S1E18: Jeffrey Deskovic - Wrongfully Convicted of Rape and Murder, Now A Lawyer (PART 1) — Transcript

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1. 0:00[Music]
2. 0:15i am michael i'm a small business owner
3. 0:17i'm an investor i'm a work in process
4. 0:19improv artist a bit manic and always
5. 0:21looking for something new to entertain
6. 0:23me i'm a tv host and your host right now
7. 0:25for what we call
8. 0:26the second scene podcast it's a dweebs
9. 0:29global production
10. 0:30they supply free mentorship for people
11. 0:33around the world
12. 0:34anything from depression to resume help
13. 0:38they want to be there for you so it's
14. 0:40dweebsglobal.org and it's completely
15. 0:42free
16. 0:44i am here today with a very special
17. 0:46guest his name is jeffrey deskovic
18. 0:48have i said your last name correctly
19. 0:50deskovic deskovic okay jeffrey deskovic
20. 0:53jeffrey was wrongly convicted of rape
21. 0:55and murder at the age of 16.
22. 0:57he spent 16 years behind bars ultimately
23. 1:00being exonerated through
24. 1:01dna through the dna data bank which
25. 1:04identified the actual perpetrator
26. 1:05he has gone on to start the jeffrey
27. 1:07deskovic foundation for justice having
28. 1:10already helped exonerate eight
29. 1:11other falsely accused he's passed three
30. 1:14laws and has 10 active cases he is
31. 1:16working on
32. 1:17and he's also gone back to school and
33. 1:18obtained his law degree in hopes of
34. 1:20using it to help others
35. 1:21so um thank you for being here yeah
36. 1:24thanks for
37. 1:26thanks for having me you know when
38. 1:27you're able to free people who are you
39. 1:28know wrongfully convicted i mean that's
40. 1:31that's like the holy grail right there i
41. 1:33mean that's uh to reach back and help
42. 1:34somebody it was in a similar
43. 1:36situation to what i was i mean that's
44. 1:38that's the ultimate developer
45. 1:40budget that way yeah it's amazing it's
46. 1:43amazing what you've what you've done
47. 1:45uh with what you've been handed and uh
48. 1:47how you've
49. 1:48used your resources and really your life
50. 1:50to to dedicate to helping others and uh
51. 1:53really respect that um i i don't think
52. 1:56there's there's not enough of you out
53. 1:57there
54. 1:57so thank you thanks for doing it
55. 2:01so i just i kind of want to get into
56. 2:02back your background a little bit uh
57. 2:03where are you from
58. 2:05yeah so i was born in north town which
59. 2:07is now
60. 2:08referred to as sleepy hollow so people
61. 2:10remember you legend sleepy hollow with
62. 2:12the headless horsemen and everything so
63. 2:14i was born there i grew up in peakskill
64. 2:16which was a short
65. 2:1720 minutes north of there in the same
66. 2:19county in westchester county new york
67. 2:21okay okay uh and you born and raised
68. 2:25there um what was your childhood like
69. 2:28yeah i mean i had a i had pretty pretty
70. 2:30chat i had a pretty happy childhood
71. 2:32um you know i we i grew up at the in
72. 2:34this apartment complex called crossroads
73. 2:36apartments and
74. 2:37there were a lot of uh there were a lot
75. 2:39of buildings and there were a lot of
76. 2:40kids that lived there in the surrounding
77. 2:42areas and they would frequently come
78. 2:43over and
79. 2:44play in the playground or in the tennis
80. 2:45court or in the swimming pool we'd go to
81. 2:47the
82. 2:48parks and we would do all kinds of
83. 2:49things and really i was kind of like the
84. 2:51life of the party in the sense that
85. 2:53whatever i would suggest it was me and
86. 2:55one other boy that
87. 2:56whatever we would suggest would usually
88. 2:58be what the group did whether that was
89. 2:59we're gonna ride bikes we're gonna go
90. 3:01play monopoly we're gonna swim
91. 3:02hey we're going to go play basketball or
92. 3:04want to play stickball or
93. 3:06want to play one kind of game we even
94. 3:08invented a few games
95. 3:09so that was me growing up and you know
96. 3:11it continued that way through high
97. 3:13school
98. 3:13but except that the change though was
99. 3:16that um
100. 3:16that was after school so in school you
101. 3:19know
102. 3:19um and i had i had skipped a grade when
103. 3:21i was younger so everyone in the high
104. 3:23school was
105. 3:24you know like a year older than me and
106. 3:26you know but it felt like the gap was
107. 3:27like longer than that because i really
108. 3:29wasn't into what they were into they
109. 3:30were
110. 3:31you know they were into like you know
111. 3:33you know drinking and cake parties
112. 3:35and you know and chasing girls and
113. 3:37dating and
114. 3:38and i really wasn't uh i really wasn't
115. 3:40in i wasn't i wasn't really into that i
116. 3:42was really into what i
117. 3:43just you know mentioned uh mentioned
118. 3:45before so as a result of that i didn't
119. 3:48i i didn't fit in and i was i just
120. 3:50became like quiet and withdrawn into
121. 3:52myself so i
122. 3:53had that life while in school and then i
123. 3:55had the other life after school
124. 3:57did you did you have a lot of friends at
125. 3:58that point when you i did
126. 4:00i did i had a lot of friends at that
127. 4:02point the other thing i wanted to share
128. 4:03for listeners is you know a big skill
129. 4:05new york
130. 4:06um again it was suburbs and you know
131. 4:08people should think uh
132. 4:09think ethnically diverse and think
133. 4:11middle class
134. 4:13gotcha got you so living the way that
135. 4:16most of us lived
136. 4:17when did things take i guess things
137. 4:18didn't really take a turn it was pretty
138. 4:20sudden
139. 4:21um yes what was the circumstance of
140. 4:25the the rape and the murder i guess
141. 4:27before i even ask you how you became a
142. 4:28subject
143. 4:29uh sure sure so
144. 4:32um in terms of how i became aware of
145. 4:34everything so this
146. 4:36the victim uh was was in a photography
147. 4:38class in
148. 4:39in the high school and she was um and
149. 4:42like like everyone else in the class
150. 4:43um you know she was given an assignment
151. 4:45to go and shoot certain foliage
152. 4:48and the teacher had assigned uh like
153. 4:50male students with the female students
154. 4:52you know um as like a buddy system like
155. 4:54a safety protocol
156. 4:56and the male student who was assigned
157. 4:59uh to angela skipped out played hooky on
158. 5:03the
159. 5:03assignment and for some reason um
160. 5:07you know that was like the one and angel
161. 5:09just for context she was an immigrant
162. 5:10she was from colombia
163. 5:12uh she had been in the country for about
164. 5:13a year a year and a half
165. 5:15um you know she was working on speaking
166. 5:17in her english her english was um you
167. 5:18know
168. 5:19somewhat limited and she literally she
169. 5:22lived a very sheltered life she never
170. 5:23went anywhere unless she was
171. 5:24accompanied by her older sister or or
172. 5:26her parents
173. 5:28uh so this male student skipped out on
174. 5:30the assignment and
175. 5:31for some reason uh i guess she just
176. 5:34wanted to
177. 5:35you know stretch out and feel her own
178. 5:37individuality
179. 5:38almost like we were talking about so
180. 5:39when she as i understand it when she
181. 5:41went home with her sister
182. 5:42her sister went to to the rest to the
183. 5:45bathroom
184. 5:46and uh when she came out her other
185. 5:48sister was gone angela went to
186. 5:50do her go to work she go went to her
187. 5:53assignment
188. 5:54at uh hillcrest park to shoot the photos
189. 5:57she went without her so that was the
190. 5:58only time she had ever won anywhere
191. 6:00without without anybody there
192. 6:02and uh she went missing and i remember
193. 6:05that i remember hearing uh an
194. 6:07announcement over the
195. 6:08peaceful high school pa system you know
196. 6:10announcing that she was missing and that
197. 6:12if um
198. 6:13you know if anybody uh had saw her or
199. 6:15her you know they should come to the
200. 6:17principal's office um
201. 6:18you know right away in fact there was um
202. 6:21even even an article
203. 6:22in the uh in in the newspaper you know
204. 6:25murders were very rare
205. 6:26in in peak skill you know um at that
206. 6:29point there hadn't been a murder there
207. 6:30in
208. 6:31maybe 20 years i mean teenage murders in
209. 6:33a middle class neighborhood
210. 6:35is rare period yes how well did you know
211. 6:38angela
212. 6:40not very well i mean i get it all
213. 6:41depends the short answer is not very
214. 6:43well i mean again i put a little color
215. 6:45to it i mean
216. 6:46how do you want to define the word no i
217. 6:47mean she was in two of my classes as a
218. 6:50freshman
219. 6:50one as a sophomore i knew her name she
220. 6:52knew mine uh we weren't even on a high
221. 6:54buy basis i mean i think i
222. 6:56spoke to her what two times sounds like
223. 7:00majority of people i knew
224. 7:01throughout school as well so it's uh
225. 7:03right yeah
226. 7:04uh knew the face knew the name it's like
227. 7:06knew the personality and
228. 7:08uh right so when how did you become
229. 7:12a suspect yes i became a suspect
230. 7:16because the police interviewed many
231. 7:18students at the high school and
232. 7:20some of them told the police that they
233. 7:21might want to speak to me
234. 7:23because i um uh seemed strange because i
235. 7:26didn't i didn't uh fit in
236. 7:28so that that was um how i got originally
237. 7:30got on the police radar
238. 7:32uh second factor was uh i was a
239. 7:34sensitive uh teenager
240. 7:36and and this was really my first brush
241. 7:38with death and uh
242. 7:40you know i reacted emotionally and the
243. 7:42police interpreted my
244. 7:44being emotional they thought that my
245. 7:46emotional reaction was disproportionate
246. 7:48to what my actual relationship with it
247. 7:50was
248. 7:50and uh so they looked at that as some
249. 7:52kind of outward sign that
250. 7:54you know i was sorry for what i had done
251. 7:57i just want to point
252. 7:58out again for context though you know
253. 8:00while i was emotional i mean i don't
254. 8:01think i was all that i don't think i was
255. 8:04that different from everybody else i
256. 8:06mean this really
257. 8:08shook the whole peak skill community up
258. 8:10to the point where free mental health
259. 8:12counseling was offered to anybody in the
260. 8:14city that that wanted it
261. 8:16you know you know there was again it was
262. 8:17like a population of approximately like
263. 8:1925 000 people that lived in peekskill
264. 8:22right our reinforcing factor was that
265. 8:26the the police got a psychological
266. 8:29profile from the nypd which purported to
267. 8:31have the
268. 8:32uh psychological characteristics of the
269. 8:34actual perpetrator
270. 8:35and i had the misfortune of matching
271. 8:38that profile so that was like a type of
272. 8:40uh reinforcing factor got you
273. 8:43um i'm guessing they were interviewed
274. 8:46friends as well at this point
275. 8:48yes they did yes yeah they interviewed
276. 8:51other people as well
277. 8:52including some of my friends yes right
278. 8:54uh were your friends there to back you
279. 8:56up were they
280. 8:58um well i don't really know what what
281. 9:00they i don't really know
282. 9:02what what they said i mean certainly
283. 9:03nobody nobody said anything you know
284. 9:05nobody's saying anything incriminating
285. 9:07uh you know about me i mean uh
286. 9:09when the time when the crime happened um
287. 9:12you know i was um
288. 9:13actually playing i was actually playing
289. 9:15with football with one of my friends we
290. 9:16came up with these
291. 9:17this creative way of how to play
292. 9:20wiffle ball like one-on-one and i guess
293. 9:23i guess they
294. 9:25was kids we as as kids and as guys we'll
295. 9:28find any way for competition
296. 9:29it's absolutely yes but our genes but i
297. 9:32guess
298. 9:33i guess they didn't believe your friend
299. 9:35your alibi as far as i know they they
300. 9:37they never interviewed him and you know
301. 9:39that would be i mean not to jump too far
302. 9:41ahead in the story but
303. 9:42that would be a mistake that was
304. 9:44repeated you know by my my attorney as
305. 9:47well
306. 9:47he never interviewed my alibi never
307. 9:49called him as a witness
308. 9:51that is crazy so you were brought in
309. 9:54for for questioning i guess this was
310. 9:56pretty early on
311. 9:58yeah this was pretty early on i mean
312. 10:00look i lived right across the street
313. 10:01from
314. 10:02from the high school you know the police
315. 10:04were able to you know act it wasn't hard
316. 10:05for them to guess like which
317. 10:07it was only two routes to get to the
318. 10:09high school from where i lived at and
319. 10:11on my way to the high school uh these
320. 10:13two men and
321. 10:15long trench coats stepped out of their
322. 10:17car and unmarked car and
323. 10:19called my name and they they said they
324. 10:22were police officers and um
325. 10:24they wanted me to uh come down to the
326. 10:25police station so i could help them out
327. 10:27and i told them well i don't know
328. 10:29anything about the crime so i i don't
329. 10:31see how i could possibly help you out
330. 10:33and they insisted they wanted me to come
331. 10:35down to the police station and help them
332. 10:36out
333. 10:37nonetheless you know and so so i did
334. 10:41um and that became you know
335. 10:44that became the starting point of
336. 10:46everything so for about
337. 10:48six weeks the police played this cat and
338. 10:50mouse game with me in which
339. 10:52um and which have when half the time
340. 10:55when they would speak to me
341. 10:56uh they would talk to me as if i was a
342. 10:58suspect and then they would when they
343. 11:00would push too hard
344. 11:01and they would uh start to become you
345. 11:03know frightened then they would switch
346. 11:05up a tactic and
347. 11:06they would then start talking to me like
348. 11:08pretending like they needed my help to
349. 11:10solve the crime you know
350. 11:11jeff is this junior detective helper
351. 11:13theme would
352. 11:14would be would be played up would be
353. 11:16played so you know it kept me off
354. 11:18balance you know emotionally
355. 11:20psychologically i didn't really
356. 11:21understand what was
357. 11:22what was happening and uh you know a
358. 11:25couple quick background things which you
359. 11:27know intersect into that dynamic i mean
360. 11:29i came from a single parent household my
361. 11:30father was never involved in my life in
362. 11:32any way
363. 11:33and that is that intersected with this
364. 11:36um good cop bad cop
365. 11:38um tactic that they executed on me which
366. 11:40is
367. 11:41you know have one one officer takes on a
368. 11:43more aggressive wall whereas his partner
369. 11:44pretends to be
370. 11:46um opposed to the crime a friend like a
371. 11:49pro
372. 11:49opposed to what's going on like a friend
373. 11:51but it was somehow powerless to
374. 11:53intervene and
375. 11:54obviously the purpose of that tactic is
376. 11:55that when a person who's being
377. 11:57questioned becomes frightened he would
378. 11:58naturally look
379. 11:59to a friendly face for assistance and i
380. 12:01began to look to that officer who was
381. 12:03pretending to be my friend i began to
382. 12:05look up to him as a father figure
383. 12:07positive adult male role model
384. 12:09the second thing is before i was a
385. 12:11teenager you know the career that i
386. 12:12dreamed of having when i grew up was to
387. 12:14be a cop
388. 12:15so this unexpected early opportunity to
389. 12:18do this positive police work was how the
390. 12:20police were able to pull the wool over
391. 12:21my eyes as to the absurdity that a 16
392. 12:24year old would be able to assist in
393. 12:26active homicide investigation right how
394. 12:29was your mom
395. 12:30uh how was your mom handling uh you're
396. 12:32being taken in
397. 12:33question and you're dealing with the
398. 12:35cops well she didn't know she only knew
399. 12:36the first time you know she knew that
400. 12:39she knew the first time
401. 12:40uh and then you know and we i had she
402. 12:43told she made clear to me that you know
403. 12:45she didn't want me
404. 12:46to speak to the police any any any
405. 12:49further
406. 12:49you know um but you know i was 16 years
407. 12:52old
408. 12:52and i knew better than my mother was and
409. 12:54of course you know look i'm innocent i
410. 12:56don't know anything about the crime
411. 12:58i don't you know i i don't see how
412. 13:00anything bad can happen from any of this
413. 13:01i mean look at that you know the cops
414. 13:03are our friends they're there to protect
415. 13:04us they're telling me they need
416. 13:06my help to solve you know you look you
417. 13:08don't understand what's going on
418. 13:09just you know and i just would keep
419. 13:12interacting with them and
420. 13:13she didn't she didn't know that and you
421. 13:15know the police you know
422. 13:17knew that they knew that my mother
423. 13:19didn't want me speaking to them they
424. 13:20knew that i didn't want my mother to
425. 13:21know it you know and so they worked
426. 13:23around that
427. 13:24you know they they facilitated my
428. 13:26keeping her in the dark
429. 13:28okay how did they get you to a point is
430. 13:31uh
431. 13:31we hear about this happening all the
432. 13:33time and it's really hard for somebody
433. 13:34to imagine
434. 13:35that hasn't been through it but how do
435. 13:36they get you to a point to
436. 13:38essentially confess to the crime yeah so
437. 13:41eventually they
438. 13:42they got me to agree to a polygraph test
439. 13:44they told me look some new information
440. 13:46is coming to the file and we want to
441. 13:47share that with them and
442. 13:49that's going to allow you to be even
443. 13:51more helpful to us
444. 13:53but first though you're going to have to
445. 13:54take and pass the polygraph
446. 13:56a polygraph test so the next day rather
447. 13:58than report to the high school i instead
448. 14:00went to the police station where i had
449. 14:03heard the rumor mill that other people
450. 14:04had
451. 14:05polygraph but instead they drove me to
452. 14:08the town of brewster which was in putnam
453. 14:10county whereas i was a native of peak
454. 14:12school in westchester county so it was
455. 14:14about 40 minutes away by car
456. 14:16and so you know that meant i was not
457. 14:18able to leave on my own i was
458. 14:20totally dependent upon the police uh
459. 14:22because it was a school day my mother
460. 14:24and grandmother
461. 14:25they thought that i was in school and so
462. 14:27they had no idea anything was wrong so
463. 14:29they did not call around looking for me
464. 14:31i didn't have an attorney present they
465. 14:32didn't give me anything to eat the
466. 14:34entire time i was there
467. 14:35they gave me a four-page brochure which
468. 14:38explained how the
469. 14:39polygraph worked but it had a lot of big
470. 14:41words in it but i didn't understand
471. 14:43but then i pushed past my own concern by
472. 14:45just thinking
473. 14:46oh i'm here to help the police so what
474. 14:48does it matter let's just let's just get
475. 14:50on with it
476. 14:51right uh from there they put me in a
477. 14:53small run and
478. 14:54they gave me countless cups of coffee
479. 14:56which
480. 14:57seems pretty clear in hindsight the
481. 14:59purpose of doing that
482. 15:00was to get me wired up and then he
483. 15:03attached the polygraph
484. 15:05machine to me and then this polygraphist
485. 15:08who by the way this polygraph was putnam
486. 15:10county sheriff's investigator but he was
487. 15:12dressed as a civilian he never
488. 15:14identified himself as
489. 15:15a cop i had no idea he was a police
490. 15:17officer and he never read me my rights
491. 15:20and and he launched into his third
492. 15:23degree tactic so he
493. 15:24invaded my personal space he uh raised
494. 15:27his voice at me
495. 15:28he kept asking me the same questions
496. 15:30over and over again
497. 15:31you know and in the manner he was
498. 15:33conducting himself i mean it was very
499. 15:35frightening especially for me
500. 15:36that you know i was not used to talking
501. 15:39to
502. 15:40grown men you know but much less
503. 15:42somebody who was you know
504. 15:43acting like he was so he kept that up
505. 15:46for six and a half to seven hours
506. 15:48and you know as each hour goes by my
507. 15:51fear is increasing in proportion to the
508. 15:52time and finally he
509. 15:54says what do you what do you mean you
510. 15:57didn't do it
511. 15:58you just told me through the polygraph
512. 15:59result that you did we just want you to
513. 16:01verbally confirm it
514. 16:03and and that really shot my fear to the
515. 16:05roof and that's when that
516. 16:06officer would be pretending to be my
517. 16:08friend he came in the room and told me
518. 16:10that the other officers were going to
519. 16:12harm me
520. 16:13but that he had been holding them off
521. 16:15but could not do so any longer
522. 16:17that i had to help myself then he added
523. 16:20that if i did as i wanted that they'd
524. 16:21stop what they were doing
525. 16:22that i had to go home afterwards that i
526. 16:24was not going to be arrested
527. 16:26uh being young naive frightened 16 years
528. 16:29old
529. 16:29not thinking about the long-term
530. 16:32implications just being concerned my
531. 16:34safety in
532. 16:35in the moment i mean i was overwhelmed
533. 16:36emotionally and psychologically
534. 16:38you know there was this push-pull
535. 16:40dynamic in play i mean on one hand there
536. 16:42was a possibility of harm he
537. 16:43threw in the air and on the other he uh
538. 16:46you know he he uh made this made this
539. 16:49false promise he threw me this false
540. 16:51life preserver
541. 16:52and so i made the decision to make up a
542. 16:55story
543. 16:56uh based upon information that they had
544. 16:58given me in the course that
545. 16:59interrogation
546. 17:00and in the uh six weeks uh run up to it
547. 17:03as well as some items from the newspaper
548. 17:05so by the time it was all said and done
549. 17:07and i had collapsed uh onto the floor in
550. 17:09a fetal position crying uncontrollably
551. 17:12you know needless to say i was arrested
552. 17:14and i was charged with the murder henry
553. 17:17right um it's it's so hard to believe
554. 17:20they put you through that
555. 17:22i don't want to jump too far ahead but
556. 17:23just on this point i mean i i've been
557. 17:25home for 14 years now and i do a lot of
558. 17:27advocacy work as
559. 17:28you alluded to and you know part of that
560. 17:31is um doing
561. 17:32uh speaking engagements and media
562. 17:34interviews and even just
563. 17:35um formal meetings and informal
564. 17:38conversations and sometimes like i re
565. 17:41there's there's been times in the past i
566. 17:42mean i'm not there anymore but there
567. 17:44have been times in the past where i've
568. 17:46like felt like i felt like really stupid
569. 17:48you know and i questioned you know this
570. 17:50is pretty stupid what you're doing right
571. 17:52now you know you
572. 17:53it was very stupid what you did and then
573. 17:55and that you're going around you know
574. 17:56you falsely confessed to something you
575. 17:58didn't do and it wound up costing you 16
576. 18:01years of your life
577. 18:02and you know you're going around telling
578. 18:04people about it you should stop
579. 18:06speaking about it and just like crawl
580. 18:08under a rock someplace and like never be
581. 18:10heard from again
582. 18:12you know so i have had i have had that
583. 18:14that feeling that sentiment
584. 18:16well thank you for not not letting that
585. 18:17happen because i
586. 18:19doing a thousand times more good sharing
587. 18:21it and absolutely
588. 18:23yes is there a secret that you have that
589. 18:25helped you get over that
590. 18:26or is it just it's something yeah i mean
591. 18:28i i guess just think
592. 18:30over over time maybe the secret is this
593. 18:32is that i've come to realize that my
594. 18:34mission in the world you know is
595. 18:35is to do this anti-wrongful conviction
596. 18:38work and i you know that's how i make
597. 18:39sense of everything that i
598. 18:41that i do when i just look at the false
599. 18:43confession as just as part of that
600. 18:45as part of that process and i just kind
601. 18:47of come to be
602. 18:48a at peace with that but it it took me a
603. 18:52really really long time
604. 18:53to to get there was there any other
605. 18:56evidence
606. 18:57against you uh yeah so before i went to
607. 18:59trial the results of a dna test came in
608. 19:02from the fbi lab which showed that semen
609. 19:04found in the victim didn't didn't match
610. 19:06me
611. 19:07which you know by rights the case should
612. 19:09have ended right right then and there
613. 19:12but not wanting to uh instead they
614. 19:14continued to um prosecute me full speed
615. 19:16ahead
616. 19:17in order to explain away this dna
617. 19:19evidence
618. 19:21the prosecutor got the medical examiner
619. 19:23to commit fraud
620. 19:24so when there's an autopsy done there's
621. 19:26written audio notes which are
622. 19:28done at the same time as findings are
623. 19:31made
624. 19:32and so it was only uh six months after
625. 19:34doing that autopsy
626. 19:36uh hundreds of autopsies later that he
627. 19:38suddenly in
628. 19:39in order to help the prosecutor get
629. 19:40around the dna evidence this medical
630. 19:42examiner claims that he
631. 19:44that he remembered that he forgot to
632. 19:46document medical evidence that he said
633. 19:48show that the
634. 19:49victim had been sleeping around which is
635. 19:51what allowed the prosecutor to argue
636. 19:53that it didn't matter that the dna
637. 19:55evidence didn't uh
638. 19:56didn't match me that didn't mean i was
639. 19:58innocent that was just yet another
640. 20:00person
641. 20:01that she slept with prior to my
642. 20:03murdering and raping her
643. 20:05uh taking it a step further he named
644. 20:07another youth by name another
645. 20:09student from the high school that he
646. 20:11claimed had slept with the victim
647. 20:13but he never performed he never he never
648. 20:16had it he never tried to support that
649. 20:17you know he never set the proper
650. 20:19evidentiary foundation he never had that
651. 20:21other person
652. 20:21give a dna sample he never even called
653. 20:24him as a witness he just simply made the
654. 20:26unsupported argument to the jury
655. 20:28not having been content with having
656. 20:30coerced the false confession out of me
657. 20:32the
658. 20:33police officers um also falsely
659. 20:35attributed a statement to me
660. 20:36you know they claimed that i said to
661. 20:38them that i did that
662. 20:39um i i said that i didn't know if the
663. 20:42perpetrator ejaculated or not
664. 20:44but that word was not in my vocabulary
665. 20:46as a 16 year old and
666. 20:48and uh further that statement does
667. 20:50doesn't didn't appear in any of their
668. 20:51early police reports
669. 20:53uh you know the written accounts of the
670. 20:54interrogation that only appeared in
671. 20:56their notes
672. 20:58after the dna didn't match me so it's
673. 21:01pretty compelling
674. 21:02evidence that they came up with that
675. 21:04again specifically trying to help the
676. 21:06prosecutor get around the dna
677. 21:08in terms of my uh defense attorney you
678. 21:10know i i had a public defender
679. 21:13and uh you know i'd never been arrested
680. 21:14before you know his attitude was
681. 21:17look just when i would question him like
682. 21:18you know what is your plan what's your
683. 21:20strategy how
684. 21:21how how are you going to defend me you
685. 21:23know his attitude was like well look
686. 21:25just
687. 21:26look just sit back i'm the lawyer let me
688. 21:28do my job
689. 21:29okay you got into all this trouble in
690. 21:31the first place by you thinking that you
691. 21:33know better than adults just sit back
692. 21:34and let me
693. 21:35let me let let me do this no and uh
694. 21:38that's what i did i didn't i didn't know
695. 21:40any better by this point i was
696. 21:4117 years old i you know gotten bailed
697. 21:44out
698. 21:44and um you know and i went to trial
699. 21:48shortly but shortly after my 17th
700. 21:50birthday
701. 21:51and his attorney essentially didn't
702. 21:52defend me he never
703. 21:54interviewed a call as a witness by alibi
704. 21:56he never explained to the jury the
705. 21:58significance of the dna not matching me
706. 22:00he never used that to argue that it
707. 22:02proved that this confession was coerced
708. 22:04and false
709. 22:05uh he never cross-examined this medical
710. 22:07examiner to expose his fraud i mean he
711. 22:09literally
712. 22:10asked him no questions he rarely met
713. 22:13with me
714. 22:14uh when he when he would meet with me
715. 22:16and i tried to explain to him what
716. 22:17happened in the interrogation room and
717. 22:19that i was innocent
718. 22:20he was always shutting me up one time he
719. 22:22told me he didn't care if i was guilty
720. 22:24or innocent
721. 22:25um when i hadn't decided if i was gonna
722. 22:28have a bench trial which is decided by a
723. 22:30judge or or go at the jury trial
724. 22:32which was something we're thinking about
725. 22:34in light of the confession
726. 22:36you know um he came to me one day and
727. 22:38told me that the judge came to him off
728. 22:40the record and told him to pick a jury
729. 22:42because he didn't want to be responsible
730. 22:44for finding me not guilty
731. 22:46my lawyer was supposed to put that on
732. 22:47the record and ask the judge to recuse
733. 22:50himself because it wasn't proper for him
734. 22:51to limit my decision that way and that
735. 22:54suggests
736. 22:55that bias you know perhaps he was
737. 22:57feeling some public pressure because
738. 22:58every time i made a court appearance
739. 23:00there was
740. 23:00it was a major media moment uh he should
741. 23:03have never represented me in the first
742. 23:04place because of a conflict of interest
743. 23:06this other youth that the prosecutor was
744. 23:08falsely staying except with the victim
745. 23:10was represented by another member of
746. 23:13that same
747. 23:14uh westchester county legal aid the
748. 23:15public defender's office and
749. 23:17specifically by the lawyer was supposed
750. 23:19to be supervising him
751. 23:20on my case so that conflict prevented
752. 23:23the defense from asking him to provide a
753. 23:25dna sample
754. 23:26it prevented the defense from
755. 23:29uh calling him as a witness to explode
756. 23:31the whole consensual sex theory
757. 23:34lastly i wanted to testify at the
758. 23:37pre-trial hearing as to the threat and
759. 23:38the false promise but he
760. 23:40wouldn't allow me to do that uh he said
761. 23:43that
762. 23:43he hadn't decided if i was going to
763. 23:44testify at the trial or not
764. 23:46and in the event that i did uh he said
765. 23:49that um
766. 23:50very seldom do people tell the same
767. 23:52story in exactly the same way and that
768. 23:54if there was any variation at all even
769. 23:56if it was slight that the prosecutor
770. 23:57could
771. 23:58make it appear as though i was lying
772. 24:00even if i had not
773. 24:01which didn't really make a lot of sense
774. 24:03because firstly if the judge had
775. 24:05believed me then the statements would
776. 24:07have been ruled involuntary and
777. 24:08therefore not admissible as evidence and
778. 24:10without that they wouldn't have had a
779. 24:12trial
780. 24:13and secondly if it really went that
781. 24:15badly i didn't have to testify at the
782. 24:17trial
783. 24:18and if i didn't there would be no way
784. 24:20that the prior testimony could be used
785. 24:22but then when i got to the trial he
786. 24:24wouldn't allow me to testify there
787. 24:26either
788. 24:26he told me it wasn't his job to prove i
789. 24:28was innocent it was up to the prosecutor
790. 24:30to prove that i was guilty and he didn't
791. 24:32think that it happened
792. 24:33yeah that might be a legal principle but
793. 24:35that's a naive way to practice law in
794. 24:37reality you have to try to prove your
795. 24:38client
796. 24:39didn't commit the crime or they wanted a
797. 24:41significant risk of being
798. 24:42wrongfully convicted i mean particularly
799. 24:44in a confession case where there's a
800. 24:4680 conviction rate i mean you have to
801. 24:48answer that confession you have to
802. 24:50explain that confession you have to
803. 24:52disprove as many aspects of the
804. 24:54confession as you can and bring it all
805. 24:55together in
806. 24:56your closing argument or you run a risk
807. 24:59again of being
808. 25:00wrongfully convicted but he didn't do
809. 25:02any of that
810. 25:04the last thing i wanted to mention is is
811. 25:06that
812. 25:07other irregularities regarding my trial
813. 25:10was that the victim's clothing had been
814. 25:13entered into evidence so
815. 25:14uh her her pants her moccasins and
816. 25:18her her bra and her shirt
817. 25:21so at one point during the jury
818. 25:23deliberation the jury
819. 25:25and i want to mention another thing
820. 25:26about him that i'll come right back to
821. 25:28that point
822. 25:29he was all over the place so at times he
823. 25:31was arguing to the jury
824. 25:32that the confession never happened at
825. 25:34other times he was arguing that the
826. 25:36confession happened but it was false
827. 25:38at still other times he was simply
828. 25:40arguing that it was coerced so when you
829. 25:42take that kind of scatter shot approach
830. 25:43you lose your
831. 25:44credibility i mean i had no chance in
832. 25:46the beginning
833. 25:47uh despite so all that happened and at
834. 25:50some point the jury
835. 25:52asked to see uh the victim's bra and
836. 25:55that was a short
837. 25:56bright spot for the defense i remember
838. 25:58my lawyer turned to me
839. 26:00and he um and he and he said good
840. 26:03they're thinking like i want them to
841. 26:05think you know um
842. 26:07there are some bras that can't be ripped
843. 26:10off of the victim's body that was one of
844. 26:11the statements in the course false
845. 26:12confession
846. 26:14so you know uh but then so them asking
847. 26:17to see the bra that that you know
848. 26:18if they could have saw that for
849. 26:20themselves and i i possibly could have
850. 26:21been uh
851. 26:22acquitted but that's when the judge
852. 26:25no told us that the clothes had been
853. 26:28left in the courtroom
854. 26:30overnight and that apparently the
855. 26:32custodians the
856. 26:33the cleaners that they thought it was
857. 26:36garbage and so they threw it out
858. 26:38and he allowed a photograph in which
859. 26:41quote unquote you can almost see the bra
860. 26:44he allowed that to be substituted
861. 26:48for the for the actual bra itself and
862. 26:51ultimately
863. 26:52i was you know wrongfully convicted and
864. 26:54given a 15 to life
865. 26:56sentence