Ligia Patrocinio interviewed by Armando Potter, 72andSunny Amsterdam | SPORT BEACH Content Studio — Transcript

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1. 0:09Hi, I'm Armando Potter. I'm the
2. 0:11executive strategy director here from 72
3. 0:14in sunny Amsterdam. And I'm joined here
4. 0:16with my friend, my bestie, Lizia
5. 0:18Patrosino from Heineken, specifically
6. 0:20Desperadoos.
7. 0:21>> Yeah,
8. 0:22>> we're coming at you live from Sport
9. 0:23Beach at K. And we're celebrating the
10. 0:25intersection of sports culture and
11. 0:27fandom. So, with that, we'll get into
12. 0:29the interview.
13. 0:30>> Fun topic.
14. 0:31>> Uh, so we're excited to be working
15. 0:33together across some of the incredible
16. 0:35brands in Hinekin's portfolio, including
17. 0:37Desperadoos. And I wanted to know what
18. 0:40stood out the most about us throughout
19. 0:41the pitch process.
20. 0:43>> Yeah. Well, uh, we are really blessed as
21. 0:46an organization to have the support of
22. 0:48amazing agencies, right? So, creativity
23. 0:50for us is the bar, right? Uh, is the
24. 0:54basic. So I don't need to tell you that
25. 0:56you is mashed on creativity as you
26. 0:59expected but for me what I was really
27. 1:00looking for is the chemistry. We spend
28. 1:03so many hours together, so many late
29. 1:05nights together, right? So many debates
30. 1:07and I think that the moment you have the
31. 1:08click and the chemistry and honestly the
32. 1:11moment I saw you across the room I said
33. 1:14like that's my guy. So, but I won't lie,
34. 1:17like I remember the first time we saw
35. 1:18each other, we really click and we
36. 1:20started hugging each other, which was
37. 1:21weird, but um I think chemistry is
38. 1:23number one because you can have
39. 1:25beautiful creativity, but you if you
40. 1:27cannot communicate and have the
41. 1:29relationship really doesn't worth it.
42. 1:31>> Yeah, just to sort of run with that. I
43. 1:33mean, literally our chemistry shot
44. 1:36across the room while presenting too,
45. 1:38right? Uh and without the chemistry, the
46. 1:41creativity can't build on itself. And so
47. 1:43I think the combination of those two,
48. 1:45chemistry and creativity, two C's.
49. 1:46>> Two C's. C.
50. 1:47>> Oh, look at that. Um, Desperados has
51. 1:51always had this slightly rebellious,
52. 1:53unexpected spirit. As you think about
53. 1:56the next chapter of the brand, how do
54. 1:58you protect what people already love
55. 1:59about it while continuing to evolve for
56. 2:01a new generation of consumers?
57. 2:03>> It's a lovely question because um,
58. 2:06Desperados is a brand uh that people
59. 2:08sometimes forget. We were born from the
60. 2:11mix of two things that should never come
61. 2:13together which was beer and agabi
62. 2:15spirit. Then we were always this brand
63. 2:18about rebellious and party and it's a
64. 2:22brand that really needs to evolve with
65. 2:24the generation. So we really our target
66. 2:26audience is more the younger side of the
67. 2:29link of the drinking le drinking legal
68. 2:32age. Sorry for that. Um and then if you
69. 2:36look at generations they keep evolving.
70. 2:38So when we launched the brand we were
71. 2:39talking with previous generations where
72. 2:41party was different. So for instance, if
73. 2:43I think about the way I used to party
74. 2:45when I was on my 20s,
75. 2:47>> maybe not better, not good to go there,
76. 2:49right? So uh
77. 2:51>> yeah, you get the picture. So the
78. 2:53parties when I was 20 uh was quite
79. 2:55different from the party now. So it's
80. 2:58it's really understanding from this new
81. 3:00generation how do they party? Where do
82. 3:02they feel they belong? How do they feel
83. 3:04they belong? And being part of their
84. 3:06day-to-day. If I think about rebellious,
85. 3:07so that's was always rebellious.
86. 3:10Rebellious was about really going
87. 3:11against the system, right? And breaking
88. 3:13things. Now, rebellious is about finding
89. 3:15my way, mixing things, experimenting,
90. 3:18expressing myself. That's the way the
91. 3:20current generation is rebellious. So, as
92. 3:22soon as the generation start evolving,
93. 3:24the brand has the legs to keep evolving
94. 3:27with it without losing it. So, so we'll
95. 3:29always be rebellious. We always have
96. 3:31this release, the moment, the dance, the
97. 3:34party, the connection, but we have to
98. 3:36evolve with the generations. Yeah, I'm
99. 3:38going slightly off script here, but tell
100. 3:39me how the product is also evolving.
101. 3:42>> Well, the product also evolves because
102. 3:44uh we are a flavor um beer for now, but
103. 3:48we are also evolving in some of our
104. 3:50markets. We're already expanding into
105. 3:52some other categories. Uh we had in the
106. 3:55past um selzer and things like that. So
107. 3:58because the brand is so true to itself
108. 4:01um we actually have the ability to
109. 4:03develop products that the audience wants
110. 4:06to drink when they want to release and
111. 4:08connect with their friends right so
112. 4:10because it's so ingrained in our DNA the
113. 4:12experimentation which we love to say we
114. 4:14can actually experiment with anything
115. 4:16>> um so that give us a lot of freedom for
116. 4:18the future as well
117. 4:19>> yeah I think just to to add to that as
118. 4:22as someone on the agency side who gets
119. 4:24to work with the brand who knows its
120. 4:27identity so well that it can flex among
121. 4:29seemingly disperate products and out of
122. 4:31categories. Like that's super exciting.
123. 4:33You could work on a brand for many many
124. 4:35years and it's just stays in its lane.
125. 4:37So for an agency and again we think
126. 4:39about creativity, there's just something
127. 4:40really exciting about that.
128. 4:41>> 100%. And we can go even beyond uh the
129. 4:44drink category, right? Like
130. 4:46>> the moment the brand the brand becomes
131. 4:48cool and everything, you could go into
132. 4:50um apperal it could go into fashion, you
133. 4:52could go into music as we did last year
134. 4:54with on the drum. So it's it's really uh
135. 4:58flexible, hybrid, fluid as the brand was
136. 5:02born. So yeah, the future is exciting.
137. 5:04>> It's amazing. Uh I think we sort of
138. 5:07touched on this, but what do you see the
139. 5:09biggest opportunities for brands like
140. 5:10Desperados to participate in culture
141. 5:13rather than simply advertise within it?
142. 5:15>> Yeah, that's very interesting, right?
143. 5:17Because a lot of brands, they go like,
144. 5:18"Ah, we do culture." Majority of them
145. 5:20don't do culture. They participate on
146. 5:22trends and majority of them is lamb the
147. 5:24logo. I'm guilty of that as well because
148. 5:26it is hard, right? So, I think the
149. 5:29moment you decide to be a culture-led
150. 5:31brand, you really need to understand the
151. 5:33communities, understand your consumers,
152. 5:35what do they want from you and and
153. 5:37really be part of what they're doing,
154. 5:39not impose yourself into what they're
155. 5:41doing because this generation, they see
156. 5:43everything through, right? So, they they
157. 5:45can smell when the brand is just being
158. 5:47opportunistic. So, we try more and more
159. 5:49to avoid this type of thing and really
160. 5:51build relationship with communities,
161. 5:53with the creators, a long-term
162. 5:54relationship where it's a win-win. We
163. 5:57build on them, then build on us, and
164. 5:58then potentially we create something
165. 6:00that's really interesting for the
166. 6:02community and our audience.
167. 6:03>> Yeah. Yeah. It's the difference between
168. 6:06sort of um uh attaching yourself to
169. 6:10culture and sort of like trying to
170. 6:12follow along or actually building. We a
171. 6:14lot of what we talk about on Desperado
172. 6:15is sort of for the community, by the
173. 6:17community, with the community and so
174. 6:19that the the the difference of what that
175. 6:21means in culture building.
176. 6:22>> Exactly.
177. 6:23>> Um Heineken has built some of the most
178. 6:26recognizable sports partnerships in the
179. 6:28world, but the expectations around
180. 6:29fandom are changing. What have you
181. 6:31learned about modern fans that has
182. 6:33influenced the way you think about brand
183. 6:35building and experiences today?
184. 6:37>> Yeah, we do have amazing platforms in
185. 6:39the Heineken organization which we have
186. 6:41loads of fun with. Um but to really it's
187. 6:44a little bit linked to my previous
188. 6:45answer as well, right? So um they see
189. 6:47through when you are just slamming your
190. 6:49logo. Uh we were talking to one of our
191. 6:52culture voices um and it's like yeah
192. 6:55it's very interesting a lot of brands
193. 6:56they come here to my market and they
194. 6:58slam the logo they throw a nice part and
195. 7:00then they leave right and then they
196. 7:01never come back. So um we are trying to
197. 7:04change that. So for us the opportunity
198. 7:06is really evolve fandom and not just I
199. 7:09go one once but I build the relationship
200. 7:12with them. Uh I experiment with them. I
201. 7:16invite them to experiment with me. And
202. 7:19so for us the the trajectory we want to
203. 7:21go is way less just sponsorships poor
204. 7:24branded sponsorships but really build
205. 7:25things with the communities build
206. 7:27experiences that then they feel they're
207. 7:29part of they belong. So therefore they
208. 7:32can release and build moments that they
209. 7:34will never forget. And hopefully this is
210. 7:37connected to Desperados.
211. 7:38>> Yeah. It's an extended relationship but
212. 7:40it's also uh the beauty of fandom is
213. 7:43that
214. 7:44>> it doesn't just connect with you the
215. 7:46brand, it connects with the f other fans
216. 7:49too.
217. 7:50>> And the community around them. Exactly.
218. 7:53>> But it needs to be genuine and it needs
219. 7:54to really be open and inviting them to
220. 7:58be part.
221. 7:58>> Yeah. Uh At 72 and sunny we always say
222. 8:03creativity is a team sport.
223. 8:04>> We play to win. We like winning.
224. 8:08Hen Despos likes winning too. Uh from
225. 8:11your perspective, what does it take for
226. 8:12a winning agency client relationship?
227. 8:15>> Oh, I I love this question because it is
228. 8:17a team game. Uh you cannot win without
229. 8:20me and vice versa, right? Uh but
230. 8:23sometimes we do go into the cracks and
231. 8:26gets ugly, which is also part. So for
232. 8:28me, you really need to be honest.
233. 8:30Transparency is the number one. Uh keep
234. 8:32the vibe up. So for me, the the the
235. 8:35connection is really important as I said
236. 8:37before, but also some healthy
237. 8:40disagreements.
238. 8:41>> Mhm.
239. 8:41>> I really don't like when I'm talking to
240. 8:43an agency and they just say amen to
241. 8:45everything I'm saying because that's not
242. 8:47when the healthy tension happens. That's
243. 8:49not when the magic happens. So I really
244. 8:52love when someone goes, "Lisa,
245. 8:54Stop there. XY Z." So and I think that's
246. 8:57what we are building as well. So I think
247. 8:59uh it's been a short relationship so
248. 9:00far.
249. 9:01>> I know
250. 9:01>> but I think we spent already more time
251. 9:03on the last two months. I spent more
252. 9:05time with you than I spend with my
253. 9:06husband. So I think u it has to be nice.
254. 9:08It has to be honest. But it also has to
255. 9:11have this tension. So for me this is
256. 9:13this is the secret source actually for
257. 9:15success from a client. I need I need to
258. 9:17allow you to bring me what I'm not
259. 9:20seeing
260. 9:20>> and and vice versa. I mean, creativity I
261. 9:24always like when it's done right, it's
262. 9:27never like this, like a straight line
263. 9:29up. It kind of goes jagged.
264. 9:31>> No,
265. 9:32>> but that's where the tension points are
266. 9:33and that's when you work through it and
267. 9:34it gets better.
268. 9:35>> 100%. And and I really love one of the
269. 9:37things I love about my job is keep
270. 9:39learning,
271. 9:39>> right? So, I think uh we were in a
272. 9:41trajectory, now we are evolving in a
273. 9:43different trajectory. For me, the moment
274. 9:45that you stop me and say, "Hey, but
275. 9:48things is not really that way, right?
276. 9:49And I've been doing this for 25 years."
277. 9:51So believe me, I have a lot of beliefs.
278. 9:53So I love when someone comes and break
279. 9:55my belief and teach me something new.
280. 9:57And that's what I expect from you guys.
281. 10:00>> Hey, we we will live to those
282. 10:01expectations.
283. 10:03>> Um what kind of conversations do you
284. 10:05think lead to the best work?
285. 10:09>> Oh, the juicy ones, the tension ones.
286. 10:12Don't don't agree with me. Uh again I
287. 10:14think I I really love sometimes when we
288. 10:17get to the point that midnight uh
289. 10:19Tuesday when we go like okay let's all
290. 10:21go to sleep and then tomorrow morning we
291. 10:23come back right so that is the moment
292. 10:24that everybody takes in what you're
293. 10:26saying what I'm saying and then that's
294. 10:28when the magic happens the next day so
295. 10:30the tension for me is crucial as in any
296. 10:33relationship I truly believe that
297. 10:34tension really brings magic uh after
298. 10:37some pain but uh it is necessary so yeah
299. 10:41>> such a Brazilian answer from
300. 10:43Is it?
301. 10:44>> I don't know. Why is it a Brazilian
302. 10:46>> something about the tension? You grew up
303. 10:47in it.
304. 10:47>> Tension. Uh, no. But yes, like just it
305. 10:51comes from an honest point, right? Well,
306. 10:53you know me already. You probably you
307. 10:55don't know me yet, but I'm no
308. 10:57I I I I really prefer that you go
309. 11:00straight in my face and tell me just go
310. 11:02around the bushes. So that's me and
311. 11:04that's how I like to manage the brand,
312. 11:07the team, and the relationships. And I
313. 11:09think that so far is creating magic. So,
314. 11:12let's keep
315. 11:13>> I agree with that. Uh, thanks so much
316. 11:15for stopping by, Lia.
317. 11:17>> Thanks for having me.
318. 11:18>> We appreciate the time. That's it for
319. 11:20now. We're all on the ground here at
320. 11:22Can. Follow 72 and Sunny on socials to
321. 11:24catch up on all the action.
322. 11:25>> And it's really hot.