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Sean Williams: What Really Happened In That Room? — Transcript

by The Interrogator Files · 14,928 words · 2,229 segments · language en · Watch on YouTube

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0:00On August 5th, 2014, at a Walmart in
0:02Beaver Creek, Ohio, 22-year-old John
0:05Crawford III entered the store to shop.
0:07While in the sporting goods section, he
0:09picked up an unboxed air rifle that was
0:11on display and continued walking through
0:13the store, talking on his cell phone. At
0:15the same time, another customer, Ronald
0:17Richie, observed Crawford and called
0:19911. Richie reported that a man was in
0:22the store holding what appeared to be a
0:24rifle and pointing it at people. This
0:26information was relayed to local law
0:28enforcement. Surveillance footage later
0:30showed that Crawford did not point the
0:32air rifle at anyone during his time in
0:33the store. Richie later clarified his
0:36statement, acknowledging that Crawford
0:38had not aimed the gun at anyone,
0:40although he still believed the object
0:42was being handled in a concerning
0:43manner. In response to the 911 call, two
0:46officers from the Beaver Creek Police
0:48Department, Shawn Williams and David
0:50Darko, arrived on the scene. Officer
0:53Williams fired two shots, striking
0:55Crawford. The officers believed the BB
0:57gun was a real firearm. Crawford was
1:00transported to a hospital where he was
1:01pronounced dead. During the evacuation
1:04of the store, a shopper named Angela
1:06Williams collapsed while fleeing the
1:07scene. She suffered a fatal heart
1:09attack, adding a second death to the
1:12incident. The events of that day led to
1:15investigations, public discussion, and
1:17legal proceedings, raising questions
1:19about communication, perception, and
1:22response in high pressure situations.
1:24Here is the interrogation of officer
1:26Shawn Williams.
1:31See you right there if if okay with you.
1:33Thanks for coming
1:40[Applause]
1:45in.
1:49[Applause]
1:51Yeah, okay. Sean, we just met briefly in
1:54the hallway. Um, but I am special agent
1:56Dave Hornac with BCI. This is special
1:58agent Brent Kurpatre. We just been
1:59assigned to look into the the Walmart
2:01shooting from the other night. You're
2:03aware of that and that's why why we're
2:04here together.
2:06Um, we've already talked with officer or
2:09sorry, sorry, Sergeant Darko and um
2:12explain the same thing to you that we
2:14did with him and I had spoken with um
2:16with Mr. Pop about this next step as
2:18well. We're a criminal investigation
2:20agency. We've been called in by your
2:22department to act as an independent
2:25investigating entity to determine the
2:28facts of what happened the other night.
2:29Um as a part of that the uh due to the
2:34unfortunate death of uh of the subject
2:37the
2:39um there is as a potential for this
2:42criminal investigation we always as a
2:44matter of protocol read Miranda rights
2:46to the to people in your position as
2:48being one of the officers that was
2:49involved. Okay. So um we want to we do
2:52it for a couple of reasons. One is this
2:54is not an internal investigation.
2:56It's a criminal investigation um but not
2:59necessarily pointed at anything right
3:01now. We are um u going to read you this
3:05and ask you to sign it. Do you have any
3:06issue with doing that? No. Okay. And are
3:08you here voluntarily? Yes. Okay. You
3:10realize you're free to free to go from
3:12our standpoint if you want to go? Yes.
3:14Okay.
3:15Okay. Sean, I know you're familiar with
3:17this, but we we typically read it as
3:19well. I look at it and it's going to be
3:21a couple of parts here. So, I'm going to
3:22read it to you out loud. Um, before we
3:24ask you any questions, you must
3:25understand your rights. You do have the
3:27right to remain silent. Anything you say
3:28can be used against you in court or
3:30other proceedings. You have the right to
3:31talk to a lawyer before advice before we
3:33ask you any questions and to have him
3:35with you during questioning. If you
3:36can't afford a lawyer, won't be
3:37appointed for you before any questioning
3:39if you wish. If you decide to answer
3:40questions now without a lawyer present,
3:42you will still have the right to stop
3:43the questioning at any time. You also
3:45have the right to stop the questioning
3:46any time until you talk to a lawyer. We
3:48realize your lawyer's here, but uh
3:50understand all that. Yes. Okay. If you
3:52would please sign date and put the I'm
3:56sorry sign date and put the time right
4:02there. Let's mark it as 109 is what I
4:05had if that works for you. It's 880
4:07today.
4:11814. Okay. And then one more part. This
4:16is the waiver of rights.
4:18Um, so this would be you. You, this will
4:21say that you have read this statement of
4:23your rights. It has been read to you.
4:24You understand what your rights are.
4:25You're willing to make a statement,
4:27answer questions. You don't want to
4:28learn at this time. Uh, you understand
4:30know what you're doing. No promises or
4:31threats have been made to you, and no
4:32pressure or coercion of any kind has
4:34been used against you. You hereby
4:36voluntarily and intentionally wave your
4:37rights. You're willing to make a
4:38statement and answer questions. Yes.
4:40Okay. If you agree to that, do the same.
4:41at the same time I'll work on.
4:55Okay, thank you. I'm just going to take
4:57care of the last bits of getting a
4:59witness
5:06line. You mind again, sir? Both spots.
5:13Was it convenient for you to come in
5:14today? Yeah.
5:19Okay. Sean, the reason my computer's up
5:21here is we're going to show you u some
5:22video from the store. We're going to
5:24talk a little bit first. Show you some
5:25video from the store. We're going to
5:25listen to the radio traffic. Again, see
5:27if that helps jar your memory about
5:28anything. Not that it necessarily needs
5:31it, but uh to get us on the same track
5:33of what we're listening to and seeing.
5:35Okay.
5:38Um Sean. Um your full name Shawn
5:42Williams. Um yes. Okay. How do you spell
5:44your first name? S E A N. Okay. What's
5:46your rank, sir? Patrolman. Patrolman.
5:51What's your badge number? 90. Okay. Is
5:53that also the radio sign you use? Call
5:56sign. Yeah. How many years you've been
5:58with Fever Creek? Um nine. Okay. Has
6:01your um what's the extent of your law
6:03enforcement experience? Um I got hired
6:06on March um here at Beaver Creek. Okay.
6:10So all my years in law enforcement been
6:11here. Yeah. Okay.
6:16Okay. We're going to have a lot of
6:18questions for you. Um trying to do a
6:20thorough investigation for and we're
6:22just here to gather the facts. Like I
6:24said, we don't make determinations about
6:25what occurred. We gather the facts from
6:28all types of sources. you being a
6:31primary source of of the information
6:32we're going to have and we present that
6:35to the prosecutor's office for for their
6:37review. That's that's the way it is. Any
6:39discuss I know if you've been involved
6:40in in these types of things before we'll
6:42get to that as well. Um where we like to
6:44start if it's good with you
6:47is again we're going back to the Tuesday
6:50the 5th the evening at Walmart. Um, we
6:52want you to start wherever you feel is
6:54appropriate about your initial knowledge
6:56of what was going on at Walmart that
6:58night and just tell the whole thing
6:59through. Try to interrupt you not too
7:01much at first and then we're going to
7:02keep rolling back a little bit. That
7:04work for you? Y. Okay. So, Tuesday
7:06night, good starting point. I'll start
7:08wherever you like. Um, I was um that
7:12particular evening I was doing paperwork
7:14behind Walmart um when the tone dropped
7:17on the radio.
7:19Um I because you were you you were
7:22already there before you got a call. You
7:24were at the Walmart act. Why why'd you
7:25happen to be there? Um I just uh taken a
7:28crash report at the BW3s
7:30um right across the way and sometimes I
7:33go behind Walmart cuz nobody usually
7:35goes back there just to kind of sit and
7:37do paperwork and Okay. Um don't usually
7:39get bothered back there. Good. Sorry. Go
7:41ahead. That's okay. So, um the tone
7:45drops on my radio signaling an emergency
7:48um from dispatch and they dispatched two
7:51units. Um they just I forget which units
7:55exactly they were.
7:57Um they just dropped a tone
8:01and stated two units on the radio. Then
8:04they kind of hesitated on the radio. Um
8:06so I didn't know exactly what was going
8:07on at first. So, I brought up my
8:08computer, brought up the call screen,
8:10double clicked the call, and saw it. It
8:13was at 3360 Pentagon. And I'm like,
8:15"Okay, I'm right here." So, um I just
8:18immediately started heading towards the
8:20around the side towards BP towards the
8:22front of Walmart. And that's when um
8:24dispatch started giving um um started
8:28explaining what the call was about. Um
8:31they dispatched two units and stated um
8:34that there was a subject with a gun
8:37inside Walmart. Um they stated that he
8:42was waving the gun around. Um that he
8:45was pointing it at people and that it
8:48was a rifle type weapon. Mhm. And that
8:51he was loading it. Um at the time the
8:56dispatch he was loading it is what
8:58dispatch said. Um, so I arrived on
9:02scene. Um, and based on the facts it was
9:05a rifle and that he was pointing at
9:07people, winging around and loading it,
9:10um, I deployed my rifle. I pulled to the
9:12front of the store, got out, called out
9:14that I was on scene and, uh, I pulled
9:18out my rifle and my goal at that time
9:20was to wait for the next unit to arrive
9:22and we were going to,
9:24um, um, go in basically. Mhm.
9:30So, so I arrived on scene. I parked
9:34um by
9:36the eastern most entrance doors um kind
9:41of by the um food area. Okay.
9:45Um because that's like the the closest
9:47doors there were. So, I parked there and
9:50then we got where they use in the pet
9:52area which was in the opposite side of
9:54the store from where I was parked. By
9:56that time, I could see a unit coming
9:58down Pentagon Boulevard, another car.
10:00So, I just ran to the other side to
10:03where he parked and ended up being um
10:06Sergeant Darko. So, as I ran up to him
10:09with my rifle, he was in his trunk
10:12getting his tactical vest on and getting
10:14his rifle as well. Um as I waited for
10:18him to get ready,
10:20um um dispatch said that the caller
10:24still had an eye on him. Um, now he's in
10:26the PET section. Um, and then I
10:29confirmed with dispatch before we went
10:31in. I confirmed with them I asked if he
10:33was in fact pointing the rifle at
10:35people. Mhm. And, uh, they confirmed yes
10:38that he was pointing the rifle at
10:39people. So,
10:43um, based on everything we knew at that
10:46time,
10:48um, um, Sergeant and I were just going
10:50to go straight to
10:52the suspect. Um, at that point we were
10:56going to go in through the
11:01um the um the garden center doors, but
11:05it was like barricaded by a big metal
11:08like gate fence. Couldn't we couldn't
11:10gain entry through there, which would
11:11been like the closest entrance to the
11:12pet area. So, we went one entrance to
11:16the east, which was closer to like the
11:18pharmacy. Mhm.
11:19Um and um I we were right outside the
11:22door and we kind of gave each other a
11:24nod that we were going in and then uh we
11:27made entry into the uh into
11:31Walmart. Um we walked straight in and
11:36immediately it
11:37was the store was very very crowded. Um
11:43um as we made our way towards the the
11:46pet area, I mean there are families
11:48everywhere, kids walking around. Um
11:51there's people all over the place
11:52crowding the main the main um drag. Um I
11:57don't know how to explain it. Like the
11:58main um hallway area, I guess,
12:01separating the different uh departments.
12:03Um was very very crowded. So, we're
12:06passing people, kind of scanning both
12:09directions as we're heading back towards
12:10the pet area
12:13um just to see if we could um find the
12:18person. I guess I should um rewind for a
12:21second. They said it was a black male um
12:23that that had the rifle. So, um as we're
12:26walking, like at that time, the
12:29particular area we were in, it didn't
12:31seem like anybody was too alarmed at
12:33that point.
12:35um just in the bulk of the the middle
12:38right outside the pharmacy, people seem
12:40to be acting normal. Um so I even asked
12:44I asked one person just at random if he
12:46had seen anybody with a gun walking
12:48around and he said no. Um so we just
12:51kept clearing the the rooms as quickly
12:53as possible as we headed back towards
12:55the pet area. So, we uh reach the pet
13:00area, which I think is like three or
13:02four aisles in the in the far um um
13:06southwest corner of the store.
13:10Um we
13:12um so we carefully start skinning that
13:16cuz we the last report was back there.
13:19So, um Darko's kind of scanned to the
13:21left and I'm kind of looking to the
13:23right, covering them. And then we've
13:24reached the the end where there's only
13:26one more row left in the pet area. So
13:30based on um the witnesses, there's a
13:33good chance, you know, I thought that he
13:35was there to the left. Um at that point,
13:38um I kind of told Darko because there's
13:40a long hall to the right as well. So if
13:43Darko would have made that left turn to
13:45the final row, he would have been
13:47exposed all the way to the end of the
13:49store to the right. Mhm. So, I told him
13:51I was going to cover him to the right
13:53while he um scanned to the left. So, he
13:58um scanned to the left and I kind of
14:00briefly glanced to the right and as soon
14:02as I glanced to the right, I heard him
14:04yell, "Drop your weapon. Drop your
14:06weapon." Um
14:09um in like a repeated manner. So, as
14:11soon as he said that, I swung around to
14:14his right and kind of cleared him so I
14:17could see what he was looking at,
14:18talking to us. So, we're kind of side by
14:20side. Mhm. And as soon as
14:23I turned around and looked down the hall
14:26or towards the end of the the pet area,
14:28I saw a black male
14:30holding what immediately popped out of
14:33me at me was a rifle. I saw a rifle um
14:36in hand. Um and I could see the
14:39silhouette of a magazine and it looked
14:42like a rifle. Um, so
14:46as Sergeant Darko commanded him to drop
14:49the weapon, um, he did not do so, um, he
14:54made, um, I've been trying to find words
14:57to describe this over the last few days.
15:00Um, he did not drop a weapon. Um, he
15:03made a movement to what I, um,
15:06interpreted as aggressive. Um he did as
15:10he was moving with the rifle and was not
15:13dropping it. And um I felt at that time
15:19he had the rifle in a position to where
15:22he could have raised it up or he could
15:24have
15:26um shot either me or Sergeant Darco. And
15:30I also felt that if he were to escape
15:33around the end and make um way to the
15:36rest of the the store that um all the
15:38families and the kids were uh in an
15:41immediate risk as well. So at that point
15:43when he didn't drop the weapon and he
15:46started making movements with it, um I
15:50felt that my life was at risk. I felt
15:52that Sergeant Darko's life was at risk
15:54and I felt that all the families that we
15:56passed walking into the store and the
15:58children um I thought they were all at
16:01risk as well. Um due to all those
16:03circumstances and with him failing to
16:05obey Sergeant Darko's command um I fired
16:09two shots at uh center mass at the at
16:12the subject. Um at that point he went
16:16down and dropped the rifle and kind of
16:18almost disappeared behind the end of the
16:21row.
16:23Um um so we started to make our way and
16:26as we're making our way I could see the
16:28rifle and I could see the the um the
16:31black male and as we're making our way
16:34to the rifle I can see that was still it
16:36was a rifle and as we made our way to
16:39him he like jumped back up and started
16:42running towards the rifle again. Um he
16:46was saying something but I couldn't hear
16:47um I I couldn't hear anything at that
16:49point. My ears were ringing. Um, so he
16:52was saying something. I was just telling
16:53him to get down, get down, get down
16:55because at that point he was already a
16:57threat to us and um, I was forced to
17:01engage him and then he was about to come
17:04back towards that weapon again. So I
17:06felt just everything
17:08about him was aggressive. He came back
17:13at us after he'd already been shot
17:17um to what I consider to to get the
17:20rifle again. So um he was about at the
17:24threshold where I was um considering
17:27shooting again when he collapsed. He
17:30came back towards us at the rifle and
17:31I'm telling him, "Get down, get down,
17:32get down, get down, get down, get down
17:34on the ground." and um he um he kind of
17:38reaches the the area of the rifle and
17:40kind of just
17:41collapses. Um so
17:45um kind of walk past the rifle and
17:49immediately scan around, make sure
17:51there's no other threats and um I um
17:56tell him to roll over onto his belly um
17:59and put his hands behind his back. Um he
18:03was kind of squirming and yelling and
18:05screaming um stuff that I couldn't
18:07understand and he wasn't immediately
18:10um cooperative as far as put his hands
18:12behind his back. I had to get on top of
18:14him and kind of pull his hands together
18:17um to cuff him. Mhm. Um when I cuffed
18:20him, I could see he had a very serious
18:22injury to to one of his elbows and he
18:26had another wound to an other uh to his
18:29other arm. I can't remember which arm
18:31was which that had the the severe
18:35wound.
18:37Um so my immediately my immediate
18:40thought was okay he's down. He's
18:43injured. There's no immediate threats in
18:45the immediate area. Um now we have to
18:49um treat him as a as a patient basically
18:52who's who's been wounded. So I
18:56told um by that time other units were
18:59right on scene and um Matt Stall was
19:02there. Um I either I for if I told him
19:05on the radio if I told him personally I
19:06go grab his medical kit and I know one
19:09of our officers um officer Bondi he um
19:13always carries a tourniquet. So, my
19:15initial thought was I did a quick um I
19:18looked him over um head to toe and from
19:22um what I could tell he only had wounds
19:24to his arms. Okay. From what I could
19:26see. Uh we even pulled his shirt up and
19:29I couldn't see any any rounds to his
19:32body from what I could see. Okay. So, um
19:36my goal at that time was to
19:40um treat what we could see, which was
19:42the wounds to the arm. So, I had
19:45um Officer Stall bring the medical kit
19:47and Officer Bonnie brought his
19:48tourniquet. Um the medical medical kit
19:51that Officer Stall brought also had a
19:53tourniquet in it. So, Officer Stall
19:56applied tourniquets to his arms to uh to
20:00stop the bleeding to the to the arms.
20:03Um, and he was still
20:07um making noises and moving um as we
20:12stood over him. And I just kept giving
20:14him words of encouragement, told him to
20:16stay awake, stay awake. Um, there were a
20:19couple times where it seemed like he
20:21passed out or fell asleep and I just
20:24kind of was tapping him on the on the
20:25side of the face trying to get him to
20:26wake up. Wake up, wake up, wake up. Just
20:28trying to keep him awake and keep him
20:31alive.
20:33Um the medics were
20:36there probably right when the
20:38tourniquets were applied and um we
20:42basically just um assessed his
20:44condition, kept him awake um tried to
20:47keep him conscious until the medics
20:48could get there. They have you know
20:50better tools um than we did at the time.
20:53So the medics got there and um um
20:58started treating them. Mhm. Um at that
21:01point once they did their assessment
21:03they loaded him up and and um took him
21:06away. And
21:08then after
21:11that, I met with um Darko like kind of
21:15in the side hall and he took uh he took
21:17my rifle and gave me his rifle and
21:23um he I knew it was probably just for
21:26evidence um because they they were going
21:28to have to take it eventually. So he
21:30took my rifle and gave me his. I
21:32eventually gave his rifle to officer
21:34stall and then I made my way outside and
21:37met officer Darko outside the doors and
21:40we just kind of
21:42um stood there until we were given
21:45further directions.
21:49Okay. Sean, were you injured at all
21:51during that entire incident? No. Okay.
21:57Um, we'll go back through slowly and uh,
22:00someone's going to jump around when we
22:01ask questions. So, I know it's tough to
22:03to talk about and sit through it. If you
22:04need a break at any time through, just
22:06let us know. Okay. Um, were you on were
22:10you on regular duty that night? What's
22:11your duty shift? Um, it's 11:00 a.m. to
22:1311:00 p.m. Okay. So, you were nearing
22:17the end of your shift. Um, what time
22:19approximately were you in the Walmart
22:20parking lot?
22:23I I if I got there paperwork around like
22:267:45 7:45 and do you recall just from I
22:30know I know a lot of information has
22:31come out even in the media. I'm not sure
22:32if you paid attention but about the
22:34times and so forth. Do you recall
22:35approximately the time the call came in?
22:37Yeah, it was around 1820 I believe.
22:40Okay.
22:43Um 1820 would be 6:20 p.m. So
22:49I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Yeah. 2020. It
22:51It's Yeah, military time gets me a lot
22:53too, especially in something like this.
22:55All right. So, about 8:20 p.m., correct?
22:58Okay. And that is during the course of
23:00your normal duty shift. So, you had
23:02about 3 hours left on duty that night.
23:04Yeah. Okay.
23:06Okay. And Sean, are you on
23:08administrative leave right now from the
23:09department? Um, that's what the chief
23:10told me um that I was. Okay. Okay. And
23:15did they uh did he say to you that
23:16that's part of what typically just
23:18occurs in a situ that's what the
23:19department does in a situation like
23:20this? Yes. Okay. Any officer involved in
23:24a shooting just typically does not
23:25admin. Okay.
23:28Um I'll I'll start near the near the
23:31beginning there. You're already in the
23:33Walmart parking lot. You said the tone
23:35came in for call to that Walmart and you
23:37said you you worked your way around to
23:39the front. Did you walk around or you
23:41drove around? I drove around. Okay.
23:43Since you're already there, did you
23:45activate your lights and sirens? No.
23:47Okay. Did feel there was a need to at
23:49that point? No. Okay. Um, is it accurate
23:52that the cruiser cameras do you have a
23:54cruiser camera in your vehicle? Yes.
23:55Okay. Is it accurate that those are only
23:57activated by two means? One is to
23:59activate the lights and sirens and the
24:01camera comes on. The other option is to
24:03do it manually. Yes. Okay. Since you
24:05didn't activate your lights and sirens,
24:06you didn't have the cruiser camera on.
24:08Um, and you did not activate the cruiser
24:11camera manually either. Correct. I I did
24:12not.
24:21Okay. In the in the front of the store,
24:24you and and and I'm not sure if you said
24:28his full name or not. We just
24:29interviewed him, so it kind of went
24:30together. You said Darkco. We're
24:31referring to who? Sergeant Dave Darko.
24:33Okay. He was the only other officer on
24:36scene at the time. Immediate time. Okay.
24:40and you engaged him. You guys met up at
24:44what sound like the trunk of his
24:45vehicle. Okay. And do you recall
24:49speaking to him about what was your
24:50conversation? Um if you if you had any
24:53at that time weird conversation.
24:57The only thing we really said was
25:00um we we didn't really have an extended
25:03conversation. He was gearing up. Mhm.
25:05And we made our way to the door.
25:08dispatch was continually um giving us
25:10information. So um while he was standing
25:13there, that's when I confirmed with
25:14dispatch if he was pointing the the
25:16rifle at people. Mhm. And they said yes.
25:18And then we we just based on training,
25:23we just knew what we were going to do.
25:25We're just going to go straight to the
25:26threat. So we kind of said, "Are you
25:27ready?" And he said, "Let's go." That's
25:29it. What's happened in the front?
25:32Okay. Uh you guys can't get into one
25:34entrance. You go to another one. you get
25:36inside and are do you recall um either
25:39you or or Sergeant Darko giving any
25:42instructions to customers in the store?
25:46Um I do recall I I think he told a few
25:51people right in the beginning
25:55to get like I think there's there's some
25:57people standing around looking at us
25:58like what the heck's going on and he
26:00told them just to just to leave. Okay.
26:04Um um so I that's the only time I recall
26:08him tell anyone I believe. What what are
26:10you looking for at that point is your
26:12entry in the store. What what's your
26:13what's your thought? Um my thought is
26:16that we have to based on the the calls
26:21um and the situation and what
26:25information was given to us. We had a
26:27threat in the store um and there was a
26:30threat to everyone in the store and
26:32we're trained to go immediately as
26:35quickly and as possible to that threat.
26:39Okay. So our goal was
26:41to go to where we knew the threat was
26:44while still carefully making sure he
26:46wasn't in the crowd. Um so our goal was
26:50to just move as quickly and efficiently
26:52as possible to the threat. Okay. And you
26:55you mentioned training. What kind of
26:56training have you had in that regard?
26:58Um,
26:59well, two weeks ago we had um we had a
27:04active shooter training and we went
27:08through scenarios exactly like this
27:11where there's people with weapons
27:14um people that were that were actively
27:17shooting and then people that just had
27:18weapons in in in um in an occupied
27:22building. And in that training, we're
27:24told to go straight um to go straight to
27:27the threat, bypassing people um and um
27:33and containing it as best as possible.
27:36And that's what that's how you would
27:37describe what you did in response. Okay.
27:40Yes. And so you felt like the training
27:42that you even just recently had was
27:45relevant to this this exact situation.
27:47Yes. Okay. Have you had um and it sounds
27:51like active shooter train. I'm not sure
27:52if you just responded that way or not.
27:54Have you had that type of training
27:56before? Yeah, we have
27:58it we have it usually once a year. Okay.
28:02Um and again, that training specifically
28:05tells you as the first responding
28:06officer there's a if there is a threat
28:09or an identified threat, you go directly
28:11to the threat. Is that what you're
28:12saying? Correct. Okay.
28:16And you and tech um Sergeant Darko
28:19didn't need to discuss that. that you
28:20felt like you both have been trained on
28:22this enough. Your seasoned officers,
28:25you're going in the door and and looking
28:26for the threat. Yes.
28:29You don't you don't recall specifically
28:31yourself discussing anything with uh
28:33giving commands to customers, but you
28:35did recall at one point um asking Did
28:39you say you asked the customer or or
28:41sorry, did you say you'd ask the
28:42customer or something at one point or
28:43Oh, I did ask. Um when we first walked
28:47in there were just people everywhere
28:50and some some of them didn't I mean just
28:54the one guy asked he didn't seem too
28:55alarmed or anything so just kind of
28:57asked like some one of the first people
28:59I saw like if you see anyone with a gun.
29:02Mhm. He said no. Okay. Um so that's
29:06pretty much the only person I asked and
29:08we were starting to focus. Okay. Um on
29:11that um on that particular direction and
29:13area of the pet area. What were you What
29:15were you um what was your uniform that
29:17night? Um I'm on the bike patrol. Um so
29:20I was wearing
29:21um a
29:24two-tone bicycle uniform top, white with
29:28black and then black shorts um and
29:31shoes. Okay. You're on the bike patrol,
29:33but you were in a cruiser that night.
29:35Yes. Okay.
29:37And uh how's that how is that uniform
29:40outfitted? Where's your Where's your
29:41badge? Where's Um there's a badge. Um,
29:44there's a plain badge, a plain view. Has
29:46my name on it. Has police across the BL
29:48back.
29:51Um, I'd have to look at it. Might see
29:53may see police in the front as well.
29:56Says police across the back. Probably
29:57reflected material behind the bike
29:59patrol. The
30:01uh
30:04um officer, I'm sorry, Sergeant Darkho.
30:07Um, you said he got some things out of
30:09his trunk when you were staging to get
30:11in there. What was he getting out of the
30:12trunk again? Um he was putting on when I
30:14ran up to his cruiser, he was putting on
30:16a tactical vest. Okay. Um which we can
30:18carry um says police on it. You can
30:21carry extra magazines and and anything
30:25else uh they need to carry in an active
30:27shooter type scenario. Put some on and
30:30he had his rifle and getting his rifle
30:31out. What kind of rifle does he have if
30:33you recall? Um he has a we're only
30:35allowed to carry an AR-15 style rifle.
30:39Okay. And that's what he had to your
30:40best of your recollection. Okay. Did you
30:42have a tactical vest yourself? No. Okay.
30:45You not assigned one? I didn't I don't
30:47have one.
30:49Okay. So, it's just you in the uniform.
30:52It's Is it mostly white? The top mostly
30:53white or top mostly white. Okay.
30:56Um Sean, do you recall um either of you
31:03identifying yourselves as police at any
31:05point during that response? Um I don't
31:08recall that being said. Okay.
31:12Um would you were
31:14you facing that on is that something you
31:17would normally do? Um it depends on the
31:21the speed of of
31:23of what's going on. I mean,
31:28um,
31:30it when we reached the end, if you're
31:33talking about the final, um, when we
31:35confronted him, um, when we confronted
31:38the suspect, um, he was already giving,
31:41my sergeant was already giving commands
31:42to him. Um, and that's what kind of drew
31:45my attention back to him.
31:48So, um he was giving commands and um I
31:54didn't have time really to say to say
31:57anything myself um to him um before um
32:03before I shot. Okay. Um stick on that
32:07for a minute. We might have jumped a
32:08little uh too far ahead on you to
32:12um keep the flow going for you. the you
32:16recalled Darko, if we're up to the point
32:18where we're at at the uh at the subject,
32:21you recall Darko saying, "Drop your
32:22weapon. Drop your weapon." Is that
32:23correct? Okay.
32:26Did you say something further to the
32:28suspect after that or before that? I did
32:31not. Okay.
32:42Going back to um going back to your
32:45training for a minute, Sean, the uh what
32:48additional training have you had um law
32:51enforcement? 9 years. You have a lot of
32:52training in law enforcement? What what
32:54additional specialized training and like
32:56tactical training have you had, if any?
32:58I've been to um it's called FAST one and
33:02FAST 2. It's a tactical firearms
33:05self-defense class OSP. Uh, I've been to
33:08both of those classes. It's an advanced
33:10tactical type course. Okay. Um, I've
33:14been to
33:16um
33:19um
33:25um officer down civilian rescue, which
33:28is like a um a tactical type response to
33:31um people down in active shooter
33:33situations.
33:34I've
33:36been I have to look at my file. I've
33:38also been the last year I went to
33:40advanced tactical weapons school. M um
33:43where um you learn how to shoot various
33:46different types of weapons, how to
33:47respond to different types of um
33:49scenarios um kind of um okay makes you a
33:53better you know better shot and um helps
33:55you make better decisions under stress
33:57and whatnot. Um so you've had additional
34:00tactical training and
34:02um how often would you say you get any
34:04type of training? Every would you say
34:06every every year? Every few months?
34:09probably I probably um as far as extra
34:13training like that I probably get go
34:15once or twice a year. Okay. But that's
34:17outside of our shooting training that we
34:19do to like qualify with our weapons and
34:21whatnot. Okay. Very good. And and on
34:22that
34:24um are you qualified on the weapon that
34:27you fired that night? Yes. Okay. What is
34:30the specific weapon? It is an AR-15 uh
34:33rifle. Mhm.
34:34um is not um issued by the police
34:39department. It was my personal rifle.
34:41Okay. We are allowed to carry our
34:43personal rifles
34:45um as long as they're an AR-15 style um
34:48rifle and as long as the um our weapons
34:54instructors
34:56um check them for safety and that we
35:01qualify with them. And once we do all
35:02that, then we have to get the weapon
35:04approved by the chief and he'll sign off
35:07on it and then we're allowed to carry
35:08them on duty. Okay. And how how long
35:12have you been qualified with that weapon
35:14with the department able to carry it?
35:16Um, approximately.
35:19Probably 4 years. Okay.
35:26Where is that weapon typically stored in
35:28in your
35:30when do you have a vehicle every night
35:33you like? Yeah, it's um we have a rack
35:35in between our seats. Okay. That we can
35:38um that it's secure. Okay.
35:43You some point chose to that as your
35:46weapon of choice that night. Um give us
35:50the give us the reasoning for that. You
35:51already touched on a little bit, but go
35:52through that again. Um, the reason I
35:54grabbed the rifle, um, was
35:58that from what we knew, the suspect had
36:02a rifle. Mhm. Um,
36:05and
36:08um,
36:10and based on um, what we knew um, that
36:16was just seemed the appropriate weapon.
36:19If because if a rifle can reach out, you
36:22know, really far, then we may have to
36:25shoot a distance as well. So, that's um
36:28the reason. Okay. You wouldn't want to
36:30be stuck with a handgun against another
36:32type of AR weapon or another type of
36:34rifle to have may have more firepower.
36:36Correct. Okay. And you still you felt
36:39like that was the appropriate choice for
36:41that situation? Yes. Okay.
36:52Sean, I know you guys um the department
36:55had you take a toxicology test and uh
36:57urine sample took from you and we got we
36:59got those results, but uh can you verify
37:01for us for this interview? Were you
37:03drinking at all that night? No. Okay. Um
37:06were you using any type of drugs? No.
37:10Okay. Did you do did you feel you were
37:12reasonably well rested that night? Yes.
37:15Okay.
37:18Um, lighting in the store. How would you
37:20How would you describe that? Well lit.
37:22Well lit.
37:32Okay. At one point you said that you
37:36told you said there wasn't much
37:37discussion between you and Darko
37:39outside. You knew what you guys were
37:41doing went inside. At one point you said
37:43that you made a statement to Darko
37:45inside the the store when you guys were
37:47clearing the aisles. Um and believe you
37:50said something that you you'd cover um
37:52one of his sides. Is that accurate?
37:54Yeah. Which side did you say you cover?
37:55Um you recall if you recall? Yeah, I
37:57told him I'd cover to the right if he
37:59was going to check the final road to the
38:01left.
38:04Okay. Do you recall saying anything else
38:07between you to both of you during that
38:08time?
38:12Um, no.
38:27Were you familiar with that Walmart?
38:29Yes. Okay. So, you knew where the pets
38:30area was? Yes.
38:32Okay. Did
38:34you ever encounter that subject? suspect
38:39prior to that night? No. Okay. Have you
38:42learned his name since the incident?
38:45Yes. Okay. And you still still But no,
38:47not familiar with him. Okay.
38:51I think we'll stick at the uh uh point
38:54of the shooting for a minute, Sean, if
38:56you're comfortable with that for a
38:57minute. The uh So, you told Darko you
39:01cover to the right. And that's is that
39:05are we an aisle away from the encounter
39:08with the suspect at that point or is it
39:10right there?
39:12By when I said that we're reaching like
39:15the end of the store. Okay. Like if we
39:17were to kept walking, we go into the
39:20garden center. You cleared some aisles
39:21already. Yeah. Okay. So, we're basically
39:23reaching that final row of the pet area.
39:27Basically, the the solid part of the
39:29store. We're reaching the end of it.
39:31Okay. So on that final row is when I had
39:34that brief discussion, you know, I'll
39:36cover your right.
39:38And cuz he was kind of taking the lead
39:40as we were going down the down the
39:43aisle. Is that appropriate to the way
39:46you guys have been trained? Yeah. Okay.
39:49As he's taking the lead, it sounds like
39:51what you were telling me is he observes
39:54the suspect first. Yes. Okay. And you
39:58went through it and you went through
39:59things a couple of times here. So
40:01forgive us for for asking the
40:04uh he at some point is moving at some
40:09point
40:11stops and then we're at that last aisle.
40:16Um so so before you hear those commands
40:19is that is that appropriate? He's he's
40:21moving slowly and then stops right
40:23before those commands are given. Dark.
40:25Yes. Um
40:31I don't know what I don't know what you
40:33mean. Okay. Yeah, probably poorly said.
40:35The uh you guys were clearing the aisles
40:36and you got you got to the last aisles
40:38where you encountered the suspect. Um
40:44Darko, what what's your indication?
40:46What's your first indication that he
40:48sees something? When he says dropped
40:50your weapon. Okay. Was the first thing I
40:52heard. Okay. Is Darko taking cover at
40:55that time? Um
40:58I can't say. Um, I I like I said, I was
41:02covering to the right and as soon as I
41:05heard him say that, I just immediately
41:07swung around and basically came um and
41:11saw the the suspect with the with the
41:14weapon. Um, my focus was I could see
41:17Dark out of the corner of my eye. My
41:18main goal was to clear Darko so he was
41:22out of sight of or out of a line of fire
41:26and um to focus on a suspect. Was Darko
41:30moving at the time when he said when he
41:32told the suspect to drop his weapon?
41:38I I can't say for sure. Okay. Okay. But
41:41you clearly moved around him. So at some
41:44point you're either moving quicker than
41:45him or he stopped and you move. No. Um,
41:48basically I know he was to the left in
41:49the aisle and I moved to his right.
41:52Okay. And we kind of just squared off
41:54with with the suspect. Okay.
41:58Darko says, "Drop your weapon. Drop your
42:00weapon." To the best of your
42:01recollection. He says it twice. Um I I
42:04can't say he said twice. It was he was
42:06saying repeatedly. Okay. Um I I don't
42:09know exactly how many times he said it.
42:10It could have been more, but it's at
42:11least more than one is what you're
42:12saying. Yes. Okay.
42:15Um, how how quickly do you observe the
42:18suspect from the time that he says that?
42:21Um, he says drop your weapon and then I
42:24just um I immediately turned and saw him
42:30um standing in the aisle with the rifle.
42:32Okay. And what do you recall again about
42:35what you So you see the suspect, how
42:37would you describe what you saw?
42:39Um, I saw him standing there.
42:43Um,
42:44and like I said before, I see him and I
42:48see the rifle. Um, I identified it as a
42:51rifle. Um, and by the time I identified
42:55it as a rifle, um, uh, Sergeant Darko
42:59had already told him to drop the weapon.
43:01And, um, so that's how I saw him. He was
43:05basically standing there.
43:08You've you've said this. You you've gave
43:10me your reasoning for why what you did.
43:13Um I'm I'm going to ask again
43:15specifically. So those commands were
43:18given. Why why did you pull the trigger?
43:23Um here's why I pulled the trigger. He
43:27began moving with the rifle in hand.
43:31um he made what I consider
43:35um he took a stance to where I felt he
43:39could have used it um from what I could
43:42see in my angle that he could have used
43:44the rifle at at at any moment. The rifle
43:46was then, you know, within his body,
43:48within grasp um and he began moving with
43:51it. Um it was it was like
43:56um the best I can describe just like an
43:59agitated movement with it. Um as if he
44:04wasn't going to listen and that he was
44:06about to use it um is how I describe it.
44:09Um, so, um, based on that, I'm just
44:13identifying him and the rifle and and
44:16and, um, the backdrop and and making
44:20sure, you know, there's no other people
44:21around and and um, and I
44:26felt quite certain at that point that
44:29um, when he wasn't um,
44:34listening to us that he was going to
44:36harm people with that rifle.
44:43The call came in
44:45as what? Again, when the initial call
44:48came in, what details did you have from
44:50dispatch? I had details
44:53that black male had a rifle in the
44:57store. Mhm. He was waving it around
45:00um pointing it at people
45:03um and he was loading it in the corner
45:08of the store. Okay. Is that a common
45:11call that you encounter as an officer?
45:14No, I've never um taken a call like that
45:18before. Okay.
45:20Um did
45:24um did that does that cause a heightened
45:27sense of alert within you when you get a
45:28call like that? Yes. And that's my
45:31initial thought before we went in. Uh
45:34what I was thinking to myself was this
45:37is Walmart. They sell weapons. They sell
45:40real guns. They sell fake guns. Um we've
45:43had calls before at similar stores like
45:46Dicks where people have been like
45:47returning weapons. Mhm. or had purchased
45:50a weapon where we've gotten a call. Um
45:53but it wasn't as serious. It was a
45:56person just walking Mhm. with a gun out
45:59of a store. It wasn't somebody's waving
46:02it around, pointing it at people and
46:05currently loading it. Mhm. Um so this
46:07was
46:08very rare, unusual call. Um and
46:15um with you know with all this with how
46:19busy Walmart is and with the amount of
46:22people that have purchased items similar
46:25um um weapon style items in Walmart, we
46:29I have never taken a call like this
46:31before.
46:34Okay.
46:36Since since the incident occurred, uh
46:39there's been a lot of media on what
46:40occurred and then we we now know what
46:42the suspect was carrying at the time.
46:44Are you are you aware at this point what
46:47the suspect was carrying? Yes. Okay. At
46:50any time during your response, did
46:52anybody indicate to you that he the
46:55suspect had anything other than an
46:57active working firearm that fired actual
47:01bullets? I didn't. There was no other
47:03word. It was anything but a rifle.
47:06Okay. And during your walk through
47:09Walmart, did you have any other
47:12indication from anyone else outside of
47:14dispatch or anything that this this may
47:17be a pellet gun as opposed
47:20to a firearm that fires bullets? No.
47:24Okay.
47:26Having seen um when you first observed
47:30the firearm, did anything that you saw
47:32of the weapon indicate to you that it
47:34was anything other than an active
47:35firearm? No. Um when it was laid on the
47:39ground, when I walked past it after I
47:41engaged the suspect, I confirmed myself
47:47um yes, that is a rifle. You know, that
47:50I'm telling myself um um because you
47:53know, you see it. Mhm. You know it's a
47:56rifle and then you know then it's down
47:59on the ground. You're telling yourself
48:01yes it was a rifle and um I I um I no
48:07one told me otherwise till like the next
48:08day I I thought it was a rifle. Okay. Um
48:12and and it wasn't until the next day
48:14until someone said um I believe it was
48:15the next day or was early that morning
48:18or that night at least at least several
48:19hours after the incident basically.
48:21Okay.
48:24And if I hear you correctly, Sean,
48:26you're saying that you as an officer
48:28have before been called to responses
48:31where someone um reports a person with a
48:35gun and you've had to use some
48:37discretion and determining uh you said
48:42the call was a little more urgent this
48:43time or a little more descriptive that
48:45there's some movements, but you've
48:46responded to calls before which turned
48:48out to be just a suspect turning a gun
48:49or so forth. So, if you've had to
48:51respond to calls before
48:54where there were reports of a
48:57gun, but not to to the extent of this
49:01call, correct?
49:06[Applause]
49:09Okay. Sean, when you're in the
49:12store and Darko had made those
49:16commands, is it accurate where you're
49:18telling me that you're saying that the
49:19suspect did not immediately comply?
49:20Correct.
49:22Okay.
49:25Your additional thought processes were
49:27he's armed, is potentially a threat to
49:30you, potentially a threat to other
49:32customers. Is that what you said? And
49:33and Sergeant Darkco. Yeah. And Sergeant
49:35Darko as well. Okay.
49:39Did you also specify that he had what
49:43you thought could be a potential escape
49:45route from beyond your your your guys'
49:48hold on that that section of the aisle
49:51where he could get back from the store
49:52and harm others? Okay. And are we
49:55hearing you accurately that that added
49:58to your decision that you felt deadly
50:01force was necessary? Yes. Okay.
50:07Sean, you fired how many shots? Two.
50:11Okay. Is that consistent with your
50:13training? Yes. Okay.
50:17Um, now that we've had a couple of days,
50:19uh, coming about 3 days to to reflect on
50:22everything, are the actions that you and
50:24Darko took in that store consistent with
50:27the training you had that that
50:30um, this this this scenario would be
50:33based upon? Yes.
50:37Okay. When the suspect is down, when you
50:41fire, I should say, suspect go down
50:44pretty quickly. Yes. Okay. Yes. Okay.
50:47And then he he does get back up. Um, are
50:52you aware at that time that where the
50:55weapon is after you fired his weapon?
50:57Yes. Okay. And where was it? It was on
51:00the ground between me and him.
51:04Okay. Suspect gets back up. Is that
51:07accurate? Yes. Okay. Are you moving
51:08toward him at that time after the shots
51:10are fired? Yes.
51:13Okay. He gets back up. And did you Am I
51:17correct in saying you said it was an
51:18aggressive fashion or did your
51:19perception was that it was aggressive
51:21fashion? Yes. Okay. He's moving towards
51:23you at that point. He's moving towards
51:25the gun like he's looking down at it
51:27like like he's about to reach for it.
51:30Okay. Um, would you say that in that
51:32moment you had the opportunity to fire
51:35if you chose to? Yes. Okay. And again,
51:39you you've talked this through. Tell us
51:41again why you didn't fire. I didn't fire
51:43the second time.
51:45Um
51:48because
51:49he didn't quite get there to the weapon.
51:54Um he
51:57um that that's the reason why um I was
52:01yelling at him, yelling at him to get
52:03down on the ground and um he just
52:06stopped short and collapsed. Okay.
52:10So again, you you thought at the moment
52:14the threat was at least momentarily even
52:16for how split of a second it was
52:18neutralized unless you made it to that
52:20gun or got a little closer to where uh
52:22you may not be able to recover. Is that
52:25I'm sorry. Can you repeat that? Yeah. Um
52:27I'm just I'm trying to get a little more
52:29descriptive detail on your discretion
52:32you used and not pulling the trigger a
52:34second or for a second instance.
52:38So what went through your mind
52:40immediately is you know it sounds like
52:42you had a a a significant thought
52:44process there that you were aware the
52:46gun was not under his control at that
52:47moment right although he's moving
52:49towards the gun and could be a threat it
52:52sounds like you rationalize that that's
52:53what second he wasn't a threat yet um I
52:57consider him a threat um even after he
52:59went down okay um he
53:04um I just have it my phone um
53:09if he would have reached the weapon. I I
53:11I felt that him coming back to the
53:14weapon was a threat and if he would have
53:18made an attempt to pick up the weapon
53:20again, I was ready to fire again. Okay.
53:22Um but like I said, as he was making his
53:24way towards it, um he kind of hesitated
53:28or just stopped short and just kind of
53:30went down. I don't know if he went down
53:32cuz I was telling him to go down or
53:34basically he just he went down. uh
53:36before he um grabbed the rifle. Okay. In
53:41in your recollection, he made a
53:43secondary aggressive movement towards
53:44you andor towards that rifle and you
53:48didn't fire and he subsequently went
53:51down on his own. Yes. Okay.
54:03He went down and you said that you had
54:06to um What was your direction to him in
54:08he was down then?
54:12What did I tell him? Yes, sir. Um I told
54:14him to put his hands behind his back.
54:16Okay. And he was kind
54:18of I told him to roll over. I think he
54:21was on his back. Um I told him to roll
54:23over, put his hands behind his back, and
54:24he was yelling um something. I can't
54:26remember what he was yelling. He was
54:27yelling at me.
54:29And he eventually rolled over and I told
54:33him to put his hands by his back and um
54:36he eventually put his hands out to his
54:38sides or down his side, but I had to
54:39manually pull his hands together um to
54:42get him coughed. Okay. And you cuffed
54:44him, shot
54:46um because that's what we're trained to
54:49do in those situations. Um he is still
54:53potentially a threat to people around
54:54him. We don't know if he has any more
54:55weapons on him. Um, so we cuff him for
54:58his safety and our safety. Okay. Do you
55:01recall at um do you recall the suspect
55:05saying anything
55:07um before the shots were fired? No.
55:10Okay. Do you recall the suspect saying
55:14anything during or immediately after the
55:17shots were fired?
55:19Um nothing that I could understand. Um
55:22he was yelling um something. Um when he
55:27was coming back towards the rifle, I
55:28could see him saying something. I could
55:31I couldn't understand it and I was my
55:33ears were ran so I couldn't quite hear
55:35what he was saying. Mhm. And then when
55:38he went down, he was kind of yelling and
55:40I can't he didn't say anything
55:43that that I can remember. Okay. Um let's
55:47talk about the the response for a minute
55:50after that. So after you cuffed him, did
55:53you feel that uh he was at least
55:55relatively secure at the moment? Yes.
55:57Okay. And then what were your next
55:58actions? Our next
56:00actions, we secured the suspect, kind of
56:03checked around, make sure there are no
56:05more threats, nothing dangerous around,
56:08and then our priority is his
56:12condition. Um,
56:15so I believe Darko called for a medic.
56:20Um then I um kind of quickly assessed
56:23him and I told um Officer Stall who was
56:26on scene at that point that we needed a
56:28medical kit
56:30um due to the wounds to his arms. Um I
56:34felt that
56:36um loss of blood was a was an issue that
56:40were trained how to um apply
56:42tourniquets. Um, so I had Officer Bondi
56:47and um, Officer Stall um, bring
56:50tourniquets and I believe Officer Stall
56:52applied both of them to his arms to try
56:53and stop the bleeding as much as
56:54possible. And at that point
56:58um, those were the only um, injuries I
57:01could see um, at that at that time. So,
57:04we um kind of just kept them awake as
57:08best we could um and waited for the
57:12medics um to get there. Okay.
57:16So, you were actively engaged in trying
57:19to attend to the suspect's medical
57:21needs? Yes. Okay.
57:27Sean, did you make a verbal statement um
57:29about this incident to the police
57:31department? Yes. After the incident?
57:32Okay.
57:34And we're not done yet, unfortunately.
57:37But is there anything at this point that
57:39and the in the time you've had it
57:40between that statement
57:43that and from what you can recall, is
57:45there anything that that's critically
57:47you would change to that verbal
57:48statement?
57:52Um, no. I mean, that initial statement
57:56to me seemed like it was just
57:58a almost like a brief summary of what
58:01happened is what they wanted. So I gave
58:03a brief summary. You still feel it's
58:04accurate to his plan say okay
58:16Sean. Do you have
58:18uh have you had prior involvement in any
58:20shooting incident? Yes. Can you tell us
58:23what that was?
58:25Um, I was involved in a shooting back in
58:282010
58:30um where me and my partner responded to
58:34a domestic violence
58:36incident. And
58:39um we
58:41uh during our response and entry into
58:45the suspect's apartment, he
58:50um
58:51he came he jumped up from the living
58:54room with a big butcher knife and
58:56charged at me and my partner. Okay. Um
59:00and he was giving verbal commands to
59:02stop and drop the knife and he did not.
59:04He was right on top of us. Okay. and um
59:07I fired and um shot and killed one. What
59:11What uh type of weapon were you holding
59:13at that time? It was a 6 hour P229
59:16uh 40 caliber handgun. Yes. Okay.
59:23And the Was there an investigation done
59:26after that incident? Yes. Okay. What
59:27were the results of that investigation?
59:29Um that I acted appropriately within
59:30policy and within law. Okay. Any other
59:33shooting incidents?
59:35Um, not that I've been directly involved
59:38in any kind of shoot. Anything you've
59:40been directly involved in? Okay. Um,
59:43with Are you saying that you've been at
59:45other incidents where other officers
59:46have shot? No, I've just been shooting
59:49incidents. I follow that's a broad term,
59:51right? Yeah. I No, I'm I haven't had to
59:53shoot on these two times. Okay.
59:58Have you ever been disciplined for a use
1:00:00of force this shooting? No. Okay.
1:00:14Sean, you're being very thorough and I
1:00:15appreciate that. Um, and you know how
1:00:18this is being an officer that a lot of
1:00:20times, you know, certain people remember
1:00:21different details um, one way or
1:00:24another. Um, if Sergeant Darko were to
1:00:27have recalled that after he gave
1:00:28commands to the subject that you gave a
1:00:32subsequent command to the subject,
1:00:33either something along the lines of get
1:00:35down or put it
1:00:37down. Um, you said you don't recall
1:00:39making any commands yourself at this
1:00:42point. At this point, I can't. Okay. Is
1:00:45it um out of the realm of possibility
1:00:47that is that Darko may just um be
1:00:50remembering it that way? Do you think
1:00:51maybe you're just not forgetting? Is it
1:00:53is it can you can you close it out one
1:00:56way or the other 100% or or can you not?
1:00:58I can't close it out 100%. Okay. Thank
1:01:00you. There's still things that are foggy
1:01:03and um Absolutely. where I can, you
1:01:07know, one day I'll see things crystal
1:01:08clear and the next day everything's
1:01:10foggy. It's just
1:01:13um so I I don't remember Okay. I don't
1:01:16remember saying anything. Have you given
1:01:18given the opportunity to speak with
1:01:20anybody about the about the shooting? um
1:01:23council or anything like that. Yeah, I'm
1:01:24scared. You don't have to you don't have
1:01:25to comment on that. No, it's fine. But
1:01:27yes, I have. Okay.
1:01:35You went into great detail about the
1:01:37medical um situation uh for the for the
1:01:40suspect. Did you feel the the medical
1:01:41attention given to him at the time was
1:01:43was appropriate? Yes. Okay. And you went
1:01:46into detail in saying that you
1:01:47personally um tried to um keep him alert
1:01:52and awake. Is that because you felt he
1:01:54was lapsing into unconsciousness and
1:01:57result in something? Okay.
1:02:02Um other officers responded shortly
1:02:04thereafter you. Is is there anything you
1:02:07saw that you would consider
1:02:08inappropriate actions done by anybody
1:02:10for this incident? No. Do you believe
1:02:13everybody acted professionally? Yes. Do
1:02:15you believe that everybody on the
1:02:16department that arrived, whether from
1:02:18your department or others, I believe
1:02:19there's multiple jurisdictions, do you
1:02:21believe everybody that um was close
1:02:25enough made every attempt to save that
1:02:28suspect's life? Yes. Okay. Sean, are you
1:02:30aware that there were other medical
1:02:32issues going on in the in the story
1:02:33either raised around there or there? Can
1:02:35you tell us about those real quick?
1:02:36Yeah, the scene quickly became very
1:02:38chaotic. Um, even more so because as
1:02:43soon as the suspect was down, we were
1:02:45getting reports of just from what I
1:02:47could hear, just people
1:02:50um going down with um various health
1:02:53issues.
1:02:55Um and
1:03:00um I believe I don't know which
1:03:04officer they were from what I could hear
1:03:07on the radio I was more focused on the
1:03:11suspect from what I can hear on the
1:03:13radio they're trying to get an AED to
1:03:15one of the people who went down I don't
1:03:16know who it was I don't know what their
1:03:18emergency was um but we were getting
1:03:21several reports that people were
1:03:24having medical emergency throughout the
1:03:26store. Okay. Did you have direct
1:03:28involvement in in the attention to any
1:03:29of those? No. Okay. So, you're just
1:03:31hearing that over the radio and through
1:03:32other through other means. Okay. You
1:03:35doing all right still so so far? Yeah.
1:03:36Okay.
1:03:39Um what we're going to move into in a
1:03:42minute here is listening to some radio
1:03:44traffic and helping you identify what's
1:03:45going on there. See if that uh triggers
1:03:47anything different. They're in
1:03:48discussion. We'll watch a little bit of
1:03:49video, but Brent's going to have some
1:03:50questions for you right now. Next. Okay.
1:03:52Yeah. If you don't mind, Sean, um I'm
1:03:55going to ask you a few follow-up
1:03:56questions, and it's just because I've
1:03:57been writing notes while you've been
1:03:58talking. Um I'm not trying to scrutinize
1:04:02anything by the questions that I'm
1:04:03asking. It's just I'm unclear about
1:04:05something and want to make sure I've got
1:04:07it right in my mind. Okay. Um and first
1:04:10one's easy. Um what what platoon are you
1:04:14on?
1:04:15The name of the platoon? Yeah. Do you
1:04:17have like is it a number?
1:04:20Uh, I
1:04:24think I think it's one. I I really don't
1:04:28I really don't know. Swing shift on like
1:04:31my own. And do you do you report to a
1:04:34certain supervisor? Yeah. Okay. Who do
1:04:37you report to? Well, at that particular
1:04:39time, it was Sergeant Darko. Um, okay.
1:04:41So, at the time of the incident, you
1:04:42were reporting to Sergeant Darko. Yes.
1:04:44Okay. And current is platoon 4. Okay.
1:04:49And do you split supervisors? I know you
1:04:51work from 11 A and 11 P and I know
1:04:52Sergeant Darkco works from 7P to 7A.
1:04:55Correct. Yeah. First my super first
1:04:57supervisor is Sergeant Molnar and I'm
1:04:59with him from 11 to 7. Okay. So So since
1:05:01you're on swing shifts, you have
1:05:03supervisors that change throughout your
1:05:05shift.
1:05:08Okay. And how long have you how long
1:05:10have you worked on that particular swing
1:05:12shift?
1:05:14Um it's
1:05:15been I think a year. Okay. So, you've
1:05:19worked very closely with Sergeant Mner
1:05:21and Sergeant Darko. Yes. Okay.
1:05:26And you'll have to forgive me because
1:05:28Dave when he I I wrote down some
1:05:30questions and as he was going through,
1:05:31he answered some of them already.
1:05:42When the commands were given by Sergeant
1:05:45Darkell, would you consider those
1:05:47commands clear, concise, and audible?
1:05:50Yes. So, it was in your opinion, do you
1:05:53think the subject could have easily
1:05:54heard put it down or drop the weapon or
1:05:57whatever command that the exact words
1:05:58that Sergeant Darko gave? Yes. Okay.
1:06:01Were there any other audible indications
1:06:04um surrounding you that would indicate
1:06:05the police were there or um near the
1:06:09store?
1:06:12I don't I don't understand. Okay. What
1:06:13you're saying? Um typically when police
1:06:15officers respond, they'll respond with
1:06:17lights and sirens. Mhm. Um did you hear
1:06:19any Did you hear any sirens going off at
1:06:21that time? Yeah, I heard um um Well,
1:06:24when I pulled around, I heard sirens um
1:06:27heard started darker siren. I heard
1:06:29other sirens responding as well. Okay.
1:06:32You heard those clearly? I could hear
1:06:34those clearly from outside. Okay. Did
1:06:37you hear them? And I know a lot was
1:06:39going on once you're inside. A lot of
1:06:40lot of chaos as you said, lots of
1:06:42crowded uh lots of crowds people in
1:06:45there. Did you hear any of those sirens
1:06:47once you were inside the building? Not
1:06:48that I could hear.
1:06:51Okay. And I didn't press this point with
1:06:53you, Sean. Um we spoke to Darko, so
1:06:55sometimes that we assume that uh you
1:06:58know, other details you have and we
1:07:00don't bring them out in the open here.
1:07:01The you said you're familiar with the
1:07:02store. Sorry to interrupt, Brent. The
1:07:04pet section is in what area of the
1:07:06store? And directional?
1:07:09Um, it is the southwest corner. Okay. Is
1:07:14that the front or the rear of the store?
1:07:15Front. Okay. So, it's
1:07:21um Did you enter on the door side? I
1:07:23know you can get in the nearest door,
1:07:25but the next door has several front
1:07:27doors. Usually, the next door you enter
1:07:29was nearest to the pet store. So, that's
1:07:32and that's close to where that's fairly
1:07:34close to where Darko staged because he
1:07:35was staging more near that other open
1:07:37door. Yeah. Okay. Sorry, Brett. That's
1:07:39okay. I'm going to jump around again
1:07:42just because of the nature of where I
1:07:44made notations. Um, I believe you said
1:07:46it was a personal weapon that you
1:07:48carried with you, the rifle AR style
1:07:50platform. What was the making model of
1:07:53that particular? I believe it's a Spikes
1:07:55Tactical. Spikes tactical. Yes. Okay.
1:08:02And how long have you had that weapon?
1:08:04About four years. Okay.
1:08:08and you've already clarified that you've
1:08:09fully qualified with that weapon and
1:08:11it's been approved by uh your department
1:08:14by your chief to carry that weapon.
1:08:16Okay.
1:08:18Um we also went into uh extent what type
1:08:22of training you have fast one fast two
1:08:25officer down civilian rescue training
1:08:28advanced tactical weapons school. Um are
1:08:30those will all those be reflected in
1:08:32your personnel or training records? Um
1:08:35they should be. Yeah. Okay.
1:08:37Have you ever had a chance to review
1:08:39your personnel or personnel record or
1:08:41your training record? Um, well, I keep
1:08:44copies of all my training certificates.
1:08:46Okay, so you have copies of all that?
1:08:48Yeah. Okay, great.
1:08:53Um, we have been made aware um through
1:08:56our investigation and that the subject
1:09:00was talking on a cell phone. At any
1:09:03point did you notice that the individual
1:09:05was on the cell phone? No. Okay. When
1:09:08did you first become aware that a cell
1:09:09phone was even involved? If you or
1:09:12unless you're hearing it first from me.
1:09:14Um I think um one of the detectives said
1:09:17something about a cell phone that he may
1:09:19have been on the cell phone or that he
1:09:20was talking on the cell phone prior to
1:09:23us
1:09:25arriving. Um but I didn't see him on the
1:09:28cell phone. Okay. So, and you say
1:09:30detectives, you're saying after the
1:09:32incident. Yeah, I told you that. Yeah.
1:09:36Okay.
1:09:37Um, did you make any physical
1:09:40observations of the subject either
1:09:43before and after um the incident? Did he
1:09:47appear intoxicated? Did he appear to be
1:09:49on drugs? anything that gave you either,
1:09:52you know, a visual um or you know um
1:09:57there was nothing that I saw that would
1:09:58indicate he was on drugs or under the
1:10:01influence, anything. I couldn't tell.
1:10:03Okay. And I know you got very close to
1:10:05him after, you know, you were rendering
1:10:07first aid to the individual. I didn't
1:10:08know if you made any observations as to
1:10:10those types of conditions when you're
1:10:12rendering first aid. No. Okay.
1:10:16And I'm not sure if we specified if
1:10:19something I missed when we were talking
1:10:21about it, but I know when you're
1:10:22rendering first aid, you apply
1:10:24tourniquets.
1:10:26Um I'd say we um Officer Stall I would
1:10:31consider a team effort, but um I was
1:10:33just kind of walking. We I was just
1:10:35helping Officer Stall apply them. He was
1:10:37he had rubber gloves on, was putting
1:10:39them on. I don't I don't know if we
1:10:40clarified where those tourniquets were
1:10:42placed. They're placed on his upper
1:10:44arms. Okay. Can you go into the extent
1:10:46of the injuries and why you thought the
1:10:48tourniquets were necessary? Um, he had
1:10:50one severe wound to one of his elbows. I
1:10:53forget which elbow to where like it was
1:10:55like there was nothing there. Like it
1:10:57was completely gone. Um, so I knew that
1:11:00was a very serious potentially critical
1:11:03injury. Um, so um and then he had a
1:11:07wound to his other arm as well. So, um,
1:11:11with,
1:11:13um, those types of injuries, you know,
1:11:15stopping the blood as soon as possible
1:11:18is critical to survival. So, um, I
1:11:22decided to try and get tourniquets on as
1:11:24soon as possible, try and stop the
1:11:25bleeding. Okay, great. That's all I've
1:11:28got. I feel that. Okay. Um, how you
1:11:31doing? You need a break or something?
1:11:32Okay. Um, fairly quick here. We'll
1:11:35listen to the rate of traffic. Um, what
1:11:37we want you to do, you don't have to
1:11:39identify um every little thing for us.
1:11:42Once you identify yourself, if um things
1:11:44pop up, you want to say, "Hey, that's
1:11:46that's him. That's this." Anything that
1:11:48triggers a memory, we'll probably stop,
1:11:50ask a couple questions through it. Um,
1:11:52we're going to start at uh
1:11:562022 and that's uh should be the first
1:11:59call on that. Ready? Mhm.
1:12:102022 113 and 96 for
1:12:16weapons 46
1:12:2833 Boulevard Walmart a black male 6 was
1:12:32wearing a blue shirt and blue pants in
1:12:34the back section holding a one.
1:12:41Is that the way you recall it? Mhm.
1:12:50463.
1:12:57Sean, who's 46? Um, that's Chris
1:12:59Williams. Okay. Relation. with my dad.
1:13:02Okay.
1:13:06I'm at Walmart.
1:13:09Affirmative. He's in the pet section.
1:13:13Okay. So, again, and before I pause it,
1:13:15uh this was um she previously identified
1:13:18the location as Pentagon Boulevard.
1:13:20That's the Walmart. You heard that call.
1:13:22This call is coming in saying it's uh in
1:13:24the pet section.
1:13:26Anything more specific on that that I
1:13:28missed? I mean, that was me. Is that is
1:13:30that you? Yeah, that was me 90 saying
1:13:32that I was on scene when I asked if he
1:13:34was pointing at people. Okay.
1:13:38Somebody with an eye on him.
1:13:41I have a gentleman who's watching and
1:13:43he's waving it around with a rifle. He
1:13:46just put some bullets inside
1:13:51himself. Okay.
1:13:56very
1:14:02slow 90. They're advising he's in the
1:14:06black back corner of P.
1:14:16But before you move on, can I ask
1:14:19um what was your mindset or your reason
1:14:22for asking for confirmation about um him
1:14:26waving the rifle? Um, I just
1:14:31wanted I just wanted just for for my
1:14:35just for responding units and and for
1:14:37myself, I just wanted to nail down over
1:14:40the radio that he was in fact pointing
1:14:42it at least that's what dispatch said at
1:14:44pointing it at people and waving it
1:14:45around. I just wanted to be certain that
1:14:47that was the case um before we entry.
1:14:50Okay. Does that elevate the situation in
1:14:53your mind? Okay. Very good. And if we
1:14:55heard on that longer transmission,
1:14:57that's where they identified rifle um
1:15:00waving it around, which you clarified,
1:15:02and loading it. Yes.
1:15:1296 37
1:15:1420 25
1:15:2226
1:15:2420 26
1:15:3220 26 Six
1:15:38down.
1:15:40You're clear. 2027.
1:15:42That's
1:15:44you again.
1:15:49You're clear. 2027.
1:15:52Not sure. I can't tell. Okay.
1:15:57You don't specifically recall it being
1:15:59you at this point?
1:16:03Yeah, it's it this is that's that's a a
1:16:06lot going on in that situation. That's
1:16:08the question. Um
1:16:15I can't I can't tell if that's okay.
1:16:19Um Okay. So, that went pretty quick from
1:16:21kind of uh like I said, that traffic
1:16:23goes from from one thing to the next
1:16:25here really quick.
1:16:28Um this is still 2027. This is an
1:16:31additional file.
1:16:42You're clear.
1:16:462027. Did you hear that part, Sean?
1:16:48Where it uh sounds like somebody's
1:16:49saying something close to on your back.
1:16:52Let's play it again. You got you got to
1:16:53kind of listen in between.
1:16:58It's right before that. It was right in
1:17:00between that. Mhm. Do you believe that
1:17:02might have been you? Yeah. Okay. More
1:17:05time just so we can just
1:17:16You're clear. 20.7.
1:17:19You think it was you standing on your
1:17:20back? Yeah, I think so. Okay.
1:17:28761 contact 476
1:17:3976 you're clear 2027
1:17:42and to the best of your recollection you
1:17:44would have been saying on your back at
1:17:46what point
1:17:48um
1:18:03I think um I'm surprised they put your
1:18:05hands behind your back. Very good. That
1:18:08could be um Yeah. Thank you. Okay. Yeah.
1:18:11All we could hear clearly was the part
1:18:12about back. Mhm.
1:18:14So I think this I think what you stated
1:18:18to us is you think he was on his back.
1:18:20You thought he was on his back. You you
1:18:22tried to get him over to get his get him
1:18:23cuffed, get his but you gave
1:18:25instructions trying to get his hands
1:18:26behind his back, right? Okay. So that's
1:18:27the way you recalled it. Yes. Okay.
1:18:30But in any case, you don't recall any
1:18:32time giving him instructions to get on
1:18:34his back. That's counter to the way you
1:18:35remember it. Correct.
1:18:47Come on.
1:18:57Medicine outside need
1:19:08almost
1:19:152029. Okay.
1:19:21You're clear. 2029.
1:19:31You need to
1:19:33take back the pet section for the first
1:19:37kit to
1:19:40somebody outside. I need a first bag.
1:19:48[Music]
1:19:51Oh my god.
1:20:02at
1:20:05Walmart 1530 2030
1:20:1196
1:20:1396
1:20:15there's a female customer back in the
1:20:18sporting news section that's
1:20:21it's going into a female customer there
1:20:22is your understanding so we've heard it
1:20:24calls for an ambulance wins at least one
1:20:26call. Get a medic back here. Is it your
1:20:28understanding that uh those calls are
1:20:31for which instance? For our suspect. The
1:20:35down suspect that's been shot. Yeah.
1:20:36Okay. So, everything medical up to this
1:20:39point where we hear there's a down
1:20:40female or I can't remember what they
1:20:42specifically said, but uh is everything
1:20:45prior to that point is for the suspect.
1:20:47Okay. Back in the sporting good section,
1:20:50that's
1:20:5396. There's a female customer back in
1:20:57the sporting goods section that's having
1:20:59a medical emergency. You need a
1:21:01additional medic.
1:21:05You're clear.
1:21:2190 out in the semi cruiser. Do you think
1:21:25they had a desk for the tourniquet? I
1:21:26was asking 96 to get his tourniquet. All
1:21:30right. Back it up a little bit. And
1:21:33again, specify tourniquet for what? For
1:21:36his arm injuries and him being the
1:21:38suspect. Mhm. Okay.
1:21:5470.
1:21:57Okay.
1:22:03Request to come to the far left area.
1:22:07Well, you're clear.
1:22:12Any more, Brett? You think you need No,
1:22:14I wanted to make sure that we got the in
1:22:17there.
1:22:20Um, the last thing we have, we probably
1:22:22have a couple more questions when we're
1:22:23through, but the last thing is to look
1:22:24at the video, see what happened. Want to
1:22:26see if it um if that alters anything
1:22:29that you recall or if it triggers any
1:22:30other information. Do you want to take a
1:22:33quick break? No, it's fine. Just roll
1:22:35through. Okay. And we won't overplay
1:22:38this. We'll actually let you determine
1:22:41how many times we run through it.
1:22:45I'm going to turn this and actually it
1:22:46took uh this is a weird program that
1:22:49doesn't stay staged. I think what I'm
1:22:50going to do before run we can pull video
1:22:54from
1:22:56uh we got the video of the suspect down
1:23:00the
1:23:00aisle from this
1:23:04location. This is the garden center. You
1:23:07guys will actually be coming up from
1:23:08here. Okay. Does that look familiar?
1:23:10Okay. So, I'm close to where you guys
1:23:12come in now. got another minute so I can
1:23:15speed up on it
1:23:29there. Um, that's actually the um young
1:23:32employee that died of the heart
1:23:34condition shortly thereafter.
1:23:37Can you see it? All right.
1:23:39Mhm. Put it over you. I want you to see
1:23:41it. Worry about
1:23:55me. All you're going to see is your
1:23:57lower halves at best.
1:24:17Rest is just response right there.
1:24:21Okay. Might play more time and ask a
1:24:23couple questions.
1:24:25Doing all right. Yeah.
1:24:32Yeah. I'm sorry. That's right. That's
1:24:33exactly right.
1:24:40Coming up on here.
1:24:42Um, first leg says legs we see I believe
1:24:45are dark codes that it's not accurate.
1:24:47You circle around them. Mhm.
1:25:02that change anything for you? That's the
1:25:04sun. All
1:25:07right. I think
1:25:09that's okay. And that's in the center of
1:25:12the aisle, I'm assuming. Yeah. And so
1:25:15you can see there's like a divider there
1:25:17in the aisle. So, uh, that's why I
1:25:19couldn't really cuz it looks like he
1:25:21went around the other side of it. So,
1:25:23which is why I didn't really have a
1:25:25couldn't really see him.
1:25:28Yeah, this let me pause this and go over
1:25:30here.
1:25:37I had to go through a whole kind of rib
1:25:44here. This is a pet out right here.
1:25:47Okay, this is early in the day.
1:26:02I think I'm going to take you back here
1:26:04for a second.
1:26:08Um, that other vantage points over here.
1:26:11Does that make sense to you? Okay, I was
1:26:13good.
1:26:24In a minute, the suspect with the rifle
1:26:27is going to come walking through here.
1:26:28So, this is 5 minutes before your
1:26:30arrival or before the
1:26:40engagement and to time frame for you
1:26:42about the time that we see the suspect
1:26:44which is
1:26:45there.
1:26:48About the time we see him is about the
1:26:51same time as a 911 call where the guy's
1:26:52given the detail about the rifle and the
1:26:54waving it around and so forth.
1:26:57Have you seen this video prior to now?
1:26:59No.
1:27:02Okay. I will gladly let you run through
1:27:05and watch the whole thing for 5 minutes,
1:27:06but I will will tell you what happens is
1:27:09there he was raising it up again.
1:27:12Um this is the standpoint. This is the
1:27:16um location where he stays for the next
1:27:195 minutes roughly within a little 5 10t
1:27:23area just kind of looking around and
1:27:25making movements at the rifle. He's on
1:27:27the
1:27:27phone and this is different from your
1:27:31vantage point in the store. We realize
1:27:32that this is up higher. It's to the
1:27:34right. You're coming from a lower level
1:27:36down on the left where you see him. Um,
1:27:38and you'd be blocked off somewhat by
1:27:40this. Is that what I believe you're
1:27:41saying, right, for your your view until
1:27:44you ped it off or got around the corner?
1:27:48Um, but that's where that's where he
1:27:50remains. Okay.
1:27:55Okay. Now, we're going to we're going to
1:27:57go to the point where you engage him.
1:28:00Um, he won't see yourselves on this
1:28:02video frame until he's down and you're
1:28:05going to be walking forward on it.
1:28:08Um, are you okay with me proceeding?
1:28:10Yeah, I'm okay.
1:28:24It's close to 20 seconds. Sean away.
1:28:44Oh,
1:28:47great. You remember what that was?
1:28:59Yeah. Yeah, that's great.
1:29:07I bet they bought those at
1:29:10Lowe's. Okay. From that point, he
1:29:12remains down. That's where you go
1:29:13through the cuffing and so forth.
1:29:16Um,
1:29:18for purposes of obvious clarity, that's
1:29:21you in the white. Mhm. Okay. And that's
1:29:24dark in the dark uniform. Okay.
1:29:31Did um
1:29:34anything change your perspective about
1:29:36seeing that right there? Is everything
1:29:38recalling it accurately? Yeah. Okay.
1:29:40Just a little bit different uh different
1:29:42angle and uh I believe we probably have
1:29:44a much clearer observation of the
1:29:46suspect from where we're at here than
1:29:47you probably did. Does that seem
1:29:49accurate? Yeah. Okay.
1:29:54I know we don't have audio. Would you
1:29:57mind if we rewind it a little bit? Um
1:30:01I I believe we can see a reflection what
1:30:05is a muzzle flash and I don't I don't
1:30:07know if you can verify that based upon
1:30:10um your actions but
1:30:15it looks like it reflects off the floor.
1:30:20Do you know the exact second? So I can
1:30:22watch 40 50 55. Yeah5
1:30:2745 54 to 55. I'm sorry.
1:30:31You'll see him startle then you'll see
1:30:34it.
1:30:37I'll watch the number for you. 50. I'll
1:30:39count it down.
1:30:44It's 48 49 50 1 2 3 4 5 6 7
1:31:008 on the screen or I I'm down there.
1:31:05Yeah. Okay. Lower screen. And
1:31:09again, we're just looking for, you know,
1:31:13your observations, what you're seeing
1:31:15based
1:31:16upon what happened that evening.
1:31:25Touch sequence is about 30 seconds.
1:31:31Right there. It's somewhere, I believe,
1:31:33lower part of the screen. Yes, sir.
1:31:3749 50 1 2 3 4 5
1:31:45Do you see that flash? Maybe it What I
1:31:48see is I see right here in the middle of
1:31:50the screen and it's it's and it could be
1:31:52a glitch. It could just be like It looks
1:31:54like an electronic glitch, but it
1:31:56doesn't mean it's that that's what
1:31:57appearance is. point you just like
1:32:03nor like pause it when he turns towards
1:32:06us. Can I just look at
1:32:09that? It's hard to
1:32:12describe his actions. Um other than I
1:32:18just like to see it. And again, as Dave
1:32:21pointed out, the camera angle was
1:32:23different than the angle you had
1:32:26obviously lower and farther to the left.
1:32:28And hold on, I'm going to
1:32:32do the pause start real quick.
1:32:37Yeah. Okay, that's at
1:32:4352. Controls are on the other side of
1:32:45me. How's he How's the view for you
1:32:47right there? That's good.
1:32:52So that's when did the shooting start?
1:32:55About 1 second later. I mean, that's
1:32:57what I remember seeing right there. I
1:33:00remember seeing the silhouette of the
1:33:02magazine like you can see right there. I
1:33:04remember seeing it's a rifle. Um I
1:33:07remember him standing there. So that's
1:33:09when when I describe
1:33:12um seeing the soul of the gun and seeing
1:33:14that it's a rifle. That's exactly what
1:33:16I'm talking about right there. In this
1:33:18in this instance where we paused it,
1:33:20he's got the rifle at almost a 45 degree
1:33:23angle pointed outward um and not not
1:33:27next to his body where he has been
1:33:28keeping it some of the time. Right.
1:33:30Okay. And from your advantage, did it
1:33:32appear as though the muzzle of that gun
1:33:35was coming towards your direction? Do
1:33:37you do you recall that? I mean, that's
1:33:39it. The motion was just all like one
1:33:41motion as he like swung towards us. So,
1:33:43I
1:33:45mean, go for a quick second here. See
1:33:48what we can
1:33:49catch. Okay. So, that was just the
1:33:54swing. That's still less than a second,
1:33:56I
1:33:57thought. See, like right there. I mean,
1:33:59that's And that's And that's what you
1:34:02see. I mean, I saw him bringing the
1:34:05rifle up. I saw him. That's the stance,
1:34:07an aggressive stance to where he was
1:34:10could have
1:34:11easily, you know, shoot us over or any
1:34:14of the people in the store.
1:34:17And that action right there and him
1:34:20starting to move with it Mhm.
1:34:24is and
1:34:28I said
1:34:308:265 p.m. according to the Walmart
1:34:32surveillance camera. You got a bent
1:34:35knees,
1:34:38um, an excitable stance at least to say
1:34:41one way or the other, and rifle's
1:34:44pointed about 35°.
1:34:48Again, I'm going to ask the same
1:34:49question. Did it appear to you that that
1:34:50rifle was coming up in your direction?
1:34:52That's what it looked like to me. Okay.
1:34:58Okay. And then he's one
1:35:00second. Where he's going down?
1:35:06What more do you want to see? Um, can
1:35:07you just play it again? Yeah. From
1:35:09there? Yeah. Or just play it from the
1:35:11beginning again? You want to go back
1:35:12before the
1:35:14I don't mind pausing it again as much as
1:35:15you like. No, it's fine. Just from
1:35:17there, it's fine.
1:35:34about 25 seconds
1:35:37out. Pause and so forth as much as you
1:35:40want. So, okay.
1:36:02Hey, what's up?
1:36:28Yeah. Let me slow part
1:36:35down. Allow me.
1:36:45Can you see a little bit from there your
1:36:47angle? Okay. Mhm. Okay. We're right
1:36:49about 6 seconds away from engagement
1:36:51again here. Um
1:36:56so that's made that move. He goes down.
1:37:00You're almost upon him. That's why he's
1:37:02coming back up. Okay.
1:37:04And again, you you told us it looks like
1:37:07he's running towards the gun. The the
1:37:09guns from this vantage point very close
1:37:11to him. Mhm.
1:37:14Um you're still trained on him, ready to
1:37:17fire if need
1:37:18be. And you don't in this situation.
1:37:30And then again, it looks like he
1:37:34makes a quick move to get back on the
1:37:36ground going backwards. Mhm. Okay.
1:37:42But you felt that that time he was going
1:37:44for the gun the second time? Yes, sir.
1:37:46Yeah. Yes, sir.
1:37:49Okay.
1:37:54Okay. Anything more you want to see
1:37:55again or listen to?
1:37:58No. Yeah. I mean I you know it I haven't
1:38:01seen any video or just been running
1:38:03through it in my head and actually I
1:38:06mean
1:38:07just surprised how exact I can remember
1:38:11it. I mean I you just I don't know you
1:38:14just hope you're explaining it right.
1:38:16What you saw is true and then this
1:38:18really this actually
1:38:21it's um what you remember. Yes. It
1:38:26um makes me feel more confident seeing
1:38:29the video. Confident in what you saw in
1:38:31your actions you were saying. Okay.
1:38:35Um Sean, did you I only have a couple
1:38:38last questions. Um straightforward. Did
1:38:40you make any other official statements
1:38:42to anybody other than the police
1:38:43department? No. Okay. The the media
1:38:45contact you at all or anything? No.
1:38:47Okay.
1:38:49And
1:38:51um I asked you earlier about the verbal
1:38:53statement you made to the police
1:38:54department. You told me it was a brief
1:38:55summary of what occurred. Um and then we
1:38:57still asked a lot of questions in
1:38:59between. Not much has changed if if
1:39:01anything what you what you described the
1:39:03first time through. So would you still
1:39:05say that that verbal statement is an
1:39:06accurate summary of of what occurred for
1:39:08what as brief as it might have been for
1:39:11what you saw at that time? Yes. Okay.
1:39:13And is everything you told us today uh
1:39:17but to the best of your recollection a
1:39:19true and accurate accounting of what
1:39:20happened? Yes. Okay. What you got?
1:39:25Nothing. Just the typical um is there
1:39:27anything we forgot to ask you that you
1:39:29think is important? any important
1:39:31aspects of No, I I just like to add
1:39:34something that
1:39:36um just the
1:39:39situation
1:39:41is
1:39:43was very hectic, unique. I it's hard to
1:39:48explain, but seeing all the children and
1:39:51families um in there walking around um
1:39:55just completely I mean that the this
1:39:58situation was just you
1:40:01know I don't know it was just a very
1:40:05um just I felt a very dangerous
1:40:08situation just with all the the families
1:40:10and the children walking around. I mean,
1:40:12the the store was packed, so it just I I
1:40:15just one thing that sticks out is is
1:40:18seeing all the kids um walking around.
1:40:21So, but I I don't know. I just wanted to
1:40:23make sure that it's known that the store
1:40:25was very, you know, was crowded and
1:40:27there were kids there and families and
1:40:30and yeah, it's, you know, we have to be,
1:40:32you know, impartial or look at just the
1:40:34factual part of it, but it's it's very
1:40:36reasonable to say there was a heightened
1:40:37sense of urgency on your part and u a
1:40:42potential life or death situation is
1:40:44basically what you're saying. Yes. And
1:40:46you've already stated that you uh had
1:40:49fear or concern for your own life,
1:40:51Dargo's life, and
1:40:54customers including children. Mhm. And
1:40:57what you're what you're adding to that
1:40:59is just you want us to understand that's
1:41:01added into why you took the actions you
1:41:03took. Yes. Okay.
1:41:07Okay. Oh, you said I can ask questions.
1:41:10Yes, sir. Um, are you guys in control of
1:41:13media? not in control of the media. I'm
1:41:15sorry. Are you guys in control of what
1:41:16you released to the media? Like what um
1:41:19when are they going to what is it when
1:41:20is it going to be released that I'm the
1:41:22one that fired? We are not Well,
1:41:27it's it's a mixed question. We are Brent
1:41:32and I work for BC. I was part of the
1:41:33attorney general's office. Um right now
1:41:38the prosecutor's office is is really in
1:41:41control of everything overall.
1:41:43Um, our office works in conjunction with
1:41:46the prosecutor's office and with the
1:41:47with the uh, police department and EB.
1:41:50So, what they're looking at is
1:41:51protection of the of the evidence and
1:41:54it's being it's an open investigation,
1:41:56not getting my heart in the
1:41:58investigation. The bottom line is Brett
1:42:00and I don't make the call. Our bosses
1:42:02don't directly make the call. It's up to
1:42:04the entities of the attorney general's
1:42:05office and the prosecutor's office
1:42:07mostly what's appropriate for the
1:42:09situation and um they make
1:42:11considerations from the police
1:42:12department but uh you know we are
1:42:14working outside of the police
1:42:15department. Is that a fairly Yeah. I I
1:42:18mean we're we're working under the the
1:42:20sunshine laws that we have to abide by
1:42:22and we have been adamant that we don't
1:42:25want anything released regarding an open
1:42:28current investigation with an unnamed
1:42:30suspect. Mhm. Uh so that's that's the
1:42:34way we're going to approach it. But as
1:42:36Dave said, um those ultimate decision as
1:42:38to what is and isn't released, that's
1:42:40not our call. Okay. Okay. All
1:42:44right. Sean, forgive me. Um just slow us
1:42:48down. Gave me another question. Um and
1:42:50we may have covered this. I know we
1:42:53talked about the authenticity of the
1:42:56firearm and you did and your precaution
1:42:59about the media brought it up because
1:43:00the attorney general's office did
1:43:01release yesterday that he was carrying a
1:43:03pellet gun
1:43:06um during the transmissions and the
1:43:09radio traffic and everything that never
1:43:11came up that that uh this gun was
1:43:15anything but a active working firearm.
1:43:18Correct. Correct. Okay. And you didn't
1:43:19learn it until the next day or at least
1:43:21several hours after the incident.
1:43:23Correct. Right. And and I know we
1:43:24discussed that again. I just went in our
1:43:26discussion with Darko and we covered
1:43:28that as well. I was blocking in my head.
1:43:30Anything else from anybody, sir? Okay.
1:43:33And I don't know if we said at the
1:43:35beginning of the interview, but Vince
1:43:37Pop, your attorney, is with FOP attorney
1:43:39and he's been in the room the entire
1:43:40time. Okay. We're going to call that at
1:43:432:49 p.m.
1:43:50Following the interrogation, officer
1:43:52Shawn Williams was not charged. A grand
1:43:54jury reviewed the case and declined to
1:43:56indict him. The US Department of Justice
1:43:58also conducted a separate investigation
1:44:01and found insufficient evidence to file
1:44:03federal civil rights charges. Williams
1:44:05later returned to duty and no
1:44:07disciplinary action was made public.
1:44:10Sergeant David Darko, who did not fire
1:44:12his weapon, also faced no charges and
1:44:14remained with the department. What do
1:44:16you think about how this case was
1:44:17handled? Was the officer justified? Let
1:44:20us know below in the comments. If you
1:44:22found this video informative, please
1:44:24consider leaving a like and subscribing
1:44:25to the channel as it really helps
1:44:27support our work and allows us to
1:44:29continue covering important stories like
1:44:31this one. Thank you.

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