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Susan Smith Drowns Her Boys, HAS MULTIPLE LOVERS BEHIND BARS — Transcript

by Nancy Grace · 6,703 words · 976 segments · language en · Watch on YouTube

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0:00you think we would ever hear the last of
0:04Susan Smith yes Susan
0:08Smith remember her okay you know what
0:12I'm going to play a 911 call to jog your
0:14memory but first I me see Grayson this
0:16is crime stories I've got an Allstar
0:19panel with me to make sense of what's
0:21happening with Susan Smith right now
0:25thank you for being with us here at
0:27crime stories and on Sirius xm11
0:30see if this jogs your memory
0:33listen yes ma'am there's a lady come up
0:37that door and uh she some guy jumped
0:40into a red light with her car with her
0:42two kids in it and he took off and and
0:44she got out of the car here at AIO and
0:46he's got the kid yes ma'am in her car I
0:48don't she's real hysterical and I just
0:51decided I need to call law get them down
0:52here and the car is it we need to know
0:55something trying to ask her
0:58now a prot what color was it a burgundy
1:03Mazda
1:04prot get him going Pam I got two
1:07kids I love that degree of detail uh you
1:12know I don't even know where to go first
1:13because I got such awesome experts but
1:16I'm going to go first with Chris McDonna
1:18uh he is the director of Cold Case
1:20Foundation okay don't care former
1:22homicide detective starting to care
1:24getting warm getting warm getting hotter
1:27he has his own YouTube channel the
1:29interview room where I found him you can
1:32find him at ccas foundation.org or on
1:34the interview
1:36room former homicide detective
1:41300ish homicide scenes under his belt
1:45Chris McDon don't you love the degree of
1:49detail hey you know what Sydney
1:51sometimes you got to hear the best ofu
1:53can you play that one more time
1:56listen there's a lady come up door and
2:00uh she some guy jumped into a red light
2:02with her car with her two kids in it and
2:04he took off and she got out of the car
2:06here at Ohio and he's got the kid yes
2:09ma'am in her car I don't she's real
2:11hysterical and I just decided I need to
2:13call get them down here kind of car is
2:15it we need to know something trying to
2:18ask
2:19her a Mazda prot what color was it a
2:23burgundy Mazda
2:25prote get them going P I got two kids oh
2:29all the detail Chris
2:32McDon um she's quote real
2:35hysterical and you need to call the law
2:38and get him down here right now and you
2:41hear her feeding details in the
2:47background Nancy wasn't that the
2:49narrative that captivated America when
2:52how can you be so
2:55calm you know it we we just get used to
2:59it unfort fortunately right it's what I
3:01still get very angry very angry and I
3:04know the end of the story but the detail
3:08have you ever seen perss and they will
3:10spin you a yarn with such incredibly
3:13Rich
3:16detail yeah and and typically that
3:19detail if it's that minutia and that
3:23amount it's typically a sign of
3:26deception and she she kicked it off
3:29right from that 911 call from beginning
3:32the beginning running up to somebody's
3:35house talking about some guy jumps out
3:37and you know this occurs in rural Union
3:40County South Carolina uh near the John D
3:43long Lake and you know uh hold on Chris
3:47McDon where where do you live
3:50Chris well right now I'm uh in Arizona
3:54but I lived in South Carolina right
3:56there in so you're very familiar with
3:58this area let me go to another Country
4:00Boy uh like this country girl right here
4:02Joe Scott Morgan joining me although
4:05he's gotten pretty high futon Professor
4:09forensics Jacksonville State University
4:11author of blood beneath my feet still
4:13waiting on another book to come out host
4:16of body bags a hit podcast now starring
4:20my goodness Joe Scott in the Pike County
4:24murders a family Massacre is going to
4:27premiere on oxygen November 24 at 8:00
4:31p.m. there's going to be the first Pike
4:34County murder then the second Pike
4:36County murder after the first one
4:38November 24th 8:00 P.M on oxygen then
4:41the next night Friday night the third
4:45episode of Pike County murders a family
4:47Massacre am I through plugging
4:49everything or is there what are you
4:51starring in a movie with with Merill
4:54stre am I leaving anything out Joe Scott
4:56Morgan God I'm exhausted after all I'm
4:59completely exhausted just reading your
5:01CV but that said this area Chris MCD has
5:06lived in South Carolina I've gone to
5:08this scene before it's extremely Rural
5:11and I'm supposed to believe a guy jumps
5:13out of what from behind a a a stop sign
5:17and hijacks her car and takes off with
5:20the children clearly in the back seat
5:22two little
5:23boys yeah what are the odds that you're
5:25going to have somebody that wants to do
5:27this kind of harm whether or not they
5:29had an awareness that you know these
5:32poor little angels were buckled down in
5:34those back
5:35seats uh the fact that you would have
5:39this kind of aggressive behavior in that
5:43location where she was specifically
5:45targeted as an investigator I'm
5:47certainly going to raise an eyebrow and
5:49I'm going to take a long look at what
5:50she has to say because as you and I both
5:53know Nancy the line share the line share
5:56of homicides that we talk about have
5:59some kind kind of familial connection
6:00that means that you're around Intimates
6:03those individuals that are most
6:04important so you're going to tell me
6:06that a random stranger just came up and
6:09kidnapped these babies and run off with
6:10them and left her standing on the side
6:12of the road weeping but I don't believe
6:14it now did you hear what he just did
6:17Chris McDon I I I'm going along with
6:20everything he says but he's a Wy one you
6:22got to really watching watch what Joe
6:25Scott says um I agree with the whole
6:28rural aspect
6:30but did you hear him say
6:32if the unknown male ellant noticed the
6:37children in the back seat I'm looking
6:40right now at a 94 Mazda
6:43Protegé uh you can see straight into the
6:46back seat from every angle of the car
6:50it's not like you know you see those
6:52black SUVs with tinted windows you can't
6:55see what's going on in there no you can
6:57see exactly what's going on in the back
6:59seat and I'm looking at a shot from the
7:01distance I can see through the back
7:04window through the the back dash and
7:07through the other side of the car
7:09whoever took the car could definitely
7:12see that children were strapped into car
7:15seats in the back
7:17seat Chris
7:20100% I mean okay you know what let's
7:23take a listen to the 911 call
7:26listen
7:28105 105 go ahead said it was a black
7:32male driving a burgundy
7:34prote affirmative
7:37105 and he had two juvenal with him 105
7:41from what I understood these were small
7:43children these are her children and she
7:46jumped out of the car and he took the
7:47car with the children and he's headed
7:49toward Chester Union 100 100 go ahead
7:53are the victim and the suspect in this
7:54call the same family 100 from what I
7:58gathered by the child they are not this
8:00is a stranger that had jumped in the
8:03lady's car at a red light and she jumped
8:06out I mean really T and there I'm
8:11leading up to what Susan Smith is doing
8:13right now and let me tell you it
8:16involves six different men that said
8:20Tara Malik joining me out of Boise Idaho
8:23co-owner Smith and Malik former state
8:26and federal
8:27prosecutor Tara
8:29once again blame the black
8:32man I remember when this happened I was
8:35on trial I was trying a case and I
8:39looked
8:40over at my friend my
8:44colleague who went on to be a judge I
8:46might add and I went Herman have you
8:50seen the composite of the guy that Susan
8:54Smith described and he went yeah I know
8:56what you're going to say I'm like yeah
8:58it looks just like
9:01you it looked just like Herman
9:05Sloan my trial partner who had come into
9:10court to bail me out of
9:11some sling I got in with the judge with
9:15some appell at law trying to suggest
9:17that I was right and whatever I did but
9:20he went yeah I've heard I look just like
9:22the sus Smith per and he did I mean
9:27think about it Torah an innocent person
9:31could have been arrested and probably
9:34tried and convicted based on her fake
9:38composite and all of her lies like my
9:41Herman one of my best friends in the
9:43DA's
9:45office yeah absolutely I mean the crime
9:48itself was atrocious and horrific and
9:50terrible and then and then you know to
9:53give this false profile of someone else
9:56who may have done it wasting resources
9:58la enforcement resources wasting
10:00everybody's time but also like you said
10:02putting somebody else potentially in
10:04Jeopardy of being picked up for it and
10:07it's just mindboggling that she would go
10:09down this road you know I I've dealt
10:12with the side defense many times I named
10:14it that some other dude did it s o d d
10:19here she goes some other dude did it and
10:22listen to her
10:25listen I would like to say to whoever
10:30has my
10:32children that they please I mean please
10:36bring them
10:36[Music]
10:38home to us where they
10:41belong you play that one more
10:45time I would like to say to
10:48whoever has my
10:52children that they please I mean please
10:56bring them
10:56[Music]
10:58home to us where they belong I mean Dr
11:02Bethany Marshall um I hate to drag you
11:05away from all your clients on R Deo
11:07Drive complaining about how expensive
11:10the shoes and the designer bags are um
11:13by the way I I think I've told you this
11:15it's Rodeo r o Deo it is not
11:19Rodeo that said uh Dr Bethany Marshall
11:22joining my us as much as I'm pulling her
11:24leg she's a renowned
11:26psychoanalyst at Dr Bethany marshall.com
11:29c as a matter of fact she now has a
11:32recording role in Paris in love season
11:362 that said Dr Bethany I don't get it
11:42right now we've got that I know of six
11:47men six men sexting and texting and
11:52writing and sending money and love
11:55letters to Susan Smith when she is a
11:58bald face
11:59liar that killed her children in the
12:02worst way letting her car her burgundy
12:07Protegé go down a ramp with the two
12:11little boys alive strapped in the back
12:16seat why I I don't get it why would man
12:20want to be with this woman send her
12:22money and sex text with her but did you
12:26hear her lying do you remember when that
12:29happened the the crying and the snotting
12:32and
12:33the all that happening and I I want to
12:37say whoever has my children they please
12:40please bring them home to us where they
12:43belong knowing full well they drowned
12:47strapped in their car
12:50seats which shows how immature she is at
12:54the most basic level she
12:56thinks the the most you say she's
12:59immature she M she's a sociopath hold on
13:03we know she's a sociopath but but what
13:06beyond the fact that she's a sociopath
13:08what additional uh factors are there
13:11that would lead to this and one is an
13:13over attachment to men she loves that
13:16feeling of falling in love the the
13:18feeling you have how are you linking
13:20this to double
13:21murder why this woman did not get the
13:24death penalty I do not know and now
13:26there's six guys trying to have sex with
13:28her really
13:29e but it's really it's really a
13:31pathological attachment to being in a
13:33barrel with with a rattlesnake who wants
13:37that I well apparently they do and you
13:40know women who commit fanticide who kill
13:43their children often have some really
13:46first of all they they usually what we
13:48call you better not say really have some
13:50sexy Mojo going on because I'm totally
13:53cutting your
13:54mic okay so their cluster B which means
13:58they
13:59have three different disorders
14:01sociopathy bipolar and borderline often
14:05they have a very pathological attachment
14:07to men either they kill the children to
14:10get back at a love object like I'm going
14:12to kill our children because I'm mad at
14:14you and I'm it's hard to describe this
14:17without really sounding like it's trite
14:20but it's these this these are the
14:23underpinnings of what these women do so
14:25it's either I'm going to kill the
14:27children to get back at
14:29or I'm going to kill the children
14:31because I found a new guy and I don't
14:33want the children to to be in the
14:35way that you said that interesting but I
14:40also want you to hear the level of
14:42detail that she weaves into her big fat
14:45lie about her two murdered little boys I
14:49can't even imagine a more excruciating
14:51death than being strapped in a car can't
14:54get out the car goes underwater uh
14:59a muddy Lake and you're in the car
15:02screaming for mommy as that car fills up
15:06with water till you drown uh listen to
15:11hour cut for Crime online on the night
15:13of October 25th Susan Smith knocks on
15:16the door of a house near John D long
15:18Lake she's hysterical when the man
15:20answers the door and tells him to call
15:22the police a black man just carjacked
15:24her at a red light he had a gun and she
15:26jumped out of the car but her two boys
15:28three-year-old Michael and 14-month-old
15:30Alex are still in the car police begin
15:33searching immediately and the nation's
15:35media converges on Union South Carolina
15:37for eight days Susan Smith tells an
15:39everchanging story of the carjacking and
15:42Friends get irritated when she keeps
15:44asking if Tom Finley has reached out to
15:46see her friends wonder why she would
15:47care about Finley when her two children
15:49are missing on day nine of intense media
15:52pressure Susan Smith meets with Union
15:54County Sheriff Howard Wells and Wells
15:57meets with the Press
16:00okay um note to self who is Tom Finley
16:04but there's more there's more
16:09listen Susan Smith has carried the lie
16:11as far as she can when she finally
16:13admits what she's done there never was a
16:15black man with a gun that stole her car
16:17with her kids in the back she now says
16:19she went out for a drive with her sons
16:21buckled into their car seats in the back
16:23feeling desperate alone and suicidal she
16:26now says she drove to John D long Lake
16:28and plan to roll the car into the lake
16:30Smith puts the car in neutral but
16:32instead of going into the lake with the
16:33car and the boys she jumps out and
16:35watches the car sink based on her
16:38directions for where the car should be
16:40scuba divers locate the vehicle with the
16:42boys in the back still buckled into
16:44their seats just let that soak in for
16:47just one
16:49moment claiming you know why is it Chris
16:52McDon that all these people that want to
16:54commit suicide end up killing their
16:57children or their family or somebody
16:58else yet they miraculously
17:01live yeah I mean just a horrific thought
17:04in of itself right Nancy I mean I I
17:07actually drove the entire route that
17:10Susan Smith took that day there were
17:12ample opportunities for her uh to change
17:17her mind and turn around I mean there
17:19were stop signs there were you know
17:21through residential neighborhoods and to
17:24think that she was saying to the public
17:26you know or or to the police when she
17:28initially confessed well you know I
17:31thought about committing suicide um but
17:34I couldn't do it Etc so I jumped out you
17:36know when you go to that boat ramp where
17:39these poor little babies are strapped in
17:40those back seats and as that car is
17:43going down that ramp I I would submit to
17:46you she had gotten out of that car
17:48almost
17:49immediately and let that car go to your
17:52point a couple of minutes ago and as
17:54that water started to fill that vehicle
17:57can you imagine the horor that these
17:59children were experiencing and the
18:02mother standing there as that vehicle
18:05started to sink it took about six I
18:08think between six to 15 seconds for that
18:11vehicle to hit the water and within a
18:13minute it was
18:15submerged Nancy it just shows how cold
18:18blooded she is she could stand on the
18:21shore look at the car submerged and
18:24knowing that her babies were drowning it
18:26really gives you insight into how
18:29detached and
18:32just coldblooded she is yeah who is this
18:36woman take list an hour cut three from
18:39crime
18:41online.com After High School she began
18:43dating David Smith soon there's a baby
18:46on the way and the pair decide to get
18:47married ultimately they have two boys
18:50Michael Daniel and Alexander Tyler but
18:52the children don't keep the marriage
18:53together the Smiths separate several
18:55times during one of these separations
18:57Susan Smith begins dating Tom Finley the
19:00single son of a wealthy Mill
19:02owner aha so that is who Tom Finley is
19:09okay Tara Malik high-profile lawyer
19:12joining us from her own law fir Smith
19:14and Malo would that be
19:18motive she wants to be with this rich
19:22guy yeah I I think you know the she's
19:26painted in different ways during the
19:28trial itself um and there was some
19:31conflicting testimony one of the
19:33theories of the case um that was put on
19:36and and suspected was that she wanted to
19:40be with Thomas Finley Finley didn't like
19:43the fact that you know she had two kids
19:45and in a way or in an attempt to uh get
19:49back together with Finley who she was
19:50having an affair with you know she
19:52drowned her two boys um the other
19:55testimony that was presented during the
19:57trial was that you know she was someone
20:00who was an abused child she had had a
20:03secret affair with her stepfather she
20:06was frightened of her husband you know
20:09and so um I think those details this
20:13jury ended up grappling with and and
20:15it's a case that should have been a
20:16death penalty case but unfortunately not
20:19here you know uh isn't it true Dave Mack
20:22joining us from crime
20:24online.com that Finley broke it off with
20:27her
20:28claiming he did not want an instant
20:31family he did and Nancy more to the
20:34point or more than just saying I don't
20:36want kids that there were other things
20:38he stated in there about her and their
20:40relationship he also cited their their
20:43different upbringing and that that was a
20:46big stumbling block another one the way
20:49Susan Smith acted and flirted with other
20:52men he didn't like that so he mentioned
20:55three basic things that he really didn't
20:57want an instant family but these other
20:59two things were mentioned as well and
21:01one was her own behavior of hitting on
21:03other men but she dismisses that in her
21:06thought process blames it all on the
21:07kids and thinks she's can get him back
21:09if she just gets rid of that she doesn't
21:11address the fact that she hits on men
21:13all the time so let me understand
21:16something Dave Mack she met Finley the
21:20son of the rich guy when she and her
21:24husband were what divorced separated
21:27what separated um they actually uh when
21:31they were married they had several
21:32full-on separations where they were not
21:35living together were dating other people
21:38um and and yet they would didn't get
21:40back together and it was on and off for
21:43I think I mean after they had the last
21:45son he was 14 months old when all this
21:46happened so it was an ongoing process in
21:49their relationship the breaking up
21:50getting back together uh let me go back
21:53to Dr Bethany Marshall what do you make
21:56of this it it was always presented that
22:01Finley broke up with her because he
22:02didn't want an instant family but
22:05according to the letter he sent her
22:07before she murdered her two little boys
22:10it was a lot more than
22:13that he's probably minimizing it because
22:16now he has the scrutiny of the country
22:18and the court and saying well I didn't
22:19really want her anyway but there
22:21partially I think a Hal truth in that
22:23maybe he wasn't ready for a family and
22:25children and he was contemplating that
22:28and I think Susan Smith was the kind of
22:30woman who would just ignore the fact
22:33that he didn't want to be with her she
22:34would think oh you know I'll I'll buy a
22:35new dress oh I'll go shopping oh I'll
22:37buy some lipstick I'll wear a low cut
22:40dress oh I'll just kill my children I
22:42mean just if she would just throw
22:43everything at it to get him back so I
22:46think if he was ambivalent about her
22:48that may have even incentivized her to
22:51kill her
22:53children okay I I obviously need to
22:56reward my question
22:58there were other behaviors he found
23:01disturbing which led to his decision to
23:04break it off with her not only that he
23:07did not want an instant family but he
23:09did not like the way she acted
23:12promiscuously with other guys he didn't
23:15want
23:16that I think some women uh relate
23:19primarily to men because they feel they
23:21can seduce them and I think this was
23:24probably her Mo that the minute she met
23:26a man she would be foration I she would
23:28be overly sexualized she would try to
23:31attract them she probably did that all
23:34the time because this is a way of
23:36feeling important like she's a real
23:38person in the real world and she doesn't
23:41really have to relate to the men if it's
23:43sexual in an instant then they they
23:46never become real people to her they're
23:48they're all just objects love objects
23:51who flatter her listen our cut
23:55four Susan Smith is planning a future
23:58with the best catch in the county when
24:00she gets a Dear John Letter From dear
24:02Tom he explains he doesn't think the
24:05relationship will work because of the
24:06difference in their upbringing the way
24:08she acts towards other men and he
24:11doesn't want an instant family he
24:12doesn't want children right now Susan
24:14dismisses her upbringing or her behavior
24:17towards other men as possible deal
24:18breakers in the relationship and the
24:20only thing she sees is Tom Finley
24:23doesn't want
24:25children so she ignores everything
24:28accept the children part of the
24:30complaint and then suddenly poof they're
24:33gone in the last days Susan Smith back
24:36in the news
24:38apparently having a romantic
24:41relationship with at least six Men
24:45Behind Bars okay what does that mean
24:49well there are precursors to today's
24:52report of Susan Smith's relationships
24:56with six guys um what precursors well
25:00listen to our cut
25:0210 a tabloid news report claiming Susan
25:05Smith had been beaten by guards at a
25:07prison in South Carolina gave birth to
25:09an investigation into the matter while
25:11there was no proof she had been beaten
25:13Smith told prison investigators that she
25:15had four sexual encounters Lieutenant
25:17Houston Kagel a supervisor at South
25:19Carolina's women's correctional
25:21institution WCI where she's confined
25:24Kagel admitted having sex with Smith and
25:26another prisoner and was charged with
25:28the offense in August of 2000 Smith was
25:3128 at the time and was disciplined for
25:33having sex with the guard while
25:3450-year-old Kagel pleaded guilty and
25:36spent three months in jail in 2001 a
25:39prison Captain Alfred row also pleaded
25:41guilty to having sex with Smith and was
25:43sentenced to 5 years probation it was
25:46then discovered that Susan Smith engaged
25:49in sexual relations with Kagel after she
25:51tested positive for an
25:53STD okay so she claims I was beat beaten
25:58and that spawns an
26:00investigation but it turns out she
26:02wasn't beaten she was sleeping with
26:04various prison guards Joe Scott Morgan
26:07remind me what is it like to drown
26:09you're the death
26:12investigator one of the most horrible
26:15deaths that you can even begin to to
26:19think about and and and the fact is the
26:22thing that's always bothered me about
26:23this case Nancy is that with Alex and
26:26Michael and I think think it's really
26:28important that I say their names at this
26:29moment in time because they are the
26:31victims uh when they were strapped in
26:33those little seats in the back of that
26:36Mazda in that tight little confined
26:38place where maybe their mother had taken
26:40them to McDonald's before taken them all
26:42over town and suddenly they're at the
26:44edge of a boat ramp and they're thinking
26:45you know what what's mama doing now you
26:49know she gets out of the car and as that
26:51car is left in neutral and goes down
26:54that boat ramp and begins to slowly sink
26:56beneath those dark Waters out there you
26:59know they found that car about 120 fet
27:02off of the shore uh they uh the dive
27:05team had look for it for some period of
27:07time car was filled with water those
27:10kids were still strapped in that back
27:11seat and our reaction as humans if we're
27:14trying to catch our breath is to fight
27:17and just imagine this Nancy they're
27:19strapped we've all got babies in our
27:21families that we've taken care of we
27:23strapped them in car
27:24seats and you ever seen a child struggle
27:27to get out of the car seat they're tired
27:29of being in it well imagine that only
27:32water's creeping up on you water's
27:34getting into your nose your little mouth
27:37your eyes you're running out of oxygen
27:39your brain is screaming it's on fire
27:42because there's no Oxygen you can't
27:44catch your breath and you have no idea
27:47it's Panic that's setting in and it
27:50would not have in I just want to dispel
27:53any kind of fantasy somebody might be
27:56having right now that this was a sudden
27:58and a quick death it wasn't it was
28:01torturous it was absolutely horrific
28:04what these babies went through at that
28:05moment time Nancy and I'm with you uh I
28:09I'm still to this day just befuddled uh
28:13why why she's not sitting on death row
28:16and uh you know forever and ever she's
28:18getting to go on with her life now isn't
28:19she and those babies died died at this
28:23Monster's hands out there in that out
28:25there in that Lake knowing full well
28:27what she did immediately running to a
28:30nearby Home claiming that an unknown
28:33male had jumped into her car and I guess
28:36the only red light in the county and I
28:38feel okay saying that because where I
28:40grew up that we didn't even have a red
28:43light uh
28:45so out of the entire County an unknown
28:49assant jumps into her car at the one red
28:51light takes her car and murders her
28:54children okay this is the woman these
28:58guys want to be with now SI at least six
29:05men um speaking of them there is the
29:10matter of Captain Alfred row now we
29:13heard about Kagel Kagel a supervisor at
29:17South Carolina women's CI correctional
29:20institute and um what happened with him
29:24we know that he
29:28was ultimately identified because uh
29:31Susan Smith turned up with an STD behind
29:34bars but there's more take a listen to
29:36our cut 11 Captain Alfred Smith was one
29:39of the guards who lost their careers
29:41after having sex with Susan Smith Behind
29:42Bars Rose says Smith is a master
29:45manipulator telling Inside Edition that
29:47Smith approached him at 3 in the morning
29:49telling him she thought he was the
29:50nicest officer at the prison and that
29:52she was lonely the former guard says
29:55things just escalated from there Ro
29:57claim claims he only had sex with Smith
29:59one time but it cost him everything he
30:01was fired from the job lost his pension
30:04and after pleading guilty to having sex
30:05with Smith he was sentenced to five
30:07years probation now that's Captain
30:10Alfred
30:12row who loses his job he's fired lost
30:16his pension that he's been working for
30:19for years and pleas guilty and gets put
30:23on probation is that a Hallmark of this
30:27type a personality Dr Bethany Marshall
30:29that there are they think there are no
30:31consequences to what they do or they
30:33don't worry about the consequences how
30:35does that work well first of all I
30:37wouldn't let this prison guard off so
30:39easy I just have to throw it throw that
30:41out there she works around he works
30:44around Disturbed women all the time who
30:46are probably sexualized but with him but
30:49but putting that aside I don't think
30:51Susan Smith can even fathom a
30:55consequence I think if you did a brain
30:57scan you would see uh that the areas
31:00responsible for empathy um impulse
31:03control all of that would probably not
31:05even light up she probably has a
31:07different brain than the rest of us you
31:09know um fmri scans of sociopaths do show
31:13that they have profoundly different
31:16functioning but think of her as she kind
31:18of operates at the level of a
31:22three-year-old in some way in some ways
31:24because she or 2-year-old grabs for
31:27whatever she wants and then operates
31:29also like at the immaturity level of a
31:3114 or 15y old who just has crushes on
31:34boys all the time and you know that's
31:36all she can think about so you know I in
31:39terms of what's swirling around in her
31:41head I I'm sure it's just being
31:43gratified and thinking she can get away
31:45with it well guys uh she was moved take
31:49list hour cut
31:5112 sex isn't the only issue Susan Smith
31:53has faced in prison twice in 2010 and
31:56once in 2015 15 Susan Smith was
31:58disciplined on drug charges losing
32:00privileges for more than a year Susan
32:02Smith's Drug use escalated when she
32:04switched prisons from Camille Graham
32:06Correctional Center in Columbia South
32:07Carolina to leth Correctional
32:09Institution in Greenwood South Carolina
32:11former prison guard Alfred row who
32:13pleaded guilty to having sex with Smith
32:15at the prison told the TV show cellmate
32:17Secrets when Smith was moved from one
32:19prison to another that it was at that
32:21point where quote she could no longer
32:23get the male attention that she used as
32:25a drug unquote and in head turned to
32:28pill which led to a series of drug
32:31infractions but you know what let's fast
32:33forward to right now to today take a
32:37list an hour cut
32:3915 Susan Smith dreams of the day she'll
32:42be released to that end she's taken to
32:44writing a number of men over the years
32:46in March of 2022 People magazine gained
32:49access to letter Smith wrote to a
32:51longdistance boyfriend in one letter she
32:53wrote I can't wait to build a life with
32:55you leave the past mistakes behind and
32:58start fresh just you and me a relative
33:00of Smith told People magazine at the
33:02time that Smith wants everything in life
33:04that she believes has passed her
33:07by you know everything in life she
33:11wanted passed from by because she
33:15committed murder Tara Malik is with us
33:19high-profile lawyer joining us out of
33:21Boise from The Firm Smith and Malik The
33:25Narrative her her story that she
33:28projects is so different from reality
33:30life has not passed her by she committed
33:35double
33:36murder that that's what happened it's
33:39not anyone's fault but her
33:42own absolutely I mean and if if life
33:46passed her by how does she characterize
33:50what she did to her son she took their
33:53life away they didn't even have the
33:55opportunity to live a life I mean these
33:57were really young kids here and and I
34:00think you know the pattern of behavior
34:03that she's exhibited like the
34:05infractions that she's picked up while
34:07she's been in prison I mean all of this
34:09doesn't tend to show that this is
34:11someone who has been rehabilitated while
34:14in prison I mean she's still showing
34:16those signs of
34:17manipulation that you know she she
34:20engaged in before she was convicted and
34:23sentenced you know leading on the nation
34:26from nine days days telling lies about
34:28what actually happened telling lies and
34:30pointing fingers at people that didn't
34:31exist so this is a really deeply
34:34Disturbed individual I'd be shocked if
34:37the parole board granted her uh her
34:39request uh Chris mcdunn with me a former
34:42homicide detective and host of YouTube
34:44channel the interview room who has
34:46investigated at least 300 homicides you
34:50know defendants can be very very
34:55Charming think about Scott Peterson or
34:58Dr Martin
35:00mcneel uh who killed his wife a beauty
35:03queen according to Susan Smith's family
35:07they say quote she seems to be happy and
35:11that she quote always had a messy love
35:15life she's creating a fictional version
35:19of her life a and people are buying it
35:23These Guys these lonely hearts are
35:27buying it and attempting to have let me
35:31just say romantic interludes with her
35:33Chris McDonna have you ever met a
35:36Charming murder defendant because I
35:40have yeah absolutely Nancy and and
35:44what's interesting about her is we have
35:46to always remember that all Behavior has
35:49a purpose and that past behavior is
35:52usually an indication of future Behavior
35:56so she she has always you know
35:59throughout her entire case and through
36:01her life here while in prison and even
36:03before prison she always sometimes
36:06projected the the words of they into her
36:10uh vocabulary and if you if we listen
36:13real carefully to the minutia of what
36:16she said in the very beginning whoever
36:19they are please bring them home I.E
36:23she's talking about two suspects but she
36:26talks about one in terms of a
36:29description and now if we fast forward
36:31that to today we have six individuals
36:35men uh who quite frankly I can't figure
36:39that piece of the puzzle out you know
36:40that's that's for the doctors uh to tell
36:43us what that's all about but she is
36:46utilizing that behavior still to this
36:50day by talking about money by talking
36:53about uh sexual you know uh tiffs there
36:57between the two of them and it she
37:00hasn't lost a spot from this leopard and
37:04uh you know God forbid she gets out in
37:0624 if if she is ever up for parole one
37:09of these
37:11guys is an airline pilot and they're
37:14creating a fictionalized life for her
37:18take a listen hour
37:2018 the man who has built a fake life for
37:23Susan Smith and himself in the game The
37:25Sims also has a pet name for the
37:27convicted child killer Pooky the
37:29messenger shared an exchange from August
37:32where he writes dearest Pooky been
37:34thinking of you and miss you so much
37:37hoping I can do something for you soon
37:39love you so much it hurts you're Pooky
37:42the man exchanging these messages was
37:44Smith a 60-year-old airline pilot okay
37:48Dr Bethany I don't want him to fly fly
37:50my plane I really don't I Can't Tell You
37:53Why just a gut
37:55instinct you know Nancy a wise colleague
37:58once said to me the Cornerstone of good
38:00mental health is having a preference for
38:02reality which we all struggle with these
38:05two are way out of touch with reality
38:08they're building a fantasy life they
38:10have fantasy children one of the
38:12children has even called after uh named
38:15after her deceased son so when you live
38:18in in like a fantasy world you never
38:21have to contend with reality you know
38:23imagine when you met your husband you
38:24know you know you were having all these
38:26Wonder ful thoughts it's very idealized
38:28it's a fun time but then then the
38:31reality is he has a personality and you
38:33have to share a home with him maybe you
38:35see him sitting on the toilet maybe you
38:36see him blowing his nose you know he
38:38becomes a real person but some people
38:41only want that initial fantasy when uh
38:45to quote Helen Fischer who's a cultural
38:47Anthropologist in the first six months
38:49of a relationship the brain of fires as
38:53if it's on
38:54cocaine so trying to figure out these
38:57guys too Dr Bethany because Dave M
39:00joining me crime online.com
39:01investigative reporter one of the men
39:04seeking for a romantic interlude with
39:07Susan Smith the double killer says she's
39:10not what you think she is I just find
39:12her interesting and
39:16misunderstood misunderstood she's
39:19actually set for a parole Hearing in
39:20November
39:212024 that's one year from
39:24now that's what you know was sentenced
39:27to life with the possibility of
39:28probation after 30 years the first week
39:30of November next year she will show up
39:32in front of the parole board her
39:34ex-husband and the father of those boys
39:36is going to be there you know Joe Scott
39:40Morgan maybe we just know too much when
39:42it comes to murder because when I think
39:45of Susan Smith I immediately think of
39:47being trapped strapped in to a car as
39:52it's going down a ramp and going
39:55underwater and seeing the water coming
39:57up on either side and starting to pour
39:59in through the
40:00windshields as as comes up around you
40:03and you can't get out I mean the
40:06children in this case were three and 14
40:12months they never they never stood a
40:15chance uh within this this environment
40:18and and here here's another thing that
40:21that uh people might not be aware of
40:24after that car dip beneath the surface
40:28of that
40:29water one other element we have to
40:31consider and again I go back to the idea
40:34that we all have had babies you know
40:37parents that sort of thing I've got you
40:39know kids and grandkids whom I love
40:41dearly and what is it the kids are
40:43afraid of late at night this darkness
40:46and it would you would not have been
40:48able to have seen your hand in front of
40:50your face so not only are they absent a
40:53loving mother who normally you would
40:56hope would take care of them they're
40:59they're disoriented they're running out
41:01of breath and it's dark Nancy it's cold
41:03and it's dark down there and that's that
41:07goes to the level of horror that they're
41:10that they're you know experiencing I I
41:12wish I wish every single one of these
41:15so-called men that are reaching out to
41:17her would would slip over to South
41:20Carolina at sometime and maybe go to
41:22this little United Methodist Church
41:23where these two little babies are buried
41:25and stare at those headstones just for a
41:28moment when they're thinking about
41:30involving themselves with this
41:33individual that they're gonna sew sew
41:36their hearts to if you will but they
41:38don't care they're as callous as she is
41:40they don't care about these two little
41:41boys that drowned all they care about is
41:44this Fantasy Life they're in uh having
41:47phone sex um imagining that she's just
41:51waiting for them that they're going to
41:53have this great life when she gets out
41:55you know these guys guys are kind of
41:56control freaks in a way because they
42:00they have complete in in their Fantasy
42:02Life they have complete control over
42:06her if you want your voice to be
42:09heard please contact the South Carolina
42:13pardon and parole board at
42:16803
42:17734
42:20355 repeat
42:22803
42:24734 35
42:2705 these new guys she's got on the hook
42:30for love and
42:32money that's their
42:34problem but what's on my mind are the
42:37two little boys that lost their lives in
42:42the John D long
42:45Lake goodbye
42:47friend guys thank you for watching crime
42:50online with Nancy Grace here on YouTube
42:53to get the very latest subscribe to
42:55Crime online
42:56here

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