Lance Armstrong: Next Stage (FULL INTERVIEW) | NBC Sports — Transcript

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1. 0:03If a kid comes to you and says, "Hey,
2. 0:05I'm thinking about
3. 0:07dipping my toe into the
4. 0:08performance-enhancing drug world because
5. 0:10others are.
6. 0:12I need to do it to stay with
7. 0:15my peers, otherwise my dream is going to
8. 0:17die." Which is kind of where you were.
9. 0:19Yeah.
10. 0:21What do you tell him?
11. 0:21It's every every situ- It's There's not
12. 0:24an easy answer. Every situation is
13. 0:25different. Um
14. 0:27I I don't want I don't ever want a kid
15. 0:28to come up to me and ask
16. 0:30that.
17. 0:30Has it Has anyone
18. 0:31No. No.
19. 0:32No.
20. 0:33Thank god.
21. 0:34I don't think I'm the right person to
22. 0:36ask. I mean, I would
23. 0:39I'd obviously advise them.
24. 0:42I would ask some questions.
25. 0:44I haven't been in that position, but but
26. 0:46my advice has to be
27. 0:48I don't think that's a good idea.
28. 0:51I don't want to be in that position, and
29. 0:53I don't want to be in that position with
30. 0:54my kids.
31. 0:56I got a I got a boy who plays Do you
32. 0:57want the ball?
33. 0:58Right.
34. 0:58I don't think Luke Armstrong would ever
35. 1:00even think that that's an option.
36. 1:02But as I watch sport, I don't think
37. 1:05about it. I watch the Super Bowl.
38. 1:07They're big, fast, strong, and tough.
39. 1:08I'm sure some of them got there
40. 1:10with some help, but I don't think about
41. 1:12that.
42. 1:12Some of them who started the game were
43. 1:14suspended for PEDs.
44. 1:15Right.
45. 1:16So, but I never even I just watch the
46. 1:17game.
47. 1:18That doesn't bother you?
48. 1:20I just watch the game.
49. 1:21Well, then that means it bothers you a
50. 1:22little bit.
51. 1:23No, I I just watch it.
52. 1:26But if Luke came to me, it would bother
53. 1:27me.
54. 1:28Then all of a sudden
55. 1:30I start to really care.
56. 1:32And the answer would obviously be,
57. 1:34"Luke,
58. 1:36stay in school, be a great teammate,
59. 1:38graduate from what is essentially an Ivy
60. 1:40League school, meet as many people as
61. 1:41you can, make as many connections as you
62. 1:43can, and go on and be great. You don't
63. 1:45need this game.
64. 1:47No way."
65. 1:49At 25, Lance Armstrong was a patient.
66. 1:52I have the utmost faith in all of my
67. 1:53doctors with whom I'm working, and I am
68. 1:55determined to fight this disease, and I
69. 1:56will win.
70. 1:57Stage three testicular cancer, tumors in
71. 2:00his lungs, lesions on his brain.
72. 2:03Armstrong is flying away. Three years
73. 2:06later, he went from survivor to victor
74. 2:09in what was called at the time one of
75. 2:11the most unbelievable comebacks in
76. 2:13sports history.
77. 2:16For seven straight years, he dominated
78. 2:19arguably the hardest sporting event in
79. 2:21the world.
80. 2:24Around him, grew an empire that included
81. 2:26a powerful foundation dedicated to
82. 2:28fighting cancer.
83. 2:29of the great human stories.
84. 2:31We believe in life, your life.
85. 2:33But after years of lies and
86. 2:35scorched-earth denials,
87. 2:37He has nothing. He's got no proof. It's
88. 2:38It's his word versus ours.
89. 2:40Armstrong was exposed as a doper in
90. 2:422012.
91. 2:44Lance Armstrong has no place in cycling.
92. 2:47His brand imploded.
93. 2:49His legacy as a cancer survivor and
94. 2:51activist polluted.
95. 2:52It's been an interesting couple of
96. 2:54weeks.
97. 2:56His story became one of the most
98. 2:58infamous in sports.
99. 3:111999, you won the Tour de France for the
100. 3:14first time.
101. 3:15Yeah.
102. 3:15And that's 20 years.
103. 3:1620 years. It's a long time.
104. 3:19What did that mean considering you'd
105. 3:21just gone from
106. 3:22cancer to champion in a short period of
107. 3:24time?
108. 3:25Well,
109. 3:27I mean, I think the
110. 3:28the biggest thing is it was a surprise.
111. 3:30I think it surprised a lot of people,
112. 3:31but it it surprised me, too. It
113. 3:33surprised
114. 3:34our team, it surprised uh my family.
115. 3:39You know, that I I finished treatment
116. 3:40December of '96, so I had '97, '98. And
117. 3:44then boom, '99. I mean, it was it was a
118. 3:46short amount of time. It didn't seem
119. 3:47short at the time, but now as I look
120. 3:48back, I was like, it It an instant.
121. 3:51Having fought his way free from cancer,
122. 3:53Armstrong's appetite for battle turned
123. 3:55on his rivals and some members of the
124. 3:57press.
125. 3:58going to find anything.
126. 3:59From the beginning, his strength at the
127. 4:01tour was questioned.
128. 4:02It's unfortunate that the yellow jersey
129. 4:03of the Tour de France always has to
130. 4:05defend drugs.
131. 4:06Extraordinary accusations must be
132. 4:09followed up with extraordinary proof.
133. 4:11You said that I am the cancer and the
134. 4:13cancer is out of remission. You are not
135. 4:15worth the chair that you're sitting on
136. 4:16with a statement like that.
137. 4:18I couldn't just lay down. There was no
138. 4:20difference between attacking in the
139. 4:22mountains
140. 4:23or attacking at the press conference. It
141. 4:25was the same mentality. I couldn't turn
142. 4:27it off. And so
143. 4:29a huge mistake. I mean, I'd love to we'd
144. 4:31all love to go back in life and and have
145. 4:33a few do-overs.
146. 4:34Yep.
147. 4:34Um never should have taken it on,
148. 4:36especially knowing that
149. 4:38that most of what they said was true.
150. 4:42Did you just believe your own lies? Do
151. 4:44you believe your own defense that you
152. 4:46built up around you and just got lost in
153. 4:48that cocoon a little bit?
154. 4:49Yeah, I didn't
155. 4:51No, I didn't believe it. I mean, I knew
156. 4:52I knew the real I knew the truth.
157. 4:56But
158. 4:58it's tough to stop once you start.
159. 5:00I mean, you don't just
160. 5:01all of a sudden one day go, "Trico,
161. 5:03you're a good guy. I think I'm just
162. 5:05going to be honest with you. I've lied
163. 5:06to everybody else, but it's 2004 and
164. 5:09I'll just be honest."
165. 5:09Did you get close to flipping that
166. 5:11switch at any point?
167. 5:12No.
168. 5:12No.
169. 5:1320 years ago you won your first.
170. 5:15Yep.
171. 5:15Seven years ago you were stripped of all
172. 5:17seven. Which one of those events defines
173. 5:21who you are right now?
174. 5:23I wouldn't change a thing.
175. 5:25I wouldn't I wouldn't change uh
176. 5:28the way I acted. I mean, I would, but
177. 5:31this is a longer answer. Um
178. 5:33but primarily I wouldn't change the
179. 5:34lessons that I've learned. I mean, I
180. 5:36don't learn all the lessons if I don't
181. 5:38act that way and I don't get um
182. 5:42investigated and sanctioned
183. 5:45if I don't act the way I acted. If I
184. 5:47just doped and didn't say a thing,
185. 5:49Mhm.
186. 5:50none of that would have happened.
187. 5:52None of it.
188. 5:53I mean,
189. 5:54it was I was begging for I was asking
190. 5:57for that. I was asking for them to come
191. 5:59after me.
192. 6:01And it was an easy target.
193. 6:02But you didn't figure that out until
194. 6:03recently.
195. 6:04Correct. I didn't figure that out until
196. 6:06it happened.
197. 6:06So, it's taken
198. 6:08years and years and years of
199. 6:10introspective and work and therapy and
200. 6:13just understanding what it
201. 6:15what it meant. I mean, you're asking me
202. 6:16about what I think that '99 Tour meant
203. 6:19to cancer survivors and to the cancer
204. 6:21community.
205. 6:22Right.
206. 6:22You know,
207. 6:245 years ago, my answer was
208. 6:27what the hell's the problem? Just get
209. 6:28over it. Look at what all Look at all
210. 6:29the good I did.
211. 6:31But as I sit here today, and it's again,
212. 6:32it's a process,
213. 6:34you can't just get over it. It's a big
214. 6:36story.
215. 6:37Growing up in Plano, Texas, Armstrong
216. 6:40first cut his competitive teeth in
217. 6:42triathlon. A national champion in the
218. 6:44sport at 18, he got into endurance
219. 6:47sports for one simple reason.
220. 6:50At some point, I just woke up and said I
221. 6:52suck at every ball sport known to man.
222. 6:55So, football, baseball, basketball,
223. 6:57I can't play those.
224. 6:58What are we talking? 10, 11, 12? That
225. 7:00age?
226. 7:00We're talking 12.
227. 7:0112 years old?
228. 7:0112 years old. And my mom said, "Okay,
229. 7:04you don't have to do that, but you have
230. 7:05to do something."
231. 7:06What was it about cycling that got to
232. 7:08you?
233. 7:09The the feeling
234. 7:12uh of freedom and uh
235. 7:15just
236. 7:16time to be alone,
237. 7:18to be outside, to be away.
238. 7:21You know, when you're 13, everybody
239. 7:22wants to be away.
240. 7:23Right? You want to be away from your
241. 7:25mom, your dad, your whoever. And so, I
242. 7:27was out. Most kids just ripped down the
243. 7:29corner and you know, mom can't see them
244. 7:30and they're free.
245. 7:31Right, exactly.
246. 7:32I was, you know, taking 50-mi rides and
247. 7:34and doing I was truly free.
248. 7:36The bike brought Armstrong to compete
249. 7:38internationally as a rare American in a
250. 7:41mostly European sport. one with a long
251. 7:43history of pervasive drug use.
252. 7:46Do you remember the first time that you
253. 7:47did a performance-enhancing drug of any
254. 7:49type?
255. 7:49Well,
256. 7:52it's just so I mean, yes.
257. 7:55I
258. 7:56I mean, I think I do. It's It's There
259. 7:59are things, you know, sort of gateway
260. 8:00drugs that maybe they weren't banned.
261. 8:04Certainly weren't detectable or tested
262. 8:05for.
263. 8:06But they were something.
264. 8:07The easiest way to think about it, if
265. 8:08you know
266. 8:09Or you think it's going to help you?
267. 8:11Mhm.
268. 8:11Even if it's not detectable or banned?
269. 8:14Then you've crossed the line.
270. 8:15So, what year were you when when you had
271. 8:16to when you had to make that decision?
272. 8:18What What year were you? '90
273. 8:19'93 or um
274. 8:21It's probably '91, maybe.
275. 8:24Italian stage race.
276. 8:26And And again,
277. 8:29it's hard to differentiate because
278. 8:31I believe that we weren't given anything
279. 8:32banned, but it was funny, the doctor
280. 8:34walked in and I was in the lead of the
281. 8:35race and I wanted to win the race.
282. 8:38And he walked in and I said, "Give me
283. 8:39everything in the bag."
284. 8:41And he just laughed. But, you know, it's
285. 8:43probably some form of cortisone or
286. 8:46And that's the first time?
287. 8:47Yeah. But
288. 8:49But the first time you take, you know, a
289. 8:51legitimate banned substance?
290. 8:54'93.
291. 8:55You were surrounded by it. Was there the
292. 8:58feeling that if we didn't, then we
293. 9:00couldn't compete?
294. 9:01Yeah. Well, that's that That wasn't just
295. 9:02a feeling, that was a fact. And
296. 9:05I don't want to make excuses for myself
297. 9:08that everybody did it or we never could
298. 9:10have won without it. That Those are all
299. 9:12true, but
300. 9:13the buck stops with me. I'm the one who
301. 9:15made the decision to do what I did. And
302. 9:18it it was
303. 9:21I didn't want to go home, man.
304. 9:25I was going to stay.
305. 9:29Why didn't you want to go home?
306. 9:31I mean, I went to
307. 9:36What I told you earlier, I
308. 9:38I don't lay down.
309. 9:41And it was the wrong decision, but
310. 9:44laying down would have been giving up,
311. 9:47going home.
312. 9:47Right.
313. 9:48I went to
314. 9:49Uh
315. 9:50I knew there were going to be knives at
316. 9:51this fight, not just fists. I knew
317. 9:53there'd be knives.
318. 9:54I had knives.
319. 9:56And then one day
320. 9:59people start showing up with guns.
321. 10:01And that's when you say
322. 10:03do I either fly back to Plano, Texas
323. 10:06and do and not know what you're going to
324. 10:08do
325. 10:09or do you walk over to the gun store?
326. 10:13And I walked to the gun store, so
327. 10:16I don't want to go home.
328. 10:18Do you wish you never did it?
329. 10:20Never started down this road and would
330. 10:22have said, "Let me go home and go figure
331. 10:24out a way to make a life somewhere back
332. 10:26in Plano, Texas."
333. 10:27It's a It's a tough question. And it's
334. 10:29an answer that that people don't like.
335. 10:32Because I wouldn't change a thing
336. 10:34because I'm sitting here today. So, I
337. 10:36So, I wouldn't change that. It was a
338. 10:38mistake.
339. 10:39Uh it led to a lot of other mistakes. It
340. 10:42led to
341. 10:45the most colossal meltdown in the
342. 10:46history of sports.
343. 10:48Think about that.
344. 10:51What I wish would have hap- I I wish we
345. 10:53would have kids from Plano and Glenwood
346. 10:55Springs, Colorado and and and Brooklyn
347. 10:58and and Montana as young Americans, if
348. 11:01we'd have gone to Europe
349. 11:03and everybody's fighting with their
350. 11:04fists
351. 11:05we still win.
352. 11:06I promise you that.
353. 11:08Armstrong bringing his team home to the
354. 11:10line. New best time. That is absolutely
355. 11:13unbelievable.
356. 11:15You led a lot of that group down that
357. 11:17road.
358. 11:18That's not true. No.
359. 11:20Who led it?
360. 11:22No, we all I mean, we all
361. 11:24I mean, who led it, you know?
362. 11:26Th- And this is the There are a few
363. 11:28things that are just not true about the
364. 11:31story. I mean, there's a lot true,
365. 11:33but this idea that myself or anybody
366. 11:35forced
367. 11:37or mandated or uh encouraged anybody
368. 11:41else to cross that line just isn't true.
369. 11:44Not true.
370. 11:45It's not true.
371. 11:47Absolutely not true.
372. 11:48That goes counter to what a lot of
373. 11:49people have said.
374. 11:51So, how do you reconcile that that it's
375. 11:53always coming back to you and you don't
376. 11:55say, "Well, what about
377. 11:57the other guys?"
378. 11:58Yeah, I can't fight that fight. You
379. 12:00know, I I I
380. 12:01you know, it it it
381. 12:04It I mean, the reality is
382. 12:07every man made their own decision.
383. 12:09At some point along the way, you
384. 12:10institutionalized justifying what it all
385. 12:13cost.
386. 12:15Yeah, I mean,
387. 12:18we did what we had to do to win. Um and
388. 12:21it wasn't legal.
389. 12:24It it it was not um
390. 12:29you know, probably wouldn't have been
391. 12:30best decision.
392. 12:31We wouldn't have won had we not
393. 12:35um
394. 12:37But
395. 12:37And you wouldn't have gone through all
396. 12:38this.
397. 12:39No, of course not. But, I wouldn't
398. 12:40change a thing. I've said that three
399. 12:41times and I'll say it again. I would not
400. 12:43change a thing.
401. 12:52So, what memory do you have when you see
402. 12:54one of your yellow jerseys framed?
403. 12:56Oh.
404. 12:58Good or bad?
405. 12:59Oh, great.
406. 13:00Great.
407. 13:01Great memories, especially
408. 13:03away from the races. My my most of my
409. 13:05memories were
410. 13:07my fondest memories. Yeah, I could pick
411. 13:10a few race highlights, you know, but
412. 13:12boy,
413. 13:13I mean, I can take about tell you about
414. 13:14the 8-hour day in in the Pyrenees
415. 13:17preview in Hautacam in the pouring rain.
416. 13:23Best.
417. 13:24It still makes you feel good.
418. 13:25Oh, yeah.
419. 13:26Even though what was the underlying
420. 13:28reality of it?
421. 13:29Oh, yeah.
422. 13:31I mean, look.
423. 13:32What did we say?
424. 13:34We said we worked the hardest.
425. 13:37We have the best tactics. We have the
426. 13:39best team composition. We have the best
427. 13:40director, best equipment, best
428. 13:42technology. Do more research. Recon the
429. 13:44courses. All the things we said.
430. 13:46We did. We left out a part. But we did
431. 13:50all that stuff.
432. 13:51Because now this one part is part of the
433. 13:53story, it doesn't erase all that. All
434. 13:54that happened.
435. 13:56If you just had this one thing
436. 13:58and did none of that, you get last.
437. 14:01A long battle over doping allegations
438. 14:03aimed at Lance Armstrong came to a
439. 14:05bitter end today.
440. 14:06UCI will ban Lance Armstrong from
441. 14:08cycling and UCI will strip him of his
442. 14:10seven Tour de France titles.
443. 14:12In all seven Tour de France victories,
444. 14:15did you ever take banned substances or
445. 14:18blood dope?
446. 14:19Yes.
447. 14:19So, 2019 we're sitting here talking.
448. 14:22It's not exactly the same thing like the
449. 14:24Oprah interview in 2013. Have you ever
450. 14:26gone back and watched that interview?
451. 14:28No.
452. 14:29Well, uh I say no. I'm I've never
453. 14:30watched it in its entirety.
454. 14:32Were you not ready at that point to be
455. 14:34honest with yourself?
456. 14:36You know, I've I've been asked that
457. 14:37question a lot. Like, why? Why'd you do
458. 14:39it then? Why'd you Why did you do it
459. 14:41with her? Why did you do it at all?
460. 14:43Mhm.
461. 14:44Um the reality is I knew
462. 14:47that I was going to get sued. And I knew
463. 14:48I was going to get sued six ways to
464. 14:50Sunday.
465. 14:50Mhm.
466. 14:52I made the decision that that that was
467. 14:54that was the place to If you don't want
468. 14:55it leaked,
469. 14:56Right.
470. 14:56which is what would have happened most
471. 14:57likely.
472. 14:59Um the news was too
473. 15:01That would have been too big of a
474. 15:02revelation. That had it would have
475. 15:03gotten out. I was like,
476. 15:05just just do it. Just get it out of the
477. 15:07way.
478. 15:07Of the times you've had to go back
479. 15:09because of legal cases and see who you
480. 15:12were, now that you've got a lot of
481. 15:13perspective under your belt, what would
482. 15:16you like to tell that Lance Armstrong?
483. 15:17When you When you're forced to watch it,
484. 15:20uh
485. 15:20you just want a do-over. And you know,
486. 15:22you don't want to watch it. It's so
487. 15:23painful and it's embarrassing.
488. 15:26How could it have taken place when I've
489. 15:28never taken performance-enhancing drugs?
490. 15:31Look, how could that have happened? That
491. 15:32was my point. You're not It's not just
492. 15:33simply you don't recall. Just
493. 15:34How many times have I said it?
494. 15:36I'm just trying to make sure your
495. 15:37testimony is clear.
496. 15:38Well, if it can't be any clearer than
497. 15:40I've never taken drugs,
498. 15:42then incidents like that could never
499. 15:44have happened.
500. 15:44Okay.
501. 15:45How clear is that?
502. 15:46My answer's in the SCA deposition.
503. 15:49Smug, arrogant, dishonest.
504. 15:52I always think about my kids when I see
505. 15:54those answers, man.
506. 15:56It's embarrassing.
507. 15:58Embarrassing in some situations,
508. 16:00Armstrong was uniquely inspiring in
509. 16:03others.
510. 16:03So, just to repeat, this would be a big
511. 16:06goal, defeating cancer.
512. 16:07That's right.
513. 16:08It's now an honor and pleasure to
514. 16:09introduce Lance Armstrong.
515. 16:13There was nothing like Livestrong. It
516. 16:15was powerful. It was grassroots.
517. 16:19It was national. It connected to people.
518. 16:21It made a difference in the fight for
519. 16:23people. People we all knew.
520. 16:25Right.
521. 16:25And your association with it has ended.
522. 16:28Yep.
523. 16:30Does that leave you frustrated?
524. 16:33Well, it didn't feel good.
525. 16:34I mean, Livestrong was a force and we
526. 16:36affected great change. We raised half a
527. 16:38billion dollars. We saved millions of
528. 16:41people's lives. I don't think it was the
529. 16:43right decision.
530. 16:44I think
531. 16:45What could they have done?
532. 16:47There's a lot you could have done. You
533. 16:48could have um
534. 16:50It's what everybody does. You put
535. 16:52somebody in time out. And the other
536. 16:54thing, Mike,
537. 16:55and this is a fact,
538. 16:59they can never
539. 17:01They They We can't separate.
540. 17:03No.
541. 17:04We can't. As long as your color is
542. 17:05yellow, your name is Livestrong, and
543. 17:08your work is cancer,
544. 17:09Right.
545. 17:09and you raise money through bike rides,
546. 17:11you will never separate. I don't care if
547. 17:12you go to Paris, Texas, or Paris,
548. 17:14France, and you say, "Okay, guys, here
549. 17:16we're going to play a little game. I'm
550. 17:17going to say one word. Tell me what you
551. 17:18think."
552. 17:20Livestrong.
553. 17:22So,
554. 17:23if it in that just that it breaks my
555. 17:26heart.
556. 17:26Do you still get
557. 17:28a day-to-day reaction from people for
558. 17:31what you did for their hopes if they're
559. 17:34diagnosed with cancer?
560. 17:35Yeah.
561. 17:36How's it make you feel?
562. 17:37Yeah, it
563. 17:38it Well, you know, it never makes you
564. 17:39feel good because you don't want to hear
565. 17:41that somebody's dealing with cancer. So,
566. 17:44a large part of you is like,
567. 17:45"Man, that sucks." Like that
568. 17:47for you and everybody around you. Um
569. 17:50it it's it's it's a nice feeling when
570. 17:53people
571. 17:54what the extent of my work in the cancer
572. 17:56community is with me and an iPhone.
573. 18:00That's it. I don't go to galas. I don't
574. 18:02speak at galas. I don't raise money. I
575. 18:05don't All I do is wait for the message
576. 18:08to come in. "Hey,
577. 18:09a friend of a friend of a friend of a
578. 18:10friend just diagnosed. Can you shoot
579. 18:13them a video?"
580. 18:14So, I just grab my phone. It's so easy,
581. 18:16Mike. You grab your phone, you hit
582. 18:17record. I mean, this isn't sexy TV work.
583. 18:20"Hey, Joey. Heard you've been diagnosed
584. 18:22or you know, in
585. 18:2330 seconds."
586. 18:25Sent. Sent it straight to them.
587. 18:27Mhm.
588. 18:28And then in the video, I say, "Hey, I
589. 18:29mean, obviously they have my number cuz
590. 18:30I just sent it to you.
591. 18:31Right.
592. 18:32You ever need my help, let me know.
593. 18:33That's all I do."
594. 18:34Does that happen often?
595. 18:36Um yeah, it happens too often.
596. 18:38I think I read a story that you went
597. 18:40into a bar in Colorado and people were
598. 18:42giving you a kind of grief.
599. 18:43Yeah. I didn't go in the bar, but I was
600. 18:45outside of the bar.
601. 18:46Okay. And then you called the manager
602. 18:48and bought everybody in the bar around a
603. 18:50drinks?
604. 18:50You know, it started out with one guy
605. 18:52and he said, "Hey, Lance." But he said
606. 18:54it in a way where I was like I go,
607. 18:56"What's up, man?"
608. 18:57Yeah.
609. 18:58And he goes,
610. 19:00"You."
611. 19:00Mhm.
612. 19:01And then next thing you know, the whole
613. 19:02table
614. 19:04is like a is like a chant like a war
615. 19:05chant. "F you. F you." And so, when my
616. 19:09world fell apart, I thought that would
617. 19:10happen every day. So, this is first
618. 19:12time. But I was so Mike, I was so
619. 19:15mad
620. 19:16and so shaken.
621. 19:17Sure.
622. 19:18The old Lance probably would have walked
623. 19:19over there and gotten a fight.
624. 19:20Right.
625. 19:21Which would have been a bad idea.
626. 19:22But I was like I I I can't just take
627. 19:24this. I have to do something. And so my
628. 19:26only thought was
629. 19:28to call the manager and say, "Hey,
630. 19:29here's my credit card.
631. 19:31Everything that that group of people's
632. 19:33having today, drinks, food, whatever, is
633. 19:36on me.
634. 19:37But you have to tell them it's from me."
635. 19:39It still shook me.
636. 19:40Sure.
637. 19:41But I couldn't just lay down. I'm not a
638. 19:43guy that lays down and
639. 19:46that guy before
640. 19:48was the guy that sat in the press
641. 19:49conferences and and attacked people's
642. 19:51credibility and denied and lied and and
643. 19:54was adamant and and mean-spirited.
644. 19:57But I'm still the same person. I've
645. 19:58learned a lot.
646. 19:59But I'm not going to lay down on
647. 20:01anything, whether it's
648. 20:04that situation or whether it's raising
649. 20:05my kids or whether it's
650. 20:07business. I'm just I I'm not
651. 20:09I don't lay down.
652. 20:10Is it easier going forward now
653. 20:13with a little piece of honesty as
654. 20:16opposed to trying to go forward when you
655. 20:19were in the tour and you were just
656. 20:20plowing over everything in your way?
657. 20:22100%.
658. 20:24100%. I mean I I
659. 20:26Every time I talk, whether it's to a
660. 20:27corporation or to a
661. 20:29a group of college kids, I tell them all
662. 20:31the same thing. I'm like, "I'm sitting
663. 20:32here right now. I'm going to be brutally
664. 20:34honest with you. You may not like some
665. 20:35of the stuff that I say.
666. 20:37But I promise you I'm not going to lie
667. 20:38to you. And if I would have done this
668. 20:39talk, if nothing would have happened and
669. 20:41I would have done this talk, I would
670. 20:42have lied through my teeth to you." And
671. 20:43so
672. 20:45I'm much happier giving this talk today.
673. 20:47How'd you get there?
674. 20:49You got You got to a place. It's pretty
675. 20:50clear.
676. 20:51yeah.
677. 20:53Mike, it was a long process and I
678. 20:55strongly believe in in the power of
679. 20:57therapy and coaching and just
680. 20:58understanding
681. 21:01the decisions you make, how they impact
682. 21:04obviously the ones around you most
683. 21:05immediately, but
684. 21:07impact everybody. And so
685. 21:09um
686. 21:10man, it's
687. 21:11And there's still work to do. Like to
688. 21:13sit here and say, I've just graduated,
689. 21:15Mike Tirico's in my living room.
690. 21:16Right.
691. 21:17No. This is I'm 40 almost 48 years old.
692. 21:19This is I'll be doing this when I'm 98.
693. 21:21And so
694. 21:23like I said, lifelong commitment.
695. 21:25Welcome back to the Forward podcast. I'm
696. 21:27your host Lance Armstrong. My guest this
697. 21:29week, get ready,
698. 21:31Charles Barkley.
699. 21:34Do you like being on the other side of
700. 21:36the microphone after you have sat
701. 21:38through many of these and been grilled?
702. 21:41Yeah, I love it. I love doing the work,
703. 21:43the research.
704. 21:45Um I get a bunch of help with that as
705. 21:47well, but I love I love going on the
706. 21:49research side, I love, you know, my guys
707. 21:51will send me
708. 21:5210 clips. I'll just go down the rabbit
709. 21:54hole.
710. 21:54I mean, you know the drill.
711. 21:55It's what we do. You're you're one of us
712. 21:57now.
713. 21:57I'm just making notes and then
714. 21:59you know, and then you I love having
715. 22:00that hour-long conversation and and
716. 22:03What kind of reaction do you get from
717. 22:04people?
718. 22:04Well, it's normally a good reaction,
719. 22:05otherwise they wouldn't take an hour out
720. 22:06of their day to do it, but
721. 22:08I my I really believe
722. 22:12that
723. 22:13they would answer my questions
724. 22:14differently than other people because
725. 22:17they see a guy across the table, they
726. 22:18know he's been nuked.
727. 22:20When I got a DUI, I had my friends I was
728. 22:23in jail for the weekend. I said, I want
729. 22:24you guys to be my ears.
730. 22:26feel a a sense of protection there that
731. 22:28I can almost tell this guy anything
732. 22:30because he's been through everything.
733. 22:31Mhm.
734. 22:32And that part is cool.
735. 22:36What we're talking about today is the
736. 22:372019
737. 22:39Tour de France. I could imagine that
738. 22:41there were some people say, wait a
739. 22:42minute.
740. 22:42Yeah.
741. 22:43Do I really want to hear from Lance
742. 22:44Armstrong about the tour?
743. 22:45Yeah.
744. 22:45After this?
745. 22:46Right.
746. 22:47But what reaction have you gotten as
747. 22:49it's grown in popularity and it's become
748. 22:51a money-making proposition now for you?
749. 22:53Yeah. The the funny thing about the Tour
750. 22:56podcast is that
751. 22:58we, and I hate to use this word, but
752. 23:02a lot of haters listen to the show, too.
753. 23:04Cuz they want to hear
754. 23:06me mess something up. I I I don't know.
755. 23:07They want to have a little material with
756. 23:09that they can they can throw some shade.
757. 23:12But which I get. I'm
758. 23:15It's still a download.
759. 23:17It's business.
760. 23:18It's still a I I I count that as a
761. 23:19download, I promise.
762. 23:21It sells.
763. 23:22It works.
764. 23:22Yeah.
765. 23:23Geraint Thomas, total domination in the
766. 23:26Tour de France.
767. 23:27Geraint Thomas, I mean, it just because
768. 23:28of the acceleration in the last
769. 23:30kilometer, that was amazing.
770. 23:32Can the Tour
771. 23:33survive and grow, and can people believe
772. 23:36that it's a clean sport in 2019?
773. 23:39I I can't answer the second part of your
774. 23:40question cuz I'm too far removed. I
775. 23:42mean, the way that that this has
776. 23:43unfolded,
777. 23:45I've been put in a place which I
778. 23:46rightfully deserve
779. 23:48that I I just can't answer the question.
780. 23:50I don't have access. I don't have intel.
781. 23:53And I don't want to guess. I'm not going
782. 23:54to guess and give you what my guess is.
783. 23:57Um I'd like to think that that it that
784. 23:59they're clean. Um
785. 24:01I love watching it.
786. 24:02You do?
787. 24:03Yeah. Well, I watch it as a fan. I watch
788. 24:05it as an analyst. I watch it as a person
789. 24:07who who can appreciate it. And then if
790. 24:09it's
791. 24:10you know, I might say it's a little
792. 24:11boring sometimes, but it it's you know,
793. 24:13I still I still enjoy it.
794. 24:15What's next for you?
795. 24:16Next
796. 24:18Well, what's next is is um Look, I I I
797. 24:22oddly enough, with this venture fund
798. 24:23that I've created with my partners, it's
799. 24:25called Next Ventures.
800. 24:27Which is
801. 24:28I love that name.
802. 24:29Um So, we'll we'll continue to create
803. 24:32content and continue to look for great
804. 24:34young entrepreneurs and companies and
805. 24:36ideas, and see if we can go build
806. 24:39the next great company of of of this
807. 24:41space, this health and fitness and
808. 24:42wellness and nutrition space.
809. 24:44We we play in a few buckets, but
810. 24:46really focused on on finding that.
811. 24:49And you think America is ready to take
812. 24:50you as that person?
813. 24:52Yes. I I think I think it's changing.
814. 24:54And and and as far as America goes, I
815. 24:56mean
816. 24:58you know, if I'm out raising
817. 25:00a $75 million venture growth fund,
818. 25:03we don't get to the place that we're
819. 25:04getting to. I mean, people are
820. 25:06giving me
821. 25:08their money.
822. 25:10Right? And so, that's
823. 25:12you you you give people money to invest
824. 25:14and and you trust them. That's
825. 25:16That's a
826. 25:17I don't take that for granted at all.
827. 25:19And I really I can't say enough for how
828. 25:21much that humbles me and
829. 25:23um and how much responsibility there is
830. 25:25with that.
831. 25:26The role of being a dad, five kids,
832. 25:29um having that constant presence in
833. 25:31their life that if something is a fork
834. 25:34in the road, they've got somebody who
835. 25:35can kind of guide them in a path because
836. 25:38of your unique experiences. How
837. 25:40important is that to you right now?
838. 25:42Well, it's the most important thing. And
839. 25:44I and I would add to it that
840. 25:48it falls on not just me. It falls on
841. 25:51my ex-wife, Kristen. It falls on Anna,
842. 25:55I've been with forever. Been engaged to
843. 25:56for a long time, too. Um
844. 25:59it it falls on us.
845. 26:01The range is 8 to 19 for your kids.
846. 26:03Yeah, 8 to 19. So, I have the 8-year-old
847. 26:05and the 10-year-old are in elementary
848. 26:07school. So, they didn't live They were
849. 26:101 and 2.
850. 26:11Right.
851. 26:11Um
852. 26:13but they'll grow into it.
853. 26:15YouTube will be there.
854. 26:17The internet will be there.
855. 26:18So, they will grow into this story. And
856. 26:20so, those conversations that I had with
857. 26:21my older kids, I'll then have again with
858. 26:23my younger kids.
859. 26:31So, you were driven to this place
860. 26:34Yeah.
861. 26:35by win at all costs.
862. 26:37Yeah.
863. 26:39You ever afraid that guy's going to come
864. 26:40back?
865. 26:41Yeah.
866. 26:42100%.
867. 26:45That would not be good.
868. 26:47How do you fight that guy from coming
869. 26:48back?
870. 26:49Well,
871. 26:52I think I took the first step by telling
872. 26:53you that I'm afraid he might come back.
873. 26:55If I told you no way,
874. 26:58then I think that's a problem.
875. 26:59The folks who are watching who
876. 27:02just can't get over
877. 27:04the way you went after and vilified the
878. 27:07people who at the end of the day were
879. 27:08right.
880. 27:09Yeah.
881. 27:10Um
882. 27:11those are the ones who have the biggest
883. 27:12hurdle to get over in
884. 27:14giving Lance a chance again.
885. 27:16Yeah.
886. 27:17What do you say to them?
887. 27:19Um I understand
888. 27:23I understand why that's a problem. And
889. 27:24it would be a problem for me.
890. 27:26Um
891. 27:28I don't
892. 27:29try to promote or advertise what I've
893. 27:31tried to rectify those situations,
894. 27:34traveling the world,
895. 27:36sitting with people. All All I can do is
896. 27:38do that.
897. 27:39All I can do is sit across the table
898. 27:41from somebody
899. 27:42and just say I'm sorry.
900. 27:44I'm truly sorry. But I think everybody
901. 27:48that the public might think about
902. 27:50has been apologized to.
903. 27:54I don't think those people are not
904. 27:57unimportant, but I don't think they're
905. 27:58the most important. I think the most
906. 28:00important is the is is the bulk of
907. 28:02society that I'll never be able to
908. 28:04apologize to across a table or over the
909. 28:07phone.
910. 28:08There's so many people that want that,
911. 28:11but they'll never sit on a plane next to
912. 28:12me, they'll never show up at the front
913. 28:14door.
914. 28:16And so they don't get their I could
915. 28:17apologize that's not as
916. 28:19I wish you could just
917. 28:21walk the world and make it happen, but
918. 28:23you can't. But as like I said, it's a
919. 28:24long walk. And it's not a short
920. 28:27commitment, it's a lifelong commitment.