arizona. Um I
47:32would trust Leaf Florida to do more with
47:34his best player. Arizona had a ton of
47:36yards last year because the defense was
47:39bad and the defense is just as bad this
47:41year, but they didn't score a lot of
47:44points. When you when you look at like
47:46total team scoring when we were, you
47:48know, looking at who's going to take
47:49that jump, they have room to to really
47:52grow and you add uh love, you know, in
47:56the back field.
47:57>> Yeah. Is that a positive or a negative?
47:59I think it's a positive. I think having
48:00a better offense is always just good.
48:02They just they had nothing at the
48:05running back position last year. That's
48:06why they their pass rate was
48:09so extremely high and like they were
48:13running so many plays. Uh we brought up
48:15the stat uh earlier of like he
48:18essentially ran multiple games,
48:22multiple games worth more of snaps.
48:24>> Uh Kyle, correct me if I'm wrong. I
48:26think the most snaps uh or most routes
48:30run for a tight end ever in the history
48:32of the NFL is just those things.
48:35>> Jacobe Brc was on pace for 685 passing
48:38attempts, which is an outrageous number
48:40that has to come down. Number one,
48:44>> it is Brock Bowers coming in at number
48:46one, the most
48:47>> talented tight end up there in football
48:50with the fact that he's the clear number
48:52one target with Clint Kubak who called
48:55him a football robot from heaven.
48:58What's better?
49:00Being the son of the solar system.
49:03>> Well, heaven is much better.
49:04>> Or a football but you're a robot.
49:06>> But you're from heaven.
49:09>> You know, heaven is above the sun and
49:11the stars. I mean, it's clearly clearly
49:14Brock Powers is better here.
49:15>> You want You want to know something?
49:16Remember we were having the debate about
49:18Gandalf versus
49:20uh
49:21>> Dumbledore.
49:21>> Dumbledore.
49:22>> Mhm.
49:23>> I didn't I talked to somebody with
49:25knowledge of the Lord of the Rings
49:26universe.
49:27>> Oh,
49:27>> Gandalf is part angel.
49:29>> I am unaware of this.
49:31>> This is what they told me.
49:32>> This is
49:32>> Now, if I'm quoting it, they said from I
49:34think it's
49:34>> Coar on the phone,
49:35>> the Similar, you know, that book talks
49:37about that. I think he's interesting.
49:39>> It was Spitballers. We were talking
49:40about this on spitballers. Um,
49:44>> but when you said heaven, it reminded me
49:45of I wanted to let you guys know I done
49:47some research.
49:47>> Yeah. Well, that's important.
49:49>> We appreciate that.
49:50>> You know, we're we're looking at these
49:51top four elite tight ends and and you
49:54know, my argument for Warren is that DS
49:58and Alec Pierce are not as good as the
50:01weapons there. You know, all of these
50:03other three guys have at least capable
50:06receivers on the roster who might break
50:09out. Marv might break out. Rome might
50:11break out. Burden might break out. Alec
50:13Pierce might break out.
50:16>> There ain't none here, brother.
50:18>> No one on the Raiders. They gave Naylor
50:20a bunch of money.
50:21>> He has the same risk that McBride has
50:24though that you mentioned.
50:25>> Well, it's which is that
50:26>> it's not a third round quarterback, the
50:28first overall pick.
50:29>> It's the first overall pick, but the
50:30same risk of quarterback change at the
50:32back half of the year.
50:32>> You would assume it will happen. It's
50:34very rare in this day and age for the
50:36number one overall pick to not get in.
50:38But that is enough of a difference to
50:40me. Carson Beck versus Mendoza
50:42>> to where you know a and you know Clint
50:45Kubak he was Lafle might be a good you
50:48know they're both offensive minded head
50:50coaches but Kubak was the prize of this
50:54offseason.
50:54>> What what's crazy is that this you know
50:56may seem really obvious to be like okay
50:58one two is McBride and Bowers in some
50:59order. The truth is you're going to put
51:01them in the order that you you you
51:02believe, but they're going directly back
51:04to back in drafts. So, this is a like
51:06you do have to just pull the trigger on
51:08one. Like, if you're if you're going to
51:10be there at 205 or 203 or whatever
51:14wherever you're at, you're sacrificing
51:16obviously a very high quality wide
51:19receiver running back
51:22and you have to make the call here and
51:24you don't want to get it wrong because
51:25you're investing so much into a fantasy
51:28tight end. So, is it is it possible to
51:29get this pick wrong? Really?
51:31>> No. I mean, injury will get it wrong
51:33with Oh, you're saying between the two,
51:34I think you're going to be
51:35>> Can you really get that wrong?
51:36>> I So, I think you could get it wrong
51:39where you will have regrets. And the
51:41only way that you get that wrong outside
51:43of injury on the regret front is that
51:45what Bowowers does is truly break, you
51:50know, the the position. I think
51:52>> that is in the range of outcomes last
51:54year. That that that's in the range of
51:56outcomes to me. funny.
51:57>> It's like he did it.
51:58>> What did What did uh what did McBride
52:00score last year on? What was his per
52:02average?
52:03>> He was he was unbelievable.
52:05>> He was 15 points.
52:06>> Four or five points better than the
52:08tight end, too.
52:08>> Yeah.
52:09>> So, that that's the part where it's hard
52:11for me to be like, you know, that the
52:13Raiders were what, dead last in the NFL
52:15and touchdowns scored.
52:16>> Correct.
52:17>> And so now you're bringing in Kirk
52:19Cousins.
52:21I I don't I don't That's the part where
52:23I have more confidence in the
52:24>> in the connection between like I'm gonna
52:28I'm gonna switch these two.
52:29>> You're moving.
52:30>> I'm sure I'm sure they're basically
52:33>> Yeah, they're three points apart in my
52:35rankings, but out of respect
52:37>> for that connection already built,
52:39>> I'm going to make that tweak.
52:42>> Okay. So I I I just
52:44>> I mean I will say right now McBride is
52:46going ahead in ADP
52:49by exactly one pick.
52:51>> Yeah. I mean that's that's what Andy's
52:53doing right here. He's saying if I'm on
52:54the clock I'm taking McBride.
52:56>> I'm going to take McBride. And I look at
52:57the end of the year I think the
52:58Cardinals score more touchdowns than the
53:00Raiders do. So I mean I think that's and
53:04now repeating 11 touchdowns. Is it hard?
53:06Yeah. Is he going to do it? Probably.
53:09He'll probably do it. Bowers might do it
53:11too. these guys going to be it's going
53:13to be a narrow very close situation but
53:16um it's it's tough. I know you are the
53:18most like into Brock Bowers you've ever
53:21been you know in terms of like looking
53:22at him as the bonafide number one
53:24overall at the position.
53:26>> Yeah. I mean that's tough. Uh they're
53:28both great players. I don't I don't
53:30think that there's um a bad pick here.
53:33And I will say that my wide receiver
53:35four last year by the way. My strategy
53:37this year is
53:39>> get an elite tight end and that means
53:42only these four and per perhaps even if
53:44you want to take the strategy to just
53:46like we know Bowowers and McBride are
53:47going to be dominant. Warren and Lovelin
53:50are projections. You're hoping now
53:52they're a little cheaper but they still
53:53cost a lot in drafts. If you wanted to
53:55take the strategy of it's just Bowowers
53:57and McBride or else punt like I'm I'm
54:00fine with that as well. Bowowers and
54:01McBride are both
54:02>> Isn't this the around Josh Allen
54:04category? I mean, could Yeah, won't this
54:06be your decision between if you're going
54:08to go on, you go Josh Allen or you go
54:10Bowers McBride?
54:11>> Probably.
54:12>> How do you view that in terms of
54:13advantage for your team? Mike,
54:16>> I I lean the tight end spot of of of
54:22getting one of those two guys. It's not
54:24a lack of confidence in Josh Allen. It's
54:26just a you you know, finding quarterback
54:29production is
54:30>> you've got guys you [clears throat] like
54:31later. It's just easier and and more
54:34predictable on a week- toeek basis than
54:36you know streaming a quarterback. Um if
54:39depending on your league and how they
54:41handle the waiver wire, but in terms of
54:43just the process of identifying the
54:45quarterback that should have a good week
54:48compared to the tight end, it's it's
54:50easier on the quarterback.
54:51>> Yeah. It's I mean, we started this
54:52episode talking about Travis Kelce. He's
54:54our 10th ranked tight end. And so if
54:56you're going to take one late and one
54:57early, the difference between Travis
54:59Kelce is like the tight end 10 versus,
55:02you know, Trevor Lawrence right now
55:03ADP-wise, is the quarterback 10. It's
55:06like, is Travis Kelce Does Travis Kelce
55:08have a chance to be another like
55:10absolute difference maker at the
55:12position? Probably not. Does Does Trevor
55:13Lawrence?
55:14>> Sure,
55:14>> probably. Does Dak? Does Jackson Dart?
55:17>> Those guys those are all those guys.
55:19>> Tyler Shuck, Bone Knicks. um sleeper
55:22tight end you're interested in? Cuz this
55:24is, you know, we have our top 10 by
55:26consensus, but throwing out a sleeper
55:27tight end.
55:28>> For me, it's Goddard. I've brought him
55:29up a couple times.
55:31>> Um whenever AJ Brown or Dvonte Smith has
55:34missed time, he's been a huge
55:35beneficiary on the offense. AJ Brown is
55:37gone.
55:38>> He's going to miss some time for the
55:39>> Kai Lemon has had two hamstring
55:40injuries. We don't Right now, it looks
55:42like Dantavian Wixs is the second man
55:44up,
55:44>> which to me makes Dallas got it the wide
55:47receiver, too.
55:47>> Eli Sters has done nothing. He's he's
55:50been buried on the depth chart so far in
55:52in camp. So, I I I like that.
55:53>> I need him to get it together.
55:55>> I agree. Uh mine is the guy I took in
55:57our last mock draft, Dalton Concincaid,
55:59the team picked up his fifthear option,
56:01who's first round pick. He was literally
56:04the best in the entire league at tight
56:06end at um yards per route run. The
56:09problem was he wasn't healthy. He only
56:11ran 15 rounds per game.
56:13>> Right now,
56:13>> very healthy. There was a a a miniature
56:16scare where it was like, "Oh, he
56:18>> Yeah, he went Yeah,
56:19>> he went down. And so he was interviewed
56:21afterwards about like what happened. I
56:23was like, was this the knee again?"
56:25>> He's like, "No, he got he got it in the
56:27family jewels as he said.
56:28>> Shout out."
56:29>> Yeah. Not enough referencing the family
56:31jewels. I feel like I haven't heard that
56:33since like early Simpsons.
56:34>> But currently very healthy and obviously
56:37having Josh Allen as your quarterback
56:39doesn't hurt. And I'm going
56:42>> as I like to do
56:44>> the senator
56:44>> with the tight end position. Oh, Jason,
56:48>> guys, like if Ben Sinn happens, we're
56:50this show. We're just we're going to
56:52close it down.
56:52>> Don't worry about that.
56:53>> Good news, Flynn. We ain't going
56:56nowhere.
56:57>> Just saying. Uh, no. I'm going with a,
57:00you know, we've talked about, hey, you
57:02need a tight end who can become the
57:04number two or the number one option. the
57:07Miami Dolphins. It's gross down there.
57:10Uh Andy is a big believer in Malik
57:12Willis. I'm more on your side of I think
57:14that he is a uh more likely to be a good
57:17quarterback than not. Who's the number
57:19one option there? I guess it's Malik
57:22Washington right now, just de facto. But
57:24Greg Doulich is there. His, you know,
57:27the nerd stats, the yards per route run
57:30pretty good. 2.38. Not a huge sample
57:33size for him.
57:33>> He's had his moments as a as an NFL
57:36moments and he has the uh the he has the
57:39athletic profile
57:41>> that we want. If when you're when you're
57:43just taking a a random shot at the tight
57:45end position, athleticism matters. This
57:48isn't like, you know, like guys at
57:50running back and wide receiver, they can
57:52be slower. It's just it can happen. But
57:55but an athletic tight end, they are more
57:57likely to break through. He could end up
57:59as the number one target for this
58:01offense. That doesn't mean I'm saying
58:03top five or anything, but it's a a
58:04player who is right now undrafted
58:07that I think he like he could be a
58:09sneaky top 12 guy at the end of the
58:11year. There's always there's always
58:13nasty tight ends that that sneak in
58:15there.
58:15>> Yeah. And and this is also something
58:16where look if he might not get drafted.
58:18He probably won't get drafted in your
58:20league, but when you're looking at what
58:21happens
58:22>> and you get a sign in week one or two
58:25>> Yeah. week week one, eight targets show
58:26up,
58:27>> right? And even if he doesn't catch them
58:29all or doesn't get in the end zone, look
58:30for I love
58:32>> looking for tight ends through the
58:34target lens when you're looking at the
58:35free agency. Yeah. See who's getting
58:37action.
58:38>> Fannon was there last year on the waiver
58:40wire. This year, I mean, Isaiah likely
58:43might be that might be
58:44>> Sadique or somebody. There's a lot of
58:47options.
58:48>> All right, that'll do it for today's
58:49episode. Mockdraft episode tomorrow and
58:52then we'll resume rankings episodes as
58:54well.
58:55footclan giveiveaway.com for that signed
58:57Bejian Robinson jersey if you want to
58:59check that out. And the ultimate draft
59:00kit is ultimatraftkit.com. Thank you for
59:03tuning in FootClan.
59:05Thank you for coming along for the ride.
59:07It's going to be a fun August because
59:09Carson Beck is starting tomorrow guys.
59:12Oh boy. Here we go. Goodbye.
59:16[music]
59:16>> Thank you for listening to another
59:18episode of the Fantasy Footballers
59:20podcast. Join our fantasy football
59:22community on jointhefoot.com
59:25and follow us on Twitter at the
59:27FFBallers.
59:29[music]

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