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In Conversation: Bryan Stevenson and Anthony Ray Hinton — Transcript

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0:04you had any morning like I did I was
0:06going from one place to another and
0:08every time I looked up I said oh it's
0:09not as late as I thought it was and then
0:11I look at something else and it would
0:12say no it's later than that and I
0:13realized that all my cloud items were
0:17catching up and that all of my manuals
0:20were not I'm Elizabeth
0:22zackler and thank you thank you for
0:26being
0:27here uh thank you for joining us today I
0:30welcome you I'm the founder of the
0:32Sackler Center here and I have the
0:34distinct honor and pleasure of currently
0:36being the board uh chair and I'd like to
0:40know how many of you are coming to
0:44states of denial the illegal
0:45incarceration of women children and
0:47people of color for the first time would
0:49you raise your
0:50hand awesome thank you thank you for
0:53joining us we've had two years of
0:55wonderful programming it's all available
0:58online to be seen ww w. Brooklyn
1:01museum.org
1:03CFA SLV videoo you can see all our
1:06previous programs which are
1:09extraordinary and um if you're a Twitter
1:13I'm at sackers soapbox or we have a
1:16hashtag states of denial bkm for
1:20today uh it is really a huge pleasure
1:24for me to welcome uh you after my
1:27introduction to Mr Stevenson
1:30um uh I'll provide right now some uh
1:35background on today's programming so we
1:37he uh we'll watch a short video and then
1:41we'll hear from Mr Hinton and then we'll
1:43see a SE second video and then Mr
1:46Stevenson and Mr Hinton will engage in
1:48conversation and time permitting I hope
1:51we will certainly have question uh time
1:54for questions and answers um for those
1:56of you uh who have read just mer mercy
2:00and can I ask to see a show of hands of
2:02people who have that's marvelous that's
2:04just marvelous I want I want to share
2:07with for those of you who haven't I uh I
2:10suspect you'll leave here and you go
2:12right to Amazon or your local
2:14bookstore um I want to share with you a
2:17personal
2:18anecdote uh that may Echo for you for
2:22those of you who have read it uh in 19
2:25uh in 20 19 1912 in 2012
2:31mass incarceration and the horror of our
2:34policing and judicial prison system
2:37surfaced fiercely and with Force New
2:41Yorker articles Michelle Alexander's
2:43groundbreaking the new Jim Crow and the
2:45new press is continuing Publications on
2:48state sanctioned violence and news
2:51finally Front Page News finally that
2:54continues now four years later about
2:56police violence our unjust judicial
2:59system and the horror of our systems of
3:03incarceration all systems that are
3:05replete with corruption inside and out
3:11and unfortunately continuing when I read
3:14Brian Stevenson's just Mercy this is
3:17what it looks
3:20like I thought as I was reading it as I
3:23opened it that I couldn't read anything
3:25that was going to give me more
3:26information or more unbearable
3:29information
3:30than I had already learned um it was a
3:33couple of years ago that I was with this
3:37book it was over the holidays Hanukkah
3:40Christmas and New Year's that's when
3:42this book that's what I was
3:45doing I devoured it and when I closed it
3:48I cried I cried through it and I cried
3:52after it um it is and describes things
3:57that are worse than anyone could
4:00possibly know or even imagine and I am
4:03so grateful to Brian Stevenson for
4:07having done this work and for writing
4:10about it so that we can
4:12learn so uh as soon as I closed the book
4:17Brian and I for the year before had been
4:19in touch uh during that year to try and
4:21schedule his appearance here but he was
4:23very busy on a book tour because uh just
4:26Mercy had just come out states of denial
4:28was in its second year and um he was
4:32also busy of course with his ongoing
4:34work with the Equal justice initiative
4:37and there was uh simply no room in his
4:39schedule which I completely understood
4:42um but as I turned the last page of just
4:46mercy and as I closed the book I
4:48literally at that moment pulled out
4:51my iPhone and uh called
4:55Brian and perhaps he remembers this but
4:58he probably doesn't because he's spoken
5:00with hundreds maybe thousands of people
5:02and admirers at this point but I
5:04remember because I was having this one
5:06particular conversation with Brian
5:08Stevenson and I want to share with you
5:11two sentences of that
5:14conversation I said to Brian
5:16Brian how do you do what you do day in
5:21and day out month after month year after
5:26year it must be devastating
5:29and he said it is hard it is hope that
5:35sustains me that was his reply four
5:39letters h o p e hope Saving Grace and we
5:44all reach for that to make the world
5:47right we look in hope you must have it
5:51it guides us it fuels you and ultimately
5:56I do believe it is our salvation and our
5:59our Redemption hope sustains us and hope
6:02Keeps Us fueled but hope alone as we
6:07know will not change the world it has to
6:10be supported with tenacity with Clarity
6:13of purpose it has to be supported with
6:15knowledge and an impenetrable belief in
6:19truth and
6:21Injustice Brian Stevenson embodies all
6:24those things he is a gift to the people
6:28whose lives he saved
6:30he is a gift to this movement to this
6:33world and I thank you Brian for your
6:37badge of hope that keeps righteousness
6:39on high and I thank him also for being
6:42here with us today at the Brooklyn
6:45Museum about Brian Stevenson Brian
6:48Stevenson is the executive director of
6:50the Equal justice initiative in
6:52Montgomery Alabama and a professor of
6:54law at New York University uh New York
6:57University School of Law he has won
7:00relief for dozens of condemned prisoners
7:03argued five times before The Supreme
7:06Court and won national Acclaim for his
7:09work challenging bias against the poor
7:12and people of color he has received
7:14numerous Awards including the MacArthur
7:17Foundation genius Grant about just
7:22Mercy Brian Stevenson was a young lawyer
7:24when he founded the Equal justice
7:27initiative in a legal practice dedicated
7:30to defending those most desperate and in
7:33need the poor the wrongly condemned and
7:37women and children trapped in the
7:38farthest reaches of our criminal justice
7:42system one of his first cases was that
7:45of Walter McMillan a young man who was
7:48sentenced to die for notorious murder he
7:52insisted he didn't commit the case Drew
7:56Brian into a tangle of conspiracy
7:58political me nations in legal
8:01brinkmanship and transformed his Brian's
8:05understanding of mercy and Justice
8:08forever just Mercy is at once an
8:11unforgettable account of an idealistic
8:14gifted young lawyers coming of age and
8:17an inspiring argument for passion in the
8:21pursuit of True
8:25Justice New York Times bestseller list
8:28named one of the best books of the Year
8:30by the New York Times Washington Post
8:32Boston Globe Seattle Times Esquire and
8:35time winner of the Carnegie uh Med medal
8:38for non-fiction NAACP image Award books
8:42for a better life award Los Angeles book
8:44prize kirkus reviews prize and American
8:47Library Association not notable book Ted
8:50Con in the New York Times book review
8:53section wrote unfairness in the justice
8:57system is a major theme of our day this
9:01brings new life to the story by placing
9:03it in two affecting contexts Brian
9:06Stevenson's life work and the Deep
9:08strain of racial Injustice in American
9:12Life against tremendous odds Stevenson
9:16has worked to free scores of people from
9:18wrongful or excessive punishment the
9:21message of the book hammered home by
9:24dramatic examples of one man's refusal
9:28to sit quiet ly and continent's horror
9:31is that evil can be
9:33overcome and a difference can be made
9:37Stevenson has been angry about the
9:39criminal justice system for years and we
9:43are all the better for it about the
9:47Equal justice initiative and there are
9:50um uh there are calendars outside for
9:52you to take with you this is their uh
9:55the Equal justice well excuse me
9:57initiative annual report from
10:002015 the eji fight fights for the
10:03release of innocent people wrongly
10:05convicted and condemned to death by
10:08execution or sent to prison for life
10:11they have won new trials for people
10:13illegally convicted and relief for those
10:17unfairly sentenced they have documented
10:20and challenged abusive conditions of
10:22confinement in state jails and prisons
10:24and have continued to fight against the
10:26persecution of children in adult court
10:29and and obtain new sentences for
10:31children who have been condemned to die
10:35in prison some as young as age
10:3913 the eji is committed to ending mass
10:42incarceration combining litigation and
10:45reform advocacy research reports public
10:48education a very Dynamic website and
10:52community outreach to end America's
10:54status as the world's most punitive
10:57Nation with the highest rates of
11:00incarceration on the planet and with
11:03that would you please join me in warmly
11:06welcoming today Brian
11:22Stevenson
11:24thank thank you
11:29thank you uh thank you very much it's a
11:31great great honor for me to be here I'm
11:33delighted uh to be back here in Brooklyn
11:36uh it's an extraordinary honor for me in
11:38one other respect as well as was
11:41mentioned uh by Elizabeth I've I've
11:44really had the great privilege over the
11:45last year uh to be talking to
11:48communities across this country as a
11:49result of this book uh that I wrote and
11:52rarely uh do I get to go places where
11:56two people uh critical to the creation
11:58of this book are in the room with me and
12:00so I I really can't uh miss taking this
12:03opportunity to thank two extraordinary
12:06people uh who made this book possible
12:08and I'm just deeply indebted to both of
12:11them for the way in which they have
12:13allowed us to kind of show people this
12:15world I I don't think I have radical
12:17perspectives and views on a lot of these
12:18issues I believe if most people saw what
12:21I see on a regular basis they would want
12:24change they would demand change I think
12:26if most people understood the things
12:27that I understand about what we're doing
12:29to people in this system of
12:32incarceration and excessive punishment
12:34uh they would want change and I've been
12:36really encouraged by how this book has
12:38allowed me to kind of share that
12:40perspective with other people but it
12:41wouldn't be possible if I hadn't been
12:44really fortunate uh just almost uh it
12:46was a miracle to be connected uh with uh
12:51who I think is the most talented
12:54thoughtful and Visionary editor in
12:56America and I'm really thrilled that
12:58he's here tonight I'd like Chris Jackson
13:00to please stand so I could acknowledge
13:01his wonderful guidance in this project
13:12Chris he's very modest but he is
13:14changing the way we think and talk about
13:16issues of race and Justice and I'm
13:17really grateful for that and another
13:19person who's here tonight uh this
13:21project would not have been possible I
13:22was very reluctant uh to engage in
13:24taking time to write a book to kind of
13:26take time away from my clients and my
13:28work uh but this persistent and very
13:30kind and thoughtful uh person uh led me
13:33to understand uh certain things about
13:35what was possible and he's been an
13:37incredible friend and guide and uh
13:40manager for me and it's my incredible
13:42literary agent Mr Doug Abrams I'd like
13:44him to stand as
13:51well so there are these realities that
13:54that that we have to know about we are
13:56are very different country today than we
13:57were 40 years ago 1972 there were
14:00300,000 people in jails and prisons
14:02today there are 2.3 million the United
14:06States now has the highest rate of
14:07incarceration in the world and it's not
14:10just the people who are in prisoned that
14:13have been affected by this era of over
14:15incarceration we have 6 million people
14:18on probation or Parole in America there
14:21are 70 million Americans with criminal
14:23arrests which means that when they try
14:25to get a job or try to get a loan they
14:26are disfavored they are burdened by that
14:28arrest history
14:29the percentage of women going to prison
14:31has increased
14:33640 uh in the last 20 years 70% of these
14:36women are single parents with minor
14:39children which means that when they go
14:40to jails or prisons their children are
14:42displaced and you're dramatically more
14:44likely to end up in prison if you are
14:46the child of an incarcerated parent uh
14:49there are collateral consequences this
14:50past weekend in Alabama was the
14:53anniversary of the suit to Montgomery
14:54March last year was the 50th anniversary
14:57and the president came and members of
14:59Congress came and 80,000 people came to
15:02participate in the 50th anniversary
15:04celebration of the suelma to Montgomery
15:06March which led to the Voting Rights Act
15:09and very few people who came to Selma
15:11had any idea that today in Alabama
15:1531% of the black male population has
15:17permanently lost the right to vote as a
15:20result of a criminal conviction what we
15:22have done to disenfranchise and
15:24marginalize people of color is a real
15:27crisis and we've got to do something
15:29about that but then there's this other
15:31phenomenon that we haven't addressed I
15:34believe that today in America we have
15:36more innocent people in jails and
15:38prisons than we have ever had in our
15:40nation's history thousands of people
15:43innocent and we cannot understand what a
15:46tragedy that is we cannot understand uh
15:51how uh challenged we ought to be by that
15:54phenomenon until we begin to know the
15:56stories of some of these people
15:59and I was eager to come here to do this
16:01event today because I am able to do it
16:05with an incredible human being uh one of
16:07my clients uh Mr Anthony Ray Hinton Mr
16:10Hinton spent 30 years on Alabama's death
16:13row for Crime he did not commit it was
16:18excruciating it was
16:20devastating he went to death row in 1985
16:23before there were ATMs before there was
16:25an internet before all of the technology
16:27that many of us have been dealing with
16:28and he spent these long years he
16:31witnessed 50 some people go to execution
16:35we talked at times he would talk about
16:36smelling the flesh burning on the day
16:38after these executions and yet he did
16:41something extraordinary he didn't just
16:43survive he became this voice of Hope and
16:47possibility and what excites me about
16:50today is that this time last year Mr
16:52Hinton was locked down in a cell if we
16:55had scheduled this last year I couldn't
16:56have done this with him but today he is
16:59free and he is here with me and it can't
17:02tell you how moved and honored and I and
17:05excited I am about that over the last
17:07year I've been giving talks and I've
17:08been talking about how I don't think we
17:10can change things until we get proximate
17:12until we change narratives until we
17:14allow Our Hope to lead us to do
17:16uncomfortable things and what I wanted
17:18to do today was to give you an
17:19opportunity to get close to this
17:22remarkable human being this Survivor
17:25this Exon this person who was wrongly
17:27condemned because in his story is the
17:30story of our nation and the challenges
17:33that we face and the opportunities that
17:35we have to do more Justice uh I have
17:39been representing people uh on death row
17:41for 30 years uh I've been representing
17:44people in prison for the same time and
17:46usually when I go to jails in prisons
17:47I'm
17:49tolerated sometimes I'm challenged by
17:52Correctional staff who are hostile
17:53sometimes I'm even blocked and and
17:56threatened and menaced uh and during my
17:58my time representing people in jails and
18:00prisons uh that was pretty much the
18:02range of my experiences until I started
18:04working on Mr hinton's case and I had
18:06the great privilege of representing him
18:08for 16 years and something really
18:10extraordinary happened when I would show
18:11up to the prison I'd have guards asking
18:14me when are you going to get ray Hinton
18:15out I had guards questioning me about
18:18how he could be on death row when it was
18:19so clear he was innocent and his witness
18:22was so powerful that it actually changed
18:25the people around him that is the
18:28strength of his Testament that is the
18:29strength of his character and I'm really
18:32deeply deeply honored uh to be able to
18:35share the stage tonight with him uh we'd
18:37like to show you a video just to give
18:38you some context for his case and then
18:41I'd like to bring Mr Hinton to the stage
18:43to talk to you about his experience
18:45before we carry on the conversation so
18:47with that uh let me uh warmly uh ask you
18:50to uh to welcome Mr Hinton followed by
18:52the video and then Mr Hinton will join
18:54the stage thank you very much
18:57[Music]
19:08for 30 years Anthony Ray Hinton was a
19:11dead man
19:14walking thank you
19:16J thank you
19:18Lord
19:19prosecution seemed deemed to take my
19:22life from me 58 years old Hinton lived
19:26more than half his life inside a cage
19:28home in Correctional Facility in
19:30Southern Alabama today he's seeing and
19:32experiencing things for the first time
19:34in decades oh my
19:36goodness
19:39so he is welcomed home a party in his
19:42honor hosted by the Equal justice
19:44initiative led by attorney Brian
19:46Stevenson and his team of attorneys who
19:48fought for decades to win hinton's
19:50Freedom thank you for giving me my life
19:54back just being here as a team you can
19:59say that you got an inome man off death
20:01row his nightmare began in
20:041985 Ronald Reagan was President Back to
20:07the Future was a box office hit and
20:09under the cover of darkness two
20:11Birmingham restaurant managers were shot
20:13dead at closing time just months apart a
20:16third victim another man who survived
20:18the shooting and helped identify
20:2029-year-old Anthony Ray Hinton as the
20:23killer you're a free man now what does
20:25that mean to you it mean everything I
20:27mean
20:29uh you never think about your freedom
20:32until it's taken away from you you
20:34couldn't put a price tag on it my $12
20:37back already so much about the world has
20:39changed but the greatest still is a
20:41world without his mother she died while
20:44he was locked away it can't get no lower
20:47for
20:48me I'm not a shame of I'm proud of
20:52That's The Bu the love of my life he
20:55goes back to the home they share
20:57together now abandoned kind of hate to
20:59see it in this shape it's his first time
21:02there since the night it was all taken
21:04away this is the room where hinton's
21:06mother kept her 38 caliber revolver
21:09police said it was the murder weapon
21:10hinton's courta appointed public
21:12defender hired a supposed ballistics
21:14expert to dispute the prosecution's
21:15claim about the murder weapon a
21:18persuasive expert he was not so his
21:21ballistics expert was blind in one eye
21:23yes that's correct he had to ask how to
21:25turn on the machine he couldn't see it
21:28he had to ask somebody please help me so
21:31when he put him on the stand as my
21:35witness They Crucified him I
21:39said they going to find me guilty Hinton
21:43was sentenced to death He was ordered to
21:45spend the remainder of his life in
21:46prison living inside a 5 by seven cell
21:50pretty much sleep in a fetal position
21:52because your feet hang over the bed you
21:54only have a bed that is mounted to the
21:57wall on a toilet
21:59and that's what I lived in for 30 years
22:02they took my 30s my 40 my 50 but what
22:08they couldn't take was my
22:17joy I couldn't do a thing about the
22:20years but I could control my joy 53
22:25inmates were executed at homman while
22:27Hinton was on death row my dog is M with
22:30being seen so many people that I got to
22:32know be executed he languished in prison
22:36for years before his case reached
22:37appeals court I was had never been so
22:40convinced of someone's innocence than I
22:42had in Mr hinton's Case no one asked
22:44them judge subel CA was one of those
22:46appell at court judges who believed his
22:48story there was no incriminating
22:50evidence he didn't have anything from
22:51the robbery there were no fingerprints
22:53this is extremely unusual his appeal was
22:56denied but his team kept fighting
22:59we had exhausted every state court
23:00appeal and it was the United States
23:02Supreme Court that finally intervene the
23:04result was a new trial the break Hinton
23:06had been waiting for but just a few
23:08weeks ago the state of Alabama dropped
23:10the case after a new look of the
23:12evidence could not MCH the bullets to
23:14the
23:14gun and Hinton was
23:18released since I've been locked up for
23:2130 years and finances is tight $5 a
23:26slight I don't sense any bitterness
23:29why is that bitterness kills the
23:33soul
23:34I cannot hate because my bible teach me
23:39not to hate I've seen hate at is worse
23:43what would it profit me to hate I want
23:47you to know there is a God he sit high
23:51but he looks low thank you Lord he will
23:53destroy but yet he will defend and he
23:56defend me
24:04[Applause]
24:05[Music]
24:39that three minutes four minutes
24:43film
24:49cannot tell
24:53you the 30 years of pure hell that I
24:56went through
24:59I went
25:01through 30 years of pure
25:04hell because I was born black and
25:08poor make no mistake about
25:12it the prosecution
25:16knew that I was
25:19innocent but
25:21yet when you have the
25:25power to send an innocent man to death
25:30when you
25:32racist and that exactly what they
25:36did 30 years
25:41ago I
25:43had made a
25:46mistake instead of standing
25:48outside I came inside and my mom she
25:52asked me she said uh are you going to
25:55Revival tonight and I said yes ma'am
25:59she said well you got time to go out
26:01there and cut the
26:03grass and I looked at my mom and I said
26:06Mama I cut the grass
26:08tomorrow and my mom looked at me and she
26:11said I'm trying my
26:12best to see how you got out cut the
26:16grass tomorrow out to go cut the
26:19grass and one would have to know my
26:22mother when she tell you to do something
26:25you go out and you do it
26:28and so I went on outside and I fired up
26:31the lawn mow and I began to cut the
26:33grass and about 15 minutes into cutting
26:35the
26:35grass I happened to look up and there
26:38was two white gentlemen standing at the
26:41edge of the porch I cut the lwn off and
26:44I asked them I said can I help you and
26:48they said yes we're looking for Anthony
26:49Ray henon I said that would be mean how
26:53can I help you they identified them
26:56themselves as a lieutenant and a
26:58sergeant of the bman police
27:00department again I said well how can I
27:03help you and they said well right now we
27:05have a warrant for your arrest we would
27:07like for you to place your hand behind
27:09your back I did as I was told and I
27:12asked him what am I being arrested for
27:15and they said we will explain that to
27:17you later so they had every intention of
27:20carrying putting me in the squad car but
27:23I kind of bed I said I want to go inside
27:26and tell my mother that I'm being
27:27arrested it for
27:29something and one of the detectives said
27:31we can't let you go inside and we stood
27:33there and we ared for about 15 second to
27:36302 and the other detective said let him
27:39go in and tell his mother he being
27:41arrested I go in the house and I show my
27:44mom the Handcuff and like any good
27:47mother she began to scream and holler
27:49what are y'all doing with my baby and I
27:52said baby literally because I am the
27:54baby of 10 five boys and five girls
27:59one of the detectives said take him on
28:00out and now I'm going to stand here and
28:02talk to his mother and I on my way to
28:05jail they asked me did I own a pisture
28:09and I said no they said Do Your Mother
28:11own a pisture and I said yes my mom
28:14taught me to tell the truth she always
28:16taught me to stand up she said do not
28:19ever throw a rock and hide your hand if
28:22you was man enough to throw that rock be
28:24man enough to say you throw that rock so
28:27I told them the truth that my mom had a
28:29pistol and they went back and retrieved
28:31the pistol they had no warrant but my
28:34mom gave them the pistol thinking it
28:36would help
28:38me they come and they car me to jail and
28:42on my way to jail I asked this
28:44detective 50 times what am I being
28:48arrested
28:49for and detective never would answer and
28:52I guess on the
28:5451st he finally answered he turned
28:57around and he said
28:58you want to know what you being arrested
29:00for I said yes sir he said first degree
29:02robbery first degree kidnapp and first
29:05degree tempted murder I said man you got
29:08the wrong
29:09person he continued to look at me and he
29:12said I don't care whether you did or not
29:15but you going to be charged with it
29:17you're going to be found guilty for it
29:19he said there's five things that going
29:21to find you guilty would you like to
29:23know what they are I said yes sir he
29:26said number one you're black number two
29:29a white man is going to say you shot him
29:31whether you shot him or not again I
29:33don't care he said number three you're
29:36going to have a white prosecutor number
29:39four you going to have a white judge and
29:42number five by all account you more than
29:45likely will have an allh jeury and he
29:48said you know what that spell and he
29:50repeated the word conviction conviction
29:54conviction conviction
29:56conviction and so I go go to jail and I
29:59asked this
30:00detective I said what time what date did
30:03this crime take place and he go through
30:06his file and he tell me I said it
30:07couldn't have been me for I was at work
30:10at that time I gave him a supervisor
30:13name and I gave him the number where he
30:15could call and check and apparently they
30:17did
30:18something and he come back probably
30:21within 2 hours and he said we not
30:24charging you for those three Crim we now
30:27officially charging you with two counts
30:29of first-degree
30:31murder I didn't even know what capital
30:33murder
30:34was he explained it to me and I went
30:39before a
30:40judge the judge asked me could I afford
30:43an attorney and I told him no he said
30:45the great state of Alabama will'll
30:47appoint you one and he called this
30:49lawyer up and told this lawyer that he
30:53wanted to represent me in two capital
30:55murder
30:56trial the lawyer did not ask me my
31:00name he looked at me and he
31:03said I did not go to law school to do
31:07Pro bonal
31:09work and I looked at the
31:13lawyer and I said would it make a
31:16difference to you if I told you that I
31:19was
31:20innocent the Lord you look back at me
31:23and he
31:24said all of
31:26y'all are always saying you didn't do
31:29something and so I lingered in jail for
31:322 years and I went to trial and they
31:34found me guilty a Capal murder and on
31:36December 17 1987 I was sentenced to
31:40death
31:42row and for three years once I got to
31:45death
31:46row I did not say a word to
31:50anyone it was as though God had just
31:52taken my vocal card and every time an
31:55officer would ask me my name ask me any
31:57anything I would write it on a piece of
32:01paper and one night going into the
32:04fourth year a
32:07inmate I heard him crying and I asked
32:09him what was wrong and he told me that
32:12he had got word that his mother had
32:14passed and I told him look at it that
32:18now he had someone in heaven that would
32:20a his case before God and I told him a
32:23joke and we began to
32:25laugh and the next morning
32:28my sense of humor kicked in I often tell
32:32people I was born with two things I was
32:36born with a mother that loved me
32:39unconditional and I was born with a
32:41sense of
32:42humor my sense of humor cared me so far
32:45till I began to believe that I was
32:47somewhat kind of crazy
32:49myself I imagine things while I was
32:53there I imagined having tea with the
32:56queen
32:58and I imagine that Queen asking me but
33:01you care for a spot to
33:03te and I would tell the queen well of
33:06course and she would ask me what would I
33:09like in my tea and I would tell her a
33:11spot to
33:12lemon and so that is how I was able to
33:16cope being in a 5 by seven I even
33:19imagine marrying and I married two of
33:23the most beautiful women that I think
33:25God had the privilege of making and one
33:28of them was Hal
33:31Berry and the second was Sandra
33:36Bullock and so I tell people they ask me
33:39why did you do that and I tell them that
33:41when you live in a 5 by S for 24 hours
33:43today you have to allow your mind to be
33:48free my body was there but my mind
33:50soared my mind went everywhere I went to
33:54France and I racked up so many freaking
33:57mileage that after this evening if any
34:01of you want to buy any freaking mileage
34:03come see
34:04me but as I sit there and begin to
34:07wonder how am I going
34:10to get my case overturned how am I going
34:13to get my
34:15freedom I never did think about
34:17it for I also was mourn and was made to
34:22believe in God I was also made to
34:24believe in faith and have faith and and
34:27so one day a guard come to my cell and
34:30he said Mr Hinton you have an
34:33attorney I said I don't have an attorney
34:36he said well someone out there
34:37pretending to be an
34:39attorney and I said okay he said well
34:41get up and put on your clothes and go
34:43out there and talk to him and I go out
34:44there and he tell
34:46me somebody by the name of Mr Bryant
34:49Stevenson had asked him to represent
34:53me he told me his name and he told me he
34:55was from Boston I didn't know Mr
34:57Stevenson I never heard of Mr Stevenson
34:59and I didn't know anything about
35:02eji but when he said he was from
35:06Boston I said I wish Mr Stevenson had
35:08checked with me before he sent you down
35:10here for I am a beloved Yankee
35:15fan
35:18I I said I don't know how a Yankee and
35:21the Boston attorney going to get to work
35:24uh work together I said but for your
35:25sake I'm willing to put my personal
35:28feeling
35:30aside and let you work on my
35:33case and for 2 years he worked on my
35:36case and he came to see me on the third
35:39year and he said Mr Hinton I'm trying to
35:42get you a life without parole and I
35:45looked at him and I said life without
35:47parole for Guilt in a guilty people not
35:50innocent people I said so since you feel
35:53that I'm guilty I need someone that
35:56believe in me I said today this is where
36:01we part when you go out the front
36:03door don't worry about coming back I
36:06need someone to work on my case that
36:08believe in me and he said you sure I
36:11said I am and so I goes back toward
36:15myself and I'm telling myself you got to
36:17be the dumbest person in the world you
36:20fir the only lawyer that you had and as
36:23I go back the lawyer the uh that I F he
36:27goes and I go back to my cell and one of
36:30the Gods is watching TV and Lord and
36:34behold there's Mr Brian stev and on
36:36TV and I asked the god I said who is
36:39that he said that's Brian Stevenson he's
36:41against the death P he of Montgomery and
36:43I said well be quiet let me hear what
36:45the man is talking about and I listened
36:48and I loved to what he was saying and I
36:50knew that I had to write this man but I
36:52didn't know how I was going to write him
36:55because most people say I must be a
36:58doctor in another world because you
37:00cannot understand my
37:03handwriting but that night I began to
37:06write Mr Stevenson and it was as though
37:09something took my hand and wrote the
37:11perfect letter I remember saying that Mr
37:14Stevenson my name and I was innocent I
37:17remember telling me that I cannot afford
37:19to pay him for his time but I will be
37:22more than willing to pay him from his
37:24gas to come down and talk to me I told
37:27told him in my letter if he could find
37:30just one tread of evidence that point to
37:33my gft don't worry about coming I would
37:37take whatever punishment that the state
37:40was given me I received the letter from
37:43Mr
37:44Stevenson replying that he would read my
37:47case and he would get back in touch with
37:49me and true to his word approximately 4
37:52months
37:53later I got a letter that he had made an
37:56appointment with the prison to come see
37:58me and when he
38:02came the
38:05moment the moment I shook his hand I
38:08knew that God had sent me his
38:11best I felt
38:13something that to this day I cannot
38:16describe and we sit down and we talked
38:19about my case and I looked at Mr
38:20Stevenson and I said Mr Stevenson I need
38:23you to do something for me and he said
38:26what is that
38:28I said I need you to
38:30hire a bisted
38:33expert Mr Stevenson looked at me and he
38:36said well I was going to do that
38:39anyway and I said no Mr Stevenson I'm
38:41not explaining myself right I need you
38:43to hire a ballistic
38:48expert but I
38:52need I need this Bist expert to be white
38:58I need him to
38:59be from the
39:02south I need him to believe in the death
39:05penalty I said but more
39:08important all I ask of him is to tell
39:11the
39:12truth and Mr Stevenson left me that day
39:16and he said I would do my best to try to
39:19find that type of
39:22person 4 months
39:26later the God come and said call your
39:29lawyer and I called Mr Stevenson and he
39:32said
39:33Ray I hired two experts out of
39:37Texas and one of them out of
39:40Virginia they testified 98% of the time
39:44for the
39:45prosecution they send men to death row
39:49they never help get them off
39:52deathro and I asked Mr Stevenson I said
39:55did you say to them from Texas and one
39:57of them for Virginia he said yes I said
40:01well they don't get no Southern than
40:03Texas and
40:04Virginia I said when will they be coming
40:07to check the bullets and Mr Stevenson
40:09said well I don't know but they will
40:11come and I said okay thank you and we
40:14hung up later on Mr Stevenson told
40:19me what already
40:23knew that all three of them came at
40:26different times and they test the
40:29bullets and they all came back with the
40:32conclusion that the bullets did not
40:34match the way the state said they
40:37did for the state of
40:41Alabama took 30 years of my
40:46life and while that 30 years was going
40:50on I received the sad news that my mom
40:54had passed
40:57I don't think there's a young man in the
40:59world that loved his mother more than I
41:02did I wasn't born with money I wasn't
41:05born with a lot of thing but I was born
41:08with a
41:09mother that I could talk to that loved
41:13me and at that moment I began to say
41:16well I don't care what the state do my
41:19mom is gone I have no reason to
41:22live and I Heard a Voice
41:26say I did not raise you to be a quitter
41:30I did not raise you to quit you fight
41:34you prove that you're
41:36innocent and I called Mr Stevenson and I
41:39said Mr Stevenson I want you to do
41:42whatever it takes to win my freedom and
41:46Mr Stevenson said okay R we going to
41:49give it our
41:51best and he came down one day and he
41:55said I am tired
41:57of fooling with the judges in
42:00Alabama I want to send your case to the
42:02United States Supreme
42:05Court and Mr Stevenson told
42:08me if I lost it at the United States
42:11Supreme Court level what would
42:15happen and I asked Mr Stevenson I said
42:17do you have any change in your pocket
42:20and he said yes I said will you buy me a
42:23Cocola at the machine and he said yes
42:26would you like some chip I should know
42:27just the coat at that
42:30moment after listening at the
42:33possibility I
42:36prayed instead of that being Coke in
42:39that can I hope it was full of
42:41whiskey because I didn't feel that no
42:44man should make a a decision off a soft
42:48drink he need a stiff
42:51drink but I took a swallow that coke and
42:55I slammed the can down on the table like
42:57to do in back in the western days and I
42:59told Mr Stevenson I said you are the one
43:02that went to
43:03Harvard you do what you feel is
43:06necessary Mr Stevenson said good I'm
43:09going to fight it and I'm going to send
43:12it to the United States Supreme Court
43:14two years later the United States
43:16Supreme Court did something that they
43:18never have done in the history of the
43:20Court they rued 9 to zero that I was
43:23entitled to a new trial
43:28and I thought I was going
43:30home after finding out what I know that
43:33the bullet didn't match Mr
43:36Stevenson petitioned three different
43:38attorney generals in Alabama and asked
43:41them to just retest the
43:44bullets but my
43:47life didn't matter to
43:51anyone and I had to sit on death row for
43:55an extra 16 years years when all they
43:59had to
44:00do was retest the
44:06bullets but they refused to do
44:10so and so
44:12finally we goes to
44:16Birmingham and the DA
44:18office now play tricks and they accused
44:22eji of not turning the gun over the gun
44:26had been lost
44:28the judge granted them a two week stay
44:30they find the gun and they come back now
44:34they said they can't find the
44:35bullets and I had to stay in
44:38jail an extra two
44:42months and on April the
44:453D
44:472015 I walked out of a free
44:52man but in
44:54that being free
44:58every
44:59morning I still wake up at 3:00
45:04a.m.
45:06expecting someone to holler
45:08breakfast because on death row they feed
45:11you every morning at 3:00 a.m. because
45:14it is the law that they have to wake you
45:17up and offer it to you whether you eat
45:20it or
45:22not I find myself instead of show every
45:27every day I still showel sometime every
45:30other day because that's how we show on
45:34death
45:35row I haven't been out a year I want you
45:39to know that 30
45:42years 8 months 9 months a year would not
45:45erase 30
45:46years that house that you seen that was
45:49in bad shape through generous donation
45:52I've been able to fix it and I
45:55have what I think is some of the nicest
45:58furnit that you could look
46:00at after sleeping in a fetus position
46:03for 30 years I went out and I bought
46:06this kingside
46:08bed I didn't just buy any Keen siiz bed
46:13I bought a California king
46:17sign the problem with that
46:20is I still yet
46:27I still cannot
46:29sleep stretched out in that big bed I
46:34still bring my knees up to my
46:39chest I have this beautiful
46:42shower instead of showering every day
46:45two time three times a
46:47day I find
46:50myself showering every other
46:54day but I want you to know today
46:58that I forgive those racist white men
47:01that put me in
47:02prison they haven't asked me to forgive
47:05them I forgive
47:07them not so they can sleep at
47:10night I forgive them so I can sleep at
47:14night I forgive them so I can enjoy the
47:18rest of my life I forgive them so I can
47:21enjoy all of the things that God create
47:25for most of you
47:27do not pay the Sun the moon the stars
47:30any
47:32attention I go out every night and I
47:35look at the Moon and I look at the stars
47:38because I was denied that privilege for
47:4030
47:41years most of you run out of the rain I
47:44run into the rain because rain was not
47:47allowed to fall on my body for 30
47:51years I
47:54believe that when you lose something
47:58and when it find it ways back to you you
48:01should love it even more I love life
48:04more than I ever have the things that I
48:08used to take for granted I do not take
48:11those things for granted
48:13anymore there's two little birds that
48:15Waits on me every
48:18morning before they begin to talk and I
48:20sit there and I watch them there was a
48:22time I would not have paid those birds
48:24any
48:25attention but being on death row for 30
48:28years in a sale that is no bigger than
48:30your
48:32bathroom it makes you appreciate life no
48:36one in Alabama have yet to apologize to
48:41me for the 30 years that they robbed me
48:45off I
48:48had the undone pleasure a smelling human
48:52being that was
48:55literally set on fire by the electri
49:00chair I have to try to make every day
49:05the best day that I can I try to put one
49:08foot
49:09forward and every day I am
49:12determined to make someone
49:15smile I would never treat anyone the way
49:19that I was treated because I
49:23believe that what this world
49:25need is
49:27love and I believe that if anyone can
49:31show anyone any kind of compassion and
49:34love it is I for I do not hold
49:40anyone I do not hate I do not think
49:43about those men that literally put me on
49:46death row for something that I didn't do
49:50and then
49:51closing I would like for everyone in
49:54this room to try
49:59imagine being in a 5 by
50:02S and after you imagine being in a 5 by
50:07S imagine being there for 30
50:12years and after you imagine being there
50:15for 30
50:17years try to
50:19imagine being there for something that
50:22only you and God know that you didn't do
50:27thank you
50:28[Applause]
50:34[Music]
50:35[Applause]
50:36[Music]
50:42[Applause]
50:42[Music]
50:43[Applause]
50:44[Music]
50:47[Applause]
50:51[Music]
50:53[Applause]
50:54[Music]
50:57[Applause]
50:59[Music]
51:04so you really cannot appreciate um the
51:08consequences of what I think our
51:10Collective indifference have done has
51:12done on this issue of mass incarceration
51:14until you start uh getting to know
51:17people like uh Anthony Ray Hinton and
51:21I've told lots of people that no one has
51:24inspired me more no one has encourage me
51:27more uh than Mr Hinton and uh uh we
51:31would be on death row sometimes in the
51:34visitation
51:35room and uh the way this the appeals
51:38process works is that you'll file
51:40something and then you'll get a ruling
51:43we kept filing things and things would
51:45go so well at court we had the hearings
51:47where we put on these experts that Mr
51:49Hinton was describing they did great
51:50nobody contradicted the thing they said
51:53uh we had the witnesses come in
51:54everybody was reinforcing his case and
51:56it was
51:57difficult to go to a hearing like that
51:59and have everything go perfectly and
52:01then get a call saying that our motion
52:03for Relief had been
52:05denied and it felt like I was always
52:07calling Mr Hinton saying the court has
52:09denied relief and denied relief and
52:13denied relief and I would go down there
52:15and sometimes and we' talk about it was
52:17so painful and
52:19heartbreaking uh and yet it didn't take
52:21us long before we'd be talking and uh he
52:24would say something to me that would
52:25make me laugh we'd be in the visitation
52:27room just laughing and there was this
52:30Dynamic that came out of all of this uh
52:33which was in so incredibly challenging
52:35but at the same time inspiring and so I
52:38just love being in public places like
52:41this with the opportunities like the
52:43opportunity I have right now um to say
52:46to you Mr Hinton how grateful I am how
52:49privileged I am to have had the great
52:53Fortune to have stood by your side and
52:55represent you along this Journey you
52:57have made my career and the work that I
52:58do so much more meaningful and I believe
53:02that you've got even more to share with
53:04the world that can make us appreciate
53:05the demands of Justice the need for
53:07justice but more than that the
53:09importance of forgiveness and compassion
53:12and so I want to thank you publicly in
53:13this space for taking the time to do
53:15what you do and sharing your heart so
53:16freely thank you thank you so much
53:21[Music]
53:23[Applause]
53:24[Music]
53:26so so so I want to begin by just asking
53:28a couple of questions about uh re-entry
53:31so in the day um that we walked out of
53:34that
53:35Jail uh it was a kind of an overcast day
53:38and people think that this is made up
53:39but it's not it was an overcast day and
53:42we walked out you walked out first and
53:44your family was there you saw some of
53:45that in the video and it did seem like
53:46as soon as you walked out the sun began
53:49to shine a little bit and uh we talked
53:52to the press and all of that uh but the
53:55world has changed a lot
53:57since uh when you went to prison and we
53:59did some interviews and things like that
54:01and I know your great friend Lester
54:03Bailey was there there and he uh picked
54:06you up and and i' I'd like you to just
54:08kind of talk about where you went
54:10immediately after uh you came out the
54:13jail and what that experience was like
54:15because because there was things were
54:16different there was technology
54:19oh on getting out of
54:23prison Lester my best friend which I did
54:26didn't
54:28mention stayed by my side for 30 years
54:31he came to see me every
54:34month 278 miles one
54:38way and he kept telling
54:42me everything have changed everything
54:45has
54:46changed and I said okay so I get out on
54:50Good
54:51Friday I go to church on Easter Sunday
54:57and I noticed
54:59the ERS get up and they go back toward
55:02the
55:03back and I'm watching them I got $22 in
55:07my
55:08pocket and I see them get these old time
55:12I call them collection
55:15plat and they come by and I go in my
55:18pocket and I reach and I give him $20
55:20I'm thinking he going to ask me how much
55:22I want to give he keep the whole 20
55:30uh I don't say nothing because I'm in
55:32God house and I want to say hey bring me
55:35some
55:36chain but I didn't so he come back again
55:40and I give him my last $2 and after
55:44church I tell my best friend I said you
55:46lied to me 56 years we've been knowing
55:49each other and you tell me a lie and he
55:51said what what you talking about I said
55:54you told me everything had changed I
55:56said they still passing those old
55:58collection plate around everything have
56:00not
56:01changed and so when we leave church and
56:04up the day that I got out I asked him to
56:07take me to the place where they laid my
56:11mom because I didn't know where she was
56:15buried and he said okay we get in this
56:17car and I don't know that you remember
56:19he got this nice Escalade and just the
56:23two of us when we get in there and we
56:26going down the road and all of a
56:29sudden some white lady come on and said
56:33in one tenth of a
56:35mile
56:41turn she said in one1 of a mile turn
56:46right and I said what the
56:49hell I said where's that white lady
56:53at and he just dying laughing I said you
56:55didn't hear that white lady and he just
56:58laughing I said listen a white lady in
57:00this car I know didn't nobody get in
57:03that car but me and my best
57:06friend I wanted to know how did she get
57:09in that car better yet what is she doing
57:11in this car and he just laughing and he
57:14pointed
57:15at what I thought was the radio I said
57:18no this was in the radio he point he
57:20said that's a GPS tractor he said she
57:23will tell us everywhere we need to go
57:26when the
57:28turn and I found that to be amazing that
57:31modern
57:33technology had rigged up something now
57:35that you can just punch you in and
57:37they'll tell you exact but the white
57:39lady scared
57:41me you have to remember I went to prison
57:44because of white people and I'm a still
57:47kind of lital white people I thought it
57:50was a trick but um that's it it it's
57:54been it's been really uh um amazing uh
57:58to see each month go by you know when
58:01when you first got up that day and I I'd
58:04gotten you a little iPhone we were
58:05playing with it uh and you know uh then
58:10you did some other things and and you
58:12got an email and you've been making this
58:16progress what do you think is uh you've
58:19been able to adjust to the most in the
58:22last 11 months and what do you think you
58:25still haven't been able to adjust to
58:26very much I've been able to adjust to
58:29the infrastructure when I left most of
58:31the road was just two lane highways now
58:33you got this interstate this
58:36Technologies uh the telephone and I look
58:39out in the audience
58:41and perhaps someone can tell me this
58:47text I don't understand why you text
58:50somebody when you can just call them and
58:52tell
58:53them what you want and my little niece
58:56she always telling me Uncle Ray I can
58:59group text 15
59:01people and I said why would you want 14
59:03other people know what you're talking
59:06about and I just being old school think
59:10that texting is kind of lazy just pick
59:13up Di and number and just tell whoever
59:15you want or what it is but there's so
59:19much that I feel that I have been
59:23cheated off I still yet do not know how
59:25to
59:26download and I hear you can get some
59:28free
59:30music uh I don't know how to download
59:33that uh I can hear you can get some free
59:36movies I don't know how to do that uh
59:40but the phones and everything is so
59:44unique and it just shows you that how
59:47great man mine is that you can put a
59:50foam in your pocket and uh I even
59:53learned how to uh my best friend I gave
59:56him a different call from anybody
59:58everybody else a noral rain just regular
1:00:01rain he has got a special tone to it and
1:00:06and no matter where I hear that ring and
1:00:07I run to the phone because it's him and
1:00:11I'm just trying to
1:00:12learn how in the world that this modern
1:00:16technology come from when I used to be
1:00:19in the street I used to see men claming
1:00:21telegram Po and now you call the other
1:00:24day I was down in Montgomery and
1:00:26something was wrong with my phone and
1:00:28the lady said all of your messages up in
1:00:31the cloud and I'm looking up in the sky
1:00:34trying don't know what she mean by Cloud
1:00:37but the guy that was with me was trying
1:00:39to explain to me
1:00:42and I know it kept saying megabites and
1:00:45I still don't know what a megabites is
1:00:47and I just don't ask people because I
1:00:49don't want to feel I really don't want
1:00:52to feel dumb to some people I don't want
1:00:54people to look at me and wow for those
1:00:57that don't know me where you been for
1:00:59the last 40 years you know and uh I
1:01:01pretend like I know what they talking
1:01:03about and I'm saying when they leave
1:01:05what the hell she just said so I just go
1:01:08that way but modern Technologies is
1:01:11something that I don't believe that I
1:01:13will ever be able to catch up because
1:01:16when I got out you had the privilege of
1:01:18handing me an i5 now they talking about
1:01:23I6 and somebody told me where they
1:01:25coming out with i7 I said they can come
1:01:27out with whatever they want I ain't
1:01:29trying to come out with nothing else but
1:01:30this i5 and like I say it's so much on
1:01:33there that I haven't learned uh I got
1:01:37lost about 3 weeks ago and my best
1:01:39friend said you got a map on your phone
1:01:41all you got to do is tell it I don't
1:01:43know how to go on there and tell it
1:01:45person where I want to go and and people
1:01:48don't have time to just sit and go over
1:01:51stuff with you uh everybody on the Hur
1:01:53so I just try to leave at time
1:01:56uh other day I had an appointment and I
1:01:59needed to be there at 9:00 I left at 600
1:02:01so I make sure I get there and know but
1:02:04if I had known how to work the modern
1:02:07technology I could have left at a decent
1:02:08hour and got there but uh hopefully one
1:02:11day I can catch up a little bit better
1:02:14than what I am now well I think you're
1:02:15doing remarkably well because you were
1:02:17sending me Tex emails and I hard figure
1:02:19out how to send them back so I think
1:02:21you're doing great what do you think
1:02:23it's been the hardest to kind of make
1:02:24the adjustments I know you talked about
1:02:27still not being able to get out of that
1:02:29routine that rigorous restrictive
1:02:31routine that they have people on on the
1:02:34rad uh what do you think has been
1:02:37hardest I think the hardest is you know
1:02:40when I got out of
1:02:41prison the state of Alabama did not
1:02:44offer me any type of psychological help
1:02:49uh I don't believe any of us is was
1:02:54created to survive 30 years in a
1:02:57cage
1:02:59uh I do believe that there is
1:03:03something
1:03:05mentally uh wrong with me I try my best
1:03:08to ignore I find myself thinking more of
1:03:12being on death row then perhaps I
1:03:14should uh but for instant as I said
1:03:19every morning I'm up at 3:00
1:03:21a.m. and I get up and I cannot go back
1:03:24to sleep doctors I went to my doctor and
1:03:27he gave me some medicine and I do
1:03:30believe that mind over man is more
1:03:32stronger that medicine did not help me
1:03:34at all uh 15 minutes uh to 3:00 every
1:03:38morning I'm up and I sit up and most of
1:03:42the time I read and I ask myself did I
1:03:45shower
1:03:47yesterday and if I convinced myself yeah
1:03:50you shall yesterday for when we was on
1:03:52death row you just kind of like washed
1:03:55up in the sink so those prison mentality
1:03:58is still on in my mind and when it get
1:04:03dark I begin to look for a correction
1:04:06officer to say hey it's time to go in um
1:04:10I have the privilege of opening my
1:04:13cabinets and eating whatever I want to
1:04:17eat but believe it or not when you get
1:04:19used to prison food other food just
1:04:21don't taste the same and so I'm trying
1:04:24to learn how to get my pallet back back
1:04:26but one thing I can say is that I can
1:04:30cook uh perhaps the best homemade red
1:04:35velv cake than anyone oh you can
1:04:39definitely do that I I I'm a witness to
1:04:41that absolutely but uh people ask me
1:04:45every day you know how do you try to
1:04:49survive and I have to believe that uh
1:04:52through God's strengthen me and I have
1:04:55to believe that there is something
1:04:57better and I cannot afford to just relax
1:05:02[Music]
1:05:03and having anyone caught on every day I
1:05:07make sure that I am surrounded by people
1:05:12uh when I first got out I was going to a
1:05:14restaurant and I would ask the waitress
1:05:16would you mind signing your
1:05:19name
1:05:21so if something came back up I could say
1:05:25I was there at this restaurant and that
1:05:28waitress uh she signed her name because
1:05:31I went to
1:05:32prison as they said because I couldn't
1:05:36give an account where I was uh the night
1:05:38of the crime so I still now come out and
1:05:41I live every day in more like a a diary
1:05:45wherever I go I make sure someone
1:05:48remember that I was with them at that
1:05:50particular time and every night I'm at
1:05:54home about by myself uh I get on the
1:05:58telephone because I'm told that uh they
1:06:00can track exactly where you was with the
1:06:03phone and so uh if something come up I
1:06:05can say well I was at home in my living
1:06:07room talking to whoever and so uh um I
1:06:11don't think as I said a year is going to
1:06:14erase 30 years uh I've been deeply
1:06:18scared and I think it going to take some
1:06:20time uh before I can really feel secure
1:06:23about where I'm at and where I'm
1:06:26uh around I make sure that uh I leave
1:06:31that house door every morning
1:06:36uh life have taught
1:06:39me this trust factor is gone I didn't
1:06:43know anyone in this orig if I had met
1:06:45them I would trust them my mom told me a
1:06:48long time ago trust people until they
1:06:50give you a reason not to trust them and
1:06:54now I only trust two
1:06:57people I trust you and I trust my best
1:07:00friend
1:07:02Lester
1:07:05uh I know that might sound somewhat
1:07:08cold but that's what 30 years have done
1:07:11to me I still believe in treating people
1:07:15with
1:07:16respect but when someone say they want
1:07:19to do something when someone ask I just
1:07:22don't have that trust uh that I once had
1:07:25yeah and I would love for that to come
1:07:27back because that's who I am you know
1:07:30yeah so so I want to talk a little bit
1:07:32uh we're going to open this uper
1:07:33questions in a bit but I do want to talk
1:07:35about um Mr hinton's experience uh in
1:07:40the context of this trauma uh because
1:07:43that's what he's describing you can't go
1:07:46through what he went through and not be
1:07:49challenged uh traumatized by that and I
1:07:52want to put it in a broader historical
1:07:54context before we open things up in many
1:07:56ways uh when I was a young lawyer I
1:08:00thought all I had to do was go to court
1:08:04and I represent people like Mr hon and
1:08:07the courts say he's been wrong convicted
1:08:09we're going to get him out and I've told
1:08:12him this he knows this we I've lost a
1:08:13lot of sleep on this because I couldn't
1:08:15understand with the evidence so
1:08:17overwhelmingly clear why did people keep
1:08:20saying deny not going to let him go it
1:08:23was so clear there are cases of people
1:08:25who are innocent who've been wrongly
1:08:27convicted where the evidence is not
1:08:29clear there's you know there's competing
1:08:31evidence there's something that's a
1:08:33little tricky and in those cases you can
1:08:36reconcile while some people are saying
1:08:38no he's guilty and while he's not but
1:08:40there are other cases like where there
1:08:42was no evidence of guilt we knew exactly
1:08:44where he was when his crime took place
1:08:46and yet the state persisted they didn't
1:08:49have a single piece of evidence that
1:08:50would persuade them we had discredited
1:08:52the ballistics we had discredited the
1:08:54gun have kept saying they in and what
1:08:57occurred to me some years ago that the
1:09:00reason why we're having such hard times
1:09:02is because is this
1:09:04narrative that we have in this country
1:09:07that allows us to not value the
1:09:10victimization of all people equally some
1:09:13people's victimization just doesn't get
1:09:16credited and that victimization is with
1:09:19r m do you want me to use this one let
1:09:21me I can do this over let me stop here
1:09:23and open it up for questions for
1:09:24everyone I want thank everybody for
1:09:26being
1:09:26[Applause]
1:09:39here I I think we'll just do we have
1:09:42time for the video we how long video 5
1:09:45minutes okay so we'll show the video
1:09:47then we'll take the
1:09:51questions in 1619 when the first
1:09:54Africans were brought brought to the
1:09:55British colonies by ship to Jamestown
1:09:58Virginia they held the legal status of
1:10:00servant but as the Region's economic
1:10:03system became increasingly dependent on
1:10:05forced labor we descended into slavery
1:10:10the institution of American slavery
1:10:11developed as a permanent hereditary
1:10:14system centrally tied to
1:10:16race millions of black people were
1:10:18forcibly taken from Africa crammed on
1:10:21ships and brought to the Americas
1:10:23through a dangerous and deadly Journey
1:10:25that that crossed the Atlantic Millions
1:10:28died once on our Shores slavery deprived
1:10:32the enslaved person of any legal rights
1:10:34or autonomy and granted the slave owner
1:10:36complete power over the black men women
1:10:38and children legally recognized as
1:10:41property an ideology of white supremacy
1:10:44A Narrative of racial difference was
1:10:46created to rationalize and justify the
1:10:49continuation of
1:10:51slavery American slavery was often
1:10:54brutal barbar IC and violent in addition
1:10:57to the hardship of forced labor enslaved
1:10:59people were maimed or killed by slave
1:11:01owners as punishment for working too
1:11:03slowly visiting a spouse living on
1:11:06another Plantation or even learning to
1:11:08read enslaved people were also sexually
1:11:12exploited the United States Congress
1:11:15finally banned the importation of slaves
1:11:17from Africa in 1808 slavery was widely
1:11:20considered a gross human rights
1:11:22violation yet enslavement was retained
1:11:25and persisted the 1808 declaration
1:11:28caused the demand for slave labor to
1:11:30Skyrocket in the Lower South and the
1:11:32domestic slave trade grew to meet this
1:11:35demand between 1808 and 1860 the
1:11:39enslaved population of Alabama Grew From
1:11:42less than 40,000 to more than 435,000
1:11:46slave Traders chained African-Americans
1:11:49together in Cel and forced them to march
1:11:51hundreds of miles from the upper South
1:11:53to the Lower South steamboats carried
1:11:56slaves along the Alabama River Rail
1:11:58routes constructed with slave labor
1:12:00brought hundreds of enslaved people to
1:12:02Montgomery Alabama every day turning the
1:12:05city into one of the largest slave
1:12:07trading communities in the United States
1:12:09enslaved people would be paraded up
1:12:11Commerce Street to slave warehouses and
1:12:13slave Depots the city's slave market was
1:12:16at the Arian Basin now known as Court
1:12:19Square enslaved people of all ages were
1:12:22auctioned along with livestock standing
1:12:25in line to be
1:12:26inspected public posters advertising the
1:12:29sale of slaves included gender age skill
1:12:32complexion owner's name and price
1:12:35slavery in America traumatized and
1:12:38devastated millions of people husbands
1:12:41and wives parents and children could not
1:12:43protect themselves from being sold away
1:12:45from each other enslaved families were
1:12:48separated at an owners or auctioner whim
1:12:50never to see each other again the
1:12:53domestic slave trade separated nearly
1:12:55half of all enslaved people from their
1:12:57spouses and parents in 1833 the Alabama
1:13:01legislature banned free black people
1:13:03from residing in the state meaning that
1:13:06enslavement was the only legally
1:13:07authorized status for
1:13:10African-Americans even as the Civil War
1:13:12raged slave trading in Montgomery
1:13:14flourished well into the mid
1:13:171860s after the Confederacy surrender in
1:13:201865 Congress passed the 13th Amendment
1:13:23which prohibited slavery Nation wide
1:13:26except as a punishment for Crime but in
1:13:28many former slave states slavery did not
1:13:30end it simply evolved Southern whites
1:13:34angry after losing the war targeted
1:13:36black people who were largely abandoned
1:13:37by the federal government in the 1870s
1:13:40for decades black men women and children
1:13:42were tortured terrorized and killed by
1:13:45mobs and violent lynchings oppressed by
1:13:48a system of racist laws and customs for
1:13:52another 100 years black people were
1:13:54racially seg at denied the right to vote
1:13:57education and basic
1:13:59dignity they were humiliated beaten or
1:14:02killed for minor offenses or for
1:14:04protesting the Civil Rights movements of
1:14:06the 1950s and 60s helped to end legally
1:14:09authorized racial segregation but racial
1:14:12bias still persists today a presumption
1:14:15of guilt is assigned to many people of
1:14:17color who are disproportionately
1:14:19arrested convicted of crimes and sent to
1:14:22prison African-Americans are six times
1:14:25is more likely to be sentenced to prison
1:14:27for the same crime as a white person one
1:14:29in three black males born today can
1:14:31expect to spend time in prison during
1:14:33his lifetime police violence against
1:14:36black people is so epidemic that civil
1:14:38rights demonstrations have shut down
1:14:40cities across the us as thousands of
1:14:42people march to protest police brutality
1:14:46many states celebrate the era of slavery
1:14:49with confederate holidays and by
1:14:51honoring the Defenders and architects of
1:14:53slavery while ignoring ing the history
1:14:55of enslavement the Equal justice
1:14:58initiative believes that racial bias
1:15:00remains a serious problem and is a
1:15:02direct and Lasting Legacy of American
1:15:04slavery and our failure to deal with the
1:15:07history of racial Injustice the Equal
1:15:09justice initiative seeks to Foster an
1:15:11honest conversation about the legacy of
1:15:13slavery about mass incarceration and
1:15:16racial inequality and how it still
1:15:18affects millions of people
1:15:21today we can confront and overcome bias
1:15:24and discrimin ation please join us in
1:15:27this conversation so that we can move
1:15:29forward
1:15:30[Music]
1:15:38together thank
1:15:41you thank
1:15:44you oh thanks uh before I take the first
1:15:47question I just wanted to acknowledge
1:15:49that video was made possible by the
1:15:51incredible artwork of u a local art
1:15:55artist and activist named Molly crab
1:15:57apple and I urge you uh to look for her
1:15:59work and to support it anytime you see
1:16:01it so I want to thank her for helping us
1:16:02put that together yes ma'am first
1:16:04question um I have a question and a
1:16:09statement first question are you part of
1:16:12the Cog foundation's initiative yes yes
1:16:16we are part of that initiative and and
1:16:18I'm I'm proud to have their support uh
1:16:20our work is a little different we we're
1:16:22not we don't think of this as sort of
1:16:23racial healing as much much as we think
1:16:25of it as Truth and Reconciliation that
1:16:27we've got to tell the truth about this
1:16:29we can't make people reconcile
1:16:31themselves to that truth but I think the
1:16:32truth telling has to happen first and
1:16:34hopefully people will be motivated to do
1:16:36that truth is the first word in the the
1:16:38new initiative so wonderful and yeah and
1:16:42the thing I want to say which is I think
1:16:45will be
1:16:46controversial is that my great great
1:16:48aunt was murdered in um Central Ohio and
1:16:54there in
1:16:551905 and there had been a lynching in C
1:16:59Central Ohio Springfield Ohio the year
1:17:02before there was extremely brutal the
1:17:05lynchings in the north may not have we
1:17:07don't I I don't know are frequent as
1:17:10they were in the South but they
1:17:14happened they the local mob gathered and
1:17:18they found a young black man that they
1:17:21were sure had done it and they were
1:17:24about to Lynch him when the local
1:17:26sheriff got him out of
1:17:29town they he he it worked he they
1:17:33decided he wasn't guilty but no one ever
1:17:38investigated further the murder of my
1:17:41great great aunt and I want to propose
1:17:44that white women and the violence
1:17:48against white women was massed by the
1:17:52lynching of the black men accused
1:17:55and and the focus on the
1:17:58impunity of the actual perpetrators of
1:18:01violence against white women um Ed that
1:18:06as a a method to maintain their
1:18:09impunity in ID be Wells uh biography she
1:18:13talks about white men raping white women
1:18:16wearing black
1:18:17face and I went very much
1:18:22for both women's rights and
1:18:25black civil rights to understand their
1:18:28connection yeah no I think it's an
1:18:30important point I mean I do think that
1:18:33um the status of women white women in
1:18:36particular is a central feature of the
1:18:39larger narrative right because uh there
1:18:42were lots of lynchings that took place
1:18:44in the South involving black men who
1:18:47were accused of intimacy with white
1:18:49women which meant that if you had a note
1:18:51that a white woman had gave you if you
1:18:53stood too close to a white white woman
1:18:55if you laughed at a person's show we
1:18:56have cases where people were lynched
1:18:58because they went to the front door of a
1:19:00home when only a white woman was present
1:19:03so there was this perverted idea of
1:19:05protecting the identity and the status
1:19:08of white women at the same time using it
1:19:10as a pretense for this violence but it
1:19:13is a complex history because many of the
1:19:14people who were lynched were never
1:19:15accused of violent crimes they were
1:19:17accused of doing things that just
1:19:19threatened that order and the reason why
1:19:20we focus on that narrative and we call
1:19:22it terrorism is because it wasn't about
1:19:25crime it wasn't about punishment it was
1:19:27about sustaining racial hierarchy it was
1:19:31about sustaining white supremacy and
1:19:33there were violent acts committed
1:19:35against people who were white and smart
1:19:36white people who wanted to commit a
1:19:37violent act would use Blackness as a way
1:19:41to cover that and and and that's a
1:19:43that's a it's a serious problem it's a
1:19:46different problem than the problem of
1:19:47using lynching to sustain uh racial
1:19:50hierarchy and we do talk about lynchings
1:19:51all over the country but in most parts
1:19:54of the country where you had that kind
1:19:55of violence that were not the Deep South
1:19:57it was sort of Frontier Justice and
1:19:59there's a difference between Frontier
1:20:00Justice where people are engaging in mob
1:20:02violence because there is no functioning
1:20:04criminal justice system and what we call
1:20:06Terror lynchings the lynchings that we
1:20:08document occupied took place in places
1:20:11where there was a functioning Criminal
1:20:12Justice System there were jails there
1:20:14were judges there were lawyers there
1:20:15were all of that but that wasn't good
1:20:16enough for these accused people black
1:20:19people were being denied even the
1:20:21Dignity of a trial of being a defendant
1:20:25and you're right there is a connection
1:20:26to this Mr Hinton spent 30 years on
1:20:28death row for a crime he didn't commit
1:20:30the state's not looking for the people
1:20:31who committed the crime somebody got
1:20:32away with murder the murders did take
1:20:34place but because we are preoccupied
1:20:37with this narrative that has these
1:20:39racial features we don't only don't do
1:20:41justice for the people who are being
1:20:42victimized by it we don't do justice for
1:20:44anybody and in that narrative I think
1:20:46there is the opportunity to do more to
1:20:49say more and to get us closer to where
1:20:51we need to be yeah thank you yes hello
1:20:55um my name is Joy um talking about
1:20:58voices and whose vo is being heard as a
1:21:00white woman I don't want to take up too
1:21:02much time speaking um that's not why I'm
1:21:05here but I am actually here to relay a
1:21:08message as part of why I'm here from a
1:21:10man on death row in um Alabama Chanel
1:21:14Jackson in Homan I don't know if you
1:21:16know him we both know him well oh you
1:21:18know him too yes I didn't know that okay
1:21:21so he um his is a case that is a little
1:21:24less clear in terms of Innocence one of
1:21:26those murky cases that you were talking
1:21:27about I my mom um on her journey of
1:21:32learning about whiteness and privilege
1:21:34and and prison abolition and everything
1:21:35she's a wonderful activist started pen
1:21:37paling with Chanel through one of those
1:21:39programs she's Quaker we're Quaker so
1:21:41I've known Chanel since I was 13 14 I'm
1:21:4423 now um has really shaped my
1:21:47understanding of race and the prison
1:21:50system and death row and really has
1:21:54formed a big part of who I am today and
1:21:56he knows I'm here so I'm just saying hey
1:21:58from Chanel it's a lot less hopeful for
1:22:00him unfortunately he's on his last state
1:22:03appeal I don't know if it's gone to
1:22:05Supreme Court no he's now in federal
1:22:06court yeah yeah and yeah he's now in
1:22:08federal court it's not looking too
1:22:10hopeful he's been on the row for most of
1:22:13his life um black poor very similar
1:22:17situation so I didn't even know I didn't
1:22:18know you knew him too but well well
1:22:21actually no I appreciate that actually
1:22:22the case is a case worth with worth just
1:22:24mentioning uh Chanel Jackson is on death
1:22:27row in Alabama he got to death row
1:22:28despite the fact that at his trial the
1:22:31jury rendered a 120 verdict for life but
1:22:35we have elected judges and our elected
1:22:37judges have the authority to override
1:22:39jury verdicts of life and that's how he
1:22:41got his uh death sentence um and there
1:22:44are dozens of people on death row who
1:22:46were condemned through a process like
1:22:48that that is very very politicized and
1:22:50so one thing I do want to just say to
1:22:52people this program where people are
1:22:54corresponding to them we have a program
1:22:56if any of you are interested in engaging
1:22:59directly uh with people who are in jails
1:23:01and prisons many of whom are wrongly
1:23:03convicted I hope you'll go to our
1:23:05website the material the calendar has
1:23:06information there uh we love connecting
1:23:10incarcerated people with people on the
1:23:11outside and maybe Mr Hinton can say a
1:23:13word about how important that can be
1:23:14we've got lots of people in jails and
1:23:16prisons who never hear uh from folks on
1:23:18the outside maybe you can say something
1:23:19about why you think that might be
1:23:21important right I think it's important
1:23:23that people from the outside give you uh
1:23:26that little sense of hope uh I was
1:23:29blessed with a friend that stuck by me
1:23:31for 30 years uh when you in a 5 by7
1:23:36and let me say this upfront I was born
1:23:39to a family of five sisters and four
1:23:42brothers in the 30 years that I was on
1:23:45death row I did not see my brothers of
1:23:48my sisters and so by having a friend I
1:23:52was able to continue to try to have that
1:23:54strength to try to have that hope and
1:23:57when you hear from someone that you
1:23:59don't know it gives you a sense that
1:24:02someone do care and we sit and we don't
1:24:06want to judge but people just need to
1:24:08know that someone care about them and
1:24:11just a letter that every now and then
1:24:13saying hello how you doing uh it goes
1:24:16great uh to that person yeah
1:24:20please I'm so busy
1:24:23listening um one I'd like to say thank
1:24:25you Mr Hinton for sharing your story
1:24:27because it makes it real um I'm from
1:24:31Philadelphia Pennsylvania my name is
1:24:33Emma and I had the privilege of serving
1:24:36on a jurry in 2014 and I was actually
1:24:39the four person and um during jury
1:24:44selection uh one of the people who was
1:24:47actually chosen as a juror actually said
1:24:50well if he was arrested he must be
1:24:51guilty of something and that young man
1:24:54was an
1:24:56africanamerican and uh luckily um you
1:24:59know I have a lot of sales
1:25:01[Music]
1:25:02experience and that uh that conviction
1:25:05was not going to happen so we actually I
1:25:08mean it was real Rough and Tumble he was
1:25:10the only hold out so my question is when
1:25:13you look at uh you know you want the
1:25:16jewelry to be made up of the person's
1:25:19peers but you know we live in a society
1:25:22where you know we've all gone through
1:25:24some level of brainwashing and you kind
1:25:26of have to wash your brain to kind of
1:25:28come to some place where you're thinking
1:25:32logically what can what can we do as a
1:25:36public what can you
1:25:39know I mean if I weren't on that jewelry
1:25:42probably it would have been hung I mean
1:25:43I'm not too my own horn I'm just knowing
1:25:46you know what I saw in that room and it
1:25:50was basically the person's Peer who was
1:25:53actually pro pro going to you know have
1:25:55it be hung and have it go to another
1:25:57jury so what can we do to be more
1:26:00conscious to get more people who are
1:26:02conscious to you know be on juries you
1:26:06know what's what's the kind of solution
1:26:08there
1:26:09yeah well I'll start I mean I think
1:26:12first of all it's important that people
1:26:14show up I mean the biggest problem that
1:26:16we have to be honest huge uh disparities
1:26:20and the and the percentage of people of
1:26:21color who are called to jury service and
1:26:23the people who show up a lot of reasons
1:26:25for that that we've got to address so we
1:26:27need to change the system so that uh
1:26:29young mothers can have daycare and
1:26:31support that people who are employed
1:26:33won't lose their jobs if they're called
1:26:34for jury service the juries have been
1:26:36taken over by largely older retired
1:26:39white people in a lot of jurisdictions
1:26:42because they have both a desire and the
1:26:44capacity to serve in that role so it's
1:26:47important to show and then when you show
1:26:49up it's important to imagine that the
1:26:51person is on trial is somebody who is in
1:26:53your family that that you care about cuz
1:26:55we see a lot of people desperately
1:26:56trying to get off of jury service trying
1:26:58to get out of jury service and that then
1:27:00leaves people vulnerable to the kind of
1:27:03misjudgments and convictions that we see
1:27:05too often so it's basically about taking
1:27:07this responsibility seriously in the
1:27:08Deep South we tell people of color
1:27:10people fought and died for your right to
1:27:12serve on a jury how dare you not uh show
1:27:16up how dare you not accept that
1:27:18obligation that responsibility because
1:27:20it's inconvenient because it's a little
1:27:22challenging I think that's the big part
1:27:24of it and then the second part of it is
1:27:26to is to demand you know just take take
1:27:28it seriously I think black and brown
1:27:30people in this country are presumed
1:27:31dangerous and guilty there's a
1:27:32presumption of guilt that they walk in
1:27:34like that young man said there's a
1:27:35presumption of guilt and your charge is
1:27:37a presumption of innocence and when
1:27:39you're in that role it's important that
1:27:41you keep underlining that idea if if the
1:27:44state cannot prove their guilt Beyond a
1:27:46reasonable doubt we are supposed to
1:27:48equit and it doesn't matter whether we
1:27:49think he did it or not we've got to make
1:27:51our judgment rooted in that presumption
1:27:53and I think that's absolutely
1:27:58KY hi thank you both so much for being
1:28:02here and um this has been an amazing
1:28:04lecture but I just wanted to ask you
1:28:06were talking about changing The
1:28:08Narrative of this country around it and
1:28:11I think something that I'm very
1:28:12interested in is I have a lot of
1:28:15good-hearted co-workers and friends and
1:28:17family who really honestly want to do
1:28:20good in the world but they if I started
1:28:23talking about um police brutality their
1:28:26their reality won't allow them to see
1:28:29that um what actually happens in a lot
1:28:31of black and brown community so I think
1:28:33my question is how do you start that
1:28:35conversation to with people who like
1:28:37this room is fantastic but everyone here
1:28:39obviously had some sort of inclination
1:28:41to come like how do we start this
1:28:42conversation with people who don't have
1:28:44the inclination to come to these events
1:28:46um who honestly are probably very good
1:28:49people but don't have um the background
1:28:52and the and the vision to see the
1:28:54reality of what this country was founded
1:28:56on
1:28:59yeah well you know to
1:29:03me I've always said that people are
1:29:08so conscious of
1:29:10race you start that conversation by
1:29:13being honest you
1:29:16started and you might offend someone but
1:29:19you know truth do offend people but you
1:29:22have to stick to your gun you have stick
1:29:24to what you believe in as far as uh how
1:29:28you get people
1:29:30to just invite him to a
1:29:33conversation uh we need to talk more
1:29:36about the justice system in this country
1:29:38we need to talk more about racism in
1:29:41this country a young lady asked me about
1:29:433 weeks ago after I had told my
1:29:47story she asked me did I believe did do
1:29:50I believe that racism had is better now
1:29:55or was it better than it was when I went
1:29:57to prison I think racism is worse now
1:30:02than it was 20 30 years ago and I think
1:30:05it worse
1:30:07because it's more
1:30:10undercover I often tell people if you're
1:30:12going to ask me something I'm going to
1:30:14tell you the truth and I have to give if
1:30:16you're going to give
1:30:18credit I have to give the Clans Credit
1:30:21in the South they took off the white Roe
1:30:25and put on the black robe we as a
1:30:28country we must learn to start VOE not
1:30:32on racist line but do your
1:30:35homework I went through
1:30:3815 uh White
1:30:40judges not a black judge
1:30:45nowhere and I begin to look at the
1:30:49truth we are
1:30:51allowing the clansmen to do more now
1:30:55than they ever have before we don't get
1:30:57out and I'm going to have to say it
1:30:59black people don't get out to vote we
1:31:01don't we afraid when as M Steven said uh
1:31:04jury duty in Alabama uh the prosecution
1:31:08more than likely will strike every black
1:31:11person that's on his uh roster but guess
1:31:14what they do they go home and they lay
1:31:17down well I got struck you should
1:31:20protest and I would love to challenge
1:31:23young people
1:31:24this country was not given to you people
1:31:27died people lost their life so you can
1:31:30enjoy whatever you enjoying now you need
1:31:33to get up and fight for something
1:31:35because I'm afraid what happened to me
1:31:37can happen to someone else and the only
1:31:40way we won't stop it from happening is
1:31:43that we got to start marging and I'm not
1:31:46talking margin and looting I'm talking
1:31:48about marging and demand that the right
1:31:51people start doing what you send them uh
1:31:54to Congress what you send Senators us to
1:31:56do uh we got to start getting up and
1:32:00making a voice and we making people
1:32:04understand we ain't going to take this
1:32:05and tolerate any
1:32:14longer hello thank you for being here to
1:32:17speak um and thank you for talking about
1:32:19the specific action steps that we can
1:32:21take next I'm think about going back to
1:32:24law school um but is there anything else
1:32:28that we can do do you need volunteers
1:32:30for eji what needs to happen um for
1:32:34everyday citizens how can we 8 your work
1:32:37yeah well I really appreciate that
1:32:38question um yes I mean I think we we we
1:32:42do have a program where we're looking
1:32:43for people who are willing to correspond
1:32:44with incarcerated people you know the
1:32:46calendars that we're handing out I hope
1:32:48that people do take them and put them up
1:32:49in their workplaces I mean one response
1:32:51to that question is if you we've had
1:32:53people uh facilitate conversations just
1:32:55with these images right the images are
1:32:57challenging but they will actually
1:32:59prompt the kind of discourse that
1:33:01sometimes allows you to get underneath
1:33:03the things that people are used to
1:33:04talking about you know videos like the
1:33:06video that we show to you are available
1:33:08we want you to take it we want you to
1:33:09share it with people we've got some
1:33:11other materials on our website that we
1:33:13we hope you'll pick up and use to
1:33:14facilitate we are calling people to join
1:33:17us on the soil collections that we're
1:33:19doing where we're going to lynching
1:33:20sites we're calling people to join us
1:33:22and the construction of the memorial and
1:33:24the construction of the museum uh
1:33:26re-entry is a word that didn't exist 20
1:33:28years ago but it's going to be a word
1:33:29that defines the Next Generation because
1:33:32every day there are going to be
1:33:33hopefully thousands of people coming out
1:33:35of jails and prisons and like Mr Hinton
1:33:37if we're not there to support him if
1:33:40somebody's not there to help them
1:33:41recover we're making it very easy for
1:33:44them to fail we're making it very hard
1:33:46for them to Su it's hard to succeed even
1:33:48when you have people who are trying to
1:33:50help you but it's impossible to succeed
1:33:52without that so everyone has skills
1:33:55ability and capacity to help people
1:33:59recover from incarceration it doesn't
1:34:00matter whether they were there wrongly
1:34:02or not for for crime they committed or
1:34:04didn't innocent or not they still need
1:34:06that help recovering there's some
1:34:08wonderful organizations here in the city
1:34:09and Brooklyn that are looking for
1:34:11volunteers to do re-entry work and
1:34:12support I urge people to take that up
1:34:15because there's probably no more
1:34:16pressing need than helping people
1:34:17recover uh from years and Decades of
1:34:20imprisonment uh without support and and
1:34:23and and service
1:34:24that'd be my call to action thank you
1:34:26you're
1:34:27welcome yes Mr um Hinton firstly I have
1:34:32four questions very short questions the
1:34:34first is what have you done what are
1:34:37your plans for employment and
1:34:40professional your own professional
1:34:42development second question what three
1:34:46specific reforms would you
1:34:50recommend in prison to change the pr
1:34:53prison
1:34:55environment the third question Mr
1:34:58Stevenson what
1:35:02specific activities can we as a society
1:35:06and I'm talking about the
1:35:09financial Community businesses MH what
1:35:13can they
1:35:14do in the
1:35:16re-entry to solve the re-entry problem
1:35:19and the fourth and probably most
1:35:22important question for you Mr hint
1:35:24is what will the Mets do this season and
1:35:28will they be better than the an what
1:35:30will the who do Mets the New York the
1:35:33Mets the Mets okay you can answer that
1:35:36question first Mr let me ask you uh
1:35:38about the
1:35:42Mets you a Met fan I am I was originally
1:35:46a Brooklyn Dodger fan and I converted to
1:35:50the Mets yes what I feel bad for
1:35:54yeah uh no team will ever steal my heart
1:36:00like the Beloved Yankees y'all went last
1:36:03year and you embarrass New
1:36:05[Music]
1:36:07York and
1:36:10uh I think
1:36:13that New York is one of the greatest
1:36:16place that you can play baseball uh the
1:36:21mitts they need to fold up shot
1:36:25and some of your good players should
1:36:26come over to New York Yankee side and
1:36:29perhaps we can go back to winning
1:36:31Championship like we used to do uh but
1:36:33if if New York waiting on the MS to win
1:36:37a championship they going to be waiting
1:36:38a long
1:36:44time uh do do you want
1:36:49to do what about the other three
1:36:51questions
1:36:54so the first question was was what are
1:36:58Mr hinton's plans for employment and
1:37:00professional
1:37:02development your own plans my my my plan
1:37:06is
1:37:08to go around the country and try to make
1:37:11some changes you
1:37:18know I could have easily come out and
1:37:22live with my best friend for a year I
1:37:25could have
1:37:26either got him to try to take care of me
1:37:29for another
1:37:31year but I believe that we as people
1:37:35when we see something wrong in it it
1:37:38have to start with us what would I feel
1:37:41like what would I be like to get off
1:37:44death row and do nothing all I can do is
1:37:48go around the country and tell people my
1:37:50story I hope that it will inspire people
1:37:53because I believe what happened to me as
1:37:56I was telling Mr Stevenson coming over
1:37:57here if you think that there haven't
1:38:01been some innocent people that executed
1:38:04in this country you sadly
1:38:06mistaken I believe that we don't need a
1:38:09death penalty in this
1:38:11country as long
1:38:13[Applause]
1:38:17as long as you have prosecutors that are
1:38:22political driven
1:38:24long as you have uh people that is
1:38:26racist long as you have judges that is
1:38:30care more about getting reelected then
1:38:33doing what is right under the law then
1:38:35we need to strike down or that law and
1:38:39just like you don't have the death
1:38:40penalty here in New York I'm trying my
1:38:42best to go around the country and get
1:38:44the law uh abolished not just in the
1:38:49South but everywhere we just don't need
1:38:51it because long as uh
1:38:53we as human we make mistake I wish I
1:38:56could tell the audience that they made a
1:38:58mistake on me but they didn't regardless
1:39:00I spent 30 years of my life or something
1:39:02I didn't do I don't want to see that
1:39:04happen to no one else and I'm going to
1:39:06get up every morning and I'm going to
1:39:08make sure someone hear me and hopefully
1:39:11if I keep talking maybe the right person
1:39:14or hear me and help me try to change it
1:39:17okay and what changes would you make in
1:39:19the prison inside what what should they
1:39:21do that they're not doing now
1:39:24we're actually out of time I'm getting a
1:39:26lot of signals here so I'm sorry but uh
1:39:29uh can I have three more questions uh
1:39:33okay well why don't we get since we had
1:39:35one single question well yes why don't
1:39:36we do those really really quickly CU
1:39:37because we are past
1:39:39time uh firstly Mr Hen go
1:39:42Yankees go Yankees and um I want to just
1:39:45thank you for your tears because you're
1:39:48modeling healing so I want to thank you
1:39:51for that um
1:39:56um I feel very blessed that um I work as
1:39:59an advocate and get to talk about trauma
1:40:01race and Justice every day but on the
1:40:05side I work with young children and and
1:40:08teenagers and talk about race and um
1:40:12bias and um I've been doing that for
1:40:15over 10 years and I was really worried
1:40:18after Obama was elected and there was a
1:40:21narrative of a post-racial America and I
1:40:24would hold these workshops with children
1:40:27and there was a lack of of a a grabbing
1:40:30hold of this conversation that has
1:40:33radically changed in the last few years
1:40:36they can't get enough they are so hungry
1:40:40for this narrative shifting and what
1:40:42disturbs me what's what's scary is that
1:40:45teachers are so now I have teachers who
1:40:47stand in the back of the class listening
1:40:51because they're concerned and they want
1:40:53they're be they're they're nervous that
1:40:56opening up this conversation about
1:40:58slavery really creates something I
1:41:00wanted to ask you how you're engaging
1:41:02with young people um and what do we do
1:41:05about those especially teachers
1:41:06administrators who are reluctant and and
1:41:09fearful of the thing that you're really
1:41:11raising that we need yeah yeah well we
1:41:13are very much mindful of the need to
1:41:15kind of engage kids of all ages some of
1:41:17the tools that we're using are really
1:41:19designed for young kids um Mr Hinton has
1:41:21been giving talks uh at eji and
1:41:24sometimes we're with adult groups and
1:41:26sometimes we're with middle-age student
1:41:27groups and the young kids I think
1:41:29respond as intensely and as with much uh
1:41:33you know reactivity as as the older
1:41:35groups and I think that that uh we have
1:41:37to teach young people this history to
1:41:39make them sensitive and aware of the
1:41:41challenges that we face but a lot of the
1:41:43tools that we're developing we hope will
1:41:45be employed uh with very young kids and
1:41:47for very young people our my young
1:41:49clients I'm certainly trying to get them
1:41:51to appreciate if they understand this
1:41:53history there's a story of survival that
1:41:55will Empower them to deal with some of
1:41:56the challenges that we're dealing with
1:41:58today yeah thank
1:42:01you one more
1:42:05question yeah my
1:42:08my I'm go ahead yeah sure yeah uh super
1:42:12quick just my name is Jeffrey dusik I'm
1:42:14I'm an exonary also I spent 16 years in
1:42:16prison prior to being proved proven
1:42:18innocent through DNA uh 10 years ago um
1:42:22I'm also an advocate
1:42:23so in the last my question is this in
1:42:25the last year and a half the mood of the
1:42:28country has changed uh in terms of
1:42:30Criminal Justice Reform uh I've and
1:42:34although mass incarceration
1:42:37unjustifiable deadly police force police
1:42:39brutality have taken center stage in
1:42:42that conversation and to a lesser extent
1:42:45uh prison reform and inmate education my
1:42:48question is how do we break through to
1:42:50add wrongful conviction to that I mean
1:42:53gone back and forth to DC I've met with
1:42:55White House staff elected officials I've
1:42:58I've continued to do a lot of public
1:42:59speaking and and media interviews and I
1:43:02can't seem to get that issue framed in
1:43:05the same conversation as that so my
1:43:07question is from your Vantage Point in
1:43:09the work that you're doing how do we add
1:43:11wrongful conviction so that it's me
1:43:13mentioned in that same conversation as
1:43:15those other worthy topics are yeah well
1:43:18I I mean I think we're I think we're
1:43:19close I think what you are doing and
1:43:22what Mr Hinton is doing is the essential
1:43:24answer I think when people hear you and
1:43:26they know of your experiences they're no
1:43:28longer to have these no longer willing
1:43:30to have these conversations without that
1:43:31being added to the list I I mean I do
1:43:34think we have this population of
1:43:36innocent people wrongly convicted and
1:43:38unfortunately uh we've all just accepted
1:43:41that there are innocent people in jails
1:43:42and prisons we accept that innocent
1:43:44people have been sentenced to death you
1:43:45know we've now had nine uh you know Mr
1:43:49Hinton was 1502 person exonerated after
1:43:51being on death row we're now up 156
1:43:54which means that for every nine people
1:43:55we've executed we've identified one
1:43:58innocent person on death row who's been
1:43:59exonerated that ought to be an error
1:44:02rate that causes everybody to say let's
1:44:04stop the death penalty we can't have a
1:44:07death penalty if we have an error rate
1:44:09that high for every nine planes it took
1:44:11off one crash everybody would stop
1:44:13Flying right and we haven't created that
1:44:16Consciousness so I think what we have to
1:44:17do is what you're doing is to give voice
1:44:19in a very personal way to the trauma the
1:44:22ugliness the pain that these kinds of
1:44:24convictions take place and then the
1:44:25second thing is we got to create an
1:44:27infrastructure where people are held
1:44:28accountable when they are responsible
1:44:30for wrongful convictions you can't sue
1:44:35prosecutors if if if there was liability
1:44:38when a prosecutor convicted someone who
1:44:40was innocent if there was liability when
1:44:43the police contributed to that
1:44:44conviction if there were if people were
1:44:46held criminally liable if they were held
1:44:47civil liable we could change this in a
1:44:50very quick quick amount of time but
1:44:52right now you can put somebody on Prison
1:44:54forever and never have to do anything
1:44:56about that that accountability piece
1:44:57that impu that getting past that
1:44:59impunity I think is going to really be
1:45:01key to how we turn this around yeah
1:45:02thank you you're wel thank you very much
1:45:12[Music]
1:45:14[Applause]
1:45:15[Music]
1:45:22[Applause]
1:45:26I I think that nobody will leave here
1:45:30today the same as when they walked in
1:45:33and that is a good thing thank you for
1:45:36joining us please join me on Sunday this
1:45:40uh March 20th my friend and sister
1:45:43Sophia Elijah who's executive director
1:45:45of the correctional Association will be
1:45:48leading a panel the role of culture and
1:45:50social change Kathleen cleaver
1:45:53Secretary of the black former Secretary
1:45:55of the for the Black Panther party will
1:45:57be on the on the panel and Monica Dennis
1:46:00of the uh New York's black lives matter
1:46:03and other people as well and do join us
1:46:06for the Sackler Center first awards on
1:46:08June second we will be honoring Angela
1:46:11Davis feminist scholar activist for
1:46:15social justice thank you very much have
1:46:18a good afternoon
1:46:20[Applause]

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