YT YouTube2Text

YouTube2Text → Transcripts → Jodi Arias Trial - Day 36 - Part 2

Jodi Arias Trial - Day 36 - Part 2 — Transcript

by croakerqueen123 · 3,763 words · 549 segments · language en · Watch on YouTube

Open in transcriber Summarize with AI Download SRT/VTT

Full transcript

0:00sir um just I'm wondering if we may have
0:03the overhead turned
0:08on Sir uh when we left off we were
0:11talking about the second or prong number
0:14two under the c um factors for
0:18post-traumatic stress disorder do you
0:19remember that yes and that's not
0:21something that you found correct number
0:24two
0:27no and so that brings us up to to number
0:31one correct
0:33yes and this section is called
0:36persistent avoidance of stimuli
0:40associated with the trauma and the
0:42numbing of general
0:44responsiveness not present before the
0:46trauma as indicated by three or more
0:48correct yes and the first one what does
0:51that talk about talks about efforts to
0:53avoid thoughts feelings or conversations
0:56associated with the trauma
0:58okay for
1:33and you found this one correct I did and
1:39um what efforts did she according to you
1:43undertake to avoid thoughts feelings or
1:46conversations associated with the trauma
1:49I took her original
1:51story as an effort or An Occurrence that
1:56separated her from the realities of the
1:58trauma
2:00and by creating this other story it
2:03created a psychological distance between
2:06what happened that she was responsible
2:08for and what she first claimed happened
2:11when she was the victim of this uh well
2:15obviously false story about what had
2:17happened on that day so what you're
2:20talking about under number one is a lie
2:22she told a lie and based on the fact
2:24that she told a lie that was her effort
2:26to avoid feelings conversations
2:28associated with The Killing I'm not
2:30characterizing it as a lie you're
2:32characterizing it as a story as a as a
2:36yes as a story a defense mechanism you
2:39call it a defense mechanism but this
2:41defense mechanism as the way these
2:43things have come out based on what you
2:45tell us about what was told later is a
2:47story isn't it yes um but there are
2:50other things that she did um during this
2:52period of time uh that affect this are
2:56you familiar with the fact that she sent
2:5820 irises to Mr Alexander's
3:02grandmother I don't remember the number
3:04being 20 but I do remember that yes and
3:07in fact if she she admitted to that
3:10that's not an effort to avoid thoughts
3:11feelings or or conversations associated
3:14with the killing is it it's an effort to
3:16distance herself from the reality of the
3:19fact that she did The Killing and that
3:21effort requires thinking doesn't
3:24it yes so in her thinking about the 20
3:28irises she's thinking about the killing
3:32right she's thinking of the event and
3:36the actions of maintaining
3:39normaly as a result of what had happened
3:42in my opinion is almost it's very
3:45similar to what happens in a
3:47dissociative identity disorder where an
3:50whole alternative reality exists now I
3:53didn't use that diagnosis here but as
3:56part of her defense mechanism I believe
3:58that she created this alternative
4:00reality which insulated her from the
4:03pain of dealing with what had happened
4:05that she was responsible for and carried
4:08on as if the alternative reality was the
4:12truth so bottom line is she did think
4:14about it right and that's why she she
4:16thought about the killing and that's why
4:18she sent the irises right I I don't know
4:20whether she thought about it there's no
4:21way that I can do then why else would
4:23she sent 20 irises unless she was
4:26thinking about Mr Alexander being dead
4:28whether it be by one story or the other
4:30well obviously sending the irises was in
4:33response to him being deceased that's
4:34true right and she knew it according to
4:37you there was one or two realities right
4:39she knew that either these two people
4:40came in and killed them or she killed
4:42them right right so she's thinking about
4:44the trauma then right not thinking about
4:47the trauma in terms of her being the
4:49actor or the person who did The Killing
4:51right she's thinking about the trauma in
4:53terms of somebody putting the gun to her
4:54head though right that's correct so she
4:56is then thinking about the trauma right
4:58a trauma that right a trauma right the
5:00trauma that she designated in the PDS
5:02right under number four correct the
5:05other thing that she did with regard to
5:06this is that isn't it true that she um
5:09went on national television with a show
5:11called 48 hours right that's true she
5:13did it on two occasions right yes and
5:16during those two occasions she talked
5:18about her thoughts or feelings and had a
5:20conversation associated with The Killing
5:22right yes so now we have two examples
5:26where she's thinking about the killing
5:27right we don't know what she was
5:29thinking you don't think that when she's
5:31asked about Travis Alexander by a
5:34correspondent that she's not thinking
5:35about the killing what could she
5:37possibly be thinking about then the
5:38alternatives to the fact that she killed
5:40him I'm not but she's thinking about the
5:42trauma he's dead right she's thinking
5:44about the trauma that's right this here
5:46just says efforts to avoid thoughts
5:48feelings or conversations associated
5:50with the trauma it says that right
5:52that's right it says and that comes
5:54straight from DSM 4 right that's right
5:57and you said that that was the Bible
5:58right Absol absolutely and so it doesn't
6:01say with regard to the trauma it doesn't
6:03say whether she killed them or not does
6:05it it also doesn't say absolutely no
6:07thoughts whatsoever it says efforts to
6:10avoid thoughts feelings or conversations
6:13associated with the trauma efforts these
6:15efforts may not always be successful and
6:18that's not my question my question here
6:20that doesn't distinguish the trauma does
6:21it no it and which is the point that you
6:25were trying to make to me with regard to
6:26the PDS right the trauma doesn't matter
6:29right case yes yeah so why is does it
6:31not matter with the PDS and it does
6:33matter here aren't you being a bit
6:34selective I'm not sure I understand what
6:37the point sure you do understand the
6:38question the PDS you told us it doesn't
6:40matter what the trauma is right in at
6:43the time that I scored it correct well
6:45no even now you're telling us when you
6:46testified that the trauma doesn't matter
6:49the trauma did not matter it was her per
6:51it was her internal perceptions of the
6:53emotional reactions to whatever trauma
6:56occurred which is what I measured and
6:58the trauma doesn't matter what you said
7:00and so you said you could still use that
7:02test and don't have to rescore it
7:04because the trauma doesn't matter that's
7:05what you said in response to a jury's
7:07question right yes so if that analysis
7:10applies for the PDS you're saying uhuh
7:12that analysis does not apply to the DSM
7:14for even though the PDS was used to
7:17corroborate the post-traumatic stress
7:19disorder right I'm afraid I'm not
7:21getting the point question sustained sir
7:26you did use the PDS to support or
7:28corroborate you're finding that this was
7:30post-traumatic stress disorder right
7:32correct and you said with regard to that
7:34the trauma doesn't matter right yes with
7:36regard to this by its own definition it
7:38says effects to avoid thoughts feelings
7:40or conversations associated with the
7:43trauma right yes it doesn't say first or
7:45second story does it no it doesn't it
7:48talks about the trauma of of being
7:50either at one point an observant to the
7:53killing or being the actor in The Killer
7:55right so when you start trying to make
7:57this distinction with me about she
7:59doesn't know whether or not she killed
8:00him it's just trauma that we're talking
8:02about whether or not it was her that
8:03killed him or somebody else right that's
8:06point I so we get back to the 48 Hours
8:08interview when you're say you I told we
8:11discussed this and the question was well
8:13isn't it true that she discussed
8:16thoughts feelings conversations
8:17associated with the trauma in the 48
8:19Hours interview yes so again that speaks
8:23against what's in number one doesn't it
8:25I'm sorry I don't see it that way right
8:27you wouldn't see that that way because
8:28you have feeling for the defendant right
8:30I beg your pardon
8:32sir the objection it's argumentative
8:35totally inappropriate we approach RoR
8:38you
8:58may e
9:42you don't see it that way right it's
9:43your opinion right yes it is as well as
9:46my professional opinion it's your
9:48professional opinion based on these 35
9:50years that you've been telling us about
9:51right that's correct so one of the other
9:54things that uh we know in this case is
9:56that the defendant spoke with lesle yudy
10:00you're you're familiar with that
10:02right uh could you refresh my memory
10:09sure approach
10:28please e
11:03sir we had information that the
11:05defendant after traveling to Utah spoke
11:07to lesie yudy about Mr Alexander are you
11:11familiar with that yes and in fact one
11:13of the questions I think that you might
11:15have addressed involved the fact that
11:17she told miss yudy about the fact that
11:19her children were going to play with Mr
11:21Alexander's children you remember that I
11:24that's not avoiding thoughts feelings or
11:27conversations associated
11:29with the trauma is it well it is how
11:32could it possibly be because isn't the
11:34person that was killed Travis Alexander
11:36it was isn't it true that Travis
11:38Alexander was a subject of that
11:39conversation that we just discussed yes
11:41but she could not have had that
11:43conversation if she was admitting to the
11:45fact that she killed him and so her
11:48conversation was her way of avoiding
11:51thoughts feelings or conversations
11:53associated with the trauma at that point
11:56the trauma in her mind her perception
11:58was that she did it no matter what she
12:00told me but isn't it true in that
12:03conversation that she's the one that
12:05brought up Mr Alexander are you aware of
12:08that well I can only only aware of what
12:10I read I don't know for sure overr are
12:12you aware of that yes or no I know I
12:14don't know if she was the one who
12:15brought it up but there was a
12:16conversation to that effect let's assume
12:18that it was her that brought it up
12:19wouldn't that be contrary to what we
12:22have listed in number one no sir not it
12:24would not be the other thing that we
12:26know is that uh she sent the letter to
12:27the family are you aware of that to the
12:29whom the family of Mr Alexander yes I am
12:33again she sent this letter to the family
12:36talking about the killing right you've
12:39read that right yes it's an 18-page
12:40letter right yes and it's a very long
12:44detailed letter isn't it yes that
12:46doesn't show she had to go to the effort
12:49of addressing it didn't she yes she had
12:52to go to the effort of getting it mailed
12:54right yes and she had to go through the
12:57effort of finding the address right
13:00I don't know whether she had the address
13:01or not but yes she had if she did have
13:03the address she would have to have
13:04addressed it correct correct so that
13:06doesn't that is not an effort to avoid
13:08thoughts feelings or
13:10associations conversations associated
13:12with the trauma is it it is if the
13:14trauma was killing Mr Alexander well no
13:17the trauma here again we keep going back
13:19to this isn't the trauma that Mr
13:21Alexander is
13:24dead by whatever means well that's one
13:27aspect of the trauma but the reality
13:29reality is her experience was that she
13:32did do the killing and she her
13:34perceptions and her emotions are tied
13:37into to what actually occurred not the
13:39story that was made up as a way of
13:42separating herself from the horror of
13:44what had happened on that day going back
13:46to the PDS you told us that the trauma
13:48didn't matter for purposes of your
13:50assessment right that's correct because
13:52what the PDS measures were her emotional
13:54states and her perceptions of the trauma
13:57whatever happened and at the time that
14:00it was administered she was telling this
14:01alternative story but the reality was
14:04she was responding to the emotional
14:06components which is what the PDS
14:08measures as a person who did commit this
14:11crime and killing Mr Alexander involved
14:13trauma right involved what killing Mr
14:16Alexander involved trauma right yes his
14:19whether it be by her hand or somebody
14:20else's hand it involved trauma right so
14:23this is what this is talking about
14:24whether her hand or somebody else's hand
14:26isn't it it doesn't distinguish it
14:28doesn't say but the trauma has to be
14:30associated with the Killer killing the
14:32person
14:34does um as I indicated earlier the
14:38trauma involved the killing of Mr
14:40Alexander she experienced that
14:43regardless of the story that she was
14:45telling at the time and so her
14:48psychological um uh reactivity and her
14:52psychological defense mechanisms were
14:54helping her avoid the thoughts feelings
14:56and conversations associated with with
14:59her having been the perpetrator of that
15:02killing my question is trauma doesn't
15:05distinguish between the killer or
15:07somebody who was a witness that's it
15:09well that aspect of the trauma correct
15:10that's correct does not uh the other
15:12thing that we know is that you've read
15:14her journals right I did and you've read
15:16the journal's post killing of Mr
15:17Alexander right yes and in it she goes
15:21out of her way to talk about Mr
15:22Alexander doesn't she well that's for
15:24the exact same
15:26reason but the bottom line is she does
15:29go out of her way which of course
15:31expresses her thoughts and feelings in
15:34that journal right correct but not about
15:37the trauma right yes the other thing
15:41that we know is that Mr Alexander had a
15:44memorial service I believe she said
15:45either July 15th or July 16th are her
15:48words you're aware of that right and um
15:51she attended the me memorial service
15:53you're aware of that
15:56right I believe so and if attended that
15:59memorial service certainly that is not
16:02an effort to avoid thinking feeling or
16:07talking uh about the trauma is it it was
16:11her way of avoiding dealing with the
16:13fact that she was responsible for that
16:15trauma by allowing herself to go through
16:18life in a in at that time in in a in a
16:22manner consistent with having been a
16:24victim of the trauma not dealing with
16:27the fact that she did perpetrate the
16:29trauma now you're adding an extra uh
16:32element here responsibility aren't
16:34you you're adding responsibility to the
16:37word trauma aren't you you're saying
16:40well she's trying to deal with her
16:41responsibility in this issue and that's
16:43how she chose to deal with it perhaps I
16:46misspoke there and this is irrespective
16:49of responsibility isn't
16:52it an individual's inner perceptions is
16:55not independent of the nature of the
16:57trauma
16:59and all of this is based on what she
17:00told you right that's correct and so you
17:03know that she goes to the memorial
17:04service so she has to think about going
17:07to the memorial service right well yes
17:09and so she has to book a flight right
17:12yes did you know that it was a flight
17:13that she I didn't know it was a flight
17:14and she got you want to see the receipt
17:16pardon me do you want to see the receipt
17:18that shows she took a flight I don't
17:20need to see the receipt all right uh the
17:22other thing is it requires that she make
17:25her way from the airport over to airport
17:27over to Mesa which is where she told us
17:29the memorial service was she requires
17:31some thought there right yes do you know
17:34whether or not she went over to the
17:35house during the time that she was here
17:37at the memorial service I don't know
17:39that and if she had gone over there
17:41wouldn't that indicate something to you
17:43that she
17:44is doing anything but avoiding thoughts
17:47about the know I don't know that she
17:49went to the house but assuming she did
17:51if you assume that she went over to the
17:53house with somebody named Aaron assume
17:56that wouldn't that indicate that she was
18:00not attempting to avoid uh thinking
18:03about the trauma if her actions were
18:06part of an avoidance reaction a defense
18:10mechanism a
18:13dissociative reality then it would be
18:16consistent with going to that site
18:18because she wouldn't have been
18:20responding as if she was the
18:23perpetrator and and and so again I don't
18:26know that she did go over there but if
18:28you have something that I can read to
18:30confirm that I would be appreciated that
18:32would make a difference for you well I'd
18:33like if for example somebody named Aaron
18:35Morton went over there with her I beg a
18:37paron if if if somebody actually went
18:38over there to the crime scene with her
18:40afterwards well I I'm I'm at this point
18:42I don't recall what the details were I'm
18:45assuming that you're a man of your word
18:47and what you're telling me is is actual
18:49so I'll go along with that but here
18:51again we're talking about trauma it
18:53doesn't distinguish between responsibil
18:55it doesn't talk about responsibility it
18:58just talks about trauma doesn't it well
19:00there are different kinds of trauma and
19:01different levels of trauma and you've
19:03told us that it doesn't make any
19:05difference in the trauma experienced by
19:06a police officer right it doesn't make
19:08any difference does it if it's a police
19:10officer or her right in terms of
19:14PTSD well people's Rea it's a person's
19:17reactions to a trauma that determines
19:19whether or not they develop PTSD didn't
19:22you just tell us when you were asked by
19:24the jurors there was a question
19:26involving are you saying that the
19:28defendant PTSD is the same is that of a
19:31police officer and you said that it was
19:33no what I said was that it met the same
19:35criteria it's not caused by the same
19:37factors but it has the same
19:39characteristics indeed all cases of PTSD
19:43all fall under the same diagnostic
19:45criteria right because the trauma
19:48doesn't look at the responsibility of it
19:51doesn't in other words it doesn't look
19:53as to whether you are rightful in doing
19:56it as opposed to wrongful in doing it
19:59right it has an impact on one's
20:01perceptions of the intensity of the
20:02trauma right but whether or not a person
20:05has this intensity of the TR of this
20:08PTSD it is
20:09PTSD whether it's slight PTSD or strong
20:13PTSD right correct So when you say that
20:15the police officer's PTSD may not be as
20:17strong as hers it's still PTSD right it
20:20still falls under the diagnostic
20:22criteria yes right so that the trauma in
20:25other words whether you are killing
20:26wrongfully or rightfully in your mind
20:29it's still trauma that triggers PTSD
20:32right both would be trauma but of a
20:33different nature sure but it's trauma
20:36right yes and the same analysis applies
20:39to somebody in war in Afghanistan you
20:41told us that right yes as it does to the
20:43defendant right yet in terms of the
20:45diagnosis of pts sure and C1 illustrates
20:48that point doesn't it correct so with
20:51regard to that one of the things that we
20:53know is that she talked in the journals
20:56about Mr Alexander right yes
20:59she talked over and over about him
21:01didn't she
21:04yes I don't know that's not an avoidance
21:08of feelings or thoughts about him is it
21:10yes it can be because if she's talking
21:14about him in flowing terms and how
21:16wonderful he was it's a way of
21:18insulating her from this the harsh
21:20reality that she did The Killing and so
21:24that that method of dealing with his
21:26demise is very different than some one
21:28saying oh my gosh I've done this
21:30horrible thing and uh I take all full
21:33responsibility for that it's a different
21:35way of dealing with a similar situation
21:38but it's very different in terms of the
21:39internal perceptions and in terms of the
21:42emotional reactivity of the client it
21:45requires thinking to write down what she
21:48did in her journals right yes and it
21:51requires thinking about the trauma
21:54doesn't it yes it
21:55does irres of whether a right rightful
21:58or wrongful it requires that so there
22:01are there was nothing that required her
22:05for example she wasn't attending a
22:07course in school that required her to
22:10write in those journals right correct it
22:12was a voluntary effort on her part
22:14correct she has used Journal writing as
22:16a way of dealing with her life since she
22:19was in school this is an extension of
22:21that this is not a new activity it's not
22:24my question nobody forced her to write
22:26in those journals forced her to write
22:28and
22:29it required her to think about it before
22:32she wrote Whatever She Wrote in those
22:33journals
22:35right sustained well and it wasn't that
22:39she just had one entry in there she had
22:40many entries right yes and she continued
22:44on up till at least a day or two until
22:47her arrest right
22:49correct the other thing sir is that
22:52shortly after this killing um the
22:56defendant called Mr Alexander's
22:59answering machine are you aware of that
23:01yes that's not an effort to avoid
23:03thinking about the trauma is it it's a
23:05consistent it's consistent however with
23:08her psychological condition of having
23:10created an alternative reality which
23:13allowed her to function in life because
23:15it was a way that she was able to deny
23:17having been the perpetrator of the crime
23:20in terms of that telephone call it
23:23required her to pick up the telephone to
23:26make the call didn't it yes it required
23:28whether or not she had him on speed dial
23:30or otherwise it required her to manually
23:32do something by pushing at least one
23:34button correct sure and it required her
23:37while she was on the phone to speak
23:40right even though the trauma had already
23:43occurred it required her to express her
23:47thoughts feelings in a onesided
23:50conversation on the telephone right she
23:52did do that additionally didn't she also
23:55send an
23:56email yes and and this email was sent to
23:59Mr Alexander's um account wherever the
24:02account was right yes and so that
24:05required her to think about sitting down
24:08and composing an email to him didn't it
24:09yes it did and she sat wherever it was
24:12that she sat and she act

About this transcript

This page contains the full transcript of Jodi Arias Trial - Day 36 - Part 2 by croakerqueen123, generated from the public captions YouTube serves with the video. The transcript has 3,763 words across 549 segments, with the original timestamps preserved so you can click any line to jump to that moment in the embedded player.

What you can do with it

Use the transcript to take notes, quote the speaker, build a study guide, generate a summary with ChatGPT or Claude via the YouTube Summary tool, or export it as a timed subtitle file with YouTube to SRT. You can also re-open it in the transcriber to translate the transcript into 100+ languages.

Free YouTube transcript tool

YouTube2Text is a free YouTube transcript generator — no signup, no daily limit. Paste any YouTube link and get the full transcript instantly, with timestamps, click-to-jump, translation to 100+ languages, AI prompts for ChatGPT, Claude, and Gemini, and exports to TXT, SRT, VTT, or Markdown.