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The Dark Reality of Indian Startups | An India of Ideas | EP 04 | SEN Lifestyle X The Quorum — Transcript

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0:12For me the journey was very different. I
0:14started very early.
0:15>> I really thought that I may never walk
0:17into this office again.
0:18>> Built resilience that I wouldn't have
0:20been able to build otherwise. Most
0:22people are not that patient anymore. The
0:24market is not that patient.
0:25>> So you need to be on ground to
0:27understand all these realities. I don't
0:29have that answer.
0:30>> People really don't care. I started
0:31entrepreneurship fairly late. I was 35.
0:33>> It's your decision.
0:34>> We don't really understand where the
0:36hell what's coming from.
0:37>> 2016 I wrote a cold email [music] to
0:39Naval Ravi Khan that led to the creation
0:41of Angelist in India.
0:42>> You will have to build very very clean.
0:45>> This is not something new.
0:46>> Started taking feedback without telling
0:48them that you were the CEO. If you have
0:50issues, you can't sleep.
0:51>> Sacrificing your health, hair, every
0:53single thing. These guys have made it.
0:58>> [music]
1:04[music]
1:11[music]
1:15>> This book is personal to me. It's not
1:17just a book. It's not just pages. It's
1:19not just words. It's an emotion. 10
1:23years back exactly in 2016 I wrote a
1:25cold email to Naval Ravi Khan that led
1:27to the creation of Angelist in India
1:30that led to me investing in over 200
1:32startups and it's never been the same
1:34like I've spoken to over thousand plus
1:35founders in my journey in the last
1:38decade in the startup ecosystem and boy
1:40I mean every single conversation is
1:42magical and memorable and some of them
1:44not so much because they all have
1:46problems issues and things that they
1:49want to discuss with me and sometimes I
1:51don't have that answer. So that's when I
1:53said let's create offline which is a
1:55community of top tech founders where you
1:57can problem solve all of this together
1:59and offline's blooming but how can I
2:02make this more accessible and that's
2:04when the idea for this book came along
2:06where let's distribute this knowledge
2:08that disperse this knowledge 100 plus
2:11best founders they're here with me right
2:13now on this stage as well and put it
2:15into chapters that anyone who's looking
2:17to start up thinking about startup or
2:19even quitting or thinking about quitting
2:22their startup can refer to and that's
2:24why we call it the founder manual and by
2:26the way startups are sexy these days
2:28everybody wants to be on Shark Tank
2:30economic times IPOs are hot esops are
2:32hot but not everyone should do a startup
2:35like I mean the cost of doing a startup
2:37is sacrifice sacrificing your health
2:40hair family life every single thing
2:43honestly and these guys have made it so
2:46I'm going to chat with them for the next
2:47354 minutes and then I'm going to hand
2:49over the floor to you so you can ask the
2:51smarter questions on what does it really
2:53take to become a founder, stay in it.
2:56The founder manual, pick one up when
2:58you're about to start up and also read
3:00it again when you're looking to quit
3:02your startup. What was that one single
3:04moment where you said that this is it?
3:06Like I'm not cut out for this. I want to
3:07quit. I want to call my mom. I want to
3:09like leave this office. Like I want to
3:11leave my co-founder. What is that one
3:13single emotional moment, day, particular
3:15call that you remember very vividly in
3:17your journey where you said that I'm
3:19done? By the way, the only qualification
3:22that we or the qualifier for somebody to
3:24be on the panel was the name Gorov, not
3:26the company.
3:27>> Let me give you a quick introduction to
3:29them also. Gorov Katri was actually I
3:32mean all three of them have had
3:34different capital journeys, right? Gorov
3:36Katri was selling smartphone cases
3:38before and now the leading smartwatch
3:40brand in the country with noise.
3:42Goravnager
3:432024 one of the cleanest IPOs in the new
3:46age tech world with TBO 18 years in the
3:49making. What a solid listing. Goravarbal
3:521 MG we've all used it leading e-arm
3:55pharmacy and what a solid solid exit to
3:57Tata group and now Tatan MG. So kudos to
4:00all of you and with that let's get down
4:02to the emotional moment of building.
4:04>> See honestly I don't have a very
4:05emotional moment to share but uh for me
4:09the journey was very different. I
4:10started very early maybe 22 23 was my
4:13age and uh that was the only thing that
4:15I was doing right uh I was supposed to
4:18be a pilot could not make it to a
4:20commercial airline uh for whatever
4:22reasons but the only thing that I had
4:25was to ensure that this works so there
4:27was no moment honestly where I could
4:29think that you know there's an option of
4:31quitting and going back to something
4:33else so there is there is no hard
4:36emotional moment that I remember but
4:38yeah there have been tough times for
4:40There have been moments when you have
4:41felt clueless. Uh in fact you mentioned
4:44that we started with cases and cover and
4:46that was one moment where you were doing
4:48great. We were selling. We were making
4:50money. Uh but still we did not know if
4:53consumer is genuinely buying a brand or
4:55is just buying a commodity. That was the
4:56most directional moment that I remember
4:58and glad we took the you know uh pause.
5:02Pressed the reset button started the
5:03business all from scratch again and
5:06thought of building a brand which has
5:08much more than commodity. How do we
5:11genuinely build that consumer tech space
5:13where the you know the entrance to the
5:16market is not so easy that any random
5:18person can just pick up uh from Gafar
5:20and start selling it. So at least uh
5:23those ideas got cl you know cleared when
5:26you were building early on the noise but
5:28yeah largely I don't think when you get
5:30into an entrepreneurship there's an
5:32option of quitting.
5:33>> I don't think I ever got to a point
5:35where I wanted to quit but there was a
5:38point where I felt business and that was
5:41the when the covid uh crisis started. So
5:44we had a travel business and uh in fact
5:47we had moved into a very new office. Uh
5:49we had a new investor uh a former
5:51capital had come in just a year ago and
5:54uh COVID happened completely out of the
5:56blue. The business shut down overnight
6:00and you know you can think of any worst
6:02case scenario you cannot imagine a
6:04scenario where your revenues go into
6:05negative right so at that point there
6:07are more cancellations happening in the
6:08business than bookings.
6:11And that day when I walked out of the
6:14office when this whole lockdown got
6:15announced and I walked out of the
6:17office, I really thought that I may
6:19never walk into this office again. I
6:20really felt that that this is probably
6:22the last time I'm walking out of this
6:24office because we will not be so we are
6:26not a very funded company. We had only
6:28ever in the history of the company we we
6:31had before the IPO. We had only ever
6:32raised about 50 crores of capital which
6:34was way back in 2012.
6:36>> A former had been a secondary deal. So
6:38while they came in, they bought Nasper
6:39ST. So we didn't have that much money in
6:41the company. To make things worse, I
6:43felt really sick a few months into the
6:45crisis. So I had some crazy rare
6:48autoimmune thing happen to me. Got
6:50really really sick. And at that point it
6:54did feel that you know this thing is not
6:57going to survive. Right? So this this
6:59thought I would say it didn't I did not
7:01think so but the thought crossed my
7:02mind. I don't think I ever verbalized or
7:05articulated that to anybody at all ever.
7:07Right? Because if I was freaking out, I
7:09don't know what would have happened to
7:10the team. I never articulated it. But
7:12>> not even your co-founder, not even your
7:13wife. I mean,
7:15>> I think you know it was so people close
7:18to the business, right? My co-founder or
7:20my wife, they also were probably
7:22thinking the same thing but nobody
7:24wanted to say it aloud, right? We all
7:25thinking business we are in zero like
7:28literally zero revenues. We have,500
7:30people in the company. How are we going
7:32to survive? Nobody wanted to say
7:33anything.
7:35uh but I think uh you know things turned
7:37around uh we kept our head uh on our
7:40shoulders and eventually in retrospect
7:42not that I'm saying I ever wish that co
7:44had happened but the fact that the
7:46crisis happened was a turning point for
7:49the company but we got really really
7:51close to it all getting over
7:53>> what a turnaround like I think if you
7:54Google his name and net worth I think
7:57you'll find out he's the second richest
7:59man in Guro so you didn't hear it here
8:02please edit this out
8:03>> I think two instances is one uh where I
8:06really felt or I really had a come to
8:09Jesus moment where I felt I I wasn't
8:12sure if I was made for it and I think
8:13some context that you know I started
8:15entrepreneurship fairly late I was 35 I
8:18had a fairly successful career in the US
8:20etc. moved back to India, started 1MG
8:23and I think in many ways you know I was
8:25that sort of quote unquote [snorts]
8:28uh you know dream founder you know like
8:31great pedigree great experience you know
8:34done great stuff leadership positions in
8:36the US etc technology and then uh we
8:39started 1MG and we were like okay
8:40market's hot we're going to go raise
8:42money this is back in 2014 2015 and uh I
8:46don't know if anyone remembers this was
8:47uh when Snapdy and Flipkart had like a
8:50really tough time raising and we go in
8:52the market and we couldn't raise a dime
8:54and we were raising like a series A
8:56round we thought we'd be done in a
8:57month's time I think for a year like we
9:01just talked to maybe every investor on
9:03the planet in Mountain View in San
9:05Francisco here etc and I don't know how
9:10many here maybe most people would have
9:12done fundraisers etc but it's the most
9:14humbling journey experience you can go
9:17through in your life where regardless of
9:19what you've accomplished lished you
9:21basically feel that you're good for
9:23you've you've amounted to nothing in
9:25your life and I think that uh you know
9:28it led to a lot of uh like challenges
9:31where I you know I had mental health
9:32issues etc and I think in that moment I
9:35called up my founder and I said like
9:36dude like I don't know are we are we not
9:39meant for this etc and you know I told I
9:42called up my wife as well I'm sort of
9:44very emotional and needy that way and um
9:47you know I was very very fortunate that
9:49we got the support but that one instance
9:53where
9:54where we lucked out and we raised our
9:57first round maybe a year and a half and
9:59I think
10:01once I went through all these challenges
10:03my co-founder you know lifted me on his
10:05shoulders and carried me along. I think
10:07that built resilience that I wouldn't
10:10have been able to build otherwise and I
10:13think every other thing that came along
10:15just meant key okay we survived that I
10:17think we survived this also and you know
10:19let's just put one front one foot in
10:20front of the other so yeah
10:22>> but in e-arm pharmacy let's staying with
10:24that thought for a minute regulations
10:26have always been sort of like a headwind
10:28right they've not been in your favor and
10:31now we're getting in India like I mean
10:33we're digitizing demand at a speed
10:34that's unbelievable like I mean nobody
10:36thought 10 minute house 10 minute I mean
10:40it's absurd right I don't want my
10:41shaving cream in 10 minutes that's
10:44totally okay when is quick commerce for
10:46medicines going to be a reality in India
10:48I I think there's there's real economics
10:52challenges with quick commerce for
10:53medicine in India and uh I don't
10:57>> just economics or is it something else
10:58>> I don't know how much time we want to
10:59spend in this panel talking about uh
11:01quick commerce and medicines but but I
11:03I'll give you I'll give you the short
11:05version of this But you know grocery
11:08quick commerce works because the whole
11:10reason why grocery quick commerce works
11:12is because you can aggregate enough
11:14demand in a kilometer and you can
11:16actually do delivery. So if you look at
11:17a blinket or a zeppto or whatever dark
11:19store they are delivering in like a
11:21kilometer kilometer and a half which
11:23basically controls their cost to maybe
11:2530 40 rupees per delivery and you
11:27essentially have an assortment and brand
11:30switching is okay you know you don't get
11:32necessary you get something else
11:33actually e-arm pharmacy has a lot of
11:35challenges because in India you cannot
11:36substitute brands as a regulated player
11:39if you go to a pharmacy a mom and pop
11:41pharmacy you can ask them for something
11:42and they can give you something else but
11:44for a regulated pharmacy you cannot do
11:46that and the moment you can't do that
11:48you're basically talking about 40,000
11:50SKs you know 10 rupee 20 rupee SKs that
11:53you have to stock to actually meet the
11:55demand and then compared to how many
11:57times in a kilometer someone orders
11:59grocery which is two times a day versus
12:01orders medicines fundamentally kills the
12:04demand funnel at the top right so you
12:06just cannot have the economics to work
12:08at that level so we do quick commerce in
12:10Gura but quick commerce for us is a
12:1230-minute delivery because that's where
12:14we the economics stop
12:18>> [music]
12:27[music]
12:27>> There is a story in the book where you
12:29said that you were sitting on a flight,
12:30somebody next to you was wearing a noise
12:32uh uh watch and you started taking
12:34feedback without telling them that you
12:36were the CEO. They gave you the feedback
12:37that wireless earbuds for I think sports
12:40are not doing that well or that's a
12:42capture I mean a wide space and you've
12:45been answering like calls of customers
12:47and in your early days as well. So at
12:49what point in your journey did the team
12:51tell you or did you selfactualize this
12:53key I should be the CEO now I'm not
12:56responsible for customer feedback or
12:57being on the front line and how does a
13:00founder think about stepping back from
13:02what Airbnb CEO now famously says
13:05founder mode or micromanaging
13:07>> see honestly uh first of all our
13:10business is a consumer brand business
13:12you know the first word itself is a
13:14consumer where if you are not connected
13:16with a consumer and this is my personal
13:18you know passion also to genuinely
13:20understand where is the you know
13:22loophole in the system which is not
13:23working why the product has failed
13:25because there are so as you become large
13:27there are so many teams so many
13:28operations that are running in par and
13:30everybody
13:31you know would keep blending in any
13:33product problem delivery problem
13:40at least sometimes it is very important
13:41to get into the situation
13:43to really understand if there is a
13:45genuine issue from our side or where
13:47exactly is uh loophole for me. My opion
13:50is to honestly understand how consumer
13:53are talking, what is their demand, what
13:55is their need. You know, I think two
13:58three days back only there was a mail
13:59that came to me that uh you know I have
14:02this watch with me uh for that I have
14:05lost my charger and this charger is not
14:07available on your website and this is
14:09coming from my son's first salary. I was
14:12like
14:14and I think that mail came to me
14:16directly. I'm sure that they would have
14:17tried it and sourcing it all across the
14:19system but then the moment I got to know
14:21I just pulled up all the people from the
14:23team emotional attachment and the teams
14:27who are picking up calls every day and
14:29morning they would not really relate
14:30with that emotions that you are building
14:32the brand with. So it's important
14:34honestly
14:39but fortunately I'm lucky that I got a
14:41good people in the system that I trust
14:43more I know they can do better job than
14:45me but I still love I still love to read
14:48the mails from the consumer especially
14:50when they are writing negative feedback
14:54people don't respect a brand brand
14:57is that specifically for that smartphone
14:59cases business that you were building or
15:00do you think that's more applicable for
15:03any largely I felt uh in my accessories
15:06business because this was also again
15:07consumer feedback uh that I got so
15:10somewhere I was and I was seeing
15:12somebody using my cases and cover and I
15:13asked him
15:16from where did you get it and they
15:17didn't even remember the brand they were
15:19like I like the design and I just bought
15:20it they don't remember it that time I
15:23realized I think in my mind as a founder
15:25I'm thinking oh world is buying me
15:27because I'm a brand I'm giving a better
15:29experience and all those ones but in
15:31reality lot of categories at a different
15:32price point. People really don't care
15:35what are they buying it for. They are
15:36just buying it for a need. So you need
15:38to be on ground to understand all these
15:40realities. People not everybody is you
15:43know formed in a shape that they can
15:46understand all these small small nuances
15:48that genuinely help you to build the
15:50business and build the brand. So I think
15:51these things have helped
15:55[music]
16:02>> [music]
16:09>> You're living life quarter to quarter
16:10now. But most founders these days get
16:13very impatient if the series A is not
16:15happening in 9 months. Like people are
16:16looking for external validation. But you
16:19stayed calm during that time. And
16:21there's a story in the book where you
16:22say that you took two years to refine
16:24your equity story. Most people are not
16:27that patient anymore. The market is not
16:29that patient. If you're not coming on
16:31panels like this, you've lost out,
16:33right? So external validation plus inner
16:35voice like philosophical balance like
16:38how do you find that?
16:39>> I think your early startup experiences
16:41you know shape a lot of what you do in
16:44the future and when we started in we
16:46started in 2007 2006 we incorporated we
16:48started in 2007. So just like everybody
16:50else, you know, we went aggressively
16:52into the into the VC ecosystem to raise
16:56money. A lot of B2C business got funded
16:59the same year. The make my trip, yatra,
17:01clear trip,
17:04flight, raja via like six businesses got
17:07funded. B2C business got funded that
17:09year
17:13VC. We used to go to Mumbai's you know
17:15literally sit you know outside the doors
17:18of VC VC VC and nothing worked for me. I
17:21drew such an had such an allergic
17:23reaction to the you know private equity
17:26VC ecosystem at that point in time I
17:29like screw it we're just going to build
17:30a profitable business. So completely you
17:33know withdrew from that whole VCPCP
17:36ecosystem because we also realized that
17:37our business was slightly non-standard
17:39it would not find traction right. So to
17:41be fair to everyone I understood why it
17:44would not find traction with that
17:45ecosystem. So he completely turned
17:47around and said we're going to build a
17:49profitable business. So except for that
17:50one co year in 20 years we've never had
17:52a loss right always built profitably.
17:54Now when it the time came for the IPO
17:57you know I was still burned from my old
18:00experiences and in my mind I was you
18:03know hand to my heart I was so scared
18:05that we will launch an IPO and nobody's
18:07going to buy. So I got we got a
18:09consultant involved and we understood
18:11you know the whole uh IPO process and I
18:15was told that there is this thing that
18:16that you do an IPO road show uh leading
18:19up to the IPO which is 3 weeks of so 21
18:22days of eight meetings a day with
18:25investors in in Mumbai, Singapore, Hong
18:27Kong etc. They're going to speak the
18:29story out 150 times you know in 3 weeks.
18:32It's a it's an exhausting process
18:35because you know I had seen such you
18:38know I had been so bad at it the first
18:40time I tried it. I decided to really
18:42hone my skills on you know telling my
18:45story. So we spend a lot of time doing
18:47the story well and I think it came out
18:49well and thankfully then the IPO got
18:51over subscribed.
18:51>> I have like PR agencies I believe
18:53somebody I know who hired a PR agency to
18:55get trained for their IPO road shows
18:57like there are these coaches
18:59>> that in my humble opinion is a very bad
19:01idea.
19:02because you know it's it's not PR and uh
19:05if you can't tell your equity story
19:07yourself without help of PR that's a
19:09problem.
19:12[music]
19:18[music]
19:19How do you build systems in place to
19:22manage this scale at trust so that it
19:24doesn't break?
19:25>> It happened the hard ways or the hard
19:28way. So when we were when we were
19:30starting out 2014 you know circa if if
19:33you guys remember again we're going back
19:3512 years if you remember it was the era
19:38of uh uh no fixed asset startups like
19:42Uber was the biggest cab company without
19:44any cabs. Airbnb was the biggest hotel
19:47startup without any hotels etc etc. So
19:50we were like oh my god we are going to
19:51be the biggest healthcare company
19:53without any healthcare assets right.
19:54[snorts] So we started with uh with you
19:57know 1MG being a marketplace a
19:58marketplace for pharmacy which was local
20:01mom and pop stores. We started
20:02diagnostics. Thyroare was our
20:04diagnostics back end then. And by the
20:06way most people don't know but we are
20:07one of the largest diagnostics brand in
20:09the country today. So top five uh very
20:11very close to thyroidare in size numbers
20:14etc. You know we didn't have our
20:15warehouses etc. And in 2 years in and we
20:19felt you know technology is going to
20:20solve all the problems. We used to write
20:22these amazing algorithms which could
20:23predict where we would find stuff. You
20:26know two years in it struck
20:28like we were hit with the fact that we
20:31are trying to deliver healthare where
20:32the only thing we also say matters is
20:34trust and we don't really understand
20:37where the hell what's coming from right
20:38we don't know like how things are
20:40getting tested we don't know how
20:42medicines are coming from what stores
20:43and we are doing all this due diligence
20:45to understand you know that quality is
20:47not compromised but we don't control it
20:49and that day we made a decision that we
20:51will actually control our supply chain
20:52so we started to own insource most of
20:55our supply chain and we actually set up
20:56at that time a quality function. So I
20:59don't know like how many of you know
21:01that there are quality functions in
21:03healthcare companies and there are
21:04quality standards and as at least as far
21:07as I'm I'm aware hospitals are mandatory
21:10required to get them. So they have these
21:11standards NABH, NABJ etc. which they are
21:14supposed to you know get certifications
21:16for. So we actually hired someone from a
21:19hospital um a very very renowned
21:21hospital used to run the quality
21:23function there. And this person actually
21:25sat out of all the organizations and ran
21:26our quality. So today 1MG does around
21:2860,000 odd quality checks and audits
21:31through all our facilities at random
21:33every year. And [clears throat] those
21:36metrics are actually things that are not
21:38left to businesses to have an opinion
21:41on. They need to get fixed. And we
21:43eventually decided that we didn't want
21:45to build a healthcare company that we
21:46won't use ourselves. Right? So we were
21:49we were anal about you know the
21:51standards we set. For instance in
21:52diagnostics um you know we have a
21:54standard in the country called NAB
21:56National Accredititation Board for
21:57Laboratories. It's a non-mandatory
21:59standard which means that if you go to a
22:02lab which doesn't have an ABR then it is
22:04not required to follow a daily quality
22:06check process to ensure that you get
22:09results that are that are let's say at
22:11least meet some standard. At 1MG we only
22:14run labs that are NAB certified. We have
22:16college of American pathologists um you
22:18know certification as well. We hit a
22:21global benchmark in terms of quality
22:23score. So a lot of this happened because
22:25we wanted to build a company that we
22:26would use for ourselves. And a lot of it
22:28happened because we wanted to do things
22:30the right way, not just build a
22:32business, right? And that was I think
22:33the core cultural difference.
22:35>> If you follow Goravaral on LinkedIn, he
22:38writes some of the best stories and I've
22:39been assured that those are not
22:41ghostritten. He's using uh not using AI.
22:43He's doing them themselves. But also
22:45check out the 1MG app. I don't know if
22:47you've many of you have downloaded in
22:49the recent times but it's I think one of
22:50the best experiences for uploading your
22:51blood test results and getting a good
22:54view into uh everything in a very
22:56beautiful format like unlike those ugly
22:58PDFs that come in your
22:59>> so true story I tried to hire a
23:01ghostriter then I fired them a month
23:02later and it hasn't happened
23:10>> [music]
23:21[music]
23:25>> Goro, how do you think about uh trust at
23:27scale? Because you're building a
23:28consumer hardware business. Many people
23:30in the industry in our audience as well
23:32will be building D2C brands where they
23:34can touch and feel the product but it's
23:36such a large scale that you'd never know
23:38what it hits what's the supply chain how
23:41does it logistically reach a customer so
23:43how do you manage that end of the this
23:46thing
23:47>> so for me I would say uh a lot of it
23:50happened in initial few years because
23:52whatever noise we see today is probably
23:55a 5 year old story but the journey
23:57started almost 10 to 12 years now. Uh
24:00there has been a lot of grunt work that
24:02has gone in all these small details you
24:04know sitting in the warehouse operating
24:05from the customer support center
24:07starting a business from basement uh
24:09while doing things from a bootstrapped
24:12uh way the only thing that I learned was
24:16probably to be disciplined and
24:17monitoring the right thing always
24:19thinking about profitability first
24:21because that's the only way to survive
24:23and I think that check you know pushed
24:25me to not take those decisions which are
24:30you know high speed in growth local
24:33deploy money we will see what needs to
24:35be done there is we see money we can you
24:37know win all the battles by money I
24:39think for me that option was never there
24:40so I think that you know resilience or
24:43that discipline came from uh you know
24:46the overall how the company was set up
24:48and I feel now that I was fortunate that
24:50I you know where the world was throwing
24:52money on the problems in our ecosystem
24:55and we kept our cool there and kept
24:59making the right set of product rather
25:01than you know going here and there and
25:03solving unnecessary problem. For us it
25:05was always important to stay closer to
25:07the consumer and solve the problem that
25:09they have rather than just creating a
25:10different problem and solving it for no
25:12one. So I think uh keeping our numbers
25:16in check was always there and hence
25:19probably you know we built the basic
25:21trust and kept very high on quality and
25:24building the right tech. And one related
25:27question inse
25:34honestly it will take a lot of time
25:36because
25:38>> whatever we say today the country does
25:41not have the ecosystem.
25:43We have people to assemble. We know how
25:46to screw it. How we know how to shoulder
25:49it. But if I tell you there is 500 other
25:52department that are needed to run a
25:54entire production. there's a tech
25:56company needed. So there are no one who
25:58are genuinely building the tech. There
25:59is no one who is genuinely building the
26:01design. There is no one who is genuinely
26:03building the uh IPS that are related for
26:06all these variable sensors and all lot
26:07of other things. Uh I think we are still
26:10little far. Uh I
26:11>> if you were to do two fixes for the
26:13hardware ecosystem to shift to India,
26:15how can we stop importing these Chinese
26:17goods mobile phones anything that we
26:19use?
26:20>> See it's not going to h so let me take
26:22an easier example for the world. I think
26:24if you think about e-commerce there's a
26:26logistics as one big arm that the
26:28different set of industry is solving for
26:30it. The payment is a different set of
26:32people solving for it. Government got
26:34involved UPI came in and that enablement
26:37happened. Credit card companies are
26:38solving for you know the whatever buy
26:41now pay later stuff and lot of other
26:43companies are solving for the payment
26:44gateways have come in that are not the
26:46banks the payment companies were very
26:49different. So these are the ecosystem
26:51that got built in India for our stuff. I
26:54think we are still away. I think there
26:55has to be a lot of investment that needs
26:57to go. The thought of this country needs
27:00to change. It's just not one brand can
27:03completely change. It's very capital
27:05inensive uh very late ROId driven
27:09business. Uh but I think it will happen
27:12but it will take its own time.
27:26>> [music]
27:31>> How did that change your worldview on
27:34how you hire candidates in the future?
27:37So uh so we run a very global business
27:40uh and just you know for the audience
27:41essentially our business is enabling any
27:44travel seller so travel agents tour
27:46operators online travel agencies to get
27:48access to travel supply. So business is
27:50very global you know 90% of revenue
27:53happens from a travel buyer like a
27:55online travel agency or a travel agency
27:56in some part of the b world sending a
27:58traveler to some other part of the world
28:00and to build a business you know which
28:02is so distributed and global you have to
28:04create a ecosystem which essentially is
28:06highly empowered but needs to have
28:08strong governance because there is no
28:10way right so we operate in Brazil we
28:12operate in North America we operate in
28:14the Middle East we operate in Australia
28:15we have like you know 28 subsidiaries or
28:17something like that when when you're
28:19operating at that that geod diversity
28:23you know sitting here there is no way to
28:25know what's going to be happening in
28:26different parts of the world. So there
28:28are two ways to do it you know one is
28:30you build a very tight control on
28:32everything and then you're trying
28:34obsessing over you know every decision
28:39send an approval and I realized that
28:41especially in a high growth scenario
28:42that never works. So we took a very
28:44conscious call of saying let's build a
28:46highly dis you know empowered and a uh
28:50distributed organization. So the regions
28:52kind of run fairly independently on
28:54their own, right? Months would go before
28:56I even have a chance to talk to them.
28:59Now with that, how do you bring
29:00governance governance and control? And I
29:02think that's a culture thing. You have
29:04to make sure that you create a culture
29:06where you know trust is inherent and
29:08integrity is non-negotiable.
29:11So that lens is very important because
29:13otherwise it's a very very slippery
29:15slope. uh as such compliance and
29:17governance is hard because you have
29:18there's all these dozens of geographies
29:20that you're trying to do business in but
29:21on top of that if you have issues and if
29:23you in your mind you you know you can't
29:25sleep because you're thinking that how's
29:27purchasing opening happening over there
29:29how do we work with vendors in that
29:30country how do we do appeals in that
29:32country you can't right so you have to
29:34leave it on culture and which is why you
29:36know this test is very important for us
29:37to say that look you know you will have
29:40to build very very clean you know and
29:43that is a non-negotiable and then it
29:45flows, right? Once you've set that
29:47standard, people realize that this is
29:49not how this company operates. And that
29:51allows you to be far more trustworthy of
29:54your organization at scale. So, this is
29:56really where it comes from. You can't
29:57build a global business if you have to
30:00micromanage at a level of establishing
30:02trust in every part of the world.
30:04>> And all three of you have had different
30:07capital journeys like I mean you were
30:09bootstrapped for most part now have Bose
30:10as an investor, public markets for you,
30:12Tata. I mean I'm going to ask any beer
30:15biceps fan in the crowd uh they might
30:17like this question. Does it ever get
30:19lonely and what is loneliness to you?
30:21You were with Tata. You have a public
30:23market board member you have both now.
30:26So definitions of loneliness for all of
30:28you individually like you know
30:30entrepreneurship has always been
30:32glamorous and sexy but I actually think
30:34it's it's a really lonely journey and uh
30:38if you founded something I think you
30:41don't have an option to quit. you have
30:43so much responsibility with everyone
30:45else that you've tagged along on the
30:46journey that you have to somehow make it
30:48right and parents
30:52it's easier to ask peers for help and
30:55actually get help from peers but if you
30:57go to parents for help
31:00you know how did you not even think of
31:02and you know I'm using the word parent
31:04metaphorically so if you go to a parent
31:06for help then you get scolded b they
31:09judge you for actually being incompetent
31:11uh c they will find ways to get more
31:13control in whatever you're trying to do
31:15right like if if a child is making
31:16mistakes then the parent wants to
31:18basically drive right so we actually if
31:20we have problems we try and sort it
31:22ourselves we we actually never never
31:24travel to Bombay for that and uh they're
31:26kind enough to you know look the other
31:28way as well
31:29>> look something I think something similar
31:30in the past whenever we had uh private
31:33equity on the board I truly appreciated
31:36the fact that they remained hands off
31:39and uh it is very lonely you And I think
31:42all of
31:44[laughter]
31:49literally this is what our pod is. It's
31:50like a big sob session of all the
31:52founders but this is it is it is I think
31:56it is very lonely but you also realize
31:57that it is truly your own journey right
31:59while people you can take advice there
32:01is nobody who can truly help you as well
32:03there is an ecosystem that you do create
32:05because the support uh system is very
32:06important I definitely you know I do go
32:09to my parents also my wife I think uh
32:11>> using the parent
32:12>> metaphor [laughter]
32:16yeah so uh I do see family as a big uh
32:20support and the important thing with the
32:21family is that you to even in good times
32:23you have to keep them updated on the
32:24business otherwise you know you they
32:26can't offer you any advice if you come
32:28to them only when you're in deep so
32:31I use family I have a co-founder which
32:33helps and I have a very supportive board
32:35uh again the board works in a way that
32:38you know they you can reach out to them
32:40but they would never unnecessarily come
32:41and ask and that's kind of like a arms
32:43length I've always preferred to keep
32:45with our investors with board members
32:46that look you know we will reach out if
32:48we need support and we do when we when
32:51we need to but end of the day you know
32:53you can say whatever you can ask for all
32:54the support in the world that journey is
32:56your own and those problems have to be
32:58solved by you. How does it feel
32:59preparing like for that first quarterly
33:02earnings call like what was going
33:04through your head
33:10ever since we listed it's [laughter]
33:12it it is overwhelming uh I think uh you
33:16know you do not realize uh you truly do
33:19not realize what you're getting into for
33:20mostly for the good parts right I think
33:22uh it's a it's great to be a listed
33:24company it has a huge amount of perks
33:26but the it is overwhelming there is a
33:28lot of pressure and you realize it after
33:30tomorrow is my eighth one. So now I'm
33:32sitting here. I don't really care so
33:34much about you know what I'm going to
33:36say tomorrow. But it is it is
33:38overwhelming the first time you're doing
33:39it. You also make a big deal out of it
33:41because you were thinking that you know
33:42I'm a listed company but then you
33:44realize yeah there are 3,000 listed
33:45companies in India. You're one of them
33:47right? There are results happening you
33:49know every hour during the earnings uh
33:52period. So after a while you kind of you
33:54know reduce that self-importance you
33:55were giving yourself listed. you realize
33:59it's just another day results stock
34:02price correlation unfortunately right
34:06our business is literally like it's
34:08probably you know multiple times bigger
34:11than what it was 2 years ago and while
34:14we are above the offer price we are
34:16still below the price at which we opened
34:18on the day of listing so what can I say
34:20right so after a point you don't care
34:29How does loneliness work for you?
34:31>> No, I think for us maintaining that
34:33relationship with your brother as a
34:34co-founder I think that in itself is an
34:36achievement.
34:37>> So yeah, for us I think uh for first
34:39seven years when we were building noise
34:41we were living in the same house. So it
34:43was like 24/7 we are together sharing
34:44all the problems and knowing all the
34:46problems. I feel that we were fortunate
34:48that we did not have a board. We did not
34:50have a pressure of valuation, numbers,
34:52delivery. We could do the things that we
34:54wanted. we could do the things that were
34:56right but yeah there are times when you
34:59genuinely get stuck and you don't know
35:00what is the right decision because the
35:02only thing in bootstrap that I've
35:04learned is you are not allowed to make
35:06lot of wrong decisions almost all your
35:08decision needs to go right uh if they
35:10are not right you just need to change
35:12very very fast so there are times when
35:14you get stuck and when your co-founder
35:16is living with you for 24/7 I think I
35:18don't know what we can discuss I think
35:21anyway so I don't think but I think uh
35:24largely it is it is the fellow
35:28co-founders or people who are running
35:29the businesses you go for go and seek
35:32advices from them because they
35:34understand the pain of building they
35:36understand the you know
35:39how they have felt into different
35:41multiple situations in their past. So of
35:43course seeking help from couple of
35:45mentors largely from them otherwise
35:51negative advice but sometimes advice is
35:54not net positive but actually
35:57takes you down.
35:57>> Yeah those mistakes you keep on making I
36:00think it's just that you have to realize
36:02it faster. You have to keep checking on
36:03the decisions that you're taking every
36:05day. And I think that's what I'm telling
36:06the bootstrap thing just tells you to
36:08keep checking again and again again and
36:10again again again and again. So there
36:13one good thing is that you don't have a
36:14pressure even if you fail it's your
36:16decision. So the loneliness is all the
36:18decision your decision
36:22that you know we need to raise more
36:24funds because in just a day or two it
36:26will nothing will happen. So all
36:27decision your decision is just I think
36:30uh
36:31I think it's not very different honestly
36:33I think the journey is very very similar
36:35ultimately then we joined offline to you
36:37know have more fellows to cry on their
36:40shoulder
36:40>> but now that we've heard all three
36:42stories you've had different stories and
36:45different paths uh if you were to pick
36:48and everyone has to pick one option from
36:50the other two IPO exit to strategic
36:54large conglomerate or bootstrapped and
36:56then is what would it be for you?
36:58>> Nobody's happy in their shoes. Trust me.
37:01[laughter]
37:02>> Yeah, I think when if I'll be building a
37:04second one, I'll be wanting a more uh
37:07reasonable life, little less pressure
37:09than I've been bearing it for so many
37:10years. I would uh want to build it slow,
37:14build it for the right purpose, for the
37:16bigger things, controlling lot of things
37:18by our hand. Uh so maybe IPO
37:23>> maybe IPO IPO becomes less less
37:25pressure.
37:28point
37:29I would not do I would not want to build
37:32again to sell something. So that's the
37:33only thing I'm trying to but again
37:35there's no right decision. It depends
37:36upon what category I built on what is
37:38the right uh market at that particular
37:40time. I think uh bootstrap and for all
37:43practical purposes uh we were largely a
37:46bootstrapped business. We got at any
37:48point in time we had exactly one
37:50investor on on the cap table. We raise
37:52very limited money always with the
37:54mindset that money literally whatever we
37:56raise 50 crores is always just s sat in
37:58a fd never really spend that money I
38:01feel that a bootstrap life is amazing
38:04>> you know you are in charge of your own
38:05destiny you're not answering to anybody
38:08>> and then you can take all the profit out
38:10and enjoy that as well
38:13[laughter]
38:14>> that's the asterisk but yeah I think a
38:16bootstrap I wouldn't mind a bootstrap
38:17life again
38:18>> for you bootstrap life man I think I
38:21think That's the dream for everyone.
38:25You know, you have enough money.
38:26Somebody was telling me
38:32[laughter]
38:33[music]
38:39[music]
38:45[music]
38:57>> [music]
38:58>> Great hire teaches you a lot, but I
39:01think a bad hire teaches you a lot more.
39:03What did that one bad hire teach you?
39:07>> You know,
39:07>> or what was
39:08>> what I've learned is that earlier you
39:10used to carry it.
39:12It's me maybe not understanding him.
39:14He's the right one. and he has done so
39:16well in his other companies. Uh if I
39:19have to do it, I mean the one thing that
39:21I have to change probably I would just
39:23say that you know I will take faster
39:24decisions in this. Uh if things are not
39:27working, it's better to be upfront and
39:29be candid about it. Uh but largely that
39:32is I think you still will make mistake.
39:33You will never be hiring the perfect
39:35person every time. Uh largely you will I
39:39will just think about the authenticity
39:41and the you know the hustle is there or
39:43not. That's it. So I think uh I learned
39:46this lesson very early and we hired
39:49somebody and we were very I mean we were
39:52very young 20 26 27 we hired somebody
39:55who was much older uh and very
39:59experienced to kind of help us uh raise
40:02money at the time when we were trying to
40:05raise money back then. and uh while the
40:08you know fundraisers did not go well
40:10they did bring a strategic buyer on the
40:14table
40:15and uh front led the negotiations on on
40:19our behalf with this buyer [snorts]
40:22and eventually that deal did not happen.
40:24It literally on the 11th hour we said no
40:26to that deal but then this guy who we
40:28had hired went ahead and joined the
40:29buyer the next day. The next day he left
40:32and joined the buyer and he took a lot
40:33of people with him. The lesson learned I
40:37think the lesson learned was that we
40:39made two mistakes and you know I don't
40:41know if I've learned from those mistakes
40:43because I think I repeated them as well
40:45but what I realized was that you know
40:48sometimes and when maybe you do it when
40:50you're younger you you you mistake
40:52experience you give too much value to
40:55experience and as you gain experience
40:57yourself you realize that you know
40:59experience has value but not immense
41:01value. The second mistake I think we
41:03made was and you know coming to the
41:05first point uh the signals around ethics
41:08and values are often very visible very
41:11early in very high performing people and
41:14you sometimes choose to look away
41:16because the person is so high performing
41:18right and you start to think yeah this
41:20person is so good I should choose to
41:22look away and which is probably one of
41:24the other reasons I became so black and
41:26white about it later on because you
41:28could see that in certain situations you
41:30know the core values are not matching
41:32but then you're also like you know this
41:34guy is so amazing and is going to do
41:35great things for us very very bad
41:37mistake right if you if you compromise
41:39on that it's like riding a tiger because
41:42then that person becomes more and more
41:43and more important you know to let
41:45somebody go early on is easier after
41:47they're entrenched they are so valuable
41:48to the ecosystem it becomes that much
41:50harder and it becomes very ugly in the
41:52end right so this went into litigation
41:54and just became very very ugly for us in
41:56the end so I guess the I think the big
41:58lesson was that you know values trump
42:01performance all the time, right? No
42:02matter how how good somebody is
42:04performing, if they if they are not
42:07principled, they are not the right hire.
42:09>> Well, nothing as profound here, but I I
42:11would side with GV. I think one of the
42:14most important lessons any entrepreneur
42:15can learn is to basically realize your
42:18mistake and fix it as quickly as you
42:20can. In fact, uh I tell every founder
42:22that you know you will make hiring
42:24mistakes. They are powerful course.
42:26Interviews are probabilistic in the
42:28nature of helping you identify the right
42:30person. Once you have decided that it's
42:33not working out then you know cut your
42:35losses move on and the biggest challenge
42:37I see is that people take just too much
42:38time to cut their losses so yeah
42:46[music]
42:54[music]
43:00what is that one cost uh that you paid.
43:03I think health and family are the easy
43:04ones. Anything else that you can think
43:06of?
43:07>> You know, you you're I would say I mean
43:10uh you know the default mode is always
43:14to be certain about everything that is
43:17happening around you. You know, you stop
43:19enjoying the small small things that are
43:21happening around you. The small success
43:23that you get in the company. sale. I
43:25remember when I did the first one lakh
43:27rupee sale, the joy that I had I I still
43:31don't I I've never received that same
43:34joy in me. Uh even after doing so many
43:36kores of revenue, you know, I still
43:38missed that one lakh rupee sale. So
43:41yeah, those small joys just keeps going
43:43away because you're always in a mode to
43:44move to the next one and figuring out.
43:47>> Yeah, look, I think I somewhat relate
43:49with what Gorov is saying. It's just
43:51that you're always switched on and you I
43:53look I switched on 20 years ago and you
43:56cannot switch off after that. It is so
43:59all consuming and you're doing a startup
44:01so you know it and all of us are
44:02founders in this room. It becomes so
44:05all-consuming
44:07that at you know you almost wish there
44:09was a way to you know be able to cut off
44:11from it and not realize that you run
44:14this company as well in the back end
44:15even for an hour right it's just
44:16impossible it is so overwhelming and I
44:19think you don't sign up for it I mean in
44:20a way you did sign up for it but you
44:22don't realize until you're really in the
44:24thick of it and you also realize that
44:25there is no way out of it as well so
44:27that's sometimes very overwhelming
44:30>> same here I think uh health and family
44:32and the ability to always have to take
44:34yourself seriously because you have so
44:36many so much responsibility on the
44:38shoulders. So yeah,
44:46[music]
44:57my question [music] is for Goravnagar.
44:59So, Gor of built uh TVO in the most
45:03challenging space. Uh, OTAA is like we
45:05understand travel is the most
45:07challenging space. Uh, mostly because
45:10it's margin squeezed and profitability
45:12is nowhere to be seen. You turned the
45:15business around especially during COVID
45:16and we saw global underwriters
45:18especially write off Indian OTAAS and
45:21B2B travel businesses back then. What
45:23was your asymmetric advantage which
45:25helped you turn your business around
45:26back then?
45:28>> A great question by the way. the you
45:30know what happened during COVID was that
45:33many large travel companies had a very
45:36knee-jerk reaction to the to the
45:38pandemic and like when when the pandemic
45:41started we did not let anybody go even
45:43though we were a travel company and we
45:45were negative revenues and all of that
45:47but the company decided that everybody
45:48across the board will take at least 50%
45:50pay cut and at you know higher as you
45:52become more senior the other thing we
45:55did was we did extensive travel you know
45:57refunds on both sides so we paid our
45:59suppliers and we paid our you know
46:01refunds to our travel agencies. It
46:03created an element of trust which was
46:05completely absent in that ecosystem at
46:07that point in time. The second thing
46:09because everybody else all the large
46:11travel players were letting people go.
46:14We had all these senior people who would
46:15have never imagined start joining an
46:17Indian travel company you know a much
46:19smaller Indian travel company at that
46:20point in time. Suddenly that talent pool
46:22became available to us that turned
46:24things around right. So one you know we
46:26established trust in the ecosystem that
46:28even in the absolute worst of times you
46:30know we did not hold our partners money
46:32and in a B2B business in a travel B2B
46:34business that's a big thing and the
46:36second thing is we really built out a
46:38global leadership team because talent
46:39which would have never considered
46:40working with us prior to the pandemic
46:42was suddenly very very accessible to us
46:44we have just created the entire
46:46leadership team during that period of
46:48time. I think that created a huge
46:50advantage for us. The other asymmetry of
46:52course is that we build tech in India
46:54and uh I think we are very efficient in
46:58how we do it compared to some of our
46:59global peers and which allow us in a low
47:01margin business you know keeping cost
47:02down is important I think we're very
47:04good at that
47:05>> the question is to so now that you've
47:08been on both sides investor and founder
47:11what is your uh mantra for the founders
47:14that you've learned which you didn't
47:15know when you were investor
47:17>> just be kind to everyone man I think
47:19that's just human principle in life like
47:20I A lot of people ghost each other on
47:22WhatsApp either. I mean just say no like
47:25I mean sometimes you don't have to
47:26explain yourself. So just be kind to
47:28everyone. I think everyone is so
47:30overstimulated these days in this world.
47:32VCs, humans, founders, everyone's just
47:35rude to each other. Yeah. Like I mean
47:36there's trolling unnecessary nonsense
47:38that's going on around like just take a
47:39chill pill. Easier said than done. But I
47:42think just being kind in whatever you
47:44do, not just VC, not just startups, any
47:46business that you do, I think that's
47:48truly one skill that everyone can learn.
47:49>> I have a question for you. So you
47:51mentioned uh the joy that you got in
47:53your first one lakh.
47:55>> Uh can you elaborate a little bit more
47:58on how that was different versus doing
48:01your first cr or 10 crown
48:03content creator and now starting his
48:05journey. So he is uh of course looking
48:08for that first joy for himself.
48:10[laughter]
48:11See
48:13one I think uh it was a first time
48:16experience of achieving something right
48:18when you start something the goal was
48:20you to
48:22per day.
48:24So I think that goal was a first set
48:26goal for me and once you achieve that
48:28first time the kick is very very
48:30different right when you keep achieving
48:32it again and again again it becomes a a
48:34work routine that you have to do it.
48:36This is not something new this is not
48:37something special that you are doing as
48:39an individual whole world is winning it
48:41and the bigger you become the bigger the
48:43competition is and they are making much
48:44more wonders.
48:49the moment you become big and then you
48:51get to know oh everybody is killing it
48:53then you're not very happy about it so
48:57yeah that's that's the uh thing
48:59>> like I think um like you set a bar you
49:01have a bar for like a lakh you cross it
49:03now the next bar is 10 lakh or cr so you
49:05know
49:06>> makes sense thanks
49:08>> cool hi there uh this is JD Singh so one
49:12thing which I could carry from this the
49:14happiness quotient now like the question
49:17which was being asked what would you
49:19think back whether you want to be
49:20bootstrapped or want to have a strategic
49:22investor or go an IPO route. So that the
49:24three sort of a thing but all of you
49:26probably said that probably you are
49:28happy being bootstrapped making less
49:30money and just having a peaceful life.
49:32So what's the motivation for the
49:34upcoming next generation founders? Do
49:36they really take this cue from you and
49:38just say that's let's be calm cool not
49:41go aggressive with investors or not go
49:43those kind of things. So there's a very
49:44old saying they say
49:49So I I'll start off by saying that all
49:52of three these three founders are very
49:54very successful. So there is some
49:56element of survivorship bias in their
49:58answers as well. Like I mean he's
50:00literally I think the second richest man
50:02and he can say [laughter]
50:04no looks.
50:05>> Yeah. My straight question is that
50:08what's the message for the upcoming
50:09founders? Do you want them to deep dive
50:12like what you did in life or do you want
50:14to send some other message across? It is
50:16super contextual like so I think they
50:19can also add to that it is super super
50:21contextual on what your situation is at
50:23that particular moment in life. So I
50:25think that will define on what is the
50:27right parameter for you to think about
50:29uh in terms of startup and also the
50:31industry defines it sometimes right not
50:33every industry like if you want to set
50:34up a semiconductor plant you can't
50:36bootstrap that if you want to do some
50:38deep tech space stuff you can't
50:39bootstrap that so
50:40>> also competition defines it right like
50:42if you're setting up a consumer company
50:44and everyone is raising money and
50:46discounting to growth then you can't do
50:47it so it's very contextual to what
50:49you're trying
50:50>> all I can say is I think don't raise it
50:52just because raising looks cool. It's
50:56not as cool as it sounds. So,
51:00that's true. But,
51:03>> thank you so much for joining us every
51:06evening.
51:13>> After studying so many founders, what's
51:16the single strongest predictor of a
51:18long-term success that people still
51:20underestimate?
51:21>> I think resilience. I think that's one
51:23of the characteristics that we've
51:24learned while writing and compiling the
51:26100 plus interviews that we've done for
51:27the founder manual. is going to get
51:30hard. A lot of people don't realize when
51:32the sacrifices that they have to make
51:34really suddenly pop up like you lose
51:36your hair, you lose family, you lose
51:37relationships, you lose everything
51:39around you, but and maybe like it's
51:41lonely at the top as they say, right?
51:43But get to the top. That journey itself
51:45is brutal. The only thing that will keep
51:47you in the game and get you up from bed
51:50every single day when is hard is
51:52resilience. So that's the single most I
51:54mean factor that we've seen that
51:56successful founders have when thinking
51:58about building a successful company for
51:59themselves.
52:00>> What's a founder trait that works
52:02brilliantly in the early stage but
52:04becomes dangerous during scale?
52:06>> Micromanaging. I think in the early days
52:08managing everything yourself I think is
52:10easy but as you scale sometimes you have
52:12to put on the hat of CEO. you honestly
52:15at scale you will have to become a
52:16glorified HR. You have to hire the best
52:18people. You have to retain the best
52:19people and let them do their work.
52:21Micromanaging will not work when you've
52:23really scaled up. Uh so 0 to one
52:26micromanage [music]
52:271 to 10 think about scaling up and
52:30getting some external professional help.
52:31>> So what's the most uncomfortable truth
52:34founders eventually learn about
52:36fundraising and investing?
52:37>> In investing and raising capital, nobody
52:40says uh the truth. I think everyone's
52:42trying to play this game of musical
52:44chairs where they're all passing the
52:45blame uh until the music stops and the
52:48buck always stops at the founder. So,
52:49you truly have to look out for yourself.
52:52No VC is your friend. No VC wants
52:54[music] to answer your call at 2 a.m.
52:55Like people glamorize all of these
52:57stories on LinkedIn. They get you the
52:59likes. But I think eventually you have
53:01to just look out for yourself. It's one
53:03man, one woman for themselves.
53:05>> If you were starting from zero today in
53:07India, what type of company would you
53:09build and why? The company that I'm
53:11building right now, the anti-AI thesis
53:13company called offline. It's a community
53:14of top tech founders. We get together,
53:17we problem solve for each other, we hang
53:18out, [music] we have fun. Company
53:20building is extremely extremely hard.
53:22But if we can support you even 5% in
53:25this journey or 10% in the journey of
53:27building a successful company and
53:29fulfilling the dreams and wishes of not
53:31just yourself but your family, everyone
53:33in the company who's working for you. I
53:35think that is a mission well-lived and
53:37that's what offline truly does. and I
53:39don't see myself doing anything else
53:41apart from this right now.
53:42>> So, how has your experience been so far
53:44at the club? What do you think of the
53:46space?
53:47>> I love it. We do so many events at
53:49offline here. We're a virtual community
53:51so we need physical spaces and third
53:52spaces like Korum and [music] in Delhi
53:55NCR. There is literally nothing else
53:57like this and it's so good to see Korum
53:59expanding to Bombay and Hyderabad as
54:01well. I hope they come up in Bangalore
54:02which is the hub of startup land as well
54:04and excited to continue our working
54:06relationship with Korum. What really
54:08drew you to be a part of this
54:10conversation here today?
54:11>> We wrote this book and uh it was just an
54:14exciting moment for us to share with the
54:15wider Korum community and bring our
54:17offline members as well into interact
54:19with the Korum community, bring them all
54:20together under one roof. And I have
54:22three awesome panelists with me today.
54:24Gorov uh who's the co-founder of 1MG,
54:27one of the leading e-acy companies in
54:28India. Goravnaga who listed his company
54:31in 2024, TBO, which is a leading B2B
54:33travel [music] solutions uh from India
54:35for the world. And then we've got Gorav
54:37Khatri who's the founder of noise
54:38leading smartw world brand in the
54:39country. So we've got three Goravs today
54:41and I think it's going to be a banger
54:43panel. So stick around for that.
54:44>> How do you think does a space like this
54:46influence the quality of conversations
54:48and ideas? I think it's designed to
54:51[music] I mean bring together I think
54:53life is boring like you have cafes
54:55otherwise in the city that you can go to
54:57and get work done but I think you need
54:59cororum like places to curate a calendar
55:01for you so that you have some element of
55:04mindexpanding
55:05activities to do up not just apart from
55:07work but I think think about cultural
55:10immersion programs and just all of these
55:12exciting speakers coming to you if you
55:14can spend even an hour thinking about
55:15these new ideas I think you're exposing
55:18yourself to things that can possibly
55:20help you in your life, personal,
55:21professional, anything. So, Korum is a
55:23place designed for that. Lots of open
55:24spaces, exciting social calendar, and
55:27not just FnB, but everything under the
55:29sun that you can expect from a private
55:31membersled club.

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