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Robinhood CEO's Shocking Prediction On Stocks, The AI Bubble, & Gambling Controversy | Vlad Tenev — Transcript

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0:00Gen Z. [music] A new report shows that
0:02generation is leaning on their parents
0:05for more financial help.
0:06>> Can we actually make broad ownership a
0:09reality? A future with relatively few
0:11owners is inherently fragile. We're
0:14building a financial super app.
0:16>> Are you setting [music] them up in a
0:18situation where the odds are are stacked
0:21against them to [music] actually make
0:22money?
0:22>> A lot of people criticize us because
0:24they think we incentivize active trading
0:26and prediction markets. [music] That's
0:28when you can kind of get into trouble.
0:29>> Get this. The richest 1% controls more
0:32wealth now than at any time in more than
0:34a half century.
0:35>> Alarm bells have started ringing.
0:38There's a small [music] circle of
0:40wealthy insiders that's benefiting from
0:42all the growth.
0:42>> How much has AI changed the game?
0:44>> Humans overseeing agents, seeing how
0:47many you can [music] actually employ,
0:48including when you're sleeping.
0:50>> So, do you think though with Robin Hood
0:51eventually you could have just a few
0:53people running [music] the entire
0:54company? Um,
0:56it's
0:57>> that's just dangling the carrot, huh?
0:59[laughter]
1:03>> Vlad from Robin Hood. Thank you so much
1:05for coming on the iced coffee hour.
1:06>> Great to see you guys again.
1:07>> Last time you sat here, you still drove
1:09a used car. Since then, your app Robin
1:12Hood has grown 125 billion with a B in
1:18assets under custody, which is 50% in
1:21one year. Today, Robin Hood stock is up
1:243%. Which some people are like, "Oh, 3%
1:26whatever, whatever, whatever." Maybe I'm
1:27up $3,000. You're up $150 million or
1:31whatever just in one day. I have to
1:34know, are you still driving a used car?
1:36>> I can afford a new car now. No. Uh yeah.
1:39Uh I had a used 911 Turbo S last year.
1:44It was kind of a a holdover because I
1:48had uh ordered a new GT3 which is a a
1:52very fun car and uh and so now I drive
1:55that. So I have a GT3 Touring manual
1:58transmission. The thing cooks.
2:00>> Do you have a long commute?
2:02>> No, not too long. I mean much shorter
2:04now that I got this new [laughter] car.
2:06Uh yeah, anywhere from uh 10 minutes to
2:0920 minutes depending on traffic. Now,
2:11when you walk into Porsche, do they just
2:13give you any car that you want, or do
2:14you have to kind of play the game a
2:16little bit to work your way up?
2:17>> A lot of brands
2:19uh reward loyalty. So, if you're loyal
2:21to a particular car uh maker or a
2:26dealership, uh they they take care of
2:29you. And not a lot of them just uh I
2:32mean, some some do this differently, but
2:35I think for a lot of them, they do
2:37actually value loyal customers. uh
2:40relative to just a random famous person
2:43reaching out to them who who wants
2:45something. So to answer your question, I
2:47don't think it has helped me very much.
2:50I kind of had to wait over a year just
2:52like everyone else.
2:54>> So as the CEO and founder of Robin Hood,
2:57if not the stock price, what is the
2:59metric that you obsess over every day?
3:01>> I don't think there's one metric really
3:03because I mean Robin Hood works on many
3:06things. We have lots of businesses.
3:08Increasingly, my job is kind of I I have
3:12folks that effectively function as CEOs
3:14of their businesses reporting to me. And
3:18if I had to think about
3:20what idea or
3:24what concept is associated most with
3:26Robin Hood, what we can own, it's really
3:29ownership. This idea of
3:33a world or a future with relatively few
3:36owners is inherently fragile and can we
3:40actually
3:42make broad ownership a reality. Can we
3:45make it so that you know more people own
3:48uh equities and and also all the other
3:51assets around us. So one thing that I
3:53have been talking about recently is
3:56percentage of households in America that
3:58own equities. So right now that's
4:00something like 65%. Before Robin Hood
4:03came along it was in the low 50s. So I
4:06think we meaningfully contributed and
4:08now the question is can we get to 95%
4:13plus which I think with initiatives like
4:15the Trump accounts with our work on
4:19private markets it makes that
4:21increasingly likely and can we also
4:24force the rest of the world to catch up
4:26which is where things like tokenization
4:28come in. Can we actually make it so that
4:30it's really easy for the best stocks and
4:33and other real world assets from the US
4:36to be distributed globally so that
4:38everyone can kind of benefit from all
4:40the great work we're doing here?
4:42>> Now, how much of that though is an
4:43ownership problem, an education problem,
4:45or just a most people don't have enough
4:47money problem?
4:48>> Yeah, that's a problem too. most people
4:50don't have enough money and I think
4:53that's where forced uh ownership or
4:56default ownership has been really
4:59impactful. Like one of the things that
5:01really moved the needle in the US was
5:04the employer sponsored 401k where if you
5:08have an employer uh and they have a 401k
5:11program effectively it's like free money
5:14to participate and get the the employer
5:17salary match and and that by itself
5:20moved ownership by tens of percentage
5:24points and now you see countries all
5:25over the world trying to replicate this
5:27Trump accounts as ownership by default
5:29too. Every single child born in this
5:32country gets $1,000 funded by Treasury.
5:35And then now you're seeing
5:36philanthropists like Michael Dell, Ray
5:38Dallio sponsoring their states. Michael
5:41Dell obviously is a much bigger
5:43sponsorship where he targets lower
5:45income zip codes all over the country.
5:47The solution to a lot of people not
5:50having enough money is um making it by
5:53default and having sort of like these
5:56employer and government sponsored
5:59programs coupled with with philanthropy
6:02to uh help the ones that are kind of
6:05living paycheck to paycheck or have less
6:07means to uh own stocks as well.
6:10>> So in order to grow $125 billion in
6:13assets under custody in one year, I mean
6:15that's just honestly unfeasible. Like I
6:16I can't even imagine that that is
6:18congratulations on the success. I'm
6:20curious. You can't just say okay well
6:21we're going to grow in assets under
6:23custody. Like there's and then grow like
6:25there are certain things that you have
6:26to do in order for that to ensue. And so
6:29I'm curious what are the things that
6:30like the main things you focused on that
6:32have made that big of an impact on your
6:34company.
6:34>> Well, we we have sort of three
6:38ways that we're furthering ownership and
6:40and really what assets under custody is
6:42is a measure of how well we're
6:44succeeding. If more assets are on the
6:46platform, then that's more things that
6:48people are owning. The first thing is
6:52serving our active traders. Active
6:54traders still very much the core of the
6:56business. A lot of the asset growth is
6:59just people bringing in money so that
7:00they can trade different things. So if
7:02we make uh the the assets that we offer
7:07great and if if we have a great options
7:09trading experience, great equities
7:11trading, we've added futures more
7:13recently and prediction markets as well.
7:15People will bring in money to trade and
7:18they're they'll tell their friends about
7:19it as well. So we've seen a lot of
7:21growth there. And you know, you can you
7:24can also look at our market share across
7:26all of the core assets, the volumes. uh
7:29we hit lots of records in Q2 which we
7:32just reported on you know record and
7:34equities trading that that's really the
7:36engine right equities is our core
7:38business what we started with and you
7:41know last quarter people were trading
7:44more equities in Robin Hood uh than back
7:48in 2021 when we saw GameStop which was
7:51also like a crazy high period right so
7:53organically through compounding of our
7:55business we've exceeded that sort of
7:58like peak uh options trading all-time
8:01high. We're now the top options trading
8:03platform uh in terms of retail market
8:06share. So, we've surpassed all of the
8:08incumbents who keep just combining with
8:11each other. So, the the task at hand
8:14gets harder, but but we've we've crossed
8:16over into number one in options. And
8:18then futures and prediction markets have
8:20been super high as well. So, I'd say
8:22that that's one bucket. The second
8:24bucket is just um how can we be your
8:26financial home for life? So it's this
8:29idea of lifelong ownership. Can we get
8:31someone from when they're born to
8:34teenage years to college, first job, uh
8:38when they have kids, can we help them
8:39with all their financial needs as well
8:42all the way through to like a
8:43inheritance event. So we've been
8:45building things to fill out that entire
8:47life cycle. Trump accounts and custodial
8:50being a great example, but also recently
8:52we've added trust accounts which make it
8:55really easy to if you have a trust
8:57onboard into Robin Hood. We've got joint
8:59accounts, so if you have a spouse or
9:01partner, you can bring them into Robin
9:03Hood as well. And and Robin Hood banking
9:06has been huge there. That's been scaling
9:09really really rapidly. Billions of
9:11assets, really high direct deposit
9:13attach rate. And that's really about can
9:16we get someone to put in their paycheck
9:17into Robin Hood? And that allows us to
9:20help them do things like how much of
9:22your money should go into retirement,
9:24how much should go into your
9:25self-directed taxable brokerage account,
9:28how much should go into strategies. So,
9:30it's kind of been putting together all
9:32the pieces so that we can actually serve
9:34all of your financial needs and that if
9:37they're at Robin Hood, you you benefit
9:39rather than having them dispersed among
9:42lots of other banks and kind of siloed.
9:44>> How much of that is just the deposit
9:46bonus where I see crazy bonuses like 3%
9:49on crypto, 1% for retirement accounts? I
9:52I think I've even seen one and a half
9:53percent on something.
9:54>> The deposit bonuses help, but it's it's
9:57a minority of it. I mean I think we we
10:00share we share numbers on you know what
10:03percentage of AATS for instance come in
10:07via deposit incentives versus otherwise
10:10and you know it's it's a good chunk of
10:12of AATS activity but still AATS is kind
10:15of a minority of of the overall money
10:18moving in and out of the the platform.
10:20>> Congrats on launching the AI investing.
10:22As soon as I saw you guys launch that I
10:24was looking over Twitter or X and I saw
10:26it everywhere. Everyone was talking
10:28about it all over Reddit. Congrats on
10:29that. That I felt like was a huge leap
10:32forward in terms of what brokerages are
10:34able and willing to do. I'm curious, how
10:36does a deal like that actually come to
10:38fruition and with AI investing agents?
10:41Are people actually making money?
10:43>> Yeah. Um, so we uh we don't really have
10:46a partnership per se. Um, basically I
10:50think what you're referring to is we
10:53launched two things, a Gentic trading
10:55and a Gentic card. And what that allows
10:58people to do is if you have your your
11:01Clawed Code or your codeex or your other
11:04AI agent, you can access the Robin Hood
11:08tools. And the idea is anything that you
11:11can do on your phone with Robin Hood,
11:14you should be able to have your AI agent
11:16do through kind of the paved path of the
11:19MCP server. So, we launched with
11:22equities trading. And since then, we've
11:24expanded into options. We've we've
11:27announced crypto, so that's coming soon.
11:30And we keep adding little tools here and
11:32there, like recently, we rolled out the
11:34ability to see your tax lots. So for
11:36those that uh can use AI agents and are
11:42reasonably sophisticated, it gives you
11:43kind of the the power of Robin Hood at
11:45your disposal.
11:46>> And what data are you seeing with people
11:47that are using AI agents to invest? Like
11:50are they are they making money? Are they
11:51losing money? How like how does that
11:53work out with with broad data?
11:55>> I don't really look too closely at their
11:57returns. Um but we we're getting a lot
12:00of people trying it out. Uh we've had
12:03over 100,000 people actually create a
12:06Gentic accounts and and they're driving
12:08decent volume and they're doing really
12:11sophisticated things like you know
12:14they're they're uh pulling together all
12:16kinds of data sources from all over the
12:19internet and kind of combining it into
12:21strategies. I I'd say um my background
12:24is from algorithmic trading. So before I
12:27started Robin Hood, I would write
12:28trading strategies and it was an
12:32incredibly challenging thing because
12:35you'd have to be a programmer. You'd
12:37have to worry about all sorts of things
12:40and you needed um really deep
12:44integrations with legacy financial
12:47companies to even get access to the
12:49markets because back then you couldn't
12:51trade through a normal broker. they were
12:53charging you $10 every trade. So, I
12:57think what's happening is it's making
13:00that power, the the ability to trade
13:02algorithmically much more democratized,
13:06but there's still challenges. For
13:08example, sometimes these agents
13:10themselves aren't optimized for trading.
13:13They'll tell you, "I don't want to trade
13:14right now. I don't think this is a good
13:16idea." And then you really have to work
13:18hard to make sure it does the thing you
13:20want to do. Well, what if it's trying to
13:21save the person from losing money and it
13:23just sees something, it's like, "Hey,
13:24this is a bad trade."
13:26>> Most of the time when they don't uh
13:28trade, it's not actually for that
13:30reason. I think it's just
13:32>> doesn't want to. It just feel doesn't
13:33feel like it.
13:33>> Yeah. It just doesn't feel like it.
13:35>> Didn't have coffee that morning.
13:36>> Yeah. It's like, h, you know, I
13:37recommend that you actually open up your
13:39Robin Hood app and and and put the trade
13:41in that way. Yeah. Because I I don't
13:43think that
13:45trading activity is in the training
13:48data. like you don't have like aentic
13:51trading traces like you would
13:54programming traces. So this is just a
13:57new thing that hasn't been done before.
13:59>> Given the way things are going though,
14:01do you think eventually financial
14:02advisers are going to be obsolete? And
14:04really quick, I just got to say that if
14:05you're running your business out of your
14:06personal bank account, you are one bad
14:09client away from a real problem. We're
14:11talking your personal savings, your
14:12home, everything you own is on the line.
14:14That of course is why we're partnered
14:16with Northwest Registered Agent. For $39
14:19a month plus state fees, they form your
14:21LLC and make sure you're actually
14:23protected. You get your state filing,
14:25operating agreement, membership
14:27certificates, and banking resolutions.
14:29All the paperwork that makes it
14:30official.
14:30>> Once you're an LLC, your personal assets
14:33are generally kept separate from
14:34whatever happens in the business. Plus,
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15:06>> Thank you so much to Northwest
15:07Registered agent for sponsoring this
15:08episode. Given the way things are going
15:10though, do you think eventually
15:11financial adviserss are going to be
15:12obsolete?
15:13>> Um, I think there's always going to be
15:17some need for humans. Um, like a
15:20financial advisor
15:24provides very different services. It's
15:26kind of like a consigary to you, right?
15:29And it's someone that is responsible and
15:32can help you
15:35um make life decisions. A lot a lot of
15:38people have financial adviserss and
15:40they're like um almost a member of the
15:42family. I think in that sense
15:45some people will always want a human. I
15:47don't know if that type of like close
15:49emotional relationship is going to be
15:51replaced by AI. I think right now people
15:54are using AI to
15:57sanity check um certain things and you
16:01know they say okay is my adviser are
16:04they telling me something that makes
16:06sense but um there's like a human need
16:11that makes it really really hard uh to
16:15trust machines for everything because at
16:17the end of the day you want someone to
16:18be responsible and and I think it's it's
16:21hard to have the AI AI take
16:23responsibility. In fact, you know, if if
16:27you can own something, if you're a
16:28fiduciary, it's it's a different bar.
16:31So,
16:31>> yeah, but even if someone is held
16:32responsible for something, it doesn't
16:33necessarily fix the actual problem if
16:35they make a mistake. Like, I've had
16:37mistakes made before for myself. And
16:39it's like, yeah, they might make a
16:41problem, but then actually correcting
16:43that problem is more work than just
16:45dealing with the problem.
16:46>> Yeah. I mean at a certain level you're
16:49always responsible for
16:51>> your own financial decisions even if
16:53it's like hey I've hired if if it's an
16:56adviser I've hired this adviser I choose
16:58to keep working with them so it's it's
17:00my responsibility as well
17:02>> I think still a lot of people just don't
17:03want to think about it you um
17:06>> you know you come across a lot of people
17:08and a lot of a lot of them have made
17:10money and they say I just want to spend
17:14very little of my time thinking about
17:17finances and
17:20they're not they're probably not going
17:21to prompt a claw agent or or open AAI.
17:25They just want a a person that takes
17:27that entirely off their plate. I think
17:29the more likely scenario is is you'll
17:32see fee compression in that industry.
17:35>> You'll see fee compression um because
17:38basically for a while there have been
17:41two models. There's been kind of robo
17:43advisory, which is asset management, but
17:46you don't actually have at your disposal
17:50the full comprehensive estate planning,
17:53financial planning, tax planning. It's
17:55just very siloed toward um financial
17:59advice and investment management. And
18:01then you have fullervice financial
18:03adviserss that kind of take over.
18:05They're a person that abstracts all of
18:07your finances, including budgeting and
18:09spending for a lot of people. And you
18:12know the the robo advisor market has
18:15kind of consolidated around something
18:17like 25 basis points of your assets. So
18:20a quarter of a percent of all of your
18:22assets are charged as fees typically.
18:24Some are more, some are less. And full
18:26service financial advice has been in
18:29like the 1% plus range. And if I had to
18:33guess, probably there's some middle
18:36ground where on average as more AI tools
18:40come in and start to blur these two. I I
18:43think it'll probably consolidate to
18:46somewhere in between. Really quick, I
18:48got a fun story here. I uploaded my
18:49entire portfolio to Claude about a week
18:52ago and I said, "Rate my portfolio. Tell
18:55me everything I'm doing wrong or any
18:56improvements." It gave me a whole list
18:59and believe it or not, it saved me
19:01$16,000
19:03a year after tax because it said one of
19:06the funds that I was holding was paying
19:08a slightly higher expense ratio than a
19:10near identical fund that I could buy
19:12from Vanguard. Yeah. And it said if you
19:14sell this fund, you could realize it was
19:15a very small loss. Realize this tax
19:17loss, move it into this other fund that
19:20has a lower fee, and that fee works out
19:22to $16,000 a year. I did it. I mean, I I
19:27researched myself in addition to that,
19:28but that pointed in the right direction.
19:29It's like, wait a second, that's such a
19:31no-brainer. I didn't think of that. I
19:33just wasn't paying attention. There you
19:35go. 16 grand a year saved.
19:37>> Yeah. And I think for some for a lot of
19:39things where it's it's really clearcut,
19:42it it's super super useful, right? Like
19:46um Yeah. If you have a fund with a high
19:48expense ratio uh and there's a similar
19:51fund with a lower one, of course, that's
19:53a that's a straightforward one. Or, you
19:55know, if you've got cash in a savings
19:57account earning 0% and there's this
20:00other account here that can get you
20:04north of three, of course, the rational
20:06thing is to move all of that cash. A lot
20:08of that doesn't even need AI to be
20:11honest. It's just a very very simple
20:14algorithm to just see, you know, if you
20:18if you have funds that are underutilized
20:20and and can be moved elsewhere. So, a
20:23lot of our investors ask us about this
20:25like cash sorting AI idea, which is,
20:30>> you know, is in the future is the AI
20:31just going to move your cash to places
20:33that have
20:35>> high interest? Um,
20:36>> oh, eventually you'll lose track of
20:38that. Oh gosh, imagine if it just
20:40>> Well, my thought is that's not even AI.
20:42You can just have a screen that says,
20:44well, and and we try to do this. Hey, we
20:46offer 3.5% APY. you could be, you know,
20:51you could be making incrementally tens
20:54of thousands of dollars per year just by
20:56doing this. Um, and and despite the fact
20:59that those products exist, people still
21:01like their legacy banks and, you know,
21:04banks still have trillions of assets
21:06that are earning almost zero because,
21:09you know, the the inertia and the
21:10strength of that relationship is is so
21:12high. Do you think investing will
21:14fundamentally change when everyone is
21:17using like a AI investing agent and
21:20these AI agents can t tap into all
21:23publicly available information
21:24instantly? And so like it it
21:26automatically just knows like is that
21:28sometime down the time horizon? If so,
21:30like how long? Or do you think that's
21:31just not even feasible?
21:33>> There's lots of different investing
21:35behaviors. I don't think that
21:39someone who is buying a stock of a
21:41company that makes a product uh they use
21:45is going to be all of that all that
21:47affected by AI. If you're like I use the
21:49iPhone, great product, I believe in it.
21:52I want to own some Apple stock. AI is
21:55unlikely to change that investment
21:58behavior significantly. What are you
22:00going to ask it? Right? I mean, maybe if
22:02you're really kind of having second
22:04thoughts and you're not sure whether
22:05it's a good one, you'll ask some
22:07questions. But by and large, I I think
22:09that that's um uh that's durable. Active
22:12trading, I think active trading is going
22:15to look significantly different. A lot
22:18of active trading is now geared towards
22:20technical analysis on charts. AI tools
22:22will certainly augment that quite a bit.
22:26Um and then you can bring in more data
22:29sources.
22:30uh passive long-term investing and
22:33portfolio construction. Yeah, I don't
22:36think it'll change very much because
22:39in that particular example, it's really
22:41about making a infrequent asset
22:44allocation decision. And may maybe
22:47you'll have more data communicating the
22:49decision and what's going on, which is
22:50what we're doing with Robin Hood
22:51products, like what's going on in your
22:53portfolio? Why did we make those
22:54changes? Um, but I think fundamentally
22:57the the the asset allocation process has
23:01been automated and streamlined pretty
23:04well and I I don't think there's juice
23:05there. So, yeah, it's it's really
23:08trading. I think trading is where you're
23:10going to see the biggest change and and
23:12the biggest disruption, which is why
23:14we're focused on agentic trading first.
23:16>> What about for productivity within Robin
23:18Hood as a company? How much has AI
23:20changed the game? I changed it uh very
23:24deeply. I mean I think our AI adoption
23:28is close to 100%. If you're a software
23:32engineer and really software engineers
23:35are building all the products. I think
23:37the the workflow has shifted from,
23:40you know, humans writing the code and
23:43humans reviewing the code to generally
23:47humans overseeing agents uh and and
23:50those agents are writing the code and
23:52reviewing the code. and your job as an
23:55engineer is shifting to making sure your
23:58agents are well managed and and seeing,
24:01you know, how many agents you can employ
24:04and can you keep them busy all the time,
24:07including when you're sleeping.
24:08>> So, do you think though with Robin Hood
24:09eventually you could have just a few
24:12people running the entire company from
24:13home?
24:14>> It's not our goal for sure. Um
24:18uh I I think sometimes we do um we do
24:22think about these things. Um
24:25but I think that someone still has to be
24:29running the agents and at the end of the
24:31day it's like my financial fiduciary
24:33point. Uh it's hard to imagine
24:37a world where a human is not like
24:40responsible for decisions.
24:43>> Yeah. And so I think we've been we've
24:45been focused on doing more with the
24:48teams that we have and and giving people
24:50more leverage. Um but yeah, less focused
24:55on just reducing headcount.
24:57>> What's the biggest mistake that you've
24:58made over the last year?
25:00>> You know, I'm I'm sure I've made lots of
25:02little mistakes. I think my my my
25:06approach to things is really just how
25:09can I move forward? like I don't like
25:12thinking about the past very much. I
25:15think we can kind of get stuck
25:16relitigating decisions, but um really
25:20it's it's about okay, where are we now?
25:23You know, I I even in some cases prefer
25:26to be behind and to be an underdog cuz I
25:30think it gives us something to work
25:32towards and and to really push on. I
25:34mean the past year if I had to think
25:35about what we've done okay uh for active
25:40traders we've launched prediction
25:42markets and that that's a interesting
25:46business for us because usually we're
25:49not the first to launch a new asset
25:51class you know equity trading was a
25:54thing for multiple decades even
25:56electronically before Robin Hood came
25:58along we improved it we we brought it to
26:01the smartphone we brought it to zero
26:03commission, but you know, we we weren't
26:06early to it. Crypto trading, we weren't
26:09particularly early either. I mean, we
26:11launched in 2018,
26:14which was early relative to the Trady
26:17companies,
26:18>> but a lot of cryptonative companies
26:20started in 2012 or even earlier.
26:23Bitstamp, which we acquired, was, you
26:26know, I think the longest continuously
26:28running crypto exchange. So, we were we
26:30were uh not the earliest there.
26:32prediction markets. We were one of the
26:33first to to roll out that product as
26:35soon as they got legalized for the
26:37presidential election. We were kind of
26:39there within weeks with a product and
26:41then we had to really expanded over time
26:44and
26:45>> uh you know it's it's it's grown to
26:48hundreds of millions of annual revenue
26:49or fastest growing business line of all
26:52time. Um so active traders we've done
26:55well. Banking uh has been a really quick
26:59roll out. I think that the challenge
27:02that I'm spending a lot of time thinking
27:04about is now that we're doing all of
27:07these things, how can we make sure the
27:08core experience is coherent? And we've
27:12been investing a lot more in
27:14personalization in making like the app
27:16clean. And you know, I can say, well,
27:19maybe maybe I should have thought more
27:20about these problems earlier, but a year
27:24ago, we probably didn't have so many new
27:26products shipping. So
27:27>> that's what I've noticed as a daily
27:29user, probably hourly user of Robin Hood
27:31app. Every time I log on, it's like
27:33there's more things to swipe through.
27:36And a lot of [clears throat] the things
27:36I'm not using, but what I find really
27:38interesting is you guys launch the
27:39prediction markets,
27:40>> but then people could just email
27:42customer support and then say, "Hey, can
27:43you like remove this from my account?"
27:44And I know people that have actually
27:46gotten that removed from their account
27:48both for the simplification and also
27:49because they don't want to be involved
27:50with prediction markets, which I found
27:52really interesting. you guys were able
27:54to like engineer the app for a specific
27:57user experience, which is like I mean
27:59like I don't know of I can't name
28:01another company that can that would that
28:03would do that.
28:04>> Yeah. Yeah. And and now at first it used
28:06to be customer support and now you can
28:08actually like flip a switch if you want
28:11prediction markets uh to Nacho Sports
28:15and also a lot of our core surfaces. It
28:19used to be that, you know, Robin Hood
28:21had only a couple types of accounts. We
28:24had, you know, your brokerage account,
28:25crypto, retirement, spending. Each of
28:28those accounts were kind of their own
28:30tab,
28:31>> but not a lot of not everyone used
28:33retirement, not everyone used crypto. A
28:36and there's another problem of well, we
28:38added 13 additional accounts, right? Um
28:42so we had to completely redesign things
28:45around this idea that you know every tab
28:48in the app should have a use case for
28:52every customer. So now we have like
28:55investment watch list search account and
28:58it's taken a lot of iteration to find
29:01the solution that is optimal because
29:03every change you make affects tens of
29:06millions of existing customers. So it's
29:08highly consequential. I do want to say
29:10just because I absolutely loved this,
29:12not that it will necessarily lead to any
29:13conversation, but I love the fact that
29:14you can open up multiple individual
29:16investing accounts. Yeah. Like ever
29:17since you guys had that, like I it has
29:20completely changed the game for me
29:22because now I don't have one strategy in
29:23one account and you know like or
29:25multiple strategies all consolidated to
29:27one account like that and the UI for it
29:30is like from a user experience
29:31phenomenal. I am curious though on the
29:34personality trait of not of not
29:37litigating prior decisions. Do you think
29:39that that's an essential trait of an
29:42effective CEO?
29:44>> Not necessarily. I think uh a lot of
29:47people
29:49uh a lot of I and and I should make it
29:52seem I I shouldn't make it sound like I
29:55don't really think about you know what
29:56happened in the past. Of course, we do
29:58postmortems and reviews and things of
30:00that nature, but I think a lot of people
30:02just um
30:05live in the past and spend, you know,
30:0780% of time worrying about things that
30:10have already happened. Um and a little
30:12bit less time thinking about, okay, what
30:14what do we do now? I try always to think
30:18about the current state and what my
30:20options are rather than saying, oh, if
30:22if I had changed this 6 months ago,
30:24things would have been different. I
30:26think it's also impossible to a certain
30:29extent to think through
30:31what would have happened if you'd done
30:33something differently in the past
30:34because there's just so many inputs in
30:36in those decisions you know like
30:38>> it's a trap sort of
30:40>> it's a trap and yeah things are the
30:43important things are never clean in the
30:45sense that oh if I had just like uh made
30:48this one decision differently
30:50my entire life since that point would
30:53have been uh would have been different a
30:55lot People say that you are one of the
30:57most effective CEOs and founders alive
31:01today, which I I mean I mean you see it
31:04all over X.
31:05>> Wow, that's humbling.
31:06>> Well, it probably feels cool to know
31:08that. If you were to distill that job
31:10description down to one thing, I could
31:12see it being problem solver. And so, I
31:15mean, would you agree with that
31:16sentiment? Running a podcast is honestly
31:18a lot more work than people may think.
31:20From sponsor contracts and invoices and
31:22clipping, it piles up so quickly. I'm
31:24not kidding when I say we literally use
31:26Claude for everything now and that's why
31:28we are so excited to be partnering with
31:29them. Claude is the AI for problem
31:31solvers. It's the collaborator that
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32:21time and money that we have saved from
32:22using Claude for our business is just
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32:44That's claude.ai/iced
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32:52Claude.ai/icced
32:55coffee. AI is going to transform your
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34:05podcast. A lot of people say that you
34:07are one of the most effective CEOs and
34:10founders alive today, which I I mean I
34:14mean you see it all over X.
34:15>> Wow, that's humbling.
34:17>> Well, it probably feels cool to know
34:18that if you were to distill that job
34:20description down to one thing, I could
34:23see it being problem solver. And so I
34:26mean would you agree with that
34:27sentiment?
34:28>> I think it depends on the company. I
34:31think the job kind of changes
34:34dramatically depending on what you're
34:37responsible for. So I'll give you an
34:39example.
34:40If the company is small and you're the
34:44CEO and you're just trying to like ship
34:46your one product to customers and make
34:49sure it works, the job is really how
34:52quickly can I ship code, right? That's
34:56essentially the problem. Uh if if you
34:58think about it on a base level, problem
35:00solver probably does fit. But problem is
35:03a very broad term. So small company, how
35:07much code can I ship? And I went through
35:09this evolution myself because when when
35:11I started at Robin Hood, I was writing a
35:12lot of code. Then you kind of get to a
35:14point where, okay, maybe we have to do
35:18two products at a time and it's not just
35:21shipping them, but marketing them,
35:24designing them, right? Uh
35:26>> and and there you're kind of leading a
35:29small team of engineers and maybe
35:33dealing with a couple of domains that
35:35aren't really in your core competency.
35:38And I think the challenge there is how
35:42do you stay close enough to the work
35:45that's being done by the folks that
35:46you're managing and also learn enough to
35:51be useful about these other domains that
35:53you're not an expert in. Right? And a
35:55lot of times it's just can you put in
35:57the hours and sort of like the mental
36:00effort to learn about things that aren't
36:02your core competency. A lot of engineers
36:05don't really have an interest in
36:07learning about marketing or legal or ops
36:10and and I think it's limiting because
36:15if if you don't know anything about the
36:17domain, how can you actually make
36:19improvements, right? or you you have to
36:21know enough to like realize what's
36:23working, what's not working, what you
36:24can change. And then you know at every
36:27layer of scale it becomes
36:30um yeah it becomes harder in a sense
36:34because you have more groups of people
36:37working on things that you're less
36:39directly involved in. And there it's
36:41about building systems. Okay. How can I
36:45efficiently if if I wanted to spend like
36:49five minutes on something, how can I get
36:51the best and highest signal five minutes
36:54possible? What are the tools to do that?
36:56Do I have the metrics? Do I have
36:58customer verbatims? Do I have just like
37:01AI tools that are plugged into the right
37:03data so that you know you can actually
37:06make every second that you spend on
37:09something as like high signal and useful
37:12as it could be and so that you're not
37:14kind of making decisions based on
37:15anecdote. So a lot of it is building
37:18these systems organizing things
37:20effectively so that you kind of know the
37:22person to ask or to probe if something's
37:25going wrong or you have a question. and
37:28also
37:29spending time on on the right things.
37:32>> That's fascinating. I mean, effectively,
37:33you just distilled down the blueprint of
37:36like building a huge company and like
37:38how to organize your life as an operator
37:41or executive. If you were to identify
37:45one trait or belief that a lot of
37:49operators have that are not working at
37:51maximum efficiency, like something
37:52that's sort of holding them back, what
37:55similarity do you see among those
37:56people? like what should the the the
37:58primary question CEOs, operators,
38:01executives should be asking themselves
38:04in order to become more effective?
38:06>> I think one is
38:09um
38:10being able to get into the details of
38:16every team, every work stream. Um, and
38:20you know, a lot a lot of people just
38:21rely on
38:24assessments of people in management,
38:26right? But sometimes it's really helpful
38:29to get both ends both ends of the
38:31barbell so to speak, you know, the the
38:33senior executive's view of a situation
38:36and also the people on the ground cuz
38:40you you could have the problem of like
38:42if if something breaks somewhere up in
38:45the chain and bigger organizations, this
38:47is a problem. if you have like
38:49individual contributors, managers,
38:51directors, senior directors, you know,
38:53if something's broken in the chain, um
38:55you could get bad information about
38:57what's happening. So that's why I I find
39:00it very helpful sometimes to go as close
39:03to the ground as possible. You know,
39:05look at the code, be able to look at the
39:07code, look at the actual copy that's
39:09shipping to the website, talk to people
39:12who are individual contributors or
39:15interns. spend a lot of time talking to
39:17interns. Um, and so, so I think being
39:21able to get extremely deep into the
39:23details is important. Not a lot of
39:25people do that. And that goes to the
39:28work. I think the other thing is just uh
39:31hiring well, making sure that the people
39:34around you um in my case, it's like the
39:37the general managers and the functional
39:39leads are incredibly strong. And I think
39:42I've been fortunate to evolve to a place
39:45where it's just of incredibly capable
39:48people that are running really big
39:51businesses and growing uh alongside the
39:54businesses that they're running.
39:55>> You know, it's a hilarious parallel to
39:56draw there, like staying close to the
39:58problem. So, we have a friend, his name
40:00is Ben Mala, and he buys huge commercial
40:03apartment complexes or just commercial
40:05real estate. like he just bought a new
40:07place that's like hundreds of units and
40:09he gets his son to move into the complex
40:13to be close to the problem to know what
40:14it's like to actually be a resident at
40:17the complex to know where to make
40:19improvements where to spend money to
40:20have the highest possible return on
40:22quality of life for the residents there.
40:25And that's kind of similar to what
40:26you're saying here. It's like you need
40:27to talk to everybody in the food chain.
40:29You need to get like the executive
40:31opinion as well as like the the person
40:33who's actually going and like you know
40:35assembling the product's opinion.
40:37>> Yeah. And also you need to talk to the
40:39customer and it it's both the customers
40:43that are loud on Twitter, the ones that
40:46are loud on customer support, which are
40:48not always the same. You need to look at
40:50what the Redditors are saying, you know,
40:52on the on the different subreddits. But
40:54also, there's a lot of customers that
40:56are quiet and will just silently stop
40:59using the product and aren't going to go
41:02talk talk about it to social on social
41:04media or write in a support ticket. So,
41:06you have to figure out how to get to
41:08those customers, too. I think it it
41:10really helps to be obsessed with your
41:14business, right? Um, and and to really
41:18feel like, you know, every little
41:20problem
41:22is just going to be on my mind until I
41:25figure out uh a way to solve it. And,
41:27you know, if I figured out a way to
41:29solve it and it's actioned, then I can
41:31kind of put it away in a little drawer,
41:33check up on it later. But, um, I think
41:36something I've noticed about myself is
41:40I spend a lot of time obsessing about
41:42every little detail. And I think in some
41:45cases that can be annoying and sort of
41:49uh
41:51not ideal for maybe staying calm and and
41:55having great mental health, but I think
41:57is actually really really good for the
41:59business.
41:59>> What's the next thing you want to do
42:01that regulation currently blocks?
42:03>> Oh, that's a great question. I'm sure
42:04the the regulators will love that one.
42:06Uh
42:07>> yeah, I mean I think generally we've had
42:09really really strong constructive
42:11relationships with the regulators. um
42:14particularly in the last couple of years
42:15where um yeah they've been they've been
42:19much more keen to support innovation. I
42:23think that the couple of things that
42:25have been
42:27sort of like fresh
42:30new issues and you know one of the other
42:33things we're doing now is we're we're
42:34starting to think about how we can push
42:36change in in all these policies um
42:39rather than just being a participant in
42:41them, right? uh PDT rule. You guys might
42:45be familiar. That rule change came in.
42:47We're very supportive of that. So, this
42:49is a rule where if you don't have
42:51$25,000 in your account, there's
42:54restrictions to day trading.
42:57>> Yeah. So that being repealed was was
43:00very very good because essentially what
43:02it did was it penalized customers that
43:05uh didn't have a lot of money in their
43:07accounts which you know a lot of
43:09customers start with us so they don't
43:11have a lot of money in their accounts
43:12and they get into these situations where
43:15um the intent of the rule was probably
43:17to prevent them from making rash
43:19decisions but then then you get into a
43:21situation where you know if you like
43:24want to close your position for a
43:26riskmanagement reason it gets flagged as
43:29a day trade. Then you get restricted and
43:31you basically have to make that
43:33decision. You intend to do it and you uh
43:36you turn to another broker because
43:39actually the other weird thing about
43:41this rule is it's on a per broker basis.
43:44So if you're a pattern day trader
43:45somewhere, you can move your account
43:47elsewhere and then
43:48>> you start you sort of start from
43:50scratch.
43:51>> So that was a great positive change.
43:53Couple of other things that I'm quite
43:56keen on. Uh, one, accredited investor.
44:00And since we last spoke, we've really
44:02been pushing on the idea that private
44:05ownership is kind of the next frontier
44:07of our mission. Uh, for for various
44:11reasons, but the main one like there's a
44:14lot of disruption by AI. A lot of the
44:16top AI companies like OpenAI and
44:18Anthropic, for instance, are private.
44:20They're going into the trillions of val
44:22of dollars of valuation and there's a
44:25small circle of wealthy insiders that's
44:27benefiting from all the growth. It's not
44:30broadly distributed.
44:32So our solution to that make it easy to
44:34own these companies um or get exposure
44:37to them. In in the US we have Robin Hood
44:40Ventures which essentially you can think
44:42of as a basket of private companies
44:45right and we we have Robin Hood Ventures
44:47fund one which started with late stage
44:50uh preIPO open AAI is is actually in
44:53that fund
44:54>> and it gave um a lowcost vehicle for
44:59investing and getting exposure to
45:01private companies
45:02>> and and kind of on the heels of RVI we
45:06started RV2 to Robin Hood Ventures Fund
45:092, which takes another angle. Uh, it's
45:12still a basket of private companies, but
45:14rather than them being ultra late
45:17immediately preIPO kind of companies, we
45:21went to the opposite side of the
45:22spectrum and now we're giving exposure
45:24to seed and series A, which is the
45:27earliest stage of capital formation. So
45:29rather than tens and hundreds of
45:31billions valuations in these companies,
45:33Robin Hood Ventures Fund 2 typical
45:36valuations are in the tens of millions.
45:37>> How do you pick those companies and what
45:39if they don't want to be a part of them?
45:41>> Yeah, great question and this is one of
45:43the things we figured out uh this year.
45:46Um
45:48we uh have taken the position that uh if
45:52a company doesn't want to be in Robin
45:54Hood Ventures uh we we generally won't
45:57force them. So, every deal that we've
46:00done for Robin Hood Ventures thus far,
46:02>> and this isn't true of some of our
46:04competitors, of which there are a
46:06couple, some of our competitors will go
46:08in and do the second layer SPVLP
46:10interest and, you know, then announce it
46:12and then you've seen the company come in
46:14and say, "Actually,
46:17we don't know anything about this." Uh,
46:19not ideal. So with Robin Hood Ventures,
46:22we've taken the position that we go
46:24direct with the company's blessing in
46:26all of these cases. And that's true of
46:29all the deals that we've done thus far.
46:32Um, and I think this was not an obvious
46:34one, right? Because there's a trade-off.
46:37What you really want is the access, but
46:40you also are creating a new product and
46:42you want that new product to
46:44>> uh be accepted by the stakeholders in
46:48the industry. What if we take it a step
46:49further and we say that everyone gets
46:51access to these private privatized
46:54companies? Then wouldn't it be that the
46:56really wealthy people just get in even
46:57sooner?
46:58>> There's always a cat and mouse game in
47:00the sense that uh the the wealthy always
47:03figure out how to get better things and
47:06so our job is never done right. Then we
47:09have to uh we have to keep working to
47:12get even earlier access
47:14>> and then they get in a little earlier
47:16too. But I mean, look, Robin Hood
47:17Adventure 2 seed series A uh that that's
47:20like pretty early. It's it's hard to get
47:23earlier. And we're partnering with YC
47:25for that fund. So, I think we'll prove
47:27out the model of seed and series A
47:30funding for retail. Um now, the problem
47:33with these things is these are still
47:35baskets, right? And what we're hearing
47:38from customers is maybe I like these
47:40three companies, but I don't like these
47:42other three. So, I think the end state
47:45is going to be investing and trading for
47:48those that want to uh individual private
47:51names
47:52>> so that they feel pretty close to what
47:55trading a public stock on Robin Hood
47:57would feel. And and that part needs both
48:00continued product innovation and also
48:04reform of accredited investor standards
48:06which now limit direct investments to
48:08private companies to high earning
48:12wealthy people.
48:13>> Is there any other product that you wish
48:14existed? Like for me I wish that you
48:17guys had or someone created a Venmo
48:20where we could send each other stocks
48:22like instead of sending Jack a hundred
48:24bucks they'd be like yo here's $100 of
48:26Google.
48:26>> Yeah. And you know, last time you guys
48:28asked me for Robin Hood social, right?
48:31Uh and I said, "Oh, well, maybe uh we'll
48:33have something to announce in the
48:34future." And
48:35>> you know, he said to me, the audacity of
48:37Graham to say this, he was all he was
48:39all, you know, didn't we say something
48:41about a Robin Hood social last time and
48:42then they launched it and I was like, if
48:44you think that because you suggested
48:46Robin Hood social afterwards, Vlad was
48:49like, "Yo, let's do it. Let's launch it.
48:51Let's launch it."
48:52>> Um Yeah. Yeah. No, I thought it was
48:54funny cuz obviously uh it it had been in
48:56the works. You know, we we we didn't
48:58just whip it up. Broke
48:59>> his heart.
49:00>> We didn't just whip it up in a couple of
49:01weeks uh from from when uh we had that
49:05conversation to Hood Summit when we
49:06announced it. But um yeah, there's
49:09always sometimes I get asked about
49:10things in the works and um I really want
49:13to like spill the beans right there, but
49:15then I'm like, "Ah, well, we have these
49:17events, we're launching things."
49:18>> So, if we just keep guessing, you just
49:20wouldn't say no. You can tell based on
49:22my reaction probably what's in the works
49:24or not. Uh even though I try to keep a
49:26very very calm poker face, but you know,
49:28Robin Hood social has done well. And now
49:31I don't know if you guys are seeing it,
49:32but people have started cross-osting
49:35>> Robin Hood social screenshots on X.
49:38>> Yeah. And they're like, "What's going on
49:39in this community?" And that's bringing
49:41in more.
49:41>> People need to be verified, by the way,
49:43because my profile is up there. And I
49:45think uh people think that I'm a scammer
49:47on Robin Hood social because they don't
49:49have a check mark. Like there's no way
49:50to verify that is actually your
49:51username. Graham Stefen.
49:54>> Okay. I'm J L S L B Y. Follow us on
49:58Robin Hood social, guys.
49:59>> Oh well.
50:00>> Yeah, but that means someone else is
50:01going to create one that's very similar.
50:03>> Uh and then they're going to like start
50:05like scamming. I don't know.
50:06>> We'll have to figure this out. Okay.
50:08Yeah. I mean, the one thing that we
50:09think works really well with Robin Hood
50:11Social is the fact that the trades and
50:14the portfolios are verified and you
50:16know, now we have P&L widgets and all
50:18these things. So in in other social
50:22media platforms where people are sharing
50:24your trades, you don't really know
50:26whether they're BSing or they could be
50:28faking the screenshots. With Robin Hood
50:30social, we kind of take care of that
50:32verification as part of the platform
50:34which I think has like uh had a really
50:37nice it's a it's a positive and also
50:39differentiated aspect. But yeah, we'll
50:42we'll obviously have to solve this
50:45verification problem for for the
50:47profiles as well. Is there any financial
50:49product that's not really being
50:51discussed though? Because as someone
50:52who's so on the pulse with customer
50:54demand and just broad investing data,
50:57there has to be like whispers of some
50:59sort of investment style. Like no one
51:01thought five maybe 10 years ago that we
51:04would have AI investing agents. Yeah.
51:06Right. But someone may have and I feel
51:08like you would probably be the person of
51:10of all to ask like what could the future
51:12of finance look like? Something we may
51:14not even be talking about right now in 5
51:16to 10 years. Is there some sort of
51:18product or service or like something
51:20else?
51:21>> Yeah, I mean Robin Hood chain I think is
51:23a is a good example of what the future
51:26could be if we could like rebuild the
51:29infrastructure from the ground up. I
51:31don't know if you guys are familiar with
51:33Robin Hood chain. It's it's basically
51:36the hottest chain in crypto right now.
51:38We rolled it out a couple of weeks ago
51:41and it's been top five in DEX volume. uh
51:46the TVL total value locked has been
51:49growing tremendously and uh one of the
51:52benefits is it has stock tokens which
51:55are tokenized representations of stocks
51:58that are available for customers outside
52:00the US for now but you know you're
52:03they're still available in 120 plus
52:06countries around the world and if you're
52:08on Robin Hood chain and you have stock
52:10tokens like Tesla Nvidia or others you
52:13actually can do
52:16everything with them that you could do
52:18with uh another onchain crypto. So, you
52:20can send them to people onchain just
52:22like you would send Bitcoin or Ethereum.
52:25You can swap them in pools. Uniswap has
52:29uh some very very active pools on Robin
52:31Hood chain. You can do uh
52:34collateralization, lending, and
52:36borrowing. So, you you get a picture of
52:40what it could look like if we kind of
52:42replaced it all with software. So, when
52:44you say swapping, does that mean that
52:46let's just say I have $500,000 worth of
52:48gains in a stock that I could swap that
52:51stock for another, keeping my cost basis
52:54without realizing a gain?
52:55>> The tax situation depends on where you
52:59are, right? Every every one of these 120
53:02countries has slightly different tax
53:04treatments. So, I can't really speak
53:06generally to that. Um but yeah all all
53:11you have to do is create a pool. If
53:13someone creates a pool exchanging you
53:16know a stock token with a crypto uh yeah
53:22you can just swap them directly. So we
53:24started out using stablecoin. So USDG
53:28which is the stable coin that we
53:31partnered with Paxos and a few others to
53:33launch. that's like the the core stable
53:36coin of the chain. But then all the
53:38developers have created all kinds of
53:42unique pools that we didn't even think
53:44would exist and and all kinds of
53:46protocols where for example if you hold
53:49a memecoin you just get uh stock tokens
53:53uh air dropped to you. Right. So they've
53:56like connected meme coins, core cryptos,
53:58and the stock tokens and composed them
54:01into into unique products that yeah, we
54:04we wouldn't have anticipated creating,
54:06we probably wouldn't have thought of to
54:08make ourselves. So it's it's um Robin
54:11Hood chain is this combination of
54:15developer platform with uh financial
54:18primitives uh like high yield and stock
54:22tokens that we're going to add to and
54:24and I think the combination of those two
54:26is going to lead to a lot of interesting
54:28things. Not to mention you know late it
54:30was built for AI agents too. So a lot of
54:33people have been rolling out APIs
54:35command line interfaces. I'm just
54:37imagining if you tried explaining this
54:39to Warren Buffett,
54:40>> like what he would say, like if if this
54:42is even something he would understand,
54:44it would say, "No, this is just
54:46>> I mean, I think to to most consumers who
54:49aren't developers,
54:51uh the value prop is really if you're in
54:54120 countries all over anywhere in the
54:57world. uh if you have a smartphone,
54:59internet connection, you can trade uh
55:03tokenized representations of these
55:05stocks 24/7
55:07uh at relatively low cost and great user
55:11experience.
55:12>> But then even if you're a US resident,
55:14then you can be trading outside of
55:16trading hours all day like it
55:20effectively opens up the optionality of
55:22a of a investor.
55:24>> Yeah. So right now they're not available
55:26in the US but there has been movement to
55:30enable tokenization here and I I think
55:33eventually it will happen.
55:36It's just the the delta in value is is
55:40much smaller. It it would be like
55:42>> you know in a lot of these places
55:44overseas they don't even have functional
55:45banking systems. So they can go right to
55:49>> uh
55:50>> tokenized stocks and it's a huge leap,
55:53right? Whereas in the US you already
55:55have Robin Hood. So going from Robin
55:57Hood to like 24/7 is comparatively
56:00minor. It would be like going from your
56:02very fast train to a high-speed train,
56:05right? Uh expensive shift. Uh a lot of
56:09the existing train operators aren't keen
56:11to make the investment and you can
56:13already get from New York to DC in 2
56:15hours. So shaving it to 1 hour maybe
56:18maybe isn't the biggest delta. And so I
56:20think that's why the rest of the world
56:23is leading here and the US is probably
56:26going to be a late adopter of of some of
56:28these technologies.
56:30>> What do you think the other brokerages
56:31fail to understand about investing in
56:332026? Now really quick I got to say that
56:36everyone has a business idea that
56:37they've been sitting on. And what stops
56:39most people really isn't the idea
56:40itself. It's everything that comes after
56:42it. We're talking building the store,
56:44taking payments, the checkout page, but
56:46it's actually very straightforward when
56:48our partner Shopify handles it for you.
56:50Everything that you need to start
56:51selling is included and ready from day
56:53one. That includes the moment your first
56:54customer is ready to pay. Shopify
56:56checkout helps more of them actually
56:58finish their purchase. Plus, when they
56:59come back, their details are already
57:01saved. It's one tap and they're done.
57:02I've personally used Shopify several
57:04times because before I was working with
57:06Graham, I set up probably five or six
57:08different Shopify stores and even me
57:10actually saw some sales and I knew
57:12absolutely nothing. Shopify is genuinely
57:14the easiest way to start an online brand
57:16and see real sales coming in. Shopify
57:20powers millions of businesses worldwide.
57:22From household names like Mattel and Gym
57:24Shark to small everyday businesses just
57:26getting started. With Shopify, nothing
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57:30business. So go make it one. Start a
57:32free trial at shopify.com/ic.
57:34Once again, that is shopify.com/ic.
57:37One more time, that's shopify.com/ic
57:40with the link down below in the
57:42description to get started. What do you
57:43think the other brokerages fail to
57:45understand about investing in 2026? I
57:48think the other brokerages suffer from
57:52just being large. I I mean, I think
57:55there's a lot of players in the space,
57:58right? There's the incumbents that are
58:00big and they have tens of trillions in
58:03assets. But yeah, I think we we ship
58:05much much faster and we're more modern,
58:08which means that we've been able to
58:10capture a younger customer base that uh
58:13is growing wealthier over the next
58:16couple of decades as opposed to aging
58:18out. And so we're kind of the
58:20beneficiary of this great wealth
58:21transfer over time. So, if you were a
58:24paid consultant to the other brokerages,
58:27what would you tell them?
58:28>> I think to some degree, um, it starts
58:32with talent. Like, if if you want to
58:35build really really great products that
58:38are competitive and 10 times better than
58:42um
58:45what's already out there. Um there there
58:48needs to be like a talent reset and you
58:51have to make sure really good engineers
58:52and designers and product builders,
58:55people that understand AI are in the
58:57company. Um so I I would probably find
59:02one area and these companies are like
59:05giant elephants, right? You can't eat
59:07the elephant in one bite as they say.
59:09You have to you have to just
59:12>> take it one one bite at a time. You you
59:14eat it very slowly. So, I'd probably
59:17find one area
59:20which maybe was small and kind of
59:22circumscribed away from the core and and
59:26try to like inject a ton of talent into
59:28that one area. Run it kind of standalone
59:31separately and see if that can
59:36provide a road map how of of how we can
59:38do like a technology transformation for
59:41the entire company. And so if we get a
59:43beach head in one area and we're able to
59:45hire special forces, elite talent there,
59:49um then we kind of like put more into
59:52there and and see that grow till
59:54eventually the the entire company is
59:57rebuilt with a stronger foundation.
59:59>> In terms of the broader economy, are you
1:00:01worried about valuations?
1:00:02>> I think in some sectors
1:00:05alarm bells have started ringing. I I'll
1:00:08give you an example. I mean, we get a
1:00:11lot of feature requests from our
1:00:13customers all the time, right? And for
1:00:16the longest time, international stocks
1:00:20was not in the top 10. I mean, some
1:00:22people wanted international stocks,
1:00:24>> but you know, a couple maybe maybe a
1:00:26month or two ago, every question I would
1:00:29get in interview was, "When are you
1:00:31going to add Korean stocks?" That's what
1:00:33everyone wants. You know, nobody wants
1:00:35>> Mhm.
1:00:36>> prediction markets or crypto. Uh, we
1:00:38just want Korean stocks. I don't know if
1:00:41you guys experienced this.
1:00:42>> Very familiar with what's going on.
1:00:44>> Or were you some of the people that were
1:00:46asking asking for them?
1:00:47>> Probably Jack, [laughter]
1:00:49>> I'll invest in anything.
1:00:51>> Yeah. And and by the way,
1:00:52>> as long as they do options on Korean
1:00:54stocks, I end.
1:00:55>> And by the way, we will add Korean
1:00:56stocks. But the fact that we were
1:00:58hearing from
1:01:00>> so many people at the same time does
1:01:03raise the alarm bells a little bit of
1:01:05like what's going on there. And sure
1:01:07enough, yes, there was just
1:01:09>> So, what are you seeing today? Starting
1:01:11to ring some bells.
1:01:13>> Yeah. And I have to be careful here
1:01:14because I'm not uh I I don't want to
1:01:17give people investment advice. Um and
1:01:20also to be fair, traditionally our
1:01:22customers
1:01:24>> are
1:01:25>> like innovation first. So, we were among
1:01:27the first to invest in electric
1:01:29vehicles. They're obviously into crypto
1:01:32AI even though, you know, um exposure
1:01:37directly to AI labs is difficult and
1:01:39we're fixing it with Robin Hood
1:01:41Ventures, you've got the semiconductors
1:01:43and and now you've got a lot of people
1:01:44talking about energy, right? So
1:01:47>> um I guess chips and energy as a
1:01:51category
1:01:53you have uh you have a very very
1:01:56complicated balancing act to play cuz on
1:01:58the one hand it is kind of obvious if
1:02:00you assume uh people are saying well if
1:02:03AI demand continues to grow of course
1:02:05that's going to impact chips and
1:02:07everything in the stack underneath it.
1:02:09On the other hand, what you have is the
1:02:11traders, and this includes, you know,
1:02:14there's been anecdotes of hedge funds
1:02:15that are just buying chips because they
1:02:18know, hey, even if I don't need this
1:02:20chip myself, I'll be able to resell it
1:02:22at a higher price. And whether something
1:02:26is undervalued or not kind of depends on
1:02:30many of these factors. And and I could
1:02:32see it tipping in one direction. And you
1:02:34know if it if a lot of the supply is
1:02:37being bought by speculators that's when
1:02:39you can kind of get into trouble with
1:02:42you know even something that has
1:02:43fundamental growth potential like uh
1:02:46chips in an AI environment.
1:02:48>> Do you think that a high stock market
1:02:49right now is actually bad for people in
1:02:51their 20s and 30s?
1:02:52>> Everything I think is is an opportunity
1:02:54in a sense. Um, back in 2020 when we had
1:02:58a big crash right around COVID, you saw
1:03:02our customers actually buying, you know,
1:03:05and and you looked at the customers of
1:03:07the other discount brokers and they were
1:03:09selling and that was the big story. Our
1:03:10customers were buying because they're
1:03:13younger. They had uh a long-term horizon
1:03:16and they saw it as an opportunity. they
1:03:19were still fundamentally bullish about
1:03:21the country and of all the things that
1:03:24you know were were were being built and
1:03:26and what the stock market offered and
1:03:28they kind of showed that through their
1:03:31activity on the platform in a sense a
1:03:34lot of people say well do you worry
1:03:35about stock market corrections
1:03:38>> I don't worry about them as much because
1:03:40we've seen in the past that having
1:03:42younger customers they they take
1:03:45corrections as opportunities now that
1:03:48doesn't mean that I want a correction or
1:03:50I even want you know a sustained period
1:03:53of slightly lower prices that can be
1:03:55very very challenging to the economy and
1:03:58to people. Uh I think everyone generally
1:04:01should just want things to go up
1:04:02smoothly up and to the right but uh it's
1:04:05not the reality and I think every market
1:04:08environment if you're a trader presents
1:04:11opportunities that you can capitalize on
1:04:13and if you're a long-term investor it
1:04:15can be hard to predict these things and
1:04:16time them. So we offer great tools for
1:04:20uh tax advantaged
1:04:21>> investing. I think we have the best
1:04:23retirement products on the market where
1:04:26it's really targeted towards putting
1:04:28money in and you know not withdrawing
1:04:30for many many decades. And and I think
1:04:33uh dollar cost averaging and passive
1:04:35management is better at Robin Hood than
1:04:38at any of our competitors. You know a
1:04:40lot of our competitors don't even offer
1:04:42good tools for for these things. But
1:04:43we're continuing to invest and
1:04:46incentivize. A lot of people criticize
1:04:49us because they think we incentivize
1:04:50active trading and prediction markets.
1:04:53If you look at what we actually
1:04:54incentivize in the product, it's
1:04:56retirement. Retirement gives you a 3%
1:04:58match if you're a gold member and you
1:05:00make a contribution. So those are the
1:05:02types of products that we've really
1:05:06directly incentivized and and had
1:05:08success incentivizing. Now, what do you
1:05:10say to the people who criticize that it
1:05:12is leaning too heavy into prediction
1:05:15markets which might be considered too
1:05:17close to gambling?
1:05:18>> Yeah, we get that criticism and of
1:05:20course you mentioned the switcher and
1:05:22being able to customize it. We get the
1:05:24criticism in both directions actually.
1:05:28Um, you know, we have people that just
1:05:30don't want to see prediction markets.
1:05:32And for that, we have personalization
1:05:34and all the initiatives we have, not
1:05:37just for you to disable it, but also to
1:05:39make sure that we show you the content
1:05:42that you want to see in the app when you
1:05:44want to see it. It's a it's a big
1:05:46priority not just with prediction
1:05:48markets but also the more different
1:05:50products and features we have. We have
1:05:53to solve the problem of you just not
1:05:56being aware of us offering a great
1:05:58feature that you can benefit from. Um so
1:06:03yeah there's there's both I don't want
1:06:04to see this product prediction markets
1:06:07being a great example. Also, I want to
1:06:10see it more like it's too buried in the
1:06:12product and I don't want it to be, you
1:06:14know, three taps away. I just want to
1:06:16see what's going on right now. And I
1:06:18think personalization is an answer. Uh
1:06:22the other thing we've been experimenting
1:06:23with is in some cases if really the
1:06:27experience is very very different, uh we
1:06:30break it out into a separate app, which
1:06:31is what we did with banking. So if you
1:06:33want like a a banking and a card
1:06:36experience, you can have that in the
1:06:38banking app. If you want a more trading
1:06:40first experience, you have like the main
1:06:42green Robin Hood app. And if you want
1:06:45full crypto, the Robin Hood wallet has
1:06:47like DeFi native experience.
1:06:50>> What do you think the critics are
1:06:51getting right that you could improve on?
1:06:53I mean, I think that um
1:06:57making things cohesive and making the
1:07:00purpose of the company and what we stand
1:07:02for more understandable is is a fair
1:07:04critique. We hear that a little bit.
1:07:06Everyone always wants features and it's
1:07:08hard for me. I mean, the the Korean
1:07:11stocks, I think they're right. I think
1:07:13we probably should have Korean stocks as
1:07:15well as stocks for from every single
1:07:18market. There's just a bunch of stuff
1:07:20that we just haven't gotten to yet
1:07:24because there's always more and more to
1:07:26build. And the way that I think about
1:07:28this is there's kind of three buckets of
1:07:31thing, right? infrastructure
1:07:33improvements that just make the ex
1:07:35existing experience better like faster
1:07:39performance like just better nicer
1:07:42cleaner UI UX uh reliability so that we
1:07:46just uh can handle traffic spikes better
1:07:50and things like that and we we made
1:07:52tremendous progress there even in the
1:07:54past year actually there's the category
1:07:56of like what's available at other
1:07:58brokers that Robin Hood doesn't have and
1:08:02that's It's a big category up until
1:08:03recently. It's trust accounts. Uh
1:08:06international stocks are available at
1:08:08some of our competitors. You've got
1:08:10things like fixed income if you want to
1:08:12buy direct bonds, mutual funds. You
1:08:15know, there's a lot of things that we
1:08:16don't offer that are sizable parts of
1:08:20portfolios of customers, right? And then
1:08:23there's this third bucket which I think
1:08:25can be easy to overlook.
1:08:28Not a lot of people have products here,
1:08:30but it's just like can we innovate and
1:08:32can we be the first to market with with
1:08:34new products relative to our peer set at
1:08:37least. And that's where things like
1:08:38prediction markets uh Robin Hood
1:08:41ventures entirely net new product things
1:08:44like Robin Hood chain and and Robin Hood
1:08:46earn like we we also want to put things
1:08:49in there that are completely unexpected.
1:08:52Agentic trading we were talking about. I
1:08:54mean, nobody
1:08:56nobody big, no no no nobody non-trivial
1:08:58is like working on aentic trading
1:09:00besides us, right? Like we're just
1:09:03figuring that out.
1:09:04>> Slightly off topic, are you ever worried
1:09:05about the billionaire tax here in
1:09:07California?
1:09:08>> I try not to think about it very much.
1:09:10Um, yeah. Yeah. And again, it's it's one
1:09:13of those things where um
1:09:17Yeah. I mean, California has this
1:09:19interesting kind of referendumbased
1:09:21structure where if you get enough
1:09:23support, um, even if the governor or
1:09:27local politicians or, you know, the the
1:09:31people support or are opposed to
1:09:33something, you can get on the ballot
1:09:35anyway. I think the predict we have a
1:09:37prediction market on this.
1:09:38>> So, you could hedge yourself in a way.
1:09:40[laughter]
1:09:42>> Technically, I could, although that's
1:09:44not one of the deepest markets. Uh but
1:09:46yeah, I think I think it's it's showing
1:09:48it as a minority. So hopefully that does
1:09:51hold.
1:09:52>> What would change in your life if there
1:09:53was a billionaire tax?
1:09:55>> Well, a couple of things. Um
1:09:58one,
1:10:00I think the real risk isn't to me
1:10:05personally, although obviously it would
1:10:07not be amazing. Um it's to the ecosystem
1:10:10here, right? Um,
1:10:13so I think I think the real risk is it
1:10:16could be like a own goal for California
1:10:19because there's basically been two
1:10:22industries that California hasn't just
1:10:25been leading the country but has been
1:10:28leading the world in many cases. One is
1:10:32entertainment industry, Hollywood, uh,
1:10:34and and that's just gotten decimated in
1:10:37the past 10 years, right? and and a lot
1:10:39of it is policy decisions, their own
1:10:41goals, not giving incentives to people
1:10:44to shoot and film and to hire people
1:10:46locally. So then they're flying to
1:10:47Atlanta or Canada or Eastern Europe. And
1:10:51you know, it's hard to break this
1:10:53network, but I think that what's
1:10:56happened in Hollywood has shown that
1:10:57that network can be broken. If you have
1:11:00filming and studios moving elsewhere,
1:11:02and then eventually the talent and the
1:11:04directors and actors move elsewhere, and
1:11:06then you get to a point where, you know,
1:11:08they're not even having the award shows
1:11:10in in LA because nobody lives there
1:11:12anymore. So, I think there's a real
1:11:14danger of that. Could that happen to the
1:11:17technology industry? Um, I think it was
1:11:20looking fairly bleak for technology in
1:11:23San Francisco during COVID. People were
1:11:26talking about moving to Texas, moving to
1:11:28Florida, and AI kind of resuscitated
1:11:31things.
1:11:32>> But, um, I think what happened in LA
1:11:35shows that we shouldn't take, uh, this
1:11:38for granted. Yeah. But what what the
1:11:40real risk is, you know, I think a lot of
1:11:42people will nobody's going to want to be
1:11:45taxed every single year, 5% of their
1:11:48wealth. And these taxes do tend to start
1:11:53uh very very popular, but then
1:11:55eventually they cover everyone. Um, and
1:11:59over time I think you could actually get
1:12:01to a situation where the lost revenue
1:12:05from people paying moderate taxes, um,
1:12:09but doing them consistently is is much
1:12:12higher than the one-time hit of like
1:12:16taxing someone once and them leaving the
1:12:19state. uh and a lot of people have
1:12:22already left the state actually before
1:12:25the the initial taxation would hit. So
1:12:27even the threat of this happening has
1:12:29been has been so severe that some people
1:12:32have have bailed in relatively large
1:12:34numbers pretty significant taxpayers.
1:12:37>> If a billionaire tax passes on a
1:12:39personal level, what would that do to
1:12:41you? Would you just be forced to sell
1:12:43some of your stake in your company? I
1:12:45think it depends a lot on implementation
1:12:48and some of it is uh yeah some some of
1:12:51it hasn't been precisely
1:12:53>> laid out
1:12:54>> laid out um
1:12:57yeah but I think a lot of people would
1:12:59be forced to I mean the bulk of my
1:13:01wealth is Robin Hood shares so um on a
1:13:05cursory reading I think a lot of people
1:13:07would have to sell shares in their
1:13:09companies.
1:13:10>> Do you keep your Robin Hood shares in
1:13:12Robin Hood? Uh, no. Um, yeah.
1:13:16>> Too many eggs [laughter] in one basket.
1:13:17>> No, no, no. It's It's not because of
1:13:19that. It's just because currently
1:13:21>> you got a 3% AATS transfer fee to some
1:13:23other. [laughter]
1:13:24It's like, oh, wow.
1:13:25>> That's I'm I'm I'm saving it for when uh
1:13:28Yeah. for for rainy day. Um [laughter]
1:13:31uh no because uh my shares and the
1:13:34shares of our our um uh employees are
1:13:37administered by um there's like special
1:13:41requirements for how to administer
1:13:44employee stock purchase plans and uh
1:13:47what are called 10B51 plans which is I
1:13:52can't just freely trade my Robin Hood
1:13:54shares, right? I have to trade them
1:13:56under a specific plan that's filed in
1:13:59advance. Yeah. Because of material
1:14:01non-public information.
1:14:04>> Yeah, that makes sense. So, so there are
1:14:06uh companies that deal with this uh and
1:14:09it's like a B2B thing like I will
1:14:12actually
1:14:13uh I will actually create a deal with
1:14:17you know a p a preo company to manage
1:14:21their ESP to manage their 10b51s and I
1:14:24become the the vendor.
1:14:26>> Do you trade on Robin Hood?
1:14:28>> I do. Yeah. So you you'll like wake up,
1:14:30check the app, make a investment, but
1:14:32also what's interesting is when you sign
1:14:35up for Robin Hood, you have to check the
1:14:37boxes that no one else does, right?
1:14:40>> Like when I'm signing up for a new
1:14:42brokerage, I say no, no, no, no. I don't
1:14:45know anyone that's a 10% owner in a
1:14:46company or this or that. Like I'm not
1:14:48affiliated by any means with like
1:14:51>> like I say no to all those disclosures,
1:14:53but you actually have to say yes. How
1:14:54does that change on a personal investing
1:14:56way? I have to be really careful uh
1:14:58trading individual stocks. I think ETFs
1:15:01are uh are are pretty simple and pretty
1:15:04clean. Uh crypto for a while I was doing
1:15:07a lot of crypto because I love uh I love
1:15:11crypto, right? I love trading. I love
1:15:14like being in the trenches with people.
1:15:17A lot of trenchers. Um I don't post on
1:15:19Reddit anymore sadly
1:15:21>> anymore. Okay. Uh yeah, at one point I
1:15:23was a I was a Redditor uh early on in my
1:15:26Robin Hood journey. I think I got off of
1:15:27Reddit. Um but uh yeah, crypto has been
1:15:31kind of nice because um yeah, it's it's
1:15:35a it's a fun trading product. Futures
1:15:37was nice when we launched it, prediction
1:15:39markets as well, but yeah, individual
1:15:41stocks. Um yeah, there's there's a lot
1:15:44of restrictions. So,
1:15:46>> what crypto do you have and own? Hey, by
1:15:48the way, really quick. If you want extra
1:15:50content just like this, as well as early
1:15:52access and a bonus post show posted
1:15:55every single week, feel free to join as
1:15:56a channel member to get immediate access
1:15:58to all of that, as well as early access
1:16:01to everything else that we post along
1:16:03with priority responses to all of your
1:16:05comments. So, if that sounds cool, feel
1:16:07free to join. Would love to have you on
1:16:08board. Thanks so much. We'll get back to
1:16:10the podcast now. What crypto do you have
1:16:12and own? And again, I I don't want to
1:16:15get into uh recommendations, but um I I
1:16:20have a pretty diversified portfolio.
1:16:22Yeah. To be honest with you.
1:16:24>> Are you bullish on Bitcoin?
1:16:26>> You know, Bitcoin is singular in a lot
1:16:30of ways, which makes it special. It was
1:16:32the first asset. It was the original
1:16:35memecoin, right? The brand of it is is
1:16:38quite strong because nobody can ever you
1:16:40you can create lots of Bitcoin
1:16:42imitators, but nobody can ever take the
1:16:44position of being the first and and most
1:16:47trusted. It's the, you know, main coin
1:16:50that companies think about as they're
1:16:51building out crypto treasuries to
1:16:54diversify against inflation and and do
1:16:56all sorts of things. So, yeah,
1:16:58long-term, I'm bullish on Bitcoin. I
1:17:01think it is singular and I think that
1:17:03gives it an advantage over comparable
1:17:06coins, but yeah, I can't tell you
1:17:10>> if it's going to hit a million or
1:17:11anything like that.
1:17:12>> One thing I want to ask you is that
1:17:13recently there was a Bitcoin hack with
1:17:16the cold wallet and Bitcoin was stolen.
1:17:18How do you make sure that if let's say I
1:17:21deposit Bitcoin on Robin Hood that that
1:17:24cryptocurrency is safe and that on your
1:17:27end there couldn't be a hack or that
1:17:29like there's an employee who just makes
1:17:32a mistake who types in a wrong little
1:17:34number and like something gets out there
1:17:36and then
1:17:37>> I think there's defense in depth what's
1:17:39called defense in depth with with these
1:17:41things. So without getting into the
1:17:44exact details of our crypto custody
1:17:47infrastructure um because there are a
1:17:49lot of a lot of hackers out there um
1:17:52>> you don't want to have too much of your
1:17:55crypto easily accessible to people. Uh,
1:17:58in fact, the lion share of it should be
1:18:00in cold storage where you have to go and
1:18:03like get pieces of paper ideally and not
1:18:07exactly how it works, but it should just
1:18:09be like not connected to the internet
1:18:12and highly secure.
1:18:13>> So, so that way even if there was
1:18:16>> an issue with the hot wallet, it covers
1:18:18a a very small minority of of crypto
1:18:22assets. uh then you have to constantly
1:18:26make sure that you're hardening your
1:18:29infrastructure, you're watching out for
1:18:31and preventing uh possible like security
1:18:34breaches and incidents is very very
1:18:37important for uh in this environment
1:18:40because you have mythos and fable and
1:18:42the AI tools are
1:18:44>> if there is a vulnerability you can't
1:18:46rely on
1:18:49it being just hard to find or it being
1:18:52too expensive. So that before AI tools,
1:18:56it used to be that, you know, you
1:18:58wouldn't have to worry as much because
1:19:00you had to worry about these state
1:19:01sponsored actors that would go after the
1:19:04softest, largest targets.
1:19:06>> Yeah.
1:19:06>> And in reality, you know, there's much
1:19:08there's banks that hold trillions of
1:19:10assets that have poor relatively poor
1:19:13cyber security posture. So they're just,
1:19:15you know, being attacked everywhere. But
1:19:17now, you know, it's so cheap to spin up
1:19:20another job that you really have to make
1:19:22sure that there's no holes. And I think
1:19:26uh you have to do that with like
1:19:28penetration testing, internal red
1:19:30teaming, and also uh using the AI tools
1:19:34themselves to scan and attack you like
1:19:36they like they were an adversary. So I
1:19:39think um we invest a lot in this and um
1:19:43we're fortunate you know to to to be at
1:19:46the frontier of a lot of these tools and
1:19:48to actually um yeah spend a lot of
1:19:52resources and a lot of our mind share in
1:19:54in securing all these things and the I
1:19:56think the surface area is always rising
1:19:58right now we have Robin Hood chain we
1:19:59have all of our DeFi products we have of
1:20:01course the traditional business as well
1:20:03as crypto so investing in security is a
1:20:07huge priority. What are your personal
1:20:09goals outside of Robin Hood?
1:20:12>> I've really been focused on teaching my
1:20:15kids math. I I still think math is
1:20:17important. Um getting them to enjoy
1:20:21learning and be curious. Uh so I um
1:20:26whenever I get time to spend with them,
1:20:28which is never as much as I would like,
1:20:31but um I try to like talk to them about
1:20:35history, uh encourage them to do math,
1:20:38see how they're doing in school. I think
1:20:40they have certain benefits
1:20:42uh that I didn't have when I was a kid.
1:20:44I mean, they could get access to the
1:20:46best tutors. They could, you know, talk
1:20:49to anyone they want. Um, and my concern
1:20:52is always like how do you get the
1:20:54benefits of that without the downsides?
1:20:57And the downsides of growing up as my
1:20:59kid is um like stuff can be easy for you
1:21:04and maybe there's not the
1:21:06>> incentive that I had to be hungry,
1:21:08right? You know, if I if if I didn't
1:21:10like work hard, my parents told me very
1:21:12directly, we don't have the money to
1:21:13send you to college. Very likely you're
1:21:15going to have to get a scholarship,
1:21:16which means you're going to have to do
1:21:17all these things. And by the way, you
1:21:20know, we were visa holders. So our
1:21:22status in this country was very very
1:21:24uncertain. There was always the threat
1:21:26of okay, if you don't do well, maybe the
1:21:29family will have to go back to Bulgaria,
1:21:31right? Yeah. And I I think there's a
1:21:33little bit less of that, which is good
1:21:35in some ways, but but also it can be uh
1:21:38it can be hard to like manufacture
1:21:40hunger if it's not really there, right?
1:21:43But yeah, I'm very proud of them
1:21:44actually because despite this, I think
1:21:46they're um yeah, they're they're growing
1:21:49up to be great humans. Uh
1:21:52yeah, other other goals I think about my
1:21:55health. I'm getting a little older now,
1:21:56so um I want to make sure that the body
1:22:00and the mind is is working well because
1:22:02I'd like to be
1:22:03>> How do you do that? Do you do blood
1:22:05testing, CT scans?
1:22:07>> I've done the full body MRI thing. Um I
1:22:10do blood testing. I just try to work out
1:22:14uh regularly. I I've been getting into
1:22:16like sauna and cold plunge and contrast
1:22:19therapy. I also have been
1:22:23trying really hard to have a routine
1:22:25before I go to sleep cuz too easy for
1:22:28me. I get into the thing of like
1:22:32being on my phone or my iPad and just
1:22:35looking at the company Slack or reading
1:22:37docs till literally the last moment
1:22:40before I close my eyes.
1:22:42>> Yeah.
1:22:43>> Like my phone just whacked me in the
1:22:45head in bed. So what I'm trying to do
1:22:47now is
1:22:50journal a little bit for 10 to 15
1:22:52minutes and then read a physical print
1:22:55book for you know 15 to 20 minutes
1:22:58before I go to sleep so that you know
1:23:01things just get to to wind down a little
1:23:03bit.
1:23:03>> What kind of books do you read and have
1:23:06you noticed an actual benefit from
1:23:08journaling?
1:23:09>> Yeah, I think the I have noticed a
1:23:11benefit from journaling. You know, one
1:23:13thing is
1:23:15journaling for me, I have a little bit
1:23:16of a structure to it. So, I write a
1:23:19little bit about what happened in the
1:23:22day or sometimes I do like a Sunday
1:23:24journaling where I I think about the
1:23:26whole week, the the week behind and then
1:23:29the week forward. So, again, breaking my
1:23:32rule of not thinking about the past. I
1:23:33do think about the past um but just in a
1:23:37way that helps me inform what I want to
1:23:40do in the future either today or the
1:23:43following week. What I like to do is I
1:23:46think about the period in question. What
1:23:48went well? I write those things down.
1:23:50Those make me feel good. What could have
1:23:51gone better? And then I I say, "Okay, if
1:23:54I had to do some things this week,
1:23:57here's the the list." And the list can
1:23:59be quite long, right? It's like I want
1:24:02to get 10 things, but then I sort them
1:24:05based on what's the most important. Um,
1:24:08and then I look back on the last one,
1:24:10see how I did, and certain things I
1:24:13carry over. Other things I say, "Hey, I
1:24:16actually finished this. This is
1:24:17awesome." But then, um, yeah, I have I
1:24:20have a list of the week ahead and the
1:24:22day ahead. And what happens is
1:24:26when I wake up the next morning, I kind
1:24:28of look it over and then I feel really
1:24:31good
1:24:33uh starting my day. I think what can be
1:24:36a source of stress is just being
1:24:39completely input driven and you kind of
1:24:42wake up in the morning and you're like,
1:24:43"Let me look at what other people want
1:24:44from me, right? What are the fires? Are
1:24:48there any emergencies? What are people
1:24:50texting me about?" And then um yeah, the
1:24:53risk is you just don't get the important
1:24:56things done. So I think this at least
1:24:58forces me to think about what the
1:24:59important things are and make sure that
1:25:02I'm aware if they got done or if they
1:25:05didn't get done and and it helps them
1:25:07get done as well. That's interesting to
1:25:09be more output driven. It's like signal
1:25:11and noise. It's like always said in all
1:25:12of these different ways. And they say
1:25:15one of the main sources of happiness is
1:25:17feeling like you're in control of your
1:25:18own destiny. And that translated to this
1:25:21is basically like what must I do for
1:25:25myself and for my business as opposed to
1:25:27what fires do I need to respond to? It's
1:25:29like you're not you're no longer in
1:25:30control of your life if all you're ever
1:25:31doing is responding to things and
1:25:33external stimulus. Oh well, there's a
1:25:35fire over here on this side of the
1:25:36business. Let me tend to this as opposed
1:25:38to like here's where I'm at. This is
1:25:40what I'm going to do and I'm going to
1:25:41push for this.
1:25:42>> Yeah. I think a a big source of
1:25:44unhappiness is to kind of feel like
1:25:47things are out of your control even
1:25:49though they aren't. Even, you know, some
1:25:53of some of the some of my fondest
1:25:56memories looking back are when I
1:26:00went through some kind of crisis, right?
1:26:02And and I went through the crisis and I
1:26:05think back about
1:26:08what was going through my mind at that
1:26:10time. And you know, now with the benefit
1:26:13of distance, I'm like, "Oh, that was a
1:26:15really interesting time." It almost
1:26:18seems fun in retrospect because now now
1:26:20I appreciate it. But at that time, I was
1:26:23really stressed out, right? Not enjoying
1:26:26it at all, not sleeping. Um, and you
1:26:30know, I think about how much better
1:26:33would it be to actually have been
1:26:36enjoying it or or be in a state of flow
1:26:39at the time. E even though a lot of
1:26:42crises are something happens that you
1:26:44have to deal with but I think even those
1:26:47things um are under your control at the
1:26:50end of the day because whether you're
1:26:52happy or not or motivated or in a state
1:26:55of flow really depends on your mindset
1:26:58as you're processing these things. In
1:27:01terms of raising your children, do you
1:27:03feel like math is more important than
1:27:06social skills or are social skills going
1:27:09to be more important in a world where AI
1:27:11could do just about any math imaginable?
1:27:13>> Did you see that Peter Teal thing? He
1:27:15was uh he was asked about this a couple
1:27:17years ago and he said, well, you know,
1:27:19at the time math or AI was
1:27:23>> getting really good at writing, right?
1:27:25and you could just oneshot a history
1:27:27essay um with just a simple prompt. And
1:27:32so the conventional wisdom was, okay,
1:27:33the math skills were going to be very
1:27:35very important, but gosh, writing essays
1:27:37or copywriting, be worried about that.
1:27:40He said, "Oh, no. Uh, I'm much more
1:27:42worried about the math people than the
1:27:45word people." Because for the longest
1:27:48time, actually, um,
1:27:52word people were dominant in society,
1:27:55but only recently has math been, um, a
1:28:00prized skill set. And um yeah, by and
1:28:05large he basically put the reason uh for
1:28:08this basically on wokeness, right?
1:28:11Because math is egalitarian in the sense
1:28:14that you know you could actually test
1:28:17different populations for mathematical
1:28:19ability and you have outliers
1:28:23no matter what your income is. But for
1:28:26verbal ability and words and you know
1:28:29how well read you are it does skew quite
1:28:31heavily towards
1:28:33you know people that have higher net
1:28:35worth and socioeconomic status. So the
1:28:38past uh
1:28:4150 years or so, maybe even a little bit
1:28:43longer, uh has been generally the flow
1:28:47has been towards like more egalitarian,
1:28:50more progressive. Um and so the math
1:28:52people have gotten an an advantage. Um
1:28:55but yeah, may maybe that could be
1:28:57reversing.
1:28:57>> Yeah. So, we were speaking with Chris
1:28:58Camilillo yesterday who's telling us
1:29:00that he wants his kids to be just
1:29:02welltraveled, interesting people who are
1:29:04good with networking because in a world
1:29:06with AI, he thinks that in-person
1:29:08relationships and conversations are
1:29:10going to matter more than they ever
1:29:11have. And if a person is really
1:29:13wellraveled, who has interesting stories
1:29:15and knows how to relate to someone else,
1:29:17that'll be irreplaceable by any sort of
1:29:20program.
1:29:21>> I think my point of view is is a little
1:29:23bit different. I still think math is
1:29:25very very important
1:29:27because my experience is math
1:29:30generalizes. So if you're really really
1:29:33good at solving
1:29:36theoretical math problems and I don't
1:29:38mean just like multiplying together big
1:29:40numbers. I mean like abstract
1:29:44theoretical math. It it's a pure form of
1:29:46problem solving. And that pure form of
1:29:49problem solving can generalize to all
1:29:51kinds of business situations. I mean, I
1:29:53studied math. I was pretty good at it. I
1:29:56never studied business. Um, but I felt
1:30:00like being better at math trained me to
1:30:03think better and thinking better helps
1:30:06you in in business and so many other
1:30:08things. Um,
1:30:11so I I do think it's helpful and I think
1:30:14that um, you know, be being better at
1:30:18thinking and thinking clearly helps you
1:30:21as you're networking or creating
1:30:23relationships as well. The the things
1:30:26needed to be better at math help you
1:30:27become more curious. So I I I view it as
1:30:31very fundamental. Yeah. which is in part
1:30:33why I also started another company a
1:30:36couple years ago building AI for math uh
1:30:39what I call mathematical super
1:30:40intelligence and and the bet there is if
1:30:43you become if you build a system that's
1:30:45really really good at math it can
1:30:48basically be really good at any economic
1:30:51activity starting with coding which is
1:30:54the closest but probably it can write
1:30:56you a better history essay uh eventually
1:30:59as well. How has your perspective
1:31:01changed over the last nine months since
1:31:03we last filmed?
1:31:04>> Well, I've shipped social as per your
1:31:06recommendation.
1:31:08>> You're very welcome.
1:31:09>> You asked me before what products are
1:31:12people not talking about enough. I still
1:31:14think even though there is a policy
1:31:16discussion on private markets.
1:31:19Uh we have to do more to like spread the
1:31:22word that hey this asset class is now
1:31:25available to individual investors. And I
1:31:28think we've we've been trying to do that
1:31:30through various means, but it's not like
1:31:32um I don't think we're we're at the
1:31:34point where it's had its full mass
1:31:36market moment. So these are kind of
1:31:38undiscovered little gems that only
1:31:41relatively few customers know about.
1:31:43Agentic Trading, another example.
1:31:45There's a lot of policy discussion on
1:31:47it. The folks that are extremely
1:31:49sophisticated are aware of it, but it's
1:31:52still 100,000. It's not at
1:31:54>> 10 million customers. So there there's a
1:31:56lot of growing there. Yeah. And I think
1:31:59now, you know, me personally,
1:32:03I mean, probably the first time we
1:32:05spoke, Graham, was 2021, right? That was
1:32:08what, uh, 5 years ago?
1:32:09>> Yeah, I think so. Yeah,
1:32:11>> 5 years ago. Um, I think I've gone
1:32:14through from this journey of being kind
1:32:17of a newbie
1:32:20uh, young person in this industry to now
1:32:25kind of being in the middle, right?
1:32:26Still young enough to kind of understand
1:32:28what the Gen Z's are doing and saying,
1:32:32even though I really can't figure out
1:32:34Tik Tok yet. Haven't made much progress
1:32:36there. But now I'm kind of old enough to
1:32:40um
1:32:41I guess be be thought of as an industry
1:32:44person. And I think this middle area is
1:32:49kind of interesting for me, right?
1:32:51because I can kind of hang in
1:32:52Washington, have a policy discussion,
1:32:54and be taken seriously, maybe in a way
1:32:56that 25 or 30-year-old Vlad wouldn't
1:32:59have, but I can I'm still kind of um in
1:33:03touch with, you know, all all of the all
1:33:06the folks on social media, all the folks
1:33:08in the trenches, and um the ability to
1:33:11kind of bridge both um I think is is
1:33:15unique given where I am in life. and and
1:33:18uh I'm just I'm just trying to enjoy
1:33:20that and take advantage of it.
1:33:21>> Yeah, I do have to say you're doing an
1:33:23incredible job. And I think the last
1:33:25time that Jack and I were here, we both
1:33:27left thinking that oh my gosh, your
1:33:29passion like the fact that you would
1:33:31come on a podcast and talk with us
1:33:33openly for two hours and nothing was off
1:33:36limits and you just allowed like that I
1:33:39think speaks volumes and after that I'm
1:33:41like oh man I am bullish on Robin Hood.
1:33:44I really, but it's I think it's because
1:33:47of you [clears throat] specifically,
1:33:49>> not necessarily Robin Hood as a company,
1:33:51but because of your passion and your
1:33:53enthusiasm and how into it you are.
1:33:56>> So, I think that goes like a long long
1:33:58way. I think the the exciting thing
1:34:01about Robin Hood is I I become more uh
1:34:04bullish and excited um as the years pass
1:34:09because the mission itself becomes much
1:34:13more expansive and much more interesting
1:34:15and now we're talking about things that
1:34:17are on a civilizational scale like how
1:34:19can we increase the ability of billions
1:34:21of people to own stocks, own private
1:34:25companies, own real world assets. Um,
1:34:29and I think that's a really, really hard
1:34:30problem. And to actually move the needle
1:34:32on that, you need to do lots of other
1:34:34little things, right, that are very hard
1:34:36to do. And you have to engage and
1:34:39entertain people because inherently
1:34:41these are kind of boring things. And
1:34:43you're never going to get everyone
1:34:45unless you make it make it a little bit
1:34:47more engaging as well.
1:34:49>> If you were consulting our podcast, our
1:34:52business, what do you think we could be
1:34:55doing better? So, a little reverse
1:34:57interview.
1:34:58>> Um, let's see. How many viewers are you
1:35:02guys at now?
1:35:03>> Total subscribers, uh, 1.63 million on
1:35:07YouTube, but it's way more
1:35:08>> across all platforms, millions.
1:35:10>> How many viewers per episode? Probably
1:35:13on average. And there is some volatility
1:35:16there, but like on average maybe 300 to
1:35:18400,000 people listen to every episode.
1:35:22>> That's the long form. And that's the
1:35:23long form, but then on top of that, we
1:35:25have distribution. So, we have like
1:35:26clips and we have shorts and we're on
1:35:28every social media platform. Last year,
1:35:30we did 1.2 uh 1.2 billion views um
1:35:33across all platforms.
1:35:34>> Okay. And and what is your north star?
1:35:37Like if you wanted to be remembered for
1:35:39one thing, one contribution for the
1:35:41podcast, what what would that be?
1:35:43>> That's really the guest selection. We
1:35:44just want to have really inspiring
1:35:47guests who could teach our audience
1:35:48something and show them a different
1:35:49perspective that maybe they didn't
1:35:51consider before. And so for me, it's
1:35:53just getting the best guest possible who
1:35:55we just want to have a conversation
1:35:56with.
1:35:57>> Got it. But is it like
1:36:00we want to get to a 100 million
1:36:02subscribers, does that matter? Getting
1:36:04to a billion subscriber, getting a
1:36:06billion views per podcast. Is that is
1:36:08that like an anti- goal or
1:36:10>> No, I think like at this point in terms
1:36:12of growth like I think growth is sort of
1:36:15something that will ensue to our other
1:36:17goal which is like talk to interesting
1:36:19people you know be as objective as
1:36:22possible and fair and be entertaining
1:36:24and fun and funny but also you know
1:36:27educational.
1:36:28>> If you had to think and you don't have
1:36:29to say me obviously I know that it's me
1:36:31but besides me who what was the best
1:36:33episode that you
1:36:35>> you have had? It's hard to say best
1:36:37because we've been doing this six years,
1:36:38so we're picking between hundreds of
1:36:39people. But like most memorable eps
1:36:42would be Dr. K, who's like a
1:36:43psychiatrist, oddly enough, who's been
1:36:45trained in eastern and western medicine.
1:36:48>> Um, and that was fascinating. Also,
1:36:50another one we love talking to Ben Ma,
1:36:52like the commercial real estate, Kevin,
1:36:55Chris Camilillo, Strad man, who's like a
1:36:57car, like we just have so many everybody
1:37:00that virtually every person we talk to,
1:37:01we're like super super super excited.
1:37:03>> Like to have them back on. Papa John,
1:37:05you know, that was absurd to be able to
1:37:07talk to him at his house.
1:37:08>> And string theory. He's really into
1:37:10string theory. Papa John likes string
1:37:12theory.
1:37:12>> Yeah. He brought it up unprompted.
1:37:14>> Wow.
1:37:15>> Yeah. We had no idea what to do, but it
1:37:16was it was fun.
1:37:18>> Yeah. String theory is uh
1:37:20>> Please don't. [laughter]
1:37:22>> Where we're getting at is that we feel
1:37:24like we have so much potential and we
1:37:27have such a big impactful platform that
1:37:30we just don't know what's next. and
1:37:32we're good at this,
1:37:33>> but we feel like there's something more.
1:37:35There's something extra that we could be
1:37:36doing, and we don't know what on earth
1:37:38it is.
1:37:38>> Also, to be frank, I think we're
1:37:40severely undermonetized. Like,
1:37:42realistically, to be able to get 1.2
1:37:44billion views and
1:37:45>> in the finance space,
1:37:46>> in the finance space, like I I
1:37:49>> I don't think that we're like I just
1:37:51want to focus on this. I don't really
1:37:52want to focus on like a business or
1:37:54something to like redirect viewership to
1:37:57or more sales. I want to focus just on
1:37:59content. But also in I think that a lot
1:38:02of other people if given the uh the
1:38:05maximal amount of marketing that we're
1:38:07able to like provide basically for free
1:38:10>> um they would be able to turn a greater
1:38:12profit.
1:38:13>> Yeah, I think that makes sense. Um,
1:38:16yeah, I guess. And and if you think
1:38:18about these shows, the the the best
1:38:21where you felt that you've done the best
1:38:23work.
1:38:24>> Is it do you judge it based on views or
1:38:28comments or how the audience has
1:38:30resonated with it or is it more like,
1:38:32hey, that was a really good conversation
1:38:34for me. I loved being a part of that. I
1:38:36felt
1:38:36>> it's got to be both. Yeah, it's got to
1:38:38be both. Because I look at the metrics
1:38:40and I'm very analytical about the data
1:38:42and I say, "Ah, this underperformed.
1:38:44why? And then I try to improve it
1:38:45because if it underperforms, I think
1:38:47that means the audience didn't watch
1:38:49enough of it and they clicked out. Why
1:38:52did they click out? Why did they not
1:38:53like that? But for me personally, I also
1:38:55just enjoy the conversations.
1:38:56>> Yeah. I mean, I think that I can tell
1:38:58it's a labor of love for you guys that
1:39:01you really care about it. You're trying
1:39:02to get better. It's really engaging. Um
1:39:06Yeah. And I think that uh it it comes
1:39:09across. I mean, I I enjoy watching it.
1:39:12Um, I think that if I had to give one
1:39:18uh area for improvement,
1:39:20I think that the the sort of like north
1:39:24star of having really interesting guests
1:39:27that you guys want to learn from and you
1:39:30think the audience could learn from is
1:39:32is probably one that you'd hear from a
1:39:34lot of podcasts. like basically lots of
1:39:36podcasts just want to have fun guests
1:39:38and uh have it be great educational
1:39:41content. But um I guess the the answer
1:39:46to the question of
1:39:49you know why would I watch you know
1:39:52Graham and Jack versus those others
1:39:55could use more differentiation right um
1:39:59like what is the one thing that they'll
1:40:02get here that they won't get anywhere
1:40:04I'll give you an example I listen to
1:40:05acquired podcast and I just don't think
1:40:09anyone else does exactly what they do
1:40:12you So if if I if if I get uh another
1:40:15episode of that, I know exactly what it
1:40:18is. It's like a 4hour thing where those
1:40:22guys are having fun and chatting, but
1:40:23it's like a 4-hour deep dive on one
1:40:25specific company. I kind of know the
1:40:27formula. Um
1:40:29>> and and I think it's differentiated in a
1:40:32sense. Um, yeah. And in your your guys,
1:40:36it's a little bit of finance, a little
1:40:37bit of pop culture, but I think a a
1:40:40sharper differentiation might might be
1:40:42something I would consider.
1:40:44>> We always try to tie everything into
1:40:46finance a little bit with some guests.
1:40:48Obviously, it's sort of impossible and
1:40:49we're just excited to talk to them. But
1:40:52we always do generally dial it back into
1:40:56some form of like where are you
1:40:58investing? Yes. you know, do you own
1:41:00equities or you
1:41:01>> or the philosophies on business? Like
1:41:02everyone we've had on is successful in
1:41:04their own right in their thing and what
1:41:06could we take away from that.
1:41:07>> Yeah.
1:41:08>> But it is still, you know, relatively
1:41:10vague. Yes. Like I couldn't tell you a
1:41:12specific claim like, oh well, we want to
1:41:13get as many people into like retail
1:41:15investing as possible.
1:41:16>> I think that the the finance aspect is a
1:41:19interesting direction. And I remember
1:41:20the the clips that I've seen of your
1:41:23guys's that really resonate are where
1:41:26you talk finances with a successful
1:41:28person that [clears throat]
1:41:30actually you wouldn't normally associate
1:41:32with with finance like that. Uh who who
1:41:35was it?
1:41:36>> Kiicular.
1:41:37>> That was our goal years ago was like we
1:41:40want to break into the mainstream and
1:41:41make like talking about finance a more
1:41:44available ubiquitous thing. Like we
1:41:46wanted to have Leonard Leonard on the
1:41:48like this was a couple years ago like
1:41:50bring on people that are celebrities,
1:41:52musicians, yada yada yada. Hey, how much
1:41:53do you make selling out Madison Square
1:41:54Garden?
1:41:55>> Like who actually gets paid out from
1:41:57this? Like what are you doing with this
1:41:58money? Like what are your intentions
1:42:00with it? Like that's what we wanted. But
1:42:01it's also very difficult because like we
1:42:03we try that like we'll bring you on the
1:42:05show and then we'll heavily debate
1:42:06beforehand, hey, should we lead in with
1:42:08a question or a phrase saying something
1:42:10like, oh, Robin Hood moved 3% today,
1:42:12meaning your personal wealth grew by
1:42:14this amount. Like that that is directing
1:42:17our audience towards that that north
1:42:19star. But at the same time, it could put
1:42:21you on your heels a little bit. It could
1:42:23make it seem like we're out to get you
1:42:24or like we're just another one of those
1:42:26podcasts that want to pocket cheap.
1:42:27>> Yeah. No. Yeah. I think you guys do it
1:42:30um uh yeah in kind of a a nice way. Um
1:42:36yeah, I never felt like it was um like
1:42:39uh out to get me or or aggressive. I
1:42:42think that there is a delicate balance,
1:42:43right? if you want to get into
1:42:46deep questions that are just
1:42:50you not what you would hear at at other
1:42:52podcasts, but you know, a a lot of
1:42:54executives are probably
1:42:57trained to some degree to not answer
1:42:59deep questions. Um, and sometimes we
1:43:01also forget, right? We're also like,
1:43:03well,
1:43:04>> shoot, I have to say a number. If I say
1:43:06the wrong number, you know, we'd have to
1:43:08edit that out or issue a correction. So
1:43:11there can be an incentive to not really
1:43:13remember numbers, right?
1:43:14>> Yeah.
1:43:14>> Um but yeah. Yeah. And and I think um
1:43:17what I've seen other people do that's
1:43:19kind of interesting is real time just
1:43:22like start browsing the web or show
1:43:24something or you know, hey, I found this
1:43:26funny tweet, pop that up um almost as
1:43:30like a visual source. And I think I
1:43:32think that can make it a little bit more
1:43:34dynamic, interactive, entertaining. So,
1:43:37here's another thing, and this is by no
1:43:38means a pitch, but I think that so many
1:43:41companies could benefit so much from
1:43:46having an unlimited marketing funnel
1:43:48behind them of like organic marketing,
1:43:51like not paid, not just like a
1:43:53sponsorship, not running an ad because
1:43:55that appears as an ad. it appears as a
1:43:57sponsor. But like if the full power of
1:44:00the iced coffee hour was put behind some
1:44:04sort of fintech company or like some
1:44:07sort of you know huge like finance
1:44:10newsletter or business or platform or
1:44:13something like that where consistently
1:44:14you have you know 1 billion views every
1:44:17year that's also growing and you have
1:44:18the the trust and the faith of the brand
1:44:20behind a company. it would be worth 20
1:44:23times what we're making on an annual
1:44:24basis. Like, and it's not even close.
1:44:26You don't see companies like actually
1:44:29try to create legitimate podcasts. Like,
1:44:31for example, we talked to John Morgan
1:44:33about it and he spent $2 billion on
1:44:35advertising this year
1:44:36>> and we were like, "Yeah, but what about
1:44:38like like organic social media reach
1:44:40where there's more trust behind it?"
1:44:42>> Like, why are companies not doing that?
1:44:44The overhead is it's it's cheap relative
1:44:46to everything else. And it's also an
1:44:48added added Yeah, it's an issue. It's an
1:44:50added element of like like trust and
1:44:54authenticity.
1:44:55>> Yeah, I think that's right. And you
1:44:56know, we've we've dipped our toes in uh
1:44:59media as a company for a while. We
1:45:02acquired Market Snacks if you guys
1:45:04remember. That was something like 8
1:45:06years ago became Robin Hood Snacks and
1:45:08there was a podcast. Robin Hood Snacks
1:45:10was a podcast with uh Nick and Jack and
1:45:14they later went off to with our support
1:45:16launch another thing TBOY right so they
1:45:20have a podcast now um I don't think it's
1:45:22as big as the iced coffee hour but uh
1:45:25they've been they've been working on it
1:45:27we had Sherwood Media as well I think
1:45:29that's evolved over time and I think
1:45:32that we uh we see huge potential in
1:45:36connecting our customers with really
1:45:40good content. Um, and I I don't think
1:45:44too many people have nailed it. I think
1:45:46Bloomberg has done a a pretty good job
1:45:48of like combining financial services and
1:45:51data with with content, media, and
1:45:53distribution, but they've kind of been
1:45:55unique. And, you know, our our thought
1:45:58is always how much of it is curated
1:46:00versus providing a platform for the best
1:46:02content from all over the world to to
1:46:04live on Robin Hood. And and I think I
1:46:07see more potential in the latter because
1:46:10there's just it's probably unrealistic
1:46:13for
1:46:15the best content to be created first
1:46:17party. So instead, what we should figure
1:46:19out is how to just empower folks such as
1:46:23yourselves who are basically
1:46:25entrepreneurs, probably don't want to
1:46:27work for a big company, but want to
1:46:29create great content and monetize it.
1:46:31How can we actually be a conduit for
1:46:34that great content? no matter where it's
1:46:36made to find its way to Robin Hood users
1:46:39as cheaply as possible. Um, I think
1:46:42that's that's that's going to be the
1:46:44winning long-term strategy because we
1:46:48want customers to get the best content.
1:46:50We're unlikely to be able to employ
1:46:52everyone that can make it. And so, uh,
1:46:55and then we also probably to get really
1:46:58good external content don't want them to
1:47:00feel like we're prioritizing the
1:47:02editorial stuff. It sounds very similar
1:47:05to like Elon Musk's approach of like I'm
1:47:07not going to buy ads from anybody. I'm
1:47:09just going to make the product so loud
1:47:11that you can't ignore it effectively
1:47:12like that. Like people will inevitably
1:47:15talk about any sort of Tesla launch
1:47:17>> because it's just such like a
1:47:18groundbreaking thing.
1:47:20>> Yeah, I think that it's simpler in many
1:47:23ways because you get to be a neutral
1:47:25platform. Uh you can just work on
1:47:29building the best tools possible. Um and
1:47:33then you know I think uh it's simple to
1:47:36understand for creators on the platform
1:47:39as well. Whenever we're building network
1:47:41products which we have at least two new
1:47:44ones since the last time we spoke Robin
1:47:47Hood chain and Robin Hood social we end
1:47:50up you know we're thinking about how to
1:47:51make it
1:47:52>> as as really attractive as possible for
1:47:56a creator or a developer to to be on the
1:47:59platform. And it's really just giving
1:48:01them the best tools, making them
1:48:03understand that the goal is for it to be
1:48:05neutral and for it to be a meritocracy
1:48:08and there's no like hidden agenda or
1:48:10hidden favoritism that can tip the
1:48:13scales one way or another and get you
1:48:16demonetized uh without you understanding
1:48:18why. So it's still super early. I mean
1:48:21both of these things are like month one.
1:48:23But um yeah, we are spending more time
1:48:26thinking through
1:48:27>> these problems. Rapid fire questions.
1:48:30What do you have to say about the
1:48:32biggest investing myth?
1:48:33>> I think what people don't understand is
1:48:37compound interest. And a lot of people
1:48:39say don't start investing until you have
1:48:42money saved up and you you know what
1:48:44you're doing. And actually, I think it's
1:48:46the opposite. The earlier you start, the
1:48:48better off you'll be. So, with Trump
1:48:51accounts, you could start at age zero.
1:48:52So, we've we've taken it to uh its
1:48:55logical conclusion, which is I think the
1:48:57the right place. Investing at age zero.
1:49:00Yeah.
1:49:00>> Are you the largest depositor on Robin
1:49:02Hood app?
1:49:03>> No.
1:49:04>> Who outside of yourself is the best
1:49:06product builder?
1:49:08>> I think Spotify has done a really really
1:49:10nice job. Yeah, I I uh I I think Spotify
1:49:13is a great product. Uh I'm sure you guys
1:49:16would agree, but it's just
1:49:18>> they're great.
1:49:18>> I love using it. Yeah. What does Robin
1:49:20Hood look like in 10 years if everything
1:49:22goes perfectly?
1:49:23>> I think that um Robin Hood should be
1:49:27helping you with every
1:49:30every investment, everything that you
1:49:32own, whether it be digital through our
1:49:34smartphone or physical. Maybe you'll be
1:49:36using our Robin Hood credit card at a
1:49:39Robin Hood grocery store.
1:49:41>> Driving a Robin Hood car.
1:49:42>> Driving a Robin Hood car. Maybe maybe
1:49:44you'll be checking time on your Robin
1:49:46Hood watch and uh
1:49:47>> a Robin Hood plane. Yes. And you'll get
1:49:50free burgers at our fast food
1:49:52restaurants.
1:49:53>> Robin Hood Wellness Centers, free cold
1:49:55plunge. And so
1:49:56>> I like that. What will surprise
1:49:58everybody by 2035?
1:50:00>> You know, one of the things that uh I'm
1:50:03really pushing is private markets. And I
1:50:06think the degree to which we can
1:50:09democratize that and make that
1:50:11accessible will be uh will be surprising
1:50:14to people. I mean, two hot takes. I
1:50:18think there will be more software
1:50:19engineers and more lawyers in 2035 than
1:50:22today.
1:50:23>> Okay. Well, that's that's just dangling
1:50:25the carrot, huh? [laughter] That's just
1:50:28>> All right. Well, you guys heard it here.
1:50:30We'll explore more of that next episode.
1:50:32Thank you so much for watching this
1:50:34episode. Thank you to Vlad for coming on
1:50:35the podcast. It's always a pleasure to
1:50:37talk to you.
1:50:38>> Thank you guys.
1:50:38>> Really appreciate it. Until next time.
1:50:40>> Till next time.
1:50:40>> There's nothing to stop the [music]
1:50:41music like the word billionaire.
1:50:43>> Do you have a billion in the bank?
1:50:45>> I'm a billionaire.
1:50:47A real one. What was your business? I
1:50:49own one of the largest law firms in
1:50:51North America. I hunt money. I fish for
1:50:54money.
1:50:55>> Income and wealth disparity in the US
1:50:58are at all-time high levels.
1:51:00>> Nobody wants to say, "Look, here's the
1:51:02real reason I'm a lazy slug."
1:51:06>> What do most people get wrong [music]
1:51:07about your business?
1:51:08>> I am the most authentic person you're
1:51:10ever going to meet. But I'm very very
1:51:13street smart and my social [music] IQ is
1:51:15off the charts.
1:51:17>> So how did you become a liquid net worth
1:51:19billionaire?
1:51:20>> If [music] work is work, you're I love
1:51:23to work cuz I don't lose.
1:51:26They lose. And when somebody with me, I
1:51:29back
1:51:32[music]

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Free YouTube transcript tool

YouTube2Text is a free YouTube transcript generator — no signup, no daily limit. Paste any YouTube link and get the full transcript instantly, with timestamps, click-to-jump, translation to 100+ languages, AI prompts for ChatGPT, Claude, and Gemini, and exports to TXT, SRT, VTT, or Markdown.