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How to Start a Startup (Season 1) | Session 9 - Kunal Shah, Founder & CEO, Freecharge — Transcript

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0:05Do you think that across the globe the
0:08average age of the entrepreneur is
0:10dropping?
0:13Successful entrepreneurs, age is
0:14dropping.
0:16It's dropping.
0:17The average age is dropping because the
0:20time to
0:22have a business model and a shelf life
0:24of business model is shrinking.
0:26The reason it is shrinking is that
0:28the world has become hyperconnected.
0:33Okay?
0:34When the world is seamlessly connected,
0:37anything good or bad seamlessly flows
0:40from one part to another part.
0:44The reason the word viral exist today
0:48because the medium has become
0:50hyperconnected.
0:53Things were not viral before.
0:57Which type of virus spreads faster? The
1:00one which uses the
1:03air, the easiest medium to spread.
1:07And which medium is the
1:09most inefficient medium to spread if you
1:11are a virus?
1:14Sorry?
1:19I don't understand that question. Which
1:21is the hardest medium You're a virus.
1:25You have to spread yourself from person
1:27A to person B. What is the hardest
1:28medium to transfer yourself?
1:32Blood?
1:35Blood transfusion, right? It'll be
1:36hardest, but malaria makes it easy.
1:39Or mosquitoes make it easy.
1:41Then what is the hardest?
1:46Which one?
1:47HIV, sexual transmission is hardest.
1:51Think about it. It's truth. It's truth.
1:54Therefore, it is easily curtailed.
1:56But an airborne virus is hard to
1:59contain. The world is behaving in this
2:00manner. In that world, when the things
2:03are moving this fast, right? It is
2:06impossible
2:08for something to last
2:10as a secret.
2:15Information asymmetry almost does not
2:17exist.
2:18Right? There was a time, let's say I
2:20was, I don't know, a big FMCG company,
2:22and I would have this policy, and I
2:23would have my distributors in different
2:25places.
2:27Today,
2:28all the distributors are on a
2:31Can you guess what are they on right
2:33now, all of them? On
2:35a WhatsApp group.
2:39So,
2:41an isolated strategy
2:43of one state would easily transmit to
2:47other states and distributors, and it's
2:49not
2:50a great strategy anymore.
2:52In the past, you could get away with it.
2:55Because information would not seamlessly
2:57pass from
2:58one distributor to another distributor
2:59or one state to another state, right?
3:02Now, in this world of super high
3:04hyperconnected world, we are we are
3:07operating with old principles, and and
3:09therefore the younger entrepreneurs are
3:10able to do a lot more impact because
3:12they understand how the new world
3:13operates. The rules are different.
3:16At least the distribution
3:17is super easy to do if you create
3:19innovation.
3:21Right?
3:23The bigger problem we have in India,
3:24which I have observed after traveling,
3:26after exiting the company, I traveled to
3:28at least 12 odd countries to understand
3:30the startup ecosystem. The unique thing
3:32I found about India is
3:36we love to sugarcoat
3:39things.
3:40We are not very frank with each other.
3:43Can anybody answer why are we specialist
3:46of sugarcoating?
3:48How many of you have traveled abroad?
3:51Okay, quite a few of you.
3:53At least you see American movies at
3:54least, right?
3:55You understand they don't sugarcoat
3:57necessarily
3:58uh or you have seen a TV series, they
4:00don't really sugarcoat.
4:02They are usually fairly blunt and
4:05uh we don't like blunt people in India.
4:06Why is that?
4:08Can anybody answer? Go ahead and just
4:10raise your hand.
4:15What is the utility value of that?
4:22No, what is the utility value of this?
4:26Sorry.
4:29More?
4:30A more inclusive society.
4:31Inclusive society, okay. That's a That's
4:33an interesting way of looking at it.
4:35Imagine we are in a small village
4:37and uh
4:38there is one
4:40shoe guy, one butcher, one milk person,
4:43one farmer, and everybody is operating
4:45in this world, and if I am
4:48the dash guy,
4:51then nobody will do business with me or
4:53help me or
4:55come to help me when there's a problem,
4:56so I have to be nice.
4:59But what happens one day in that
5:01village, one kid whose dad
5:05decides to
5:07invent
5:09a steel bucket.
5:13And he starts selling to everybody.
5:15Everybody takes it because otherwise
5:16they're using the clay
5:18pot, which was breaking every time they
5:20would
5:20transport water.
5:22And he becomes super wealthy. He sells
5:24it to other villages, even more wealthy.
5:28And now everybody is nice to him again.
5:32He was still not nice to them.
5:38We are still living in that village
5:40world.
5:43Because a lot of our world still
5:46operates with being nice to each other.
5:48It's not true meritocracy
5:51that we think we live in.
5:53We don't.
5:56What I'm What I'm talking about is the
5:58world that we are living in right now.
6:01It is not standardized anymore.
6:05The disruptors are not coming from your
6:07vertical.
6:09They're coming from different verticals.
6:11What is the disruption that will happen
6:15because of a self-driving car? Anybody
6:18wants to
6:19tell me what will happen because of a
6:20self-driving car?
6:24Off.
6:26Okay, that's the easy one. Let's talk
6:28about the hard disruptions. What are the
6:30other disruptions that will happen
6:32because of that?
6:37So, let's say cab companies will get
6:38disrupted also. What else?
6:41Insurance companies will get disrupted.
6:43Sorry?
6:46Let's assume it works properly.
6:47Everybody Whenever technology came,
6:49everybody thought that it's not going to
6:50work properly. When cars came also, that
6:51time also people said the same thing.
6:53That's why they continued to ride
6:54horses.
6:58So, owning will disappear. What else
7:00will happen?
7:03Now, just think uh no traffic police.
7:06Okay, what else?
7:07Hospitals. Why?
7:10Less accidents. So, let's say 10% of
7:13business came from accidents, it will
7:14disappear.
7:15Okay, what else?
7:18Legal system.
7:19How?
7:22RTO is not required. Okay.
7:25Sorry?
7:28Okay. Can you imagine what will be the
7:29impact to the hotel industry?
7:34Can anybody tell me why?
7:39What were you saying?
7:41You were saying something.
7:46Why?
7:50So, what will be the new behavior?
8:00Perfect.
8:02Now,
8:03you think the hotel guys are thinking
8:04about the disruption right now? They are
8:06worried about mera competitive brand kya
8:08kar raha hai uske samne mujhe kya karna
8:10hai and all that stuff.
8:11And there are strategy presentations
8:13around that.
8:18By the way, the driverless cars are not
8:19some sci-fi things in the future. They
8:22are here.
8:24And it will not take too long.
8:28What what I'm talking about is that some
8:30of these things are real and happening.
8:33I'll tell you one interesting thing. The
8:34inventor of
8:36automated cars told me. There's a guy
8:38called a Sebastian who was the guy who
8:40invented the Google self-driving car. It
8:43was the first car of the lot. And he
8:44made a very interesting observation. He
8:46said that uh
8:49when a car meets with an accident in
8:52Texas,
8:54that information is learned by a cloud.
8:59And that information is learned by all
9:01the other cars in the US.
9:04And by all the other cars that are going
9:06to be manufactured
9:08in the future.
9:11But, humans are extremely inefficient in
9:14learning.
9:16Because we have to go, raise a kid, and
9:18explain the whole thing again.
9:22Even if an I am a father gets a kid, he
9:25has to still go through the whole
9:26process, get the kid to I am a, and
9:29hopefully it will reach the same level.
9:31But, the Google car is learning like
9:32this.
9:33Born with it.
9:36And therefore, the world is moving in
9:39that direction and and we are not
9:41prepared for it.
9:42In the past, we could
9:44parents could tell their kids
9:46don't do what I did, do something else,
9:47and that's going to be the future, and
9:48that's that's what most of us did. How
9:50many of you are
9:51going to get into the same thing that
9:53your parents are doing? Please raise
9:55your hand.
9:57Two, three, four, five. Great.
10:00There's a reason, right? The reason is
10:02that what you're going to choose is
10:03going to give you more returns for your
10:06effort
10:07versus what he picked in the past. You
10:09may also say that I don't like what he's
10:11doing,
10:12but
10:13there are
10:14more likely chances that you'll pick
10:15something that is going to be giving you
10:16more return for your time.
10:19But, what is happening is that some of
10:21these things are happening so quickly,
10:24right? Uh how many of you are actively
10:26following what's happening in the world
10:27of AI?
10:29Please raise your hand.
10:31One.
10:33Yeah.
10:34How many of you think that your
10:35knowledge on AI is six out of 10 and
10:38above? Please raise your hand.
10:43Yeah.
10:45Please pay attention to this. All right,
10:46it's important.
10:47Uh if you have some time over the
10:49weekend, please study all the
10:51development that are happening. There
10:52are some easy videos out there to show
10:54you
10:55uh how quickly some of these jobs are
10:56going to get disrupted
10:58uh and done much better.
11:01Um some of the things that are being
11:02developed in cities like Bangalore right
11:04now. There's a company which is
11:06developing
11:08How many of you have any background on
11:10how, let's say, a
11:12pathology lab, anybody has a background
11:13over here?
11:15Anybody family business?
11:17You must be knowing, sir, how a let's
11:19say a sperm count is done right now. Can
11:21you tell us how the sperm count is done
11:23on a on a microscope?
11:27And
11:29and
11:30how are you measuring it?
11:33There is a counter.
11:35You measure on a unit
11:37like this.
11:40This is how sperm counts are measured.
11:44Today, in 2017,
11:48I say, you watch 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10
11:5211, multiply by 1,000 because the
11:55the unit that you measured. This is how
11:56it's done, right, sir?
12:01Yeah.
12:02Oh, there are at least 20 startups
12:04disrupting this.
12:06Now, okay, who's the largest employer of
12:08India?
12:12Who's the second largest employer of
12:13India?
12:15Army.
12:19The largest employer of India is
12:21inefficiency.
12:30What happens when
12:33things become efficient? Let's say
12:34pathology, one company says, "Put the
12:36slide, tells you your sperm count in
12:38microseconds, and does 60,000 a day." By
12:42the way, it's happening right now in
12:44India by one startup. 60,000 slides a
12:47day.
12:49It's the current capacity of it, with
12:50better accuracy than humans.
12:53At least
12:5550% or more better accuracy in terms of
12:58getting to the decimal level right per
13:01unit.
13:04How many jobs do you think will
13:05disappear?
13:07A lot.
13:09Because you saw the current method.
13:12By the way, it's not funny, but this is
13:14exactly how it's done in India.
13:17Now, the the problem of this is that the
13:20some of these computers that are not
13:21even like extraordinary crazy stuff,
13:23like an average engineer amongst you
13:25would think, "Is me kya difficult hai?"
13:29Take a photograph low or you know
13:32Well, I'm sure 10 of you can make this
13:35quickly
13:36in this room.
13:37But nobody's thinking about it because
13:39nobody understood that some inefficiency
13:40existed like this.
13:43Imagine I was this guy who is running
13:45this great army and
13:49I have made them such superhumans
13:53and like the best
13:55things
13:56and I'm I was winning wars all the time
13:58in the past with those people.
14:00Somebody just I don't know invented
14:02nuclear bomb. Like
14:05Ab kya kare itne logo ka?
14:09Cuz that's how you became a superpower,
14:10right?
14:14So, applying some of these principles,
14:17uh we'll talk briefly about
14:19Delta 4. Some of How many of you know
14:21about this framework?
14:23Okay, 4 5. Good.
14:28Uh
14:30What What goods and services were more
14:32efficient 10 years ago?
14:34What goods and services
14:39were more efficient 10 years ago?
14:43Please raise your hand and answer.
14:48What was more efficient 10 years ago?
14:50How?
14:52Oh, water is water is still the same. We
14:54are more inefficient.
15:00Actually, we become efficient by the way
15:01with water
15:02than what we were before.
15:05What else?
15:09Public transport was more efficient 10
15:11years ago?
15:15No, that's the state, but was the
15:16service by itself more efficient 10
15:18years ago?
15:20I don't think so. Anybody else Somebody
15:21raised their hand over here.
15:24Rivers were more?
15:26Cleaner. That's not efficient, right?
15:28I'm I'm saying goods and services right
15:29now.
15:30Let's stick to that.
15:33Was more efficient.
15:35It is efficient today. You know what?
15:37You can make a joke of a particular
15:39politician and show them as a humorous
15:41character and win elections. It's
15:42possible today. It's more efficient
15:44today.
15:48In fact, the last election was won
15:49because of the digital
15:52So, it was not more efficient 10 years
15:54ago.
15:54What else?
15:58Okay, it's it's such hard. So, I'll tell
16:00you why it's hard. So, now imagine
16:02you're you're a lion or a tiger. What
16:04was more efficient for you 10 years ago?
16:08Why?
16:15No, what is efficient about you? Why
16:17were you more efficient about it?
16:19Raise the state.
16:21The external. Why were you more
16:22efficient at it?
16:27Perfect. Let's talk about technology.
16:30What is the technology of a lion?
16:34Nails.
16:35Which he has to wait for evolution to
16:37become more efficient.
16:38His body structure or adjustment to the
16:41sun or ozone or whatever he has to wait
16:43for. So, only one species figured out
16:46that we will grow faster than evolution.
16:49And that's humans. That's why we
16:50dominate this planet. Any doubt on us
16:52dominating the planet? Okay, good. We
16:55are the only ones which has this thing
16:57where we believe that all the efficient
16:59stuff exists in the future.
17:01And all the inefficient stuff exists in
17:04the past.
17:08And today
17:09is the most efficient state, just not
17:12evenly distributed.
17:15Would you agree?
17:16Let's say for example, only two labs
17:18have taken the sperm count startups
17:20idea.
17:21But it is the most efficient state today
17:24and eventually everybody will get it and
17:25then 10,000 of people will lose job in
17:27let's say Bangalore alone.
17:31Now, because we are in this state
17:35everybody who's in the state A to state
17:38B
17:39and humans are constantly moving from
17:40state A to state B
17:43everything that is a hurdle between this
17:44state
17:46is
17:47pot of gold.
17:49Would you agree to this?
17:51Let's give an example.
17:54I see close to 50% or more of this
17:57classroom is wearing
17:58spectacles.
18:01Let's say if Ujjwal here figures out a
18:03way to
18:04create a pill
18:06that we take overnight we get rid of our
18:09problem. Actually, we get
18:11zoom vision.
18:17Will he become a billionaire overnight?
18:22Inefficient state.
18:25Efficient state.
18:27Anybody who unlock and move humanity
18:29from A to B unlock the pot of gold.
18:32How do you know if your idea is going to
18:35create wealth
18:37or destroy wealth? This is a classic
18:39problem that everybody approaches with
18:40me. Kunal, mera idea ye hai, what do you
18:42think about it? It's very easy to to ask
18:44from this
18:46lens. It's called efficiency scoring.
18:50Let's just efficient see scoring we do
18:52for a few ideas
18:55and we will get the thing. It's called
18:57old behavior versus new behavior. First
19:00is railway ticket booking
19:02at a railway platform versus IRCTC.
19:06Anybody wants to give me a score out of
19:0810
19:09for both these behaviors from an
19:11efficiency perspective.
19:16Nine and?
19:19Nine and two. Anybody else wants to give
19:20me a score?
19:23Five and seven. Okay.
19:25You're a unique person, my friend.
19:29I'm very curious to know why.
19:31One and four.
19:36I'm sure you guys have done this
19:37behavior, right?
19:39Two and eight.
19:42Sorry?
19:44Somebody said
19:4610 old behavior.
19:48One and 10, okay. All right.
19:51Okay, if I averaged out this
19:53number,
19:54I will find that
19:56it's probably in the range of, let's
19:58say,
19:59two
20:01and potentially six.
20:06And what you'll observe is anytime the
20:07delta is greater than equal to four,
20:10three things happen.
20:13It is an irreversible behavior.
20:18Okay?
20:18Nobody How many of you after going
20:21online
20:22went to railway station saying that this
20:25stupid IRCTC is not working in the
20:27morning, I'm going to straight to the
20:28platform. How many of you did that?
20:31One person.
20:35You must be generally intolerant type of
20:36person, no?
20:42It's largely irreversible. Let's let's
20:44say that way.
20:46There are exceptions to everything.
20:49But it is irreversible.
20:51Second thing you will see is that there
20:52is very high tolerance for it.
20:55Slow head,
20:57down head.
21:00How many hours was it down for you to go
21:02to railway station?
21:05Okay, wow.
21:08Okay, the third thing you will see is
21:10UBP.
21:11It's a word that I
21:13keep talking about. It's unique
21:15brag-worthy proposition.
21:18Sorry?
21:24No, just just be careful about what you
21:25words you use shifting to internet,
21:27okay?
21:28Let's say we
21:29somebody move to state B, which is delta
21:31four.
21:32What does he do?
21:34He sees somebody doing A behavior. What
21:36do you do with them?
21:39You tell them away.
21:44Move to a more efficient behavior. We
21:45keep bragging about discovering a new
21:48efficient method.
21:50And then we scream at everybody over
21:51there and we
21:54move all of them over here till this
21:56becomes the new inefficient state.
22:03So, let's say two and six. I'll take
22:05another example.
22:07Uber {slash} Ola
22:10versus old cabs methods. What is the
22:13score out of 10 for both of them?
22:16One and one and eight.
22:23Very good. You are lucky.
22:26Just give me a score so it's easier for
22:28me. Three and seven. So, let's assume
22:30this is also appearing like that.
22:34Let's take another example. We used to
22:35say it become a digital or internet. So,
22:37this is happening, but let's say where
22:39it fails.
22:42Mhm.
22:46Buying shirts
22:49offline versus online.
22:53Anybody wants to give me a score?
22:57Seven and four. Okay, what else?
23:01Six and five.
23:02Six and four.
23:04Five and 5
23:06You always come to the mean
23:10I'm a kidding dude. I'm just pulling
23:11your leg. Just pulling your leg.
23:157 2
23:19Sorry, 6 2. All right. So, what you'll
23:21observe is that it just becomes this and
23:23the delta is
23:25-4.
23:28But guess what? How many startups will
23:30start in the business of selling shirts
23:31online? A lot of it because we think
23:34self digital condo.
23:38Logo I change it.
23:40But this is failing.
23:45And this is a classic problem of all
23:47startups I have seen. Just make an app
23:49of it.
23:53Making an app of it does not make it
23:55more efficient.
24:00Let's take another example.
24:02This is a slightly more controversial
24:04one.
24:05Food delivery.
24:10Give me a score again.
24:12Uh using old methods, calling the
24:14restaurant, and getting the food versus
24:16using apps like Swiggy, Zomato, and
24:19others.
24:2110 and 6
24:234 and 8
24:258 and 5
24:29You You see this unique thing happening
24:31right now?
24:32There's somebody who's on four and
24:34somebody's on minus four.
24:36Let me tell you the attributes of people
24:38who are on minus four.
24:39They usually order from two restaurants.
24:44And on average order three dishes.
24:48For them, app is extremely efficient.
24:54But people who don't like talking on the
24:56phone.
24:59And dealing with the address here here
25:01what you should do.
25:06They'll find that thing. But if you take
25:08that cohort behavior and take it to
25:09let's say
25:1020 million customers,
25:12it will start becoming slightly
25:14negative.
25:16Because we are more like two
25:17restaurants, six dishes people versus
25:19this I want to try a Japanese today.
25:21They don't have it in India up to that.
25:26So here's what happens. When a startup
25:28starts, they start seeing 10,000
25:30customers loving it.
25:33Because they somehow gravitate
25:35the guys who are feeling Delta 4 to use
25:37the app and talk about it and they do U
25:39UBP over here
25:41and the company gets funding.
25:46Then they go after another
25:48100,000 customers, still doing well.
25:51Now they go to 1 million customers.
25:55And what happens when it's less than
25:57four? It is reversible.
26:02It is absolutely low tolerance. You
26:04can't buck what happened. See the phone
26:06call.
26:08Or the third thing, nobody brags about
26:10it.
26:11It's not a cool thing that you have
26:12discovered.
26:13Anyway, so what you'll observe if you
26:15take all of these things and apply to
26:17multiple things that you've come across
26:19and and it applies to everything.
26:23As long as you think from a behavioral
26:24lens.
26:27A lot of times startups are just
26:28created.
26:30Digital got there.
26:32Online got there. Internet used got
26:34there.
26:37Okay.
26:38When
26:39is it hard to disrupt even when you have
26:42a Delta 4 product?
26:44Can anybody guess?
26:47For the business.
26:48People hate change. And especially when
26:51you are in the old business. like
26:52imagine a guy who was running the old
26:54camp business, how much they must have
26:56fought
26:57and put court cases and all sorts of
26:59allegations against the branded
27:01companies.
27:02Right?
27:04One of the things that you'll observe is
27:05that uh
27:07Delta 4 is a more of a feeling.
27:10It's not an empirical fact because it's
27:12changing from every person. What I feel.
27:15Sometimes when you have taken a lot of
27:17effort in the old behavior,
27:20Okay, let's talk about uh our houses
27:23right now.
27:24Your mom, how many of you have a
27:27um maid in the house that's been there
27:30at least for 5 years and above?
27:34Okay.
27:35If you ask your mom and say, "We have to
27:37find We have found a Delta 4 maid now.
27:40We have to fire this person now." Why
27:42will they not fire them?
27:46Sorry?
27:49What is comfortable? What is
27:51comfortable?
27:53Okay, trust. What else?
27:56What is trust?
28:01What is accustomed? No, you're getting
28:03close. What is accustomed?
28:06Trained. What is trained?
28:11No, no. Hold on. Hold on. Let's stick to
28:12trained.
28:15Actually, let's stick and let's switch
28:16the example quickly before we get lost.
28:19I have a driver now
28:20and I'm not firing that driver even if I
28:22find a Delta 4 driver who can drive
28:24better. Why?
28:28He knows my habits.
28:31Okay.
28:32I have done
28:34micro configurations on the driver.
28:39100, 200, 300 of them.
28:43That if I get a new person,
28:46the habits
28:48will break.
28:49I'll give you a classic habit that I
28:51have.
28:52Every meeting I go to, every five-star
28:54hotel, there is a fixed pickup location
28:56and fixed drop location.
28:58And they are different based on the most
29:00efficient path. Sometimes it's hard to
29:02get inside a hotel. It takes 5 minutes.
29:04I said
29:05drop and drop over there.
29:08There are hundreds of these micro
29:09configuration I've done on them.
29:11To the point that he's become an AI. Now
29:13he calls my assistant and finds out
29:16meetings and where they are.
29:19So when I get inside a cab one fine day
29:20I was on the phone and he drives to the
29:21right location. I said, "How did you
29:22know that you're not supposed to go to
29:24office and go supposed to go to
29:25Trident?"
29:30He became smart. Now it's impossible to
29:32fire him.
29:35And that driver apparently did some bad
29:37behavior
29:39which I would normally not tolerate.
29:42But I can't fire that person now.
29:47Another example.
29:48Is English the most efficient language?
29:53Why are we not able to disrupt it?
29:57Why are you not able to disrupt English
29:59as a way to a way of communication?
30:02Network effects, which is
30:07Every one of us has learned 2 3 4 5 6
30:107,000 words and the grammar.
30:13And all of us are now using that same
30:16method. If I have to do a language, I
30:18have to start and explaining it to
30:19everybody and then hope for it to
30:21happen. Not going to happen. Therefore,
30:23we are going to continue to use
30:25English.
30:27If we banned uh
30:31marriages in India of someone with same
30:34language
30:36which will be the national language of
30:37this country in 50 years?
30:43Let me let me start again. If you banned
30:45marriages
30:46of people between same language
30:50mother tongue
30:51what be the
30:53English
30:56It's that easy.
30:58And it's that hard.
31:00What I'm coming to is that there are
31:02certain things that even if you create
31:03disruption they're hard to get rid of.
31:05Give you another example.
31:07Why is Tally hard to disrupt?
31:11Everybody knows Tally over here?
31:15How many of you
31:16don't know about Tally? I can explain it
31:17to you.
31:18Don't feel ashamed. It's okay to raise
31:19your hand.
31:21It's an accounting software that is used
31:23by every single accountant in this
31:24country.
31:26Almost a monopolistic market.
31:28Why?
31:31The CAs are
31:36What is used to it?
31:38Trained on it.
31:40Tally did the craziest hack. They
31:42started making sure that all the
31:45colleges that were teaching accountancy
31:46were only teaching it on Tally.
31:52So I go to a new place
31:54and say paper
31:56computerize karna hai. What did I order
31:58for?
31:59Tally. Cuz that's what I know.
32:02Why is it hard to disrupt Microsoft
32:04Excel?
32:10Even if you make a delta four product of
32:12better than Excel.
32:14Because even if I
32:16I will make my own let's say XYZ file.
32:19I'll mail it to you. Then what do you
32:21say?
32:21Are you going to ask me to go?
32:25So then then and then half the things
32:27will not work. So I'll say Johnny don't
32:29maybe I can use cut down.
32:34What I'm what I'm talking about over
32:36here is that how
32:38things are getting disrupted and things
32:40are getting easy to disrupt because it's
32:42easy to spread now. The diffusion of
32:44innovation is almost instant. How
32:47quickly do you think you get a good joke
32:51to you? Normally, let's say a good joke
32:53was made somewhere
32:55at 9:00 a.m. on 21st February.
32:58Typically, by and how many hours do you
32:59get it?
33:023 4
33:04How many of you think that you get a
33:04joke after a week usually?
33:06Anybody thinks that way?
33:08It doesn't happen.
33:10Why? Because it's a great thing to share
33:12a good joke. And we spread it like a
33:14virus.
33:20Uh and and we steal the joke of the
33:23original guy and put it on our Facebook.
33:25Then what happens?
33:31Somebody?
33:32Somebody will start trolling you. "Hey,
33:33it's got to go to you."
33:36This was never happening before because
33:38we could all share the jokes as if we
33:39created them.
33:4015 20 years ago, you could crack jokes
33:43without quoting source.
33:49This is happening today.
33:52Some of the older guys are smiling more
33:53because they've done that. You guys
33:54won't understand what is quoting
33:56original sources.
33:59Anyways, coming to
34:01uh the point I was making about this. A
34:04lot of times, startups are done
34:07Uh so, there's a longer video of this
34:09you can watch online on YouTube. I'm
34:11talking about
34:12Actually, let's talk about when what
34:14what happens when a company is Let's say
34:15both of them are
34:17company A and company B
34:20are
34:22at the same almost the same delta.
34:24What starts happening?
34:28No.
34:30When when two companies are
34:34equally
34:35innovation or efficiency scoring point
34:38of view, what happens?
34:42They'll drop price.
34:44Okay, when you drop price, who won?
34:47Customer. So, when two people compete,
34:50the benefits go to
34:52customer. Who else does it go to?
35:00Suppliers.
35:03If you were a monopoly,
35:05let's say you were a tally, any supplier
35:07you would say, "Boss, come connect a
35:08row."
35:09I'm not Joe. But now, there are two
35:12people who are equally competing,
35:15you say, "I'll
35:17not pay you
35:20enough. I'll increase my
35:23I'll give you what a 10% margin instead
35:26of a eight that is to make earlier, and
35:28so on and so forth." And they'll make
35:29these guys compete. What else happens?
35:33Somebody said that. What did you say?
35:36Talent.
35:40A delta four talent
35:42will start milking these two companies.
35:48Amazing, isn't it?
35:50That's how you will see the sentiment of
35:51placement salaries going up and down.
35:57What else?
35:59Who else takes the benefit of this?
36:02Government. How?
36:07Media companies.
36:08Woah, this is the best.
36:14May I be full page out? I could be full
36:16page out. Three full page out. Four full
36:17page out.
36:26Every time you are in the of helping
36:28other people compete,
36:31you'll win.
36:33Which are those companies?
36:42FreeCharge
36:43used to be in that world. Now we are
36:45also in this zone.
36:47But we are still okay compared to other
36:49people because nobody's going back to
36:52the shops to recharge
36:54after they have tried these platforms.
36:56Between all of us and all the players
36:59combined,
37:00can you can anybody guess what
37:01percentage of people are recharging
37:03online right now?
37:05Between all the players in the wallet
37:07{slash} payments industry.
37:1520%
37:20And the biggest jump during
37:22demonetization.
37:24It was 10% before that.
37:26And before the 10% was done, there are
37:28unicorns created out of this.
37:3410% before demonetization was 10%.
37:36Recharging online.
37:38But it's an irreversible behavior.
37:40You'll understand that. Some of you
37:41already do it.
37:43How many of you recharge or pay bills
37:45offline after they have tried online?
37:47Anybody raising hands?
37:49So, this time I won.
37:51It's irreversible.
37:55Okay. So, what happens is when you are
37:57not a delta four, then all of these guys
38:00will
38:01take your advantage.
38:05So, unique world, right?
38:09But if you again create a delta four,
38:12which is better than all of these guys,
38:15then again
38:17they will start getting customers to
38:19them.
38:20And it be disrupted.
38:25A lot of times the companies that are
38:26there already are too arrogant to
38:29acquire a new innovation.
38:34Therefore, they get disrupted. Companies
38:36like Google are very smart.
38:41What was the biggest acquisition?
38:43Which became really big for them?
38:45YouTube. Which else?
38:47Android.
38:50Ad serving platforms.
38:52Google Maps.
38:55Smart.
38:56Use the capital that you have
38:58to buy Delta 4 companies.
39:03How many of you remember we used to tell
39:05the guy maps use karo ye kya phone karte
39:08ho kahan aana hai left right left right
39:10kar rahe ho.
39:12Now, the cabs learned.
39:14Now they tell you sir location dal do ye
39:16sab kya bakwas baat kar rahe ho.
39:19How many of you have experienced that? I
39:20have experienced that now. Like kya left
39:22right kar rahe ho dal do location sir.
39:26This happened
39:27in very short period of time.
39:30So,
39:32anyways, what I'm what I'm coming to is
39:33that this is how the world is quickly
39:35changing.
39:36Today tools are available, distribution
39:39platforms are available to create
39:41innovation
39:42and disrupt markets.
39:48And
39:50keep winning. One exception which I did
39:53not talk about is
39:54how many of you feel Apple is Delta 4 to
39:57Android?
40:01For a couple of like if you felt like do
40:03it.
40:05Two, three, okay. How many of you feel
40:06Android is Delta 4 to Apple?
40:11Is it Delta 4? Please think again and
40:13tell me if you can raise your hand again
40:15after that. Is it truly delta 4 to
40:17Apple, Android?
40:20You think it is? Okay.
40:25It's not, but there's a unique hack that
40:28Apple uses.
40:31You ask any Android guy right now.
40:36iPhone got dealer.
40:37Shift over here.
40:39He'll shift.
40:41Why?
40:43Can anybody answer that? It's a very
40:44easy thing. This is up your alley.
40:50Brand. What is brand?
40:53What is bragging?
40:57Perception of the company.
40:59Okay.
41:01Okay.
41:04Perceived to be
41:08richer people.
41:09Okay, interesting.
41:11How many behaviors have migrated from
41:13poor to rich?
41:16How many behaviors that poor people had
41:20migrated and became the behavior of the
41:22rich.
41:28Anybody wants to give me examples?
41:32Jeans were with poor people and moved
41:34and became behavior of rich.
41:36How do you know what happened?
41:38What time poor people wore jeans
41:40then suddenly rich people wore them.
41:42Anybody knows that?
41:46No, devices are
41:49There's something that happened.
42:00What is cool to wear? What is cool to
42:02wear? I'll tell you what happens, right?
42:04Suddenly
42:06two celebrities will say
42:08boss
42:10ripped jeans.
42:12And suddenly all the people are now
42:14wearing ripped jeans.
42:17They try to show you are influential and
42:19you do unique behavior and everybody
42:20imitates you.
42:22How many of you believe that we ape?
42:26Ape other people. How many of you
42:27believe that we ape other people?
42:30Are you Are you guys don't ape other
42:31people? Really?
42:35Some people did not raise their hands.
42:39We consciously and subconsciously only
42:41ape people. The type of ape is
42:44different.
42:45Some of you may ape a model. Some of you
42:48may ape Steve Jobs. Some of you may ape
42:51I don't know, your professor or some
42:54alum or your dad or somebody.
43:01How many of you think that you still
43:02don't ape anybody? Please raise your
43:03hand.
43:05Okay, finally.
43:07It's hard to get across points here.
43:10Anyways, how many of you know the
43:11history of potato?
43:13Raise your hand.
43:15Sir, can you tell me the history of
43:16potato? How did it become such a popular
43:18vegetable?
43:31Okay. Anybody else knows the history of
43:33potato?
43:37Sorry?
43:44Not not truly.
43:49Okay, perfect. Actually, let me make it
43:51easy.
43:52King of Prussia wanted the fertility of
43:55wheat prices and wheat to not be there,
43:57so he asked the farmers to grow half
43:59wheat, half potato. No
44:03vegetable, we can't do this.
44:07So,
44:08he started punishing farmers, killing
44:10them for not growing potatoes. They
44:12would still not grow. Then he did an
44:13amazing thing. He said, "From today
44:16onwards, potato is the royal vegetable."
44:20All the royal meals had potato.
44:23And
44:24all
44:26uh there was a royal patch that grew the
44:28royal potato,
44:29which was guarded by the royal guard,
44:33but just not guarded well enough.
44:38That's the history of potato.
44:43Do you You go to history of anything,
44:45history of sugar,
44:48you'll find the exact same thing.
44:50How many of you know history of sugar?
44:54Refined sugar that we have today.
44:59Okay, interesting. Did How many of you
45:01know that uh bef- before sugar was
45:04consumed, there used to be statues of
45:06sugar, which were more expensive than
45:08crystals?
45:10Okay, nobody knows. Okay.
45:13That's the history of sugar, by the way.
45:15It was royal. It was so expensive people
45:17won't eat it. It would be a
45:20a statue made out of sugar.
45:22It was sugarcane was not
45:24discovered as a great source of
45:26uh doing refined sugar, and it used to
45:28be so expensive, and considered to be a
45:30royal thing. And then it became normal.
45:35Therefore,
45:36in the past, halwais were very rich
45:38people like because
45:39sugar was royal, and then now sugar is
45:42not a big deal.
45:44Anyways, what I'm talking about is
45:46that's another way of hacking this
45:47behavior, that you can make it look like
45:49only kings use it.
45:51That's what Apple is doing.
45:53How do they do that?
45:58One, brand positioning and price. They
46:00make it make sure that it's constantly
46:02with rich people.
46:06The margin that they make is growing.
46:09Which that breaks all the principle of
46:11all the stuff that like whatever we've
46:13learned.
46:15The cost of making a phone is dropping.
46:17And that is growing.
46:22This is only possible
46:24when you play this game really well and
46:25only keep it with the rich.
46:29Right? Uh
46:31So that's that's all from my side. We're
46:33going to put into Q&A mode. Hopefully, I
46:37made you rethink a few things.
46:40And
46:42added some value
46:44to you guys.
46:45Questions.
47:10Uh Large majority of these countries'
47:13phones are dual sims.
47:15And rarely people would have the same
47:18operator.
47:22Therefore, they like to go to a platform
47:24that gives them all the options.
47:30Uh
47:31Initially, initially they did not like
47:32us much.
47:34We were banned by multiple telcos
47:36initially.
47:38Uh
47:39But as you get consumer traction, you
47:41grow. How many of you have been How many
47:44of you use FreeCharge in the 2010 time?
47:462010?
47:47Okay. Some of you.
47:50Some of you remember the coupons we used
47:51to give you and all that stuff. Okay,
47:52good. When we certain telcos thought
47:55that we were undercutting
47:58and they banned us.
48:00But we were giving coupons of some other
48:01retailers. They said, "You are
48:03undercutting and our distributors are
48:04complaining."
48:06So, our consumers would ask us on social
48:08media that, "Hey,
48:10why don't you have this operator?" And
48:11we would tell them, "Sorry, it's coming.
48:13It's coming." And one fine day we gave
48:14up and told the social media that, "Hey,
48:16this particular operator is not giving
48:17us the thing. Why don't you tweet to
48:19them and email them on this if you want
48:22this operator to be live on our
48:23platform." And 600 tweets went in 1 hour
48:28to that Telco.
48:29And then Telco called us and said, "You
48:31got to go with them. Let us go. Let us
48:32go."
48:35As an entrepreneur you have to do some
48:36things like that and and that's what we
48:38did. Uh
48:39do they like us? I think it's a love and
48:41hate relationship because of the reason
48:43of the disruption that has been brought
48:45into this space. Uh nobody thought of
48:47this category as a even a e-commerce
48:49category. Till 2014,
48:51nobody even reported recharge as an
48:53e-commerce category.
48:55And I loved it.
49:00Because if I had not loved it, there'd
49:01be more players
49:03and more of this happening.
49:28No.
49:29You can show a demo. When I started
49:31FreeCharge, I showed
49:34people a mock screen. I had not even
49:36written a single line of code.
49:38And I showed it to them.
49:39Only when 95% of them said that we will
49:42use this absolutely.
49:44I did not do efficiency scoring method
49:47cuz I did not know about this. This is
49:48something I realized after selling the
49:49company.
49:50I used to meet startups and say, "Kunal,
49:52what do you think of this idea?" And I
49:53would tell them, "It's stupid." And And
49:55they would get offended when I tell them
49:56it's stupid.
49:57So, I said, "Let me invent a method to
49:58tell them it's stupid."
50:05I have a question.
50:06Uh
50:07So, I've created a Delta 4 product, say.
50:09And now, diffusion is very fast, as you
50:11said. So, what role does marketing play
50:14when a startup has created a product?
50:15So, how does
50:16That's a good very good question. How
50:17many of you use Truecaller?
50:21How many of you downloaded Truecaller
50:24because you saw a marketing campaign of
50:26Truecaller?
50:30That's the role of marketing.
50:38Is there Delta 4 marketing manager I
50:39got? Sir, I'll help you compete.
50:42Media will say, "I'll give you a better
50:44platform to show your ad."
50:47I'll make a nice creative for you or
50:49your ads so that we kill the
50:50competition. All this stuff happens when
50:52you have no Delta difference.
50:56A Truecaller did not spend a single
50:58dollar. They have 100 million daily
51:00active users in India.
51:05That's the role of marketing in the long
51:07run.
51:10Sorry, marketing is a loose word. I I We
51:12confuse that. This is Delta 4 is
51:14marketing by itself.
51:16Sir, I have a question regarding that.
51:18Why FreeCharge has not moved from
51:20recharging just to the online shopping
51:22experience? And
51:24Mhm.
51:26So,
51:28I said Actually, I'll I'll touch upon
51:29this two points of this question. Uh
51:32There are transactions that people hate
51:34to do, and there are transactions that
51:36people love to do.
51:38Anybody wants to guess what those two
51:40are?
51:42Any examples of those and these?
51:44Transactions that you hate to
51:46Bills.
51:49Huh? Taxes.
51:51Insurance.
51:53Booking tickets.
51:55Fueling your car.
51:57Drying clothes.
51:58Paying your building maintenance.
52:00So many of these things, right? What are
52:02the transactions that we love to do?
52:04Shopping.
52:06What else?
52:08Holiday booking.
52:10So,
52:12naturally, we want to spend more time
52:14here
52:16and less time here.
52:21Because you want to spend less time
52:22here, this company has to focus on how
52:25to make sure that you spend no time over
52:27here so that you go more spend time on I
52:30don't know what a viral video
52:33or shopping or whatever.
52:37When you merge these two,
52:39it's like trying to open a shopping mall
52:40in petrol pump. What happens?
52:43Does it work?
52:46How many shopping centers have worked in
52:48a shop petrol pump?
52:51It does not work because people hate
52:53being at a petrol pump.
52:56That's the
52:57long answer to that question.
53:07Yeah, at the B2B hack I only seen is
53:10the the whole king thing, right? So,
53:12let's say there are two pharma companies
53:14uh pharma company number 38,
53:17pharma company number four.
53:20And I two people, let's say both of us
53:23are selling exact same solution.
53:26He manages to sell to number 38 because
53:29he dost hai.
53:31And I spend nine months convincing this
53:33guy, Mr. number four, and he implements
53:35my solution.
53:36Okay? Now, yeah. Or now let's say I go
53:39to gentleman over here who is pharma
53:41company number
53:42six, whose solution will he buy? Mine or
53:44his?
53:45Why?
53:51That's how B2B behavior operates,
53:53mostly.
53:54It's weird, but it's true.
54:00We'll we'll take one more question.
54:13It's a good question.
54:14Um
54:19Sometimes the Delta 4 is short-term
54:22because others will catch up and the the
54:25effort you took to make it Delta 4 is
54:27not dramatic.
54:30Actually, let me give you a simpler
54:31example. Let's say
54:35I I figure out a method
54:39to use some way of doing this which does
54:42not make the bottle leak.
54:44It's a Delta 4 method then let's say
54:45your current way of closing the bottle
54:47or let's say tying shoelaces. I invent a
54:49new method. But once it spreads on
54:51YouTube, you learn the new method and
54:52never
54:53like it doesn't get out. I have not
54:55earned from it.
54:57I've just made a Delta 4 behavior which
54:58I spread to everybody. So not all Delta
55:004 is monetizable.
55:02I can just give it on the internet how
55:04to break eggs perfectly or You've seen
55:07those videos. They're they're huge hits.
55:11Like all how-to videos will have 10, 20,
55:1230, 40 million views, right?
55:15Once I do it, it's not valuable anymore
55:17so much monetizable, but when you see
55:19that you can protect that Delta 4
55:20because you've taken technology effort
55:22to build that.
55:23It's not for easy for the old guy to
55:25learn. Let's say, can shops learn to do
55:27online recharge? Can can the local shop
55:29outside launch an app for IIM-A campus
55:31can mera app use karna recharge karne ke
55:33liye.
55:35That's where it's you can protect it.
55:38Other case, you can just lose that data
55:39for advantage once you figure it out.
55:43Cool. Thank you so much. Uh good fun.
55:49Thank you, Kunal. I would now like to
55:51request Professor Khanna to deliver the
55:53vote of thanks.
56:00So, maybe I should give this thing
56:01first.
56:03Thank you.
56:09So, uh thank you very much, Kunal, for
56:11uh finally making it to the campus.
56:12We've been
56:13trying to get him here uh for last 6
56:15months, and some things just never uh we
56:18are just not able to schedule it. But,
56:21uh thank you very much uh for spending
56:23some time here and uh getting to the
56:25Delta 4 theory. We are all expecting
56:27that uh even in the teaser sent out by
56:29the by the team. And thank you all for
56:32coming here, and uh we hope to see you
56:34also for the last session.
56:36Um
56:37There's something surprising for you,
56:39and and we'll get back to you soon.
56:41Thank you very much.

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