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Speaking with the Senator - Death Row Exonoree Sabrina Butler Porter — Transcript

by Kevin Avard · 4,474 words · 590 segments · language en · Watch on YouTube

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0:00the following program was provided by an
0:02independent producer solely responsible
0:04for its content the opinions expressed
0:06do not necessarily represent the views
0:08of this station its staff board of
0:11directors or underwriters
0:19[Music]
0:42[Music]
0:52[Music]
0:54welcome to another episode of speaking
0:57with the senator I Kevin a vard state
1:00senator here in district 12 in New
1:01Hampshire and today we're going to be
1:03talking about the death penalty and my
1:06guest is Sabrina Butler Porter from
1:09Mississippi who was on death row and
1:11she's actually an exonerate and I want
1:13to welcome you to the show thank you for
1:15coming and thanks for listening to my
1:17singing so when people think of death
1:23row most people don't generally think of
1:25a women being on death row but somehow
1:29you ended up on death row how did that
1:30happen well when I was 17 years old I
1:34was accused of grammatically my son is
1:36operating on me and I didn't know how to
1:38apply CPR I was accused of beating him
1:42today
1:46a hard thing for me because you know I
1:48lost my son and being being accused of
1:50killing him was very difficult I went to
1:55the police station after it happened and
1:57they started questioning me and they
1:59wanted more answers and they didn't want
2:02to hear the ones i was giving it they
2:04were throwing away the original
2:06statements that I were giving them and
2:08he wrote out a statement for me to get
2:11to find after 4i read the statement that
2:14he made after four hours of them fussing
2:17at me and see me like they want to jump
2:19on me and all that I just found I was
2:22scared I didn't know what did it at 17
2:25and I didn't think I just knew that
2:27these people were like they want to hurt
2:31me so I found and when I found it I was
2:35charged with Captain with a capital
2:37murder and have you had any convictions
2:40or any problems prior with the longhouse
2:42everything at all you're so we married
2:45at the time room oh yeah remember and
2:47how did that what did your husband say
2:50well we were separated again I again
2:54pregnant my first child very early age
2:56mom signed me over to my first husband
2:59we didn't play together for a year okay
3:02so I had been promised by myself since I
3:05was 14 years old columbus mississippi
3:07thats Sarah yeah Columbus's uh and so
3:13what you described briefly what happened
3:16how did you cover my way wells at the
3:19police station no prior to that oh you
3:21son he just I don't know I don't know
3:23what happened I mean what I did was I
3:26went jogging at night and most time I
3:29think that's why I made my mistake I
3:30left them at the house you know sleep
3:33and I jogs up the street and came back
3:34and that's when I noticed it he wasn't
3:37breathing and I panicked I didn't know
3:38what I should do what I shouldn't do I
3:41just grabbed him in Moran I think back
3:45on that a lot of people say well you
3:47shouldn't left him at the house but I
3:48mean I was only seven town was thinking
3:50like I should have been thinking but you
3:52grabbed him and grabbed imran and when I
3:54ran lady downstairs in the apartment
3:57below me he called me by me
4:00I didn't know she knew me but he ever
4:01did she did she grabbed my son and she
4:03put him on the floor and started CPR and
4:06so she told me to blow in his mouth
4:08holders and all the president's nominee
4:10that wasn't the right way I applied
4:12adult CPR to a nine-month a lot of
4:14weight acosta you know so how did they
4:20go from that to capital murder and
4:22capital murder you had to have intended
4:23to do it no they said I beat him because
4:26you know his stomach was suspended after
4:28we did PPR I think I plateau so the
4:31right amount of pressure the lady that
4:33was helping you what happened to us she
4:36was a white female I'm black so they
4:39count a pusher to the fat after she gave
4:41her a statement and everything it was
4:43nothing else and to her you see was
4:45definitely looking to me yeah okay so
4:50you're in a panic you're grieving and
4:53you signed your life away and all in
4:58within 24 hours what happened to ask
5:04that you went to trial they sent me to
5:06the county jail bait in an old jail
5:08period for a year a year I saw my first
5:12set of attorneys two days before trial
5:14didn't know who my journey to work I was
5:18told to just sit in front of juries look
5:20at the true I was given no type of
5:22preparation for trial or anything like
5:24that one of the times ahead was drunk
5:27doing the whole track so you're sitting
5:29in prison return to jail for a year no
5:32communication with any defense lawyer
5:34nothing not really sure what you're
5:37being charged or did they charge they
5:38charged me they charged me but they also
5:40charged me with a child abuse law and
5:42wasn't allowing 223 days after I'm
5:44locked up I was already locked up and
5:47they gave me a chart that wasn't even a
5:49lawyer did you have any family to
5:53support you my mom when she found out
5:55they came down my mom started trying to
5:59talk for me you know and do things like
6:01that she really didn't know what to do
6:03we're never faced with you know
6:05something of that magnitude so it was
6:07basically just lose for black and in the
6:10wrong places where I see it because
6:12I think my case was mostly merely
6:16racially motivated and it was just
6:18something for this district attorney has
6:20time to do 25 years old he was
6:22overzealous and he just did whatever he
6:24could do to get it out prosecution of
6:27thinness so did they are they how do you
6:30sign a confession yeah and the way I
6:32find it I knew it was wrong I put my
6:35signature on the outside of paper and
6:37that was brought up in in court like if
6:40she knew what she was signing why did
6:41she put her initials way over here and
6:45you accepted that as a as her you know
6:48hey that's a fulsome know that I'm good
6:52they just they want your head they just
6:55wanted a conviction how long did Shiloh
7:00I try last a week because two hours for
7:03them to come back and if I get very near
7:06the jury had a jury not of my peers but
7:08haven't you two black from the jury one
7:10was all do we tell you the symptoms
7:16sends me to die by lethal injection
7:18launched to 13th 1990 and my death date
7:21july second nineteen ninety on the new
7:25industrial use mammals
7:32prison for a year browse to it how come
7:36you were on death row for two years of
7:38the two years and a month when they
7:40overturned my sentence in 92 sent me dad
7:44back down I'm thinking that I did well
7:45how did we come to overturning the
7:46symptoms they overturned it because the
7:48dish return took the jury to a picnic
7:50why they were supposed to be sequestered
7:51and he kept alluding to the fact that I
7:53wouldn't testify in my own defense he
7:56made jokes being so concerned and you
7:59can't do that but he can't do it because
8:01of me he did it I guess just to do it my
8:04attorneys will let me take the stand in
8:05my own defense I tried but they were let
8:08me take the show who said hey you know
8:09what district attorney screwed up here
8:12we went to bat for either the first
8:15attorney that I had felt really bad
8:17because we really didn't do the
8:18investigative work at two attorneys one
8:20was drunk with it the main attorney I
8:22decided to write a brief for this for my
8:26nowhere to go to the higher court and
8:28when he did I ended it with two sets of
8:31new attorneys who took his briefs and
8:33they went to argue which is one of the
8:35attorneys name was Clive Stafford Smith
8:37who was a he's started organization I'll
8:40retrieve and he's from England but he
8:42does a lot of work in the states at the
8:44time and I he saw my case and took it
8:49you didn't pay charged music into the
8:53game they knew who was wrong so you your
8:59child got overturned is that when you
9:00were exonerated know when I was with my
9:02trial was overturned in 92 I thought
9:05that I was supposed to go back to court
9:06and you know try to be over but it
9:09didn't happen like that this returning
9:11made me sit in the county jail another
9:12three years before i even went back to
9:14trial for the second trial when i went
9:18that you asked for a speedy trial well
9:20my lawyers did yeah he he kept making
9:22excuses and they kept grand him you know
9:25more time and it took three years so
9:29then once we did make it back to court
9:32all the time in my firm's records he had
9:35heart problems kidney problems and
9:37chronic bowel syndrome always there the
9:40autopsy report that was done it was
9:42halfway done because they didn't exhibit
9:45in have enough money to do
9:46proper office reports they just kind of
9:48throw them together and I all this was
9:50found out in the second trial some of
9:53the likely also police officers they
9:58change their testimony a lot of so it's
10:02a hours of deliberation I'll find on
10:05your TV 7 18 to 99 25 right on already
10:09six lamp unit took an idea here's our
10:13that's wrong please nemikham this will
10:15not kill situation give a nice apology
10:18no I got it upset they were very angry
10:22because anyone into win the game before
10:24it was for case about it at County alone
10:28that got a genre I mean about living
10:33it's a knowing that you're going to die
10:36i'll be fun time what was this will with
10:40the little situation like famous 659 to
10:47nobody to really tell me their state and
10:51exhaust out they will use acrylic
10:52actually carry out her it says when I
10:58tell please my story that's the hardest
10:59part for me because on I pesos lower
11:04waiting thinking that you know the day I
11:07actually work on that so every day was
11:10you thought you could be eminently you
11:13couldn't were you on a block like with
11:18their rooms next year yeah well next to
11:20me but see when I got the best only and
11:22it's another girl on death row prison
11:25that I was read they didn't have really
11:27had in the world I also so the house was
11:29in the main security unit it could this
11:31rare piece of tape that they would put
11:33it all the end of the hall and you know
11:35you couldn't go beyond this point that's
11:38where we were there's only two of us on
11:40death row at the time and the only
11:42wacker talked to her was to get down on
11:44the floor between the bullet that was
11:48the conversation that I had no with her
11:50those years did your TV our name we
11:55could get a TV later on in it we
11:59reading reading material yeah we they
12:02let it fulfill all I mean we had to be
12:05changed Chapel to go to the law library
12:06and look up cases and stuff like that
12:10the prison they don't do any of that now
12:12but they did it back then we don't have
12:15know where the house we're delighted
12:17give it a Bible or anything like that
12:18and ragan offensive output material
12:21reading material for stuff like yeah how
12:28tell me about your conversation me know
12:31basically with her talking to me trying
12:34to tell me her experience of being ago
12:35she had been on there for a while mmm
12:37she kind of knew you know what they
12:39expect or what was going on she just
12:42basically just let me grow up I was 19 I
12:47got there I was she she 30 that's what
12:53happened she was a piece of cool police
12:55up there he got out no she got all day
12:5840 but they gave her for 25 years to one
13:01does Mississippi so utilized to
13:05definitely it's still on the books still
13:08on the books and actually and add it
13:09more to it I think they kind of regret
13:12the firing squad and like this chair we
13:15have lethal injection but they're trying
13:16to do add those two I don't understand
13:20the electric chair that just doesn't
13:22make sense to me it does not make sense
13:25living right because we've talked many
13:28times to people on death row Green Mile
13:33yes I that was it that was very sad and
13:37but just thinking I do a better job if
13:41you're wanting execute somebody that's
13:44just a horrible way to go no ideas just
13:48put somebody under their existence I
13:50make them miserable on their way bottom
13:52line so you're John raid well you
13:57communicated with this lady to a toilet
14:00I mean I'm on the floor you had that
14:01talk underneath the under the wall yeah
14:03under wall she was really my keeper
14:07again we did
14:10much that's going on there during your
14:11days are you really I mean what would
14:13you talk about the life itself yeah just
14:16the things you want to do no Oak's dream
14:18stuff I wanted to do that didn't get a
14:20chance to do want to see my phone when
14:23I'm older found that older them
14:25something bad and all so some people say
14:31well you know if we if we get rid of the
14:33death penalty where we're going to get
14:36rid of a deterrent you know for people
14:40doing crimes or we're not gonna be able
14:42to use that in the negotiations your
14:45prosecution to get confessions and
14:47things of that nature that's all kind of
14:49screwed up isn't it is because the
14:52definite is not a deterrent it doesn't
14:53suit climb people are filled one out
14:55doing god knows what I think that
15:00you really definitely will be great so
15:04living in a cubicle if instead of giving
15:07somebody the death penalty in spending
15:09millions of dollars i don't know how
15:10much was spent on your case from the
15:13state but if you were to be put in that
15:14cubicle for the rest of your life only
15:17allowed one hour oh I justice has to be
15:21served for those that do commit instance
15:23that the gentleman that went I'm I
15:24shouldn't call me gentlemen but he went
15:25into a bar gay bar and he just shot up
15:27everybody that was going to happen to
15:30that person sorry your garage general
15:32population is too good saying I beg to
15:37differ yeah yeah because see for me if I
15:41hadn't been in detective density pinion
15:43calculus because you're not facing
15:46people think that you're all but you
15:48change so many things happen ribbon and
15:51general population is worse because get
15:54raped its speed up tab it's true i mean
15:59people think that prison is really hard
16:02for the card that means for you yeah or
16:04like it that's just not true sometimes
16:06that trade was here look at rats and I
16:10fail isn't a no place for nobody and if
16:15you get that kind of training for life
16:16sentence my work yourself it's really a
16:20disservice to be honest to be honest you
16:22you're not show you some prison I tell
16:25everybody there I mean I also have to
16:28either the revolving door I really don't
16:31but I just don't feel that we have the
16:34right of Center vegetate those life
16:35because I feel like if you kill me for
16:38something that I did in order to any
16:41better than me you're killing killing is
16:43wrong it doesn't matter hottie and gooey
16:44and I just feel like prison takes care
16:47of itself what you do Jeffrey Dahmer
16:50it's happening here in the last two
16:53months so you're obviously being in the
16:59bottom what stopped you from losing your
17:01mind Oh hard i mean i think the
17:04conversations with her role it a lot
17:08great a lot because I imagine if I had a
17:11set
17:12probably cracked up I mean it's what is
17:15it you know that you know the verse in
17:17the Bible it says before hearken
17:19demagogic written in our heart
17:22our hearts condemn Assad then we have
17:23conference towards God you shooting in a
17:27prison knowing that you you know your
17:29child dies and you were accused there
17:31must have been some self-reflection
17:32thing I done wrong what I derive did all
17:35that I was angry for the first three I
17:38wasn't headed everything and everyone
17:40because I felt like I you know I tried
17:42to say you know I'm gonna do the right
17:44thing didn't know how to do so I felt
17:46like I shouldn't left the house I felt I
17:50was continuing myself I didn't need to
17:52look for Noel yet cuz I do that every
17:54day of my life you know I figured always
17:56try always making ten what I've done
17:59better with you know but I look at it
18:01like my phone already creeped sick to
18:04the point that I didn't even know I
18:05didn't even know he had all these easy
18:08and and I say that to say today I have a
18:1214 year old daughter with the same
18:13exactly and we're fighting for her life
18:16right now so I mean it's not fit I'm
18:20something that happening i will compete
18:23concert for me now you're going around
18:25the country doing the check from this
18:28lipid utility Mississippi know a little
18:33more north bad ago how to find something
18:38better yeah so yeah yeah dad you're out
18:41there you know what is the reason that
18:47you doing why are you going how many
18:49states have you done on two so far do
18:55this because I want to bring attention
18:57because i think that the film is like
19:00the knowledge what I really think it is
19:03and I think that is more we educate and
19:06tell people about their students is not
19:08imposed run and I figure if I keep doing
19:13our best to change in the organization
19:15that I work with our witnesses and it's
19:18comprised of nothing blood therefore
19:20exonerating these are people that 150
19:23something that has already been
19:24accelerated a lot of things that's a lot
19:27of counting the warmth that they don't
19:28already killed the dizzle they're not
19:31saying no one else end up a lot how many
19:33people aren't different right now Gina
19:36but I think one of the things that
19:39disturbs me most about this whole thing
19:41I mean I've been poor definitely all my
19:42life you know in this part of the you
19:45know being conservative you know justice
19:47I mean justice denied us or delayed
19:51istam you know justice denied in and you
19:55come up from a fake that that believes
19:58that there is a degree of of justice
20:02that need to be carried out however in
20:04that same faith which is my Christian
20:06faith it the Lord is very angry with
20:09those that shed this is blood and if we
20:14allow innocent blood be shed in our
20:18justice system and if some innocent
20:21legate's that's not the cost of doing
20:23business and and these six things stuff
20:26the Lord hey no lying tongue last one is
20:30he that he that shits in a simple I'd so
20:35if we are trust these people that have
20:39ambitions and did you know they like
20:41they just made a conviction I'm going to
20:42make attorney general if I get this this
20:45person on death row I'm gonna look like
20:48a hero because I got the bad guy
20:50regardless of the truth and it seems
20:52that that's happened at least 150 times
20:54in our what are the safeguards from
20:57being under a road prosecutor business
21:03and I feel like as long as we have a
21:06human element surrounding the distance
21:08we're not going to get it right I'm just
21:10sorry I just don't feel like you can fix
21:14this or make it where I got the right
21:16person this time I just don't I feel
21:19like if you got a life sentence you got
21:21a chance to go back and fix with you so
21:24you can't fix the person there to kill
21:26you k you can't go back and fix that so
21:28that's why I feel like we should best
21:30final bleeding again so you must you
21:32must have spoken to a number of
21:34exoneration what is one of the most
21:36compelling stories that you've heard
21:37other than your own well I mean we just
21:41whole time is wall justice and we want
21:43to see something done for the role that
21:45lead up this is like ups to us
21:48we were tortured no reason I mean being
21:52accused of something that you didn't do
21:53and you sit in something no big it in
21:55your bathroom and you having to you know
21:58look at its window and say hey you know
22:01I didn't do this you guys got me locked
22:03up Colin so this is 17 year olds are out
22:07there right now and which is therefore
22:11being accused of them what's your first
22:13advice give advice to them I wouldn't
22:16think it always I would see it's my
22:19parents or whatever are coming that room
22:22or I would explore attorney right off
22:23the back I don't care what they say to
22:25me I would that's where i miss good fit
22:27I should have waited ask my mom
22:31something that's furniture in here thank
22:34you learning and keep your mouth closed
22:36and let the attorney advise you as to
22:38what you need to do well what about
22:39after four hours worth of being
22:41interrogated I actually watched them a
22:44Discovery Channel where they wore
22:46somebody down 24 hours I know it and
22:48they didn't mom to eat no bathroom break
22:51and and they got a fault you know
22:54because the boy was handicapped no no no
23:00and then that's my hardest thing I don't
23:02know I don't have an answer for that
23:04because that's that falls on the Calusa
23:07phone wherever you have interrogated lot
23:10of money retraining you know what I'm
23:12saying and I think it's a lot of naughty
23:14college type night this isn't it my
23:17humble opinion you know the police are
23:18trying to do their job and and you know
23:20but if you know there could be one bad
23:22apple in the hole you know we don't want
23:26to cast aspersions how we don't know
23:27about there's the police officer ability
23:29yeah I melody I it's the prosecutor
23:33that's but on the case that should be
23:35professional and look at all the
23:36evidence and have a clear discernment
23:39but you have somebody who's ambitious I
23:41think that's work I really struggle with
23:43it your ambition doesn't you know you
23:48can affect somebody's life or death and
23:51we were joking a little bit before we
23:53got on camera and said you know I have
23:55you know my faith in the justice system
24:00is somewhat skewed right
24:02and we both agree to that because if lot
24:05they're flawed individuals inland
24:08precious life so why I feel like we
24:14should have a dancer so we wouldn't have
24:15to worry about them making that type of
24:18mistake and killing them well I
24:23appreciate you coming on the show how do
24:24people get in touch with witness when is
24:26the institute is go to limit inches or
24:28and you can go on and it shows exonerees
24:32that we have that are in the program
24:34with us and then you can also go to d
24:37picta therefore it shows all these
24:41honorees and i'm in other cities and
24:45basically just you know get in touch
24:48with us that way you can come to your
24:49town how many schools churches you speak
24:52all over you do this for a living which
24:55is a strong fear fees no I don't do for
24:57a living I just do it every night I'll
24:59do it all time I got a job what do you
25:01for woody's you for i'm working at
25:03target all right all right good yeah are
25:07you married no i mean well a merry but
25:10subsequent you thinking yeah so it takes
25:14its toll right I did everything takes it
25:16so it is as you know exonerees is hard
25:18for your spouse or something to count on
25:21the Santa jean-marie right it makes it
25:23kind of difficult and I think you
25:24brought something up above me two pts I
25:26mean people that come back with more
25:27aware people that have been in orange a
25:30detour to institutionalize which in my
25:32opinion can be just as bad as being sore
25:34again mentally you have to deal with a
25:37lot of different emotions you're very
25:38complicated at this point right you
25:40don't get help for it to get out they
25:42don't and we've all tell me can't for it
25:45so I try to do this is my way of filling
25:48my fill I think that does help when you
25:51help others it helps you process for the
25:54whole thing some people can internalize
25:56and poor me but by helping others I
25:59think you have me you can move forward
26:02and move on with your life and out of
26:05here and you're 14 year old daughter how
26:07does she deal with all this well she
26:09wants the car with me every time I gold
26:10but that's it strip right yeah thanks
26:14for coming on the show really
26:16preciate it and thank you for all your
26:17hard work on this ok you know there's
26:20there's some legislation coming up soon
26:21in the house about expanding the death
26:24penalty and I think I'm going to have a
26:25little trouble supporting that but for
26:28more information if you want to find out
26:29about it please contact witness when
26:32Santa phys.org so thanks for watching
26:36the show we appreciate it and if you
26:38have a story come on let me know next
26:41week
26:47[Music]
27:09[Music]
27:19[Music]
27:22the preceding program was provided by an
27:25independent producer solely responsible
27:27for its content the opinions expressed
27:30do not necessarily represent the views
27:32of this station its staff board of
27:35directors or underwriters

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