YT YouTube2Text

YouTube2Text → Transcripts → He Built a Website That Sells His GHL SaaS on Autopilot (No Sales Team, No Ads)

He Built a Website That Sells His GHL SaaS on Autopilot (No Sales Team, No Ads) — Transcript

by ItsKeaton · 12,571 words · 1,804 segments · language en · Watch on YouTube

Open in transcriber Summarize with AI Download SRT/VTT

Full transcript

0:00The things that I'm doing anybody can do
0:02from any starting point. Will this lower
0:04the churn rate or raise it? And if
0:06there's even a remote chance of it
0:08raising it, I'm not doing it. Last year,
0:10we hit a record number for ourselves. We
0:12closed out the year at 2.7% for our
0:14annual churn. The wonderful part is that
0:17we don't have a sales team. Our sales
0:19team is our website. Super simple. Give
0:22them the information they need and let
0:23them make the best decision for
0:24themselves. We're just talking about a
0:26CRM. Ironic thing about it is we don't
0:29put a whole lot of thought into it. I
0:31didn't have a ton of money. I also have
0:33three kids. I'm a single dad. I had a
0:35lot writing on this and so I had to find
0:37creative ways of getting to scale as
0:40quickly as possible. Welcome to what's
0:42working where we talk about what's
0:44working to sell high level right now in
0:462026. Today I got to sit down with
0:48Charles Higgins who lives in his own
0:50words between a corn field and a cow
0:53pasture in the middle of nowhere in
0:55Tennessee. And despite not being in a
0:57big city or really near many people at
0:59all, he has managed to get 250 active
1:02paying subscribers on his high level
1:04white label at about $190 a month each,
1:07which puts him at over $45,000 of
1:10monthly recurring revenue. And as we'll
1:12talk about in this video, his margins
1:13are extremely good as well. The most
1:16unique thing about Charles and why I
1:17wanted to bring him on, however, is that
1:19he truly truly sells a CRMbased SAS.
1:23Meaning the people buy a CRM from him,
1:25they configure it and do everything or
1:27they pay him more money to configure it
1:29for them, but they're buying a CRM, an
1:31operating system for their business, not
1:34just one or two features, which is
1:36typically what I coach people to start
1:38with. So, he's definitely not the only
1:40one to do this. This is definitely the
1:41model that High Level kind of pushes,
1:43but the only people I usually see having
1:45success with this are people with really
1:47big audiences. So Charles does not have
1:49a big audience and he grew this in a
1:51number of really cool organic ways,
1:53never spending a dollar on paid
1:55advertising. So this is going to be an
1:56awesome one. I really enjoyed it. Let's
1:58get into it. How's it going [snorts]
1:59everybody and welcome back to another
2:00interview. I am so excited to be joined
2:02today by Charles Higgins who runs Get
2:05Pinnacle AI which is a highle white
2:07label with over 250 subscribers. And
2:10he's got a really unique model in that
2:15he sells just a CRM. He doesn't go in
2:18and build for his clients unless they
2:20pay extra for that. The main thing that
2:22he sells is a CRM. It wasn't always that
2:26way. We're going to get into how he got
2:28there. But I love Charles, your story
2:32because of how much you focused on
2:35building a sustainable business that
2:37doesn't require you in the day-to-day
2:40and is optimized around the life you
2:42want to live instead of being optimized
2:43around making as much money as possible.
2:46Absolutely. It's not always, despite
2:49what so many people may think, it is not
2:51always all about the money.
2:52>> Love it. So, the the reason that I
2:55reached out to you originally is because
2:58I always tell beginners, don't sell a
3:00CRM. Like, you you've been sold this
3:03dream of like, change the colors on your
3:05white label, hire a white label support
3:07company, you're going to be a software
3:09founder overnight. And 10 out of 10
3:12times people fail with that because
3:15they're focusing on the wrong thing.
3:17They're trying to sell too many things.
3:19And a lot of business owners don't even
3:20know what a CRM is. They just want XYZ
3:24result. The beginner doesn't really know
3:26how to wrap their head around that
3:27result and how to articulate that in a
3:29way and you know sell only the few
3:30features that the the client needs. So
3:32that's what I typically coach them is go
3:34back to the basics, figure out what your
3:36client actually wants and just give them
3:38that. and then if they ask for more down
3:40the line, you can give them the full CRM
3:42and the kitchen sink and everything, but
3:43you kind of do the opposite. So, can you
3:46talk through how you got to that point,
3:48your thought process, and what you tell
3:51beginners to do as well?
3:52>> Yeah, so it's it's funny and I'll start
3:54this off. I I am very much in line with
3:57Katon. Most beginners I do I am like
3:59look this is not the path for everybody.
4:02It is not the easiest path. It was just
4:03the best path for me. And I think that's
4:05the most important like part of this is
4:08that I had to find something that fit
4:09me. And so, you know, my background
4:12comes from 20 years in automotive doing
4:15CRM and data management systems.
4:18>> I started with CRM when there were still
4:20a wall of rolodexes on, you know, the
4:23wall. So, before all the digital stuff,
4:25that that's where I started. So, I've
4:27seen the entire evolution of it over the
4:29years. And I've just always been a CRM
4:32nerd. I've got involved in technology
4:35really early in elementary school and
4:38got, you know, brought up in that and I
4:41had some amazing teachers and
4:43influencers and uh mentors in
4:46technology. And so that's just always
4:48what kind of I kept driving back to I
4:51love CRM. I love data management
4:53systems. I'm a data nerd. Um, so that's
4:57kind of what got me into it. When I
5:01started with High Level, when I learned
5:02about High Level, I was like, "Man, this
5:04is like CRM on steroids. I love this."
5:07Um, I just nerded out about it and I saw
5:11some problems I could solve and that's
5:13where I started to kick off. Um, you
5:18know, but I went back to my roots and
5:20automotive.
5:21>> Yeah. So, you started selling to the the
5:22automotive niche, but you didn't start
5:24with the full CRM, right?
5:26>> So, I did start with the full CRM, but
5:28it wasn't really focused around that.
5:30So,
5:30>> hey guys, quick pause here because I
5:32want to tell you about Charles's
5:33community. He has an amazing spot where
5:35you can go in and ask him questions any
5:38day of the week. He gets back on
5:40weekdays, but he also runs multiple
5:42group calls a week where you can get on,
5:44ask him tech questions, strategy
5:46questions, sales questions, whatever it
5:48is that you need help with. Charles is
5:50obviously a wealth of knowledge and if
5:52you're listening to this podcast and at
5:53any point you're like, "Yeah, I need to
5:55uh talk to Charles about XYZ problem."
5:57You should definitely consider joining
5:58his community. It will be linked below
6:00and get this. It's under 50 bucks a
6:02month. So, it's great value for what you
6:04get. See you inside. With that said,
6:06let's get back to the podcast. So, I did
6:08start with the full CRM, but it wasn't
6:10really focused around that. So, I
6:13started off much the same as what we
6:15talk about, you know, find a find a
6:17problem and solve that problem. Well, I
6:19didn't go to dealerships. I went to
6:21actual salespeople. And with those
6:23salespeople, I already knew from being
6:25in that industry that they were
6:27inherently lazy. They wanted to make as
6:29much money with as little work as
6:31possible. So, I just built out a, you
6:34know, I look at it now, I'm like, gosh,
6:36that was horrible. Um, but I built out
6:39automations that were just based on
6:41pipeline statuses. That was it. They
6:43were very simple automated SMS,
6:46automated email. There wasn't near as
6:49much in high level then as there is now.
6:51Um so [clears throat]
6:54we were doing campaigns and triggers
6:55back then. We didn't even have workflows
6:58and it was just very rudimentary. But it
7:00solved the problem from the aspect of
7:03salesperson that they wanted to do as
7:05little work as possible. They didn't
7:07want to call customers. They didn't want
7:09to email. They just wanted people to
7:11show up and buy a car. And so I was
7:13like, "Well, I can pay me $300 a month.
7:17I'll get your manager off your back
7:19because you'll actually do your
7:20follow-up, but yet you won't be the one
7:22doing it. And what lazy salesperson
7:25didn't like that solution? Um, so that
7:28that's how it started was just with
7:30simple
7:31long-term nurture, automated follow-up,
7:34very templated, very non-personalized,
7:37but it worked. It was just about put as
7:40many people in as you can the first 90
7:42days and then every 90 days after that,
7:45you know, you you'll see people just
7:47dropping out and reactivating and buying
7:49cars. Okay. So, for those who don't even
7:52know what a pipeline stage is, can you
7:54explain what each stage of that
7:57automation that you sold or automation
7:59set of automations did and uh what the
8:03most valuable part to the sales person
8:05was? It really started off about their
8:08process from making it as simple and
8:10understandable as possible. And so with
8:13their pipeline, you know, essentially
8:14you had this, think of it as a big board
8:17with different columns in it that you
8:19know, here is a new internet lead, here
8:22is a new phone lead, or here's a new
8:24walk-in that walked in the actual
8:25building. Those were the three things
8:27that I knew they could understand no
8:28matter what. And so that was kind of my
8:31starting point. And so whenever they got
8:33a new phone lead, someone called the
8:36dealership. All they had to do was just
8:39create a uh fill out a form and say
8:43that, you know, here's her name, here's
8:45her phone number, here's their email,
8:47and put in a few notes and that would
8:50just automatically create the
8:52opportunity for them. And after that, it
8:55would just create a task for them to
8:57call, text, and email. And that was
8:59always my thing. I'm like, you're going
9:01to have to do the initial outreach, but
9:03after that, we will do everything else.
9:05And so once they did that first
9:08outreach,
9:09whether it was a new phone lead,
9:11internet lead, or walk-in, once they did
9:13that first one, we took it from there.
9:15It would go directly into a long-term
9:17follow-up. and we would just continually
9:21email them and um send them SMS trying
9:25to get them back into the dealership or
9:28back into the um appointment.
9:32>> So, you weren't integrating at all. The
9:34salesperson had to actually manually
9:36enter the information of this person,
9:38but as long as they did that, basically
9:40all their followup was taken care of.
9:43>> Correct. Yep.
9:44>> Dude, I love I love this so much.
9:46There's no need to integrate or do
9:48anything fancy because they're already
9:50writing that information down. You just
9:52need to put it into an actual system
9:54instead of like creating more work for
9:56yourself by having to follow up with all
9:58those people. So smart.
9:59>> Yeah, exactly.
10:00>> So, how much of that did you sell? Hey
10:02guys, quick pause here. If you've liked
10:04anything that I've said in this podcast
10:06and you'd like to get my eyes
10:08specifically on your business, the best
10:10way to do that is by joining my paid
10:11community, the High Level Guild. Now, it
10:13is $997 to join directly if you want to
10:16pay, but you can actually get free
10:17access in a couple of ways. Number one,
10:19you can sign up or upgrade with High
10:21Level. Number two, you can sign up with
10:23merchant. And number three, you can sign
10:24up with Smart Directory AI, which I did
10:26a recent podcast on. If you sign up with
10:28any of the softwares, you get 100% free
10:30access, and you don't have to pay the
10:31997. So, all of those would be listed
10:33below here. If you do sign up with a
10:35software other than High Level, please
10:37email me at kwitzkaton.com to get access
10:40to the community. And with that said,
10:41let's get back to the podcast. So, I
10:43went to about 10 15 accounts and then I
10:47was like, "Okay, I'm out of the red. I'm
10:49in the black now. Now, let me because it
10:51was funny. I didn't want to have
10:53anything to do with automotive." Um, I
10:55did I was done uh with automotive. And
10:58so I sold 10 to 15 accounts and then um
11:03started to pivot to what I do now,
11:05>> which is
11:06>> which is just helping more entrepreneurs
11:09and small businesses um get access to
11:12technology that they were used to before
11:15they were an entrepreneur or own their
11:17own small business. you know, maybe they
11:19came out of corporate or large franchise
11:21model and they were used to having
11:24access to really nice technology that
11:27they no longer could afford as a
11:29soloreneur or a small business startup.
11:32>> So, your ideal customer is somebody
11:35that's used this technology or similar
11:38technology in the past but doesn't know
11:40that they can get access to it through
11:42high level for their now small business.
11:44>> Yep. And that's the big differentiator
11:47and why
11:49I've had success with just selling a CRM
11:51is that I'm not looking to an industry.
11:54I'm looking to a very particular avatar
11:58um and when I find them, they know who
12:01they are and so it just creates a
12:04creates a good union um and a great
12:07customer uh for us.
12:09>> Love it. Yeah. For those listening, when
12:11I talked to Charles and we talked about
12:13what we were going to talk about, he
12:14says, "I only sell to people who already
12:16know what a CRM is." So, if you say the
12:20word CRM to, I don't know, 60 to 70% of
12:24business owners, it may mean like a
12:26bunch of different things to them. And
12:29usually most industries have some sort
12:30of like field man uh field management
12:33tool for home services or perhaps like
12:36patient management in in dental and
12:39medical that type of thing. But the
12:41sales enablement tools in that specific
12:44industry specific software is not that
12:47great. And they might not even know that
12:50they need something greater. But you're
12:53so smart just targeting the people who
12:55are like, "Yeah, I wish I had like what
12:57I had back when I was in corporate." So,
12:59how do you find these people and what is
13:02like what's the thing you say to get
13:04them to turn their head and like say,
13:06"Yeah, this is what I need."
13:07>> It's very intentional. So, all our
13:09marketing, we've never done advertising,
13:10we've never done paid advertising. We do
13:12100% organic marketing on social media
13:15through our website and you know
13:17different uh platforms but it is always
13:21we're just talking about a CRM and the
13:24ironic thing about it is we don't put a
13:27whole lot of thought into it. We don't
13:29overthink the process because
13:32>> you either know what a CRM [snorts] is
13:34or you don't. And if you don't know or
13:37if you aren't a nerd like me,
13:41you're not going to look at my content.
13:43You're just not. It is not going to
13:45interest you. However, the people that
13:47we are trying to get, they're like, "Oh,
13:49that's cool. I can automate that in my
13:52CRM. I need that." Those are the people
13:55we're trying to find. Those are the
13:57people that we want to sell a CRM.
13:59Because again, we don't want to educate
14:01them and go down this rabbit hole of why
14:04it is valuable to have a CRM, why do you
14:07need to put notes in your contacts and
14:10you know, how does this enable your
14:12business to scale? We don't want to
14:13educate all that. If they don't have a
14:15core understanding that it's garbage in,
14:18garbage out with a CRM that you're only
14:21going to get out of it what you put in,
14:23then that's not our customer. And so we
14:26really focus all our marketing, all our
14:29um website material, blogs, everything
14:32that we do really around that message of
14:35we're just talking about the technology.
14:37We're talking about the platform that we
14:39provide. We're just doing it in more
14:41ways than most.
14:42>> Okay. And tell me about the sales
14:43process. Like how how do they find you?
14:46Where are you posting this content in
14:48the first place? And then do you do a
14:49call? Do you do a demo? How does the
14:51onboarding typically go? Um, yeah. Talk
14:55to me about like they don't know who you
14:56are to they've signed up and paid their
14:59first uh monthly payment.
15:01>> Yeah, so a lot of ours we we focus a lot
15:04on a corporate brand.
15:06>> Nice.
15:07>> We put out a ton of content. So, every
15:10day we put out blog articles. We do a
15:13deep dive on competitor platforms, what
15:16they're blogging about, what they're
15:17talking about, and we have content
15:19pillars that we run all this against.
15:22But our AI agents go out and do
15:23research. They write these articles. And
15:26so we're dropping blog articles every
15:28single day, which also feeds out to our
15:31social media. We do social media content
15:33every single day across all the major
15:35platforms. We do YouTube um where we
15:39have pretty horrible admittedly uh
15:44videos that go up that just talk about
15:46features. We have a podcast where it is
15:50literally like two to three minute
15:52episodes and it's just about a feature
15:54release. That's it. Um and then we do
15:58press releases. So every week we do a
16:01weekly recap and then once a month we
16:03actually email out to about 50 different
16:06publishers a press release uh covering
16:09the last 30 days or the last month. And
16:13uh let's see what else we do. Um we run
16:17our own change log uh which also gets
16:19scraped um by search engines and
16:22everything. So we we invest a lot in
16:24content and brand identity.
16:29>> So just getting our brand out there in
16:31all these different places online
16:34and putting as much information into our
16:36website as possible. Our website I think
16:39without the blog pages is hitting about
16:42250 pages. Um, and it's all based on
16:46industry, based on use case, you know,
16:48here's the solutions we provide, here's
16:50all the different tools.
16:52>> So, we have dedicated pages for all the
16:54tools, industries, use cases, things
16:57like that. And we've got a big video
17:01library with bunch of training videos on
17:03it. Um, and so we just put we pump a lot
17:07out lot of content out.
17:09>> Yeah, it sounds like a a real software
17:12company.
17:14>> [laughter]
17:14>> Yeah. How a real software company would
17:16market.
17:16>> That's the thing, you know, when you got
17:18to make yourself look good, [laughter]
17:20>> right? Yeah. And that's kind of the
17:22approach that I take is I look at other
17:24leaders in the industry. I'm like, what
17:26are they doing? I look at high level.
17:28I'm like, what are they doing? And so
17:30our sales process starts there with the
17:32marketing organic content. And then it
17:36has really when we first started, we
17:38focused on partnerships because I knew I
17:42wanted to do software. I had no interest
17:44in touching ads with a 10-ft pole. I did
17:47not want to do websites or funnels or
17:50any of that. So, I started with
17:52partnerships, brought those partners in
17:54to help promote my platform.
17:58Then I was like, okay, what's everybody
18:00else doing to get to the next step?
18:02Well, Highle runs an affiliate program.
18:04Why not do that? It works for them. Why
18:07wouldn't it work for me?
18:08>> So, we started doing that. We've been
18:10really successful with our affiliate
18:11program. We've got like over 700
18:14affiliates.
18:15Not all of them are active. That's just
18:17part, you know, the nature of the beast.
18:19But yeah,
18:20>> um we've got a large affiliate base.
18:23>> And then from there, we just keep
18:24pushing people to our website. The
18:27wonderful part is that we don't have a
18:28sales team.
18:30>> Our sales team is our website. We have a
18:34pre-recorded demo that we push everybody
18:36into and it is direct signup,
18:40transparent pricing. We don't hide
18:43anything. We don't try to, you know,
18:46bamboozle people like we're we're not
18:48trying to do anything crazy here.
18:50>> Yeah.
18:51>> Just super simple pricing
18:53straightforward direct offer.
18:56Give them the information they need and
18:58let them make the best decision for
19:00themselves. But it's also it caters to
19:04the audience that we're attracting
19:05naturally through our content, the
19:08people that we're attracting.
19:10If I'm that person, I do not want to get
19:13on a sales call with you. That is the
19:15last thing I want to do because I don't
19:16have time for it.
19:18>> I just want to be able to find the
19:19information I'm looking for and be able
19:21to easily identify a path to either sign
19:23up or not. We don't offer trials. We
19:26don't do any of that. it is.
19:29Go learn as much as you want from our
19:31website. Watch our pre-recorded demo. We
19:34do have a ton of video testimonials on
19:36our YouTube channel and on our website.
19:39That of course helped. But even starting
19:41out, we just had a pre-recorded demo.
19:44That was it. And that's been our entire
19:47sales process. And we just take direct
19:49signups and then they go straight over
19:52to our onboarding, which is done
19:54wholeheartedly by Extendley. We don't
19:56touch it. We let them do their thing.
19:59And again, that was just, well, man,
20:02they they've been doing this longer than
20:04me, and they do it all day every day.
20:07Maybe I should just, you know, think
20:09that they kind of know what they're
20:10doing and just let them do their thing,
20:12and wouldn't you know, it it works.
20:15>> So, I I want to get back to the sales
20:17demo, like what what does the
20:19pre-recorded demo actually say, etc. But
20:21let's go back to that partnership
20:23strategy that you mentioned.
20:25>> Mhm. So once you stopped selling to the
20:27car salesman and you decided you were
20:28going to go into selling a full CRM, how
20:30did you get your first like 10
20:32customers? Online networking. So I
20:35started to go to online network. And you
20:37have to keep in mind I live about an
20:39hour, hour and a half south of Nashville
20:42in between a cow pasture and a corn
20:44field. So there's not a whole lot here
20:46for me to go like in person. And this
20:48was, you know, postcoid and everything
20:50was still weird and
20:52>> uh,
20:53>> you know, so I just started doing online
20:55networking and just going and telling
20:58people, hey, I'm Charles Higgins. I own
21:01Pinnacle AI. We offer CRM solutions for
21:05entrepreneurs to small and medium
21:07businesses. Features automations. And at
21:10that time, it didn't even have AI, so it
21:12was just automations. Um, and that was
21:17it. I just started telling people and I
21:19didn't care about selling anybody in the
21:21room.
21:22>> I did not want to sell anybody in the
21:24room.
21:25>> Yeah,
21:25>> I was looking for my golden goose.
21:28>> Who in here already has my ideal
21:30customer?
21:31>> Well, the website designer that sells
21:33$10,000 websites, I'm sure they could
21:36use a CRM. So that's where those
21:39partnerships became a huge role in
21:42launching of this business was okay, let
21:45me get this website designer. Let's get
21:47on a one-on-one meeting. Let me learn
21:49more about what he does, who his clients
21:51are, and some of the struggles he sees
21:54with his own clients. If I can provide
21:57the forms and the automations to make
21:59that $10,000 website function like a
22:03$50,000 website, man, we got something
22:06nice here.
22:07>> And I don't have to worry about finding
22:09customers. He'll just bring them to me.
22:11And so it it started with that. And one
22:16of the things I was very adamant on, I
22:18would not partner with anybody unless
22:20they would use the account or at least
22:23go into the account. And this was
22:26important for me because I cannot stand
22:29people talking about or promoting
22:32something that they've never actually
22:33used themselves.
22:35>> Yeah. So when you say go into the
22:37account, they mean you mean they need to
22:39use Pinnacle themselves so that they can
22:42recommend it.
22:43>> Yeah. I would give them a free account
22:45and say, "Look, I I get it. If you
22:48already have a system in place, I'm not
22:50trying to replace that. I just want you
22:51to be able to talk intelligently about
22:54what to your customers what they will
22:57experience working with us."
22:59>> And so I would give them a coupon code
23:02for a free account, but I made them go
23:04through our checkout. I made them go
23:06through our onboarding process and get
23:10into the account. and all they had to do
23:12is refill their own wallet. I just
23:14wouldn't give them wallet credit. So, it
23:15didn't cost me anything except for the
23:17cost of the onboarding. But what that
23:20did is now it's no longer well they say
23:25they do this during their onboarding
23:27call like no I went through the
23:28onboarding call they're super nice you
23:31know it it's a great platform we're
23:33super h we actually switched ourselves
23:36and that first person experience that
23:39they can then share to their clients is
23:41huge and it establishes a huge trust
23:44factor between you and this new partner
23:48that you're trying to create a relation
23:49relationship with. It's like don't take
23:51my word for it. Go see it for yourself.
23:53Don't don't listen to me. Go experience
23:55it yourself. And you if you have
23:57feedback, let me know. I will fix it.
24:00And that's how we started. We started
24:02selling through partners. So they would
24:05just pull people in. And it just made
24:08their jobs, their lives easier. And that
24:13way they could stay in their area of
24:15expertise and we could stay in our area
24:18of expertise.
24:20>> Yeah. And you didn't have any like
24:21affiliate fees there. It was just like,
24:24>> hey, you send us people, we'll make your
24:25life better.
24:26>> And we would send them people because
24:28inherently we would have people sign up
24:30direct that want a website design. Well,
24:33we don't do websites.
24:34>> You can build websites in our platform,
24:37but we don't do that.
24:39>> Yeah. But we do have partners that we
24:42work with that do websites or they do
24:46Facebook ads or Google ads or whatever
24:49it is. And so we just built out that
24:51partnership network and it was just good
24:54old referrals. Um,
24:55>> so genius. I love it.
24:57>> Nothing crazy.
24:58>> So you you did that until what, like 100
25:02150 customers? Like how how far did that
25:04get you?
25:05>> I'd say about 50 75. Um, and then that's
25:09when we started to pivot. Okay, how can
25:10we ramp this up even faster
25:13>> and get get some more meat on the bone,
25:15so to speak. And that's
25:17>> more content, more affiliates.
25:19>> Yeah, that's when we started looking at
25:21affiliates and also content. They kind
25:24of came around the same time is one,
25:26we've got to really get our brand
25:29solidified in the market and make us
25:31look like a much bigger player than what
25:32we are. Mhm.
25:35>> Then it it was the affiliate system and
25:37that was just a pure like well high
25:41level's doing it and it's working for
25:42them so why why not what's the worst
25:45that could happen
25:46>> for those that don't know like what
25:48online networking is or how to find
25:49these groups. Can you give a couple tips
25:51there?
25:52>> Oh yeah. So, I told people if you've
25:53never done online networking and maybe
25:55you know you're
25:58an introverted nerd like myself,
26:01go to there's a website that's called
26:03Lunch Club. Um, and it honestly just you
26:08say, "Hey, I've got these two slots or
26:10three slots a week that I'm open for
26:12meeting with people." And it will
26:14autoarrange those onetoone meetings for
26:17you.
26:17>> Dang, that's cool. You can go to
26:19Eventbrite and find online business
26:22networking. You can go on LinkedIn and
26:24find networking events or Facebook. Um
26:27they're they're all over the place, but
26:29it's just it's no different than going
26:31to like a local chamber or local BNI.
26:34It's just online. I I love that you just
26:37said we we do CRM. So, if you haven't
26:39been to a networking meeting, guys,
26:40typically you get 30 seconds to a minute
26:42to kind of pitch your thing. And I love
26:44how intentional you were about it. You
26:46weren't trying to sell whatsoever.
26:47You're literally just saying CRM, like
26:50the word CRM will automatically repel
26:5390% of people in that room, but the 10%
26:55that do come to you are the perfect fit.
26:57It's so It's so clever.
26:59>> Exactly. Yep. Yeah. And that's always
27:01been the magic behind it is like we're
27:03we're not trying to,
27:05>> you know, people, oh, what do you guys
27:07do? We offer a software platform. We
27:10offer a CRM. We're not going to get you
27:12more appointments. we're not going to
27:14get you more contacts or leads or, you
27:17know, we're not going to do any of that
27:18because if you don't use it, I can't
27:21guarantee that.
27:22>> Um, and so I'm I'm not going to stick my
27:24guarantee on someone else's, you know,
27:27desire to want to do something. Uh just
27:30a small story if you guys are struggling
27:31to find these local networking events or
27:34online networking events. I got invited
27:36to a couple actually because I just
27:38started posting in a local Facebook
27:40group about a couple of different things
27:43[clears throat] like a voice AI demo
27:46like hey I'll give you a free voice AI
27:47demo. I even did one where I'd pay you
27:49to do a voice AI demo. And what was cool
27:51is I got on with the CMO of like a big
27:53franchise who happened to be in that
27:55group, but also like went to these
27:57networking meetings for his side
27:59business. Um, and he he he went to like
28:03one in person, they had two online ones
28:05that happened like every other week or
28:07whatever. So, you could literally get
28:08like 10 of these online networking
28:11meetings if you worked your way in. And
28:14then I I really like that lunch club
28:16one. It's like sounds like you know what
28:18Omega is?
28:19>> Yeah. Yep.
28:20>> Yeah. It's like Omega for business
28:21networking. [laughter]
28:23>> Yep. Similar. Yeah.
28:24>> It It's like this guaranteed show. I
28:26mean, it's not guaranteed that they show
28:28up, but you just you get in a meeting.
28:30Like half the battle for a beginner is
28:32just getting the meeting to show up
28:34>> knowing what to say and there's so much
28:36pressure on it when it's a sales
28:38meeting. Whereas, if it's like, "Hey,
28:40let's just network. Oh, let's do a
28:42one-on-one. Oh, here's a free account.
28:44Can you refer me to someone?" It's such
28:46a smart way to go about it. Well, and it
28:48it was, you know, I didn't have a ton of
28:50money. I had money saved from when I was
28:53in corporate, but you know, I also have
28:56three kids. Yeah.
28:57>> I'm a single dad,
28:58>> you know, and I had a lot writing on
29:01this, so I couldn't just blow money left
29:04and right. I I didn't have that luxury.
29:06>> And so, I had to find creative ways of
29:08getting to scale as quickly as possible.
29:12Um otherwise my kids would have
29:15profoundly told me to go back to what I
29:17was doing before and that is not what I
29:19wanted to do.
29:19>> Can you this is a good moment for you to
29:21talk about that I think like the the
29:23decision that you made to
29:26>> become self-employed and start a
29:28business because of your kids. Let's
29:30hear about that.
29:30>> I I I I tell you it was absolutely the
29:34scariest decision I've ever made in my
29:36life. Um and
29:39I don't say that lightly at all. I it
29:42took me over a year just to make the
29:45decision to leave corporate and it's
29:47because it was scary. You know I'm a
29:49single dad of three kids and um you know
29:53this was my daughter I've got two
29:56teenage boys and a daughter. Um but my
29:58daughter at that time was three
30:02>> and there's a big age gap, right?
30:04>> Yeah, there is. So, I've got a
30:0617-year-old now that's fixing going to
30:08the Air Force. And then I've got a
30:1015-year-old that's still trying to
30:12figure out what the heck he wants to do.
30:14And then I've got my, you know, little
30:16daughter that can do no wrong. Um, we
30:19all know how, if you're, if you're a dad
30:23to a daughter, we already know how that
30:24works. [laughter] But um so I it took me
30:29over a year because it was a lot of
30:30responsibility and I live in a
30:32multigenerational home so I can't lose
30:34my home either. Like there's a lot of
30:36memories and sentimental attachment to
30:38this home. This was the house I grew up
30:40in that I was now raising my kids in.
30:43And so it was a lot of pressure. But one
30:47thing I regretted was I just never got
30:51time with my kids in corporate life. I
30:54made great money, sure, but all I was
30:58doing was paying for them to go do
31:00things with friends or pay for
31:02babysitters or nannies or it was just
31:06that money was just to keep them
31:08occupied while I was still at work.
31:10>> Yeah.
31:10>> And I had always wanted a daughter.
31:13Finally got the girl and
31:17I was like, I I just can't do this
31:19anymore. I I don't want to have the same
31:21experience. And even after I made the
31:24decision to move out of corporate into
31:27my own business,
31:29I wasn't sure I made the right decision.
31:32I was scared to death cuz there was no
31:34money coming in and I had no idea what I
31:37was going to be making. There was there
31:39was no security whatsoever.
31:42>> Yeah. The thing that solidified it for
31:44me was I took I had to take my boys to a
31:48wellchild checkup, which if you're a
31:51parent, you know that is the most
31:52mundane checkup you will ever do with
31:54your children. It's every year.
31:57But when I went, I was sitting there
31:59filling out the paperwork. I'm like,
32:01"Holy cow,
32:04I have never been able to do this
32:05before.
32:08Something that simple I had never been
32:11able to experience with my kids before.
32:13I'd miss baseball games. I'd miss
32:15football. Like I'd miss so many things.
32:18And of all things, the most routine
32:21child checkup, I was like, gosh, I can't
32:26I can't believe I missed this.
32:28>> Yeah.
32:29>> And you know, and if you're a parent, I
32:31mean, you get it. It's just there's
32:34there's something about that. And that's
32:36when I was like, "Okay, I've got to make
32:38this work." And I just went head down
32:41and worked my butt off. Um, long hours,
32:457 days a week, you know, and but it, you
32:49know, it was worth it. I knew I had to
32:50put in the work in the beginning to get
32:52to where I wanted to be. And that's what
32:55I did. I just went head down, worked as
32:58hard as I could, talked to many, let as
33:00many people know what I was doing as
33:03possible, any way I could to get that
33:06ball rolling. When you were first
33:07starting out, you said you mentioned it
33:09or talked to a bunch of people. Would
33:11you say, "I started a CRM. I started a
33:13software company. I'm white labeling
33:15high level." Like did you ever mention
33:16high level to people when they like I
33:19think most the population doesn't know
33:21what it takes to start a software
33:22company but I I was always nervous at
33:24the beginning if I said like oh I I
33:26started this software like somebody who
33:28has an inkling of how hard it is to
33:30actually code a software product and
33:32like get it out to market would be like
33:34you did that in a month. So how did you
33:38how did you go about that and and did
33:40you ever feel any imposttor syndrome
33:42around white labeling versus having
33:44built it yourself? So I think you know
33:46this gets into a lot of ethical stuff
33:48and I take a pretty firm line on it. I I
33:51don't I don't think there's anything
33:53wrong with saying that you have created
33:56a CRM offer or CRM system even if you're
34:01white labeling because it is your own
34:03system. It is your own processes that
34:05you're hopefully you're just not giving
34:06them software and nothing else. I mean
34:08we give them a snapshot
34:10>> and but we did tell people you know I I
34:14would tell people I own Pinnacle AI we
34:18are a CRM software company we've created
34:20this platform
34:22now if they asked we would directly tell
34:26them we are we have never and will never
34:29lie to people if they say this looks sim
34:32yes we are built off a high level and
34:34here's what makes us different um not
34:37only are snap snapshot but our training
34:39or onboarding all the documentation
34:42longevity
34:44you know my background and experience
34:46this is what makes us different
34:47>> and what do you do when one of your
34:49clients comes to you and asks is this
34:51highle or hey I just found highle it
34:54seems similar can I switch because
34:57that's one of the main concerns I think
34:58a lot of people have with running this
35:00CRM model
35:01>> so we actually have a hidden page on our
35:03website um for this very instance so If
35:07they ask us if it's high level, we will
35:09absolutely tell them. We are not going
35:10to hide it at all.
35:12>> And if they want to transfer their
35:14account to another agency or to their
35:16own highle agency, we simply have them
35:19fill out a form on our website that asks
35:22them, one, why are you wanting to
35:25switch? And two, is there anything that
35:27we could do to help you want to stay
35:31with us? We're not above making
35:33mistakes. I'm not saying we're perfect
35:35by any stretch of the imagination. So,
35:38that's a really important question to
35:40us. If if there's anything that we could
35:42do to get them to stay, we're going to
35:43do it. And oftent times, we've had a few
35:46people where like, yeah, we just don't
35:49want to pay 2.97 or 3.97 a month
35:52anymore. We can go direct to high level
35:54and pay 97. Okay. So, the only
35:58difference for you at this point is the
36:01price.
36:03Well, what if we just sold it to you for
36:05the same price? What if we just gave you
36:07the discount? That way you could
36:08maintain the support and everything
36:10else. You just got to do me a favor.
36:12Can't tell your friends about this.
36:14Okay, I'm just doing this for you. We
36:16don't even have a coupon code. We're
36:18going to go in and manually change your
36:19price for
36:22it. You know, I I'd much rather It
36:25doesn't cost me anything.
36:27>> So, okay.
36:30Yeah,
36:30>> I'm making $200 less. That's better than
36:33making $297 less.
36:36>> Yeah.
36:36>> So, um Yeah, but they just fill out a
36:39form. And we don't The other thing is,
36:42oh my god, stop holding accounts
36:44hostage. Please, if you're one of those
36:46people, stop doing it. Um it it just
36:49makes you look bad. Um if we have a
36:53client that wants to move to their own
36:55highle account and it has nothing to do
36:57with money, it's nothing we can do. they
36:59just want to have their own account. We
37:02are going to transfer everything over,
37:04snapshot and all. We're not going to rip
37:05anything out of their account. We're not
37:07going to do that. Same thing if they
37:09want to move to another agency. If
37:11that's what they want, hey, by all
37:14means, we will make it as easy for you
37:16as possible because we've also had
37:18people come back.
37:21Can we transfer back? You [laughter]
37:22know, um, and if they have a horrible
37:25experience, guess what? That's never
37:27going to happen. So, if we, you know, it
37:30is what it is. We, we're just going to
37:32do what's right, and that's one of our
37:34core principles is no matter what the
37:37cost, either in time spent or
37:39monetarily, just do what's right.
37:42>> That's all that matters at the end of
37:43the day.
37:44>> What is your sales demo video like
37:48general broad strokes? what do you cover
37:50and what would you recommend that
37:51somebody put in that um
37:54version one and then what they what what
37:57can they as they build into more
37:58versions what can they add?
38:00>> Yeah, so we
38:02have about a seven minute video and
38:05honestly it covers a lot more than I
38:07ever could in seven minutes which is why
38:09I love it. But it just goes over the
38:11core principles of the CRM. It doesn't
38:14get into all the AI stuff. Um, it
38:16doesn't get into like AI employee or AI
38:19studio or any of that other stuff,
38:22>> but it is really just about
38:26having the unified inbox, the sales
38:29pipeline,
38:31multi- channelannel communication, chat
38:33widgets, um, mis call text back, website
38:37funnel builder, email builder, like core
38:40everyday business operation stuff that
38:43no matter what business it is, because
38:45we're industry agnostic.
38:47>> I don't care about talking about the
38:49tools that you might use once a quarter.
38:52>> That doesn't mean anything.
38:55>> Here's how your day is going to change.
38:57Here's how we'll be part of your day
38:59every day.
39:00>> And you know, we're going to give you
39:02those tools. So that that's really what
39:04it's more focused around
39:06>> is daily operations. And it's the same
39:09thing with our snapshot. We give the
39:11same exact snapshot to every single
39:13customer. every single one no matter
39:15what they do, but it's all basic
39:18operations.
39:19>> And can you speak to the support thing
39:21because you said something when we
39:23talked earlier that I really liked where
39:26you said, "My support is better for
39:28local business owners than highle
39:31support." And I think a lot of beginners
39:33don't believe that. They don't
39:34understand that high level is not super
39:36equipped to help the average local
39:38business owner. And yeah, I'd love to
39:41hear what you've built in that High
39:43Level doesn't have and what makes you
39:45believe that and what you would tell to
39:46a beginner to kind of increase their
39:49confidence that they can do this.
39:51>> The things that I'm doing anybody can do
39:53from any starting point. And so this is
39:56not stuff that you have to wait. It's
39:58like, oh, I need, you know, 50 or 100
40:00counts to be able to do that. The things
40:02I'm going to talk about are you can do
40:04this from the very beginning. It just
40:05may require you do a little bit more
40:07actual work. Um, but one of the things
40:11that I would do in the very beginning
40:13was I hosted a weekly Q&A call where all
40:18my users could come on a question and
40:21answer call on Zoom and I would just
40:24answer questions. Um, maybe show off a
40:26new feature or a new way of doing
40:28something, but then they could get their
40:30actual questions answered. Now, you
40:33can't do that forever and you can't
40:34certainly, you know, support every user
40:37that way. So, then we started getting
40:40into third-party support. Now, we ended
40:43up going with Extendley and using them
40:47as our third party support provider and
40:51they
40:53do an amazing job from and most of your
40:56thirdparty providers do. They do they
40:59understand that they're talking to an
41:01end business where high level support is
41:04high level is built for agencies not end
41:07businesses. So think about when you're
41:11an agency
41:13if you're going in and you're asking
41:16high level support for something like oh
41:18go over here for your agency settings
41:20and click this and do that and go read
41:22this help doc and like you really think
41:25an end business owner wants to
41:26experience that. Let me tell you, they
41:28do not they are not technical in any
41:31way, shape or form. And they just want
41:33someone to do it for them half the time
41:35or at least show give them a video
41:37showing it being done in their own
41:39account. And that was one of the things
41:42that the third party support really
41:45helped out with was approaching it from
41:47an enduser perspective of simplified
41:51terms, no jargon, no industry terms,
41:56just simplifying it and providing a Loom
41:59video. How do I do this? Well, here's a
42:01Loom video. We're not going to do it for
42:03you because you need to learn, but we
42:05will show you in your account how to do
42:07it, where to go, where to click, and
42:09we'll explain it all in this Loom video.
42:12The other part with that is we spent a
42:16lot of time with documentation and
42:18training. So, we have training courses
42:21on most every feature of the platform,
42:23every major feature of the platform. And
42:26it's an actual course. Now, we don't
42:29tell businesses, and this is one of the
42:31differentiators for us. I've seen a lot
42:34of agencies try to put a business
42:37through a training course like start
42:39here, end up here. I don't do that. It
42:42is not my job to tell you how to run
42:44your business. I sell you software, but
42:46I'm not going to tell you how to run
42:48your business. Your priorities may be
42:50different than the next person. So, we
42:53break it out by feature. That way, if
42:55they're like, "You know what? Our
42:56invoices are a mess." They can go learn
42:59how to manage invoices before they go to
43:02the social planner and connect accounts.
43:04I don't care. I just want them to see
43:06value as quickly as possible and easily
43:09as possible. So, if I let them pick
43:11their own priority path, what they need
43:13to learn in the system, that allows them
43:16to see the value way faster than me
43:19trying to force them down a certain path
43:22that they may not really appreciate.
43:25>> And so, we do a lot of training videos,
43:27a lot of courses, lot of documentation.
43:30Um, you know, we have our own change
43:32log. We do change log videos.
43:35We put them up on YouTube, on social
43:38media. You know, it's just pushing out
43:40education about our platform, how to use
43:42it, how to benefit. And we still do
43:45calls. So, we do bi-week bi-weekly calls
43:48now where any of our users can come on,
43:51ask any questions. We'll usually do some
43:52training, but they get those answered.
43:56And it's just people, it doesn't matter
43:59how good your platform is or your
44:01technology or snapshot or whatever your
44:03offer is. None of that matters if people
44:07don't feel supported. If they don't feel
44:10like there's someone there beside them,
44:13>> they are going to churn there. There's
44:15no question about it. You could have the
44:17best software in the world.
44:18>> They would rather go to and I've done it
44:21myself. I have stayed with a lesser
44:25product in many ways just because their
44:28support was incredible.
44:30>> You know what's like fascinating me
44:32right now is it's almost like what
44:36you're doing selling it as a CRM comes
44:39with all these extra things that you
44:42have to do like the documentation like
44:44the support like the calls. You really
44:47have to focus on the churn aspect and
44:49you're running a real software company.
44:51you just don't have to worry about the
44:52development like the change logs all
44:54this stuff that's that's a lot
44:56>> right
44:57>> on the other end you have you're
44:59promising a specific outcome it's more
45:02like maybe lead genen based maybe the
45:05business owner isn't even logging into
45:06the software you just have some
45:08automations running for them and they
45:10fill out some forms like you were doing
45:11with the salespeople or whatever the
45:13industry needs you take care of it for
45:16them with high level and they don't even
45:18know what's going on like these are the
45:20two extremes dreams of the what you can
45:23do with high level. And I feel like most
45:25people get stuck in this like really
45:27murky middle where they're like
45:29halfassing all of the documentation and
45:32everything. They're halfassing the
45:34offer. It's like, oh yeah, you can do
45:36all this, but also like we're kind of
45:37selling this promise as well. And it's
45:41it's like this really natural divide
45:43where it's like pick a lane, get really
45:45good at that. And if naturally something
45:48else comes out of that that you need,
45:50then you can build it. But you have to
45:53have to have to focus and differentiate
45:56yourself in one of those ways.
45:58Otherwise, you're just going to get
45:59stuck in this crazy churn cycle that
46:01doesn't work for anyone.
46:02>> Yeah. And everything we've done to this
46:05point and what we continue to do is very
46:07intentional. There is, you know, we're
46:11competing against HubSpot and
46:13Salesforce. I mean, we're doing this to
46:15ourselves. Don't get me wrong, by
46:18advertising and marketing as a CRM, we
46:20are directly stacking oursel against
46:23every competitor in the market.
46:25>> And so the things that we do, the things
46:27that we put in place are very
46:31purpose driven.
46:33>> We have to compete on a software company
46:36level. And you know, when we look at our
46:39website, when we look at how much
46:40content is on our website, how we're
46:42doing, you know, people think I'm crazy
46:47by having a change log or having we have
46:49our own uptime status monitor. Um, so
46:52people can see, you know, if the
46:54system's up or down or what's going on.
46:57>> That's all part of a software company.
46:59And to compete in the realm that we're
47:02competing in, you at least have to look
47:05the part. Um, yeah. So, um, so true. You
47:09know, you can't look like you were
47:10thrown together last night. And that's
47:13that's been a big separator for us.
47:15>> Yeah. It's genius, Charles. I love it.
47:17And it's it's like you alluded to
47:18earlier, it's not the right path for
47:20everyone, but it's like you are uniquely
47:22suited to do this. Like, you geek out on
47:25on putting an hour into something like
47:28some kind of resource that can then be
47:30consumed by hundreds of people and save
47:32you a hundred hours in the future. or a
47:35lot of other personalities are much more
47:37like I I I couldn't possibly spend this
47:39like pre-work time doing something that
47:42somebody might use later because I'm not
47:43even sure if I can get the clients. I'm
47:45not, you know, so it's it's all about
47:48what's your personality
47:50getting out of the red like you talked
47:52about. You didn't do this until you were
47:53out of the red and then you did what you
47:55really wanted to do.
47:56>> And um
47:57>> it's it's just such a breath of fresh
47:59air, man. It's uh it's more people need
48:01to to hear from you for sure. You have
48:04to find your own path, you know, and you
48:07can't listen to what everybody's telling
48:08you. You know, you you know yourself
48:11better than anybody else. And I I always
48:13tell people, and I'm sure you tell them
48:15very like go back where you came from.
48:17Start there because you already know the
48:19industry. You know the problems. It's
48:21going to be the easiest approach because
48:23you're not trying to pretend you know
48:25something that you know absolutely
48:27nothing about.
48:28>> Yeah.
48:29>> Um had I gone into
48:31>> Do I have friends that are plumbers and
48:32electricians? Sure. Could I have built
48:35the system? Maybe. Did I know anything
48:38about those industries? Absolutely not.
48:41Um, so that would have been a much
48:43harder approach than going back to where
48:45I came from, automotive. But at the same
48:48time, if you have a passion about
48:50something, I can't tell you how many
48:52times still to this day people call me
48:54stupid and I'm an idiot because I'm just
48:57selling a CRM. They tell me every day
48:59that it shouldn't work.
49:02It works for me. It It works based on
49:04what I love to do, what interests me,
49:08you know, my analytical crazy mind that
49:11is also nerdy. It works for me and
49:14that's all that matters at the end of
49:15the day. You know, just because someone
49:18doesn't find success that way doesn't
49:20mean that you won't. You just have to
49:22find your own path.
49:24>> The other thing that I really need you
49:26to talk about today is how much you
49:29focus on churn. uh because you guys
49:31aren't growing at like some crazy rate,
49:34but you keep growing simply because you
49:38don't really lose people. So, talk to me
49:40about what what your turn rate is and
49:43we've talked about a lot of the things
49:45that help that like the brand that
49:47you've put out there, the change log,
49:49the support,
49:50>> anything else that's like not obvious
49:52that you do that beginners could
49:55implement.
49:56>> Yeah, I mean really it's just about
49:58documenting everything. One of the
49:59things that we did early on and there's
50:01actually uh there's a company called
50:03Prod Camp um and they offer a NPS survey
50:10um which if you don't know what that is
50:12is net promoter score
50:14>> for completely free and a feedback
50:16widget. So, we've had we've done our own
50:19NPS surveys in our white label and we
50:22have our own internal feedback widget in
50:24our white label so that as users are in
50:27the system, we're polling them to see
50:31how likely are they to recommend us, but
50:33then also providing a really easy way to
50:36report bugs or things like I wish this
50:39was a little bit different through that
50:41feedback widget.
50:43We had that there in the beginning to
50:45get that feedback because we have to
50:47listen to our customers and what they're
50:49wanting. So that's when I started
50:50focusing on churn rate and every
50:54decision I make within my company all
50:57comes down to will this lower the churn
51:00rate or raise it.
51:03And if there's even a remote chance of
51:05it raising it, I'm not doing it. I'm not
51:09taking a gamble on that.
51:11>> Yeah. And anything that might even
51:13decrease it hundth of a point, I don't
51:17care. Like the change log, the weekly
51:21emails that go out from the RSS feed
51:23from our change log, the uptime monitor,
51:27the uptime monitor probably doesn't keep
51:29anybody on platform,
51:31>> but to to really speak of, but if it
51:34helps release a frustration for one
51:37customer,
51:38>> I'm good.
51:40>> Yeah. because that's one more customer I
51:42don't have to worry about turnurning.
51:44>> And so last year,
51:46>> last year we hit a record number for
51:47ourselves. So we last year we were at
51:502.7%
51:51uh we closed out the year at 2.7%
51:54>> for our annual churn. And that is just
51:57unheard of. [laughter]
51:59>> And it's a lot of it revolves around
52:02it's it's all of it combined. It is
52:06how we approach our offer, how we sell,
52:09because we're not promising anything.
52:12What, you know, what are they going to
52:14say? Well, we didn't get enough
52:15appointments. Well, we never said we
52:17would get you more appointments in the
52:18first place. We just told you we we gave
52:21you calendars. What you do with those
52:23calendars is totally up to you. Um, so
52:26they can never blame us for their lack
52:29of success.
52:32And so that's one part of it, but then
52:35that onboarding experience, getting them
52:38in onboarding within 24 to 48 hours of
52:41sign up, getting them through that
52:42process within 3 to five business days,
52:45and so they're up and running and going
52:47in the system, and then providing
52:49training and coaching calls and not
52:52really coaching calls, but open Q&A
52:54calls.
52:55>> Yeah.
52:56>> Giving them every reason
52:59to reach out to us. feedback tools, NPS
53:03surveys, like we have a community that
53:06has training in it and we push our
53:10updates into there. Like there is no way
53:14that a customer can not get a hold of us
53:17>> at all. Like it's impossible. We we make
53:20it too easy. That's that's really what's
53:22led to the low turn rate is not
53:25complicating the offer, keeping it
53:27stupid simple. This is exactly what we
53:29do. We're not going to overpromise,
53:31underd deliver. This is what we offer.
53:34>> Yep. How many people do you bring on per
53:36month at this point?
53:37>> I would say we average probably
53:41four to six new accounts a month.
53:44>> Yeah,
53:45>> I I just did the math.
53:46>> There's some months where we don't have
53:47anybody.
53:48>> Um, you know, I mean, there sometimes we
53:51go a month or two and nobody. And that's
53:53fine. I don't care.
53:55>> Oh, it's so it's such a breath of fresh
53:56air, man. It's I just did the math. I
53:59know the number was probably calculated
54:01on a slightly lower number, but at 250
54:03clients, 2.5% churn, that means you had
54:07six or seven people cancel total last
54:09year,
54:10>> and you brought on probably
54:12>> I mean, let's say your average four per
54:15months easily. Yeah.
54:18>> Yeah. Yeah.
54:18>> Yeah. [laughter]
54:20>> It's just like if you don't lose the
54:23clients, the business and and what I
54:24love about your your business as well is
54:26you could sell it someday. This is the
54:27most sellable highle business I've ever
54:29seen.
54:29>> Oh yeah, we've had several offers and
54:31I'm like, no, this is my retirement
54:33plan. Um, you know, but because I love
54:36what I do, I Yeah,
54:37>> I don't I I don't have any interest in
54:40>> getting rid of it.
54:41>> Are you comfortable talking about your
54:43profit margins?
54:44>> We run lean and mean. Um, that that is
54:47one beautiful thing about this because
54:49we're not having to pay for all this
54:52ancillary stuff, you know. Thank God for
54:54Claude. I I will say that. Um, so Claude
54:58has actually cut down a lot of our extra
55:00subscriptions and costs that we had. Uh,
55:04>> you know, and Cloudflare is a godsend as
55:06well. I can't tell you how many workers
55:08we deploy through Cloudflare, but it's a
55:10lot. Um,
55:11>> how many workers?
55:12>> Yeah. So, like our change log, our API
55:15documentation.
55:16>> Oh, nice. Nice.
55:17>> Everything, all that runs through
55:19Cloudflare workers. It's all stuff we
55:21used to have to pay for,
55:23>> like pay a third party company for. So
55:26your costs are essentially cla Extendley
55:29and a few team members.
55:30>> That's it. You know, we've got about a
55:32dozen team members um because we run a
55:34virtual assistant service as well. Um
55:37[clears throat]
55:37>> you know, but it's a completely separate
55:40offer from our CRM. They don't have to
55:42use our CRM to use the VAS. And then if
55:45our CRM people want stuff built for
55:48them, great.
55:49>> Tell me more about how you decided to
55:51roll out the virtual assistant offer. We
55:54kept getting requests for websites and
55:56funnels and help with automations and
55:59it's not something that any support team
56:01is going to do and so we're like gosh
56:03how do we how do we solve this and we
56:06had partners but those partners weren't
56:08building automations in high level so
56:10we're like okay I
56:13we'll start with V8s and I kept looking
56:15around
56:17I did not want to run any anywhere
56:20remotely close to anything that serve
56:23service-based. And so I started looking
56:25around for VA companies that I could
56:27white label.
56:29The problem was is I always had to be
56:31the monkey in the middle.
56:34They wouldn't talk to my clients
56:35directly. And I'm like, I don't care
56:38what I have to pay you. I'm going to
56:40charge my clients, so I, you know, cover
56:42my cost, but
56:43>> yeah,
56:44>> I don't care what I have to pay. I don't
56:45want to be monkey in the middle. I don't
56:46want to talk to my have my client talk
56:48to me and then me tell you what I need
56:51and then have to have you come back to
56:53me to tell my customer. I'm like, no,
56:56I'm out on that. That's crazy.
56:59>> But that's what every model was.
57:02And they're like, "Oh, well, you could
57:03hire a dedicated VA to be that middle
57:05person." I'm like, "That's still
57:06Why would I do that?" Um, so
57:10if I'm going to do that much work, I
57:12might as well make more money. So, I was
57:15like, guess I'm going to start my own VA
57:17service. And I just hired a few people.
57:20And it kind of built from there. And
57:24it's been great. Um, we
57:28I would say we probably have I think
57:31last I looked we were hitting at about
57:3362 63 penetration rate on current
57:37subscribers for CRM. Um, which is a
57:41great number. Um,
57:42>> so meaning over half of the CRM users
57:46engage a VA at some point
57:48>> and they may only do it temporarily. Um,
57:50you know, it's month, it's strictly
57:52month-to-month. There's no annual
57:53subscriptions available and they just
57:56buy the number of hours they need per
57:58month. And I just wanted it to be an
58:01easy button. Again, this is looking at
58:03bigger brands that are doing things
58:05right and how can I apply it to my
58:07customer.
58:07>> Sweet. And it's like how much do you pay
58:11on average for the VAS and how much do
58:13your clients pay?
58:14>> Anywhere from $4 an hour up to 12.
58:18>> Okay.
58:18>> And then we start at $16 an hour. Um so
58:23we sell our packages to our clients. So
58:2610 20 30 40.
58:28>> At 10 hours it's $16 an hour and then
58:31every package they go up. So at 20 hours
58:34a month it's$,550 and then 15 and 1450.
58:39So as they go up it goes down um until
58:42we hit
58:4412 I think is the lowest you know that
58:47then then the discount stop. But it was
58:49never intended again this goes back to
58:52retention.
58:54I don't care about knocking people's
58:56heads off on VA services.
58:59I care about retention and if I if I can
59:02make a little bit of money, great.
59:06But what's most important is that I'm
59:08keeping that monthly recurring revenue
59:10or the annual recurring revenue nice and
59:13safe.
59:14>> Yeah.
59:14>> Like that that's the most important part
59:16to me.
59:18>> And not only do you keep the revenue,
59:20you make it more secure because they've
59:22got another automation, they've got
59:24another funnel, they've got something
59:25else, some other reason to stay with
59:27you.
59:28>> Yeah. Nobody likes switching CRM, let me
59:29tell you that.
59:30>> No. So, the more you can get them in,
59:33the less likely they are to churn. As
59:35long as
59:36>> the turn only happens because they're
59:37not using it,
59:38>> right? Yeah.
59:39>> Do you remember like a moment where you
59:43hit a certain level of profit where you
59:45were like, "Cool, I'm good." And you
59:48kind of let off the gas pedal.
59:50>> Well, yeah. And and I think and this is
59:53going to surprise some people. Um, you
59:57know, I am very much about my lifestyle.
1:00:01>> And when I say lifestyle, I mean family.
1:00:04>> I don't mean having a private yacht or
1:00:06owning a boat or having some
1:00:08Lamborghini. I could care less about any
1:00:10of that nonsense.
1:00:11>> Yeah.
1:00:11>> Um, I drive a Ford Explorer. I bought it
1:00:15pre-owned off of Carvana and I'm damn
1:00:17proud of it.
1:00:18>> Um, I I don't like debt. [laughter]
1:00:22>> My lifestyle is very simple. And so when
1:00:24I got to the point where I was
1:00:28had about
1:00:3115 18k a month, I was good. My kids were
1:00:36happy. I could get them everything that
1:00:38they needed.
1:00:40I was okay with telling them no to
1:00:42things that they wanted. I'm a very
1:00:44simple person when it comes to home
1:00:46life. I I now when it comes to
1:00:49technology, I am not a simple person at
1:00:51all. When it comes to running a
1:00:52business, I'm not a simple person. But
1:00:54when it comes to my home life and my
1:00:56lifestyle, I am a very simple person.
1:00:59>> Love it.
1:00:59>> Playing board games with my kids, you
1:01:01know, that that is better to me than
1:01:04going on some fancy trip. Um, I don't
1:01:07care about any of that. And so that's
1:01:11and that's what this business has really
1:01:13afforded me to do. And that's again one
1:01:15of the reasons why I focus on churn is
1:01:17because I don't I don't want to have to
1:01:19worry about my business all the time. I
1:01:21want to be able to just
1:01:23you know what I'm going away for a week
1:01:26and you know I get to get involved in
1:01:30organiz nonprofit organizations. I'm
1:01:33going to a big event next month um to
1:01:37support a nonprofit that is a client of
1:01:39ours as well. And you know we donate
1:01:42backpacks to kids at school. And I mean
1:01:46those are the things that matter to me.
1:01:47It is not
1:01:50it is not about the rich and famous or
1:01:53you know it's just not what I'm after.
1:01:57And so yeah 15 18 I was like we're good
1:02:01we got everything we need.
1:02:03>> So that that's when you could turn off
1:02:04the uh networking meetings and just grow
1:02:06through content kind of.
1:02:07>> Yep. And I still go to some, you know, I
1:02:10I still jump in every now and then. And,
1:02:12you know, it's good to see people. And,
1:02:15um, you know, now we've started getting
1:02:17more involved in local uh, meetups, been
1:02:21able to really get involved in a lot of
1:02:23those organizations and contribute and
1:02:25give back. Um, and it's it's been great.
1:02:29And inevitably, we end up with customers
1:02:31just from that.
1:02:32>> I love it. Um, have you read the 4-hour
1:02:35work week?
1:02:36>> Nope.
1:02:37>> No. Okay, you need to read this book.
1:02:39You embody every principle from it.
1:02:41>> Everybody Everybody tells me that, but
1:02:44[laughter]
1:02:45>> but there's this line where he said, "I
1:02:47started he started like a supplement
1:02:48company." He said, "The purpose of the
1:02:50company was to make me $30,000 a month
1:02:54profit in my bank account, whether I was
1:02:56banging my head against a keyboard or
1:02:57clipping my toenails on the beach.
1:03:00That's it. That's the goal."
1:03:02>> And designing with that intention is
1:03:05just so powerful. It is and I think it's
1:03:08easy for people to get stuck in and we
1:03:11see this a lot in the high level arena
1:03:14is that oh that lifestyle is you know
1:03:17sipping pinina coladas on a beach or
1:03:19whatever like that doesn't have to be
1:03:21it. Yeah,
1:03:22>> I would much rather one I hate beaches.
1:03:26Um, but [laughter] two, I'd much rather
1:03:28be up in snowy mountains somewhere
1:03:30sipping a
1:03:32>> cup of coffee and just relaxing with no
1:03:35internet connection whatsoever. You have
1:03:37to find that place for you. And I I
1:03:40think that's a great point, you know,
1:03:41whether it's banging my head up against
1:03:43the keyboard or clipping my toenails,
1:03:46you know, and it it's funny because,
1:03:50you know, someone that we both know
1:03:52well, um Jonah, um he refers to me
1:03:56lovingly as Uncle Sass. It's what I do.
1:03:59I do software as a service. You got to
1:04:02figure out where you want to be and if
1:04:04you can build towards that, then you'll
1:04:07be just fine. You just got to cut out
1:04:08the noise sometimes.
1:04:09>> Love it. Um, so I'd love to close with
1:04:12this. Any thing that you've learned that
1:04:16you feel like could apply to
1:04:19the majority of highle offers like
1:04:21people that run a SAS like you are few
1:04:23and far between. Typically they have a
1:04:25big audience.
1:04:26>> Uh, which is why I was super excited to
1:04:28interview you because you have the the
1:04:30CRM based SAS without an audience. Um,
1:04:34so I'm thinking of like if you guys
1:04:36don't know who runs these types of
1:04:37businesses, REI Reply, Christa Mayor,
1:04:41um, Course Creator 360. These are three
1:04:44examples of people with really big
1:04:46followings who white labelled high
1:04:48level, sold hundreds to thousands of
1:04:51accounts because they had the marketing
1:04:53all figured out, and they had the team
1:04:54and the backing to kind of build out
1:04:56everything that Charles has talked about
1:04:57that you you need. For those who don't
1:05:01have that backing and don't feel like
1:05:03the CRM side is what they want to go
1:05:05into and they're selling more of an
1:05:07outcomebased offer,
1:05:09>> what things would you advise them for or
1:05:12against based on what you've learned
1:05:14because you do a lot of coaching as well
1:05:15in different communities and you you
1:05:17come up against these questions a lot.
1:05:19I'm curious how you handle um you know
1:05:22the the typical beginner dilemmas in
1:05:24that case. Yeah. And this is something
1:05:27that gets my head beaten up against the
1:05:30wall all the time. [laughter] And it is
1:05:35you have got to stay simple.
1:05:38And I I can't stress that enough. You do
1:05:42not have to have a complex offer. I
1:05:44don't care what it is. focus down on one
1:05:49very specific problem that you can say
1:05:52in one sentence what it is you actually
1:05:55do.
1:05:56Any more than that, you're just adding
1:05:58complexity, especially when you're first
1:06:00starting out. You are just learning. And
1:06:03so, the simpler you can keep it, the
1:06:06better. If it's, hey, we do reputation
1:06:08management. We respond all to your
1:06:11positive and negative reviews and we
1:06:14give you a QR code that you can put up
1:06:16wherever else. Now, here's the problem
1:06:19that most people get into is they go to
1:06:22a networking event. Let's say it's a BNI
1:06:24meeting or local chamber. They start
1:06:26telling people what they do. They're
1:06:28like, "Oh yeah, we've tried that. You
1:06:30know, we we really want to start texting
1:06:32people, you know, to leave a review. Oh,
1:06:34yeah. We can do that. Oh, and this would
1:06:36be nice to have, too. Yeah, our system
1:06:38can do that. That wasn't your offer.
1:06:42>> Stop letting the scope creep come in.
1:06:45Like, you have got to stay glued to that
1:06:48offer. Now, once you get out of the red
1:06:52and into the black and you're actually
1:06:54making money and people are staying with
1:06:56you more than
1:06:58two to four weeks, you know, if you can
1:07:00keep them on and paying for
1:07:033 to six months consistently and you've
1:07:06got those first 10 to 15 clients, then
1:07:09you can look at what your current
1:07:12customers want. Hey, if we added one
1:07:15feature today, what would that be? And
1:07:17so if you can keep them longer adding a
1:07:19feature, well then you can take that as
1:07:22your next offering or your expanded
1:07:25offer and you can continue to grow that
1:07:28way. But I see too often
1:07:32people say, "Oh, well, I saw this agency
1:07:34doing it this way and that way and you
1:07:37know, oh, I I watched some video of, you
1:07:41know, some training that High Level was
1:07:43putting on and they were talking about,
1:07:44oh yeah, you can sell High Level this
1:07:46way." And they start building it out and
1:07:48then the next week there's another
1:07:50speaker and they're like, "Oh yeah, that
1:07:52that that sounds amazing. Let me do
1:07:54that. Let me just tear my whole agency
1:07:55apart to go a totally different
1:07:57direction." Don't do that. Um,
1:07:59>> yeah.
1:08:00>> For the love of God, stop watching
1:08:01YouTube videos. Um, [laughter]
1:08:04go talk to people that are actually
1:08:05doing it every day.
1:08:06>> The master classes, too. [laughter]
1:08:09>> Yeah.
1:08:09>> So, if people want to get help from you
1:08:12directly, Charles, where's the best
1:08:14place?
1:08:15>> So, I started an online community, um,
1:08:18call it Nexus Hub, and it is I do five
1:08:24calls a week. Um, two on Monday, one on
1:08:27Wednesday, two on Friday. It's all
1:08:29central time. Sorry, that's the only
1:08:30real time zone that I acknowledge. Um,
1:08:34but no, we do a morning and afternoon
1:08:36one. Um, so immediately after highle
1:08:39town halls, which you'll usually see me
1:08:41on anyways, um, we start a morning
1:08:43session and then we have a afternoon
1:08:46session as well. And it's really open
1:08:48Q&A. So, and I've got a ton of training
1:08:50material. I've got all the highle same
1:08:52thing we give our clients, I give
1:08:53everybody in there. So, if you're just
1:08:55starting out high level trying to figure
1:08:56out how to set up a calendar, there's a
1:08:59course in there that you can learn how
1:09:01to do that. And then we've got a bunch
1:09:04of stuff on our uh Nexus Hub uh
1:09:06community that for tips and tricks,
1:09:08hacks, third party partners that you can
1:09:11trust, things like that. But yeah,
1:09:13that's that's the best way to get a hold
1:09:14of me is just in that community.
1:09:17>> Love it. That is a steal, guys. It's
1:09:19under It's like what, 50 bucks a month,
1:09:21Charles?
1:09:22>> 49 bucks a month. That's a just just
1:09:25enough to cover my time that I spend it
1:09:27like I this was not like I want to
1:09:30another way to make more money. It was
1:09:32like okay I'm spending way too much time
1:09:34on one-on-one calls with it.
1:09:35>> Charles Higgins. Ladies and gentlemen,
1:09:37thanks so much for coming on, man. This
1:09:38has been so good. Um, the link for the
1:09:41community will be down below and you
1:09:44guys should 100% join that because this
1:09:47guy lives and breathes high level and he
1:09:50can definitely help you with anything
1:09:52you're struggling with. Thanks so much,
1:09:54Charles, for coming

About this transcript

This page contains the full transcript of He Built a Website That Sells His GHL SaaS on Autopilot (No Sales Team, No Ads) by ItsKeaton, generated from the public captions YouTube serves with the video. The transcript has 12,571 words across 1,804 segments, with the original timestamps preserved so you can click any line to jump to that moment in the embedded player.

What you can do with it

Use the transcript to take notes, quote the speaker, build a study guide, generate a summary with ChatGPT or Claude via the YouTube Summary tool, or export it as a timed subtitle file with YouTube to SRT. You can also re-open it in the transcriber to translate the transcript into 100+ languages.

Free YouTube transcript tool

YouTube2Text is a free YouTube transcript generator — no signup, no daily limit. Paste any YouTube link and get the full transcript instantly, with timestamps, click-to-jump, translation to 100+ languages, AI prompts for ChatGPT, Claude, and Gemini, and exports to TXT, SRT, VTT, or Markdown.