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0:00Have you heard about Top Host, the
0:03contest that is sponsored by On Air with
0:06Ryan Seacrest and iHeart Radio? Well, I
0:09am honored to represent the faith
0:11community. And right now, I am top 15.
0:16That means I need you to organize your
0:20faith community and vote. Let's show
0:24Ryan Seacrest that the faith community
0:26knows how to rock the vote. Because
0:30faith conversations matter. So, all you
0:32need to do is scan this QR code.
0:37God bless you. I'll see you on Top Host.
0:42Hello, beloved. I have a very special
0:45[music] guest with me today, Pastor
0:48Darlene Rankin.
0:50She has been walking with the Lord for
0:5233 years, experiencing first hand the
0:55transforming power, faithfulness,
0:57[music]
0:59and redeeming grace of Jesus.
1:02She carries a commissioning and mantle
1:04from the Lord to preach, teach, and
1:06minister healing through the power of
1:08the Holy Spirit. She has ministered in
1:11pregnancy centers, county jail,
1:13rehabilitation facilities, and in four
1:17other countries. Currently, she serves
1:20alongside her [music] husband as
1:22co-pastor of Kingdom Point Church in
1:25Georgetown, Texas.
1:27Her ministry includes weekly Bible
1:29studies, leading weekly intercessory
1:32[music] prayer, mentoring women, and
1:34ministering deliverance to those seeking
1:36freedom from spiritual bondage.
1:39Her life's message is simple. What God
1:42heals, He can use. Whom Jesus sets free,
1:46He can send. And every testimony belongs
1:49to the glory of the one who [music]
1:50saves, restores, and transforms lives.
1:54Come and join us for today's
1:56conversation.
2:00The Trumpets of Truth podcast is
2:02designed for those who know they are
2:04called and to equip [music] you in the
2:06confidence you need to carry out that
2:09calling. Through biblical [music]
2:11understanding, you'll discover how God
2:13created you and the blueprint [music]
2:15within your fingerprints so you can walk
2:18in purpose. Our podcast [music] is an
2:21intentional tool for you to be empowered
2:23so you can walk in radical influence and
2:26advance the kingdom of God where he has
2:28called you to go.
2:30It's time [music] for you to awaken,
2:32arise, and advance.
2:46Hello, Pastor Darlene. Thank you for
2:49being with me today.
2:52>> It's a blessing to be here.
2:54>> I want you to know how honored I am to
2:58have you with me today. Truly honored
3:00because you and your husband have had
3:03such an incredible journey. Your church
3:07is just an amazing
3:10member in the body of Christ and you and
3:14Pastor Jerry have just been such solid
3:18support systems for
3:20Jeffrey and I personally and for this
3:23ministry. So, I just want to honor you
3:26and say thank you.
3:28>> You're so sweet.
3:30>> [laughter]
3:31>> It's just true.
3:32>> We're very blessed to have the two of
3:34you in our hearts and in our lives,
3:37truly. The only thing that is difficult
3:40for us is that you're so far away.
3:42>> I know.
3:44>> [laughter]
3:45>> Too far, too far.
3:47And it's hard to believe that our
3:50husbands have known each other for 30
3:53years.
3:56>> You're making me feel really old now.
3:58>> [laughter]
4:00>> That is a long time.
4:02>> It is. And they have some amazing
4:05stories and testimonies.
4:07>> Yeah.
4:07>> It's really sweet.
4:09>> Yeah, how fun. And you know, I it's it's
4:13truly amazing when
4:16you have such strong bonds in Christ
4:19with other people and you have journeyed
4:22together on some level for a significant
4:26amount of time.
4:28And
4:29you know, just what a blessing it is
4:31that we do have each other. So, I want
4:33to thank you for that.
4:35>> Thank you. It is, you know, um
4:39that's not normal to have those kind of
4:41connections for that long. You can
4:43usually count on one hand
4:46people that are a part of your story for
4:49most of your life. They're few
4:51and far between.
4:52>> Yeah, it really
4:54is.
4:55>> It really is.
4:57Well, as you know, today we are
4:59continuing our discussion on church
5:02hurt.
5:03And I have to admit that even in this
5:06conversation over the last several
5:09weeks,
5:10um probably about a month now at this
5:12point, it's even opened my eyes at how
5:16widespread church hurt actually is.
5:20And so, my first question to you is
5:24you know, before I approached you and
5:26asked you to do an episode with me on
5:28this topic, have you ever thought much
5:31about church hurt before?
5:34>> Absolutely, I have.
5:37Um
5:38because I've been hurt.
5:39>> Mhm.
5:40Yeah.
5:42>> Um you know, I really tried to pray
5:44about this and sit down and put thoughts
5:46on paper after you um reached out.
5:50And the first thing that came to mind
5:52is, what is it? Where did we somehow in
5:55the body of Christ
5:57um
5:58buy into the idea or the lie, if you
6:01will,
6:03that we're going to come into the body
6:04of Christ and we're just not ever going
6:07to get hurt.
6:08Because the body of Christ is full of
6:11broken people.
6:13And as I started to think about it like
6:15that,
6:16we're all in the process of being
6:18sanctified and changed and healed. And
6:23because we're in all different kinds of
6:25places, different levels of maturity and
6:28growth,
6:29um we're going to have those times where
6:32we're not going to
6:34uh connect, relate, or love each other
6:37the way Christ does.
6:39Cuz we bring our brokenness with us. So,
6:42the idea that we're going to come in and
6:44it's just going to all come together and
6:46we're not going to have any struggles is
6:48not realistic.
6:50>> That is such a great point because often
6:55we think of the church in general in a
6:58certain way and we think once we enter
7:01in,
7:01>> Mhm.
7:02>> now we're we're just safe and everything
7:05is going to just work itself out. And,
7:08you know, part of that is true to some
7:10extent, right?
7:12>> [laughter]
7:12>> Mhm. It is.
7:14>> But often not the way that our brain
7:15processes that.
7:18>> Well, it's just it can be messy
7:20sometimes because we come in with
7:22things, especially and this is where it
7:24kind of took me as I thought about it.
7:27I can think of different seasons of my
7:30walk with the Lord
7:32and how I've experienced hurt in each
7:34one.
7:35Mhm. What I mean by that is like I
7:39have had hurt that I experienced a young
7:42believer, okay? That was different from
7:46hurt that I experienced
7:48after I had been walking with the Lord
7:51for a season, and then I had another
7:54experience as being someone who was
7:56raised up and called to a leadership
7:59role in the body of Christ.
8:02And I experienced even another kind of
8:04hurt. So,
8:05it's like I feel like I've been on both
8:08sides.
8:09>> Mhm.
8:10>> Being someone who wasn't leading, being
8:12someone who is, and then the the
8:15transition in between.
8:17>> Yeah. Yeah. So, when you experienced
8:21church hurt when you were not a leader,
8:24um how were you able to kind of journey
8:28past that hurt?
8:31>> Well, I'll tell you honestly,
8:33uh how I got hurt was I really wanted to
8:37connect and I really wanted to fit in.
8:40And I felt like I just couldn't find my
8:42place. And no matter
8:45it seemed what I did, it just was like I
8:48I didn't fit.
8:50And I was so extremely blessed, this
8:53sister uh in the Lord will never know
8:55until probably I see her
8:57>> Mhm.
8:58>> on the other side,
9:00how God used her to help me. It's This
9:03is how I how I how I walked through it.
9:06>> Wow.
9:07>> She was obedient.
9:09She prayed, she heard the Lord, and she
9:12reached out. And she didn't even live
9:14here, she's in Oregon, okay?
9:16>> Wow.
9:16>> And so, she wrote me uh
9:19she was just being led by the Holy
9:21Spirit, and she wrote me and said,
9:23"You know, I was praying, the Lord has
9:25given me this word for you. I felt
9:26compelled to write." And the Lord said,
9:30"Stop trying to um
9:34conform and become a form of something
9:38that he didn't make you to be. Quit
9:40trying to force yourself into something
9:43to become something you're not.
9:46And it was liberating for me because I I
9:49had the freedom to let's just walk this
9:51out with him, let him teach me who I am
9:55in him instead of me trying to be
9:57someone else.
9:59>> Wow.
10:00>> We're not going to ever be
10:02a good someone else, right?
10:04>> That's so true.
10:05>> [laughter]
10:06>> And
10:06>> And so here I was because I was I just
10:09wanted I just wanted so desperately to
10:12be connected and a part of
10:16and it wasn't that they weren't
10:19friendly or loving or kind to me. They
10:21didn't even realize how they were
10:23hurting me.
10:25It wasn't intentional in any way.
10:27>> Right.
10:28>> It was more about my own brokenness and
10:31my
10:32internal things that had not even yet
10:35been addressed, right?
10:37>> Yeah.
10:37>> That I came into the body with that
10:40really the enemy of my soul was using to
10:43try to discourage me.
10:45>> Mhm.
10:46>> Right? So having a a someone in the body
10:49who was willing
10:50to pray, to be obedient, and to reach
10:53out
10:55that I was seen
10:57by the Lord like that.
10:59>> Wow.
11:00>> Does that make sense?
11:01>> Yeah. And I think that's very
11:04encouraging to make sure that for anyone
11:07who's listening who's still in that
11:09place and they have been hurt
11:12don't block everyone out of your life.
11:16>> Right.
11:18You're right. You're right.
11:19>> Yeah.
11:19>> And so then the next thing that happened
11:21when I like I look at as a transitionary
11:24period
11:25>> Mhm.
11:26>> I had been walking with the Lord for a
11:28considerable amount of time.
11:30I even went through a season of not
11:32really having anyone and the Lord told
11:34me the reason that he did that was
11:36because he didn't want them to take his
11:38place.
11:39>> Wow.
11:39>> And I needed to learn how to
11:43uh have my relationship without him
11:45without other influence so they wouldn't
11:48become an idol. So I've come out of the
11:50backside of that
11:52and he wraps me with around me all these
11:55amazing anointed women
11:59that I'm doing life with
12:01and um very powerful times of ministry.
12:05But then what happened um
12:09I mean there was it was it was beautiful
12:11cuz I had never experienced
12:12relationships with women like that in my
12:15life before. And you know in the world
12:17it's not the same.
12:18>> That's for sure.
12:20>> And it shouldn't
12:20>> [laughter]
12:21>> it shouldn't look like the world in the
12:23body either, right?
12:25>> Yeah.
12:26>> Um but then God raised us up.
12:29And when he raised us up
12:31to make us overseer over our peers
12:35what happened
12:37and how I got hurt was they couldn't
12:39make the transition.
12:41>> Um
12:42Yeah.
12:43>> And um so they left.
12:46And I found myself in a place where I'd
12:49been surrounded by all these
12:51amazing women to where now I had no one
12:54again.
12:55>> Ugh.
12:56Yeah.
12:57>> And it was directly related to the fact
13:00that I had been really pushed by the
13:02Lord into this new place.
13:05And it really really hurt because my
13:08heart and my spirit was sewn into
13:10theirs. We we prayed for
13:14so many people together. Ministered to
13:17so many people, fed people, clothed
13:19people. I mean we did life.
13:21>> Yeah.
13:21>> Right.
13:22And then they just walked away.
13:24>> Wow.
13:26>> So I had that and then
13:29on the other side after being raised up,
13:33you can get really, really hurt um by
13:36the people you're trying to lead.
13:39>> Yeah.
13:40>> Because um
13:43there are, you know, unfortunately,
13:46uh people that you're trying to minister
13:48to and
13:50um
13:51they
13:52there's envy, there's jealousy, there's
13:54competition, there's comparison, all of
13:57those things can happen, especially with
13:59women, unfortunately.
14:00>> Right.
14:01>> Um
14:03and you know,
14:05if I if I can stay in a place where I
14:07realize it's because what's in them, you
14:10know, if it's in them, it's going to
14:11come out, right? You can't
14:16you may be able to fake it for a while.
14:18>> [laughter]
14:18>> Somebody can maybe fake it for a while,
14:21but enough pressure, right?
14:24Uh enough pressure happens and then the
14:26result is whatever's inside of that
14:29person is going to come out, just like
14:30the word says, right? Out of the mouth
14:33the heart speaks.
14:34>> Yes.
14:35>> And and so, you're seen as um their
14:39adversary when you're really
14:42you're fighting for them, you're praying
14:44for them, you're believing for them,
14:45things about them they don't even
14:47believe for themselves.
14:48>> Right.
14:49>> And yet you're considered
14:52uh the adversary.
14:54That is very painful.
14:56>> Yeah.
14:57>> Um I heard somebody say one time, when
15:00you love people, it's like
15:02the branches on a tree
15:04and you go out on the branch and you put
15:06yourself out there.
15:08>> Mhm.
15:09>> And then sometimes the branch breaks.
15:12>> Uh
15:13>> And you fall to the ground and you get
15:15hurt, you get bruised up. But
15:18you get up and you climb back on the
15:20tree and you climb out onto another
15:22branch and you love another person
15:25and you put yourself out there.
15:28That's what the Lord would do.
15:30>> Yeah.
15:30>> That's what he's actually asking us to
15:33do.
15:34>> Yeah.
15:34>> Yeah, I'm not saying it's easy.
15:37But when we're leaning on him and asking
15:39him and truthfully, Karina, you know,
15:42even when these very painful situations
15:45happen through very broken people
15:49myself included, right? At different
15:51stages of my walk with the Lord.
15:55>> Yeah.
15:56>> God still uses all that.
15:58>> He sure does.
15:59>> He uses it to um reveal things within us
16:03that we need to confront and deal with.
16:06>> Yeah.
16:06>> And the idea that we can just come in
16:09and we don't we're done.
16:11We're all good now. No, no you're not.
16:14That's just the first step.
16:16Which just lends me all leads me all the
16:18way back to the beginning, which is
16:20where do we get the idea that we're
16:22going to come into a body of believers
16:26filled with all different kinds of
16:27people from all kinds of places with all
16:30different kinds of stories and
16:32brokenness and pain and hurt
16:35and think that there aren't going to be
16:37some not good things come out of us.
16:40>> Right. Right. And so sometimes that the
16:44beginning of church hurt in a person um
16:48starts out with expectations
16:51>> Absolutely.
16:52>> other people instead of really just
16:56getting to know one another's journey.
16:59>> Yes, and having mercy and grace for each
17:02other.
17:02>> Yes.
17:03>> And you know, when you have expectations
17:05and they're not met, you set yourself up
17:08for disappointment and discouragement.
17:10Hope deferred makes the heart sick. I
17:12have this idea and expectation of how I
17:15think things are going to be
17:17And then when it doesn't come through,
17:20now, you know, we've actually put more
17:22on another person than we should. We
17:24should never, you know, I've had to
17:26minister to women and tell them
17:28you you should never allow another
17:31person to have that much power in your
17:33life.
17:33>> Yes.
17:34>> The only person that you should allow to
17:37do that is the Lord Jesus.
17:40>> Yeah.
17:40>> And so we can get spiraled to a place
17:43where we get so um overrought with
17:46emotion, we're no longer thinking
17:48clearly,
17:50and we're just reacting
17:52out of raw emotion and hurt.
17:55>> Right.
17:55>> And we can say and do things that are so
17:57extremely destructive to the body.
18:01You know, the Holy Spirit told me a long
18:03time ago, at first I was like, what?
18:06>> [snorts]
18:06>> And he said to me,
18:09the And what it was is I was praying for
18:12a worship team, and I was watching some
18:14things that were going on on this
18:16worship team.
18:17And I'm just going to tell you, there
18:19can there can be some really messed up
18:21stuff because of egos
18:23>> [laughter]
18:23>> Right.
18:24>> and pride. And um not just on a worship
18:27team by any means, but I've seen a lot
18:30there. And the Holy Spirit said to me,
18:33the body of Christ is cannibalizing
18:35itself.
18:36>> Mhm.
18:37>> What?
18:39Backbiting, gossip, slander,
18:43>> Yeah.
18:43>> uh the competition and comparison, all
18:46the things of jealousy and envy, all the
18:48things that were going on. The body is
18:51devouring itself.
18:52>> Mhm.
18:53>> And I was just like, oh my gosh, Lord.
18:57And that's what the enemy does with the
18:59hurt that we don't resolve.
19:01>> Yeah.
19:02>> That we don't confront, that we don't
19:04deal with.
19:06And um
19:07he loves that.
19:09Cuz as As as we're turned in on each
19:11other, we're not doing what we're
19:12supposed to be doing.
19:14>> Exactly.
19:16>> [laughter]
19:18>> Exactly. And I think that's one of the
19:20sneaky tactics of the devil because not
19:24all church hurt comes in an obvious way.
19:27Like, you know, just bam, in your face,
19:29all at once, surprise, church hurt. I
19:32mean, it's often, right? The enemy is
19:34very clever.
19:36And he starts to just build that
19:40bitterness little by little, that
19:43resentment little by little.
19:47And, you know, it, unfortunately, can
19:50change people's hearts in the opposite
19:52direction.
19:54>> So true.
19:55>> Yeah.
19:56>> Yeah, I was I was sitting here making
19:58notes to myself before we started and,
20:00you know, so a person gets hurt in one
20:03place
20:04and and they leave
20:06offended
20:08and hurt
20:10and they go to another place and, you
20:11know, they take it with them.
20:14They take the baggage with them.
20:16>> Yeah.
20:16>> And so they come in the door and they're
20:19already carrying all that and chances
20:21are, if this is a pattern and a cycle in
20:24their life,
20:25that they brought some with them when
20:27they came, right? Unless they're willing
20:30to do the hard work
20:32that we need to do sometimes. I'll tell
20:34you the truth, the the the Lord said to
20:36me this morning, he said, "You don't get
20:39off the potter's wheel."
20:41>> [laughter]
20:44>> Wow.
20:44>> You don't get off the potter's wheel and
20:46I'm like, okay.
20:49Um
20:50there's always more, um,
20:53like the layers of an onion, right? Uh
20:56uh
20:57greater depths of healing and revelation
21:00that the Lord wants to bring to us and
21:02we can only handle so much at a time and
21:04sometimes we're just not mature enough
21:06to even handle it.
21:07>> Right.
21:08>> Right?
21:09But he knows what we what we know and
21:10don't know and when we're ready.
21:13And you know, um,
21:15so I was thinking about and reflecting
21:17on that. So they can carry their
21:19bitterness, their hurt, their
21:20unforgiveness, their offense to the next
21:23place and they've already got a bucket
21:25full of that when they get there.
21:27So chances are even if it was like
21:30really
21:31if you could so call a perfect fit for
21:34them,
21:35they're going to still find something
21:36wrong because eventually at some point
21:39because they haven't dealt with the the
21:41matters of the heart that they need to.
21:44Cuz we are clearly told and admonished
21:46in the word of God that we need to
21:48forgive.
21:50We're told that if there's an issue, we
21:52need to go and make things right with a
21:54brother or sister in the Lord.
21:56>> Yeah.
21:56>> And many times people do not want to do
21:58that. I I have literally had to sit at a
22:01table
22:03with a couple of women. Actually, Jerry
22:05and I did this and brought their
22:07husbands in.
22:08So we were all around a table
22:11and they were at odds with one another.
22:14And um, we used the word and, you know,
22:18we we're supposed to
22:20forgive. We're supposed to work through.
22:23You you can't even You're not even
22:24supposed to take an offering to the
22:26altar
22:27>> Right.
22:28>> until you make things right with your
22:30brother or sister.
22:31>> Right.
22:32>> Or take communion and you're you're
22:35you're heaping judgment on yourself.
22:36Some have even died. Some are sick. This
22:39is all scripture, right?
22:41And so what they've done was they were
22:43creating their own camp.
22:45>> Yeah.
22:45>> Drawing trying to draw people to their
22:47side, if you will, right?
22:49>> Wow.
22:51>> And we could see that this was
22:52happening. So that's why we're like, we
22:54have to address this. This is one of the
22:56things we have to do. We have to address
22:58issues when they come up. We can't
23:00ignore them, sweep them under the rug,
23:03act like it's not happening, right?
23:05And um
23:07so
23:08we we basically told them all these
23:10things and one woman said
23:13I was wrong
23:15and asked for forgiveness.
23:16>> Oh, praise the Lord.
23:18>> Yeah, if only they had both said that.
23:22And the other one said
23:24I'm
23:25I'm not I'm not going to do this and I'm
23:28not ever going to come back here and I'm
23:30I'm not going to sit under you
23:33and
23:34um
23:36it was really sad and they never came
23:38back, but
23:39her husband said
23:42you do realize what the word says, that
23:44if you do not take care of this
23:48you know, it's the uh parable where the
23:50one man is forgiven of the really great
23:52debt and he's forgiven and then he
23:54somebody owes him something that it's
23:55far less and he won't forgive them,
23:58right? And then the master finds out and
24:00what happens is he's turned over to the
24:03tormentors.
24:04>> Yes.
24:05That's it.
24:06>> And so that's what this guy said to his
24:07wife, you're going to be turned over to
24:09the tormentors for not doing what's
24:11right.
24:12>> Wow.
24:13>> And he just looked at us like
24:16held his hands
24:18>> Oh.
24:18>> like
24:19and followed her out of the room.
24:22>> Wow.
24:23>> And you know, so um
24:26when I say I've been on all sides of it,
24:28I am not kidding and I'm sure you have
24:30too.
24:31So I was thinking, okay, so I have
24:34different experiences
24:36myself of what I've gone through and how
24:38I've been hurt, right?
24:40>> Yeah.
24:41>> And then I'm thinking, so what does that
24:44look like? How do we How do we
24:46How do we deal with those things? Well,
24:48the very first thing we have to do is go
24:50to the Lord.
24:51>> Yes.
24:52>> We need to take it to the Lord. I always
24:54tell the ladies here, I'm like, you know
24:55what? You need to go to the throne
24:56before you go to the phone.
24:58>> Come on.
24:59>> [laughter]
25:00>> There's nothing wrong with you having,
25:02you know, your good friend, sister in
25:05Christ, uh that you're
25:07you know,
25:09you're close to that uh but you know
25:12what? Sometimes people don't hold you
25:14accountable the way they need to.
25:16>> Yes.
25:17>> And they're going to give you a yes when
25:19you don't need to hear a yes.
25:21And so, we need to go to the the Lord
25:24first and ask the Holy Spirit to examine
25:26our heart. Is the reason why this
25:28triggered me this way because of some
25:30unresolved issue within my heart?
25:33>> Right.
25:34>> You know, is this why I'm so emotional
25:37about this situation or circumstance
25:39because maybe there's some healing that
25:41still needs to take place in me?
25:44But instead, what happens is people
25:46would rather, you know, point the finger
25:49uh and go and talk and and stir things
25:52up than actually stop and be in
25:54perspective and examine their their own
25:57heart.
25:58>> Right.
25:59Yeah.
26:00>> To make sure they're where they need to
26:02be.
26:03>> Right.
26:04>> Right.
26:05That was the first. Take responsibility
26:08for your own part, whatever that might
26:10be.
26:11>> Yeah.
26:12>> Um
26:14and stop overlooking patterns. We can
26:16have patterns and I and I always tell
26:18the ladies this, too. You know what? If
26:20you have a pattern that continues to be
26:22repeated in your life, guess what? Who's
26:24the common denominator? You are.
26:27>> [laughter]
26:28>> And if you're the common denom-
26:30denominator, that tells me that there
26:32are some issues that you need to deal
26:34with.
26:35>> Yeah.
26:35>> And you know, it's
26:37it's because I lived it myself.
26:41And you know, so that leads me to think
26:43of things like
26:45you cannot take a person to a place you
26:48yourself have not been.
26:50>> That's right.
26:52Yeah.
26:53>> You cannot impart things to people that
26:56you don't have.
26:58Right?
26:59>> Yeah.
26:59>> If I'm not willing to go and do the
27:02things the Holy Spirit's instructing me
27:04to do, if I'm not willing to pay the
27:06price, if I'm not willing to make
27:11sacrifice, whatever it is he's
27:13requiring, I am not going to have the
27:15oil, I'm not going to have the wisdom,
27:16the discernment that I need when it
27:18comes to dealing with things that come
27:19in life. And you're going to We're going
27:21to have relational issues.
27:23>> Right.
27:24Yeah.
27:25>> Yeah.
27:26>> Yeah.
27:26>> And so, if we can learn how to
27:29deal with our own stuff first, if there
27:32is any,
27:34>> Yeah.
27:35>> and then try to actively pursue
27:38reconciliation with the other party.
27:41>> Yes.
27:42>> Again, I like to tell the ladies, "Okay,
27:45let's just say, hypothetically, there's
27:48a circumstance that you're dealing with
27:50in a relationship, and you go and do
27:52what you're supposed to biblically do.
27:54What is your part? You're not
27:56responsible for the reaction of the
27:58other person.
28:00>> Right.
28:00>> You cannot make another person want to
28:03have a relationship with you. And the
28:05truth is, do you really want to have a
28:07relationship with somebody who doesn't
28:09really want to have one with you?
28:12>> Right.
28:13>> That's not willing to be invested in the
28:15relationship even when it's hard?
28:17>> Yeah.
28:18>> We should want accountability. We should
28:21want to have to be much maturing. Again,
28:25I know I'm I'm probably rambling, but
28:27it's like I always tell the ladies,
28:30"You should be in a different place
28:32today than you were a year ago today."
28:34>> Yeah.
28:34>> That's called growth.
28:36>> Yes.
28:36>> That's called growth. And the kingdom of
28:38God is about growth. It's about
28:41progression. It's about moving forward.
28:43And if you're still
28:44going around the mountain in the same
28:46place,
28:47you need to start with you.
28:49If you're still on the same
28:51merry-go-round,
28:53if the other player on the other side of
28:55the problem is shifted, but you're still
28:57there, we're back to common denominator
28:59again.
29:00>> Yes.
29:01>> You can't keep
29:03you know,
29:04uh blame shifting and projecting onto
29:07other people all the time.
29:09>> Right. Absolutely.
29:11>> And somebody has to be willing to say
29:13these things sometimes.
29:16>> Yes.
29:16>> And
29:17I get to do that.
29:19It's not always fun. I don't relish it,
29:23but I'm not afraid of it.
29:25Because I know the fruit that it can
29:27bear if they will actually do what
29:29they're supposed to do, right?
29:31This is so much bigger, right? It's a
29:34bigger picture, really. I know it's
29:36personal. I know it's relational that
29:39you got hurt by somebody, but
29:41okay, the word says,
29:44if one part of the body hurts, the whole
29:46body hurts, right?
29:48If one part of the body rejoices, then
29:51the whole body is to rejoice with the
29:53the person that's rejoicing.
29:56And so,
29:57you don't live in a vacuum. You don't
29:58live in a void. The things you do and
30:01say have an impact on the people around
30:03you, and you're either building up or
30:05you're tearing down
30:07>> Yeah.
30:08>> by your relationships with people and
30:10how you treat them.
30:11>> Yeah.
30:13And I think a part of that equation,
30:15too, is when people come into the church
30:18and, you know, come in with the stuff
30:21that they come in with,
30:23they try to approach and have
30:25relationship within the church body in
30:28the way that they do
30:30in the world or that they have done in
30:32the world. And, you know, the world is
30:35not about accountability.
30:37>> [laughter]
30:37>> Not at all.
30:39It feels good, do it.
30:41>> Right.
30:42>> Right?
30:42Mhm.
30:44>> And you know, trying to um
30:46expound on model the example and teach
30:50about, you know,
30:52how we are supposed to be different. We
30:54are supposed to be a peculiar people.
30:56We're not supposed to sound like, act
30:58like,
30:59uh look like
31:01the world.
31:02And um you have to ask yourself, are you
31:05know, do you just know about Jesus or do
31:08you really know him and are you sold out
31:10to him to the point that you're willing
31:12to do the work to work through these
31:14issues when they happen cuz they're
31:16going to.
31:17>> Right.
31:18>> You can't get around
31:20>> [laughter]
31:21>> I I I
31:22>> breathing, there's going to be an issue
31:24at some point.
31:26>> Yeah.
31:27So um one of the uh one of the things I
31:31had here was, you know, you got to speak
31:33directly and privately to people, right?
31:35We use the word, you go and speak to the
31:37person. If they won't, then you bring in
31:39another person. You use just point them
31:42I I'm I'm a big, you know, I I love the
31:45Holy Spirit and I follow after him and I
31:48listen to him, but I'm also very much
31:50the word. What does the word say?
31:53Uh the Holy Spirit is always going to
31:55come together with the word. They're not
31:57going to They're not going to clash.
31:59They're going to affirm and confirm one
32:01another, right?
32:02>> Absolutely.
32:04>> And so it's like um
32:06we're going to use the word as the basis
32:08for how to address the problem.
32:10And you know, honestly, Corina, a lot of
32:13people don't want to do that cuz it's
32:14not easy.
32:15>> I know.
32:17Uh I I
32:19>> I'm thinking another circumstance with a
32:21couple of women that were on a worship
32:23team, okay?
32:24And they, you know,
32:27uh
32:28again, it's the same MO every time. It's
32:31jealousy, comparison, competition.
32:34There's some gossip and slander going
32:36on. Uh
32:38all the wrong things, right?
32:39>> Right. Yeah.
32:40>> Call them in, sit them down, use the
32:42word.
32:43Same thing as with these other women,
32:45but this time I'm like
32:49y'all have to be able to speak out and
32:53talk to each other openly in a safe
32:55place right here.
32:57>> Yeah.
32:58>> Why? Why How did you get here? What
33:01happened? Where did you get hurt? What
33:03did someone say or not say? Where What
33:07are the real issues here that you have
33:09with one another? Because you're not
33:11going to be able to move past this place
33:12until you're willing to be honest and
33:15really talk it out. And they honestly
33:18did not want to do it at first. And I
33:20just said, "You know what? We're not
33:22leaving here today
33:23>> Come on.
33:24>> until we start working through some
33:26stuff, right?" And so finally they
33:29opened up and they started sharing their
33:31hearts. And then there were tears and
33:34there was forgiveness
33:35and they hugged each other.
33:38I couldn't help myself. I was like, "You
33:40know what? Y'all are so lucky because if
33:42my mother was in the room, she would
33:43make you kiss and hug, okay? When you
33:45make up."
33:46>> That was my grandma, too. My grandma
33:48would be like, "Okay, now hug. Hug. Tell
33:50each other you love each other and give
33:52each other a hug."
33:53>> [laughter]
33:54>> Yes. Oh, but we would have to kiss each
33:56other, too.
33:58You're like, you know, and and they just
34:00laughed at me, but that was good because
34:02they had moved from
34:04where they were when they came in the
34:05door, that they could laugh about it and
34:07they could hug each other and there was
34:10restoration.
34:11>> Amen.
34:13>> But you know what? Facilitating those
34:16kinds of things, a lot of people don't
34:17want to do it.
34:18>> Right.
34:19>> They just don't.
34:21>> Yeah.
34:21>> So you have to be willing to do that.
34:23Then you have to be willing to make room
34:26for grief when relationships change.
34:30>> Mhm. Amen.
34:31>> Like my sisters I've been walking and
34:34doing all this ministry with who just
34:36chose to step out.
34:38>> Mhm.
34:40>> Yeah.
34:40I It was a loss and I had to grieve the
34:43loss.
34:44But at the same time I had to let it go.
34:47>> Right.
34:49>> Um it took some time, I'm not going to
34:51lie.
34:52>> Yeah.
34:53>> And um
34:54but now
34:56you know, if I see them if I if I talk
34:59to them, whatever, there there are no
35:02issues whatsoever.
35:04>> Yeah.
35:04>> Which is great. But that's because I was
35:07willing to go to the Lord and say, "You
35:09know what, Lord? I I'm really hurting
35:11and I need your help with this because I
35:13can't do this on my own."
35:15>> Yeah.
35:16>> And I know you understand in a way that
35:18I can't even put into words right now.
35:21>> Yeah.
35:22>> You know,
35:23when you really love somebody and you
35:24get hurt by them.
35:26>> Yeah.
35:28Yeah.
35:29>> It's It's hard to articulate what you're
35:31even feeling on the inside. You just
35:34know you're hurting.
35:36>> Right.
35:36>> And you just know they're not there. And
35:38there's a void.
35:40>> Right.
35:41>> So it really is a
35:44there is a grieving that can happen
35:46sometimes when you get hurt.
35:48>> Yeah.
35:49>> Um
35:51oh, forgiving
35:53>> [laughter]
35:54>> while allowing trust to be rebuilt.
35:57>> Ooh.
35:58>> Okay.
35:59>> Yeah.
36:00>> Yeah, because um
36:02again, I had a situation with a couple
36:04of women and um
36:10they wouldn't even really open up and
36:12tell me. I just knew they were that
36:14there was some situation going on
36:16between them. What made it worse is the
36:18fact that they actually work together in
36:20the same place and then they come to the
36:21church, okay? So they live a lot of life
36:24together, all right?
36:26And they were really budding heads and
36:28at odds with one another and I just
36:30said, "You know what? You need to do
36:32what the word says and you need to go
36:34and you need to ask for forgiveness if
36:36you did something or said something you
36:38shouldn't have."
36:39>> Yeah.
36:40>> You're not responsible for her response.
36:43But you can have a healthy boundary.
36:46And she doesn't have to be your BFF
36:48anymore.
36:49>> Right.
36:49>> Right?
36:50>> Yeah.
36:51>> Sometimes
36:53it doesn't work out that way.
36:56You know, you
36:57uh it may be
36:59too that part of the reason why there's
37:01a fracture in the relationship is
37:03because one is growing and the other one
37:05isn't.
37:07>> Right. Yeah.
37:08>> Which I believe is actually what
37:10happened in this circumstance.
37:12>> Yeah.
37:12>> Where one of them wanted to choose to go
37:15a more mature direction
37:18and the other one kind of wanted to put
37:20one foot in the world and one foot in
37:23the house.
37:25And I'm always telling them, "You can't
37:26do that and you can't ride the fence and
37:28the fence belongs to the enemy. What are
37:30you doing?"
37:31>> Right.
37:33>> You know, it's like uh
37:36"Oh, I see where you're at. You think
37:38that you can go and be a friend to this
37:40girl and she's out playing in the club
37:42and you're going to go out there. Did
37:44the Lord tell you to do that?"
37:46>> Right.
37:47>> See, hanging out in the club?
37:49>> Yeah.
37:49>> Uh you're going to go save her?
37:52Uh not if the Lord didn't tell you to.
37:54>> Right.
37:55>> Cuz you're dancing around the fire.
37:57>> Right.
37:58>> And so, you know, those kind of
38:01situations too. And people get hurt
38:03because they want you to get in the boat
38:05with them.
38:06>> Mhm.
38:06>> Right? Uh I feel better and I can
38:09justify my choices if someone else is
38:11doing it with me.
38:13>> Right. There we have it.
38:15>> [laughter]
38:16>> Right?
38:17>> Uh-huh.
38:18>> Uh
38:19>> It's who who can I find to justify
38:23my ungodly behavior?
38:26>> Exactly.
38:27>> Yeah.
38:27>> And you know, you got to just decide.
38:30You got to draw a line in the sand and
38:33um be obedient to what the Lord's
38:35telling you, not your so-called BFF. And
38:38then I wonder, you know, really is that
38:41is that really a good friend to have?
38:44>> Yeah.
38:44>> Because they're
38:46you know, um
38:48I remember we studied uh in the book of
38:50Hebrews and it was talking about
38:54there's a lot of warning in the book of
38:55Hebrews.
38:57>> [laughter]
38:58>> But it was talking about how you can
39:00drift.
39:02And I told them, I said, "If it's
39:04warning you not to drift, that means you
39:06can."
39:07>> Right.
39:08>> Or the Lord would not have put it in
39:10there.
39:10>> Yes.
39:11>> Be careful that you do not drift.
39:14>> Yes.
39:14>> Right?
39:16That means that I can um
39:18>> Yeah.
39:19>> And it can be incrementally slowly, a
39:21little
39:22one choice at a time.
39:24>> Absolutely.
39:26>> Small choices, little foxes eating at
39:28the vine.
39:29>> Mhm.
39:30>> And um we're supposed to actually love
39:32each other enough to speak truthfully in
39:35a loving way
39:36>> Yeah.
39:37>> um when we see someone we care about
39:40kind of drifting.
39:42>> Yeah.
39:43>> Right?
39:44>> always remind people is
39:46don't fall for the false doctrine that
39:50says once you accept Jesus you have no
39:54more free will.
39:55You still have free will.
39:58>> All the time, every day. [laughter]
40:02That's crazy to me.
40:03>> You're just not going to make every good
40:06and right choice immediately.
40:08>> You're right.
40:10You know,
40:11it's crazy. Um well
40:14but I have grace. Well, yeah, you have
40:16grace, okay, but
40:18uh you don't have grace so you can abuse
40:20it.
40:21>> Right.
40:22>> And uh if you're actually doing what
40:24you're supposed to and building your
40:26relationship with Jesus, you should be
40:29you know, it's not about behavior
40:32modification.
40:33Okay? There are people that land in that
40:35camp. Well, if I just change my
40:36behavior. Well, what's going on on the
40:38inside of you?
40:40>> Yeah.
40:40>> Right?
40:41>> Uh-huh.
40:41>> Cuz if you're white-knuckling it for a
40:43while and then all of a sudden you fall
40:45off the back of the bus and I'm not
40:47saying that doesn't happen even when
40:50we have
40:51been trying to allow the Holy Spirit to
40:54sanctify us.
40:56>> Yes.
40:56>> And we can still get into
40:59uh
41:00our flesh and be deceived and seduced
41:03and lured and um
41:05have blind spots that we haven't dealt
41:07with.
41:08Oh, it's not that big a deal. Really?
41:12Okay.
41:15Um let's see. Uh making confession.
41:19Excuse me.
41:21I'm talking so much I need a drink.
41:25>> [laughter]
41:28>> We need to make um confession and
41:30repentance just a part of our everyday
41:33life.
41:33>> Yes.
41:35>> And I I think there's a uh I think
41:37there's a a large group of people
41:41in the body of Christ that don't
41:43necessarily do that. Because if we're
41:45doing that, then if things are not where
41:48they should be, not only within us or
41:50relationally with somebody in the body,
41:52the Holy Spirit's going to say, "Hey,
41:55what about that right there?"
41:57>> Yes.
41:58>> What have you done with that?
41:59>> Yeah.
42:01>> Because the Lord will help us if we'll
42:02allow him to.
42:05>> Mhm.
42:05>> You know, a long time ago Jerry preached
42:07this um message and it was about
42:10if you, then I.
42:12>> Uh-huh.
42:12>> And there are a lot of places in the
42:14word of God where if we will do certain
42:17things, God will do so or he's already
42:19done certain things and we have
42:22responsibilities.
42:24A lot of responsibilities in a lot of
42:26very
42:27important areas of life.
42:29>> Yes.
42:31>> But if we um
42:33choose to cop out and say, you know,
42:35well
42:37I have grace or
42:39what other
42:40reason we can come up with to justify
42:43not being responsible. Last time I
42:45looked,
42:47um
42:48the sin of omission is a sin. I know
42:50it's wrong and I just choose to look the
42:53other way or sweep it under the rug.
42:55Well, that goes with relationships in a
42:57church.
42:58>> Yes.
43:00>> And
43:01>> Absolutely.
43:02>> I will say
43:04when you're talking about Christ being
43:07the head and us being the body
43:12the body has to have the head.
43:14>> Yeah.
43:14>> It cannot do anything without the head.
43:17>> That is a great point. Yes.
43:21>> And here's the other thing though.
43:24The head will not be able to do the
43:26things that it's supposed to do without
43:28the body.
43:29>> Amen.
43:30Yeah.
43:31>> So we have to be in line with the spirit
43:33of God, the word of God and each other.
43:36Unity commands a blessing. That's what
43:38the word says.
43:39>> Yeah.
43:40>> So
43:42another thing we can do is build a
43:43culture
43:45where members and leaders are able to
43:47actually receive correction.
43:49>> Mhm. Yes. Mhm.
43:52>> If we can't receive correction
43:56you know, Jerry and I are like, you
43:58know, um we're not here to check off a
44:01box.
44:02>> Right.
44:04>> This is our entire life
44:08laid down
44:10for him
44:11>> Yeah.
44:12>> and for those he brings to us.
44:14>> Mhm.
44:15>> And a part of that means sometimes
44:18working through things that are
44:20sometimes hard
44:22relationally.
44:23>> Right.
44:25>> And again, teaching and modeling the
44:27example in front of them.
44:29>> Right.
44:29>> This is what to do. This is not what to
44:32do.
44:33>> Yes.
44:34>> Yes.
44:34>> I know.
44:36>> [laughter]
44:37>> Uh I'm thinking um
44:43we're supposed to be changing.
44:46We're supposed to be being transformed.
44:49>> Yeah.
44:51>> So, if that's not happening
44:54because we refuse to be corrected,
44:55there's something wrong.
44:59>> Yeah.
44:59>> The Lord's clear. He says that he
45:01admonishes and chastises those that he
45:03loves.
45:05>> Right.
45:05>> He brings correction out of love.
45:10>> Yeah.
45:10>> If my child is going to stick their hand
45:13in the fan
45:15I discipline them so that they will not
45:17come away with digits missing.
45:20>> Right. Exactly.
45:21>> If they're going to run out and I say,
45:24"Don't go out in the street.
45:26You cannot go out and play in the
45:28street."
45:29And they go a little closer and a little
45:32closer.
45:34>> [laughter]
45:34>> They're just testing the boundary,
45:35right? We've We've all done it.
45:39And they And they they push the boundary
45:41just a little further to the point where
45:43now they're actually in the street.
45:46And you're trying to protect them from
45:48the enemy and from themselves
45:50so they don't get maimed
45:52>> Right.
45:53>> or die.
45:54>> Yep.
45:55>> So, we have to have a willingness to be
45:58able to correct and receive correction.
46:01>> Yeah.
46:03>> So, that we can be healthy.
46:06Okay, if I have an injury, I'm just I'm
46:08just flying by the seat of my pants
46:09here. If I have an injury on my
46:13arm and I'm wounded
46:15because I have this injury here
46:19and I don't clean it
46:22>> Mhm.
46:22>> and I just let the infection spread
46:24>> Oh, yeah. [sighs]
46:26>> it can become gangrene in my body and it
46:28can kill me.
46:30>> Right.
46:31>> So the Lord comes along
46:33and he takes the nasty filthy bandage
46:36that you slapped on there.
46:38That hurts. He takes that off.
46:41Then he cleans the wound. That hurts.
46:44>> Yeah.
46:46>> And then he finally is able to put the
46:47balm of Gilead on there
46:49>> Mhm.
46:50>> where it can for the first time since
46:52you had the injury inflicted on you
46:54begin to heal.
46:55>> Amen.
46:56>> And he puts a clean dressing on it.
46:58>> Yeah.
46:59>> Yeah, we have people walking around
47:02and this sounds uh like the walking
47:04[clears throat] dead and you're supposed
47:06to be the walking alive.
47:08>> Right.
47:09>> Overcoming.
47:10>> Yeah.
47:10>> Victorious.
47:12>> Yes.
47:12>> Yes, in this world you will have trouble
47:15but Christ overcame
47:18and he will help us overcome.
47:21>> Yeah.
47:21>> But we've got to be willing to do our
47:23part.
47:24>> Amen.
47:24>> And stop um denying, suppressing,
47:28sweeping under the rug
47:30and acting like we're all good when
47:32we're not
47:33and have this facade.
47:36>> Mhm.
47:36>> You're not even being real with yourself
47:38and the Lord.
47:39>> Yeah.
47:40>> And you wonder why you can't have a
47:42genuine authentic relationship with
47:44someone else?
47:46What I run into, maybe I don't know
47:48about you Karina, but what I run into
47:50too is people don't have any idea who
47:52they are.
47:53>> Mhm. A thousand percent. They think they
47:56do.
47:58>> Yes. [laughter]
48:00And so you're trying to to point them to
48:03the one that can show them who they are.
48:05>> Yeah.
48:05>> And sometimes that means some things
48:07have to come out and be displaced and
48:09removed
48:11so that then the Lord can fill you with
48:13the things of him and then he can draw
48:16up out of you the things that the Father
48:18weaved into you when he created you
48:21to become the full expression of who
48:23you're really supposed to be.
48:24>> Yeah.
48:25>> That's a process.
48:27>> Yes.
48:28>> And at times it can be painful.
48:30>> Yeah.
48:31>> And it requires
48:33dealing with issues. So, I saw this
48:36awesome illustration the other day and a
48:39guy had a bottle of water, right? That
48:41had water in it.
48:42>> [snorts]
48:42>> And um
48:44another person just came and bumped into
48:46it.
48:48Okay?
48:50And then bumped into it again. Well, so
48:53what happens is when there was enough
48:55force, what was in the bottle, the
48:57water, came out.
48:59>> Mhm.
49:00>> And so what it was was it was a picture
49:02of a person having triggers
49:05>> Wow.
49:06>> and buttons on the inside.
49:09>> Mhm.
49:10>> And you're just a part of the story on
49:12the path of their life. You aren't the
49:14one that the hurt originated with
49:17>> Mhm.
49:18>> but you said or did something that
49:20pushed a button or triggered them and
49:23then what they haven't resolved all came
49:26out.
49:26>> Wow. Oh, wow. That's that's a powerful
49:30analogy.
49:31>> Right. I was like, "Oh my gosh."
49:34>> Yeah.
49:35>> It's so true.
49:38Goes back to what I was saying earlier.
49:39If you don't
49:41you've got to be willing to confront and
49:43deal with things in your life. That's
49:45part of the sanctification process.
49:47>> Yes.
49:48>> So, I had this quote, "The church should
49:50be a place where wounded people receive
49:53compassion
49:56and harmful behavior is addressed.
49:59>> Amen.
50:01>> Repentance is practiced
50:04and restoration is pursued.
50:07>> Wow. Yeah.
50:08>> We give one another
50:10grace to grow while helping one another
50:13become more like Christ.
50:17>> That sums it up.
50:18>> If you If you see it,
50:20if you cannot even If you're not even
50:23willing to be honest,
50:26okay, an addict. If you're not willing
50:29if you if you're going to live in
50:30denial, if you're going to live in
50:32delusion, and you're not willing to own
50:34and take responsibility of the
50:36of the fact that you have a real issue,
50:40you're never
50:41going to move past it.
50:43>> Right.
50:44>> You're going to always be in bondage to
50:46whatever that is.
50:48And honestly, many times I believe one
50:50of the ways that God
50:52tries to do things is through
50:53relationships.
50:55>> Mhm.
50:57Yeah.
50:58Yeah.
50:59>> He's a relational God. He wants
51:01relationship with us. He wants us to
51:03have relationship with each other.
51:05>> Mhm.
51:06>> And he And And so, you know, iron
51:09sharpening iron.
51:12Um
51:13Sometimes some people are, you know,
51:17they're the really lightweight
51:18sandpaper.
51:20>> Yeah. [snorts]
51:21>> And some people are the saw that comes
51:24up.
51:24>> [laughter]
51:26>> And they're lopping something off,
51:29right?
51:30>> Right. Yeah.
51:32>> And many times they don't even realize
51:34it.
51:36>> Yeah, it's true.
51:37It's true.
51:39Well, I cannot believe how this hour has
51:44flown by.
51:46But is there
51:48else that really the Lord put on your
51:51heart that
51:52you want to make sure that you get to
51:55share with our listeners today?
51:58>> I would say there's one more thing.
52:00>> Yeah.
52:00>> Back to the potter's wheel. So,
52:03I was in my quiet time this morning when
52:05the Holy Spirit started talking to me
52:07about that.
52:08And I saw the image of the potter's
52:11wheel.
52:12And when I saw this piece of pottery
52:14that was on there,
52:16it was like
52:18uh I guess you could say it sort of look
52:21like the Leaning Tower of Pisa. It was
52:23leaning one way.
52:25>> Uh-huh.
52:26>> [laughter]
52:27>> And it was the actual texture of the
52:30vessel was not very pretty. It had a lot
52:34of really rough places in it.
52:37And the Lord said, "You know, many times
52:40people
52:42cannot see
52:44their true condition.
52:46>> Wow.
52:46>> And they think they're okay.
52:49But, I want them on the wheel because
52:51they're not. They're not who they they
52:53they are. They're not where they think
52:55they are.
52:57And oh they need to stay close to me on
53:00the potter's wheel and let me straighten
53:03out, make all the crooked places
53:04straight,
53:05>> Yeah.
53:06>> smooth all the rough edges so that they
53:09can be a better reflection of me
53:12>> Yes.
53:12>> through their words and actions and how
53:14they relate to other people."
53:16>> Mhm.
53:17>> And I I remember one time I met this
53:20potter and she I mean like she made tons
53:23of beautiful pottery.
53:25And she said, "You know, you work the
53:27clay for a really long time.
53:30>> Mhm.
53:30>> You you you break it down and you work
53:33it and you break it down and you work
53:35it." And she said, "The reason why is
53:37because if it has air pockets in it
53:41and you put it in the fire of the kiln,
53:44it explodes.
53:45>> Oh, wow.
53:47Mhm.
53:48>> And all that is is just more imagery for
53:51me that ties right into when we don't
53:54deal with the things within ourselves.
53:56We're so quick to blame the other
53:57person.
53:58>> Right.
54:00>> And I'm not saying that that's not the
54:01case. I have so been there.
54:04>> Yeah.
54:04>> I
54:05We we have we didn't even go there with
54:08the things I've dealt with and I know
54:09you have, too. You're a woman, you
54:11shouldn't be in ministry. You're a
54:13woman, you shouldn't be a leader. You're
54:15a woman, you shouldn't be teaching. I
54:17mean, I I have been through some of that
54:20fire.
54:21>> Yeah.
54:22>> Um but, you know what? It's made me
54:23stronger and it's made me bolder.
54:25>> Yes.
54:26>> And it's given me more courage.
54:29>> Yeah.
54:30>> Um because
54:31I know the Lord called me.
54:34And I I just know that.
54:36>> Yeah.
54:36>> And um so I I there are legitimately
54:41times when we really do get hurt.
54:44And it doesn't have necessarily so much
54:47to do about what's on the inside of us,
54:49but for whatever reason,
54:51that's what I believe believe the Holy
54:53Spirit really wanted me to dive into
54:56because so many people just want to
54:58avoid that.
54:59>> Yes.
55:02>> It's like, okay,
55:05you marry somebody
55:07and it's a very messed up relationship.
55:11And you get very hurt.
55:14And you divorce that person.
55:17And you go down the road of your life
55:19and you marry another person.
55:22And now all of a sudden, this second
55:24person
55:25is paying for things that they had
55:28nothing to do with.
55:30>> Right.
55:31>> From the first relationship because the
55:34person that is now married for the
55:36second time and didn't take care of the
55:39things within themselves.
55:40>> Right.
55:42>> And you're making an innocent party
55:46pray pay for if you will in a sense your
55:49brokenness.
55:51>> Yes.
55:52>> And the body's doing that to itself all
55:54the time.
55:55>> It sure is. And it's heartbreaking to
55:58watch it.
56:00>> It is.
56:01>> Yeah.
56:03>> It's really hard when you love somebody
56:05and you have the answer
56:07and they just don't want to take it.
56:08They don't want to apply it.
56:10>> Right.
56:11>> You're not going to see the
56:12transformation if you don't actually
56:14apply the word of God and walk it out.
56:17>> That's it.
56:19That is
56:19>> I hope something I said today
56:22was beneficial to somebody out there.
56:25>> Oh, yes. I have no doubt
56:28you are so full of wisdom. You are so
56:32full of experience. You are so uh full
56:36of
56:37practical examples because you are so
56:41full of the Lord.
56:43So, I want to thank you, Pastor Darlene,
56:46for just sharing, for being with me
56:49today, and um
56:52just really blessing all the listeners.
56:54I know that this is going to be
56:57impactful for many. So, thank you.
57:01Pastor Darlene [music]
57:02is a beautiful and wise woman, and she
57:05is the example of what godly leadership
57:08is supposed to look like. So, if you
57:11would like more information about her
57:14church, you can go to
57:15kingdompointchurch.com.
57:18And there's a link in the description of
57:21this episode, along with a link to their
57:24YouTube channel, so you can listen to
57:27some of their sermons. And if [music]
57:30you'd like to know more about her
57:31testimony and how God has moved in her
57:34and her husband's marriage, you can go
57:37to the Trumpets of Tirzah website and
57:39view that testimony film. It's called
57:43[music] Light of the World, Jerry and
57:45Darlene's Story. And there is also a
57:48link in the comments of this episode.
57:52God is so good. Beloved, God has healing
57:56for you. He wants you to heal before you
58:00move forward.
58:01So, open your heart to what the Lord
58:04wants to do in your life.
58:06And know that he calls you by name.
58:09Because you are called. Now it's time
58:13[music] to rise up and be confident in
58:16that calling. God bless you.

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