I Dated Nicole Brown Simpson After O.J. — And Witnessed Her Battle to Escape His Abuse — Transcript

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1. 0:00There is this tug-of-war of falling in
2. 0:02love with her, but knowing her situation
3. 0:04was impossible. He was unhinged, you
4. 0:06know, this man's lurking everywhere I
5. 0:08go.
6. 0:09>> We believe we know who's responsible for
7. 0:12the crime.
8. 0:13>> I just thought, oh, he did it. He did
9. 0:15it. He
10. 0:16He killed her.
11. 0:17>> Nicole and her friend Ronald Goldman
12. 0:19were discovered in a pool of blood.
13. 0:21>> I certainly felt Ron Goldman could have
14. 0:23been me.
15. 0:25I still owe it to Nicole, as a man who
16. 0:28had fallen in love with her, to share
17. 0:30this piece of her
18. 0:31>> [music]
19. 0:31>> that he couldn't take away.
20. 0:34You know?
21. 0:39We know she's the most famous
22. 0:42victim of domestic violence and we don't
23. 0:44know anything about her.
24. 0:46I'd collected all the things we'd shared
25. 0:49and I I tucked away and I hid it.
26. 0:51She says,
27. 0:52I'm missing you like crazy, love me.
28. 0:56When I finally sifted through these
29. 0:59things,
30. 1:00they
31. 1:01had a different meaning to me. I
32. 1:03rediscovered
33. 1:05someone that I had forgotten about, who
34. 1:07was a lot different than portrayed by
35. 1:10the media and who was overshadowed by
36. 1:12the trial and by by O.J. Simpson. It
37. 1:15brought back all the the beauty of the
38. 1:18the wonderful moments we shared
39. 1:20together.
40. 1:22This story really began writing itself
41. 1:24in 1989 when I first met Nicole.
42. 1:28I was working for Neiman Marcus in
43. 1:31Beverly Hills. Chris Jenner was
44. 1:34Kardashian at the time was a a very good
45. 1:36friend and she'd always call and invite
46. 1:39me to a spontaneous lunch. I'll never
47. 1:41forget I we were on San Vicente
48. 1:43Boulevard and I saw the coral trees
49. 1:45and they were blooming and like I've
50. 1:47never seen anything like it in Los
51. 1:49Angeles before. I asked her, I said,
52. 1:51where what are we doing? And she said,
53. 1:53oh, you're meeting my
54. 1:54one of my best friends, Nicole, and I
55. 1:56would love for you to connect her with
56. 1:57some people at Neiman's. You could help
57. 1:59her with some shoes. She has to attend a
58. 2:00black tie with O.J.
59. 2:02And of course I said, "Oh, who doesn't
60. 2:03know O.J. Simpson?" Of course. So, Chris
61. 2:05alluded that yeah, she's
62. 2:07>> [music]
63. 2:07>> going through a little difficult time,
64. 2:09you know, with her marriage. Um there's
65. 2:11it's tumultuous sort of thing. So, I
66. 2:13showed her some shoes, and that was it.
67. 2:16Three years later, I got a phone call
68. 2:19from Chris. She says, "You can't imagine
69. 2:21who I just ran into last night, [music]
70. 2:23and she asked about you. She each
71. 2:25separated from O.J. She looks the best
72. 2:27she's ever looked. She's happy. She's a
73. 2:29totally different woman, and she asked
74. 2:31about you." And
75. 2:32and I was shocked.
76. 2:35So, we went to dinner, and I was
77. 2:38mesmerized by her new found freedom. She
78. 2:40looked me in the eye, [music] and she
79. 2:42said, "Chris told me you were really
80. 2:43nervous about getting together tonight."
81. 2:45And I was bowled over by her
82. 2:47by how bold she was to say that. And I
83. 2:49said, "Well, you know,
84. 2:51look, I I wanted to say, "Well, look,
85. 2:53you're you're going through a
86. 2:54separation." But I said, "No, I wasn't
87. 2:56I'm I wasn't apprehensive. I'm I'm glad
88. 2:58we got together." And she said, "Great.
89. 2:59Well, let's let's plan on going for a
90. 3:01run sometime."
91. 3:02>> There you go.
92. 3:03>> I had started mountain biking with Bruce
93. 3:05who identifies as Caitlyn now. So,
94. 3:08Caitlyn and I would mountain bike ride,
95. 3:10you know, once or twice a week. When we
96. 3:13got to the top uh of that mountain, and
97. 3:16we'd always walk out there and just have
98. 3:17a idle chit chat, you know. And she
99. 3:19said, um "Oh, big big date with Nicole
100. 3:22tonight." She looked me in the eye, and
101. 3:24she said, "O.J. will always be a
102. 3:26problem."
103. 3:27I was so attracted to her. It felt so
104. 3:29right to me. And that warning from
105. 3:32Caitlyn, it started to get a little more
106. 3:34distant.
107. 3:37I learned a few things about her. One
108. 3:38that was she was a foodie. She had
109. 3:40destination dishes around Los Angeles.
110. 3:43And she loved the Seal album. It had
111. 3:46just come out.
112. 3:50So, we were listening to Seal,
113. 3:52you know, kissing on the sofa and I just
114. 3:55remember walking out of her house and I
115. 3:57got this eerie sense. And I get to my
116. 3:59car and I I kept kind of feeling like I
117. 4:02need to look over my shoulder. I
118. 4:04remember her driving away and looking in
119. 4:05the rearview mirror thinking that was a
120. 4:07very strange feeling.
121. 4:09I had a a friend, a producer,
122. 4:12in the industry who called me out
123. 4:15[music] of the blue and he said, "Hey, I
124. 4:17understand you went out on a date with
125. 4:20O.J. Have you lost your mind? You're
126. 4:22stepping into a very volatile
127. 4:25situation." One side of me was falling
128. 4:27in love with this woman and the other
129. 4:29side of me was wondering if love was
130. 4:31even possible with
131. 4:32with someone in a situation like hers,
132. 4:34especially [music] with the the man she
133. 4:36was trying to separate herself from.
134. 4:39She told me that she spoke to O.J. and
135. 4:42and she challenged him on coming to the
136. 4:44house when she was there with someone
137. 4:46and and he said he he just happened to
138. 4:48be driving by and he wanted to make sure
139. 4:50everything [music] was okay and
140. 4:52no wonder when I walked out of her house
141. 4:54that evening why I felt this
142. 4:57strange eerie feeling.
143. 5:00By then, I realized there was no way I
144. 5:02could resist her.
145. 5:04I finally confessed that I had [music]
146. 5:06fallen in love with her.
147. 5:07And I just felt like, "Wow, this is
148. 5:09really
149. 5:11this is getting really serious." And she
150. 5:13took a deep breath and she said, "I told
151. 5:15I told him."
152. 5:16And I said, "Told him? Told what?" And
153. 5:18she said, "I told O.J. I'd fallen in
154. 5:20love with you."
155. 5:21And wow, I I don't know. I felt like a
156. 5:25cold water was just thrown in my face
157. 5:28and I and I would and I was really
158. 5:31surprised and I and I said, "Why why
159. 5:34would you say that to him?"
160. 5:37And she said, "Look, I'm living my life
161. 5:39openly and honestly and I'm going to
162. 5:42tell him how I feel and and it's the
163. 5:45truth and I don't want him coming
164. 5:47between what we have.
165. 5:50That producer friend of mine knew I had
166. 5:53was continuing with my relationship with
167. 5:55her.
168. 5:56And he really gave it to me straight. He
169. 5:59He said, "You've really lost your mind.
170. 6:01You're about to step on a landmine. Your
171. 6:03foot's in midair. Pull back. Walk away.
172. 6:06Don't take that step forward."
173. 6:09And I I I did say, "You know, it's easy
174. 6:12for you
175. 6:13to say that where you sit." And he said,
176. 6:15"Well, from where I sit is reality and
177. 6:18that OJ thinks he could do whatever he
178. 6:21wants." His words, you know, and just
179. 6:23like Caitlyn's, they kind of fell silent
180. 6:27whenever I was close to her again.
181. 6:31By then,
182. 6:32she finally confessed to me about the
183. 6:35abuse. She said, um, "You know, he beat
184. 6:39me
185. 6:40really badly." And the way she described
186. 6:43it, I I
187. 6:45remember the every word. It was so
188. 6:47visceral.
189. 6:48The sound of fists, you know, um, and
190. 6:51the pain was so intense she blacked out.
191. 6:53She told me that. She really thought
192. 6:56she was she was going to die.
193. 6:59Through her tears, I'll never forget,
194. 7:00she said, [music]
195. 7:01"I'll never go back to that man.
196. 7:03I'd rather die than go back to him."
197. 7:06That's what she said.
198. 7:08It changed my relationship tremendously
199. 7:10because I was woefully unprepared
200. 7:15for something like that. I knew nothing
201. 7:16about domestic violence at all.
202. 7:19And I didn't know what I could do to
203. 7:20help. So,
204. 7:22I don't
205. 7:24I don't
206. 7:27One morning we went for a run and her
207. 7:29friend Cora showed up to run with us.
208. 7:30And I look ahead and I see this man
209. 7:34with two children. And then Cora
210. 7:37I I she seizes up like, "Oh my god." And
211. 7:40she
212. 7:41takes her hand and digs her fingernails
213. 7:43into my upper arm so hard she gouged
214. 7:45into my skin. She said, "Joseph,
215. 7:47whatever you do, you need to keep
216. 7:48running." And there's OJ. Before I
217. 7:52passed him by, we
218. 7:53>> [music]
219. 7:53>> it almost felt like he marked me a
220. 7:55little bit. Like we looked at each other
221. 7:58and he looked at me and and but his
222. 8:00glare was like penetrating. Before that,
223. 8:04he was this figure
224. 8:05you know, I imagined him to be OJ
225. 8:07Simpson in a certain way. Until that day
226. 8:10when I saw him, I felt like I was seeing
227. 8:12something that very few people had seen.
228. 8:15Nicole was very upset and uh
229. 8:19and she felt like he followed her with
230. 8:22the children to make her look bad and he
231. 8:24was supposed to be away with the kids
232. 8:26for the weekend.
233. 8:27But she kind of was look, it's
234. 8:29Brentwood, he's lives close by. This is
235. 8:31these things are going to happen. And
236. 8:33that was a big shift for me. I I just
237. 8:35thought, you know, I don't think I could
238. 8:36live my life like this feeling like this
239. 8:38man's lurking everywhere I go.
240. 8:41And I decided to end the relationship.
241. 8:45I had collected all the things we'd
242. 8:47shared, the books, the [music] cards and
243. 8:50letters she'd given me and I put it in
244. 8:52this briefcase [music] and I tucked it
245. 8:54away and I hid it.
246. 8:56And I decided that was it. I I can't do
247. 8:59this anymore.
248. 9:01We kept in touch. She She wanted to be
249. 9:03[music] friends, you know. She called me
250. 9:05that summer just to update me on a few
251. 9:07things, you know, called one day, "Hey,
252. 9:09guess who's officially single." Her
253. 9:11divorce had gone through.
254. 9:12So that was a relief. I thought things
255. 9:14would be easier for her now.
256. 9:17Since breaking things off with Nicole, I
257. 9:19wasn't spending as much time with the
258. 9:21Jenners. They were living in Beverly
259. 9:23Hills by then. They left Malibu. So
260. 9:25Christmas of 1993, I saw Caitlyn at the
261. 9:27gym. Couldn't have been nicer. Like,
262. 9:29"Joseph, where the heck you been? The
263. 9:31kids miss you.
264. 9:32You got to come to the Christmas Eve
265. 9:34party." When I walked into the party,
266. 9:37everybody's were on me and the entire
267. 9:39room fell silent, like dead silent.
268. 9:43Everything stopped.
269. 9:44And I looked over and I see Nicole. And
270. 9:47I turn around and OJ's behind me. And I
271. 9:50had heard a rumor that they were back
272. 9:51together,
273. 9:52>> [music]
274. 9:52>> but I couldn't I didn't give it credence
275. 9:54because I I just I thought about that
276. 9:57night in Laguna when she cried and said
277. 9:59she'd never go back to him. And I said,
278. 10:01I don't know why I said I said, "Hi, OJ.
279. 10:02You're You're looking well." And that
280. 10:05couldn't have been further further from
281. 10:06the truth. He was unhinged, you know,
282. 10:08his he's sweating, you know, and
283. 10:11he's holding this flute in his hand and
284. 10:14I'm not wasn't sure what he was going to
285. 10:15do with it. It was he going to smash,
286. 10:18you know, then he placed it down and he
287. 10:21looks at me with this chilling like
288. 10:24stare, dead in my eyes and he said,
289. 10:27"It's only an illusion."
290. 10:29And then he turned around and walked out
291. 10:31the door.
292. 10:32And stormed out of the house and [music]
293. 10:35the party was instantly in shambles
294. 10:37because the way he stormed out of the
295. 10:38house, I mean, he was taking everything
296. 10:40with it.
297. 10:41I looked and [music] I I saw Nicole.
298. 10:44I just felt like, okay, this was it.
299. 10:46This is what she decided.
300. 10:48And I felt like that was the last time I
301. 10:50was going to see her. I knew it because
302. 10:51[music]
303. 10:52I knew I was never going to go back to
304. 10:54that world.
305. 10:55>> Many many can't believe that this has
306. 10:56happened, especially that he has run
307. 10:59from the scene and
308. 10:59>> I got a phone call and it was a mutual
309. 11:02friend of ours and he was talking so
310. 11:06fast that
311. 11:08I couldn't even really understand him.
312. 11:10And then I somehow heard Nicole and
313. 11:12murdered.
314. 11:14And then I stopped hearing. And it just
315. 11:17hit me, you know, I just thought, "Oh,
316. 11:18he did it. He did it. He
317. 11:21He killed her."
318. 11:23I became sort of a zombie, I think,
319. 11:25while all this was going on and the
320. 11:26whole country was getting swept up in
321. 11:29this.
322. 11:30I was still kind of processing that she
323. 11:32had been killed and the way she was
324. 11:33killed and that's when I remembered I I
325. 11:35thought gosh, you know, I put all her
326. 11:38all those little things I wrote about
327. 11:39her
328. 11:40that spring we spent I have it all. Let
329. 11:43me go find it and say goodbye to her.
330. 11:47I went into the closet. I remember where
331. 11:49I put that briefcase and it was gone.
332. 11:51So, I walked away from all that and I
333. 11:54never grieved her death and I pretended
334. 11:57to never love her
335. 11:58for all those years.
336. 12:01>> In the matter of the people of the state
337. 12:02of California versus Orenthal James
338. 12:04Simpson
339. 12:05>> When the verdict was read, I remember
340. 12:08seeing them celebrating and I remember
341. 12:10looking into that TV trying to see his
342. 12:14eyes and I remember those chilling
343. 12:16words, "It's only an illusion." It all
344. 12:18hit me really hard that that moment
345. 12:21watching that.
346. 12:23The briefcase that had been missing for
347. 12:26all those years
348. 12:27suddenly turned up. 3 years later I was
349. 12:30living in New York at the time and
350. 12:31Elaine, the woman that lived in that
351. 12:33house, called to say, "I found your
352. 12:36briefcase you were looking for." It
353. 12:38looked [music] like a portal I was about
354. 12:40to slip into and I did. The moment I
355. 12:42opened it, I saw
356. 12:44her book, her favorite book.
357. 12:47I felt like
358. 12:49I it was incumbent upon me to do
359. 12:52something significant [music] with these
360. 12:53things, you know?
361. 12:55I drove to Brentwood and I walked along
362. 12:58the meridian
363. 12:59>> [music]
364. 12:59>> and the crow trees were in bloom.
365. 13:03And
366. 13:04I saw this beautiful story coming
367. 13:07together
368. 13:08and
369. 13:10as I pieced it all back together, I I
370. 13:12saw her coming back to life.
371. 13:14She was
372. 13:15>> [music]
373. 13:15>> this
374. 13:16spiritual woman who was looking for
375. 13:20peace and tranquility [music] and
376. 13:22happiness and
377. 13:23hopefully this in some small way will
378. 13:25will
379. 13:26open up people's hearts and minds to who
380. 13:29this woman really truly was.