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On Communism, Marxism, & the Black Panther Party (Pt. 1) | David Horowitz | POLITICS | Rubin Report — Transcript

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0:00[Music]
0:05joining me today is the author of
0:06several books and the founder and
0:08current president of the David harowitz
0:10Freedom Center David harwitz welcome to
0:13the rubben report thank you Dave what
0:14are the chances that you ended up being
0:16the president of a place called The
0:17David Harts Freedom Center that is that
0:19is incredible I actually fought that
0:21name but but my board said uh I had I
0:25had named it the center for the study of
0:27popular
0:28culture as a as a leftist I thought it's
0:31a very hard to attack a a center for
0:34studying anything let alone just but
0:38conservatives see the word culture and
0:40they think left so that and it was just
0:42confusing so they may me they said got
0:45to put your name on it so so here we are
0:48all right so I don't know in the years
0:50that I've been doing this show that I've
0:51read anyone's bio and found it more
0:54interesting than your bio it was at
0:56least not someone that was born in the
0:57United States I thought it was just
0:59there's so much richness there your
1:01Evolution politically it has a lot to do
1:03with some of the things that you write
1:04about about going from the left to the
1:06right and all that um so I want to start
1:08with your history first your parents
1:11were Communists card carrying card
1:13carrying not Communists like the
1:15Communist that kids that think it's cool
1:17today talking old school these are these
1:20are people who are part of a a vast
1:23International
1:24conspiracy orchestrated by Moscow um my
1:28parents my my I don't think my mother
1:31ever got a traffic ticket they they were
1:33very middle class not break the
1:35law um but they did hide an East German
1:40communist in the basement who the
1:42government wanted to
1:43deport how did he get to your basement I
1:46have no idea I was very
1:48young did you know there was someone
1:50down there I mean did you know something
1:52was going on deer was his name I forgot
1:54the last name his brother was the mayor
1:55of East
1:57Berlin okay um but um yeah they were
2:02very
2:04conspiratorial um they never referred to
2:07themselves as Communists only as
2:10progressives even then because it wasn't
2:13a dirty because oh it was very dirty it
2:15was a dirty word it a very healthy
2:17period but um because this anti-American
2:21left very
2:22subversive ready to work with the our
2:26enemies so you know a horrible tot
2:30itarian dictatorship were effectively
2:34quarantined we lived in a kind of ghetto
2:36where you couldn't say what you what you
2:39believed and that for a Democrat or with
2:42a small D for a liberal minded person
2:46that doesn't seem right but it was
2:47actually
2:48healthy given the Cold War at the time
2:53so so so what did it mean at that you
2:55have a stigma on people who hate this
2:58country and we've lost that completely
3:01so so we'll get to that part cuz that
3:03really sort of that gets to the
3:05evolution part of where you're at now so
3:07we were stigmatized and uh but what did
3:09they believe like what did that actually
3:10mean if you said you were a communist in
3:13you know we're talking the 1940s now I
3:16nothing my mother was a registered
3:18Democrat um I don't think anything
3:20different from certainly not the
3:22Democratic party of today although then
3:25I mean when Roosevelt was President they
3:27were all happy Democrats when
3:31um declared that uh America would defend
3:34free people's fighting for their freedom
3:37against the Soviet Union they all
3:39defected then formed the Progressive
3:41Party which was run by the Communist
3:43Party yeah and then around 1956 if I'm
3:46not mistaken all the information comes
3:49out about Stalin and then that sort of
3:51right that was my way I was 17 at the
3:54time and that was my kind of Awakening
3:56that everything that the William Buckley
3:59that we hated the right that the right
4:02said the Right Said Stalin had killed 7
4:05million people he actually killed about
4:0640 million um and we said was this was
4:10all anti-soviet lies the Soviet Union
4:13was a a paradise of the future everybody
4:17equal everybody working everybody happy
4:20all lies but we my community believed
4:24them and then Kev came along with this
4:27gave a secret speech that the is Israeli
4:30mosad smuggled
4:31out and it just it blew up my community
4:35that there were divorces in our that we
4:39knew of uh over people dividing over the
4:41cruise Trevy Port people felt betrayed
4:44they had lived a lie and other people
4:47felt you know you continue you go on and
4:50they defended it yeah and that that made
4:53marriages
4:55untenable right you think it's tough now
4:58for marriages when people are I love
5:00Trump I hate Trump but but that's that's
5:02that's Earth shaking stuff your whole
5:04narrative yes so I came into the when I
5:08went to college I mean
5:10my mission self
5:15self-developed um was to rescue the left
5:19from
5:21stalinism um I still believed in this
5:24future where every you know Common uh
5:27government ownership of the means of
5:29produ ction and equality and everything
5:33um and so I I was a fervent new leftist
5:37I was one of the actually one of the
5:39creators of the new left I was at
5:42Berkeley um we published a magazine
5:44called roen branch
5:46and but by the end of that decade it was
5:49clear the left was a totalitarian force
5:52it couldn't it it was
5:55supporting you know whatever was The
5:58Mists they were ma as ma killed more
6:01people in Stalin um and uh so you saw
6:06that change from what you thought was
6:08something decent you saw that basically
6:10anything related to authoritarianism
6:12would be sort of pieced into this my my
6:15most I had two serious deviations I had
6:18a nuclear family and everybody else was
6:21living in communes or whatever
6:24um but the more serious one was that I
6:27read books so I
6:31I I remember when Billy AES uh was
6:33elected vice president when the weather
6:35people took over SDS this is a a a
6:39college senior he boasted that he hadn't
6:42read a book in a year I was horrified as
6:44a leftist by that statement um but what
6:48was so his argument was what I'm not
6:49being programmed by these people no but
6:51they no she was an irresponsible twit I
6:54mean is you know came from wealth very
6:58you know privileged
7:00uh I have I have nothing good to say
7:02about Billy AES but by saying I I
7:04haven't read a book in year who is he
7:05how is he trying to impress Somebody by
7:06that he trying to imp well because the
7:08books are written by the ruling class or
7:12what got what did Mark say the ruling
7:14ideas or the uh ideas of the ruling
7:17class completely false how would you
7:19explain our universities today Marx is
7:22full of crap I mean that's the first
7:23thing you have to yeah well we'll get to
7:25our universities don't worry about that
7:26but wait a minute the first one you
7:27mentioned there was you came from a
7:29nuclear family and that was then a
7:30problem I had a nuclear family yeah oh
7:33you had your own nuclear family at that
7:35time okay but you also came from a
7:36nuclear by the end of the decade I had
7:38four children yeah yeah so why was that
7:39a problem for them because they want uh
7:42they didn't I wasn't expelled from the
7:44left I I I
7:46was um well what happened to me was that
7:51I I I edited ramp Parts which was the
7:54leading it was the biggest magazine of
7:56the left and a Hollywood produc producer
8:00producer of easyy
8:02Rider um was a big uh funer and sponsor
8:07of the Black Panther Party and he he
8:10introduced me to huie Newton because he
8:13wanted me to take Eldridge Cleaver had
8:15been on our Mast head uh and Eldridge
8:18there was a war it was basically a black
8:21panther party is a a street gang and uh
8:25this was a contest for leadership um
8:30so he
8:32um he introduced me and I I got involved
8:35raising money for the Panthers I raised
8:38for a
8:39school um I was very impressed they had
8:42a lot of children and the panther party
8:44was a mix there were you know genuinely
8:47good people and there were
8:49gangsters um and the good people
8:52impressed me and uh one of them was
8:54running the
8:55school a school and they were jammed
9:00into a uh Brown Shingle House in uh in
9:05Oakland I mean they they had double
9:07decker beds from one wall to the other
9:09wow for the kids so
9:11I um I thought this Hollywood producer
9:15would give me the money but it it didn't
9:17turn out that way but I
9:19raised I think it was
9:21$125,000 which a lot of money of those
9:23days and bought a
9:25church a Baptist Church in East Oakland
9:28that had been overtaken
9:30by the uh inner city was a white Baptist
9:33Church and I and I I signed a the check
9:37um I created the Oakland Community
9:39Learning Center of 501c3 to house the
9:43school I'll never forget the uh the
9:45minister said to me as I handed him the
9:48check I hope you're not going to turn
9:50this over to the Black Panthers for the
9:53Nation of
9:55Islam did he know who that you were
9:57working with them at all at the time
9:58with the black P he had no idea so he
10:00was literally joking to you like most of
10:03the left today I had no idea who they
10:05were the Panthers mhm um but anyway I've
10:10told this story in a radical son my
10:12autobiography anyway in in uh 1974 I I
10:17recruited the bookkeeper my bookkeeper
10:20at ramparts to do the books for the
10:21school because I believed our own
10:23propaganda that the government was
10:25racist and that they would shut down the
10:28Panthers if they didn't keep the books
10:31which was ridiculous I mean look at
10:33Jesse Jackson look at Al Sharpton I mean
10:36he's a huge taxi Vader yeah and he's
10:40walking the streets cuz he's Progressive
10:42and black he's
10:44protected um and in December 1974 uh
10:49Betty disappeared and by the time the
10:51police fished her body out of San
10:52Francisco Bay I knew the Panthers had
10:55killed her I had been interviewed by the
10:57police they explained to me lots of
10:59things it's very difficult to hire to
11:02dispose of a body unless you have an
11:05organization and then it's not so hard
11:07you have safe houses and this and that
11:10um and so when that happened um I was
11:14personally devastated I mean I was in
11:16the same place my parents were being
11:19embarrassed by the cruise d report
11:21something I swore that would never
11:23happen to me
11:25um and I I I'm curious were your parents
11:28around at the yeah my mother was very
11:30they were worried for my safety as they
11:33should be I was threatened by Elaine
11:35Brown who was the head of the Panthers
11:37is alive today um toasted by the Atlanta
11:41Journal Constitution and
11:44uh funded by actually conservatives uh
11:48often not always to speak on college
11:52campuses um she was the head of the
11:54party uh wait why would conservatives
11:57fund her now has she evolved I forget
11:59what's the name of this a big Orange
12:01County Foundation they gave her $10,000
12:03to speak at uh I can't remember it was
12:06UC Santa Barbara huh I went the students
12:10there informed me now because uh uh
12:14conservatives in this country are are
12:16well-meaning
12:17uh liberal minded people generally
12:20especially the ones with money um give
12:24you the benefit of the doubt I mean
12:26here's a black person claiming that
12:28America is an oppressor sub country oh
12:30sure here has some
12:33money
12:35anyway
12:37uh I was personally devastated I was
12:40clinically I would say clinically
12:42depressed for seven or eight years I I
12:45wake up in tears every morning I felt
12:48responsible for having recruited Betty
12:51uh her name was Betty Vamp the woman who
12:53was murdered she was the mother of three
12:56children
12:58um ideology is so pernicious that on the
13:02way to the to Betty's funeral her
13:04daughter who worked for me and was I
13:07don't know if she was 19 or 20 at the
13:09time I tried to warn her I mean I was
13:11afraid for my children but I said I
13:14think the Panthers killed your
13:16mother and her response was no they're
13:18good
13:20people so so I set out then to
13:25warn when I had sort of assimilated all
13:30this uh I I my mission was to warn other
13:34people and that's how I know that Barack
13:37Obama is a communist all right so wait
13:39let's let's pause before we jump to to
13:41modern day because everything that you
13:43just described there was why I thought
13:45your bio is so interesting because you
13:46grow up with Communists you know I
13:49didn't know about the guy I I didn't
13:50know about the guy in the basement but
13:51you I mean you you are firmly on the
13:53left your whole first 40 some ideas was
13:56a mar I wrote a book called Empire and
13:58re ution which the left used right so
14:01leftist communist Marxist I mean so yeah
14:05Paul bman for example
14:08um said of the of my book that it was
14:11like a I don't know what he said a
14:13handbook a Bible for the for the left
14:17before he called me a
14:19renegade for leaving the left right
14:22right so that's so you're you're a hero
14:25but the second you now change now of
14:27course if you deviate from the Party
14:29Line This is what political people don't
14:32realize political correctness is a term
14:34that MSY dong the greatest mass murderer
14:36in human history invented to shut people
14:39up it's the party line if you deviate
14:42from the party line they throw you into
14:43the cold yeah all right so now we're
14:46let's Flash Forward unless there's
14:48something maor or shoot you right so
14:51they first they silence you then they
14:53shoot you you know uh so unless I'm
14:55missing something I think we can Flash
14:57Forward now to around 85 which is really
14:59really when you then that's right um
15:01what happened was when this happened I
15:04was writing I I had um left ramp Parts
15:10with Peter ker who was my
15:13buddy uh and it was Peter's idea that to
15:17write a a a dynastic
15:20biography uh the The goldsworthy Saga
15:24was on PBS at the time or so it was a
15:27generational Saga
15:29so I was in the midst of writing a book
15:31on the Rockefellers which became a
15:34bestseller and then we were asked to do
15:36a book on the
15:38Kennedy which came out
15:40in
15:421985 and uh in 198 and and uh when it
15:47came out it was a number one New York
15:49Times
15:50bestseller and uh the Washington Post
15:54the editor of the Washington Post Sunday
15:56magazine called
15:57me to picked my brain about young Joe
16:01Kennedy was a congressman and he said
16:04what have you guys been doing oh you
16:06won't believe this but Peter and I just
16:08voted for Ronald Reagan and neither
16:10Peter and I had talked before casting
16:13that vote wow oh that's a good story you
16:15want to write it so our story was better
16:18Ron than red but he renamed it lefties
16:20for Reagan right so then and that's when
16:23the knives came out and Peter said to me
16:25at the time I just show you how deeply
16:29current rot the fake news
16:32is um we were Front Page New York
16:36Times both books both the Rockefellers
16:39and Sunday times and the New York Times
16:42sets the standard for all the media they
16:45even reprint the reviews but
16:49um and when our article came out on we
16:53voted for Reagan Peter said to me our
16:57literary careers are over wow I said you
17:00must be joking I me so you really had no
17:03idea I had no idea even though you knew
17:06some of the tactics but it was exactly
17:08right that was the end I don't my last
17:1120 books The New York Times They noticed
17:15one and called me a relic for using the
17:16word
17:18communist it was just a squib right so
17:21even though you knew all the tactics
17:23that could be coming down your way and
17:25the way you'd be treated I've never been
17:26a realist about that that's so you so
17:29that's it you just weren't a realist in
17:30your own even though you saw you had
17:32such a history of seeing what would
17:34happen yeah not that parents than
17:35communism black panther I can never
17:37believe that people um can be you know
17:40so ideological and so duped and I should
17:43know yeah I think I'm suffering from a
17:44little of this right now when I'm meet
17:46the rubber's meeting the road with me at
17:47the moment of of this kind but but what
17:50was it about was it something about
17:51Reagan or was it really about Mandel
17:54it's Reagan yeah was uh this happened
17:57earlier uh my bummed into into the
18:00parking L of the Berkeley Co-op uh which
18:03is a supermarket that was we everybody
18:06liked because it was a
18:08Cooperative um when uh Rolling Stone
18:12actually published a story that Peter
18:13and I did on the weather the Weather
18:16Underground telling the truth about it
18:19um and
18:21uh this woman I knew met me in the
18:24parking lot and she said David you know
18:25people really hate you
18:27now
18:30truth about these crazy terrorists is
18:33what they were who got people
18:36killed and they hate you now they hate
18:38you they hate me for for saying the
18:41truth about it yeah but but what was it
18:43about Reagan also that then they hated
18:45Reagan the way they hate trump it was
18:48the same kind of
18:50hatred they pick out they just it's it's
18:54because he's he's not one of
18:57us it's it's it's very visceral yeah is
19:00that what it more than anything ironic
19:02that for the media he's not one of them
19:04you know he was an act and you
19:06know I don't
19:08know the the
19:10Trump phenomenon and problem is a little
19:13different but it's it's not all that
19:15different I mean Reagan was an actor
19:17that they looked down on that
19:20um you know um vanon Mees wrote a
19:24pamphlet called the uh an essay which is
19:27a pamphlet called the anti-c capitalist
19:31mentality why do academics um hate
19:36capitalism why are they so left and the
19:40answer is because they feel Superior to
19:42businessmen and here's Trump the
19:45businessmen uh businessmen are
19:48yahoos they have no respect for what it
19:51takes to build a billion dollar Empire
19:53and for them it's all theft or something
19:56underhanded it's it's theft or crony
19:59capitalism or something Reagan was like
20:01that he was an actor how dare he be pres
20:04we're so much smarter than he is we
20:06should be running the country so
20:08intellectuals I think it was about
20:10intellectuals generally they don't they
20:12they feel that they're smarter than
20:14everybody else right because they
20:16haven't actually created for the most
20:18part so they have to sort of elevate
20:20they want the P they think the power
20:21should go to them and I learned very
20:24early when I was still a leftist when
20:26Jack Kennedy was assassinated and lynon
20:29Johnson became president I was living in
20:31England and of course Europeans looked
20:32down on Americans from the beginning of
20:34the Republic but
20:39um LBJ he had the LBJ cufflinks and the
20:43LBJ children and the LBJ dogs and the
20:47LBJ you know so they they just thought
20:51he was this is a yahoo this is a you
20:55know and Johnson was much smarter than
20:58Jack
20:59Kennedy he he went to East Texas State
21:02teachers college but he imp he
21:05unfortunately he put in place the Great
21:07Society which is an albatross on
21:10America's neck has been for low these
21:14this half century but he was smart he
21:17knew how to get it through Congress and
21:19Jack Kennedy couldn't get any of it
21:21through yeah and now Congress barely
21:23works so that's why when Trump came
21:26along I I wasn't one of these never
21:29trumping inside the Beltway snobs
21:32although some of my my good friends went
21:35down that
21:45path

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