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If I Needed More Customers in 2026, I'd Do This | 1 Hour — Transcript

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0:00My name's Matt. I sell accounting
0:02services to real estate entrepreneurs.
0:04So, property managers, developers. We're
0:07doing 250K this year. We're only 11
0:09months in.
0:10>> Oh, congrats.
0:11>> Thank you. I would like to be at, you
0:13know, 100K per month.
0:15>> Cool.
0:15>> Right.
0:16>> Um, I think what's stopping me is not
0:18enough leads. I've been doing like cold
0:20DMs, cold email,
0:23>> and people here told me to do more of
0:25those things, but I'm kind of tapped
0:27out. Like, it's becoming a mess.
0:28>> You personally? No, like software and I
0:30have a VA that's helping me.
0:32>> Okay.
0:33>> So, I'm not sure what to do to get more
0:35leads.
0:36>> Yeah. So, uh so you sell to real estate
0:38professionals and when you say real
0:39estate you Okay. Um
0:46DMs via social media.
0:48>> Yeah. LinkedIn, Instagram. LinkedIn is
0:51really what's driving it. Okay. I'd say
0:53I also do podcasts. Like I guest on
0:55podcasts. It's been four. that's gotten
0:57me some clients as well. It's really
1:00been like a spread across all those
1:01things and
1:03>> Yeah. So, um,
1:06>> do you have somebody else who's doing
1:07the actual services?
1:09>> Well, yeah, like an offshore team that
1:11takes care of 95% of the heavy lifting.
1:14>> So, you're just in charge of acquisition
1:16primarily, like you need to market.
1:17>> I still do a lot of fulfillment like I
1:19review the files and everything, but
1:21like all the heavy lifting, the
1:22bookkeeping and everything that's pretty
1:24much taken. percentage of your time is
1:26going towards front end versus back end.
1:28>> Too much on the back end for sure.
1:30That's what I realized. I need to focus
1:32on the constraint. I do more front end.
1:34That was like my main takeaway from
1:36this. But
1:37>> where where on the front end? I'm not
1:40sure.
1:40>> Yeah. So, um Okay. So, one, LinkedIn
1:43should be able to allow you to scale
1:45more in terms of your uh outbound
1:47efforts. You can go through sales
1:48navigator and then basically create
1:49>> only do 150 connection messages though.
1:52>> I think you can do more. I feel like
1:54conf like there's a way.
1:56>> Yeah, I could have get another account
1:58and then burn like big companies use
2:00LinkedIn and they're not like capping at
2:02your sales velocity.
2:03>> Do they do cold DMs or do they do ads?
2:07>> No, I know they're not. I'm talking from
2:08a DM's perspective.
2:09>> Yeah.
2:10>> Um ads obviously you can scale like
2:13pretty straightforward.
2:13>> Yeah, exactly.
2:14>> Um
2:15>> so okay, there is a solution. I am just
2:19not the one who's like DMing every day
2:20and so I don't know the the the click
2:22here answer to that.
2:24>> Um but there is a solution. That being
2:27said in order I would still go back to
2:30front on this which is that like you
2:31have to get more of your time back
2:33because right now I can feel this is me
2:34just you know not overstepping. Um I
2:37feel the stress you know what I mean of
2:39what's going on. Um and the good news is
2:41this man like it's been 11 months. You
2:43have a business doing 250 grand a year.
2:44It's [ __ ] awesome. That's really
2:46cool. So congrats. Um, but in terms of
2:49the uh way to get customers, if LinkedIn
2:52is working really well for you, I I'm
2:55very confident that there's a way to do
2:56more. Um, but if for some reason the
2:59gods of LinkedIn have just banned you
3:01from doing this, um, then running
3:02LinkedIn ads might just be the next best
3:04thing because if all the people are
3:05already there, you already know where
3:06the targeting is, and you already know
3:07what the offer is because you can just
3:08use the basically the the same structure
3:10that you use in the DMs, you just do it
3:11at scale, um, via LinkedIn, then that
3:15might just be the kind of the next best
3:16bet. You may be able to I whoever is
3:19really good at LinkedIn ads or um, you
3:22may be able to do uh, ads that go to
3:25message. Is that true? Can you do that?
3:27>> You can use trip and actually you can
3:31the limit of messages you can send out.
3:35>> There's a way
3:36>> and you have a will
3:38>> and you can also run ads actually. So
3:41>> okay
3:41>> if you want we can talk. [laughter]
3:43>> Appreciate it. Thank you very No, but I
3:45I say to say like the So, this is a
3:47better meta thing here is that um
3:49[clears throat] you have so little time
3:51and attention. Like this was a 60-second
3:55figure it out. You know what I mean?
3:56Like and I'll bet you if you had all
3:57your time back, you would have figured
3:58this out in one day that you could have
4:00done more more DMs, but it's like you're
4:02barely getting those done and then it's
4:04like it's not coming in fast enough and
4:05then you've got fires on the back end.
4:07Um but you're not doing anything wrong.
4:10It's just this is the season. And so
4:12whenever you start a business, you
4:14always incur debt. And something that
4:15like it took me a long time to
4:16understand this. Every business incurs
4:18debt. It's just which debt you want to
4:19incur. And so you will either incur
4:21talent debt like you don't have any good
4:23people, right? You'll incur
4:25technological debt. So you have like no
4:27IT systems in place. Uh you'll incur
4:29financial debt if you wanted to take
4:31money on. And sometimes if you take
4:32money on then it allows you to get the
4:34IT infrastructure in place, get talent
4:36that you otherwise couldn't afford.
4:38Yeah.
4:38>> But then you have to pay the financial
4:39debt back. So, it's really just which
4:40debt do I want to incur and which one do
4:42I is easier for me to pay back. And so,
4:44right now, you've chosen, I'm not saying
4:46it's wrong, to take on technical debt
4:49and talent debt as the primary two types
4:51of debt. And so, you're you're paying it
4:53right now in how you're working.
4:54>> Mhm.
4:55>> Does that make sense?
4:56>> Yeah. And so the stress that you're
4:57feeling is normal and it will, this may
5:00sound terrible, uh, but it will go away
5:03at like
5:04never. Um, [laughter]
5:09and uh, it'll just change. [laughter]
5:11You'll just have bigger problems. Uh,
5:13but yeah, so uh, but I I I just want you
5:16like you're not doing anything wrong. I
5:17think there are ways to scale the
5:18outbound. In order to do that, you still
5:20need to get the backend fixed, which is
5:23what we do is we look at a time
5:24calendar. We map out all the mints of
5:26the day. We try and block those into
5:28what are the what are the activities
5:29that we're doing that have the lowest
5:31leverage. Give those to somebody else.
5:33And then you need to spend it as quickly
5:34as possible. Um you need to get to like
5:376 hours a day of promotion.
5:39>> Okay.
5:39>> And you basically need to keep doing
5:41that until you're probably at about
5:42between 1 and 3 million a year. And then
5:45you'll have the additional cash flow to
5:47be able to bring somebody else in who's
5:49high level so we can take some of this
5:50load off of you. I'm guessing you don't
5:52have an operator.
5:52>> No. And you
5:53>> right.
5:54>> Yeah.
5:54>> But not right now.
5:57>> So there this is kind of like there's no
5:59right way up the mountain,
6:00>> right?
6:00>> Um if you this is this will apply to a
6:03lot of you.
6:05>> There are like you can see this with
6:07math. So it's not like a like like
6:09theory here. Like let's say you're doing
6:10a million dollars topline and you have
6:1225% margins. Good business, $250,000 in
6:15profit. Okay. Well, if I want to bring
6:17in somebody who's really good to help me
6:19out, I have two options. I can either do
6:21that person's job and then work 18 hours
6:23a day and then still have money so I can
6:26feed myself or I bring that person in
6:29have no profit because the cost of
6:30somebody who's like that is 180 200
6:33whatever maybe some upside and then all
6:34of a sudden it's like my profit's gone.
6:36And so that's why that period is so
6:38terrible because either you're working
6:39yourself to death or your business feels
6:42like it's on thin ice because if you
6:45hiccup you lose money
6:47>> and so that's why we call it the swamp.
6:49>> Exactly. Yeah.
6:50>> So, yeah, you just like the good news is
6:52that every entrepreneur has been there
6:55before you and you will make it.
6:57>> Thanks. Appreciate it.
7:01>> Hi. Um, I'm Jacqueline. I know we talked
7:03about
7:04>> dentist. Yes. 3 million, 5% profit
7:07margins. You have five different ones.
7:09Three are part-time.
7:10>> Perfect. Wow. Great memory. [laughter]
7:13>> Yeah. You're in Dallas. His 30-year-old
7:14business inherited from your father.
7:16>> Yes.
7:16>> Yep.
7:17>> And my social security number. No, just
7:19kidding. I [laughter] can pull it up.
7:21>> Um, so I know we talked Yes. last night,
7:24which you obviously remember, and um, a
7:26couple other people from your team, we
7:28talked about this issue. Um, that my
7:31number one constraint probably isn't our
7:34cancellation rate, but it is something
7:35that I'm like really perplexed about and
7:37want to at least go back with a little
7:40bit of something to share with my team
7:42about.
7:42>> Sure.
7:43>> Um, so our show rate or our cancellation
7:46rate is a little over 30%. And um this
7:49past year we've lost like a million
7:50dollars because people made
7:52appointments, confirmed them, and they
7:54didn't show up.
7:55>> Um so if you have any insight on what we
7:59could do to start improving that, I
8:01would be really help uh grateful.
8:03>> Yes. I don't think it's the constraint
8:05of your business.
8:07One moment, please.
8:10I'm pulling up.
8:14My uh my little my little duad here.
8:17Okay. So, uh, number one is you're going
8:22to want to make sure that the obviously
8:24like that that time is the right time
8:26for them. And we ask questions like, is
8:29there anything that will possibly get in
8:30the way of you showing up for your
8:32meeting? And so, we call this an
8:33integrity tie down. And so, after you
8:35get a time slot, you want to ask that
8:36right afterwards because then it like
8:38gets like shakes them out of their like
8:40mind for whatever reason. It works. So,
8:42I could come up with some narrative for
8:44it, but it works. Um, number two is, uh,
8:47I think I mentioned this yesterday, but
8:49I think it might be worth considering,
8:50um, pulling up appointments
8:53like to basically can we bring them up
8:55sooner so that we have increased shop
8:58rates.
8:59>> Um, the next one is
9:03uh, let's see here. You want to make
9:05sure that you have automated reminders,
9:06which you probably do,
9:08>> but then you want to have manual
9:09reminders on top of that. So if you have
9:12I would have an office iPhone um and you
9:14want to send manual text at three times.
9:17So you want to send the manual text at
9:1824 hours. Uh so basically think night
9:20before. Uh second text is going to be
9:23morning of and then the third text is
9:25going to be 60 to 90 minutes prior
9:27basically when they have to like get
9:28your [ __ ] together, get in the car and
9:30and
9:30>> three within 24 hours.
9:32>> And those are manual. So you want those
9:33to be blue iPhone messages if possible.
9:36>> Okay. Now, uh, ideally we like to have
9:39some sort of, um, selection that they
9:42pick that we've like some cost we have
9:44incurred. So, this works exceptionally
9:46well for brick and mortar, which is why
9:47I'm sharing it with you. Um, and so in
9:49the gym space, obviously, like we would
9:52say, "Hey, uh, Sharon, I've got uh this
9:56shirt. Uh, tell me what size you're at
9:59and I'll put it pull it aside for you."
10:02And so when you come here, I'll give it
10:03to you. or it's like, do you want red or
10:06do you want blue? Like just do some sort
10:08of AB uh ask for them. And so it could
10:12be as simple as like
10:14you're going to you're going to pull I
10:16mean because it's a dentist office,
10:17right? And so you're like, "Okay, what
10:18can I give them?" Well, I always get
10:19free [ __ ] when I go to the dentist
10:20office. And so just like have them pick
10:22the free stuff that you put in their
10:24goodie bag and they and just and then I
10:25would send them a picture with their
10:27name on it
10:28>> so that they're like, "Oh man, they
10:29incurred this cost just for me. I have
10:32to show up now. [laughter]
10:34Right. Um, so that's another one. Um,
10:39the Okay, we got that. Um,
10:44because you're having the issue cuz
10:46someone books and like 6 months later is
10:48their cleaning or whatever, right?
10:50That's the the problem here.
10:52>> Um, yeah. Well, we call and confirm
10:54their appointment a week in advance and
10:56then we call and remind them again three
10:58days in advance and then we call them
10:59and text them again a day before and
11:02they'll say, "Yeah, I'm going to be
11:03there." And then 2:00 comes and they
11:04don't show up.
11:05>> I think they're you're you're reminding
11:06too far out.
11:08>> Okay.
11:09>> Like if if if I schedule an appointment
11:11on Saturday, Monday morning is a
11:13different universe for me.
11:14>> Yeah.
11:15>> No, I'm just being like super real. And
11:16so I think I think a lot of people are
11:18that way. And so all of the manual
11:20reminders are like if you want to like I
11:22would use the automated ones for the far
11:24out like hey you're seven days away. Hey
11:26you're three days away.
11:28>> Okay.
11:28>> But I would have the ones that you're
11:30putting the real effort in 24 morning
11:32and right before.
11:34>> Okay.
11:34>> And then have the incentive have the
11:36personalization.
11:37>> Alex Heroszi I love you. [laughter]
11:40>> I love you too man.
11:42>> Uh so I'm I'm Abram. I uh I have an easy
11:46natural weight loss program for women
11:48online.
11:49>> Uh we do $4.1 million a year right now
11:53>> and we'd like to be at $12 million a
11:56year.
11:56>> Okay.
11:57>> Uh
11:58>> what is stopping me is consistently
12:01filling the sales calendars with
12:03qualified leads. And if I don't solve
12:05this problem, then you know my team
12:07can't support their families and not
12:10hitting my goals bothers me to no end.
12:12Um, so how can I get more qualified
12:15leads on my sales reps calendars
12:18consistently?
12:19>> Yeah. So they can feed their kids and
12:20not be homeless. What are we doing here?
12:22>> Right.
12:22>> All right. So, uh, primary way of
12:24getting customers right now.
12:26>> Uh, it's uh, basically 50/50 between
12:29meta ads and organic.
12:31>> Okay. And is it IG is your your organic?
12:35>> Uh, mostly uh, it's Facebook and
12:39Instagram or the organic.
12:40>> Got it. So it's meta. All right. So,
12:41meta organic and then meta ads for
12:45>> uh correct.
12:45>> Yeah. On paid. Okay. Got it.
12:47>> Um what's uh what's price point and
12:50what's ke?
12:52>> My price point is $10,000 for a year.
12:56>> Okay.
12:56>> Or $5,000 for a downell for a year.
12:59>> Got it.
13:00>> I'll pull up our cost to acquire a
13:02customer right now.
13:04>> It is
13:07$1,193.
13:10>> Okay. cost to acquire a customer.
13:12>> And is that paid or blended?
13:15>> Blended. I don't I don't know how to
13:16separate them anymore ever since I've
13:18been doing paid and organic.
13:21>> It's like it's really hard because like
13:22they'll they'll go through one path and
13:24then they end up
13:25>> out the other end, you know.
13:26>> I got you. So, 1100 is blended.
13:30>> 1100 is blended. Correct.
13:31>> Okay. That's not bad. Okay. Um All
13:34right. And then you said five and 10k.
13:36What's average ticket?
13:38The average ticket is
13:43is 5,087.
13:45>> Oh, so most people go for the five. So
13:47you anchor at 10 and then most people
13:48drop down to the five.
13:49>> Correct. Yeah.
13:50>> Okay. Got it. All right. 57. Okay. Got
13:54it. So you need to scale your your your
13:57demand gen side. All right. So
14:01dude, weight loss is tough, man. Um
14:05h [sighs] it's tough, man. The reason
14:08it's tough is there's no revenue
14:10retention in the business,
14:13right? Like after you sell this thing,
14:14I'm guessing they don't buy something
14:15else, do they?
14:17>> Uh yeah, we sell them into our back end,
14:19the community for it, they typically
14:20stay on for two to three more years.
14:23>> Okay. What's the price point of that?
14:25>> Uh that one is like a fourth the price.
14:27We we basically we took the money models
14:30um approach where we
14:31>> Yeah, exactly. So, uh, after the first
14:33one, we sell them for basically half the
14:35price. So, like 2500 upfront, and then
14:37they do a monthly recurring, and then
14:39they get to keep that monthly recurring
14:41for as long as they stay in the program.
14:42>> And what's the price point of the
14:44monthly recurring?
14:45>> Uh, it's anywhere from $50 to $150 a
14:48month.
14:49>> Got it.
14:49>> Yeah. Yeah. And so, that's where the
14:51churn is super low because they pay. So,
14:52what percentage of people go into the
14:542500?
14:56>> Uh, 70% go into the 2500. Yeah.
14:59>> Astonishing, dude.
15:01>> Yeah. And they're they're actually
15:02thanking us on the sales calls now
15:04because they're like, "Oh my gosh, I
15:05cannot believe you're letting me do it."
15:07Because we increased the price of our
15:08program by $1,000 every six months.
15:10We're very public with it. Yeah.
15:11>> So, everyone that's in the program
15:12already, they're like, you know, we have
15:14people that join for $3,000 before and
15:17now they're like, I get to pay, you
15:19know,
15:19>> Yeah. 100 bucks a month.
15:20>> $1,500 plus, you know, $100 a month. And
15:22they're like, oh my gosh, this is the
15:23best thing ever.
15:24>> Dude, I love it. I almost wrote a whole
15:25chapter on it. I love it. Uh, [laughter]
15:28okay, cool. So, we have to increase
15:30demand. I mean, if that if these numbers
15:32are true, which I'm assuming they are,
15:34right? Um, if you had a three month a
15:36three-year stick on a hundred bucks a
15:38month, uh, you've got 10k on the back,
15:42right? Plus the 2500, you got 125 plus
15:45the 57, right? So, you're you're at
15:48almost, you know, 18,000 in LTV, right?
15:50And a lot of that's margin.
15:52>> Yep. Yeah. A a huge part of his margin.
15:55Yeah.
15:55>> What's margin right now on four
15:59>> on
16:01Oh, like what do what do we take home?
16:03>> Yeah. What's your net?
16:05>> Uh my net for a crap. I'd have to pull
16:07up the other ones, but um it anywhere
16:10about 120,000 a month I take home for my
16:14what I take home.
16:16>> Oh, a month. Okay, got I was like, what
16:17the hell? Okay, got it. So, you're doing
16:19>> uh 1.4 on four.
16:22>> Yeah. So that's like the net net like if
16:24we're just talking about the uh net
16:27operating costs or things like that or
16:28you just mean like net that I take home
16:30as counter.
16:31>> So you got so yeah so you're at you're
16:32at like 30ish% net margins somewhere in
16:35there. Yeah.
16:35>> Okay. Got it.
16:38[sighs]
16:39>> Okay.
16:40So what happens when you scale your paid
16:44>> though? Ever since the drama hit, it's
16:45been way easier to have profitable ads.
16:49Like it's so crazy
16:50>> because as soon as you put something up,
16:52you spend like $30 and we get a 5k paid
16:54in full like the next day.
16:55>> Yeah.
16:56>> And then
16:57>> a week later it is just hammering money
17:00like and or or the lead quality just
17:02goes to [ __ ] like right away
17:04>> and we have to shut it off. So
17:06>> um I'm basically just cranking through a
17:08ton of
17:10>> like things for to feed the Andromeda
17:13engine.
17:13>> Yeah. And that works to a point, but I
17:16can never seem to scale it up to
17:18wherever I want to get. I've never found
17:19a I've not found a true winner in like I
17:23feel like a year now. They've all just
17:24been really short cycles.
17:26>> It's because the game has changed.
17:28>> And so what you need to build So this
17:30will be really this will be really good
17:31for a lot of people, not just you.
17:33>> So you obviously have like when you have
17:35weight loss in the business like yours,
17:36it's all demand, right? And so
17:39>> um rather than me say, "Hey, let's make
17:40more better content." I think that that
17:42one seems obvious. Um, I think what you
17:45need to build is kind of what I was
17:47talking about from the tax side, but you
17:48need to build this you need to build a
17:50self-licking ice cream cone within the
17:51business that can basically make you an
17:53affiliate army. So, for example, like we
17:56put out gosh, I would say collectively
17:58probably 500 pieces of creative a day.
18:02And so you just aren't putting nearly
18:04enough creative out. Which means like if
18:05that is the if that is the true
18:07limitation of the business, which it is
18:08right now, like right now the thing
18:09[clears throat] that's limiting your
18:10business is your creative. You need more
18:12creative.
18:13>> And so that means we need to have a
18:14process or a system that creates
18:15creative. And so my my curiosity would
18:20be, is there a way that we can create a
18:24cycle for your customers to make reels
18:29and shorts about your stuff? and
18:32basically keep their instead of paying
18:35$100 a month, it's like you can pay $100
18:37a month or you can make me two pieces of
18:39content a week or five pieces of content
18:41a week.
18:43>> What does that content look like
18:46>> them?
18:48You would look at all the strongest
18:51hooks in weight loss, tell them what
18:53those hooks are, let them use those
18:55hooks, and also make their own because
18:56that's how you discover new ones. So
18:59what you need to do, so are you familiar
19:00with Tik Tok shop?
19:02>> Yeah.
19:03>> Okay. You want to create your own Tik
19:06Tok shop affiliate system fundamentally
19:10for people to create creative to promote
19:13your thing. Like this is what will take
19:15you from four to not 12. Like this will
19:16take you to 50.
19:19Like this is the highest point of
19:20leverage in the business for you.
19:23And so answering the question like how
19:24can I get a 100red people to make me
19:26five pieces of content a week. So you
19:28get 500 pieces of creative and with
19:31Andromeda the algorithm will read number
19:34one what they're saying number two what
19:37they look like in the room and so it
19:39will match
19:40>> because [clears throat] all Andromeda
19:42did which is why the ROI is so high is
19:43they just took the the idea of national
19:45ad campaigns is like gone. It's all
19:48sub-segments because they want the they
19:51want the process rather they want the
19:53experience for a consumer to be feel
19:57like the algorithm is so catered to them
19:59which means that advertisers can no
20:00longer just be like hey buy my [ __ ]
20:03right it's like you have to be like oh
20:05you're just like me who look like you
20:06talk like me and you're making those
20:08recommendation now more likely so
20:09marketers love it and hate it because
20:11it's your experience is 100% what
20:13Andromeda does you get better rorowaz
20:15and it burns out in two
20:17And so I just happened to come like the
20:20biggest gift I ever got was I started as
20:21a local business owner. And so I had the
20:24same 100,000 people I could advertise
20:26to. So I had to make fuckloads of
20:28creative before it was cool. So that's
20:30why I I I flexed this muscle a lot. And
20:32so it but your needs at your spend is
20:36beyond
20:38like you're you're going to need
20:41I make your target 500 pieces a week.
20:45500 piece a week from the my clients
20:48just talking about whatever these hooks
20:49are. So if andromeda
20:52the static and um
20:54uh static and video.
20:56>> Yeah, that was going to be my question
20:57because the uh when I have uh Andromeda,
21:01I have that's exactly what my split is
21:02right now. It's like 50/50 uh text and
21:05images and video, but uh
21:08>> the messaging has to be 100% unique
21:11between every single creative for it to
21:13crank like that. And I I mean like
21:14literally nothing is the same. Like the
21:17like the entire thing is com all of them
21:19are like 100% different. That's why they
21:20crank so much. But so if I have my
21:22clients doing this and they're putting
21:24out this five piece of content, am I
21:26telling them, hey, these are all the
21:27best hooks. Everyone record these best
21:28five hooks.
21:29>> They can make the same brand messaging.
21:31>> They'll be fine. Yeah. They could like
21:32they could for like if you have
21:34different people saying the same thing
21:35that's totally fine.
21:37>> Okay, that would still that would still
21:38be okay. What about do I need to worry
21:40about like brand messaging inside of
21:42like what they're saying?
21:44>> Prove it. I mean you can watch them.
21:45>> Oh no. I mean like uh like I want to
21:47sell easy weight loss for women. Do I
21:49have to make sure they say that specific
21:51thing? You know, like or do I have to
21:52say like lowered my cortisol?
21:55>> Dude, if you can get that past the ad
21:56scraper, if you get easy weight loss for
21:58women working,
22:00>> amazing. A lot of I mean, dude, you're
22:02skating on thin ice on that one.
22:04>> Yeah.
22:05>> Easy, fast weight loss. [laughter]
22:07>> Yeah. Yeah.
22:09>> The only thing else you need is free and
22:11you be and you hit you'll hit the
22:12trifecta, dude.
22:13>> Yeah. Free guaranteed.
22:15>> Yeah. Fast, easy, free weight loss.
22:18>> Uh, no, that's what you need to do. You
22:19need to build out the machine. Um, and
22:21do you already have um AI automation set
22:24up so that you can get 100 or 200 uh
22:26statics a week just cranking to you uh
22:28without you doing anything?
22:30Uh, no. I write out all the copy. Um,
22:33No, I mean that every day.
22:34>> No, dude. No, dude.
22:36>> Yeah, that's because I' i've tried.
22:38Yeah, because I've done the uh the AI
22:40ones I've done or I guess it's all
22:42testing cuz I I don't know. Like some of
22:44the ads I think suck ass and all a
22:46sudden I put them out and they rock. So,
22:48like I don't know what's going to be
22:49good. So, if I'm putting out the
22:51different uh like text and imaging
22:53things, do you have like best practices
22:54that you guys have seen work right now
22:56where if you guys are are you doing like
22:58five different um
23:00>> image or one image and like five
23:02different copies and then you're doing
23:04advantage creative or anything specific
23:06that you guys are seeing?
23:07>> Dude, we're just cranking so much
23:08variety and then whenever we do have
23:09winners, we add it to the winner the
23:11winner sheet and then that feeds the AI.
23:16>> Gotcha. Oh my gosh, why am I not doing
23:19that? All right, I've been I took my
23:20winning emails, you know, I should Why
23:22am I not taking my winning ads? Like,
23:25all right, so it makes a lot of sense.
23:27>> Good talk.
23:28>> Awesome. All right, [laughter]
23:31>> appreciate you, man.
23:31>> I will definitely do this. Yeah, thank
23:33you so much.
23:33>> Yeah, you bet, dude.
23:34>> I sell uh outdoor lighting to
23:36homeowners. We do 880,000 revenue. About
23:3940% is in the holiday season doing
23:41Christmas lights. Um, basic the problem
23:44is we don't have enough leads in the not
23:47holiday light time of year. Yeah. So,
23:49um, the first half until basically now.
23:52>> I fixed this business so many times. Do
23:53you want to just walk you through it?
23:54>> Yeah, for sure.
23:54>> Okay, cool. Um, [laughter]
23:58>> so basically you have you have one kind
24:00of existential uh decision that you need
24:01to make, which is are we going to be
24:03full-time lighting, which there's
24:04nothing wrong with that. Look at the
24:05Halloween store like they're open two
24:07months a year and they just murder it
24:08and that's all they do, right? M
24:10>> the alternative is that you basically
24:12have um a home team that goes from lawn
24:16care and other home services to uh you
24:20know lighting because the the lawn care
24:22guys have the equal opposite issue.
24:23They're like okay well there's grass
24:24that's growing nine months of the year
24:25and then it's holiday season and what do
24:26my guys do for three months or four
24:28months depending on whatever geographic
24:29area you're in right and so um
24:33I tell you which one I prefer. I prefer
24:36the keeping the holiday season business
24:38>> year round and I'll explain why but
24:41either option works. I just want to be
24:42really clear about that. I like thinking
24:44about it. How many months of the year
24:46are you doing the lights? Three.
24:47>> Yep. 45 days basically.
24:48>> Yeah.
24:49>> So instead of So the way I think about
24:51it is how can I take how can I equip my
24:54existing team with as many skills as
24:56possible so that the other 10 months of
24:58the year all they're doing is getting
24:59business. And so like the perfect
25:01business in the world is you sell all
25:03year and then you only have to deliver
25:04for this much. It's an amazing business.
25:07You just collect cash all day long.
25:08Collect cash, collect commitments,
25:09collect cash, collect commitments all
25:11year round. And then you boom and you
25:12basically earn the living over the next
25:1545 or 60 days and then you go back into
25:17the sales cycle. And so that's one way
25:19of doing it. I like that because it's
25:20such a simple like you just have to
25:22think about one thing for 10 months
25:24which is marketing and sales.
25:25>> Yeah.
25:25>> And that gets pretty nasty. And the cash
25:27flow is really good. The alternative
25:29obviously is you're like, "Okay, well
25:30these guys don't have these skills."
25:32Which then begs the next question is
25:34what type of talent would I need to
25:35facilitate model A versus model B,
25:37right? If you have model B, which is
25:39maybe maybe you have lower skilled
25:41people who work for you right now,
25:42>> uh then it's like, okay, can I buy some
25:44lawnmowers? Can I buy some landscaping
25:46stuff so that I can give them something
25:47to do for the other nine months of the
25:49year?
25:49>> Yeah. So, we were doing lawn care and
25:52picked up Christmas lights to fill that
25:53gap. Well, where I live in October, you
25:56have to do both. Yeah.
25:57>> So, I got rid of the long hair.
25:58>> Okay.
25:58>> Well, just to do just Christmas
26:00>> and you made better margins and all that
26:01stuff.
26:02>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, that was awesome.
26:04So, what we're doing now is project
26:06based permanent lighting jobs with the
26:08exact same team. So, we can literally
26:09just shut it down as soon as Christmas
26:11time starts.
26:12>> Cool.
26:13>> So, I guess where I'm what you're saying
26:15would be just sell Christmas all year,
26:18>> which is like really hard to sell this
26:20time of year. Really like
26:22>> super easy to get leads in Christmas.
26:24>> Yeah.
26:24>> So, my thought was sell permanent
26:26lights. Uh-huh.
26:27>> And then also 50% of them still get
26:29Christmas lights.
26:30>> Um, but
26:31>> why not do that?
26:32>> That is what I'm doing.
26:33>> Well, great.
26:34>> Well, so the the problem is the leads
26:36problem.
26:36>> Okay.
26:36>> So, I'm running out of Christmas light
26:38customers to sell landscape lights to
26:39cuz that was the natural first, like
26:40easy to get them. Well,
26:42>> I'm running meta ads.
26:44>> Um,
26:45>> so lead gen for permanent lights. Okay.
26:47>> Yeah, exactly. Is the problem. So,
26:49>> what I'm trying to figure out is is the
26:51problem like lead magnet issues or
26:53landing pages issues is where I'm at, I
26:54think.
26:54>> Right. So, now we're now we're in the
26:56meat of it. Great.
26:57>> Uh, no, I'll bet you that the crate is
26:59probably not that good because I think
27:00it's a pretty easy thing to sell.
27:01>> Yeah,
27:01>> the permanent lighting. Like, you just
27:03show a house before and after. You show
27:04the dark
27:05>> before and after. Like,
27:07>> oh, look, lights.
27:08>> Nice thing. It's very visual.
27:10>> So, I actually think that I actually
27:11think that the ads is probably the
27:12issue. What's the lead magnet you're
27:14offering right now?
27:14>> Uh, we come to your house, do a free
27:16demo so you can see how it looks. Yeah.
27:17>> Yeah. Um, I'd probably try and enhance
27:20that offer.
27:21>> Um, the nice thing is in local markets,
27:22it's very offer driven. Mhm.
27:24>> Um and so
27:27>> I'd have to think more than three, you
27:29know, 2 seconds about it. Um because
27:31it'll be the front end of the whole
27:32business.
27:33>> Um but it would probably be some element
27:35of like
27:37some amount of lights that come for
27:39free. Uh, so like like I think something
27:42that would murder would be like can I
27:45light someone's like not their deck but
27:48like maybe their the side like from the
27:50sidewalk to the house or can I just
27:51light the driveway like some small
27:54element. So we talk about in the in the
27:56leads book um a lead mag can either be a
27:58trial of something. It can be one part
28:01of a multi-step process
28:03>> um
28:04>> uh or it can be a third thing.
28:07[sighs and gasps]
28:08But for yours, I think the Thank you. Uh
28:11one step in a multi-step process. That's
28:12why I wrote I wrote it down so I don't
28:13have to remember it. Uh
28:15um but I think uh like if I can if I
28:18wanted to because like I'll I'll prefer
28:19to start with a banger offer and then
28:22add friction.
28:23>> Uh because the thing is is like you can
28:24say I'm going to give this away, but you
28:26don't have to give it away to everybody.
28:27You can say I only give it away to
28:28houses that are over X. And you can have
28:31people put their address in and then run
28:33an API to Zillow, look at home value,
28:35and then rank order the leads based on
28:37value of home and then basically
28:39prioritize those leads ahead of time.
28:40And so you can go to those, you know,
28:42those houses first and probably sell
28:43much bigger bigger packages overall. But
28:45I think that like
28:48>> if I'm struggling to get leads, I just
28:50need them to say they want lighting. I
28:52don't really care how they say they want
28:53lighting. I just need them to say they
28:55want it and then the sales process takes
28:56care of the rest.
28:58>> Cool. Do you like that?
29:01>> I'm just trying to process. Yeah. Yeah.
29:03Like how that would go. I mean, you're
29:05100% right. That's the problem is people
29:06once they say they want lighting,
29:07selling it is easy.
29:08>> Yeah.
29:08>> So, I just got to get them to say it and
29:10put their phone number.
29:10>> Exactly. So, give them a crazy So, give
29:11them a much better offer than I'll give
29:13you a free sales pitch.
29:14>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
29:15>> No, I'm just being real. Like, that's
29:17So, fundamentally, that's it. So, I
29:18think you saying like we'll we'll do the
29:20install for free. You just cover the
29:22cost of the lights.
29:23>> Mhm.
29:24>> For this tiny amount. See how I'm
29:26developing it now? I like it. All right.
29:27Now, you can put the markup on the
29:28lights and put zero on the labor. It
29:30doesn't matter either way. You just
29:31basically mix and match how you're uh
29:33showing the money. And that way, you'll
29:35still break even on that first thing.
29:36And you'll just know that one out of two
29:37or whatever it is who buy the first
29:39thing, buy the 10 times bigger package.
29:41>> And then that's just math.
29:42>> Cool. That's it. I like that.
29:44>> I like
29:44>> I've been in real estate investing for
29:4623 years. Such a wide range of
29:48possibilities. How to approach niching
29:50down. Definitely a pattern here.
29:53>> Yeah. Okay.
29:56So, in the offers book, I talk about
29:58kind of like four levels of of niching
30:01down. And so, it's like if I sell time
30:03management, like what everyone's missing
30:05here is they think that they can get
30:06more customers, but what you're missing
30:07is how much you can charge, how much
30:09more you can charge per customer when
30:10you're niched. And so, level one is I
30:13sell a course on time management for 19
30:15bucks, right? Level two is I sell a
30:17course on time management for
30:18salespeople, which is maybe a $100
30:20thing. If I sell a course on time
30:22management for outbound salespeople,
30:24then that might be a $2,000 thing right
30:26now. If I sell an uh a system for uh
30:29time management for outbound sales reps
30:31who do gardening and uh thank you. Wow,
30:34you found him. Amazing. Um yeah,
30:37perfect. for B2B power tools then for
30:40that guy like I know what a sale is
30:43worth to that dude and I say like my
30:45system because I can very clearly map my
30:48messaging to the value for that avatar
30:51and so time management even if the
30:53fundamentals of all four of these
30:54systems are the same the difference in
30:56price is 100x between these things and
30:59so I think people miss this and the
31:03thing is you're not going to get a
31:04hundred times the volume in your time
31:06management because you're undifferiated
31:07And unless you are the guy for time
31:11management, which by the way, you start
31:13by being the guy for outbound gardening
31:16reps and then eventually say, you know
31:17what, I think I can help all outbound
31:19reps because you've developed enough of
31:20a reputation. And then over time, you're
31:21like, you know what, I think I can just
31:22help all sales guys. And then over time,
31:24you're like, you know what, I think I
31:24can just help anyone. Right? Like if you
31:26look at um gosh, I'm trying to think of
31:28somebody who doesn't have a a bad
31:30reputation. Um,
31:34most educators start with a niche and
31:36then they expand outwards. So, just
31:39start with what you know you can master
31:40and crush and then move on.
31:44Maybe one example is Sam Ovens. He
31:46started by teaching SAS companies how to
31:49get local agency clients
31:53and then expanded out and out till
31:55consulting.com and now school which is
31:57super broad.
31:58>> Right. Exactly. I mean I I mean I could
32:02use my story, but you already know my
32:03story. Like I help people lose weight
32:05locally and then I help people lose
32:07weight remotely and then I started the
32:09gym and then I had people who asked me
32:12how to run gyms and so I started running
32:14gyms and then I had enough people who
32:16were like, "Hey, how do you scale a a
32:18service business to this level
32:19nationally?" And so I answered that and
32:21then once we had a portfolio of
32:22different types of companies, people
32:23were like, "How do you grow my
32:24business?" And so it just keeps going.
32:26like you can look at the types of
32:28questions that you're getting to see how
32:30broad you can go and you don't really
32:32want to go broader until you have so
32:33much demand that the opportunity of
32:36making the expansion more than nets you
32:38your current revenue. So it's not like
32:40you don't want to make an adjacent move
32:42for a double. You want to make an
32:43adjacent move for a 10x. McKenzie, you
32:47are on
32:49our hotline. Okay. Monthly revenue is
32:52$100,000.
32:56Hello, Mackenzie.
32:58>> Hey,
33:00>> McKenzie.
33:01>> Can you hear me?
33:02>> What's up? $100,000 a month.
33:04>> Hey, man. How's it going?
33:05>> Rock and roll. Good. You got cold
33:07outreach. Got it. You're doing your
33:10custom apparel. Okay. Custom apparel.
33:15Interesting. Um, offer is apparel for
33:18colleges and college organizations. So,
33:20like fraternities and stuff.
33:23>> Yep. All right.
33:25All right. Colleges. Okay. Um and then
33:29the constraint is cold outbound works
33:31economically but too many unqualified
33:33leads.
33:37Okay. Um so does that mean that where
33:41how are you getting your leads right
33:42now?
33:45>> Just scraping. So basically we're just
33:47trying to find contacts for these
33:48organizations primarily through like
33:50Instagram and then we just reach out to
33:52all of them cold.
33:53>> Okay. Um what's the model?
33:59>> Um as far as like how do we make our
34:01money? So basically um we handle the
34:05design side for all the apparel and then
34:08we outsource the manufacturing. And so
34:10we're just kind of active the middleman
34:12and and mark that up. And so on all of
34:14our orders, we average about 35% gross
34:17margins.
34:18>> Yeah. So is that $100,000 a month um
34:22your slice or is that that's topline?
34:24Okay, got it. So you got 35ish of gross
34:26margin left over.
34:29>> Yeah.
34:30>> 100. Okay. And so
34:33what's happening when we reach out to
34:35these different organizations is
34:36basically it's very hard to segment
34:38between who we think is going to end up
34:41being a big customer with like a high
34:42lifetime value. We have some customers
34:44who are going to spend, you know,
34:45$20,000 a year with us versus others
34:47that are going to spend $1,500 a year.
34:50And it's just really hard for us to
34:51identify like what are the markers that
34:55make a customer in which group, you
34:58know?
34:59>> Yeah.
35:01So
35:03yeah, and you've and you is there a
35:05reason that I mean you focus on colleges
35:08just because they were easy to reach out
35:09to decision makers.
35:12>> Yeah. So that that was kind of that was
35:13going to be the second part. Uh
35:15basically what I found so far is like
35:16we're reaching out to the colleges. It
35:18we've got the process really dialed in.
35:20So we have like a pretty good conversion
35:21rate like it it's easy for us to acquire
35:23customers. But what I actually notice is
35:26that's what we focus our outbound on.
35:27But the AOV for the colleges is maybe
35:30like 12-500 bucks. We have other
35:32customer segments that are spending way
35:34more per order and per year.
35:36>> So let's talk about those segments.
35:37>> We just haven't really figured out the
35:38acquisition as much.
35:39>> Okay. So what are those segments?
35:43>> Um construction uh is a big one
35:47>> and also summer camps. But the thing
35:49with those I kind of run into the same
35:51issue because you know I might reach out
35:53to two construction companies. one of
35:55them they don't order like any apparel
35:56and then another one orders like you
35:58know $50,000 a year. So yeah, I'm still
36:00just trying to figure out how to know.
36:02>> I just want to reframe it a little bit
36:04for you. So if you know that like okay
36:06well construction seems like on average
36:08they're worth like 25 times more or
36:10something like that. Does that sound
36:11close to right?
36:12>> Yeah.
36:13>> Okay. So if you have some like duds and
36:15some good ones but they're worth 25
36:17times more then I'd rather just do the
36:18duds and good ones play with in general
36:20people that are worth 25 times more.
36:26Yeah, because I I mean I'm running into
36:27the same issue either way. So, it's just
36:29basically targeting higher value
36:31customers.
36:33>> Yeah, but I mean I think like I'll say
36:35it differently like this is a feature,
36:37not a bug.
36:39Like this is just part of what what you
36:41have to do with outreach and like list
36:43segmentation and list list enrichment is
36:45like part of what makes outreach
36:48effective.
36:52>> Yeah. So do you think like basically on
36:54the last live stream, you know, I kind
36:56of went through the five Ms and I
36:58realized it is data that's holding us
37:00back from being able to scale. Okay. So,
37:01I've already started, you know, having
37:03my dev like build out different stuff to
37:05help us track this data better.
37:07>> And I'm kind of wondering like
37:10should I be focusing a ton of my time on
37:13trying to figure out like and identify
37:16the segments? Yes. You know, more
37:17specifically, like what makes this
37:18construction company spend more money
37:20and or or should I be focusing on
37:22volume?
37:22>> No. Get the data right.
37:26>> Like if you take a longer perspective on
37:28the business, right? You knowing who
37:30your customer is is going to be data
37:32that you absolutely have to have no
37:34matter what. And so why would we delay
37:37something that's going to give us so
37:38much leverage on our messaging, our
37:39offer, our channels like like picking
37:42the customer is the first and most
37:44important thing that you can do in the
37:45business and then your offer comes from
37:47the customer. Like the one regret that I
37:49have in the offers book is that I would
37:50have added in uh your first customer
37:52which is uh one I think the first
37:54chapter in lost chapters. Um, I would
37:56have added that as the first chapter of
37:58the offers book because so many people
38:01just like you have to start with the
38:02customer and then from the customer we
38:04reverse engineer the offer.
38:08>> Yeah. And that's like one of the reasons
38:10why we target uh like fraternities and
38:12sorities is because on a per unit basis
38:15like they spend more per shirt but that
38:18the you know they order 50 shirts at a
38:20time versus 5,000.
38:22>> Yeah.
38:23So all we have to look at like we just
38:25have to look at absolute profit per
38:28order and then I would just like that's
38:29that should be like north star.
38:32>> So what is so if we have you know 50
38:33shirts with you know 50% margins versus
38:355,000 shirts with 20% margins we'd still
38:38rather have 5,000 shirt because you're a
38:39middleman anyways.
38:42>> Yeah. It doesn't take any more work.
38:43>> Right. So like Right. So like let's go
38:46sell the bigger people and expect that
38:48we're going to have some that are
38:49smaller. But if we're shooting for 5,000
38:51orders, your your small ones all of a
38:53sudden are going to be 500 orders
38:54instead of 50.
38:57>> Yeah. Yeah, that makes sense. And I, you
39:00know, honestly, like even though we
39:02don't have the data yet, that's kind of
39:04after the last couple of calls, like I
39:06realized that is the direction we need
39:08to go in that. I'm trying to figure out
39:10>> h how we should make that transition
39:12because, you know, it's like you always
39:13say like more then better than
39:15different. And I feel like I I'm I could
39:18be doing more and better, but I'm
39:19choosing to do different because it's
39:21just a better model.
39:22>> Yeah. Well, you're I mean, you're
39:23reaching out to me, so I mean I I I make
39:25these rules. I can break them. Um so, uh
39:28you're in an instance where like it's
39:31you you should unless unless you had a
39:34way that it was like I'll say it
39:36differently like you could for sure
39:38double outreach and the business would
39:39probably double. It's just like I think
39:41there's just so much more meat in these
39:43other industries because like I think
39:45you'll I don't want to see you'll cap
39:46this out because like you could for sure
39:48become like like oh maybe I'll maybe
39:50I'll think about like this. These are
39:52the conditions under which I would stick
39:53with what you're currently doing, right?
39:56I would stick with what you're currently
39:57doing if you knew that those college
39:59customers would become lifetime
40:00customers. If you knew that every single
40:02one of those college organizations would
40:03just always order, you know, $1,500 a
40:06year worth of gross profit and you just
40:08knew that you were keeping 80 to 90% per
40:10year, then this business would just
40:11continue to stack. And then over time,
40:13you build this kind of like monopoly
40:14within the colleges of like the default
40:17t-shirt guy, right? That would be the
40:20condition under which I would I would
40:21continue to pursue the colleges. And
40:23maybe you could just say like, okay,
40:24well, how do we retain revenue better?
40:26How do we get these people to reorder?
40:27can we reach out to them more regularly
40:28so that they're buying four times a year
40:30instead of two, etc., etc. Like that
40:32would be that path. Um, but you're
40:35>> I would say that we're kind of in that
40:37situation. Okay. I mean, we we've been
40:39doing this for a few years now. We don't
40:41have like really any turn. Like our turn
40:44level is like extremely low. Um, and
40:46we're very proactive, like you said,
40:47trying to get people to order more. Like
40:49we're trying to bring up the order
40:50frequency, bring up the AOB,
40:52>> but at the end of the day, it's like I
40:54could I could probably just leave this
40:55running, like leave my operator just
40:57continuing that side of the business.
40:58Yeah.
40:58>> And then maybe shift my time towards
41:00focusing on these other uh you know,
41:03targets. Yeah. Building up that
41:04acquisition system.
41:05>> I hear you. I I I
41:08I'm g
41:11I would do the other thing that's
41:12bigger.
41:13>> I'll be honest. I I would do that. And
41:15that's normally not the advice that I
41:17would give because like the for sure bet
41:18like if I had to say
41:20>> how do I guarantee
41:22>> that you go from 100k a month to, you
41:24know, 250k a month, I would say, dude,
41:27just triple what you're currently doing.
41:28That would be for sure my bet because
41:29you're keeping the customers, you have
41:31pro, you know, gross profit that's there
41:33and it'll just continue to stack. That
41:34would be my like if we had to bet. But
41:38if you're like, I want to get to, you
41:39know, 20 million a year or something
41:40like that. I don't know what your What
41:41are your goals? I should have asked that
41:42earlier. What are your goals?
41:44That that's my goal. I'm trying to get
41:46to like 10 20.
41:47>> Yeah. Then I think you just need you're
41:48gonna you just want to get you want to
41:49make get paid more per and it's the same
41:51number. It's the same level.
41:52>> Yeah.
41:53>> Yeah. I mean you like you could do more
41:55but then we'd be asking the question,
41:56okay, how do we go from your current
41:58outreach level volume to like how do we
42:00truly and I mean this truly like how do
42:02we actually do 10 to 50 times the
42:05outreach?
42:07Like you could do that. That would be
42:08still probably less risk.
42:09>> It's not feasible with this target
42:11market.
42:12>> Okay. Well, then if that's that, then if
42:13we go metrics and then market, which is
42:14the next M, right? Then then I would
42:17rather go construction that's bigger
42:18whales. If that's the market that you
42:20feel better with, I don't normally say
42:22that, but I think that it's probably
42:23what makes sense.
42:26>> And here's here's the great part. If you
42:28do it and you just fall flat in your
42:30face and you find out something that
42:31like actually makes construction suck,
42:34you can always just go back to the
42:35college and then just and then say,
42:36"Okay, well, my my for sure path of of
42:38of growing this business is like I will
42:4010x my outreach." That is your for sure
42:43path. You can always go back and do
42:44that. But if you have an opportunity
42:46where you can get literally you're
42:47talking about 50 shirt orders versus
42:485,000, it's 100x the leverage.
42:50>> Then I'm like, I really want to look at
42:52something like that.
42:56Yeah, that makes sense. Um,
42:59>> and I guess like I just need to treat it
43:01as like a test. Like I don't need to
43:02like shut down my business and start
43:04doing construction like
43:06>> God know,
43:06>> you know, start building out another
43:08channel.
43:09>> Yeah.
43:11I don't normally say this, but when you
43:12when I see a 100x difference and you're
43:14at the size you're at, I'd rather you
43:17I'd rather you look there.
43:21>> Yeah. Yeah, bro. That's like That's what
43:23I'm thinking. Like I've been thinking
43:24the same thing you're saying, but I'm
43:25like ah this goes against all the
43:26advice.
43:26>> No, I know. No, I mean that's why you
43:28called. That's why we're here. Cool.
43:30Feel all right.
43:31>> Yeah. All right. Sweet. Yeah, that's
43:32what I'm going to do then.
43:33>> Just don't burn down the existing
43:34business. Have your operator still run
43:35it. Make sure it's still good. The
43:36things that you want to make sure that
43:37you like what are the things you want to
43:38validate for the new market is you want
43:40to make sure as fast as possible that
43:41they reorder. As long as you have that,
43:43then you're gonna have revenue
43:44retention. You're good to go.
43:47>> Yeah, that makes sense. I mean, okay,
43:48let me ask you this. This is I I when I
43:51view um this business like the reason
43:54that we're able to penetrate the college
43:57market so well is because you know we
43:59target all of our marketing around that.
44:01Like if you go to our website that
44:02that's the avatar we're trying to serve.
44:04>> Yeah.
44:05>> I've considered basically building out
44:09maybe have like different websites for
44:11different niches. So like I just
44:12replicate everything we did for college
44:14but into construction. um and kind of
44:18ser serve a whole another avatar. I
44:19don't know if that makes sense, but like
44:20build a customer journey around them.
44:22And I just I don't know if that's maybe
44:25like a not the smartest way to scale is
44:27doing like more.
44:28>> No, I don't want you to do like many
44:30different vertical. I definitely No, no.
44:31I want you to commit to one of these
44:32things. And so we're like this is a
44:34potential 100x in terms of leverage for
44:37this type of avatar, which is the only
44:39like if you were like they're worth
44:40three times as much, I'd be like screw
44:41it, dude. Just do more of the college
44:42thing. when you said 50,000 in order
44:44versus 1500 like that is a very big
44:47difference and it's the same level of
44:50work for you. So at that point that's
44:51why I'm like I'm like it is only because
44:53of the unique characteristics of that
44:54thing. The only other thing that we'd
44:56want to make sure is that you have
44:57revenue retention there. Once you have
44:58that there's more than enough
44:59construction firms for you to get to 20
45:01million a year. No question.
45:04>> Yeah 100%.
45:05>> Okay.
45:06>> Yeah, that makes sense.
45:06>> All right, rock and roll.
45:08>> But don't don't spread it out like focus
45:09my on one.
45:10>> Yeah. I don't want you to have like a
45:11100 verticals. That's not the point. We
45:13like you new colleges. Like every one of
45:14these ones is going to have different
45:15nuances, different acquisition things,
45:16different sales. Like you have to learn
45:18all that stuff again.
45:19>> But like I'm I'm only kind of like
45:21signing off on this because of the crazy
45:24difference in value and the virtually no
45:28difference in operational effort. So
45:29it's like you don't have to relearn how
45:30to how to be a middleman for shirt
45:32ordering, right? It's like it's the same
45:34thing. We're just targeting a different
45:36person and we only have to figure out
45:37one thing, which is how to acquire that
45:38customer versus the other. And once we
45:39have that, the rest of the business
45:40works the same. when you make, you know,
45:4220, 30, 40 times more. That's why I'm
45:44saying I think it makes sense.
45:47>> Yeah, that's exactly right. That is the
45:48only difference. All right, cool, man.
45:49That's perfect. That's a game plan.
45:50>> All right, rock and roll. Appreciate
45:52you, man.
45:52>> What do you think is the most suited for
45:54like cold outreach?
45:55>> It's about ticket size.
45:57>> Yeah. So, typically the the larger the
45:59ticket, the more specific the target,
46:01the more cold outreach is important. The
46:04less specific the target, the lower the
46:07LTV, the more content and paid ads are
46:10the better channels.
46:11>> Makes sense. So like is there like a
46:13figure because I've noticed the same I
46:15figure like our best customer
46:17>> I like 10 grand or more as a rule of
46:19thumb.
46:19>> Yeah, that's right on [laughter] that's
46:21right on the nose where we're at too.
46:22But I wasn't sure if you could if
46:25there's something I'm missing where you
46:26can like make these micro things work.
46:27But see, cuz we've taken on like SAS
46:30customers to sell like PLG type stuff
46:32and it just like a lot harder to make it
46:34work.
46:34>> Yeah. And they need a ton of volume.
46:35It's like you want to be hunting whales,
46:37not hunting minnows with a harpoon. It
46:38just not I mean you could, it's just not
46:40efficient.
46:41>> Got you. So if someone's like they're
46:43doing a lot of like low stuff, it's like
46:45content ads. If you're doing like
46:47mergers, acquisitions, private equity,
46:49you're trying to get all outbound. Yeah.
46:51Yeah. Okay, that makes sense. Um, and I
46:54figure organic's good to bolt on to
46:55everything to like
46:57>> Yeah. Uh,
46:58>> just to be I I heard you say before
47:00where it's like one channel, one
47:02audience
47:02>> up to a million.
47:03>> Up to a million, a million a month or a
47:05million a year.
47:05>> A year.
47:06>> A year.
47:07>> Do you think that you should always bolt
47:09on organic two just to kind of give that
47:11like lubrication sales process?
47:13>> Shifted from like I still like the focus
47:16of the of the um of the advice. Yeah.
47:19>> Um
47:22>> it's I just feel like organic is so easy
47:24to do at so I consider organic to have
47:26two two levers. So you have like MVP
47:29level of how do I have my minimum viable
47:32product of organic which satisfies a
47:34different need than using organic as my
47:36primary method of acquisition. And so if
47:39I use it as like I have to show that I'm
47:41alive and that I can provide value then
47:43the purpose of the organic is lead
47:44nurture. So I'm doing outreach as my
47:46primary method. But then if you do
47:48outreach from a channel that has
47:49literally no posts, people will be like,
47:51"This is a scam." And rightfully so. Um,
47:54if you have like if you post three times
47:56a week and you have something that's
47:58relative relevant to your avatar and
48:00whatever you sell, then they will, what
48:03most people do, most sane people, some
48:05of the customers that you have, um, is
48:07that they will click your, you know, if
48:09you do outbound, they'll click over to
48:11your profile before responding to your
48:12email and they'll be like, "What is this
48:14guy about?" or "What is this guy about?"
48:15And they'll be like, "Oh, this guy seems
48:16legit." They'll watch two or three
48:17things and they'll come in. And I'm sure
48:18if you have any kind of, you know, data
48:19tracking or any kind of surveys on the
48:21way in, they will say that. If you use
48:23it as uh as the true like I want to
48:26generate my demand almost entirely from
48:28organic, it's a different strategy. To
48:29me, it's a much different level of
48:30investment. And so at the base level,
48:33yes, one avatar, one channel, uh one,
48:35you know, one offer. Um but I think that
48:38if you do outreach, it's like it's it's
48:40so low effort just for the MVP level.
48:43for the next level. That's a different
48:45monster. But just like having enough to
48:46show that you're alive, I'm pro.
48:48>> Yeah. So like using it more so as like
48:50nurture rather than lead.
48:52>> 100%. And then the sales guys also
48:54you're going to I I love knowing this
48:57because uh you will make some content
48:59that just does hit and then does create
49:01inquiries. And then that content is the
49:03stuff you give to the sales team as the
49:04greatest hits. And then the team should
49:06have a searchable database of what are
49:08the greatest hits for this type of
49:09avatar or this type of overcome because
49:11typically people are going to either
49:13have questions around like will this
49:14work for my type of business which is
49:15where the you know case studies and
49:17avatars about specific case studies is
49:18useful or they'll um or they'll have
49:21objections that are kind of more
49:22standard sales objections that might be
49:24around your specific thing. Um and
49:26having sets of content that's both which
49:28is like does this work in this setting
49:29or does this overcome this specific myth
49:31or you know belief that I have that's
49:33not true. content around both those
49:35things, then create sales assets that
49:36the guys can then use or gals uh can use
49:39to go uh sell stuff.
49:41>> Gotcha. So, high level, if you're doing
49:44content as not your primary channel, you
49:46should still probably do it as nurture.
49:49Yeah.
49:49>> Yeah. Have a pulse.
49:50>> Cool. And should you do that like omni
49:52channel like is it fine if you're just
49:53one and ideally the channel that you do
49:55outbound for? Now, if you do outbound on
49:57on email, then it's just going to be
49:58like you'll have your website and you'll
50:00have your one social profile and that's
50:01what they're going to link to. Like
50:02whatever you link to is what they're
50:03going to click. So, I would just link to
50:04the one thing that you're active on.
50:06>> Okay.
50:06>> Yeah, just to keep it minimum.
50:08>> Cool. Yeah, that makes sense. Um,
50:10>> uh, my name is Joe Stress, uh, with
50:11Squeaky Clean and Dry. We do cleaning
50:13and restoration. Um, mainly residential
50:15at the moment, which is going to be part
50:17of my question. Um, we currently do 1.9
50:19million revenue across two locations.
50:21Um, want to be at a $100 million exit.
50:23No timeline on that. As long as it takes
50:25to get there. Um, our current
50:27constraint, I believe, is a lead gen and
50:30ideal avatar problem. So currently a
50:33majority of our leads come from Google
50:34LSA. Um about 92% that data is not
50:37accurate. We know we need to get a new
50:38CRM. Um so far as data, but um with that
50:42being said, it comes down to if we need
50:44a second acquisition channel and who to
50:46market to. Currently LTGP to CAC is
50:49lower on the residential side than
50:51commercial. We don't have a ton of data
50:53on commercial, but CAC is the same. LTV
50:55is obviously, you know, much higher um
50:57recurring revenue with property managers
50:59and just bigger restoration jobs with
51:01mold, water, and fire.
51:02>> And they're all and those are coming
51:03through LSA as well, the commercial
51:04jobs.
51:05>> Correct.
51:05>> Are you running a different advertising
51:07campaign for those or they're just
51:08coming through?
51:09>> We can't really control who comes
51:10through that funnel because we just rank
51:12at the top if whether a homeowner or a
51:14property manager searches us or our
51:16services on Google.
51:17>> Okay. So, what stops you from doing more
51:19ads? So currently we are essentially
51:22anytime uh LSA gets close to max budget
51:24we're just increasing it which is
51:26increasing leads but not at the rate
51:28that's actually going to move the needle
51:30the way we want it.
51:31>> Okay for your local market. Now what how
51:34how many customers can you take before
51:37location caps?
51:39>> It's a great question like per week
51:41because we do so cleaning and
51:42restoration. So, I know what you're
51:45going to say. Focus. Um, we actually
51:47bought an exist, right? Chocolate and
51:48yoga, right? They go together.
51:50>> So, about a third of our business comes
51:51from cleaning. We do um between two
51:54roots, uh, three to four appointments on
51:57each route per day. Um, each day is
51:59about $1,200 per per route.
52:02>> Um, restoration, we can handle about a
52:05job or two a day. Um, each of those jobs
52:07basically caps at $3,500.
52:10>> And this is just like flood flooding
52:11type stuff. Restoration. Yeah.
52:12Baseballs, fire damage.
52:15>> Oh, fire. Okay.
52:15>> Yep. Mold remediation.
52:17>> Got it. Okay.
52:18>> Yep.
52:18>> So, that's two. Is there a third
52:19business or missing here? No,
52:21>> just two. Okay. Thank god. Okay. Um,
52:24[laughter]
52:25so, so the two locations, they both do
52:28this by model or you just have services.
52:31>> Okay. Got it. All right. And so, what's
52:33the capacity of the facilities or the
52:36locations? So I mean we see people in
52:39our market um you know the the bigger
52:41national chains they usually are around
52:433.5 to 5 million before they have other
52:46locations.
52:46>> What's primary channel for them?
52:48>> Uh TPAs. So we do a lot of insurance
52:51work on the water and the fire side. So
52:53they work with third party
52:54administrators through insurance claim
52:55goes through insurance company pass
52:57>> and that's on the restoration side not
52:58on the squeaky cleaning side.
53:00>> Correct.
53:01>> Okay. Um
53:05what's LTV to CAC on both of those?
53:07>> So for residential again
53:09>> no no not residential like
53:11>> on the cleaning side versus the uh
53:13restoration side.
53:15>> So again data is not super accurate from
53:18what we're able to get from the data we
53:20do have. It's 6.1 to one on the cleaning
53:246.8 to one on the restoration. about the
53:27same. Um,
53:29easier to
53:31I would imagine it'd be way easier to
53:32get cleaning customers than restoration
53:35customers.
53:36>> 100%.
53:36>> Okay. What percentage of the business is
53:39restoration versus cleaning?
53:40>> One/3 revenue is cleaning, 2/3 is
53:42restoration.
53:43>> Okay. Did you start both at the same
53:45time?
53:45>> Yeah. When we bought the business, it
53:46was
53:47>> Oh, it was like that.
53:48>> It was like that.
53:48>> So, you're inheriting
53:50>> correct
53:50>> step siblings. Got it. Okay. Um Okay.
53:55Do you want to run both?
53:58>> Did you buy it? So you bought it?
53:59>> We did about four years ago.
54:01>> Are you paid? Are you is the debt
54:03service done and all that stuff?
54:04>> Done.
54:04>> Okay. So you own it out, right? There's
54:05no issues there.
54:06>> Correct.
54:06>> Okay. And it's still 2/3 one third.
54:08>> Correct.
54:09>> So the another kind of caveat to that
54:12with commercial um and for that matter.
54:15>> So messy. Keep going. Yeah. Well, it
54:17just cleaning gets our foot in the door.
54:18>> Yeah. So, we can offer our cleaning
54:20services for commercial spot treatment,
54:23um, cleaning their area rugs in a larger
54:25facility, and then if something happens,
54:28we're their go-to guy.
54:29>> Just like by chance if something gets
54:31destroyed while you happen to be clean.
54:32>> We usually try like for [laughter]
54:39um so for the commercial side, usually
54:42we we try to put a contract together.
54:44Um, I see usually some property managers
54:46kick back on that. Um, but if we can, we
54:48put a contract in place that if anything
54:50happens, mold, water, fire, while we're
54:52not like in contract period, we're here
54:54to help.
54:55>> Yeah, this is so weird. Um, okay.
55:00>> It's a weird business. Um, you're like,
55:02if by any chance someone has, you know,
55:05food poisoning or here, we also do like
55:07resuscitation or whatever. It's just um,
55:14how are you getting your leads on
55:15restoration? Same way. LSA.
55:18>> Okay. And there's not really much
55:20recurring there.
55:21>> Hopefully not.
55:22>> Yeah. Right. Yeah. Um you can always
55:24mess something up on cleaning now. Um
55:27Okay.
55:35So if we think about this, so this is a
55:38$100 million leads problem, right? Which
55:40is which of the
55:42lead generation methods are you going to
55:44pick? So, you're profitable, I'm
55:45assuming, uh, and you're just trying to
55:47do more and you are maxing out your, you
55:50know, local search stuff and you just
55:52need more. Right. Exactly. Now, this is
55:55relatively common, too, that um, local
55:58search is super profitable, but like
55:59there's only so many people searching,
56:00there's only so much inbound intent and
56:02after that, you basically have to go to
56:03interruption based marketing. So, I kind
56:07of need you to choose your own
56:08adventure. And I think, tell me if I'm
56:10wrong here, it seems like you're at a
56:11point of relative stability in the
56:13business.
56:13>> Correct. Okay, so you're at a point
56:15where you kind of need to make a bet.
56:17Uh, and so let's just walk through the
56:20bet together of which of these is the
56:22lowest bet for you. All of these are the
56:24right bet for the right person. We just
56:25need to figure out the right ones for
56:26you. Okay, so bet one is that you go all
56:29in on content and have, you know,
56:31dancing men in beards, uh, cleaning
56:33squeaky squeaky clean floors and then
56:36slipping and then restoring it. Um,
56:38[laughter]
56:40oops, a mop bucket, you know, uh,
56:42flooding. So, so that's that's option
56:44one. Okay. Uh, option two is you run
56:49kind of interrupt metabased ads. Uh,
56:51because whenever you go from intent to
56:53interruption, the ocean opens up to you
56:55because no one only a very small percent
56:57of people wake up and say, you know
56:58what, I need to go get a cleaner day.
57:00Just about everyone else just keeps
57:01living their life and then gets
57:02interrupted and says, oh, maybe I will
57:03consider a cleaner because of the ad.
57:05Right? So, option two is we can run
57:07interruption based ads. Probably meta
57:08would be the first place that I would
57:10look. The third option is we can do
57:14basically a channel partner strategy. So
57:16affiliates and so of and the thing is
57:19like you have two businesses to feed
57:20which I hate sign but um because it's
57:24like okay [ __ ] that's a totally it's
57:25going to be a different game for both of
57:26them. Um if you think that the foot in
57:28the door is easier with cleaning I would
57:29agree with you. Um, I would put all my
57:32front-end focus on the cleaning most
57:34likely, and then have a cross-ell motion
57:37between cleaning and restoration, which
57:38you kind of have. But my focus from a
57:40legion perspective would be cleaning
57:41because it's so much easier to get those
57:42customers.
57:44Whereas, I think restoration will
57:45definitely have far more inbound intent.
57:47People don't wake up and say, you know
57:48what, I do need to restore my my
57:50basement today because it's flooded.
57:51Like, that's that
57:54they know. [laughter] No one just
57:56decides to because of an ad, right? And
57:58so, um, which of those three feels like
58:01more up your alley?
58:02>> So, I love the sales side. I love going
58:05out and meeting people, um, trying to
58:08acquire referral partners, whether
58:10that's plumbers, property managers that
58:12are actually going to use us. Um, which
58:14was kind of my question about switching
58:15more to a commercial ideal avatar.
58:19>> Um, and then also anytime I'm doing
58:21that, I'm always preaching restoration.
58:23I rarely even talk about cleaning. Um
58:25just because again it's you know higher
58:27margins. Yeah. Um so
58:29>> but like you're you're going in and say
58:32like let's say here we've got a bunch of
58:34properties, right? Yeah.
58:35>> And so you'd say hey
58:38>> if something happens hit me up.
58:40>> That's much harder to do than like why
58:42don't we just start cleaning and then
58:44that stuff comes later cuz I feel like
58:46you need to like draw blood. You know
58:47what I mean? Like you need to you need
58:48to get a dollar across the line,
58:49>> right?
58:50>> Um
58:51>> cuz obviously there's big door
58:52knockocking teams which you could do if
58:53you want to do residential. commercial
58:54will be a little tougher from a door
58:55knocking perspective because there's
58:56gatekeepers. Um, but I think if you are
58:58and if you have like more sales aptitude
59:00if you want to go after property
59:01managers in order to target commercial
59:04customers, I think that makes sense.
59:06>> Basically, what I what I would love to
59:08give you a line of permission on, right?
59:09You can store it if you want to. Um, is
59:12you're going to have to make some
59:13material change right now. And that
59:15might seem contrary to what I was saying
59:16about refreshing the bricks, but you've
59:17reached kind of a local maximum of
59:19you're spending as much as you possibly
59:20can on the search words that you're
59:22aware of. Um, it does feel low from a
59:25revenue perspective because if each
59:27location's at 900K and that split
59:30between restoration and cleaning, I find
59:32it hard to believe that $300,000
59:37in a local market is the cap for
59:39cleaning search,
59:40>> right?
59:40>> That sounds unlikely.
59:41>> So, would it make more sense to focus on
59:43brand? So, when people see us, multiple
59:46touch points. So,
59:46>> who's doing your search ads?
59:48>> Uh, my partner.
59:50>> Okay. I think they're Where we at? I
59:52think there's I think you can probably
59:53bid on more keywords than you probably
59:55are right now.
59:56>> So he's he's referring we do LSA.
59:58>> Okay.
59:59>> So that's that's the majority. We spend
1:00:01right now our budget's about 10k a week.
1:00:03>> Okay.
1:00:05>> And that's
1:00:06>> that's a lot given wait that's across
1:00:07both locations for all
1:00:09>> we've had increased revenue since
1:00:11increasing that but 1.9 was last year.
1:00:15>> Okay.
1:00:15>> So right now we're at about a million
1:00:17this year.
1:00:18>> Okay. Okay. So, what stops you from like
1:00:19you just can't spend more than you are?
1:00:21>> Yeah. I mean, every time we hit the
1:00:23budget for the week, you know, we're
1:00:25coming into our busier season, maybe we
1:00:26get to 12 and then, you know, we just
1:00:29won't start won't reaching.
1:00:33>> Do you know where I'm coming from,
1:00:34though? Like it it it's like you're in
1:00:36How big's the market you're in?
1:00:38>> Big.
1:00:39>> Yeah. Like I just I I have a hard time
1:00:41believing that you're like $300,000 like
1:00:43we capped it, you know, um for this
1:00:46whole platform.
1:00:47>> Be the case. What?
1:00:48>> I said I would love for that not to be
1:00:49the case. I just want to do more.
1:00:50>> Yeah. Yeah. No, I don't I don't think it
1:00:52is. Um,
1:00:53>> so I think probably having a keyword
1:00:56strategy would be the next kind of big
1:00:58thing cuz that like you already have an
1:01:00inbound call set up I'm assuming.
1:01:03>> Yes.
1:01:03>> Yes.
1:01:04>> Okay. That would probably be the easiest
1:01:06dial to move cuz on keyword like search
1:01:10stuff, you can do 100 grand a month, no
1:01:12problem, and spend. Yeah.
1:01:13>> And that could probably take you to the
1:01:15levels that you're looking for. So, I
1:01:16was trying to exhaust like is there
1:01:18anything that's close to what you're
1:01:19currently doing? I wasn't getting it
1:01:21earlier. So, I was like, "Okay, we got
1:01:22to pick out something new, but um if
1:01:25you're not doing any like search
1:01:27keywords."
1:01:28>> Yeah.
1:01:28>> Like there's a lot there that would
1:01:30probably be my first thing to do quote
1:01:33semi more of technically it's new, but
1:01:35yeah. Go.
1:01:36>> So, you think include PPC with LSA even
1:01:39though it's like several like
1:01:41>> Yeah. Yeah. like you need to there's
1:01:44there's no there's no way on earth that
1:01:48you have cap like you just said like the
1:01:50the people in your market are doing way
1:01:52more than you, right? And there's no way
1:01:54that you've even come close to the cap
1:01:56on that, right?
1:01:56>> And just there's no way. And so we just
1:01:59need to spend more across more kind of
1:02:01flows of traffic.
1:02:03>> Okay. So stay on Google just more off
1:02:06Google.
1:02:07>> That would be my first like my my shest
1:02:09first bet.
1:02:10>> Yeah. Beyond that, you're going to have
1:02:11to try one of the co call it net new
1:02:13strategies, which would either be
1:02:14finding centers of influence, finding
1:02:16those, you know, the the property
1:02:18managers and then doing deals with them.
1:02:19And it's going to be a slower role, but
1:02:21obviously it's more recurring and
1:02:22there's higher higher value. From a
1:02:24selling perspective, commercial's
1:02:27recurring is what matters more than
1:02:29commercial versus residential. Yeah.
1:02:30>> Um,
1:02:32>> but yeah, I would I would hit that easy
1:02:33button before I would try the new thing.
1:02:35Is that track?
1:02:37>> Cool.
1:02:37>> Okay. Yeah. Sorry, we had to like No,
1:02:40you're good. Go through two two
1:02:41locations, two different businesses, two
1:02:43different LTV CACs to get there. But
1:02:45>> Alex, how do I convince rich clients to
1:02:47hire me when my case studies are all
1:02:49from lowerend small businesses?
1:02:52>> Bro,
1:02:53great question. So, I'll give you a
1:02:56tactical answer, um, which is
1:02:59you just basically need to decrease the
1:03:01risk for them. And so, people don't buy
1:03:04because of risk. Period. That is why
1:03:06they don't buy. And so they either buy
1:03:07because they don't buy because the
1:03:08price, they don't buy because of risk.
1:03:09They don't buy because of work, right?
1:03:10It's one of these things. So it's either
1:03:11you're asking too much of them in terms
1:03:12of what they got to do. You're asking
1:03:13them to take too much risk in terms of
1:03:15the outcome, which is going to be
1:03:16relative to the price. So what we can do
1:03:19is we can sync the price to zero. Okay,
1:03:21I'll do it for free. We can sync the
1:03:23work down to zero. I'll do it all for
1:03:25you. And so then the only risk they have
1:03:26is that the outcome won't happen, which
1:03:28we've tried to reverse as much of the
1:03:29risk as humanly possible. The way that
1:03:31the person who did my clips when I
1:03:33started doing shorts got me, I think I
1:03:35was like his first account or second,
1:03:37like not a lot, right? The way he did it
1:03:40was he just said, "Hey, I already see
1:03:42all this YouTube video that you got. I
1:03:44will clip them into shorts. You don't
1:03:46have to do anything. Don't pay me.
1:03:49Please just let me get permission to
1:03:52post. And in the meantime, if you don't
1:03:54want to give me permission, I will send
1:03:55you the clips and then you can post them
1:03:56yourself."
1:03:57And I was like,
1:03:59"Okay, man. Like, if you want to go make
1:04:01some make some videos and send them to
1:04:03me and I'll take a look at them and if I
1:04:04like them, I'll post them." And that is
1:04:06how it started. And so, I was he punched
1:04:09way above his weight class because he
1:04:12made a truly risk-free offer for me. And
1:04:14then as he made more and more clips and
1:04:15they were good, I said, "I'll give you
1:04:17posting permission so that you can post
1:04:19uh from the stuff that I had." And then
1:04:20as those did better, he was like, "You
1:04:22know what? If you actually made some
1:04:22shorts yourself rather than me
1:04:24repurposing stuff, it would do even
1:04:25better." And so then one day a quarter
1:04:26he flew out and we'd record a hundred
1:04:28shorts in a day and then that became the
1:04:29next 90 days of content or whatever.
1:04:31That's how we did it. And so every
1:04:33little bit that I gave him he did well
1:04:35with. Right? And so you know to whom
1:04:36much is given much is expected and also
1:04:38to the same degree. If you steward
1:04:40someone with a little bit and they
1:04:41multiply it, you give them more. Right?
1:04:43And so he did a lot with the little that
1:04:45I gave him. And so I kept giving him
1:04:47more and he kept multiplying it. And so
1:04:49you just want to get a shot. And so I
1:04:51think the big mistake that people are
1:04:52making you specifically in trying to get
1:04:54these richer customers is you're trying
1:04:55to have them take all this risk on.
1:04:57Right? You're like, I want you to pay me
1:04:58all this money. I want you to do all
1:04:59this work and I want you to take all the
1:05:01risk that it's not going to happen.
1:05:02Well, that's ridiculous. Now, once you
1:05:03have enough case studies, once you have
1:05:05enough proof, then you can say, listen,
1:05:06I have no doubt that I can that I can
1:05:08help you. I have I have a track record.
1:05:10And when you have a track record, then
1:05:11you can charge the premium prices. Boom.
1:05:14>> I have a D and D publishing business
1:05:15making Dungeons and Dragons book. And
1:05:17I've spent a ton of time doing the
1:05:19theory of constraints to the product
1:05:21development. Sure. Where I have a
1:05:22background in like IT DevOps. So I've
1:05:25been optimizing that and I've been
1:05:27realizing that I've been neglecting the
1:05:29rest of the funnel for like the whole
1:05:31businesses.
1:05:32>> Do you sell on Amazon? You sell Shopify.
1:05:33What do you sell
1:05:34>> primarily? I do it right now through
1:05:35like Kickstarters.
1:05:36>> So bunch of crowdfunding campaign.
1:05:38People give you a bunch of money to
1:05:39build this product. You then build that
1:05:40product.
1:05:41>> So you have a publishing business
1:05:42basically.
1:05:43>> Yes.
1:05:44>> Okay. Got it.
1:05:45>> Yes. And so, um,
1:05:46>> do you have a pen name?
1:05:47>> Sorry, I do have
1:05:48>> Do you have a pen name?
1:05:49>> Uh, no. It's all under mine.
1:05:51>> Oh, but so, but like, so you're an
1:05:53author?
1:05:53>> Yes.
1:05:54>> Okay, cool.
1:05:55>> Yeah. So, I'm I've made two books. I'm
1:05:57working on my third. I got a handful of
1:05:58like other supplements and stuff.
1:05:59>> Okay.
1:06:00>> And so, I've done I don't know, maybe
1:06:02like 30,000 in Facebook ads, um,
1:06:05miscellaneous other advertising methods,
1:06:07but that's not my skill set and not what
1:06:09I'm good at. So, I'm trying to think
1:06:10like like as going through the
1:06:11exercises, revenue is definitely my
1:06:13biggest constraint at this point. Sure.
1:06:15>> It's like I've done all the other stuff
1:06:16too much. I've been focused on that. And
1:06:18so I can make a better product faster,
1:06:20but I have need a better way to sell it.
1:06:22Like I need a better way to bring in
1:06:24customers. And so a bunch of the people
1:06:26have had great ideas on things to try
1:06:28like dipping my toes into Tik Tok. Um
1:06:30doing miscellaneous things on my email
1:06:33list. Um
1:06:33>> yeah, Tik Tok shop is kind of
1:06:34interesting. I'm sure to buy.
1:06:35>> Yeah, that's that's what Caleb
1:06:36recommended. So if I if if you were in
1:06:38my shoes and you took like a step back
1:06:40to look at the business as a whole,
1:06:42where would you look at trying to apply
1:06:44your resources to really like build up
1:06:47that revenue as efficiently as possible?
1:06:49>> Do you have um but all is all of your
1:06:51revenue comes from Kickstarter or they
1:06:52go to Amazon afterwards and then it
1:06:54becomes
1:06:54>> I'd say 90% of it's coming through
1:06:56Kickstarter and then
1:06:57>> on a regular basis.
1:06:58>> Uh there's a project that launches every
1:07:01year. Well, the first project took about
1:07:0314 months to get to the second one.
1:07:04>> But you only have two books.
1:07:05>> Yes. So, I have a third project that
1:07:07I've already
1:07:07>> So, you have a launch business right
1:07:08now?
1:07:09>> Right now, yeah.
1:07:09>> Okay. So, there's like basically no
1:07:11revenue between launches.
1:07:13>> Yeah. People can go buy the stuff in
1:07:14between launches on Shopify that I've
1:07:16got set up. Um, and I've been thinking
1:07:18about setting up Amazon.
1:07:19>> You should set up Amazon.
1:07:20>> Yeah.
1:07:21>> We sell 50 times more books on Amazon
1:07:23than Shopify.
1:07:24>> Okay. So, with the the next play to
1:07:26>> I do a million a month in books.
1:07:28>> Okay.
1:07:30>> Oh, it's just as silly to me. were like
1:07:33[laughter]
1:07:34silly, ridiculous. The books are free.
1:07:37>> So So setting up Amazon.
1:07:39>> I'm like, they're free. You don't have
1:07:40to buy them. They're like, we'll buy
1:07:41them, right? Whatever.
1:07:43>> So setting up Amazon would be like the
1:07:45best revenue boost ignoring doing any
1:07:47marketing tomorrow. Yeah, for sure.
1:07:49>> All right.
1:07:50>> Cuz here's what's really interesting is
1:07:51that um
1:07:54I I did you watch my uh traffic ranking
1:07:58uh video? I put out like it's three
1:07:59videos ago. It's very recent. Anyways,
1:08:01I'll just tell you. I think so. So
1:08:02what's really interesting is that people
1:08:03don't think about Amazon as a traffic
1:08:04like a social media or traffic source.
1:08:07But I think like 13% of customers that
1:08:11Well, let's just test this. Watch my
1:08:12theory just look flop on this. Did
1:08:15anyone buy my book first? One, two, look
1:08:17at this.
1:08:19Cool. Okay, that's cool for me. Anyways,
1:08:21okay. Um, so people will buy the book
1:08:24and then they'll find me later somewhere
1:08:26and they're like, "Oh, that's the guy
1:08:28that wrote the book that I like." And so
1:08:30Amazon actually gets me customers.
1:08:31There's this whole misnomer that like
1:08:33you'll have to have an audience in order
1:08:34you have to have an audience to have a
1:08:35big launch. But if you have a good
1:08:37product, which it sounds like you do,
1:08:39>> then when you have 10,000 five stars, I
1:08:42buy books with if there's any business
1:08:43book that's 10,000 five stars, I'll buy
1:08:44I'll just buy it.
1:08:47>> And so number one is I would I would do
1:08:49Amazon for sure. Like for sure. It's
1:08:51where 90% of people buy books. It's like
1:08:53you're not on the biggest platform that
1:08:54that people buy and sell books from. Now
1:08:57you can still do your launches. I still
1:08:59launch through Shopify, so I can still
1:09:01own the own the customer base and all
1:09:02that stuff, but between by all means
1:09:05like kick it up there and and do it in
1:09:07multiple formats in multiple languages.
1:09:08Like right now, I think we have like
1:09:11>> 30 or 40 SKs from from from two books.
1:09:15So it's like we have all four formats
1:09:17and we have two books and then we have
1:09:19them in
1:09:21five languages
1:09:23and we have them on 13 platforms. So, we
1:09:26have it on Coobo Digital or Cooba. We
1:09:28have Drafted Digital. We have like, uh,
1:09:30what do you call it? Um, uh, it's kind
1:09:33of funny about publishing, so it's fresh
1:09:34on my mind. Um, Ingram, if you've heard
1:09:36of that, Spark, um, if you Google it,
1:09:40it'll come up. Um, and so all that to
1:09:42say, I think you just need to like the
1:09:45first thing I would do this quarter is
1:09:46maximize all distribution of the books
1:09:48on all platforms that people buy books
1:09:49on. The first thing the second thing I
1:09:53would do was try and expand my audience.
1:09:54like right now like let's just use all
1:09:56of the distribution that already exists.
1:09:58Let's do that first and then um you can
1:10:01do you know Tik Tok strategy or what
1:10:03whatever you want to do to to basically
1:10:05market any other product that that this
1:10:06works. Now, long term, once you get your
1:10:07third book out, it actually unlocks a
1:10:09bunch of stuff because you will be able
1:10:11to be profitable with ads because you'll
1:10:13be able to sell bundles and you can sell
1:10:15three books at a time and you can sell
1:10:16really three, but it's like six books
1:10:18because you're going to do audio and
1:10:20audio, digital, and hardback times three
1:10:22is nine books. And so, you can get away
1:10:24with like basically a $99 or$125 or$149
1:10:28in terms of price tag. And you'll be
1:10:29able to you'll be able to to arbitrage
1:10:31the traffic that way.
1:10:32>> Okay. Yeah. You you would never buy one
1:10:34of these as like a audio book because it
1:10:36would be I mean essentially you're using
1:10:38this as like
1:10:39>> oh got it to build your character and
1:10:40stuff like that but I think the
1:10:42platforms could still make sense then
1:10:43for doing
1:10:44>> I'll say this
1:10:45>> you would be surprised.
1:10:48>> I would be very surprised. You're
1:10:50>> but like you'd be surprised. I my
1:10:52workbooks are audio but they're
1:10:53workbooks but people buy them on audio.
1:10:56>> I don't know if I've ever seen anyone
1:10:57try that but that doesn't mean it
1:10:59couldn't be done. people listen like
1:11:01listening is a very different experience
1:11:04>> and a lot of times people are like okay
1:11:06just having in the background
1:11:09>> because what's interesting like I get a
1:11:10lot of people tell me like oh yeah I've
1:11:11listened to your book six times
1:11:13>> right and just cuz like listening your
1:11:15your comprehension is significantly
1:11:16lower than visual because it's a second
1:11:18attention stream you're doing other
1:11:20stuff too and so it's like every time
1:11:22they listen to it they get something
1:11:23else it's the same book and so it might
1:11:25dude it'll take you a half day to
1:11:27narrate it like throw it up if you like
1:11:29this video and your business owner who
1:11:30wants to break through your current
1:11:31revenue ceiling. I distilled every
1:11:32lesson from scaling 10 businesses past
1:11:3410 million and three businesses past 100
1:11:36million into a completely free scaling
1:11:38road map that I've used to go from 0 to
1:11:401, 0 to 10, and 0 to 100 plus. And so
1:11:43you can click here and you can check it
1:11:44out. Again, absolutely free. And since
1:11:46you're a business owner, appreciate you
1:11:47and uh enjoy.

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