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Harry Styles - Zane Lowe & Apple Music ‘Kiss All the Time. Disco, Occasionally’ Interview — Transcript

by Harry Styles · 9,680 words · 1,466 segments · language en · Watch on YouTube

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0:00All
0:10right, I'm live. This is great. Okay,
0:16>> thank you.
0:18>> Great.
0:19>> I'll be out here in 2 minutes.
0:20>> Oh, good. Appreciate it.
0:22>> Yeah.
0:22>> Can I give this to you, please? I don't
0:24want my device on me,
0:26>> but of course.
0:29Thank you.
0:32>> Thank you. I feel like I'm starting
0:33these kind of conversations quoting
0:35Brian Eno more than ever.
0:36>> Okay.
0:37>> I'm not mad at it.
0:38>> Yeah. He's like Yoda.
0:39>> And um one of the most important things
0:41he's he said that sticks with me is like
0:44it's it's a human right to have taste
0:45and to exercise that taste and and
0:47asking yourself what do I like
0:49>> is kind of like the first step to
0:52achieving that ultimate sort of goal of
0:54expression. Like what do I like? And I
0:56and I know you've always gone for that
0:57and and and stayed true to that, but I
1:00feel like this album really is an
1:01exercise in sort of what do I like on
1:04this record?
1:05>> I think the the biggest kind of change
1:07on this album for me is like that I
1:11think I noticed
1:13was I saw uh I think it was Fort who
1:17like did an interview and he was talking
1:19about listening to something and being
1:23like this is brilliant. and
1:27going, "How do I make something that
1:29sounds like that?"
1:30>> And kind of shifting that desire
1:35to like replicate in some way and going,
1:38"This is brilliant. How do I make
1:39something brilliant?" [snorts] And I
1:42like saw him say that at like a kind of
1:45right at the start of us making the
1:47album. And it felt like a really pivotal
1:51thing for me. I think
1:54living with songs that you love so much
1:57that you know there's that feeling when
2:02you hear something for the first time
2:03and you think like this song's going to
2:06be in my life forever.
2:09I think making music in in some degree
2:12to me is like chasing that feeling with
2:14a song that you're writing. I think it's
2:17a pretty impossible task because you're
2:21always going to know how it happened and
2:25it doesn't always just come out, you
2:27know, like it's the first time you're
2:28saying it.
2:30But sometimes they kind of feel like
2:32they do. And I think that is the closest
2:34thing to like really being like more of
2:39a vessel for something than really like,
2:41oh, I decided exactly how this song was
2:45going to sound. It kind of feels like,
2:46oh, it happened to me.
2:48>> It feels like that. It feels like
2:49there's a real letting go
2:51>> happening on this record. And
2:53>> it's it's interesting though because
2:55that's a precious time to be able to
2:57make music and to find that space and
2:58then you come back to this
3:00>> and we're in Paris and
3:02>> my friends, the crew are here.
3:04>> Yeah.
3:04>> And um thanks for coming.
3:05>> We're back together again doing this,
3:06which I always really love and look
3:08forward to.
3:09>> Um and you've been rehearsing and
3:11>> getting new songs ready.
3:12>> Yeah.
3:13>> How does that feel different? And how
3:14does all this feel different this time?
3:16>> It feels It suits me cuz back to taste.
3:20I love quissants like so much. It's my
3:23favorite.
3:24>> Where do you put them?
3:26>> Cuz they show up on me really fast.
3:27[laughter]
3:28>> My tummy.
3:28>> Okay. Well,
3:29>> um, so it's been really nice. I think
3:33being here, I think the end of the last
3:36tour felt like such a
3:38the end of a chapter
3:40>> to me.
3:41It was just like a time for me to look
3:44at the way
3:48uh that I'd done everything. I think
3:50like I tooured that way. I'd always told
3:53that way of just it's like as much as
3:56possible. And I think it was just kind
3:58of the only way that I'd ever done it.
4:00And I thought that's kind of what it
4:02would always be.
4:04And I think this time I was turning 30
4:07and I wanted to like take a break and
4:12kind of like assess. I think I didn't
4:14want to just roll straight into
4:18another process of
4:21um of making something. And I thought it
4:24was time to just honestly like make sure
4:28I still loved it in a lot of ways. And
4:33it's funny because I was obviously
4:35really lucky to be able to like stop for
4:38a second and and kind of do that. Um,
4:45but I think it I think it's a good thing
4:47to
4:49have moments where you've done something
4:51for a long time. Um, to kind of stop and
4:56like check in with yourself about do I
4:59do I do this because like this is what
5:01I've been doing for a long time or do I
5:03do this because I really love it?
5:05[snorts] And
5:07I don't think that's about being like
5:10ungrateful because it's so obviously
5:13amazing.
5:14>> It's almost the opposite.
5:15>> Yeah. I think it's actually that I know
5:18like I know how special it is.
5:20>> Yeah. You don't find it in for us.
5:22>> Yeah. I think I've always like had the
5:25conversation with myself about if I ever
5:28checked in with myself and was like I I
5:31don't love it.
5:34um it's not fun anymore.
5:38Then I I kind of just like made a
5:40promise to myself that I wouldn't do it.
5:42I don't think it's fair in a lot of
5:44ways. I don't I don't think it's fair to
5:47me. I really don't think it's fair to
5:50the fans
5:51>> for me to like not really be there
5:54anymore,
5:56>> but doing it because it's just what I've
5:59always done. And I think what is has
6:02been interesting is kind of allowing
6:04myself to even have that thought
6:06process. I think for a long time even
6:10even having that conversation with
6:12myself I thought like oh you're so
6:14ungrateful like how can you ever think
6:18about you know deciding not to do it and
6:22and stuff like that. Do you think a part
6:24of that thought process that that that
6:27you had stems from your introduction to
6:30this whole thing which is like let's
6:32look at it through the lens of of what
6:34those opportunities are for kids.
6:36>> Yeah.
6:36>> You're lucky to even be up here on the
6:38stage auditioning for us. You're lucky
6:40that you got selected. You're lucky.
6:42It's all you're lucky. You're lucky.
6:43You're lucky. You're lucky. Right. And I
6:45can imagine that, you know, at a really
6:47important time in your life, coming out
6:48of your teenage years where your
6:50identity is about to shift into a pretty
6:51significant cycle,
6:53>> that you're kind of attached to
6:55gratitude in a pretty a pretty big way.
6:57Yeah. I think what's actually really
6:58interesting with that is there's a
7:00point, I think, where it shifts. So I
7:02think you're really lucky until you
7:04haven't done anything and then a lot of
7:06people start telling you that you
7:08deserve it all the time. And that I
7:11think is actually
7:13the more dangerous part because then it
7:16becomes about deserve. And then when
7:19you're
7:20doing something great, you feel like you
7:22deserve it.
7:23>> And when you're not feeling great or you
7:26don't do something perfectly, you feel
7:28like I don't deserve this. And actually,
7:30I think staying in a place of like when
7:34you have that kind of self-doubt
7:36instead of going, you don't deserve
7:39this, you shouldn't be here.
7:42If you can stay going, I'm so lucky to
7:45be here. I'm so grateful that like this
7:47is my life.
7:49>> That's like such a gift. When you won
7:53the album of the year, it was
7:54interesting cuz I was so happy and so so
7:55many of us were so happy for him. We
7:57love that album. I did see you later on
7:59that night struggling a little bit with
8:00that feeling of imposter syndrome like
8:02holy
8:03>> you know and it's it's so interesting
8:05that you know you could be at such a
8:06point of success and still to your point
8:08it's fine to ask yourself you know do I
8:10deserve this based on my willingness to
8:12do it for the right reasons but equally
8:14like
8:15>> I just felt like you were you were in
8:16this interesting transition point from
8:18what it was to what it was becoming for
8:20you at that moment that was quite a
8:21turning point
8:23>> it was a really interesting experiment I
8:26think for me to like be in that
8:28conversation
8:29>> cuz it was it was very I think also
8:33you're like in this bubble of Grammys
8:36and stuff so you're like rehearsing and
8:38all the and everything in your life is
8:40kind of leading up to that moment and I
8:42wrote myself a letter the night before
8:45[snorts]
8:46um that I said like I would open the day
8:49afterwards
8:51kind of I wanted to like
8:54I don't know catch myself with whatever
8:57happened if I was like disappointed or
9:00if I was feeling myself a little too
9:02much.
9:03>> So, um I basically said I'm
9:07paraphrasing, but it basically said
9:08something like whatever
9:11everyone just told you is not true.
9:13Remember why you made it.
9:15>> Like that is the reward.
9:19>> And I remember like opening it and being
9:22like
9:24I was so smart two days ago.
9:26to do this,
9:28>> you know. And
9:29>> I think
9:31>> the best thing that happened to me also,
9:34I was kind of I was in LA like a couple
9:36days after.
9:37>> Yeah.
9:38>> I was feeling like, you know, everyone
9:39makes you feel like you're kind of top
9:41of the mountain and I got on my flight
9:44back to London and um the stewardist
9:48came up and she was like, "Oh, congrats
9:49on your Emmy."
9:51And I saw your grandma gave it to you.
9:53That must have been nice. [laughter]
9:55And I was like, "Oh yeah, I was like
9:59outside of the bubble."
10:02>> Amazing.
10:02>> It's not a thing, you know,
10:05>> like that.
10:06>> And um
10:06>> she was the human equivalent of that
10:08letter.
10:08>> Yes.
10:09>> Right. And
10:10>> I had a friend I used to do, he was
10:12doing a play and he used to get really
10:14nervous and um an actor that he was
10:17working with took him up to the roof
10:20>> before the first night and he he said
10:22like look out over the all of these
10:24roofs and he's like out there is
10:28millions of people who couldn't care
10:31less that you're about to do a play.
10:33>> Brilliant.
10:34>> And he was like yeah it's not
10:36>> Yeah. You know, there's something in
10:39being able to zoom out in those moments
10:41that I think is
10:44a really important tool. Getting back to
10:48that fuel that drives everybody at some
10:49point in their life if they want to
10:51express themselves in front of others
10:52and share their thoughts and feelings,
10:54which is the idea of proving something.
10:56>> Yeah.
10:56>> Either to yourself or someone. I don't
10:58hear that on this record. We're about to
11:00get into the into the buildup and the
11:02journey to making this record. But to do
11:04that, I think we've got to honor the
11:06moment when you decided to stop.
11:09>> Yeah.
11:09>> Proving yourself in that way.
11:11>> When was that? When did you realize that
11:13like that the same things were
11:14motivating you for a long time had
11:16perhaps run that course?
11:18>> Everything was like bigger and more and
11:21that was always kind of the
11:24what felt like meant it was great, you
11:27know?
11:29And I think there was a point where
11:33um
11:34I kind of felt like when I was touring
11:37for example,
11:39like when I was doing therapy during the
11:42tour, for example, it felt like I was
11:44really like ticking a box. I just felt
11:46like, okay, I'm doing therapy. I'm doing
11:48this thing. I'm doing these things.
11:49They're all like healthy things.
11:52And I had a conversation with my
11:54therapist where I was like, I feel like
11:55I'm not like doing like any work on
11:58myself. I feel like I'm kind of
12:02like telling you what's happening,
12:05asking why everyone else is doing
12:08everything wrong, you know? And I think
12:11for me it was like there was this moment
12:13where I kind of felt like having a
12:15moment of like being freed from the idea
12:19that anything that makes you not like
12:22this perfect package makes you horrible,
12:26which I think a lot of people struggle
12:28with. And it's not like feeling free to
12:31make music on this album has made me not
12:34care what people think about it. It
12:36hasn't made me not
12:39sensitive. Hasn't made me like actually
12:43not care.
12:44>> I think that just isn't who I am. I
12:46think if you're sensitive enough to be
12:49an artist, you're sensitive enough to
12:50like have your ego hurt, people don't
12:53like what you're making. And I think I
12:56think being able to like look at myself
12:58and actually just grow up a little bit
13:01and like take responsibility for
13:05places in my life where,
13:08you know, like
13:09it was maybe my fault what happened. And
13:12I think that used to feel like such a
13:16scary place to like delve into. It felt
13:19like, oh, I can't possibly look inside
13:22that the possibility that it's like my
13:25responsibility. It felt like too big of
13:27a mess.
13:29>> And I think being able to do that just
13:31freed me from so much. I think when you
13:35live in a way that is like a lot of
13:38denying some of that stuff, then you're
13:41just living in like the shadows. And I
13:43think being able to come out of that and
13:45be like, "Yeah, I'm not a perfect
13:47person. And I'm not a perfect version
13:51that I think you can struggle with when
13:54when there's this kind of image being
13:56like reflected back at you all the time.
13:59and and like for a while I too I think
14:01when when you're an artist who's trying
14:04to make something you're trying to
14:06obviously make something like it's the
14:09first time you're doing it in a lot of
14:11ways that I think it can be easy for me
14:14to forget like I was 16 when we started
14:17which now is feels like quite a long
14:19time ago
14:20>> and being able to just acknowledge I
14:24think when I've been at fault for things
14:26has freed need also my writing in such a
14:31way because it's just a whole different
14:34thing to like explore in terms of the
14:36conversation you're having with
14:38yourself. Like I look at the past albums
14:40now where I was kind of like, "Oh, this
14:43line is like super vulnerable." And I'm
14:45like, "Is it?"
14:47>> [laughter]
14:47>> you know, so so to me it's like,
14:52you know, even with it's why I think
14:54like Aperture felt like a perfect start
14:56to me cuz it was about Aperture was so
14:59about like the moment
15:03of realizing like no, I was in the wrong
15:06for something and like you can you can
15:10move forward when you acknowledge the
15:13things that you don't know and therefore
15:15give yourself the space to like let Like
15:17I mean that is what that song is about
15:20you know and going to a club and having
15:22a big
15:23>> correct
15:23>> and
15:26yeah
15:26>> were you out the night before you made
15:28that?
15:28>> I was.
15:29>> Did you get any sleep between coming
15:31back and making that?
15:32>> We didn't sleep that much. We Yeah, that
15:34was kind of
15:35>> Berlin.
15:36>> It was Berlin.
15:37>> Bird time.
15:38>> It was towards the end of
15:40>> the sessions.
15:42Tom like making the track and like it
15:45being that energywise was because I
15:48think I was
15:50had been out the night before was in the
15:52other room writing sad songs and feeling
15:56down and he was like I have to get the
15:58energy up or we're toasted.
16:00>> So then I came back in the room and he
16:02had
16:03>> the modular stuff going
16:05>> and then we were kind of just spent a
16:08bit. So, it just came from this like,
16:11okay, I'm too like tired to pretend I
16:15want to write about this thing. I don't
16:18want to make up a story. I don't want to
16:20write this thing. I don't want to make
16:22it like super this. Just kind of like
16:26this is how in my feelings I am. And I
16:30think it ended up being like kind of the
16:32freest song on the record. It's long and
16:36playful. When we had that song, I think
16:39it was like the last thing that I felt
16:42like hadn't quite said yet.
16:46So, I think when we got that one, it was
16:47like, "Oh, I think the record's like
16:50pretty close."
16:51>> So, if Aperture is the song that closes
16:54to some degree, this kind of initial
16:57this this latest phase of learning, what
16:59what what begins it? Is it is it Are you
17:01listening yet? Is that the first
17:02>> The oldest song on the record is Are You
17:04Listening Yet? Yeah, because that sounds
17:06like the musings of a madman on tour
17:08trying to figure out what the is
17:09going on. Like my therapist is over here
17:12well fed.
17:13>> She's well my favorite line.
17:15>> It's so good. It's so good. Oh, Harry's
17:17having a breakthrough.
17:18>> Yeah,
17:19>> we're good. Let's renovate. [laughter]
17:22>> He's on tour again. I'm moving.
17:25[laughter]
17:26>> Um,
17:27>> you know, and I mean, but it is it's
17:28like it's like the stream of
17:29consciousness going on there to come to
17:31that realization of are you listening
17:32yet? that sense of like like that's the
17:34ultimate self-reflection. Like that's
17:35the beginning. Yet is the key word in
17:37that song.
17:38>> Yeah, that was kind of at a time I was
17:40doing shows in New York. I was really
17:44like so in it and felt kind of thrashy.
17:48That song felt like a reaction to that.
17:51And I think I like the
17:55you know the the end refrain of are you
17:57listening it over and over again? It's
17:58like by the time you are listening it's
18:01finished in terms of like similar tone I
18:05mean totally different song but paint by
18:08numbers was kind of originally
18:10>> track one
18:12>> I think where where the record started
18:16it was like
18:18>> okay what do I I think I was just
18:21married to the idea of coming off the
18:24last record and coming back and the
18:26first thing I say being oh what a gift
18:27it is to be But it's nothing to do with
18:29me. I just loved that.
18:31>> I love that song and it sits beautifully
18:33in the context of the record because it
18:34doesn't open it in my opinion.
18:36>> Yeah.
18:36>> But it could easily have not it could
18:38easily been just something for you to
18:40figure something out to move on past.
18:42>> Yeah.
18:42>> So why did you honor it as a song that
18:45really stands alone in the context of
18:46the record?
18:47>> Yeah.
18:48>> I think it felt like a pillar of
18:52something.
18:53I think for me like some of my favorite
18:56moments of like artists that I love is
18:59when I feel like I'm listening to them
19:01discover themsel.
19:04So I think in terms of like being
19:07vulnerable and what it means to
19:12be an artist in that way, I think it's
19:14like
19:16those are the bits where choosing the
19:19song that kind of is like meant just for
19:21me to work through something. I think it
19:23becomes something important when you
19:26choose to like let people look at that
19:28because I think writing it and keeping
19:30it on my hard drive is I don't know what
19:32feels like brave about that in any way.
19:36I think the thing that makes someone
19:38like an artist is like letting them
19:40watch you be an ordinary person. It's
19:43not about being I am this
19:46mystic thing. I think the difference is
19:51we're all ordinary people and there's
19:54some people who let other people watch
19:57you be an ordinary person. And I think
19:59that is kind of the key in a lot of ways
20:03for me anyway.
20:04>> I love the idea to break that spell of
20:06what extraordinary is to other people
20:08>> in the in an attempt to try to create
20:10something that's beautifully ordinary
20:11for yourself.
20:13I just thought of Liam when you said
20:14that, you know. I thought of some and
20:16not just Liam, but people who struggle
20:17to get out of extraordinary situations.
20:20Yeah.
20:23Yeah. It's um
20:27it's really like you know
20:32I mean full transparency it's like
20:34something that I even the idea of
20:38talking about it feel like I struggle
20:41with that a little bit even I think
20:45>> I think there was a a period when he
20:48passed away where I really struggled
20:52with
20:54kind of like
20:56acknowledging
20:59how strange it is
21:02to
21:04have people kind of like own part of
21:07your grief in a way.
21:10I have such strong feelings
21:14around my friend passing away
21:18and then suddenly being ma you know like
21:20aware of
21:22there's maybe like a desire from other
21:24people of you to
21:27um
21:29to convey that in some way or it means
21:32you're not feeling what you're feeling
21:33or something you know and like it's so
21:37difficult to lose a friend It's
21:40difficult to lose any friend, but it's
21:41so difficult to lose a friend who is
21:44like
21:46so like you in so many ways.
21:50It's like I saw
21:53someone
21:55with like the kindest heart
21:58who just wanted
22:01to
22:03be great. It was a really important
22:07moment for me in terms of taking a look
22:09at my life and being able to say to
22:12myself like, okay, like what do I want
22:15to do with my life? Like how do I want
22:17to live my life? And I think the
22:21greatest way you can honor your friends
22:23who pass away is by living your life to
22:25the fullest.
22:29like super special person and
22:33really sad
22:34>> like Yeah.
22:38>> Um when you went to uh Italy, it wasn't
22:42a surprise to me cuz we'd spoken about
22:44it.
22:45>> Mhm. And you've been driven there on
22:47your own during co and I could tell when
22:48we spoke about that in Palm Springs,
22:50your eyes lit up and I was like, "Oh,
22:51what is it about Rome? What was it about
22:53that place that drew you back?" It just
22:55was a place that for me I was able to
23:00slow down for the first time sitting
23:03down to have a coffee. It doesn't mean I
23:05was sitting down to have a coffee all
23:06day. I was doing other things also.
23:08>> Yeah.
23:09>> To me it was it wasn't about the coffee.
23:11It wasn't about the thing. It was about
23:14the appreciation that is in the way of
23:18life there of like how special they
23:22treat food, how special they treat their
23:25relationships with each other, how
23:27special they treat time that is spent
23:29together.
23:30>> So ultimately, I think it comes back to
23:34appreciating
23:35the love around you and like the time
23:38you have. It was for me just the right
23:42time to like
23:44>> I think I knew that if I keep just going
23:48and I stop this tour and I just make
23:50another record and then I go tour there
23:52that I'm going to do it like this way
23:55for the rest of my life
23:57>> without ever taking a moment to check in
23:59with myself about like am I even
24:03processing how special this is because
24:05like to be able to like you can't miss
24:08something if you don't go anywhere. You
24:10know, you have to give some space to
24:14allow for something to show up as
24:17special again. You know,
24:19>> when you start to miss it in my dream,
24:21in my head, in in the perfect scenario,
24:23you're at a show or something's
24:24happening and you're just like, I felt
24:26something again and it was somebody else
24:28doing it and I felt it as a fan and
24:29I do that.
24:31>> Can I do that? Getting back to what you
24:32said before about like, can I feel that?
24:34>> Yeah. I think dancing in Berlin
24:38and I remember and I went to see Radio
24:41Head in Berlin
24:43>> and felt like so part of the audience in
24:46a way that I felt like I had a very
24:48clear moment of like this is why I get
24:52on stage because like I'm watching this
24:55and like feeling
24:57everything that's happening around me in
24:59the crowd. There's like people picking
25:02each other's things and people like
25:03bringing each other things and it's this
25:07sense of like strangers looking at each
25:09other and like massaging each other's
25:12shoulders when someone was emotional and
25:15uh looking into the eyes of a stranger
25:17and like screaming out a chorus
25:18together. I think for me, I had a moment
25:21of like I'm there so that people can
25:26have this, you know, like I'm
25:29soundtracking
25:31this.
25:31>> But I feel like that was the old
25:33psychology. When I hear the new album, I
25:36feel like the new psychology is I kind
25:38of want to feel that here, too. There's
25:40sort of this
25:41>> this this kind of invisible barrier that
25:44exists when you go see most concerts
25:46which is like we're giving and you're
25:48receiving and then you give and we
25:49receive then we it's this kind of back
25:51and forth. When I hear this record I
25:53feel like it's dissolved that barrier a
25:55little bit. I feel like on stage for the
25:57you'll be able to almost put yourself in
26:00their experience.
26:01>> That part is like selfishly for me I
26:05think like I want to enjoy it the most.
26:08The record for me is about like how do I
26:12still have my experience while I'm
26:15playing it. And that was what making the
26:16record was about for me was like what
26:18music do I have to make for me to be on
26:21stage feeling like I'm in the middle of
26:23the dance floor and it's not like I was
26:26in the dance floor but now I've made it.
26:29I actually have to separate my life
26:31again and now it's now I'm just going to
26:33kind of deliver the sermon if you will.
26:36But it's like now I love this music too.
26:39Like I want to dance to it, you know,
26:42and I think that's that's the
26:44difference.
26:45>> And you had those experiences at the
26:46clubs as well. I mean, what was it?
26:48Let's talk about in more detail about
26:50what it was like going out. You left
26:52Rome, you've recaptured yourself and
26:54started this whole journey.
26:56>> But there's no point in leaving an
26:58isolated protected environment to go to
27:00an isolated protected environment,
27:01right? Which is what Italy could have
27:03been for 2 years, 3 years. Go to Berlin,
27:05go clubbing, go meet people, meet random
27:07people.
27:08>> Those experiences all happen. I hear it
27:10on the record. I mean, you told me I'd
27:11imagine you found yourself in some
27:12really interesting conversations with
27:14some interesting people.
27:15>> For me, it was largely about being in
27:18Italy, which I love. It's brought me so
27:20much peace and all of those things.
27:24But also, if I keep saying no to
27:26everything,
27:28>> I'm just going to be here. M
27:30>> and I think there was a version of that
27:32where I was like like if I made a record
27:35right now I could make it about touring
27:37and like this corner of my life and
27:40cooking
27:41>> and cooking. And I felt like there was a
27:46version of me always searching for this
27:49place that like brought me peace
27:52that could end up being just another
27:54place that I go and like sit on
27:56Instagram and watch other people. It's
27:58just another isolationist environment
27:59really.
28:00>> So I think it was about going what's the
28:03worst thing
28:04>> that can happen if I trust someone
28:08>> and that doesn't go well cuz you can't
28:10serve your curiosity if you don't.
28:12>> Correct.
28:13>> You're going to you're going to be just
28:14curating another experience.
28:16>> Yeah. So part of it for me was that was
28:21kind of going, okay, if I trust someone
28:24and that turns out to be a bad decision,
28:26am I going to be able to live with that?
28:28Okay, yes. Am I going to really beat
28:30myself up about it? Maybe a little bit,
28:32but also like it's life. So
28:36>> it was just allowing myself, I think, to
28:39feel not the need to be so
28:45buttoned up in a lot of ways and kind of
28:47acknowledging like, all right, I'm a
28:51person. I can like do these things. I
28:54can make mistakes and
28:56all of those things. So I think I think
28:59going out and meeting people, having
29:02really nice conversation with people,
29:04meeting people who are like super
29:06interesting
29:08that I could go dancing with. And like
29:12most of my life, a lot of my friends are
29:15like these big family units.
29:18And a lot of my friends have like two
29:20kids or three kids. And it's like, okay,
29:22well,
29:23you're not coming
29:25clubbing with me. Yeah,
29:28>> which [snorts] is fine.
29:29>> Yeah,
29:30>> priorities exist for a reason.
29:32>> Yeah.
29:32>> Like we might we might I mean we won't
29:35get in.
29:36>> I think you'd be all right.
29:37>> And those glasses, [laughter]
29:42>> but I think going out and being able to
29:45Were you nervous?
29:45>> Maybe not the cardig, [laughter]
29:53>> but me neither.
29:54>> Were you nervous though when you Come
29:56on, be honest. when you went out the
29:57first time to the door.
29:58>> Yes. Every time.
29:59>> Every time.
30:00>> Every time. Right.
30:01>> But that's why it's fun.
30:02>> Yeah.
30:03>> So, yeah. So, the families that have
30:05adopted you as you've been growing into
30:07becoming a man, which is definitely,
30:08you're right, a thing. You know, it's
30:10like, hey, I'm I'm really successful.
30:11I'm really young. And so, naturally,
30:13there's going to be this nice dynamic
30:14between people who've kind of like, oh,
30:15you're safe here. You're protected here.
30:17But they're not going to follow you into
30:19an unsafe, unprotected environment,
30:20whatever that means. Yeah.
30:23>> Not this cardigan anyway.
30:24>> So, so yeah. I love it. Anyways, so I
30:28think it was about it it was for me
30:31about like meeting some people whatever
30:35level of trust to just spend time with
30:38someone and saying yes to things.
30:41>> Do you think people were surprised when
30:42you said yes
30:42>> kind of I remember someone saying like
30:44do you want to come with us? And I was
30:46like yeah and they were like oh
30:48[laughter]
30:50okay. So I think like trusting people
30:54>> and like being rewarded for that by
30:56meeting like some great people
30:58>> and learning a lot through them. And I
31:00think like at all different levels
31:02there's so there's been such a thread in
31:04the last couple of years for me of
31:06reconnecting with someone who invited me
31:08to something that I always would have
31:10said no to.
31:11>> Yeah.
31:12>> Going to that meeting two friends there
31:16that I wouldn't have met if I hadn't
31:17gone there. That leading to all these
31:19other things. going back having these
31:21experience with this group of people
31:24learning so much
31:26from a group of people that I didn't
31:29know 6 months before. everything you
31:32imagine about like friendship and
31:35relationships and honesty and like being
31:39around friends who are really like
31:42dedicated to honesty in a way that is
31:45terrifying if you're not
31:47>> and being in friendships and watching
31:50people be in relationship to each other
31:52and people be like this is the most
31:55honest version of like who I am
31:58is that okay and being like yeah it is
32:01and and all right so why wouldn't it be
32:03okay for you to be that version of
32:05yourself
32:06>> so being in a group of new people I just
32:10learned so much in that period about
32:13what is okay for me to decide for myself
32:16I think as well that it's okay to like
32:19no I feel like I know this person enough
32:22I can make my own like judgment call
32:27and everything I learned through those
32:30interactions of like learning when it
32:32was right to say yes, learning when it
32:33was okay for me to say no
32:36>> has just led to like so many wonderful
32:39things in my life
32:41>> that it that it just has changed the way
32:45that I'm experiencing the life I'm
32:47living in such a grand way that it's
32:51>> it becomes like yes this album is such a
32:53wonderful byproduct of that because I
32:56was recording while all this was
32:58happening and I was exploring all that
33:01But I think also just being in a place
33:03in my life where I'm like, if I put this
33:06album out and everyone decided they
33:07hated it, would I be sensitive about it?
33:10Yes, I would. Would it make me doubt who
33:13I know myself to be as a person? No, I
33:16wouldn't.
33:16>> Whereas if you done it straight off the
33:18back of the last one, it might have done
33:19it.
33:20>> Yeah, I think it would. Yeah.
33:21>> Yeah.
33:21>> And I think that's the difference.
33:22>> The success was defining you.
33:24>> I I think so. Yeah.
33:26>> It all wraps up in um season 2 weight
33:28loss a little bit for me as well. the
33:30idea of like, you know, you got to sit
33:32yourself down and it comes in the middle
33:34of the record for a reason, right? It's
33:35kind of that moment when it's like,
33:37okay, I'm
33:38>> at least on this journey of
33:39self-discovery, like, all right, some
33:41some real hard now. I got to
33:42figure this out. Like, why am I
33:44holding on? I'm holding on.
33:45>> The mission statement of the record in a
33:47lot of ways. It's like, you know, when
33:49there's like a Netflix show and then it
33:51blows up and everyone comes back
33:54>> in the second season, everyone's got a
33:56nutritionist and everyone's got a
33:57trainer and everyone suddenly looks
34:00amazing.
34:01>> Yeah.
34:02>> Season 2 weight loss.
34:04So, it's like this idea of just coming
34:06back as like
34:09returning as like this is the same
34:11character, but suddenly he has
34:14cheekbones.
34:15>> He has cheekbones.
34:16>> Yeah. And that was that was what it was
34:17for me is like I felt like I was coming
34:19back as like a stronger version of
34:22myself.
34:23>> Yeah, of course. sub three-hour
34:26marathon, mate. Thanks. By the respect
34:28and you got I mean this is something you
34:30got to really we got to acknowledge
34:31here. By the way, who's Steanos?
34:33[snorts]
34:34>> I thought about Steady Va [laughter]
34:37>> and Stewood Norton came up as well, but
34:39I went with Steandos. It felt a lot more
34:42inside baseball.
34:44The song to me was like whenever I used
34:47to have a break from touring, I would
34:49always grow up my stash and then when
34:51I'd get back on the road, I would shave
34:52it off
34:53>> and there would be some feeling of like
34:55this isn't the version of me that people
34:58expect. M right.
35:00>> So I think the idea of it was like
35:06less in a facial hair thought but more
35:10in in the idea of if I go away and grow
35:16and change my relationship with this
35:19idea of like feeling like I have to show
35:22up as this version of myself.
35:25Will you take me as that or are you
35:29taking me because I show up as this
35:31version of myself
35:32>> that you've kind of desired from me in
35:36some way? So that's the like you know do
35:39you love me now? Do you will I let you
35:41down?
35:43>> Hold the hope will come.
35:44>> Yeah. I think it's from this
35:46conversation now it's it's clear how
35:47important that song is based on that.
35:49you know this idea of um who am I to you
35:51and does it serve me as much as it
35:53serves
35:54>> you
35:55>> and therefore what responsibility do I
35:57have to play that role
35:58>> in your life?
36:00>> Yeah.
36:00>> Um who's Carla? Why is it her song?
36:05>> Why is it her song? Um, Carla
36:10I will include in that group of
36:14friends that if I hadn't said yes to
36:17this thing, I wouldn't have met this
36:19person. If I hadn't met them, I wouldn't
36:20have met this person. If I hadn't met
36:22them, I wouldn't met these people.
36:24>> Carla kind of just became in so many
36:27ways like the most important part of the
36:29record to me. It's a song that answered
36:32so many questions. all of that like
36:35questioning of why and who do I want to
36:40be and what am I giving by doing this
36:43and making sure that I love this enough
36:46and being at a show and going like oh
36:48this is why I do all of those things I
36:51think having a moment of reminding you
36:54of like there was a time when you heard
36:57a song for the first time that made you
37:00want to like touch music in some way.
37:04And Carla is a friend of mine in this
37:08group of friends
37:10who we were at a a friend's house and we
37:14were waiting to go to this afterparty
37:17and she kind of mentioned in the room
37:19that she had just discovered Paul Simon.
37:22She was like, "I was feeling kind of
37:23down, so I was listening to," she was
37:26listening to like Norah Jones and it was
37:28on like a playlist
37:30and she was obsessed with 50 Ways to
37:32Live Your Love and she was listening to
37:33it over and over again. So she was kind
37:35of asking everyone like, "Oh, have you
37:37heard Paul Simon?" We were like, "Yeah,
37:40he's amazing."
37:41>> So I was kind of like, "Oh, you've never
37:44heard Simon and go uncle?" And I grew up
37:47listening to Sam Gothogical all the
37:49time.
37:50>> When I lived in a pub a little bit when
37:53I was younger, there was like a 4 CD
37:56changer that I think Bridge Over
37:57Troubled Water Record was in
38:00>> the whole time I lived there. So I think
38:04it's like why I like harmonies is
38:07listening to them so much.
38:09>> And I was like, "Oh, I really want to
38:10play you something."
38:13So I played her Bridge Over Troubled
38:15Water and watching her like listen to it
38:20>> having never heard that song
38:23>> felt like I was just watching someone
38:25like see or something in like technical
38:29or like discover magic. There was
38:32something in that moment that reminded
38:34me of like what by making music what
38:36you're investing in. And it's it's songs
38:39that go so beyond our lifetime. change
38:42your DNA.
38:43>> Yeah. And I think it removes a lot of
38:45the pressure like from me or from them.
38:48I think it's like people will be
38:50listening to this song
38:52when those artists aren't around
38:54anymore, you know? And
38:57>> I think acknowledging that making music
39:01is just adding something to this world
39:04of things that is waiting for people to
39:06discover is the point. like that is what
39:11the joy is. And I then played a Kathy's
39:15song which is just another one of my
39:18favorite Simon Garuncle songs which is
39:19why it's called Carla song. But the
39:22ability to be able to add something like
39:25maybe someone hears a song of yours and
39:28goes this song's going to be in my life
39:30forever.
39:31>> That is kind of it. Like that is enough.
39:33And I I don't ask
39:36>> for any more than that really. And I
39:39think the the idea of I know what you
39:42like, you can hear any time and it's all
39:45right for you.
39:45>> This will be here after like when I'm
39:48not here.
39:49>> These songs will exist.
39:51>> I don't think they can play as much as
39:53Bridgewater, but the point is the same.
39:55>> If you actually whittle it down to like
39:57just the most microscopic of of
39:59intention that's so beautiful that
40:01someone gets to have that feeling
40:02>> that and also the lyric you're just a
40:05baby asleep on a candy bar. You've been
40:08a baby sleeping on a candy bar.
40:09>> Yeah, it's a good one.
40:10>> Yeah.
40:11>> You see like a baby try like ice cream
40:14for the first time and like the
40:16sweetness
40:17>> or something.
40:18>> Yeah.
40:18>> But it's always been there.
40:20>> Yeah.
40:20>> It's always been around. It's always
40:22existed and it always will exist. Hasn't
40:24been in your life and the baby eats the
40:27ice cream for the first time. Their eyes
40:29just light up.
40:30>> Game over.
40:31>> Yeah.
40:31>> You're pretty hard on second verses.
40:33Dance No More.
40:34>> Yep.
40:35>> It's not even a second verse in there.
40:36There is not.
40:37>> This is straight into the chorus again.
40:38>> There is a Single reference though in
40:40that one.
40:40>> Keep your customer satisfied.
40:42>> Oh
40:42>> Yeah.
40:43sneaking in. It's great.
40:46>> It does have one of the most beautifully
40:47constructed lyrical references to what
40:50it is to be on a dance floor listening
40:52to music. And there's no difference
40:53between the tears and the sweat. I
40:55remember the, you know, like going out
40:59kind of the first time in Berlin and
41:01like standing in the middle of the dance
41:02floor and feeling so
41:05>> unbelievably free
41:07>> and like safe
41:09>> that I kind of just had my hands in the
41:13air and my eyes closed and I just felt
41:15these tears like streaming down my face
41:18and it was this moment of like I feel so
41:23alive right now.
41:25And another reference to Simon and
41:28Garuncle
41:30was I'd heard about you can call me out
41:32the bass fill and heard that it was his
41:35bass player's birthday and he was like
41:38you can have you know
41:39>> do whatever you want with it
41:40>> 16 or whatever
41:41>> that's the
41:44wow his birthday present
41:46>> so
41:46>> amazing
41:47>> um Yafa who plays keys with me I was
41:50like yes just have this section and like
41:53do whatever if you want. And that's how
41:55we got the
41:59And then right before that, we take in
42:02this piece says, "Be a good girl. Go get
42:04it."
42:05>> And at the end of that phrase, I just
42:07go, "Fox."
42:09>> Yeah.
42:09>> Which is Tom's son's name.
42:12>> Who's always been jealous that I put his
42:14mom Jenny in Canyon Moon.
42:17>> And he was like, "If I hit He was
42:19playing football. We were FaceTiming
42:20him. And he was like, "If I hit the
42:22crossbar, will you put my name in a
42:24song?" And I was like, "I'll give you
42:26three tries." [laughter] And he hit the
42:29crossbar. So [snorts] then it was like,
42:30"All right, now we've got now we've got
42:32to put Fox on a song." So like across
42:35the board with Dance No More, it's like
42:38the freest and most fun I think
42:41>> we've had in the studio, it was like
42:43anytime it was getting a bit heavy was
42:46like, "Let's listen to that." There's
42:47some really beautiful poignant moments
42:49on this album as well. Um, the waiting
42:51game is a powerful
42:54>> one.
42:55>> I love that song.
42:56>> Same. You want to tell us a story about
42:57it?
42:58>> That was the first song that I wrote
43:01once I'd kind of settled in Italy for a
43:04while. And I was like right in that zone
43:07of reflection and what we're talking
43:09about of the cycle of like behaving the
43:13same way, writing songs about it,
43:15getting rewarded for that.
43:17>> So you can romanticize your
43:19shortcomings,
43:20>> ignore your agency to stop, write a
43:23ballad with the details while skimming
43:24off the top.
43:26>> Really cynical. That's cynical.
43:28>> Yeah. And that was what we had. had that
43:31verse for a while and I was like I think
43:34I just liked being that honest with
43:37myself about what I was doing and what I
43:39was doing with music and what I was
43:41doing with
43:42>> my life and what I was doing with my
43:47relationships and what I was doing with
43:49like cycles that I'd got into. And
43:53>> you try and you always justify playing
43:55the waiting game. You try messing with
43:56your own design, playing the waiting
43:58game and it all adds up to nothing.
43:59Yeah, that's a good day therapy. That's
44:02like breakthrough day.
44:03>> Would recommend.
44:04>> We have to talk about American Girl,
44:06second song on the record, because it
44:07slides in in the most beautiful way.
44:09It's the It's the olive branch between I
44:10think where you were last time and this
44:12time to me at least sonically.
44:14>> It's sort of uncharacteristically
44:16playful for the nature of the record,
44:18which is far more searching and curious.
44:21>> Um, but that song just shows up.
44:23>> Yeah. I think the song to me is like
44:26it's actually quite a lonely song in a
44:28lot of ways. I watch like my three
44:30closest friends get married and actually
44:32seeing them like trust in something and
44:38risk something to find something like
44:42truly fulfilling
44:44in a way that isn't as like shiny and on
44:48paper as exciting as like you know
44:50watching them get married I was like I'm
44:52single so I'm having all the fun and
44:55American Girls is actually about
44:58watching them get married and like you
45:01know there just is a magic when you find
45:03the right person that you want to be
45:04with
45:06>> but I think watching them do that
45:08>> and seeing that it doesn't come without
45:11any uncertainty it doesn't come without
45:14any risk there's actually more
45:15uncertainty wrapped up in that decision
45:17than there is just moving from one
45:19experience to the next like you create
45:20your own uncertainty when you do that
45:22exactly
45:22>> in this situation when you when you
45:24really make a commitment to one another
45:26it's like tomorrow I don't know what
45:28tomorrow's going to bring. But I know we
45:29got to figure it out together and I
45:31can't just run away.
45:33>> Yeah.
45:34>> And it's like being truly vulnerable
45:36with someone like sharing a life with
45:39someone like that.
45:40>> Having the time
45:43to stop and assess like all of it and
45:46really look at my life from like a
45:48bird's eye view and go like what do I
45:51actually want in my life? Like I have
45:54all these things around me all the time.
45:57It's hard to pull those things in
46:00without making space for them. So, if I
46:02stop everything,
46:04then I get to decide what I want to
46:06bring back in. Like, what are really the
46:09things that I want in my life? If you're
46:11like touring all the time and you're
46:13doing this all the time and all these
46:14things, there's no space to
46:18really choose. I think I had a real
46:21honest conversation with myself about
46:23okay in five years what do I want my
46:25life to look like
46:27and then how do I make changes to like
46:31aim at that I don't want to be the guy
46:34who's like on his own but was like oh I
46:36really did it you know I want to be
46:41fulfilled and I want to be in great
46:43relationships with people I want to have
46:44great friendship friendships with people
46:46I want a family I want these things. Um,
46:51it just allowed me to go like,
46:54okay, what do I have to do to create
46:58space to like allow these things to
47:00happen? I can't just expect them to just
47:02happen to me, you know?
47:04>> Yeah. No, you're right on time. I mean,
47:07to have that kind of relationship that
47:08leads to having a family, to creating
47:10something that is substantial and
47:12shared,
47:12>> Yeah.
47:13>> you got to try to get ahead of of your
47:15as much as possible.
47:16>> Yeah. You never fully do.
47:18>> Mhm.
47:18>> But it really gets amplified when
47:20someone else is right next to you all
47:21the time.
47:22>> Yeah. [laughter]
47:23>> Yeah. And also the right person, that's
47:27part of why you choose that person is
47:30cuz they hold you accountable to the
47:33person that they know you want to be.
47:35Like I think accepting flaws and stuff
47:38is like yes, having understanding
47:42is like wonderful, but you know that I
47:44want to be better than that. So when you
47:47challenge me on something
47:49>> Yeah.
47:51>> It's a gift to me actually.
47:55>> You know,
47:56>> is coming up roes a love song? Like I
47:58think it's a love song, but it's also
47:59again holds that accountability
48:02>> Yeah.
48:02>> front and center in that song.
48:04>> It actually ends in a really vulnerable
48:06way. It's like I'm not quite sure I fit
48:08into your life here and
48:09>> whether that's my doing or your doing.
48:12>> Yeah. I think I mean it's one of my
48:15favorite things I've ever done. The kind
48:17of writing of it was really something
48:20that just happened. Like that was one of
48:22those that felt like it just fell out,
48:24you know, and then
48:26>> you're like reading the lyrics back and
48:28I'm like learning something as I'm doing
48:31it. I'm like, "Oh, magic.
48:33>> I I'm discovering this thing, you know?"
48:37And I actually I I wrote in December and
48:41I it started because I was trying to
48:43write a Christmas song.
48:45So that lasted two lines, but it was
48:47tell me your fears. I've turned back the
48:49clocks. It's that time of year.
48:50>> Oh, it is a Christmas song.
48:52>> Why were you trying to write a Christmas
48:54song?
48:55>> I think I was just trying to do
48:56something different. Maybe taste. Maybe
48:58it's about taste.
48:59>> I think it's just about wanting to have
49:01that Christmas song.
49:02>> Oh, you think?
49:05cuz everyone has everyone has a crack at
49:07it, right? But how many really join the
49:09pantheon of the great?
49:11>> There's a couple who get away with
49:12joining the pantheon.
49:14>> I think you've got one in you.
49:16>> Not if I give up after two lines.
49:18>> That's true. [laughter]
49:20You got a great song out of it.
49:21>> Yeah. I think I started it and then it
49:24kind of just wrote itself and I was
49:25like, "Oh, this has nothing to do with
49:27Christmas." For me, it is a love song
49:30about
49:32how
49:34like special something can be and not
49:36everything has to last forever in order
49:39for it to be special. I think
49:43some of the greatest
49:45relationships in your life that teach
49:47you something
49:50don't last forever, you know? And I
49:52think that just is kind of the
49:54definition that we have of like success
49:57of of a relationship is like longevity
49:59and lasting for eternity.
50:01>> And I think there's like it just negates
50:04all of the beauty and
50:07so much positivity that can come from a
50:11relationship that where you learn
50:14something about yourself.
50:16And
50:18>> I think that's a gift that someone else
50:21gives you even when it's difficult. And
50:24I think it's a real like it's something
50:26that I'm like really grateful for cuz I
50:29kind of had to learn a lot about myself
50:32at that point.
50:33>> Are you the kind of person that really
50:36Yeah. needs things to end well?
50:39>> Yeah. And I think it's it goes back to
50:42like caring, you know, like being
50:45sensitive
50:47and caring what someone thinks. If you
50:49upset someone,
50:51>> whether
50:53because you have a difference of opinion
50:55or whatever it is, if you upset someone
50:56knowing there's someone out there that
50:58like hates you, it's horrible feeling.
51:01Like anytime a relationship ends, it's
51:04not like a wonderful thing, you know,
51:07but I think what can come from those
51:09relationships can be like really
51:10wonderful.
51:12>> I want to um finish talking about what
51:14comes next.
51:16>> Yes.
51:17>> Starting with this forthcoming tour.
51:19>> Yeah. And I mean, [clears throat] you've
51:21done a runs before, so I guess you got a
51:24taste of what it was like to be in a
51:25city for a period of time,
51:27>> had this, you know, had that kind of
51:28residency feel, but this is a different
51:30kind of thing. Now, you're not alone.
51:31Radio Head just did it. Other people are
51:32starting to do it. Adele did it. She did
51:33it in Germany. Um, this idea of settling
51:36in one place and giving people from
51:38surrounding areas a chance to come see
51:39you as opposed to going and doing 25
51:41shows in 25 cities. Yeah.
51:42>> You tell us what the thinking behind
51:44doing it this way is, at least in the
51:46first round touring. I mean, I think a
51:48lot of the thinking behind it for me is
51:50about I think it makes the show better.
51:53I think you can build something that
51:56doesn't have to travel every night. I
51:59think the show itself is better.
52:01>> I think there's something in this that
52:03allows me to like stay in my life while
52:07I'm doing it and therefore I think
52:11allows me to take care of myself better,
52:13which I think makes me better at doing
52:15the thing. It's not like I'm saying I'll
52:18never travel again, but I want to see
52:19what it looks like if you do it a
52:21different way.
52:23>> And you know, people in my band have
52:25like families now and kids and some
52:28aspect of that, too. It's really
52:31important to me that they're on the road
52:34that I would love to like have them and
52:37I don't want to make it like near
52:39impossible for them to be able to do
52:41that with me. It feels like you're
52:43honoring what you learned about how to
52:45balance life and work
52:47>> and you're giving others the chance to
52:49honor that
52:51>> as well. I think there's a version of
52:53that that happened to where I took 2
52:55years off.
52:56>> I slept a bit. I traveled a bit. I went
52:58out.
52:59>> I came back as the exact same person and
53:02did the exact same thing. And that to me
53:04is the only thing that terrified me.
53:06>> Yeah. The upshot of all of this, the end
53:08result of of all of this period of your
53:10life is that you you came back because
53:12you want to do this and it's not
53:13expected. It's something you genuinely
53:15love.
53:16>> Yeah.
53:16>> And I guess in a way that opens up the
53:19realm of possibility more than ever
53:21before in terms of what comes next and
53:24where you go, right? And then
53:26>> it's yours. I think the best thing about
53:32putting this album out right now is that
53:35I kind of
53:37promised myself I wouldn't put it out
53:41until I really wanted to. I think that
53:44felt really important to me. I think the
53:47the key thing was like while I was away
53:49from it all, I missed it. Like people
53:52asked me if I missed it. I missed it
53:54because I love it and I still love it.
53:56And I think at the end of the tour, I
53:58came away from it loving it more than I
54:01ever had.
54:02>> I don't miss it in the way where I'm
54:04like, I have to go do that right now.
54:07Like, I'm missing a part of me if I
54:09don't do it.
54:10>> And I think that's been really important
54:14for me to acknowledge. I think I was
54:17kind of getting ready to put it out.
54:19Felt like
54:21this music's ready. It feels like it's
54:25meant to be played. and now I feel like
54:27I'm ready to play it. I want to share it
54:29with people. That felt like the reason
54:31for me to put it out more than, well,
54:35the album's finished. I was happy to sit
54:37on it if I if I was kind of like, I'm
54:40not ready yet, you know?
54:42>> How long did you sit on it for?
54:44>> I mean, we finished it like August. I
54:47think getting to a place of like living
54:49with the music and being like I just
54:51want to play it and that's what it's
54:53about and that's why now that's been a
54:56really fresh and like beautiful
54:59experience for me to be like I'm just
55:01excited to like share the songs with
55:03people and play it to people and I think
55:05that's a really beautiful framework for
55:08the future for me of like I have to feel
55:11like this about putting music out for me
55:14to put it out. I think this feels like
55:16the most organic version for me of
55:18showing up and being like, "Yeah, I feel
55:22I feel good. I feel like ready to play
55:24this for you, you know,
55:27instead of like someone came and got me
55:29and was like, it's dinner time, you
55:31know?

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