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Jarrett Adams 8.5.2016 — Transcript

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0:05production and distribution of City Club
0:07Forums on IDE stream are made possible
0:09by the generous support of PNC and the
0:12Rasin family fund with additional
0:14funding from Cleveland State University
0:17Robert Conrad and the pain
0:21[Music]
0:28fund
0:30[Music]
0:31[Applause]
0:33[Music]
0:41good afternoon and welcome to the City
0:44Club of Cleveland I'm Michael mudy a
0:47partner at Baker and Hostetler and it's
0:49my pleasure to introduce you to today's
0:52speaker Jared Adams in addition to my
0:55day job I serve as a president of the
0:58Northeast Ohio ch chapter of the
1:00American Constitution
1:02Society ACS is a nationwide network of
1:06progressive lawyers judges students and
1:10professors all dedicated to the promise
1:13of our Constitution and to the values
1:15that it embodies civil rights and
1:18Liberties genuine democracy and access
1:22to
1:23Justice over the past few years our
1:26chapter has hosted various programs on
1:29barriers to Justice generally and the
1:32problem of wrongful convictions
1:35specifically for example we heard from
1:38Ohio attorney general Jim petro and his
1:41wife Nancy about the myths of our
1:43criminal justice system and how they
1:45produce wrongful convictions and to be
1:48clear Jim and Nancy are both Republicans
1:51which shows that this issue is not a
1:53part is
1:54in last year we heard from Ricky Jackson
1:58a Clevelander who spent 39 years of his
2:01life Behind Bars several of which on
2:04death row for a crime that he did not
2:07commit and at last year's ACS convention
2:10in Washington DC I was fortunate enough
2:13to meet Jared Adams who has an
2:15experience in common with Ricky
2:18Jackson Mr Adams was 17 years old when
2:22he was sentenced to 28 years in a
2:24Maximum Security Prison after being
2:26convicted of sexual assault after
2:29serving nearly 10 years and filing
2:32multiple appeals he was exonerated with
2:34the help of the Wisconsin Innocence
2:37Project rather than be overcome by
2:40bitterness Mr Adams used the Injustice
2:43that he had endured as an inspiration to
2:46become an advocate for the underserved
2:49he enrolled in the loyal lyola
2:51University Chicago School of Law after
2:53graduating from Roosevelt University
2:56with high honors in May 2015 Mr Adams
3:00graduated from law school and started a
3:02public interest fellowship with
3:04honorable an Clare Williams a judge on
3:07the seventh circuit US court of appeals
3:10the same court that had reversed Jared's
3:13conviction because of his trial lawyers
3:15constitutional
3:16deficiencies shortly thereafter Mr Adams
3:20along with fellow life after innocence
3:22exer antoan Day established the life
3:25after Justice Center which serves as
3:29quote an advocate for the rights of the
3:32wrongfully convicted by seeking Health
3:34Care housing job training computer
3:38skills Finance classes mentoring and
3:42more end
3:44quote this past year Mr Adams passed to
3:47New York State Bar and just last month
3:50he joined the New York Innocence Project
3:53as one of its attorneys serving our
3:55profession and our society by freeing
3:58wrongfully convicted men and
4:00women since 1989 innocence projects
4:04across the country have exonerated 342
4:07wrongfully convicted inmates in 37
4:10States 70% of whom have been people of
4:14color while his accomplishments can be
4:17considered extraordinary part of Mr
4:20Adam's story is not unique according to
4:22a 2014 study published in the journal
4:27pnas more than 4% of those was sentenced
4:30to death between 1973 and 2004 are
4:34likely innocent and men of color are
4:37disproportionately represented in that
4:39figure it begs various questions how do
4:43we combat racism in the criminal justice
4:45system to ensure that suspects are
4:47treated as truly innocent until proven
4:50guilty what role can attorneys play in
4:53creating a justice system that is truly
4:56fair for all the conversation on race
5:00equality in America's criminal justice
5:02system is an ongoing One Nationwide and
5:05here at the City Club and we're so glad
5:08to add Mr Adams voice to the discussion
5:11ladies and gentlemen members and Friends
5:14of the City Club please join me in
5:16welcoming Jared
5:18[Applause]
5:27Adams all right
5:30thank you all for joining um us here
5:32today Mike thanks for that that great
5:34introduction um as I'm starting to get
5:36more and more speaking opportunities
5:38I've come to found that the introduction
5:40is like the best part you get to hear
5:43you get to hear someone say these great
5:44things about you but but thank you so
5:46much this is something that me and Mike
5:47worked on uh for for over a year now um
5:50trying to get me to uh to come and to
5:52tell my story so I'm very thankful uh
5:54I'm thankful for Stephanie the City Club
5:56for having me here today um my story
6:00began when I was 17 years old I thought
6:03it was a good idea to go with friends to
6:05a college party in Wisconsin uh which is
6:07like an hour and a half outside of
6:09Chicago and uh it changed the trajectory
6:13of my life forever you know 17 years old
6:16just all in the name of fun and that 17
6:19year old many of you may be um or or or
6:23getting close to we do things as kids
6:25without thinking about the repercussions
6:28well in my case you know me just going
6:31to a party ended with me being falsely
6:33accused of a sexual assault I didn't
6:35commit the age of 17 um just like most
6:3917 year olds look making out sex
6:42drinking without your parents knowing
6:43smoking pot that comes with being a
6:46teenager but with me and also came with
6:48a false accusation and that changed
6:51everything the reality um for me was
6:55totally different after this accusation
6:57I was a kid thinking about you know even
6:59during trial you know about the chores
7:01that I needed to do when I got home
7:03during the weekend but I ended up being
7:05sentenced to serve 28 years in prison my
7:08mother a single mother worked two jobs
7:11and it still wasn't enough to be able to
7:13afford an attorney and that in many
7:16instances is the reason that our prison
7:19population is overfilling right now and
7:21it's the access to Justice yes the
7:24prison system has a disproportionate
7:27amount of black and brown men but if we
7:30were all green it would have a
7:32disproportionate amount of poor green
7:34people in prison being an attorney is
7:37more than just saying I'm an attorney
7:40and wearing nice ties we are promising
7:44and being sworn in to serve the people
7:47and that's exactly what I set out to do
7:50once I was
7:51released when I was sentenced in
7:541998 to prison the first prison that I
7:57went to was Green Bay Wisconsin and it
8:01was one of the most violent prisons in
8:04the state of
8:05Wisconsin and I fortunately was never
8:08attacked but you can't erase what your
8:11eyes see prison is in a place of
8:15Corrections it's a place of warehousing
8:18I saw on a daily basis men just waking
8:22up eating going to sleep and just waving
8:26the white flag on their lives and % of
8:29those men will be going home one
8:33day and I really sat and I thought about
8:37that at the same time while fighting for
8:39my freedom that fight didn't start until
8:43one day while in the prison sale I was
8:47sold up with a man who was close to 60
8:50years old he had been in prison for
8:52about 20 years and he was an older guy
8:55older white man who U was found guilty
8:58of two murders and he would tell you
9:00look I I committed the crime and so I'm
9:02here and I know why I'm here after an
9:05incident happened in the prison we were
9:07all on lockdown and when you're in
9:09prison you're on lockdown you're pretty
9:10much in your cell and they do an
9:12investigation to find out if it's an
9:13isolated incident or if there's just
9:15like a full scale Riot well while on
9:18lockdown was the first time strangely
9:20that I really had a conversation with
9:22someone I had been in a sale with for
9:24almost 6 months and during this time I
9:27just so happen to have a prison phone
9:29call and I was calling out to my parents
9:32and uh they bring you the phone in your
9:35sale everything's in your sale your
9:37bathrooms in your sale they feed you in
9:39your sale so this phone call in my sale
9:42that Day in the year 2000 at the time
9:47was very very very instrumental and to
9:50me getting right here today as I'm on
9:52the phone and I'm speaking to my mother
9:54and my aunts I'm telling them about how
9:56they denied another one of my appeals
9:58and they basically were denying my
10:00appeals throughout the state of
10:02Wisconsin by saying well your lawyer
10:04chose a strategy that's a strategy you
10:05can't do over they never addressed any
10:08of the witnesses that prove definitively
10:12it was impossible for me to be two
10:13places at one time they never addressed
10:16that at all and me um in prison I got to
10:20the point where I was in a cycle just
10:23like many of the people that I was in
10:25prison with and I just didn't want to
10:28deal with my case
10:29and as I'm talking to my mother on the
10:31phone and I'm telling them look they
10:32they denied another one of my appeals I
10:34don't understand why as soon as I got
10:36off the phone my cmate told me to get
10:38down off of the top bunk he was
10:40listening to everything that I said on
10:42the phone because he was right on the
10:44bottom bunk um and he said listen you
10:47know I've been in this sale with you
10:49almost 6 months I've never heard you say
10:52anything about your innocence your case
10:56I mean you don't do anything but work
10:58out play basketball and play chess quite
11:01frankly you act like you're in college
11:04and it wasn't until I had that
11:05conversation with him that I saw myself
11:09in this same cycle of giving up and not
11:11thinking about anything else and he said
11:14let me see your transcripts let me see
11:16your files and I gave them to him that
11:18day many of which were unopen and still
11:21in the envelope from my my attorney
11:24because I just not I just wasn't strong
11:27enough to deal with the reality
11:29of being in prison for 28 years with the
11:32mandatory release of
11:342019 I wasn't strong enough to take my
11:37own life but I also wasn't strong enough
11:41to deal with the reality of the place
11:42that I was in over the course of a week
11:46we had gotten off of lockdown and he
11:49read through my transcripts and all my
11:51police reports and I again went out and
11:55played basketball chess and worked out
11:58this was my th apeutic uh uh way of not
12:01dealing with it and I came back to
12:03myself c one day and he had all of my
12:06paperwork spread out and he had the
12:08police reports in hand and he said sit
12:11down he threw me a notepad and a pen and
12:15he said look I'm never getting out of
12:17this place you're in here for some
12:20racist bull crap with no
12:23evidence and you're going to play chess
12:26you're working out and you're giving up
12:29it's like you're 18 19 years old you
12:32have the rest of your life ahead of you
12:34you need to start working on fighting
12:36for your innocence I've never seen a
12:38case so devoid of any evidence that
12:41day I put down my my basketball shoes I
12:46got rid of my chess board which I really
12:47loved I actually made the chess board
12:49myself uh and uh I went to the law
12:52library and I started to craft my own
12:55shotty version of a petition to get
12:58myself home home um I started off
13:01writing letters to everyone you know um
13:04NAACP innocence projects Oprah I tried
13:07to find stepan's address I was writing
13:11everyone trying to tell them I was
13:13innocent but I realized that as the
13:17years went by um my writing got better
13:22um my research got better so I went from
13:25saying hey look I'm innocent get me out
13:27say hey look I'm in
13:29Strickland versus Washington is a case
13:31where a lawyer was defective and his
13:33constitutional rights were denied
13:34because this lawyer didn't do his job
13:36and as immediately as I started writing
13:38these letters and sending them out I got
13:40a response I got a response from the
13:43Wisconsin Innocence Project and Keith
13:45Finley is the director of the Wisconsin
13:47Innocence Project and they came and saw
13:49me with two law students who were in
13:51school at the time and they said uh you
13:54know do do you mind if we take your case
13:57and I almost fell over like do I mine
13:59like I didn't know you you had to ask
14:02and so um I told them absolutely they
14:05took my case and they started litigating
14:08my case in court um and they did this
14:11federally and and to not be too
14:14confusing once you exhaust all of your
14:16remedies in state court and you appeal
14:18and peel Andel there's a process you
14:20have opportunity to file in a federal
14:21court and say look there are
14:24constitutional flaws in this conviction
14:26would you overturn it and the Seven
14:28circuit granted me a certificate to
14:31appeal and the Wisconsin Innocence
14:33Project appealed my conviction all the
14:35way to the seventh circuit where three
14:38panel judge judges unanimously agreed to
14:41overturn my conviction as I listened to
14:44them argue uh my
14:46conviction I was on the phone in prison
14:51with shackles on listening to them argue
14:53uh on my behalf in the seventh circuit
14:55in Chicago and almost a year to the date
15:00that they argue my conviction in at
15:02court I was
15:04released you know and that was another
15:07fight that started cuz now I'm
15:11released um I don't have a record record
15:14expunged but how do you expunge 10 years
15:17that I'm missing from your
15:19life while doing a report um CBS they
15:23asked me to get pictures and uh I went
15:26to my mother's house and uh you know not
15:29only just the Eater of food but to get
15:30these get these pictures and uh I looked
15:33through the photo album and from when I
15:35was a baby up until 17 years old when I
15:38graduated high school they are pictures
15:41and those pictures do not start again
15:44until I was 27 years old and that you
15:47know as strong as I am you know almost
15:50made me remove myself from the room and
15:52go cry but it really put into
15:55perspective just how you can't erase
15:57that you know and um I got out and I
16:03noticed when I got out that my aunts and
16:06my mother they they uh their emotions
16:10were very high and very sensitive to to
16:14me they just didn't know right you know
16:17all of the misconceptions that you you
16:19believe from prison and people who go to
16:21prison um you just you just don't know
16:24because you know that they aren't set up
16:27we aren't set up once we release
16:28released from prison to do very well so
16:31they thought the same about me as well
16:34and I just felt so God awful that I put
16:40them through this like I made the
16:42decision to go sneak and go to this
16:43party and although I wasn't guilty I
16:46felt so guilty that when my mother had
16:49to go to church and they would ask where
16:51was her son that dark cloud was over her
16:54head and she would be brought to tears
16:58so I can't can't tell you today that I
16:59knew I would be an attorney um in the
17:02state of New York but I did know that I
17:06owed that woman I owed her for the
17:09prison phone calls I owed her for the
17:13support I owed her for giving me birth
17:17twice one time to get me here and for
17:21continuing to keep my Spirit Alive as I
17:23sat for 10 years in a prison
17:28I got up off the couch in 2007 a month
17:32after I was released and I walked three
17:36miles and enrolled in South Suburban
17:38Community College now 3 miles isn't
17:42quite that long but in Chicago in
17:44February it is long I'm telling you okay
17:48the wind was blowing I had this little
17:50thin coat on um I enrolled in school and
17:55uh I I I just wanted to to be able to to
17:58one day day someday do what I'm doing
18:00now and be able to contribute to be able
18:02to talk to people who are going through
18:03through things um and even talk to
18:06people before they go through things to
18:08help them understand that you know this
18:10is real and this is possible I graduated
18:13in 2009 from South Suburban um I was
18:16able to meet someone who introduced me
18:19to someone who hired me as a full-time
18:21investigator at the federal public
18:22defenders office I got that job and that
18:25job it it it really contributed to my
18:28growth
18:28as as a person you know I went from from
18:31from being in prison just in 2007 and in
18:342010 I'm actually going into two prisons
18:37and um taking statements and I'm helping
18:39people and and and I'm contributing and
18:41that encouraged me to continue to go um
18:44and continue to go to school so I went
18:46to school at night and what I my
18:49schedule was ridiculous now that I I I
18:51get the opportunity to sit back and
18:53think about it I would get up at 5: get
18:57to work at about 6:30 before anyone got
18:59there and heard me copying a 100 papers
19:01from a book um go to work during the day
19:059 to 5 and serving subpoenas and stuff
19:09like that uh in in Chicago I never
19:11really realized how many loose dogs were
19:13around in the city until I started
19:15serving subpoenas as an investigator so
19:18I did that and I would come back from
19:20work uh into the office and read from
19:225:00 to 6:00 and go to school at night
19:24from 6:00 to 9:30 and I would get home
19:26at about 11:30 uh um and just repeat the
19:29process and I did that for for five
19:32years that was undergrad at Roosevelt
19:34and the three years at at college and
19:37I'm saying that
19:38specifically for you kids that are here
19:41um look you're going to have obstacles
19:43always in life but you're going to have
19:45to decide whether or not you go around
19:47it go over it or right through it but
19:50you're going to have to keep going and
19:52that that is look that is a real message
19:56it's not scripted and that's what I had
19:57to do do I didn't know I would be here
20:00today at all as an attorney but I knew I
20:02wanted to do something and I knew I was
20:04if you read the book of Jared aen it it
20:06wasn't going to say wrongfully convicted
20:08got out the end that just wasn't going
20:10to be it not at all and I was able to
20:14get through law school by continuing to
20:17network and meet great people I make I
20:19met great attorneys great attorneys and
20:23graduating law school was an outstanding
20:25feeling but was even better was me
20:29clerking in the seventh circuit cuz I'm
20:31clerking in the seventh circuit the same
20:33circuit that overturned my conviction
20:35many of the times I would have to ask
20:37the clerk that was in the courtroom with
20:39me what all was going on in court
20:41because I was daydreaming back to when I
20:44was in a Maximum Security Prison
20:46listening on the phone to attorneys
20:49argue my case for my freedom and now I'm
20:52in the same courtroom less than 10 years
20:55later as a graduating law student on his
20:59way to becoming a
21:01lawyer just made me pinch myself it
21:03really did and judge an
21:05Williams was my mentor I met her as I
21:09started law school cuz I applied for um
21:13the Chicago Bar Scholarship Foundation
21:15which I won and she was one of the
21:16deciding um vote members and um that was
21:21very important for me because again
21:25nothing on my record but the tentacles
21:27of a wrongful conviction will reach you
21:30almost
21:31forever I didn't have a bank account I
21:34didn't have credit and bankers didn't
21:36find me credit wory when they did a a
21:38credit uh check and the last known
21:39address was a Maximum Security Prison in
21:42Wisconsin so while most people were
21:44getting their student loan money and
21:46buying Starbucks I was bringing fers
21:48Crystal to school and paying my way
21:51through college because of the
21:53difficulties that that I Endure with
21:54money and so that scholarship that I
21:57received from the uh the the Chicago
21:59bars SC Foundation was it was very very
22:02very important um to get me where I am
22:04today and I never lost touch of that
22:08relationship I contined to send Judge
22:10Williams emails updates and let her know
22:14how I was doing in school and that gave
22:16me the opportunity to clerk on the very
22:18same circuit that overturned my
22:20conviction I spent the next six months
22:23after um I clerked in the seventh
22:25circuit in the southern district of New
22:27York and I clerk for judge Deborah bats
22:30and she was another amazing judge
22:32another just amazing person who sat me
22:35down and and told me you know um things
22:38that that that definitely I needed to
22:40know as a young person starting a legal
22:42career um the bar has absolutely nothing
22:46to do with being a lawyer oh my goodness
22:48it just doesn't right but it's necessary
22:51right and you have to do what you need
22:53to do to get through and get by and
22:55that's exactly what I did but I needed
22:57that community
22:58of support and I got that continuously
23:01to get to where I am today um I passed
23:06the New York Bar started working for the
23:08Innocence Project uh and and it's just
23:10it's I can pinch myself sometimes as I
23:13walk through the door um and I have my
23:16case files uh of of people who I'm
23:19fighting for their innocence and you
23:22know here it is not even 10 years ago I
23:25was fighting for my own innocence you
23:27know and I I just you know I don't want
23:30to to to seem as if what I did was just
23:33so amazing and no one else can do it
23:35because you absolutely can you have to
23:37believe in yourself the the the one
23:38person that should never stop believing
23:40in you is you is you and so I know this
23:45is a talk about my life and my story but
23:48whenever I'm in a room with kids who are
23:50close to my age I make sure that I
23:51address you and I let you know that you
23:53have to continue to push forward so um I
23:57know that the my time is short and I
23:58have a timer up here to make sure that I
24:00stay within the the um the time limit um
24:03I'll close by saying this I had a bird's
24:06eye view of the Criminal Justice System
24:09it is not a place of Corrections it is a
24:12place of Warehouse the two scariest
24:14things that I ever saw in prison were
24:16not violence one of them was people
24:19getting out in the winter time and
24:23coming right back in the summer and
24:26because I was there for so long
24:28I would see these same people come right
24:30back and I would have conversations with
24:32them and like you know what happened man
24:36and basically what I got from what they
24:39were telling me
24:40was they were first convicted from a
24:43crime in their
24:44Community they were in prisoned with no
24:48skills at all being taught to them they
24:51were released where right back into the
24:55community where the crime happened at
24:58and they were right back as a result of
25:01that and that's what's happening in our
25:03prison the last the second thing that
25:07really just shook me as I'm watching
25:11couple guys play
25:13basketball you know I'm noticing that
25:15they're calling each other names and and
25:18you know I'm thinking like it's just
25:19nicknames people in prison have
25:20nicknames they're referring to each
25:21other as
25:24pops old man Grand poops and son
25:28I didn't learn until a month later that
25:30they weren't nicknames that was a
25:33grandfather a father and a son in one
25:37prison not on the same crime could you
25:41imagine how their family looks like
25:42right now and if we continue to banish
25:45people from society and break down these
25:49structures in our
25:50community I could we ever expect to stop
25:53the senseless gun violence that is
25:56plaguing our community how how do we
25:58ever expect to bridge the gap of the
26:01police in the
26:03community women are strong but they're
26:06not strong enough to be a father and a
26:08mother and there are a lot of fathers in
26:12prison some rightfully but a lot just
26:16because they were in the back seat of a
26:18car that happened to send out a couple
26:19shots and it's ridiculous an enormous
26:21amount of men and increasingly women are
26:25in prison for drugs for pot and now
26:29you're telling me you can sell pot and
26:31create pharmacies legally but they're
26:34still in
26:35prison that's a head scratcher and it's
26:38taking its toll on our community you
26:41can't put people in prison teach him
26:44nothing and then release him and tell
26:47him do
26:48good it doesn't make any sense you don't
26:51have to be an attorney a rocket
26:53scientist or anything like that to
26:54understand that this system is broken
26:56and it has been broken since its
26:59Inception sorry since its
27:01Inception its design is flawed now
27:06people are are are speaking about it but
27:08they're speaking about it now because
27:10again it's not so
27:13much a racial color
27:16line it's access to Justice if you're
27:19poor and you can't put up a defense your
27:22chances of going to prison are high an
27:25attorney I won't name told me this as I
27:27was matriculating through law school he
27:29said look I'd rather be rich as hell and
27:32guilty as hell than poor as hell and
27:35innocent as hell and that is so truth
27:39that just that's just truth in the
27:40reality of it and the people that we
27:43released from prison are going right
27:45back where into our communities and now
27:47they're starting to boil over into
27:48everyone's neighborhood and everyone
27:50must take notice to this and do
27:51something about this I don't care if
27:53you're in the library you're a librarian
27:55your your doctor whatever it is have
27:57these real conversations at the water
27:59fountain because what you do what you
28:02decide who you vote for um it it does
28:05have an effect speak up because we all
28:09will be here and be gone someday but
28:11we're going to leave it to the next
28:14Generation how do you want to leave it
28:16right do you want to continue to be the
28:18greatest country in the world um and
28:21also the greatest imprisoner in the
28:24world it can't be we can't say that our
28:27ourselves that there are 1 point
28:29something million people that are worthy
28:30of banishing from society I worked for
28:33some of the most prestigious judges the
28:35smartest attorneys and still some of the
28:38most thoughtful and eloquent and
28:40smartest people I've ever met were right
28:43there in prison with a prison number on
28:45their chest very smart men and we don't
28:50know what we're banishing from
28:51society and I'll reach you by reaching
28:53you this how do we know that one of
28:56these young men or young women who are
28:58in prison forever won't have the
29:02groundbreaking idea for a medication
29:06that can cure cancer for something that
29:09can contribute to society and some
29:12people are banished and placed in these
29:14situations simply by the demographic
29:17where they're born at and it shouldn't
29:19be that way I thank you all for your
29:22time and I really appreciate coming out
29:24today thank you
29:26all
29:27[Applause]
29:52I'm Stephanie jansy director of
29:54programming at the City Club of
29:55Cleveland and today we are enjoying a
29:56Friday Forum with Jared Adams Attorney
29:59and co-founder of life after Justice
30:01we're about to begin the Q&A we welcome
30:04questions from everyone City club
30:06members guests students or those of you
30:08joining us via our radio broadcast
30:10webcast or new Live simal cast at the
30:13Parma snow branch of the kyoga County
30:15Public Library if you would like to
30:16tweet a question please tweet it at the
30:19City Club and our staff will try and
30:20work it into the forum we want to remind
30:22you that your questions should be brief
30:24and to the point and actually questions
30:27holding our microphones today our
30:28marketing and Outreach fellow faay
30:30Walker and office assistant Wesley Allen
30:33may we have the first question
30:36please uh good
30:38afternoon I am so happy that you're here
30:41and I'm glad to see that the uh young
30:42people here to hear your uh to hear your
30:45important message uh I'm a retired
30:47school teacher and so often uh students
30:50would come in front of me who have the
30:52same story that you have um that are fr
30:57frustrated and have been falsely accused
30:59of something and so my question is what
31:03can a teacher say to a student who has
31:09uh stopped believing in himself or
31:11herself uh no longer has his or her eyes
31:14on the prize uh is just ready to give up
31:18so what would you say to a teacher to
31:20try to help that student well uh well
31:23first thank you for your question um
31:26teachers have one of the most diff
31:27difficult jobs in society like for real
31:30the attention span of kids teenagers are
31:34like you know so um I would encourage
31:37you to do this you as as the teacher um
31:42have in some ways more of an effect on a
31:44student's life than their parents cuz
31:46you're around them and you see them so
31:48much and you can't give up if they give
31:51up that's one thing but you can't give
31:54up encouraging them you just can't um
31:58it's it's a full-time job like it really
32:00is and I'm sure that you take a lot of
32:02these stories home with you a as a
32:04teacher and it just it waves heavily on
32:06your heart but you have to continue to
32:08encourage them continue to encourage
32:10them and continue to you know tell them
32:12stories like I'm I'm not the only you
32:14know young black man who's been able to
32:16overcome the odds although you know I I
32:20don't get as much air time as if I was a
32:22rapper or something like that there are
32:24stories that you can find um to continue
32:27to encourage these kids to continue to
32:29push forward and I really don't have you
32:32know the the the concrete answer for you
32:35other than to say that look faith is
32:37believing until it becomes true come on
32:41now so continue to to to to beg that
32:43they have faith and continue to push
32:45forward thank you again for your
32:51question uh I wanted to know after you
32:53got out of jail did you go back up to
32:55the jail and speak with your
32:57uh
32:58cmate yeah you know actually um you know
33:01he he I believe he passed away um you
33:05know and it it was it was hard for me to
33:09find like him and where he went because
33:12which real sounds strange is when you're
33:14in prison like you you're not known by a
33:16name like you just have numbers on an ID
33:18so you don't really know people's full
33:20name and government names and stuff like
33:21that so I was I was reaching around
33:23letters and trying to contact them and
33:25stuff like that and I believe one of my
33:27letters did did make it uh to him um he
33:31was he was you know a person who just he
33:35didn't care about being known or
33:36anything like that he just wanted to say
33:39his his his peace and and quite honestly
33:41most of the time I was in there with him
33:42he was like a grumpy old man I'm like
33:44you know you know for real so um I I
33:48wasn't able to to have as greater was
33:52relationship with him as I as I wanted
33:54to um and specifically when I got out
33:57there was just so much that I had to
33:59deal with getting out and starting a new
34:02life is it just just I can give you one
34:05example I I go down to go get my ID and
34:08you all have who have ever been to go
34:10get an ID you know how those lines are
34:12right they're they just ridiculous down
34:14so I go down and get my ID and I'm in
34:16line for about an hour get up there at
34:18the beginning they're like okay yeah you
34:19can get your ID you just need like a
34:21birth certificate or Social Security
34:22card I'm like I don't have one they're
34:24like okay well go ahead and you it's
34:25over here I go stand in another line for
34:27two hours or get up there they're like
34:28oh yeah you can get your birth
34:29certificate you just need your ID so it
34:31was it was stuff you know it was stuff
34:33like that that I I I was dealing with in
34:35in and trying to reintegrate back into
34:37society that it just you know it took my
34:40focus off of thinking him the right way
34:42and one thing's for sure I'll make sure
34:44that his memory lives on because I won't
34:46stop telling that story thank you for
34:49your
34:52question um do you find that immigrants
34:55foreign borign people are particularly
34:57vulnerable because they're in a strange
34:59place they don't know the language they
35:00don't know the laws often times they
35:02don't have the money so what have you
35:04seen um well I can tell you from two P
35:07perspectives right from from being in
35:09there um and being out now as an
35:10attorney so absolutely they're
35:12vulnerable they're vulnerable to not
35:14only just just you know access to
35:16justice but also victims of crime like
35:20who are they going to report to right um
35:22you know there are a lot of studies out
35:25on um
35:27immigrants who come to this country just
35:29to make a living and send back to their
35:31family they they are are are taking
35:33advantage of slave wages and all type of
35:36things and in prison what I found was
35:40there were people who barely spoke
35:41English and they was sentenced to serve
35:44time in prison and instead of being
35:46released they were released to a County
35:49Jail awaiting
35:50extradition back to their country so
35:53that was another heads scratcher for me
35:55because now as an attorney I'm asking to
35:57myself right and not only as an attorney
35:59but a contributing member of society who
36:01pays taxes um why are we spending money
36:04to lock people up in in cin out of the
36:05country like what what sense does that
36:07make like you know it just it makes no
36:10sense at all so I I saw a lot of that um
36:14and it was it was very disheartening
36:16because when you think of people and the
36:17way we depict people um that have
36:21handcuffs on them we immediately when
36:22you see people on the news and a person
36:23is arrested you immediately you don't
36:25ask yourself uh I wonder what he was
36:27accused of or I wonder you know uh if he
36:30has a good attorney you immediately say
36:32I wonder what he did or she did right
36:35right and I found out that many of these
36:38people that I met in prison like they
36:40had families too they were fathers too
36:42they were brothers too and I um I met a
36:46lot of a lot of people who were getting
36:48deported like as soon as their sentences
36:50were were over and it was just it was
36:53one of these things where they would
36:54tell me often times look man I'm I'm you
36:56think it's violent over here you don't
36:57know violence over in Venezuela or over
37:00here and they would come over here and
37:02Circumstance would have it they would be
37:05in end up in prison and they would be
37:07deported back to the same country that
37:08they
37:09flee and many of them would do it over
37:11and over again so I that's definitely a
37:15long topic and an issue but but thank
37:17you for your
37:19question how you doing my name is Daryl
37:22R I go to John F Kennedy High School and
37:23I was just wondering where you found the
37:25drive and encourage to keep going after
37:27you got out of um prison and not to just
37:29be one of those people to go back and
37:30did you ever receive an apology from any
37:33any of the defense attorneys or anybody
37:35who wrongly accused you of your crime of
37:38the crime great question but they don't
37:40apologize in court that's not that's not
37:42what they do um I had a chance to speak
37:44to my um you know my attorney um and and
37:49you know look he he didn't he failed to
37:53investigate my case look I'm accused of
37:54a rape following someone up some stairs
37:57and it's like Witnesses all around the
37:59school who could have placed you know me
38:01somewhere else and just totally proved
38:02that it was a false accusation he didn't
38:04hire an investigator he didn't go
38:06investigate he didn't call any Witnesses
38:08he didn't do any of this and I was so
38:10upset at him for so long but when I got
38:13a chance to to you know actually hear
38:15from him um I heard that he too is human
38:21and he made a mistake and he dropped the
38:24ball and it happens the practice of law
38:28is just that it's the practice some
38:31lawyers shouldn't be lawyers um and some
38:35lawyers try their damnest and they just
38:37you know they make a mistakes they we're
38:39all human we are um I do want to say
38:42that you all are Easter Sunday sharp
38:43over there that's what we used to say
38:45going up you really are um and then to
38:49to to to answer specifically the the um
38:52the question about what encouraged me if
38:55if if I I can get you all to see the the
38:58the wrinkles and creases of Anguish on
38:59my mother's
39:00forehead in that prison in that visiting
39:03room being told that that's it you can't
39:06hug the son you gave birth to cuz the
39:09visit is over uh those phone calls the
39:13the the just just the whole everything
39:17right cuz I'm not the only one there
39:19she's out but she's in prison in spirit
39:22all of these ridiculous shows about what
39:25happens in prison and she's thinking
39:27that this is all happening to her son in
39:29prison I owed her and I was going to
39:32repay her somehow some way you know and
39:35that's what encouraged me and your your
39:38your encouragement may be different you
39:39may find something else that encourage
39:41you uh maybe what you hear from me will
39:43encourage you to to go on and and and
39:46and be not just great but
39:49extraordinary right cuz you can do it
39:52you definitely can and just remember me
39:54man when you get up there I might have
39:56my RP card and be retired just remember
39:59look out for old me throw me a bone you
40:00know thank you for your question
40:04though oh right um thanks for your
40:07presence and teaching us some lessons I
40:09had the one question about your cellmate
40:11but I have another one and now only have
40:13one question um your perception having
40:16been in jail and you made some comments
40:18about drugs possession do you think if
40:20we treated all drug possession charges
40:22not necessarily trafficking charges as
40:25diseases and did
40:27imprison those people that that would be
40:30and save the prisons for people that
40:32have been proven to be violent um or
40:35violent crimes do you think that would
40:37be a great Improvement on the system or
40:38do you have an opinion on that and when
40:40is your book coming out just kidding
40:43thank you um thank you for your question
40:45but yeah I I do I um I'm a you know
40:47extreme Note Taker so I you know was
40:49taking notes in prison and I take notes
40:50here and I and I I'm a bit of a nerd I
40:52read everything uh I read a study in nor
40:55Norway of how they uh run their prisons
40:58right and and the idea of them running
41:00their prisons is more so like like how
41:02it should be they um you're in prison no
41:05doubt you can't get out and leave but it
41:07doesn't look like a prison right um and
41:10and it goes to my point that I'm making
41:12you can't cage people up like animals
41:16feed them like
41:17animals and then release them and tell
41:20them to be human it doesn't make sense
41:23it doesn't work at all and you know the
41:26the thing with people who are in
41:30prison a lot of them in prison I don't
41:32want to paint with such a broad brush
41:34they're there because they have
41:36different vices different different type
41:38of you know uh uh uh abuses and things
41:41like that right many of them are
41:43substance abusers right many of them are
41:46are are selling drugs to feed their own
41:48habit many of them are robbing killing
41:50and stealing to feed their drug habit
41:53and we are punishing people we have this
41:56just is this extreme glutton for
41:57punishment in in society right like we
42:00don't just put people in prison and say
42:02that's punishment like we punish them
42:03all the way until they die like you got
42:04to register you have you can't do this
42:06you can't get this you can't get that so
42:08people are going to prison and they're
42:11not being treated right they're not
42:14being treated at all there are people
42:16who come and they are right before your
42:18eyes they are suffering from with
42:20drawals of heroin right in the sale with
42:23you if that's your salate and not being
42:25treated at all and when you don't treat
42:27people in a are released into the same
42:30community that they come from the same
42:32things happen and you to be quite honest
42:34with you you can get whatever drug you
42:35looking for in prison okay whatever it
42:37is right and many of them do drugs in
42:40prison as well we have to separate
42:43people who are there for nonviolent
42:45crimes from the people who are there for
42:47violent crimes and I'll tell you why if
42:50if you're in a room if you're raised in
42:51a in a house full of people who yell
42:54you'll Raise Your Voice without knowing
42:57so if you're in prison with a bunch of
42:58people who are violent you will be what
43:01as a result violent you are either the
43:05one who is handing out the violence or
43:07receiving the violence and the the
43:11entire the entire system needs to be
43:15rehauled but it has to be a want by that
43:1910% who really has all the money in our
43:21society right right yeah well 1% yeah 1%
43:25It has to a want to change that so I
43:28really am I'm I'm an advocate for
43:30changing what goes on inside right cuz
43:32if you change on change change what
43:34what's going on inside you change the
43:36numbers of the people who are inside if
43:38if over 70 if if it's like over 50 I
43:42think it's around 70% I'm not sure of of
43:44the recent study but if over just think
43:46about this over half of the people in
43:48prison have been there before right
43:50right so that means that they've been to
43:52prison this place that we call
43:54Corrections they've been released and
43:56they came back well let's use another
43:58analogy imagine if 50% of the cars that
44:02were produced by I'm not going to name a
44:04company I don't want them mad at me if
44:06they see this but let's just imagine if
44:08if if a car company produced cars and on
44:11average 50% of those cars came back
44:15after they left the production
44:17line it would stop something would be
44:21done so why hasn't it been done with the
44:24prison system right
44:26I I mean the answers may be there is it
44:29because of the the people who hugely
44:31fill the prison system is it a black and
44:34brown thing is it a poor
44:37thing it's something we do know that
44:41thank you for your question
44:44though hello over here hi my name is Amy
44:48Spence um my fiance is Ruel sailor he's
44:51been in prison for 13 years for a crime
44:53that his best friend committed they both
44:55passed Telegraph test him based on
44:58innocence and his best friend admitted
45:01he was guilty and also passed um we have
45:05always fought for his innocence for his
45:08freedom um there hasn't been one year
45:10that we've fi haven't filed something
45:13any kind of you know appeal or or
45:14whatever um but recently the Innocence
45:17Project here in Ohio decided to
45:18collaborate with his attorney to file
45:21his new trial motion and um we have an
45:23application of Innocence pending with
45:25our local conviction Integrity unit um
45:28they accepted it once last year sat on
45:31it for 9 months and then denied it but
45:33after this article was written um by
45:35Kyle Swinson um they decided to reopen
45:39his case officially reopen his case but
45:41um I think it was because of the
45:43attention um you know from the article
45:46that you know H brought them to make
45:50that decision to reopen and
45:51reinvestigate his case but as the family
45:54members you know how do we keep bring
45:57how do we create more attention on these
45:59cases when all the evidence is is there
46:02it's as clear as day I mean if you read
46:04this you would say to yourself why is
46:06this man still in prison you know we
46:08even started a petition on change.org
46:11and we got a thousand signatures but
46:12then it just that it it stopped right so
46:15how how did your family keep fighting
46:17for you after so many years it's been 13
46:19years for us you know and and it's now
46:22you know it seems like we're we we got
46:24to this point you know with Innocence
46:26Project with is which is awesome you
46:28know but we still want to bring more
46:30attention to his case and make more
46:32people aware of the Injustice that are
46:34happening to him and so many others you
46:36know how do the family members keep
46:38fighting and create that attention yeah
46:41CU we've written celebrities and
46:42everything too but yeah I um thank you
46:44for your question I I'll make sure I
46:46give you my information before I leave
46:47so we can we can talk further but to be
46:49honest with you look that's a question
46:51that my mother or my aunts could could
46:53answer better than I could um but I but
46:55I will I will say this um the the the
46:58squeaky wheel gets the oil you know so
47:01you have to continue to to to beat that
47:02drum until the attention you know comes
47:05and then listen we cannot forget about
47:07the power uh that we hold in our hands
47:10now with these cell phones uh with
47:12social media and and you don't have to
47:14wait for someone to write a report you
47:15can become your own author and and write
47:18these these you know these blogs and
47:21continue to spread them on social media
47:22and tag people like look tag pus
47:25president of United States like tag you
47:27know people in it and continue to beat
47:28the drum but he also himself has to
47:30continue to to write out and and and and
47:34you know wait for justice and I you know
47:36look that the unfortunate thing about
47:39prison and being in prison in the time
47:41is is look it it really doesn't go slow
47:44like you know before you know it one
47:46Christmas will turn into eight before
47:48you know it and and you know it's one of
47:52these things like the best thing for me
47:54to do when I was in there was believe
47:56that each and every you know day I was
47:58going home the next day that was one of
47:59the things that kept me saying you know
48:01um it was like reverse pychology for
48:04myself so I can just imagine what you're
48:06going through cuz I know what it was
48:07like to speak on the phone with my
48:09mother you know during prison calls and
48:11and see your on a visit and stuff like
48:13that so I would definitely uh repeat
48:15what I said earlier and just telling you
48:16look keep the faith and continue to
48:18reach out to as many people as you
48:20possibly can on average I was sending
48:22out 50 letters a week on average you're
48:25only supposed to get 10 stamps a week
48:28but I was doing other uh writings and
48:30legal work for people getting stamps
48:32from people and sending out fif free 50
48:34St and many of the letters wouldn't
48:35change besides the date hello it's me
48:38again um can you you know and I was
48:40mailing the same people and so it just
48:42took it took a long time I was in prison
48:44for five years before the Innocence
48:46Project took my case and so it just took
48:48a lot of of of reaching out and now more
48:51than ever back in 1998 there was no
48:53Google like that Google didn't come out
48:55until like 1999 there was no emails and
48:58there was no cell phone and stuff like
48:59that so you know if you're going to
49:01Tweet and and and Facebook like do it
49:04with the purpose and with the cause
49:06thank you for your question though say
49:08Facebook and Twitter all right I'll make
49:10sure I give you my my information okay
49:13this is going to be really a follow-up
49:14to that question each time I've read or
49:18heard about a person like yourself being
49:21found innocent or being exonerated it
49:25seems that there was an extraordinarily
49:27sloppy job done on the police and the
49:30prosecut prosecutor side yeah of
49:33investigating and making any real effort
49:36to determine what happened now I
49:38appreciate the pressure that is brought
49:40on the assistant prosecutors or District
49:43Attorneys depending where you're from to
49:45achieve a conviction but from your
49:48Vantage Point do you have any
49:50suggestions as to changes that could be
49:53made on the prosecutor's side and
49:55perhaps on the police side to see that
49:58matters such as yours are in fact
50:00properly investigated thank you for your
50:03question and I think that that uh that's
50:05a great question and I I actually have
50:08uh been giving this some thought there
50:11the relationship between the police and
50:13the
50:14prosecutors shouldn't be as close as
50:17they are they should not be able to work
50:20hand inand prosecutors should not be
50:22able to become investigators and end
50:25back to to a prosecutor you shouldn't be
50:27able to go into a room and question a
50:29suspect as we've seen so many times with
50:32prosecutors you shouldn't be able to go
50:33tell a police officer how to question a
50:36suspect how to obtain stuff we have
50:39created a criminal justice system um in
50:41a system in itself that pits sides
50:45against one another and I don't care if
50:47it's a spitball contest whatever type of
50:49contest it is you don't care about
50:51anything besides winning and when you do
50:54that just Justice is robbed so my my
50:57suggestion would be we need to have a
50:59separate entity between the police and
51:02the prosecutors a entity where you don't
51:06see you don't have to know the name of a
51:08person to find out whether there's
51:09enough evidence of guilt you definitely
51:11don't need to know the color of a person
51:13to find out if there's enough evidence
51:14for Guilt you don't need those things
51:17there should be a room with three
51:20open-minded people who get evidence who
51:23look at evidence and decide whether or
51:26not it goes to trial and the prosecutor
51:30and the police should not be able to to
51:33to hand job that evidence into making it
51:36fit whatever that they want it to fit it
51:39should never be this way it it just
51:41shouldn't you you and then when you get
51:44out if you are wrongfully convicted it's
51:46a thing called immunity so you can't
51:48even sue the prosecutors and the police
51:52unless you kept catch them doing
51:55something egregious meaning egregious
51:57meaning that they were actually on tape
52:00dropping the murder weapon at your house
52:01or something like that and how do you do
52:03that how do you like most of the cases
52:05of people being wrongfully convicted
52:06they've been there for years before
52:08technology was was out and now science
52:11is advancing right now with DNA and all
52:13type of stuff to get people out but once
52:15you get out you can't even punish the
52:17people who did it to you cuz many of
52:19them who are prosecutors and police
52:22officers are now judges and now captains
52:24of the force and stuff like that it is
52:26all about winning it is not about
52:29Justice at all it's just not think you
52:32can see I'm passionate about that like
52:34that is just that is mind boing thank
52:36you
52:39though uh can you comment on the um
52:42wildly popular serial podcast kind of a
52:45similar situation where the lawyer
52:47didn't do her job yeah and is is that
52:49GNA help innocence projects I I actually
52:53was in prison with Stephen Avery Stephen
52:55Avery uh was in Wisconsin the show is
52:58about a case from Wisconsin and I I
53:00didn't know him personally and stuff
53:02like that but when you're in prison like
53:03you bounce around from prisons to prison
53:04and stuff like that so I was in the same
53:06system with Stephen Avery I don't know
53:09enough about the case to venture into to
53:11to guilt or innocence or anything like
53:13that but I do know
53:14this I can't even go and get my own
53:18niece or nephew out of school and I'm
53:20their Uncle so how on the earth Can the
53:22police go and get a kid out of school
53:26question them in a police station
53:27basically question them for hours to say
53:29what they want them to say then take
53:31them back to school and later use that
53:33evidence to charge him and his uncle
53:35with a crime how like how on Earth what
53:38if if if we want to preserve the
53:41criminal justice system they should be
53:43given a new trial that's what they
53:46should be given they should be given a
53:47new trial if there's enough evidence and
53:48you feel like they're guilty then there
53:50should be enough evidence still to find
53:52them guilty fairly without using
53:54evidence that was manufactured by way of
53:57intimidation and just straight just
54:00taking advantage of people just taking
54:02advantage of people so for you all
54:04who've seen this show uh making of a
54:07murderer you know um in detail what I'm
54:10talking about but for for those of you
54:11who haven't some of the evidence that
54:13was used in the case there was a kid who
54:15was basically you know he was questioned
54:18for hours and hours with no parent and
54:20no lawyer in this Police Department
54:23being questioned by people who question
54:26people for living and have been doing it
54:28forever and they use this evidence to
54:31convict them at their trial and I it's
54:32just it's heartbreaking this kid is in
54:34prison right now basically you know with
54:37the that's a de facto life sentence he
54:39has uh with all those years that he's in
54:41prison um and I'm glad that they exposed
54:43um you know this through this show but
54:46also there's another point that I that
54:49that I want to make about the show that
54:50I think it missed so Stephen Avery was
54:52wrongfully convicted this guy in making
54:54of a murder was wrongfully convicted
54:55that he was released uh after 20 years
54:57and DNA proved that he didn't commit
54:58this uh this rape and and uh I think
55:00murder or something like that it just
55:01was probably was a rape so he's released
55:03from prison and the crime that he's in
55:06jail for now happened like a year after
55:08his release or probably shorter than
55:10that he's released from prison with
55:14nothing and he's staying on an auto body
55:18salvage yard basically a junkyard in a
55:22trailer surrounded by nothing but baking
55:25toring down cars isolated reminiscing of
55:29what a prison you're all isolated in a
55:32prison he wasn't giv mental health care
55:35he wasn't a mental evaluation no
55:37screening no nothing just oh yeah our
55:41bad um you're released uh you didn't do
55:44it you didn't commit the crime so he's
55:45released in these conditions of God
55:47knows
55:49what into a trailer yard living by
55:52itself and now he's arrested in impon
55:55prison for murder that should be a
55:57bigger Topic in itself like I said I
55:59don't know the evidence of the case but
56:01I do know the fact that he was released
56:04without no one talking to him and I
56:06think look after 20 years of anything
56:08you know anything whether it's marriage
56:10or whatever it is you might need to talk
56:12to someone um from time to time and it's
56:15like he's released from prison and and
56:18you know it's like nothing so it's just
56:20that case is just
56:21mindboggling thank you for your question
56:23though
56:29all right brother thank you again for
56:32having me out man really appreciate you
56:34thank
56:36you today at the City Club we are
56:39enjoying a Friday Forum with Jared Adams
56:42co-founder of life after Justice
56:45Community Partners for today's Forum are
56:48the northeast Ohio chapter of the
56:50American Constitution society and the
56:52Legal Aid Society of Cleveland our
56:55Hospitality partner is a metropolitan at
56:58the nine hotel we thank you for your
57:01partnership we welcome guests at tables
57:04hosted by edwins restaurant and
57:06Leadership Institute in the
57:10Ohio and the Ohio innocence Project's
57:13Northeast Ohio Board of Advocates lastly
57:17we welcome students from JFK Eagle
57:19Academy and JFK packed
57:23Academy
57:28we thank all of you for being here and
57:30that brings us to the end of today's
57:33Forum thank you Mr Adams thank you
57:37ladies and gentlemen this forum is now
57:42[Applause]
57:46adjourned for information on upcoming
57:48speakers or for podcasts of the City
57:50Club go to City club.org
57:53[Music]
58:01production and distribution of City Club
58:03Forums on idea stream are made possible
58:06by the generous support of PNC and the
58:09Rasen family fund with additional
58:11funding from Cleveland State University
58:14Robert Conrad and the pain
58:21fund

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