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Is Black Culture a Manufactured Identity? | The Construct EP8 with Chad O. Jackson — Transcript

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0:00Welcome to the construct, a show about
0:02how civilizations are built and how they
0:04fall apart. I'm your host Liam the board
0:06and today we're asking a highly
0:08controversial question. Is there such
0:11thing as black culture? My guest is Chad
0:14O. Jackson, documentary filmmaker
0:16featured in Uncle Tom and known called
0:18Tom too and now making the myth of
0:20blackness. Chad's answer is that black
0:23culture is a manufactured political
0:25identity. We get into why the right
0:27surrendered the arts, why you can't
0:30reason with a crowd, why people get
0:32angry when mass graves turn up empty, as
0:35well as the battle for the soul of the
0:36West between socialism, tribalism, and
0:39Christendom. Before we get started, if
0:42you'd be so generous as to leave a kind
0:44review on whichever platform you're
0:45listening to the show on, that would be
0:47greatly appreciated. So, let's get into
0:49it.
0:55So, Chad, is there such thing as black
0:59culture?
1:02>> Um, that's a very
1:04loaded question.
1:06Um, it it it's funny because I
1:09participated in a debate not too long
1:11ago in Las Vegas
1:13on the digital social hour podcast and I
1:16was actually thinking about this that
1:18this morning when I woke up because one
1:19of the
1:20opponents who sat across from me,
1:23um,
1:24she she referred to blacks as we and
1:28this is she stopped herself and said,
1:30"Wait, are you black?"
1:32And I said, "No." And she's like, "Oh,
1:35okay. Well, that makes sense." And we
1:36continued the conversation. I was
1:38thinking about that this morning and I
1:39was thinking, you know, what what should
1:41I have said instead?
1:43Um,
1:44I think the answer is that I should have
1:46asked her to qualify what she means by
1:48black.
1:50I think that would have made for a
1:52better moment and hopefully would have
1:55caused people to actually think about
1:57these words that we just throw around
1:59loosely, like black and black culture
2:01and and and things of this nature.
2:04The context, or not the context, but but
2:06basically what I meant when I said no
2:09was
2:11typically when people think of black
2:13they think of, whether consciously or
2:16subconsciously,
2:17a kind of
2:20slew of
2:22of principles or perceptions that go
2:26along with this identity we call black.
2:30Uh which is in large part political,
2:34philosophical, there's an ethos, there's
2:36a pathology, there's so many different
2:39things working with that word black.
2:43And so
2:44because I don't identify with political
2:47blackness
2:49because I don't identify with the
2:52struggle that the word suggests uh the
2:56historical mythology
2:58um that one is taught to believe when
3:01they come up in this culture
3:04um because I reject a lot of it, I just
3:07simply choose not to identify with it.
3:09Not necessarily the aesthetic of
3:12blackness, but the the political kind of
3:16characteristic of blackness is the thing
3:18that I'm rejecting. So, to ask the
3:20question, what is black culture?
3:22Um black culture is a deliberately
3:25manufactured
3:27identity for the sake of serving
3:30political purposes.
3:32That's the best way I can describe it.
3:34>> And it's very odd to me because the
3:37people that manufactured that often
3:41subscribe to the notion that race is a
3:44social construct. So, it it it's it's
3:47very strange. I don't know how to square
3:50that circle essentially, where you're
3:52telling me on one hand that race is a
3:54social construct, but then on the other
3:58that this thing defines you and your
4:01ability to
4:03uh
4:04actualize yourself in the world. And now
4:07it's So, now it's the primary thing. I
4:09don't I don't get Do you understand that
4:11part of their ideology and how they
4:12connect those two dots, or is that just
4:15complete cognitive dissonance?
4:16>> actually going to throw throw the
4:18question at you and say and ask you like
4:20what do you think that they realize that
4:21they are being contradicting?
4:24Um
4:25>> Well,
4:26>> I don't cuz I don't I don't think they
4:27realize that they're being
4:28contradicting, but I'm interested in
4:29hearing your thoughts.
4:30>> Yeah, well, I wonder whether maybe
4:33that's part of the ideology's goal in
4:37terms of the contradiction because that
4:39was Orwell's whole concept with
4:41doublethink, right? The The concept of
4:44holding two contradictory beliefs as
4:47true simultaneously,
4:49and it's not so much about getting
4:53that person to believe that single
4:56thing, whether it's black culture or
4:58whether it's race as a social construct.
5:01It's about creating contradictions in
5:03order to break down people's
5:07rational ability and their uh and in
5:10logic in their mind. And because as soon
5:12as you do that, now they can't form any
5:14opinions about anything.
5:16That's kind of where I would go to with
5:18it, but also part of it is just I think
5:21maybe there's like a that concept of
5:24Schrödinger's feminist as well where
5:26it's like they're simultaneously
5:28uh empowered and independent and also
5:32victimized, and it's like just depending
5:34on the scenario which narrative is
5:36beneficial for me to be able to get
5:38power and assert myself in this
5:40discussion, then I'll take that stance.
5:43Yeah, I don't I don't I don't It's It's
5:45It's pretty wild to me that people just
5:46accept these things openly.
5:48>> Well, it's also very characteristic of
5:51what we call black culture, and you see
5:53it time and again. In fact, uh
5:55you know, I was doing some research just
5:57the other day.
5:58I wanted to see
6:00how many times uh the pastor from
6:03Atlanta named Jamal Bryant
6:06um
6:07used the pulpit to talk about abortion.
6:11And so I did a transcript a transcript
6:13search on his YouTube channel.
6:15And what was interesting is, you know,
6:17he rightly said from the pulpit at least
6:20half a dozen times that God
6:23can forgive you even of your abortion.
6:26And if you believe in God's forgiveness,
6:28you don't have to be ashamed of it.
6:30And so he's talking about abortion in
6:32that context. However, I found other
6:35videos that he
6:37did from his from his podcast where he's
6:40at the same time
6:42um and and what I mean by that is in the
6:44same year, same month, sometimes even
6:46the same day uh went on his podcast and
6:49he's talking about
6:51um how those, you know, darned
6:54Republicans and those right-wingers are
6:57trying to
6:59take away women's reproductive rights
7:01and it's a woman's right to choose, it's
7:03her body, it's her choice. So, this
7:06pastor on the one hand is saying it is
7:09talking about abortion as though it's
7:11this is this, you know, evil and wicked
7:14thing, but God can forgive you for it.
7:16Like God will, you know,
7:18heal you and mend you. But then at the
7:20same time he's advocating for access to
7:23abortion. How does that make sense in
7:25the mind of this pastor? And there's a
7:27history there that we don't have time to
7:29get into specifically about how um the
7:33black church was specifically targeted
7:36um for, you know, with this birth
7:38control
7:40propaganda, which was encouraged by W.
7:43E. B. Du Bois, the great black
7:45intellectual who who was an atheist, but
7:47specifically said that we need to send
7:51this propaganda into the Negro church.
7:53Um so that's a history. Um but then too,
7:56you look at the fact that the use of the
7:58N-word
8:00is something that, you know,
8:03many so-called black people uh, get
8:05offended when white people use it, but
8:08then they use it amongst each other. A
8:11contradiction.
8:12There's so many kind of working
8:14contradictions that we see show up in
8:17the so-called culture.
8:19And it's become this kind of routine
8:21thing where they don't realize that it's
8:23that it's
8:25uh,
8:25that it's a contradiction, which tells
8:27me
8:28that they are operating from a very
8:31post-modern kind of predisposition.
8:34Where,
8:36you know,
8:37for for you or for me to say, "Hey,
8:40that's a contradiction. Do you realize
8:41how fallacious that is?" That doesn't do
8:44anything in the minds of somebody who
8:46who is operating from a
8:49this kind of cognitive dissonance, who's
8:50operating from this kind of post-modern
8:53worldview. Logic doesn't mean anything
8:55at that point. Um, how do you reason
8:58with someone somebody like that? And so,
9:01that's not to say that all people we see
9:04as black uh,
9:07are operating from cognitive dissonance.
9:08I know many who aren't. Um, but it has
9:11become characteristic of what we call
9:13black culture, for sure.
9:16>> Well,
9:17that brings up an interesting
9:19conversation when it comes to the very
9:23concept of logic and whether people are
9:26operating on it rationally.
9:28I I really like
9:30Nietzsche's concept where he said,
9:33"Every drive, so every internal
9:36instinct, seeks to be master and
9:39attempts to philosophize in that
9:41spirit." So, for instance, if you allow
9:44anger to overtake you, you're going to
9:46now create philosophical worldviews that
9:49justify your emotional position. Same
9:51thing with You can imagine that somebody
9:53who's very hedonistic is going to create
9:56a utilitarian type of argument. Okay,
9:59well, you know, the greatest good in the
10:00world is just to maximize pleasure for
10:02everybody. And so, they create the
10:04philosophical to justify the emotional.
10:08And then so, this leads me to where I
10:10see the world getting to nowadays, and
10:12it's why I originally started this was,
10:15"Okay, I want to try and model what a
10:20reasonable conversation is, engage in
10:23dialogue as I think the opposite is
10:26violence, and I'm very much getting to
10:30this point now where I wonder how
10:35I I I
10:35like are we past the point of dialogue
10:38socially? Because as you're pointing to,
10:41people aren't at all thinking about
10:44things logically. And this this happens
10:46all sides, all different types of
10:48people. It's just the the emotional
10:50state of society has reached such a
10:53degree that people's rational faculties
10:56have just disappeared.
10:58>> Yeah.
10:59That's a fantastic question.
11:02Um I'm going to say something
11:03interesting here, and I'm interested in
11:04hearing your thoughts on it.
11:06But,
11:07um
11:10for all of his wickedness,
11:15I don't believe that Herbert Marcuse was
11:18all the way wrong
11:20in his assessment of how to
11:24push public opinion, or at least public
11:27sensibilities.
11:29Um
11:30in what he would have perceived as the
11:33appropriate direction. And of course, he
11:35believed that socialism was natural. It
11:39it it it was most compatible with man's,
11:43you know, wiring. And so, he wanted to
11:47to basically detach man, the Western
11:51man, from the Odyssean sirens of
11:54capitalism. Because he acknowledged that
11:56capitalism
11:58um was successful. He acknowledges in I
12:02believe it was
12:04uh
12:06I'm actually not going to quote the book
12:08because I'm I'm going to share with you
12:09after this because I have it in my
12:11archives.
12:13Um
12:14but I I don't want to mislead people in
12:16in terms of where they can find it. But
12:17he did
12:20talk about how I'm just going to look at
12:22it later. I'll send it to you after
12:23this. But he he
12:25he talked about how
12:28um you know, capitalism is successful in
12:32terms of creating creature comforts, in
12:34terms of of promoting and advancing
12:36creature comforts. Uh but he said that
12:40that man still needs to be liberated
12:41from it.
12:43Um and
12:45that socialism was natural and organic.
12:50And this is where we need to push man
12:52to, right? So that was his objective.
12:55Now,
12:56the reason I say that I think he was
12:58right
13:00in a sense was not on the basis of
13:03socialism being natural and organic, but
13:06on how to get man to to kind of cozy up
13:11to this particular idea,
13:13which was through the arts. Because he
13:16said that the arts can do
13:18what the orator can't do.
13:20The arts can do what the activists can't
13:23do. The arts can do what social
13:25movements marching in the streets can't
13:28do. Namely, it can basically give the
13:32audience or give the masses a kind of
13:34picturesque
13:36um idea of what it is they're fighting
13:39for. It can deal with you know, human
13:41love and human tension and and all the
13:43different things that
13:46are successful in kind of like loosening
13:48people's minds, so to speak, and getting
13:51them to a certain point, getting them to
13:53think a certain ways. You're you're in a
13:55sense using the arts to rewire man. And
13:57so this is what Marcuse was was was
14:00understanding as one of the vehicles or
14:02the catalyst to get society to shift in
14:06the sense.
14:07And so what I think um
14:10is that, you know, when it comes to
14:13exactly what it is you're talking about
14:14with regard to
14:16uh the fact that there are a lot of
14:18people who just aren't willing to have
14:20the conversation. There are There are a
14:21lot of people who aren't willing to
14:22engage or to to have their their
14:26thinking um scrutinized for the better,
14:30you know?
14:31Um
14:33we do still have the arts to uh
14:37um
14:39to
14:41basically
14:42uh
14:44give a picturesque picturesque version
14:46of what it is we're talking about.
14:48If that makes sense.
14:50Um
14:50We we we can through the arts take a
14:54very high-shelf
14:56you know, philosophy, good philosophy
14:59and theology and bring that down to the
15:03shelf
15:05uh or or to the counter rather in a way
15:08that resonates with people. And we can
15:10do that through the arts. And so I know
15:13I butchered that explanation, but um I
15:16do think that we still have other
15:18mediums to get our points across. Um and
15:23I think that you know, what we've seen
15:25is that conservatives, Christians,
15:28whatever you want to call them, even
15:29though you know, throughout Western
15:31civilization have mastered the arts,
15:33have mastered literature, have mastered
15:35the classics
15:36at some point we let our foot off the
15:39gas, so to speak, and we've we've punted
15:43this gift to these postmodernists, to
15:47these leftists, to these so-called
15:48progressive types. And they've made a
15:50mockery of it.
15:52And they do it well, you know, they make
15:54decent films that are watchable, you
15:56know, they um and part of that may be
15:59that they are appealing to
16:01like the
16:03the
16:04uh wicked passions of man, the vices of
16:08man, um they they are appealing to
16:11uh the temptation of man, much the same
16:15as, you know, Satan appealed to Adam and
16:18Eve in the garden.
16:20Um even though they had paradise, they
16:23had the they had the garden, they had
16:25God,
16:26um
16:26they were lured into
16:29uh the desire to have knowledge that
16:32made them equal to God.
16:34And so,
16:36if since it's a prince if if Satan is
16:38the prince of the power of the air,
16:41and you know, Jesus said that, you know,
16:43those who don't obey
16:45obey God are children of their father
16:48the devil. Uh it it then makes sense why
16:51you know, these Hollywood executives,
16:53many of these satanic artists and things
16:55of this nature,
16:56uh they use the talents and the gifts
16:58they have to sing, to make films, to do
17:01write, to do whatever,
17:03um to to be the kind of temptus, if you
17:06will,
17:07um
17:08uh encouraging and aiding and abetting
17:11the public to
17:13to embrace vice, to embrace degeneracy,
17:16to embrace, you know,
17:18uh
17:19discombobble thinking, you know what I
17:21mean?
17:21And so, how do you counteract that with
17:24with positive messaging through the
17:26arts?
17:27Uh so so I'm rambling, but but but this
17:30opens up so many different questions,
17:32but it also opens up so many
17:34possibilities
17:35uh when it comes to how can we, yes,
17:39take to college campuses like Charlie
17:41was doing,
17:42write uh on our substacks and our books,
17:45um
17:46um do lectures and all the things. Yes,
17:49continue that, but how can we take that
17:53to the arts in a way that's not uh
17:57you know, third rate, you know, in a way
17:59that's not
18:00crap, you know, to put it in to a word.
18:03Uh because we've proven for centuries
18:07throughout Western tradition and Western
18:09civilization that we're capable, but how
18:11do we get back to using the arts
18:13to push this messaging?
18:15>> Construct is a brand new show, and the
18:17best way to help it grow is to subscribe
18:20or follow wherever you're watching or
18:21listening. Your support is greatly
18:23appreciated and now let's get back to
18:25the conversation.
18:27>> So.
18:27>> Yeah, no I I I completely agree and I
18:30think even even Stalin would agree as
18:32well. He famously said that
18:35writers are the engineers of human souls
18:38and so he was meaning that more in terms
18:40of like poets and novelists than
18:42journalists, but
18:45I think he was entirely correct and
18:46that's why
18:48those communist regimes have always
18:50clamped down on that very early, the
18:52cultural aspect. Whether you look at
18:54Mao's cultural revolution, but even as
18:57soon as he took power in '53,
19:00they immediately started clamping down
19:02on on arts and science in general, any
19:06way that man could express himself.
19:09Um and so I think that goes to another
19:11one of Orwell's observations that all
19:14art is propaganda, but not all
19:16propaganda is art.
19:18>> Mhm.
19:18>> So all art is telling you one way or
19:21another what the proper way to live is
19:23or what it means to live, um but then
19:26the propaganda aspect is when we kind of
19:29butt up against reality and go, "No,
19:31this seems this seems manufactured." And
19:34so that would have been the the latter
19:36side of that quote.
19:37But
19:39I think that is very much I I completely
19:42agree with you where
19:45the right has lost a lot of cultural
19:49influence is by
19:53seeding the grounds of the arts because
19:57it makes complete sense to in in a way
20:00because
20:02leftists are always going to be more
20:05creative. They It's actually It's It's
20:08It's one of the defining features. If
20:10you're creative, you don't like being
20:12put in a box. You don't like being
20:14orderly. Um and so you are naturally
20:17going to kind of take a stance against
20:19that and if you're a creative type,
20:21you're very artistic. Uh luckily I got
20:23balanced with the conscientiousness
20:25aspect, so I think that's where the more
20:27more right right-leaning side of it
20:29comes, but I am very very creative on
20:31that front, too.
20:32>> Yeah.
20:33>> Um
20:34but yeah, there's there's three
20:35different ways that you can make an
20:37argument. I think this was Aristotle,
20:40where he pointed to logos, ethos, and
20:43pathos. So, logos being logic and
20:46rationale, then ethos being authority.
20:51So, you know, I'm an expert in this
20:53subject matter or whatever that you can
20:54build your opinion on that. And then
20:56there's pathos, which would be your
20:59emotional. Now, when I first got into
21:01this, yeah, I was
21:03I purposefully said, "I'm going to put
21:05all of my energy and effort into logos,
21:08into logical uh I'm not going to try to
21:11tell people how to feel, even if, you
21:14know, it's funny when people ask me
21:16uh certain things about my content, and
21:19I go back and I I I ask them I go, "Go
21:21listen to all of it, and I can promise
21:23you that 95% plus of everything I say is
21:27descriptive claims. So, I'm not telling
21:29you how things should be. I'm not
21:31telling you how you should feel about
21:34something. I am simply trying to make a
21:36diagnosis, um which is quite different,
21:39but
21:40yeah, I don't think that speaks to the
21:42masses quite like art or and kind of
21:46more of that pathos element does.
21:48>> Mhm.
21:49>> And you look at guys like, for instance,
21:51whether it be
21:53C. S. Lewis or whether it be Tolkien,
21:56it's like did
21:57what had a greater impact? Was it their
22:00essay writing, which I personally enjoy
22:03more, because I'm like, let's let's pull
22:05away all the symbolism and like I want
22:07to get down to the base of how you
22:08think.
22:09>> Right.
22:09>> But that's not what the average person
22:11is looking for, and so they go to Narnia
22:15or The Lord of the Rings, which are
22:17explicitly
22:19um explicitly based on their
22:21philosophical principles.
22:23And then I think that's where you can go
22:26and show somebody. It is It is kind of
22:28funny. It's like
22:30I've I've seen videos of people online
22:33like breaking down crying after watching
22:35The Lord of the Rings for the first time
22:37and how amazing of a story it is and
22:38you're like, "This is an implicitly
22:40right-wing story." Like it's all It's
22:43all about establishing the proper order.
22:46>> Yeah.
22:47>> And
22:48And yeah, so I like I think definitely
22:51you're onto something there in terms of
22:53the the art side of things and it does
22:55make me think more and more about my
22:58strategy on the way that I approach
23:00these and whether I should be putting
23:01more time into making music like which
23:04was my original creative passion and I
23:06never I've never done any of that
23:08publicly since doing this. And so it's
23:11like, "Yeah, is that is that the Is that
23:13the play?"
23:14>> Yeah. I texted you by the way the the
23:17quote from Marcuse. It was actually from
23:19a lecture and not from a book, but just
23:21just so you have it.
23:23But no, like I mean it's cuz I'm the
23:25same way. That's the way my brain works.
23:27But thankfully, you know, um
23:30I am able to delve into
23:34the conversation and and I'm a
23:36conversationalist. I enjoy having
23:37conversations with people um from
23:40different spectrums, from different
23:41walks of life,
23:43um you know, prying in areas that need
23:45to be pried,
23:46um and having my own
23:49um having my own logic pried because I
23:52mean, you know, I'm I'm a
23:54finite human being. I don't know all
23:57things, but I do know
23:59I do know who the author of truth is.
24:02You know, I do um
24:04I I do read the scripture and I believe
24:07the scripture. um But, you know, at the
24:10same time as a human being I have my
24:12blind spots and so it's necessary to
24:14like to to kind of duke it out as it
24:17were rhetorically with with folks. And
24:21you know, I try to be approachable in
24:23that way, but also am sure of what I
24:26believe and am going to you know, jab
24:30like the like the like the best of them
24:32in in in debate and conversation and
24:34discourse.
24:36Um
24:38and at the same time, I I do see the
24:41necessity of the creative. I do see the
24:43necessity of and this is why I'm a
24:45filmmaker, you know, I do see the
24:46necessity of like actually um
24:50putting into pictorial form
24:53um the points that I'm that I'm trying
24:56to make the points that I'm trying to
24:57get across.
24:58Um
24:59you know, when you look at, for example,
25:01I mean, you brought up
25:03you know, Lord of the Rings and
25:05Chronicles of Narnia, which are great
25:06examples. Um but, you know, you look at
25:09somebody like Ayn Rand
25:11who had some unique and interesting
25:15beliefs, you know,
25:17and she saw that the
25:19necessary way of getting these points
25:21across was through novels. She wrote
25:24Atlas Shrugged, The Fountainhead.
25:27Um her her
25:29views would become increasingly weirder
25:32as she got older.
25:34Um but, she was successful in basically,
25:39cuz everybody has an opinion, but she
25:40was successful in
25:42in pushing her opinion over and beyond
25:45her contemporaries in so far that she
25:48was able to disseminate them through a
25:51novel.
25:52Which I think is very interesting.
25:54Um
25:55and so
25:57not not to belabor this point, but I do
25:59think uh
26:01that
26:02that's one of the ways that we should
26:04pick back up in terms of trying to
26:07figure out how do we wrestle
26:09back
26:11society and civilization to some some
26:14sense of sanity.
26:15Um if it is true that, you know,
26:19uh we're getting to a point where not
26:22even conversation is working. Um where
26:25people are not open to logic. People are
26:28open to reason. People are open to to
26:32dissent, quite frankly.
26:34So.
26:34>> And I'm starting to very much feel that
26:37way in when you look at something like
26:40what's unfolding in France right now. I
26:42go
26:43>> Yeah.
26:43>> Like you can't have a debate about this.
26:45Hundreds of thousands of people in the
26:48streets. Like obviously this has nothing
26:51to do with school conditions. All of
26:54that is simply just an excuse in order
26:57to be violent and radical. Um
27:00but it's like you look at that and you
27:02go, there's no talking to these people
27:04anymore. And this is one of the
27:06characteristics of mass movements where
27:10by their very nature, they have to
27:13operate at the lowest common
27:15denominator.
27:16>> Uh-huh.
27:17>> And you at that point, actually Gustave
27:20Le Bon, a social psychologist from the
27:221800s in France, he wrote a fantastic
27:25book that I've referenced a lot called
27:27The Psychology of Crowds. And he said,
27:29crowds themselves, they have the
27:31temperament of child, women, and
27:33savages.
27:35And you look at it and you go, yeah,
27:37that's pretty pretty spot on.
27:40>> Yeah.
27:41Um and so like, yeah, you can't reason
27:43with that and that's why I do kind of
27:45worry that in the next
27:47I'd say 5 to 10 years, you are going to
27:50see mass civil unrest. And you've
27:54already started to see in certain areas
27:57of France, there was
27:59uh like patriotic types getting together
28:01with uh like large crowds to fight these
28:03other crowds. And I go
28:05I think this is this is where we're
28:08headed. That's the new form of
28:10conversation for the
28:13you know, 2030 era is is just people are
28:16going to speak through through violence.
28:17And that's not how I
28:20want to you know, I much more I'm I
28:23would much more take the position of
28:25going, I've got my property and stay the
28:27hell off of it. Leave me the hell alone.
28:29Uh if you want to come onto my property,
28:31all right, we can we can do battle, but
28:33uh I'm not going to go out and look for
28:35look for it. Um but then I do like I I
28:38look at
28:39people that are concerned about this
28:41kind of stuff
28:42rightfully so
28:44and I think like how are you not
28:46preparing for that?
28:48Like how are you not preparing for that
28:49that future? And so I guess a good a
28:52good cuz you've you've done a lot more
28:54of the
28:56cross aisle talk than I have in debates.
28:59Um
29:00but you're really good at keeping a
29:03level head during those. Like your
29:06passion level essentially is the same in
29:08this conversation as it would be on the
29:11opposite end. Like how do you how do you
29:13maintain that that emotional state
29:16throughout all of this?
29:18>> Um
29:19I guess
29:21this is going to sound cheesy and very
29:22Sunday school,
29:24but
29:26it's really the fact that I'm at peace,
29:28quite frankly.
29:29Um
29:31given everything that you just said
29:33about like what the state of America or
29:37the world might look like in 10 years,
29:39the things that we see going on in
29:41France and other parts of the world, um
29:45I can see why it would be easy to to be
29:48anxious. I mean, I have four children.
29:50You know, they're going to have to live
29:51in this future world.
29:54>> [sighs]
29:54>> And then their children are after them
29:56and so it's it's it's necessary as a as
30:00a father as a man as a son of God
30:03to um
30:04do what is is necessary with
30:06faithfulness
30:08to try to prevent this kind of ensuing
30:11doom
30:12that is self-inflicted,
30:14uh which means it's necessary to try to
30:16to to to to train your children up in
30:18the way that they should go. It's
30:19necessary you know, to the extent that
30:20you have a voice your in in in a
30:23platform to to try to
30:25to speak sense into this dark and dying
30:28generation, and to speak reason and and
30:31logic into the the crowds that herds of
30:35people who are otherwise confused is
30:36necessary to do those things. And I and
30:39I do those things. I try to do those
30:41things at least.
30:42Uh but I'm at peace with how all this is
30:44going to end. Yes, we're going to have
30:46to go through the suffering. Yes, we're
30:47going to have to have the you know, the
30:50labor pains as it were as the Bible puts
30:52it.
30:53Um but you know, in the end we will be
30:56comforted by our Lord. And so I'm at
30:58peace with that. And you know, watching
31:01people like Yuri Bezmenov talk about
31:03like, "Hey, this is inevitable. You can
31:05show them this. You can show them that.
31:07You can take them to the gulags and you
31:09know, they still won't get it. They
31:10still won't know."
31:11When I'm in a crowd or not a crowd, when
31:13I'm in a debate and somebody sitting
31:16across from me being smug or yelling or
31:18whatever the case may be, I'm not even
31:19really thinking about them so much. I
31:21understand that, you know, this video is
31:23going to go out. Thousands of people are
31:24going to see it. I'm really talking to
31:26them. I'm really talking to that person
31:27who
31:28in the the the quietness of their home
31:32or their car or their cubicle
31:35is watching this video without
31:37distractions, without the outside buzz,
31:39and are and are listening to reason
31:42versus lunacy.
31:44Hopefully they side with reason.
31:46Hopefully they saw they they they
31:49uh
31:50side with peaceful resolve, you know, as
31:52opposed to
31:54um
31:55further exacerbation, chaos, calamity,
31:58so on and so forth.
32:00And so
32:02I think that, you know, to the extent
32:04that you show that you're outraged and
32:08um
32:09angry and all the things, like I think
32:11there's obviously such a thing as
32:12righteous indignation.
32:14Um there's plenty of things in this
32:16world that we should be angry about. Um
32:19but we as men have to
32:23exemplify
32:24control. We have to exemplify
32:27um
32:29this kind of even-handed
32:32resolve even in the midst of the storm.
32:36You know, i- i- if
32:39if, you know, we are driving if I'm
32:42driving my family. We just took a road
32:44trip to Idaho.
32:46And the
32:48let's say that we we we decided to leave
32:50during the winter and there was a patch
32:52of of black ice that I didn't see. I'm
32:54driving.
32:56Um
32:57if the van began to wobble and and shake
33:03and my family started screaming
33:05frantically and I started screaming
33:07along with them.
33:09I'm not going to be able to save the
33:12family by taking control of the wheel
33:15and getting us back all right that we
33:17might continue on our path.
33:20Um and you know, if I were screaming
33:23frantically
33:24and we still somehow managed to survive
33:27it. How would my children look at me?
33:30You know, how how much confidence will
33:31my children have in me moving forward.
33:35How much how much confidence will my
33:36wife have in me?
33:38Uh I think that in such times as this
33:42it's up to us uh men in particular to
33:46address what needs to be addressed
33:49to do the work that needs to be done
33:51with faithfulness, but do it with
33:53resolve, do it with uh
33:57a degree of stoicism
33:59quite frankly
34:00um and do it with with certainty, but
34:03most importantly do it with peace and
34:04peace and none other than Christ.
34:08>> Do you think that this is a Noah's Ark
34:11kind of situation where it's
34:13>> It kind of is. It kind of is.
34:16>> you know,
34:17and I don't mean to like I'm not a black
34:20pillar by any means. Um I I'm very
34:23similar to you where
34:25as an individual I find myself very much
34:28at peace with my day-to-day. I've got a
34:30good uh family circle around me. I've
34:33got good great friends. Um I've got
34:36passions and interests that I very much
34:39enjoy.
34:41And then
34:43but a lot of people definitely don't
34:45have that. And so I wonder more so,
34:48yeah, whether this is just okay,
34:51essentially
34:53button down the hatches, take what you
34:56need for recreation, and just try to
35:00weather the storm that is inevitably
35:02going to come.
35:03>> In a way it is,
35:04because the fact is
35:07um you know, I too am not a black pill
35:10guy. I'm very much a white pill guy.
35:12Uh at the same time
35:15you're dealing with people. You're
35:16dealing with what Walter Lippmann called
35:19the bewildered herd
35:20in a sense.
35:22And the question is, you know, how many
35:24people are
35:26um
35:28willing to
35:30rise above it
35:32and to take ownership and take
35:35responsibility
35:37and to
35:38uh resist the propaganda, resist
35:42the ensuing doom that is in many ways
35:45self-conflict, you know, self-inflicted,
35:47which then brings me to the other side.
35:49You know, how many of us are are
35:52uh gullible enough to go along with the
35:56uh
35:57the the messaging
35:59the
36:01uh doom and gloom kind of like, you
36:03know, the world will end unless we get
36:06you know, climate change legislation,
36:08unless we get socialist legislation,
36:11unless we get X, Y, and Z.
36:13Uh the world will end. And so they take
36:16to protesting, they take to all all all
36:19the all the things that we see on on
36:21news. And not just even that, and also
36:24the way that
36:26um it shows up in the institutions,
36:28whether it be education, academia
36:30entertainment, uh which are all, I
36:33guess, complicit in in pushing this
36:35narrative, pushing this
36:37this uh
36:38you know, helping to shape public
36:39opinion in that way.
36:41And as a result of taking that ideology
36:46to its logical conclusion, you're you're
36:48left without a civilization. I hate to
36:51be so um
36:53I I hate to be so uh
36:55apocalyptic about it, but it but but
36:58that
36:59what what else can we expect from
37:02institutions, academia, entertainment,
37:05uh the the activist class
37:08all singing to the same tune, all
37:11singing you know, in a chorus in this
37:14diabolical
37:16symphony, as it were.
37:18Um
37:19What else do we expect in terms of where
37:22something like this will end up? And so,
37:25um I'm not saying that we lay down or
37:28you know, fall asleep at the gate. Um I
37:31do think now is the time to fight, uh
37:33but it does become a kind of Noah's Ark
37:36situation in so far that you know, the
37:39people who
37:41are going to hear it are the ones
37:43willing to hear it and not everybody
37:44else. And and and and and you know,
37:46there are too many unfortunately who are
37:49unwilling to hear it. And so, at at some
37:51point,
37:53you know, when some major catastrophe
37:55happens as a result of
37:58the bewildered masses insisting on their
38:01own way,
38:03um
38:05you know, what what do you do? You know,
38:08be
38:09I'm not saying that we go out and we
38:10build compounds and underground bunkers
38:12and things of this nature. Um but what I
38:15am saying is that like uh we we can't
38:18the very least uh equip our minds
38:21um in a way that uh
38:26allows allows us to sustain any kind of
38:29uh
38:30of uh
38:31harsh conditions that are brought about
38:34by a bewildered herd who insists on
38:38carrying these bad ideas to their
38:41logical conclusion.
38:43>> Yeah, well, and this is where I've got
38:45to in terms of you know, when people
38:48say, "Oh, we we want the same things,
38:51but we just differ on how to get there,
38:53right?" And I even saw this in in regard
38:56to what we were watching unfold in
38:58France. And it's just like I I genuinely
39:01don't get how you can be that daft. I
39:04think maybe the only thing is that you
39:07don't want to reach a point where you
39:09lose faith in humanity and you want to
39:11be able to believe that all of those
39:13people are capable of salvation
39:15essentially. Um and hey, you know, maybe
39:19maybe they are, but at the same time
39:22you look at what you're talking about in
39:24terms of anti-civilization,
39:27the
39:28doctrines and the ideologies,
39:31especially, you know, the ones that run
39:33through universities and higher academia
39:36today, they explicitly call for this.
39:39And so, even for instance, uh John Paul
39:43Sartre,
39:44famous French intellectual,
39:47and he said, "Our soil must be occupied
39:51by a formally colonized people and we
39:54must starve of hunger."
39:57Like they're calling for this. They're
39:59And it's it's funny cuz it's kind of
40:01that religious impulse in a sense for
40:04wanting to atone for your sins. And so,
40:07they look at the sins of say Western
40:09civilization in the past, although I
40:11don't think they were unique. I think
40:13that was [snorts] very much the time and
40:17that was I mean, to this day, there are
40:20still many nations that operate the way
40:23that we
40:25self-flagellate for operating
40:28uh
40:29centuries ago.
40:31And it does seem like this this drive to
40:36get rid of guilt, get rid of to deal
40:39with shame, and their idea for doing
40:42that is to destroy
40:46what
40:47has been built. It's It's like It's
40:50almost a little bit of like a survivor's
40:52guilt type of thing where it's like, you
40:54know, you got home okay from the war and
40:57you feel bad about the fact that other
40:59people didn't and so you start becoming
41:02self-destructive because you think that
41:04is kind of like almost balancing the
41:06scales of some sort. But I think that is
41:08very important for if there is one
41:11narrative to correct that is uh so
41:15pervasive socially is the idea that, you
41:18know, these leftist types, especially in
41:20their modern form, simply want, you
41:23know, better health care and better
41:24education. It's like, no, they want to
41:27smash the foundations of civilization
41:29because they believe that civilization
41:31itself, you know, going back to
41:34Rousseau, French French intellectual who
41:36kind of started this entire idea of
41:38thinking, you know, man is born free but
41:40everywhere in chains. And so the way to
41:44get to liberation, which they all talk
41:46about so much, is to break down social
41:50structures. And so it's like, no, this
41:52is this it's it's not that we just
41:55disagree on how to get to the same
41:57place, it's that we want fundamentally
41:59different things.
42:01>> Absolutely. It's interesting because I
42:03mean France
42:06I don't know when France will learn its
42:07lesson. Um
42:10I mean this goes all the way back as you
42:12all know.
42:13It's interesting because
42:15there was a student in the midst of the
42:17protests
42:19who was asked about, well, what about
42:22the violence? I don't know if you saw
42:24this. You know, what about the violence
42:26that uh
42:28that the students are engaged in,
42:29they're beating up teachers, they're
42:31doing all kinds of things.
42:33And you could tell that her answer was
42:35prepared uh for her
42:38uh cuz she said something to the extent
42:40of, well, what about the violence of the
42:42state?
42:43And so far and so far that they are, you
42:46know, they're not paying well enough or
42:49they they're denying health care or are
42:51they're denying this or they're denying
42:53that?
42:54So,
42:55these people have
42:57come to acknowledge
42:59the fact that the government isn't
43:01benevolent enough, is not as great of a
43:04nanny as it ought to be. It's not as
43:07great as of a big brother as it ought to
43:09be. And as a result of this,
43:11it's committing violence against against
43:13me.
43:14And so, it's like whether she this this
43:17young woman had an a handler who who
43:20coached her with that answer or whether
43:21she's learning that in her schools,
43:23that's problematic and that's what I
43:24mean when I said earlier, when you look
43:27at academia, education, entertainment,
43:29those three in particular,
43:31uh the demonic trinity, as it were.
43:34Um th- this is the the way that they're
43:38indoctrinating and shaping
43:40our youth around the world.
43:43Um certainly in the Western world. And
43:45and it's a problem.
43:47Um instilling the virtues of
43:50multiculturalism and
43:53you know, all the things. And and that
43:54it will be the end of us. And and again,
43:56I'm not I'm not a black-pilled person,
43:58but I'm saying like so long as these
44:00people remain
44:02um authoritative in these institutions
44:06and they're churning out hundreds of
44:09thousands, millions of of young people,
44:12it's like what do you do to to to change
44:15that mindset if you're not leading the
44:18institutions?
44:19You know? Um and so, we we do have to
44:22find other ways to do it, but it's like
44:25um
44:26you know, to to to believe that because
44:29the government is not giving me
44:31something that I should be giving
44:34myself, that I should be doing for
44:35myself, is tantamount to violence.
44:39Like
44:40how do you turn that around, you know?
44:42So.
44:43>> Yeah, well, silence is violence, right?
44:46You know. [laughter]
44:47It's not It's not It's not merely that
44:50you don't uh that you have to or that
44:53you can't say certain things that are
44:55hate speech or whatever. It's that you
44:57must affirm the ideology. And I mean,
45:00that's that goes back to both, you know,
45:02Mao's China and stuff as well, and
45:04that's very much part a part of that
45:06entire ideology. There's no freedom of
45:08conscience, no freedom of thought. In
45:10fact, they believe that you are in false
45:12consciousness, and it's their job to
45:14break you out of that and so that you
45:16can become a proper proper radical if
45:19you only knew how how oppressive things
45:21were.
45:22But like even to that point, it's like
45:24what are you comparing this against?
45:26Because you look at France, for
45:29instance. Yeah, oh well, it's it's this
45:30is about health care and education.
45:32France's public social spending
45:35as a share of GDP, now these were 2022
45:37numbers, although I'm sure the trends
45:39are more or less the same,
45:41is [snorts] that 31.4%
45:44of their GDP was being spent on public
45:47social services, and the highest in the
45:50world. And so, if you look at in
45:53especially the social state is far
45:56larger than any other in human history.
45:59And so, you could make the case that
46:02France has the best social programs, or
46:05at least not maybe best, but puts the
46:08most amount of effort and resources
46:10towards social programs than any other
46:13nation in human history. And yet you're
46:16using that for a justification to burn
46:18it down.
46:19And that's why I think I think that
46:21yeah, there's got to be something much
46:23deeper and darker here because
46:25if you create an incentive structure
46:28where
46:29your moral virtue and your opportunities
46:33are tied to your victimization,
46:37then you are going to fight tooth and
46:41nail against any narrative that pulls
46:44that moral authority, which is
46:45essentially power, away from them. And
46:48you can see this
46:50I This is when it first clicked for me
46:52was after the mass graves hoax in Canada
46:56where they were saying there's thousands
46:58of bodies across across Canada, but then
47:01you looked into it
47:02under residential schools. This was a
47:04genocide of indigenous children. And
47:07then you looked at it and what they were
47:09doing was using ground penetrating radar
47:12and then saying any soil anomalies that
47:15they could find were dead children.
47:17They've not They spent millions of
47:19dollars on excavation at one site in
47:22particular and they found nothing. Um
47:25and but this was then used in order to
47:30attack the system, so to say. And I
47:32remember I was having a conversation
47:33with a comedian in a green room.
47:36And he was talking about
47:39that that issue in particular. And so I
47:42mentioned the whole ground penetrating
47:43radar stuff and how the excavations
47:45didn't actually turn up anything. And
47:47hey, maybe certain things did happen,
47:49but we don't have anything evidence-wise
47:52to make that claim yet.
47:54And he got upset. And I And I asked him,
47:56and you could tell this is actually when
47:58it flipped. So maybe this is a good
47:59question for any audience members to put
48:01on these people is being like, "Why do
48:04you want this to be true? Like if you
48:06care so much about indigenous children,
48:09shouldn't you be glad to hear that there
48:12wasn't actually thousands of them buried
48:15in unmarked graves essentially in a
48:17ditch somewhere? Like
48:18>> Mhm.
48:19>> You should be relieved, but you're not.
48:22You're actually angry because that thing
48:24would give you power today. And so
48:26that's what That's where I think it all
48:28comes from.
48:29>> Oh, 100% and I said
48:32>> [laughter]
48:32>> I mean, we you see something similar
48:34with the
48:35the the Tulsa race riot of 1921.
48:39Um the original numbers I think showed
48:42like
48:43Uh
48:44well, the original story covered it as a
48:46riot. It said it was a riot and that 10
48:50Negroes and three whites died in this in
48:54the midst of this kerfuffle.
48:56Um but the numbers keep getting larger
48:58and larger and larger over the years.
49:01And not only does that happen, it's now
49:03called a race massacre
49:06as opposed to a race riot, which is what
49:09it actually was. There's this claim that
49:11there's this mass grave of Negroes
49:15buried near in the Greenwood district of
49:17Tulsa, Oklahoma.
49:19Haven't been able to find the grave.
49:21Uh they're raising all kinds of money to
49:23try to to locate it and it's like it's
49:26not there. It just simply isn't there.
49:28And it's interesting because, you know,
49:30the the the Greenwood district, which
49:32was burnt down, like many of the
49:34buildings were burnt down during this
49:35race riot in 1921, but by 1925, all of
49:39it was built back. All of it was built
49:41back and it wasn't just Negroes building
49:44back up their own community, it was
49:45white people helping them in many
49:47instances
49:49uh build back their community. So, by
49:511925, it was completely built back.
49:53There's archival video of this having of
49:56this happening and it wouldn't it
49:58wouldn't decline again until the 1960s
50:01during the height of the Civil Rights
50:02era.
50:03Um and all the rhetoric that was
50:06poisoning the well, as it were,
50:08uh would begin to take shape.
50:10Now, it's interesting because when I
50:12tell people, uh particularly black
50:13people, that story, like, "Hey, you
50:15know, you realize it was built back,
50:17right? And that there is no mass grave,
50:19that the original numbers were
50:20significantly lower than what's being
50:22reported right now by the likes of the
50:24Library of Congress and other such
50:25things." And they get upset and similar
50:28to what you're talking about, and they
50:30want so badly for the numbers to be in
50:33the thousands. They want so badly for
50:36there to be a mass grave. They want so
50:38badly to for it to not be true that
50:42Tulsa
50:43the Greenwood district was built back.
50:46They they they want that and it's like,
50:48"What is that?" Like the
50:50What it is, Liam, I believe, is that
50:53they're they're constantly looking for
50:56fodder to justify the revolution.
51:01That's what they're interested in.
51:02They're They're They're interested in
51:03fodder and using that weaponizing that
51:08as a as a tool
51:10for the revolution. And that's
51:12That's That's what they're interested
51:13in. They're not interested in And And it
51:15And it kind of show It reveals the mask
51:18kind of slips to the extent that they
51:20get upset
51:21because it reveals that you're not so
51:22much interested in the the people who
51:27were massacred
51:30uh in the Tulsa
51:32uh situation or in the situation that
51:34you're talking about. You don't give a
51:36damn about them. You You What you care
51:38about is the revolution and using them
51:41to push the revolution. That's really
51:43what this is about. And to the extent
51:46that you expose that, I think that
51:48you're you're you're doing the right
51:50thing. You're on to something. Uh I
51:52think I used this analogy before on your
51:54show, but it's like you're like the boy
51:57in the fable The Emperor's New Clothes.
52:00To the extent that you say the quiet
52:02part out loud, you say the thing that
52:03needs to be said,
52:05um
52:06and encourage other people around you to
52:09acknowledge the same thing. Like, "Hey,
52:11these people don't care about the
52:12situation. They don't care about the
52:13facts, which which actually uh betrays
52:17everything that they're saying. The
52:18facts complicate the issue at the very
52:21least, but but but at worst, it
52:23completely dismantles their whole
52:26logic."
52:27Um
52:29but they're not interested in having
52:31those questions answered. They're not
52:32interested in looking into those
52:33details, into those facts, because they
52:35just are using it to to further the
52:36revolution at the end of the day.
52:38>> If you'd like to get my work delivered
52:40directly to your inbox and receive
52:42newsletters, essays, and exclusive
52:44content, please head over to Liam Out
52:46Loud.substack.com.
52:49The link is in the description as well.
52:51And now, let's get back to the show.
52:53Yeah, and I think too, even on a more
52:55spiritual level outside of the
52:57political, and I think what we're seeing
52:59is this spirit being amplified through
53:04the political. And so, it ends up taking
53:06hold, but
53:07essentially two passages I just wanted
53:09to throw out there that I think touch on
53:12this kind of human condition aspect so
53:14deeply is uh from Dostoevsky's
53:18The Brothers Karamazov, and then also
53:21Kierkegaard's The Sickness unto Death,
53:24where Dostoevsky said, "A man who lies
53:27to himself is often the first to take
53:30offense. He sometimes feels very good to
53:33take offense, doesn't it? And surely he
53:35knows that no one has offended him and
53:37that he has invited the offense and told
53:39lies just for the beauty of it, that he
53:42has exaggerated for the sake of effect,
53:44that he has picked up on a word and made
53:46a mountain out of a pea. He knows all of
53:48that, and still he is the first to take
53:51offense. He likes feeling offended. It
53:53gives him great pleasure, and thus he
53:56reaches the point of real hostility."
53:59And I noticed that Kierkegaard ended up
54:01touching on pretty much the exact same
54:03thing, and what he said was that the the
54:06sufferer fastens onto one pain point,
54:10gives it all of his energy, and then
54:12turns that into his identity of sorts,
54:15and would even turn down relief from God
54:19and the angels. And so he wrote, uh "He
54:22prefers to rage against everything and
54:25be the one whom the whole world, all
54:27existence, has wronged, the one for whom
54:30it is especially important to ensure
54:32that he has his agony on hand, so that
54:35no one will take it from him. For then
54:38he would not be able to convince others
54:40and himself that he is right. This
54:43finally fixes itself so firmly in his
54:46head that he becomes frightened of
54:48eternity for a rather strange reason. He
54:51is afraid in case it should take away
54:54from him what from a demonic viewpoint
54:57gives him infinite superiority over
55:00others."
55:01And that's another great paradox of this
55:03kind of
55:04I I I do view it more spiritual than I
55:08kind of went at first I was like oh it's
55:10a political party that's doing all of
55:11this and then I was like okay it's a
55:12political ideology and then I kind of
55:15went okay now it's actually I think it's
55:17much more like a spiritual where that
55:19type of person is is essentially who
55:23falls into these these mass mass
55:25movements
55:27but he
55:28Kierkegaard I think put it as like a
55:31form of demonic despair.
55:33>> Yeah.
55:34>> I guess like how do you how do you as a
55:36Christian kind of
55:38get to these two because now that I've
55:40viewed it more spiritual
55:42I've started to very much see people as
55:45possessed by these things like you can
55:47see it in their eyes sometimes too I've
55:49seen it in person I've seen it online a
55:51bunch where like you just look at
55:53somebody and you go like that demonic
55:54despair that he's talking about it's
55:56like I can see that there's just nothing
55:58behind your eyes and I'm essentially
56:01dealing with this demonic presence
56:03like how I don't know like how do I
56:05guess
56:06I'm very similar to you where I like to
56:08try to remain calm and all of that but I
56:10guess I'm looking at it going like at a
56:12certain point you do start to feel
56:14threatened by those types.
56:15>> Yeah.
56:17No I mean the best again I'm going to
56:19give you another Sunday school answer
56:21but the best you can do is just pray for
56:23them and pray for the world quite
56:24frankly
56:26because you know
56:29unfortunately people who who are in that
56:31space like they're captured but there's
56:34but there's still hope for them yet you
56:36know so long as they have breath in
56:37their lungs
56:38um
56:39but you know for
56:41I know that faith comes by hearing and
56:43hearing by the word of God and so for me
56:46it's like to the extent that I engage in
56:48these conversations
56:50whether it be in person or even when I
56:52do stuff on YouTube or what have you
56:55I
56:56incorporate scripture I incorporate
56:59biblical knowledge and wisdom and the
57:01things that I say and thankfully there's
57:04been people who have
57:08boldly come to me
57:10uh or emailed me or DM'd me or or even
57:13wrote in the comment section for all to
57:15see uh that they were in that place that
57:18you're talking about. And after having
57:20watched some of my stuff and some other
57:22people's stuff, uh they they were able
57:25to thankfully overcome it.
57:28Um and so it's it's really nothing that
57:30I can do other than being faithful. Um
57:33because that's what God calls us to do
57:35is to be faithful.
57:36Um
57:37Some of us want to be like Peter, the
57:39Apostle Peter,
57:41where we just uh are over the top and
57:44what and what it is that we want to do.
57:46I mean, during the Transfiguration,
57:48uh you know, um Peter wanted to like
57:51immediately start building this
57:53tabernacle. And he had to God actually
57:55had to tell him like, "Hey, calm down.
57:58This is my son with whom I'm well
58:00pleased, you know?" Uh speaking of of of
58:03Christ. Um Peter was willing to cut off
58:07the ear of the soldier uh whenever they
58:09came to seize Jesus, a Roman soldier.
58:12So, Peter was that guy who was always
58:14willing to go to the max, you know? Um
58:17and then you had other apostles who were
58:19who were less so, but they were more
58:21obedient in things of this nature. And
58:22so, it's like I think that um
58:25that we have to leave room obviously for
58:28the Holy Spirit. We have a role to play
58:30as uh children of God who are in his
58:35royal family. And we all have different
58:37skills, we all have different talents,
58:39we all have different um um abilities.
58:42And and and that's beautiful, quite
58:44frankly. Um because the way that you
58:46communicate, Liam, is always going to be
58:48the same way that I communicate and vice
58:49versa. But that's beautiful. Um because
58:51the fact is like we're all reaching
58:53people in in various ways, uh but for
58:57the same purpose. And so, as a result of
58:59this,
59:00um
59:01you know, the Bible says one uh plants,
59:04one waters.
59:06And and so, we have different roles. And
59:10so, for me it's like I can't be the
59:11planter and the waterer and the one that
59:14causes it to grow.
59:15Um I have the role as the planter and
59:18and maybe the waterer, but but only God
59:21can make that seed grow. And so
59:24what what is what is tantamount
59:26biblically to planting and watering?
59:29Well, it's it's the uttering of the
59:31word. It's the the the telling of the
59:34truth.
59:35Um and beyond that I can't be too much
59:39like Peter where I'm just doing too much
59:42and and actually maybe even
59:43self-sabotaging, you know? So, I'm
59:46hoping that answer makes sense.
59:48>> Yeah, and
59:49I think
59:51where I come to with a lot of the the
59:54Christian side of things in cuz I'm I'm
59:57definitely I I grew up I was very
1:00:00atheistic, you know, I think my
1:00:02introduction to the more intellectual
1:00:04sphere was like a lot of people at that
1:00:06age and it was the Christopher Hitchens
1:00:09and, you know, the
1:00:10>> Dawkins
1:00:11>> Yeah, Dawkins and Sam Harris and all of
1:00:13these and, you know, dunking on dunking
1:00:16on
1:00:16>> of Peter Atkins?
1:00:18>> Uh not familiar, actually.
1:00:20>> Uh I think Oxford.
1:00:22>> Okay.
1:00:22>> an interesting debate with uh
1:00:25uh
1:00:27um
1:00:29Professor Lennox.
1:00:30>> Okay.
1:00:31>> Back in I think 2008
1:00:34or 9. But anyway, I cut you off. Go
1:00:35ahead.
1:00:36>> No, it's okay. Um
1:00:38yeah, I didn't uh I I I was very much
1:00:40that's kind of what I was brought into.
1:00:43Now that I've
1:00:44dove into these more philosophical and
1:00:47theological
1:00:49frameworks more deeply, I start to
1:00:51understand how shallow a lot of their
1:00:54arguments were.
1:00:55Um but they're they're highly appealing
1:00:57if if you don't kind of know cuz a lot
1:01:01of it is is straw man type of arguments
1:01:03and so you kind of take their caricature
1:01:05of what Christianity or religion is and
1:01:08then you assume that that is the the
1:01:11idea. But where I was going to with this
1:01:13is that it's very interesting because
1:01:17I've had a lot of controversial
1:01:20opinions. I've had a a lot of Well, and
1:01:23it's funny cuz actually it's only I
1:01:25don't think they're controversial to the
1:01:27majority. I think they're controversial
1:01:29to a small sum that is very loud.
1:01:32>> Right.
1:01:32>> And because because the number one thing
1:01:34that I get all the time is like thank
1:01:36you so much for saying the things I'm
1:01:37thinking and I'm scared to say.
1:01:40>> Yeah.
1:01:40>> Um but
1:01:42one thing that I've just noticed from my
1:01:44own personal thing is like the religious
1:01:47side of things is and I I I I wouldn't
1:01:50classify myself as a Christian because I
1:01:54don't know it well enough yet and I've
1:01:56been trying to explore this and actually
1:01:59take it seriously, not uh not engage on
1:02:02it on this uh this caricature level and
1:02:04also just from understanding how
1:02:07important it was to the history of the
1:02:10West.
1:02:10>> Mhm.
1:02:11>> But
1:02:12I have not experienced as much
1:02:17pushback or
1:02:22whether it's even if it's not anger,
1:02:23just like discomfort from people when
1:02:26you talk about that. Like even if I just
1:02:29say for instance that I I'm exploring
1:02:32these ideas and starting to try to uh
1:02:35try to live by them a little bit better
1:02:36and and actually apply them to my life
1:02:39and yeah, take them seriously.
1:02:42Why is that do you think
1:02:44that that side of things
1:02:46has so much
1:02:48hesitation towards people? Like they can
1:02:51a lot of people can obviously there's
1:02:53types that can't entertain anything
1:02:55outside of their worldview, but even
1:02:57I've noticed the types of people that
1:02:59are typically more
1:03:01intellectually curious and not
1:03:04extremely dogmatic
1:03:06they all of a sudden become that way
1:03:08when religion is the topic. Why do you
1:03:10think?
1:03:12>> Um I think that part of it has to do
1:03:15with uh
1:03:16what they think
1:03:19um religion is responsible for
1:03:21historically.
1:03:23Um they think of
1:03:28religion and Christianity in particular
1:03:30what I think of communism.
1:03:33In other words, when I look at the
1:03:36millions of bodies
1:03:38uh that have been
1:03:41piled up as a result of communism in the
1:03:4420th century alone,
1:03:46um a lot of
1:03:49Americans, I mean, I know you're in
1:03:50Canada. I imagine it's the same there.
1:03:53Um have a similar
1:03:55uh belief when it comes to
1:03:59the Crusades or
1:04:01uh this idea that
1:04:04Christianity is so dogmatically
1:04:07inhibiting
1:04:08that it doesn't allow you to be your
1:04:10true self.
1:04:12Um
1:04:14and that's that in itself is genocidal.
1:04:18Um because what if a person wants to be
1:04:21gay?
1:04:22What if a person wants to be trans? What
1:04:24if, you know,
1:04:27um a person doesn't want to abide by
1:04:30this rule book called the Bible that
1:04:34prevents me from having fun and and just
1:04:37finding myself and being myself?
1:04:39Um
1:04:41and so
1:04:42I think it's it's mainly on those two
1:04:44fronts. So, one,
1:04:46uh what they believe Christianity has
1:04:48been responsible for historically,
1:04:50and two, what they believe Christianity
1:04:53prevents people from from doing, from
1:04:55experiencing true liberation.
1:04:58They can't define what true liberation
1:04:59is, but they know that
1:05:02or at least they think they know that
1:05:03the scriptures prevent them from
1:05:05experiencing it.
1:05:07>> Yeah, and that kind of just
1:05:09jogged something in my head a little
1:05:10bit, which is even I think why, you
1:05:13know, I'm speaking more from personal
1:05:14experience here, having been on the
1:05:15other before where
1:05:18I think
1:05:20an aspect is how demanding it is as
1:05:23well. It's not like say for instance if
1:05:26I have a certain opinion on
1:05:30how a certain like a specific
1:05:32institution like university should
1:05:34operate or something. Trying to convince
1:05:36somebody of that, it's like okay, here's
1:05:38this one belief that applies to this
1:05:40very small aspect of society. And so if
1:05:44you are to accept that belief it doesn't
1:05:47require all that much from you. But if
1:05:51you make that leap from an atheist to a
1:05:54believer
1:05:56it
1:05:57makes you change everything. It's not oh
1:06:01it's not oh I now have to cut out sweets
1:06:03at 9:00 p.m. Like that's the one change
1:06:05I have to do in my life. It's no, I have
1:06:07to I have to change how I behave. I have
1:06:10to change how I interact with people. I
1:06:11have to change how I think how I think.
1:06:14I have to change how I how I approach
1:06:17relationships. I have to change how I
1:06:21view the world top to bottom.
1:06:24And so I think that's probably part of
1:06:26it as well where it's just the the the
1:06:29demanding aspect of of essentially the
1:06:31the ask is so large. And I think that's
1:06:34why even subconsciously I I resisted it
1:06:37a little bit because I was extremely
1:06:43I wouldn't say extremely but even just
1:06:45little things like okay, partying. Oh, I
1:06:47like partying with my friends on on
1:06:48weekends but then can I really if I
1:06:50accept this faith like can I now engage
1:06:53in what would be considered moral
1:06:55degeneracy? And so it's like you have to
1:06:58essentially
1:07:01to put it in harsh terms it's like you
1:07:02have to kill your prior self.
1:07:04>> Mhm.
1:07:04>> So maybe in your sense they have a
1:07:06point.
1:07:08>> Yeah, I mean and that is that is the the
1:07:12the ask.
1:07:13That is the demand.
1:07:16Um to die. That's what the cross
1:07:19represents is dying.
1:07:22Um you're born in a natural world to
1:07:25natural parents who taught you natural
1:07:27things. [snorts]
1:07:29Um, and you have to die to that natural
1:07:31self
1:07:33and supernaturally
1:07:36be born again
1:07:38with a new set of values
1:07:40um, that are God's values.
1:07:43Um,
1:07:45the Bible calls this Christian walk
1:07:48sanctification.
1:07:50It's It's a you're a daily work in
1:07:52progress and you're following the Holy
1:07:55Spirit, which means that you are denying
1:07:58yourself. You're denying the flesh. Um,
1:08:02and you're choosing to to uh,
1:08:05to walk with with God, quite frankly.
1:08:08Um,
1:08:09and a lot of us don't want to do that.
1:08:11We don't want to die to ourselves.
1:08:13Uh, we
1:08:15and and it's really tantamount to
1:08:17believing you are a God, quite frankly.
1:08:20Again, it goes back to the Garden of
1:08:21Eden and I and I know Jordan Peterson
1:08:22talked about this as well. Uh,
1:08:25the the the the what what Satan was
1:08:28offering
1:08:29uh, Eve and the reason why she was
1:08:32interested was she can become like a God
1:08:35herself.
1:08:36Um, knowing good from evil or choosing
1:08:39for herself what is good
1:08:41and evil and rejecting what God has to
1:08:43say about it.
1:08:45Um, that that intrigued her and so she
1:08:48ate from the fruit and gave some to Adam
1:08:50and he
1:08:51who was was with her
1:08:53ate from it too and we are descendants
1:08:55of Adam and Eve. The Bible calls Adam
1:08:57the first Adam.
1:08:58It calls Christ the second Adam. In
1:09:01other words, what Adam broke
1:09:03Christ repairs.
1:09:05And so,
1:09:07what is it that he's repairing? Well,
1:09:09he's repairing the fact that we have
1:09:12fallen from God.
1:09:14Uh, in the desire to be gods ourselves.
1:09:17But what Christ does on the cross is he
1:09:19reconciles us back to God.
1:09:22Um,
1:09:23and it's a it's a better life
1:09:26when you're reconciled back to God.
1:09:28You're still going to
1:09:29endure suffering. You're still going to
1:09:33slip up, mess up, and um these are
1:09:36things that are still going to happen.
1:09:37You still live in the world. You're
1:09:38still a
1:09:39a fleshly human being in the world on
1:09:41this side of heaven.
1:09:43Um
1:09:44however, you're perpetually being
1:09:46sanctified. Uh you now have an
1:09:49intercessor
1:09:50um on your behalf that is Christ
1:09:53interceding on your behalf to God.
1:09:56Um
1:09:58and
1:09:59like what I've experienced as a
1:10:01Christian is
1:10:03that
1:10:05because of my faith
1:10:08I am a better father than I would
1:10:10otherwise be, a better friend than I
1:10:12would otherwise be, a better dad than I
1:10:14would otherwise be.
1:10:16Um because you're constantly taming that
1:10:19natural passion
1:10:21um to be a bad father, to be a bad
1:10:25husband, to be That's not to say that,
1:10:27you know, there aren't atheists who, you
1:10:29know,
1:10:30uh
1:10:32don't treat their wives well and take
1:10:34them on dates and are pleasant to their
1:10:36children. I'm not saying that at all.
1:10:38But to love with a with with with God's
1:10:41love, it's it just hits different, quite
1:10:43frankly. Um
1:10:45and so
1:10:47a lot of us insist on our own way.
1:10:50And it's to that extent that we don't
1:10:52want to give our lives unto God. Uh we
1:10:57we we believe with our finite minds that
1:11:00we can just figure this thing out on our
1:11:02own
1:11:02um and still enjoy the pleasures that we
1:11:05seek. We we can still, you know, satisfy
1:11:09uh our desires uh in a way that God
1:11:13can't quite fulfill.
1:11:15Um and so for this reason we're not
1:11:17interested in in
1:11:19and uh
1:11:21submitting to him.
1:11:22So.
1:11:24>> Tying this into the larger conversation
1:11:28that we are kind of having socially.
1:11:32I was I picked up The Camp of the Saints
1:11:35recently, which is a uh controversial
1:11:37book, but uh all about essentially a
1:11:40dystopian vision of mass migration and
1:11:42what it would look like.
1:11:44And actually that Sartre quote that I
1:11:46referenced earlier, that, you know, our
1:11:48soil has to be filled with the colonized
1:11:52and we have to starve, that I found that
1:11:55in the forward because actually he wrote
1:11:58that book as a
1:12:01response to that worldview. He went,
1:12:03"Let me Let me allow this worldview to
1:12:05play out." And so it starts off as,
1:12:08"Okay, you've got this large migrant
1:12:11population that first tries to go to
1:12:13South Africa and gets shot at." Like the
1:12:16boats get shot at. So they turn away and
1:12:18head towards Europe. And then they get
1:12:21to Europe and they
1:12:24the leaders of France,
1:12:27cuz he was a Frenchman, you know, it's
1:12:28very very timely. Um that they didn't
1:12:31have the will to shoot down the boats
1:12:34because of this universality of the
1:12:36Christian ethic that is so deeply
1:12:39intertwined with our civilization that
1:12:42they see no difference between us and
1:12:45them. You know, there's just one
1:12:47universal. And
1:12:49but it's like, "Okay, now
1:12:52how do we balance those two?" Because I
1:12:55would like to live in a world where yes,
1:12:57we can have a universal ethic that, you
1:13:01know, whether it's
1:13:03whether it's my skin color, whether it's
1:13:04my gender, or anything of this nature,
1:13:06like a law doesn't apply to me
1:13:08differently
1:13:10or benefit me. I don't want an
1:13:12undeserved benefit. I also don't want
1:13:14somebody to or I and I don't want to be
1:13:16undeserved persecution.
1:13:19But
1:13:20then how do we balance that with like
1:13:22this particular, so we've got the
1:13:24universal being the Christian ethic that
1:13:27our society's function on, and then the
1:13:29particular, which all of these other
1:13:32societies function on, which is very
1:13:34much a more tribalistic us versus them,
1:13:37they do not see us as one whole. And
1:13:40it's kind of like, how do I how do we
1:13:43bridge those two?
1:13:46>> That's a interesting question.
1:13:49Um because you're absolutely right. Uh
1:13:52when you when you look at
1:13:55um the communist ploy
1:13:58over the course of the 20th century
1:14:01to spread their ideology in the West,
1:14:05and particularly in America,
1:14:07um this is something that they came up
1:14:09against because
1:14:11you know,
1:14:12when you look at American institutions
1:14:14and Americans in general,
1:14:16uh who had a Christian disposition,
1:14:20um
1:14:23the communists kind of found a way
1:14:27to use that against them in order to
1:14:31neutralize them and thus infiltrate.
1:14:36Uh much like what you're talking about
1:14:37with regard to migrants coming into
1:14:40France.
1:14:41Um
1:14:44and so
1:14:46mhm
1:14:47And so, for me, the word that comes to
1:14:48mind is discernment.
1:14:51And
1:14:53you know, it it in studying to show
1:14:55yourself approved, it
1:14:58not letting your foot off the gas, so to
1:15:00speak. And so, what that means is like,
1:15:02how is it how do you, on the one hand,
1:15:06maintain the posterity,
1:15:10the the foundation of your civilization,
1:15:14um
1:15:15and at the same time,
1:15:18uh honor the scriptures when it talks
1:15:21about, you know, thou shalt not kill,
1:15:24uh to to to welcome the stranger, and
1:15:27and things of that nature. How how how
1:15:29can both of those things fit into the
1:15:31same
1:15:32box or fit into the same civilization
1:15:35because, you know, there are those who
1:15:37say, "Well, you have to do what South
1:15:40Africa did um in order to prevent uh the
1:15:44collapse of your own society."
1:15:47Um and I think there is a way to do
1:15:49that. I think I think it comes down to
1:15:51once again studying to show yourself
1:15:53approved, understanding what's going on,
1:15:57having the discernment enough to um
1:16:01to say, "Okay, we are going to show
1:16:04brotherly love by welcoming the
1:16:06stranger, but we insist on
1:16:10our civilization, our foundations,
1:16:13uh our faith, and we're not going to
1:16:16allow a kind of poisoning of the well,
1:16:19we're not going to allow
1:16:20multiculturalism because we are Canada,
1:16:23we are America. Um and we have a set of
1:16:27values. Um and so
1:16:30um and so there's this balancing act
1:16:33that one has to do uh legally um and
1:16:37socially uh to to to on the one hand
1:16:41say, "Look, we welcomed you in. Um
1:16:45y- y- you you fled uh a disastrous
1:16:49situation from where, you know, that
1:16:52that was going on wherever you're from,
1:16:54and obviously there's something about us
1:16:57that caused you to come here
1:16:59um that wasn't true of where you came
1:17:02from. So, we're not going to allow
1:17:05where we are to become where you came
1:17:07from by bringing those same
1:17:10twisted values here, right? That's
1:17:14essentially what multiculturalism is in
1:17:16a large metropolitan area or wherever
1:17:18the case may be.
1:17:20And so
1:17:22you know, how do you strike that balance
1:17:24of welcoming the stranger
1:17:27but un- but but making the stranger know
1:17:30that you're coming to us, like you're
1:17:32you're coming to where we are. Here's
1:17:34how we do things.
1:17:36Um we're not going to allow uh
1:17:39this kind of melting pot as it were
1:17:42um of this amalgamation of confusion uh
1:17:45that would ultimately mean our collapse,
1:17:48you know? And so I think that
1:17:50unfortunately over the course of the
1:17:5120th century
1:17:53uh because of the fact that we didn't
1:17:55know what hit us and we were all too
1:17:57willing to um
1:18:00to uh
1:18:01acquiesce to the exaggerated grievances
1:18:05of
1:18:07of
1:18:09groups who played victim
1:18:12in order to uh usher in a foreign
1:18:15ideology.
1:18:17We've lost our way.
1:18:20We we we've been neutralized.
1:18:23And as a result uh we live in a nation
1:18:25that's unrecognizable at this point.
1:18:28And so it's this kind of slow bleeding,
1:18:30this kind of slow death from within
1:18:32that's taken place.
1:18:34Multiculturalism is a sickness.
1:18:36Um
1:18:38and and you know
1:18:41when you when you read the scriptures
1:18:43Old and New Testament
1:18:45but specifically the New Testament
1:18:48and it and you see this language of you
1:18:50know God's people are made up of every
1:18:53tongue, tribe, and nation. That in
1:18:56Christ there's no longer slave nor free,
1:18:58Jew nor Gentile, male nor female, for we
1:19:00are all one in Christ Jesus.
1:19:02That's an interesting verse
1:19:04because you know it it's the subject is
1:19:08in Christ.
1:19:11Right?
1:19:12And so you have this kind of diverse
1:19:16group of people from different walks of
1:19:20life, different backgrounds, different
1:19:22ethnicities, so on and so forth so on
1:19:24and so forth so so on and so forth, but
1:19:26they are in Christ, which means Christ
1:19:29is the authority.
1:19:31I don't get to bring my blackness
1:19:34to the equation or my maleness or
1:19:37whatever to the equation, I'm subject to
1:19:41Christ. Christ is considered Lord, which
1:19:43necessarily means that I'm
1:19:45subject to the Lord. I'm I'm the
1:19:47subject, he's the Lord. I'm subordinate,
1:19:50he is the authority.
1:19:53And so, what he says goes. But, the
1:19:55beauty in that is,
1:19:57you know, he whom the Christ you know,
1:20:00he whom uh the Lord sets free is free
1:20:02indeed, right? Is this Is this beautiful
1:20:05dichotomy because we're all slaves.
1:20:08We're all slaves to our passions, we're
1:20:09all slaves to something. The old Bob
1:20:11Dylan says, yeah, show the old Bob Dylan
1:20:13song, you know, goes, you know, uh it
1:20:16might be the devil or it might be the
1:20:18Lord, but you're going to have to serve
1:20:19somebody. We all serve something,
1:20:21whether it's ourselves, whether it's
1:20:23whatever. Whatever your passions are,
1:20:25you you become in a sense a slave to
1:20:27that passion, a slave to that
1:20:30desire.
1:20:32And so, you know, Paul the Apostle Paul
1:20:34calls himself a slave to Christ. He
1:20:36says, I'm a bondservant to Christ.
1:20:38Uh but but the beautiful dichotomy of
1:20:40that is
1:20:42those whom the son sets free are free
1:20:44indeed. We're we're slaves to Christ,
1:20:47yet we're free in Christ.
1:20:49We're free indeed in Christ. And so,
1:20:53um and so, in other words, Christ is the
1:20:56only master
1:20:58who can grant you true liberation.
1:21:01If you're a slave to money,
1:21:03right?
1:21:04Money's not a good master.
1:21:07It It's okay to have money. I'm not
1:21:09pooh-poohing the the whole aspect of
1:21:11having money. Money is necessary, money
1:21:13is a tool.
1:21:14But, to the extent that you become a
1:21:15slave to money,
1:21:17um it's just not a good master to have.
1:21:20Your wife is not a good master to have
1:21:23to the extent you become a slave to her.
1:21:25Um mankind in general are not good
1:21:29masters to have. Uh
1:21:31they can they can, you know, rain down
1:21:35uh
1:21:36you know, love and confidence on you,
1:21:38and they can also abuse you. Uh
1:21:41physically, um
1:21:43mentally, emotionally, whatever the case
1:21:46may be.
1:21:47It's up and down because we're finite
1:21:49individuals who
1:21:51are sinners.
1:21:54Objects, you know, to the extent that
1:21:56you become a slave to an inanimate
1:21:57object, a video game.
1:22:00You know, it robs you of your time, robs
1:22:01you of brain cells.
1:22:04Christ is the only entity
1:22:07who is a good and faithful master.
1:22:11And so,
1:22:12all that to say that whenever we model
1:22:16civilization
1:22:17after the standards of biblical
1:22:21Christianity,
1:22:24understanding that God is a god of
1:22:25common grace,
1:22:27who allows the sun to to rise on the
1:22:29just as well as the unjust and the rain
1:22:31to fall on the righteous as well as the
1:22:33unrighteous.
1:22:35In other words, and that's what English
1:22:37common law is fashioned after, you know,
1:22:39equal justice, you know. The Supreme
1:22:43Court, it says above the door,
1:22:47equal justice under the law.
1:22:49And so, in other words, we don't believe
1:22:53or
1:22:54in in theory, and
1:22:56wait and
1:23:00you know,
1:23:02unequal scales,
1:23:04um,
1:23:05we're not going to show favoritism
1:23:08in a court of law to
1:23:11someone because they're wealthy or we're
1:23:13not going to we're not going to virtue
1:23:15signal
1:23:16by
1:23:18throwing a case in the favor of someone
1:23:21who's poor just because of their
1:23:23condition.
1:23:24Obviously, we've gotten to a point where
1:23:26we are doing that, both of those things,
1:23:29but on paper, we're not supposed to be
1:23:32that. But to the extent that we depart
1:23:34from those values, from those biblical
1:23:37virtues,
1:23:39in pursuit of multiculturalism or trying
1:23:41to tilt the scales in favor of some
1:23:45fulfilling some political or or
1:23:47ideological
1:23:49um
1:23:50endeavor or agenda, um
1:23:53you know, your your civilization is not
1:23:55long for this world. So, I know I'm I'm
1:23:57kind of off on that rant at this point,
1:23:59but my to bring it back to your question
1:24:01with regard to migration and
1:24:05um and and this kind of
1:24:08shifting of the scene as it were
1:24:10in order to appeal to the sensibilities
1:24:15or what one thinks are the sensibilities
1:24:17of these newly emerged people um
1:24:22instead of recognizing, "Hey, there's a
1:24:24reason why they are a refugee. They're
1:24:27seeking refuge. Um it's because we're
1:24:30doing something right, whereas where
1:24:32they came from is is doing something
1:24:35wrong. Let's maintain those things that
1:24:39made us a highly sought-after nation as
1:24:42opposed to and embracing
1:24:44multiculturalism
1:24:45um and and thus losing this nation. I'm
1:24:49hoping that makes sense.
1:24:51>> No, it made a made a lot of sense, and I
1:24:52think that's a a perfect cap off to the
1:24:55discussion and the perfect place to
1:24:57leave it because yeah, I very much see
1:24:59that similarly to you where
1:25:03there's only a few options, which is
1:25:05either we end up in a socialist state, a
1:25:09socialist civilization, we end up in a
1:25:12tribal pagan civilization where it's
1:25:15just multicultural all against all
1:25:18or we restore Christendom, and I think
1:25:22those are the options. I I don't see
1:25:25I don't see any other ones on the plate.
1:25:27I know a lot of people still believe in
1:25:30kind of a more classical liberalism
1:25:33approach
1:25:35of the civic institutions and
1:25:37participation in society is what's going
1:25:39to hold us together. I don't think
1:25:40bureaucracy can tell a people how to
1:25:42operate.
1:25:44You know, I think two people are always
1:25:46going to have more influence on the
1:25:49institutions than institutions have an
1:25:51influence on people.
1:25:52>> Right.
1:25:53>> And so, we're going to see that flip if
1:25:55we don't restore the ideals that created
1:25:59those institutions in the first place in
1:26:01the people.
1:26:02Um and so, if that essentially type of
1:26:04person doesn't find themselves back into
1:26:08the institutions, then I think yeah,
1:26:11you're going to see them see them vastly
1:26:13overhauled in the next 5 to 10 years.
1:26:16Actually, that's a great point about the
1:26:17camp of the saints, too, is because
1:26:19people talk about it as if it's this
1:26:22racist book against the or you know,
1:26:25against the third world and calling them
1:26:27all savages, but actually his his entire
1:26:29point was that the
1:26:33battle was lost long before a boat ever
1:26:35landed on the shore, which was that
1:26:37those people no longer
1:26:40uh no longer viewed their civilization
1:26:42as something worth upholding. And so,
1:26:44it's like, yeah, at that at that point,
1:26:47you've just
1:26:48Can you really blame the wind for
1:26:50knocking down your house if you've first
1:26:53gone and broken the foundations? And so,
1:26:56it's like, yeah, I think I think that's
1:26:58very much very much where we're at, but
1:27:00uh
1:27:01>> That's a great point.
1:27:03>> But I think I think you touched on the
1:27:05the return vision quite uh quite quite
1:27:08well there. So, yeah, thank you very
1:27:09much for joining me today, Chad. Is
1:27:11there anything you're working on that
1:27:13you want the uh audience to know of or
1:27:15where they can find you?
1:27:16>> Yeah, uh you can find me at
1:27:18chadojackson.com,
1:27:21as well as @chadojackson on IG,
1:27:25Facebook, YouTube, and X. I am working
1:27:29on a film called The Myth of Blackness.
1:27:32It is an independent film, which means
1:27:34that we are relying on uh
1:27:38the people, quite frankly, to to help us
1:27:41get this film to the finish line. So, if
1:27:43people want to contribute to what we're
1:27:45trying to accomplish with this film, uh
1:27:48you can learn more about it at
1:27:49chadojackson.com.
1:27:52>> Well, thank you very much for joining me
1:27:53and I always appreciate our
1:27:55conversations very much and look forward
1:27:57to doing so again in the near future.
1:27:58So, all right. Thank you all for
1:28:00watching and we'll catch you next time.
1:28:02If you enjoyed this discussion, please
1:28:04consider supporting my work. I am
1:28:06entirely independent and have exclusive
1:28:08content available for paid subscribers
1:28:10on YouTube, Substack, and Instagram.
1:28:13Thanks for watching and we'll catch you
1:28:14on the next one.

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