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The Return of Phillip Schofield — Transcript

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0:00hello and welcome to this episode of the
0:02rest is entertainment with me Marina
0:04Hyde and me Richard Osman hello Marina
0:06right then here we go Cast Away da your
0:09hazmat suits because we're about to and
0:12we're going to go away to an island uh
0:16off the coast of Madagascar um Channel 5
0:18have
0:19um uh performed I can I say it's
0:23performed the dubious coup of signing
0:25Philip scoffield latal of this morning
0:27for their format Cast Away which is when
0:29a celebr has to go and live on an
0:30uninhabited Island for 10 days filming
0:33themselves there not even camera
0:34operators it's literally just one person
0:37by themselves now um the it it it's
0:40being stripped across um every Monday
0:43Tuesday and Wednesday night of this
0:45current week I have seen the first
0:47episode I had to go through a huge
0:50number of Loops to to do that really
0:53what what sort of what sort of Loops do
0:54you have when programs come out they
0:56have I noticed that the rules were
0:59completely different for who wish to
1:00write news stories about it but anyway
1:02um you have something called an embargo
1:04which means you're not allowed to write
1:06about it until or talk about it and for
1:08review purposes until a certain time in
1:10this case apparently two hours after the
1:12episode has finished airing um so anyway
1:15I have signed a number of documents and
1:18it it it aired on Monday Night episode
1:20one so some people would have seen last
1:22night's episode which is the one you're
1:23going to talk about I have not because
1:25uh spoiler alert we do not record this
1:27live on a Tuesday morning we do this on
1:29a Monday morning so I I still have the
1:31uh pleasure of watching this show but so
1:34you've signed lots of documents I I I
1:37have not but you are you're allowed to
1:38talk now I'm now allowed to talk about
1:40now allowed to in a tabloid Parliament
1:42break my silence excellent Marina hide
1:44ungag on this um anyway I mean he says
1:48it took him 30 hours to get to
1:50Madagascar I don't know which airports
1:52he passed through on the way but had he
1:55cared to look out of the window in any
1:57of those he might have had a realization
2:00that what he was about to embark on was
2:02some real first world problem stuff as
2:04we know Philip scoffield was let go
2:08fired resign from delete there seemed to
2:11be a number of conflicting narratives um
2:13from this morning um because he had a
2:17relationship with a much much younger
2:19member of very very junior staff which
2:22he consistently lied about and the
2:24relationship with his co-host Holly
2:26Willoughby had broken down for for
2:30reason for part partly for that reason
2:32but for other reasons as well some of
2:34which can't be discussed um anyhow he
2:39asks quite early on and we the format of
2:41the show is we see him at home talking
2:44about the the things that have befallen
2:45him um and we see him with his family
2:48and we see him in a studio before he
2:51goes and he says you know will this be
2:53my OPP um opportunity for reflection no
2:56on the basis of what I've seen um I
2:58would call this a Voyage to the Limit of
3:00self-pity it really I mean you know he I
3:03think there was almost zero Contrition
3:05at all in the episode I saw he said I
3:08screwed up I made a mistake but
3:09otherwise it's a sort of just a sort of
3:12picnic of
3:13narcissism he he he talks about there's
3:17some funny sort of quotes that you have
3:18to laugh at he says you know he says I'm
3:21for to one to do the other jungle show
3:24and and then and he's asked you know
3:26will you do it by the way you haven't
3:28been asked is that yeah Ain half hot
3:31that's it Ain half that's I'm a
3:32celebrity which he hasn't been I just do
3:35you know what I thought I had to say
3:36something there because all I'm doing is
3:37I'm going to sit back like everybody
3:39currently walking the dogs we just want
3:40to hear we want to hear your views on on
3:42this program as the person I feel like
3:44I'm doing a bit of our Anthony
3:45scaramucci here apologizing but then
3:47saying listen but I've got to just tell
3:49you this because I've seen it anyway so
3:51he says I'm a celebrity well my best
3:53friends host it but there are s just
3:56some channels you won't work for some
3:58people you won't work for okay I'm sure
4:01Kevin Lio over at ITV director of
4:03programs is crying into his coffee about
4:05that one I can't imagine Kevin ligo at
4:07ITV ever crying in it yeah he's like a
4:10sort of ter he's like sort of a
4:11Terminator for people I think his tears
4:13won't liquefy if he watches this episode
4:15let's put it that way um he talks a lot
4:17about scoffield talks a lot about three
4:19shits um who have done him over um I
4:22assume they're ITV I I don't know who
4:24they are but you and team they're
4:26Executives I suspect that uh one is
4:29Holly because who by the way has gone
4:31through some horrific stuff in the last
4:33year I mean genuinely that legal case of
4:36the person who Wasing to rape and kill
4:39her I mean the most horrible thing
4:41anyhow you see the stuff with Scofield
4:44and his wife and daughters that start
4:45they having sort of family Barbecue and
4:47he sort of Hammerly dead pans to them
4:49all are you okay which is something that
4:51Holly said when she came back to this
4:53morning after he had departed so I think
4:55that was a sort of little driveby on her
4:57there's a significant loathing of the
4:59media medium by which he of course made
5:02had a great 40-year career he says I
5:04think for balance if I was scoffield I
5:06would have a significant loathing of the
5:07media as well at the moment but uh he
5:09says let me get on with the Quiet life
5:11you've all given me you're on a you're
5:13on a reality TV show on Channel 5 but
5:15okay what don't you miss about TV you
5:18learn a lot about people you really
5:19learn a lot and I don't miss
5:22that wow there is a sense when you're
5:25watching this that he doesn't remotely
5:27understand what has happened he says I
5:28will not be defeated by it and there's a
5:31bit when he's eating a mango which I
5:32really thought could serve as a review
5:34of the entire episode he says the
5:36bitterness sucks the inside of your
5:38cheeks in well yes uh and and that show
5:41business yeah and yes and his attempts
5:43at fishing he says this must be so
5:45embarrassing to watch well yes I did
5:47find it I can see why Channel 5 have you
5:49can see why Channel 5 done this yeah
5:51yeah I get it and it's uh it seems you
5:54know no harm no foul it's literally just
5:56him on an island you know you're going
5:58to get huge publicity we're talking
5:59about other people are going to watch it
6:01for sure it's going to do very U big
6:02business for Channel 5 um It's Tricky
6:06and again there's been no court case so
6:07it's not a Hugh Edward situation there's
6:09nothing stopping anybody putting um
6:11Philip scoffield on the television it's
6:12just a matter of time before he came on
6:14TV he's still pushing that line by the
6:16way unwise but not illegal which which
6:19is Crisis PR gave to him and I have to
6:22say oh my God the crisis PR needed a
6:25crisis
6:25PR that was not yeah I I he I think he's
6:29dropped the illegal so he now says it
6:31was
6:32unwise okay unwise yet illegal yeah you
6:36know what unwise and illegal yeah you
6:38know what I should not have set fire to
6:39that warehouse when I think about it it
6:40was unwise also against the law now I
6:43think about it um so yeah I absolutely
6:46understand why they did it would I have
6:48done it probably not maybe leave it
6:50another six months or something if I was
6:52F scord would I've done it absolutely oh
6:55you can see why I did it they've got no
6:57right no one's got a right of reply yeah
6:59it's he controls the narrative
7:02absolutely he films himself he hasn't
7:04got a mole rajen interviewing him no
7:06absolutely not which is a lovely place
7:07to be for anybody at any given time
7:09honestly any day you go where Amal R is
7:11not interviewing you you just think you
7:13know what I will tuck that day in my
7:14back pocket and keep it with me uh so
7:17yeah I get it and also you know Philip
7:18Scofield's view of Philip scoffield and
7:20his family's view of Philip scoffield is
7:21obviously very very different to most
7:23other people so you know he's coming
7:24from a completely different angle which
7:25is he wants his stuff out there so it's
7:27sort of perfect for all signs I would
7:30say but what you really want of course
7:32is to be on the show and for everybody
7:34to go actually you are forgiven and
7:37actually we do now understand your side
7:39of the story we do understand your
7:41perspective welcome back into the fold
7:42but you don't think that's what's
7:44happening here well we'll come to we'll
7:46come to whether he can parlay this into
7:49a return to television in a bit but I
7:50what I would say is I I'll be really
7:53interested to see what you think when
7:54you watch it because for me I found it
7:56such a sort of maned portrait of a man
7:58who knows how to television works so
8:01there's a bit at the start where he sort
8:03of gives him you know he keeps he gives
8:04himself a potential Arc he says I want
8:06to see if the ultimate isolation can
8:08finally Set Me Free that's clever he
8:11keep he says there's a bit at the start
8:13where he's interview they have an
8:15interview with him back you know before
8:16he's got to the island he says I'm going
8:18to say this now and then we'll cut to
8:20and then we'll cut to and then he says
8:22I'm really good at fire and then they
8:25duly do cut to him not actually being
8:27able to get the fire going and then a
8:29load of mugging at the camera like he's
8:31doing one of those silly demos on this
8:33morning and I just felt incredibly
8:36managed throughout it all like yeah I
8:38can see what you're trying to do you've
8:40also said to us what you're trying to do
8:43and I found it just for that reason a
8:45sort of double layer of cynicism because
8:48you're sort of being shown how he's
8:49going to manipulate you into saying I've
8:52actually done nothing wrong um as I say
8:54ITV didn't have a right of reply and
8:57there are certain things that you know
8:58he's I would watch a show where they put
9:00um Kevin ligo now on a desert island for
9:03uh a week genuinely I'd watched that for
9:05people we talk about Kevin sometimes and
9:07obviously people don't know who he is we
9:08always need to talk about but he's an
9:10yeah we do uh he is an incredible
9:12character and if you put Kevin ligo on
9:14an island for a week he's Indiscreet
9:16enough if you have lunch with him if you
9:18left him on a desert island by himself
9:19for a week and then just had handed impr
9:22prompt cards like scoffield Anton deck
9:25uh you know daytime TV I would honestly
9:28that would that's a that's that's a
9:29winner it would be truly epic but I I
9:31have to say it's less so with scoffield
9:34he's also the the sort of sense of
9:36self-importance is Titanic he talks
9:40about he says they the three shits
9:42they've taken pretty much everything
9:43reputation dignity Legacy Legacy I mean
9:47your T your your legacy is whatever
9:50inherited audience you leave over for
9:51loose women when you wind up at the end
9:53of the program right that's that's your
9:55legacy okay you the the self-importance
9:58is extraordin
9:59and it does slightly remind you of the
10:01personality we were dealing with him
10:03which spoiler in my view had some part
10:05in his downfall as a little thing of a
10:07like tarantula running away from him
10:09Everyone's a Critic um but that that
10:12sort of you there's I mean maybe he
10:14thinks he's being Winson but honestly I
10:16kept watching it thinking there will be
10:18palm trees on this island on the phone
10:20to their agent saying get me off this
10:21job I do not want to work with this guy
10:23I'm no I've had enough and in a way
10:26that's what he I'm not saying you meet
10:29them all on the way on the back back
10:30down but there there wasn't that much
10:32support for Philip Scofield because a
10:33lot of people not all people but a lot
10:35of people found him very difficult to
10:36work with and here he doesn't really
10:39have to work with anyone which is
10:41perhaps in some ways his Heaven he does
10:43seem to be enjoying it hugely so often
10:45the the the case when people do do
10:47something that is um unwise but not
10:49illegal if people do illegal things by
10:51and large that's it for them in
10:53television and uh rightly so if you do
10:56something that is on that razes edge
10:59where you kind of where where there is a
11:01group of people could without full
11:03knowledge of the facts go oh seems fair
11:04enough what he did I I I kind of get it
11:07in in those situations tax avoidance
11:09things like that um the way that you
11:13have treated people over the years
11:14becomes very very important the
11:15relationships that you've grown and the
11:16way that that you've um um dealt with
11:18people actually means you can be
11:20protected and looked after and there is
11:21an easier route back uh and you're right
11:24and I don't know his relationship
11:25particularly with people at ITV but he
11:27didn't seem to have very many Defenders
11:29he didn't seem to have many people who
11:30would go out to bat for him um and I
11:35often think it's interesting when agents
11:36dump clients as well when they haven't
11:38done anything illegal like if you're hu
11:40Edwards agent of course you dump your
11:41client there's no way around it but if
11:44your agents are dumping you as well then
11:46that's interesting his agents were um
11:50ymu his agents were um ymu uh and it's
11:54interesting that when agents dump people
11:56because I think he's you know having a
11:58go at them as well and so if you done
12:00something unwise but not unfair then the
12:03only reason if you're ymu that you would
12:05dump that client is is you you had
12:07absolutely no previous knowledge of how
12:09they might behave in any way whatsoever
12:11and this has all come as a shock to you
12:13which of course is not true so if you're
12:15ymu I think reputationally it's
12:18difficult for them to to you know
12:20reconcile what they've done with what
12:21they' known about him previously so I
12:23understand why there's some beef there I
12:25kind of get that you know you can't
12:26support someone support someone support
12:28someone and then the second you know
12:30publicly things come out you don't
12:32support somebody so that's a that's a
12:34tricky one his daughter became his who
12:36used to work for ymu left ymu to become
12:38his publicist but
12:41actually ymu did go in with his daughter
12:44many months later to ITV saying is there
12:47a blacklist at ITV is Philip on it why
12:50is he not getting you know to complain
12:52about well I I don't know if you
12:54remember something from 10 minutes ago
12:56but this is why he's not currently
12:57working at ITV but they did go in and so
13:01there there must be I don't know whether
13:03there's some sort of residual
13:04relationship there I don't quite
13:05understand why someone who dumped him
13:07then went in and said you've been treat
13:09you've treated him very badly my
13:10absolute favorite bit by the way of that
13:12um thing we did the world television
13:13Society conference a couple of weeks ago
13:15was Amal rajin interviewing Tim Davy at
13:17the BBC and saying uh will Hugh Edwards
13:19ever work for the BBC again and Tim Davy
13:21going no and Amal rajin going why it's
13:24like have you opened the newspapers this
13:26morning do you do you have access to the
13:28internet take your guess uh and that's
13:30you know so I'm not sure what the ymu
13:32scoffield relationship is but I'd be I'd
13:35be I'd be interested to find out yes I'd
13:37consider that a developing story but one
13:40of the things Philip scoffield says in
13:42this is that it was to do with
13:45homophobia um and that he would have
13:47been treated differently if it had not
13:48been a young ma if it had not been a
13:51young man maybe there was some of that
13:52in the coverage and that an but he said
13:55if it had been a young woman if that had
13:56been the case with me and it had been a
13:58woman pat on the back well done mate
14:01well I think that if you're in an almost
14:0440-year age Gap relationship you're the
14:07most senior person on that show and this
14:11person is the most Junior person on that
14:13show you first met them when they were
14:1415 you say nothing happened till they
14:16were 20 and that person and that say
14:19that if say it was a woman and that
14:21woman had lost her dream drob and was
14:23now jobbing around the pub trade and
14:27really have had her entire out life
14:29having to be discussing this thing then
14:31no you would not have been getting a pat
14:33on the back for me and I just think
14:34that's complete nonsense and it might be
14:36a nice story likes to tell himself when
14:38there's nobody to challenge him over his
14:40little beach bonfire but that's a
14:42ridiculous point of view yeah it's crazy
14:44I mean maybe in the 1980s before you
14:45know any of us were in the workplace but
14:47that it would you would absolutely it it
14:50it would be held over you for the rest
14:52of your career if you to do that if you
14:53had that reputation I mean listen talk
14:54to Jermaine genus if you want to know
14:56whether it's pure homophobia or actually
14:59inappropriate relations in the workplace
15:01with you know colleagues are you know
15:03know domain genus is in a relationship
15:04blah blah blah so there's all sorts of
15:06as always with these things they're
15:07always complicated but the basic truth
15:09of it is uh what he did was
15:11inappropriate and I've never worked in a
15:14workplace I never worked in a in a in a
15:15television production where it would
15:17have been acceptable or whether even if
15:19there was nothing you could do about it
15:21whether people would have patted him on
15:22the back yeah and anybody by the way in
15:25his life who would have pent on the back
15:26of people that you would want to drum
15:27out with the business anyway I agree and
15:30I think saying oh in the gay world this
15:32is totally normal is a form of
15:34homophobia in itself so I think we he we
15:37don't need to have him on his high horse
15:39what I was really struck by when you
15:41watch this is that sort of sense of
15:44indispensability now your this morning's
15:48ratings have consider have continued
15:50much as they were they are on a downward
15:52Trend like all you know the general
15:54terrestrial Gloom but they've sort of
15:57tracked the general trend
15:59he's a sort of you know he's like he's
16:01coronus like when they banish corus and
16:05they say Rome sits St safe and still
16:07without him well same with daytime Cory
16:09elenas you know it's all fine one thing
16:13I would love to talk about with you
16:15because I do think it's fun the island
16:18format I just the islands have become
16:21it's really interesting islands and
16:23reality TV when they first started doing
16:24reality TV lots of shows quickly be came
16:27on islands and and I sort of love what
16:29islands they wanted something or even
16:32subconsciously they wanted something
16:33this is reflexively part of the choice
16:36where kind of like normal rules don't
16:38apply the culture has done all this work
16:40heavy lifting before ever since Robinson
16:42crus you just think oh okay people are
16:44just having to do things that they
16:45wouldn't normally do to survive normal
16:47rules don't apply it might turn really
16:49nasty but that's only to be expected
16:50we're on an island all of those kind of
16:53things so I find the island format it's
16:55a place where you're going to either you
16:56know fight or find yourself and I
16:59find that a sort of hilarious although
17:02if you're by yourself like phip
17:03scoffield you can't there's a couple of
17:05those you can't do um I say I think he
17:08could have a fight there I really back
17:10in for that uh yeah it's funny enough
17:12it's it's it's exactly like um crime
17:14fiction in a funny kind of way uh modern
17:16crime fiction which is you need
17:17somewhere where people cannot escape
17:18from and and don't have Mobile coverage
17:21and if you've got that suddenly you've
17:22got yourself a plot um yeah islands have
17:24always been the thing and this weirdly
17:26Hawks back to one of the very first so
17:28Cast Away
17:29um years and years ago early uh late '
17:3280s Joan Lumley did it was abandoned on
17:34a on a on a desert island and that's
17:36where a Survivor came from Charlie
17:38Parson said to me oh Jo Al's been this
17:40island can we do something on an island
17:42and I said why you send a load of
17:43different people over there and you vote
17:44one out each week and that's you know
17:46voting out and that's all that kind of
17:48stuff and that's Survivor but Islands
17:49yeah are are a real Trope and it is just
17:52that thing of you can't go anywhere I
17:54mean you know even in the jungle you
17:56know there's doctors around you know the
17:57crew are nearby you know on on on an
17:59island you sort of there's just
18:01something about it which which means the
18:04fripperies of Television you know
18:06there's not a green room do you remember
18:08on 30 Ro they had a really they had a
18:10fake pitch for one called mil Island
18:12which was going to be like 25 super hot
18:15moms uh 508th grade boys no rules uh and
18:19yeah I just they still they do
18:23endure weirdly weirdly that you know the
18:25history of that is is is brexit as well
18:28which you just say no honestly we just
18:30we're an island yeah okay our rules our
18:33Gaff our rules so it's a big it's a big
18:34reality show but where yeah you can't
18:36escape to Cali why can't they can't all
18:40the semican men be put on an island and
18:46the prize is that they can return to
18:49their career exactly as they left it and
18:51it's everyone it's like scoffield Scott
18:53Rubin any if they haven't gone to prison
18:56yeah they and they and and they all I
18:58mean redemp Redemption Island yeah well
19:01I think it would be murder Island
19:02because they would tread over each
19:04other's warm corpses to get back to
19:06exactly how it was before they were can
19:08it would be a whole series of men sort
19:10of saying no but I really reflected and
19:12just it it would be like a reflect off
19:14like who has reflected the most wonder
19:16if it would I think reflection Island
19:18well Scofield's not reflecting it would
19:20be a but he is reflecting isn't he in
19:22this in this deflecting yeah I I would
19:24call it like Edge Lord of the Flies and
19:26they would all have to and they would
19:28all end up killing each other but how
19:30long do you think a okay let's let's get
19:33to this final question then if he's not
19:35sort of how long do you think a
19:36Wilderness thing should last for me this
19:39is about 15 minutes after he departed PE
19:42we've seen that lots of these people are
19:44being released back into the world
19:46slowly people like the producer Scott
19:48Ruden in the states who people think is
19:50can yeah Scott ruden's back he's coming
19:52back through theater okay all of these
19:54yeah it's like a beautiful story they're
19:57being released from captivity of the
19:59prison of their own making Louis C K
20:02came very quickly he's he got a Grammy
20:05as he's and soorry lots of these people
20:06are sort of coming back at you know
20:08coming back into the wild but how long
20:11should a Wilderness in last in politics
20:13it's about five minutes nowadays see
20:15here's the interesting thing isn't it
20:16because for us it doesn't feel like
20:18Philip Scofield's Wilderness has lasted
20:20very long because we don't think about
20:22Philip scoffield very often no so since
20:24you know he was he not been
20:26indispensable to the culture exactly we
20:28we've thought about him 14 times whereas
20:30Philip scoffield is Philip scoffield all
20:31day every day Philip scoffield family
20:33are his family all day every day so
20:34they're very is very very present to
20:37them the Wilderness thing and so 18
20:39months to him he's lived every single
20:40minute of every single day so he would
20:43obviously be fast forwarding the dewi
20:45Wilderness in we call it de wildering
20:48right yeah that's the word we do now
20:49yeah uh uh whereas for us we're just
20:51thinking oh no I need to have thought of
20:52you maybe 40 times before you're allowed
20:54back and in in your terms that seems
20:57like a good amount that would be 4 Years
20:59or or or or something like that so
21:00people will always try and come back out
21:02of the Wilderness quicker than we would
21:04like them to uh and um what will he get
21:07out of this a
21:09travelog I mean this see that's the
21:11question is what does he get out of this
21:13so where does he want to get back to
21:15what is it that he wants to do and I'm
21:16I'm aware in this show that you know he
21:18said this might be the last thing I ever
21:20do I just wanted my right to reply but
21:22of course he's a TV presenter that's
21:24been his job his whole life and as you
21:26rightly point out the way he deals with
21:27this but TV producer a TV brain that's
21:29how he's that's the that's where he's
21:31comfortable that's where he's happy uh
21:33and he's done it very very well a number
21:35of times in lots of different places so
21:38if you are Philip scoffield then of
21:40course you want to come back onto
21:42television there's no you know that's
21:44absolutely fine and of course by the way
21:45you've done this program of course
21:46you're going to do all of these things
21:48if he feels he has not done anything
21:50wrong if he feels he's been over
21:51punished and he feels like the job that
21:54he used to do which he was good at is
21:55something that he's not allowed to do of
21:57course his job is to step by step come
21:59back to where he was but in terms of an
22:03industry it's hard to work out where the
22:05next step is for him so this is sort of
22:09an ideal first step for everybody guess
22:12I makes me feel uncomfortable clearly
22:14makes you feel uncomfortable I think
22:15it'll make lots of people listening it
22:17makes me feel
22:18disdainful yes which is he's not made me
22:20feel uncomfortable he has made me feel
22:22disdainful oh and you and that makes you
22:25feel comfortable because you you like to
22:27feel dis
22:29yes disdain um so the question is yeah
22:32where do you go next now do you go on
22:33I'm a celebrity we're going to talk a
22:35little bit about yeah he's not going to
22:36get book by ITV can I just put that out
22:38here I just he's not going to get book
22:40by ITV but then you always get to the
22:43stage where channels become desperate or
22:46format starts losing some of its luster
22:49or some of its viewers not Tom Cruz
22:51though he's not box office I just
22:54fundamentally there's a lot about this
22:56that's disproportionate the way that
22:57people talk about this morning who host
22:59it no offense you know it's a great show
23:02for the time of day but it's we talk
23:05about this more than like British
23:06foreign policy and it's like a show with
23:09well no I actually think that's quite
23:10important yeah I do too yeah I don't
23:11want to do a podcast about it but
23:14I but I would say that we talk about
23:17this show that has you know under a
23:18million viewers sign significantly under
23:20a million
23:21viewers in a sort of feverish way that
23:24is disproportionate to its surely actual
23:27influence within the culture and this is
23:30why he thinks that he is an
23:32indispensable you know broadcaster who
23:35can talk about something like Legacy
23:37it's like when Pierce Morgan left gmbb
23:39and he was saying well good luck without
23:41me and of course the ratings are
23:42identical there occasionally he'll he'll
23:44he'll quote that they've gone down but
23:46they they went down from the one episode
23:47where he walked out which weirdly got
23:49more uh viewers and so he takes that as
23:51his Benchmark and actually listen if
23:53he's listening he'll he knows the truth
23:55of this it's it's exactly the same as it
23:57was if not slightly more and they've got
23:59loads of great new um hosts on that show
24:01they run it in a very interesting way so
24:03Morgan was able to do that and it's not
24:05just that thing saying I want a legacy
24:07Morgan was then able to Parlay that into
24:10like a 50 million pound deal with News
24:13International which is insane I mean
24:16it's
24:17absolutely losing his marbles but I
24:20mean the deal the deal is no longer is
24:24no longer uh exent I think I doesn't
24:27doesn't matter
24:29he's had the money yeah he doesn't need
24:30more money than that and what but for
24:32nothing for lit they literally got
24:34nothing the channel they put him on is
24:36gone but
24:38anybody anybody works for a News
24:40International any like Murdoch anyone
24:42like that if you are thinking of
24:43spending 50 million pound on somebody
24:46talk to just any television producer
24:49anyone any single person say what do you
24:52think we're getting for this money what
24:53is it that he brought to your program
24:55you know what extra return on investment
24:57did you get on andb for him being there
24:59and they will every single one I'll tell
25:00you zero which is not to say he wasn't a
25:02good percent on that cuz he was not to
25:04say it wasn't an entertaining watch cuz
25:06it was but he bought no extra money into
25:08that they didn't have any experience of
25:09Television this is you see this is the
25:11thing but I have to say that news
25:13organizations have been run like that
25:14all the time you have journalists from
25:16editorial running business things which
25:19is a huge mistake and in that case you
25:22had someone who knows nothing about
25:24television thinking oh I understand
25:27television I understand V verality and
25:29how to you know in this model well I
25:31mean as as has been proved you don't yes
25:34you really don't um and so the question
25:36is where does scoffield go next what can
25:39he do and we live now in a world in the
25:40culture actually those Gatekeepers are
25:42much much much less important um you
25:44know the Russell brands of this world
25:46can go on their own platforms and
25:47produce their own content and find their
25:49own audience scoffield I think is of a
25:51generation where that is alien to him
25:54he's absolutely a beast of Television a
25:56beast of terrestrial television so his
25:57in think there's always how do I make my
25:59comeback I make my comeback by going on
26:01Channel 5 rather than I make my comeback
26:04like Russell Brand by starting to
26:06baptize people in a river so you know in
26:08in in a way that's uh it's Scofield's
26:11way of coming back is just the way he
26:14understands which is I'm going to go on
26:16television which people can click on
26:18their remote control and they can find
26:20me but actually the way of coming back
26:21now is very different but Ellen
26:23degenerous has done the same thing she's
26:24done a big new standup special in
26:26America after all the kind of bullying
26:27alligations and you know she said uh
26:30yeah they accuse me of this they accuse
26:31me of that well I'm a strong woman and
26:33you think yeah oh I don't again that's
26:36been widely received as a sorry not
26:38sorry yeah and people don't like that
26:41yeah she had a chance if she had
26:43actually really just gone completely raw
26:46and pulled herself apart for it as does
26:49Philip scoffield because he's on his own
26:50and he can do what he like yeah but both
26:52of them have stopped not even in the
26:55same postcode of the brink of that they
26:57are miles away from that level of
27:00self-reflection and both both of those
27:02to me would have been highly watchable
27:05television events and the fact that
27:07they've both done a sorry not sorry yeah
27:09is in fact I mean if it's if if they can
27:12even be called that to me leaves them
27:16feeling like okay I I think this is the
27:18end yeah I feel like we have not seen
27:21last of either Ellen degenerous or
27:23Philip scoffield or unfortunately
27:25Russell Brand I think they're going to
27:26be part of our culture
27:28brand we definitely haven't seen the
27:30last off but yes I I they'll never be
27:32what they were again that's couldn't be
27:34more clear but um we'll have to see in
27:36what way they managed to en vagle their
27:37way back into sections of the public
27:40affection would you just to people
27:42listening would you recommend they watch
27:43the scoffield thing or leave it
27:45unwatched I think it's well I mean it's
27:46totally up to you it will give them
27:48ratings and then he'll take something
27:50from that um but I think it's quite
27:52interesting for the reasons I've said a
27:54sort of Television native trying to tell
27:57you you telling you what he's doing and
27:59then doing it and trying to redeem
28:02himself in a in a really sort of very
28:05obvious and in my view quite sort of you
28:07couldn't call it gossam a touched way um
28:10and I think it would be quite it's quite
28:11interesting to watch from that point of
28:13view um but yes as an exercise in not
28:17giving people rights to reply not giving
28:20um not telling the whole story I I you
28:23know I again it's interesting all of
28:25these things are interesting they're in
28:26the culture I watch them all I didn't
28:28have sort of things that I refused to
28:29watch really this episode is brought to
28:32you by Sky proud partners of the resters
28:34entertainment where you can watch on
28:36missible shows including the penguin
28:38starring Academy Award nominee Colin
28:40Farrell I know now uh Colin Farrell was
28:43the penguin in the Batman uh movie and
28:46genuinely wouldn't have a clue it was
28:47him it really shows the magical power of
28:49makeup and Prosthetics incredible
28:50performance now in this story Gotham
28:52City uh is in ruin in total chaos the
28:55penguin AKA osob is out to fill the bow
28:57vacuum in the City and take control of
28:59its criminal underworld come on man not
29:02only does it St Colin Farrell there was
29:03a return for Christen motti oh I yeah
29:06she plays Sophia Falcone the daughter of
29:08the Penguin's former boss you might have
29:09seen Kristen in The Wolf of Wall Street
29:11brilliant cast and great world building
29:14tense violent dark always darker and
29:16grittier the show looks like everything
29:17we got on the Batman and then it kicks
29:19it up a notch uh now in this eight part
29:21series it goes deeper into the dark
29:22deaths of Gotham's criminal underworld
29:24and we'll get to see how it all plays
29:26out the Penguin on sky from the 20th of
29:30September there was recently a bridan
29:32immersive experience which which didn't
29:34go quite as well as it might have done
29:35yes the cultural Mania for immersive
29:38experiences which we're also going to
29:39discuss the Bridgeton one I've got to
29:41say right off the bat because a lot of
29:43people wen't got that far down the news
29:45reports it was not an official Netflix
29:48or sheland experience um by the way
29:51there are a load of Bridget and
29:52experiences which we'll come to in a
29:53minute and these these immersive
29:55experiences where you turn up somewhere
29:56and so you're in the middle of a ball
29:58those wonderful kind of uh it can be all
30:00sorts of things you can do Monopoly live
30:02you can do there's a sort of dopamine
30:03one in London there are so many of these
30:05things which we'll talk about in a bit
30:06but the Bridgeton one this was an
30:08off-brand one I'm going to stress that
30:10in Detroit people spent hundreds of
30:13dollars on their outfits they look great
30:14in the pictures um they were in invited
30:18to step into the enchanting world of the
30:20Regency Era with sophistication Grace
30:22and historical charm now what they
30:24actually stepped into was a world of one
30:27violence in I think sort of strip
30:29lighting no chairs there was for some
30:32reason that a strippers pole with an
30:34exotic dancer in the center of this um
30:37again not necessarily typically Regency
30:39but I didn't want to comment on too much
30:41I'll leave that to the rest of his
30:41history but and they had soggy noodles
30:44and chicken wings wow um and all the
30:47organizers have said as I say not
30:49Netflix or shander land have said is
30:51that there were organizational
30:52challenges which is like yeah I've seen
30:53the pictures and so it's been one of
30:56those things a bit like the woner one
30:57order ever um but there are many many
31:01bridges and experiences they've had the
31:03Queen's ball which is in cities across
31:05the world and you pay a lot of money you
31:06go and you there's somebody who's as
31:08Queen Charlotte and she chooses the
31:09diamond of the ball and all of this
31:10stuff and that's the real deal yeah
31:12there's Bridget and by candlelight which
31:14is concerts of all the sort of
31:16orchestral concerts SS I know is there a
31:19strippers poll there yeah there's a
31:20thing that says you will smell flowers
31:22and you will not be imagining things by
31:25the way what you are in fact smelling is
31:27a synthetic Wisteria scent that is being
31:29pumped through the venue honestly for me
31:31I prefer that cuz you don't have to go
31:33outside well I'm going to come to
31:34immersive experiences in a bit because
31:36there are so many the ones in London at
31:38the moment I mean this you know van go
31:39live that the sort of ways of looking at
31:41art I'll is it art we come along to that
31:44there's been one finally is it art
31:47dopamine dopamine land the faulty T
31:49dining experience alcatra prison
31:52cocktail bar theatrical experience no
31:54fundamentally different understanding of
31:56the rock than I'd ever and you know
31:58anyway whatever now tell me about the
32:00task master cuz the signs have gone up
32:02for the task master experience I've been
32:04talking to as as a Taskmaster uh alumnus
32:07uh I've been talking to them all about
32:09it so it is interesting you know some of
32:11those things when they get advertised
32:12you just think I mean could this be
32:15awful I went to one of those immersive
32:16plays years ago uh which everyone loved
32:19and it literally might have been the
32:20worst evening of my life punch drunk are
32:22the most famous immersive theater
32:23company and they've done lots of these
32:25immersive like we masks walk between
32:27different rooms andu like that I was
32:28just just honestly put on a play you
32:30would absolutely hate this there are no
32:32mul teers nothing but this world where
32:35you go along like the crystal ma
32:36experience which was also done family
32:39and loved it um so you know when people
32:41put a bit of money and love Behind these
32:43things and when the show is involved it
32:44they can be great so dmaster experience
32:46now everything Taskmaster does tends to
32:49be good and it tends to be good because
32:52uh Alex as the Alex horn as the talent
32:55loves that show and puts his all into
32:56things and the production team behind it
32:58Andy devir and his team also love it
33:00it's one of those shows where they they
33:02live it and you know Andy devir's been
33:03making this for 10 years nonstop and
33:06adores it and talking to everybody
33:09behind it it sounds like it's going to
33:11be amazing so it is sort of an immersive
33:13theater experience I think it's got 72
33:14members of cast on this thing and you
33:16turn up with your friends and you
33:18genuinely play Taskmaster uh and the uh
33:20all the tasks have been created by Alex
33:23and they are the one thing about it is
33:26you're not judged they're all things
33:27where you there is actually somebody
33:29wins by getting more or doing more or
33:32something like that so it sounds like a
33:34genuinely uh great experience but also
33:36you know the love and care behind the
33:38scenes it sounds like over the years
33:39they got so many props from yes that
33:41show and um the Taskmaster house itself
33:45which is very very tiny um which they
33:47constantly trying to um uh pretend isn't
33:50where it is and then someone keeps
33:52putting it on Google Maps where it is uh
33:54but uh you know it is Iconic it is
33:56Iconic but even the house itself is too
33:58small even to film the show really and
34:00would certainly be too small to do this
34:01immersive experience so they've
34:02recreated lots of the environments
34:03within that they've got loads of
34:05paintings from people who've been on the
34:06show um you know the cocktails are all
34:09themed around awful cocktails people
34:10have had to make on the show you know o
34:12over the years and stuff like that uh
34:14and yeah it just you know the the
34:16production design is going to look like
34:17Taskmaster it will be filled with things
34:19from Taskmaster the events and you know
34:22all the challenges that you do with your
34:23friends have been created by the team
34:25behind Taskmaster uh and you know that
34:28makes all the difference if someone has
34:29just like said licensed the idea and
34:32said you get on with it exactly that
34:34then that and lots of the board games of
34:36popular shows are bad for this reason oh
34:38my God some of the board games of shows
34:40I've done okay like the pointless board
34:42game I mean absolutely inexplicable I
34:45always say if any if anyone have has a
34:47go at me I nothing to do with me but I
34:48say just use the cards and ask your own
34:50questions come up with your own format I
34:52really liked it at our house when you
34:54did use the cards and ask my children
34:56all the questions that's the that's they
34:59were in true Heaven he did the entire
35:01show and they were on it that's an
35:03immersive experience yeah that was so
35:04that was so immersive yeah uh so not
35:07scalable really not SC Not really SC I
35:09was you know I was think about that how
35:10do you do a house of games experience uh
35:12and um so it's run by one of these
35:15immersive production companies but Andy
35:17the producer and Alex he just said look
35:19we all can't help but get involved and
35:23we all can't help but because they care
35:25because they care they love it and also
35:27they love the legacy of that show and so
35:28they are constantly suggesting things
35:30and constantly you know outside of their
35:32work hours and you know what they're
35:33being paid for constantly you know
35:35suggesting things and recommending
35:36things and improving things uh and so
35:38it's launching this week or the Press uh
35:41actually get is this week I think it's
35:43going to be great I think it is I mean
35:45listen look for the reviews and stuff
35:47like that but it I tell you what it
35:48isn't and it is not the the the Detroit
35:51Bridgeton run by you know some scammers
35:54uh I suspect there won't be a a a
35:56stripper pole there I'm although you
35:58never know no with that show uh so yeah
36:00I think it's going to be the sort of
36:02thing that if you are a fan of that show
36:04that you will love and it's loads of it
36:07is already sold out it might be one of
36:09those things that is enormously
36:11profitable I think um which Sayes to
36:13another Point really which is if you are
36:15Bridgeton or you are Taskmaster this
36:16world we talk about a lot where it's
36:18much harder to make money out of
36:19Television than it used to be if you do
36:21have a brand then these this is the way
36:24that you make money out of you think
36:25it's going to be worth eight eight TR
36:27over 8 trillion The Experience economy
36:29as they call it by 202 not just the Tas
36:33which would be nice by 2028 and it's
36:36exploded since the pandemic and there's
36:38lots of interesting reasons for that I
36:41think it's true but you know even
36:42something like a voyage that's an
36:43immersive experience really you know
36:45it's not the band playing it's something
36:46that's been created by producers in a
36:48venue which you can just go to Forever
36:50and Taskmaster is it Canada water I
36:52think and the economics of it are as I
36:54say 72 members of staff on this thing
36:55and lots of stuff has to be done but the
36:57economics are such that if it is a hit
36:59it's a hit like we were talking about um
37:01recently is a hit like a West End show
37:03is a hit and if it runs and runs and
37:05runs it's making the money of a western
37:06show which is a huge amount of money and
37:09given there there there is not a huge
37:10amount of money left in television if
37:12you have one of these Legacy Brands
37:14which um you know Taskmaster uh is then
37:18it's the way to go and if you do it
37:19properly and it runs and runs and runs
37:21then that's the way to do these things
37:25and that that that's the way you can you
37:26can start monetizing
37:28um your Brands because the world of
37:30Television you're not able you know
37:31traitors is quite hard to monetize the
37:33format of traitors but a traitor
37:35immersive experience which you would
37:36imagine would be you can definitely see
37:37yeah coming you know down the tracks
37:39then you know that would be a way of
37:41making a huge amount of money out of
37:42that format people thought in the
37:44pandemic oh maybe the communal
37:45experience is dead um and as it turns
37:48out it it wasn't but it's come back in
37:51this this has particularly taken off
37:53since the pandemic and I have to say
37:55that there's various reasons that kind
37:57make it possible first of all the
37:59technology has become so good and
38:01technology in general is improving or
38:05changing lots of these experiences but
38:08also I think the audience has changed
38:10bear in mind that the sort of audience
38:12who will go out to these things
38:13including Taskmaster things now are the
38:15audience that grew up with Hands-On
38:17museums which we forget now but that was
38:19a that was a a total Innovation that
38:22museums were places you went and you
38:23didn't touch and now museums a place
38:25where everything's interactive and you
38:27know everyone changed and people were
38:28there was a lot of sort of anting about
38:30that at the time but they've grown up
38:32and also think of the movies they watch
38:34I mean for better or for us the
38:36predominant cultural product has been
38:37Marvel movies which as Martin scor said
38:40are like more like a Thrill Ride
38:43amusement parks of immersive experiences
38:45these are a different form of amusing
38:47Parts in my
38:49view I sometimes do think about the the
38:52the the the impresarios of these places
38:55there's a few that I've been to that are
38:56like I've got got a warehouse M and I
38:59want to fill it with something so to me
39:01it's sort of like landlords meet social
39:03media yes is it my favorite cocktail I'm
39:07not sure it is but you know they and so
39:09you go and see something like the darly
39:10experience I saw I slightly felt like I
39:12see someone's got a warehouse they'd
39:14like to make some money yes so many of
39:17these things like um these art
39:19experiences van go or whatever which is
39:20like BL so many millions of people
39:22around the world stuff where you you
39:24walk in the sort of inside the paintings
39:25and stuff haven't been to one but rather
39:27like these things you don't walk in at
39:29the start of the film so you sort of
39:30like you walk in and then you think I
39:32better wait and see the first half that
39:33I didn't see but and you're in it but to
39:35me that isn't you know the van go show
39:37that is at the at the National Gallery
39:40that's actually a van go picture you're
39:42having some different form of experience
39:44if you're standing in a sort of 360 kind
39:47of virtual yeah world of it and saying
39:50you can appreciate every brush St but
39:52it's not really meant to be appreciated
39:54in those particular ways but I do think
39:56slightly that the tech firms and the
39:58internet are making museums like them
40:01they're making theater like them they
40:04are all of these things when you go to
40:06even a restaurant now and someone's put
40:08a sort of love seat outside it and lots
40:10of silk flowers it's because they want
40:12you to put it on Instagram and I I
40:15slightly feel like people used to say
40:17about the lighthouse family that it was
40:19Soul music for people who don't like
40:20Soul music and I slightly feel this is
40:22art for people who don't like art youf
40:25for me yeah well exactly um but also
40:28there's a sort of sense of Escape isn't
40:30there but in a risk averse world like if
40:33you really wanted to take a risk and do
40:34something new and exciting and immersive
40:36get on a plane and go somewhere but in
40:38fact what people want is to go to the
40:40Caledonian Road and be sort of locked
40:42into a room where they must solve a
40:43number of Clues and be out in an hour
40:45and it's a sort of managed form of chaos
40:48isn't it and a managed form as as
40:50consumers uh certainly us growing up we
40:52are passive so it's absolutely a it's
40:54paity you go to the cinema you're not on
40:57your phone you just watch the thing you
40:58sit at home you're watching television
41:00it is scheduled so you know you can go
41:02to the L during the outbreaks but that's
41:03that's about as interactive as it's
41:05going to get so we absolutely consume
41:07these things passively and this
41:08generation do not consume anything
41:11passively or if they do that's a
41:12deliberate choice and it is an
41:14experience in and of itself they go oh
41:15no we're going to it's an amazing thing
41:17where you go along you have to sit still
41:19and you have to be quiet uh for two
41:21hours and that's the experience so
41:23they're very very used to watching
41:24things actively and to interacting and
41:26so all of these experiences are places
41:28you can go along but you don't just look
41:30at a painting you can walk around you
41:31can choose your own root through you
41:33know you can be inside something you're
41:34experiencing something You' a VR headset
41:37on I feel like you're always mediated by
41:39their machines it's a place where you
41:41can be alone together you are always
41:44mediated by their Mach you are you're
41:46mediated by their Mach and you you can
41:48be alone together I'm not convinced it's
41:50a but you know the also it must say
41:53something about the kind of crapsack
41:55world that people are constantly wishing
41:57to escape from it and reality is
42:00something from which you wish to sort of
42:01immerse yourself away from see I have I
42:04have some sympathy with that because
42:06because because of course an imagined
42:08reality you can do anything which of
42:10course that's going to be better than
42:11actual reality well I know I went to
42:12thought part recently and the Angry
42:14Birds interactive Cinema has been
42:17repurposed as the r without irony
42:20apparently as the Ready Player one thing
42:22and it's like ready player one is
42:24specifically about like the world has
42:26gone no one bothers solving it any
42:28longer and people just Retreat into a
42:31place called The Oasis which is sort of
42:33like Mark Zuckerberg's vision for the
42:34metaverse and you know again all
42:36mediated bya their machines and you can
42:39be what you like but you're alone
42:40together and um and I slightly felt like
42:44wow I can't believe the Angry Birds land
42:46has become this without irony like you
42:48you get that this is about a really
42:50really that this is really really
42:51dystopian don't you but it's the ride
42:54but also I I I think that the culture is
42:56very you know has has lots of ways of
42:58enduring uh and it's interesting being
43:00over in the states it's exactly the same
43:01as in the UK bookstores are thriving
43:04right so bookstores are huge in a way
43:06that 105 years ago you wouldn't have
43:07thought possible because with a book
43:09that is passive you have to sit down and
43:11read it and by the way ebooks haven't
43:12taken off in the way they thought they
43:13might but having an actual book in your
43:15hand is a huge cultural phenomenon a
43:18huge cultural Phenomenon with younger
43:19people the audiences all the book events
43:22much much younger than you would think
43:24uh and however we sort of Drive that
43:27part of our culture the immersive thing
43:29and the interactive thing uh and I'm all
43:31for it because the better technology you
43:32can throw at it the more interesting
43:33exciting that is everyone is still
43:36seeking out um passive experiences and
43:39still seeking out experiences where you
43:41need some concentration and still
43:42seeking out experiences that are long
43:43form uh and in the way that podcasts
43:45have become enormous in the last 10
43:47years book stores and physical books
43:49have got grown and grown and grown in
43:50the last 10 years I think it's
43:52interesting that the faster our culture
43:55gets the more the slow culture
43:57Industries are making money and the more
44:00they're thriving because we like we like
44:02to have a bit of both I think it's just
44:04the fast culture Industries are becoming
44:05better at what they do and the slow
44:07culture Industries do what they've
44:08always done which is let's listen to
44:10some people talk let's read a book
44:11that's from someone's imagination takes
44:13me to another world you know that stuff
44:15is always there and that stuff doesn't
44:16seem to be disappearing and that the
44:17only thing that would worry me if we all
44:19spent all our lives in VR headsets but
44:21we don't actually is the truth people
44:23who like that do that but he wants you
44:25to he wants you he think yes he wants
44:28you to but the head of Coca-Cola wants
44:29you to drink Coca-Cola that's okay I
44:31want you to read my books all of that's
44:33you know that's all of that's okay we
44:34all want to you know people's money to
44:37and give them an experience uh in but I
44:39think but but the difference with these
44:41these Tech Titans is they're far more
44:43powerful than the the head of Coca-Cola
44:45orever was you're talking about Alex
44:46horn again yeah I'm talking about Alex
44:47horn yeah I'm talking about Tex and Alex
44:49I would love if Alex horn was a tech
44:51Titan I'd be quite relaxed about it all
44:53if I'm perect but maybe he turned into a
44:54nightmare maybe it's the very Act of
44:56becoming a tech Titan that makes you a
44:57nightmare maybe uh maybe it works that
44:59way around maybe Mark Zuckerberg was
45:01like Alex horn years
45:03ago he was never like Alex horn what no
45:06he was never like Alex horn if he was
45:08then I would feel so much more relaxed
45:09about our future beneath his machines so
45:12Tedd you can I just did this is just a
45:14you know inside baseball thing the thing
45:16I found hardest about Taskmaster yes
45:19because I love Alex you know he's
45:21amazing but you would turn up to do your
45:22task and Alex was in character and so
45:25you couldn't like you say hi Alex and
45:28you go hello Richard I go oh no that's
45:30normally if I say hi Alex you say hi and
45:32talk about your day and you go hi
45:34Richard open the task uh and so I found
45:36that very um that to me was like going
45:39to one of those experiences and feeling
45:41the Daniel de Lewis of those experiences
45:43just will not break character for the
45:45shoot yeah he he refused to break
45:47character absolutely it infuriated me
45:50because where was my human contact
45:52where's his baa is they must have won a
45:54baa haven't they well I want him
45:55personally to win a ba best I me yeah he
45:58should do uh but yeah I I think that the
46:01this this experience is going to be
46:02great so when you talk about sorry so I
46:05don't want to misinterpret your points
46:07when you talk about tech Titans being in
46:08charge of us you are saying that these
46:10immersive experiences come from
46:12technology and wanting as much of our
46:14attention as possible and wanting to
46:15manipulate us as much as possible I
46:16think that the way that yes I well I
46:18think that that sense of sort of be you
46:21know they talk about being commun all
46:23the time but actually what is occurring
46:24is a very atomized experience and that's
46:27what I say about being alone together
46:28when Mark zacher talks about he says you
46:30know this is about the future of human
46:32connection and he had a conference last
46:35week where he was speaking to a AI bot
46:39of a guy who was standing next to him on
46:41stage and I just thought yeah that
46:43that's a that's a this is a tableau here
46:46right here you talking to an AI version
46:48of the person who's right there and
46:51telling me that this is the future of
46:53human communication well I'm sorry but
46:55I'm I'm sorry I'm not going to lay out
46:57roses for it but is this not just like
46:59the early days of Steam Trains and
47:01they're just trying to work out how
47:02steam trains work no these people are
47:04far more powerful than any of these
47:06people than any of the people who ran
47:07standard all any of all of the biggest
47:09monopolies they are far more powerful
47:11than those people ever ever were and
47:13those people by the way ended up broken
47:14up so this is a form of Monopoly power
47:16which we haven't seen before it's un
47:18it's unmatched in in history and no I
47:21think it's much more
47:23dangerous sorry I know this is not I
47:25genuinely love that we are talking
47:28simultaneously about Taskmaster life and
47:30the uh Standard Oil the break up of
47:31stand the dystopian future of uh of
47:34technology and uh the collapse of the
47:36world well you never know what you're
47:37going to get yeah right it's always a
47:40bit of both with us on that note can we
47:41talk about strictly
47:44yes often people sometimes say oh
47:47reality shows it's it's for you know
47:48people it's it's for people washed up
47:50and it's that has just not been the case
47:51on British television over the years
47:53almost a large proportion of the biggest
47:55stars on British TV come from yeah
47:57reality shows uh and you know strictly
48:01has been the absolute making I me the
48:03wonderful late Caroline Flack absolutely
48:06went from minor TV presenter to
48:08presenting the xfactor on love Island
48:10because she won strictly AJ adodo who
48:12had been doing a few bits and Bobs and
48:14television went on stly everyone saw her
48:17and loved her and you know now she'll
48:18present everything in the world if you
48:20have a client who is on the cusp of
48:22becoming huge and they have a
48:24personality that people like watching on
48:26television and then doing something like
48:28strictly almost impossible to think of a
48:30better show it's the big it's the bigger
48:32show on TV for people to do it exactly
48:34that and and Big Show on TV and
48:35obviously you know it can go wrong for
48:37you but it's equally if it goes right it
48:39goes really really really right uh and
48:43usually it's women who do better rather
48:45strictly but this year I think there's
48:46two guys Capt The public's imagination
48:48in how do you capture the Public's
48:50imagination Richard so capturing the
48:52imagination is an interesting question
48:53because what you really want to do is
48:55capture a ser of tick boxes for a
48:57commissioner right so it would have been
48:59well who who can present this big new
49:01show and you have to have a series of
49:02tick boxes and it you know so if you
49:04were AJ or Doo before strictly it would
49:07have been well I've seen you on House of
49:08games I've seen you on Big Brothers
49:09little brother I see what it is that you
49:11do um people seem to like you but do
49:14people know you yeah do you know what I
49:16mean you you're sort of too unknown and
49:17then you do strictly and you do very
49:19well on Strictly and that final tick box
49:21is there which is oh people know you now
49:23as well so a commissioner knows already
49:24that this person can present a big Prime
49:26time show but will the public accept it
49:29cuz do they know you and you get that
49:31little tick and suddenly um you know you
49:33are accepted and you can do it same with
49:35um Caroline as well uh and so here's the
49:39thing here here's how you become famous
49:41and this year strictly I think is a very
49:42interesting version of it so take the go
49:44compare man wi Evans right now can you
49:49be a big star can you be booked for a
49:51big show if you are if you have a
49:53regional Welsh radio show no you cannot
49:57that's what win has right can you be a
50:00big star if you're an opera singer no
50:03that's what win has can you be a big
50:05star if you're on the Goen paare adverts
50:09no you can't well that's what win has so
50:11he's got all three of those things so
50:13he's got a Welsh show he is the goare
50:17man and he's an opposer so he has a a
50:20real skill a real talent then he goes on
50:22Celebrity Master Chef cuz actually
50:24celebrity Master Chef with those three
50:25things you think oh actually that's you
50:27know you stick him in the mix you go on
50:29Celebrity Master Chef and you oh this
50:31guy's actually got a personality that's
50:33interesting he's got charm and he's you
50:35know he's he's he's more than you think
50:37he's going to be if you just heard the
50:39CV so you go okay let's put him on
50:41Celebrity Master Chief that's fine yeah
50:42that's fine you know he's one of 16 on
50:44that and that's fine and he goes on
50:46there and he wins that and so you kind
50:48of go okay that's interesting so he's
50:49done that show so people have seen him
50:51on that so that's another he's so he's
50:53an opera singer he's he's got this radio
50:55show uh he's a c compare man and oh you
50:57want up Master Chef as well I may yeah I
51:00don't know about strictly uh well let's
51:02get him in let's get him in and talk to
51:03him about strictly at at the very very
51:05least and this is where book has come in
51:07is someone like win Evans will come into
51:10that uh and they'll put him through his
51:12dancing paces and go oh he dances better
51:15than you would think so that's
51:17interesting and also they'll chat to him
51:19and they just go oh I think people will
51:22like this guy I think people are going
51:23to find this guy interesting so I put
51:26together all the things he's got is he
51:28is he famous enough to be on Strictly
51:30he's probably just under the threshold I
51:32meet him and you go oh people are going
51:35to love him let's book him on this you
51:37stick him on Strictly and he's brilliant
51:39you know which is what the Bookers knew
51:40all along so he just about justifies
51:42being on Strictly even though all the
51:44people are going I've never heard of him
51:45he's the guy from The Go andir ads you
51:47go no listen he's it doesn't matter yeah
51:49it doesn't matter also he's got an awful
51:51lot of other skills which the Bookers
51:52know and they really really like him so
51:54win Evans I think if you're watching
51:55that show I think be the funniest stly
51:57ever by the way this series because he
51:58is genuinely a very very funny man um so
52:02he I think is going to go a long way in
52:04the competitions he's better dancer that
52:05you think he's very very funny and he
52:07will then be able to write whatever
52:09check he wants he'll be able to present
52:10show he will be on everything and
52:12anything you can book him on anything uh
52:14and if you do the wheel if you do House
52:16of games anything you go oh yeah he was
52:18on Strictly so you can have him now but
52:19people will give him shows uh and it's
52:22just I think he's a very interesting
52:24test case of how how you build up to
52:27become famous and he just block by block
52:30Lego Brick by Lego brick he just built
52:31enough to do this which built enough to
52:33do that and built enough to do that but
52:35every single step of the way people
52:37liked him and that's the absolute key
52:39yeah part of it on that show I do think
52:41your personal is a bit like almost being
52:43in an ensemble cast in a comedy or a
52:45drama your personality must be easily
52:47understood yes in in reality television
52:49in general even if it's like I'm mean or
52:52I'm you know it's easy and and he he is
52:55so Charming he's so nice but and he's
52:57very funny but it's easy to understand
53:00where he fits in and it's there's a sort
53:02of readability that really helps I think
53:04exactly that and the beauty of strictly
53:06as well is if you stay in long enough
53:07which he which he will you also get the
53:08other side of the journey which is I am
53:10vulnerable and it is difficult being me
53:12sometimes and you know here's my family
53:14and this is who this is who I actually
53:16am as a human being by which point
53:17people have falling in love with him
53:18already and so you know they are
53:20absolutely ready to accept all all of
53:22that stuff so I think he is going to be
53:24huge the guy who's going to be super
53:25massive off the back at this show is
53:26Chris mland uh and I first came across
53:29Chris on would I lie to you a few years
53:31ago uh and Chris listen no secret he's
53:35blind okay which uh and representation
53:38on television has become incredibly
53:39important and you know so it's always
53:42great to you know represent um people
53:44but the key thing about Chris is he's
53:47funnier than everybody else right he's
53:49just brilliant and you know he can do
53:50jokes about being blant he can jokes
53:52about Vision impairment but he also just
53:54does jokes he just does brilliant jokes
53:55and every single time we've put him on a
53:57show and he came on House of games he is
54:00just brilliant you know he is relatable
54:03people like him he's funny he has a sort
54:05of the earth quality to them to him he
54:07understands the format he's on um if
54:10he's on House of games he will be funny
54:12but he will make everyone around him
54:13funnier as well which is the real skill
54:15but that's an incredible thing to do
54:17it's not that ego thing of I'm going to
54:19be the funniest person in the room is I
54:21definitely have the capability to be the
54:22funniest person in the room but I want
54:24everyone else to be enjoying themselves
54:25as well and I want to you know have fun
54:27in people's company and you see uh you
54:30know as I say I do think strictly is the
54:31funniest ever cuz he and wi are
54:33genuinely very funny and there's lots of
54:35supporting uh uh cast members there also
54:38who can uh who can keep up with them but
54:40Chris is one an example of somebody who
54:44again so he's a comedian there was a
54:45route through for comedians to be on
54:46television programs because you you can
54:48be booked on things but lots of people
54:51get booked on something for the first
54:52time and it's like oh yeah yeah yeah he
54:55was good or she was funny but you know
54:56they don't get booked again every single
54:58time Chris has done
55:00something before he gets in he does the
55:02work absolutely does so he's naturally
55:04very very funny anyway but he will do
55:06the work he will turn up understanding
55:08the job you want him to do uh the first
55:10one is on what I like to you first
55:12couple of things you did were gang
55:14clearly done before in this standup
55:16about visual impairment which are very I
55:18mean brilliantly funny as as you would
55:20expect because you know they're honed
55:22over the years so you think oh that okay
55:24that's interesting but then Lee will say
55:26something and Chris will come back with
55:27something that completely extemporized
55:29you think oh oh you got that as well
55:31have you got that in your locker uh and
55:33then you just think well this guy has
55:34got everything because he's got a
55:36relatability he's got a stick uh but
55:39also he's brilliantly funny off the cuff
55:42and you see him on um strictly and genu
55:45both dances he's done sitting there with
55:47ing were both in tears there's something
55:49about it there's something about the
55:50fact he can't see and he's doing these
55:51dances and The Bravery it takes uh so
55:54before the thing he can do proper jokes
55:56he does this thing which you just think
55:57this is extraordinary and then he's back
55:59to doing jokes again and doing jokes in
56:02such a way that he makes the show
56:03stronger so he will do jokes about Craig
56:05that make the format stronger that makes
56:07strictly stronger he absolutely
56:09understands that so he looks good he
56:11will do jokes about his fellow
56:12contestants that make the show stronger
56:14uh and you know that's how you become a
56:17star and that's how you become a
56:18deserved star is and 20 years ago would
56:22a blind comedian have been booked for
56:23the first time and would a lie to you
56:25possibly not I would say uh and the fact
56:28that he was and the fact that he
56:30immediately showed who he was and the
56:31fact that he's had this incredible
56:32trajectory all down to him by the way
56:34every single bit of it a door was opened
56:36and he has my god he has made every
56:39single you know every single mile of
56:41progress has been his progress uh and
56:44it's so amazing to see but it's an
56:47example him and wi as I say it's usually
56:50women on these shows that that really go
56:51from strength to strength but this year
56:52I think it's the two of them and it
56:54comes from being incredibly good at what
56:56they do being incredibly likable and
56:59just turning up putting the work in and
57:01and and making the show the most
57:04important thing and so I I I think both
57:07of those two are a testament to the
57:09booker art as well which you know if you
57:11hadn't heard of them before you've
57:12certainly heard of them now they've cost
57:14Anna delie I can't remember what her
57:15real name is but it's not that the one
57:17from inventing Anna the the scamming era
57:20fake aest who just came out of prison
57:22she actually has an electronic tag and
57:24actually she Drew attention to I mean I
57:25hate thought like a male online article
57:27but she was flaunting it and didn't care
57:29who saw right um anyhow uh but she was
57:32voted off in week one in a double
57:35elimination for Tory Spelling what she
57:37did do I mean obviously she's a terrible
57:39person they had to by the way you're
57:41right they had to negotiate because
57:42she's she's supposed to be under house
57:44arrest waiting to be deported so they
57:47had
57:48to negotiate with the immigration
57:50department you can imagine if the BBC
57:51tried to do this I know they want our
57:53television people who hate the BBC want
57:54our television to be more like America
57:56well here you are this is what happens
57:58um anyhow she was voted off but was I
58:00mean I obviously she's a terrible person
58:02but they did say to her at the end and
58:05what do you take from this experience
58:06and she just said nothing now I know I
58:10mean I love slightly I always
58:12reflectively slightly love people who
58:13say the wrong thing in any given
58:15situation and the fact that it wasn't a
58:17journey for her and it wasn't any of
58:19that you know I did find quite funny
58:21although normally of course she does
58:22take things she likes to have a few
58:24things in her bag just you know1 or yeah
58:27if it's not nailed down she will take it
58:29but you know that's the interesting
58:30thing that's what you know if you want
58:31famous people then she was famous cuz
58:32she went to prison but you know that's
58:34not how you book a real that's not how
58:35you book strictly you book strictly you
58:37meet people go are people going to fall
58:39in love with this person and they do you
58:40don't have a convicted felon because it
58:43sounds good and again she comes out and
58:44just goes oh I was edited badly which is
58:46the last recourse of every Scandal has
58:48ever been on these shows people didn't
58:50really see the real me they didn't see
58:51the the great stuff I was doing they
58:52gave me the wrong dances they gave me
58:54the wrong partner they didn't people
58:55just don't like it I've paid my debt to
58:56society I believe was in that mix wow
58:59there's I've served my time sorry been a
59:02lot of that on this uh on on this
59:04episode hasn't there yeah there yeah and
59:07people who haven't quite still have some
59:09to clear of that debt I believe yeah
59:11exactly that so anyway I think that this
59:13this this year strictly is going to be a
59:15cracker and I think it's good that they
59:16avoid the uh the anad delies of this
59:18world yes all right on that note please
59:22join us again on Thursday for the
59:23questions and answers Edition look
59:25forward to it every so much we covered a
59:26lot of ground didn't we today we
59:27certainly did yeah a lot going on yeah
59:29lot going on um and I'm sure there will
59:31be on Thursday so do join us the address
59:33for questions is the rest is
59:35entertainment at gmail.com um we'll see
59:37you on Thursday see you on Thursday

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