OJ Simpson: Guilty, but not of murder - Bill C. Dear Documentary — Transcript
Full transcript
- 0:00Now, on BBC 1, Tom Mangold presents
- 0:02Panorama, which contains strong
- 0:04language.
- 0:05Hi, I'm O.J. Simpson. Now, you may know
- 0:07me as a sportscaster, commercial
- 0:09pitchman, or an actor, but I also played
- 0:11some pro football a while back, but that
- 0:13was a couple of years ago.
- 0:15He was fast.
- 0:16He was strong. He was America's football
- 0:19hero, a super athlete with a nice guy
- 0:21image.
- 0:21He's in the Hall of Fame.
- 0:24There are moments of time when it seems
- 0:25that every
- 0:26He achieved even greater fame when he
- 0:27advertised Hertz cars coast to coast.
- 0:30It's a beautiful Hertz you're receiving.
- 0:32All right. Listen up everyone.
- 0:34I want you to calmly file towards the
- 0:36exit.
- 0:36And as a film actor, he promised his
- 0:38fans everything.
- 0:40Well, I must have done something good or
- 0:42something right to be here, and I just
- 0:43want you to know that I'll never let you
- 0:45guys down.
- 0:46I put
- 0:47But something went terribly wrong, and
- 0:49now an American hero is accused of two
- 0:51dreadful murders.
- 0:55So, is O.J. Simpson the sporting legend
- 0:58who adored his wife and family, or the
- 1:00ranting bully terrorizing her in this
- 1:02tape recorded by the police?
- 1:03911 emergency 5150.
- 1:04get someone over here now? He's back.
- 1:07Please.
- 1:08Okay, what does he look like?
- 1:09Simpson. I think you know his record.
- 1:11Okay, is he the sportscaster or
- 1:14whatever?
- 1:14Yeah.
- 1:15Okay, and what is Wait a minute, we're
- 1:17sending police. What is he doing? Is he
- 1:18threatening you?
- 1:20[ __ ] going nuts.
- 1:22Tonight, as America obsessively asks
- 1:24itself which is the real O.J., and did
- 1:26one of them brutally murder his wife and
- 1:28her friend, Panorama explores both the
- 1:30crime and the deeper issues raised by
- 1:32it. Issues that persistently trouble
- 1:34America at the end of the millennium:
- 1:36race, domestic violence, money and
- 1:38justice, and the power of fame.
- 2:11The crime itself was only too simple. On
- 2:14the night of June the 12th, someone
- 2:15called here at Nicole Simpson's house on
- 2:18South Bundy in the posh Los Angeles
- 2:19suburb of Brentwood.
- 2:22When she came to the garden gate and as
- 2:24the car drove by, she was noiselessly
- 2:27slashed to death in the shadows.
- 2:30At about the same time, Nicole's friend
- 2:31Ronald Goldman came to see her.
- 2:34The same killer then overpowered and
- 2:35knifed him to death, too.
- 2:38Even in a city that lives by excess,
- 2:40this was an awful crime.
- 2:48In the morning, detectives began
- 2:50investigating the nightmare on South
- 2:51Bundy. Nicole's throat had been cut.
- 2:54Goldman had been slashed in a maniacal
- 2:55frenzy. There was no apparent motive.
- 2:58Suspicion soon fell on Nicole's
- 3:00ex-husband, but O.J. Simpson was both
- 3:02the most and least likely man to have
- 3:04committed the murders.
- 3:07Why did Hertz invent number one club
- 3:09gold service?
- 3:10Having run into America's consciousness
- 3:12as a superb black athlete, O.J. Simpson
- 3:15next transcended color through the
- 3:17marketplace with these groundbreaking
- 3:18commercials.
- 3:20Yeah, it's a good feeling. I always
- 3:21wanted to play with this guy and I'm on
- 3:23a team that is a pretty exclusive
- 3:25consolidated his favored uncle image as
- 3:27a sports commentator, helping middle
- 3:29America convince itself it was color
- 3:31blind.
- 3:32Yeah, well, we got a great team that
- 3:33we've just joined in this Hall of Fame.
- 3:35This is as close as most Americans will
- 3:37come to having some member of their
- 3:40family on trial.
- 3:41What we see on the surface is never the
- 3:45real person and if there is one thing
- 3:47that I hope people will take out of this
- 3:50tragedy,
- 3:51it is to be very careful about thinking
- 3:55that we know somebody from their public
- 3:56persona, because we don't.
- 4:00The image required an appropriate
- 4:02lifestyle, and this is one of his three
- 4:04homes. $5 million worth of mock Tudor
- 4:07mansion, pool, and tennis courts in
- 4:09Brentwood. He told police he was asleep
- 4:11here during the murders.
- 4:14This is the exclusive golf course he
- 4:15played on.
- 4:17Closed to anyone without real money or
- 4:18fame. No problem in Brentwood. But some
- 4:21traditions die hard, and O.J. Simpson
- 4:24was a black man who didn't work as a
- 4:25caddy on the greens.
- 4:30And these are the streets and coffee
- 4:31houses of Brentwood where hanging out
- 4:33and looking fabulous are full-time
- 4:35occupations for most of the rich young
- 4:37film star and sporting wannabes. For
- 4:40O.J., all this was a million miles from
- 4:42home, yet just 1 hour's flight away.
- 4:46The number 32 jersey still covers the
- 4:48most famous son of the Potrero Hills
- 4:50district here in San Francisco, where
- 4:53O.J. Simpson was born. But this is the
- 4:55other side of the tracks. Indeed, it's a
- 4:56whole world away from Brentwood and
- 4:58Hollywood. This is the very humble place
- 5:00of his youth.
- 5:03He was born in one of these slum
- 5:05dwellings that still cling to a
- 5:06hillside. The poverty endures, and each
- 5:09generation faces the same uphill
- 5:11struggle. His father deserted him. His
- 5:14stern mother took charge. Today, the
- 5:16Juice, as he's called, is the one
- 5:18shining light on the narrow path out of
- 5:20this trap.
- 5:21We're from BBC Television. How are you?
- 5:24British Broadcasting. Hi. Thanks very
- 5:26much for asking us to talk.
- 5:31What did he mean? What did O.J., what
- 5:34does O.J. mean to the Potrero community
- 5:36here?
- 5:37O.J., O.J. meant quite a bit to us.
- 5:40To be perfectly honest, because he was a
- 5:42he he showed us that, coming from our
- 5:45area, that you can rise above.
- 5:48You can rise above your circumstances,
- 5:50be how meager they are. You see. And
- 5:53O.J. was like a role model, man.
- 5:55Everybody was proud of Juice.
- 5:59O.J. could see for himself how
- 6:01tantalizingly close he always was to the
- 6:03better life that hung like a backdrop on
- 6:06the other side of the slum hill of
- 6:07Potrero.
- 6:11He worked out at the recreation center
- 6:12which sits in no-man's-land.
- 6:17And his face remains an inspirational
- 6:19come-on, emblematically encouraging the
- 6:21young hopefuls who leave their homes as
- 6:23he did for a few hours a day to earn
- 6:26their passport to freedom.
- 6:30This is how and where O.J. trained
- 6:32himself to become the fastest man of his
- 6:34sport. It took strength to play his way
- 6:37out of Potrero, but what was the real
- 6:39cost of that achievement?
- 6:42Calvin Tennison was a close childhood
- 6:44friend. We met in the center's playing
- 6:46field.
- 6:47Being a black man,
- 6:50you have to be black till you hit the
- 6:52the dirt, until you're dead. I mean,
- 6:54there's no time in your life when you're
- 6:56not going to look in the mirror and be
- 6:58black. And I feel that with all the
- 7:02money, the fame, the camera, the lights,
- 7:05the action, at some point in his life,
- 7:08in the early '80s, around the time he
- 7:10met Nicole, he looked in the mirror and
- 7:12he didn't see a black man anymore. He
- 7:14seen a neutral man or another kind of
- 7:17man that could fit in with the the white
- 7:20society in in Hollywood without any
- 7:24problem. He felt comfortable with that.
- 7:26Maybe he became uncomfortable with being
- 7:29black.
- 7:30He said, "Love me for O.J., for what I
- 7:34am, and not for my image." But what
- 7:35you're saying is that the image was
- 7:37crucial to his existence.
- 7:38Yeah, he had to have that image, and the
- 7:40O.J. that he wanted you to love, I don't
- 7:43think it even exist no more. I think he
- 7:45left the real O.J. right here in in
- 7:48Potrero Hill.
- 7:56That was the world he left behind when
- 7:57his extraordinary sporting triumphs
- 7:59eventually elevated him here to Los
- 8:01Angeles in the suburb of Brentwood. He
- 8:04married Nicole, his second wife, in 1985
- 8:06and they divorced 2 years ago.
- 8:09But we now know that on O.J.'s part this
- 8:11remained a dangerously obsessive and
- 8:13violent relationship. It didn't end, it
- 8:15couldn't end, save in what the
- 8:17prosecution now claims was a conclusion
- 8:19of appalling finality.
- 8:23Simpson has vigorously denied both
- 8:25murders, but the problem for him is
- 8:26threefold. He had a motive, his alibi is
- 8:29weak, and the forensic evidence
- 8:31implicating him is powerful. The murder
- 8:33scene was drenched in blood.
- 8:38The killer seems to have worn gloves and
- 8:39one of them, heavily blood stained, was
- 8:41found at the scene.
- 8:44The police allege that the Nicole murder
- 8:46was carefully premeditated by Simpson.
- 8:48Goldman was just in the wrong place at
- 8:50the wrong time. They say Simpson then
- 8:52immediately drove the 2 miles home.
- 8:56Damning evidence is the second blood
- 8:58stained glove found in Simpson's own
- 8:59garden.
- 9:00And there are blood stains on the door
- 9:02and inside his white Ford Bronco Jeep.
- 9:05If Simpson did it and there are no other
- 9:07suspects, what could have been the
- 9:08motive?
- 9:09Here was a man who had everything money
- 9:11could buy into or out of.
- 9:13But evidence that Simpson was anything
- 9:15but a nice guy to his wife has now
- 9:17emerged. Evidence of another O.J.,
- 9:20selfish, spoiled, possessive, a dominant
- 9:22bully.
- 9:23This is the O.J. America praised doesn't
- 9:25exist, but he seems to be real enough.
- 9:28He was certainly a vicious wife beater
- 9:30struck by a social illness rampant
- 9:31throughout America as the prosecuting
- 9:33district attorney himself revealed.
- 9:37I've been talking about domestic
- 9:39violence and about the need to do
- 9:42something early on in domestic violence
- 9:45to protect
- 9:47not just the victim like Mr. like Ms.
- 9:50Simpson
- 9:52but others too.
- 9:54Los Angeles has one domestic murder
- 9:56every 9 days. O.J. frequently battered
- 9:59his wife.
- 10:01The vehemence of his verbal violence is
- 10:03heard on this police tape of an
- 10:05emergency phone call.
- 10:13Could you just please O.J. O.J. O.J.
- 10:16O.J.
- 10:21Please.
- 10:28O.J. please the kids.
- 10:31Is he leaving?
- 10:32No.
- 10:34This was one of several such calls.
- 10:36After one of them, Nicole went to seek
- 10:38help.
- 10:39She found it with Dr. Susan Forward, a
- 10:41distinguished psychologist and a world
- 10:43expert on domestic violence. She became
- 10:46Nicole Simpson's personal
- 10:47psychotherapist.
- 10:50What was your reaction when you heard
- 10:51the 911 tapes?
- 10:53I cried
- 10:55because I remembered her.
- 10:57The voice came back to me when she was
- 10:59sitting across from me crying. At one
- 11:01point, I went over and I put my arms
- 11:03around her and held her
- 11:04because and I said it's safe in here.
- 11:06You can say what you need to say and
- 11:08then you need to get angry. And when I
- 11:10heard the 911 tape, I heard some of the
- 11:12hopelessness and I heard a lot of the
- 11:15terror in her voice that I had heard in
- 11:16the office.
- 11:17Okay, and what Wait a minute. We're
- 11:19sending the police. What is he doing? Is
- 11:20he threatening you?
- 11:22He's [ __ ] going nuts.
- 11:24Okay, has he threatened you in any way
- 11:26or
- 11:28or is he just harassing you?
- 11:31You're going to hear him in a minute.
- 11:32He's about to come in again.
- 11:34Okay, just stay on the line.
- 11:35want to stay on the line. He's going to
- 11:36beat the [ __ ] out
- 11:37Wait a minute. Wait. You just stay on
- 11:38the line so we can know what's going on
- 11:40till the police get there, okay?
- 11:43When I saw her, hair was somewhat
- 11:45bedraggled. She wore no makeup. She had
- 11:47on blue jeans and a T-shirt.
- 11:49And um
- 11:51very ambivalent, very frightened about
- 11:54what she was doing both from the sense
- 11:58of having had many threats against her
- 12:00by O.J. that, you know, if you leave me,
- 12:02I'll kill you. If I can't have you,
- 12:04nobody can. If I can't have you, I'll
- 12:05kill you.
- 12:07Threats that she took very seriously
- 12:08knowing um
- 12:10how violent and volatile his his temper
- 12:12was.
- 12:14In 1989, Simpson was charged with wife
- 12:16beating. His fame may have helped him
- 12:18secure a minimum probationary sentence.
- 12:21Why didn't she take your advice and get
- 12:23out?
- 12:24He told her that he would get the kids.
- 12:27He would prove her to be an unfit
- 12:28mother. He He was powerful. He had
- 12:30friends in high places. He would use
- 12:32every weapon he could to get the kids
- 12:34and to cut her off without a cent. And I
- 12:36said, "Nicole, he can't do that."
- 12:39She believed him. He had so narrowed her
- 12:41world and he so defined reality for her
- 12:45because she had limited activities
- 12:48outside of what she did with him. And
- 12:50she literally had to go to him for
- 12:52permission to see friends.
- 12:54My wife, Nicole, who came into my life
- 12:57at what
- 12:59is probably the most difficult time for
- 13:01an athlete, at the end of my career. And
- 13:04she turned those years into some of the
- 13:05best years I've had in my life, babe.
- 13:08My dad
- 13:09But the public saw a devoted adoring
- 13:11family man.
- 13:13And uh
- 13:15I don't I don't I don't know what what
- 13:16you say about the most important person
- 13:18in your life.
- 13:19I'm just glad she's here today.
- 13:21My mother.
- 13:23I
- 13:28The impression he gives them
- 13:30is of an intensely loving man who loved
- 13:33his father, loved his mother, and
- 13:35certainly loved his wife Nicole. Are you
- 13:37saying that was all fake?
- 13:39Yes.
- 13:40You don't want people to know that you
- 13:42need to control and dominate and abuse
- 13:44your wife in order to assure yourself
- 13:46that you're the powerful one. You don't
- 13:47want people to know those things. I
- 13:49mean, he's never even acknowledged that
- 13:51he was abusive with his wife. He said
- 13:54that they had some normal family
- 13:57problems. So, the denial is enormous in
- 14:00this man.
- 14:02Simpson himself once spoke disarmingly
- 14:05about the difficulties he'd faced with
- 14:06Nicole.
- 14:07But, it was embarrassing. But, because
- 14:10our relationship was strong and all our
- 14:12friends knew it, and they knew what they
- 14:14were reading wasn't uh necessarily the
- 14:15truth. Um hey, we just tried to put it
- 14:18behind us and ignore it as much as we
- 14:20could.
- 14:22Nicole's funeral, O.J. was there.
- 14:25As the cortege moved sadly on, Nicole's
- 14:27mother asked him whether he'd murdered
- 14:29Nicole. "No," he answered, "I loved your
- 14:31daughter." But, the unbelievable was
- 14:34about to happen.
- 14:37Detectives and forensic scientists have
- 14:39been gathering more evidence, much of it
- 14:41from O.J.'s home. Blood stains sent for
- 14:43DNA testing returned with ominous
- 14:45results.
- 14:46Finally, the district attorney was ready
- 14:48to prosecute. O.J. being O.J., he was
- 14:51invited to submit himself for arrest,
- 14:53but he declined and simply did a runner.
- 14:56Mr. Simpson
- 14:58has not appeared.
- 15:03The Los Angeles Police Department right
- 15:06now
- 15:07is actively searching for Mr. Simpson.
- 15:12They wouldn't have to look far. Driven
- 15:14by his friend A.C. Cowlings, he was
- 15:16heading south on the freeway.
- 15:18I'm very confident we're going to find
- 15:20O.J. Simpson.
- 15:21Because this is a man who can't hide too
- 15:24easily.
- 15:26Now followed the mandatory but rather
- 15:27sedate police chase. A.C. Cowlings even
- 15:30called them on his mobile.
- 15:31911, what are you reporting?
- 15:33This is This is A.C. I have O.J. in the
- 15:35car.
- 15:36Okay, where are you?
- 15:37Please, I'm coming up the five freeway.
- 15:40Okay.
- 15:40Right now, we all we are okay, but you
- 15:42got to tell the police to just back off.
- 15:44He's still alive. He's got a gun to his
- 15:46head.
- 15:47Okay, hold on a minute.
- 15:49Okay.
- 15:50So, that's all I That's all we ask. He's
- 15:52got a gun to his head. All right.
- 15:53And And what's What's your name?
- 15:54My name is A.C. You know who I am,
- 15:56goddammit.
- 15:57We couldn't actually see O.J., but we
- 15:59seen the guy driving the car. IT WASN'T
- 16:01O.J., THOUGH.
- 16:02As the sky blackened with helicopters,
- 16:04the chase became a procession. Next, a
- 16:06friend of O.J.'s solemnly read what
- 16:08sounded like his suicide note.
- 16:10This letter
- 16:12was written by O.J. today.
- 16:16To whom it may concern.
- 16:21First,
- 16:23everyone understand I have nothing to do
- 16:27with Nicole's murder.
- 16:29I think of my life
- 16:32and feel I've done most of the right
- 16:35things.
- 16:37So, why do I end up like this?
- 16:41I can't go on.
- 16:43No matter what the outcome,
- 16:46people will look and point.
- 16:50I can't take that.
- 16:51Stay back, everybody.
- 16:55I've had a good life.
- 16:57I'm proud of how I lived. My mama taught
- 17:00me to do unto others.
- 17:03I treated people the way I wanted to be
- 17:06treated.
- 17:07This is a copy of that letter, and it
- 17:09does reveal a disturbing and
- 17:10manipulative character.
- 17:12It's maudlin, egocentric, and filled
- 17:14with self-pity. It targets his adoring
- 17:17public, yet oddly expresses not a word
- 17:19of curiosity about who may have killed
- 17:21his ex-wife.
- 17:23"Thank you for making my life so
- 17:25special.
- 17:26Think of me as the real O.J. and not
- 17:28this lost person."
- 17:30"I have been totally loving and
- 17:33understanding of what she's been going
- 17:35through.
- 17:36At times, I have felt like a battered
- 17:39husband or boyfriend."
- 17:42He says in his letter, the so-called
- 17:45suicide note.
- 17:45Which is I knew when it came out was not
- 17:48a suicide note because narcissistic,
- 17:51abusive, obsessive men do not commit
- 17:54suicide.
- 17:55He says, "There were times when I felt
- 17:57like a battered husband." Why did he say
- 17:59that?
- 17:59Classic. Abusers always make themselves
- 18:03the victims. The villain becomes the
- 18:05victim and the victim becomes the
- 18:06villain.
- 18:07But
- 18:09his ability to minimize and deny the
- 18:14vicious pummeling, beatings. He would
- 18:16kick her, throw her on the floor, kick
- 18:19her.
- 18:20He would punch her in the face. When the
- 18:23police came on that New Year's Day, she
- 18:25had choke marks. She had fingerprints on
- 18:28her neck from his hand where he had
- 18:30tried to choke her. This is what O.J.
- 18:32described in that letter as um problems
- 18:36that every relationship has.
- 18:39You're a doctor of psychology and a
- 18:41primary source in this story. Are you
- 18:43telling me in no uncertain terms that
- 18:45O.J. Simpson is mentally ill?
- 18:48Mentally ill in the sense of clinically
- 18:51certifiably insane, absolutely not. What
- 18:54I'm telling you is that O.J. Simpson
- 18:56falls into that category that we call
- 18:58character disorders, which means people
- 19:01who have a big missing piece inside and
- 19:03that big missing piece is conscience,
- 19:06compassion,
- 19:08empathy for other human beings, the
- 19:10ability to understand that behavior has
- 19:13consequences and the ability to take
- 19:15personal responsibility for what you do
- 19:18to another person.
- 19:19The word is psychopath.
- 19:22You said it, I didn't.
- 19:24Yeah, that's the word.
- 19:28O.J. eventually gave himself up and was
- 19:30driven like a visiting potentate to
- 19:32police headquarters, cheered by
- 19:34rubberneckers all the way.
- 19:36There was some evidence he'd been trying
- 19:37to flee from arrest. There was some
- 19:39suggesting he just couldn't face
- 19:41imprisonment on the run.
- 19:48Now his fame and his wealth began to
- 19:50work for him.
- 19:52Even as he was led away in handcuffs, a
- 19:54cavalry of lawyers was saddling up for
- 19:56the rescue.
- 20:00The biggest names in defense rode into
- 20:02town attracted by his fame and possibly
- 20:04his $10 million fortune. First, they
- 20:06strung up a free phone hotline to
- 20:08solicit any evidence on his behalf.
- 20:10If you have any information or evidence
- 20:12regarding the O.J. Simpson case, press
- 20:15two now. If you are an expert in the
- 20:17field relating to the O.J. Simpson case
- 20:20and would like to offer your services,
- 20:22press three now.
- 20:24If you have millions of dollars, the
- 20:26American legal system really can offer
- 20:28better odds of proving your innocence.
- 20:30You can buy as Simpson has a dream team
- 20:32to defend you, but you can never buy a
- 20:34jury.
- 20:35Nevertheless, American justice itself is
- 20:37on trial in the Simpson case. For as the
- 20:39hysteria subsides, the nation will
- 20:41eventually demand clear and unequivocal
- 20:44evidence that neither the accused's
- 20:46money, nor fame, nor image is going to
- 20:48lead to the wrong verdict.
- 20:50At this time, do you wish to enter a
- 20:51plea guilty or not guilty?
- 20:54Not guilty.
- 20:55O.J. will spend at least $4 million
- 20:57fighting to prove his innocence, but
- 20:59it's not so much what O.J. Simpson is
- 21:01buying as what many fellow black
- 21:02suspects can't buy that makes this case
- 21:05so controversial.
- 21:07What the average black defendant in a
- 21:10murder case?
- 21:12In a sense, uh
- 21:14the whole world is against him right
- 21:16from the beginning.
- 21:18Uh instead of being like O.J. Simpson in
- 21:21in that people don't want to believe
- 21:23that he's guilty, everybody wants to
- 21:25believe that he's guilty and does
- 21:27believe that he's guilty.
- 21:29But the most serious thing that affects
- 21:30him is that he has uh
- 21:33when he's on trial for his life, uh he
- 21:36has no uh champion.
- 21:38He He doesn't get to uh an adequate
- 21:41lawyer to do any of these things uh that
- 21:44that have been done for O.J. Simpson,
- 21:47not one of them. Um and that's so that
- 21:50there's a sense I keep wondering what
- 21:52these men in prison think as they watch
- 21:55uh the Simpson trial.
- 22:04San Quentin Prison, death row for some
- 22:07300 convicted murderers, many of them
- 22:09black.
- 22:13I went to visit three of them, all angry
- 22:15that O.J. Simpson has already been
- 22:17granted immunity from the death sentence
- 22:19if found guilty. Multiple murder is a
- 22:22capital offense in California.
- 22:26Inside one of the toughest prisons in
- 22:28America, they contemplate a justice
- 22:30system they believe is hand-tailored for
- 22:32the rich.
- 22:40Convicted men argue that indifferent
- 22:42lawyers, less consultation time, and
- 22:45less investigative work make their
- 22:47chances so much worse.
- 22:48Is this where you have your visits
- 22:50normally, Terry?
- 22:56To put it at its simplest, if you are
- 22:58poor
- 23:00and a minority in the United States, you
- 23:02just don't get the kind of justice that
- 23:04Simpson is getting. Is that what you're
- 23:05saying?
- 23:06If you're poor period in this country,
- 23:08you don't get that type of
- 23:09representation.
- 23:10Why not? Is it just a shortage of money?
- 23:15No, the system
- 23:17moves in a certain way and if you can't
- 23:20shake that
- 23:24way up, if you can't
- 23:29the fallacy about being proven
- 23:33guilty or being innocent until proven
- 23:35guilty, it just doesn't exist. Uh
- 23:37there's a basic misconception that where
- 23:39there is smoke, there is fire.
- 23:42And the average the average, not all,
- 23:45but the average 12 jurors in this
- 23:46country, if you're sitting in the
- 23:48defendant chair, you are guilty.
- 23:50Uh money
- 23:52can help buy you that assumption of
- 23:55innocence. And that's what O.J. has
- 23:58going for him.
- 24:08Were you surprised when the district
- 24:10attorney decided not to ask for the
- 24:11death penalty for Simpson?
- 24:14I was
- 24:15uh
- 24:17not surprised
- 24:19that he did not ask for it
- 24:21in that particular case.
- 24:23Why?
- 24:24Because uh
- 24:26it would have brought to the forefront
- 24:28the whole issue of the death penalty in
- 24:31those type of cases and people would
- 24:33have said, well, you know, O.J. Simpson
- 24:37friends in Hollywood places like that,
- 24:40these people that are normally used by
- 24:41the uh
- 24:42state to promote the death penalty, many
- 24:44of them would have came out against it
- 24:46simply because O.J. Simpson was their
- 24:48friend.
- 24:57Do you need money to get justice?
- 25:03Pointedly, I think yes.
- 25:06Seriously.
- 25:07There is a two-headed
- 25:09sword in the justice in the criminal
- 25:11courts
- 25:12that I can understand here in
- 25:13California. Um
- 25:15if you have money
- 25:17certain investigative services, um
- 25:20certain experts are available to you
- 25:22that are not available to you if you
- 25:25don't have the funds to pay for them.
- 25:27How would it have affected your case?
- 25:32I think that um
- 25:34the argument um in the areas of the lack
- 25:36of evidence that was in my case at the
- 25:38time
- 25:40it probably would have um ended in a
- 25:42much different
- 25:45situation. I don't think that I would be
- 25:46on death row right now.
- 25:48Really?
- 25:48Absolutely.
- 25:51The truth is the justice system is
- 25:53geared to speedy trials for the poor.
- 25:55Compromise deals cost less and don't
- 25:58drain the system of time and staff.
- 26:00That's why the rich benefit. What would
- 26:02happen if every accused were able to do
- 26:04what O.J. Simpson has done?
- 26:06The system would totally collapse. Uh
- 26:08the rights are there, but if everybody
- 26:11could
- 26:12could uh take advantage of them, that we
- 26:14don't have enough judges, enough
- 26:16courthouses, enough jails, enough police
- 26:19uh
- 26:20to uh to do that.
- 26:22As to Detective Fuhrman, uh three issues
- 26:25are raised. First of all, evidence of
- 26:27racial animosity.
- 26:29This is Detective Fuhrman. Someone on
- 26:31Simpson's defense team has leaked a
- 26:33smear that the detective is a racist, so
- 26:35biased that he might have set O.J.
- 26:37Simpson up. It's a dirty trick even by
- 26:39Californian standards.
- 26:43It was Fuhrman who found the
- 26:44incriminating blood stained glove.
- 26:46Nothing would serve Simpson's defense
- 26:48team better than to have the honesty and
- 26:50credibility of this key witness
- 26:52impugned.
- 26:53Now, the case of Detective Fuhrman is
- 26:55one example of a potentially dirty trick
- 26:57at work, for there is a subtext to this
- 26:59case. Everyone knows what it is, but
- 27:01says little about it in public. It's
- 27:03race.
- 27:04O.J. Simpson is a black man who made it
- 27:06in a white man's world. That image,
- 27:08unthreatening, a genuinely nice guy,
- 27:11affable, a corporate American you would
- 27:13rent a car from, broke the stereotype
- 27:15mold.
- 27:16He married a white woman. That's still a
- 27:18sensitive matter here. Now, it's alleged
- 27:20he killed her in a rage. The subtext for
- 27:22the racists in Southern California is
- 27:25obvious enough.
- 27:27This is a cafe in South Central, the
- 27:29black area of a city becoming the focus
- 27:31for racial tensions in America. The
- 27:33lines already being drawn over the O.J.
- 27:36Simpson case.
- 27:38Don't you understand where you are? This
- 27:40is an area where
- 27:42white people feel that they are losing
- 27:44ground.
- 27:45In the next decade, they will be a
- 27:47minority in the entire state of
- 27:49California. point, they are a minority
- 27:52in terms of numbers in the city of Los
- 27:54Angeles.
- 27:55Okay? They are afraid of people of color
- 27:58because of the decades and and and and
- 28:00centuries of uh
- 28:03uh
- 28:04sitting back unapologetically
- 28:06uh treating people of color the way they
- 28:08have.
- 28:10There are malign forces on all sides.
- 28:15In a car park, I met two private
- 28:17detectives who claimed to be working for
- 28:19the friends of Nicole Simpson, but whose
- 28:21real job seems to be to spread
- 28:23malevolent gossip, often with racial
- 28:25connotations, about O.J. Simpson to the
- 28:27press.
- 28:28In a nation closely tuned into any
- 28:30information about the case, men like
- 28:32this often find an audience.
- 28:34One of them is armed with smears.
- 28:37What have you learned about O.J. Simpson
- 28:40which you think you want to pass on to
- 28:42uh
- 28:42reporters like me?
- 28:43Well, I've learned that he uh he's not
- 28:46the Mr. Goody Two-Shoes uh you know,
- 28:48all-American hero athlete that he's
- 28:50perceived to be.
- 28:52The second detective is camera shy and
- 28:54hides in the back of the car. Both
- 28:56investigators are anxious to give
- 28:57answers that reflect badly on O.J., but
- 29:00they become more evasive about questions
- 29:02concerning the people who've hired them.
- 29:04Where does the money come from?
- 29:07How do you mean? Well, two of the people
- 29:09are just I would characterize them as
- 29:11independently wealthy, old money in this
- 29:14city, Los Angeles.
- 29:15And just explain to me what old money
- 29:17means.
- 29:18Old money being established, passed down
- 29:21generation to generation, having having
- 29:23been in the city a long time, their
- 29:25parents in in established large
- 29:28business ventures in this city.
- 29:30Old white money.
- 29:31Right, more or less, yeah.
- 29:33But what are the motives of the people
- 29:36who you won't name, who are sponsoring
- 29:38you? What is it that they want?
- 29:39Well, in the words of at least one, the
- 29:42way I remember the initial meeting was
- 29:44they want to see to make sure he was
- 29:45convicted in the words of one, see him
- 29:47fry.
- 29:48In a country where poverty, crime, and
- 29:50race remain inextricably linked in the
- 29:52ultra-conservative mind, comments like
- 29:55that identify these men's paymasters
- 29:57more clearly.
- 29:58You said rather enigmatically at the
- 29:59beginning of the interview that that
- 30:01some of the money was was coming from a
- 30:03political source and that it was old
- 30:05white money.
- 30:06Is that a kind of subtext for for racist
- 30:09money?
- 30:11No, not at all.
- 30:12Do you think it could be?
- 30:13No. In fact, I would characterize these
- 30:15people as liberals.
- 30:16It's not a liberal sentiment to say I
- 30:18hope he fries, is it?
- 30:19Right. Right. I think they're just so
- 30:21fed up with the crime in Los Angeles and
- 30:24the and the constant what the way they
- 30:25put it, the black eye for this city. And
- 30:27they haven't they didn't just move into
- 30:29town to get into show business. They've
- 30:30been here a long time. They've seen it
- 30:32change. They don't like it.
- 30:34Why for all of these very legitimate
- 30:35issues
- 30:37is the lightning rod persona an
- 30:39African-American man? Why does why does
- 30:41the focus only come when you have these
- 30:44scandals or when you have these
- 30:45tragedies?
- 30:46And I think the African-American
- 30:48community
- 30:49uh is starting to resent the atten- the
- 30:51negative attention and the unfair
- 30:53attention. Crime is has a black face.
- 31:01Secure in the embrace of their church
- 31:03and their history, many blacks still
- 31:04turn inwards for comfort. O.J.'s
- 31:07uniqueness was that he faced out and for
- 31:09most whites came to represent the
- 31:11acceptable face of black America,
- 31:13subdued, unthreatening, racially
- 31:15neutral.
- 31:19By living in the white man's world,
- 31:24His fame and wealth certainly protected
- 31:25him from some of the harsher realities
- 31:27of his crossover life.
- 31:29But leading members of the black
- 31:31community identify acute sensitivity
- 31:33about some of the racial dimensions of
- 31:35the Simpson case.
- 31:38On a racial
- 31:39basis, it will bring to the front
- 31:42one of the last taboos
- 31:45in the discussion of race, black man,
- 31:48white woman. It will bring that to the
- 31:50front.
- 31:51What is the subtext on the interracial
- 31:53marriage issue?
- 31:55That's a minefield.
- 31:57Uh the interracial marriage between an
- 31:59African-American man and a white woman
- 32:01in a in a society that used to be based
- 32:03on complete separation of the races in a
- 32:05society that stems from slavery of
- 32:07African-Americans, you have to
- 32:08understand how central it was to keep
- 32:10them separate. So, you're talking about
- 32:12the most central taboo in American
- 32:15culture is for an African-American man
- 32:17to marry a white woman.
- 32:19But will these undercurrents divert the
- 32:21true course of the justice that Simpson
- 32:23seeks and America deserves, or can
- 32:26prejudice and bigotry be cooled by the
- 32:28impartiality without which there is no
- 32:30justice in a democracy?
- 32:33Can
- 32:34a black jury member be impartial in this
- 32:36case?
- 32:37No.
- 32:40No black and a white man.
- 32:43Without a great deal of
- 32:47moral
- 32:49wherewithal.
- 32:51A majority of whites have already
- 32:52prejudged O.J. Simpson guilty. A
- 32:54majority of blacks are still thinking
- 32:56that he's innocent.
- 32:57Even very sophisticated people say, "All
- 33:00you have to do is put a couple of blacks
- 33:02on the jury and you're going to get a
- 33:03hung jury." It's much more complicated
- 33:06than that. I mean, anybody who thinks
- 33:08that, I think, is degrading the system.
- 33:12You you get these people, you think you
- 33:14know what they think, but when they get
- 33:16together and they
- 33:19exchange views,
- 33:21it's
- 33:23something that it's it's mystical
- 33:26and and it works most of the time.
- 33:29Justice will be done in this case. Will
- 33:33it be complete with justice?
- 33:36I can't really answer that. A lot of
- 33:39times
- 33:42people make decisions
- 33:45that they feel they can go home and sit
- 33:47comfortably
- 33:49and be able to defend.
- 33:50But if you don't believe that a juryman
- 33:53can be impartial on the matter of race
- 33:55alone, neither black nor white, how can
- 33:57justice be done?
- 33:59Welcome to Southern California.
- 34:01Good morning it's K-Rock 106.7 KROQ
- 34:047:56.
- 34:05The skeletal thoughts of the media
- 34:07invaders besieged Los Angeles
- 34:09courthouse.
- 34:13Journalists jostle with entertainers to
- 34:15scratch the nation's insatiable O.J.
- 34:17itch. Some despair at what they witness.
- 34:21Television itself has expanded to the
- 34:23point that there are so many options for
- 34:25viewers that the people operating
- 34:28elements of television are enormously
- 34:30fearful that if you don't give them
- 34:32something very catchy and exciting right
- 34:33away, somebody will turn to another
- 34:36channel.
- 34:36You talk about them. Sorry to interrupt.
- 34:37You talk about competition. I mean, just
- 34:39turn around, look at it. We've got CNN
- 34:40live, right? We've got Channel 4 live,
- 34:43that's NBC. Channel 2 live is CBS.
- 34:46And if I had three more monitors, you
- 34:47could
- 34:47at the top.
- 34:48three more monitors, you could see uh
- 34:50some other stations also covering it.
- 34:52All running the same picture.
- 34:53story. It's a What What's available on
- 34:55one screen is available on the other
- 34:56screen. And they're all enormously
- 34:58fearful that if
- 35:01they should be the first one to withdraw
- 35:03from the story, that somehow uh
- 35:06it'll it'll it'll taint them forever.
- 35:13It's very noisy out here, but the jury
- 35:15selection has begun in the O.J. Simpson
- 35:17But there is a logic behind this
- 35:18coverage. The demand is real, and no one
- 35:20should underestimate the public
- 35:22appetite, even if media dignity is the
- 35:25first casualty.
- 35:27O.J. Simpson button.
- 35:29O.J. Simpson button.
- 35:31How much you charging for them?
- 35:33$1.
- 35:33$1?
- 35:34$1.
- 35:34For one of those buttons?
- 35:35That's right.
- 35:36How much profit do you make from that?
- 35:39How much profit I make? 60 cents a
- 35:40button.
- 35:41Right.
- 35:41Yeah.
- 35:42Why do people buy them?
- 35:43Look,
- 35:44if you turn off the television, I'll
- 35:46tell them why.
- 35:47Okay. Why?
- 35:48They're crazy.
- 35:49They're crazy.
- 35:51You think people are crazy to buy the
- 35:53buttons? Do you think you're crazy to
- 35:54sell them?
- 35:55No. I'm here for one reason.
- 35:58This. Okay? I I did World Cup. I've done
- 36:02this. I was
- 36:03I was ready to do the Pope is coming. I
- 36:05do only big events.
- 36:07For weeks, crews have been constructing
- 36:09the scaffolding and high-rise camera
- 36:11O.J. Simpson's image has long outlasted
- 36:13his sporting talent. He became famous
- 36:15for being famous. Now he's become
- 36:17notorious.
- 36:18in recent history.
- 36:20They call it the O.J. media feeding
- 36:22frenzy, and there are certainly scenes
- 36:23here that you wouldn't see outside the
- 36:25Old Bailey. But things are not quite
- 36:27what they seem. Behind the circus and
- 36:29the carnival, behind the commerce and
- 36:30the nonsense, something profound is
- 36:33happening. America is talking to itself
- 36:35in one of those periodic bursts of
- 36:37self-examination
- 36:39when almost by accident it takes a great
- 36:41criminal trial to draw out the defining
- 36:44issues of the moment.
- 36:46Ironically, the nation has been
- 36:48galvanized into displaying the flags of
- 36:50endless controversy by the O.J. Simpson
- 36:52trial. It is a testament to the power of
- 36:55celebrity.
- 36:57Will his fame help or hinder him?
- 37:01I think it's going to help him.
- 37:04Will his color help or hinder him?
- 37:08Probably hinder him.
- 37:09And his wealth?
- 37:13Depends on the juror. That cuts both
- 37:14ways. There's resentment against wealth
- 37:16as well, but there's also a
- 37:17romanticization of people who have money
- 37:19and who've made it. It could cut either
- 37:21way.
- 37:22Do you think he did it?
- 37:23I have no opinion about that.
- 37:25Do you think he did it?
- 37:27My own personal view is uh that he is as
- 37:30guilty as homemade sin.
- 37:32Do you think he did it?
- 37:33Yes, I do.
- 37:35Do you think he did it?
- 37:37Why?
- 37:38Based on the evidence I've seen now, no.
- 37:41I want to hold
- 37:45until the last shred of evidence is in.
- 37:48I want to believe him innocent.
- 37:52The preliminary evidence weighs heavily
- 37:55towards guilty.
- 37:58Innocent or guilty, the man inside this
- 38:00prison has touched all the hot buttons
- 38:02on the American agenda.
- 38:04But sadly, the nation has already
- 38:06forgotten that murder is also a simple
- 38:08and profound tragedy. The lives of two
- 38:11innocents brutally and pointlessly
- 38:13extinguished. In this there is only one
- 38:15certainty, and that is the unquenchable
- 38:18loss of personal bereavement.
- 38:20I love my son dearly.
- 38:24And we're going to miss him a lot.
- 38:26And we'll And we'll miss him.
- 38:32Okay.
- 38:33Thank you.
- 38:58in
- 38:58American culture is for an
- 39:00African-American man to marry a white
- 39:02woman.
- 39:03But will these undercurrents divert the
- 39:05true course of the justice that Simpson
- 39:07seeks and America deserves? Or can
- 39:10prejudice and bigotry be cooled by the
- 39:12impartiality without which there is no
- 39:14justice in a democracy?
- 39:17Can
- 39:18a black jury member be impartial in this
- 39:20case?
- 39:21No.
- 39:24Nor can a white man.
- 39:27Without a great deal of
- 39:31moral
- 39:33wherewithal.
- 39:35A majority of whites have already
- 39:36prejudged O.J. Simpson guilty. A
- 39:38majority of blacks are still thinking
- 39:40that he's innocent.
- 39:41Even very sophisticated people say, "All
- 39:44you have to do is put a couple of blacks
- 39:46on the jury and you're going to get a
- 39:47hung jury." It's much more complicated
- 39:50than that. I mean, anybody who thinks
- 39:52that, I think, is degrading the system.
- 39:55Uh it You you get these people, you
- 39:58think you know what they think, but when
- 40:00they get together and they uh exchange
- 40:03views,
- 40:05uh
- 40:06um it it it's something that it's mis-
- 40:08it's mystical.
- 40:09Um and and it works most of the time.
- 40:13Uh justice will be done in this case.
- 40:17Uh will it be complete and wholesome
- 40:19justice?
- 40:20I can't really answer that.
- 40:22A lot of times
- 40:26people make decisions
- 40:29that they feel they can go home and sit
- 40:31comfortably
- 40:33and be able to defend.
- 40:34But if you don't believe that a juror
- 40:36man can be impartial on the matter of
- 40:39race alone, neither black nor white, how
- 40:41can justice be done?
- 40:43Welcome to Southern California.
- 40:45The world famous K-Rock 106.7 KROQ 756
- 40:48Kevin and Bean here.
- 40:49The skeletal thoughts of the media
- 40:51invaders besieged Los Angeles
- 40:53courthouse.
- 40:54That's as grueling a work as being a
- 40:55juror, isn't it?
- 40:55Almost.
- 40:57Journalists jostle with entertainers to
- 40:59scratch the nation's insatiable OJ itch.
- 41:02Some despair at what they witness.
- 41:05Television itself has expanded to the
- 41:07point that there's so many options for
- 41:09viewers that the people operating
- 41:12elements of television are enormously
- 41:14fearful that if you don't give them
- 41:16something very catchy and exciting right
- 41:17away, somebody will turn to another
- 41:19channel.
- 41:20You talk about I'm sorry to interrupt.
- 41:21You talk about competition. I mean just
- 41:23turn around, look at it. We've got CNN
- 41:24live, right? We've got Channel 4 live,
- 41:27that's NBC.
- 41:28Channel 2 live is CBS.
- 41:30And if I had three more monitors you
- 41:31at the top.
- 41:32had three more monitors you could see uh
- 41:34some other stations also covering
- 41:36All running the same picture.
- 41:36The same story. It's a What What's
- 41:38available on one screen is available on
- 41:40the other screen and they're all
- 41:42enormously fearful that if
- 41:45they should be the first one to withdraw
- 41:47from the story that somehow
- 41:50it'll it'll it'll taint them forever.
- 41:57It's very nice.
- 41:58Closed to anyone without real money or
- 41:59fame, no problem in Brentwood. But some
- 42:02traditions die hard and OJ Simpson was a
- 42:05black man who didn't work as a caddy on
- 42:07the greens.
- 42:11And these are the streets and coffee
- 42:12houses of Brentwood where hanging out
- 42:14and looking fabulous are full-time
- 42:16occupations for most of the rich young
- 42:18film star and sporting wannabes. For
- 42:21O.J., all this was a million miles from
- 42:23home, yet just 1 hour's flight away.
- 42:28The number 32 jersey still covers the
- 42:29most famous son of the Potrero Hills
- 42:31district here in San Francisco, where
- 42:34O.J. Simpson was born. But this is the
- 42:36other side of the tracks. Indeed, it's a
- 42:37whole world away from Brentwood and
- 42:39Hollywood. This is the very humble place
- 42:41of his youth.
- 42:44He was born in one of these slum
- 42:46dwellings that still cling to a
- 42:47hillside. The poverty endures and each
- 42:50generation faces the same uphill
- 42:52struggle. His father deserted him, his
- 42:55stern mother took charge. Today, the
- 42:57Juice, as he's called, is the one
- 42:59shining light on the narrow path out of
- 43:01this trap.
- 43:02We're from BBC Television. How are you?
- 43:05British Broadcasting. Hi. Thanks very
- 43:07much for asking us to come.
- 43:12What did he mean? What did O.J. What
- 43:15does O.J. mean to the Potrero community
- 43:17here?
- 43:18O.J. O.J. meant quite a bit to us.
- 43:21To be perfectly honest, because he was a
- 43:23he he showed us that coming from our
- 43:26area that you can rise above
- 43:29you can rise above your circumstances,
- 43:31be how meager they are. You see?
- 43:34And O.J. was like a role model, man.
- 43:36Everybody was proud of Juice.
- 43:40O.J. could see for himself how
- 43:42tantalizingly close he always was to the
- 43:44better life that hung like a backdrop on
- 43:47the other side of the slum hill of
- 43:48Potrero.
- 43:52He worked out at the recreation center,
- 43:53which sits in no-man's land.
- 43:58And his face remains an inspirational
- 44:00come on, emblematically encouraging the
- 44:02young hopefuls who leave their homes, as
- 44:04he did, for a few hours a day to earn
- 44:07their passport to freedom.
- 44:11This is how and where O.J. trained
- 44:13himself to become the fastest man of his
- 44:15sport. It took strength to play his way
- 44:18out of Potrero, but what was the real
- 44:20cost of that achievement?
- 44:23Calvin Tennison was a close childhood
- 44:25friend. We met in the center's playing
- 44:27field.
- 44:28Being a black man,
- 44:31you have to be black till you hit the
- 44:33the dirt, until you're dead. I mean,
- 44:35there's no time in your life when you're
- 44:37not going to look in the mirror and be
- 44:39black. And I feel that with all the
- 44:43money, the fame, the camera, the lights,
- 44:46the action, at some point in his life,
- 44:49in the early '80s, around the time he
- 44:51met Nicole, he looked in the mirror and
- 44:53he didn't see a black man anymore. He
- 44:55seen a neutral man or
- 45:18The crime itself was only too simple. On
- 45:21the night of June the 12th, someone
- 45:22called here at Nicole Simpson's house on
- 45:25South Bundy in the posh Los Angeles
- 45:26suburb of Brentwood.
- 45:29When she came to the garden gate, and as
- 45:31the cars drove by, she was noiselessly
- 45:34slashed to death in the shadows.
- 45:37At about the same time, Nicole's friend
- 45:38Ronald Goldman came to see her. The same
- 45:41killer then overpowered and knifed him
- 45:43to death, too.
- 45:45Even in a city that lives by excess,
- 45:47this was an awful crime.
- 45:55In the morning, detectives began
- 45:57investigating the nightmare on South
- 45:58Bundy. Nicole's throat had been cut.
- 46:01Goldman had been slashed in a maniacal
- 46:03frenzy. There was no apparent motive.
- 46:05Suspicion soon fell on Nicole's
- 46:07ex-husband, but O.J. Simpson was both
- 46:09the most and least likely man to have
- 46:11committed the murders.
- 46:14Why did Hertz invent number one club
- 46:16gold service?
- 46:17Having run into America's consciousness
- 46:19as a superb black athlete, O.J. Simpson
- 46:22next transcended color through the
- 46:24marketplace with these groundbreaking
- 46:25commercials.
- 46:27Yeah, it's a good feeling. I always
- 46:28wanted to play with this guy and now
- 46:30on a team that is a pretty exclusive
- 46:31He consolidated his favorite uncle image
- 46:34as a sports commentator, helping middle
- 46:36America convince itself it was
- 46:37colorblind.
- 46:39Yeah, well, we got a great team that
- 46:40we've just joined in this Hall of Fame.
- 46:42This is as close as most Americans will
- 46:44come to having some member of their
- 46:47family on trial.
- 46:48What we see on the surface is never the
- 46:52real person. And if there is one thing
- 46:54that I hope people will take out of this
- 46:57tragedy,
- 46:58it is to be very careful about thinking
- 47:01that we know somebody from their public
- 47:03persona, because we don't.
- 47:08The image required an appropriate
- 47:09lifestyle and this is one of his three
- 47:11homes. $5 million worth of mock Tudor
- 47:14mansion, pool and tennis courts in
- 47:16Brentwood. He told police he was asleep
- 47:18here during the murders.
- 47:21This is the exclusive golf course he
- 47:22played on.
- 47:24Closed to anyone without real money or
- 47:25fame. No problem in Brentwood, but some
- 47:28traditions die hard. And O.J. Simpson
- 47:31was a black man who didn't work as a
- 47:32caddy on the greens.
- 47:37And these are the streets and coffee
- 47:38houses of Brentwood where hanging out
- 47:40and looking fabulous are full-time
- 47:42occupations for most of the rich young
- 47:44film star and sporting wannabes. For
- 47:47O.J., all this was a million miles from
- 47:49home, yet just one hour's flight away.
- 47:54The number 32 jersey still covers the
- 47:55most famous son of the Potrero Hill
- 47:57district tours and each generation faces
- 48:00the same uphill struggle. His father
- 48:02deserted him, his stern mother took
- 48:04charge. Today, the juices he's called is
- 48:07the one shining light on the narrow path
- 48:09out of this trap.
- 48:10We're from BBC Television. How are you?
- 48:13British Broadcasting. Hi, thanks very
- 48:15much for asking us to come.
- 48:20What did he mean? What did OJ What does
- 48:23OJ mean to the Potrero community here?
- 48:26OJ OJ meant quite a bit to us.
- 48:29To be perfectly honest, because he was a
- 48:31he he showed us that coming from our
- 48:34area that you can rise above
- 48:37you can rise above your circumstances,
- 48:39be how meager they are.
- 48:41You see?
- 48:42And OJ was like a role model, man.
- 48:44Everybody was proud of Juice.
- 48:48OJ could see for himself how
- 48:50tantalizingly close he always was to the
- 48:52better life that hung like a backdrop on
- 48:55the other side of the slum hill of
- 48:56Potrero.
- 49:00He worked out at the recreation center,
- 49:01which sits in no-man's land.
- 49:06And his face remains an inspirational
- 49:08come-on, emblematically encouraging the
- 49:10young hopefuls who leave their homes as
- 49:13he did for a few hours a day to earn
- 49:15their passport to freedom.
- 49:19This is how and where OJ trained himself
- 49:22to become the fastest man of his sport.
- 49:24It took strength to play his way out of
- 49:26Potrero, but what was the real cost of
- 49:28that achievement?
- 49:31Calvin Tennison was a close childhood
- 49:33friend. We met in the center's playing
- 49:35field.
- 49:36Being a black man,
- 49:39you have to be black till you hit the
- 49:41the dirt, until you're dead. I mean,
- 49:43there's no time in your life when you're
- 49:45not going to look in the mirror and be
- 49:47black. And I feel that with all the
- 49:51money, the fame, the camera, the lights,
- 49:54the action, at some point in his life in
- 49:57the early '80s, around the time he met
- 49:59Nicole, he looked in the mirror and he
- 50:01didn't see a black man anymore. He seen
- 50:03a neutral man or another kind of man
- 50:07that could fit in with the the white
- 50:10society in in Hollywood without any
- 50:13problem. He felt comfortable with that.
- 50:15Maybe he became uncomfortable with being
- 50:18black.
- 50:19He said love me for O.J. for what I am
- 50:23and not for my image. But what you're
- 50:24saying is that the image was crucial to
- 50:26his existence.
- 50:27Yeah, he had to have that image and the
- 50:29O.J. that he wanted you to love, I don't
- 50:32think it even exist no more. I think he
- 50:34left the real O.J. right here in in
- 50:37Patrol Hill.
- 50:45That was the world he left behind when
- 50:46his extraordinary sporting triumphs
- 50:48eventually elevated him here to Los
- 50:50Angeles in the suburb of Brentwood. He
- 50:53married Nicole, his second wife in 1985
- 50:55and they divorced two years ago.
- 50:58Fuhrman, someone on Simpson's defense
- 51:00team has leaked a smear that the
- 51:01detective is a racist, so biased that he
- 51:04might have set O.J. Simpson up. It's a
- 51:06dirty trick even by Californian
- 51:08standards.
- 51:11It was Fuhrman who found the
- 51:12incriminating blood stained glove.
- 51:14Nothing would serve Simpson's defense
- 51:16team better than to have the honesty and
- 51:18credibility of this key witness
- 51:20impugned.
- 51:21Now, the case of Detective Fuhrman is
- 51:23one example of a potentially dirty trick
- 51:25at work, for there is a subtext to this
- 51:27case. Everyone knows what it is but says
- 51:29little about it in public. It's race.
- 51:32O.J. Simpson is a black man who made it
- 51:34in a white man's world. That image,
- 51:36unthreatening, a genuinely nice guy,
- 51:39affable or corporate American you would
- 51:41rent a car from, broke the stereotype
- 51:43mold.
- 51:44He married a white woman. That's still a
- 51:46sensitive matter here. Now it's alleged
- 51:48he killed her in a rage. The subtext for
- 51:50the racists in Southern California is
- 51:53obvious enough.
- 51:55This is a cafe in South Central, the
- 51:57black area of a city becoming the focus
- 51:59for racial tensions in America. The
- 52:01lines already being drawn over the O.J.
- 52:04Simpson case.
- 52:06I want you to understand where you are.
- 52:08This is an area where white people feel
- 52:11that they are losing ground.
- 52:13In the next decade, they will be a
- 52:15minority in the entire state of
- 52:17California. They are a minority in terms
- 52:20of numbers in the city of Los Angeles.
- 52:23Okay? They are afraid of people of color
- 52:26because of the decades and and and
- 52:28centuries of uh
- 52:32sitting back unapologetically
- 52:34uh treating people of color the way they
- 52:36have.
- 52:38There are malign forces on all sides.
- 52:43In a car park, I met two private
- 52:45detectives who claim to be working for
- 52:47the friends of Nicole Simpson, but whose
- 52:49real job seems to be to spread
- 52:51malevolent gossip, often with racial
- 52:53connotations, about O.J. Simpson to the
- 52:55press.
- 52:56In a nation closely tuned into any
- 52:58information about the case, men like
- 53:00this often find an audience.
- 53:02One of them is armed with smears.
- 53:05What have you learned about O.J. Simpson
- 53:08which you think you want to pass on to
- 53:10uh
- 53:10reporters like me?
- 53:11Well, I've learned that he uh he's not
- 53:14the Mr. Goody Two Shoes uh you know,
- 53:16all-American hero athlete that he's
- 53:18perceived to be.
- 53:20The second detective is camera-shy and
- 53:22hides in the back of the car. Both
- 53:24investigators are anxious to give
- 53:25answers that reflect badly on O.J., but
- 53:28they become more evasive about questions
- 53:30concerning the people who've hired them.
- 53:32Where does the money come from?
- 53:35How do you mean? Well, two of the people
- 53:37are just I would characterize them as
- 53:39independently wealthy, old money in this
- 53:42city, Los Angeles.
- 53:43And just explain to me what old money
- 53:45means.
- 53:46Old money being established, passed down
- 53:49generation to generation, having having
- 53:51been in the city a long time. Their
- 53:53parents in in established large
- 53:56business ventures in this
- 53:59They wouldn't have to look far. Driven
- 54:01by his friend A.C. Cowlings, he was
- 54:03heading south on the freeway.
- 54:05I'm very confident we're going to find
- 54:07O.J. Simpson.
- 54:08Because this is a man who can't hide too
- 54:11easily.
- 54:13Now followed the mandatory but rather
- 54:14sedate police chase. A.C. Cowlings even
- 54:17called them on his mobile.
- 54:18911, what are you reporting?
- 54:20This is This is A.C. I have O.J. in the
- 54:22car.
- 54:23Okay, where are you?
- 54:24Please, I'm coming up the 5 freeway.
- 54:27Okay.
- 54:27Right now we all we are okay, but you
- 54:29got to tell the police to just back off.
- 54:31He's still alive, but he's got a gun to
- 54:33his head.
- 54:34Okay, hold on a minute.
- 54:36Okay.
- 54:37Well, that's all I That's all we have.
- 54:39He's got a gun to his
- 54:40Okay, and what's what's your name?
- 54:42My name is A.C. You know who I am,
- 54:43goddammit.
- 54:44We couldn't actually see O.J., but we
- 54:46seen a guy driving the Bronco. It wasn't
- 54:48O.J., though.
- 54:49As the sky blackened with helicopters,
- 54:51the chase became a procession. Next, a
- 54:53friend of O.J.'s solemnly read what
- 54:55sounded like his suicide note.
- 54:57This letter
- 54:59was written by O.J. today.
- 55:03To whom it may concern.
- 55:08First,
- 55:10everyone understand I have nothing to do
- 55:14with Nicole's murder.
- 55:16I think of my life
- 55:19and feel I've done most of the right
- 55:22things.
- 55:24So, why do I end up like this?
- 55:28I can't go on.
- 55:31No matter what the outcome,
- 55:33people will look and point.
- 55:37I can't take that.
- 55:38Stay back, everybody.
- 55:42I've had a good life.
- 55:44I'm proud of how I lived. My mama taught
- 55:47me to do unto others.
- 55:50I treated people the way I wanted to be
- 55:53treated.
- 55:54This is a copy of that letter, and it
- 55:56does reveal a disturbing and
- 55:58manipulative character.
- 55:59It's maudlin, egocentric, and filled
- 56:01with self-pity. It targets his adoring
- 56:04public, yet oddly expresses not a word
- 56:06of curiosity about who may have killed
- 56:08his ex-wife.
- 56:10Thank you for making my life so special.
- 56:13Think of me as the real O.J. and not
- 56:15this lost person.
- 56:17I have been totally loving and
- 56:20understanding of what she's been going
- 56:22through.
- 56:24At times, I have felt like a battered
- 56:26husband or boyfriend.
- 56:30He says in his letter, the so-called
- 56:31suicide note
- 56:32Which is I knew when it came out was not
- 56:35a suicide note because narcissistic,
- 56:38abusive, obsessive men do not commit
- 56:41suicide.
- 56:42He says there were times when I felt
- 56:44like a battered husband. Why did he say
- 56:46that?
- 56:47Abusers always make themselves the
- 56:50victims. The villain becomes the victim,
- 56:52and the victim becomes the villain.
- 56:54But
- 56:56his ability to the
- 56:59But the most serious thing that affects
- 57:00him is that he has
- 57:02a
- 57:03when he's on trial for his life,
- 57:05he has no champion.
- 57:08He He doesn't get to an adequate lawyer
- 57:12to do any of these things that that have
- 57:15been done for O.J. Simpson. Not one of
- 57:17them.
- 57:18And that's so that there's a sense I
- 57:21keep wondering what these men in prison
- 57:23think as they watch
- 57:25the Simpson trial.
- 57:34San Quentin Prison, death row for some
- 57:37300 convicted murderers, many of them
- 57:39black.
- 57:43I went to visit three of them, all angry
- 57:45that O.J. Simpson has already been
- 57:47granted immunity from the death sentence
- 57:49if found guilty. Multiple murder is a
- 57:52capital offense in California.
- 57:56Inside one of the toughest prisons in
- 57:58America, they contemplate a justice
- 58:00system they believe is hand-tailored for
- 58:02the rich.
- 58:11Convicted men argue that indifferent
- 58:12lawyers, less consultation time, and
- 58:15less investigative work make their
- 58:17chances so much worse.
- 58:19Is this where you have your visits
- 58:20normally, Terry?
- 58:26To put it at its simplest, if you are
- 58:28poor
- 58:30and a minority in the United States, you
- 58:32just don't get the kind of justice that
- 58:34Simpson is getting. Is that what you're
- 58:35saying?
- 58:36If you're poor, period, in this country,
- 58:38you don't get that type of
- 58:39representation.
- 58:40Why not? Is it just a shortage of money?
- 58:45No, the system
- 58:47moves in a certain way, and if you can't
- 58:50shake that
- 58:54way up, if you can't
- 58:59The fallacy about being proven
- 59:03guilty or being innocent until proven
- 59:05guilty, it just doesn't exist. Uh
- 59:07there's a basic misconception that where
- 59:09there is smoke, there is fire.
- 59:12And the average The average, not all,
- 59:15but the average 12 jurors in this
- 59:16country, if you're sitting in the
- 59:18defendant chair, you are guilty.
- 59:20Uh money
- 59:22can help buy you that assumption
- 59:25of innocence.
- 59:26And that's what O.J. has going for him.
- 59:38Were you surprised when the District
- 59:40Attorney decided not to ask for the
- 59:41death penalty for Simpson?
- 59:44I was
- 59:45uh
- 59:47not surprised
- 59:49that he did not ask for
- 59:51in that particular case.
- 59:53Why?
- 59:54Because
- 59:56it would have brought to the forefront
- 59:58the entire state of California. They are
- 59:59a minority in terms of numbers in the
- 1:00:02city of Los Angeles.
- 1:00:04Okay? They are afraid of people of color
- 1:00:07because of the decades and and and
- 1:00:09centuries of
- 1:00:11uh
- 1:00:13sitting back unapologetically
- 1:00:15treating people of color the way they
- 1:00:17have.
- 1:00:19There are malign forces on all sides.
- 1:00:24In a car park, I met two private
- 1:00:26detectives who claim to be working for
- 1:00:28the friends of Nicole Simpson, but whose
- 1:00:30real job seems to be to spread
- 1:00:32malevolent gossip, often with racial
- 1:00:34connotations, about O.J. Simpson to the
- 1:00:36press. In a nation closely tuned into
- 1:00:39any information about the case, men like
- 1:00:41this often find an audience.
- 1:00:43One of them is armed with smears.
- 1:00:46What have you learned about O.J. Simpson
- 1:00:49which you think you want to pass on to
- 1:00:51reporters like me?
- 1:00:52Well, I've learned that he
- 1:00:55he's not the Mr. Goody Two-Shoes
- 1:00:57you know, all-American hero athlete that
- 1:00:59he's perceived to be.
- 1:01:01The second detective is camera-shy,
- 1:01:03hides in the back of the car. Both
- 1:01:05investigators are anxious to give
- 1:01:06answers that reflect badly on O.J., but
- 1:01:09they become more evasive about questions
- 1:01:11concerning the people who've hired them.
- 1:01:13Where does the money come from?
- 1:01:16How do you mean?
- 1:01:17Well, two of the people are just I would
- 1:01:19characterize them as independently
- 1:01:21wealthy, old money in this city, Los
- 1:01:24Angeles.
- 1:01:24And just explain to me what old money
- 1:01:26means.
- 1:01:27Old money being established, passed down
- 1:01:30generation to generation, having having
- 1:01:32been in the city a long time. Their
- 1:01:34parents in in established large
- 1:01:37business ventures in this city.
- 1:01:39Old white money.
- 1:01:40Right, more or less, yeah.
- 1:01:42But what are the motives of the people
- 1:01:45who you won't name who are sponsoring
- 1:01:47you? What is it that they want?
- 1:01:48Well, in the words of at least one, the
- 1:01:51way I remember the initial meeting was
- 1:01:53they wanted to see make sure he was
- 1:01:54convicted, in the words of one, see him
- 1:01:56fry.
- 1:01:57In a country where poverty, crime, and
- 1:01:59race remain inextricably linked in the
- 1:02:01ultra-conservative mind, comments like
- 1:02:04that identify these men's paymasters
- 1:02:06more clearly.
- 1:02:07You said rather enigmatically at the
- 1:02:08beginning of the interview that that
- 1:02:10some of the money was was coming from a
- 1:02:12political source and that it was old
- 1:02:14white money.
- 1:02:15Is that a kind of subtext for for racist
- 1:02:18money?
- 1:02:20No, not at all. In fact
- 1:02:21You mean it could be?
- 1:02:22No, in fact I would characterize these
- 1:02:24people as liberals.
- 1:02:25It's not a liberal sentiment to say I
- 1:02:27hope he fries, is it?
- 1:02:28Right, right. I think they're just so
- 1:02:30fed up with the crime in Los Angeles and
- 1:02:33the and the constant what the way they
- 1:02:34put it, the black eye for this city. And
- 1:02:37they haven't They didn't just move into
- 1:02:38town to get into show business. They've
- 1:02:39been here a long time. They've seen it
- 1:02:41change. They don't like it.
- 1:02:43Why, for all of these very legitimate
- 1:02:44issues,
- 1:02:46is the lightning rod persona an
- 1:02:48African-American man? Why does Why does
- 1:02:50the focus only come when you have these
- 1:02:53scandals or when you have these
- 1:02:54tragedies?
- 1:02:55And I think the African-American
- 1:02:57community
- 1:02:58in dollars fighting to prove his
- 1:02:59innocence, but it's not so much what
- 1:03:01O.J. Simpson is buying as what many
- 1:03:03fellow black suspects can't buy that
- 1:03:05makes this case so controversial.
- 1:03:08What faces the average black defendant
- 1:03:11in a murder case?
- 1:03:13In a sense, uh
- 1:03:15the whole world is against him right
- 1:03:17from the beginning.
- 1:03:19Instead of being like O.J. Simpson and
- 1:03:22and that people don't want to believe
- 1:03:24that he's guilty, everybody wants to
- 1:03:26believe that he's guilty and does
- 1:03:28believe that he's guilty.
- 1:03:30But the most serious thing that affects
- 1:03:31him is that he has
- 1:03:34when he's on trial for his life,
- 1:03:36he has no champion.
- 1:03:39He He doesn't get to an adequate lawyer
- 1:03:43to do any of these things that that have
- 1:03:46been done for O.J. Simpson, not one of
- 1:03:48them.
- 1:03:49And that's so that there's a sense I
- 1:03:52keep wondering what these men in prison
- 1:03:54think as they watch
- 1:03:56the Simpson trial.
- 1:04:05San Quentin Prison, death row for some
- 1:04:08300 convicted murderers, many of them
- 1:04:10black.
- 1:04:14I went to visit three of them, all angry
- 1:04:16that O.J. Simpson has already been
- 1:04:18granted immunity from the death sentence
- 1:04:20if found guilty. Multiple murder is a
- 1:04:23capital offense in California.
- 1:04:27Inside one of the toughest prisons in
- 1:04:29America, they contemplate a justice
- 1:04:31system they believe is hand tailored for
- 1:04:33the rich.
- 1:04:42Convicted men argue that indifferent
- 1:04:44lawyers, less consultation time, and
- 1:04:46less investigative work make their
- 1:04:48chances so much worse.
- 1:04:50Is this where you have your visits
- 1:04:51normally, Terry?
- 1:04:57To put it at its simplest, if you are
- 1:04:59poor
- 1:05:01and a minority in the United States, you
- 1:05:03just don't get the kind of justice that
- 1:05:05Simpson is getting. Is that what you're
- 1:05:06saying?
- 1:05:07If you're poor, period, in this country,
- 1:05:09you don't get that type of
- 1:05:10representation.
- 1:05:11Why not? Is it just a shortage of money?
- 1:05:16No, the system
- 1:05:18moves in a certain way and if you can't
- 1:05:21shake that
- 1:05:25way up, if you can't
- 1:05:30the fallacy about being proven
- 1:05:34guilty or being innocent until proven
- 1:05:36guilty, it just doesn't exist. Uh
- 1:05:38there's a basic misconception that where
- 1:05:40there is smoke, there is fire.
- 1:05:43And the average the average, not all,
- 1:05:46but the average 12 jurors in this
- 1:05:47country, if you're sitting in the
- 1:05:49defendant chair, you are guilty.
- 1:05:51Uh money
- 1:05:53can help buy you that assumption
- 1:05:56of innocence.
- 1:05:57And that
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