I Found the HOA Taking Gravel From My Pit Every Week — So I Blocked Their Loader Before Road Work — Transcript
Full transcript
- 0:00The chain was the only thing standing
- 0:02between Diane Caldwell and my gravel.
- 0:046:00 a.m. Monday morning. I'd padlocked
- 0:07the gate to my own pit on my own land,
- 0:10and the HOA president was already on
- 0:11speakerphone telling the loader operator
- 0:13to cut it off.
- 0:14>> Remove the chain. He has no say in this.
- 0:17>> No say over my own property. My father's
- 0:21pit. Four acres he dug and worked for 20
- 0:23years before he died. The operator
- 0:26hesitated.
- 0:27>> Fletcher, I'm giving you 60 seconds to
- 0:29open that gate or I'm calling the
- 0:30sheriff and filing an obstruction charge
- 0:32against you today.
- 0:35You don't get to hold this community
- 0:36hostage because you think you own a pile
- 0:39of dirt.
- 0:40>> A pile of dirt. That's what she called
- 0:4220 years of my father's work. I didn't
- 0:44move, didn't raise my voice, just looked
- 0:47at the operator and said, "Ask her how
- 0:49many Tuesdays that loader's been on my
- 0:51land. Ask her where the $9,500
- 0:54went." The line went quiet. Eight weeks
- 0:57she'd sent that machine onto my
- 0:58property. Eight weeks she'd told the
- 1:01board my gravel was free, and every
- 1:03single week she'd bill the neighborhood
- 1:05for it anyway. She thought I was
- 1:06bluffing. That was the first mistake.
- 1:09The second one was much worse and she'd
- 1:10already made it. Before you hear what
- 1:12happened next, if you're listening on
- 1:14YouTube and haven't subscribed yet, hit
- 1:16that button now. This one gets wild. Let
- 1:19me take you back about two months. My
- 1:21name's Fletcher Townsend. I own four
- 1:23acres at the dead end of Ridgeline
- 1:24Estates, a 40-lot subdivision that used
- 1:27to be nothing but hay fields and cattle
- 1:29fence. Most of the houses went up in the
- 1:31last 10 years. Mine didn't. My family
- 1:34had the land before any of them broke
- 1:35ground. My father bought the parcel in
- 1:381996.
- 1:39Northeast corner of the lot, he found a
- 1:42natural gravel deposit, dense, clean,
- 1:45good base material. He spent 20 years
- 1:48working that pit, sold loads to local
- 1:50contractors, maintained the access road
- 1:52himself, kept the drainage right. It
- 1:55wasn't a goldmine, but it paid for
- 1:57itself and then some. More than that, it
- 2:00was his. He died 3 years ago, left me
- 2:03the house, the land, and the pit. I kept
- 2:05it running. Not because I needed the
- 2:07income, I had a day job, but because
- 2:09every time I walked that pit edge, heard
- 2:12gravel shifting under my boots, I was
- 2:14standing where he stood. You don't sell
- 2:16that. You don't let it go. Now, the HOA,
- 2:20Ridgeline Estates formed its homeowners
- 2:22association about 10 years back once
- 2:24enough lots were built out. I didn't
- 2:26fight it. Figured it'd handle common
- 2:28area mowing, maybe a sign at the
- 2:30entrance, normal stuff. Then Diane
- 2:32Caldwell got elected president 3 years
- 2:35ago and normal left the building. Diane
- 2:37lived in lot four, a two-story colonial
- 2:40she kept like a showroom. She treated
- 2:42the HOA the way some people treat a
- 2:44badge. Fines for mailbox height, fines
- 2:47for trailer visibility, fines for a boat
- 2:49parked 2 inches past the driveway slab.
- 2:52Every month, a new policy nobody asked
- 2:54for, passed by a board that never pushed
- 2:56back. I stayed out of it, paid my dues,
- 3:00kept my head down. But about a year
- 3:02after she took over, Diane knocked on my
- 3:04door with what she called a community
- 3:06partnership opportunity. The pit, she
- 3:08said, "It's an eyesore, but it's useful.
- 3:12I think the HOA should have access for
- 3:14maintenance, road base, drainage
- 3:16projects. Think of it as your
- 3:18contribution to the neighborhood." My
- 3:20contribution, as if I owed them a piece
- 3:22of my land for the privilege of living
- 3:24on it. I told her no, politely, clearly.
- 3:28She smiled, said she understood, and
- 3:31walked back to her car. That was the
- 3:33last time she asked. What I didn't know
- 3:35was that she'd stopped asking and
- 3:37started taking. Fast forward to about 2
- 3:39months ago, early March. Diane sent out
- 3:42the quarterly newsletter. Big
- 3:44announcement. The HOA had approved a
- 3:47$35,000 road resurfacing project.
- 3:50Potholes, drainage shoulders, fresh
- 3:53gravel base on the two main loop roads.
- 3:55At the bottom, one line stood out.
- 3:58Materials sourced locally to save the
- 4:00community money. I read it and thought,
- 4:02"Good for them." Didn't think about it
- 4:04twice. The first Tuesday after that
- 4:06newsletter, I drove out to the pit to
- 4:08check stock for a contractor pickup
- 4:10scheduled that Friday. The load was
- 4:12fine, but something else wasn't. Tire
- 4:15tracks. Not mine. Not my contractor's.
- 4:17He drove a single axle dump. And these
- 4:20were wide-set, deep, heavy front-end
- 4:23loader tracks cutting straight from the
- 4:25access road into the pit floor. I walked
- 4:27the edge. There was a fresh cut in the
- 4:29gravel bank where somebody'd scooped a
- 4:31clean 20-yd bite. I could see the bucket
- 4:34marks in the wall. I stood there for a
- 4:36while. Told myself maybe a county crew
- 4:39got confused, wrong address, came in off
- 4:41the back road. It happens. Then I came
- 4:44back the next Wednesday. Same tracks.
- 4:47Fresher. Gravel level noticeably lower
- 4:49on the south bank. That's when the math
- 4:52stopped adding up. Somebody was coming
- 4:54in regular, not random, not once, and
- 4:57they were taking real volume. I drove to
- 4:59the hardware store that afternoon,
- 5:01bought a solar trail cam for 40 bucks,
- 5:03mounted it on a fence post at the pit
- 5:05entrance, lens angled down the access
- 5:07road, tight enough to catch a plate,
- 5:09wide enough to catch a bucket. Before I
- 5:12left, I stood at the rim and looked down
- 5:14at the gravel my father spent two
- 5:16decades pulling out of this ground. I
- 5:18could still hear him saying it, the
- 5:20thing he told me every time I complained
- 5:21about the work. "This land gives back
- 5:24what you put in, Fletch. You just got to
- 5:26show up." I showed up. Every week since
- 5:30he died, I showed up. Somebody else had
- 5:33been showing up, too, and I was about to
- 5:35find out who. The trail cam paid for
- 5:37itself in 6 days. Tuesday morning, 6:14
- 5:41a.m., my phone buzzed with a motion
- 5:43alert on the nightstand. I opened the
- 5:45app in bed, still half asleep, squinting
- 5:48at the screen in the dark. A front end
- 5:50loader rolled through my gate like it
- 5:51owned the place. Yellow paint, mud cake
- 5:54treads, and right there on the cab door,
- 5:56the Ridgeline Estates HOA logo. Not a
- 5:59county crew, not a lost contractor. The
- 6:02HOA's own machine on my land at 6:00 in
- 6:05the morning. The operator swung the
- 6:07bucket into the south bank, bit down,
- 6:09scooped a clean load 20 yards easy. You
- 6:12could tell by how the hydraulic strained
- 6:14on the lift, dumped it into a flatbed
- 6:16waiting on the access road, and drove
- 6:18out. The whole thing took 11 minutes. He
- 6:21didn't look around, didn't hesitate. He
- 6:24moved like a man who'd done this before
- 6:26and expected to do it again. I sat on
- 6:28the edge of my bed and played it back
- 6:30twice. Timestamp clear, license plate
- 6:33readable, HOA logo sharp enough to zoom
- 6:36in on. Then I pulled up the week before
- 6:38the cam had caught that one, too. Same
- 6:40loader, same operator, same Tuesday,
- 6:43almost the same minute. Two weeks
- 6:44confirmed on video. And based on the
- 6:46tire tracks I'd been seeing since early
- 6:48March, this had been going on at least 6
- 6:51weeks before I ever mounted that camera.
- 6:54I did the math on the back of an
- 6:55envelope at the kitchen table. 20 cubic
- 6:58yards per week, minimum 4 weeks before
- 7:00the camera, two confirmed on camera, 6
- 7:03weeks total at least. 120 cubic yards.
- 7:07Market rate was $15 a yard. $1,800 of my
- 7:11gravel hauled off my land without a
- 7:13word. That afternoon, I drove to Diane
- 7:16Caldwell's house. She lived in lot four,
- 7:19the colonial with the perfect hedges and
- 7:21the flagstone walkway that always looked
- 7:23pressure washed. She answered the door
- 7:25in a pressed linen shirt, iced tea in
- 7:27hand, like she was expecting a neighbor
- 7:30dropping off banana bread. I held my
- 7:32phone up and hit play. "Your crew has
- 7:34been coming onto my land and taking
- 7:36gravel from my pit every Tuesday. I have
- 7:39it on camera." She didn't flinch, didn't
- 7:41lean in to look, took a sip of her tea,
- 7:43glanced at the screen the way you'd
- 7:45glance at a child's drawing, and looked
- 7:47back at me like I'd shown her a weather
- 7:49forecast. Fletcher, that pit sits along
- 7:51the community access corridor. The board
- 7:54voted to authorize use of adjacent
- 7:56resources for the road project. This has
- 7:58all been approved. Adjacent resources. I
- 8:01let those words sit in the air for a
- 8:03second. That's my land, Diane. It's on
- 8:06my deed. She set the tea down on the
- 8:08porch railing. Slow, deliberate. Her
- 8:11voice dropped half a register the way
- 8:13someone talks when they've already
- 8:14decided you don't matter. We'll see what
- 8:16the board says. In the meantime, road
- 8:19work starts in 3 weeks. Don't make this
- 8:21difficult for yourself. Then she closed
- 8:23the screen door. Not a slam, worse. A
- 8:26slow pull, like she was shutting a
- 8:28conversation that was never worth
- 8:29having. I stood on her porch for 5
- 8:32seconds staring at the mesh. The smell
- 8:34of her iced tea still hanging in the
- 8:36air. Then I turned and walked back to my
- 8:39truck. She hadn't denied it. Hadn't
- 8:41apologized. Hadn't even pretended to be
- 8:43surprised. She'd looked at video
- 8:46evidence of her own crew on my land and
- 8:48told me to stay out of the way. That
- 8:50told me everything I needed to know
- 8:52about what was coming. Two days later,
- 8:54an envelope showed up in my mailbox.
- 8:57Official HOA letterhead heavy stock,
- 8:59blue seal, bold font at the top, notice
- 9:02of non-compliance. Failure to cooperate
- 9:05with community infrastructure access,
- 9:08fine, $250 per day effective Monday. I
- 9:12read it standing at the mailbox, the sun
- 9:14beating down on the back of my neck.
- 9:15$250 a day for refusing to let them
- 9:18steal from me. That night, I sat at my
- 9:21kitchen table with the HOA bylaws, the
- 9:23full document, 46 pages, the version
- 9:26they email every January. I went through
- 9:29it line by line with a yellow
- 9:30highlighter. Infrastructure, common
- 9:32areas, maintenance access, easement
- 9:35provisions, emergency access protocols,
- 9:39nothing. Not one clause about
- 9:41infrastructure cooperation, not one line
- 9:43granting the HOA access to private land
- 9:46for materials, not one reference to
- 9:48gravel pits or adjacent resources. The
- 9:52word gravel didn't appear once in 46
- 9:54pages. She'd made it up. The fine had no
- 9:57legal basis.
- 9:59The board authorization was built on a
- 10:00claim that didn't exist anywhere in the
- 10:02governing documents. I picked up the
- 10:05phone the next morning and called the
- 10:06county assessor's office, requested a
- 10:08certified copy of my plat map and deed.
- 10:11The clerk said five business days. Five
- 10:14days. Road work in three weeks. The
- 10:16clock was ticking in two directions at
- 10:18once. That next Tuesday, I checked the
- 10:21trail cam from my kitchen before
- 10:22sunrise. 6:11 a.m. The loader rolled in
- 10:26again. Same operator, same route, same
- 10:3020-yard scoop off the south bank. Like
- 10:32I'd never knocked on Diane's door. Like
- 10:35I'd never shown her the footage. Like
- 10:36the conversation had never happened. I
- 10:38saved the clip. Week three on camera.
- 10:41And Diane Caldwell had looked me in the
- 10:43eye, heard me say I have it on camera,
- 10:46and sent the machine back the very next
- 10:47Tuesday. She wasn't confused. She wasn't
- 10:50misinformed. She just didn't think I
- 10:53could stop her. The plat map arrived on
- 10:55a Thursday. I cleared the kitchen table,
- 10:57unrolled it flat, and traced the
- 10:59property line with my index finger.
- 11:01There it was, the northeast corner of my
- 11:03parcel, marked with the original survey
- 11:05pins from 1996.
- 11:09The gravel pit sitting well inside the
- 11:11boundary. Not on the edge. Not
- 11:13straddling the common area. 30 feet
- 11:16clear of the nearest HOA line. 30 feet.
- 11:19You could park two trucks in that gap.
- 11:22No gray area, no overlap. My land, my
- 11:25pit, end of discussion. Except it
- 11:27wasn't. Because when I requested the HOA
- 11:30board meeting minutes, which any
- 11:31homeowner has a right to under our
- 11:33bylaws. What came back five days later
- 11:35changed everything I thought I
- 11:37understood about what Diane was doing. I
- 11:39sat down with the minutes from the
- 11:40February meeting, the one where Diane
- 11:43had pitched the road resurfacing
- 11:44project, page three. Agenda item six,
- 11:48her presentation to the board summarized
- 11:50by the secretary in neat official
- 11:53language. I read her words out loud to
- 11:55an empty kitchen. Gravel reserves
- 11:57adjacent to the community corridor have
- 11:59been identified for road work. No
- 12:01acquisition cost. Materials will be
- 12:04sourced on site. I read it again, then a
- 12:07third time. She hadn't mentioned my
- 12:09name, hadn't mentioned my property,
- 12:11hadn't mentioned that the reserve she
- 12:13was talking about sat on private land
- 12:15behind a fence on a parcel that
- 12:16pre-dated the HOA by eight gravel pit.
- 12:19She'd said adjacent reserves and on-site
- 12:21materials language that made it sound
- 12:26like the gravel was just sitting on
- 12:28common ground waiting to be scooped up.
- 12:30Four board members heard that, read no
- 12:32acquisition cost, and voted yes, four to
- 12:35one. Why wouldn't they? Their president
- 12:38said it was free. I put the minutes down
- 12:40and stared at the deed spread next to
- 12:42them on the table. Two documents side by
- 12:44side. One said the pit was mine, the
- 12:47other showed the president had told
- 12:49everyone it wasn't. This wasn't a
- 12:51misunderstanding. This wasn't Diane
- 12:53getting confused about a property line.
- 12:55She'd sat in that board room, looked at
- 12:57four people who trusted her, and lied
- 12:59about whose land they were taking from.
- 13:01I wanted to drive to her house right
- 13:03then, slap both documents on her porch
- 13:05table, and watch her face, but I stopped
- 13:07myself. Because if I showed her the deed
- 13:10now, she'd backpedal, call it an honest
- 13:12mistake, a survey mix-up, promise to
- 13:15stop. The board would nod, the gravel
- 13:18would stop flowing, and Diane would walk
- 13:20away clean with nothing but an apology
- 13:22she didn't mean. And there was still a
- 13:24question I couldn't answer. The
- 13:26newsletter said materials sourced
- 13:27locally to save the community money. The
- 13:29minutes said no acquisition cost, but
- 13:32the total road budget was $35,000.
- 13:35If the gravel was free, what exactly was
- 13:37the money paying for? Paving labor?
- 13:39Sure. Equipment rental? Sure. But was
- 13:42there a specific line item for gravel?
- 13:44And if there was, how much had she
- 13:46allocated for something she was getting
- 13:47for nothing? I didn't have access to the
- 13:49full budget yet, but I knew someone who
- 13:52might. That same week, my neighbor Nolan
- 13:54Moore from lot 12 stopped by. He knocked
- 13:57on a Saturday afternoon, stood in my
- 13:59doorway with a crease between his
- 14:01eyebrows and a dues notice in his hand.
- 14:03"You seen this?" he said. "Two hundred
- 14:06dollars more a quarter, earmarked for
- 14:08road improvement materials. That's on
- 14:10top of regular dues, 800 a year. 37.5
- 14:14one." I brought him inside and showed
- 14:16him the trail cam footage on my laptop.
- 14:19His face changed in about two seconds,
- 14:21jaw set, eyes narrowing as he watched
- 14:23the loader scoop into my South Bank.
- 14:25"That's your pit," he said. "I've driven
- 14:27past your dad's trucks coming out of
- 14:29there for years. Everybody on this road
- 14:31knows that's Town land. It is, and
- 14:35they've been taking it every Tuesday
- 14:36without asking." Nolan sat back in the
- 14:38chair and stared at the ceiling. Then he
- 14:40said something that mattered more than
- 14:42he realized. "I'm the treasurer
- 14:44alternate, backup signatory on the HOA
- 14:46accounts. I can access the financial
- 14:48portal." I didn't ask him to look, not
- 14:51yet. I wasn't ready to tip my hand until
- 14:53I knew what I was looking at, but I
- 14:55filed it. Two days later, Diane made her
- 14:58next move. An email blast went out to
- 15:00every homeowner in Ridgeline Estates. No
- 15:02names, but no subtlety, either. "One
- 15:05homeowner is threatening to delay your
- 15:06road improvements over a personal
- 15:08dispute. The board is handling the
- 15:10situation and road work will proceed on
- 15:12schedule." She didn't name me, she
- 15:15didn't have to. In a 40-lot subdivision,
- 15:18news travels by mailbox. My phone rang
- 15:21three times that evening. One neighbor
- 15:23asked what was going on, cautious,
- 15:24trying to get the story. Another said he
- 15:27hoped I wasn't holding things up over
- 15:28something petty. The third, a guy from
- 15:31lot 31, I'd waved to maybe twice in 3
- 15:33years, told me flat out,
- 15:36"Don't mess with our roads, man.
- 15:38Some of us actually care about this
- 15:40neighborhood." I hung up and sat on my
- 15:42porch in the dark, listening to the
- 15:44frogs. I could see the access road from
- 15:47there, the ruts from the loader carved
- 15:49into the dirt, silver in the moonlight.
- 15:51Eight weeks of ruts leading straight to
- 15:53my pit. Diane had turned the
- 15:55neighborhood against me without using my
- 15:57name, and she'd done it while standing
- 15:59on a lie she'd told to the board's face.
- 16:02I wasn't going to rush this, but I was
- 16:04done waiting for her to stop on her own.
- 16:06The attorney letter showed up on a
- 16:07Wednesday, tucked between a water bill
- 16:10and a furniture catalog. Not from Diane,
- 16:13from a law firm, Prescott, Hayes, and
- 16:15Whitfield. Cream-colored envelope,
- 16:17embossed logo, the kind of paper that's
- 16:20heavy on purpose, the kind that says,
- 16:22"This costs money you don't have." I
- 16:24opened it standing at the mailbox. "The
- 16:26Ridgeline Estates Homeowners Association
- 16:29hereby asserts a prescriptive easement
- 16:31claim over the access corridor adjacent
- 16:33to and including the gravel extraction
- 16:35area on your parcel. Any obstruction of
- 16:38ongoing community use will be treated as
- 16:40interference with established access
- 16:42rights and may result in legal action
- 16:44including injunctive relief and recovery
- 16:46of damages. Prescriptive easement." I
- 16:49had to read it twice to make sure I was
- 16:50understanding it right. They were
- 16:52claiming that because the HOA had been
- 16:54using the access road near my pit,
- 16:56they'd earned a legal right to keep
- 16:58using it, including the pit itself. It
- 17:00was the property law equivalent of
- 17:02saying, "We've been stealing long enough
- 17:04that it's legally ours now." I knew
- 17:06enough to know the claim was weak.
- 17:08Prescriptive easement in our state
- 17:10required continuous, open, and hostile
- 17:13use for at least 10 years. The HOA was
- 17:1510 years old, sure, but the gravel
- 17:18taking started 2 months ago. You can't
- 17:20claim a decade of use when the actual
- 17:22taking began in February. The math
- 17:24didn't come close, but a lawsuit didn't
- 17:26need to win to hurt. Filing fees,
- 17:29depositions, discovery motions, months
- 17:31of back and forth in county court. Diane
- 17:34didn't need a verdict in her favor. She
- 17:36just needed to make fighting her more
- 17:38expensive and exhausting than letting
- 17:39her take my gravel, and she knew I
- 17:41wasn't a rich man. That wasn't the only
- 17:43front. Two days after the attorney
- 17:45letter, a second envelope arrived. This
- 17:48one from the county road department.
- 17:50Diane had contacted them directly,
- 17:52claimed my obstruction of community
- 17:54access was endangering a road safety
- 17:56project, and requested county
- 17:58intervention. The letter was polite,
- 18:00bureaucratic, but the message underneath
- 18:02was clear. We're aware of the situation,
- 18:05and we're watching. I laid everything
- 18:07out on the kitchen table that night.
- 18:08Attorney letter on the left, county
- 18:10notice in the middle, fine invoices on
- 18:13the right, $500 in climbing. Three
- 18:15separate pressures, all converging. My
- 18:18strategy, collect evidence quietly, wait
- 18:21for the right moment, was running out of
- 18:23road. Diane had set the timeline
- 18:25herself. Road work in 2 weeks. If that
- 18:28loader reached my pit one more time,
- 18:30she'd have the gravel loaded, the trucks
- 18:32would be rolling, and every fight I
- 18:34brought would be after the fact. You
- 18:36can't unspread gravel. You can't unpave
- 18:38a road. I sat there staring at the three
- 18:41documents for a long time. I could hear
- 18:43the kitchen clock. I could hear the
- 18:45refrigerator hum. And I could hear my
- 18:47father's voice, clear as anything, not
- 18:49the gentle version, the direct one. The
- 18:52one he used when something was broken,
- 18:54and complaining about it wasn't going to
- 18:55fix it. Then Nolan knocked. He had his
- 18:58laptop under his arm, didn't wait for
- 19:00coffee, didn't sit on the porch. He
- 19:02walked straight to the kitchen table,
- 19:04pushed the letters aside, opened the
- 19:06laptop, and turned the screen toward me.
- 19:09Look at this. The HOA financial portal
- 19:12budget page, road resurfacing project,
- 19:16line items in a neat spreadsheet. Paving
- 19:18contractor, labor, equipment rental,
- 19:22shoulder grading, mobilization fee. And
- 19:25right there, third line from the top,
- 19:27highlighted by Nolan in yellow, gravel
- 19:29procurement contractor delivery, $9,500.
- 19:34I stared at it, read it again, $9,500.
- 19:38She told the board there was no
- 19:40acquisition cost, I said. No acquisition
- 19:42cost, Nolan repeated, tapping the
- 19:44minutes I'd left on the counter. That's
- 19:46what she said in February, but the
- 19:48budget shows 9,500 allocated for gravel
- 19:51procurement. And she's been taking it
- 19:53from your pit for free. The kitchen went
- 19:55very quiet. Just the clock and the hum
- 19:57and the math doing itself in my head.
- 20:00$9,500 budgeted for gravel that cost
- 20:02zero. No vendor name on the line item.
- 20:05No delivery company. No contract
- 20:08reference. Diane had billed the
- 20:10homeowners of Ridgeline Estates, 40
- 20:12households paying increased dues for
- 20:14road materials for gravel she was
- 20:16stealing from my land at no cost to
- 20:18anyone but me. This wasn't trespass
- 20:21anymore. This was fraud. Nolan and I
- 20:23spent the next hour going through every
- 20:25transaction we could find on the portal.
- 20:28The $9,500
- 20:30had been allocated in the approved
- 20:31budget. Diane controlled disbursements
- 20:34as president. There was no matching
- 20:36vendor invoice. No delivery receipt. No
- 20:39purchase order to a gravel supplier. The
- 20:41money had been drawn from the HOA
- 20:43operating account. Where it went from
- 20:45there, we couldn't trace on the portal
- 20:47alone. But it didn't matter where the
- 20:49money landed. What mattered was this.
- 20:51Diane told 40 families she was saving
- 20:54them money by sourcing free gravel. Then
- 20:56she charged them $9,500 for it anyway.
- 20:59Everything shifted. I called a real
- 21:01estate attorney the next morning, not
- 21:03the HOA's firm, my own. Found one two
- 21:06towns over. Brought the deed, the trail
- 21:09cam footage, the board minutes, and the
- 21:12budget page. He spread them across his
- 21:14desk like a hand of cards, read in
- 21:16silence for 10 minutes, and looked up.
- 21:19You have every right to block access to
- 21:21your property. This is textbook
- 21:23trespass. And if she billed the HOA for
- 21:26material she took at no cost, that's
- 21:28conversion and fraud. What about the
- 21:30prescriptive easement claim? He almost
- 21:32smiled. With 2 months of use? That's not
- 21:35a claim. That's a bluff on letterhead. I
- 21:37drove home with the windows down and the
- 21:39radio off,
- 21:41thinking.
- 21:42The roadwork was scheduled for the 28th.
- 21:44The loader would need gravel before
- 21:46then.
- 21:47I had 12 days. That evening I stopped at
- 21:49the hardware store, bought a heavy gauge
- 21:51chain, the kind you'd use on a farm
- 21:53gate, and a hardened steel padlock rated
- 21:55for outdoor use. Loaded them into the
- 21:57bed of my truck. The quiet strategy was
- 22:00over. What came next was simple. Block
- 22:03the pit at the exact moment Diane needed
- 22:05it most, and bring every receipt I had.
- 22:07I started with the paper, sat at the
- 22:09kitchen table with the printer running,
- 22:11and organized everything I had.
- 22:13Certified deed with the survey overlay
- 22:15property line highlighted, trail cam
- 22:17screenshots from eight consecutive
- 22:19Tuesdays, each printed with the
- 22:21timestamp visible, board meeting minutes
- 22:24from February with no acquisition cost
- 22:26circled. Budget page with the $9,500
- 22:30gravel procurement line underlined. My
- 22:32attorney's cease and desist letter. All
- 22:34of it went into a Manila folder, tabbed,
- 22:37labeled, in order. If this went the way
- 22:40I expected, I'd get one chance to lay it
- 22:42all out. It had to be clean. My attorney
- 22:45sent the formal cease and desist to the
- 22:47HOA board that Thursday, not to Diane
- 22:50personally, but to every board member by
- 22:52name, certified mail to their home
- 22:54addresses. The letter laid it out plain.
- 22:57The pit was private property, the taking
- 22:59was documented trespass, and the HOA
- 23:01needed to provide a full accounting of
- 23:03the $9,500
- 23:05gravel line item within 10 business
- 23:07days. The certified receipts came back
- 23:09signed by Friday afternoon. All five
- 23:11board members had received it. Diane's
- 23:14response took less than 24 hours. Nolan
- 23:16texted me Saturday morning. She called
- 23:19an emergency session. Today, 1:00 p.m.
- 23:22"You're excluded," she told the board.
- 23:24"You have a conflict of interest and
- 23:26can't attend." I sat with that for a
- 23:28minute. Phone in my hand, coffee going
- 23:30cold. She'd received a cease and desist
- 23:33letter with a certified deed and eight
- 23:35weeks of trespass evidence attached. And
- 23:37her first move wasn't to answer it,
- 23:40wasn't to call my attorney, wasn't to
- 23:41open the budget to the board. Her first
- 23:43move was to lock me out of the room. The
- 23:45board met at 1:00 in Diane's living
- 23:48room. Nolan was there as treasurer
- 23:50alternate. She couldn't exclude him
- 23:52without tipping her hand about the
- 23:54finances. He texted me the result at
- 23:562:15. Three to two. The board voted to
- 23:59authorize continued access to the gravel
- 24:01corridor pending legal review from HOA
- 24:04council. Diane framed the whole thing as
- 24:06one homeowner trying to derail a
- 24:08community project. She never showed the
- 24:10board my deed, never mentioned the trail
- 24:12cam, never addressed the budget
- 24:14question. Three to two. She needed
- 24:17three, and she got exactly three. The
- 24:19same board members who'd never seen my
- 24:21evidence, never questioned the budget,
- 24:24and never asked where the $9,500 went.
- 24:27But she wasn't done. Not even close.
- 24:30Monday morning, Nolan called me before
- 24:32I'd finished breakfast. She moved the
- 24:34timeline, called the paving contractor
- 24:36over the weekend, and pushed everything
- 24:38up. Road work was the 28th. Now it's the
- 24:4125th. Loaders coming Monday the 24th for
- 24:44the gravel. She'd cut three days off my
- 24:46window. Three days. If the loader
- 24:49reached my pit Monday morning, the
- 24:51gravel would be loaded, the trucks would
- 24:53be rolling, and by the time I I in front
- 24:55of a judge, the material would be under
- 24:57asphalt. You can't unpave a road to
- 25:00recover stolen gravel. I hung up and
- 25:02stared at the calendar on the kitchen
- 25:04wall. Today was Friday. That gave me the
- 25:06weekend. Saturday I went through every
- 25:09document one final time. Deed clean.
- 25:12Trail cam footage 8 Tuesdays time
- 25:15stamped clear. Minutes no acquisition
- 25:18cost page three. Budget $9,500.
- 25:22No vendor. Attorney's cease and desist
- 25:25certified received. I cross-referenced
- 25:27every number, every date. If I was going
- 25:30to stand at that gate and tell the HOA
- 25:32president she couldn't pass, the paper
- 25:33had to be airtight. One wrong number,
- 25:36one inconsistency, and she'd use it to
- 25:38muddy the water. Everything checked out.
- 25:41I closed the folder and set it on the
- 25:43counter. Sunday evening, just before
- 25:45dark, I drove out to the pit. The air
- 25:47smelled like wet limestone and cut
- 25:49grass. I could hear the creek behind the
- 25:52tree line, the same creek my father said
- 25:54kept the gravel washed clean. The pit
- 25:56walls threw long shadows in the last of
- 25:58the sunlight, and the south bank still
- 26:00showed the fresh scoop marks from
- 26:02Tuesday's loader run. Eight weeks of
- 26:04bite marks in my father's gravel. I
- 26:06looped the chain through both gate
- 26:08posts, pulled it tight, and threaded the
- 26:10padlock through the end links. The click
- 26:12echoed off the pit walls, metal on
- 26:14metal, sharp and final. I repositioned
- 26:17the trail cam to cover the gate head-on.
- 26:19Then I cable-tied a laminated sign to
- 26:21the center of the chain. Private
- 26:24property, no trespassing, owner
- 26:26recorded. Before I left, I pulled out my
- 26:29phone and called the county sheriff's
- 26:30non-emergency line. Told the dispatcher
- 26:33I was securing access to my private
- 26:35property due to ongoing trespass. Gave
- 26:38her the address, the parcel number, and
- 26:40the deed recording reference. Asked her
- 26:43to log it officially. "You expecting
- 26:45trouble?" she asked. "I'm expecting
- 26:47someone to show up tomorrow morning and
- 26:49tell me I can't lock my own gate."
- 26:51Noted. "I'll flag it for the morning
- 26:53unit. I drove home as the last light
- 26:55drained out of the sky, set my alarm for
- 26:585:00 a.m., put the evidence folder on
- 27:00the passenger seat of my truck right
- 27:02where I could reach it. Around 9:00 that
- 27:04night, the phone buzzed. Nolan,
- 27:07contractor confirmed with Diane. Crew
- 27:09plus loader, 6:00 a.m. Monday. She told
- 27:12them gravel would be ready and waiting.
- 27:14I typed back, Been ready for 8 weeks.
- 27:18Set the phone on the nightstand, turned
- 27:19off the lamp, and lay in the dark
- 27:21listening to the house settle. 12 hours.
- 27:24In 12 hours, Diane Caldwell was going to
- 27:26pull up to a locked gate on my property
- 27:29and discover that the man she'd been
- 27:30stealing from wasn't confused, wasn't
- 27:33bluffing, and wasn't going away. She
- 27:36thought she'd moved fast enough. She
- 27:38hadn't. I was at the pit by 5:45. The
- 27:41chain was locked. The trail cam blinked
- 27:43green. The pit sat quiet in the gray
- 27:46half-light before sunrise. Gravel banks
- 27:48pale against the dark line of trees. I
- 27:51leaned against my truck hood with the
- 27:52folder on the seat behind me and a
- 27:54thermos of coffee I didn't touch. At
- 27:566:05, I heard the loader before I saw
- 27:59it. Diesel growl coming up the access
- 28:01road, then the yellow cab cresting the
- 28:03hill with the paving company flatbed
- 28:05right behind it.
- 28:07Two vehicles ready to load. The loader
- 28:10rolled to the gate and stopped.
- 28:12The operator leaned out of the cab, saw
- 28:15the chain, saw the sign, and killed the
- 28:17engine.
- 28:19He didn't get out. He didn't touch
- 28:21anything. He just pulled out his phone
- 28:23and made a call. 3 minutes later, I
- 28:25heard Diane Caldwell's voice through the
- 28:27cab speaker. Sharp, bright, already
- 28:31angry. What do you mean it's locked? Cut
- 28:33the chain off. The operator glanced at
- 28:35me, then back at the phone. Ma'am,
- 28:38there's a no trespassing sign. Says
- 28:40owner recorded. And there's a guy
- 28:42standing right here. A pause. I could
- 28:45hear her breathing through the speaker.
- 28:47I'm on my way. Don't move that
- 28:49equipment. She pulled up at 6:22 in a
- 28:51white Lexus SUV, dust swirling behind
- 28:55her tires before she'd even come to a
- 28:56full stop. The paving contractor's
- 28:59foreman, a stocky guy in an orange
- 29:00safety vest, had been leaning against
- 29:02his flatbed with his arms crossed since
- 29:05the loader shut down. He wasn't
- 29:06interested in cutting anybody's chain.
- 29:09He was interested in getting paid and
- 29:11not getting sued. Diane got out and
- 29:13walked straight toward the gate. She
- 29:15didn't look at the chain. She didn't
- 29:17look at the sign. She looked at me the
- 29:19way you'd look at someone who'd parked
- 29:20in your reserved spot. Open this gate
- 29:23right now. You are sabotaging a $35,000
- 29:26community project. I didn't raise my
- 29:28voice. This is my land, Diane, my pit.
- 29:31You've been sending that loader onto my
- 29:32property every Tuesday for 8 weeks. I
- 29:35have all of it on camera. Her jaw
- 29:37tightened. The board voted to authorize
- 29:39access. You're in violation of a board
- 29:42resolution. Open the gate or I'll have
- 29:44you cited for obstruction and
- 29:45trespassing on community infrastructure.
- 29:47Trespassing on my own land? The access
- 29:50corridor is There is no access corridor.
- 29:53Not on my parcel. Not according to the
- 29:55deed, the survey, or any document that
- 29:58exists. I reached into the truck and
- 30:00pulled out the certified deed, held it
- 30:02up so she could see the county seal and
- 30:04the survey overlay. 30 ft inside my
- 30:06property line, Diane. The pit has never
- 30:09been common area. It's never been HOA
- 30:12property. Not one day since my father
- 30:14bought this land in 1996.
- 30:17She didn't look at it. She turned to the
- 30:18contractor foreman instead. This man is
- 30:21obstructing a community infrastructure
- 30:23project. I need you to document this for
- 30:25the HOA's legal file. The foreman
- 30:28shifted his weight, uncrossed his arms,
- 30:30and took a step back from her. Ma'am, I
- 30:33pour asphalt. I'm not getting in the
- 30:35middle of a property dispute. That's
- 30:37between you and him and whoever's got a
- 30:38badge. Two board members pulled up
- 30:41within the next 10 minutes. Diane had
- 30:42called them on the way. Then Nolan,
- 30:45right behind. Three of five board
- 30:47members standing in the dust and diesel
- 30:50haze at the mouth of my gravel pit at
- 30:526:30 on a Monday morning. That's when
- 30:54Diane made her last play. She turned to
- 30:57face the board members, straightened up,
- 30:59lifted her chin, and pitched her voice
- 31:01like she was addressing a full assembly.
- 31:03"This man is trying to hold the entire
- 31:05road project hostage for a payout. This
- 31:08is extortion. He wants the HOA to write
- 31:11him a check for gravel that's been part
- 31:13of this community's resources since day
- 31:15one." She said it with conviction. She
- 31:17said it looking each board member in the
- 31:19eye. And for about 5 seconds, standing
- 31:22there in the morning light with dust on
- 31:24her shoes, she almost sounded like she
- 31:27believed it. Then my attorney Sedan
- 31:29pulled off the access road and parked
- 31:31behind the flatbed. Craig Hutton got out
- 31:33carrying a folder identical to mine.
- 31:35He'd been waiting for my text since
- 31:375:30. He walked over with the unhurried
- 31:40pace of a man who'd done this kind of
- 31:42thing before, nodded to me, and turned
- 31:44to the board members. "My name is Craig
- 31:46Hutton. I represent Fletcher Townsend,
- 31:49the owner of this parcel. I'd like to
- 31:51show you three things. It won't take
- 31:53long." He laid the documents out on the
- 31:55hood of my truck, one at a time, like
- 31:57dealing cards. "First, the certified
- 32:00deed and survey." He pointed to the
- 32:02property line with his pen. "This pit is
- 32:04entirely on Mr. Townsend's private land.
- 32:07The boundary runs here 30 ft south of
- 32:09the nearest pit edge. It has never been
- 32:12designated as common area, community
- 32:14property, or any kind of HOA corridor.
- 32:17That's not an opinion. That's the county
- 32:19record." One of the board members, a
- 32:21tall guy from lot nine, leaned in and
- 32:23traced the line with his eyes. I watched
- 32:26his face change. "Second, printed trail
- 32:29cam stills. Eight images, eight
- 32:31Tuesdays, each with a timestamp and the
- 32:34HOA logo visible on the loader door.
- 32:37Eight consecutive weeks of documented
- 32:39trespass onto Mr. com Townson's
- 32:42property. He reported it directly to Ms.
- 32:44Caldwell. The taking continued. Hutton
- 32:47let that sit for a beat. Diane opened
- 32:49her mouth. He kept going. Third, two
- 32:52documents laid side by side on the warm
- 32:55hood. On the left, the February board
- 32:58meeting minutes, Diane's words
- 32:59highlighted in yellow. On the right, the
- 33:02budget page, the $9,500
- 33:05line item circled in red. The morning
- 33:07was dead quiet. Even the frogs had
- 33:10stopped. Hutton tapped the minutes. In
- 33:12February, your president told this board
- 33:15that gravel for the road project would
- 33:17come from, and I'm quoting the minutes,
- 33:19adjacent reserves at no acquisition
- 33:21cost. He tapped the budget page. But the
- 33:24approved budget includes a line item for
- 33:26$9,500 in gravel procurement with
- 33:29contractor delivery. He looked up,
- 33:32looked at each board member in turn. The
- 33:34gravel cost nothing. It was taken from
- 33:37Mr. Townson's land without permission.
- 33:39But your homeowners were billed $9,500
- 33:42for it anyway. There's no vendor
- 33:44invoice, no delivery receipt, no
- 33:47supplier contract. He paused. Three
- 33:50seconds. Four. Where is the $9,500?
- 33:55Nobody moved. The loader engine was off.
- 33:57The flatbed idled low. The only sound
- 34:00was wind across loose stone. Diane
- 34:02didn't flinch, not at first. Then
- 34:05something shifted behind her eyes, a
- 34:07flicker, quick, like a light catching
- 34:09behind a curtain that someone pulls too
- 34:11late. That line item, she said, and her
- 34:14voice had lost half its volume, was
- 34:16allocated for future procurement needs.
- 34:19It's a contingency reserve. The tall
- 34:21board member from lot nine turned to
- 34:22her. A contingency reserve? You told us
- 34:25in February there was no acquisition
- 34:27cost. You said the materials were on
- 34:29site and free. Now there's a $9,500
- 34:33line for procurement that never
- 34:35happened. Which one is it, Diane? She
- 34:37opened her mouth, closed it, opened it
- 34:40again. The budget reflects standard.
- 34:43Where's the vendor invoice? He wasn't
- 34:45yelling. His voice was flat, which was
- 34:47worse. Where's the delivery receipt? Who
- 34:50was paid the $9,500?
- 34:53Silence. Nolan stepped forward from
- 34:55behind the other two. I checked the
- 34:57financial portal. There's no matching
- 34:59vendor invoice, no purchase order, no
- 35:02supplier contract. The disbursement went
- 35:04to an account with Diane listed as sole
- 35:06signatory. The second board member, a
- 35:08woman from lot 18 who'd barely spoken,
- 35:10turned to Diane. Is that true? Diane's
- 35:13lips pressed into a line so tight they
- 35:15went years
- 35:18of fines and policies and board meetings
- 35:20and that confident, clipped voice, she
- 35:23had nothing left to say. The tall board
- 35:25member looked at the other two. I'm
- 35:27moving to suspend the president's
- 35:28authority effective immediately, pending
- 35:31a full independent financial audit.
- 35:33Nolan didn't hesitate. Seconded. All in
- 35:35favor. Three hands. Three to zero. Diane
- 35:39abstained. The fifth member was at home,
- 35:42unaware. The foreman straightened up,
- 35:44walked back to his crew, and waved them
- 35:46off. Pack it up, boys. We're not loading
- 35:49anything today. The loader engine stayed
- 35:51dead. A county sheriff's deputy rolled
- 35:53up the access road about 10 minutes
- 35:55later. My Sunday call had been logged
- 35:58and dispatch had flagged Monday morning
- 36:00for a unit. He parked behind Nolan's
- 36:02truck, took one look at the crowd around
- 36:04my gate, and walked over with a
- 36:06clipboard. I handed him a copy of the
- 36:08evidence folder. He took my statement,
- 36:10photographed the chain and the sign,
- 36:12took down Diane's name and address, and
- 36:14told her, professionally, to remain
- 36:16available for follow-up. She stood by
- 36:19her Lexus through all of it, arms at her
- 36:21sides. She didn't speak to the deputy,
- 36:23didn't speak to the board members,
- 36:25didn't speak to me. The last thing I saw
- 36:27before she drove away was her hands on
- 36:29the steering wheel white-knuckled, 10
- 36:31and 2, staring through a windshield
- 36:33covered in a thin film of gravel dust
- 36:35from my father's pit. Eight weeks she'd
- 36:37sent that loader onto my land. Eight
- 36:40weeks she'd lied to the board and billed
- 36:42the neighborhood for gravel that cost
- 36:44her nothing. Eight weeks she told me I
- 36:46had no say over my own property. And all
- 36:49of it ended at a locked gate on a Monday
- 36:51morning with three documents on the hood
- 36:53of my truck. The audit took 11 days. The
- 36:56board hired an independent accountant,
- 36:59not the firm Diane had been using, a
- 37:01completely new one recommended by their
- 37:03interim legal counsel. He pulled the
- 37:05HOA's financials for the full fiscal
- 37:07year and went straight to the road
- 37:08resurfacing budget. The result was clean
- 37:11and ugly. The $9,500
- 37:13allocated for gravel procurement
- 37:15contractor delivery had no matching
- 37:17vendor invoice, no purchase order, no
- 37:20delivery confirmation, no contract with
- 37:22any gravel supplier anywhere. The money
- 37:24had been disbursed to a side account
- 37:26Diane Caldwell had opened under the
- 37:28HOA's tax ID number with herself listed
- 37:31as sole signatory.
- 37:32Nobody else on the board knew the
- 37:34account existed. The board met the
- 37:36following Tuesday, regular monthly
- 37:38meeting, not an emergency session, full
- 37:40attendance, five members present. Nolan
- 37:43read the auditor's summary out loud.
- 37:45When he finished, the room was quiet for
- 37:47a long time. The vote to remove Diane as
- 37:50president was unanimous, five to zero.
- 37:53Her board seat was vacated the same
- 37:55night, no appeal, no transition period.
- 37:58Two weeks after that, the board and my
- 38:00attorney filed a joint criminal
- 38:02complaint with the county district
- 38:03attorney. The charges, theft of
- 38:06property, 160 cubic yards of gravel
- 38:09valued at $2,400 at market rate and
- 38:12fraud, and embezzlement of $9,500
- 38:16in HOA funds. Diane Caldwell was
- 38:18arrested on a Thursday afternoon at her
- 38:20home on lot four.
- 38:22Released on bond the same evening. I
- 38:24found out from Nolan, not the news. I
- 38:27didn't celebrate. I didn't call anyone.
- 38:29I just sat on my porch and thought about
- 38:31how much easier it would have been if
- 38:33she'd listened the first time I knocked
- 38:35on her door. On the civil side, things
- 38:37moved quicker. The HOA's new council
- 38:40reached out to my attorney within a
- 38:41week. They offered restitution. $3,800
- 38:45for the stolen gravel market value, plus
- 38:48compensation for damage the loader had
- 38:50done to my pit access road over eight
- 38:52weeks of unauthorized use. All fines
- 38:55Diane had issued against me, $1,250
- 38:58total, were formally rescinded. The
- 39:00prescriptive easement claim was
- 39:01withdrawn in writing, and Diane was held
- 39:05personally liable for the HOA's outside
- 39:07legal expenses. I signed the settlement
- 39:09at my kitchen table, same table where
- 39:12I'd unrolled the plat map, same table
- 39:14where Nolan had turned his laptop around
- 39:16and shown me the $9,500 that didn't
- 39:19belong to Diane.
- 39:20The road work eventually got done. Took
- 39:22about six weeks longer than Diane's
- 39:24original timeline, but it got done
- 39:26right. The HOA contracted a legitimate
- 39:29gravel supplier out of the county
- 39:30quarry. The cost, $6,200,
- 39:34less than the $9,500
- 39:36Diane
- 39:38had budgeted for gravel she stole for
- 39:40free. The irony sat there like a rock in
- 39:43the road. It literally cost the
- 39:45neighborhood less to be honest than to
- 39:47let Diane steal. The roads came out
- 39:49fine. Fresh asphalt, clean shoulders,
- 39:52proper
- 39:54Nobody complained. Three of the
- 39:55neighbors who'd called me after Diane's
- 39:57email blast stopped by the house over
- 40:00the next few weeks, one at a time. Each
- 40:02one said some version of the same thing.
- 40:05Sorry. Didn't know. Should have asked. I
- 40:08didn't hold it against them. They'd been
- 40:10lied to, same as the board. Same as
- 40:13everybody. Nolan got elected interim
- 40:15president at the next quarterly meeting,
- 40:17ran unopposed.
- 40:19No HOA access to any private property
- 40:22without written consent from the owner,
- 40:24documented and filed with the board
- 40:25secretary. Simple rule, should have been
- 40:28there from the start. A couple of weeks
- 40:30after everything settled, I drove out to
- 40:32the pit on a Saturday morning. No
- 40:34agenda, no contractor pickup, no
- 40:36evidence folder, just me. The trail cam
- 40:39was still mounted on the fence post,
- 40:41green light blinking slow. I thought
- 40:43about taking it down. Then I left it
- 40:45where it was. Not because I thought
- 40:47anyone was coming back, but because my
- 40:49dad would have said the same thing he
- 40:50always said, "Trust people, Fletch, but
- 40:53keep your receipts." I walked to the rim
- 40:56and looked down. The south bank still
- 40:58had the scoop marks from the loader,
- 40:59eight weeks of clean cuts carved into
- 41:02the gravel wall, softening now from rain
- 41:04and settling. The rest of the pit was
- 41:06the same as it had always been, dense,
- 41:09clean stone, good base material, 20
- 41:11years of my father's work sitting right
- 41:13where he left it. I stood there for a
- 41:15while, boots on loose gravel, morning
- 41:18light coming through the tree line, the
- 41:20creek running behind the ridge, same
- 41:22sound it made when I was 12 years old
- 41:24hauling buckets for my dad while he ran
- 41:26the old excavator. On the way home, I
- 41:28drove past the new road, smooth dark
- 41:31asphalt, fresh yellow center line. It
- 41:34looked good. It looked like a
- 41:35neighborhood that had figured out how to
- 41:37do things the right way, even if it took
- 41:39a while to get there. My gravel was
- 41:42still in my pit. My father's land was
- 41:44still my land. And the woman who tried
- 41:46to take both was answering to a judge
- 41:48instead of a board. Some things do give
- 41:50back what you put in. You just got to
- 41:52show up.
About this transcript
This page contains the full transcript of I Found the HOA Taking Gravel From My Pit Every Week — So I Blocked Their Loader Before Road Work by HOA Power Breakers, generated from the public captions YouTube serves with the video. The transcript has 7,318 words across 1,094 segments, with the original timestamps preserved so you can click any line to jump to that moment in the embedded player.
What you can do with it
Use the transcript to take notes, quote the speaker, build a study guide, generate a summary with ChatGPT or Claude via the YouTube Summary tool, or export it as a timed subtitle file with YouTube to SRT. You can also re-open it in the transcriber to choose a caption track available on the video.
Free YouTube transcript tool
YouTube2Text is a free YouTube transcript generator — no signup, no daily limit. Paste any YouTube link and get the full transcript instantly, with timestamps, click-to-jump, caption language selection, AI prompts for ChatGPT, Claude, and Gemini, and exports to TXT, SRT, VTT, or Markdown.