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Fortune 500 Advisor: Knowledge No Longer Makes a Leader — Transcript

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0:00that our value is no longer around how
0:01much we know, because you can have a PhD
0:04in physics and I can go to AI and I can
0:06get the same data in 5 seconds that you
0:09spent 5 years to get. That's no longer a
0:10human differentiator in leadership
0:12knowledge. Now the differentiator is
0:15everything is around the speed of
0:17change. What I found to be true after
0:20research and I interviewed over 1,200
0:22executives across Fortune 500 companies
0:25and leaders, everyone said people are
0:27not equipped.
0:31>> [music]
0:36[music]
0:41[music]
0:42>> Hello my dear friends. This is Kristina
0:44Mand Liyani co-founder of Mindvalley,
0:46host of Mindvalley Book Club. Today we
0:48are talking on the topic that I don't
0:50often get to talk about, mostly because
0:53it is a very loud space and there are a
0:56lot of books on this topic. So for us to
0:59have picked that book is an extra
1:00special event. My guest today is Melissa
1:03Dawn Simpkins. Welcome Melissa.
1:06>> Thank you Kristina. I feel very honored
1:08to be here. Thank you. [laughter]
1:10>> Thank you. The book today is called
1:12Athleteship. Melissa is the CEO of
1:14Velvet Suite, the founder of Athleteship
1:17Movement, the obviously the author of
1:19the book Athleteship. She has more than
1:22two decades of experience working with
1:24the leaders and the CEOs and the
1:26executives of the Fortune 500 companies
1:29of professional athletes and rather
1:32outstanding people. But I understand
1:33Melissa that your background is mostly
1:35in understanding how the athletes and
1:38the sports people who undergo huge
1:40pressure, how do they function? How do
1:42they actually thrive in that
1:44environment? You promised your book with
1:46the idea that the way the leaders were
1:48produced previously doesn't catch up
1:51with the contemporary environment. So
1:54what's what's different about being a
1:56leader now? And I'm not saying compared
1:57to thousands or even and of ago, but
1:59what is the big difference which makes
2:01it so challenging and so different
2:03compared to our predecessors?
2:06>> Yes, great question and it is really the
2:09premise of athleticism. I believe we're
2:12in a different era. Every era has its
2:14own unique kind of thumbnail print and
2:17in this era it is with AI around speed.
2:21Everything is around the speed of change
2:25and what I found to be true after
2:27research and I interviewed over 1200
2:29executives across Fortune 500 companies
2:32and leaders in different shapes and
2:34sizes and everyone said people are not
2:37equipped to lead at this speed.
2:41We have had an orientation in leadership
2:43around knowledge, which is why we go to
2:45school, we get certifications, we get
2:47capabilities, we learn and learning is
2:49great when the plans don't shift. But
2:52when there's uncertainty and there's
2:54change,
2:55it makes it very difficult to access
2:58that knowledge under pressure. And so
3:01that is the era that we're in now is our
3:04value is no longer around how much we
3:06know because you can have a PhD in
3:08physics and I can go to AI and I can get
3:11the same data in 5 seconds that you
3:13spent 5 years to get. No, no, that's no
3:15longer a human differentiator in
3:17leadership knowledge. Now the
3:19differentiator is can you lead under
3:21pressure? Can you make decisions without
3:24complete information? Can you calm your
3:26the emotions in a room? That is a skill
3:29in leadership that we haven't had a
3:31formal process
3:33to be able to actualize and I take the
3:35insights from athletes because they
3:37that's what they condition for. Those
3:40are the moments that they condition for.
3:42>> I'll ask a few questions from this
3:44explanation. So one of them is So what's
3:46the answer? Do we have to match the
3:48speed or or should we let the speed be
3:51there and not worry about the fact that
3:54everything changes super fast and
3:56there's no certainty?
3:58>> We have to be right regulated. Our
4:01environment is something that we don't
4:02always control, right? But we can choose
4:05to set our own thermostat internally,
4:08which is how are we going to go into
4:10this room in this situation
4:13before the moment requires us to do so.
4:15What's our practice?
4:17Right? Again, an illustration of
4:18athletes. Every athlete, soccer player,
4:20basketball player, track runner, ballet
4:23dancer, what do they all do? They
4:25practice.
4:27Where do leaders practice?
4:29Well, it's work.
4:31They practice in real time, right? That
4:33becomes really problematic. And so, I
4:36start in the book with you. I start in
4:38the book with you as the arena, which is
4:40the mindset, which is why the
4:41neuroscience ties into it. So, that's
4:43where we start. We can't control our
4:45environment all the time, and we won't
4:47always be able to lead at that same
4:48speed, but we can be able to
4:51navigate those moments much sharper and
4:55elevate our value
4:57much more in this environment than we
4:58have in the past if we do a different if
5:00we do it a different way.
5:01>> You say that you have to condition the
5:03leader. So, what's the difference
5:04between conditioning the leader versus
5:06teaching, giving MBAs,
5:08whatever you're [laughter] comparing it
5:09to?
5:09>> I would first of all like to demystify
5:11leadership. I think many times when you
5:13hear leader, people say, "Okay, I don't
5:15have that title. That's not my role."
5:17And I believe everyone has the ability
5:20to lead at home, in your profession, in
5:23your community. And I believe leadership
5:25is a response. So, when you respond to
5:28whatever life gives you, that is you
5:30stepping into the to the plate as a
5:32leader, right? So, what is the
5:34difference? I think the orientation that
5:37we have had for leadership has been very
5:39much knowledge-based.
5:40And what is great about knowledge is
5:43that it gives us the ability to have
5:45skill
5:46and expertise.
5:48And that has a place because when we are
5:51planning, when we are doing things with
5:52intention, we have to be able to have
5:54that we rely we fall back on that.
5:57What becomes interesting, which is why
5:59the neuroscience plays into this, is
6:01that when we are as humans put in
6:03situations that we are uncomfortable
6:05with, unfamiliar, uncertain, our
6:08amygdala
6:10which is the mind that says warning,
6:12something's wrong, going wrong, we then
6:14begin to react off of emotion.
6:17And our nervous system kicks in. You how
6:19many time I think in the last decade
6:21I've heard more about people being
6:22triggered
6:23than we ever heard in the workplace.
6:24That wasn't a word in the workplace,
6:26right? What is triggering? It's because
6:28of there is an emotional and a
6:30neurological response that has that's
6:33very different than the knowing brain,
6:35which is my skill, my competence, what
6:36I've learned. So, you can be in the same
6:39situation. I just recently did my first
6:41podcast that released today and I talked
6:43about when I was 9 years old getting
6:45into this moment and I was only asked to
6:48say my name and in the moment the lights
6:50went on, I forgot my name. Okay, I know
6:52my name.
6:53>> [laughter]
6:54>> I know if anyone knows I know my name,
6:56but when that pressure hit, when the
6:58uncertain hit, my my brain shut down. My
7:01knowing brain shut down and my emotions,
7:03my nervous system kicked in and I wasn't
7:06prepared for that. That's the difference
7:08that we're in right now and many of us
7:10are in these emotional moments. We
7:12thought it was just COVID, right? And
7:14then we get over COVID and it's next.
7:15So, it's how do we begin to train and
7:18what I say condition, which is where
7:19practice comes in,
7:22regulating how we think, how we feel and
7:25then ultimately decide that helps us
7:27perform. That breakdown, I think we
7:29haven't had a real strong language for
7:31that in the past in leadership. It's
7:33always been about what you know and not
7:35how to regulate that other side that
7:38that's important to leadership.
7:39>> I actually didn't learn leadership in
7:41any school and I think a lot of people
7:43end up in this position not because they
7:46got an MBA or something. I don't even
7:47know if MBA gives you any
7:48>> Yes.
7:49Correct.
7:50>> What do normal people do when they have
7:53to lead a project and a bunch of people
7:55and things go wrong? What do we do?
7:57>> Correct. [clears throat] Yes, and I this
7:59is the premise of the book. I never
8:01Christina was tapped as a leader. That
8:04wasn't who I grew up seeing myself as
8:07and so I say in the book leaders aren't
8:08born, they're built. And so there is a
8:11system that says people are tapped and
8:13they were born that way. That's why
8:14they're leaders. And I believe people
8:16can be built to be leaders. And so what
8:18do you do if you're in a situation
8:20at work? Maybe it's with your children
8:22at school. I'm dealing with a situation
8:24with my son at school right now, right?
8:25That's has nothing to do with work, but
8:27I have to step in and be a leader for
8:29him.
8:30I think what we have to do is step back
8:32and look at the mindset, the arena. And
8:34we start with what are our thoughts
8:36about that situation?
8:38And those thoughts create a feeling,
8:40fear, anxiety, worry,
8:43detachment, right? And then we give
8:46ourselves agency to choose.
8:49And so in the book I talk about the
8:50drill, the foundation drill, which is
8:52five words and then two options and then
8:55you choose. So part of what we're
8:57practicing, conditioning, is the ability
8:59to step back before we react, respond as
9:03a leader, step back, what am I thinking?
9:06Take a beat. How do I feel about this?
9:08Okay, I'm scared. I don't know what to
9:10do. I don't have all the information.
9:13Decide.
9:14Okay, I'm going to choose option A.
9:17And then move forward. So it's giving
9:19all of us the power back in these
9:22moments when our emotions and our
9:24nervous system take take over to step in
9:27and say no, I can choose differently.
9:28And guess what? I'm going to practice
9:30and sometimes I'm going to fail.
9:31>> Mhm.
9:32>> But with athletes, there's always a game
9:35and there's always a winner and a loser,
9:36every game.
9:37But they don't stop playing, they just
9:38get back and do it again.
9:40And so athleticism in this book and why
9:43it's athleadership is not just a nice
9:46metaphor.
9:47It really is backed by science to see
9:49that the way that athletes are
9:51conditioned for high stakes moments has
9:54been practiced and there is a
9:56methodology that I think leaders every
9:58day, no matter your title position, can
10:01begin to access so that you have the
10:03ability to be
10:05the leader the moment demands. Whatever
10:07that moment is for you.
10:08>> I actually
10:09>> want to ask about the athletish of the
10:11name as well. Why did you pick
10:13specifically the athletes, the being
10:16this professional athlete as as the
10:19framework for for the leadership
10:22reconditioning that you are you are
10:24talking about. And I know you had this
10:26one interesting story somewhere in the
10:28middle of the book about
10:31you kind of touched upon it right now
10:32about the the players going into the
10:34game and sometimes losing sometimes
10:36winning and where you had the switch. I
10:38know there are a lot of stories in your
10:39book of athletes
10:41and athletes. So I hope you know the
10:43story that I'm talking about.
10:45>> Yes, yes. Yeah, we all So one thing I
10:48like to caveat cuz it's been in the
10:49market a a little while and people say
10:51I'm not an athlete, that's not me. And
10:53it's that you don't have to be an
10:54athlete to be an athlete. The
10:56inspiration came from my own personal
10:58journey of athleticism and how it's
11:00helped me. Christina, I was literally
11:02picking up groceries this morning
11:04and I thought about a session I'm going
11:06to do in a month
11:08on a panel with neuroscientists about
11:10this book. And I'm like I'm not a
11:12neuroscientist, right? But there's a lot
11:14of it in the book, but I said what
11:15Melissa is has helped you apply these
11:18principles. And I think about
11:21trying to get into grad school and I did
11:23not have the highest SAT score. And I
11:25sat there and I said listen, I believe I
11:27belong here and I'm going to be your
11:29best graduate and I spoke at graduation,
11:32but I had saw that in my mind in sixth
11:35grade that I wanted to go to this
11:36university. I thought about the time
11:39that I was told I was not going to be
11:40able to conceive.
11:42And I believed that was a part of my
11:44story and so that happened. And so
11:47what I would say is that the athletic
11:49mindset, coming back to how I created
11:52I've experienced that for me as an
11:55athlete
11:56my mind has helped me go places I never
11:58thought I could be. Like being in this
11:59conversation with this book
12:01is a place I did not think I could be
12:04unless I wired my mind to see things
12:06differently than my circumstance, than
12:08my environment. And when I I with
12:11athletes because of that passion, I work
12:13with the National Football League in the
12:14United States and I took a program that
12:17I built through over 400 players across
12:2019 teams in 2008. And I wasn't a
12:23professional athlete. I'm not a guy on a
12:25football field, American football field.
12:28And so I took time to understand the DNA
12:30of that the sport and I really
12:33interviewed players. I had coaches who
12:35coached me about the game and how
12:37professional sports worked and I learned
12:40so many powerful parallels about being
12:42ready to perform.
12:44And as the world has evolved and is
12:48evolving, I said, "This is a gap.
12:51People need access to how to make these
12:53decisions and how to build their value
12:57when the world is changing and AI is
12:59saying their job may not even be
13:00relevant anymore.
13:01What do they do? Right? And so I really
13:03feel that this a mission behind this
13:05book to equip people with a language and
13:09a framework that's very personal but
13:11that can play out to other teams, to the
13:13organization and I think we can build
13:15athletors all around the world in this
13:17moment of change.
13:18>> Striking, if you're not ready to lose,
13:20you're not ready to win.
13:22>> Yes. Yes, I think that's the the whole
13:24premise. When we think about winning and
13:27losing, I've had to personally, like
13:29everything in this book, I've had a
13:30business for 20 years in October, this
13:32month, 20 years. And I have had to
13:35relearn some things. And one of the
13:37things I've had to relearn is my
13:39relationship with failure.
13:41And I think in order to be an athletor,
13:43we have to reorient ourselves around
13:45failure because we think it as a
13:47lose-lose situation. So no one wants to
13:49try. Nobody wants to take the risk cuz
13:52what if I fail? What does it mean to
13:53about my identity and
13:55my competency and my skill? And if we
13:58look at failure as reps,
14:01I work out in the gym and I have to go
14:02to failure.
14:04And then when you go to failure, that
14:05means that you're showing your where
14:07your muscle is but then you recover and
14:10then you get back stronger and every
14:11week you're getting better and better.
14:13And if we have that mentality, we won't
14:15be afraid anymore. I think a lot of what
14:17we move from is fear.
14:21Fear of failure, fear of what people are
14:23going to say, fear of if it doesn't
14:25work. And it's taken me so long to get
14:28to that place where I'm not afraid
14:29anymore.
14:31And that's a powerful journey that I've
14:33had to go through with my relationship.
14:35I think a lot of it had to do with my
14:36relationship with loss.
14:38>> I as I was reading the book, I was quite
14:40conscious that it was about leadership
14:42and business environment. But now that
14:43as we are talking with you and you
14:45mentioned also your son,
14:46would it be also correct to say that
14:48actually if you remove the leadership or
14:49the business environment from this book
14:51and replace it with some other area of
14:53life, it would actually still hold?
14:55>> It holds. It's life. I believe,
14:58Christina, life is we are we're
15:01experiencing one experience. I think we
15:03have defined our life by Friday and
15:06Monday and work and but it doesn't work
15:09that way. We are one human having one
15:12experience and work is just an
15:13expression.
15:15It's the muscle we exercise the most. So
15:17a lot of times we don't realize the
15:19patterns we carry at work, carry at
15:22home. I spoke at a conference recently
15:25and I was talking about our patterns and
15:27she was saying, "I realize sometimes
15:29when I the way that I lead, my husband
15:31will say, 'I'm not your employee.'"
15:33>> But the muscle is so strong cuz she's
15:35leading, directing that Yeah, and so she
15:37gets in the work home environment and
15:38and that dynamic may shift or her
15:40communication has to shift. But she's
15:42still the same person, right? So we all
15:45leadership is a lifestyle.
15:48>> And that's what I hope this book will
15:49do. If you're a stay-at-home mom, you
15:52don't have a quote-unquote career, you
15:54do at home. You're working. You're
15:55building children. You're building the
15:57future. That's a job. So whatever your
16:00lot in life is, you're a student, right?
16:03You don't have a career yet, but you can
16:05build these muscles that will help you
16:07navigate whatever environment you're in.
16:10>> So talking about muscles, I do encourage
16:12you guys to read I mean, obviously
16:14reading the book takes longer than 45
16:16minutes that we do the interviews. So
16:18walk us through a little bit through
16:19your framework because it's a pretty
16:22comprehensive framework, I would say. If
16:24you could give like a little bird's eye
16:26overview for the people to understand
16:27what what they women have.
16:30>> Yes, I love that. So, I'm definitely
16:32someone who believes in frameworks and
16:34giving people meat. I don't want just
16:37fluff. I like meat. So, the framework of
16:39the book talks about there's two
16:41environments. There's what's happening
16:43in the game of life, leadership, and
16:46then there's the arena. That's what's
16:47happening on the inside. And so, as we
16:49are experiencing life and leadership,
16:52the world and life is going zigzagging,
16:54right? We have to have an anchor and
16:55that anchor starts with the MVP.
16:58In sports, it's most valuable player. In
17:00this environment, it is the mission,
17:02vision, and purpose. That becomes our
17:05anchor. That becomes our foundation for
17:07forever. It's what we come back to every
17:09time. Harvard Business Review said fewer
17:12than 20% of {quote} leaders have a
17:15mission purpose statement, even fewer
17:16have written it down. So, every
17:18organization exists with one. If they
17:21don't, they're not real an organization.
17:23So, every individual should have one as
17:25well. So, that becomes the anchor.
17:26But then when we talk about what are the
17:28attributes of
17:29>> down here a little though. You said
17:31Harvard Business Review said that less
17:32than 20% of leaders have a purpose and
17:35that means a purpose statement.
17:36>> identified at their own personal purpose
17:39statement.
17:40>> And it's not necessarily related to work
17:42or is it work related?
17:45>> So, that's the it's not neither.
17:47>> [laughter]
17:47>> Neither.
17:48>> Neither. Yes.
17:49>> The way I wanted to slow down here is
17:51the question is
17:53why are they doing what they're doing?
17:55>> Correct. I believe that if you don't
17:58have a plan for your own life, chances
18:00are someone else will have one for you.
18:03Right?
18:04>> [laughter]
18:04>> Our boss, our family, our people. Ev-
18:06Everyone has plans for you if you don't
18:09have your own. And so, I think that it
18:10this all to me is very interwoven. If
18:13you think about the burnout rate, right?
18:16We don't get burnt out necessarily
18:18because of what we do, so we don't know
18:19why we're doing it sometimes.
18:22Okay? And when you think about the
18:24disengagement, this third less than 30%
18:26of people are actually engaged in their
18:28work.
18:29That's huge. And we've been 30s, 20% for
18:33decades.
18:35What are we doing? We're on a treadmill.
18:36We're just doing.
18:38>> The question is why are we afraid of
18:39robots taking over if all obviously 70%
18:42of people are there already?
18:44>> Okay. Okay. So, this is the wake-up call
18:48we're talking about. This is the wake-up
18:50call that we need to have because it's
18:53so easy to have the job, the career that
18:55was suggested to you versus defined by
18:57you. You get a a job, your parents say
18:59you should go to the school, you don't
19:00go to the school, you get this trade,
19:03you then take a job, you get promoted,
19:04you get a little bit more money, and all
19:05of a sudden you're on this treadmill.
19:08But, have you stepped back, which gets
19:09to the core four? The core four become
19:12mission, vision, purpose gets us
19:13anchored, so we're clear.
19:15And that takes time, it takes
19:17self-reflection, tapes reviewing your
19:19game tape, and understanding who you
19:21are.
19:22But, then if you look at how do athletes
19:24be able are they able to perform under
19:26stress, urgency, and pressure? It's what
19:27I call the core four, which is agility,
19:30resilience, alignment, and well-being.
19:32So, each of those core four sit above
19:35the MVP as a way to navigate your life.
19:39And so, when you talk about what you
19:41just asked, well, what are people doing?
19:44You got to check in with alignment.
19:46Am I really aligned with this role, with
19:49this job, with where I want to be in my
19:51life? And I have we have a whole
19:53curriculum around this, Christina. So,
19:55it's more than a book, there's actually
19:56an online leading learning platform. And
19:58so, that's where I work with 250,000
20:00leaders.
20:01And I will tell you without question,
20:0495% of them say this is awakening for
20:06me. No one's ever asked me these types
20:08of questions.
20:09And I'm good at what I do. I love I
20:11sometimes I like I love my job. It's
20:13okay sometimes. But, it's the
20:15opportunity for them to step in and say,
20:17"Who do I want to be? How do I want to
20:20show up in the world?"
20:22And I still ask myself that question
20:24every day. You never stop asking. But if
20:27you've never been given the chance to
20:29know that question is important,
20:31what are you doing with your life?
20:33>> Or even relevant for some like if you
20:35look at it from the point of view of
20:37business owner, you put people in places
20:39not because their purpose of vision
20:41aligns because you need a little cog in
20:43that spot in your business.
20:46>> I think that's the opportunity. So what
20:48we are doing in our curriculum is we
20:51have an organ have individuals
20:52understand organization like what's
20:54their role, why were they hired, but
20:56then what is my why to this work? So you
20:59can create that alignment. How much more
21:01engaged are people when they feel like
21:03their why aligns with their work?
21:05How much more eager are they to
21:07contribute? The engagement goes up
21:10significantly because now I'm tapped in.
21:13I'm not just a cog in the wheel. I have
21:16a reason to do this work. And also when
21:18I'm tired, when I'm frustrated, when I
21:20want to quit, I go back to my why. That
21:23keeps me going. Christina, what I
21:25believe was missing was I didn't have a
21:28framework for these hard questions,
21:30these challenges. And so I literally
21:33through practice, through interviews,
21:35through practical application of others,
21:37I saw that this is an opportunity to
21:39create this for a language and a lane
21:42for people to activate.
21:44How? How do I navigate? My job has been
21:48eliminated.
21:49What where do what what's next?
21:53I've been a doctor
21:55for 15 years and this really I can't
21:57keep up with the pace. I have a
21:59different family dynamic. What do I do
22:01next?
22:02And it those are real situations.
22:05>> [laughter]
22:05>> I guess you need some level of
22:06empowerment to be even able to have the
22:08guts to say what's my purpose in this
22:11because sometimes if you feel that you
22:13depend on a certain job to pay your
22:16bills, you just feel like maybe I'm
22:18maybe it's not my place to to question,
22:20you know.
22:20>> Yes.
22:21>> What does it as a
22:23human being and my purpose?
22:24>> You're getting at the first couple of a
22:27section of the book, which is identity
22:28theft and really the performance
22:30paradox.
22:31Right? When we perform so well and we
22:33it's called to your audience the
22:35performance paradox. When we perform
22:36well and we get rewarded for what we do
22:39and we start to accumulate recognition
22:43and titles, I call it trinkets, it
22:45becomes harder to detach who we are from
22:47what we do.
22:48So, when we lose the job, when we don't
22:51get the promotion, when we aren't picked
22:53for that opportunity, we begin to
22:55question our value. We question our
22:58competency. Could we do something
23:00different?
23:01I went through that. I I worked a job
23:03and I was came from an orientation of a
23:05family that you just get a good job.
23:07Right? So, to step out and leave a good
23:10job, even before I was vested,
23:12Christina,
23:14I kicked myself out of the job
23:16to get uncomfortable and to leave what
23:18was familiar. That's very scary.
23:21And right? And then what happens if you
23:23don't succeed? What happens if you fail
23:25again?
23:26And so that becomes the muscle we're
23:29building and that the confidence comes
23:31from seeing yourself do hard things.
23:34When you watch yourself do hard things,
23:37you begin to become more confident of
23:39what's possible.
23:41>> The four muscles that you're talking
23:42about, they are very interesting and I
23:43would like us to get back to that again.
23:46>> Yes, yes. So, the core four, which is
23:49agility, resilience, alignment, and
23:50well-being. So, agility is being able to
23:54shift when the ground moves beneath you.
23:56So, think about a situation that you
23:58thought was going to go one way and then
24:00suddenly it shifts and changes. So, how
24:02do you respond in those moments? Some of
24:05us have a tendency to control, others of
24:07us feel like we just want to run and
24:10hide. Those patterns are indications of
24:13opportunities for us to practice.
24:15Re- resilience, right? And I say
24:17resilience is news lose no lessons. I
24:19think after COVID resilience was a big
24:20theme. Everybody was like, let's be
24:22resilient. Let's be resilient. Bounce
24:23back. I don't think it's always bouncing
24:25back and I talk about it in the book
24:27stories where you don't just bounce
24:30back. Life hits you and you've got to
24:32lose no lessons in the loss.
24:35It's the real dealing with the real
24:36relationship with loss.
24:38It's dealing with how do you restructure
24:40and
24:41navigate and still come back stronger.
24:44That's what resilience is. Alignment we
24:46talked a little bit about earlier.
24:49When your car light comes on in our US
24:51it says check engine light or it's time
24:53for an alignment. It's really asking
24:55yourself it am I aligned? Is my team
24:58aligned? Is my family aligned? When
25:01things are off, you you feel it. There's
25:03stress, there's irritation, there's
25:06frustration because often times we're
25:08just not aligned. In relationships we're
25:10not aligned. So that's checking the
25:11alignment. And then finally is
25:12well-being. One of the things that I
25:14talk about too is that we all admire
25:17athletes for their high performance, but
25:19they don't perform at that level 24/7.
25:23They're very intentional about rest and
25:25it's a practice.
25:26And so high performers often have a hard
25:28time. We think of work hard, play hard
25:31in the United States. Other places have
25:33a better balance, but the idea is that
25:36we have to have a practice of recovery.
25:39Checking out, checking in with
25:40ourselves, taking care of ourselves. And
25:43that allows us to sustain
25:45the pace of the change that's happening
25:47around us is if we can take care of
25:49ourselves first.
25:51So that's the core four.
25:52>> You just talked about balance a little
25:54bit. There is this tension about it I
25:56feel in the book somewhere between the
25:57lines even if you maybe not explicitly
25:59talk about that, but on one side you're
26:02describing this high pressure
26:03environment especially that the leaders
26:05are forged in this high stress
26:06environment where they they get to
26:09actually
26:09become who they are, but you also talk
26:12about burnout and about not having a
26:14moment to even slow down and ask
26:16yourself important questions.
26:18So have you found that balance for
26:20yourself between
26:22between the stress, quick change, things
26:25changing faster now than ever before,
26:27huge demands and also needing that
26:29recharge? Because I know in one place
26:32you write something along the lines that
26:33the balance is important, but when I
26:35some of you will have to slow down, it
26:37doesn't mean that
26:38you won't be achieving anymore. So, if
26:40you found that balance for yourself, how
26:42do you navigate it between too much and
26:46>> Yeah.
26:47>> And and and slow down.
26:49>> It's first of all, Christine, it's an
26:51awareness, right? It's first an
26:53awareness. Where am I in the space of
26:56well-being? And who am I in this space?
26:59I am a high performer. I'm a driver. So,
27:02my tendencies naturally is to do more.
27:06Right? And so, I have to put in forcing
27:08functions
27:10that empower me to remind myself and to
27:13slow down. Forcing functions look like
27:16my slogan and even in my team, simplify
27:19to amplify.
27:20Melissa, don't do more. Simplify to
27:22amplify. That's one of my themes.
27:25Forcing function is I have a coach
27:28that holds me accountable and I check in
27:29with her on Tuesdays.
27:31I had my check-in, excuse me, Wednesday.
27:33Yeah, today's Thursday, yesterday. And I
27:35do a I will check in with her and she
27:37gives me feedback. And she says,
27:39Melissa, this week you got to be better
27:40on your sleep.
27:42Okay. I have to have I have to have
27:43accountability, right? Support system
27:46looks like in my husband going for a
27:48walk with me.
27:49I just want you to do that for me. Go
27:50for a walk with me to help me take time
27:53to unwind.
27:54Another forcing function that I do is
27:56every quarter, I do a 90-day reset. The
27:59end of the quarter, just this last
28:00weekend was my 90-day reset. What does
28:02that look like? I talked about the
28:0390-day way in the book is I do something
28:05for myself. For me, I stayed in the bed.
28:08I slept in.
28:10I made that a priority and I don't
28:12always do that, but it was amazing.
28:17So, I think that we number one have to
28:19have awareness. Number two, we have to
28:21create accountability for ourselves. So,
28:22we know our weaknesses,
28:24create accountability, and then find
28:26forcing functions, things that we say to
28:29ourselves,
28:30activities that we put on our calendar,
28:32rituals we create.
28:35That's how we begin to create a rhythm.
28:38The last thing I'll say with you,
28:39Christina, is you got to understand
28:41seasons.
28:42I would get so frustrated sometimes
28:44because it wouldn't go as planned. And I
28:47real had to realize that's a part of
28:49agility.
28:51I had a really good wellness plan until
28:54I wrote this book.
28:55That went out the window.
28:57Because for the season of this book,
28:59I was up till 2:00, 3:00, 4:00 in the
29:02morning. I had to settle in with
29:04Melissa, this is a season.
29:06This is what it's going to take for this
29:08season. This season will have an end.
29:11And you'll be able to go back. Now, find
29:12little things you can do, but your
29:14schedule to work, to be a present mom
29:16and a wife, and to write a book, you
29:18something's got to give.
29:19Don't beat yourself up about that.
29:21That's the season that you're in right
29:22now. So, I think that's really important
29:24for our your listeners to hear that I
29:27can talk about all these wonderful
29:28things that I do, but in the season like
29:31writing a book, some of that went out
29:32the window cuz I had to do what I had to
29:34do because the book was the priority to
29:37get it to you. Right? But I under I had
29:40to build that awareness first and be
29:42okay with it and give myself grace in
29:45that season for this book to happen.
29:48>> You said that you know your weaknesses.
29:50And I guess in your case, being aware of
29:53what's going on inside on your arena or
29:55inside your mind
29:56>> Yeah.
29:57>> is probably a habit of 20 years. But a
29:59lot of the people who are on a
30:01treadmill, how well do they actually
30:03know their weaknesses? And I'm coming
30:05back to that concept that you talked
30:06about the paradox where you perform a
30:09certain thing that has gotten you into
30:10this trouble. And you actually perform
30:13even more because that's what you think
30:15is what is expected of you to move on.
30:18So, how do you break out of this vicious
30:20cycle? How do you
30:22actually get to know yourself?
30:23>> Christina, you remind me of conversation
30:24I had yesterday with someone that I am
30:26in an advisory relationship. And she
30:28said, "Melissa, this is hard."
30:31This is hard.
30:33Because it requires a different muscle
30:35that you have to step to the plate and
30:38say, I want to go through this pain to
30:40get the purpose.
30:41And why I say it's painful sometimes is
30:43because we have to get a mirror, and
30:46sometimes what we see isn't what we
30:48think we are.
30:51We have to get honest, and the first
30:54step is saying, I'm willing. Cuz
30:57you know when things aren't working.
30:59Every you could fool a lot of people
31:02on social media, in a meeting, with your
31:04team.
31:06But at home, coming back to home, you
31:08know when things don't align. You know
31:10when you're doing the thing, but your
31:12mind is somewhere else. You know that
31:14you're swallowing
31:16deeply as you go into this meeting cuz
31:18you just like, I don't want to be here.
31:20And so, it's just giving yourself
31:22permission, first of all,
31:24to sit down with yourself.
31:27And ask yourself these hard questions.
31:29Why am I doing what I'm doing?
31:32Does this really feel aligned with who I
31:34am today?
31:36And give yourself permission to have an
31:37answer that
31:39doesn't fit.
31:41And that's where we start.
31:43And so, I hope that the book begins to
31:45give people language and a starting
31:47line. A starting line. Even just to
31:49become aware of these stories that I
31:51talk about with real people
31:54doing all the things and missing all the
31:55birthdays, missing all no longer getting
31:58invited to parties anymore from their
32:00friends because they're always busy at
32:02work. And they've lost touch with
32:04relationships.
32:05Right?
32:06>> We started this interview with
32:08leadership.
32:09So, clear-cut I said there are a lot of
32:11books where people talk about
32:12leadership.
32:13But I feel we are talking more about
32:15self-discovery than
32:16>> [laughter]
32:16>> Yes.
32:17>> than leadership per se.
32:19>> Leadership is an inside job.
32:21Leadership is an inside job. We look at
32:25leaders by role and title and position.
32:27It's an inside job.
32:30>> Melissa, you're welcome to show the book
32:31on your side as well. So, this is the
32:33book. We'll share the link to the book
32:35down under the video. I have one
32:37question that I like to ask my guests,
32:39and that is how would you like your book
32:41to change the world? And I know you just
32:42started answering that question, but I
32:44want you to go deeper into that answer.
32:46>> I really worked hard, Kristina, to find
32:48the premise of the book.
32:51I believe that what I want people to do
32:53is I want to unlock leadership in
32:55everyone.
32:57I want us to move away from leadership
33:00just being a title and a role. I believe
33:02leaders aren't born, they're built.
33:05I was someone who probably is an
33:07unlikely leader.
33:09But
33:11practicing what I talk about in
33:13athleadership has given me the the
33:15privilege
33:16to serve and to be the leader that you
33:17see today. Not perfect, still
33:20conditioning, but being able to bring
33:22this message forward. And I've been
33:24through a lot of loss, I've been through
33:25a lot of change, I've been through a lot
33:27of uncertainty,
33:28and I recognize that in every person
33:30that's on this call,
33:32professionally or personally. Right? And
33:34so, I my mission in this book is to
33:37unlock leadership for everyone around
33:39the world.
33:40>> You mentioned that you would like to
33:41unlock leadership in a lot of people,
33:43and of course we end up in leadership
33:44positions throughout life in very
33:46different and sometimes unexpected
33:48circumstances. In my environment, I also
33:49have a lot of those high-pressure
33:51cookers of leaders
33:55>> [laughter]
33:55>> on the verge of exploding. I want to
33:57ask, so if you are the other type, not
34:00the one who needs the confidence to step
34:02into their leadership and to find their
34:03purpose in whatever they're doing, but
34:05for those of that of us or the those of
34:08our listeners who are actually in the
34:10pressure cooker right now, who are so
34:13busy and on a treadmill that they don't
34:14have time to slow down, how do you start
34:17changing it from there? And when do you
34:19know that it's time to change?
34:22>> It's always time to change. Every great
34:24athlete has a season. They always are
34:27practicing and they're always prepared.
34:29So, my niche in the work that I do is
34:32the high performance. I call the H3
34:34leader, high pressure, high performance,
34:36high platform. And that's who you're
34:38talking about. Every single day you're
34:40on. You've got to make critical
34:42decisions, high-stakes moments, and
34:45there are people whose lives and their
34:49business opportunities real rest on you.
34:51So, the first step is that recognize
34:54that we are conditioning new muscles,
34:57new mental muscles, and I think that's
34:58for the the tagline is the elite
35:01athletic mindset, how to lead under
35:03pressure and perform when it counts. And
35:05I I am very passionate about building
35:07leaders who are high value, that are
35:10high demand. And so, in this new
35:13environment with AI, we have to shift
35:17how we are orienting our value. And so,
35:19for that high-pressure, high-stakes
35:21leader, that H3 leader, I want them to
35:23be able to take away these are the
35:25skills and the muscles I can build today
35:28that will sustain my value and also help
35:32me sustain my well-being
35:34at the same time.
35:35>> So, you're talking about the people that
35:37you work with are the high-pressure
35:38people. A lot of them have been in their
35:40positions for many years, have gone
35:42through a lot of crisis, and they just
35:43deal with them the way they deal with
35:44them. And a lot of us who are a little
35:46bit older in life will
35:49somewhat set in our ways, and you know,
35:51we're confident in in ourselves. So, how
35:53do these people know or
35:57where do they find the motivation to
35:58actually try to do it better and not
36:01just run on the same treadmill all the
36:03way to their grave?
36:05>> I will tell you what often keeps them
36:08there is fear, right? And that peer
36:10performance paradox. So, there's either
36:12typically two motivations. There's the
36:14person who's motivated because they want
36:16to be high growth and they want to be
36:17better. There's the other person who's
36:19motivated because their weakness has
36:22been exposed.
36:24People, leaders have seen their
36:27weakness, and it's been identified that
36:30this is something you need to address.
36:32It's costing them their next level. It's
36:34costing them their health. Maybe they've
36:36gotten a doctor's report that no money
36:39can fix, cuz when your health is gone,
36:41you've lost everything. So, there are
36:43external forcing functions that make
36:45them slow down, stop, take inventory.
36:48And you have a choice. You can continue.
36:51It cost to change, but it cost a lot to
36:53stay the same.
36:54It cost your peace. Can cost you
36:56opportunities.
36:58Can cost you your fulfillment. So, it's
37:00a choice, and I think that's the power
37:02that everyone has agency to choose.
37:05Wise,
37:06smart, and forward-looking leaders in
37:09these high-pressure moments recognize
37:11the signs.
37:12They see indications in their team. They
37:13read signs all the time. That's how they
37:15report on the business. They got to do a
37:17self-report as well, and then they've
37:18got to make the decision.
37:20>> I think a lot of the world leaders are
37:23really
37:24not in what they're doing because of
37:26their purpose in life.
37:28>> There's a misnomer, too, that purpose is
37:30not profitable, and I don't believe
37:32that, either. I believe that's the super
37:34engine when you are able to align why
37:36this is not charity. I'm not talking
37:38about opening a nonprofit. I'm saying
37:40that when you can align purpose and why
37:43you do what you do to a greater
37:45profitability value for yourself. My
37:47first book was Brand Me. So, I talked
37:49about how you build brands.
37:52And that's what I did in my prior
37:53corporate career. So, I understand
37:55value. I understand equity. I understand
37:57building something that's last and
37:59people have high demand for. So, to me,
38:02this is an extension of that. And it
38:05doesn't have to be a charity case. It
38:07actually can be this is how I become
38:09high Listen to this.
38:11Why do
38:12professional athletes get paid so much?
38:14There's a lot of athletes that just kick
38:15balls and run and do They get paid at
38:18the level that they get paid financially
38:21for 45, 90 minutes of 90 minutes of a
38:24game because of their ability to perform
38:26under pressure.
38:27That is directly equating to their
38:29financial value.
38:31That's what I'm saying is the
38:33opportunity for leaders today. If they
38:34don't want any other motivation, how do
38:37you become in demand?
38:39Is this is the formula to do it.
38:40>> I think for us, authors,
38:43book is another baby in our life.
38:45>> [laughter]
38:45>> And it is an important baby and I do
38:48wish your book Melissa all the success.
38:50However, I want to ask you, what do you
38:52wish for your book?
38:53>> [laughter]
38:55>> Have a My initial wish is that and I
38:59when I launched the book my first this
39:01year I wanted it to land in 10,000
39:02leaders' hands.
39:04So, I created athletishipmovement.com
39:08for a 10,000 leader initiative. In the
39:09first year I wanted it to land in 10,000
39:11leaders' hands. Why? Because I believe
39:14that when something
39:16this powerful lands in people's hands,
39:18they will share it and it becomes
39:20catalytic and other people will get it.
39:22And so, my wish for the book
39:24is not just It's not about a monetary
39:26thing. I want to make money, but I want
39:28to be able to get this methodology far
39:31and wide globally. So, which is why so
39:34grateful for this opportunity and the
39:36work that you do to share stories of of
39:39books and authors like myself with your
39:42community because we need not only
39:45knowledge, but we need tools
39:47to live and lead better and that's what
39:49I hope that this book does.
39:51>> Melissa, thank you so much for this
39:53wonderful conversation and for your
39:55wisdom and for having a passion for what
39:57you do because part I think of our
40:00contemporary suffering is the fact that
40:02we see so
40:03much facade and performance around not
40:08just among leaders, but even if you take
40:10I don't know if you open internet, you
40:11look at news, social media, everything.
40:14There's a lot of performance. Thank you
40:15for what you're doing and for those of
40:18you who joined us, thank you. If you are
40:20here accidentally because we moved the
40:22platform, so I know there were some
40:23stumbling who don't know what is My
40:25Valuable Club, you're welcome to join
40:27us. It's actually a free service.
40:30It's [laughter] because of my passion. I
40:31want to do the hard work with the new
40:33releases of books and personal growth
40:36and business for you guys. So, we
40:37actually go through thousands of books
40:39every week and pick five and of those
40:42five we pick one for then interview once
40:44a week. And I like to say have access to
40:46the world's best authors, at least the
40:48newest best office. Thank you, Melissa,
40:51for joining me and thank you everyone
40:53else who joined us online and I'll see
40:55you next week again.
40:57Bye-bye.
40:58>> Bye-bye.

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