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The Most Valuable 64 Minutes You'll Spend This Year (Hormozi x Mylett) — Transcript

by Ed Mylett · 15,264 words · 2,171 segments · language en · Watch on YouTube

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0:00I had this great piece of advice from a
0:01mentor who told me I said yeah you know
0:02had a couple good days and she said I'm
0:04pretty sure the secret to life has dream
0:05as many days in a row like that as you
0:06can and it was one of those very
0:07tactical pieces of advice that I've
0:08actually taken with me forever which was
0:10so when I looked back on my whole year I
0:11was like okay what were the top 10 days
0:13of this year and I I started thinking
0:15through them and I would say that like
0:16if you think of a day as a microcosm of
0:18your life it's like I would like to end
0:20end this life being like I gave I left
0:22it alone ironically then people look at
0:24you and think guys so skilled as an
0:26entrepreneur or what a great speech
0:27maker or but it's actually happened
0:29through emptying the tank all these
0:31days. I also don't want to fall into
0:33this I get you call it like bro culture
0:35hustle culture notion of like the funny
0:38clip of me saying I work a million hours
0:40a day and I can change time.
0:43However, what what I don't want to sound
0:45like is like that that's that there's no
0:48meaning in other things. It's [snorts]
0:50about maximizing output of unit of time
0:52total. But if I only had 24 hours, then
0:55yeah, take as many stimulus as you can
0:56because you only have 24 hours to work.
0:57But that's not how the world works. You
0:59have and for the the games that we're
1:01trying to play decade plus, it's like
1:04not only that, you actually have to be
1:05alive from a meeting purpose
1:06perspective. That's a really good point.
1:08Maybe one of the best points I've heard
1:09on a podcast in probably 10 years.
1:18>> Welcome back to the show everybody. So
1:19here's who I have with me today.
1:20Somebody that I admire a great deal. I
1:22wish I spent more time with um I think
1:25he's one of the great American
1:26entrepreneurs actually worldwide
1:27entrepreneurs. He's um I told him this
1:29privately on a conversation I don't know
1:31about six, eight weeks ago. I think he's
1:33the best in the world at teaching people
1:34how to be better business people and
1:36better marketers. I think he's number
1:37one in the world and I say that as
1:39somebody who does it myself and so I
1:40have a great deal of admiration for him.
1:43Um most importantly his brain is huge
1:45but his heart is bigger. That's the one
1:46thing I think most people online would
1:48not know about this young man. He's got
1:50a heart of gold. He's a kind person.
1:52He's a humble person. And he still is
1:55curious and still wants to learn. He
1:57still actually asks for advice from time
1:58to time. And so, um, you're going to get
2:00his advice today on the Ed Mlet Show
2:02with the great Alex Hermosi. Welcome
2:04back.
2:05>> Thank you for having me. And my only
2:07goal in this podcast is live up to that
2:09introduction. [laughter]
2:10Oh,
2:10>> you you'll do great. So, uh, you got a
2:13lot going on in your life.
2:14Congratulations on the potential the the
2:17sooncoming fatherhood for you. How has
2:19it changed you at all? like just the
2:20thought of it, just knowing it's coming.
2:22>> I'd say the thought has changed my life
2:25maybe in two ways. One is that I'm
2:26actively really um trying to get ahead
2:28on education for my son and thinking
2:30like what inroads do I need to do so
2:32that I can set
2:33>> him up education wise because I don't
2:34like the system obviously.
2:36>> Um I'd say that's one. I would say two
2:38is that I feel like I've had a little
2:39bit of a shift in terms of up to this
2:41point I've just only had I would say I
2:44have had reverence for the game and that
2:46is why I continue to play it. Um, but
2:48I've had a weird shift where I was like,
2:50oh, I guess I am going to leave this to
2:52someone because until this point it was
2:54just I'm going to write it to charity in
2:56one check and let it go to like the
2:57Acumen Fund or some of these really good
2:59institutions that know how to deploy
3:00capital in a charitable way because I
3:01was just like this was just chips to
3:03play the game.
3:04>> Um,
3:05>> but so that's I would say those are the
3:06two things that have changed about in
3:08terms of like what has what new weights
3:10are waiting my decision-m those are
3:12those two. um I'm more I'm more likely
3:14to respond to a a student outreach, you
3:16know, like something student related.
3:18>> Um but beyond that, in terms of my like
3:20>> internal stuff, um I'm here to support
3:22Ila.
3:23>> Um and I expect the emotionality of
3:25it'll probably come when he's
3:26>> born. Yeah. But I know you and I have
3:29had enough conversations. I think it's
3:30more than that with you. I think it's
3:32changed your overall look on everything.
3:35I mean, you've asked me a few questions
3:37in different ways, but but
3:39>> I you appear to, at least to me, it
3:42seems to have almost I don't know
3:45broadened your perspective, made it
3:47bigger. Uh,
3:48>> totally.
3:48>> In what way? Like if if we're using my
3:50terminology because I think it's
3:52important. You have a lot of young
3:53people that follow your content. You
3:54have a lot of people that follow your
3:56content, but a lot of them are guys like
3:57me when I was coming up, guys like you
3:59when you're coming up, and they're not
4:00at this stage of their life yet. I
4:02wonder knowing what you know now about
4:04you're going to be a dad, would it have
4:05changed anything you were doing or
4:07thinking prior?
4:08>> Leila and I got really serious about
4:10having kids when I was 28
4:12>> and we [clears throat] were like really
4:13going to do it and then we were like you
4:15know what let's not. But there was like
4:17you know a few month period we're like
4:18let's do this. Um and I think that we
4:21could have like again I can't replay
4:23life but like I think me doing it at
4:24that point I was 28 and she was 25
4:28>> might have been like that would have
4:29been good. I probably would have been
4:30easier to have more kids.
4:32>> Um because I think Leila and I are very
4:34all like all or nothing. Um and so as
4:37soon as we found out that she was
4:38pregnant with um our son,
4:41>> um we're like, well, I guess we're going
4:42to have a lot more than one or at least
4:44that's the goal. So it's either like
4:46none or have a soccer team, you know,
4:48that's kind of [laughter] like
4:49>> and we have settled on Edward. That is
4:51his name, right?
4:52>> One of the great names of that.
4:53>> Yeah, he's going to be Edward. I got to
4:55tell you, when he told me about the the
4:57the blessing, I I think you would agree.
5:01I was almost as excited as if my own
5:03son.
5:04>> And the reason is I just want to tell
5:05you and then we'll get into content that
5:07everybody wants. I've long thought you'd
5:09be a great father.
5:11>> And I've told you that. I told you that
5:12before this happened. So, I'm just
5:13really happy for you. I just want you to
5:15know that. I'm really
5:16>> say that for people I mean, everyone who
5:18listens to this already knows you, but
5:19like Ed's even better in private than he
5:21is on these podcasts. And um
5:24>> thank you.
5:24>> It's one of the one of the rare gifts. I
5:26think I had someone ask me like, "Hey,
5:27what are the people of all the people
5:29that you've met
5:30>> um that were, you know, different in
5:32person versus their content?" And I was
5:34like, "Ed, for sure." And they were
5:36like,
5:36>> "Oh." And I was like, "No, he's just way
5:38better."
5:39>> Oh, thank you.
5:40>> And um and yeah, it's just like there
5:42are very few people that I that I like
5:44if I was like having something that was
5:45kind of complex. like you have this very
5:47great depth of understanding from both
5:48like you have the business acumen but
5:50you have this great balance of of
5:52humility without having any judgment and
5:54I think that's super rare.
5:55>> Thank you. So do you by the way it's
5:56what I admire about you. We both at our
5:58stage are important people to know we're
6:00both still curious. We still both want
6:01to learn. You're the smartest guy in the
6:03room most of the time but you don't ever
6:05act like it. And that's one of the
6:06things that I really love about you. You
6:08made me think about my own content. So I
6:09want to go into some stuff. I want to
6:10ask you about some stuff. You've
6:12challenged my own thinking. So, I was
6:14probably one of the early on way back in
6:16the day morning routine, evening routine
6:20guys.
6:21>> Creating structure.
6:22>> I probably made it sound as if I was a
6:25little bit more dialed in than I really
6:26was on any given day. You know how
6:27content can come across that way.
6:29>> But you've sort of taken a different
6:30perspective on it. And frankly, you've
6:32persuaded me, you're probably more right
6:34than I was. And so, I've actually not
6:37really gone back to the old way that I
6:38teach this stuff. Meaning I think
6:40there's a lot of things that are
6:41ritualistic we do
6:42>> that are just time fillers now that are
6:44wasting time. So share with the audience
6:46kind of your view on morning routines
6:49and what is what really matters to get a
6:52day started in a business going.
6:54>> I I I basically see the time that you
6:57wake up after any period of sleep even
6:59if you take a nap right afterwards is
7:01where your your processing power is
7:02going to be the best. And so the morning
7:04typically is where you're going to have
7:05the the best thinking if you can use the
7:07morning ideally. Some people can't get
7:09the time, fine. You can do late at
7:10night. It's okay. Um, but because of
7:12that, my goal is to compress the time
7:14from when I wake up to when I begin
7:15working as fast as to as little as
7:17possible. And so for me, it's basically
7:19>> wake up, uh, stimulate, meaning
7:22caffeine, nicotine 8, proteinate, you
7:24know, creatine 8, do all my stuff, my
7:26stuff, and then just basically go right
7:27into it. Um, I think some people having
7:29like maybe a 10-minute meditation or
7:31something like that because it calms
7:32their, you know, emotionality, attack
7:33the thing, that's fine. I think
7:35anything, you know, much longer than
7:37that, like for example, I love training.
7:39Um, but when I'm trying to be my most
7:41productive, I train at the end of the
7:42day.
7:43>> You do?
7:43>> Yeah. Okay.
7:44>> Because my brain is exhausted, but my
7:46body is still fresh.
7:47>> Um, but if I use if I train the way I
7:49want to train, which is two hours, I'm
7:51using the first two hours of my day on
7:52train, which if I don't if I'm not in a
7:54go- go season, which happens plenty, um,
7:56I'll train first. Um, because I'll use
7:58all my juice there. But I'm definitely
8:00more fatigued because I train pretty
8:01hard.
8:01>> Yeah. I'm interesting. I I've had a
8:03Let's talk about this for a minute. I
8:04think it's a little bit of and debate
8:06this with me a little bit. One, my
8:07routines were too long. You're right. It
8:09was
8:10>> two hour an hour and a half or two hours
8:12of stuff to just get going. Yeah.
8:14>> And frankly, as I step away from it,
8:16>> I don't even believe any of that in real
8:17life. You don't have to be perfectly
8:19prepared to do anything. In fact, you're
8:20never going to be.
8:21>> Some people is it not? You don't think
8:23it's more like know thyself? Like the
8:24most successful high performers I know
8:26know their peak cognitive time of the
8:28day.
8:29>> So, are you saying that you think for
8:30everybody it's their morning? Cuz for
8:31me,
8:32>> I'm with you. I'm probably best like not
8:35not 5:00 a.m. morning, but I'm probably
8:37best my best meeting should be taken
8:38hardest meeting should be taken between
8:409:00 and noon for me.
8:41>> The basis 10 a.m. meeting.
8:42>> Yeah, that but do you think that it's
8:44more if you're giving advice to
8:45somebody, it's it's become self-aware of
8:47when your cognitive peak is.
8:49>> Yeah, I think there's the um the like
8:51population versus n equals 1. And so I
8:54think population wise most people when
8:56they're the freshest is like after they
8:58wake up. Now I'm not saying like you get
9:00shook out of bed now write an essay.
9:01That's not what I'm saying. But 30 an
9:03hour once your cortisol comes up and
9:05you're like alert um usually at that
9:07point you're you're freshest now n
9:09equals 1 everyone's different and so if
9:11you had a scatter plot of humans it's
9:13like in general that is where it is
9:15going to be if you don't know where to
9:16start where you're going to be more
9:16productive start in the morning if you
9:18have if you're like I for sure I'm a
9:20night owl then be a night out like I I
9:22think both like I have no dog in this
9:24fight whatever you want
9:25>> right agreed
9:26>> I think the only thing that I I would
9:27say that I am adamant about that I would
9:28you know what sword would I would
9:30actually fall on is that I would never
9:32want my routine to become a crutch in
9:36that if it if I didn't have it, it would
9:38make me less capable.
9:40>> And so it has to be something that I can
9:42win
9:43>> without it, but if it's there, it's
9:45additive. So it's a preference, not a
9:46requirement.
9:47>> And so I think um one of my favorite
9:49lines in Invictus, which is like this
9:50weird movie with Morgan Freeman,
9:52>> he's talking to uh Matt Demon, who's the
9:55lead South African player. they have
9:58some exchange and he says, you know, I
10:00um I wish we could have played better
10:02this year, but you know, we we weren't
10:03100%. And Morgan Freeman, who's supposed
10:05to be Nelson Mandela, says no one's ever
10:07100%.
10:08>> And I it was this really great exchange
10:10that um I've always thought a lot about,
10:12which is like a lot of like champions
10:14and winners win despite imperfect
10:16conditions.
10:16>> Amen.
10:17>> Not in the s pursuit or effort of
10:20creating perfect condition.
10:21>> I want to talk about that. By the way,
10:22in about something ironic, my drive over
10:23here with my Uber guy, I can't say why,
10:26but but I have a recent engagement with
10:29Morgan Freeman. I spent the last 40
10:31minutes driving over here talking about
10:32Morgan Freeman of all human beings. And
10:33now you bring up that name in the
10:34interview. I want talk about effort and
10:36conditions. Here's the thing I think
10:38that you have.
10:39>> I want you to discuss this with
10:40everybody. I think for most people,
10:42effort
10:43>> is conditional. Like when I'm working
10:46with athletes, you know, I'll go to
10:47these college football teams or these,
10:49you know, professional teams and if the
10:51guy's starting and he's first string and
10:54it's, you know, 10 to seven in the
10:56fourth quarter, you're getting 100% max
10:58effort from that person. But if he's
10:59second or third string in practice on
11:01Thursday, he knows he's not going to
11:02play in the game or it's 21 to nothing.
11:04Effort changes for most people based on
11:07conditions.
11:08>> And I think someone like yourself who's
11:10had long-term success, you've made
11:12effort unconditional. Meaning regardless
11:14of the conditions, winning, losing,
11:16pregnant, not pregnant, an exit, a deal
11:19that falls apart, effort is not based on
11:21conditions or even how the people around
11:23you are behaving.
11:24>> Do you believe that that's a key?
11:26>> A thousand%.
11:27>> Yeah.
11:27>> For for two reasons and I think the
11:28second you'll appreciate more. So I'll
11:30actually start with that one.
11:31>> If you are somebody who starts to win,
11:34right? So this is maybe only talking to
11:35the 10% or 5% of people who are
11:37listening to this. You can't you can't
11:40make your effort conditional on winning
11:42anymore because winning the bar is too
11:44low
11:45>> because starting to outco compete other
11:47people who aren't as prepared who didn't
11:48realize how much effort you're going to
11:49put in ahead of time like you actually
11:51end up sacrificing your potential
11:54>> um in just trying to beat them
11:57>> rather than saying like and this is why
11:59I love Andy's uh Andy Fcella's 100 to
12:02zero that that like leave no doubt. Y
12:05>> um so it's like we have to only be
12:08playing against ourselves especially
12:10once you get past a certain level.
12:11>> What a great point.
12:12>> Um and so I'll say that it's like thing
12:14one. I would say the second part is that
12:16I think I had a year off when we sold
12:18the company and going through that whole
12:20process and it was one of the most
12:22miserable of my life. Um and I derived
12:25from that period uh this concept or this
12:27mantra of work is the goal. And it was
12:30the idea that a lot of times even we
12:33hear the coaches say, "Hey, you know,
12:34work super hard, the score takes care of
12:35itself." But even adding on the the
12:38score takes care of itself. Still makes
12:40the score the objective or the goal.
12:43>> If we could just say work as hard as you
12:45can, period. And I will judge you by how
12:48hard you worked relative to how hard you
12:50could work.
12:51>> And what's difficult about that
12:53>> is that the only person who actually
12:55knows how hard you can work is you.
12:56>> Wow. And so that is both uh gratifying
12:59and also terrifying because
13:02>> you can win and in [snorts] the world's
13:05eyes and still lose in your own if you
13:06use that as your as your metric.
13:09>> Yes.
13:09>> And so
13:10>> Wow. Very good.
13:11>> What was what was interesting about the
13:13So we did this book launch in August of
13:16last year and we
13:16>> I heard you made a little money on that.
13:18>> It worked out.
13:18>> Yeah. [laughter]
13:19>> Um so
13:20>> he made a hundred million bucks. So the
13:22whole the whole idea was, you know, the
13:25record was Prince Harry's record, which
13:26was uh 1.4 million copies sold in 24
13:29hours, which is roughly like $43 million
13:32in 24 hours.
13:34>> And so we we ended up breaking the
13:36record within the first like 3 hours or
13:38something like that.
13:39>> That's crazy.
13:40>> And but we still had we still had 21
13:42more hours.
13:44>> And so this was the 100 to zero concept
13:46of like, well, let's we're not going to
13:48stop now. Like let's let's run up the
13:50score. And I think my team was even
13:52surprised when I like took a water break
13:547 8 hours in
13:56>> and they were like, "Okay, so you know,
13:57what are we going to do now?" I was
13:58like, "We're going to keep going."
14:00>> And like I had almost no celebration.
14:02Um, yes. But part of it was cuz I was
14:03like, "I'm not going to waste this."
14:05Like we put all of this time, we
14:07gathered all of this attention and we're
14:09going to deliver as much value as we
14:10possibly can during this period of time
14:12and then we're going to go for 100. So
14:13it wasn't even like don't don't beat it.
14:15Yes.
14:16>> Like put a whole new marker for what you
14:18think is possible. And we had done the
14:20math or I had done the math prior to
14:22which is why the hundred million dollar
14:23launch was the idea. But it was like I
14:25think we can do this. And so that
14:27becomes the standard rather than the
14:28world standard of just winning.
14:30>> You know, first off, this is why I love
14:32talking to you because you make me think
14:33and but I I want to stay on this just
14:36for a second. First off, we've unpacked
14:37two gigantic lessons. One is how to
14:39prepare for your day and when to take
14:41your best meetings and to be self-aware.
14:42The second one is this idea of
14:43unconditional effort. But when you're
14:45saying something, are you like this too?
14:48I have actually not really celebrated
14:51nor have I enjoyed what I think the
14:54world would think are really normal big
14:56like life events like the day of an exit
14:58or like the day you had the $100 million
15:00day. Yet on the other hand, I've I've
15:04had massive personal celebrations on
15:06days where I have, no pun intended, but
15:07like maxed out my potential possible
15:10effort in a given day. Meaning almost
15:12this is this is really counterintuitive
15:14for most people but so important because
15:16this isn't on social media. It's not on
15:17most podcasts. I don't think I've
15:19mentally the last year played like a
15:21results game even though I am outcome
15:23focused.
15:24>> I am much more process andor effort
15:28focused. And I celebrate to the extent
15:31that I'm capable of doing that. The max
15:33effort days, not the the actual result
15:36day. And by the way, my celebrations are
15:37pretty weak and suck too.
15:38>> We both have had this.
15:39>> We both have this time privately, right?
15:41But share your thoughts on that.
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16:42subscription. Um, when I looked back on
16:46that year where I was like, "What are
16:47the what are the the happiest days of my
16:48life?" Because when you have you have
16:50your your monetary itch scratched,
16:52you're like, "Okay, well, what what am I
16:53doing the what the rest of my innings
16:54for?"
16:55>> Um, I had this great piece of advice
16:57from mentor who told me um after I had
16:59this particularly good weekend and I was
17:00in a good mood and um uh she said,
17:02"You're a good mood." And uh I said,
17:04"Yeah, you know, had a couple good
17:05days." And she said, "I'm pretty sure
17:06the secret to life is string me as many
17:07days in a row like that as you can." And
17:09it was one of those very tactical pieces
17:11of advice that I've actually taken with
17:12me forever, which is so when I looked
17:14back on my whole year, I was like,
17:15"Okay, what were the top 10 days of this
17:17year?" And I I started thinking through
17:19them and I have this written on my wall,
17:22which is so there's like two things
17:23written on my wall, three um that are my
17:25my constant reminders. One is focus is
17:27subtraction. The second is my good day
17:30formula, which is um
17:33>> work out with people you like,
17:35>> eat with people you like, and write
17:36something.
17:37>> I've heard this is good. And so if I can
17:38do those things, because when I looked
17:40back at my days,
17:41>> when I did those three things, those are
17:43my best days.
17:44>> And so I was like, how can I do that as
17:45much as I possibly can and organize my
17:46day to do that?
17:47>> But that last one, which I would say is
17:49not on that list, but is kind of like
17:51the result of the list is to have
17:52nothing in the tank.
17:53>> Yeah. It's like when I when I've earned
17:55my shower, when I feel like I have
17:56nothing left to give. And I would say
17:58that like if you think of a day as a
17:59microcosm of your life, it's like I
18:02would like to end end this life being
18:05like I gave I left it all on the field.
18:07>> Emptied the tank completely.
18:08>> I left it all on the field. There was no
18:09one who's like he could have done more.
18:10It's like [ __ ] just squeezed
18:12from places we didn't know existed.
18:14>> That's what I would like every day to
18:15be. And of course, it's an ideal. It's
18:17not something I hit every day, but I
18:18strive to.
18:18>> So do I. It's funny because you reach
18:20levels of capacity and talent or what
18:23people think are skill, at least me,
18:26through doing that. So, ironically, then
18:27people look at you and think, man, this
18:29guy's so skilled as an entrepreneur or
18:30what a great speech maker or but it's
18:33actually happened through emptying the
18:34tank all of these days. How do you
18:36navigate? Because you if we're not
18:38careful, you and I fall into this trap
18:40of the people that you also hear on
18:41social media that you and I privately
18:44discuss sometimes too. Like I can't
18:46believe with no offense why someone's
18:48listening to this person if they've
18:49actually never produced anything. But
18:51I've also I I also don't want to fall
18:54into this I get you'd call it like bro
18:57culture hustle culture notion of like
19:00the funny clip of me saying I work a
19:02million hours a day and I can change
19:03time and caveman lived a million years
19:05ago or whatever was a little uh
19:08misspeaking there. However, what what I
19:10don't want to sound like is like that
19:12that's that that there's no meaning in
19:15other things and that rest is not also
19:18okay. So I just want to give you a forum
19:20so that people don't think that of you
19:21also like what are your philosophies
19:24about rest or recuperation or reflection
19:28because for me a lot of times these big
19:29efforts I make a lot of the the growth
19:32actually happens in reflecting on what
19:33took place and what I learned from it
19:35and you do do that more than most people
19:36know.
19:37>> Totally. So if you so uh so tactically
19:40if you were to look at my calendar my
19:41five days out of seven have almost
19:43nothing on it. I do one day I do a half
19:45day of meetings on one day and then I do
19:47one one filming day a week. So today was
19:49my filming day. Um and then if you
19:51include the weekends those two days I
19:53have three during the week and then two
19:55two weekend days that are almost always
19:56completely empty.
19:57>> Interesting.
19:58>> Um okay.
19:58>> And so that is that is how I work most
20:00effectively. And it's because I think
20:02that two weeks ago I could not know what
20:04was going to be most important today
20:06>> but today I will be able to do that. And
20:08so I I have faith that I can pull things
20:10together. Like I I put together this
20:12deal on a Sunday once after like Yeah,
20:14I'm sure you had one of these days where
20:15somebody calls you and you're like, "Oh,
20:16I think I can put this together."
20:18>> And it was six straight hours of calls
20:20and we ended up putting like almost a
20:21$400 million stock deal together.
20:22>> Oh my goodness.
20:23>> But it was just like just but if I had
20:26had appointments all day, I would have
20:28missed that and that wouldn't have
20:29happened. And so there's just huge value
20:31to that. So that's like thing one in
20:32terms of organizing time and trying to
20:34create space and that's just how I
20:35function. The second um is I think it's
20:40it's extending the time horizon in terms
20:42of what we're thinking about output. So
20:44if you if whenever you shrink the time
20:46horizon then it always creates a false
20:49narrative of extremism. And so for
20:51example, if I said if you're going to
20:52die tomorrow, you change your behavior a
20:54lot today. But if I say you're going to
20:56die in a week, you change it for sure a
20:58lot, but it would be slightly different.
21:00If I said you're going to die in a
21:01month, it would still be different. Die
21:02in a year, it's for sure going to be
21:03different. And then beyond that it's too
21:05far for human consciousness real in
21:07reality. And so as a result it's like we
21:10have to think how do I maximize my
21:11output over a year or two years or 5
21:14years or 10 years. And so if we take
21:16let's say even a 10 year horizon
21:18>> then for sure we need to rest
21:21>> because like
21:22>> it's like if I worked out every hour
21:24every day you're not going to get
21:25stronger. You're just going to break
21:26down your muscles too much and you're
21:27just going to look terrible and be
21:28exhausted and overtrained, right? And so
21:30like there obviously has to be some
21:32recuperation that that exists. And so
21:34it's about maximizing output of unit of
21:37time total.
21:39>> But if I only had 24 hours then yeah
21:40take as many stimulants as you can
21:42because you only have 24 hours work.
21:43That's not how the world works. You have
21:45and for the the games that we're trying
21:47to play decade plus it's like not only
21:49that you actually have to be aligned
21:51from a meaning and purpose perspective
21:52because we assume that we're going to
21:53win to a certain degree. So it's like we
21:55have to find ways to make it worth it
21:57and also not sacrifice the other
21:58reinforcers we have in our life like
22:00family, wife, kids, whatever.
22:02>> And so I think it's it's it's navigating
22:05how do I have the highest output over
22:06the longest period of time which allows
22:08for a much more I'll call it
22:11>> balance with quotes approach but it
22:14still comes into seasons and I think
22:15again when we think in this longer term
22:17when how you work in your 20s is going
22:19to look very different than how you work
22:20in your 40s.
22:20>> I agree. So would you say that that
22:22schedule you're running now with those
22:23open days, you more almost had to adjust
22:25to your current circumstances, but if it
22:27was startup Alex or Mosy in the gym,
22:29>> you're probably
22:30>> Oh, all day. Yeah. My the my startup
22:32schedule, I'll tell you what it was cuz
22:33I I still remember it. So basically, I
22:35take my I did Hold on.
22:37>> But I I did split it into thirds, kind
22:38of like you. And so I I I bake it into I
22:41would do all my um my innovation stuff
22:43first because that's when I was
22:44freshest. So I would work until like
22:46from 4 to 10ish, so I got sixish hours.
22:48And then at that point I'd have
22:50customers and the fires of the day would
22:52happen. Um I would spend the middle of
22:54the day on uh promotion and sales. So I
22:57basically do marketing and meeting with
22:58sales you know
23:00>> customers to try and sell them our
23:01stuff.
23:02>> And then the back end of the day was all
23:03the admin stuff. So that was billing and
23:06finance and you know fixing broken
23:08equipment and all that stuff. But I
23:09slept at the gym. But it was basically
23:10if you think about it from a pure big
23:12big perspective, you got you know
23:14attraction, you've got conversion,
23:15you've got delivery. That's kind of like
23:16how you're you're breaking down the
23:17business. Mhm.
23:18>> Um, and I just would say that that has
23:20to happen throughout the day, but you
23:21have to take some block every day, at
23:23least for me, that's working on it
23:24rather than in it. How do I build the
23:26assets that can rep, you know, replicate
23:28a trainer, replicate uh the front desk
23:30girl, replicate the sales process,
23:31whatever.
23:32>> Um,
23:33>> but yeah, that was that was that was 12
23:34hours a day, 6 days a week. I've been
23:36able to do uh 12 hours a day, six days a
23:39week, taking one day off as like I can
23:41do that for a very very long time. I'm
23:42also not saying that's right for
23:43everyone. I can do that. But I have to
23:45say, and by the way, I'm not saying
23:46that's right for everyone either, but
23:47that's exactly what I did. That's
23:48exactly what Andy did. What the three of
23:50us have in common. You slept in the gym,
23:52he slept in the in the store, and I
23:54slept in the office. I'm not saying you
23:55got to sleep in your building either.
23:56>> But and the idea of this time thing,
23:59poorly chosen words in some of these
24:00clips, but you're really compressing
24:02time, meaning you're trying to do things
24:03that most people think take two hours in
24:0630 minutes if you can. Not all meetings
24:08need to be an hour, and that's why
24:10having a day broken up matters. Now my
24:12hardest thing at the highest level of
24:14entrepreneurship like when I'm talking
24:17with people that you know that have done
24:18something really significant there's
24:21this really interesting dance you have
24:22to have as an entrepreneur I want you to
24:24help me understand your view on it okay
24:27and it's this I think most entrepreneurs
24:29I am as a human I have become a control
24:32freak meaning I try to control about
24:34you're better at this than me of giving
24:36um of separating from tasks and trusting
24:39people you have to handle things I'm
24:40still not great at that. I think I'd be
24:42>> because you're so good.
24:43>> Well, thank you. I think though I think
24:45potentially I'd have been a wealthier
24:46man had I given a little bit more
24:47autonomy to people. I think I squeezed
24:49them a little bit when I was younger.
24:51>> But because I am a control freak. So
24:53it's this interesting dance I've had my
24:54entire career and even to this day of
24:57I'm a control freak yet I know the key
25:00to my progression, my growth, my
25:02expansion as a person and as an
25:04entrepreneur is my capacity to deal with
25:06uncertainty simultaneously. So, how do
25:08you navigate that? Wanting to control an
25:10outcome,
25:11>> yet we I want you to discuss the concept
25:14of your ability to be out of control
25:17theoretically and deal with this mass a
25:19massive amount of uncertainty more than
25:21most people think they can handle.
25:23>> So, I think there's two parts to this at
25:24least that I that I think of
25:25immediately. So, the first is one of my
25:27favorite and I think underrated quotes
25:28as an entrepreneur from Jack Dorsey. He
25:31said um perfect all the details, limit
25:34the number of details.
25:35>> [laughter]
25:36>> And so I think that is like in a
25:38sentence so elegant for like I think
25:40it's like I absolutely am a control
25:41freak
25:43>> at the thing that I think has the
25:44absolute greatest point of leverage in
25:47the business.
25:48>> And so I keep that flexibility in my
25:49schedule so that I can go fool in an
25:51attack three levels down, seven levels
25:53down in the company and be like, okay,
25:54what are we doing here?
25:55>> What are like what show me the texts
25:57that we're sending for this very
25:58particular campaign and then I can scoop
26:00back out and then go somewhere else. Um,
26:02so I would say that from the the the
26:03maniacal control, I think Elon's been an
26:05example of like he kind of has he's
26:07delegated everything and also nothing.
26:08But I think his his perspective is uh
26:11he's always attacking the rate limiter.
26:13That's the the verbage he uses. I use
26:14constraint, but whatever. It's the same
26:15idea. Like there's a bottleneck
26:16somewhere. There always is one. And I
26:18think your ability to identify where the
26:19bottleneck is is in some way predicated
26:21on your ability to recognize patterns
26:23and your skill as an entrepreneur. M
26:25>> but if we think about entrepreneurship
26:26in general as our we are allocators of
26:29resources and so we have limited
26:31resource extremely limited when you
26:32compare them to the resources of the
26:33world
26:34>> time money energy the limited uh
26:36attention to the team we have this tiny
26:38little reservoir of resources and all we
26:41have to do is we have to just continue
26:43to get higher returns than everyone else
26:44does on this tiny bit of resources which
26:47is for the most part why the second
26:48thing on my wall is focus subtraction is
26:50how do I how do I subtract what can I
26:52cut away what can I prune from this tree
26:54in order to keep it growing. Um because
26:57left unchecked, everything becomes
26:58weeds. Everything becomes cancerous.
27:00Everything overgrows because people want
27:01to take on more stuff. And I think that
27:03successes entrepreneurship has three
27:04traits that are completely antihuman.
27:06It's something I've been thinking a lot
27:07about recently, which is one, we like
27:10new [ __ ] Sorry, you don't here.
27:12>> We like we like new stuff.
27:13>> Mhm.
27:14>> Number two, we like um we like stuff
27:17now.
27:18>> Um and number three, uh we want things
27:21easy
27:22>> and low low energy. Mhm.
27:24>> And it is the exact opposite of what it
27:26takes to be successful as an
27:27entrepreneur because instead of wanting
27:28new stuff, you have to uh be willing to
27:30do the old stuff for a long time
27:32>> over and over and over.
27:34>> And instead of uh so it's basically
27:36focus, one thing, patience for a long
27:39time, and then frustration tolerance,
27:41which is that if if at first you don't
27:43succeed, you try again. And if you at
27:45first you don't succeed 100 times, you
27:46try again. Which is why I love the one
27:48mantra.
27:49>> Thank you. Um, and so if you have those
27:50three things together, if I were to say,
27:51I have this entrepreneur in front of me,
27:53he's actually a dum dum. But once he
27:56starts a task, he has a really hard time
27:57abandoning it. And he has an unlimited
28:00time horizon in terms of how he's
28:02thinking about doing this. And he wants
28:03to do this for the rest of his life.
28:04He's keeping all of his assets in there.
28:06He's never going to sell it. And we knew
28:07that to be true.
28:09>> And [ __ ] cannot fail because
28:13every time he does, he just gets better.
28:15>> Yeah.
28:16>> It's hard to beat that guy. I those are
28:18the guys I bet on, the people I bet on.
28:20>> And and what's interesting, and you've
28:21seen this too, is that like almost all
28:23of those things have to do with behavior
28:25patterns and very little to do with
28:26intelligence.
28:27>> Yes.
28:28>> And so when I think about that, like
28:30your business isn't scaling off for lack
28:31of information, for lack of character.
28:34>> And I think when you when you think
28:35about it that way, it's like, wow, when
28:36I'm presented in these conditions, I
28:38make the wrong decisions because I've
28:39I've I've been reinforced for doing new
28:41things too much.
28:42>> Gosh. And so when I when I try to adapt
28:45that for my own uh to to answer the to
28:48loop back to the original question of uh
28:51the maniacal control um I think a lot of
28:54the control is actually in trying to get
28:56the team to do less and do fewer rather.
29:00>> Um and I think that's where a lot of my
29:02call it exertion they I they should feel
29:04better when I come in because I can tell
29:05them what not to do.
29:06>> Right. I know exactly what you mean.
29:07>> That's a terrible idea. We should not do
29:08that.
29:09>> Yeah. I do you think the uh this idea
29:11that you said you said it twice and I'm
29:13>> it's what I do when I coach people.
29:15>> So I'm wondering what you I want you to
29:16elaborate on it. I think great
29:18entrepreneurs have pattern recognition.
29:21>> Um even people we've already discussed
29:23here today that are mutual friends of
29:24ours. They're really good at seeing
29:25patterns. I'm pretty good at seeing
29:26human behavioral patterns. Right. But
29:29just step away from that. How important
29:31do you think if you were coaching an
29:32entrepreneur is it to to to get them to
29:35see both patterns in the business world,
29:37patterns in the economy? um trends.
29:40That's a pattern recognition to me. And
29:42also human behavioral patterns at the
29:44same time.
29:46>> If I had to if I had to have them pick
29:48one, I would rather have them be amazing
29:50at human behavior patterns because if
29:52you can do that, you can pretty I think
29:53I think humans are how you unlock
29:55everything despite the world of AI and
29:56all the things that we talk about. Um
29:58because humans unlock everything like so
30:01you might find this I think you might
30:02actually I was I was really excited to
30:04talk to you about this specific. So this
30:05is perfect. Um,
30:08>> I I'm going to guess, and I don't want
30:10to go out on a limb here, but I'm going
30:11to guess you're not spending 12 hours a
30:12day vibe coding.
30:13>> I [laughter] am not.
30:15>> And what's really interesting is that
30:16you probably made more money than the
30:17vast majority of people by a very large
30:19margin last year.
30:21>> Just to just to put it out there,
30:22>> right?
30:23>> And so when I was think I was thinking
30:24about you specifically and I was like,
30:26how do I reconcile this apparent uh
30:29contradiction with
30:31>> uh we're so cooked AI is we're etc. with
30:35the fact that a lot of the people that I
30:37know that are extremely wealthy
30:39>> um are not necessarily AI maxing
30:41themselves.
30:42>> And so it got me thinking around the
30:44concept of leverage, which is one of my
30:46two favorite topics in the world, supply
30:47and demand and leverage. That's what the
30:49logo is built on. Okay.
30:50>> Um
30:51>> and so I think one of the big
30:52misconceptions that entrepreneurs are
30:54having right now is that
30:55>> AI is somehow the only form of leverage.
30:59>> But it does not erase the other forms of
31:01leverage that are also multiplicative.
31:02So for example, if I make a decision
31:04that we say we're not going to do this
31:06gigantic initiative, the amount of time
31:07that I get back from my company is
31:09larger than us trying to AI max that
31:10initiative that was incorrect.
31:11>> What a good point.
31:12>> Right? If we think about it from a
31:15boiling it down to brass tax
31:16perspective.
31:16>> Wow.
31:17>> We're going there's so many
31:18entrepreneurs right now that are using
31:19AI to do dumb things very fast
31:21>> because they have more capacity. They
31:23are choosing to take on more and as a
31:25result are less focused than they were
31:27before. And if we look at the output of
31:28their business, they are not making more
31:30money. They're only spending more money
31:31on tokens. Wow.
31:32>> And so when I
31:33>> Very good, Alex.
31:35>> Very good.
31:36>> And so when we think about the different
31:38the different types of leverage, it's
31:39like this is leverage. We can record
31:41this one conversation. Millions of
31:42people can watch it. Uh you know,
31:43obviously software has, you know,
31:44different types of leverage, but um
31:46picking one good person has tremendous
31:49leverage. So to the idea of like, okay,
31:51well, Ed's not AI maxing,
31:53>> but do we think that AI that Ed can find
31:56somebody AIAX?
31:57>> Correct.
31:58>> Probably. And do we think that Ed has
32:02leverage in other ways that would
32:04attract or incentivize that person to
32:06want to do their special gift within
32:08this larger business because it was
32:09designed well earlier on?
32:12>> Yes.
32:13>> And so these technologies come, but the
32:16game has remained unchanged. It's just
32:18another tool of leverage that exists.
32:19Now, to be clear, it's it's an amazing
32:21tool and we use the hell out of it at
32:22ACQ, but it's understanding where it
32:25fits in the toy box
32:26>> because we still have to make the right
32:28call. And as of right now, AI still
32:29sucks at making decisions, at least from
32:31the ones that I look at, because you can
32:33pretty much make it say yes or no based
32:35on how you prompt it.
32:36>> Um, and so that is something that I've
32:38given a lot of.
32:38>> That's a really good point. Maybe one of
32:40the best points I've heard on a podcast
32:41in probably 10 years. It's a really good
32:43point because that's exactly what's
32:44happening. It's actually become almost
32:46burdensome for people that are doing
32:47nominal tasks, adding more to their
32:49plate. It's really, really good. In
32:51fact, that's one of the clips I'm going
32:52to use from the show. I don't hear you
32:55talk a lot and maybe I've just missed
32:56it, but you know, I'm a huge fan and
32:58follower and friend.
33:00>> I don't hear you talk about in terms of
33:02yourself as a leader.
33:03>> In other words, I almost feel like
33:05sometimes you look at business as an
33:07operator and and correct me if I'm
33:09wrong, okay? But what are you like as a
33:11leader of a company? Like that's not a
33:13lot of the content that I've seen you
33:14discuss. So, how do you view like
33:17leadership? Because it's a it's a
33:19overcooked concept and topic, right?
33:21Yeah. But you're very technical,
33:24very strategic, very tactical.
33:27>> But if I worked for you or with you and
33:29someone asked me his philosophies on
33:32leadership or what type of a leader he
33:34is, would he even does he see himself as
33:37a quote unquote leader and what is what
33:39does that mean to you?
33:40>> Um,
33:42so a couple things. So one, Leila had
33:45just finished her book on leadership and
33:47you know, I got to edit and you know,
33:49and help out. Um, and so I have a ton of
33:51concepts from that book, but I think
33:53I've I've deferred to Ila for for most
33:56things and you know Ila well and Ila
33:58will never get the credit that she
33:58deserves for the for the able to build.
34:02>> Um, but Ila is the internal leader of
34:04the business and I would say that I am
34:05the external leader of the business and
34:06that is more or less how we've managed
34:08our our working relationship. I have
34:11>> one direct report which is my
34:12father-in-law. So virtually I have no
34:13direct reports in the business which
34:15allows me to have um the schedule that I
34:17do and we've just found that that has
34:19worked really well for us. I would say
34:21um
34:22>> I would say to if there are if there are
34:2412 core activities of leadership
34:27>> um the first one um which the others are
34:31all predicated on is that we have to
34:33define what good looks like.
34:35>> Okay,
34:35>> in behavioral and observable terms. And
34:37so the second step of leadership and I
34:40won't go through all of them. I'll let
34:42do her thing. But the second one is that
34:44we have to model what good looks like.
34:46>> And so there's a famous story of Gandhi
34:48where um a mother comes to him and says,
34:50"Hey, can you get my kid to stop eating
34:51sugar?" And he says, "Uh, yes, but come
34:53back in 30 days." And so she comes back
34:55in 30 days. Um she brings the kid to him
34:57and he says, "Stop eating sugar." And
34:59she's like, "Why did that take 30 days?"
35:00And he was like, "Well, I was eating
35:01sugar when you asked me the first time."
35:03[snorts]
35:03And so he had to quit sugar for the 30
35:05days to make it. And so it's it's a
35:07great little a great little story, but I
35:09think that's like leadership is caught
35:10not taught,
35:11>> right? And it is of course taught, but
35:13it's taught through modeling and it's
35:14taught through red flag, right? And so
35:16um where I fit in this leadership
35:18paradigm is that I believe that I number
35:20one, I hold the standard.
35:22>> Yeah.
35:23>> Um
35:24>> one of the things that I get feedback
35:25from from the team because I see the
35:26surveys of the people who at least work
35:28in my vicinity more so than work
35:29directly for me is that they're like,
35:32you know, I've watched the content. I've
35:33been, you know, I've been seeing
35:34everything for all these years, but like
35:35it was only when I came when I came to
35:38the office and realized that Alex was
35:39literally always here at 4:30 in the
35:41morning every single day, six days a
35:44week.
35:45>> Um,
35:46>> that I was basically very difficult to
35:49witness consistency unless you are also
35:51consistent.
35:52>> Jeez. Yeah.
35:53>> Like you cannot witness consistency,
35:56right?
35:57>> It's good. And so um I would say that
36:00that I say holding defining the standard
36:02and then modeling the standard is where
36:03where the majority of my my work from a
36:05leadership perspective is. I think the
36:07rest of the leaders in the company do a
36:08lot of the other stuff.
36:10>> Um and then I'd say that I am more of a
36:14strategic decision maker um than than
36:19true true operator because I think it
36:20would it would um it would take away
36:22credit from the people who are actually
36:23doing the stuff. Is there a void of any
36:25type of um emotional leadership in your
36:28businesses?
36:29>> No, that's Leila. Okay. Like Leila
36:31[snorts] is she provides it.
36:32>> And I think and this is something that I
36:33would say like what is what's taking up
36:34my time right now is
36:36>> managing the transition of her becoming
36:38a mother and completely stepping away
36:40from the business, which is our
36:41intention. Um
36:42>> Okay.
36:43>> Yeah. So she's she's completely going to
36:45going to check out
36:46>> um for an extended period. And so I'm
36:49I'm reoriented because
36:51>> the business works with the the
36:53dichotomy, you know, between the yin and
36:55the
36:55>> Yes. Yes.
36:56>> And when she's not there, I'm softer.
37:00>> And uh and when I'm not there, she's a
37:02little tougher.
37:03>> And it's and we've had this dance that's
37:05worked really well. And I'm going to
37:06have to relearn that and I'm going to
37:07probably crack some shells and mess up a
37:09little bit. Um I'm sure.
37:10>> Uh but that's something that I'm I'm
37:12really paying attention.
37:12>> I'm really watching you. You know how
37:13much I've always appreciated you and
37:16admired you. You've grown a lot the last
37:18few years.
37:19>> We talk on the phone, but we haven't
37:20done this. And uh you're at a different
37:22level. You're at a different level. And
37:24one of the reasons is is you're you're
37:26willing to take on more and more risks
37:28still. And I want you to talk about
37:29this. I've never heard this before. Only
37:31you.
37:32>> And I'm like, gosh darn it, he's right.
37:33I wish he wasn't right, but it's just
37:35sort of like the law of the universe.
37:37People look at me or you, but I'll just
37:40speak from my own perspective and I'll
37:41let you comment on yours. And they do
37:43sort of go like we're recording this now
37:45in the middle of I've been giving
37:46speeches and doing business meetings
37:48here today and I've got another one
37:49tomorrow which is a Saturday and you're
37:50cranking you'll be in here and I'm blah
37:51blah blah and they're like the old
37:54when's enough's enough and all that
37:55other stuff. And I'm like, I really
37:56don't feel like I'm working. But having
37:58said that, my capacity
38:01has expanded over the years to the
38:03extent where I feel like I have to take
38:05on more almost in order to remain
38:07challenged, but also to live up to the
38:09blessings and and honor the
38:13>> perspective, nuances, wisdom, and skills
38:16I've developed theoretically. Right. So,
38:18this thing you discussed lately about
38:20risk and capacity and ability and the
38:23correlation between the two, do you know
38:24what I'm talking about? No. Okay. I
38:26heard you say something recently where
38:28you said, "My ability to take on risk is
38:31almost connected to the fact that I'm
38:32better and better, and in order to
38:34continue to grow and expand, I have to
38:35take on more risk."
38:36>> That for sure.
38:36>> So, I never even heard this before.
38:39>> So, um,
38:41well, what So, I've I don't read it, so
38:44I don't want to pretend like I read all
38:45day or something like that, but there
38:47are moments where I do punctuated
38:48reading. And I think my favorite type of
38:50reading is autobiographies of ultra rich
38:52people because usually, especially at
38:53the end of their career, they don't care
38:55at all about being politically correct
38:56and they actually tell you what they
38:58finally tell you. They finally and so
39:00was really interesting that I found
39:01between Paul Getty
39:03>> um who was the richest man in the world
39:04for like 30 years. Uh Rockefeller and
39:07Elon Musk um and just take these guys
39:09objectively. Don't don't
39:10>> whether you like their whatever
39:12>> you can you can appreciate that they are
39:13wealthy [laughter] fact. Um,
39:16>> right.
39:17>> What I found is this very recurring
39:19theme is that they had multiple moments
39:22of call it like local maximums where
39:25they then looked around and said, "I'm
39:27pushing all my chips back into the
39:28middle of the table again."
39:29>> Yeah.
39:30>> And so I I kind of see it like and in
39:32some ways as much like it is necessary
39:35for the to take a bigger swing to get a
39:37bigger payoff, but it's almost more
39:40necessary to keep the game interesting.
39:42>> Yes. And so like if and we're in Vegas
39:44so I'll just make it a Vegas theme.
39:45>> If you're playing $10 hands and let's
39:48say at some point you get good enough
39:49that you have this gigantic stack of
39:50chips at some point you have to up the
39:52ante otherwise you just don't care
39:54anymore.
39:54>> Yes.
39:55>> And so a billionaire playing $10 hands
39:56it's like he literally loses money
39:59playing a $10 hand.
40:00>> Oh so good. And so um one of the things
40:04that I think is a little bit of a
40:05mindset shift which I don't like using
40:07the term but like we behave differently
40:08in different scenario is that your risk
40:12tolerance has to concurrently increase
40:14with the size of opportunity that you
40:16want to pursue. And it's of course in
40:19the beginning you don't need to take a
40:20there's lots of risk and also no risk
40:21because you don't need to put money
40:22down. You can start a business for for
40:23almost nothing. But
40:25>> if you want to start SpaceX you need to
40:28put money [laughter] in on the table.
40:29You know what I Like there are some like
40:31there and and the thing is is capital in
40:32some ways becomes a gigantic moat
40:34because other people are not willing to
40:36risk it. And so you start to develop
40:37more sophisticated frameworks for
40:39understanding risk and reward which is
40:41that like not only will I take my
40:42expertise and my track record and my
40:43network but I'll also take $100 million
40:46and put that on the line because that's
40:48how I can get to 10 billion.
40:49>> Okay. I want to just jump in here. I
40:51don't even think you know how big this
40:54could be a book you do. Okay. Even
40:55though I know it's not the but how big
40:57this is. And by the way, listening to
40:59you on this,
41:01>> how many people do you and I meet that
41:03have gone from zero to a little bit and
41:06then they're stuck and they're so
41:08frustrated. They're like, I just I can't
41:10get past 400 grand a year. I'm at a
41:12million a year or whatever it is.
41:13>> And what what's interesting is what
41:16happens when you have nothing and then
41:17you get a little bit. you become very
41:19risk adverse and you don't know that
41:22potentially the key for you to become
41:24unstuck is actually to take on more risk
41:28and that's the stimulus to go to the
41:29next level. Do you know how big of a
41:31deal this is what you're talking about?
41:32Cuz it's the thing most people stall at
41:34100 or 250 gooseies right when they
41:37stall it's because you're still in the
41:39same risk tolerance category you were
41:41before and you've mastered your domain
41:43to some extent.
41:45>> Okay. So I have given a huge amount of
41:47thought to this. So there's this bull
41:48because we see entrepreneurs every
41:49single week that come through. There's a
41:50bullet of entrepreneurs between$1 and $3
41:52million and for whatever reason there's
41:53this swamp there and I think there's a
41:55couple of factors. So number one is that
41:56usually between$1 and $3 million of
41:57revenue, you've actually made enough
41:59money to satisfy personal needs. You can
42:00pretty much go to every dinner, go to
42:02every hotel, take the vacations and like
42:03you're good to go. And to be fair,
42:04nothing wrong with that. However, if you
42:06want more,
42:07>> right, if you do,
42:08>> then you have to change the way you
42:10play. And so what's very interesting is
42:11that we call this the swamp at
42:13acquisition.com. It's 1 to three, maybe
42:141 to 5 million. It's right there. And
42:16the reason it's the swamp is that it
42:18takes more risk to get out of the swamp
42:20than to get into it.
42:21>> Oh boy. So true.
42:22>> And so you take some risk to quit the
42:24job to whatever. But when you start your
42:26first zero to a million for most
42:28business, especially service, which is
42:2980% of the US, it's you and maybe some
42:32helpers, but it's almost all margin
42:34because it's just you working really
42:35hard.
42:37>> In that one to three, maybe one to five
42:39range. You have to make some decisions
42:41of like, okay, I can't service any more
42:42customers. My time is becoming my
42:44biggest constraint. And then there's the
42:46question of am I going to bring help on?
42:48Am I going to in am I going to get a
42:49vendor that's going to be a legit vendor
42:51that's going to cost real money? And I
42:52think there's one there's the emotions
42:54of like well I'm already comfortable. So
42:55we're sacrificing something that I know
42:57I I need to achieve all my personal
42:59goals to get money that I don't need in
43:02the future which is a big it's a big
43:03like it doesn't necessarily mean it's
43:05rational to do this to be really clear
43:06like it's in some ways
43:08>> right?
43:08>> But if you decide yes I want to do this.
43:11Here's the math behind the second layer
43:12of difficulty, which is, let's say it's
43:13a $2 million business, 20 20% margins.
43:17If you have 20% margins in the business
43:18at this point, you got $400,000 to play
43:20with. All right? Now, you're going to
43:21leave maybe 100 grand in the account
43:22because you want to like have some
43:23safety net. So, maybe 300 grand. If you,
43:25let's say, need somebody who's going to
43:26run client success or be, let's say,
43:29your first real leader in the business,
43:31a director level, not just a manager,
43:33you're probably looking at high ones,
43:35maybe mid twos, you know, as a small
43:38business owner. So that means that on
43:39this one hire or maybe a vendor, you're
43:41going to risk half or more of your
43:44profit on one bet.
43:46>> And because most people are unwilling to
43:48do this, and arguably logically,
43:50>> um, they stay stuck. And so there's
43:52these points where you have to increase
43:54your bet size. You have to be able to go
43:55from spending $1,000 a day on ads to
43:57$10,000 a day on ads. You have to be
43:58willing to spend go from like I'm only
44:00going to spend $1,000 on Indeed to
44:01recruit these people to say I'm going to
44:02pay a head hunter $35,000 because I
44:04think I really need this role and it's
44:06specialized, but if I have it, it
44:07unlocks a huge amount of capacity.
44:09>> And so one of the I'll give you a couple
44:11tactical things for the audience.
44:12There's a couple tricks to um getting a
44:15business through that without using as
44:17much to get them into that like 5 to 10
44:20range million a year
44:21>> so that then they have more cash flow so
44:23they feel more comfortable in the bet.
44:24So I can only resolve one of the two
44:25risks but it's still there which is that
44:27You have to increase the leverage on one
44:30or multiple of the three elements of the
44:32business. So we have to increase
44:33leverage of demand. So it's like how can
44:35we uh create some sort of content wheel
44:37within the business so that when
44:38customers come in they make us content
44:40that we can then use to get more
44:41customers and you service customers
44:43every single day and then boom we have
44:44more leverage demand. The second kind of
44:46wheel of this is the leverage
44:48conversion. And so whether you're
44:50selling like basically there's three
44:51ways to scale the sales. either you have
44:52a big big sales team uh you sell one to
44:55many or what I prefer which is you
44:57create order takers and so my
44:59combination of solution is how do I sell
45:01one to many and preload the customers
45:02with as much information as humanly
45:04possible so that my sales people only
45:05have to make six in putts
45:06>> right rather than drive and chip and
45:08then wedge and then go all the way right
45:10and so by doing that it's much easier to
45:11attract to to to recruit somebody and
45:14just say I just need you to make drop
45:15the ball six inches from the hole and
45:16make this you can train that person up
45:18in a week whereas if they have to be a
45:20coach a therapist a product expert
45:22uh a teacher to a customer and then also
45:25a relationship manager. It's like it's
45:27so hard to find them and if they already
45:28do come preloaded with all those skills,
45:29they're way too expensive, right? And so
45:32we have to have leveraged uh leverage
45:34conversion, right? And then the third
45:36process is leverage delivery. Now, one
45:38of the thing I think one of the big
45:39misconceptions on delivery for service
45:41businesses is that whatever way you
45:43started that got you to one or three
45:44million in terms of your service
45:45delivery, you say, "Well, this has
45:47worked so far." And I am a big advocate
45:48of doing more of a work, don't get me
45:49wrong, but there are some tweaks that
45:51you can make in your um agreements of
45:53what you plan to deliver to a customer
45:55that dramatically expand the leverage
45:57that you have in the business to deliver
45:59without in any way really changing how
46:02likely they are to buy. And so, for
46:04example, if we said, you know, we have
46:05support that is via phone call at any
46:07time, you could say, we're going to do
46:09email, we're going to do chat. Um, and
46:11all of a sudden that increases leverage
46:13on the supply side. Mhm.
46:14>> We could say, "Hey, instead of having
46:16scheduled calls, we're going to do it
46:17asynchronously." And then that allows
46:18you to batch all the work together. You
46:20can review all of the accounts. Let's
46:21say you're a marketing uh you know,
46:22agency, you could do them all at once
46:24and you can do them in 11 minutes rather
46:26than having a 30 minute call and wasting
46:27it. So it's like great, that might
46:28triple the leverage. We can change
46:30whether components of the service are
46:32done live or done recorded. We can
46:34change whether it's in person or it's
46:35done remotely. Um we can change the
46:37delivery ratio so that it's instead of
46:39one-on-one, it's one on small group or
46:40one-on-one to many. Um, and so there's a
46:43number of these levers that we can do on
46:44the delivery side that if we at each of
46:47these points, if we expand a little bit
46:49of leverage on the demand, expand a
46:50little bit of leverage on the
46:51conversion, so we give people a couple
46:52videos with some proof before they talk
46:54to a salesperson, all of a sudden the
46:55sales take less time, and there's fewer
46:58of them. And so all of a sudden, my
46:59sales, my utilization per sales rep
47:01doubles or triples. And so I don't need
47:03to hire the extra rep. I can still
47:04double or triple the business if that's
47:06the constraint. And so in each of those
47:08situations, usually one, two, or all
47:09three of those things, depending on
47:10where you're at, is where you need to
47:11employ. Notice none of them were AI
47:13because you can still make good
47:14decisions and increase leverage of the
47:16business, not necessarily using A. And
47:17to be fair, I'm a big AI advocate, but
47:18I'm also an even more common sense
47:20advocate.
47:20>> It's Alex, this is so good. I when I
47:23coach and even when I've watched your
47:24content, it is funny though because by
47:26the way, those of you that feel stuck or
47:28know someone that's stuck, send them the
47:29podcast today because this is probably
47:31why you're stuck. It's the risk
47:33adversion. You don't you're looking at
47:35all these other mechanisms. It's the
47:37risk aversion. But what's really funny
47:38about it is I'll even watch it on your
47:39stuff and when I coach you, I'm like,
47:40"Well, no, you're going to have to hire
47:42that 250 person or you're going to have
47:44to triple your ad spend." And you watch
47:45their face when you say it
47:47>> and they're immedi
47:49they're immediately in their mind trying
47:51to process, is there any other way I can
47:53get out of doing this? Now, you've given
47:54a couple great hooks here that mitigate
47:57some of that risk, but you watch the the
47:59the reason this is so important is the
48:01tendency at this stage, even when given
48:03the counsel, is to try to find a way out
48:05of that room and not have to take it.
48:07And if you're going to get to that next
48:08level, you're going to feel unstuck. And
48:10here I am, an older guy, 55 years old.
48:13And it is, I think, the key as to why
48:15I'm still pretty fresh and in the hunt
48:17and going and excited and not stuck. Is
48:20I've And by the way, I think you would
48:22agree, it's a muscle you also build over
48:24time. Your first risk you take to start
48:27a business does not require the muscle
48:28because you're moving from nothing. It
48:30requires a muscle over time to continue
48:32to throw. Like you said, Musk earlier,
48:34whatever you think of the guy, are you
48:35kidding me? The amount of risk this
48:36dude's willing to take on over and over
48:38and over again. been compensated more
48:40than anyone.
48:40>> That's right. He's he's adequately
48:42compensated for the risk he's willing to
48:44take.
48:45>> What about We don't have much more time,
48:46by the way. So good. Like we need to
48:48agree we're going to do this at least
48:49once a year.
48:50>> And I need to expand the format of the
48:51show when you're on to like two hours.
48:53>> We can roll late and then we can do a
48:55second a second half.
48:56>> Oh, that would be really good. It would
48:57be really good. I uh
49:00there's a lot holding someone back and
49:02I'll visit on my channel if you want.
49:04>> Okay, I love that. Whatever you want. I
49:05I there's a lot holding someone back
49:07from this risk adversion at any stage
49:10>> and I don't know that I've been very
49:12good at getting somebody to sort of deal
49:14with it. Now what I used to say and then
49:15I want to have your version of it
49:17because like yours is frankly I think
49:18better. I used to go, you know, this
49:20like boogeyman when I was a little kid,
49:21I thought there was a boogeyman. And my
49:23dad when he would come back from his
49:24drinking binges, I'd be up. But I
49:26created this boogeyman and my dad would
49:28literally have to come in my room when I
49:29was a little boy and open the closet and
49:31go, "Eddie, look in here. The there's no
49:32boogeyman in the closet." But I had this
49:34great book. If he would open it and show
49:36me, all of a sudden, a lot of my fear
49:39was reduced. And as an entrepreneur, a
49:41lot of these fears you have, they're
49:42real things. But even if you lost that
49:45investment you made, even if the
49:47business crumbled, the boogeyman's
49:49probably not quite as bad as you think
49:50it is, you can come back, right? You
49:53teach people that have fears to actually
49:55put it down, right? Can you talk about
49:57this because I think this is a great
49:59tactic to get above or be self-aware of
50:02your fears or or their limitations.
50:04>> So, it's my it's my position that um
50:06emotions exist in the vague, not the
50:08specific. um meaning fear exists in the
50:12vague like because basically we abstract
50:14things to death because we're
50:15evolutionary beings and like we don't
50:17want to die okay but we think if if this
50:19does not work uh I will fail I will go
50:21bankrupt my wife will leave me and I
50:23will die and I will die right
50:25>> but when you actually define out no like
50:27let's re let's sit in it because we're
50:29so afraid to look at what would happen
50:31that even the fear of looking gets
50:33people to not
50:34>> crystallize it and it's like listen
50:35first thing you can do is prepare for
50:37failure at least
50:38>> but in preparing for failure you
50:39decrease the likelihood that it happens
50:41because you actually know what's what
50:42what happens next. And so I remember
50:44when I when I started the gym, I had to
50:46write down my plan B, which for me was
50:48um well, I didn't have any real skills.
50:50I was in shape uh and I had time. And so
50:53I said, I'll drive Uber and I'll strip.
50:56Um and that way if I fail, I'll drive
50:58Uber 12 hours a day and I'll strip at
50:59night and I'll be able to like in a year
51:00probably make $250,000 and I'll and I'll
51:02do it again. You know, like I'll start
51:03back. But the goal was to get back into
51:05it again. And so one is like when you
51:07really play out your failure story,
51:09maybe you're sleeping on a on like you
51:11will only lose status in the eyes of
51:14people around you who are not taking the
51:16risk that you're taking,
51:17>> right?
51:18>> And
51:19>> so true
51:19>> and you don't want their lives. So why
51:21would I care about their opinions? And
51:23we just have to expand the time horizon
51:25because like not to sound tright here,
51:29but like failure and success are on the
51:31exact same road. It's just that failure
51:33is an earlier exit. M
51:35>> and so one is a requisite for the other.
51:37But the thing is is that thinking about
51:39success leads you to failure.
51:42Failure
51:44>> leads you to success.
51:45>> Yeah.
51:45>> And so it so failure is closer to
51:48success than thinking about successes.
51:50>> Wow.
51:51>> Which is ironic.
51:52>> Ironic.
51:52>> And so the idea is like like one of my
51:54favorite things to tell sales guys
51:55especially especially in the cold
51:56calling outbound side is like let's get
51:57some nos today. Right? If we can make
51:59the failure a success a mile mark. How
52:01many nos we collect today? Right? It
52:03stops having this emotional charge
52:05because we're saying, "Wait, we're not
52:06making no mean something.
52:08>> We're saying we're making no mean
52:09something good."
52:10>> And so, if we know that um
52:13>> wow,
52:13>> the the failure that we're going to have
52:15is going to teach us something like the
52:17$250,000 pet that we're talking about
52:19with this operator, right? We this
52:20person who's incredibly in fear, how do
52:21we get them out of that out of that
52:23fear? is that if you don't see another
52:26way and maybe that maybe you pulled all
52:28the levers that we just talked about and
52:29and still there's no other way. You have
52:31to take the risk
52:32>> then you take the risk.
52:34>> Yeah.
52:34>> And and you know and you do that
52:36knowingly because what you are building
52:37is the thing that we were talking about
52:38earlier which is pattern recognition.
52:40So, let me tell you the story of how
52:41entrepreneurship really works, which is
52:43if you've ever played a video game, you
52:45played and the first time you play the
52:46game, you get to a level, it's hard, you
52:47got to beat the boss, you got to figure
52:48it all out, you find out there's a sword
52:49under the stone, whatever, right? And
52:51then you get to the next level and you
52:52trial and error, trial and error, you
52:53get it. Now, if you go back and play
52:55that game again, it's a straight line.
52:58How fast? Now, the character itself
52:59can't play faster because it's it's
53:01controlled by the same algorithm, the
53:02video game. But how does it take you a
53:04tenth of the time to get three, four,
53:06five levels deep? Because you know
53:07exactly what to do. Why? because you
53:08recognize the patterns.
53:10>> And so if you've ever had multiple
53:12businesses, which a lot of people are
53:13entrepreneurs, like by the way, you
53:14know, spoiler alert, you're going to
53:15have more than one business. You're
53:16getting into it and you have this fear
53:17that this will be the perfect one. Um
53:20>> the second business you start almost
53:22always grows faster than the first
53:24business you start because you you go
53:26you blow through all the bosses you had
53:27on the first one and then you get stuck
53:29at the same point and then you move as
53:30slow as you can which is trial and error
53:32again. It's you get into the slog again.
53:34And so the the failure that you're
53:35experiencing is is create is the
53:37creation of pattern recognition. And so
53:39I remember for me just to give an
53:41analogy that might make sense for people
53:43>> the first time you hire a sales manager
53:45or even the first time you hire a
53:46saleserson right
53:48>> you go through you hire one person and
53:50the most expensive hire is a sales
53:51person your first salesperson because
53:52you're losing that person doesn't close
53:54you lose all the business. I mean it's
53:56horrible right? But you have to make the
53:57bet at some point and so you hire them
54:00and maybe that person doesn't work out.
54:02Okay so we hire another one. maybe that
54:03person doesn't work out. Now, eventually
54:05you will hire one and it won't work out.
54:06And then at that point, you're like,
54:08"Oh, I know what this looks like now."
54:10>> Pattern recognition. And so, when the
54:11next ones, you're like, "I need to get
54:12them to look as similar to this as I
54:14possibly can." And then all of a sudden,
54:15your failure rate starts dropping and
54:16going down and down and down. Then,
54:17you're like, "What if I train harder?"
54:18And then all of a sudden, you start
54:19increasing your percentages. But the
54:21same thing happens when you're like,
54:22"Now I need a sales manager." And you
54:23repeat that process. And so I think a
54:24lot of what the call it the the better
54:26entrepreneurs in the world versus the
54:27the non the the lower entrepreneurs is
54:30that it's just every single role in the
54:32business. You have to know what good
54:34looks like and you have to fail at each
54:36one of them until eventually you find
54:37the one that works and then that forever
54:39becomes your pattern of this is
54:40>> and to be clear there's different ways
54:42to run sales teams but I know this way
54:44works and I know this type of person
54:45works for the way I like to run sales.
54:47And so that then when you when you
54:49create the next business and this is I
54:51use different verbiage for it which is
54:52at a certain point you don't build
54:54businesses anymore. You assemble them.
54:56>> Wow. You're so right.
54:58>> You're so right.
54:58>> I had to change my language because I
55:00was like I'm not really building this
55:01business. I'm just putting the we're
55:02just assembling. We're putting all the
55:03piece I know this is going to work. And
55:05also, which one of the advantages that
55:06you don't that we don't talk about as
55:08much because it's only applies to a
55:09small percentage of people is that the
55:10longer you do business and if you if you
55:12do business well and you do right by
55:13people, you develop this network, this
55:15rolodex. And if I'm going to start a new
55:17thing or Ed's going to start a new
55:18thing, it's like I got 10 people I can
55:20call who are like, "Oh, you're doing
55:22something. I'm in, man. Let's go."
55:23>> And failure was one of the reasons
55:25you've actually built all of these
55:26relationships, this in this uh human
55:28capital that you've actually developed.
55:30>> And then you can deploy that capital.
55:31Now, I wonder if that has more leverage.
55:32>> Mhm. That's what you said earlier about
55:34AI and me not having to do that. I've
55:36actually got so many other resources at
55:37this stage of my life that I can deploy
55:40AI or get access to it without having to
55:42fiddle with it myself because of these
55:43relationships.
55:44>> You have the benefits of AI.
55:45>> You're I have the benefits of it. This
55:47is so good. I want to do want to finish
55:48on one thought and by the way, I'm just
55:50going to finish in the middle because
55:51there's so many things we could cover.
55:53But this idea of pattern recognition,
55:54it's not talked a lot about and the
55:56video game analogy is perfect. So, it's
55:58going to give you a a little runway to
56:00answer two things at once. Okay. What
56:02pattern recognition's given me, if we're
56:04giving the video game analogy and the
56:05reps that I've had in business, some of
56:07them were successes, some of them were
56:08failures. But what's happened is about
56:10this idea of assembling a business is
56:12the absolute truest thing you'll ever
56:13hear. By the way, at some point once you
56:15kind of understand the mechanics and the
56:18mechanisms of putting these things
56:19together, it's an assemblance rather
56:20than is of a building. He's completely
56:22right. He and I have actually talked
56:23privately about doing a a type of
56:25business together. And I I just know
56:27that if we did it together, it would be
56:28successful because between the two of us
56:30on that human rolodex and what we know,
56:31we would just assemble the parts. Here's
56:33the thing that pattern recognition has
56:34given me over time that a new
56:36entrepreneur gives them needs to give
56:38themselves some grace to develop. And
56:40that is that I now as I'm building
56:42businesses, there are days where I
56:44react. There certainly are. They're just
56:45things that happen. I spend some of my
56:48time reacting. When I was a young
56:50entrepreneur, I spent most of my time
56:51reacting. Now that I have pattern
56:53recognition, human pattern recognition
56:55and also just trends, I anticipate more
56:58often than I respond and react. So I
57:01want you to talk about anticipation as a
57:03skill
57:04>> as a skill like the thing you and I have
57:05talked about with banking. Let's just be
57:06honest, right? Like okay, so the
57:08anticipation aspect and then inside the
57:11answer to that final question, what do
57:13you anticipate about the world of
57:14business the next two to five years with
57:17AI as a factor in it? So why is
57:19anticipation matter and what do you
57:21anticipate?
57:23>> Man, that's a really hard question.
57:25>> Um,
57:30so I think I think anticipation matters
57:32a lot from an entrepreneur perspective
57:34because it it it reverts back to the
57:36people who get the best returns on their
57:38resources. So why like why would
57:40anticipation even be important? Well, it
57:42means that if I allocate resources to a
57:45new thing, let's say it's a new platform
57:47emerges for social media and I'm one of
57:49the first people on it because I
57:50anticipate that it's going to grow
57:51because it has all the stuff that looks
57:52right. If I'm a first mover in that
57:55situation, then the minimal amount of
57:56resources that I deploy towards that,
57:58I'm going to get a way higher return.
57:59And then when people are lagards or
58:01later, they're going to have to deploy
58:02more resources to get even less out. And
58:04so anticipation is another form of
58:06leverage. And if we just define
58:08leverage, I know we're late on defining
58:09it. But it's just getting more for what
58:10you put in. High leverage at least. Low
58:11leverage would be the opposite.
58:13>> And so if we're trying to deploy as much
58:15leverage as we can, getting the call
58:17right
58:18>> allows us to get more for what we put
58:19in. And so the anticipation I think is
58:22>> a lot of it is uh call it macro pattern
58:25recognition, right? So I'll tell you
58:26I'll tell you something that I heard
58:29>> I want to say 12 years ago or something.
58:31I had a Gary Vee clip
58:33>> and he said one of the biggest regrets
58:34he had was that when he was printing
58:36money on Google PPC or Adwords uh for
58:39the wine business that he didn't spend
58:40more talk about the risk thing at that
58:43point now he's a way better bigger
58:44entrepreneur now and he has way higher
58:46risk tolerance but at that point
58:47spending 10,000 20,000 50,000 a day
58:49whatever it was was a lot of money
58:52>> and I remember hearing that clip right
58:56um in the early gym launch days
58:58>> really
58:58>> and we were printing on on Facebook and
59:01meta ads and these were new newish ads.
59:03Um, and I was like, well, I don't want
59:05to make that mistake. And so we're like,
59:06how do we spend more? And so that became
59:08the question is what would it take for
59:09us to spend more rather than
59:11>> I sure if I want to spend more, right?
59:14What would it take? Which is one of my
59:15favorite questions in the world to ask.
59:16It assumes the success then you work
59:18backwards.
59:18>> The second thing was um what is, you
59:20know, what is it going to look like uh
59:22in an age of AI? Um I will give an
59:25unsexy but
59:28accurate answer of what I'm actually
59:30doing. Um, I like basis's frame a lot on
59:34this, which is
59:37the future is very uncertain and one
59:39thing that is true is that we are
59:40notoriously bad at predicting it.
59:43>> And so he prefers to ask himself, what
59:45things do I knew know will not change.
59:47And so he's made all of those gigantic
59:50bets in the business based on the few
59:51things that he knows will not change.
59:53And so he says, I believe in the future
59:55people will want cheaper prices still. I
59:57believe in the future customers prefer
59:59more selection to less selection. I
1:00:01believe that customers will in the
1:00:02future prefer things to get them faster
1:00:04rather than slower. And so there are
1:00:06bets that you can make in the business
1:00:07based on human behavior that we know
1:00:09will be true.
1:00:10>> Do I think that in the future humans
1:00:11will eat food? Yes. Do I think that they
1:00:13will need shelter? Yes. And so
1:00:14[clears throat]
1:00:15>> the bets that we're making in the
1:00:16business um I would say and this this
1:00:19one thing about risk which I think is
1:00:20important is entirely personal because I
1:00:22get the question a lot and I'm sure you
1:00:23do too. one, when do I push and when do
1:00:26I pivot,
1:00:27>> right?
1:00:27>> And the second question is, how much
1:00:28should I take out of the business to
1:00:30save for a rainy day versus double down?
1:00:32And both of those are unanswerable
1:00:33questions because they're entirely
1:00:34personal. Ask Elon, he'll say, "Put it
1:00:35all on the line." If you have a wife and
1:00:37kids and you don't want to do that,
1:00:38which I respect,
1:00:39>> don't do that.
1:00:40>> And so those are dials for you. Um, but
1:00:44back back to the point, I'll just share
1:00:46what I'm doing is that
1:00:48>> I take chips off the table and put them
1:00:51into these places that I think are
1:00:52boring that will still be here. So we
1:00:54have lots of real estate and things like
1:00:55that, but the big investments that I
1:00:59make in the business on call it big
1:01:00swings I think have been predicated for
1:01:02at least me on making sure that my
1:01:04oxygen mask on is there for me and my
1:01:06family. People are different. Elon
1:01:07doesn't need that. I maybe he does he's
1:01:10already so rich. He knows enough friends
1:01:11that he's never actually going to
1:01:12starve. Um, but I think that
1:01:16what has served me very well was that I
1:01:18very aggressively lived cheap when I was
1:01:20younger so that I could save what I
1:01:22believed to be a nest egg. And that nest
1:01:24egg has changed in terms of what the
1:01:26size of it has been.
1:01:27>> But always having one allowed me to take
1:01:30gigantic swings and do things like the
1:01:32school deal or do things like the book
1:01:34launch or do things like some of the
1:01:35other things that we're talking about
1:01:37and be okay because the worst case
1:01:39scenario is that my my life doesn't
1:01:41change at all. Me too. Identical exact
1:01:44same thing. This is my favorite
1:01:46interview we've done. My favorite
1:01:48interview. Um
1:01:49>> can I do one more little bit
1:01:50>> please?
1:01:51>> So one thing in terms of the specificity
1:01:53of risk. So we talked about um like what
1:01:56would it actually look like?
1:01:57>> Yeah.
1:01:58>> One of the things that's been even more
1:02:00micro for me is what changes about my
1:02:03day.
1:02:04>> And so this is both upside and downside.
1:02:06So, if I'm considering like, hey, should
1:02:07I take on this investment or should I do
1:02:09this anything? The question that I ask
1:02:12is like, what will this change about my
1:02:13day?
1:02:14>> Do I have to now do something that I
1:02:16don't want to do? Do I have to do I have
1:02:18to stop doing stuff that I do want to
1:02:19do? And most decisions um don't actually
1:02:23affect my day, which then means that
1:02:26it's actually not there's no real stakes
1:02:28here. It's all made up. It's literally
1:02:29just it's it's in the air. Now, every
1:02:31once in a while, there are some things
1:02:33that when I actually run it through that
1:02:35that filter. For example, if your wife's
1:02:36pissed at you,
1:02:37>> that is going to change my day
1:02:40>> or week or month more than just about
1:02:43any negative business consequence will.
1:02:45Honestly, just about more.
1:02:46>> And so, it actually has helped me truly
1:02:49redefine priorities.
1:02:50>> Wow.
1:02:51>> In a way that's actually much more
1:02:52tactically relevant to how I experience
1:02:54life.
1:02:55>> Wow.
1:02:56I'm glad you added that. That's probably
1:02:57best for me of the entire conversation.
1:03:00No, because a lot of the risk that I
1:03:02have in my mind is made up. Yet, the
1:03:04risk I most fear is that it would alter
1:03:06my day and then I would have to do
1:03:08things I don't want to do anymore or
1:03:09actually stop doing the things that I do
1:03:11want to do. What a great formula.
1:03:13>> Turns out you're pretty smart.
1:03:15>> Turns out you're pretty smart. Um I'm
1:03:18real proud of you. Thanks, man.
1:03:19>> You know what I mean? And I'm grateful
1:03:20that you're in my life and uh I'll
1:03:22always be here for you. And um I love
1:03:26Leila, too. And uh you're really
1:03:27important in the world. I just want you
1:03:29to know. No, I meant what I said in the
1:03:30beginning. There's a lot of people that
1:03:31are really good at this business stuff.
1:03:34You're you're on a level that is yours.
1:03:37So, continue to expand because your
1:03:38capacity is even greater than this.
1:03:40Proud of you. Great job today.
1:03:41>> Appreciate it.
1:03:42>> All right, everybody. I don't have to
1:03:43tell you to do this one. Share this
1:03:44episode. You know where to find Alex.
1:03:45He's everywhere. And max out your life.
1:03:47God bless you.

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