The Most Passive $104K/M Online Business You've Never Heard Of — Transcript

Full transcript

1. 0:00On this podcast, we only reserve the P word  passive for like things that I truly believe
2. 0:05can be. And I I don't like that word usually, but  I will use it when I feel like it applies. And it
3. 0:11seems like this is one of those exceptions where  it does apply. The best part about this business
4. 0:15model, we talk about the money and everything  like that, and that's awesome, but genuinely,
5. 0:19once you get that client in the door, this becomes  99% passive. Your website does not need to be
6. 0:26touched ever again. I have clients that have been  with me for 5 years now and I haven't spoken to
7. 0:31them or had any communication with them since  and they've been paying me every single month
8. 0:35and that's my goal. People like to talk about real  estate like it's passive but it's definitely Oh
9. 0:41jeez started. Definitely not. This is a thousand  times more passive than real estate cuz the risk
10. 0:47is so much lower. You're not taking out a half  million dollar mortgage on some property and the
11. 0:53overhead is so low in this business. If you're  using the most drag and drop userfriendly tools,
12. 0:58you're spending no more than like $25 a month  in total overhead. Our company does around
13. 1:03$100,000 a month as a whole, and our overhead's  maybe less than $5,000 a month. Yeah, it's crazy.
14. 1:09I was so desperate to get out of the situation  I was in in my previous career. I just threw
15. 1:14out the number. I go $6,000 and within 20 minutes  it was wired. And I looked at my wife, I'm like,
16. 1:19"Somebody just wired me $6,000." I'm like, "It  didn't seem real." I was chasing time freedom and
17. 1:26I tried finding it in things like drop shipping,  day trading, other business models online. But
18. 1:31when I found this business model, I was in it for  the time freedom and the easiness of it. But the
19. 1:37real thing that gets me excited is the unlimited  amount of time I get to spend with my kid.
20. 1:43So, let me tell you about Kyle. A while back,  Kyle texted an old high school friend a screen
21. 1:48recording and 20 minutes later had six grand wired  into his bank account. and he had never earned a
22. 1:53dollar online before that day. Six years later,  he runs what he calls a website landlord business,
23. 2:00doing about $104,000 a month with almost no  overhead. And yes, he works only an hour or
24. 2:06two a day. He uses cheap online tools to find  supply and demand gaps. Then he builds basic
25. 2:12websites within those niches. So today, of course,  we're going to talk about how you can copy Kyle,
26. 2:17what his script is for closing these deals, and  what niches are still untapped. Enjoy. All right.
27. 2:22Well, Kyle, tell me what a website landlord is.  So, essentially, a website landlord is people who
28. 2:29own pieces of internet real estate. And it's not  domain flipping or anything like that. It's you're
29. 2:35basically building a website for a certain niche  in a certain city and then renting out that lead
30. 2:41flow that comes through it to an actual local  business owner. So, let me give you an example.
31. 2:46If I were to build a website right now for junk  removal services in Austin, Texas, I don't own a
32. 2:53junk removal company. I don't have a client that  has a junk removal company. Anybody can build
33. 2:57whatever website they want, you know. So, I go  out and build this website that's all about junk
34. 3:02removal services in Austin, Texas. I do what's  called SEO on the website to get it ranking. It's
35. 3:08involves content and something called backlinks we  can get into later, but I get that website ranking
36. 3:13to page one. And once it's on page one of Google,  so that it shows up anytime somebody searches for
37. 3:19junk removal services in Austin, Texas. Obviously,  people are going to be clicking on it. Obviously,
38. 3:24there are hundreds if not thousands of people in  Austin, Texas every day going to Google to try
39. 3:28and find a junk removal company. So, if my website  is one of those sites on page one, I'm gonna get a
40. 3:35percentage of those people searching. And once  they come to my site, they're going to see the
41. 3:40little phone number that's on my website, right?  It's called a tracking phone number. I can control
42. 3:44where all those calls flows to. It's my like dummy  number. So when people call that phone number,
43. 3:50it automatically forwards to a business owner I've  partnered up with. Right? But to backtrack just a
44. 3:55hair, before I even have a business owner hooked  up to them, I'm getting the site to page one.
45. 4:00It's getting calls. At first, I'm just letting  all those calls go to voicemail before I have a
46. 4:04client working with me. It's no big deal. Let them  go to voicemail. There will be more callers next
47. 4:09month. There's never ending. and you're capturing  their info, they're not like as likely to convert,
48. 4:14you know, if you find a guy to buy your leads  and he calls them later, but at least you still
49. 4:18have the data and it's proof of concept. So, you  can say, "Hey, Bob, I get three calls a day for
50. 4:22people searching for exactly what you're selling."  Exactly. Exactly. Well, the best part about this
51. 4:28is that the overhead is so low in this business  model. Like if you're using the most expensive
52. 4:33tools or like the most drag and drop userfriendly  tools, you're spending no more than like
53. 4:39$25 a month in total overhead per site. That's  for the hosting, the URL, and the phone number,
54. 4:45right? So, the benefit of that is that once I  do have a website, it's getting like 50 to 100
55. 4:51calls or so a month, I'm calling up that junk  removal company in Austin, Texas, and I'm like,
56. 4:56"Hey, man. I got this website. It's getting  like 50 calls a month of people looking for
57. 4:59junk removal services in Austin. I connect them  to you for a week for free and I'm not going to
58. 5:04take a credit card information from you. I'm not  going to um make you sign anything. It's literally
59. 5:09just a free trial. And sometimes it sounds too  good to be true to them and they're just like,
60. 5:14"It sounds suspicious." But usually they're like,  "Well, whatever. All you need is my email and
61. 5:18phone number." So you give them the free trial  and you just want them to start trusting you and
62. 5:22to see that your leads are good. So then they'll  want to pay for that. Right. Exactly. So, I give
63. 5:27them the free trial and by the end of that week,  if they've made some money off my calls, that next
64. 5:32conversation I have with them is really just about  what monthly flat fee we negotiate. Can I pause
65. 5:38you because I feel like that's the that's a big  key of this is if they're making any money on on
66. 5:43my calls. How do you know that they're reporting  accurately, that they're not lying, that they're
67. 5:48following up with the leads, that they're actually  answering the phone, etc., or is does there just
68. 5:52have to be a good bit of trust involved? Well, I  could see if they're answering the calls or not.
69. 5:58Sometimes in the call tracking platform, I could  see the recordings and stuff, but the thing is is
70. 6:03if they are didn't make any money off of it, then  they're probably not going to be a good client for
71. 6:09me anyways. So, I'm just going to move on to the  next person because if they're not making money
72. 6:12off of it, why would they pay me, right? Sure.  And if they are making money off of it, they're
73. 6:18not going to want me to turn the calls off. So,  the incentives are aligned. Exactly. So, can you
74. 6:23see the the recordings or the call transcripts  as well? Yes. So, if they're like, "Sorry, yeah,
75. 6:28I got a few calls but didn't go anywhere and  then you look at the transcript and it's like,
76. 6:31all right, $700 invoice sent." You're like, "Hey,  bro." Yes. But you're saying that doesn't even
77. 6:36happen that often because they see that the calls  are good and now it's just a matter of not will
78. 6:40you pay me, but how much will you pay me? Yeah.  It we come up with a flat fee and I don't do any
79. 6:45contracts with them. I'm just like, you know what?  Cancel anytime because I have the leverage because
80. 6:51I'm sending them the calls and if they cancel the  calls go away. So they're basically if they cancel
81. 6:55they're agreeing to lose a big portion of their  income, right? So they could cancel whenever they
82. 7:00want, right? So they have that exit. So it's a  pretty easy conversation. They saw the calls,
83. 7:06they trust me versus a standard marketing company  who does like sells Google ads or Facebook ads or
84. 7:12something like that. these sales calls for those  people. It's it's a trust game. They're working
85. 7:17out like, "Hey, can I convince this guy to pay me  $1,500 a month for the next six months and without
86. 7:25any guarantee of results, right? That's a tough  sell. It's like you have to show them testimonials
87. 7:30and be like, "Look, I promise you I'm really,  really good at this, but sign this contract
88. 7:34and you're going to pay me for the next six months  whether I get you results or or not." With me, the
89. 7:38whole script is flipped because I'm like, "Hey,  I already did the work of building and ranking
90. 7:42a website and it's sending you calls and you're  making money off of me before we even agree on a
91. 7:48deal." And I'm not pressure selling. Yeah. This is  more of like a a landlord and tenant relationship,
92. 7:53not like a oh customer, please work with me,  right? Relationship. This is the rent. And if you
93. 7:59don't like I've had I've had rental homes. It's  like the rent is not negotiable because I've got
94. 8:0418 people applying for this house. 100%. You don't  want these calls. I'm just going to call Joe down
95. 8:09the street. And I know that sounds like aggressive  and mean, but like my service is hugely beneficial
96. 8:15to small business owners who can't afford to to  take that $1,500 a month risk on some marketing
97. 8:22company with no guarantee of results. These  small businesses, most of the guys I work with,
98. 8:27they they only have 1,500 bucks to gamble on  a marketing company. So with me, there's no
99. 8:32gambling. day one, they're getting leads to pay  for my services. There's never a loss of money.
100. 8:40It's I'm an instant slot machine. You put you put  $1,000 into me, I'm sending you $5,000 back. You
101. 8:47see what I mean? So, it's really a huge benefit  to these like more mom and pops that can't afford
102. 8:52to gamble in a marketing company. Well, you  mentioned like I don't have contracts. Like I
103. 8:57don't I don't negotiate on price. And this is  a trust business and results are the greatest
104. 9:02form of trust there is. Right? Contracts equal  lack of trust in a relationship. You're saying,
105. 9:08"I already brought you results. They were free.  I called you and I brought you results. Like
106. 9:12this is the price. I don't need a contract cuz  I got a guy waiting." Exactly. I'm not afraid
107. 9:17of you cancelling. I could call the next person. I  love like this is one of my general frameworks for
108. 9:23life is do the hard thing first. So, like if you  start a business and it is just a beast and you're
109. 9:29beating your head against the wall and it takes  months to get profitable, that means everything
110. 9:33after that point is just going to be so much nicer  and easier. Every business after that point, every
111. 9:37sale after that point in the same business you're  saying, listen, bro, I did the hard part. The hard
112. 9:43part is ranking. That's my skill. You're good at  junk removal. You keep doing that. I'm really good
113. 9:48at being a website landlord. I've already done  the hard part. I've proven the results. And then
114. 9:53everything after that is just gravy. Exactly.  Exactly. It's it's just day one results and
115. 9:58uh that's that's really the benefit. The only  downside for the business owner is that their
116. 10:03brand isn't being advertised on my site, right?  But they don't care because the only reason you
117. 10:10want to be on page one is because you want the  customers that come from page one. And it's tons.
118. 10:15It's not just any customers. It's high intent  customers because no one is typing into Google
119. 10:22junk removal services in Austin unless they're  looking to purchase junk removal services in
120. 10:27Austin. And plus, a lot of these people have had  experience with paid ads. And paid ads, you get
121. 10:32such low ROI because you pay thousands of dollars  for them. And plus, if you're anything like me,
122. 10:37which I think most searchers are, once you go to  search on Google and you see a bunch of ads in
123. 10:42this top section of the front page, you scroll  right past them and go to the results below,
124. 10:46which is where we are. Because people have this  inclination or what's the word, the the belief
125. 10:52that if you're in the spots below the ads, that  means you're the best in town. When in reality,
126. 11:00showing up right there has nothing to do with  your quality of work. You could be the worst
127. 11:05junk removal company in the whole state and  you'll still be on page one because you have
128. 11:09good SEO. Well, just like anything, if you're the  best at marketing, you win. Yeah. Right. Yeah.
129. 11:14And and the great part about the best part about  this business model, we talked about the money
130. 11:18and everything like that and that's awesome, but  genuinely once you get that client in the door,
131. 11:24this becomes 99% passive. All right? as you scale  to more be because once the site is built and
132. 11:32ranked, majority of the time your website does  not need to be touched ever again because we're
133. 11:37competing in low competition SEO spaces like  longtail searches. Not even not even because
134. 11:44junk removal Austin might not be a great example  because I haven't done my research on a actual
135. 11:49lowhanging fruit niche in city but SEO is just  a game of competition. I don't want to go into
136. 11:54a niche where like personal injury lawyer Los  Angeles where the competing websites are funded
137. 12:00by major marketing companies that these law firms  are paying $50,000 a month to. I want to compete
138. 12:07against Joe, Bill, and Steve in Oram, Utah with a  junk removal company where they have websites that
139. 12:12I'm competing against. They bought those websites  maybe back in 2005 and haven't touched them since.
140. 12:18And so I go in there, yeah, make a halfdecent site  and do basic SEO and I'm knocking them out of the
141. 12:23park really quickly and I don't have to do ongoing  SEO to maintain the site because I'm already so
142. 12:31far ahead and they're not even noticing that  they're that they're not in the number one spot
143. 12:34anymore and they're still getting roughly the same  amount of calls because being in spot one, two,
144. 12:37or three is roughly the same. Yeah. Funny because  OM Utah is actually really competitive usually
145. 12:43as well as return missionaries like myself.  I know you just picked that city at random,
146. 12:47but super competitive there. But I want to just  mention the passive part one more time because
147. 12:51it is genuinely passive. The only thing that the  only time it becomes like maybe an hour or two a
148. 12:57day of work is when you scale up to a point where  I'm at where I have like over a hundred clients
149. 13:03and maybe 20% of those clients every month credit  cards decline and I have to go follow up payment,
150. 13:09right? And so I just test involves me shooting out  texts and emails every day to follow up with them
151. 13:14to collect the payment. Maybe by the end of the  month, one or two of them don't pay. I have some
152. 13:18churn and then I'm following up. Just making phone  calls to find a new client to replace them. Yeah.
153. 13:23Hey, YouTube's fine, but what about when you're  driving around? What about when you're mowing
154. 13:26the lawn? You need my audio podcast, The Kerner  Office. Just look up TKO Pod in Apple, Spotify,
155. 13:33or wherever you get your podcast. I mean, what  we're talking about is basic supply and demand.
156. 13:38You're saying you look to the supply and demand  first. Not necessarily the keyword volume,
157. 13:42but the supply and demand. And there are at least  a thousand home service niches out there. And I
158. 13:47know that sounds like too much, but there's really  not. If I say the word gutters, then it's gutter
159. 13:51cleaning, gutter repair, gutter replacement.  Like just in the gutters, there's at least 10,
160. 13:56right? So let's just say there's a thousand to  be conservative. And then let's say there's only
161. 14:00a thousand cities worthy of trying to rank.  That's a million supply and demand variations
162. 14:06that we're talking about. Are you telling me  that the market is so perfectly efficient that
163. 14:11all million of those combinations are there's a  there's the right amount of supply and demand in
164. 14:16all of them? Absolutely not. And a decade from  now there still won't be. Right? So that's the
165. 14:22level of opportunity here. And on this podcast,  we only reserve the P word passive for like things
166. 14:28that I truly believe can be. And I I don't like  that word usually, but I will use it when I feel
167. 14:33like it applies. And it seems like this is one of  those exceptions where it does apply. So listen,
168. 14:38it's not like dividends, right? It's not passive  dividends. Well, it takes activity to get to the
169. 14:44passive point. I'll tell you right now, you know,  people like to talk about real estate like it's
170. 14:49passive, but it's definitely Oh, dude. than we  started. Definitely not. This is a thousand times
171. 14:56more passive than real estate because the risk  is so much lower. You're not taking out a half
172. 14:59a million dollar mortgage on some property and  your overhead is maybe 20 $25 a month in total
173. 15:06overhead. Plus, you cash flow way more and the  maintenance is so much lower. So, let me ask
174. 15:11you about pricing. I'm going to make an assumption  here because I'm kind of in this industry and I've
175. 15:15I've been in lead genen forever. Different types  of lead genen, directory sites. To me, there's a
176. 15:21lot of overlap here with directory sites. I mean,  a directory site could be a a website landlord,
177. 15:26a rank and rent site, right? Yes. So, I'm going to  make an assumption that you've tested a pay-perle
178. 15:32model here as opposed to a flat monthly price  model because you thought, man, we could be much
179. 15:38more profitable if we charge 30 bucks per call.  And 30 bucks per call is very generous because we
180. 15:43know that his close rate is 50%, his average job  is $800. So, 30 bucks per call is cheap for him.
181. 15:50you tested it and then you saw that it just didn't  work as well because these business owners want to
182. 15:55know what their bill is going to be every month.  Even if they net out behind, they would rather
183. 15:59pay you a flat fee every month because of the  predictability of it. Is that accurate at all? So,
184. 16:06what most of these business owners want to do is  a commissionbased and they want to just pay on
185. 16:10jobs they close. But obviously, I can't do that  because that requires me to track all their jobs
186. 16:15and trust. you know, there's no way for me to know  if they actually closed the job or not. And if
187. 16:20you could if you could trust them perfectly, it'd  probably be more profitable for you. I'm actually
188. 16:25for It's funny you bring that up because for the  first time ever, I my contractor that I use for my
189. 16:29house, we've become pretty good friends and just  recently I started generating concrete leads for
190. 16:34him and we're actually doing a 10% commission with  it and it's turning out to be way more profitable.
191. 16:39But that's because I totally trust him and he's a  cool guy. Yeah. Yep. But the pay-per- call thing,
192. 16:45yes, it's unpredictable for the client. And  I've done things in the past where they have
193. 16:49fluctuating tiers of rates where it's like, hey,  if you get 25 to 50 calls, you're going to pay
194. 16:55this much. If you get 50 to 100 calls, you're  going to pay this much. I've kind of abandoned
195. 16:58that, not only for the client's sake, but for my  sake. I know I do really well. I make around 35k
196. 17:05a month, and it might be sound impressive to some  people, and it is, I guess, kind of impressive. Is
197. 17:09that profit? That's pretty much the overhead  is like so low. It's our company does around
198. 17:15$100,000 a month as a whole and our overhead's  maybe less than $5,000 a month. Yeah, it's crazy.
199. 17:21But the point I'm trying to make is I am not one  of those aggressive entrepreneurs with like SOPs
200. 17:28and watching motivation videos and going to the  gym every morning. I am at my core a fairly lazy
201. 17:35guy. Like I used to work in television. I worked  in television for 10 years. And I was working 20
202. 17:42to 24-hour days some days during show weeks.  Like I worked on award shows like the Oscars,
203. 17:48Emmys, and big shows like that. And when there's  a deadline, there's no avoiding that deadline. I
204. 17:52was grinding it out and got burnt out and started  looking for business modes. I guess the reason
205. 17:57that relates to what I'm about to say is because  I really wanted I was chasing time freedom and I
206. 18:04tried finding it in things like dropshipping, day  trading, other business models online. But when
207. 18:09I found this business model, I was in it for the  time freedom and the easiness of it. And so when I
208. 18:14first started, I had this rush of motivation built  out really, really big for the first few years
209. 18:19because I was just I had my eye on the prize. But  I'm in year six of doing this business model now,
210. 18:25right? And at the level I'm making, which some  people would assume I should probably be making
211. 18:30more after six years, but I'm I've kind of fallen  into the comfort zone. I'm making a a number that
212. 18:36I'm really comfortable with. But the reason I've  switched from the tiered pricing to the monthly
213. 18:43flat rate pricing is because I wanted simplicity.  When you have the tiered pricing, I have clients
214. 18:50reaching out to me being like, why did my invoice  pop up to 1,500 this month? Then they want to go
215. 18:55over every single lead with me and determine  whether it was actually a legitimate lead or
216. 18:58not. Yeah, I don't want that headache. I'd rather  make less money and have this be 100% passive than
217. 19:04squeak out an extra 5 to 10 grand a month because  I'm like overanalyzing and auditing all the leads.
218. 19:10Auditing leads. Yeah. I don't want anything to do  with that. Clients that have been with me for five
219. 19:15years and I haven't spoken to them or had any  communication with them since and they've been
220. 19:20paying me every single month and that's my goal.  How long did it take you after starting this six
221. 19:25years ago to see your first win? Three months.  I kind of did it a backwards way. I since I was
222. 19:31really hungry to get money in the door, I didn't  do it the classic way of building the sites first,
223. 19:36then finding a client. What I did was I went onto  my phone, I went into my Facebook, Instagram,
224. 19:40I made a list of all the business owners I knew,  right? And I came across this one friend of mine
225. 19:45who was an attorney, um, a workers comp attorney.  He was a friend of mine from high school. I hadn't
226. 19:50talked to him in 10 years, though. But I reached  out to him. I made a screencast video where I
227. 19:54recorded my screen and showed him how this  business model works and how I could build
228. 19:57him a site targeting Torrance. I could build him a  site targeting Long Beach, Anaheim, Sei Valley and
229. 20:03specific cities targeting where I could generate  him leads from. And he loved the idea. He wanted
230. 20:09to try it. And he said, "What do I have to pay  to get this ball rolling?" And so I just I had
231. 20:12never I had never made a single dollar in my life  outside of W2 earnings. And so I just threw out
232. 20:19a number because I always heard in movies and  stuff, aim high. And you know, in your defense,
233. 20:24like a personal injury attorney as like an  agency owner is like the golden club. Well,
234. 20:29it was a worker. They've got budget. It was a  worker. Okay. You said that. Okay. So it was
235. 20:33still attorneys are great clients. Yeah. They've  got cash. Yes. Exactly. I I just threw up the
236. 20:37number. I go $6,000 and within 20 minutes it was  wired. And I looked at my wife. I'm like, somebody
237. 20:43just wired me $6,000. I'm like, it didn't seem  real. The good thing about that is I still at the
238. 20:49time wasn't like an expert at this. But what was  good about that is that this was somebody I knew
239. 20:55and I didn't want to burn his trust and and burn a  relationship. And so by him sending me that money,
240. 21:00it lit a fire to get things going. I didn't care  or deliver. Yeah. I didn't care if I spent every
241. 21:06single dime of that $6,000 in outsourcing or the  ways to make it happen faster. I just needed to
242. 21:13deliver results cuz I knew if I did, it would  be a long-term relationship. and he's still
243. 21:16my client to this day. Wow. Now, what does he pay  on an ongoing basis? Well, since he was a friend,
244. 21:22he did have fluctuating. At first, we started  out at like 5,000 or so a month and then we
245. 21:29got once the lead flow started increasing. I  got to like 7,500 a month and stuff, but over
246. 21:34time like we we've restructured deals cuz he is  a friend. We go on hikes and stuff sometimes. He
247. 21:39was pay started paying me like 300 bucks per new  client he landed, which added a little bit more
248. 21:45incentive to me. And then he would also pay a base  SEO fee of like 1,500 bucks. So he pay me 1,500
249. 21:51bucks a month plus $300 per new client he signs  up. Wow. So you spent your first three months
250. 21:57just learning. Were you building and publishing  anything or just kind of learning tools? Yeah,
251. 22:01I was just building and learning. Well, I think  it's so important that when anyone launches any
252. 22:06agency, digital marketing, whatever, start with  your network. Like, it all comes down to trust.
253. 22:11Don't be afraid to burn your friend. Like, just  let it light a fire under you to overd deliver
254. 22:16and start with your network. Because if you  just start cold with people out of insecurity,
255. 22:20which I've done that before, it's going to be  so much harder to get your first yes. But if
256. 22:24you get your first yes from a friend, now you  have a case study that you can sell to all the
257. 22:28cold leads. 100%. I always tell people I think  a key is digging yourself into a hole, you know,
258. 22:35which is what I did. It sounds crazy, but I know  exactly what you mean. Yeah. I I I accepted $6,000
259. 22:42from this guy and I'm not the type of person  that feels comfortable just robbing someone. So,
260. 22:46I felt this overwhelming pressure to dig myself  out of this hole. I'm like, he's expecting
261. 22:51something very soon. I got to get into action.  It's kind of like a gym membership. You know,
262. 22:57if you go sign up at Planet Fitness and you're  paying $10 a month, it's very easy for you to
263. 23:01be like, I don't feel like going this month, big  deal. 10 bucks, right? But if you're spending like
264. 23:07500 bucks a month on a gym membership, you're be  like, I better show up because spending this damn
265. 23:14money. Well, didn't you tell me that you first  learned how to do this from a course? And if so,
266. 23:18how much did that cost? Did that light a fire  under you? $6,500. Was it a course and a community
267. 23:25or just just one and community? It was it was a  good one, right? It doesn't exist anymore. That
268. 23:31course doesn't uh really exist anymore, but  it was I don't care. It doesn't I'm so glad I
269. 23:38spent that money now. Obviously, I did not have  a ton of money back then. Like my net worth was
270. 23:42probably 20k, but I was so desperate to get out of  the situation I was in in my previous career that,
271. 23:48you know, I had bought $500 courses in the past.  Now, my mindset was like, you know what? You
272. 23:53get what you pay for. Why would I spend $500 on  something that's not getting me anywhere? Wouldn't
273. 23:58I rather spend $6,000 on something that's going to  actually get me somewhere? You know, obviously you
274. 24:04have to vet that it's actually going to be worth  the money, but like I did and it actually was,
275. 24:09you know, this was there was involvement and  everything. Yeah. I think I think that's why
276. 24:12courses and communities get a better rap because  they don't deliver on their promises. They they
277. 24:17sell a crapload of goods. Yeah. And if it if  they do deliver on their promise, they can be
278. 24:21life-changing. I know courses do have bad rep  and they probably some of them deserve it, but
279. 24:26a course changed my absolute life. I've witnessed  it changed so many other people's lives. It's just
280. 24:32you're you're learning new skills. And what you  really want to find in your course is a community
281. 24:36that's keeping you engaged. And that's probably  the most important part. How much does your most
282. 24:42profitable customer pay for you? So let me ask  you two questions in one. One is how much do you
283. 24:47make from your most profitable customer? Two is  how much does your most profitable customer make
284. 24:54for themselves from your leads? Does that make  sense? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like how much are we both
285. 24:58benefiting from all this? Yeah. And maybe it's the  same customer, maybe it's not. I don't really have
286. 25:04exact insights onto my customers revenue like  ROI. Yeah. I don't have exact numbers. Look at
287. 25:11that. my metric really is anecdotally like do  you know of a customer that was like dude I'm
288. 25:16making 30 grand a month from your leads. You know  what I'm saying? I have been told things like that
289. 25:20before. So I do have clients who have told me that  like I get holiday cards from some of these guys.
290. 25:25They're like telling me how grateful they are  that I made their Christmas because I showed up
291. 25:29in their lives. I have a guy who told me we just  upgraded our house to a we moved to a fourbedroom
292. 25:36house instead of a two-bedroom with our kids and  everything and it's all because of your leads.
293. 25:40the best feeling ever. And it it you almost feel  guilty accepting that praise because you haven't
294. 25:45really done any work for them since you built  the website. It's not like I'm grinding it out
295. 25:50for them every day, but I'm still benefiting them.  But we do have some clients that pay us, you know,
296. 25:55like $5,000 a month. And my metric for assuming  why they're paying me is that they're doing really
297. 26:01well. You know, if they were only squeaking out  an extra thousand off my the $5,000 of paying me,
298. 26:06I don't think they'd be still paying me. Yeah.  Let me ask you something. How many leads have
299. 26:10you lost because nobody picked up the phone?  An 8:00 p.m. call comes in, you're at dinner,
300. 26:15and you let it go to voicemail. And by the time  you call back the next morning, they've already
301. 26:19hired someone else. And that's reality. Leads come  in after hours when emergencies strike. And when
302. 26:25you miss the call, you miss the job. And it's  not about quality, it's about speed. Highlevel
303. 26:30built an AI employee to fix just this. It answers  real phone calls, talks to leads, qualifies them,
304. 26:37and books appointments directly on your calendar  24/7. Also, it'll handle text, DMs, and web chat,
305. 26:45so you can stop missing revenue just because  you couldn't grab the phone. Oh, and you can
306. 26:51also white label the entire thing and resell it to  your clients as your software. Charge them monthly
307. 26:57and that is recurring revenue that you didn't have  yesterday. So, check out gohighlevel.com/tkopod
308. 27:04and they will give you a 30-day free trial to see  what I mean. How many calls are is a client like
309. 27:10that getting? 5,000. Well, it depends what niche  you're in and the niches that my partners and I
310. 27:15focus on. It's I mean, that would be maybe like  800 calls a month. So, lot sometimes I'll I'll
311. 27:22build out a client to sometimes a client who has  like multiple cities. like you don't really get to
312. 27:29800 calls a month in one city in most it's usually  multiple cities or multiple territories within
313. 27:34the state. So what you could do with some of your  clients is you could grow them out if they offer
314. 27:40services in adjacent cities or adjacent markets.  So we'll start with them in let's say Dallas and
315. 27:46then you could build them another site in Fort  Worth. You can build them another site in say they
316. 27:51go all the way to Austin, build another site in  San Antonio, and then all of a sudden you've built
317. 27:54up this client to something like $5,000 a month  and getting 800 leads a month. You know, it's
318. 27:59well worth it for them. I honestly am okay. Like I  there are tons of clients that I should be getting
319. 28:04paid more from. 100%. I deserve more for some of  these sites. But because of the passive nature of
320. 28:10this business model, I try not to get too greedy  because if somebody loves my leads and say I feel
321. 28:17like I should be getting $1,000 for this site, but  they're only paying me like 600. I'm going to be
322. 28:22okay with that deal because I know they're going  to be comfortable at that rate. They're never
323. 28:25going to bother me and they're going to stick with  me for years and years and years and I don't have
324. 28:29to hear from them and it's easy. versus if I'm  charging them too much, then they're going to
325. 28:34they're going to be on top of like the quality of  my services and be calling me up and questioning
326. 28:40every time there's a slow month or something.  I don't want any of that. I want easy. This is
327. 28:44such a hard principle to learn. I'm still trying  to learn it because I'm like I I still fight a
328. 28:51scarcity mindset having grown up poor. But if you  think of the most profitable companies on uh on
329. 28:57the planet and the the highest value companies on  the planet, Apple, $4 trillion company, they are
330. 29:03all companies that offer hundreds or thousands  of times more value than what they're selling.
331. 29:10Amazon, if Amazon Prime went from whatever it is,  150 to 400 tomorrow, I'm gonna pay it. And Amazon
332. 29:16knows I'm gonna pay it, right? Because I'm buying  from Amazon like every single day. If the Apple
333. 29:21iPhone went from $1,000 to $2,000, I'm gonna buy  it. And Apple knows it. Right. Right. They know
334. 29:25that not everyone will, but their core users  will. But my lifetime value with Apple is over
335. 29:31$100,000. Right. Because of the fact that I think  that even though my MacBook was $3,500, I'm going
336. 29:38to spend thousands of hours on it and generate  millions of dollars from that MacBook. It's worth
337. 29:43hundreds and or even thousands of times more than  what I paid for it. And because of that, Apple's
338. 29:49insanely profitable and they're a $4 trillion  company. Rinse and repeat with any mega profitable
339. 29:54company. And so it it's hard to do that. It's hard  to not charge more when you know you can. But if
340. 30:00you play the long game and you're relentlessly  addicted to playing long-term games with long-term
341. 30:05people, then you can do it. Like you cannot raise  your prices just because you can. You can keep
342. 30:11buying more and more trust and goodwill and then  they'll tell their friends and then they'll tell
343. 30:15their their friends and you will make more money  while charging less all along. It's a magical
344. 30:20thing. Yeah. It's it's you almost want people  to forget your bill even exists. That's kind of
345. 30:25my goal. You know, I don't want people to feel it  every month and get punched in the gut. You know,
346. 30:30I want them to kind of forget about it because  then they're just going to leave me alone because
347. 30:34what we're all doing this for. I mean, some people  are in entrepreneurship for the love of the game.
348. 30:38You know, some things about doing business gets  me excited, but the real thing that gets me
349. 30:43excited is the unlimited amount of time I get to  spend with my kid, my ability to travel whenever
350. 30:48I want on my own terms, and, you know, being able  to max out my, you know, savings accounts and IAS
351. 30:55and everything like that. And so, I just create a  safe life for my kids. So, that's the goal. It's
352. 31:00not to necessarily become the richest man in the  world. I don't have the Jeff Bezos bug, you know?
353. 31:05Yeah. Yeah, once you hit this level, you kind of  just want easy. Whatever guru or marketer try to
354. 31:10convince people that a lifestyle business is a  pjorative, a bad thing, a negative thing. I hate
355. 31:17them because I've done both. I've raised money,  venture capital. I've flown to Silicon Valley.
356. 31:22I've like I've gone like the billion dollar exit  path and oh my gosh, like you are much more likely
357. 31:28to fall on your face than you are to ever reach a  billion dollars or anywhere close to it. Whereas
358. 31:34if you optimize for six figures a year or hundreds  like 2 3 4 $500,000 a year, you are more likely to
359. 31:42get to 10 million a year or 5 million a year than  if you optimize for a billion and land at 10. Like
360. 31:49if you optimize for a billion, it's boom or bust  and it's probably bust. Optimize for 500,000, it's
361. 31:54more likely to be boom. And you're able to take  that 500,000 and scale it if you want to while
362. 31:59still having a great lifestyle. Like I spend hours  in the yard every day trimming my fruit trees,
363. 32:05planting trees. Like I love spending time outside  with my kids, traveling. We go on like five trips
364. 32:10a year and this is a lifestyle business and it's  freaking awesome. Yeah, people should optimize for
365. 32:16that. I don't think people realize that you don't  need a half a billion dollars to be financially
366. 32:23free. You know, you don't even need $20 million to  be financially free. You just need enough money in
367. 32:29your checking account that could keep you floating  for a year or two years to hit the fan. You just
368. 32:35need to be able to have enough money in your bank  account to be able to tell your employer to screw
369. 32:38off if you didn't want to work there anymore.  Yeah. Cuz that's the real freedom. If you feel
370. 32:43like you're trapped in a job and you can't leave  it, that's not freedom. If you have enough money
371. 32:48in your bank account and you could walk away from  any job, then that's true freedom. What does your
372. 32:52tech stack look like? What tools could you not  live without to do with uh to do what you do? So,
373. 32:58number one, you know, I started off building  sites on Weebi because I didn't know how to
374. 33:03build websites and it's super easy, drag and drop.  But since I got partners who were a bit more savvy
375. 33:08at things like WordPress, my costs went down and  we use WordPress and things move way faster. The
376. 33:13reason I don't encourage people to start with  WordPress if they don't already know it is
377. 33:17because it takes a long time to learn it. So even  though Weebly is more expensive, it's better to
378. 33:22get started on that. So first tech stack WordPress  or website building tool. Then you got Call Rail,
379. 33:29which is the call tracking software. You could  use Call Rail, you could use Twilio. There are
380. 33:34a bunch of other providers out there, but that's  where I get the phone numbers from and how I could
381. 33:37track all the phone numbers. And it also automates  emails to my client with a recording of the call
382. 33:42and the phone number of the caller so they can  keep track of any call that comes from me and so
383. 33:47that there's no question of whether it came from  me or not. And then it also does something called
384. 33:50a whisper message. So whenever my client picks up  the phone, the first thing they hear is a little
385. 33:54robot voice recording that says call from Kyle's  leads. And boom, they're talking to the customer.
386. 33:59So it's a all-in-one tool. Um, so Call Rail,  WordPress, and honestly an Excel sheet. I don't
387. 34:06use any fancy uh CRM. I only use Go High Level.  Some people do, but all I need is my client's
388. 34:14name, business name, phone number, email, and  that's all I really need. And obviously, we have a
389. 34:20Google sheet page for all of our sites and all the  domain names and everything, but there's no reason
390. 34:25to get o to get overly complicated with it. Now  for researching what city, what niche to go after,
391. 34:31are we talking ahrefs, semrush, or are there other  tools out there that you use? So as a beginner,
392. 34:38I would use ars because it's very detailed and  it it'll help you give get really good, accurate
393. 34:43information to find backlinks, to do competition  research and niche research, etc. But today,
394. 34:49these days, I use something called Mangles. It's  just a really clean, fun, easy interface. And I
395. 34:55don't need extreme detail anymore because I have  a lot of intuition I've built up. And so I'll
396. 35:01use Mangles. It's really cool. They got a Chrome  plugin that's really easy. And that's just what
397. 35:07I use now. But I would recommend anybody starting  out if you're learning this game to use AFS. Okay.
398. 35:12What did your first like six months and 12 months  in revenue look like? How how long did it take you
399. 35:17to get to 10 grand a month, 20 grand a month,  etc.? I got to $10,000 a month at the end of my
400. 35:22first year. I found this business model in August  of 2019 and then obviously pandemic hit March 2020
401. 35:29and everything shut down and so my TV work went  away and I was double down on this and give it my
402. 35:34full attention during pandemic and you know I was  able to get to $10,000 a month on you know I would
403. 35:39say 50 to 75% effort right just because I'm Yeah,  like I said before I'm not the crazy aggressive
404. 35:46person. So there are some people I know who got  to 30 or 40 grand a month by the end of their
405. 35:51first year. I'm just not one of them. And then how  long until 20 30 100 grand a month where you're at
406. 35:56now? We started averaging around 100 grand a  month in the company around year four but we
407. 36:03were hovering around 50 to 70 for a while. We were  kind of cruising and plateauing for a bit and then
408. 36:08we just got a second wind and built ourselves up  to 100 around you know year four or five. Okay.
409. 36:13How do you find clients? Or I guess you told me in  the very beginning you build you proactively build
410. 36:18the sites for them based on what your Mangles AHF  show and then you go find junk removal companies
411. 36:25in that whatever it is whatever site you built  you go find people to sell it to. Is that right?
412. 36:29Yeah. I build a generic site that's all about the  niche and city generic site. No branding. And then
413. 36:35I just literally go to Google, Yelp, Yellow Pages  and make a list on a on an Excel sheet of all the
414. 36:41businesses in town that offer that service. And  then I uh just start calling because it's such
415. 36:46an easy phone call. Some people are too afraid  to make the phone call so they do text or email,
416. 36:50but I just want to get it over with and I'm just  offering people a free trial. It's a gift. The
417. 36:55difficulty of your phone call is correlated with  the the strength of your offer or not, right?
418. 37:01You're confident in what you're selling because  you're already generating leads for the person.
419. 37:05Like you're calling them up and and saying, "I  have free money for you. Would you like that or
420. 37:10not?" So, I hate cold calling. I'm an introvert.  But if I'm calling with that offer, I'm picking up
421. 37:15the phone all day. No brainer. It's a no-brainer.  I have a script I've said over and over again that
422. 37:19I've tweaked throughout the years, but it's not  What's the script? What's the 8020 of it? I mean,
423. 37:24it's really just like I'm really sounding very  casual. It It's not I won't call them and say,
424. 37:29"Hey, my name's Kyle from Superstar Leads LLC  and I want to know if I can speak with a business
425. 37:33owner." No, I'm not doing any of that. I'm calling  up and saying, "Hey, what's up, man?" I'm almost
426. 37:38presenting it like I have a problem I need help  with from them. I go, "Hey man, I got this website
427. 37:44that is getting like 50 calls a month for junk  removal services in Austin. I'm not a junk removal
428. 37:50company. I don't know what to do with them. Do you  think I could send them to you for like a week and
429. 37:53you could just see what they're like? All I need  is a phone number and email to send them to and
430. 37:58obviously there's some conversation there. They  ask some questions. I tell them I explain to them
431. 38:02how they're going to receive the calls. And then  it's almost like, you know, they're almost like
432. 38:06this is not going to work. This is going to  be nothing. this is some schmuck that's just,
433. 38:10you know, calling me for some random reason. And  it's really that casual. I almost want to present
434. 38:15it like I need their help taking over these calls  because I can't handle them, right? And so just
435. 38:21give them the calls for a week and then it does  the selling for me. I just have to almost trick
436. 38:26them into accepting this beautiful gift because  they or else they or else sometimes they'll get in
437. 38:32their own way and they'll just be like this is too  good to be true. I can't take this. Right. Right.
438. 38:37Right. Guys, tkowners.com. That's my community  where people are building businesses. I do AMAs,
439. 38:42Q&As's every week live. You can ask me anything  you want. You can have accountability partners.
440. 38:47It's about a thousand people in there building,  starting, growing businesses. Check out TKO as in
441. 38:52the Kerner office. tkowners.com. Do you have any  idea like what your close rate is with this pitch?
442. 38:57If you actually get them on the phone, I would  say it takes me one to maybe three trials to get
443. 39:04a locked in business owner. One to three. What's  your turn once you have them? Average client lasts
444. 39:09for I mean it's really if somebody's going to  cancel they usually do it within the first six
445. 39:15months but if they make it past six months  they're sticking around for maybe 5 years or
446. 39:18more. Wow. I have client I still have my first  client like I said so you know there it could be
447. 39:23forever. Are you able to share a URL of a site so  we can see like what it looks like? Why don't you
448. 39:28just go to Google and type in autoglass repair New  Orleans? Okay. You see the second site right below
449. 39:34broadcast right here. There. Yeah, click that.  Okay, this is my basic site. And what's be you,
450. 39:40it's very basic and ugly, but I think it's  beautiful because you know what? It works. Google
451. 39:45is just an algorithm. And it's like a baby and  you want to be abundantly clear to Google, this
452. 39:52is what I do and this is where I do it. You don't  want them to struggle to figure that out. So,
453. 39:59my website loads really fast, easy for Google's  little bot to read, and it clearly conveys that I
454. 40:06am the expert on autoglass repair in New Orleans.  All right. Yeah. And so, it gets the job done.
455. 40:12It communicates properly, and I just keep adding  content to it until it gets to page one. And there
456. 40:16it is. And this site generates around 50 calls or  so a month for a company I've been working with
457. 40:21for five years now. And he pays me around 600  bucks a month for the past five years. and have
458. 40:26maybe talked to him five times. Jeez. And like  you they get the the form leads for free as well,
459. 40:33right? Yes, he gets the form leads as well. Yeah.  And also like I know this site's ugly and basic,
460. 40:38but if you tell me if you're going to hire a  tow towing company or an autoglass company,
461. 40:43do you care if their site is pretty or not? No.  My highest converting newsletter like paid ads
462. 40:50site for my newsletter is this one right here.  No distractions. There can't I'm serious. I've
463. 40:56AB tested it. It looks ridiculous. Like, put  your picture on there. Put a testimonial. No,
464. 41:01that's that's a distraction. That's something  else for them to click. I don't want them to be
465. 41:06distracted by anything. I don't need their number,  their name, anything. Just give me your email.
466. 41:09That's fascinating. That's awesome. Yeah. I mean,  when you're looking for these bluecollar services,
467. 41:14you you you expect the sites to be you want  your tow truck guy to not really care about the
468. 41:19internet his internet presence, you know? If if  my if if I have a contractor roll up to my house
469. 41:25with a wrap truck, I'm saying, "Bro, turn around.  You're too expensive." Yeah, I'm serious. What
470. 41:32What niches do you target? And it does it matter?  Is there a better niche out there than others or
471. 41:38does it mostly come down to supply and demand? It  mostly comes down to the level of competition. So,
472. 41:44I mean, great niches. I I know somebody making  $50,000 a month strictly doing epoxy flooring
473. 41:51leads, right? I know a guy doing $90,000 a month  and all he does is spray foam insulation leads,
474. 41:59right? So, there's a wide variety of niches and  you learn about those ones all the time. Like I
475. 42:04just stumbled across one the other week, uh, crime  scene cleanup. You should look into that industry.
476. 42:10It's actually something that you might find  interesting for your show. Oh, you have? Yeah,
477. 42:14there's like I haven't done an episode on it,  but I I'm aware there's franchises for it. Like
478. 42:19it's a very profitable business. They make so  much money. It's dark business. I don't know if
479. 42:24I'd want to generate leads for that, you know,  but it's an industry not a lot of people have
480. 42:29thought about and you're going to come across  a lot of these types of industries as your eyes
481. 42:32are opening to these different spaces, right?  Yeah. Now, this is a loaded question, but like
482. 42:39what's the 8020 of how to get these to actually  rank? Like let's say you look at these, you know,
483. 42:45these research sites, lot of search traffic, very  low competition. Okay, cool. You buy the domain,
484. 42:52city name in there, you build it. What What are  like the most important things you need to do
485. 42:57to get it to actually rank for the client to get  leads? I'm going to preface this by saying that
486. 43:04too many people follow the SEO blogs and the  big Google updates and stuff and get freaked
487. 43:11out and take them too literally. It's going to be  hard to believe and people are going to think I'm
488. 43:15full of it, but I'm doing the same strategies I  was doing back in 2019 to get local sites ranked,
489. 43:21right? And the 80% is content and backlinks. The  20% is maybe citations, heading structure and
490. 43:31stuff like that, right? But the 80% is content  and backlinks and volume of content, quality of
491. 43:36content and quality of backlinks and volume of  backlinks. But people have to remember if they
492. 43:42go onto Google and do their own research on SEO  and they think that my strategies are outdated,
493. 43:48they have to remember I'm doing local low  competition SEO. All right? And I'm not competing
494. 43:54against I'm not trying to rank for the keyword  weight loss where I'm competing against WGO
495. 43:59and OMIC. I'm competing against the keyword junk  removal Austin Texas and the other sites there are
496. 44:06run by Joe Bill and Steve. Yeah. You just got to  show up. Yeah. Good best principles, back links,
497. 44:13content. Sure, of course. But mostly just show  up. Yeah. Show up. Exactly. And if you're reading
498. 44:20online about all this stuff like schema markup  and and the Google helpful quality content update,
499. 44:26that mostly applies to the major sites that need  highlevel SEO. We're not doing any of that need
500. 44:32to. You know, I probably make more money than a  lot of the people trying to do with do that stuff,
501. 44:36right? You don't have to go after the biggest  fish. You just have to make a bunch of salmon
502. 44:40and trout. You're speaking my language. That's  a fish analogy. I love fish analogies. I'm going
503. 44:45to show you a website here. I uh to your point, I  don't know anything about SEO. I'm not technical.
504. 44:50I I've heard about schema markups. I don't know  what it is. Don't worry about it. Um but I was
505. 44:55doing research for pet cremation. Long story. And  I saw, holy crap, a lot of people are searching
506. 45:01for pet and horse cremation and euthanasia and  no one is providing it. Wow. And so I bought the
507. 45:07domain name. I spent 3,400 on this domain name,  which I don't recommend. Animalare.com and I've
508. 45:14done nothing with it. I set it up and this is my  traffic for the last two years. Wait, you've done
509. 45:19nothing with it? Nothing. I've done nothing with  it. I'm not selling the leads. I'm not If anyone's
510. 45:25listening to this or watching this and you have  a contact at like So Mars, the big candy company,
511. 45:30they own a bunch of vet clinics. If you have  anyone at Mars or anyone that has veterinary
512. 45:35clinics, I will sell you these leads because  I'm getting calls and and like emails every
513. 45:41single day and I'm I got too much going on. I  could sell that for you. Please do. Seriously,
514. 45:46if you could If you're serious, shoot me an email  and then I'll No, I am serious. Like, it's sold
515. 45:51for you. I'm I am serious. I'm not just like this  isn't for the content. I It's been like on my back
516. 45:56burner forever. But my point in showing you that  is that I don't know what I'm doing. I don't know
517. 46:02about SEO, but I knew there was a supply and  demand imbalance. So, we built a website and it
518. 46:08not only does it get leads every single day, but  it's growing every single How are you capturing
519. 46:12leads just like through a form or you a form and  then they go to a Google voice number? Okay. Yeah,
520. 46:18we got to do something with those. That's a really  interesting niche. Yeah, I think it's a valuable
521. 46:23site. A horse cremation costs $3,000. Wow. In the  state of Texas, there's two cremation facilities.
522. 46:30Two Texas. So, that could be a problem because  they probably are already overwhelmed with leads
523. 46:36and they might not be willing to pay for more  if there's only two, right? So, that's two also.
524. 46:41I Yeah, there's some value there to be. For  sure. For sure. Let's talk after about that.
525. 46:46For sure. All right. So, doesn't matter the niche.  I think I got I ran through my questions. Kyle,
526. 46:51sorry to rush us off, but where can we find you  and learn more about you and what you do? So,
527. 46:56if you want to learn more about what I do, I  did set up a page with it's not going to grab
528. 47:00your email or anything like that. It's a whole  page with information on how this business model
529. 47:04works in more detail. Rentlosites.com.  Again, it's rentlocits.com.locites.com.
530. 47:10can explain to you the the the more details about  how this business model works with videos, but
531. 47:15also if you up with me and learn more with little  tips and tricks, you could follow me on Tik Tok. I
532. 47:21am the handle website landlord. It's all one word,  website landlord. That's such a good name. So,
533. 47:27that's such a good name. Rentlosites.com and  website landlord. Two ways to find me. All
534. 47:32right. And you can DM me if you have questions  also. Thank you, Kyle. Thanks so much, Chris. And
535. 47:37um yeah, be in touch. Listen, I need more people  like this to interview on my podcast. So, if you
536. 47:43know of someone with a side hustle or a business  that's unique and cool and super profitable,
537. 47:47email Molly M o ly at coofounders.com. That's one  word, co-founders.com. [email protected].
538. 47:54Tell her your story and we'll give you a hundred  bucks if we end up interviewing them. Please share
539. 47:58with a friend, hit a like or a comment below,  and we'll see you next time on the Kerner