How I was Wrongfully Convicted of Rape & Murder | Jeffrey Deskovic — Transcript

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1. 0:08you ready to go let's do it thanks for
2. 0:10doing this man i appreciate you coming
3. 0:11down absolutely thanks for bringing me
4. 0:13down here i'm excited man obviously
5. 0:14you're wildly successful you're flying
6. 0:16me in for this
7. 0:17man thanks for coming i really
8. 0:19appreciate it you got it your story is
9. 0:22is fascinating and i think it's
10. 0:25incomprehensible to people to understand
11. 0:27what you went through as such at such a
12. 0:30young age at the age of 16.
13. 0:32for people who don't know why don't you
14. 0:34just give me a brief background on on
15. 0:36what happened to you when you were 16. i
16. 0:38was arrested at the age of 16 for a
17. 0:40murder and rape that i did not commit
18. 0:42and ultimately i was wrongfully
19. 0:44convicted of that so i my wrongful
20. 0:46conviction which happened at the age of
21. 0:4817 was caused by
22. 0:50coerced false confession prosecutorial
23. 0:52misconduct fraud by the medical examiner
24. 0:54terrible public defender i lost even
25. 0:56though the dna didn't match me i was
26. 0:58given the 15 the life sentence because i
27. 1:00had been charged as an adult and i then
28. 1:02spent um 16 years in the men's maximum
29. 1:06security prison from age 17 to 32 losing
30. 1:08seven appeals getting turned down for
31. 1:11parole because i maintain my innocence
32. 1:14being going through that and then
33. 1:16ultimately being exonerated through
34. 1:18further dna testing which identified the
35. 1:21actual perpetrator fast forward to today
36. 1:24and i'm an attorney now
37. 1:26i've been cleared and i have a
38. 1:28non-profit organization the jeffrey
39. 1:29descartes foundation for justice which
40. 1:32has freed 11 people we've helped pass
41. 1:34three laws aimed at preventing wrongful
42. 1:36conviction i'm an advisory board member
43. 1:37for the group it could happen to you and
44. 1:39pass another six laws currently we have
45. 1:4117 cases and we're working on policy
46. 1:43changes in new york pennsylvania and
47. 1:45california it's fascinating it's it's
48. 1:48unbelievable what you've what you've
49. 1:51been through and and how common that
50. 1:54this is in the judicial system in the
51. 1:56united states of people getting
52. 1:57wrongfully convicted
53. 1:59um
54. 2:00so
55. 2:01so what was the story of the girl who
56. 2:05was i think she moved from colombia to
57. 2:07new york yeah and she was in a high
58. 2:09school with you yeah that's right yeah
59. 2:10angela carrera was her name she moved
60. 2:12from colombia
61. 2:14she
62. 2:15was living as i understood it she was
63. 2:16living
64. 2:17a very sheltered life she was in the
65. 2:19country for about a year and a half
66. 2:21and uh you know ultimately she was you
67. 2:24know her she went missing on november 15
68. 2:261989 and her body was found a couple of
69. 2:28days later on november 17th 1989 and you
70. 2:31know she had been she had been raped and
71. 2:33murdered and how old was she she was 15
72. 2:35years old 15 years old and you guys were
73. 2:37friends in high school right uh we were
74. 2:39not we i knew her name she knew mine uh
75. 2:42she was in a couple of
76. 2:44uh classes as a freshman one as a
77. 2:46sophomore that was it i think in two
78. 2:48years i think i briefly spoke to her
79. 2:51twice so we were not even really on a
80. 2:52high buy basis
81. 2:54now did you guys interact at all like
82. 2:57was it just like randomly passing by you
83. 2:59met her a couple times but you didn't
84. 3:00really talk to her much did you it was a
85. 3:02lot yeah it was it was a ladder like you
86. 3:04said she just had by coincidence or by
87. 3:06school schedule she happened to be in
88. 3:07two of my classes as a freshman one as a
89. 3:09sophomore like i said i briefly spoke
90. 3:11with her twice one time was
91. 3:13uh i passed a note to her on behalf of a
92. 3:16male classmate who was interested in her
93. 3:18and uh he was kind of nervous to
94. 3:19approach so he asked me to pass it to
95. 3:21her and that was that was really it
96. 3:24so
97. 3:24the day she went missing in 1989 i
98. 3:27believe it was right yes it was yeah
99. 3:29november 15 1989. so the day she went
100. 3:32missing um
101. 3:34where were you at what was going on what
102. 3:36was that day like
103. 3:38it was just like any other day in terms
104. 3:41of the school day after school i
105. 3:44i had a friend named jason and
106. 3:46uh he lived nearby where i lived at and
107. 3:49i
108. 3:50we had developed a rather innovative way
109. 3:52of playing one-on-one in wiffle ball
110. 3:55and so i
111. 3:56played wiffle ball with him that day and
112. 3:59and uh had dinner at his house and
113. 4:02around uh i would say around eight or
114. 4:04nine o'clock i left this house on my
115. 4:06bike and i
116. 4:08drove down the hill about like less than
117. 4:1010 minutes away and got to my house
118. 4:13that's what i was doing that day
119. 4:15and i think that day when she she left
120. 4:18her house and she went to like a popular
121. 4:19hangout area in the woods in
122. 4:22mid-afternoon i believe it was yes so
123. 4:24let me give some backstory so angela was
124. 4:25in a photography class and the teacher
125. 4:28had assigned the whole class including
126. 4:30her to take pictures of some foliage
127. 4:33so after school she walked went back to
128. 4:36her house with her older sister
129. 4:39the teacher had assigned like a buddy
130. 4:42system uh for the protection of the
131. 4:43students like a male student was matched
132. 4:45up with with a female student
133. 4:47and so she went back to her house her
134. 4:49sister went to the bathroom when she
135. 4:51came back out and angela wasn't there
136. 4:53she left on her on her own so she went
137. 4:56to the park to take pictures of the
138. 4:59foliage
139. 5:00and the male student played hooky on the
140. 5:03assignment so he never showed up so she
141. 5:05was taking pictures on this um
142. 5:08there's a path between hillcrest and
143. 5:10peekskill new york and hillcrest
144. 5:12condominiums and
145. 5:13and uh well this hillcrest condo yeah
146. 5:15there's the the hillcrest school and
147. 5:17then there's condominiums and there's
148. 5:18like a woods and a macadam path that uh
149. 5:21links the two and so she went down onto
150. 5:22the path which is not that far away from
151. 5:25this wooded area called um
152. 5:27which is called the pit which you know
153. 5:29kids teenage kids used to drink at and
154. 5:31used to used to make out
155. 5:33that wasn't very far from off of the
156. 5:35path she's so she's on this path with
157. 5:37heavy woods taking pictures and she
158. 5:40comes across stephen cunningham who say
159. 5:42who's a drug addict and who's high and
160. 5:45he sees her he attacks her murders and
161. 5:48rapes her this guy was smoking crack i
162. 5:50think it was that is correct and how old
163. 5:52was he at the time of the crime he was
164. 5:5429 years old and so you know angela was
165. 5:5615 and at the time i was 16. i never saw
166. 5:59him a day in my life it was just kind of
167. 6:01like a random encounter it was just
168. 6:03unfortunate that she came across him at
169. 6:05that time and you know that's what gave
170. 6:07the occasion for him to attack her and
171. 6:09you know do what he did
172. 6:11so he attacked her obviously he murdered
173. 6:14her
174. 6:18at what point did
175. 6:21she get reported missing
176. 6:23and how did and how long after that did
177. 6:25they discover the body
178. 6:27yeah i think that she got reported
179. 6:28missing uh
180. 6:30later
181. 6:31like early evening later that late
182. 6:33afternoon early evening she got reported
183. 6:35messing and her
184. 6:36you know it was even uh ran in the the
185. 6:38lo there was a local uh paper called
186. 6:40then called the evening star it was a
187. 6:41daily newspaper a connect paper and they
188. 6:44ran a story teen missing had her picture
189. 6:47and everything and you know and then a
190. 6:49couple of days later they ran a
191. 6:51follow-up story uh you know her body had
192. 6:53been found you know naked from the waist
193. 6:55down
194. 6:56right yeah they found her body in the uh
195. 6:58obviously she had been beaten i think
196. 7:00she had a lot of head trauma that's
197. 7:02right they found uh
198. 7:04a bludgeon
199. 7:06wound on her head that was like an inch
200. 7:08deep
201. 7:09and they said a gatorade bottle or
202. 7:10something well they yeah they well the
203. 7:13gatorade bottle comes in later so her
204. 7:15yeah i'll get into that i know what
205. 7:16you're getting that though okay yeah uh
206. 7:19yeah so she had like a deep head wound
207. 7:20in the back and so you know that was so
208. 7:23the the medical examiner
209. 7:25i mean kind of flip-flops a little bit i
210. 7:26mean in one hand he says well the the
211. 7:28wound on the top of the head that's what
212. 7:30killed her but then he also says well
213. 7:32either that or strangulation okay so he
214. 7:34can't really determine which of those
215. 7:35two things actually is what caused the
216. 7:38death but both of them both of them
217. 7:40occurred occurred to her we're going to
218. 7:41get to the gatorade bottle uh after okay
219. 7:44and so the people investigating this is
220. 7:47it just the local police department it's
221. 7:49just the local pigskill police
222. 7:50department yes and there had been very
223. 7:52few murders in pigskill
224. 7:54overall so you know their inexperience i
225. 7:56think was definitely a factor not a
226. 7:58common thing to happen not a common
227. 7:59thing to happen at that time no so in
228. 8:01the course of the police investigation
229. 8:03they interview a lot of students from
230. 8:05the high school
231. 8:06and some of the some of the students
232. 8:09wind up telling the police that they
233. 8:11might want to speak they might want to
234. 8:13speak with me
235. 8:14because i didn't quite i didn't quite
236. 8:16fit in with them like the kids were like
237. 8:18like a year um
238. 8:20well my my they were like a year older
239. 8:22than me my first year so i i would let
240. 8:23me hold on a minute here let me start
241. 8:25again
242. 8:26because i'm skipping
243. 8:28things but take your time sure
244. 8:32so my first year in the high school the
245. 8:33kids were like a year older than me i
246. 8:35skipped first grade and so that caught
247. 8:37up to me in high school and so you know
248. 8:39the kids were a little bit older than me
249. 8:41and you know i really wasn't into
250. 8:42drinking and going to parties and
251. 8:44chasing girls and playing organized
252. 8:46sports and plus i didn't know them like
253. 8:49i i grew up right next to the high
254. 8:51school but i had my own set i went to
255. 8:53catholic school from grades two through
256. 8:55eight you know and then i had a lot of
257. 8:57friends after school so my after school
258. 8:59life was different than my grade school
259. 9:01life so i was like kind of popular after
260. 9:04school you know just whatever i would
261. 9:07there's a lot of kids that lived in that
262. 9:08apartment complex and kind of whatever i
263. 9:10would suggest would would be what we
264. 9:12would do we're going to ride bikes we're
265. 9:13going to movies we're playing monopoly
266. 9:15playing video games
267. 9:16football all type of things right but it
268. 9:19was all unoral basketball all kind of
269. 9:21unorganized things but that was after
270. 9:23school and in school that was a
271. 9:24different crowd a different set of kids
272. 9:27so i didn't quite i was kind of quiet
273. 9:29there too and
274. 9:31i wanted to go to public school for high
275. 9:34school not another catholic school
276. 9:36because i really wanted to go to school
277. 9:38with the with the kids in the
278. 9:39neighborhood that i was playing with and
279. 9:41so you know i purposely failed the
280. 9:43entrance exam
281. 9:45on the catholic high school for where my
282. 9:46mother wanted me to go to oh really
283. 9:49so i think because i wanted to go to
284. 9:51peekskill high school and she didn't
285. 9:52want me to so i failed this exam on
286. 9:55purpose and i go to peekskill high
287. 9:57school and to my surprise i don't find
288. 10:00the kids that i'm playing with in the
289. 10:01neighborhood these are all kids that are
290. 10:03like a year older than me because i
291. 10:05skipped school i mean i skipped a grade
292. 10:08so you know i was kind i was definitely
293. 10:10picked on for sure and my grades really
294. 10:12suffered a lot and you know so much so
295. 10:15that i had to go to summer school but i
296. 10:17knew that if i went to summer school in
297. 10:19order to pass i was going to be stuck
298. 10:21with the same kids
299. 10:22again next year and so i decided not to
300. 10:25go to summer school and so i did not go
301. 10:27to summer school purposely to get left
302. 10:29back to get held back get held back so i
303. 10:32get so now you're with kids your own age
304. 10:33now i'm with kids my own age so things
305. 10:36that get better some that way but then
306. 10:38at the same time these are still
307. 10:40different kids then i was not in any of
308. 10:42the classes with the kids from the
309. 10:44neighborhood these were other kids the
310. 10:46same age as me but other kids so i
311. 10:48didn't i still didn't quite fit in i
312. 10:51wouldn't say i was really picked on
313. 10:52anymore but i still didn't quite
314. 10:55fully fit in so i was still
315. 10:57relatively quiet and to myself
316. 10:59so in the course of the police
317. 11:00investigation the police interviewed
318. 11:03many students from the high school
319. 11:05and some of the kids told the police
320. 11:07that they might want to speak with me
321. 11:09because i didn't quite fit in so this is
322. 11:11what the police said it originally put
323. 11:13me on their radar
324. 11:16an additional factor is that
325. 11:19is that this was i was a sensitive
326. 11:21teenager this was my real first brush
327. 11:23with death
328. 11:24and i had an emotional reaction to that
329. 11:27and you know the police thought that it
330. 11:30was suspicious that i would have an
331. 11:31emotional reaction to the death of a
332. 11:33classmate that as i've described earlier
333. 11:35that i barely knew how did you
334. 11:37originally find out about her death
335. 11:39i found out originally um through
336. 11:42reading the reading the newspaper art
337. 11:43the follow-up article on november 17th
338. 11:46you know and then you know there was
339. 11:48also you know announcement in the the
340. 11:50the school loudspeaker you know on awake
341. 11:53and funeral details and that thing and
342. 11:55everybody was talking about it was a
343. 11:56huge thing
344. 11:57it was a huge thing in peak skill yeah i
345. 11:59mean the whole city kind of shut down in
346. 12:02a way i mean parents were you know
347. 12:04concerned with their own safety safety
348. 12:06with their children they were bringing
349. 12:07kids to the high school and and then
350. 12:10bringing them straight back you know
351. 12:11picking them up bringing them straight
352. 12:13back home there were town hall meetings
353. 12:15that were held periodically updates on
354. 12:17investigation
355. 12:19uh safety tips that kind of thing so
356. 12:21everybody was everybody was talking
357. 12:24about it
358. 12:25so the police thought that this
359. 12:27emotional reaction that i had
360. 12:29was
361. 12:30suspicious like it was some sort of
362. 12:32outward sign for something that
363. 12:36i was sorry i did
364. 12:38how are you display how are you being
365. 12:40emotional like what were you doing that
366. 12:42was
367. 12:42making them think that you were
368. 12:44emotional
369. 12:45no i cried i definitely cried i mean
370. 12:47many people many people it affected me i
371. 12:49don't think i was that in a way i don't
372. 12:51think i was that different than the rest
373. 12:52of the people in the city i mean a lot
374. 12:54of people are emotional a lot of people
375. 12:56cried a lot of people
376. 12:57went to uh multiple wake sessions i mean
377. 13:00that was kind of commonplace so much so
378. 13:02that there was free mental health
379. 13:03services offered to anyone in the city
380. 13:05that that wanted it that's how badly it
381. 13:08like kind of shook everybody up but we
382. 13:10have these two reasons that i've just
383. 13:12laid out why i'm on the police radar and
384. 13:14then there's a third thing which is that
385. 13:16the
386. 13:17uh pay scale police they got a
387. 13:18psychological profile from the nypd so
388. 13:21they turned to a more experienced police
389. 13:23department you know and look give us his
390. 13:25profile what type of person should we be
391. 13:27looking for
392. 13:28you know what were there characteristics
393. 13:30and so i had the misfortune of matching
394. 13:32this profile i mean this profile said
395. 13:34well it's um
396. 13:36you know likely somebody that likely
397. 13:38someone that knew her someone that was a
398. 13:40loner
399. 13:41ver likely somebody in the high school
400. 13:43well that fits me so type of reinforcing
401. 13:47factor
402. 13:48so
403. 13:49for next six weeks the the police play
404. 13:52this cat and mouse game with me in which
405. 13:55half the time they speak to me like i'm
406. 13:57a suspect and when they would push too
407. 13:59hard and i would want to they would get
408. 14:00me frightened and i'd want to get away
409. 14:02from them
410. 14:03they would then switch it up and
411. 14:05you know jeff as this junior detective
412. 14:07helper theme was developed
413. 14:09so before i was a teenager the career
414. 14:12that i fantasized about having when i
415. 14:14grew up was i wanted to be a cop i mean
416. 14:17i grew up the copper cops were our
417. 14:19friends they protected us
418. 14:20you know they were definitely the good
419. 14:22guys and people you could trust and i
420. 14:24wanted to have that career when i when i
421. 14:27grew up i fantasized about that
422. 14:29uh and another thing about my background
423. 14:31is i came from a single parent household
424. 14:33my father was never involved in my life
425. 14:35in any aspect
426. 14:36and that also will intersect with this
427. 14:39police tactics that i'm going to explain
428. 14:40to you so you never met your father or
429. 14:42well i met him for the first time after
430. 14:44i was released oh wow so i met him at
431. 14:46three i met him at uh i met him at 33.
432. 14:50so yeah so i never had any any any
433. 14:53interaction with him so
434. 14:55um and the police were aware of this
435. 14:57the police became aware of it just like
436. 14:59they became you know they were aware
437. 15:01that you know i had wanted to be a cop
438. 15:02when i grew up that was what i thought
439. 15:04about you know when i was in my teenage
440. 15:06years then i switched and i wanted to
441. 15:08like be a lawyer but but still the idea
442. 15:10of wanting to be a cop before that was
443. 15:12something they were aware of and that
444. 15:13was still kind of like part of inside me
445. 15:15some
446. 15:16so i was vulnerable to this
447. 15:19uh jeffers
448. 15:20junior detective helper tactic so they
449. 15:23would say things like
450. 15:24kids won't talk freely around us but
451. 15:27they will around you
452. 15:29let us know if you hear anything
453. 15:31stop in from time to time
454. 15:33they would ask me questions and you know
455. 15:35opinion they asked me opinion questions
456. 15:37and then congratulate me that my
457. 15:39opinions were correct they made me feel
458. 15:41important
459. 15:42what kind of opinions would they have
460. 15:43when they try to get from you well they
461. 15:44asked me well
462. 15:46um you know what route do you think that
463. 15:48she took going from her house to the
464. 15:50park and so i just thought about well i
465. 15:52know where her house is situated i know
466. 15:54where the park is this is the most
467. 15:56logical route that she would take right
468. 15:59you know and then um
469. 16:01you know then they told me then they um
470. 16:04and then another thing would be they
471. 16:06told me uh they told me her keys were
472. 16:08missing and then they asked me to
473. 16:09speculate well what what kind of what
474. 16:12kind of keys do you think that she
475. 16:14probably had
476. 16:15but separate from that they you know
477. 16:17they they um
478. 16:19they you know they told me like there
479. 16:20was a cassette you know her cassette
480. 16:22tape with her cassette or walkman was
481. 16:24was found with the walkman tape was
482. 16:26missing so when they they asked me what
483. 16:28kind of keychain you know so i'm
484. 16:30thinking well she's an immigrant her
485. 16:31keys are missing probably i love new
486. 16:33york
487. 16:34type of keychain would be so they're
488. 16:36just asking me these opinions and
489. 16:38they're you know they're saying either
490. 16:39ask they're using the word opinion what
491. 16:41do you think in in in your opinion
492. 16:43they're just and as far as i'm concerned
493. 16:45i'm just having a normal conversation
494. 16:47with them you know my speculations or my
495. 16:49opinions are no they're just playing
496. 16:50psychological games with you they're
497. 16:52playing psychological games with me and
498. 16:53in addition to that a further game is
499. 16:55that they're playing good cop bad cop
500. 16:58one officer pretending uh is the more is
501. 17:01pretending to be my friend like you know
502. 17:03and and uh you know and the other one is
503. 17:05is the bad cops they were keeping me off
504. 17:07balance that way and and in time i began
505. 17:10to look at the cop who is pretending to
506. 17:12be my friend
507. 17:14as as like an adult a positive adult
508. 17:16male role model in lieu of my father
509. 17:20so that goes on for
510. 17:23that goes on for about uh about six
511. 17:25weeks and in the course of that you know
512. 17:27they're they're giving me details about
513. 17:29like one time they brought me to the
514. 17:30crime scene and the lieutenant uh who
515. 17:33oversaw everything
516. 17:35you know he's uh telling me that three
517. 17:37different scenes you know and you know
518. 17:39at the crime scene there's three
519. 17:40different scenes at the overall crime
520. 17:43scene where different things happen like
521. 17:44the scene where she was first attacked
522. 17:46and then she was dragged
523. 17:48correct yeah yeah yeah there's a scene
524. 17:49when she was first attacked the area
525. 17:51where she was raped there's then there's
526. 17:53a air another area where another area
527. 17:55where you know her
528. 17:57she was dragged so he tells me this and
529. 17:59then he's just asking me to you know
530. 18:01then confirm that
531. 18:03you know and then then later on and when
532. 18:05i'm at the police station after that and
533. 18:08then uh the detective was pretending to
534. 18:10be my friend he asked me to draw a map
535. 18:12of the area where you think everything
536. 18:14happened at
537. 18:15well you guys just told me earlier where
538. 18:17you think everything happened that so
539. 18:19i'm just regurgitating what you know
540. 18:21what what you're saying and when i was
541. 18:23at the crime scene you know the
542. 18:24detective said to me you know her body
543. 18:26was found over here and it almost
544. 18:29this was when he was building off what
545. 18:30the lieutenant said he says well her
546. 18:32body was uh found over here and there
547. 18:35was leaves on top of it it was almost
548. 18:37like somebody was uh you know trying to
549. 18:39there's a contrast on one hand she had
550. 18:41been attacked murdered and raped but on
551. 18:43the other hand uh after that um there's
552. 18:46like an attempt to try to protect her
553. 18:48body from the elements by putting leaves
554. 18:50on top of it so he so he tells me that
555. 18:52at the scene and then when we're at the
556. 18:54police station later with this map thing
557. 18:57and you know and then he's i'm just
558. 18:58repeating stuff that they're saying is
559. 19:00what i'm getting is what i'm getting at
560. 19:02just as a microcosm of the many
561. 19:05interactions that i had with the police
562. 19:06over those six weeks
563. 19:09so they wind up taking a blood sample
564. 19:11from me and they said that they were
565. 19:13going to send it for dna testing and
566. 19:15that this was one way that i could be
567. 19:18ruled out as a suspect so i gave them a
568. 19:20sample of my blood
569. 19:22then later
570. 19:24uh they tell me
571. 19:26that there's some no information has
572. 19:28come into the police file and
573. 19:30they want to
574. 19:32they want to share that with me and
575. 19:34that's going to allow me to be more
576. 19:35helpful to them first though i'm going
577. 19:38to have to
578. 19:40take him past a polygraph
579. 19:42you know so so the next day rather than
580. 19:44report to the high school i instead
581. 19:47went to the police station for this test
582. 19:49where i had heard through the rumor mill
583. 19:50that other people had been tested at
584. 19:53and instead they drove me to the town of
585. 19:55brewster which is in uh putnam county so
586. 19:58it's 40 minutes away by car so there's
587. 20:00three cops that come with me from
588. 20:02peekskill is the two detectives in the
589. 20:04lieutenant but the bad cop and the
590. 20:06lieutenant they're in one car they put
591. 20:07me in the car by myself with the cop
592. 20:10who's pretending to be my friend so
593. 20:11another example of another psychological
594. 20:13game that they're that they're playing
595. 20:15you know and throughout this process
596. 20:18they periodically uh they periodically
597. 20:21um do they have you like my rights
598. 20:22restrained
599. 20:23no i'm not i'm not restrained at this
600. 20:25point no and they're periodically
601. 20:27they're periodically reading me my
602. 20:28rights but i'm a 16 year old i don't
603. 20:31understand what you know what they're
604. 20:34saying and every time they read
605. 20:36uh anything you say canon will be used
606. 20:38against you in a court of law i'm
607. 20:39thinking to myself you know my mind goes
608. 20:41to like a civil court i'm thinking court
609. 20:43what what are you talking about we're
610. 20:45not we're not going to court
611. 20:47you know and that was all further
612. 20:48obscured by the fact that they're
613. 20:50playing this game overall that they're
614. 20:52pretending like you know they need my
615. 20:54help to solve the crime jeff is this
616. 20:56junior detective helper
617. 20:59so they drove me um to brewster 40
618. 21:02minutes away by car which now means i'm
619. 21:04not able to leave on my own i'm totally
620. 21:06dependent upon the police
621. 21:08it's a school day so my mother and
622. 21:10grandmother they think that i'm in
623. 21:11school so they don't call around looking
624. 21:13for me they have no idea that anything's
625. 21:15wrong they have no clue what you're
626. 21:17doing they have no clue what i'm doing
627. 21:19no
628. 21:20do they have any idea of you like
629. 21:22working with the police for the weeks
630. 21:24prior
631. 21:25no they no they don't the my mother knew
632. 21:27that i interacted with the police once
633. 21:28and then she didn't want me to interact
634. 21:30with him anymore oh okay so you didn't
635. 21:32tell her but i didn't right so i didn't
636. 21:33tell her i mean look i'm at 16 i mean
637. 21:35that's the age where kids are you know
638. 21:36they push back on the authority of their
639. 21:38parents and you know try to get
640. 21:39independents and you know we're all
641. 21:41smarter than our parents anyway and i
642. 21:44didn't do anything they're telling me
643. 21:46you know what can possibly happen
644. 21:47they're telling me i need my they need
645. 21:49my help to solve the crime the cops are
646. 21:51our friends
647. 21:52i don't think you know what you're
648. 21:53talking about let's let me just you know
649. 21:55so that was kind of like the dynamic
650. 21:56that was going on and you know they knew
651. 21:58that my mother didn't want me to
652. 21:59interact with them but i'm 16 years old
653. 22:01so i'm allowed to waive my rights and
654. 22:04speak to the police without parental um
655. 22:07permission
656. 22:09so i get to the place and uh since i'm
657. 22:12driven there i don't know where i'm
658. 22:13where i'm at i'm totally dependent upon
659. 22:15the police now
660. 22:17so
661. 22:18uh there's a there's a putnam county
662. 22:21shirt there's uh the the polygraph is a
663. 22:23putnam county sheriff's investigator
664. 22:24daniel stevens and
665. 22:26he's dressed like a civilian
666. 22:28and
667. 22:29he never identifies himself as law
668. 22:31enforcement he never reads me my rights
669. 22:34you know and so we go to the waiting
670. 22:36area and he gives me
671. 22:38a four-page brochure which explains how
672. 22:40the polygraph worked
673. 22:42but it had a lot of big words in it
674. 22:44which i didn't understand but then i
675. 22:45figured well what does it matter i'm
676. 22:47here to help the police let's just get
677. 22:49on with it
678. 22:51and they don't give me anything to eat
679. 22:53the entire time i'm i'm there
680. 22:55then from there they bring me to uh
681. 22:58another small area where the
682. 22:59polygraphist gives me countless cups of
683. 23:01coffee
684. 23:02and but by the way i'm gonna need
685. 23:04something to drink i can't oh yeah yeah
686. 23:05sorry an option without taking yeah
687. 23:07please that would be great
688. 23:11liquid death yeah it's interesting it's
689. 23:13an interesting brand yeah they sponsor
690. 23:14us perfect perfect for this uh
691. 23:16conversation yeah i would agree
692. 23:19i would agree so it gives me countless
693. 23:21cups of coffee it seems fairly clear the
694. 23:23purpose of giving me the coffee is to
695. 23:25get me nervous
696. 23:26and then he attaches his polygraph
697. 23:28machine to me
698. 23:30and then he launches into his third
699. 23:32degree tactic so he
700. 23:33invades my personal space he raises his
701. 23:36voice at me he asks me the same
702. 23:38questions um over and over again
703. 23:41and as you know i'm really i'm not used
704. 23:43to talking to adult males because as i
705. 23:45mentioned my father was never involved
706. 23:46in my life and you know i didn't spend
707. 23:48very much time with my like uncles or
708. 23:50other male members of my family so i'm
709. 23:52not i'm really not used to communicating
710. 23:54with an adult male much less somebody
711. 23:55who's
712. 23:56carrying on
713. 23:58in the ferocious manner that he is right
714. 24:00so each hour that goes by
715. 24:03my fear is increasing in proportion to
716. 24:05the time
717. 24:06and he keeps us up for like six and a
718. 24:08half to seven hours
719. 24:10towards the end yeah that's a really
720. 24:12long time
721. 24:14oh i'm attached to this machine
722. 24:18and so
723. 24:19he winds up saying at the end i guess he
724. 24:20was exasperated by that point
725. 24:23that he hadn't gotten me to confess yet
726. 24:24and he says
727. 24:26what do you mean you didn't do it
728. 24:28you just told me through the polygraph
729. 24:30test result that you did
730. 24:33i just want you to verbally confirm this
731. 24:36and when he said that to me that really
732. 24:39shot my fear through the roof
733. 24:41and at that point the officer who had
734. 24:43been pretending to be my friend he comes
735. 24:46in the room the other cop leaves he
736. 24:47comes in the room the detective maktar
737. 24:50comes in the room
738. 24:51and
739. 24:52he says um
740. 24:53he told he tells me that the other
741. 24:55officers are going to harm me he's been
742. 24:57holding them off but he can't do so any
743. 24:59longer that i have to help myself
744. 25:02then he says to me just tell them what
745. 25:04they want to hear you can go home
746. 25:06afterwards you're not going to be
747. 25:08arrested so being young naive frightened
748. 25:1116 years old
749. 25:13not thinking about the long term
750. 25:16instead being concerned
751. 25:18with my own safety in the moment
752. 25:20you know i was in fear in my life the
753. 25:22fact that i didn't know where i was and
754. 25:23that nobody else knew where i was either
755. 25:25loomed quite large in my mind i was
756. 25:28overwhelmed emotionally and
757. 25:29psychologically there's this push-pull
758. 25:31effect on one hand there's the
759. 25:34possibility of harm and on the other
760. 25:36there's this false life preserver that
761. 25:38he threw me and so i took the out which
762. 25:40he offered and i made up a story based
763. 25:43on the information that he
764. 25:46had given me in the course of the
765. 25:48investigation by the time it was all
766. 25:49said and done i collapsed on the floor
767. 25:52in the fetal position crying
768. 25:53uncontrollably and obviously i was
769. 25:55arrested
770. 25:56tying back to the gatorade bottle one of
771. 25:59the statements that i made in the course
772. 26:01of the uh false confession
773. 26:04was i said that i um hit her over the
774. 26:06head with a gatorade bottle but as we're
775. 26:08gonna see a little bit later in the
776. 26:11story you know a gatorade bot at that
777. 26:13time gatorade bottles were made of glass
778. 26:15and there's no way that a
779. 26:17gatorade bottle would have been able to
780. 26:18inflict the type of wounds that this
781. 26:20medical examiner testified she had to on
782. 26:22her head and then in addition there was
783. 26:24no like shattered glass there was no
784. 26:26shards of grass in the in the in the
785. 26:29body either so it like the story just
786. 26:32doesn't like make any sense
787. 26:34right
788. 26:35at what point did you was this the point
789. 26:37that you finally realized that you were
790. 26:40getting swindled by the cops
791. 26:42no this happens a little bit later so
792. 26:43let me tell you about that so what so i
793. 26:45mean you're going through all this
794. 26:47interrogation you're hooked up to a
795. 26:48polygraph and
796. 26:50you're you're saying that you're the
797. 26:52amount of fear that you have is
798. 26:54insurmountable yes what is that fear of
799. 26:58i thought
800. 27:01i i might was it was fear of my safety i
801. 27:04i thought that they might kill me there
802. 27:06i don't i don't know i kill you yeah i
803. 27:08don't know where i'm at i'm i'm in the
804. 27:11middle of some place where i don't know
805. 27:12where i'm at and you know i have these
806. 27:14adults that are that are questioning me
807. 27:16that are putting pressure on me so at
808. 27:18this point you obviously have lost trust
809. 27:20in them right yes i have definitely
810. 27:22obviously i've lost trust in them yes to
811. 27:24which up to that point you trusted them
812. 27:26like they were helping you and you were
813. 27:27helping them right yes
814. 27:30okay yes and then this and then again
815. 27:32the cop was then pretending you know my
816. 27:33last hope my last best hope this friend
817. 27:36right this detective uh who's pretending
818. 27:38to be my friend he tells he tells me
819. 27:41that they're gonna harm me
820. 27:42he's telling me that they're gonna harm
821. 27:44me and that he can't stop them any
822. 27:45longer so that fear you know is
823. 27:48betressed by this objective this you
824. 27:50know this outside factor that's what i'm
825. 27:52getting it's not all just going in my
826. 27:54head it's external external also
827. 27:57and the way that he's you know he's he's
828. 27:59in my face when i'm being questioned i'm
829. 28:00in i'm in the chair and he's this
830. 28:02mountain of a man and you know like he's
831. 28:04within a couple of feet of my face and
832. 28:06he's he's raised his voice is raised and
833. 28:09he's asking me the same question so it's
834. 28:11all of those things in
835. 28:13in totality right so
836. 28:17so after that after i gave this
837. 28:19confession i'm on the floor i'm crying
838. 28:20uncontrollably they finally get me to
839. 28:22stop crying then i'm given something to
840. 28:24eat afterwards
841. 28:26then
842. 28:27and then it's time to go back to the
843. 28:29police station and they say they're
844. 28:30going to take me back to the police
845. 28:32station and we're going to share some
846. 28:34pizza
847. 28:35you know and that's when um they put me
848. 28:38in the the handcuffs and i said well why
849. 28:40are you putting me in handcuffs you just
850. 28:42told me that i'm not gonna be arrested
851. 28:45so the lieutenant said oh this is just
852. 28:47uh safety
853. 28:49so i didn't question it past that so
854. 28:51they put me in the car i have the i'm
855. 28:53handcuffed behind me behind
856. 28:55and then um
857. 28:57they bring me to the police station and
858. 28:59uh the the cop was pretending to be my
859. 29:02friend and the lieutenant they
860. 29:03disappeared but the the the bad cop
861. 29:05detective levine he's
862. 29:08he he's still there but i'm interrupt as
863. 29:10i'm eating pizza i'm interrupted by this
864. 29:12uniform police officer who's
865. 29:14periodically carrying out different
866. 29:16aspects of uh processing
867. 29:18and so he winds up eventually putting
868. 29:22ink on my fingers to do the to do the
869. 29:24fingerprints and i remember that really
870. 29:26pissed me off and so i looked at this
871. 29:28other the detective and i said you know
872. 29:30you know what is he doing you know i got
873. 29:32you know i've got ink all over my
874. 29:34fingers i'm over here trying to eat
875. 29:35pizza and i've got ink on my fingers now
876. 29:38and he says well he has a right to do
877. 29:40that
878. 29:41and i said well what do you mean he has
879. 29:42a right to do that
880. 29:44and i was told that i wasn't going to be
881. 29:46arrested and that's when he said to me
882. 29:48oh you are being charged with the crime
883. 29:51and at that moment i realized i had been
884. 29:52swindled that and i remember being angry
885. 29:56i remember also being like dumbfounded
886. 29:58and stunned and you know i couldn't you
887. 30:00know i didn't know what the hell was
888. 30:01going to happen
889. 30:02from that point forward it felt like an
890. 30:04out of control feeling that's why i all
891. 30:06kind of like
892. 30:07sunk in
893. 30:10did they
894. 30:11during all of this it's like they were
895. 30:14they were
896. 30:16grooming you to be their their perfect
897. 30:18suspect
898. 30:20like do you think from the onset that
899. 30:23they
900. 30:24were trying to just
901. 30:25frame you
902. 30:27or do you think that they did they
903. 30:28believe that you could have been the
904. 30:31actual murderer or do you think that
905. 30:33they knew from the onset that
906. 30:35we just need to find somebody to pin
907. 30:37this on i think that they just from the
908. 30:39outset they just thought that they just
909. 30:41needed to find somebody to pin this on
910. 30:43let me tell you why
911. 30:45uh so
912. 30:47firstly the whole false confession um
913. 30:49there was no it was not there was no
914. 30:52videotape there was no audio tape
915. 30:54there's no signed confession it's just a
916. 30:56cop's word for it
917. 30:57so when they come to court it's crazy i
918. 31:00i agree
919. 31:01and when we came to court they left the
920. 31:03threatened false promise you know
921. 31:06out of out of their testimony
922. 31:09you know um
923. 31:10but um let me
924. 31:12i mean the reasons i think that it was
925. 31:14not it was not a good faith error is
926. 31:15because look when the dna didn't match
927. 31:18in the dna before i go to trial the
928. 31:19results of a dna test result come in
929. 31:22from the fbi lab the dna doesn't match
930. 31:24me
931. 31:25and rather than acknowledge they made a
932. 31:27mistake they continue to prosecute full
933. 31:29speed ahead so in his letter to the fbi
934. 31:32asking them to the prosecutor the
935. 31:35lieutenant the police the lieutenant
936. 31:37okay yeah yeah lieutenant tumulo so he
937. 31:39writes a letter to the fbi asking them
938. 31:41to expedite the dna testing because the
939. 31:44county at that point is not not able to
940. 31:46do the the dna they have the fbi doesn't
941. 31:48right yeah at that time at that time yes
942. 31:51so he says to them in his letter
943. 31:54that
944. 31:55the test results you know are either
945. 31:57going to
946. 31:58confirm my guilt or else it's going to
947. 32:00exonerate me
948. 32:02but when the results don't match me
949. 32:05you know um the case kept going he said
950. 32:08after the fact after i was exonerated
951. 32:10years later he says that he claims that
952. 32:13you know he had concerns and he went to
953. 32:14the prosecutor but that was all he did
954. 32:17like he didn't go to the prosecutor's
955. 32:18supervisor he didn't go to the district
956. 32:21attorney
957. 32:22you know he didn't go to the attorney
958. 32:23general
959. 32:24he angled the fbi he didn't do anything
960. 32:26he just sat back and let everything
961. 32:28happen so that's one aspect of why i say
962. 32:31that and another thing
963. 32:33is another aspect of it is that
964. 32:37when the dna didn't match me the police
965. 32:39went back out into the field and they
966. 32:41interviewed 17 witnesses who
967. 32:43knew angela in one capacity or another
968. 32:46and all of them told the police that
969. 32:49uh she didn't have any friends that
970. 32:51that she didn't have any boyfriend
971. 32:53rather that she didn't have any
972. 32:54boyfriend that there was no consensual
973. 32:56sex because that's what they're trying
974. 32:57to they were trying to use that excuse
975. 32:59for the other state but for the dna they
976. 33:01tested the semen that was on earth
977. 33:03that's right yes they tested the semen
978. 33:05it didn't match me and then that's when
979. 33:06the medical examiner says
980. 33:09his theory he came up so he comes up
981. 33:11with this the day the day after the dna
982. 33:13doesn't match me
983. 33:15he says that he remembered that he
984. 33:18forgot
985. 33:19to document medical evidence that he
986. 33:21said showed that the victim had been
987. 33:23sexually active so that opens the door
988. 33:25for the prosecutor to argue
989. 33:27aha
990. 33:28this is how the dna doesn't match you
991. 33:30and yet
992. 33:32uh you know you know and yet uh you know
993. 33:34you still murdered and raped her how
994. 33:35could they possibly have medical at what
995. 33:37con
996. 33:38is considered medical evidence that she
997. 33:40was sexually active he well he claims
998. 33:43that he saw perf um perforations of her
999. 33:46hymen on medical slides
1000. 33:48that that that's what that's what the
1001. 33:50medical examiner says but wouldn't that
1002. 33:51be from the rape
1003. 33:53yeah it would have yeah it would have
1004. 33:55been not only that but if there was a
1005. 33:56consensual sex and then i murdered and
1006. 33:59raped her after that that means that
1007. 34:00there would have been seminal fluid from
1008. 34:02at least two people right not one right
1009. 34:04okay so uh so taking it a step further
1010. 34:07he mentions another youth by name that
1011. 34:10he claims had slept with the victim
1012. 34:13but he didn't try to prove that he never
1013. 34:15had a dna test performed to prove that
1014. 34:17he never
1015. 34:19called him as a witness he just made the
1016. 34:21unsupported argument to the jury but
1017. 34:23what i'm getting
1018. 34:24trying to get to is
1019. 34:26in that context when
1020. 34:28um
1021. 34:30when it when they're trying to support
1022. 34:31this consensual sex theory the police
1023. 34:34went back into the field and interviewed
1024. 34:3717 witnesses who knew the victim in one
1025. 34:39capacity or another and all of them told
1026. 34:41the police she didn't have a boyfriend
1027. 34:42there's no consensual sex
1028. 34:44the police purposely did not document
1029. 34:47any of those witness interviews
1030. 34:50and so that way there was nothing they
1031. 34:51didn't have to turn that over to my
1032. 34:53attorney
1033. 34:54so i'm all speaking to the issue of
1034. 34:57whether or not i think this is a good
1035. 34:58faith error or not that that's what i'm
1036. 35:00bringing this in for additionally wasn't
1037. 35:03there also um pubic hair found on her of
1038. 35:06african-american descent yes there was
1039. 35:08there was pubic hairs
1040. 35:11found in and around the body
1041. 35:13that were determined to be a negroid and
1042. 35:15of [ __ ] origin origin and i'm
1043. 35:18caucasian i'm white
1044. 35:19so the
1045. 35:21so again the prosecutor uh argues by
1046. 35:24inference he says oh this must have come
1047. 35:26from the vietnamese medical examiner and
1048. 35:28his african-american assistant
1049. 35:31so i've learned since then that when
1050. 35:33pubic hair
1051. 35:35those pubic and head hairs both okay yes
1052. 35:37that yeah so he's saying that he's
1053. 35:39saying he's just saying the word hairs
1054. 35:41but he's referring to both but he's not
1055. 35:43saying pubic hairs he's saying head hips
1056. 35:45he would have said pubic hairs you're
1057. 35:46right that that's like makes that's like
1058. 35:48really crazy you get naked with the body
1059. 35:50i mean we got another issue here
1060. 35:52right but he just says hairs to try to
1061. 35:54encompass everything
1062. 35:56but the hair expert i've learned later
1063. 35:58the hair expert um dr peter deforest
1064. 36:00says
1065. 36:01well if that's your explanation they get
1066. 36:03get me the hairs from the medical
1067. 36:05examiner right and let me do the actual
1068. 36:07comparison right but he was never given
1069. 36:11he was never given any any of the he was
1070. 36:13ever provided with any of the hairs and
1071. 36:15one more thing on the police level
1072. 36:18which is that um
1073. 36:20uh not not content with having forced
1074. 36:23the confession out of me with his
1075. 36:25illegal tactics but they also
1076. 36:28they tried to help the prosecutor get
1077. 36:30around the dna exclusion also so they
1078. 36:33fabricated a statement and attributed to
1079. 36:36me
1080. 36:37what i mean is they claimed that i told
1081. 36:39them
1082. 36:40that i didn't know if the perpetrator
1083. 36:43ejaculated or not
1084. 36:46and
1085. 36:47that word was not in my vocabulary as a
1086. 36:5016 year old
1087. 36:51and
1088. 36:53that when you look at their police
1089. 36:54reports
1090. 36:55that statement in their write-up of the
1091. 36:57confession that statement doesn't appear
1092. 37:00in their early write-ups about the
1093. 37:01confession it only appears in their
1094. 37:04write-ups
1095. 37:05after the dna doesn't match me so it
1096. 37:08seems clear that they came up with that
1097. 37:10in order to help the
1098. 37:12prosecutor get it around the
1099. 37:15dna exclusion
1100. 37:17so there's a dna test result in all the
1101. 37:20stuff that's taken place before the
1102. 37:22trial that i've just mentioned to you
1103. 37:24so in terms of the trial itself
1104. 37:27you know i i couldn't afford an attorney
1105. 37:29my family couldn't afford an attorney so
1106. 37:31we had we went with uh westchester
1107. 37:33county legal aid so my the public
1108. 37:36defender i had assigned to me was uh
1109. 37:38peter incero and he supposedly was their
1110. 37:40best trial lawyer
1111. 37:43so
1112. 37:44he essentially didn't defend me he
1113. 37:47rarely met with me when he would meet
1114. 37:49with me and i tried to explain to him
1115. 37:50that i was innocent and what happened
1116. 37:52interrogation room he was always
1117. 37:54shutting me up one time he told me he
1118. 37:56didn't care if i was guilty or innocent
1119. 37:58he never interviewed my alibi i told him
1120. 38:01i was playing with football with uh
1121. 38:02jason he never he never interviewed or
1122. 38:05calls a witness my alibi
1123. 38:07he never explains to the jury the
1124. 38:08significance of the dna not matching me
1125. 38:11he never uses that to
1126. 38:14um to challenge the confession and argue
1127. 38:17that the confession is coerced or false
1128. 38:20speaking of the confession sometimes
1129. 38:21he's arguing to the jury that confession
1130. 38:24never happened other times he's
1131. 38:27arguing that it
1132. 38:28happened but that it was coerced and
1133. 38:30still other times he was saying that it
1134. 38:32happened but it was false
1135. 38:34so by adopting this uh throw mud against
1136. 38:37the wall
1137. 38:39type of uh
1138. 38:40approach he had to have been standing
1139. 38:42there with no credibility at all in
1140. 38:43front of the jury and when it was time
1141. 38:45to cross-examine this medical examiner
1142. 38:48uh you know it would have it's obviously
1143. 38:50would have been important to to attack
1144. 38:52his credibility because he's the one who
1145. 38:54came up with this consensual sex thing
1146. 38:57um but instead he stood up in open court
1147. 39:00and with a
1148. 39:01uh big smile on his face like if him and
1149. 39:03the medical examiner were great friends
1150. 39:05from back in the day said to him
1151. 39:07you're going to be pleased to know that
1152. 39:09i don't have a single question for you
1153. 39:14now the last thing is that i wanted to
1154. 39:16testify at the at the trial so that i
1155. 39:19could put the
1156. 39:20threat and false conflict of threat and
1157. 39:22false promise on the record so when you
1158. 39:24defend the case where there's a false
1159. 39:26confession you have to answer that
1160. 39:27confession you have to explain that
1161. 39:29confession you have to disprove that
1162. 39:31confession in as many ways as you can
1163. 39:33you bring it all together in your in
1164. 39:35your closing argument
1165. 39:37you know but he didn't he didn't do he
1166. 39:39didn't do any of that he wouldn't allow
1167. 39:40me to testify there either
1168. 39:42and
1169. 39:44that was this you know so all those
1170. 39:46things i got a terrible defense a real
1171. 39:47terrible defense now there were a couple
1172. 39:49of other irregularities about the trial
1173. 39:51but you want to ask me something first
1174. 39:52do you think the lawyer
1175. 39:54was just incompetent or do you think
1176. 39:57that he was working with the other side
1177. 39:59you know i
1178. 40:01i kind of feel he was working with the
1179. 40:02other side because i mean some of these
1180. 40:04mistakes i mean even like a third year
1181. 40:07law student would know not to do that
1182. 40:09and when i've met with defense lawyers
1183. 40:12in westchester that know my story i've
1184. 40:13had lunch with them they've often asked
1185. 40:15me well who who who is your trial lawyer
1186. 40:17and when i mention his name to them
1187. 40:19they're quite surprised because they've
1188. 40:20tried cases with and against him and
1189. 40:23they thought that he was pretty good
1190. 40:25so he's still practicing today no he's
1191. 40:27he retired now he retired now
1192. 40:30so here's the other irregularities that
1193. 40:32happen at the trial
1194. 40:34so firstly
1195. 40:35the polygraph uh results they're not
1196. 40:38admissible in court because it's not
1197. 40:39it's not scientific you know in fact
1198. 40:41even like intelligence agents in the
1199. 40:43field they're trained to beat the
1200. 40:45polygraph right so it's not scientific
1201. 40:48you know um and the whole premise of the
1202. 40:50polygraph by the way is that when
1203. 40:51somebody the theory is that if somebody
1204. 40:54lies you'll get nervous your nervousness
1205. 40:56will result in an increased pulse rate
1206. 40:59and it's the pulse rate that's actually
1207. 41:00measured by the machine right people can
1208. 41:02control that people can control that
1209. 41:04yeah so because of that polygraph test
1210. 41:07results are not are not admissible in
1211. 41:10court right so despite that general rule
1212. 41:12this judge comes up with this back door
1213. 41:15rule where
1214. 41:16he says that because the confession
1215. 41:18happened while i was attached to the
1216. 41:20polygraph he lets the polygraphists
1217. 41:22repeatedly tell the jury that i failed
1218. 41:24the polygraph
1219. 41:26while prohibiting my attorney from
1220. 41:28questioning him
1221. 41:29about the methods that he used to arrive
1222. 41:32at his opinions so that was one
1223. 41:34irregularity that was definitely
1224. 41:36prejudicial against me
1225. 41:38second thing is that
1226. 41:41the victim's clothes including the bra
1227. 41:43the jury has to see it that
1228. 41:46co-related to one of the statements that
1229. 41:48was coerced out of me in which i said
1230. 41:50that i um ripped her bra off the jury
1231. 41:53asked to see the bra and that's
1232. 41:55important because some bras you can't be
1233. 41:57the way that they're designed you can't
1234. 41:59rip them off of a body so the jury has
1235. 42:01to see the bra
1236. 42:02and that's when the judge said
1237. 42:04that the evidence included victims
1238. 42:07clothes
1239. 42:08including the bra had been left in the
1240. 42:10courtroom over the weekend
1241. 42:12and that apparently the janitors
1242. 42:14thought that it was garbage and so they
1243. 42:16threw it out and that the bra is not
1244. 42:18available anymore and he substituted the
1245. 42:22uh the uh a photo
1246. 42:24in which he said you can almost see the
1247. 42:26bra in the photo
1248. 42:28he substituted that from the with the
1249. 42:31actual bra
1250. 42:33and that's wild
1251. 42:36right
1252. 42:37he refused to declare a mistrial he
1253. 42:39refused to strike any testimony
1254. 42:41pertaining to the bra and the last thing
1255. 42:43was that
1256. 42:44on the third day of the jury
1257. 42:46deliberations they sent out a note
1258. 42:48asking
1259. 42:49well if we don't
1260. 42:51if we can't come up with a verdict are
1261. 42:53we going to be sequestered over the
1262. 42:56christmas holiday and and the judge said
1263. 42:59yes and so i've learned since then that
1264. 43:01at that point it was 1101 for a
1265. 43:03conviction there was one hold out juror
1266. 43:06who
1267. 43:08uh thought that i was innocent but he
1268. 43:10said that they were all pressuring him
1269. 43:12and they all he also said that when they
1270. 43:13sent out the note and and we got the
1271. 43:15answer back
1272. 43:17that the pressure ratcheted up and that
1273. 43:19nobody wanted to be there over the
1274. 43:20christmas holiday and so based on that
1275. 43:23he switched his vote even though he was
1276. 43:25not convinced that i was guilty
1277. 43:27and so when you add all those things up
1278. 43:30you know i guess it's not that
1279. 43:32surprising that i was found guilty
1280. 43:34i mean i i never forget the day i was
1281. 43:36found guilty i mean it felt like i was
1282. 43:38kind of in like a nightmarish
1283. 43:40alternative reality because
1284. 43:42it's my way of thinking at least
1285. 43:43happened to that point in time i thought
1286. 43:45that only you know guilty people were
1287. 43:47convicted
1288. 43:49but they said what they did and i was
1289. 43:51taken into custody i remember just
1290. 43:52sitting there kind of stunned not
1291. 43:55not um you know i couldn't believe my
1292. 43:57own hearing i mean the first three
1293. 43:58charges that they read i was found not
1294. 44:00guilty of and then the fourth
1295. 44:03the fourth you know fourth count they
1296. 44:06read then i they said guilty and i mean
1297. 44:08well wait a minute i mean that that that
1298. 44:10can't be right today did i miss
1299. 44:12something that i missed the word not you
1300. 44:14know but i heard that then they read
1301. 44:15guilty and then guilty so i was kind of
1302. 44:18like in a stunned disbelief i was kind
1303. 44:20of beside myself
1304. 44:23wow what what were you where were your
1305. 44:25parents during this whole trial were
1306. 44:27they or your mother your mother rather
1307. 44:28was she there yeah my mother my mother
1308. 44:29was in the courtroom and and um and so
1309. 44:32was my aunt janet yeah
1310. 44:34and when they read that you they
1311. 44:36sentence you to 15 years what was it 15
1312. 44:3916 in life i was it was yeah i was
1313. 44:41sentenced to 15 well that was when i was
1314. 44:42convicted i went back you come back to
1315. 44:44court
1316. 44:45after that a different proceeding for
1317. 44:47the sentencing okay yeah so i remember
1318. 44:51the day of the sentencing that uh well i
1319. 44:53mean my mother and aunt could have
1320. 44:54couldn't believe it either i mean they
1321. 44:56totally believed in the system and they
1322. 44:57thought that i was you know going to be
1323. 44:59found so did they believe that you were
1324. 45:01the murderer at that point no they did
1325. 45:03they did not no they did not no they
1326. 45:05believed that i was innocent
1327. 45:07so we went so on the day of the
1328. 45:08sentencing i begged you know i made the
1329. 45:10judge to overturn the verdict because i
1330. 45:12was innocent and
1331. 45:13i referenced the dna to support my
1332. 45:15contention and uh you know judge
1333. 45:17calabello actually told me on the record
1334. 45:19he said maybe you are innocent
1335. 45:22but you know he didn't you would think
1336. 45:24that he would overturn the conviction
1337. 45:26then right that but instead he took
1338. 45:28which he could have done by reversing
1339. 45:30any number of the procedural rulings he
1340. 45:32made against me in the course of the
1341. 45:34trial including the evident throwing out
1342. 45:36of the evidence issue that i went into a
1343. 45:38minute ago
1344. 45:39but instead he took the easy way out he
1345. 45:41gave me a 15-in life sentence so i had
1346. 45:44been charged as an adult tried as an
1347. 45:46adult and i was there for a sentence
1348. 45:48as an adult and i was
1349. 45:50sentenced to i was given i was sent to a
1350. 45:52men's maximum security prison
1351. 46:01you