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Menstruation, menstrual health and menopause in the workplace | Mariella Frostrup and BSI — Transcript

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0:05finally this is my great pleasure to
0:07welcome presenter journalist and
0:09campaigner Mariella frostrop in 2018 she
0:12made her acclaimed BBC program the truth
0:14about the menopause and then wrote the
0:16best-selling book of which I was
0:18fortunate enough to be co-author
0:20cracking the metaphors which was
0:22published in 2021
0:24last year she co-founds at the campaign
0:26group menopause Mandate of which she is
0:28a chair she has spoken and written
0:31widely about the importance of menopause
0:33education access to treatment and
0:35informed Choice currently helming her
0:38own afternoon show and times radio
0:40Mariella was recently named one of
0:42vogue's 25 most influential women in the
0:45UK her wit passion and quick minds are
0:48legendary good luck
0:50[Applause]
0:58thank you very much Alice Witt what else
1:01did you say look brain fog
1:03um I'm afraid that um I was going to say
1:06fresh from my radio show but um that
1:08would be uh the wrong description of how
1:11you feel after two hours of live radio
1:13in three days so far I've just enough
1:15one more to go anyway I'm absolutely uh
1:17delighted to be here in such excellent
1:20company I'm not sure what the collective
1:22noun is for business people a success a
1:25drive a host I'm not sure but anyway I'm
1:28delighted to see you all here and um I
1:31was just listening to this session uh
1:34here I mean such a fascinating panel and
1:36just listening to people speak with such
1:39passion and eloquence about women's
1:41health I think we all have to remember
1:43how unusual just that very thing is and
1:48um how far we've come already and it
1:52looks like it's been an incredible
1:53afternoon chock full of informative talk
1:55from an array of speakers about an array
1:57of top topics that were ironically
2:00considered unspeakable
2:03um as a teenage girl who used to hide
2:05her tampons under a cereal box when I'd
2:08go to the shops uh to get them I didn't
2:10even need the cereal
2:12um so that no one knew I was having a
2:14period to find myself on this platform
2:17and deeply immersed in the issues being
2:20discussed feels like the great world has
2:23really spun to paraphrase the wonderful
2:25author Colin McCann if you haven't read
2:28his book let the great world spin me I
2:30highly recommend it
2:32um menstruation menopause and the
2:34workplace are very much the topics du
2:37jour I can only congratulate the BSI on
2:39their excellent standard and full-on
2:42recognition of the Zeitgeist the
2:43standard has already had such an impact
2:45and and Promises uh to have far more
2:48over the following years and standards
2:51aren't necessarily what we expect in the
2:53world at the moment exposed as we are to
2:55the incessant lowering of them in so
2:59many aspects of Our Lives from the
3:01political world to the online world
3:03where Anonymous voices create salem-like
3:05conditions without a shred of what used
3:07to be called common decency so what a
3:10pleasure it is to be here at an
3:12institution devoted to creating positive
3:14standards that can be referred to and
3:17measured and ultimately will lead to
3:20making our lives better
3:22embarrassingly until this year sorry my
3:25glasses have stretched because I keep
3:26wearing them on my head it's sliding
3:28down my nose embarrassingly until uh
3:30this year I was woefully ignorant of the
3:34bsi's work
3:35and didn't really realize it was
3:37possible to create a standard for the
3:39workplace that could play a key role in
3:41embracing women's biological Journey
3:43instead of sidelining it as a pesky
3:46stumbling block to continuing business
3:48as usual from Century to Century the
3:51long linear hierarchical progression uh
3:54best suited to the male of the species I
3:57didn't understand that we needed a
3:59standard for the workplace I just knew
4:01full well that we didn't have
4:02legislation protecting those of us whose
4:05possession of ovaries wombs and vaginas
4:07made our working lives different and far
4:10less linear perhaps to the experience of
4:13the other half of the population
4:15why it still comes as a surprise that a
4:18different arrangement of hormones means
4:21just that not demanding or difficult but
4:25different I don't know but there are
4:27unquestionably still many people who
4:30look upon 50 of the population's biology
4:33as inferior and irritating
4:37so I can't quite emphasize that my joy
4:41enough at the excellent beautifully
4:43researched and perfectly presented new
4:46standard menstruation menstrual health
4:48and menopause in the workplace launched
4:51with a Fanfare of excitement news
4:53stories and general Joy this year
4:56deserving of all of them I've read it
4:58from start to finish though I won't be
5:00taking questions thank you but I can
5:03assure you that it is a masterpiece and
5:05I've read a few of those uh there is
5:08I've recently learned a standard for
5:10everything there are standards for all
5:12manner of sectors you know food and
5:14Retail Energy Healthcare manufacturing
5:16the list goes on I'll try not to
5:19standards are the structure around which
5:22our workplaces and economy are woven and
5:25built and as I say I had no fully formed
5:28understanding of their imperative
5:30contribution to our lives until we spoke
5:32with BSI before our last menopause
5:34mandate meeting in Parliament and we're
5:37fortunate is enough to have a preview of
5:40the current one
5:41looking on the BSI website I read that
5:45new standards are developed when there's
5:46a market or organizational need for one
5:49from an employer point of view a
5:51standard can help a business to succeed
5:53reduce costs boost growth and which is
5:56really the end game of any business help
5:58companies become more profitable in the
6:01case of menstruation menopause and the
6:04associated Joys this is the sort of
6:06Clear Blue Sky Thinking and policy that
6:10we desperately need I can't help
6:12wondering why the entire governing of
6:14the UK isn't handed over to the BSI
6:16let's just get it over and done with and
6:18maybe they're just too professional
6:21and the aim of this particular standard
6:25is for organizations to do more for
6:27those employees suffering from the
6:29impact of a totally natural biological
6:32progression from menstruation to
6:34menopause with all the stuff imperative
6:36to our survival as a species in between
6:39including but not primarily focused on
6:42fertility has been the ca which has been
6:44the case for far too long the standard
6:47can be used if necessary to appoint
6:49Employers in the right direction but
6:51really
6:52really it's to enable everyone to do
6:55better to make life easier and to fill
6:57it there and to facilitate employers uh
7:00employees to continue working
7:02as I say I'm not going to deconstruct
7:04the whole thing you can all do that at
7:06your own Leisure but I will flag up a
7:09few excellent points it tackles myths
7:12reminds employers that they should
7:14recognize that there are racial and
7:16ethnic disparities in experiences
7:18something that's coming to the fore more
7:20and more at the moment and needs to be
7:21highlighted by all of us and it gives
7:25clear and very practical suggestions for
7:27employers many of whom do come up with
7:30baffled looks on their faces just going
7:31we really want to do something but we
7:33don't know what to do well here's here's
7:36a clue more than a clue a Direction
7:40the emphasis is on education awareness
7:42and an individual approach that
7:44considers the diversity of experiences
7:46I'd like to think that it's going to be
7:48launched on a global scale uh one of the
7:51great rewards of the work we've been
7:52doing recently on menopause is that many
7:55other countries are looking to the UK
7:58for inspiration how wonderful to think
8:00that we might be global leaders in
8:02something
8:04if only there had been a standard in
8:07place throughout my personal and I
8:09absolutely hate this word and I hate
8:11using it but it just felt appropriate
8:13here Journey
8:15um
8:15I can't think of a of a better word in a
8:18way because that's what we all go
8:19through it though I say that it's not
8:21really been so much of a progressive
8:24Journey as a a slow Dawning realization
8:27that awareness about women's health has
8:29been so appalling that even I a
8:32dedicated campaigner for women's rights
8:34my entire career my entire life seemed
8:37to have overlooked parts of it as
8:39demonstrated by my lack of knowledge
8:41about my own menopause
8:43it's the biggest elephant in the room
8:46ever or at least it was a few years ago
8:49and hopefully gradually is dissipating
8:51the biological experience of women
8:53including trans men and those who
8:55identify as non-binary effects over half
8:58the population 52 percent of the
9:01population
9:01as such it's surely ought to be an
9:04instant number one or maybe maybe we'll
9:08put up with number two
9:10um priority on any government or
9:11employer Health Care agenda
9:15rather it's been the case that our
9:17health has relied for far too long on
9:19the idea that the possession of certain
9:20physical attributes means that we are
9:23lesser versions of humanity The Spare
9:27Rib theory has haunted us down the ages
9:29with the assumption that we're fashioned
9:31from a cast off bit of male anatomy and
9:34our health needs are one and the same or
9:37where they diversify irrelevant
9:40I absolutely can't myself complain about
9:43menstruation or indeed pregnancy on on a
9:46personal level the only downside to
9:48pregnancy for me was my horrific craving
9:51for sardines my husband would come home
9:53and find me inside the fridge door like
9:56cramming another load of them and I mean
9:58that's not um physically unpleasant I
10:00suppose unless you're trying to kiss me
10:02afterwards
10:03um but a boss at the BBC did I
10:06remembered when I was jotting down notes
10:08for this speech tell me when I returned
10:10uh to work 12 weeks after my second
10:13child that my breastfeeding schedule was
10:16inconveniencing the production of the
10:19culture show
10:21um I'm very happy to say that that would
10:22never happen now I think um such
10:25accepted misogyny is no longer tolerated
10:29but I have to admit that my own
10:31menopause hit me like a truck an
10:33invisible one as I had no idea at all
10:37utterly clueless about what was coming
10:39down the track at me
10:41um I mean it's shameful it feels
10:43shameful now because things have already
10:45started to move on which is a really
10:46positive thing but you know I went
10:48through two years of low level anxiety
10:50high level insomnia completely oblivious
10:55to the idea that this complete change of
10:57character and alarming struggle to cope
11:00might have anything to do at all with
11:02midlife hormones menopause was something
11:05you didn't talk about and you knew you
11:07had it if you had a hot flush or turn
11:10and and that was it so it just never
11:13even occurred to me I I suffered from
11:15really
11:16um horrendous anxiety
11:19um but completely irrational you know
11:20I'd be as agitated about you know
11:22whether I'd ordered Tomatoes uh on the
11:25uh Supermarket list to whether we could
11:28achieve world peace uh or whether I was
11:31getting home in time to relieve the
11:33babysitter I mean everything was at a
11:35completely heightened level and I just
11:38had no clue about what was happening
11:42um incidentally back then just a few
11:44years ago I definitely didn't have the
11:46confidence or indeed the knowledge of
11:48the subject to be standing here my my
11:5150th birthday was a particularly muted
11:53event as I just couldn't face large
11:55crowds at all at my 60th I'm happy to
11:58report
12:00um just a few months ago was a rather
12:02raucous weekend with dear friends
12:06probably yeah embarrassingly raucous
12:08really uh with dear friends and and
12:10family from which I emerged um exhausted
12:13but very happy
12:15um but back to Perimeter perimenopause I
12:18mean my temper was horrific I suspect my
12:21husband would gladly testify to this uh
12:24but he says all of it was horrific
12:25pregnancy everything really getting me
12:27pregnant in the first place I mean it's
12:30a sort of constant it's nice to have a
12:31constant in life isn't it
12:34um but alongside the kind of tamper was
12:36the self-loathing and the confusion
12:39because I didn't know what it was so I
12:41just thought I was actually falling
12:43apart and and also that I'd I'd lost
12:45myself I just couldn't find myself in
12:48this morass of hormonal activity as I
12:51understand it now
12:52um I'll gloss over the road to diagnosis
12:54but as is the case for so many women it
12:57was a bit of a postcode and also bank
12:59balance lottery I ended up going private
13:02in order to just get some answers and I
13:04was very very lucky to be able to do
13:06that I know there are lots of people who
13:08go private and don't get their answers
13:09so there is no you know one size fits
13:12all on that
13:14um but suffice it to say there's a
13:16there's a happy ending a sort of happy
13:17HRT pact ending for me anyway
13:22um did my career suffer probably yes uh
13:25but like every other woman on the planet
13:27until very recently there's only been
13:29the niggling sensation of feeling below
13:32par and trying to mitigate and most
13:35importantly disguise uh what pesky
13:38hormones are putting us through in
13:40instead of um shaping the Working World
13:43around our imperative presence in it and
13:47I mean I mean economically imperative uh
13:49presence in it we're forced to try and
13:51find space for our inclusion and that
13:54has to has until recently depended on
13:56maintaining a male standard
13:59and that's really the issue because it's
14:02a playing field full of lumps and bumps
14:04that only one half of the population
14:05have to navigate and until recently
14:08appeared to the other a handicap they
14:11hoped we'd find a way through whilst
14:13keeping our noses firmly to the
14:15grindstone
14:17so like most other women I just got on
14:19with it we've been bred to be stoic to
14:22accept hormones and hormonal turbulences
14:24a lot and to pretend actually that our
14:27hormones don't really exist especially
14:29when it comes to work
14:31I struggled horrendously uh brain fog
14:34and air is better I couldn't even say it
14:36irritability aren't ideal when you're on
14:39uh live radio uh neither is lack of
14:42sleep but in our book cracking the
14:45menopause um we wrote about menopause
14:48being the third shift uh something to be
14:50got on with alongside work and home life
14:52uh the only ones to really suffer being
14:55of course women
14:57had there been the awareness of these
14:59life stages that there are today a mere
15:01decade on then perhaps I might have
15:03recognized my symptoms better sooner
15:06been supported when they were at their
15:08most debilitating and navigated my way
15:11through this inevitable biological phase
15:14most importantly it could have been a
15:16shared experience to laugh about with
15:19friends over a glass of wine recklessly
15:21ignoring the bad night's sleep that that
15:23would ensure and maybe I would have felt
15:26confident enough even uh to mention it
15:28at work
15:31of course being me at once I had my
15:33hands on a pocket full of HRT which
15:35coincided with the nice guidelines God
15:37bless the nice guidelines If Only They
15:39were employed more often
15:42um so coincided with the nice guidelines
15:44being Rewritten I started to write and
15:47talk and actually make a documentary
15:50about menopause and why it so badly
15:52needed uh demystifying
15:55but all the elements of our biology from
15:59menstruation to menopause have been seen
16:01as an inconvenience in the workplace
16:03periods pregnancy and Associated
16:06complications pregnancy loss fertility
16:09problems fibroids endometriosis and pmdd
16:12or until very recently swept under the
16:16carpet
16:17and all of this because it's not been of
16:19interest to those who've historically
16:21written the medical textbooks and made
16:23the rules it's effectively a gas
16:26lighting and a cover-up bigger than the
16:28fact that there was room on that
16:30floating door in Titanic
16:33um
16:34a good example perhaps of how it all
16:38started is back in 300 BC when Aristotle
16:41the revered Greek philosopher we might
16:45question why it suggested that the
16:47reason we have periods is because we are
16:50colder than men as well as less active
16:53positively lazy so we need to get rid of
16:57our excess blood and I'd be tempted to
17:00scrutinize Aristotle's pioneering
17:02philosophies with a Stern eye if they're
17:04anything like as flawed as his
17:06description of women's bodies periods
17:09According to Aristotle are the process
17:11of getting rid of this excess blood
17:13hence the issue when menstruation stops
17:17whereas men of course are constructed
17:20with perfect balance and just the right
17:22amount of heat and blood which they make
17:25into semen for which were incredibly
17:27grateful
17:30um this idea of menstruation as a
17:33cleansing process of some sort or rather
17:36endures for almost another 2 000 years
17:41um incidentally uh just in case you
17:43can't get enough of Aristotle uh he
17:45thought of women as mutilated males
17:49and he may have kicked off the theme of
17:51women being little more than an
17:53embarrassing biological footnote but
17:56things are only just changing now and
17:58medical misogyny I'm afraid Still
18:00Remains Rife obviously the presence of
18:03ovaries and wombs doesn't make us second
18:05best just listen to that sentence
18:08and how ludicrous it sounds nor are they
18:11impediments that need to be worked
18:13around our biology is what should be
18:16shaping business as we go forward that
18:19means that working practice must
18:21fundamentally change to stop the brain
18:23drain that happens along the route of
18:25the female biological Journey that just
18:27happens to coincide with our working
18:30lives and that's what I see starting
18:32very gradually to happen now the
18:35realization that our biology isn't
18:38something to apologize for but accepted
18:40as a part of our lives with time and
18:42research devoted to how we can be at our
18:45individual best and supported when it
18:48comes to the occasional trial and
18:50tribulation as I emerged from my own
18:52experience of menopause an educated
18:54journalists considering myself to be
18:56well informed and aware of my body
18:59I was really really shocked at the death
19:02of general knowledge about the subject
19:04and I remain so I mean if only my
19:07company had had a standard my various
19:09companies I mean I don't mean my various
19:12companies I'm not a magnet but at
19:15various companies I work with in my
19:17experience might have been preempted and
19:19now that's true for so many women out
19:22there
19:23um you know now we have the possibility
19:24of being understood being understood
19:27what might happen and the possibilities
19:29of adjustments being made that very
19:31simply just make working life better
19:35um and this is uh right across the board
19:37as well I mean it's not just in the area
19:39of menopause and that's what I feel so
19:42passionately passionately about today
19:44because working in the menopause sphere
19:47is only highlighted for me the fact that
19:49you know right across the board women's
19:51biology is seen as something that we
19:53have to apologize and make up for that
19:58we need mentors to help us through and
20:01so on and what we've entirely failed to
20:03grasp is that we are 50 to 52 percent of
20:06the population and
20:09absolutely imperative to the future of
20:12our world and so actually it's a
20:14woman-shaped space that we want in the
20:17Working World and it's a completely
20:19different shaped space to the linear
20:21hierarchical one that I referred to
20:23earlier that men have created because
20:25their bodies work differently it's not
20:27as an act of you know punishment to us
20:30but I think it's just what's happened to
20:32evolve and that's what we need to change
20:34today it's not minor adjustments and
20:37slight tweaks you know we who'd ever
20:39thought that we'd be working you know
20:41flexi hours and flexi days until the
20:44pandemic came along and actually opened
20:46the world's eyes to the fact that there
20:48were different ways to do things and
20:50that's what we need to continue with
20:52today I interviewed um
20:55just a few weeks ago on my program on
20:58times radio a young woman I think just
21:01in her early 30s when I spoke to her
21:03um about her endometriosis
21:05um and what she described was just it
21:08was spellbinding radio because it was so
21:10horrifically unjust 10 years of
21:13excruciating Agony that was repeatedly
21:16dismissed as just painful periods and
21:19that she needed to just suck it up and
21:21get on with it and she had to pretend
21:23she was fine until a decade later she
21:26really wasn't by the time she was
21:27diagnosed after a whole 10 years of
21:30humiliation and career setbacks any of
21:32you who've actually found yourselves
21:34calling up
21:36um a a boss and saying to them I'm sorry
21:39I've got bad period pain will know that
21:42you're treated often as though you're
21:44calling up with a hangover or it's a
21:46bear bear excuse for for something else
21:49that you've been up to and and this was
21:51something that this woman had endured
21:52for over a decade and so by the time she
21:55was diagnosed after this decade of
21:57humiliation and career setbacks her
22:00condition was critical because
22:01endometriosis obviously gets worse
22:04her career was in tatters and her
22:07fertility entirely gone her story
22:09doesn't just highlight the agonies that
22:11we might face but also the patronizing
22:14I'm afraid and unhelpful societal
22:16attitude that covers the female
22:18situation you know as I just mentioned
22:21it's seen as flaky shameful even to call
22:24your boss and say you're having a bad
22:26period or indeed that you haven't slept
22:28because of menopausal symptoms and both
22:31those things just add extra stress to an
22:34already stressful situation and here are
22:37some statistics to further show the need
22:39for this standard and support for us 1.5
22:43million British women suffer from
22:45endometriosis as many as 30 percent of
22:48moderate to severe PMs and five to eight
22:51percent have pmdd premenstrual dysphora
22:54dysphoric disorder in addition according
22:58to Women's Health concern one in three
23:00described that period as heavy and at
23:02least one in 20 women speak to their
23:03doctor every year about this problem as
23:07did the young woman that I spoke to
23:09according to the brilliant Fawcett
23:11Society report from last year menopause
23:13in the workplace one in ten women who
23:16worked during the menopause have left
23:18their job June due to menopause symptoms
23:22eight out of ten say their employer
23:24hasn't shared information trained staff
23:26or put in place and menopause absence
23:29policy when it comes to menstruation
23:31this all makes just dismal dismal
23:34listening
23:36um and also worryingly as I do now go
23:39often to different companies to give
23:41talks I'm often accosted in the toilet
23:44afterwards something that began after I
23:46made the menopause documentary and has
23:48continued ever since the toilet's now no
23:52longer a refuge for me but somewhere
23:54where I have some of my most heated
23:56discussions but I often find myself in
23:58these companies and having listened to
24:00you know various bosses described the
24:03wonderful policies that they have in
24:05place the menopause Mentor
24:07Etc and then have women tell me that
24:10actually the the culture is completely
24:12different and that nothing has changed
24:15and I I'm really sad to say that I think
24:17perhaps menu washing might be a new
24:20inclusion in the Oxford Dictionary next
24:23year
24:24um the workplace as I've said is
24:26designed in a linear hierarchical and
24:30patriarchal fashion no wonder after
24:32hundreds and indeed thousands of years
24:34it's not because we're being actively
24:36discriminated against but because the
24:38female form is such a relatively new
24:40presence in every walk of working life
24:45if you want women and trans women and
24:48non-binary individuals to be involved
24:50and to stay involved and frankly if you
24:52want your business to be successful you
24:53don't have a choice
24:55and you want them to give their best and
24:57to actively Aid your company's success
24:59then it's got to be a sea change not
25:03just little changes as I said and tweaks
25:06but an absolute acceptance that the
25:08world that we live in now has been
25:09constructed around one half of humanity
25:12and not around the other and that is
25:15what needs to change a tsunami of change
25:19from the ground up
25:21would I Rejoice over and the BSI
25:23standard is an excellent example of this
25:25is the fact that menstruation pregnancy
25:27and menopause are finally in 2023
25:30accepted as not just an inconvenience
25:33but a fact and one to be openly and
25:35enthusiastically celebrated for its
25:38imperative to the future of our species
25:39not just as something that stops us
25:41being as biologically perfect apparently
25:45as the male of the species
25:48um and I think it's really really great
25:50that so many of you here today
25:51highlighting the fact that businesses
25:52are finally taking responsibility for
25:55the health of half of their employees
25:57the amount of successful people taking a
26:00stand using their voices is increasing
26:03daily all of you here today my menopause
26:06sisters including Davina Penny Lancaster
26:09Lisa Snowden Michelle Griffith Robinson
26:11and Gabby Logan of course my co-author
26:13Alice who's safe hands you've been in
26:16all day there's also Daisy Network
26:18raising awareness of premature ovarian
26:21insufficiency and of course Davina
26:23McCallen and Kate Muir have recently
26:24spoken at about contraception as well
26:27and its failings
26:30um I am personally incredibly proud to
26:33have been a part of the discussions and
26:34as chair of menopause mandate pioneered
26:37some of them
26:38I'm just as excited also to have the
26:41conversation opened up even further and
26:44along with colleagues such as BSI it
26:47looks out to continue improve and
26:49perhaps get even louder but if you leave
26:52this room with anything from what I've
26:54said I really think it has to be a
26:56wholesale Revolution
26:58um you know the times have come for
27:01Change and it really needs to happen now
27:03it's a completely ridiculous
27:05unsustainable and I think unjust uh
27:08situation still and we need to change
27:10that each and every one of us can play a
27:12part thank you
27:15[Applause]
27:21nice
27:23[Applause]
27:25isn't she a washer thank you thank you
27:29very much Mariella and
27:31um thank you to everyone who has been
27:33here who's working towards a more
27:35inclusive and supportive working
27:36environment and finally I'm going to
27:39hand you over to the excellent and Haze
27:41for her closing words after which her
27:43invited to join us for drinks thank you
27:46thanks Alice
27:48um tough at to follow just so we all
27:50know so what I'm going to say is that
27:53um I believe the revolution has started
27:55I believe that this standard is is a
27:58great tool for you
27:59um I also believe that there are drinks
28:01outside so I'm not going to go on too
28:02long there are three three things that
28:04really struck me today are um sort of
28:06the role of this standard is to
28:08normalize the conversation so there's
28:10there's uh a document out there that you
28:13can now take into your workplaces you
28:15can talk to people about it and actually
28:16you have a starting place in order to
28:19have that conversation the other key
28:21thing is not one size fits all what
28:23might work for our organization might
28:25not work in another organization and I
28:27think that's come up a number of times
28:28in the questions and I really can't
28:30emphasize that enough the standard
28:32doesn't say you have to do one thing it
28:34gives you a whole plethora of ideas and
28:36things that you can use about it and
28:38finally there's been a lot of questions
28:39today around or comments today around
28:41people leaving the workforce early not
28:44necessarily of their own choice but
28:46because they feel feel it's impossible
28:48to go on and and I'm actually
28:50coincidentally really proud to say that
28:52today BSI have launched some research
28:54that we've done globally on the second
28:56glass ceiling and why women leave the
28:58workplace and so there should be a QR
29:00code that will appear in a minute and if
29:02it doesn't we'll make sure you get it so
29:04that you can download that report
29:05because all of this information which is
29:08validated information is out there to
29:10help that conversation that you can take
29:12back to your businesses
29:14um our board constantly asked me about
29:15what is the call of action that you're
29:17you're giving people so my call of
29:18action to you is to say uh you need to
29:21go out of here and you need to tell at
29:22least five people about this standard
29:24and you need to tell them that they need
29:25to download it it's free to download we
29:28will take on board comments or at least
29:30the team at BSI well not me personally
29:32but we will all gather together and take
29:33on board the comments we want to make it
29:35a success we believe we have a real
29:37opportunity to make a difference in
29:38having you all here today and online
29:41um just makes that easier for us so
29:43thank you for your attention please stay
29:45for a drink and some food and we really
29:47appreciate the efforts you've all made
29:48to get here today because I know
29:49transport and schools situations has
29:52made that difficult so thank you very
29:53much and thank you to Alice actually
29:55huge thank you
29:58[Applause]

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