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⭕Jennifer Pan - Police interrogation - Girl who hired hitmen to kill her parents - Part 3 — Transcript

by Red Circle Interrogations and Confessions · 32,558 words · 5,028 segments · language en · Watch on YouTube

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0:01y kind of odd
0:03[Music]
0:07very all
0:09right so just to let you know right away
0:12Jennifer everything in this room is
0:14being videotaped and audio taped okay
0:17that's actually for your protection of
0:19mine if anybody ever asks us what we
0:21talked about there's a record of it okay
0:23okay so just for the record it is the uh
0:2622nd of November
0:282010 we're at at The five district
0:31station in the town of Markham uh my
0:34computer right now says
0:36239 in the after okay uh just for the
0:41record my name is detective William
0:43Gates you can just call me Bill here
0:44today and what do you like to be called
0:47Jen J Jenifer what do you prefer Jen or
0:49Jennifer either either okay so Jen um
0:54you're aware that the um audio tape and
0:57everything's on um it's the same as last
1:00time okay you've been here on two other
1:02occasions I understand on the 9th of
1:05November and I believe again on the 11th
1:08November is that correct okay and do you
1:11know why we're here
1:13today just to discuss stuff yeah
1:17regarding
1:24what what happened at my home okay and
1:28that happened uh there was was a home
1:30invasion for the record there was a home
1:32invasion at your residence on the 8th of
1:35November 2010 is that
1:38correct and uh your residence is located
1:41at 238 Helen Avenue in the town of
1:44Markham that's correct okay and as a
1:48result of that home invasion um your
1:52father uh Han Pam was actually shot and
1:55your mother uh Bea P was actually killed
1:59is that
2:02correct yeah you'll have to speak up a
2:04little bit just so I can hear you sorry
2:06yes
2:07okay uh so that's what we're going to
2:09discuss here today on previous occasions
2:13um a commissioner of O has come in and
2:17you've sworn the video statement is that
2:20correct okay and on those forign video
2:25statements you promis to tell the
2:28truth okay is that correct yes okay and
2:32I'm gonna have to get you to speak up or
2:34or we can't pick it up yeah and what was
2:38the what was your understanding that if
2:41you did not tell the truth what would
2:44happen there would be jail consequences
2:47there could be okay there are specific
2:50charges uh for fabricating evidence uh
2:54for public uh Mischief for obstructing
2:56police and a police investigation you
2:58understand that right okay
3:00um so the same thing applies here today
3:03okay um that uh if you were um to make a
3:08false statement um if you were to lie to
3:10the police or mislead the police in an
3:13investigation uh you could be charged
3:15with those offenses of public Mischief
3:18uh fabricating evidence or obstruct
3:20police do you understand that okay then
3:23of course um if you had anything to do
3:27with the actual homicide self uh of
3:31course you could be charged with murder
3:33you understand that yes okay now do you
3:37understand what your rates are here
3:39today do you understand what your rights
3:41are here
3:43today everybody has rights do you know
3:46what your rights
3:49are as a citizen do you know what your
3:52rights
3:53are that you don't have to speak to the
3:55police we they they went through some
3:57things with you before you don't have to
3:59give a statement if you don't want to do
4:01you understand
4:03that no I do okay and it's your choice
4:07whether you give a statement or
4:09not you understand that that was on that
4:12form that they read out to you and it
4:13said you that it's your choice you
4:17understand that though I do know okay
4:20all right um and what I tell everybody
4:24that I speak to is that all of our
4:27rights are guaranteed and they're
4:28guaranteed under the the Charter of
4:30Rights and Freedoms which states that
4:32when a person's been arrested or
4:34detained while they must be advised
4:36their rights to council or rights to a
4:37lawyer so first of all you're not under
4:39arrest here okay you're not being
4:42detained that door there that's not
4:44locked it's just closed to ensure our
4:46privacy okay so if at any time you want
4:49to leave please feel free to do so okay
4:53if anytime you want me to stop these
4:55proceedings just say so and I will if at
4:58any time you did want to speak to lawyer
5:00you just have to tell me and you can
5:01speak to a lawyer in private we can
5:03phone a lawyer and you can speak to them
5:05privately on the phone do you understand
5:07that okay now have you ever heard of
5:10legal
5:11aid well like the term yeah you've heard
5:15the term before do you know what it
5:18means okay so legal a lawyers are
5:20lawyers available to give people free
5:22legal advice okay and they're available
5:2524 hours a day uh for people uh at a
5:28police station and they're available to
5:30everyone and these lawyers give people
5:32free legal advice okay so that's another
5:36option available to you here today do
5:37you understand that and do you
5:40understand these rights okay and do you
5:42wish to speak to a
5:47lawyer need to well I just advise people
5:51what the rights are but I can't tell you
5:53that you should or you
5:56shouldn't I think I need okay so that's
5:59fine fine if you change your mind let me
6:01know
6:03okay
6:04now um as discussed before okay in
6:09relation to this case um you don't have
6:11to say anything to the police in
6:13relation uh to this murder okay um but
6:17whatever you do say may be given as
6:19evidence in court okay and if it had
6:23anything to do with you that evidence
6:25could be used against you do you
6:26understand that you just have to say yes
6:29or no
6:30yes okay um
6:33now we've never met before right no I
6:37just brought you from the front to the
6:39back here and we didn't discuss the case
6:42no okay so when when I meet somebody for
6:44the first time um I have to let them
6:47know that I don't want what you've said
6:50to any other police officer in this case
6:52to influence you or make you feel like
6:55you even have to talk to me here today
6:57okay and whatever you've said to date uh
7:01to anyone about this case you don't have
7:03to repeat that nor do you have to say
7:05anything further okay but whatever you
7:08do say that may be given as evidence do
7:10you understand that okay okay just tell
7:13me your understanding of what I've been
7:14telling you just tell me what you
7:17understand me to
7:18say in your own
7:22words take your
7:26done I don't have to say anything but
7:30if I want a lawyer I can have
7:34one yeah and I don't want anything
7:37anybody else has said to you to make you
7:39feel like you have to even talk to me I
7:42don't want them influencing anything
7:43that may have said previously do you
7:45know what I mean okay I don't want you
7:47to feel forced into talking to me okay
7:50all
7:51right um do you have any other
7:55questions you understand okay
8:01now what um since you and I have never
8:04met um of course I know a lot about you
8:07because I've been following the
8:09investigation okay but I don't know
8:11everything about you and I hate talking
8:12to people when I haven't formally met
8:14them okay so if I were to ask one of
8:18your friends about you or um you wanted
8:21to tell me yourself what would how would
8:23you describe Jennifer pan
8:47this maybe a bit about your history
8:48where you grew up and where you went to
8:53school grew up here in I born and grew
8:56up in Toronto okay
9:03I like to play yep I hear you're pretty
9:06good at it
9:07too yeah okay andh what else do you like
9:12to
9:13do I like to figure yep okay and you're
9:17pretty good at that too I haven't done
9:20it for a while yeah but at one point it
9:22was a passion of yours y y okay what
9:27else I'm going back to school okay and
9:31when's that starts in January okay and
9:34what are you going to be taking biotech
9:36engineering okay and what's your future
9:40aspirations
9:42then okay just hold on a sec
10:10okay we're we're having technical
10:11difficulties here okay so that's why
10:14they interrupted me what we're going to
10:15do is if you don't mind holding tight
10:18there I'm just going to move my
10:19equipment to the other room okay and
10:21then I'll come over and we'll move over
10:23there next door okay I'm just not
10:25comfortable being on my okay I'm going
10:27to be right here though okay
10:30yeah if you have a problem just knock on
10:31the door and I'll come right over okay
10:33I'm just going to be three seconds I
10:34just have to take the uh stuff here move
10:37it over there and then I'll come get you
10:38okay
11:08this be a couple minutes there okay let
11:10leave the door
11:47test of the video
11:49equipment by District 22nd of November
12:07see one more minut
12:40all right so we're going to switch rooms
12:42uh the equipment's now working over
12:44there we had a technical problem here
12:45but I have had it has been audio taped
12:48we just lost the video and audio from
12:49the video machine
12:51itself
12:53okay come across the walk ACR
12:59chair at the bottom there just down here
13:01if you don't mind
13:04y
13:06okay so just for the record this room is
13:10being videotaped and audio taped just
13:12like the other one
13:13okay and I'm just going to grab my chair
13:16from across the way okay
13:40okay so right now we're in uh the
13:43separate video room across the hall from
13:45the first one by my computer now it's
13:49252 um the officer advised me to
13:52detective cook that we're having a
13:54problem with the other room the video
13:56and audio went down uh but everything
13:59what we talked about has been um audio
14:02taped uh on our portable audio okay all
14:07right now um just for a recap um we
14:12reviewed uh why that you're here today
14:16discuss um the home invasion that
14:18occurred at your Residence at 238 Helen
14:20Avenue on the 8th of November okay and
14:26that um in that instance
14:29um your mother was killed and your
14:32father uh was um shot uh but survived
14:38right and we reviewed um what your
14:42rights are here today that you didn't
14:44have to speak to the police um that
14:47anything that you do say to the police
14:49here today could be evidence is that
14:51correct yeah you just have to speak a
14:53little louder yes okay and um that if
14:57you had any involvement
15:00um uh well first of all if you provided
15:03a false statement um or lied to the
15:06police uh a person could be charged or
15:08you could be charged for um obstruct
15:12police uh public Mischief or fabricating
15:15evidence you understand that yes and
15:19that if you had any involvement um uh in
15:23that home invasion then you could be
15:26facing charges of murder and attempt to
15:28murder
15:29okay do you understand that okay and um
15:34anything that you do say to us in
15:35regards to that home invasion uh is
15:38being recorded here and that could be
15:40used as evidence in court okay you
15:43understood that and that you don't have
15:45to say anything to us in in relation to
15:48this case but whatever you do say may be
15:50given as
15:51evidence right you understood that yes
15:55okay and lastly that um we've never met
16:00before so I don't want anything any
16:01other officer said to you to influence
16:04you or make you feel like you have to
16:05say anything to me here today and
16:07whatever you've said previously you
16:09don't have to repeat that nor do you
16:11have to say anything further but
16:13whatever you do say that may be given as
16:15evidence is that correct yes yes
16:20okay all right so we were just starting
16:23to talk about yourself and um you were
16:26telling me that you do or have had a
16:29passion for the piano and uh you do like
16:31friger skating okay what are some of
16:34your other likes what other things you
16:36like to
16:38do and watch TV with my friends yep okay
16:42and who are your specific TV buddies
16:45Adrian okay and his last name okay and
16:50anyone
16:53else I talked on the phone I watch
16:59now do you have a particular best friend
17:02right
17:03now who would you say is your best
17:06friend best friend isn't
17:08know no who that you get along with that
17:11you have a special relationship with
17:14like a best friend who's the friend that
17:16you like the most or that you get along
17:18with the
17:19best Daniel Daniel okay and what's his
17:23last name okay and uh why do you say
17:27that you're best friends
17:29would say best friend but he's able to
17:32comfort me and call me okay and how does
17:35he do
17:36that just we've been friends for a long
17:39time
17:41and I don't know just we used to date
17:45and just part of me so
17:50calm yeah okay so you have
17:53history okay and I know you've said some
17:57of these things to the police before but
17:58I just want to go over it for my own
18:00understanding so when did you first date
18:03Daniel
18:0620 okay and how did you actually meet we
18:09went to school together okay and what
18:11school did you go to
18:13Mary and is that a Catholic School yes
18:16yeah okay and when did you start going
18:19to merrywood 2000
18:23okay so you started grade nine there
18:26yeah okay and in elementary school did
18:29you go St Barnabas what's that St
18:31Barnabas Barnabas okay um and do you
18:34practice um catholism or do you practice
18:38a different are are you Catholic uh I do
18:42practice catholism but uh I do believe
18:45in some CH beliefs yeah okay that's good
18:48okay so you have uh um Christian beliefs
18:52uh that are both Catholic and Buddhist
18:55uh religions okay um and how long uh
19:00were you baptized when you were born or
19:02okay and were your parents Catholics
19:04then my father okay your father okay and
19:08what about your
19:09mom okay so that's where you get the the
19:12combination okay and um y
19:41okay um and growing up did you guys go
19:44to church every Sunday or how did that
19:47go not every Sunday but we went for
19:51holidays and special occasion okay and
19:54you also had religion in school I guess
19:57okay and
19:59um did they go to uh church at school or
20:03not in elementary school I had of church
20:06next yes okay I had the same thing so
20:09that's why I'm
20:10asking okay and basically we went every
20:13Friday morning uh the church uh because
20:16we're right beside it right so um they
20:19had a special service for us okay
20:26now what else can you tell me about
20:28growing
20:31up just I live on schedule
20:34okay and um tell me about that
20:39schedule just School eight
20:42panel a little swimming little karate
20:45for a couple years sure was a steady
20:48steady schedule okay and how did you get
20:51into
20:52skating to be honest I think my parents
20:55just applied okay and I just took and
20:58how old were you when you
21:01started or eight okay so young and how
21:06long did you just stay in
21:10it okay so quite a long time okay and
21:14what made you stop going I tore my ACL a
21:17lot okay so injuries okay if you didn't
21:21get injured would you still be doing it
21:23I hope yeah okay so that's nice and did
21:27you as far as is that did you do uh like
21:31competition skating or okay and how did
21:34you do with
21:35that it was at the top of the pack but
21:38just the middle as yeah so that's good
21:41though but you did actually enjoy it it
21:44was more than just going for a
21:46competition you enjoyed actually do I I
21:49I was petrified of the competition okay
21:52all right um and where would be the
21:56farthest place you would go for a
21:57competition
22:00like would you go outside of this
22:03area because I actually started I said
22:05scar Toronto that's where I trained and
22:08grew up yeah it wasn't until later that
22:10I moved up to Richmond Hill just the
22:12last year or two right but we went
22:16everywhere
22:17from
22:20oranga just in around Sal Ontario yeah
22:25okay and tell me about the piano when
22:28did you start with
22:30piano wow okay and you're still doing it
22:34I understand okay and I hear you
22:37actually teach yeah I taught a bit and
22:40I'm still working towards that final
22:42qualification okay and what do what do
22:44you have to do to uh get that final
22:46qualification I have three exams okay
22:51and are the exams practical or are they
22:53practical and practical wait practical
22:56and written written okay
22:59and like an exam how long would that
23:01take to
23:02write writing exams take about two to
23:04three hours okay and are you in that
23:07process right now or I was yeah okay and
23:12so when do you hope to complete that I
23:15was hoping in June June by June you
23:18would yeah okay and um so you went from
23:26uh a student and now to a teacher is
23:29what uh okay and um although you don't
23:34have your highest papers you were still
23:37able to teach students yes yeah okay
23:40what does the actual whole papers give
23:43you what would you be able to do with
23:44that it's just a formality an
23:48achievement yeah okay
23:51credentials okay uh can you charge more
23:55I don't
23:56know okay when you've been uh
23:58teaching um what would you charge for
24:04lessons mainly there were just family
24:06friends so it's just $10 half an hour
24:09yeah okay and how many students would
24:12have you been teaching three
24:15years okay over what time
24:19period four years four years okay all
24:23right um and do you have any students
24:27right now okay and why not uh the
24:31students I were teaching they went to
24:33high school and lost oh okay yeah too
24:36big for
24:38panel yeah I took it in grade school too
24:40but uh I I think I got I went to grade
24:43seven in it I think like in when I was
24:46in grade seven I stopped taking it but
24:49uh I still remember swans on the lake I
24:52know how to play that that's about
24:55it um now
24:59I understand what kind of jobs have you
25:01had um serving jobs serving jobs okay
25:05and when was your last
25:07one Bost
25:11Pizza okay and when's the last time you
25:14worked
25:17there two year two years ago I year and
25:21a half okay and was that your last uh
25:25serving job okay and previous to that he
25:30said Mar okay and what time period did
25:32you work
25:45there sry I don't remember
25:50exactly maybe okay and how
25:55long three four years okay you spent
25:58three or four years there okay why did
26:00you switch from um East Side to Boston
26:03Pizza um when I went over to Bost I did
26:07I did both for a little bit okay yeah
26:09and I found that Boston Pizza was easier
26:11and better okay better tips or yeah it
26:15was easier because less unlimited stuff
26:18to run and okay more appreciative guests
26:21okay the experience was better for you
26:25okay and um but you haven't done that in
26:29about two years okay and any particular
26:33reason um just try to concentrate on
26:37piano okay all right on your studies
26:41pardon me on your studies my piano
26:43studies yeah yeah okay and what is it
26:46that you're hoping you're going back to
26:48school what is your ultimate goal uh for
26:52school I want to finish this threeyear
26:54biotech course yeah and see how the
26:56field is after three years because I
26:59know it's booming now but I'm not sure
27:01how it's going to be in three years okay
27:03and what would the number what job would
27:05you like to get from
27:09it like what are some of the jobs that
27:11you would get with the degree in
27:14that I haven't really looked much into
27:17it okay to be hon all right all right
27:21um now if you could pick any job
27:26yourself not talking about any body else
27:28but if you could pick for yourself what
27:31would it
27:33be I'm going to be a teacher on like
27:37when I come home but in the daytime I'd
27:40like to have a a simple maybe like a la
27:43technician job just
27:46work eight like eight hours a day and
27:49come home and
27:50teach okay and so why don't you do
27:54that uh I actually did try to apply for
27:58technician but I wasn't eligible to
28:00enter okay and any particular reason or
28:03I probably just didn't have the qual the
28:05the needed credits okay and uh High
28:09School Credit you mean
28:10or yeah okay um and have this other
28:15course you're on you've been accepted
28:17yeah yeah okay
28:19um okay and from that I guess you could
28:23be a technician though uh I believe that
28:27if I get through the first year okay I
28:29would I will be eligible to transfer to
28:31the technician courses okay all right
28:34sounds good okay um
28:38now I understand that um you mentioned a
28:44schedule okay um whose decision have you
28:50on a schedule
28:52Who's well it was more along the lines
28:54of uh where I was at my sking level yeah
28:58and what times were needed to be at
29:00certain places yeah okay so but
29:03basically you didn't have time for much
29:05other than School skating piano that's a
29:09lot yeah okay now um eventually you were
29:15discussing Daniel what happened with
29:17that
29:19relationship I hit it from my parents at
29:21first they didn't agree with me having a
29:23boyfriend okay and U once they found out
29:27they they didn't like the fact that he
29:30was of mixed race okay and they told me
29:34to stop seeing him okay and how did that
29:38make you
29:47feel he was the person who just filled
29:50an empty void for me so it felt that a
29:55part of me was missing
29:59um in when did you feel the part was
30:02missing me when you broke up you felt
30:04the part was missing is that what you're
30:06saying when when they first told me to
30:07stop seeing him stop talking to him I
30:09just I felt like a part of me was
30:12missing and I fell intoed a little bit
30:13of depression okay and how old were you
30:16when this
30:20happened 2021 okay so you're
30:2324 now right when you're 21 they told
30:27you to stop seeing them or
30:292021 and how old were you when you first
30:31started
30:32dating 17 okay and from 17 to 2021 they
30:39didn't know about
30:40relationship okay how did they find
30:43out um one day when my mother came to
30:46pick me up uh she saw me he had dropped
30:49me off okay dropped you off uh at
30:53Pacific Mall and my mother was coming to
30:55pick me up the Pacific Mall okay and
30:58somehow they saw each other I guess oh
31:00my mother saw me husand good okay that
31:04gave it
31:05away okay and then when she asked about
31:08it what did you tell
31:10her I told her that you know we've been
31:13dating a little bit but mainly was just
31:15when we were in school we saw each other
31:18okay right and so was that the whole
31:21truth or not it was at that point in
31:23time okay what happened next then um
31:28I tried to bring him home my mother at
31:31first was like you know bring him home
31:33let us need him when I brought him
31:37home they didn't they automatically
31:39didn't like him for some reason okay
31:42that's when they told me to stop okay
31:45and what is it you you mentioned already
31:48that he was mixed race okay which is
31:50what philipo and China okay and your
31:55parents themselves what uh races are
31:57they Vietnamese and Chinese okay what
32:00was the problem with um Chinese and uh
32:05Philipino they didn't see him as a
32:07chines person they thought him as a
32:10Filipino person okay and they Associated
32:13Filipino people
32:14with okay so that was their personal
32:18belief or personal I would on Filipinos
32:21I guess okay and okay so you were told
32:26to uh stopped seeing him so what
32:30happened then at first I stopped for a
32:33while um but like I said I just felt
32:37really empty and I felt depression and
32:40okay I started talking him
32:42again okay and how would you get a
32:46chance to see him um seeing him was
32:50really difficult I would try to see him
32:53before class here and there um not much
32:57time
32:59sometimes I'd ask a friend of mine Gary
33:01who's a mutual friend of ours he'd come
33:04and tell my parents that he Tak me up
33:06for dinner and the three of us would go
33:08up to dinner together okay so he' pick
33:10you up with the host Garen and what
33:13Grace is he he's white he's a white guy
33:16yeah okay and did they have a problem
33:19with white guys or no no they didn't
33:22have a problem with you going to dinner
33:25with uh Garrett no no
33:28and
33:30um they were just against this
33:33guy Daniel yeah okay now were they
33:38against you going out with
33:40friends a little bit Yeah okay but they
33:43let you go with Gary so well it was like
33:46I said they didn't say yes often but
33:49when they did all right so and then what
33:53would happen you would then Gary would
33:55take you to Daniel uh would meet up at
33:58like our sushi place okay where was that
34:01uh sometimes we'd go to uh Taste of
34:05Japan we tried Sushi on 7 once Sushi on
34:097 okay and where's that first place
34:11located B in with b and John and where
34:15what about the other one keny okay and
34:20um so you like sushi my friend Gary
34:23likes Sushi okay and how did you meet
34:26Gary through Daniel through Daniel okay
34:30um but he's become your friend as well
34:33yeah okay and when's the last time you
34:35would have spoke to him been a while
34:38been a
34:39while a good three four months three
34:42four months and um since you and Daniel
34:44broke up how often would you see
34:50Gary see him well he'd stop by my house
34:54sometimes if my mom was at work okay
34:57and how many times do you think Gary
34:59took you to see
35:01Daniel three or four times three or four
35:04times okay and when would the last time
35:06have
35:13been sometime in summer I believe okay
35:17and where do Gary actually live he's in
35:22ad okay uh have you ever been to his
35:25place where about he live
35:29I don't exactly know he drove in okay
35:33what does he
35:34drive he
35:37um the maybe F car with dark ped Windows
35:42okay you know you don't know what kind
35:43of car I believe it's in Impala Impala
35:48okay now how has Daniel taken it when
35:52your parents said that you couldn't see
35:54him anymore how did he take it
36:00hurt
36:02yeah
36:05um and how did you
36:08feel also hurt also hurt
36:12okay um
36:15now after high school what did you do
36:17for schooling I didn't um but I lied to
36:20my parents okay so tell me about that
36:23what happened there what was their
36:25impression and what were you doing in
36:27the time they thought that I was going
36:30to school at Ryerson for the first
36:32couple years and then I that I
36:34transferred to UT okay um but I was
36:38actually working in the day time okay
36:40and where were you
36:41staying at the first two two three years
36:45I was staying I was coming back home
36:46every day um but my final year I said
36:48that it was difficult and so I would
36:51stay at Daniel's place okay so you
36:53actually lived together for a year Well
36:55it his parents place yeah
36:58um so where would you stay in that house
37:00then they had aare bedroom okay um but
37:04one of his parents got more comfortable
37:05let me with him okay all right so you
37:08were you slept in the same room for a
37:10while yeah okay all right so is it fair
37:13to say that you had an intimate
37:14relationship yes yeah okay and of course
37:17your parents didn't know what that no
37:19okay and how long was the relationship
37:23intimate would you say you've been
37:25dating for seven years almost I guess
37:28at what point did it become
37:32intimate i' say After High School
37:34sometimes yeah okay um and his parents
37:38were I guess more liberal than your
37:41parents their his parents they love they
37:44they love me yeah okay and um they
37:49recognized that you loved each
37:50other and so they let you stay in the
37:53same uh you moved up to his room or how
37:56did that work next door
37:58okay there were two rooms in the
37:59basement no and it's the main floor oh
38:01the main floor okay and where were the
38:03parents rooms across the way
38:06okay um I'm guessing that sometimes you
38:10sneak into each other's rooms before
38:12they let you do it no no you didn't okay
38:15I'm just thinking what young people
38:17would do okay um but how how long did
38:20you end up staying in the same room
38:22before you move back home
38:27two two years yeah okay so you lived
38:30there for two years
38:32then like I still came home every
38:35weekend and stuff yeah yeah okay but
38:37they thought and they thought you were
38:38where on campus at a friend place
38:41okay and if they phoned you they would
38:44just call your I called them every
38:46morning okay you cut it off okay
38:51um how what ended up how did they find
38:55out you weren't going to school
39:00they asked for records and at first I
39:02wasn't able to and then um after I said
39:06I had finished um I didn't feel that I
39:11need I could I didn't feel that I I told
39:14them I didn't want to do the pharmacy
39:16like far pharmacist I want to be a
39:18technician I I'm
39:20responsibility Pharm so much um I told
39:25them that I wasn't really into it
39:28and um because I hadn't gone to school
39:30for it I had lied about it I didn't want
39:33to go and pursue like applying for the
39:36job when I didn't have the
39:37qualifications okay um and they thought
39:40you did have the qualifications yeah
39:42okay and how did you try to prove to
39:44them that you did have the
39:46qualifications I bought online um I got
39:50a friend of mine to buy online a uh F
39:54diploma okay and who what friend was
39:57that Daniel who that Daniel oh Daniel
40:00okay what did it cost to buy a fake
40:03uh 500 or something wow okay and um what
40:10happened when you gave them that then
40:12they stopped counting me for a bit until
40:14they realized I wasn't actually I I
40:16wasn't pursuing looking for the job hard
40:19enough they were wondering what was
40:20going on okay then what was the next
40:23step what ended up how did you end up
40:26back home I guess
40:28uh
40:29they called up my friend who I said I
40:33was staying with in the middle of the
40:35night
40:37and she was groggy and
40:41forgot what day it was and so she's like
40:43isn't she home and I wasn't home okay
40:46she messed up I don't blame her but no
40:50okay and what was that friend's name
40:53topz topz okay so she was your cover
40:56okay and she uh basically uh got caught
41:01because they called her in the Mel okay
41:04and so then what did how did they
41:06approach you on that they called me and
41:09they told me to come home immediately
41:10right now okay and what happened um
41:15that's when I like that's it like you're
41:18staying home in the out
41:21and we're going to get your life back on
41:24track okay and what did you say to that
41:29that I I was still cre uh doing my piano
41:34career and I didn't feel
41:37that like I felt that my piano career
41:42could take me and then
41:45um I didn't I didn't understand really
41:49okay so you expressed your
41:52opinion uh but they wanted more they
41:54said that they wanted an education okay
41:57and a degree okay and so ultimately a
42:03plan was set up I guess and what was
42:06that plan to go back to school okay this
42:10January uh actually it was supposed to
42:11be for September y but uh they were it
42:15was too late to apply okay so I I
42:19reapplied for January and okay now when
42:23did this actually happen that they found
42:27or that that they brought you home about
42:30year and a half ago okay and
42:33so um what's been happening in the last
42:36year and a half
42:37then like you finally got into school
42:39now I understand what's been happening
42:41for the last 18 months just a lot of
42:44piano like catching up on my theories
42:47and stuff I've been fling a little and
42:52uh pretty much piano and then I also did
42:55a little summer school get my high
42:57school calcus so I could apply because I
42:59know calculus is a big thing in uh
43:02applying for college and universities
43:04now okay so I did do that one summer as
43:06well okay and how what's your math
43:08skills
43:09like they were pretty good but they've
43:12gotten Rusty over the yeah
43:14okay um yeah you're not 18 or 19 anymore
43:19and you haven't done it in a few years
43:20okay uh so do you just uh is it home
43:23studies or is it internet studies I did
43:25it at a summer school okay you did it
43:28but are you doing any correspondence uh
43:30no no okay and so what was the when they
43:34said this is what's going to happen what
43:36were all the rules that got put in place
43:38to make sure it happens that I wouldn't
43:40see Daniel or talk to Daniel anymore
43:43okay and then i'
43:46like i' like my friends would have to
43:49come and over to the house rather than
43:51me go out okay
43:54um uh or if I with a friend they need to
43:59call and make sure okay and did you have
44:02a curfew or anything um they always said
44:05before at 9 o00 usually would be home
44:08okay and would they ever waiver on
44:12that just once because it was my
44:15friend's wedding reception yeah and how
44:18long did you get to stay over that just
44:2011 okay and how do you get to and from
44:26things when you want to go some
44:27they drive me they drive you or the odd
44:30time if they know it's like a class that
44:31I always go to they'll let me take the
44:33car okay you do drive so
44:37yeah um so how has that felt being under
44:41those guidelines for the last 18
44:44months it was okay like uh it wasn't the
44:48best feeling in the world cuz you know I
44:51just felt little trapped okay but U it's
44:54what I chose to be with my family
44:57and so you made a choice between what uh
45:01living out on my own with Daniel and
45:04stay home with my parents my back okay
45:07and did they say you could stay it on
45:09your own if you wanted
45:11to
45:12um at one point the was said but my dad
45:15also said that he'd uh hire a private
45:18investigator to follow me on okay he
45:21didn't like that
45:23option it's not bad it's just I I chose
45:26to be my parents at wasn't even okay
45:28like he said it in arguments but yeah it
45:31I wasn't leaving okay did you feel you
45:34really had a choice or not there was no
45:37choice because the family always comes
45:39first okay and where do you get that
45:44from where do you get that
45:47belief okay well family's number one
45:53yes
45:55um now you said you were
45:58depressed when were you
46:00depressed what time period did that
46:09start um I was depressing Elementary
46:11School for a little bit okay um the
46:15Depression started I'd
46:18say hard very about two years ago okay
46:24at the time of this or what what brought
46:27on the
46:31depression just I wasn't happy with any
46:35parts of my life okay which included
46:38what
46:41um I regretted not going to school okay
46:45um my piano wasn't going as fast as I I
46:48was
46:49liking
46:52um um my friends were moving on with
46:55their life and felt that I was wasn't
46:58going anywhere I was kind of being left
47:01behind okay
47:05and
47:08that I didn't understand
47:11why that at 2021 that I had to be home
47:15at
47:169:00 I can see that okay and what how
47:22what was the worst the depression
47:24got I cut myself
47:27okay and when did that
47:33happen where did you do where did you
47:36cut uh on my wrist and once people
47:39started noticing I'd hide it other
47:41places but never T so how many Cuts do
47:44you have on you now none none they've
47:49healed okay and did you want to kill
47:54yourself yes okay when the first time
47:57that you actually thought you would try
47:59and kill
48:05yourself 19 at 19 what was going on at
48:10that time that brought it
48:12on my friends were in school when I was
48:20in came to the realization
48:24that like
48:28my family Dynamic is very
48:32broad so I just felt everything was
48:36crumbling around me and I wasn't able to
48:38hold anything up for myself okay and you
48:41really weren't able to tell your parents
48:43you weren't in
48:45school so it was tough living a double
48:48life type thing yeah but is that fair to
48:50say yeah okay and um
48:56did you ever try to actually kill
48:58yourself I tried once and what did you
49:01do I tried to open
49:04sleep okay and what
49:07happened I wasn't able to do it okay how
49:11many did you take four five four or five
49:14okay and where did that
49:16happen where bedroom in your bedroom
49:20okay um I guess you just got
49:23tired yeah you woke up the next day
49:27like I stopped myself oh okay you you
49:30could have taken more but you didn't
49:32okay all right um when you were
49:36cutting um were you actually trying to
49:38kill yourself no no what were you trying
49:40to do control one part of my life okay
49:43and what did that do for you when you
49:46actually
49:48cut I was able to feel physical plan so
49:51I didn't have to think of like other
49:52pains in my life okay so it was a
49:54distractor
49:56okay did anybody know you were cutting
49:59not at first okay who was the first to
50:02find
50:10out okay and what did he say he like
50:14don't be stupid
50:17okay uh did your parents ever find out
50:20they noticed it but they
50:23never they don't I don't think they
50:25realize what it was
50:27okay um what's the lowest you ever
50:31got what was the lowest moment you've
50:33ever
50:49had my brother had moved out and not
50:51gone to school and I was home alone
50:54and in the middle of
50:57and feeling
50:59veryone so he was kind of a bond while
51:01you were at
51:03home okay and so you guys got along all
51:07right as far as brother and sister go
51:11well we we we had our moments but uh
51:13there's just an unsaid unsaid bond which
51:17is nice okay uh but when you were on
51:20your own it was a lot
51:23tougher you didn't have that Ally in the
51:25house
51:27okay now when you said there was
51:29fighting what kind of fighting went on
51:30in the
51:34house bickering about what were the
51:38issues hous work hous work okay and who
51:42was
51:43bickering parent and who are they
51:46bickering at each other each other okay
51:48so there's some tension
51:50there
51:52okay um how would you characterize their
51:55relationship
51:57over the last couple
52:03years do you mean by that how has it
52:06been in the host for them as a
52:12couple they put on a front but there's
52:15not much of a relationship okay and what
52:19what do you think the problem is what's
52:21the issue what happened
52:29my mother took on a lot of
52:32responsibility doing everything paying
52:34the bills in that
52:37house she was just fed up for doing it
52:40by
52:41herself okay so she was depressed too or
52:47not I I couldn't say
52:51Okay
52:53um who's the boss of the host then what
52:55you say
52:58and so um what does that
53:05mean much his
53:09opinion okay so he has the final say on
53:12and how did your mom take
53:17that she's went she
53:22went um if you had a real problem could
53:26you ever go to either one of
53:30them okay and what would you and your
53:33mom
53:35discuss future
53:37PL
53:39okay and um did she agree with your
53:43father's plans or
53:45not
53:48sometimes okay ultimately they wanted
53:52you to be educated I guess was their is
53:55their goal
53:57okay um did you ever feel that they
54:00expected too much of
54:02you how
54:13so comparison to other people okay so
54:17who would they compare you
54:19to like
54:22classmates Club
54:23mates cousins
54:27and so some of them have been successful
54:30recently okay and what did they say to
54:33you wish you could have been that person
54:37okay so that's pretty hard right hard to
54:39take for
54:40you what I've heard on my
54:43letter nothing okay um
54:48now was there ever any um physical abuse
54:53in your household
54:59you had to think about that what did he
55:00well just when I when you're a kid you
55:02know just little tap on the bottom okay
55:04you got a spanking but that's it okay
55:07you were never
55:09um injured or and um your mom and dad
55:14weren't physical with each
55:16other you did you ever see them be
55:18physical with each other no
55:21no
55:23um now
55:26do you
55:27feel um I get the feeling
55:31that
55:36um they think you could do any job there
55:41is is that true
55:44or I don't know I guess my question for
55:47you is did you ever feel like I know
55:50you're smart and they believe you're
55:53very smart but did you ever feel you
55:55weren't as smart as what they thought
55:57that you were yeah okay I get that
56:00feeling that it's pretty tough to live
56:03up to their
56:05expectations okay like your dad
56:07ultimately would like to see you be like
56:09a doctor that type of thing and maybe uh
56:14you can't do
56:17it right and I'm not saying you can't
56:19but I get the feeling that um those were
56:23pretty high standards for anybody
56:26not everybody can be a
56:28doctor okay and but they may have acted
56:33like you could have done it no problem
56:36is that
56:40fair like I don't want to say something
56:42that's not accurate but I just get the
56:43feeling that
56:45um their expectations were so high that
56:49few people would be able to reach that
56:51expectation I'm not just talking about
56:53you I'm talking about
56:55anybody um um and it started at a young
56:57age it didn't start just when you went
57:00to University it's been an
57:02expectation uh that
57:05um uh since you were a child that you
57:08would be
57:08successful better than everybody
57:12else now
57:15um in that um when did your uh parents
57:20come to
57:23Canada I don't know exact here but you
57:26were born here and your brother was born
57:29here okay and where did they actually
57:32meet you know how they got to get them
57:34they met back home
57:36but they they just knew of each other
57:39back home okay which back home means
57:41Vietnam okay and when uh and did they
57:46grow up in the same neighborhood or same
57:49town or something I guess town maybe
57:52yeah okay area all right
57:58okay okay
57:59So
58:01eventually
58:04um how did they um what else did you do
58:08to pretend you were in
58:11school what kind of things would you do
58:13to try and make it look like you got
58:15your grades
58:16or when they asked for something i' try
58:19to make a documents okay so what type of
58:22documents did you um student
58:26okay report okay and how did you do them
58:31using Photoshop Photoshop okay and uh
58:35what did they say when they saw the
58:38report cards did they ever question
58:42it not person no up until how did they
58:47actually figured out when I know they
58:49figured out you weren't living with your
58:51friend
58:52um do they still at this point even know
58:55that you don't have any University yes
58:58my father okay when did he find
59:01him after I told the police okay so up
59:05until this event they just thought that
59:07I didn't go to school the full time okay
59:10but they still thought you had some
59:12credits okay um how did it feel having
59:16to lie to them all those years really
59:20hard really like I wanted to tell them
59:22but just they always look down
59:27disappointment
59:29okay I'm sure there were days when you
59:31actually planned that this is the day
59:34I'm going to tell him and then you just
59:36couldn't spit it
59:39out all right
59:45um
59:47now what if your parents had let you
59:51would you still be with Daniel
59:56if they didn't interfere what would what
59:58would have happened
1:00:01sure maybe I be with him I'm not sure
1:00:04okay you never know all right yeah so we
1:00:07can't say because we don't know for sure
1:00:09I can say we could be friends but I
1:00:11don't know any more than that okay and
1:00:14do you want more than
1:00:16that I'm not sure I do right now okay
1:00:20all right
1:00:22um since the time you come home have you
1:00:25wanted to you still went and saw them so
1:00:28obviously you were trying to keep
1:00:29something going okay um at what point
1:00:34did he move
1:00:38on maybe February of last year okay of
1:00:4309 or February of 2010 of this year 2010
1:00:482010 okay and how how did he move
1:00:53on one of his old um
1:00:58friend okay and who's that Christine
1:01:02okay and how does that make you
1:01:05feel I knew that we weren't together so
1:01:08okay but it made me feel that I wasn't
1:01:12good enough to be waited to wait you
1:01:16mean okay so what was your kind of plan
1:01:18then go back to school and get my degree
1:01:23make something of my life with my
1:01:24parents and then once I make my life
1:01:28then see where we would go okay um
1:01:33so it was upsetting that he didn't wait
1:01:36till that played out yeah okay
1:01:38depressing for you for me yeah okay what
1:01:41about him he still came back and said
1:01:44that you know I love you and if the
1:01:47circumstances were different but it's
1:01:48not okay um did you ever plan a future
1:01:54together disc it but okay like
1:01:59marriage some days he'd say yes some
1:02:01days he'd say no okay so you brought it
1:02:04up you bring it up some sometimes okay
1:02:07so ultimately because you went out for S
1:02:09they could have ended up in marriage
1:02:11still could Someday I'm not saying I'm
1:02:14not sure okay all right
1:02:21um on a fairness scale where would you
1:02:24put the this
1:02:26did you feel it was a fair
1:02:29decision you mean that at 24 you have to
1:02:33stay at home with a curfew of
1:02:359:00 I knew I messed up I knew I messed
1:02:39up and that I need to put my life back
1:02:41in Action okay do you think it had to be
1:02:43that strict
1:02:46though considering my past
1:02:49I I thought it was a little strict but I
1:02:52I understood okay
1:02:56over the years what other things have
1:02:58you had to hide from your
1:03:05currents well just besides having
1:03:08boyfriends
1:03:09and um not going to school okay did you
1:03:13have a different boyfriend at one point
1:03:14then well I dated Adrian for about four
1:03:18months in high school but that wasn't
1:03:20they didn't know about it it wasn't much
1:03:21it wasn't dating it was it was high
1:03:22school yeah it was just I'll see you in
1:03:25class no okay and what grade were you in
1:03:27at that time um 11
1:03:30okay um what have your friends said
1:03:33about all
1:03:38this well they don't know about the
1:03:40whole school thing they just know I'm
1:03:42going back to school okay who else knows
1:03:46that you never went to school though
1:03:49topz she yeah she kind of
1:03:53knew she thought I was uh Daniel oh okay
1:03:57that was the cover but she thought you
1:03:58were still going to school yeah okay so
1:04:00she didn't know the whole story but she
1:04:02knew she was your cover for she just
1:04:05thought it was so they wouldn't know
1:04:07where you were staying yeah
1:04:09okay um did anybody else know that you
1:04:12weren't going to school who who would
1:04:14who would know
1:04:15that I didn't tell Daniel yeah anybody
1:04:20else
1:04:23um no did his parents no no no okay so
1:04:28just you and Daniel
1:04:31okay
1:04:33um what other things have you in your
1:04:37Depression had to lie about over the
1:04:39last
1:04:40year just going to see him that I was
1:04:42still talking to Daniel and that I try
1:04:46to find ways to communicate with him
1:04:48okay and how did you end up eventually
1:04:50communicating
1:04:56your cell phone okay how did that
1:05:00work I text him and he text me back
1:05:03whenever he could and yeah just delete
1:05:06them when I got them okay now how did
1:05:09your uh parents monitor this
1:05:12self when I was around them they didn't
1:05:14like me on it okay so what would they
1:05:17say who is that what is it why is it so
1:05:21important okay they ended up taking it
1:05:23for a couple weeks when
1:05:27one of my first like a year and a half
1:05:29okay since then how many times have they
1:05:32taken it away from you I can't count
1:05:35more
1:05:36than five more than five okay and what
1:05:39were the occasions that resulted in them
1:05:42taking it away from you on the phone too
1:05:44much or they saw it was Daniel
1:05:49or that they thought it was a
1:05:51distraction okay so where would you be
1:05:53trying to make these calls from where
1:05:54would you be in the house
1:05:56in the basement like if had to go get
1:05:58something in the basement or I was in
1:06:00the
1:06:01washroom okay so they would actually
1:06:04watch you every second almost well not
1:06:07every second but they knew we about
1:06:08there was all the time and if they heard
1:06:10you
1:06:12talking now did they ever barge into the
1:06:14room and take the phone off yet no no
1:06:18okay um so a lot of times I guess you
1:06:21were trying to text so they would know
1:06:24is that fair to say
1:06:26okay so how did they find out you were
1:06:28talking to Daniel
1:06:33then
1:06:37um they just assume that I still do okay
1:06:41was there an occasion where you said
1:06:43they checked the phone or oh I told you
1:06:45I deleted the call history and stuff
1:06:48okay uh and did they ever find it before
1:06:51you got it
1:06:53deleted no okay did they ever take the
1:06:56phone but you had another phone yes okay
1:06:59so how did that work he got me another
1:07:02phone and I just whenever I wanted to
1:07:04talk to them I plug in the SIM
1:07:06card um but I kept the SIM card out of
1:07:08the phone in case they found the phone
1:07:10yeah and there was no card in it to use
1:07:13so did they know you had more than one
1:07:15phone no no okay now how many phones did
1:07:19you end up having just the two and which
1:07:22for what uh the
1:08:56like the new ones what what kind of
1:08:58phone were you hoping to get iPhone 4 oh
1:09:00okay or the new BlackBerry the latest of
1:09:04now you actually had a Blackberry at one
1:09:06point though U my brother yeah he gave
1:09:08me one of his friends old one okay but
1:09:11it didn't again no internet no nothing
1:09:13so you need that internet eh well it
1:09:15wasn't that I needed it it was just
1:09:17convenient you'd like it yeah okay now
1:09:22um did they ever take an iPhone off of
1:09:24you did they ever find it they just
1:09:25always take your Samsung phone yeah i'
1:09:27always take my Samsung phone so right
1:09:30now you actually have a third chip then
1:09:32you're
1:09:34saying yeah I just bought it um but I
1:09:37hadn't activated it yet okay and that
1:09:39was with who and what's the number for
1:09:41that one there is no I it's just I just
1:09:43bought
1:09:44the Box oh the Box okay SIM card only
1:09:48yeah okay and what kind of phone can it
1:09:51go into it it came with a like I bought
1:09:54a $50 phone so when I activated it it
1:09:56would work okay and I don't know the
1:09:59model it's just a basic basic phone okay
1:10:02now what kind of
1:10:05phone it's just a FAL phone I don't know
1:10:08you don't know the brand on the phone
1:10:11okay so where's that phone now then um
1:10:13it was at home and my brother just
1:10:14brought it for me but I'm not using it
1:10:17CU oh he he ended up buying it for you
1:10:20no he bought he brought it it was at my
1:10:22it was still at my house and recently
1:10:25yesterday he just brought it home okay
1:10:27so he's been back to the house have you
1:10:28been back to the house since I can't I
1:10:30can't even go near the house okay all
1:10:33right and where are you staying now then
1:10:35at my Uncle M's house okay and how's
1:10:37that going it's okay okay
1:10:42um now when's the last time you spoke to
1:10:46your
1:10:48dad at the
1:10:50hospital Saturday
1:10:53Okay called uh this morning just to see
1:10:58if my brother had made it into school
1:11:00okay and what have you and your father
1:11:04discussed about this
1:11:06case he just asked me if Daniel was
1:11:09behind it okay and I told him I don't
1:11:13know 100% but I don't think he did okay
1:11:16why would he ask
1:11:18that because he believed that we still
1:11:22talk and that he would go to any
1:11:26okay and what do you think about
1:11:29that I know that he's moved on so I
1:11:31don't think he
1:11:33would he go to read L to be with when
1:11:35he's already moved on
1:11:38okay
1:11:41um what else did you discuss about the
1:11:45case about what happened that
1:11:50night I haven't spoken to him about
1:11:53it nothing think about what went on any
1:11:57details No all he said
1:11:59was that was a Daniel
1:12:04okay and you told him you don't think so
1:12:07I don't think so but is it
1:12:10possible I don't think he knows anyone I
1:12:13don't think he did it
1:12:15but I can't be 100% sure so you can't
1:12:18say
1:12:19no you can't say for sure not is that
1:12:22what you're saying
1:12:26uh has he told you that he did it has
1:12:29Daniel told you that he's done it or had
1:12:31anything to do with it no
1:12:34no okay
1:12:37now um who else have you discussed the
1:12:43case well besides the officers and my
1:12:47social worker I haven't spoken any
1:12:50details to anybody okay what about
1:12:52relatives
1:12:56like my uncle did ask me if he
1:12:59confronted me about something about
1:13:02having a black friend but I I didn't
1:13:05know what he was talking about okay uh
1:13:08do you have any black
1:13:10friends no but when he said that the
1:13:12police officers had a photo of me
1:13:16talking with a friend uh it wasn't he's
1:13:19not really a friend he was more a friend
1:13:21of mine's roommate okay so I didn't like
1:13:27he's not a friend of mine but um yeah I
1:13:30I did I did meet up with him once or
1:13:32twice okay okay and who is that um my
1:13:36friend Andrew one of his old roommates I
1:13:39only know him by Rick Rick okay and
1:13:43where did you meet
1:13:44him um the first time he met me near My
1:13:48Piano
1:13:49School um just did uh we just met up and
1:13:54my Andrew was like he he was on the
1:13:56phone and he like yeah that's my friend
1:13:59um he my friend was busy working inaga
1:14:02and they were having some rent
1:14:05problems so uh they asked me if I could
1:14:07help them out with their rent okay so
1:14:10what happened so I met up with him a
1:14:12little later at agent Court just chatted
1:14:15a bit and then uh I lent him your money
1:14:19okay so how much money did you lend them
1:14:25like about 1100 1100 okay and this is
1:14:30you gave it to this Rick guy yeah okay
1:14:32and he was introduced to you through
1:14:34Andrew yes okay what's Andrew's last
1:14:36name m
1:14:37mayor is that one of the friends you
1:14:39talk to all the time I don't talk to him
1:14:42a lot but occasionally we go through
1:14:45like maybe a week or two of talking a
1:14:48lot and then we drift apart for a couple
1:14:50months and how do you spell his last
1:14:52name montoo to me or I I forget okay
1:14:58what's his phone
1:14:59number
1:15:04um
1:15:05647
1:15:08618
1:15:108643 618 8643 647 start is that the
1:15:15Andrew you were talking to the
1:15:17night
1:15:19um uh before you talk to the other
1:15:22gentleman before Edward yeah okay
1:15:26um okay so now Rick um you made him
1:15:30where at agent court and what uh it was
1:15:34Kennedy and Shephard Kennedy and
1:15:36Shephard and what's what type of place
1:15:39did you meet him at like my met him we
1:15:41went for coffee and we walked around and
1:15:44then we went to library because Andrew
1:15:46wanted to meet me and uh see see the
1:15:48place cuz we haven't seen each other in
1:15:50a while okay see what place I see my
1:15:53house like come visit me okay and so you
1:15:56came back to your host no uh so I gave
1:15:59Rick the address so that uh he can go
1:16:02home and give it to Andrew and I showed
1:16:04him how to commute because he doesn't
1:16:06drive but I showed him how to commute up
1:16:08to my uh so you took Rick up to your
1:16:11place no no you just told him where it
1:16:14was and he was to tell Andrew who then
1:16:17could come and visit you sometime yeah
1:16:20okay um and so what uh what was the
1:16:23building that you met uh for coffee at
1:16:26what was the coffee shop not okay and
1:16:29where was the location uh Kennedy and
1:16:31Trier and when was
1:16:36that I'm not
1:16:38sure spring summer I don't remember
1:16:41exactly okay um this
1:16:45year okay and um second time you met him
1:16:51that was the second time I met him where
1:16:52did you meet him the first time I told
1:16:54you name my Pi school okay sorry and
1:16:58where though
1:17:00specifically shepher
1:17:02and and where another coffee shop or
1:17:05what was that no it was just I just
1:17:06finished piano we introduced each other
1:17:08and then I had to go home okay and who
1:17:12else was there nobody okay and how did
1:17:17he know to come see you there how on the
1:17:19phone with Andrew and Andrew was like
1:17:22yeah and where was Andrew at the time he
1:17:24was I believe okay and so the first time
1:17:29you met him what did you talk about no
1:17:31just hello I'm Andrew's roommate how are
1:17:34you okay so he was living with Andrew at
1:17:37the time yeah are they still living
1:17:39together I don't think so okay and where
1:17:42were they staying I'm not sure somewhere
1:17:44in M okay and who um why didn't Andrew
1:17:51just meet you he was doing a he was in
1:17:55of doing uh Insurance stuff like I think
1:17:58he was doing classes or seminars or
1:18:00something so he wasn't able to come out
1:18:02to
1:18:03chal and what race is Andrew Filipino
1:18:07Filipino okay and um this Rick guy him
1:18:13and Andrew lived together for how long
1:18:15I'm not sure he just said he was a
1:18:17really good friend okay and they live
1:18:19together and so what was the time that
1:18:22you met him first then when was that
1:18:25maybe just a week before I met him the
1:18:27second time
1:18:29okay um and what did you discuss then
1:18:34nothing it was just uh who we who he was
1:18:36and yeah and then I had to go okay and
1:18:39so the next time you met him how come
1:18:41you met him the second
1:18:42time because that's after that Andrew
1:18:45was like yeah we're having problems with
1:18:48rent and
1:18:49okay and okay so they wanted
1:18:53money they my a friend Andrew wanted to
1:18:56see if I could he can lend uh if I could
1:18:57lend him some money to help a par and so
1:19:00you did and you gave the money to who
1:19:04okay that day um at Tim Horton's okay
1:19:08and what else did you discuss that day
1:19:11just what he liked doing like you said
1:19:14he liked these like Japanese manga books
1:19:17and Japanese manga books they like comic
1:19:20books or something yeah that's his hobby
1:19:22yeah what else I was working he's like
1:19:25no I'm looking for a job and okay um I
1:19:29just B my piano stuff and that was good
1:19:31it okay what is it that Andrew actually
1:19:34does he's uh doing some sort of like
1:19:38selling life insurance I believe 100
1:19:40what what's the companies with do you
1:19:43try to sell you a policy yet
1:19:45or usually they go after their friends
1:19:48first right yeah I told them right off
1:19:49the B I'm like I'm okay I'm not buying
1:19:51any okay so um he uh you gave him $1,100
1:19:58where did you get the
1:20:00$1,100 I have a lot saved up from an I
1:20:03was serving cash okay so how much do you
1:20:06have saved
1:20:08up like now or yeah oh I had about just
1:20:12a little under a thousand saved up
1:20:16recently okay all right so right now how
1:20:20much do you have a thousand you're
1:20:22saying well now I don't have any right
1:20:24okay you took it off okay so
1:20:28um now before Andrew took the money how
1:20:32much did you
1:20:39have 3,000 3,000
1:20:43okay and so um you gave him 1100 has he
1:20:48paid that back yet uh I talked to him
1:20:50recently said he's working on it he's
1:20:52just working at home sense right now and
1:20:55uh he just moved back home so that
1:20:56should decrease his rent so he said he's
1:20:59working on that which home since I'm not
1:21:02sure okay and where does he actually
1:21:04live with his p i which
1:21:07is you don't know
1:21:10okay um this Rick fella what about him
1:21:13where do he live I haven't I don't know
1:21:16I haven't spoken to him for a long time
1:21:19six mons was just more of anain okay so
1:21:23after you gave him the money did they
1:21:25give you a receipt or anything no no
1:21:27okay what was his promise to you about
1:21:30how he would pay you back well Andrew
1:21:32said that he'd pay me back when he could
1:21:34okay you didn't give any timelines no no
1:21:39okay
1:21:41um okay so and after you talk or saw
1:21:45Rick have you seen him since that day
1:21:47you gave him the money okay have you
1:21:49talked to him since maybe a week after
1:21:52but no okay what did you you talk a we
1:21:55after no just asked him how he was if
1:21:57the rent was okay and what he was doing
1:22:00was like just watching some of his
1:22:01friends kids or something and where was
1:22:04their apartment somewhere in missa so
1:22:07you know I guess they're not are you
1:22:09saying they're not there anymore yeah I
1:22:11know my Andrews is back home
1:22:14okay um okay do you know any other black
1:22:19guys not that are very very close with
1:22:22me okay
1:22:24um who would be that aren't very close
1:22:27to you well Daniel's best friend is uh
1:22:29black okay and what's his name Carlos
1:22:32Finch Carlos Finch okay and um you ever
1:22:37talk to him or no how come you say
1:22:41they're best friends they went to
1:22:43elementary school together they grew up
1:22:45together almost neighbors they still
1:22:47hang out um I believe okay believe so
1:22:51when's the last time you saw cinal
1:22:55years years yeah okay um does Daniel
1:23:00still hang out with them then or I
1:23:02believe so when's the last time they
1:23:04would have been you seen them together
1:23:06oh I've seen them together I years does
1:23:09Daniel ever talk about them sometimes
1:23:11for birthdays and stuff like I went out
1:23:14for my birthday or his birthday
1:23:16or be there yeah and so when when your
1:23:21last birthday was did you go out with
1:23:22Carlos was Carlos there no no no I meant
1:23:26like his birthday or Carlos's
1:23:28birthday um when Daniel's birthday comes
1:23:31around you make a point of seeing them I
1:23:34try but it doesn't always work
1:23:37out
1:23:42um
1:23:44okay
1:23:48um how many uh so a personal black
1:23:53friend do you don't have one you
1:23:55do um how about Filipino
1:24:00friends Edwards Filipino okay he's a
1:24:03good friend of mine all right um Andrew
1:24:06like I said we talk but we're not really
1:24:08like close we don't ever see each other
1:24:10okay I can never get out to see him okay
1:24:13uh what about white friends I have
1:24:16eering think it like I said and Gary
1:24:20okay there are the
1:24:22two now is timin
1:24:24Ukrainian Ukrainian European yeah okay
1:24:28you know where he's actually from or
1:24:30he's born here his parents were born
1:24:31here too oh born here yeah oh both I
1:24:35believe so okay but his grandparents
1:24:37from the Ukraine I believe so he's very
1:24:40into the Ukraine yeah culture
1:24:44okay
1:24:49um
1:24:51now obviously we spoken to a lot of
1:24:53people right
1:24:55uh one of your relatives said that you
1:24:57had mentioned that um these guys liked
1:25:00you that broke into the
1:25:04house why did you say that I didn't say
1:25:07that I said that I asked them why like
1:25:10when they separated my parents away from
1:25:12me I asked them why could I be with them
1:25:14and they're just like you cooperated
1:25:16just Co keep
1:25:19cooperating okay so you're saying you
1:25:23made that comment to Rel that they liked
1:25:25you though why is that what you meant or
1:25:28what
1:25:29was I don't
1:25:35understand I don't really understand
1:25:38okay did you feel like they liked you no
1:25:41they were I if you have a gun to your
1:25:44head I don't think they they like you
1:25:46very much okay but they didn't shoot you
1:25:49no why did they not shoot you I I don't
1:25:53know when I when they took my parents
1:25:57away I asked to go with them and they're
1:25:58like shut
1:26:00up but you must have thought of this you
1:26:03must be thinking I I still do and I I
1:26:06spoken to the therapist about it okay
1:26:08and why do you what have you come up
1:26:11with in your mind
1:26:13why the only thing they they could say
1:26:16was they kept saying that you know I
1:26:17cooperated and to shut up and cooperate
1:26:19keep cooperating did you feel like your
1:26:21parents didn't cooperate
1:26:26I don't know okay is there something
1:26:28that they didn't cooperate with they
1:26:31were trying that's what I mean like so
1:26:33really they did cooperate when you think
1:26:35about it there was no money to be found
1:26:39no they told the
1:26:41truth dad said he had $60 right
1:26:47um so there wasn't anything that he
1:26:50wasn't cooperating with I don't know
1:26:54I'm just trying to say you were there
1:26:56I'm just trying to get a feel for did
1:26:57you think he wasn't cooperating no I
1:27:00thought that he was everyone was
1:27:01cooperating that's what they kept saying
1:27:03no one will get hurt if we just
1:27:04cooperate okay I'm trying to figure out
1:27:07where they didn't
1:27:11cooperate is there any time that you
1:27:13believe they didn't cooperate I wasn't
1:27:15with them the entire time I was only
1:27:16with them for a short period of time
1:27:18okay but during that time that you were
1:27:20there you were in the house did you hear
1:27:22them not cooperating I guess is the
1:27:23question
1:27:25I didn't hear anything they just kept
1:27:27asking where everything was but right
1:27:29did your couldn't remember okay did did
1:27:32your parents lie to
1:27:35them I don't know that you can from
1:27:38anything you heard did they tell a
1:27:41lie I don't know like all I know I don't
1:27:44know how much my father had I didn't
1:27:46know how much okay but they ultimately
1:27:48found your dad's wallet I'm not sure
1:27:52okay and your mom's
1:27:56they couldn't find it after and then
1:27:57they took me away
1:28:00okay
1:28:04um but they never said they never lied
1:28:07to them I guess is what I'm getting down
1:28:08to that you
1:28:10remember during any interaction you
1:28:14had I don't understand it no no like do
1:28:18you feel like they cooperated
1:28:24now do you think there's any reason why
1:28:27they tied you up and didn't tie your
1:28:29parents
1:28:36up I don't know does that seem odd to
1:28:40you why does it seem
1:28:44odd because I was a I pr much separated
1:28:47from them the whole
1:28:50time and does it make sense that they
1:28:53would leave a witness
1:28:57behind if they were going to kill
1:28:59somebody does that make
1:29:02sense I guess I just thinking about it
1:29:06would it make sense for somebody that
1:29:09was going to kill somebody to leave a
1:29:11witness behind that could describe
1:29:13them does that make common sense for
1:29:17Killers
1:29:21not what do you think
1:29:26do you think that was a mistake they
1:29:27made then I don't know they kept saying
1:29:29that they're running out of time and
1:29:30they
1:29:31just doesn't take a long time to kill
1:29:33someone or does it I know I I don't know
1:29:36no okay um when you say they kept saying
1:29:39who kept saying perpetrators okay which
1:29:42ones
1:29:44though one of them he kept telling me
1:29:47that you know it's taking too long okay
1:29:51all right how long did this thing last
1:29:53in your mind
1:29:55I know you didn't have a watch on
1:29:57but or I guess you did have a watch on
1:29:59didn't you no I didn't um did you look
1:30:02at the time at
1:30:03all did you look at the time on your
1:30:06cell phone at
1:30:10all just estimating how long it went on
1:30:14how in your mind because you were there
1:30:16how long did you think it
1:30:21lasted I don't know
1:30:24all I know what people told me
1:30:27approximately okay which is about what
1:30:29they said half an hour 45 I don't know
1:30:32half an hour and
1:30:3445 all right now I have your statement
1:30:37here the first one that you gave so I
1:30:39just want to go over some of the
1:30:40information there just to make sure that
1:30:42I I understand it okay um in the morning
1:30:49um your mom was going to visit your
1:30:52grandfather
1:30:54and um she went outside and then there
1:30:57was a problem with a gas leak on the
1:30:59street is that
1:31:01right okay when she first went out did
1:31:04you go out with her no no okay when she
1:31:11uh was going were you going to go with
1:31:13her
1:31:14originally no you never were going to go
1:31:17see your
1:31:18grandfather I seen her the day before
1:31:20and she said to concentrate on my
1:31:22studies just that you did go outside so
1:31:26I was wondering she she came back in and
1:31:29told she told you to come out okay uh
1:31:33because of
1:31:35what okay so she had gone out and then
1:31:38she came back to get you and then you
1:31:40went out together I I went into change
1:31:43and we left okay so what did you change
1:31:45into then don't remember don't remember
1:31:49okay um and then you went back out and
1:31:53they called the guy Le
1:31:55off and you went back in and your mom
1:31:57went to see your grandfather that
1:32:00correct okay was anyone else at the host
1:32:03at that
1:32:05time yes no
1:32:10no and um then you went and on to the
1:32:15internet um or did some studies and you
1:32:19played some games on Facebook is that
1:32:22correct okay
1:32:24what games do you play on
1:32:28Facebook resta
1:32:31city award what's the last one award
1:32:35okay and are you playing against
1:32:37somebody or by
1:32:39yourself my okay and who's in that any
1:32:43of your
1:32:46friends my friends Mark Mark what pong
1:32:49Mark pong okay so that morning were you
1:32:52playing against him you don't play
1:32:54against like you send each other gifts
1:32:57and you work on your own thing you love
1:32:59each other okay and so you uh were
1:33:04working on which all three of those
1:33:06games or just one of
1:33:13them don't know all of them a little bit
1:33:16this a little bit of that okay and how
1:33:19do you when you go on how do you get a
1:33:21hold of him to know do you have to phone
1:33:23him ahead of time and say let's go
1:33:24online or what do you do like you do
1:33:27your own thing and then you know if
1:33:29you're online and the other person's
1:33:30online you just message them hey can you
1:33:32send me just GI that gift okay and so is
1:33:35that what you did that day you were in
1:33:37communication with him I think I don't
1:33:39remember anymore okay all
1:33:42right okay then
1:33:46um you played some piano how long would
1:33:49you play piano for
1:33:55to network okay and what do you actually
1:33:57do are you practicing are you going over
1:33:59stuff you already know or you playing
1:34:01for pleasure or you playing for do you
1:34:04know what I mean I practice them my
1:34:07older
1:34:08pieces okay and then I do a little bit
1:34:12of practical for my exam and then I do a
1:34:16little bit for pleasure so it's a
1:34:18combination of everything okay and you
1:34:22do that for about half an hour
1:34:37okay so you go through the day and
1:34:39eventually your mom comes back around
1:34:493:30 did she tell you how your
1:34:51grandfather was doing or did you talk
1:34:53about that yeah just that you know he
1:34:57wasn't eating much
1:35:00okay and what's happened with your
1:35:02grandfather
1:35:03since time okay and when did that
1:35:07happen wow sorry to hear
1:35:10that and were you guys close
1:35:14or what was your relationship like with
1:35:21him quite old
1:35:24so he doesn't remember much okay but
1:35:28um I see him as much as I could yeah
1:35:31okay and that's your mother's father
1:35:35okay and what about your grandma is she
1:35:37still around or no okay and he was in
1:35:42the nursing home I understand
1:35:44okay and um when did he actually come to
1:35:48Canada do you know with my mom okay so
1:35:51years ago
1:35:55he brought the family over we we all
1:35:57Refuge to Canada pardon me we all Refuge
1:36:01to Canada
1:36:02okay and does your mom have some
1:36:05brothers and sisters or lots lots okay
1:36:08and did they all come over most of them
1:36:12okay and do some of them live on your
1:36:15street or is that your dad's side that's
1:36:17my mom okay so how many and that's who
1:36:20you're staying with now your aunt your
1:36:23mom my brother brother
1:36:28okay and what's your aunt's name your
1:36:34stand
1:36:35UD
1:36:38UD
1:36:41okay all right
1:36:54okay so Adrian came
1:36:55over is that right okay and anything uh
1:37:02you watch some shows did you talk about
1:37:04anything
1:37:06no like when you watch your shows do you
1:37:09have uh talk about them after or how's
1:37:12the how's the evening going with him
1:37:14just watch and then what's next if this
1:37:17joke be
1:37:18laughing okay and what were you watching
1:37:21that night
1:37:27girl but then there was another show
1:37:29don't remember which one and how many
1:37:31shows did you actually
1:37:34watch I'm not sure three four
1:37:38two and are those shows a half hour or
1:37:41an hour long somewhere an hour somewh
1:37:43half okay and so the whole time he was
1:37:46there did you watch TV or did you have
1:37:48some conversation or I mean a TV
1:37:51conversation what's that talked about
1:37:54what else did you talk about though the
1:37:57TV that's it ever talked about anything
1:38:00else okay when you watch TV do you
1:38:03eat I offered him but no no you had
1:38:07already eaten we ate dinner I ate he
1:38:09didn't want anything okay and from your
1:38:13place how far away does he actually live
1:38:171520 okay and where about does he live
1:38:23and the address
1:38:27there like 15 lewood 15 lewood now do
1:38:32you ever do TV night at his place okay
1:38:36and obviously what well what do your
1:38:38parents think of
1:38:40him they like him why did they like
1:38:44him his mom is his mom and and parents
1:38:48are good people okay and um do the
1:38:54parents know each
1:38:55other they know of each other okay like
1:38:58do they go to the same church or
1:39:00anything like that or same social events
1:39:03or anything don't okay but they say they
1:39:07know they come from a good family
1:39:10okay um now you went up to once he left
1:39:15what did you do after he
1:39:18left went to my room okay what did you
1:39:22do watch TV I was on the phone with
1:39:24Andrew okay and this is the same Andrew
1:39:30that you lent the money to okay and what
1:39:33did you guys talk
1:39:35about how he do his girlfriend okay and
1:39:39how is he
1:39:41doing like he said that he now we
1:39:44getting home sent he moved back home and
1:39:46put straight on the relationship that
1:39:47they work
1:39:49together she works at home since no she
1:39:52works at the insurance company that he
1:39:53works for okay so is he got two
1:39:57jobs I guess like I know the insurance
1:40:00thing is just whenever it is so the
1:40:02other one
1:40:04more
1:40:05okay and what else did he talk
1:40:08about not much J it
1:40:12okay um and did he phone you or did you
1:40:15phone
1:40:17him what would the usual thing
1:40:20be sometimes one of us contacts one want
1:40:23to contact okay but you were you're
1:40:26verbally talking on the phone okay and
1:40:29how long did that go on for not
1:40:33long I don't remember the call
1:40:36time 15
1:40:4020 um and then what happened I hung up
1:40:46then I called Ed okay so you did call Ed
1:40:49and then what did you guys talk about it
1:40:52watching TV what they
1:40:55was now is this a routine for you to
1:40:58phone out in the evening to people or
1:41:00okay um do your parents mind you calling
1:41:03people or I okay um so it's not just
1:41:08Daniel they don't want you talking to
1:41:10it's they don't want you on the phone at
1:41:11all or yeah not late night not late
1:41:13nights okay but was that considered late
1:41:16or
1:41:17what what's late for them 9 10 okay
1:41:23and because your dad actually goes to
1:41:25bed fairly early I think so I don't
1:41:28remember when he actually no in general
1:41:30yeah okay because he works and yeah what
1:41:32time does he get up in the morning
1:41:33usually five okay uh and your mom do
1:41:37your mom and dad sleep in the same room
1:41:39or do they sleep apart sometimes they
1:41:41sleep together but lately she been
1:41:44sleeping in my Bud's room okay which
1:41:49is away okay all right so the one across
1:41:52from your room okay how long she been
1:41:55doing that for two years okay so it's
1:41:58more than lately then okay so for two
1:42:01years she's been sleeping across the hle
1:42:04any particular reason
1:42:12or haven't really getting along Okay now
1:42:17what's her normal Turnin time it
1:42:21depends the noral night okay so she
1:42:24stays up later than
1:42:26everybody or maybe you stay up late too
1:42:28I don't know what what's your usual turn
1:42:30in time like turn around n okay turn you
1:42:35go to your room but how long do you
1:42:36usually stay up watching TV and trying
1:42:39to talk on the
1:42:40ho two in morning okay so it can get
1:42:45obsessive okay um so is your dad a sound
1:42:49sleeper
1:42:50then sometimes yeah CU he's upstairs
1:42:54during those times but your
1:42:56mom's um does she when she stays up to
1:43:00midnight what does she do watch Chinese
1:43:02television okay her feet and where does
1:43:05she do that from living here okay how
1:43:08does it make you feel that they don't
1:43:10get along very
1:43:17well what does that do to you I have to
1:43:23okay and when you mediate what do you
1:43:25got to
1:43:31do find a common ground okay and what's
1:43:35kind of the Common Ground that you
1:43:37usually go
1:43:40to get my leg
1:43:44back so you try to be if you can be good
1:43:47for them it'll help them is that your
1:43:49position yeah
1:43:51okay um
1:43:56now what's her typical fights
1:44:00about my dad being loud and noisy and
1:44:05inconsiderate my mom being Naggy my dad
1:44:08not doing enough housework and carrying
1:44:11as opposed to help as opposed to other
1:44:13people's houses okay what do you mean
1:44:15other people's
1:44:17houses just like he has all these ideas
1:44:20for other people's houses that he
1:44:21doesn't think do our house decorating
1:44:26upgrading okay but when he talks about
1:44:29his friend's houses he has a lot of
1:44:31ideas okay but he doesn't apply them to
1:44:35okay and how's that make your mom feel
1:44:37then but he doesn't care about this hope
1:44:40the family
1:44:42okay how does that make you
1:44:46feel I know that that's just my
1:44:49dad okay how long's this been going on
1:44:52the
1:44:55attention I can remember it's always
1:44:58been there did your brother ever have to
1:45:03mediate that year when I moved out well
1:45:07not moved out but the year I stayed away
1:45:08from home yeah we took a lot of it and
1:45:11he was at home at the time it this his
1:45:14last year of high school
1:45:16okay right and then when he left you
1:45:19were on your own
1:45:20again okay what do you and your brother
1:45:24discuss about that how do how do you
1:45:28feel
1:45:29about could buy and
1:45:31conert I try to go and comfort my mom
1:45:34help my mom off of stuff and he goes to
1:45:36my dad calming him down talking to him
1:45:39interest okay so we separate them
1:45:43since okay um the arguments how what do
1:45:48they do during the arguments
1:45:53yell bigger okay and when you hear the
1:45:56yelling what does that do to
1:45:59you tells me I need to go to where they
1:46:01are to help them calm
1:46:05down all right
1:46:09um and how often do they actually get in
1:46:12one of these loud
1:46:14fights almost every day almost every
1:46:18day um and what was the last fight that
1:46:21they had
1:46:24my father came home late back
1:46:30okay and they had an argument about
1:46:34that and how did that
1:46:37go my mom just left for
1:46:40dance okay my dad left first and then
1:46:44sorry he left after he came home from
1:46:46work and then he called on my uncle left
1:46:49and then by the time my dad got home and
1:46:50E DIN and my mom had to leave
1:46:55um so they didn't have the time to but
1:46:58originally there was a fight that
1:47:00night okay and what did your mom say to
1:47:03your
1:47:07dad where did you go until that time and
1:47:10she didn't believe that just forgot to
1:47:12lock his something at
1:47:15work
1:47:17okay did it sound unreasonable to you
1:47:21or I don't
1:47:24if you forgot something at work then he
1:47:25forgot something at work but usually why
1:47:27she was yelling because he doesn't turn
1:47:28on his phone or he doesn't let us know
1:47:30so okay she didn't think it was
1:47:32considerate I guess is what the argument
1:47:34really was about not so much that you
1:47:36were late but you didn't call about it
1:47:38is that
1:47:39more if I'm wrong tell me but I'm just I
1:47:42think
1:47:43so and
1:47:46um but he was about a half an hour late
1:47:49compared to usual 40 minutes minutes
1:47:53okay what did she think he was doing in
1:47:55those 40
1:47:57minutes she never said did she believe
1:48:01that his story or
1:48:05not she didn't
1:48:08really now was she more upset that he
1:48:10was late or that he just didn't
1:48:13call but he has a phone and he never
1:48:15uses it
1:48:17okay um the supper is it usually made
1:48:20for a certain time every night which is
1:48:23what time five
1:48:25530 so he'd have been home in time for
1:48:27that though yeah
1:48:31okay now um when you went up to your
1:48:34room to get ready for bed what does that
1:48:39entail brush tee go to
1:48:42my
1:48:44okay and um what do you wear to
1:48:50bed comfortable
1:48:52okay do you wear
1:48:55pajamas sometimes not all the time okay
1:48:58what what would make you wear them or
1:49:00what would make you not wear them
1:49:01laundry or how lazy I am or how
1:49:04comfortable my regular clothes is okay
1:49:06did you actually change your clothes
1:49:08that
1:49:09night I put on a sweater it was cold
1:49:12okay which was what skating sweater I
1:49:16believe okay um and what did you have
1:49:19for bottoms
1:49:28black pants okay and so did you actually
1:49:31change in out of them or had how long
1:49:34had you had those on I don't
1:49:39remember I'm sorry I don't remember when
1:49:41would have you put them on that
1:49:43day maybe in the
1:49:46morning when Mom ask you to go with her
1:49:49okay
1:49:51think um underneath the skating shirt
1:49:54what did you have
1:49:58on think I had anything
1:50:03on so you had to take something off
1:50:06that's why I'm just getting to if you
1:50:08put that on did you take anything off my
1:50:11bra okay and maybe a tank top because
1:50:15you obviously weren't walking around
1:50:17with adjust your bra all day is that
1:50:19fair I'm sorry I just don't remember the
1:50:22detail take your time I just don't
1:50:24remember of a t-shirt or something yeah
1:50:27okay um and but you put on
1:50:31the you remember that okay and then what
1:50:37happened fromwhere you were essentially
1:50:40then um on the phone just
1:50:44[Music]
1:50:45watching watching TV and talking to Ed
1:50:48on the phone okay how did the
1:50:51conversation end with Ed
1:50:53I heard my father my mother calling from
1:50:55my
1:51:00father and then what have to go to this
1:51:03again okay at um when you went to bed
1:51:07was your mom home yet she had just
1:51:10gotten home and I went down I told Ed
1:51:12I'll be right back and I I went down I
1:51:14said hi to her and I went back up to my
1:51:17room okay so what time would have that
1:51:20been I guess it was I'm trying to get
1:51:21out
1:51:239:15 okay so she got home you went down
1:51:26how long did you when she came home she
1:51:28changed yeah and then did you that's
1:51:31when I know she came home when she went
1:51:32up to change and she went back
1:51:34downstairs and I went down to say hi
1:51:37grab a glass of water I believe and went
1:51:40back up to okay and then you were back
1:51:43on the phone with
1:51:44that when you heard what call my dad
1:51:49okay
1:51:51so when you went went down to see your
1:51:53mom what did you talk about my just High
1:51:58she was watching her Tiny shows I just
1:51:59left her alone okay and what else did
1:52:02you do while you were
1:52:05downstairs go get a glass of water and
1:52:07then went back up the
1:52:10stairs okay and where did you get the
1:52:12glass of water
1:52:15from
1:52:17um now while you're downstairs at any
1:52:21time do you make make sure that the
1:52:23house is
1:52:24secure that's the person who goes to bed
1:52:27left okay just in our house anytime
1:52:30anybody's going to bed they usually each
1:52:32one of us end up doing it in case
1:52:34somebody else forgets so did you uh
1:52:37check the front door at all I don't
1:52:41no no no back door side
1:52:45doors okay if you were the one that go
1:52:48to bed last what doors would you check
1:52:51back door and front door okay what would
1:52:53you
1:52:54do make sure that they're locked okay
1:52:57and if they weren't locked lock them
1:52:59lock them
1:53:01okay um and the back door how do you
1:53:04guys secure
1:53:07that lock and pull them close okay is
1:53:11that a slider do you guys put a piece of
1:53:13wood in there at all no so you just make
1:53:15sure it's
1:53:18locked um and so who would be the person
1:53:21that mostly does that my mother
1:53:24okay um is it typical that if she's
1:53:27coming in late that she would lock
1:53:33it you know mean if it's already dark
1:53:35outside would she lock the door as soon
1:53:38as she comes
1:53:40in you know as opposed to being in the
1:53:43middle of the day and you just I think
1:53:45I'm pretty sure I
1:53:47don't not 100% sure like let's just say
1:53:50you came in and it was already dark side
1:53:53mhm what would you do I block the door
1:53:55behind me yeah because you don't intend
1:53:58on going out again it's say common
1:54:02practice
1:54:03okay all right
1:54:23were you injured at all during the whole
1:54:31process okay not really
1:54:35anything okay when they tied your hands
1:54:39what kind of uh style did they tie them
1:54:42I'm not
1:54:44sure okay and when they tied you to the
1:54:47banister how did they do that
1:54:53one of them was
1:54:54holding I think okay and how did how did
1:54:58they tie I don't
1:55:00know they made me kept looking down okay
1:55:03didn't let me look yeah what could you
1:55:08feel a tight and then like another tight
1:55:11where did it feel
1:55:13[Music]
1:55:15tight okay so what was around your upper
1:55:20arm face okay and what was around how
1:55:25else were you
1:55:26tied
1:55:28okay
1:55:30and were your wrists tied to the
1:55:34bister how do you
1:55:37know they TI my wrist first and T my arm
1:55:39to
1:55:41the
1:55:42okay now
1:55:47um you mentioned um on the tape that you
1:55:50were getting loose
1:55:52what did you mean by
1:55:54that the upper my upper arm was
1:55:59fall was
1:56:01falling okay where did it fall
1:56:05to short
1:56:07dist okay and how did you get it to do
1:56:11that I don't remember just
1:56:16legally TR okay um and where did that
1:56:21string end up please got
1:56:27there what that I go through okay well
1:56:32the details are important because it
1:56:34shows us what uh what they did right we
1:56:36need we need to get that
1:56:39um the one thing I do want to go over is
1:56:43the
1:56:44description of the gentleman that you
1:56:47said you called them number
1:56:49one can you tell me that again
1:56:57the first person that uh you dealt with
1:57:00or
1:57:04that can you help me with
1:57:18that you're going to have to speak up I
1:57:20can't hear you
1:57:24slightly shorter than sorry slightly
1:57:26shorter than you yep which is what five
1:57:32yep what kind of
1:57:36build okay and what type of face round
1:57:41face
1:57:43okay
1:57:46and
1:57:49age late 20 early 30
1:57:52and then there was a another
1:57:56gentleman that you called number
1:57:58two
1:58:01previously what would how would you
1:58:03describe
1:58:11him
1:58:15put was his face covered the whole time
1:58:19yeah I think with what
1:58:26okay
1:58:27okay
1:58:30and okay I appreciate that and the third
1:58:37person okay well you did see some of
1:58:45them and what color
1:58:53it's all dark though
1:58:55okay but he had a caran accent
1:58:59okay and how do you know it was
1:59:02Caribbean it sounded like what I hear on
1:59:05TV
1:59:07and people okay what about um voices for
1:59:12the other two number one
1:59:26and what about the neither of them had
1:59:29an accent or number two didn't speak
1:59:31very much so I'm not sure when he did
1:59:34speak one syllable okay and what were
1:59:37those syllables
1:59:39okay okay
1:59:42yeah and what else did you hear from him
1:59:45I don't
1:59:47remember all right um do you need
1:59:50anything to drink at all
1:59:57okay you realize that it's important
1:59:59though okay all right
2:00:04um
2:00:06[Music]
2:00:07obviously everything is so important
2:00:10that night that it's probably the most
2:00:13important night of your life and I know
2:00:15it's tough to keep going over but it's
2:00:17important okay uh I'm just going to step
2:00:20out for a second okay
2:00:22did you need
2:00:24anything no okay hold
2:00:28tight I won't be
2:00:50long
2:01:20e
2:01:50e
2:02:20e
2:02:50e for
2:03:45okay sorry about
2:03:46that all
2:03:49right um
2:03:53the money that you um they took from you
2:03:57how much was that
2:04:02again
2:04:042 of mine and I don't you guys I believe
2:04:07I heard my mom saybe 1100 but I don't
2:04:10know okay so prods of your own 2000 okay
2:04:15and what kind of denominations was
2:04:18that a 50 20
2:04:22okay and if you had it in a stock how
2:04:25big would that stock
2:04:32be
2:04:34okay and where did you keep that in my
2:04:38night table underneath the TV okay and
2:04:42how long had you kept it there
2:04:52six months okay and before that six
2:04:56months it was
2:04:58in my other
2:05:01table okay which is
2:05:03where why did you switch it
2:05:07up that one got okay so you moved it
2:05:10over did you have any other money in
2:05:12your room in any other
2:05:14places you in my wallet okay did they
2:05:18get that I believe they did okay did you
2:05:21give it to them they pointed it at one
2:05:25person okay and what did they do with
2:05:28that don't
2:05:30okay you saw him take it or
2:05:34not okay and you haven't been back to
2:05:36check since I
2:05:39can't okay gotcha now
2:05:43um and where did that money come
2:05:47from of I just recently her and others
2:05:51from
2:05:53money okay how much did you
2:05:58withdraw 500 twice but U it was to pay
2:06:02back my mom
2:06:05for okay so how much did you 500 okay
2:06:10and when did you take that 500
2:06:17out okay and the other 500
2:06:22okay maybe two we and where did you get
2:06:24that from sorry where did that come
2:06:29from my bank and where's your
2:06:31bank when I was I don't remember the
2:06:34other withdraw but my one withdraw was
2:06:37at my most recent withdraw was at Warden
2:06:40and
2:06:41Warden I don't remember where I the
2:06:44other one okay um but you went through a
2:06:47teller or did you go through a cash
2:06:49machine machine okay for both or
2:06:54dis I'm pretty sure for both okay and
2:06:58how much did you take out each time is
2:07:00that your maximum that you can take out
2:07:02on the machine okay how much do you have
2:07:04in your
2:07:12account okay and where did that come
2:07:16from my mom your mom and when did she
2:07:19give it to you
2:07:21me these checks okay she works and she
2:07:25puts it under
2:07:27my she works
2:07:30where I don't know
2:07:32they packaging company okay and that's
2:07:36on the side or yeah okay and she puts it
2:07:39in your name and do you have to give her
2:07:41the money back then yes okay she keeps a
2:07:43tab okay at the time I withdrawn I give
2:07:45it to her okay and how come you hadn't
2:07:48withdrawn or how come you hadn't given
2:07:50it to her yet
2:07:52she hadn't asked for it she's like just
2:07:55give it a few days and then but she knew
2:07:57you withdrew it no she's like I will be
2:07:59withdrawing from okay she didn't know
2:08:02you already took it so why would you not
2:08:04just give it to her then why would you
2:08:06withdraw it and not give it to
2:08:10her I don't know just i' I'd only give
2:08:13it to her because she forgets to write
2:08:15it in her book
2:08:17okay all right so how often does she
2:08:20give you she has a check made out to you
2:08:23do you put the deposit in or okay how
2:08:26often does she make a deposit in your
2:08:30account once a week okay for 500 or
2:08:34what's they random random 200 300 okay
2:08:38and they come from a packaging company
2:08:40and where's
2:08:45that 14 area and does she report there
2:08:49every day
2:08:50or whenever they need to thr color okay
2:08:54all right um okay now the reason why I'm
2:09:00here today okay is that I'm an expert
2:09:05okay in what we call truth
2:09:08verification okay I'm not a homicide
2:09:10detective okay although I work on a lot
2:09:12of homicides okay so my job in any case
2:09:17and anybody that's a witness in this
2:09:19case I have to speak to okay after
2:09:22they've been interviewed originally by
2:09:24anybody else okay and so what it's about
2:09:28is truth verification okay so basically
2:09:33all my studies come into interviewing
2:09:36and uh detecting
2:09:39deception uh determine if somebody's
2:09:41telling the police the truth okay
2:09:44because every investigation that we run
2:09:47that's a homicide we run a parallel
2:09:49investigation okay and when I talk about
2:09:51a parallel investigation what I mean by
2:09:53that is obviously the detectives that
2:09:55are assigned to the case Okay are trying
2:09:58to determine who's responsible for the
2:10:01home invasion who's
2:10:03responsible uh for what happened there
2:10:06okay that's their job okay my job is to
2:10:11determine whether everything somebody
2:10:13has told us as a witness or is a
2:10:16reporting party is actually the truth
2:10:19okay now in my experience as a police
2:10:22officer no matter what the case is okay
2:10:26um for some reason or another people
2:10:28make mistakes in
2:10:30that they don't always tell the truth
2:10:35okay um they may tell some of the truth
2:10:37but they don't always tell all of the
2:10:39truth do you what I mean okay and I know
2:10:42in your life you've already had
2:10:44occasions where you you're well aware
2:10:46what half truths mean right what do they
2:10:49mean you don't
2:10:52yeah so when we're talking about truth
2:10:55we're not just talking about a person
2:10:56saying
2:10:58something uh that's not true right
2:11:01that's one way of not telling the truth
2:11:03simply by making something up right do
2:11:05you agree okay but also withholding
2:11:10information is not telling the truth
2:11:12okay it's purposeful deception really
2:11:15right okay they're leaving stuff out
2:11:18that may assist the investigation okay
2:11:20that may lead uh to the people that are
2:11:24responsible from being caught right um
2:11:27and that's where uh we talked earlier
2:11:30about um so some people obstruct the
2:11:33investigation okay because they they
2:11:35provide facts that are totally not true
2:11:38okay other things they tell about the
2:11:40case obviously did happen so what we
2:11:42talk about is a combination of people
2:11:46telling things that are totally not true
2:11:49leaving information out would be two
2:11:51ways that people haven't been
2:11:54truthful okay so how do I make my
2:11:59conclusions okay so some of the ways is
2:12:03obviously I count on my experience right
2:12:07I talk to thousands of people okay and I
2:12:10basically know when somebody's not being
2:12:13straightforward with me okay I can tell
2:12:16by the language they use how they answer
2:12:18the questions their body language how
2:12:20they treat the question that something's
2:12:23wrong here okay this doesn't make sense
2:12:26okay the other thing is something an
2:12:29understanding of what common sense is
2:12:32okay could this have happened that way
2:12:35by what the person's telling me could
2:12:37have it even happened like that okay is
2:12:40it realistic is it plausible okay
2:12:44so basically we're trained in statement
2:12:47analysis okay so what I did with your
2:12:50stat is I wrote it all out every word
2:12:53that you said okay just like everybody
2:12:55else that gave a statement every noun
2:12:59pronoun verb everything okay and people
2:13:02are trained to speak in a certain
2:13:03language okay and when they are not
2:13:07being truthful that shows up in their
2:13:09language they don't even know they're
2:13:11doing it okay but when we analyze the
2:13:15statement itself we know whether they're
2:13:17being truthful or not truthful okay and
2:13:20these days we even have software that
2:13:22assist us in that okay we're in the
2:13:24modern ages right okay so we have uh
2:13:27computer programs and one of the ones
2:13:29that we utilize in these cases is an
2:13:32analysis program called event
2:13:34probability analysis okay and what we do
2:13:38is we feed everything into the computer
2:13:40basically the computer I type it out and
2:13:44we feed it in and it takes you scan it
2:13:46in actually and it takes a copy of
2:13:48everything that's been said and it
2:13:50analyzes is um what a person has said
2:13:55okay and based on what they say it will
2:13:58tell us where the areas of deception are
2:14:02okay when something's missing uh that
2:14:05they're not telling us okay areas of
2:14:08concern and uh areas that are flat out
2:14:12not truthful okay and areas that they
2:14:16you come back with a result that says
2:14:18not plausible okay because what it is
2:14:21this software analyzes it's being
2:14:23entered by all police forces okay so it
2:14:28has data from thousands of cases right
2:14:31so if it gets information that's totally
2:14:34never happened before in any other case
2:14:37right that tells you something right
2:14:39because human beings there's only so
2:14:41many ways to do something okay and
2:14:44people follow patterns okay and when
2:14:46things go outside of a normal pattern
2:14:49that's a red flag right do you agree
2:14:52when when when things don't add up so
2:14:55that that's another um thing that we
2:14:57look into of course I have to go over
2:15:00all the forensics of a case Okay because
2:15:05that's evidence okay and you're already
2:15:08aware of how many days the police were
2:15:09at your host right about what's that
2:15:13about this yeah days on on days on days
2:15:18and when they were there okay they're
2:15:20not just they're um taking a couple
2:15:23pictures or anything okay they're going
2:15:25over that house with a fine tooth foam
2:15:28okay they're going over every hair fiber
2:15:31every skin cell every bit of blood
2:15:35because essentially you know what DNA is
2:15:38right okay basically a person cannot go
2:15:43in or out of a anywhere without leaving
2:15:46a part of themselves behind right you
2:15:49understand that do you watch CSI at all
2:15:51a little bit little bit but you're it
2:15:54tells you that it would be like if you
2:15:56and I walked out of this room right now
2:15:57right and we brought in our forensic
2:16:01experts right and what they would do is
2:16:03they would collect any hair any fibers
2:16:07uh any skin cells any DNA that was in
2:16:09this room okay and what they could do
2:16:12with that is simply say at the end of
2:16:14the day they would say you know what
2:16:16Jennifer Pam was in that room and Bill
2:16:18Gates was in that room okay it's
2:16:21conclusive that um we can't go in and
2:16:24out without leaving parts of ourselves
2:16:26behind you understand that right okay so
2:16:30obviously the forensic in this case uh
2:16:34will tell us a lot of information okay
2:16:37who was in what room who wasn't in what
2:16:40room okay what you have to remember is
2:16:43what is there and what is not there or
2:16:45just as
2:16:47important okay so if somebody was said
2:16:50to be in a certain
2:16:52room and our experts went through there
2:16:55and there were no fibers from that
2:16:57person what would that tell
2:17:01you yeah they weren't there okay um so
2:17:06in my work I'm looking for what's there
2:17:08but also what's not there is it just as
2:17:11important and you know what a lot of
2:17:13times it's even more important okay
2:17:16because it goes to verifying what the
2:17:19person what the witnesses told me okay
2:17:22or what they haven't told me both right
2:17:25okay so that that's another thing that
2:17:28uh of course that's uh done at every
2:17:30scene okay the other thing that we do is
2:17:33obviously we talk to a lot of people and
2:17:35you already know we've done that because
2:17:37we've talked to a lot of your friends
2:17:38and people that you know
2:17:41right so you're well aware that we don't
2:17:43leave any Rock unturned okay and so we
2:17:47go outad and do that uh you already know
2:17:50um um that we've contacted these people
2:17:53because that's part of what we do in
2:17:55every investigation okay every interview
2:17:57is important every person that may have
2:17:59any knowledge at all is important right
2:18:03we also talk to people that have talked
2:18:05to the witnesses okay so if we've
2:18:08interviewed you for instance and then we
2:18:11go and interview that person that's
2:18:14talked to you they will tell us what you
2:18:16said okay and if there's odd things in
2:18:19what you've told them or they don't make
2:18:22sense of course we find that out because
2:18:24they tell us right and so that's another
2:18:26way we can determine if somebody's being
2:18:29truthful they tell someone else
2:18:31something different than what they've
2:18:33told uh us ourselves or something that's
2:18:36in conflict with that
2:18:38right uh so that's another thing that we
2:18:40do um the other thing we do is we have
2:18:44to reach out to what we call modern
2:18:46technology okay so there some of the
2:18:48things that we utilize is satellite
2:18:51okay now are do you know what satellite
2:18:53can do okay do you watch any of these uh
2:18:57when uh these War programs on TV where
2:19:00they do bombings and stuff have you ever
2:19:03seen any of that or when uh the Iraq War
2:19:07was on you ever see any of the news
2:19:08Clips where you can see the satellite
2:19:10honing in on
2:19:12buildings okay so we can go back and
2:19:15obtain satellite information okay and
2:19:19essentially the satellites a a 24-hour
2:19:21video that's going on uh you know 24
2:19:25hours a day seven days a week right it's
2:19:28recording
2:19:29information okay and that's how the
2:19:32military uses it in you know for
2:19:34precision bombing and everything else
2:19:36because they're able to find out where
2:19:38bombs are inside buildings and hone in
2:19:41on that through satellites and heat
2:19:43seeking uh uh apparatuses that tell you
2:19:46what's going on inside right okay so
2:19:49we're able to go back uh and review that
2:19:52okay and so we would have to obtain uh
2:19:56that data for specific address uh get it
2:19:59for the dates and time that we're
2:20:00concerned with okay and basically if
2:20:04people are moving around in a house um
2:20:07it's like an x-ray okay and basically
2:20:10we're able to tell you know are those
2:20:13movements are those actions that number
2:20:15of people consistent with the story that
2:20:17we've been told um are the people
2:20:21in the positions that the Witnesses are
2:20:23telling us they were in uh or are they
2:20:26different okay and if they're different
2:20:28why are they different is what what our
2:20:29question becomes right so that's a
2:20:33that's another uh thing that we do
2:20:35obviously just to go back to forensics
2:20:37for a minute what we're doing is stuff
2:20:39like um in this case that door knob is
2:20:42very important that door lock okay and
2:20:45so we're looking for who was the last
2:20:47one that actually uh touched that door
2:20:50knob or door lock right okay um did
2:20:55somebody lock at last or did somebody uh
2:20:59unlock it okay so we would see uh you
2:21:03would get like Fingerprints of one
2:21:04person locking and then overlap by the
2:21:06person that unlocked it that type of
2:21:08thing um and
2:21:11um again it would just be information
2:21:14that would go to determine what happened
2:21:16on in that house right and uh from there
2:21:20the other thing of course um in any case
2:21:24you know about Crim Stoppers right have
2:21:27you heard of Crim Stoppers before yeah
2:21:29call yeah okay when you get a case like
2:21:32this okay people want to help okay it's
2:21:36in the papers it's everywhere okay so
2:21:38people actually end up coming to us to
2:21:41help us out with the case okay now in a
2:21:44case like this we're actually very
2:21:46fortunate because the more people that
2:21:48are involved in a crime the more
2:21:50information we always get okay if a
2:21:53person goes out and commits a crime
2:21:55themselves who knows about
2:22:00it just themselves for sure and maybe
2:22:03anybody they tell right in a case where
2:22:07they actually is uh multiple people
2:22:10involved so in this case three people
2:22:13inside the house and a number of other
2:22:15people involved on the peripheral right
2:22:18um each of them know
2:22:21okay so now we're getting into a higher
2:22:22number of people knowing what happens
2:22:24and you know what somebody always tells
2:22:27somebody else okay and so that doubles
2:22:31the number of people that know okay and
2:22:34then over drinks and everything else
2:22:36that person tells another person and
2:22:39before we know it a ton of people
2:22:41actually know what happened that night
2:22:43okay and suddenly we get people calling
2:22:46in because what you know why they want
2:22:49to help okay there's other people that
2:22:52just want the money they know what
2:22:54happened they've heard about it they've
2:22:56heard it through a friend okay in all
2:22:59the years that I've been
2:23:01placing you don't know how many people
2:23:03actually call in on their own
2:23:05friends it happens all the time okay
2:23:09because they want that money okay they
2:23:11get greedy so we get calls all the time
2:23:14from people uh that are involved we also
2:23:18get people that are actually involved in
2:23:19the crime telling about other people
2:23:21that were involved in the crime and
2:23:23they're actually going to collect money
2:23:25on a
2:23:27case that they were involved in that you
2:23:31hear what I'm saying okay and and so at
2:23:35the end of the day okay there's so many
2:23:39resources available to me um that at the
2:23:43end of the day I'm going to know if a
2:23:46person's telling me the truth or not
2:23:49okay whether they they and it may not be
2:23:51to me because I'm analyzing also every
2:23:54statement they made to the police okay
2:23:57and the other things that we do is
2:24:00obviously we get uh forensic sciences
2:24:03and profiling people involved to
2:24:05determine the events of these things
2:24:08okay now I can tell you that nothing
2:24:13surprises me in this job okay I am well
2:24:18aware that anybody on this Earth is
2:24:22capable of making a
2:24:24mistake okay I don't care who they are I
2:24:27don't care um if they're a priest I
2:24:31don't care if they're a school teacher I
2:24:33don't care what the situation is given a
2:24:38certain set of
2:24:40circumstances everyone has the
2:24:42capability Jennifer of making mistake
2:24:46doing the wrong thing okay um the key
2:24:51though when I talk to people
2:24:53is when they made a mistake okay that's
2:24:56one thing right the key is to not keep
2:25:00making the same
2:25:02mistake
2:25:03okay and to get that information out and
2:25:06get it off your
2:25:08chest okay you understand what I'm
2:25:11saying okay so at the end of the day
2:25:15from this case and I can tell you I've
2:25:18spent literally a week on this case case
2:25:20going over information after information
2:25:23accessing all the sources speaking to
2:25:25every other expert on the case
2:25:30okay and at this point
2:25:32Jennifer I know that you've not been
2:25:34truthful with the
2:25:36police
2:25:38okay you've not told us everything that
2:25:41you know purposely okay and that you've
2:25:46left information
2:25:47out okay there's a number of
2:25:51inconsistencies in what you've told the
2:25:54police okay one of the things you have
2:25:56to remember is that your dad was
2:26:01there okay and your dad had a front row
2:26:04seat to all of
2:26:06this
2:26:07okay and your dad's a very smart
2:26:11man okay and he has a very clear
2:26:14perception of what's going
2:26:16on and he tells the very truthful story
2:26:20I've gone through this whole process
2:26:21with him okay I've had to do the same
2:26:24thing and I know he's being
2:26:26truthful okay the problem is that your
2:26:31story what you're telling is not
2:26:34truthful okay and we have to clear this
2:26:37up
2:26:39okay
2:26:41your rition of what happened one a lot
2:26:46of events you say that happened never
2:26:48did okay a lot of things that you told
2:26:51the police happen never happened okay
2:26:55they never happened in the sequence that
2:26:56you've told okay you got to remember
2:27:00that your dad was there okay that's just
2:27:03one part of it there's lots of other
2:27:04things that tell me that you've not been
2:27:06truthful all this analysis that I've
2:27:08been doing but on top of
2:27:11it that yours doesn't match at all
2:27:15except for very few factors that you've
2:27:17told truth but you haven't told all the
2:27:19truth we're getting into where you know
2:27:23you've spent a considerable amount of
2:27:26time in the last seven years telling
2:27:28half truths okay and I can understand
2:27:31why okay you've had a tough life okay
2:27:34what's happened to you to me equates to
2:27:38abuse okay
2:27:41and all the stresses that you've had en
2:27:43forced to lie I can understand why you
2:27:45did it okay but you're in another
2:27:48situation here where you're under
2:27:49another tremendous amount of stress okay
2:27:54and that stress is brought on by those
2:27:55same factors that brought on stress
2:27:58before okay the number one thing that
2:28:00brings on stress to you is when you're
2:28:02not
2:28:03truthful right that hurts you
2:28:07right okay and it doesn't feel good
2:28:10inside does it it breaks down the person
2:28:14that you are CU at the end of the day
2:28:16you're a good person I know that you've
2:28:18got a good heart okay in this case
2:28:23though you've made
2:28:24mistakes okay and you're involved in
2:28:27this I know that okay there's no
2:28:30question about it okay the only question
2:28:33right now is are you going to keep
2:28:36making mistakes are you going to go on
2:28:39the route that you've gone on over the
2:28:40years and try to pretend that things
2:28:43happen that never happen okay are you
2:28:45going to not face reality here okay you
2:28:50were not truthful to the police in this
2:28:53case we know that you're involved we've
2:28:56done our homework okay we have to
2:28:59resolve that now here today okay I need
2:29:03to know from you what really happen okay
2:29:07and I
2:29:08mean who's else is involved in this okay
2:29:12because there's no doubt Jennifer that
2:29:14you are okay we know that we're past
2:29:16that okay there's no question about it
2:29:19at all all okay and I know why this has
2:29:23happened okay you have spent your whole
2:29:26life trying to live up to expectations
2:29:28that you can't make okay and that stress
2:29:31the hell out of you you're a 24y old
2:29:34woman being treated like a 15year old
2:29:37okay what you've never done anything
2:29:39that terrible in your life but you're
2:29:42being treated like you have you're not
2:29:45being treated like the adult that you
2:29:47are yes you made some mistakes big deal
2:29:50you're not the first person that has
2:29:52gone out and not told their parents that
2:29:54they're dating a guy because in your
2:29:57culture they don't accept it I
2:29:58understand that I've talked to people in
2:30:00here that have kept that secret for
2:30:02their whole life from their parents okay
2:30:05so that's not abnormal but that puts a
2:30:07lot of stress on you right that's not
2:30:10easy for you is
2:30:12it
2:30:14no now what we need to get down to here
2:30:17today Jen is what really
2:30:23happened you need to tell me what went
2:30:27on because you know who was in that
2:30:30house that
2:30:31night you do Jen there's no question
2:30:34about that
2:30:35okay there's no question about it okay
2:30:40you have actually given an improper
2:30:42description of the person you were
2:30:43dealing with upstairs number
2:30:47one you falsified the whole descript of
2:30:50that person we know that okay we know
2:30:53that okay he yes you did Jen okay you
2:30:58did you've made a a mistake here and we
2:31:01got to get to the bottom of
2:31:03that that person did not exist in that
2:31:06house that night I know that okay we've
2:31:08done our homework okay you heard on the
2:31:12news that there was video right okay it
2:31:16wasn't three black guys that left that
2:31:18house you know that and I know that
2:31:21okay so we need to get down to why you
2:31:24have purposely told us a false
2:31:27description of number one okay no
2:31:32Jen it's totally wrong and it was done
2:31:36on purpose okay to mislead us okay
2:31:40because you're involved in this okay you
2:31:43cannot deny that okay you cannot deny
2:31:46that we know now okay so let's just get
2:31:49it out on the table you've made a
2:31:50mistake I know that okay but you can't
2:31:53live with this any longer than this
2:31:56you're your your buddy nervous wreck
2:31:58over this thing this thing if you could
2:32:02take it back I know that you would if
2:32:05you could go back to that day and play
2:32:06this all over again it would be
2:32:08different okay but you need to right now
2:32:12know
2:32:13that we know that you're involved
2:32:16there's no question about that none
2:32:18whatsoever okay okay but what we also
2:32:21know is that you're a good person okay
2:32:24that's made a mistake here right you you
2:32:27made some bad decisions okay and it's
2:32:30you know how you made the bad decisions
2:32:32that not talking telling your parents
2:32:35what's up you don't want to do that with
2:32:37us okay you don't want to do that with
2:32:39the police do you yeah but you don't
2:32:41want to mislead me do you no okay so
2:32:44let's not do that you made a mistake
2:32:47that night you got involved with the
2:32:49wrong people people okay you got
2:32:51involved in the wrong set of
2:32:53circumstances okay but that's over with
2:32:56now we're past that okay we know that
2:33:00that happened okay but you know
2:33:05what in all my years of policing it
2:33:08doesn't matter what goes wrong with
2:33:10people it's never too late to do the
2:33:12right thing you know that and I know
2:33:15that okay and what you can do here today
2:33:18is actually do the right thing okay you
2:33:21have to do the right thing okay you
2:33:23can't go around continuing this okay
2:33:27remember when you said what it did to
2:33:29you when you went through those years of
2:33:32depression that was brought on by not
2:33:34being truthful living a lie you don't
2:33:37want to keep living this lie okay
2:33:40everybody knows okay you know and you're
2:33:43getting the feeling from everybody
2:33:45around you that they know okay nobody is
2:33:48surprised
2:33:50okay there's nobody surprised here okay
2:33:54after what you've been
2:33:56through I'm surprised this didn't happen
2:33:58a lot earlier truthfully okay you're 24
2:34:01years old and you were a prisoner in
2:34:03your own house you had lost your own
2:34:07identity there was no Jennifer anymore
2:34:10okay you were living for what somebody
2:34:12else wanted you weren't you you were
2:34:15what somebody else wanted you were
2:34:17living someone else's expectations okay
2:34:19okay and yes family is important but
2:34:23when family takes over you as a human
2:34:25being when they take your
2:34:28identity there is no more gen so no
2:34:31matter how good their intentions are no
2:34:33matter how much they love
2:34:36you they're taking away
2:34:38Jen okay and you have gone through this
2:34:42for years in the middle of tension
2:34:47tension that's got to the point that it
2:34:49makes you sck
2:34:50your stomach churns over it you don't
2:34:53wake up a day that there's not some
2:34:55issue on the table not some stress in
2:34:57your household
2:35:00okay essentially you've been told to
2:35:02live up to expectations you yourself
2:35:04years ago knew that you could not do
2:35:08okay they're taking away
2:35:11Jen there is no Jen they took Jen away
2:35:15the Jen that just wants to be a piano
2:35:18teacher why isn't that good
2:35:20enough why was that not good
2:35:24enough that was great expectations why
2:35:26not just be a lab technician why the
2:35:28doctor why does it always have to be
2:35:31something bigger why can't it just be
2:35:33what you
2:35:35want and all that has resulted in what's
2:35:39happened on on November
2:35:428th the tension built up to a point that
2:35:47you know what it's like an animal that
2:35:49gets cornered it's at some point the
2:35:52nicest dog when it's cornered bites
2:35:56back okay it's called
2:35:59self-preservation okay and in your case
2:36:02all that's happened here is
2:36:05self-preservation 18 months ago Jen you
2:36:08chose your family over
2:36:10Daniel okay but you gave up Jen in the
2:36:13process you gave up yourself to this
2:36:16whole thing there was no Jen anymore
2:36:20the Gen that just wanted to to teach
2:36:23piano that wasn't good enough the Gen
2:36:26that just wants a normal 9 to-5
2:36:30job that's not good
2:36:32enough and Jen was in a state of
2:36:35depression backed into a
2:36:38corner and what it came down to is one
2:36:42thing
2:36:44self-preservation
2:36:46self-preservation overrules anything in
2:36:48life okay okay at the end of the day
2:36:52it's like your life is being choked out
2:36:54of you that's what's been happening for
2:36:56the last seven years and
2:37:00basically the grip on your throat on
2:37:03your life has shrunk and tightened up to
2:37:07a
2:37:08point where either you do something
2:37:10about it or it's the end of
2:37:13J and you diminished to a point where
2:37:16the only thing you could do is fight
2:37:18back for once
2:37:21and that's what's happened here again we
2:37:23know that we know that and I again I'm
2:37:27surprised it took this
2:37:29long a 24-year-old young woman being
2:37:34treated as a prisoner in her own home I
2:37:37can't imagine like the rules that they
2:37:40have are for 12y olds not for somebody
2:37:43twice that age yes their intentions
2:37:46might have been good but they're not
2:37:48realistic
2:37:50they're not de were
2:37:52they
2:37:54again their expectations weren't
2:37:56realistic were
2:37:58they you couldn't live up to them could
2:38:01you you tried
2:38:04to
2:38:06right am I
2:38:09right and finally you had to bite back
2:38:13right you had no other choice you felt
2:38:16like you had no other options you
2:38:18thought of everything else including
2:38:20killing
2:38:22yourself to make this change
2:38:25right
2:38:29right I'm right aren't I
2:38:35Ken
2:38:38right it's
2:38:40okay we understand let's talk about it
2:38:45let's get it out in the open Jem that's
2:38:48all this is about understand standing we
2:38:50know that you were involved we know what
2:38:52you
2:38:57did but you can't live like
2:39:01this you got to get it off your
2:39:05chest you've been so stressed out from
2:39:08the moment this
2:39:12happened you knew that it was going to
2:39:15happen that
2:39:16night before it happened
2:39:21and why you froze on your bed there is
2:39:23because reality had set in the plan was
2:39:26in
2:39:28motion there was no turning
2:39:32back and I know right now you wish you
2:39:34could turn it back
2:39:36right you wish you could go back before
2:39:38that night and stop this
2:39:41right right
2:39:45Jen right
2:39:53what
2:40:01happened what
2:40:11happened happened okay it happened yes
2:40:15the guys came in okay but you were
2:40:17involved that's what the difference is
2:40:19here okay
2:40:22right a lot of what you said happened
2:40:24but a lot of it that you said didn't
2:40:26happen
2:40:30Okay okay but it's what you're not
2:40:32saying that's important here you were a
2:40:35part of setting this plan in motion
2:40:39right you were behind
2:40:41this
2:40:43right you have to get it off your chest
2:40:46and it's killing you get it off your
2:40:49chest and we're going to talk it out
2:40:50here we're going to understand and we're
2:40:52going to get this pressure off you
2:40:54because that's what you need right
2:40:57now do the right thing now J we already
2:41:00know you're not going to surprise me
2:41:02here okay I already know what the answer
2:41:06is I can't let I can't stand to see you
2:41:09go through this any
2:41:11longer you've been a physical wreck
2:41:13because you know that you haven't been
2:41:15truthful with us a lot of things that
2:41:17you said are true but there's so many
2:41:18more that aren't and you're leaving so
2:41:20much information out we know that you
2:41:23have to sit there and ask yourself yes
2:41:25he knows Bill knows everyone
2:41:31knows but what you have to do now is get
2:41:34the strength in you to tell
2:41:37us why it
2:41:39happened I have some pretty good reasons
2:41:41there why it happened like
2:41:43I to me it was a form of abuse
2:41:47here because you can't do that to a
2:41:49person you can't this is
2:41:52Canada we're in the 21st century
2:41:55here you cannot take everything out of a
2:41:59person you can have expectations for
2:42:01your kids but you can't expect them to
2:42:03do everything the way you wanted okay
2:42:07it's just like your dad said about
2:42:09fixing everybody else's home but not
2:42:11fixing his own okay it's the same with
2:42:13you okay he was trying to make a future
2:42:17for you bigger than it should have been
2:42:20and in the process of his love for you
2:42:23he made the mistake of actually pushing
2:42:25you
2:42:31away
2:42:33right all is good
2:42:36intentions what happened all his good
2:42:39intentions went the other way because he
2:42:42made too high of expectations on a young
2:42:45woman we know that Jen
2:42:49you know
2:42:50that and now is the time to get it out
2:42:53in the open
2:42:55here right you know the importance of
2:42:59telling the truth when it really
2:43:00counts and you know what it does to you
2:43:03as a as a person when you have to deny
2:43:05things that you know are
2:43:08true
2:43:11right it doesn't feel good does
2:43:13it Canen it doesn't feel good to have
2:43:17secrets does it
2:43:19no you have to let me know what happened
2:43:23here
2:43:25okay okay but you were
2:43:28involved right that's the part we
2:43:33need okay we need to hear that from you
2:43:35because we know you
2:43:38were we're going to talk this out and
2:43:40figure out what
2:43:43happened I'm going to make it easy on
2:43:45you
2:43:47Jen all you have to do is tell me that
2:43:50you were involved
2:43:53right I'm right aren't I you know it we
2:43:58know
2:43:59it it's plain as
2:44:02day I'm 100% correct here I wouldn't be
2:44:06sitting here saying this if it wasn't
2:44:09Jen
2:44:16okay we have to get through this you
2:44:19have to get through
2:44:22it yes people came into your house that
2:44:25night yes that part's
2:44:27true the descriptions you've given
2:44:31you've held back you haven't been
2:44:33straightforward okay I know that okay I
2:44:37no you haven't okay we know that okay
2:44:39let's get it out on the table here Jen
2:44:41okay it's not true okay you were
2:44:46involved in
2:44:47this right
2:44:50you knew before that night that this was
2:44:52going to happen I'm going to make that
2:44:55easy on you that's a true statement
2:44:58right you knew before that night that
2:45:00they were
2:45:01coming
2:45:06right that's all I need Jen let's get
2:45:09the truth out here
2:45:11now you knew before they came that they
2:45:14were coming
2:45:17right right
2:45:24be honest with me
2:45:28J give me
2:45:35that right you knew before they got
2:45:38there that they were
2:45:40coming
2:45:43right now the good thing is here that
2:45:45you didn't actually shoot
2:45:47anybody that's a POS in this
2:45:50situation because you couldn't do
2:45:53that you're not that type of
2:45:55person
2:45:57right and a lot of people do do
2:46:00that a lot of kids make the mistake of
2:46:02going out and doing it themselves okay
2:46:06you couldn't do that I know
2:46:11that I know that and that's a good thing
2:46:20but you did make a mistake because you
2:46:22got involved in
2:46:25it Jennifer you don't need to live with
2:46:27this pain
2:46:28anymore let it
2:46:35out look at me
2:46:38to let's be honest with each
2:46:41other I've been nothing but honest with
2:46:43you here today and I hope you can do the
2:46:45same with
2:46:47me I'm here The
2:46:57Liston
2:46:59Ken it's not worth it
2:47:02anymore it's hurting
2:47:06you I need to know the details I can't
2:47:08even
2:47:11say but I can tell you one thing is that
2:47:14we already know so you can't change that
2:47:21why I know you
2:47:24did but it got too far ahead of you
2:47:27right you didn't see you didn't think
2:47:30this far ahead did
2:47:33you but once they started once they came
2:47:36in you couldn't stop it could
2:47:38you could
2:47:41you
2:47:46Jen I wanted it to stop I know
2:47:49why didn't they stop for
2:47:53you I don't know who they
2:47:56were but you were part of the planning
2:48:00right you have to tell me that part and
2:48:02then we're going to work through it
2:48:05together do you know what I'm saying you
2:48:08didn't want this you wanted to stop it
2:48:10you have to prove that to me now because
2:48:13at the end of the day we have to stop
2:48:16this from happening to someone else
2:48:20right what happened to me Jen we're
2:48:24going to have to deal with it one step
2:48:26at the time okay I'm going to be honest
2:48:28with you I need to know what you
2:48:35did and then you and I are going to work
2:48:37through this together because the most
2:48:39important part is of this whole thing is
2:48:42that we do the right thing for your
2:48:44mom
2:48:47right I am voice right now I'm working
2:48:51for your mom that's my
2:48:53job and I have to get to the bottom of
2:48:55this for your
2:48:57mom but I need you with me on
2:49:00it
2:49:02okay I want you to step back for a
2:49:06minute and think what would your mom
2:49:09want you to do right
2:49:12now and I know she's a good woman and
2:49:15she's taught you all your life that
2:49:17Jennifer
2:49:19no matter how bad it
2:49:22gets no matter what you've done wrong
2:49:24you can come to me and tell
2:49:27me and I'll understand
2:49:34right and you need to talk to me
2:49:38the okay but let's get back to how they
2:49:41got there why they got there okay
2:49:45because we know that you help get this
2:49:47thing in order
2:49:49right that's what we need to start with
2:49:52then we're going to work through the
2:49:53case okay but we got to start but what
2:49:57happen to
2:49:58me well I don't know at this point okay
2:50:02because I don't know what you're going
2:50:03to tell me other than that you were
2:50:05involved but I need to hear
2:50:09it okay but I can tell you one thing I'm
2:50:12going to sit here as long as it takes
2:50:15for you to get this off your chest okay
2:50:22you know what I mean do it what's
2:50:27that okay you need to tell
2:50:30me how you got involved in
2:50:33this we know that
2:50:37Jen we need to talk about
2:50:40that
2:50:43okay you wanted it to stop then you have
2:50:45to stop this right now
2:50:48okay because this needs to stop you
2:50:50can't go around like this anymore
2:50:53hiding secrets from your own family they
2:50:56know Jen they know they're not going to
2:50:59be
2:51:01surprised what they're looking for you
2:51:03to do right now is to do the right
2:51:06thing that's what I'm looking for that's
2:51:08what you're looking
2:51:10for
2:51:12right you know what what I tell people
2:51:14is just tell the
2:51:17truth okay and we're going to sit down
2:51:19here we're going to get to the bottom of
2:51:22it okay
2:51:24together
2:51:31okay
2:51:34can what
2:51:40happened how did it
2:51:42start I'm talking before that day how
2:51:45did it start before that day how did
2:51:48this thing get in
2:51:50motion there was a plan ahead of time
2:51:52and I want to know about the
2:51:56plan you can do
2:51:59that
2:52:00okay be strong
2:52:06Jen
2:52:09again be strong
2:52:13here what you have to remember is that
2:52:15we're not offside here okay we know
2:52:18already that it happened there's
2:52:20absolutely no doubt that you were
2:52:22involved in this or we wouldn't be
2:52:24sitting here right now you've been
2:52:27waiting and wondering when the police
2:52:29were going to ask you or tell you this
2:52:32you thought it was going to happen the
2:52:33last time you were here
2:52:40right stay with me
2:52:42J let's get through this
2:52:50you're sorry out now are you
2:52:53not are you sorry for what
2:53:00happened you wish you could take it
2:53:04back
2:53:06again okay that's good to hear that's so
2:53:14positive you wish it didn't happen right
2:53:20that night you wish you'd never got this
2:53:22plan in motion
2:53:24right
2:53:28right you wish you never told anybody to
2:53:31do this
2:53:35right
2:53:40again you got to get it off your ch
2:54:07Jen I'm looking for the Jennifer that
2:54:09knows the right
2:54:10wrong are you
2:54:13there yes okay sit up and let's talk
2:54:19okay I
2:54:20know this has been hell for you you have
2:54:24gone through hell for
2:54:26years all you were looking for is a
2:54:29break a chance to be on your
2:54:32own to make your own decisions to be
2:54:36Jen right that's all you were looking
2:54:38for
2:54:41right
2:54:43right you felt cornered you felt like
2:54:46you didn't have any other options
2:54:51right
2:54:53Jen you didn't have another option did
2:54:55you at the time you felt like this was
2:54:58the only thing you could
2:55:02do but once it started that night you
2:55:04wish you could have stopped it so much
2:55:09right
2:55:13again you wish you could have stopped it
2:55:26how did it start
2:55:35again look at me how did it
2:55:44start what was your plan
2:55:49let's just go through the plan that you
2:55:51had okay let's start
2:55:54there we know that you weren't the one
2:55:57that pulled the trigger we know
2:55:59that and we know that you would have you
2:56:01could have stopped this whole thing we
2:56:03know
2:56:05that but we also know that you were
2:56:07involved from the
2:56:09start
2:56:14okay and what this all
2:56:17was with a lot this effort to live your
2:56:21own life to be your own person to make
2:56:25your own
2:56:26decisions
2:56:29right it would happen to anybody in the
2:56:31same
2:56:35circumstances now I do a lot of
2:56:39reading and over 300 kids in North
2:56:43America every
2:56:45year are involved
2:56:51and their parents' deaths
2:56:56okay and when we look into those cases
2:57:00there's always a common
2:57:03factor that those kids have had to live
2:57:07up to expectations that weren't
2:57:10reasonable that they weren't being
2:57:13treated the way human being should be
2:57:16treated
2:57:20the host rules were just so out of
2:57:23whack and you know that because look at
2:57:26all your
2:57:27friends look at all the people around
2:57:29you does anyone else have a
2:57:31curfew for 9:00 at 24 years of
2:57:37age
2:57:39Jen do you know anybody else with those
2:57:43expectations yes or
2:57:45no
2:57:46h yes or no
2:57:49do you know anyone that
2:57:52has to be under the pressure that you're
2:57:56under
2:57:58no I myself don't know of anybody and I
2:58:01investigate these all the time I've
2:58:03never seen someone under 24 years of age
2:58:06that has to have gone through what
2:58:08you've gone
2:58:11through the taking of the love of her
2:58:13life out of her
2:58:15life the decision that the maker your
2:58:18own
2:58:23decisions you had no choice here Jen I
2:58:26know
2:58:30that and anybody else in your situation
2:58:33would have done the exact same
2:58:34thing the only thing different is I
2:58:37would say that they'd have done it a lot
2:58:39earlier they would have looked for a way
2:58:42out you've tried
2:58:45everything you've told them no one
2:58:50listen they didn't listen
2:58:56yet
2:59:00now I want you to ask I want you to
2:59:02answer a simple question for me okay can
2:59:05you do that look at me for a sec here
2:59:08look at me for a sec I have a simple
2:59:11question for
2:59:15you I just want
2:59:18here
2:59:20yes
2:59:24okay you knew this was going to happen
2:59:28right
2:59:35again
2:59:41Jenifer let's work through this together
2:59:43okay
2:59:51it's okay you made a
2:59:54mistake you made a
2:59:58mistake that you can't
3:00:00change but you can change the fact that
3:00:03you're not going to keep making these
3:00:06mistakes right you don't want to keep
3:00:09making these mistakes do you Jen you
3:00:12want to be a part of the solution not
3:00:14the
3:00:15problem you want to be a part of the
3:00:17solution
3:00:20here
3:00:22again
3:00:27okay when did you first start planning
3:00:33this when did you first plan
3:00:37this just give me a date
3:00:50again when did you first start planning
3:00:58this when was the final straw what was
3:01:01the final
3:01:03straw that's what this is all
3:01:12about what was the final thing that did
3:01:14it
3:01:29H Jen do you want to be a good person
3:01:34here okay and you know when a good
3:01:37person makes a mistake they have to face
3:01:40that mistake
3:01:43right right
3:01:48what do you think should happen I don't
3:01:51know what would you like to see happen
3:01:53in this
3:01:57case what's that Justice for your mom
3:02:01okay
3:02:03so to get that
3:02:05Justice we have to KNE the whole story
3:02:13right well one
3:02:16thing that you're going to be J
3:02:20again
3:02:22right that I can promise you you're
3:02:24going to be a person making decisions
3:02:27for
3:02:36J you're going to prove to people that
3:02:38you know what the right thing to do is
3:02:41that's what is going to
3:02:44happen you're going to have the chance
3:02:46to explain to me
3:02:51why this got out of
3:02:52hand you know what I mean but that's
3:02:55where we have to start I can't make any
3:02:57promises to
3:02:58you okay you know
3:03:01that but I can promise I'm going to sit
3:03:04here and listen and we're going to get
3:03:06Justice for your
3:03:07moment that's what I can promise you
3:03:11we're going to get Justice for your
3:03:14M I want to work together with you to
3:03:17get it though
3:03:18that's the only
3:03:19way
3:03:22right you can understand that we have to
3:03:26work together now Jen we can't be on
3:03:28opposite sides here there's going to be
3:03:30Justice for for your mom it has to be in
3:03:38Partnership you and I have to work
3:03:41together and we'll get
3:03:45that okay
3:03:48so how did this
3:04:05start do it for your mom that's all this
3:04:09is
3:04:10about I watched you in all these
3:04:15statements okay
3:04:19and you know I know what the truth is
3:04:22and I know that you loved your mother
3:04:23and I've told everybody that I said the
3:04:26worst thing about this whole thing is
3:04:28that poor girl loved her
3:04:30mom but she got involved over her
3:04:36head and every word you heard from your
3:04:38mom it affected you I know this is the
3:04:41whole worst thing about this whole
3:04:46thing you give anything just to talk to
3:04:48her one more time
3:04:52right but she needs to
3:04:55understand what happened what went wrong
3:05:00here okay so I want you to pretend that
3:05:04I am your
3:05:06mom and get it off your
3:05:09chest I want you to think of you telling
3:05:12your mom what went
3:05:16wrong okay
3:05:18okay and then we're going to get Justice
3:05:21For a Moment are we going to do it
3:05:24together
3:05:29okay again can we work
3:05:32together can you and I work together on
3:05:37this okay let's this is a plan that went
3:05:41wrong okay you had a plan you have to
3:05:44tell me about that
3:05:45plan then we're going to work through
3:05:47the the rest of it okay so we have to
3:05:50start with
3:05:51you okay because you got those people
3:05:54there okay you set this in motion okay
3:05:58we have to know how that happened then
3:06:00we're going to figure out it together
3:06:03okay all
3:06:06right that's what your mom wants right
3:06:08now she's watching us here she's
3:06:11wondering is Jen going to make the right
3:06:13decision here is Jen after all of this
3:06:16going to come on top doing the right
3:06:18thing is she going to be truthful now
3:06:21because really all these other things
3:06:24that you've done in your life you know
3:06:26what everybody's lied to their
3:06:29parents okay that's just
3:06:32life okay I have a daughter too and
3:06:34she's lied to
3:06:37me and it hurts as a parent but at the
3:06:39end of the day what do we want our kids
3:06:41to
3:06:42do we don't mind so much if they make a
3:06:45mistake but we don't want them to keep
3:06:48making the mistakes right Jen that's
3:06:51what it's all about that's someday
3:06:54you're going to be a parent and you're
3:06:55going to want the same thing for your
3:06:57kids
3:06:59right and you want to be able to say to
3:07:02a kid honestly that no matter what you
3:07:05can tell
3:07:08me and right now if your mom was sitting
3:07:11with me
3:07:13here that's all she would expect is that
3:07:15you tell Phil
3:07:18what went wrong
3:07:20here so that there can be
3:07:23Justice
3:07:25okay it goes beyond just yourself here
3:07:29okay we have to think of your
3:07:32mom
3:07:34okay she's the most important there's
3:07:37really nothing else for me that's more
3:07:39important I'm her voice here today
3:07:42that's who I work for okay do you know
3:07:46what I'm saying as a police officer I
3:07:48have to work for the people that don't
3:07:50have a voice
3:07:52anymore I have to sit and figure out
3:07:56what went wrong in every
3:07:58case in order that Justice can get
3:08:01done and that's what you want
3:08:04right because we both want the same
3:08:06thing
3:08:08Ken
3:08:10right okay where did this
3:08:13start take your
3:08:15time I want to talk what happened before
3:08:18that night even came that's what we need
3:08:21to talk about
3:08:25okay what happened before that
3:08:31night I'm with you to here to
3:08:34here we're going to figure it out
3:08:36together okay what happened
3:08:57be
3:09:00strong be strong for moment
3:09:24I'm here for you Jen I'm here for your
3:09:34mom well you have to tell it's one of
3:09:37those situations you know what we know
3:09:39that what you did okay but you have to
3:09:42be able to explain to me what happened
3:09:44okay I can't tell you exactly going to
3:09:48happen to you okay it's like telling you
3:09:52something without knowing the facts
3:09:54right okay at this point I know 100%
3:09:57that you were involved and this was
3:10:00planned out ahead time
3:10:03okay but you need to tell me where
3:10:06things went with this
3:10:09okay it's the truth that's going to tell
3:10:12me what's going I can give you a better
3:10:14answer but if you don't give me that you
3:10:16know what I mean I don't want to lie to
3:10:18you here you know what I'm
3:10:24saying can you see what I'm saying Jen
3:10:28I'm not going to lie to
3:10:32you but I I prefer to deal with this at
3:10:34one step at a time you need to get it
3:10:37out first and then we're going to sit
3:10:38down and we're going to discuss this so
3:10:41the justice for your mom gets done
3:10:43that's your priority isn't it but I told
3:10:46you
3:10:47I remember okay but that's not
3:10:50everything okay you didn't you weren't
3:10:53straightforward with that okay you know
3:10:55that and I know that right you didn't
3:10:57give us everything you misdescribed that
3:11:01yes Jen Jen we past that okay but what I
3:11:04said is what I remember about them like
3:11:07okay how I remembered them okay but it's
3:11:09impossible because we have another
3:11:12witness your dad was right there okay
3:11:16and there's no way you could get those
3:11:18descriptions mixed up okay we know that
3:11:21okay so let's not go there let's go with
3:11:24what we can deal with
3:11:26okay what I need to deal with though is
3:11:29okay you did not pull the trigger right
3:11:34let's deal with what you didn't do
3:11:37okay right you weren't a part of that
3:11:42right that's positive to know okay but
3:11:46we need to know what you were involved
3:11:48in and what you weren't involved in now
3:11:51we know that you
3:11:53didn't shoot anybody that's a positive
3:11:57right you could never do that could you
3:12:03no
3:12:06but before that night ever
3:12:10happened you knew it was going to happen
3:12:12right that start there that's what we
3:12:15need to talk fact there okay that's I
3:12:19don't want to get into an argument about
3:12:22what happened that night because it
3:12:23happened okay
3:12:26right and you wish you could have
3:12:28stopped it is that true or not or are
3:12:30you just saying that to me if I could
3:12:32stop it I would have stopped it
3:12:36okay did you try to stop it that night
3:12:39yes how I wanted to go be with my
3:12:42parents I wanted to go be with
3:12:45them okay I understand
3:12:47that
3:12:49okay but this all started off with the
3:12:53decisions that you made hey those guys
3:12:56didn't show up there to take your
3:12:58money okay we all know that they came
3:13:01there to do what they did to shoot your
3:13:05parents okay we know that okay and they
3:13:09didn't get there
3:13:10randomly okay they just didn't decide
3:13:12that we're going to show up here
3:13:14tonight and pick this house randomly
3:13:17okay this was set in
3:13:19motion before that night
3:13:22okay and I'm asking you to be
3:13:25responsible here in your answers
3:13:30Jen you couldn't stop at once it start I
3:13:33appreciate
3:13:35that
3:13:38okay
3:13:41right but what I'm going to say to you
3:13:44is that before it even happened is where
3:13:48you made your bad decision right you got
3:13:51those people to come to your
3:13:53host a plan that you put in
3:13:56motion
3:13:59okay so that's what we have to deal with
3:14:03here okay now do you want Justice or not
3:14:07for
3:14:08rum okay look at me then because I'm
3:14:12going to get it for you but we have to
3:14:14do it
3:14:15together okay
3:14:18tell
3:14:19me how this
3:14:23started because that's what you haven't
3:14:25told us Jen you left that part
3:14:29out okay that's the part I want to
3:14:32hear that's the part that's going to get
3:14:35us Justice
3:14:36here
3:14:38okay then we can work through the rest
3:14:40of it you can help us with the rest of
3:14:43it after
3:14:44that you want to help us
3:14:4810 yes
3:14:50okay I'm glad to hear you say
3:14:53that
3:14:55okay so you need to tell
3:14:57me how you made this
3:15:04plan
3:15:06okay that's all that's missing here the
3:15:09rest we know what happened I'm I don't
3:15:12need you to tell me what happened in
3:15:14that house I already
3:15:15know okay
3:15:18I'm not going to go through that
3:15:20again
3:15:22okay what happened that night was
3:15:25unfortunate okay that but what's
3:15:29happened after that to you it's
3:15:31destroyed you this whole
3:15:37thing
3:15:43right what are you going to do now Jen
3:15:47to make this
3:15:49right that's what you're faced
3:15:53with and you can help
3:16:03us you just have to be brave here you
3:16:07have to be
3:16:08brave you have to actually really want
3:16:11Justice for your mom okay then you're
3:16:13going to have to show me you can't just
3:16:16say the word you got to mean it
3:16:20okay now how did this get started
3:16:38Jen go ahead
3:17:00what did you do that you wish you didn't
3:17:02do
3:17:03now tell me
3:17:09that what things did you do that you
3:17:11wish you didn't do
3:17:38okay
3:17:40J what did you do you wish you didn't
3:17:44do that's going to help us here
3:18:15for
3:18:45e for
3:19:27okay you can tell
3:19:45me e
3:20:22sorry aren
3:20:34you supposed to take
3:20:37you
3:20:41why
3:20:44okay soos take the whole family out no
3:20:48just
3:20:49me what went wrong I don't
3:20:55know okay so tell me how that happened
3:21:01then
3:21:03okay it was supposed to be
3:21:06you is that right okay how was it
3:21:10supposed to happen
3:21:18it's
3:21:20okay what
3:21:23happened know why did it change I don't
3:21:27know okay what do you
3:21:30know how come it was supposed to be
3:21:35you CU I didn't want to be here anymore
3:21:38why not I was such a disappointment okay
3:21:42you made some mistakes but nothing that
3:21:44couldn't be corrected
3:21:47right
3:21:51H okay so how did this play out
3:22:01then how did it
3:22:05start what was the plan
3:22:13then yeah
3:22:16you have to help me here we need that
3:22:18Justice for Mom now right wasn't
3:22:20supposed to be mom is that what you're
3:22:22telling me yeah okay what about your Dad
3:22:27was supposed to be that was supposed to
3:22:29be me okay why was it supposed to be
3:22:34you everyone could be free from
3:22:39me
3:22:40okay so why did it happen this way then
3:22:44I don't know okay how did they get
3:22:48there I don't know you knew they were
3:22:51coming though
3:22:54right because you said it was supposed
3:22:56to be you right so what had you done
3:22:59ahead of time to make them come there
3:23:01what
3:23:03was what did you tell them to
3:23:10do then
3:23:16work this out okay let's work it out for
3:23:18a
3:23:29moment why was it supposed to be
3:23:33you everyone could be free from me I was
3:23:37the disappointment in everything okay
3:23:40but why did it have to happen this way
3:23:51yeah cuz when I tried suicide I
3:23:58failed come on
3:24:00my what did you
3:24:06do I couldn't do
3:24:09it
3:24:11okay so then how did we get to this
3:24:13point
3:24:18you told these guys to come and kill
3:24:26you J yeah okay so who did you
3:24:36tell what did you tell
3:24:40him what did you want
3:24:44done how
3:24:48matter
3:24:50okay so who did you get to do this
3:24:58then you have to tell me J I don't know
3:25:02who he is I just got his
3:25:05number okay and what's his number I
3:25:09don't memorize
3:25:11it where can we find
3:25:13it on the cell phone
3:25:17on the other cell on the Bell cell phone
3:25:20on the Bell cell phone yes where's that
3:25:23phone now I don't know what this
3:25:27C okay and how did you get a hold of
3:25:30this
3:25:34person and what did you say to
3:25:43him suppos to
3:25:46okay I appreciate that how did it happen
3:25:49how did they get
3:25:50there I don't know how they got there
3:25:54what was your
3:25:56request come
3:25:58in take me
3:26:02up how would they know who you were
3:26:19only
3:26:23girl and what did you discuss with this
3:26:38person I have
3:26:40money and to come take me up
3:26:45and how much was he going to charge for
3:26:47it
3:26:51then
3:26:56okay and that's what you gave
3:27:00him
3:27:01okay now the guy you spoke to on the
3:27:04phone's the guy that showed up and you
3:27:05gave the money to I don't know if it
3:27:07that was the same guy I've never met him
3:27:09before okay what was did he say his name
3:27:14was the
3:27:17homeboy okay
3:27:20home how did you get his number to make
3:27:23this call on the first
3:27:35place which
3:27:40one what's his name I
3:27:46that black guy the Rick guy that's
3:27:49Andrew's
3:27:50friend he set you up with this guy give
3:27:54the number so when you had those
3:27:57meetings what did you ask
3:27:59him what did you tell Rick you
3:28:03needed wanted to be shot or killed it
3:28:08didn't
3:28:09matter what did he
3:28:14say number
3:28:18okay so when did you make that
3:28:26call
3:28:30ago okay how did you what did you
3:28:33discuss
3:28:46just to make sure I had the money
3:28:49in okay
3:28:53and you had to tell him what you wanted
3:28:55though I told him that I wanted to be
3:28:58killed and did he think that was
3:29:00something
3:29:01crazy said are you sure that's what you
3:29:04want and I said yes cuz I don't think
3:29:06many people get that
3:29:08request do
3:29:10you no but that's what I wanted and he
3:29:13asked me over and over just to make sure
3:29:15I was sure and I said I sure okay so
3:29:18what did you ask him to do
3:29:21then come take me out in the
3:29:24me
3:29:28okay why did they do it when you
3:29:32were um when your parents were there
3:29:37then never
3:29:41alone
3:29:45okay so that meeting you had with Rick
3:29:48you told him what you wanted no I just
3:29:51said that I wanted if you knew anybody
3:29:53who could take care something that I
3:29:56needed that I wanted to be killed and he
3:29:59said what there's the
3:30:02number did he have the number with him
3:30:04that day yes okay and that was the first
3:30:09meeting second
3:30:13meeting okay what happened with the
3:30:15first meeting nothing we just got to
3:30:17know each
3:30:18other
3:30:20okay when you had the first meeting with
3:30:23them why did you have the first
3:30:25meeting like I said he was a roommate of
3:30:27a friend of mine and that they were
3:30:29having problems with
3:30:40rent okay so you phone them up and have
3:30:44another meeting is that the meeting that
3:30:47someone saw you
3:30:49at and who was it that saw you
3:30:53there I don't know my uncle told me that
3:30:56another person that saw me there was a
3:30:58black person okay and was that black
3:31:00person Rick I guess were you with any
3:31:04other black guy there no so you know him
3:31:07as Rick yep okay and you told him what
3:31:11that day
3:31:13then if he knew anybody said help me
3:31:16take care of a job but I wanted to be
3:31:19killed okay and he said what call this
3:31:23number okay did he write it down yes
3:31:26where's that number now I put I I put it
3:31:30into my phone and then I thre the paper
3:31:32out okay what was the number you put in
3:31:36your phone I don't memorize the number
3:31:38it was just on my
3:31:40phone was that uh what can you remember
3:31:43by that number though
3:31:46and a five in it what did it start
3:31:51with 46 or 64
3:31:53s don't I just remember the middle
3:31:56numbers had an eight in it and right
3:31:59about
3:32:00five like 85
3:32:03six just run eight because no one else I
3:32:06have had an eight okay and what phone is
3:32:10that number in then on the Bell line the
3:32:14same line
3:32:16okay you put it in your phone though
3:32:18which phone did you put it in I was on a
3:32:21SIM card on the iPhone okay but did you
3:32:25still have to put it in like a friends
3:32:27or a calendar or I just kept it and then
3:32:30text me just kept
3:32:32that okay so what's the text that you
3:32:35have
3:32:37what's he sent WhatsApp what did you
3:32:40send
3:32:42back that's
3:32:46okay then
3:32:48what said he called me once or twice
3:32:51just basically
3:32:53just want to need to know and that was
3:32:57it okay so when did you first talk to
3:33:00the
3:33:02guy don't remember anymore where did you
3:33:05meet him I never met
3:33:08him and what's his name what did he go
3:33:11by home homeboy
3:33:17did he have an
3:33:23accent what did he say he would do he
3:33:26just like want me take care of it let me
3:33:28do me so your specific request to him
3:33:31was
3:33:33what come make sure he killed me and
3:33:37what did he say he like okay let me do
3:33:40me let me do me what does that mean
3:33:46can let me do it my way
3:33:51okay isn't it odd that somebody would
3:33:53give her request like
3:33:55that to kill themselves he asked me and
3:33:59he's still going to charge you to do
3:34:04that okay so then what happened you said
3:34:07you talked a few other times about the
3:34:09other
3:34:13talks when
3:34:16I was just asking him when that was it
3:34:19okay so when
3:34:29then just like whenever I have
3:34:33time I can get
3:34:36people okay well you're not going to
3:34:38show up at your host randomly you're
3:34:39going to have to know exactly when he's
3:34:42coming so how did that play out
3:34:46he texted me game
3:34:47on Pardon he texted me game on when did
3:34:52you get that
3:35:01text don't remember the time sometime in
3:35:04the evening what day that
3:35:08day okay so before they came in you had
3:35:11a text that said game on yes okay and
3:35:14where did that come from
3:35:19pardon
3:35:21me where did he send it
3:35:28from
3:35:30Tex which was what that number I can't
3:35:34remember okay and what time did you get
3:35:36that game on Call I don't know
3:35:41time how many minutes before they came
3:35:44in
3:35:47okay let's get it out we're working
3:35:49through
3:35:51it how many minutes before I don't know
3:35:55I didn't even realize they were in
3:36:00it okay but they did come
3:36:04in
3:36:06right how much
3:36:08before you heard anything maybe an hour
3:36:12two
3:36:13hours so you were just waiting there for
3:36:152 hours I was watching
3:36:18TV okay so what time did you get the
3:36:20game on where were you when you saw that
3:36:22message
3:36:26first I was watching TV with Adrian okay
3:36:29so he was there did you tell him
3:36:33no who else knows about
3:36:40this Ken yeah who else knows about this
3:36:46me and the people who did
3:36:48it
3:36:51okay and who are they I don't know who
3:36:54they are he just said let me do me and
3:36:57then that was it okay so he does come
3:37:00into the
3:37:01house and you're the obvious only young
3:37:04girl there
3:37:06right
3:37:08okay when he came to her your
3:37:14room what discussions did you have with
3:37:16the guy that came to your room the real
3:37:18discussions you had not what you told us
3:37:20where was the money and I showed him
3:37:22where the money was
3:37:24okay but he obviously said I'm here to
3:37:27do what you asked he never said anything
3:37:30like that what did he
3:37:32say just like hands behind your
3:37:41back so the money you gave him was
3:37:43payment for killing you
3:37:46is that he wanted 2,000 yes when did he
3:37:50give you that figure of
3:37:522,000 in one of our phone
3:37:54conversations okay what's that in one of
3:37:57our phone conversations okay so in all
3:38:00the phone conversations you had when was
3:38:02the first one that you had what
3:38:06month Jen this doesn't happen every day
3:38:08that you ask somebody to kill you
3:38:10so I honestly I don't remember though
3:38:14okay I said you do remember you're going
3:38:16to have to remember when's the first
3:38:21time I really really don't
3:38:24remember okay
3:38:28September like from the first time you
3:38:30mentioned this to Rick when was that
3:38:33back in June
3:38:34right is that right something like that
3:38:37PO I mean spring summer sometime yeah
3:38:40how come it took so
3:38:42long cuz I didn't know you didn't know
3:38:46what I'm
3:38:48sure so when did you confirm 100% you
3:38:52wanted it
3:38:54done they accus me of doing something
3:38:56that I didn't do who okay which was
3:39:02what accus me Daniel I didn't okay so
3:39:06when was
3:39:12that end of August Maybe
3:39:15okay so you got in in contact with
3:39:18homeboy and said
3:39:20what I'd like you to come and I was a 24
3:39:24year old
3:39:28girl and he
3:39:30said okay I'll call you then
3:39:37what and then
3:39:45back and he's like are you sure he's
3:39:48like
3:39:49yes okay and then he's like okay then
3:39:52you just let me do me
3:39:55then he said let me do me yes which
3:39:59means what let let him do it his way
3:40:02okay did he discuss ways with you how he
3:40:04would do it no did you request any way
3:40:07for him to do it make sure no one else
3:40:10was
3:40:11around
3:40:13okay and
3:40:16did you tell them who lived in the house
3:40:19yes what did you tell them my can't
3:40:22house okay did you tell them where they
3:40:25are in the house no what rooms they're
3:40:27in
3:40:28no where they would
3:40:38be so when why didn't they do it the way
3:40:42you wanted I don't know I asked them I
3:40:45asked to take me with my mom when they
3:40:46took them
3:40:55away I realize that but it doesn't seem
3:40:59to make sense I know it doesn't make
3:41:01sense to me but that was supposed to be
3:41:15can you sit up for a minute
3:41:19Jen okay look at me look at
3:41:22me
3:41:24okay we have remember everything I told
3:41:27you about what I do for a
3:41:30living
3:41:32okay I'm an expert in determining truth
3:41:35and half truths okay what you've just
3:41:39told me is half the
3:41:41truth okay now what I do
3:41:46believe is that you went to
3:41:49somebody and I do believe that night you
3:41:52paid them the
3:41:54$2,000
3:41:56okay that's the true
3:41:59part
3:42:01okay
3:42:03right but what's not true is it was
3:42:06never for you okay Jen no okay you went
3:42:11to this person and you asked them to do
3:42:14a job
3:42:15and the job was for your parents okay
3:42:18that's what we got to get to here okay I
3:42:21know that's what really happened Jen
3:42:24okay that's what really happened okay so
3:42:27you've done good
3:42:29here you're telling me half the truth
3:42:31I'm going to get the other half out here
3:42:34okay that's the part that you need to
3:42:37get to
3:42:39now okay maybe you were supposed to be
3:42:42part of it but you definitely want your
3:42:45parents out of the picture Okay that was
3:42:48for sure okay so sit up and listen to me
3:42:51for a minute because this is important
3:42:53okay now
3:42:56listen because of how you've been
3:42:57treated for the last seven eight years
3:43:00of your
3:43:01life you no longer know how to tell the
3:43:04whole story the truth from the start
3:43:07okay you've been conditioned just to
3:43:09tell little bits of the truth and little
3:43:13bits about lies right right that's what
3:43:16you've done for eight years now that's
3:43:18how you've lived it's an instinct now
3:43:22okay and that's part of your
3:43:23self-preservation that I talked about
3:43:25earlier okay and right now that's where
3:43:28we're at
3:43:30okay that's where we're at you did ask
3:43:34someone to come to the house Jen but it
3:43:36wasn't for you
3:43:39okay
3:43:40pardon it was supposed to be you asked
3:43:44them
3:43:46to do this job on your parents Jen okay
3:43:51let's be
3:43:52truthful okay nobody's going to come
3:43:55there and get the wrong
3:43:57people okay they're not going to tie you
3:44:00up and just kill your parents okay
3:44:04that's not going to happen that's not
3:44:06realistic okay that never
3:44:09happened okay they were there because
3:44:12you planned
3:44:13this they were there
3:44:15because you gave the order okay and I
3:44:18understand why you gave the order
3:44:19because you couldn't do it
3:44:21yourself okay that's good okay Jen
3:44:25supposed to take me okay but they were
3:44:28supposed to take your parents Jen and
3:44:31they did that
3:44:33part
3:44:35okay nobody needs if you wanted to kill
3:44:38yourself Jen you're not going to pay
3:44:40somebody $2,000 to do it I couldn't do
3:44:42it myself but there's other ways okay
3:44:47and if that was going to happen they
3:44:49could have taken you outside and done it
3:44:52anywhere it wouldn't matter would it
3:44:55okay there's no need to involve other
3:44:56people in this if you really wanted to
3:44:59die all they would had to do is pull up
3:45:02beside you in a car and shoot you
3:45:06right he told me just to let him do okay
3:45:09but you're not going to accept that okay
3:45:12you're not going to accept that he's
3:45:14just going to ran romly do it someday
3:45:16okay there's other things that happened
3:45:18on in this case Jen okay you let them in
3:45:21the
3:45:22house you let them in we know
3:45:25that you went downstairs and you open
3:45:28that door for
3:45:29them we know
3:45:32that
3:45:35Jen you did leave the door open for them
3:45:37didn't
3:45:38you paron yes yes and that's why you
3:45:42went downstairs earlier in the night
3:45:44right
3:45:46after your mom got home what did you
3:45:48do went down and said
3:45:51hello pretended to check the
3:45:55door and was it locked
3:45:58no you made sure it was unlocked
3:46:02yes okay then
3:46:06what went a bed to me she said I don't
3:46:13know okay okay so again we have some
3:46:16truth here that's good Jen we know all
3:46:20the along that you let them in okay we
3:46:23knew that I knew why you went downstairs
3:46:27okay that was done on purpose right you
3:46:30had to let them in
3:46:33right
3:46:35Jen okay now did they tell you to do
3:46:38that yes so what else did they tell you
3:46:40to do that was it just to make sure that
3:46:43they had access
3:46:45okay so what was the agreement
3:46:51then well I told you $2,000 and they
3:46:54were supposed to kill me and then they
3:46:55called me and made sure that they they
3:46:57had access okay so how did they do that
3:46:59though what was the question on the
3:47:02phone was it a text or a phone message
3:47:05text VIP access what does that mean I
3:47:08didn't know and then he said just make
3:47:10sure they can get in okay so you saw a
3:47:12message that said VIP access meaning
3:47:15they could get in okay and so what did
3:47:17you text back I didn't text them back I
3:47:20called them okay and what did you say
3:47:23I'm like what does that mean okay and
3:47:25what did they say make sure that there
3:47:26was a way in okay and what did you say
3:47:30would be the best way I didn't say I was
3:47:32just like front door and he was like yes
3:47:35okay all right
3:47:41so that's good Jen I appreciate that
3:47:44because
3:49:14make sure of the way in okay and you
3:49:17said front doors okay and
3:49:21then I went down to the front doors okay
3:49:24and what did you do made sure if they
3:49:27were locked yet and they weren't okay so
3:49:29how could you
3:49:32tell okay so you checked the what did
3:49:35you check the lock okay and did you kind
3:49:38of turn it and turn it back or how I
3:49:41don't
3:49:43remember when you left that door you
3:49:45were satisfied that it was open
3:49:47yeah okay
3:49:51then what
3:49:55happened then everything else I said
3:49:58happened I went back to my room I called
3:49:59Ed I didn't even know when they came
3:50:02in okay but you they came up to your
3:50:07room or somebody came up here well like
3:50:09I said I heard my mom call from my dad
3:50:11and that's when I went out yeah and what
3:50:17happen and then he was there standing
3:50:19there okay give me one sec
3:50:43okay
3:51:13for for
3:51:52[Music]
3:51:57okay Jen sorry about that
3:52:02okay so we get to the
3:52:06point
3:52:08where
3:52:10um you get the text
3:52:12message uh you go down around you do the
3:52:16door you go back upstairs and what do
3:52:18you do call
3:52:20head okay why do you call
3:52:22him what I usually do
3:52:26okay what were you expecting to happen
3:52:31next I honestly I don't
3:52:34know because he didn't tell me anything
3:52:37he just said let me do me I didn't know
3:52:38how he didn't do anything okay what else
3:52:40did he say on the phone like how like he
3:52:43must have told you we're around the
3:52:44corer or something
3:52:46no did he tell you how long no okay but
3:52:51it was on for that night he had game on
3:52:52on the text yes okay what did you do
3:52:55with those text
3:52:58[Music]
3:53:00messages okay and the phone that you
3:53:02were using were you using two phones
3:53:04that night yeah okay you have to sit up
3:53:07because I can't hear you here you were
3:53:09using two phones okay so the phone you
3:53:12were talking to with Andrew on was what
3:53:15phone and the one you were talking to
3:53:17them on was what the iPhone the iPhone
3:53:21okay and
3:53:22[Music]
3:53:24then uh did you ever talk to them on the
3:53:27Samsung no okay
3:53:31now
3:53:33um what
3:53:37next everything else that happened next
3:53:40we
3:53:41inste okay
3:53:43now look at me
3:53:46Jen you're almost there
3:53:50okay most of what happened in the house
3:53:53happened okay we know that
3:53:55okay you gave a description of a black
3:53:58guy with dreads there was no black guy
3:54:00with dreads in there okay we know that
3:54:03okay we know that because your dad's not
3:54:05going to miss that okay he gave a good
3:54:08description of the guy that you were
3:54:09with and he's not even black so tell me
3:54:11about
3:54:12that Hest honestly Jen that's exactly
3:54:16you got to be up front here okay because
3:54:19obviously you didn't want to tell us
3:54:20everything because there was a plan he
3:54:22didn't tell us that that night either
3:54:25okay so everything else that happened
3:54:27after that is that guy with dreadlocks
3:54:29was never there okay so why did you say
3:54:32that but that's what I remember okay you
3:54:35can't mix that guy up with the
3:54:37description your dad gave he's not even
3:54:38the same
3:54:40color right but that's tell me why you
3:54:44said guy with dreadlocks because that's
3:54:46who I because there was no guy with
3:54:47dreadlocks there
3:54:49Jen that's the problem here
3:54:54okay that's the problem okay now the
3:54:58issue here is this and you have to look
3:55:00at
3:55:00me okay your dad wasn't supposed to be a
3:55:04witness okay that's where this whole
3:55:07thing went wrong okay your dad wasn't
3:55:10supposed to live okay and when he did
3:55:13live he was was able to tell us what
3:55:15really happened that night okay which
3:55:18was in conflict with what you told us
3:55:22okay seriously in Conflict okay you had
3:55:25all these things about number two going
3:55:27upstairs and everything else number two
3:55:29was down there with a gun on your mom
3:55:31number three was down he didn't okay we
3:55:33know that never happened okay I don't
3:55:35want to argue about it okay I'm not
3:55:37going to argue about it but I've already
3:55:38gone this far you've gone this far but
3:55:40that doesn't mean okay what now let's
3:55:43get it all straight because you this is
3:55:45a total half and half we're we're there
3:55:49again just like the school just like
3:55:51everything else this is how you deal
3:55:55with pressure okay you give half and you
3:55:58hold half you give half and you don't
3:56:02give the rest of the true facts okay
3:56:04that's your stress mechanism okay that's
3:56:07what you've been trained to do since you
3:56:09were 15 years old okay because your
3:56:12parents could never accept the
3:56:15truth that's why this whole thing
3:56:17happened okay no matter how honest you
3:56:19try to be with them okay they didn't
3:56:22they always wanted more it was never
3:56:24good enough it was never good enough
3:56:26that you were a good kid okay and that
3:56:29you loved figure skating and piano and
3:56:31if that's all you ever did that's good
3:56:32enough but it wasn't good enough for
3:56:35them right
3:56:39again so what happened here I'll tell
3:56:41you what happened
3:56:44you made a specific
3:56:47request and the job was for your mom and
3:56:50dad okay nobody's going to come in there
3:56:53and do the wrong job okay nobody's going
3:56:56to do
3:56:58that they came you paid and they did
3:57:02what they were supposed to do okay if it
3:57:06was supposed to be for you you would
3:57:08have said that to them okay you never
3:57:12did okay this was always for two people
3:57:17okay this was for about Mom and Dad
3:57:20because they had taken things too far in
3:57:22your life Jen
3:57:24okay that's what it's all about and you
3:57:27and I have to get that out right now
3:57:30okay so sit up for a minute let's get
3:57:33this final piece out okay cuz that's the
3:57:35only mistake you made in this whole
3:57:38thing you got fed up and you went out
3:57:41and did something about it okay okay
3:57:44this was all about
3:57:47self-preservation you had no choices
3:57:49this was the only choice you felt you
3:57:51had left Jen I know that's why you feel
3:57:55so bad about this okay is because okay
3:58:00no Jen you have to be honest with me
3:58:03here I am being honest with you Jen okay
3:58:06it's all going to come out okay and the
3:58:09last thing that you want to happen later
3:58:12okay is for people do say that she
3:58:15didn't tell the whole truth okay this is
3:58:17your one chance what I do remember okay
3:58:20but you made a request Jen and this was
3:58:23a planned request okay and the
3:58:26plan was for your parents okay Jen you
3:58:30have to be honest about it this is the
3:58:32only thing that's in contention here
3:58:34okay you made the mistake okay everybody
3:58:37understands everybody in this Police
3:58:40Department feels sorry for you I can
3:58:41tell you that right now okay because
3:58:44they've seen what you're going through
3:58:45it's so obvious okay that all this
3:58:49tension they put out basically this is
3:58:51like a volcano all right and at one
3:58:55point it was just too much and you
3:58:57erupted okay and you made a bad decision
3:59:00okay and once you hired this guy there
3:59:03was no turning
3:59:06back it was supposed to be yourself Jen
3:59:10no it would not happen that way okay it
3:59:14would not happen that way now in the
3:59:17original story you said that you hid
3:59:19your cell phone okay if it was for you
3:59:23you wouldn't have hid your cell phone
3:59:25that would have never
3:59:27happened so it's in Conflict not hitting
3:59:30it's just I I put it there naturally
3:59:33what I naturally did okay but you said
3:59:36on tape that you hit it there and that
3:59:39they didn't know about
3:59:41it that's your language not mine Jen
3:59:45which tells me that you intended to use
3:59:48it sometime to get out of there as a
3:59:51rescue
3:59:52mm okay
3:59:57so I already know that you planned this
4:00:00Jen and it wasn't for
4:00:02yourself we know that Jen you know that
4:00:07I know you don't feel good about it and
4:00:09I know you've thought many times that
4:00:11you would not like to be here okay okay
4:00:15but who caused that why did you feel
4:00:17like that okay I'll tell you why it's
4:00:21because the way you've been treated all
4:00:23these
4:00:24years you didn't bring that on yourself
4:00:27they brought it on
4:00:29you the depression you were cutting
4:00:31yourself and they didn't even pick up on
4:00:34it all they wanted was so much success
4:00:37out of you they were not even looking at
4:00:40you as a
4:00:41person they were looking for a success
4:00:43story
4:00:45instead of just
4:00:47saying whatever Jen wants is what's good
4:00:49for
4:00:52us whatever she's happy with as long as
4:00:56she's happy in her life I'm happy with
4:00:58it if she wants to work at East Side
4:01:00Marios for the rest of her life that's
4:01:03fine if she wants to be a piano teacher
4:01:06that's
4:01:08great if she wants to continue figure
4:01:10grading that's wonderful
4:01:16do you know what I'm saying Jen I know
4:01:19what you're saying but this is what I
4:01:20know and I okay so the only thing that
4:01:23you haven't told me is that you put the
4:01:27plan in motion for your parents okay and
4:01:34now you would wish you never did and
4:01:37that's good okay it's good that you feel
4:01:40sorry about it because you do if you
4:01:44could go back you wouldn't have gave
4:01:45that plan to them would you I knew what
4:01:48they were going to do I would okay Chen
4:01:50look at me you knew what they were going
4:01:52to do okay listen let's be rational here
4:01:55for a minute
4:01:57okay nobody makes a plan to have
4:02:00themselves killed in that fashion
4:02:03okay nobody shows up at your house for
4:02:06no reason and kills the wrong
4:02:09people
4:02:12okay that's where we at here
4:02:16okay that's what you're afraid you're
4:02:18afraid to say that you made that mistake
4:02:21don't be afraid Jen just tell the truth
4:02:23okay because we're getting into what's
4:02:25happened to you all your life
4:02:27okay I know exactly when and when you're
4:02:31not telling me exactly what happened
4:02:34okay you got to give us some credit here
4:02:38this is all that I do
4:02:40okay and you're halfway to tell telling
4:02:44the whole truth okay this is another
4:02:46case of making something up in hopes
4:02:49that somebody will listen and accept it
4:02:53okay I can accept it okay you know that
4:02:56and I know
4:02:59that
4:03:01right I can't accept that when I know
4:03:03it's not true and I don't like to see
4:03:05you doing this to
4:03:08yourself you're just beating yourself up
4:03:10some more
4:03:11here okay
4:03:14Jen because I'm telling it to you but
4:03:17you say that it's contradicting and I
4:03:19don't understand why it doesn't make
4:03:21sense okay that someone if they if you
4:03:24wanted yourself killed okay they
4:03:26wouldn't do it in your house okay
4:03:28there's no reason to hide anything okay
4:03:31someone can just walk up to you and
4:03:33shoot you somewhere where you're by
4:03:34yourself and nobody knows about it and
4:03:37they walk away but I'm never by
4:03:40myself okay at any time you can go well
4:03:44you were by yourself all day but they
4:03:47said they they can't do it in the
4:03:50daytime
4:03:54okay so you could walk out the front
4:03:56door and they could have shot you there
4:03:57and ran
4:04:00away like they didn't have to involve
4:04:02other people and that's why it doesn't
4:04:04make
4:04:06sense you could have walked out on the
4:04:08front porch and that have been the end
4:04:10of it I'm not supposed to leave the
4:04:12house okay but
4:04:14you've done it before
4:04:19right
4:04:21right since you started watching me okay
4:04:24but that night you could have walked out
4:04:25that front door and no one know the
4:04:28difference for two
4:04:30seconds my mother would know she was
4:04:32right right there okay but they could
4:04:33have came and done it
4:04:37okay but they didn't tell me how they
4:04:39were going to do it okay
4:04:43why would somebody shoot someone they
4:04:46didn't have to shoot I don't know I
4:04:47can't figure that out and actually not
4:04:49shoot the person they're supposed to
4:04:51shoot I don't know that's what I'm
4:04:52trying to figure out okay why didn't you
4:04:54tell us this that night
4:04:57then cuz I was
4:04:59scared scared of what telling the truth
4:05:03yes said I wanted to
4:05:05die okay listen if you wanted to die you
4:05:09would tell us everything because it
4:05:10wouldn't
4:05:12matter Jen
4:05:14if you really wanted to die you would
4:05:16tell us everything because it doesn't
4:05:17really matter right it does matter
4:05:20because the wrong person are hurt and my
4:05:23dad is
4:05:27suffering I appreciate that's what
4:05:29happened in the end but that's what was
4:05:32supposed to happen Okay the good thing
4:05:34about this is your dad did
4:05:37live okay he did
4:05:41live and that went against the plan
4:05:45okay he wasn't supposed to make it
4:05:46through and he did so that's a good
4:05:49thing right that's a positive in this
4:05:54situation
4:05:56right Jen my dad's hurt how can that be
4:05:59a POS okay but he's not dead is he no
4:06:02okay and this thing started out with him
4:06:05supposed to be dead okay again there's
4:06:08just no doubt about that okay there's no
4:06:11doubt about
4:06:12that okay okay and you got to remember
4:06:15we're all over this case
4:06:18okay and when you say something that's
4:06:21going to contct what other people tell
4:06:23us
4:06:25okay that the order was for Mom and Dad
4:06:28that's not going to look good is it when
4:06:30it comes from someone
4:06:33else
4:06:37right because we're going to solve this
4:06:39thing okay we already know what happened
4:06:43so I'm not in here guessing with
4:06:46you I already know what the order was
4:06:48from from
4:06:50you okay and I have to sit here with you
4:06:56and let you get that off your
4:06:58chest okay I know it's not easy and
4:07:03that's what's you're woring order was
4:07:05from me but it was foring no it was for
4:07:07your parents Jen okay and that's hard to
4:07:09say I know that I know that's hard to
4:07:13say
4:07:14okay because that's not if you could
4:07:16make this decision over you would change
4:07:19it okay you would change
4:07:22it right of course if I knew who was
4:07:26going to get hurt of course I wouldn't
4:07:28Jen you knew who was going to get hurt
4:07:30that's the whole issue here okay that's
4:07:33the whole issue here that's all we're
4:07:35dealing with here okay from the start
4:07:38I've told you that I know you were
4:07:40involved okay and it's beyond asking
4:07:43someone to kill
4:07:44you okay the order was for Mom and Dad
4:07:51okay the only mistake they made is they
4:07:54didn't get your dad okay yes they hurt
4:07:57him okay yes he's injured but he's alive
4:08:01and that's a good
4:08:04thing and as I told you earlier this
4:08:06happens to 300 families a
4:08:09year 300
4:08:13and it's always because of the same
4:08:15thing
4:08:16Jen the people reach the end of their
4:08:20rope it's the last
4:08:22straw and they make a
4:08:25mistake and I agree once you put those
4:08:28Wheels in
4:08:30Motion you
4:08:33know it's hard to stop
4:08:36it it's very hard to stop it
4:08:43so let's get down to the bottom of this
4:08:46Jen you got to help me through the rest
4:08:49of
4:08:50this
4:08:53okay
4:08:55now the only thing that's an issue here
4:09:02today is that you gave a request to
4:09:06these people for your parents and They
4:09:09carried it out okay you didn't do it
4:09:11that's a good thing okay you didn't
4:09:13shoot
4:09:13them you didn't hurt
4:09:16them your mistake was making a
4:09:20request
4:09:22right that's where you and I are at
4:09:24right now okay that's the only issue we
4:09:27need to talk
4:09:28about okay I'm not going to get into
4:09:30everything else because it's not even
4:09:33important
4:09:38okay but we need to see Justice done
4:09:41here and we need to do that together
4:09:43again
4:09:45okay and there's only one face to
4:09:48Justice okay that's the face of
4:09:52truth right now we only have half that
4:09:55face okay I need to see the rest of it
4:09:59okay we're only halfway there okay you
4:10:02made the mistake of asking them to do it
4:10:05okay you asked them to do your parents
4:10:08that's it's as simple as that Jen okay
4:10:12and they did or they tried
4:10:14to
4:10:18okay but you're sorry that this happened
4:10:21right okay that's what the whole key is
4:10:24here everyone wants to know is is she
4:10:27sorry because everyone knows that you
4:10:29did it okay but they want to know is
4:10:33given a chance and turning back the
4:10:35clock to that day would you do it
4:10:38again no right this was a onetime
4:10:42mistake right
4:10:45Jen
4:10:47okay you gave them the plan for your
4:10:51parents
4:10:52right that's all I need to hear no Jen
4:10:56you did no and this is not going to go
4:10:58anywhere because I wanted them to kill
4:11:01me okay maybe you wanted that to happen
4:11:04as well okay and maybe things got so bad
4:11:07that that's how you feel okay but your
4:11:11parents were brought into this okay on
4:11:14your request yes Jen this was your
4:11:18request okay and that's what we have to
4:11:20deal with okay and that's what you're
4:11:22afraid of here today that's what you're
4:11:25afraid of no one's thinking bad of you
4:11:27here everybody understands what you went
4:11:30through okay and what you are going
4:11:32through okay but what people are looking
4:11:34for from this young woman today you know
4:11:36what they're looking for
4:11:39can to know that you actually are sorry
4:11:43okay okay that you're sorry that you
4:11:44made the request for your parents okay
4:11:47it wasn't for you we're past that okay I
4:11:49don't want to talk about that okay the
4:11:52request was for your parents and your
4:11:54parents only that's it okay that's what
4:11:58you put in motion that's what happened
4:12:01okay we know that okay at the end of the
4:12:05day you have to look at yourself and say
4:12:08when bill came to me with the answer did
4:12:12I deal with
4:12:13it okay because that's where people are
4:12:16going to be looking at you now from
4:12:18they're going to be saying what did she
4:12:20do when the police knew and confronted
4:12:22her with the
4:12:24truth did she face reality and admit the
4:12:27truth or did she run from
4:12:31it does she even care what happened of
4:12:34course what happened okay so you have to
4:12:36prove that now Jen because the only way
4:12:38you can prove it that you really care is
4:12:41that you admit that you made a mistake I
4:12:43did make a mistake but okay we have to
4:12:46get that on the table though and it's
4:12:48not about you okay it's about them it's
4:12:50that simple okay it's not complicated
4:12:53okay is that what you want me to say but
4:12:55that's not how what happened tell me
4:12:56what happened you want me to tell I want
4:12:59you to tell me that you made the plan
4:13:01for your parents okay we're going to get
4:13:03to the rest of it anyways okay we
4:13:06already like I'm in here
4:13:09okay there's 20 other investigators on
4:13:12this case I'm only dealing with the
4:13:14truth as it regards to you okay there's
4:13:17a lot more things that you don't even
4:13:18know that I know that's why as you're
4:13:21not going to be able to tell me things
4:13:23okay that I don't know already okay so I
4:13:26will know when you're telling me the
4:13:28full truth I already know you made the
4:13:29plan so I can't just say okay yeah don't
4:13:32worry about it you made the plan for
4:13:34yourself but I know that's not true okay
4:13:37you got to know that I already have the
4:13:38answers okay or we wouldn't be sitting
4:13:40here okay so I do need you to tell me
4:13:44that you made the plan for your parents
4:13:46okay because that's what really happened
4:13:48Jen okay I'm not asking you to lie to me
4:13:50I'm just asking you to tell me that you
4:13:53made the plan for your parents that's
4:13:56where we're sitting here right now
4:13:57trying to deal with okay that's a big
4:14:01hurt for you okay because I know that
4:14:04you still have love it's like a LoveHate
4:14:06Thing and that's what happens in
4:14:08people's lives okay you love them to
4:14:10death but you can't live with them you
4:14:12can't live with the situation anymore
4:14:15okay that can happen in life it happens
4:14:18all the time okay and essentially you
4:14:21got forced into a corner here okay you
4:14:23didn't have any other
4:14:26choices 24 years old Jen and you're not
4:14:30allowed to make your own decisions a
4:14:33prisoner in your own house 9:00
4:14:40curfew again I'm just surprised never
4:14:43happened before
4:14:45this everybody's going to understand
4:14:48that
4:14:49Jen but why they're going to understand
4:14:51it you know why they're going to
4:14:53understand it because that's the truth
4:14:56what people don't understand is when
4:14:58people tell half truths they recognize
4:15:00it right away they recognize it that's
4:15:03not what really
4:15:04happened okay that's not what really
4:15:06happened okay you've spent a lifetime
4:15:10trying to get around people and all that
4:15:13has ever done is hurt you more
4:15:16Jen you missed out on an education
4:15:20because you tried to fake it
4:15:23okay you missed out on things that made
4:15:26you want to kill
4:15:28yourself and you realize that and it
4:15:31reached a low point to the point where
4:15:34if you don't care about yourself you
4:15:35can't care about other
4:15:37people you know what I mean you can't
4:15:39care for other people if you can't love
4:15:41yourself
4:15:43and that's where this got to
4:15:46Jen and I don't blame you but we need to
4:15:50understand this together
4:15:52right we need to have a resolution
4:15:57here
4:16:04okay
4:16:06stuck
4:16:10okay can we understand each other Jen
4:16:14okay you've told so much of the truth
4:16:16you're just not telling the final
4:16:18portion this isn't even half truths
4:16:20anymore this is three quarters okay the
4:16:23only thing missing is a quarter of the
4:16:25truth okay the rest is true okay we know
4:16:30that okay we know you got the
4:16:34text we know that you gave the
4:16:36goahead okay but the go-ahead wasn't for
4:16:40yourself that's what's that issue here
4:16:44we're going to sit down here and work
4:16:46through this together okay we're going
4:16:48to work this
4:16:51out we're going to get the full truth
4:16:54because you know what the full truth is
4:16:57only
4:16:59100% not 75% not 90 not
4:17:0499 100% everything that really happen
4:17:07that
4:17:08night okay
4:17:11Jen all right
4:17:14let's do it together okay you did and I
4:17:16don't understand why it doesn't add up
4:17:18why it doesn't add up is because that's
4:17:20not what happened
4:17:24okay the truth will add
4:17:27up half truths don't add up that's all
4:17:30they ever are is half
4:17:39truths now we have to understand each
4:17:41other Jen all I need to
4:19:12for
4:20:41e e
4:21:27[Music]
4:21:27[Laughter]
4:21:36okay I need you to listen close to me
4:21:38okay
4:21:40Jen at this point in the investigation
4:21:44okay I'm going to be arresting you for
4:21:47murder okay also attempted murder and
4:21:52conspiracy to commit murder do you
4:21:54understand
4:21:57that just have to tell me if you
4:21:59understand those charges just say yes or
4:22:01no yes okay it is my duty to inform you
4:22:07that you have the right to retain and
4:22:08instruct Council without delay do you
4:22:11understand that
4:22:13and what does that mean to
4:22:17you yes
4:22:19okay you also have the right to
4:22:21telephone any lawyer your wish do you
4:22:24understand
4:22:25that
4:22:27yes you also have the right to free
4:22:29advice from a legal aid
4:22:31lawyer do you understand
4:22:34that 1 800 2650 0451 is a toll-free
4:22:39number you have to listen here so can
4:22:41you take your hands off your ears I need
4:22:44you to listen there a toll-free number
4:22:46that will put you in contact with a
4:22:49legal aid lawyer for free legal advice
4:22:53do you understand that so you can speak
4:22:56to a legal aid lawyer right now or a a
4:22:59lawyer of your choice if you like do you
4:23:02understand that do you wish to call a
4:23:05lawyer
4:23:08now
4:23:10yes okay you have a lawyer that you know
4:23:15of to speak to Okay what I'm going to do
4:23:18is read you some other things and then
4:23:20we're going to deal with your lawyer
4:23:24okay we'll we'll deal with how we're
4:23:26going to get that
4:23:29so you may be charged with murder
4:23:33attempted murder and conspiracy to
4:23:36commit murder in relation to your mother
4:23:40and father those are where those charges
4:23:43stem from do you understand
4:23:45that this yes or
4:23:48no yes okay do you wish to say anything
4:23:52in answer to those
4:23:54charges you're not obliged to say
4:23:56anything unless you wish to do so but
4:23:59whatever you do say may be given in
4:24:01evidence do you understand
4:24:03that yes you have to speak a little
4:24:06louder
4:24:08okay again I've already given this to
4:24:11you but I'm going to read it
4:24:13if you have spoken to any other police
4:24:15officer anyone with authority or if any
4:24:18such person has spoken to you in
4:24:20connection with this place I want it
4:24:22clearly understood that I do not want it
4:24:24to influence you in making any statement
4:24:26do you
4:24:28understand
4:24:30Jen you just have to speak a little
4:24:32louder
4:24:35yes okay so what we're going to do right
4:24:37now is do you have your own lawyer no no
4:24:42okay do you have a lawyer you would like
4:24:45to speak to that you know of
4:24:48no okay would you like to speak to duty
4:24:56counsil I just want to talk to someone
4:24:58who can help me and
4:25:00understand okay so who would that be I
4:25:02don't
4:25:05know so do you have a lawyer you said
4:25:09that you were on my side okay I am on
4:25:11your side Jen
4:25:12okay I know what happened here
4:25:17okay I'm on the side of Truth okay I
4:25:21want that to come out here but at this
4:25:23point you need to deal with a lawyer you
4:25:25said
4:25:27okay I have to honor that request so
4:25:30what we need to do now before we discuss
4:25:32anything else
4:25:36okay is deal with that issue okay so we
4:25:40have options okay
4:25:43you can do you know anyone you could to
4:25:47a lawyer yourself no um I can bring a
4:25:51form book in here with numerous lawyers
4:25:54and you can look at
4:25:55that if you like and pick a
4:25:59lawyer or we can call duty counsel they
4:26:03will call back we'll put you in a
4:26:05private room and you can speak to them
4:26:07in
4:26:08private okay but the decision is yours
4:26:15what would you like to
4:26:20do I don't have I don't have any idea
4:26:23what to do
4:26:25okay you do want to speak to a lawyer
4:26:27though you
4:26:29said that's your
4:26:31decision so I have to accommodate that
4:26:35now okay so that's what I want to do for
4:26:37you I want to accommodate that if that's
4:26:39what you want to do
4:28:34okay so in your pockets you had a couple
4:28:36pads you have one in your jeine pocket
4:28:38or with you and you had two $1 in cash
4:28:43is that correct did you have any more
4:28:45money no okay and then you have this
4:28:47change here is that correct anything
4:28:51else okay and your cell phone which I
4:28:54have here okay so in change I have 25 35
4:28:5945 55 65
4:29:0275 85
4:29:0595
4:29:08$1
4:29:10and7 so
4:29:12$100
4:29:14$117 okay we'll put that in a bag for
4:29:17you okay need 200 sorry 200 you're right
4:29:24so
4:29:26$217 two $100 bills right okay that will
4:29:30be kept with some property for you when
4:29:32to come back in
4:29:35okay I'm going to make sure that they're
4:29:37making a call to duty counsel and we'll
4:29:39line that up and you can speak to duty
4:29:41Council private
4:29:43okay all right you have any uh jewelry
4:29:46around your neck at all okay all right
4:29:50hold tight while we do that
4:30:10okay
4:30:40for
4:31:10for
4:31:40for
4:32:10e
4:32:40e
4:33:10e
4:33:40for
4:34:10e
4:34:40e
4:35:10for
4:35:40for
4:36:10e
4:36:40e
4:37:10e
4:37:40for
4:38:10for
4:38:40e
4:39:10e
4:39:40e e
4:40:14we've uh made a call to duty Council and
4:40:16we're just waiting for them to call back
4:40:19okay I need to drink of water or
4:40:22anything what's
4:40:24that uh I do have to uh go and speak to
4:40:27these officers but I'll come back and
4:40:28speak to you okay but we got to get we
4:40:31got to take care of the lawyers okay
4:40:34that's the priority right now okay

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