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Jodi Arias - Police Phone Interviews June 10, 21 (vm) & 25, 2008 — Transcript

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0:07well um can I call you again if I need
0:09more information I have another question
0:13do you have any questions I can answer
0:15for you
0:17um yeah do you know when all this
0:19happened I mean I got a call last night
0:21but is there any word
0:23on um sometime between Thursday and uh
0:31we're not sure we
0:34hav't um and you said that maybe
0:37multiple people because he's a big guy
0:39was I maybe you can't talk about this
0:41but was there um was there like any kind
0:44of weapon used or or was there was it
0:48was there a gun was there I can't say
0:50what type of of weapon was used but yeah
0:52I I'm guessing there was a weapon
0:54despite the type of injuries that were
0:55left
0:56behind um do you know of him having any
1:00all in the house um his two FS really
1:07yeah no no handguns or rifles or no he
1:12wasn't one to keep any that that
1:14I or anything like no he was more into
1:19like wrestling and UFC and he had you
1:22know he said he had just bought a
1:23punching bag and he's like I love a crap
1:26on the punch you know um
1:38hours interview with Jody
1:42Aras number 2008
1:4616184 hello hello can you speak to jod
1:49please this jod hey jod this is
1:51detective Steve Flores Bas Arizona
1:53Police Department oh hey how are you
1:55good I I just got a message uh from one
1:57of my patrol officers that uh need talk
2:00to me about something well I just wanted
2:02to offer any assistance that I might
2:03have I was a really good friend of
2:04Travis's and I just you know I I don't
2:09know a lot of anything but what what
2:11have you heard so far I heard that he
2:13was that he passed away and that um it
2:17was I I don't know I've heard all kinds
2:19of rumors I heard there was a lot of
2:21blood I heard that um his roommate found
2:23him or his friend dra him or people were
2:26I just I'm sorry to so I I'm upset but
2:30um I've heard that I nobody's been able
2:33to get a hold of him for almost a week
2:36which and that was about the last time I
2:38spoke to him two um which is actually
2:41why I thought I my friend said I should
2:43call you anyway and let you know the
2:44last time I talked to him yeah
2:46absolutely I mean any help we can get
2:47from anybody who had any kind of contact
2:50with him any contact I used to talk to
2:54him quite regularly um I used to live
2:56there I live in Northern California now
2:59um but after I moved I moved a few
3:01months ago and after I moved we kept in
3:03touch very regularly and um kind of fell
3:07back a little bit and it it got down to
3:09about a couple times a week but I hadn't
3:11heard from him I I I talked to him on
3:14Tuesday night um I looked at my phone
3:17records on on on the internet to check
3:20and uh I definitely talked to him
3:21Tuesday
3:23night so was on was that your cell phone
3:25or yeah that was my cell that's the only
3:27phone I have okay is it this is this the
3:31number that I called yeah
3:34okay so that was Tuesday night do you
3:38remember about what
3:39time uh I think it was I want to say
3:43like a quarter after nine but I think it
3:45was sometime between 8 and 10 I know it
3:48wasn't as late as 10 probably between
3:508:30 and 9:30 more so
3:55I and what did you guys talk about um it
3:59was brief he I was um I was driving out
4:01to Utah and you know he was like are you
4:04g to come out and see me and I'm like no
4:05and you know he's he's supposed to make
4:07a trip up here um at the end of the
4:10month because he we um thing that we are
4:15doing it's called um there's a book
4:17called a thousand places to see before
4:18you die and it's been featured on the
4:20Travel Channel and all that and we sort
4:22of got into that last year where we're
4:24starting to see all these different
4:25places on the list and we thought a
4:27thousand places is a lot of places but
4:29why not that would be fun goal so we
4:32each kind of have that goal and and one
4:33of thees is the Oregon coast um and the
4:36sherian festival and so he was going to
4:38come up here for that um and we were
4:41just going to go see that in Crater Lake
4:43and and just different landmarks then
4:45was that trip already scheduled or was
4:47just something you guys talked about um
4:49it was it was it was wasn't officially
4:52like dated but I had been trying to
4:54reach in so that I could solidify my own
4:55schedule because I was planning on
4:57making a trip down there um soon
5:00but uh it was supposed to happen of May
5:03and then supposed to happen um last week
5:08and that didn't work out so he was gonna
5:10leave for Cancun today and um and then
5:13he said as soon as he gets back from
5:14Cancun he was trip because he's going to
5:16drive up the coast and when he reaches
5:19me we'll go do some things and then
5:21he'll continue on to Washington and see
5:23some friends up there um and then I
5:26guess that was supposed to happen before
5:28the beginning of July July he was
5:30supposed to go to Washington DC okay did
5:33did he have any issues with anybody here
5:36in town any enemies anybody that wanted
5:39to do him harm you know got his tires
5:42last it was last
5:44year um he was he he said he was worried
5:49about that um and I was worried about
5:51that he never locked his doors and I
5:53told I would tell him lock your doors
5:55and like you're not my mom you know and
5:57um I come from he comes from a A Bad
6:01City I he comes from rubydo California
6:03which is Gang and violence but and I
6:06come from a similar type of neighborhood
6:08in California so I've always my parents
6:10and I we've always locked our doors and
6:12that's just my habit that he doesn't
6:13have that habit and he lives in a great
6:15neighborhood and it's never been an
6:16issue nothing has ever been stolen
6:19nothing has ever been he's never been
6:21you know broken into and and he had his
6:23tire flashed um I don't remember when it
6:26was it was last year sometime around
6:28Christmas I think
6:30okay
6:33and other than that now how would you
6:37describe your relationship with him we
6:40dated
6:41for we dated for like five months and we
6:45broke up and we continue actually to see
6:47each other for quite a bit um you know
6:51right until I moved when did you guys
6:54break up we officially broke up June
6:5729th of last year
7:02but we didn't we even though we broke up
7:04we were no longer boyfriend and
7:05girlfriend we decided to remain friends
7:08but you know I I kind of feel
7:10embarrassed talking about this but it
7:12was more like it was more friends but it
7:14wasn't boyfriend girlfriend it was more
7:16like kind of Bud you know what I mean
7:18yes okay so you guys were not like
7:21romantically together at any time or we
7:25we were intimate um but I wouldn't say
7:28romantic as far as relation reltionship
7:29goes but we were in no way headed toward
7:33marriage we talking anything about that
7:36H
7:38probably much sometimes now you say
7:41intimate does that include like a sexual
7:43relationship with him yeah it does okay
7:46I know it's kind of embarrassing to talk
7:47about you don't know me so yeah and if
7:51you could just keep it confidential for
7:52now because I know that it's you he's
7:55Mormon not seriously look down upon in
7:58our church and
8:00I mean I just I'm telling you this to
8:03help in any way I can okay I appreciate
8:06it um so you actually moved back to
8:10California a couple of months ago yeah I
8:13did okay what day was that do you
8:16remember um I don't remember the exact
8:18date I mean I had the date during at the
8:20U-Haul was early April early like before
8:23April 10th so it's after the 1 but
8:26before the 10th so I'm getting 7 8 nth
8:31maybe I'd have to check the
8:33DAT did did you stop by the house uh
8:36when you rented the UL s by house oh
8:38yeah in fact um after I was I was almost
8:42moved out completely out of my house for
8:44about a week afterward and I just stayed
8:46at this house the whole time I mean I
8:48practically lived there um even when I
8:49was there I spent I spent the night
8:51there several times a week while I lived
8:53there um I came over and clean's house a
8:57lot sort of he paid me a a little bit
8:59every month to keep his house nice and
9:01clean sort of like a housekeeper so um
9:04did you ever uh happen to meet any of
9:06his roommates at that time um I knew his
9:09room really well at the time um various
9:12roommates some have moved out one guy
9:13moved to Utah and one guy moved to
9:15Phoenix um Zach is the I don't know if
9:18Zach is still there I think he is yeah
9:20he is um I knew Zach because I met him
9:24and you know we we sort of connected
9:26because he's a photographer like on am
9:28you know he took the room that that Aon
9:32lived in previously
9:33so yeah what what do you think about
9:36Zach what do you think his relationship
9:38is with with your
9:40ex-boyfriend um he seemed like a nice
9:43guy when I first met him he seemed um
9:46just like a normal guy the return
9:47missionary um from and he
9:52served okay good I didn't L you um he
9:55served his he served his mission I don't
9:57I think in Arizona and he liked it so
9:58much that he back new Travis from church
10:01so you know um yeah him and his
10:04girlfriend were there there I think
10:05there was some alcohol there one time
10:07and Travis um was suspicious about it
10:10but he said he used it for cooking you
10:13know that's fine because you know
10:15Mormons don't drink alcohol but um well
10:20some yeah so they're not supposed to and
10:23Travis you know that's another thing
10:24when it came to that we call it the word
10:26of wisdom no Alcohol Tobacco drugs or or
10:30Co coffee or tea and he was just super
10:33super super strict on that yeah he
10:35wouldn't even take exed for a headache
10:36because it had caffeine she's so strict
10:39on that I'm I'm a little less strict on
10:41that I'll popic any day but there's a
10:43lot of diet CES in the fridge yeah
10:46they're not travises I can guarantee you
10:48he wouldn't even touch Coke so it's one
10:51of his other roommates I guess and that
10:54was around April that you last saw him
10:57right early ail you haven't haven't been
10:59back in town since then no I haven't at
11:02all um okay I thought somebody had
11:04mentioned your name and youve been back
11:06in town for like a week or a couple days
11:08oh I've been I've been thinking about
11:10going there so yeah I've been definitely
11:12planning on heading down there um but
11:14you haveen physically been here since
11:16since you left since I moved no I
11:20haven't I was gonna go this week
11:22actually while he was in Camp and stay
11:24at his house but I just not in the
11:27budget
11:30so um was that something that you guys
11:32had scheduled that you were going to
11:33come down
11:35St yeah no actually not that's what I
11:38had emailed him about last week because
11:40it was kind of last minute because I was
11:41gonna go I'm looking at a calendar here
11:43I was going to go not this week but the
11:45next and then he was going to come up
11:46here that following week which was
11:48before July and um it all sounds kind of
11:51weird we're all like Travelers um and I
11:54figured you know it would be a good idea
11:56if I I would have a place to stay his
11:58house is open all the time to friends I
12:00mean anybody in his business or anybody
12:03that comes to visit he gives up his bed
12:04he'll sleep on the couch he lets him
12:06have the whole room um so it just didn't
12:09seem like he said the door is always
12:11open so I would have felt totally okay
12:14just showing up and staying at his house
12:16eating his frozen dinners etc etc and we
12:19would have been fine with that too and I
12:21just you know he said just always give
12:22me a heads up so I I asked them you know
12:24let me know if that's cool if not I'll
12:26make go arrangements and I never heard
12:27that and when was it email down
12:31H just a few days ago I'm in front of
12:34the computer so I can check right now
12:35for you
12:38yeah
12:40yeah just L my
12:44account what's his email
12:48address yeah to his email yeah what is
12:51his email address you know off email is
12:54um travis.
12:56Alexander gmail.com
13:03um let's
13:06see I sent one on June
13:097th haven't heard back from you he got a
13:13little bit upset when I said I wasn't
13:14driving out to see him but he he gets
13:17upset real easily
13:20um I don't know he just he like hanged
13:23over me a little bit and we kind of
13:24guilt each other sometimes so you guys
13:27still had a a fairly decent relationship
13:29ship with friends we did um we
13:32had some people that we talked to said
13:35that you guys that your relationship was
13:37kind of Rocky and it got a little got a
13:40little crazy at times or did um what
13:44happened was when I I broke up with
13:46Travis around last year because it was
13:49all really dumb it was a bunch of drama
13:51I uh had the suspicion that he was
13:53cheating on me and so I I looked in his
13:56phone to find out and I found all these
13:58text messages and like it just all blew
14:00up and it was like we realized we
14:02couldn't trust each other so I mean we
14:04broke up at that point but we were still
14:07we were still attracted to each other
14:08and we still loved each other so it
14:10wasn't the best thing but we still hung
14:12out all the time together and um it
14:15didn't really help either of us to move
14:17on because I haven't really dated anyone
14:19since and he told me that he hadn't
14:23dated anyone since but then he told me
14:25that he has so it it's all been kind of
14:28weird because we kept our dating lives
14:30sort of from each other like a don't ask
14:32don't tell policy sort of and uh just I
14:37think it was it worked out it was more
14:39convenient for us I figured you know he
14:41doesn't have a girlfriend then I'm okay
14:42coming over and as long if he didn't
14:46think that I was with anybody then he
14:47was fine too so just the L we knew about
14:50each other's dating lives or romantic
14:52lives the better that we were the better
14:55off we
14:56were so um it was
15:00sent June 7th yeah I
15:05without what to are you in
15:07again I'm sorry what town are you in
15:10again I'm in wi California y r e k
15:18a y r e k a uhhuh where is that it is um
15:2415 minutes from Oregon and it's on
15:26Interstate 5 okay
15:30right
15:37yeah not close to the coast no
15:47unfortunately
15:48um I have some other questions I'm
15:51trying to remember what they were I mean
15:54you kind of lived in the house for a
15:56while you you knew the surroundings in
15:59the kind of furniture he had the bedding
16:01and stuff okay can you describe his his
16:04bedroom bedding and stuff for me um
16:07seems kind of unusual question but no
16:09that's fine um I spent a lot of time in
16:11there um he's got like I don't know if
16:14it's like Egyptian cotton or whatever
16:16but it's a really nice um Brown um linen
16:20and it's soft it's not like flannel but
16:22it's soft and uh he always brags to
16:25everyone about his intelligel bed which
16:27it's really comfy um
16:29so he's got a great mattress and it's
16:32like apparently it's like this $5,000
16:34mattress that he picked up for really
16:35really cheap because it was a showroom
16:37thing or it was a return somehow we got
16:39a really sweet deal on it so it's a king
16:42size I don't know if it's California or
16:43what but it's a king size bed it's kind
16:46of like a I think it's like a sleigh bed
16:47it's dark wood okay um but the bedding
16:50is is mainly like a Brown Linen really
16:54nice cotton linen yeah he has it's maybe
16:57different patterns on the sheet for is
16:59the the comforter but the sheets are
17:01brown and the comforter is brown and the
17:02pillowcases are brown what so the color
17:05of the comforter is brown as well does
17:07it have any type of pattern
17:09or or like tassel or edgy I think it has
17:17stripes I it has like and and they're
17:19not like colored Stripes They're just
17:21like stripes in the brown pattern stu oh
17:24like you know it's dark brown but it's
17:26got a little bit darker brown like
17:28threading yeah yeah you can see that
17:30there's a pattern
17:31there and the sheet may be more of like
17:34a checkered thing I
17:36think if I remember
17:40correctly and it his cover too is is bed
17:43spread is like it's a down comforter
17:45that's white and then it's got like a I
17:47don't know what he used to call it it
17:49has special names but it's like a duvet
17:51cover yes a
17:53duvet what what does the duvet look like
17:57um it it comes like
17:59like it's it's got buttons on the end
18:01and it covers the whole thing you slide
18:03the actual comforter inside the DU which
18:05is what you pull off to wash or you know
18:08or you can that kind of thing so and
18:11we've like many times it's so hard to
18:13get in there with one person so you kind
18:15of just grab the corners and we pull it
18:17in together on one side and then you
18:18just sort of fluff it out and then
18:21button up the
18:24button yeah that down kind of just
18:28shoves over one corner and it doesn't
18:29want to spread out yeah exactly um so it
18:34didn't have like any any type
18:36of edging or tassels or anything like
18:39that that you know like a light brown I
18:41I remember is there anything in the
18:43house that resembled anything with some
18:46type of small tan Rish kind of material
18:51or edging or anything like that a
18:54blanket he may have pillows yeah he may
18:56have had pillows um yeah he has pillows
19:00on his um on his bed not on the set but
19:03on the chair that's next to his bed
19:06yeah yeah there's those um there's also
19:10a round pillow
19:12could I it's said and there's just one
19:14he puts it in the
19:15center and like there may be some kind
19:18of tackle thing on
19:24that do do you know anybody back here
19:27still that still has cont cont with him
19:30uh yeah lots of people tons of people is
19:33that how you found out about what what
19:34had happened a friend of mine Dan
19:37Freeman called me last night I met Dan
19:39through Travis Dan Freeman
19:45Freeman okay yeah we we talked to him as
19:53well I met him last year with his sister
19:56when we all took a trip out to the Grand
20:00so he called you last night and told you
20:02what happened yeah yeah
20:05he he didn't have a lot of
20:08information any idea what what
20:10everybody's talking about what what
20:12they're saying what their suspicions are
20:14um they're saying what everything that
20:17I've heard was that and I got a lot of
20:19my information from Bishop bton more
20:22detailed um and he basically that they
20:27they took everything body and separated
20:29them and I don't know who everybody is
20:31I'm assuming Zach because he was there
20:33and his girlfriend um because I called
20:35Zach's cell phone and she couldn't tell
20:36me anything but she answered and she
20:39said there are a lot of people here that
20:40I don't know but um Zach's not here so
20:43it didn't make sense and I I just I was
20:46confused but she couldn't tell me
20:47anything so I didn't get a lot out of
20:49her but Bishop Leon said he was there
20:51for four hours and they interviewed
20:53everybody and they all went to the
20:55police station and um that they're
20:59treating it as a suspicious excuse me as
21:01a suspicious death and I I heard from my
21:05friend um Dave Hall that there was a lot
21:09of blood and I don't know if that's just
21:11a rumor that's going around or true but
21:15and I also heard that his services will
21:17be in California but that they haven't
21:19released his blood to his grandma yet so
21:22um that's all I've really heard so
21:27far well I I can tell you that we're
21:30investigating it as a
21:33homicide not a suspicious death anymore
21:35it's pretty
21:37obvious and it's important for us to
21:41find
21:42out why somebody would want to do harm
21:45to him exactly um what kind of stuff he
21:49was possibly involved in or um or maybe
21:53it just could have been as simple as a
21:56you know a burglary an intruder or
21:58something that had gone wrong I'm
22:01wondering CU he still when you said like
22:04when they said suspicious death I
22:05thought well he's trying to ship pounds
22:08for Cancun so he looks good in boxes or
22:11bathing suit or whatever swim trunks and
22:13um you know I know that he takes or
22:16thought he takes supplements and he
22:17works out really really hard and seen
22:19him work out and it's a very intense
22:21routine and um he has these heavy
22:24dumbbells that he uses and he's so
22:26strong I mean there are a couple times
22:28we tried to wrestle just for fun and
22:30show me some moves and there's just no
22:32like I don't see how anyone unless maybe
22:34there were two people I don't see how
22:36anyone could overpower him unless they
22:39he's a pretty good sized guy yeah he was
22:43close to 200 pounds I think yeah yeah it
22:46would take I would say two people if not
22:49maybe more to kind of overpower
22:52him um I mean I've tried with officers
22:55you know working this job to take down a
22:58woman 135 PBS who's out of control and
23:01it's difficult to control you know
23:03somebody like
23:05that um no ideas come to mind huh why
23:09somebody would want to hurt him is he ow
23:12somebody money did he have any worries
23:15or concerns about anybody he did owe
23:18people money but I they were all good
23:20friends they weren't like it wasn't a
23:23bad situation it was in fact they were
23:25there was one family that lent to money
23:27that's very very wealthy from what I
23:29understand and it's not like it hurt
23:30them to lend in the money of course they
23:31expected him to pay it back and he had a
23:33a very reasonable timeline and they also
23:36had a really good collateral in case he
23:38didn't pay back um they they owned a
23:41piece of stock that he owned so if they
23:43didn't pay him back it was like $6,000
23:45or something um or yeah I think it was
23:476,000 but if they if he didn't get them
23:50paid back on time then they would just
23:51keep a stock which would eventually be
23:53worth over 25,000 so I mean I don't
23:56think they were worried about that at
23:57all um those were that's the Hyatt
23:59Family in Fr Hiatt was there last night
24:02um but I don't I don't I that was when
24:05he was struggling financially several
24:07months back and and um I don't know I
24:10haven't talked to him about how that's
24:12going since um but I know that that
24:15what's the um situation with with the
24:17car that was uh somebody mentioned a BMW
24:21yeah I'm buying this BMW okay because we
24:24found a check that was written by you uh
24:27to him
24:29was last mon yeah yeah I recently him a
24:32check
24:34um I mailed him that in a few other
24:36thing he um I'm P making payments to him
24:39okay you you still have that car right
24:41now no it's actually not in my position
24:44I did the dumb thing um I went and
24:46hooked it up to the U-Haul everything
24:47was cool and F to go and I I got the
24:50dolly that where the back wheels on on
24:52the ground because it was cheaper yeah
24:54and the uul guys said okay drive it up
24:57here okay stop and everything was cool
24:59and I off the car turned it off um got
25:02the car let the door open so they could
25:03look at everything and they shut the
25:05door and said you're good to go and I
25:06took off and this is going to sound
25:08really dumb I realized now that this is
25:10not how you tow a car but I left it in
25:11first gear and I started headed down the
25:14highway and I blew the engine just sming
25:16um looks like it gave birth all over the
25:19highway there's just black oil
25:20everywhere and um so it's sitting at W's
25:24Auto something last time I checked um
25:28it's being there in Mesa and uh the
25:30guy's been really nice about just
25:31keeping it until Travis figures out what
25:33he's going to do we've called we've
25:35called lawyers about it and my lawyer
25:36said um you know um have your insurance
25:39fix it and his lawyer said your
25:41insurance might not fix it because might
25:43be considered mechanical so that's the L
25:45we talked about it we've been um he's
25:47been real busy and hasn't had a lot of
25:49time to attend to it and I have a
25:50vehicle right now but not for much
25:52longer because I have to give it back to
25:53the bank so um you know either way what
25:57did you mail that payment end of May um
26:01it was a few weeks ago yeah it must have
26:06been so you're still you're still making
26:08payments to that oh yeah in fact that's
26:11my first payment because we I just we
26:12just did this card deal like right
26:14before I moved and he said we had a oh
26:17we have a um buyers agreement too I
26:20think that I checked out emailed to him
26:22um but uh we have like you said just get
26:28on your feet you know and instru
26:30payments and the agreement was you know
26:31X am for months whatever it could pay so
26:34finally got a job and gave that payment
26:36for what was
26:39$200 yeah it was um $100 a month
26:43minimum minimum and if I could pay more
26:46pay more please you
26:49know okay U we did talk to certain
26:52people and
26:55um I mean I don't want to tell you this
26:58don't want to make you feel bad but uh
27:00there's they didn't have the the best of
27:02things to say about you um they felt
27:06that you were um either taking advantage
27:09of him or
27:13um just you know hanging around when you
27:16weren't wanted um they mentioned that
27:19you would sometimes you know end up
27:21going into his house and you were in his
27:24house and he didn't want you there and
27:26he would ask you to leave but you would
27:28in return there was also some um some
27:31talk about you you know spying on his
27:34email and Facebook accounts those kinds
27:37of things oh he gave me his um he gave
27:40me his Facebook password and his mind
27:42password and I gave him my but I gave
27:45him my Facebook password and my Gmail
27:47account password and the reason we did
27:49that is because it was kind of dumb we
27:51did that months and months ago and we
27:53thought
27:55um let's what can we do to try to reab
27:58trust between us and um you know well
28:00why don't we start with that and so
28:03that's what we did and then you know it
28:04just didn't work he got really upset
28:06finally and he's like you know this
28:07isn't working um and I said all right
28:10this is too much of a headache let's
28:11just change our passwords so we did we
28:13changed our passwords after that how
28:15long ago did you guys change him uh I
28:17changed mine gosh not long ago
28:22probably three weeks ago
28:25maybe and I don't know about his because
28:28I haven't once he made it clear that he
28:29wasn't comfortable with that anymore I
28:31didn't even try to get back into his
28:32account anymore so yeah I've been
28:36married almost 20 years and I don't have
28:38my wies youa know really I know you know
28:42you just got to trust sometimes true
28:46it's true and I told him you know we'
28:47have we've had hours upon hours of
28:50conversation and I said no I just don't
28:51know if if I could ever trust you again
28:54you know and and he doesn't know if he
28:56could ever trust me again because I
28:57might want to get back into his phone
29:00and find out does he really have
29:01something going on or what because you
29:03know he did at one point um or you know
29:07and so he said yeah I understand that
29:10and he said but if we were married you
29:11would have all my passwords everything
29:13because there wouldn't be anything to
29:14worry about and I thought well that's
29:16nice you know but we're not married so
29:19and as far as getting into his email
29:22that never happened um what he has on
29:24his computer is um he would often times
29:28leave his computer on okay and he'll
29:30leave his Gmail window up and there were
29:32times when I got on his computer to look
29:34up other things and if his Gmail window
29:37was open and I would just close it that
29:39was constantly getting um you know I had
29:43to mention that to you because uh we are
29:45getting a a search warrant for his email
29:48or you know Gmail and Facebook those
29:52account and we can tell where those
29:56things were accessed from by IP
29:58addresses and I just want I just want to
30:00make it clear that um you know that if
30:04you did access it from somewhere else a
30:06certain time you know if you access it
30:09from California we're g to know yeah
30:12I'll tell you right now that I did okay
30:14he gave me his password no the only
30:16accounts that I've accessed though were
30:17Myspace and Gmail because those are the
30:19only passwords how long how long ago
30:21when was the last time you actually
30:23access uh weeks ago we had
30:26um we had a conversation where it's like
30:30we he made it clear that he wasn't
30:32comfortable with that anymore and um and
30:36I said that's okay and he and I changed
30:38my Gmail account password because he got
30:40into that too and then he saw another
30:42guy's email there um and gave me a hard
30:45time about it and so it just was dumb
30:49you know we're both trying to move on
30:51and yeah we're both I don't know weird
30:55seems like there was a lot of jealousy
30:57issues
30:58I think there might have been on both
30:59parts um for me it wasn't so much
31:01jealousy as it was like I just I just
31:05wanted to
31:06know like I just wanted him to be honest
31:09and for him I think there one of the
31:11reasons I moved was because we were
31:13spending too much time together and we
31:15weren't we weren't moving on and um it
31:18wasn't able to I mean I guess I could
31:20have dated other people but our Social
31:22Circles were so small
31:24that anytime you heard about something
31:27it it just just look good did you did
31:29you move down here the first time
31:31because of him yeah I moved there
31:33because of him and I moved away because
31:35of him primarily I also moved away for
31:38financial reasons I'm with my
31:39grandparents now but you know there were
31:42three main reasons I moved here one I
31:44miss my family and two financially and
31:45three was because of traic and the main
31:48reason that I moved there was because of
31:49traic okay yeah because um when we first
31:52arrived on scene I started talking to
31:54people some of his closest friends um
31:58you know began mentioning your name as
32:00you know hey you need to call her
32:01because she probably knows what happened
32:03to him or she possibly has something to
32:06do with it oh gosh no I've that's how
32:09bad it was
32:11getting and I you know I needed to talk
32:13to you to find out why they wouldn't say
32:16something like that uh why would they
32:18would start pointing fingers in your
32:20direction right
32:21away I don't know maybe I'm maybe
32:24because my exgirlfriend we've had lots
32:26of fight was it was a lot of issues uh
32:30you know I mean obviously it wasn't you
32:33know it wasn't a great
32:35relationship it was great for a while
32:37until we until
32:39all yeah we started fighting because I I
32:42did the wrong thing and I got into his
32:44phone because I had a suspicion I that
32:47he wasn't being faithful and I found you
32:49know a bunch of text messages that were
32:51no good and um rather than being an
32:53adult about it and confronting him I I
32:55kept it in and I kind of let it and you
32:58I was miserable and he didn't know why
33:00and I wanted to tell him but I was
33:01worried that it would just lead to a
33:02unnecessary fight and then I realized
33:04this was no kind of relationship so it
33:06finally all came out and he was really
33:08apologetic but we just both realized
33:10that neither of us could be in a in a an
33:14adult relationship and that was June of
33:16last year so at that point
33:21we um we continued to see each other you
33:25know a long time after that well you
33:28know I'm glad I I did get a hold of you
33:30again you did call me because it kind of
33:32clears up a lot of the questions I
33:35had a lot of the
33:38concerns it's not what I don't think
33:40it's what these people
33:42thought
33:44going um I should probably I should
33:47probably tell you that you know Travis
33:50when he got upset he would send
33:52me um really me emails um he would send
33:59me me text messages and things um you'll
34:03find probably some stuff on his Facebook
34:06I know for sure you'll find one on his
34:07Facebook and definitely in his Gmail and
34:09you're welcome to access all of my
34:10accounts too if you want um with we're
34:14probably gonna um gonna subp on all his
34:18Facebook and Gmail
34:19and you know everything to see who he
34:22was communicating with what he was
34:24saying saying to him
34:28I'm not sure how far back uh we usually
34:31go 6 months to a year okay but U you
34:36know in a case like this you know we
34:37need to know you know who had some type
34:40of beef with him who you know why they
34:42would do something like this
34:46to you know I hate telling people over
34:49the phone but you know like I said it is
34:51a homicide
34:52eviation and uh it was an angry
34:57situation
34:59and and when we see scenes like this um
35:04you know the first thing we think is
35:06these people hated each
35:09other Somebody went in there to to hurt
35:12him and and they did and they hurt him
35:16really
35:17bad and he's a big guy and it would take
35:21like I mentioned to you before it would
35:22take more than one person to do this
35:26to can you
35:28and I I was just hoping maybe you could
35:31kind of point me in the right direction
35:33I'm talking to everybody that he
35:36knows might want to talk to a guy named
35:38Thomas Brown um and I don't think that
35:42honestly I haven't seen or heard from
35:43him since he was kicked out
35:46um I think his last name was brown I
35:49could try to find him on on lbs
35:51linkup.com
35:53but um it was you know that was so long
35:57ago though that was was last spring of
35:582007 March even and what happened was he
36:02got kicked out because he was considered
36:05like borderline sexual predator not like
36:07a rapist but coming on to girls and and
36:10you know that kind of thing and it just
36:12really looked down upon in the church
36:13and so he was dis fellowed and Travis
36:16said you need to get out you know get
36:18your stuff out of my house it wasn't a
36:20friendly situation it was said over the
36:21phone because he and I were in um
36:24Missouri and somewhere back he just
36:26touring and um
36:28and um Thomas was so he ended up kicking
36:32him out at that time yeah he kicked him
36:35out at the time but Thomas you know is
36:37is he's a really big guy but he doesn't
36:40seem
36:41like he doesn't seem violent he seemed
36:44pretty gentle he just seemed like a
36:47little bit thuggish but like he was
36:48trying to act AP part not because he was
36:51that because maybe because he thought it
36:53would like attract chicks or something I
36:56don't know
36:58um so he seems honestly like I didn't
37:01know him that well but he seemed like a
37:03big dumb teddy
37:07[Music]
37:11bear okay you know and I just wanted to
37:14say you know again that that Travis and
37:16I had we had an onoff kind of
37:20relationship um I we just weren't
37:24talking a lot the last several weeks um
37:27a couple times a week and I just keep
37:30saying what if what if I just gone down
37:32there what if I had never moved and I
37:34would have been there and I could have
37:36do you guys continue to talk this whole
37:38time yeah yeah definitely we I mean it
37:42it was more sporadic was more sportic
37:44but um we usually talk late at night
37:48like 12 anywhere between 12:00 a.m. and
37:51or 1: a.m. and like 2 or 3 or 4 in the
37:54morning he was kind of um did he have
37:57any other cell phones besides
37:59um well we found one cell phone um no he
38:05I'm pretty sure he didn't otherwise i'
38:06know about it he had his Verizon cell
38:09phone and he had his
38:12landline this is sent to my cell phone
38:15on June 21st 2008 from jod Aras
38:28first Saved message hi detective War
38:30this Jody Aras calling in regards to
38:32Travis Alexander um it's Saturday not
38:35exactly sure what time but um maybe
38:37you're off and still I hope you're
38:38enjoying your day off if not if you
38:40could give me a call back my phone
38:41number is
38:4383142 one91 thanks talk to you soon
38:48bye end of message to delete this
38:51message press seven to save it in the
38:53archives press to hear more
39:00how long did you guys actually know each
39:02other we met in September of 2006 at the
39:06NGM Grant 200 yeah and that was the pre
39:10legal International
39:12Convention where tens of thousands of
39:14people go and when did you guys actually
39:16start
39:17dating um not for a while we met in
39:21September uh the following weekend he
39:23invited me to church and the following
39:25Wednesday of that Sunday he gave me a
39:26copy of the book of I started reading it
39:28I got baptized November
39:3126th um we would talk a lot and hang out
39:34a lot and we kind of had like a thing
39:36and there was definitely an attraction
39:37and an interest but we weren't
39:38officially dating until about February
39:41of 2007 early February say um and I
39:45think just a string of events sort of
39:48pushed that Together Travis has kind of
39:50a
39:51commitment uh phobia I guess you could
39:54say
39:57down here no I didn't move down actually
39:59until June which was right about the
40:01time we broke up ironically she mov up
40:03in June of 2007 you guys broke up soon
40:06after yeah we broke up L at the same
40:10time I've been in relationships before
40:13where that the other guy wasn't faithful
40:15and there's like a distinctive gut
40:16feeling that you just have and that I've
40:20noticed and because I've been in
40:21relationships where they were Faith at
40:22least to my knowledge they were totally
40:24faithful um and that feeling just isn't
40:26there so I had this deing with Travis
40:28and I gently asked him about it he got
40:30really upset and he's like he's like no
40:32there's nothing there don't worry about
40:33it and I knew he was on his phone
40:34texting a lot and I he was texting these
40:36girls and I was like um I was like well
40:41are what about your text messages he's
40:42like look I can be flirtatious but
40:44there's nothing going on and I said okay
40:46so um this was last year I think in June
40:49and one day he was taking a nap and I
40:52felt this is why we lost this is one of
40:53the reasons we lost all of our trust um
40:56I just I should done this but I grabbed
40:58his phone and I looked at his text
40:59messages and I found there were tons of
41:02girls that I'd never heard of and I knew
41:04that he knew a lot of people from the
41:05business so I didn't worry too much
41:07about it but what bothered me was there
41:08were um not only were some flirtations
41:10like I had suspected which bothered me
41:12but it wasn't necessarily a crime um but
41:15there were plenty of uh
41:18uh there were like plans like things
41:21like um well where do you want to meet
41:24oh I don't know where's the best place
41:25for where's the best place whoever the
41:26best place to make out it you know and I
41:28was like what oh my gosh you know we've
41:30been dating for a few months at this
41:31point and and he always said well we're
41:34not dating anybody else and and to him
41:36that was I think reasonable enough
41:38because I think in his mind he was
41:40making out with other girls but he
41:41wasn't dating them was okay and the only
41:43reason I think that's true is because of
41:45what we continue to do while he was
41:47dating Lisa and I didn't realize that
41:49either um so I confronted him about it
41:51actually I didn't confront him at first
41:52I should have been an adult about it in
41:54confronted him but I held it in for a
41:55few weeks and then it all came out and
41:57when we broke up and so I just realized
41:59that I I don't I didn't feel like I
42:01could trust him fully to be monogamous
42:04and I don't think that he could trust me
42:05fully to not get back in his phone somay
42:08and then try to find something
42:11El whole time down here that you just
42:13kind of tried
42:15to work and I yeah I guess I figured you
42:19know like Mesa is like the Morman land
42:21of opportunity honestly kind of the way
42:23I foret it
42:27kind of hung around town doing your
42:29thing till April or so and then you left
42:32uh yeah I hung around I was in the
42:34University 6th Ward went there he was in
42:37his Desert Ridge Ward and we we didn't
42:40live that far apart so I mean I was over
42:43there a lot um not not a lot a lot
42:46because he had his own Social Circle
42:48from his church that I didn't really
42:50want to interact with because I I sense
42:54that maybe there's a little bit of
42:55awkwardness there because of Lisa and
42:57because of atena and oh that's right
42:59Lisa after
43:02that you mention it I mean obviously you
43:04guys dated before and yeah we did we we
43:08kind of just still really good friends
43:11but not you know
43:13romantically seeing each other
43:15anymore uh not exactly um we broke up
43:21kind yeah and I would say there was
43:24there was certainly a romantic side to
43:25it you could say or an intimate side to
43:28it um but uh we weren't exactly on the
43:31path to marriage anything like that and
43:33we both knew
43:35that I mean some people have some
43:38unpleasant stuff to say about you and uh
43:41I don't know why I mean I talked to you
43:43seem like a great person and you know
43:46they're just saying that you were kind
43:47of obsessive after the breakup and
43:51things like that but what was going on
43:53make them think that the only thing I
43:55can think of and I realize that is
43:57because I was at his house a lot um but
43:59I didn't go to his house unless I was
44:01invited over unless he knew I was coming
44:03over um he would send me text messages
44:05late at night saying hey I'm getting
44:07sleepy dot dot dot with
44:08somee um dot dot dot and that was like
44:11that became like my queue that became
44:13like our code word for um I'm falling
44:16asleep you can come over now and sneak
44:17into my room and wake me up kind of
44:18thing and so um that would happen a lot
44:21and uh I I mean I don't want to make
44:24this unpleasant or anything but I mean
44:27um was there still a sexual relationship
44:29going on after that yeah there
44:33was last time actually at his house was
44:36in April when you left yeah it was April
44:39I spent um I had my friend Rachel that I
44:43originally moved down with gave me a
44:44pluton to sleep on and I gave that back
44:47um about a week week and a half prior to
44:49moving her her and her husband came out
44:51with his truck and they loaded it up cuz
44:53I they were just lending it to me and I
44:55didn't want to move it so they came got
44:57it and I didn't have a bed and he was
44:59like you know you just come stay with me
45:01so I pretty much stayed there for the
45:04last
45:05week left yeah said something about you
45:08you know the last day you had a U-Haul
45:10and you were leaving and uh you had
45:13stopped by to say goodbye or something
45:15yeah I had the U-Haul and I I was
45:17already there but I parked it around the
45:19corner because it was huge and I had a
45:21car my car on the back of it so I
45:23couldn't just park it right out in front
45:24of his house so there's a there's a
45:26little um
45:27you go just past his house around the
45:29corner i' be Hall Park there it's like
45:33so do you remember what day April it was
45:37I don't I want to say I keep thinking
45:39the ninth but before you quote me on
45:41that I can I can check towards the
45:44beginning of April something yeah it was
45:47like more towards the middle but it was
45:49already with maybe toward the beginning
45:51yeah because originally I was supposed
45:53to leave early April like April 1st like
45:56left fool but I ended up staying um
45:58another four or five days was like stay
46:01there with him or some yeah okay yeah
46:03with him yeah a lot of pictures actually
46:06he just bought a he had just purchased a
46:09camera yeah I remember that I mean we
46:11found the box in his house and
46:13everything yeah he um did did you help
46:15him byy that or I did yeah I was I was
46:18living here but he called me for advice
46:21and I was on the phone with him that's
46:22who I I saw somebody who knew what they
46:24were doing before I bought a camera yeah
46:26and I guess a photographer he he he
46:28texted me and he was like what do you
46:29think of this camera and I texted him
46:31back well what about this and finally I
46:33was like just call me this is too
46:34complicated so he called me and he was
46:35going over I was like ask her this and
46:37so he was asking the sales rep what
46:38about this this and this and where's the
46:40flash located in mega pixels and the
46:42brand I was like don't get anything
46:43Kodak you know just different things So
46:45eventually he settled on I don't
46:47remember what he got but it was it
46:48sounded like it was a really nice
46:50camera do you remember when you got that
46:55camera April maybe I know it was after I
46:58moved it could have been in
46:59May could have been in May um I know it
47:02was after I moved up here because I was
47:04I was here I was on the phone with him
47:06purchasing see you never got to see the
47:08camera then or anything no and I'm
47:10trying to remember well we the reason
47:12I'm asking is because we found this
47:14camera and you know it's pretty much
47:17ruined and we didn't know why oh I can't
47:20you know this go why but you know how
47:22it's Ru but we just it's we're just
47:25don't sound we have no idea why somebody
47:27would you know destroy his
47:29camera and oh wonder if you could
47:32describe it to me but obviously you
47:33haven't seen it you've never touched it
47:35never seen it so no um I think I'm
47:38thinking there's a picture of him on
47:40Facebook where he took a picture of
47:41himself in the mirror okay and I think
47:43that's his camera so I mean I can't tell
47:45what it is though because the picture
47:46isn't really sharp and it's a small
47:48resolution but there's a picture of him
47:50on his profile picture on
47:53Facebook calling Jody Aras it's uh
47:576258 at 1105 hours
48:00dr2
48:038161 0844
48:39hello hello Jody yes hi just take the
48:42floor hey how are you pretty good all
48:45right is this a good time for
48:48you I'm sorry I'm sorry bad reception is
48:51this a good time for you to talk uh yeah
48:54this I'm sorry yeah this mine I'm just
48:56driving a spot where I'm good okay sorry
48:59got you driving hope I don't distract
49:00you too much that's okay car accident or
49:03something yeah all right hey um the
49:07reason I wanted to talk to you is just
49:08to kind of figure out what was going on
49:09the week um just prior to when we when
49:13we found uh Travis um because we're not
49:16we're still not sure what day you know
49:19this incident happened we're trying to
49:20figure out you know who had contact with
49:22them and I know I talked to you you know
49:26a couple weeks ago AG go about what was
49:27going on but it was kind of brief and I
49:29was just trying to get to everybody who
49:32yeah had a theory or whatever but um can
49:35you tell me what was going on let's just
49:36say starting on Monday I think it was
49:38the
49:39second Monday the second tell me if you
49:42or when you had contact with him or the
49:44last yeah I think I know that I talked
49:47to
49:48him early Monday morning uh which would
49:51have I was just up late Sunday night for
49:53example and um I probably talked to him
49:58it may have been a good 45 minutes that
50:00that morning and we were just talking
50:03about um how he was he had a
50:05conversation with another person about
50:07Gordon gley and they were it was a
50:08really good conversation you know he was
50:10just talking a lot about what was said
50:12there and I think we probably talked
50:15till about 4 in the morning I say yeah
50:18we were he was a night out I'm night out
50:20and it wasn't a really long like we've
50:22had conversations that have lasted hours
50:23and hours but this one was probably only
50:26I want to say 45 minutes it may have
50:28been longer I guess I could check and
50:30that was late at night well technically
50:33it was early Monday morning okay that
50:35was in the
50:36second so um yeah that was primarily
50:40what that one consisted of and you know
50:42he knew I was taking a road trip that
50:43week and he was kind of guilting me
50:45because I wasn't going to Arizona I was
50:47going to Utah
50:49um conference or something in Arizona as
50:52well it was um the the primary reason
50:56didn't tell Travis this but the primary
50:58reason I was going there was to meet
51:00somebody um and you know we we weren't
51:03like totally open about our dating lives
51:05just because it was just an area where
51:08we just kind of decided it would be best
51:11to not give each other all those details
51:13and so you know just because we had a
51:15past from before and you know he we kept
51:18each other like moderately informed like
51:19he told me a little bit about this
51:21person a little bit about this person
51:22but we didn't go into a lot of details
51:23so I didn't tell him that I was making
51:25this big trip out to you to go see
51:27somebody I think he suspected it though
51:29he was just like well who are you who
51:31are you going out there to see and I'm
51:32like oh nobody I'm just going out you
51:33know to see friends and because we both
51:35have um a mutual circle of friends in
51:38Utah you know from prepaid legal so I
51:41told him that that was the reason I was
51:42going was there is a there's a briefing
51:44out there it's called a business
51:46briefing which happens every week on
51:48Thursday nights so um I was looking for
51:51that and you know was actually there was
51:53that reason because I knew I would see a
51:55lot of my friends that night but have
51:56spend time with with my other friend
51:58that I was meeting um and his name is
52:00Ryan um so I talked to him that day and
52:07later on that morning I got on the road
52:10um and my car isn't the best
52:12mechanically so I stopped in Reading at
52:15the airport to rent a car and someone
52:18had driven me there my my future soon to
52:20be sister-in-law drove me there um and
52:24let's see I got the car came went to my
52:26brother's house and took a nap for a
52:29while cuz i' been up all night and then
52:30I got on the road and I went to Santa
52:33Cruz and I met up with some other
52:35friends I'm from the Monterey area okay
52:39so I have lots of friends there and I
52:40stayed the night at a friend's house
52:42there and visited with some other
52:44friends um the next day and then drove
52:47to La so that I could see my uh other
52:51friends baby I'm a photographer I don't
52:53know if I told that yeah um
52:57but yeah I'm a photographer she just
52:59recently had a baby and I'm trying to
53:01build my portfolio with um you know
53:03infants and things like that and she was
53:05really
53:06excited her name is Laura Brewer she
53:08actually never called me back she did
53:09call me back but she called me back too
53:11late so I couldn't just wait around for
53:12her I had an itinerary she was just a
53:15friend or she um she's a really close
53:18friend I dated her brother for about
53:20four years so we were we're a lot like
53:22family still oh okay hang on just a
53:25quick second I'm sorry
53:49are you still there yeah I'm sorry my
53:52phone I got to figure it out I need it
53:54sorry I'm just getting out of my car
53:56little
54:00distracting all right so that's the last
54:03time was like on Monday morning
54:06um I'm sorry I did talk to him on
54:08Tuesday night oh Tuesday night it was
54:11brief though um like that was a matter
54:13of just a few minutes it wasn't like a
54:15really in depth conversation um what
54:17time that
54:18was oh 10 o'
54:21maybe 10 p.m. yeah I say 10 p.m. or
54:25maybe 900 p.m. :30 10 10:30 something
54:28around there I could I guess I could go
54:30back and check about 9 to 10 anywhere
54:32there somewhere between then yeah it was
54:34it was it was a late it was like kind of
54:37a late evening I me for us that's not
54:39late but what was the purpose of that
54:40call um just call check in and say hey
54:43and let them know just hi okay I was
54:47just calling people because I was bored
54:48I was on the road oh so you were on the
54:50road at that time yeah it was real
54:53pretty um he was he was nice and but he
54:56was kind of
54:58acting like he had hurt feelings because
55:00you know I wasn't
55:03oh the re trying to figure out when this
55:07actually occurred as people are saying
55:10they kind of lost contact with him maybe
55:13Tuesday on Tuesday Tuesday or Wednesday
55:15so people aren't sure they're to think
55:18back I talked to him last Tuesday and I
55:22I'm sure I called him I may have called
55:23him Wednesday I know I called him again
55:25from the road
55:26twice I sent him a couple of text
55:28messages I sent him a picture did you
55:30actually talk to him though when you
55:32were on the road um yeah but it was it
55:35was when I when you first started yeah
55:38yeah it was it was I did talk to him
55:40when I was on the road but it was I'm
55:41sure that was Tuesday
55:43night
55:46and so I figured he was either in
55:49California because he was planning to go
55:51there um that week I think he because he
55:54had I I know he was going to California
55:55sometime for Cancun because he was going
55:58to leave his dog with his grandmother um
56:01know time do you remember what time on
56:03Tuesday night it was that you talk to
56:05him oh it was it was dark it was I think
56:09it was like maybe 10 maybe 10
56:13o' 9 9:30 at that time you were still
56:17kind of like were you still head to LA
56:19area or were you already up going to
56:22Utah yeah I was in Pasad when I talked
56:24to him that time I think I was
56:27I just left Starbucks or something I
56:29don't
56:30remember I don't know if I gotten gas
56:32yet or what but I left Starbucks and I
56:35was talking to him now what was
56:38conversation about it was really brief
56:40it was um two or three minutes and I
56:42just said hey you know I'm on the road
56:44still and going you know he knew I was
56:47headed to Utah and I just called because
56:49I called my sister and I think I called
56:52I I may have called Ryan I don't know if
56:53I called or not at that point but um I
56:56was waiting around for a while uh for
56:58for Laura and I didn't know where she
57:00lived and couldn't her brother because
57:03he was at work and I didn't wanted to
57:05show up at her house because I hadn't
57:06heard back from her so um I was just
57:09killing time and called him talked to
57:11him briefly and and uh that's about the
57:14last time people were were able to get a
57:17hold of them as well and then what's
57:20unusual is you know people are saying
57:22yeah you know we text them and call them
57:24and then pretty soon his his voicemail
57:27was full yeah that's unusual cuz he
57:29deletes messages like he doesn't save
57:32anything even if it's halfway
57:33sentimental like he rarely say that
57:35stuff so the next time you tried to call
57:37him you weren't able to get a hold of
57:39him uh no I left him a message
57:42um and I sent him text messages and he
57:46he doesn't always pick up but he's
57:47usually pretty good and he doesn't
57:49always respond to text messages there
57:50but when I didn't hear from him for like
57:52two days and I called him again and I
57:54didn't want to be obsessive about it um
57:56because you know we're not together
57:58anymore and I'm just like I don't like
58:00calling him too much but we he called me
58:03or I call him and it's it was a pretty
58:04good balance but um at one point it was
58:07like okay at what point do I start
58:10calling friends that live there you know
58:12that thought cross my mind that I was
58:14like no he's in California you know he's
58:16going to
58:17[Music]
58:22Cancun didn't get to meet with her then
58:25I didn't so I hung out there for a while
58:28um at Starbucks and you know just refill
58:32and all that and they talked on the
58:34phone for a little bit and then just got
58:35on the road and went to Utah
58:39um slept in my
58:42car and that's a long drive from La it's
58:46about it's about nine hours so yeah it's
58:49actually just as long to go from LA to
58:53West Jordan as it is to go from to
59:00La um let's see so the meeting in Utah
59:04when did that happen that was Thursday
59:07night at 7 o'clock I don't remember the
59:08exact location but I follow over ran
59:11there oh so you met him then yeah yeah I
59:14ended up um we crossed at his house for
59:17a little while and you know just hung
59:18out and all that and then went
59:22to and then left a little bit longer
59:24because I was you know
59:26until I got on the road and you talk to
59:28I can't remember who it was up there in
59:30Utah um they called me and just they
59:33said they they knew Travis they said
59:35that there was a meeting on Wednesday or
59:38was it Thursday uh there is a lunch in
59:40on Wednesday I didn't go to that
59:43though I don't think I went to that no I
59:46went to some kind of meeting it was at a
59:48restaurant like restaurant own name is
59:50Chris and he's he was recruited by a
59:52Brian maybe that's what they said it's
59:54kind of like a split up meeting one day
59:56they had like a lunch and then the other
59:57day meeting
1:00:00that's yeah I don't think I went to the
1:00:02lunch um okay it's like a thing that
1:00:06happens at it's the same kind of deal
1:00:07only it's set in a restaurant instead of
1:00:09a like a business style meeting where in
1:00:12the meeting you just kind of sit for an
1:00:13hour and you listen to a presentation or
1:00:1545 minutes or however long it takes and
1:00:17uh to lunch and you listen to the same
1:00:19thing but you get to eat lunch and it's
1:00:21in a
1:00:22restaurant so did you ever stop by Vegas
1:00:24on the way up I went through it no I go
1:00:29there once a year anyway for the pre
1:00:30legal thing and I've never been a
1:00:32gambler or that kind of Lifestyle so no
1:00:36I I just drove through I drove through
1:00:38um I I went through Boulder City and I
1:00:41went through Vegas I don't remember all
1:00:43I think
1:00:44Henderson um you know until I went up
1:00:47through I think it was St George took a
1:00:50while I was on the phone with tonight
1:00:51with Ryan that time but um you know so
1:00:54you can keep me awake but I still to
1:00:56pull over
1:00:57anyway so I mean I'm not I'm not shy
1:01:00about just pulling over wherever and
1:01:02sleeping in my
1:01:03car the road it is it is it's not the
1:01:07smartest thing I realize that um I
1:01:09usually park my car in a place where I
1:01:11can just drive off if I need to so I
1:01:13have it backed out instead of um you
1:01:15know and I have the keys and ignition
1:01:17I've got I'm ready to go but e either
1:01:20way it's still kind of unsafe anyone
1:01:21could break a window or something but
1:01:23it's D anything just some protection or
1:01:25something since you driving alone I was
1:01:27thinking of that I know and I I
1:01:29just I don't know I guess I do but it's
1:01:32not too difficult I well California I
1:01:34would say it's a little more difficult
1:01:36because at least in Arizona you don't
1:01:38even have to register any weapons you
1:01:39just kind of you just go byy that's it
1:01:43well I've actually looked into I've
1:01:44actually looked into handguns um because
1:01:47I have like I have a list of like things
1:01:49that I'm really scared of that I'm
1:01:50trying to overcome and that's one of
1:01:52them and being in front of a public
1:01:54crowd is another and I was shaking one I
1:01:56thing the national anthem there was only
1:01:57like 200 people but I had to hold the
1:01:59mic with both hands it was shaking so
1:02:02actually I got that from Travis just
1:02:04trying to push yourself and get out of
1:02:05your comfort zone and make yourself
1:02:07uncomfortable and do things that you're
1:02:08scared of and uh so I you know I've been
1:02:11looking into that but handguns are
1:02:13expensive and you know it's not really
1:02:16in my price range right now it's
1:02:21not um but anyway what was I saying with
1:02:24that um oh no we just discussed uh
1:02:26you know next two days after that you
1:02:28weren't able to get a hold of him and
1:02:30thinking about calling his friendsy yeah
1:02:32and that's part of the reason I didn't
1:02:33is because I I knew that I it just it
1:02:36didn't feel like my place any longer to
1:02:37be like his mother and calling his
1:02:40friends you knew about his his trip and
1:02:45uh do you remember him telling you when
1:02:47he when he was leaving first trip yeah
1:02:49yeah cuz we had discussed a days of
1:02:50travel up here so um I asked that he had
1:02:53said that he was leaving
1:02:5610 I didn't know how long it would be I
1:02:58don't know if it was four or five days
1:02:59or six days but um I did know that the
1:03:03last we had discussed if his trip up
1:03:05here was going to be after Cancun and
1:03:06before DC so it' be sometime toward the
1:03:09end of June and it would probably be at
1:03:11a 4- day thing for me or three-day thing
1:03:14but longer for him because he was
1:03:16traveling along the California coast and
1:03:17and on to Washington okay so he was
1:03:20going to leave the 10th and when was he
1:03:22going to come back um I don't know exact
1:03:26I know that
1:03:32they're you heard has anybody well when
1:03:34did you first find out what happened to
1:03:36him uh Dan called me Dan who Dan Freeman
1:03:41I'm sorry he called me um Monday I think
1:03:45it was Monday night but it was more like
1:03:47I think it was late Monday night like 11
1:03:49something and uh he said hey how are you
1:03:52doing I was like DN because I had
1:03:53thinking been thinking about him and I
1:03:54was planning my trip to Arizona and he
1:03:56was definitely on my list of people to
1:03:57visit I love him and his family um I
1:04:00used to go there every Sunday for dinner
1:04:02um
1:04:04and and I said hey how you doing he's
1:04:06like great I said hey I'm thinking about
1:04:07making a trip out there and he's like
1:04:08yeah I think you're G to have to and I
1:04:10was like yeah yeah you know a pause he's
1:04:13like and then he's like yeah um there
1:04:16it's just about Travis and I was
1:04:18like um what you know like that's never
1:04:21good yeah way said that yeah so but I
1:04:25didn't didn't think anything at first I
1:04:27mean he just kind of okay what you know
1:04:30you don't want to assume too soon and
1:04:32and he said uh said they found him and I
1:04:35was
1:04:36like what does that mean well I don't
1:04:38know what do you mean you don't know
1:04:40what what do you know I don't really
1:04:41know anything right now I just know that
1:04:43that Brent Hyde is at his house and
1:04:45Taylor surl is at his house and that the
1:04:47cops are there and I was totally shocked
1:04:51I don't think that I said much um I
1:04:54think that I
1:04:56I just kept thinking that maybe there's
1:04:58a mistake maybe there's a mistake are
1:05:00you sure and he didn't really know so I
1:05:02kept say it maybe there was just a
1:05:03mistake he couldn't say anything and he
1:05:06didn't give me any information so I
1:05:07thought he said I was the first person
1:05:10that he thought of to call but I think
1:05:11he called um a couple other of leaders
1:05:14in in tr's business first that were
1:05:16close with him I don't remember who he
1:05:18called in what order but he called me
1:05:20and uh I keep thinking that maybe there
1:05:23was there that they just made a mistake
1:05:27and like I felt so helpless because I
1:05:29wasn't there if I still lived there I
1:05:31was four I was like 10 minutes away not
1:05:34even 10 maybe seven minutes away I could
1:05:36have just driven there but and found out
1:05:39and and saw what was going on I just
1:05:41felt totally helpless what did you think
1:05:43about I mean the last time you talked to
1:05:45him was what was it Monday or Wednesday
1:05:47what was it I think it was um Tuesday
1:05:50evening I
1:05:51think yeah Tuesday night yeah did you
1:05:55think of you know what was going on the
1:05:57last time you talked to him did you try
1:05:59to get a hold of him after that yeah
1:06:02yeah I did I tried to get a hold of him
1:06:04um I I called him Tuesday
1:06:07night um I called him subsequently and
1:06:10emailed him
1:06:12um a couple
1:06:18times is there anything else that you
1:06:20can remember or think of or any theories
1:06:23or anything that could help us I just I
1:06:27just don't know Travis was a friend to
1:06:29everybody and you know even when things
1:06:31were bad between us he was
1:06:34always he would give his
1:06:37last he would give his last dollar his
1:06:39last whatever he um he was telling me he
1:06:42was BMW and I was actually supposed to
1:06:44email yeah enough kind of burn it out or
1:06:47something oh you said found he said he
1:06:50found my check in his house check oh
1:06:53yeah check that you gave him for payment
1:06:55yeah yeah yeah I mean um I guess like I
1:07:01this is so dumb like it seems so
1:07:02unimportant but I guess I need to know
1:07:04if that check is going to be deposited
1:07:05anytime soon no no after death I can't
1:07:09be deposited so really yeah okay well
1:07:12then I'll just consider that whatever
1:07:14and then I and then I'll still own in
1:07:16the full balance until they figure out
1:07:17what they're going to do honestly I I
1:07:18trashed his car and he took it so well
1:07:23um we were trying to figure out out
1:07:25between my lawyers and his lawyers and
1:07:27prepay legal and the insurance and the
1:07:29U-Haul who was going to be held liable
1:07:31and you know it didn't matter who was
1:07:33held liable the fact was I that was a
1:07:35debt that I promised to pay and it's
1:07:36just money and it wasn't worth you know
1:07:38anything so um I mean as far as getting
1:07:40any any contentions over so um he was
1:07:43never he never had any doubt that I
1:07:44would pay him back but he was trying and
1:07:46this is what's difficult is he was
1:07:48trying to um work with the insurance um
1:07:52to hold you hul accountable um for how
1:07:55it had all gone down they said the
1:07:57engine just blew up now the now the
1:07:59vehicle was still in his name correct
1:08:01yeah he still he was going to hold the
1:08:03title until I paid in the balance in
1:08:04full did you guys have like a written
1:08:06contract or anything or I had yeah what
1:08:09I did is I typed out an email to him and
1:08:11I sent it and um I just wrote back just
1:08:14reply I agree if you agree with this and
1:08:17he wrote back um something about you
1:08:18didn't saying you on insurance and so
1:08:20like okay so I amended that I think and
1:08:23then wrote back to him and so that was
1:08:24our agreement our agreement was I pay
1:08:25him what I can each month until the
1:08:27balance is paid off and I I take care of
1:08:29general maintenance like oil changes and
1:08:31tires and things like that I don't know
1:08:32what's going on with that with his car
1:08:34or anything I think it's still at the
1:08:35shop but uh his family I think it's just
1:08:37sitting there collecting desks his
1:08:39family dealing with it because right now
1:08:40it's still considered one of his assets
1:08:42and it goes oh you know so yeah and I
1:08:45was told and I probably shouldn't have
1:08:47done this but I didn't know who to get a
1:08:49hold of or who was doing what and I
1:08:50should have asked Dan first but I
1:08:51emailed his sister to Nisha on my face
1:08:55and I was like yeah I just Center my
1:08:57condolences and then I the next
1:08:59paragraph was like you know this is
1:09:00really hard but I I owe Travis this
1:09:02amount of money and I I know that at one
1:09:03point I'll need to settle this debt and
1:09:05you know that kind of thing um if you
1:09:08need to be in contact with him out this
1:09:09is my phone number and you know she
1:09:10didn't get back to me and I don't you
1:09:13know well don't when a death occurs like
1:09:15this you know everything's got to go to
1:09:17probate anyways yeah and I realize now
1:09:19that there's a Mike Chapman is the
1:09:21executor of his will and so I did get in
1:09:23touch with him yesterday and he said um
1:09:25just give me all the information you
1:09:26have on that matter and then we'll go
1:09:28from there and decide what's gonna
1:09:30happen never give you his uh his
1:09:33voicemail from his
1:09:35phone uh no did you ever obtain it at
1:09:38any time or um I I didn't have it but he
1:09:43had one pin number that he always used
1:09:45and that was
1:09:471220 um I don't know if that was his
1:09:49voicemail pin number to oh and he had a
1:09:51garage pin I have too which different
1:09:53his garage was his 1220 was his him for
1:09:55his ATM because there are many times
1:09:57when he G his card to go get money um
1:09:59you think his phone as well it's
1:10:02possible I don't know what kind of I
1:10:05mean mine's not password protect oh mine
1:10:07is password protected mine before it
1:10:08wasn't so
1:10:10I um the one for his um his ATM was
1:10:14Joseph's Missi birthday so that's how I
1:10:16always remembered that and then he gave
1:10:17me the garage pin number which was um
1:10:210187 and I think that was Chris Hugh's
1:10:24birthday oh it's

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