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"Forgiveness Is for YOU" with Rwandan Survivor Immaculée Ilibagiza — Transcript

by Tony Robbins · 10,429 words · 1,322 segments · language en · Watch on YouTube

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0:00I will never forget the day started it
0:03was on Wednesday April
0:057th my brother came to my room in the
0:08morning I was still sleeping and he
0:10pushed the door and I woke up and he
0:12said you are still sleeping you don't
0:14know what happened I asked him what
0:17happened a million things went through
0:19my back my mind I thought maybe my mom
0:22was sick maybe my dad died something
0:25happened to Quick he told me the
0:27president of the country was killed
0:30night when we were
0:31sleeping I remember jumping out of the
0:33bed and I told him they are going to
0:36kill us and Rwanda in
0:399394 was
0:40Crisis all of a sudden you have two
0:43different groups of people who live in
0:44the same country but it's all about
0:47separation you know a foreign power came
0:50in and they started to seemingly favor
0:52one group over the other looked a little
0:53bit more European in their facial
0:56structure and that created conflict one
0:59group group was more Farmers another
1:01group was moving up into different class
1:04and all of a sudden this sparked rage
1:06and anger and it got completely out of
1:08control it was promoted by the media by
1:10the way the media promoted it and all of
1:13a sudden neighbors even members of the
1:15same family were killing members of
1:17their own family based upon these little
1:21differences which really don't even
1:22matter in any way sheap perform but why
1:25hear about this well it' be nice to hear
1:26about it for someone who experienced it
1:28someone who is also targeted to be
1:30murdered themselves and not only survive
1:33that level of Crisis which is much
1:34greater than anything we've talked about
1:35this morning personally having someone
1:38try to kill you or a group of people
1:39trying to kill you in your own home and
1:42making it through that to the other side
1:43and finding the beauty on the other side
1:45and then seeing a culture change if you
1:48go to Rwanda today it's a very different
1:49world again there's no discussion about
1:52these separations then all these
1:53councils can you imagine if you
1:56literally a few years after someone
1:58killed your mother or your brother
1:59brother your sister and they your
2:01neighbor now you're sing across the
2:02table from them trying to create
2:04forgiveness whole country did this I
2:07mean this is a role model of what's
2:10possible and transformed it doesn't mean
2:12doesn't have challenges and so forth
2:14there's days there where everybody the
2:16president of the country set it up so
2:17everybody goes and picks up trash and
2:19takes pride in the country it's just
2:21like it's a unique place and at some
2:23point we might want to do a trip there I
2:25my gorillas and Miss type of experience
2:27was one of my favorite experiences in
2:29life we might be interested a trip like
2:30that an adventure trip right so maybe
2:32we'll do that and we'll also get a
2:33chance to meet the president and see the
2:35culture but I know it's long so I want
2:37you to keep your energy strong because
2:38this last person is not last because
2:41they're last they're last to put the
2:42cherry on top to bring you back to your
2:44own understanding of humanity that in
2:47spite of all these things we've talked
2:48about and these crazy Technologies and
2:50injustices there's something deeper than
2:52that in the human spirit that is
2:54superior to anything anyone can do to
2:56you there's something greater inside all
2:58of us that's Superior to anything we
2:59could ever go through and the one we're
3:01going to introduce you to has been
3:02through that
3:13directly one of the big lesson was truly
3:16to understand the importance of love and
3:19actually to learn what love
3:21was another big lesson was the power of
3:25forgiveness also to understand
3:27forgiveness I used to think when you
3:30forgive somebody have maybe said
3:33something bad about you somebody you
3:35know I remember when the genocide
3:36started I was a student in college and I
3:39thought if you took my book away I would
3:41think about forgiving you but when I
3:43went through this terrible experience it
3:47was truly then I realized that this is
3:49what forgiveness is because I felt anger
3:53I felt what anger felt like I remember
3:55burning with my skin I remember sweating
3:59out of anger my blood was running fast
4:02out of anger my heart was beating faster
4:05out of anger and I remember begging God
4:07if only I can be innocent again if only
4:11I can remember how to smile again
4:13because that anger I felt like my face
4:16was twisted I felt like I was not myself
4:19again I would never smile again but I
4:21remember the moment I felt truly
4:23forgiveness which I will share a little
4:25bit with you it was that time I said
4:28this must be what they called
4:30forgiveness but truly truly what felt
4:33like it felt like peace it felt like
4:36true freedom and about love you know I
4:40remember you
4:43know many times I have asked myself what
4:47went wrong in this world that what
4:50happened to my country can happen and I
4:52really realized that it is we fa to love
4:55one another and I remember asking God in
4:57my heart but what happened to me because
5:00I think I have loved people and I
5:02realize also that we can't we can't just
5:06be alone We are family we have to love
5:10one another but we also have to pray for
5:13other people because we are a family
5:16what goes wrong in another country
5:18another person's life can affect all of
5:20us even if we have loved but when our
5:23neighbors were hateful it have affected
5:26us so the genocide happened 1994 for I
5:30was a student in college and I happened
5:32to be home for Easter holiday I will
5:34never forget the date started it was on
5:38Wednesday April
5:407th my brother came to my room in the
5:42morning I was still sleeping and he
5:45pushed the door and I woke up and he
5:47said you are still sleeping you don't
5:49know what happened I asked him what
5:51happened a million things went through
5:53my back my mind I thought maybe my mom
5:56was sick maybe my dad died something
5:59happened so quick he told me the
6:02president of the country was killed that
6:04night when we
6:06sleeping I remember jumping out of the
6:08bed and I told him they are going to
6:10kill us and he said why you know they
6:13going to kill us I said don't you see so
6:15in some ways like we are talking today
6:19when terrible things really are about to
6:20happen or happened most of the time
6:23we're prepared and many times we refuse
6:26to learn or to hear or to take the hint
6:29so in our country we were prepared in
6:31some ways one of the thing that prepared
6:34us was actually a radio that was created
6:38by the leaders of the country to spread
6:41hatred among people we had two main
6:43tribes as 20 said I belong to the tribe
6:47that was being killed tosti we were two
6:51tribes Hutu and tosti and people who
6:54were on power they have decided they're
6:56going to kill the other tribe so that
6:58they can you know keep the power again I
7:00live in this country now for 22 years
7:03now around the election I always feel
7:06like oh what is going on you know so I
7:08you can feel it was more like a
7:10political parties so they were trying to
7:13keep their power for some reasons and
7:16they started to spread hatred among
7:18people so the radio the journalist they
7:21literally used to call people call us
7:24like we're snakes we this and they would
7:27act like they were drunk so they were
7:29say that give me Scotch give me whiskey
7:31the journalist and they we say one day
7:33we are going to kill them and I always
7:36wondered how can they do that I mean as
7:39we are speaking again this afternoon how
7:41can they do that no one can just go to
7:44kill another human being but actually we
7:47knew that it can happen another thing
7:49that prepared us that was much better if
7:53you have heard a place called Lords in
7:56in France or Fatima thank you
8:00Fatima in um in Portugal the Blessed
8:04Virgin Mary the mother of Jesus appeared
8:07in a place called kibo 12 years before
8:10the genocide two three kids so far
8:13actually approved by the Catholic Church
8:16by the Vatican three kids in high school
8:18who were 14 years old 16 years old 17
8:22and they were now approved Our Lady Mary
8:25told them a terrible thing was going to
8:28happen to our country
8:30if we did not come back to God if we did
8:33not come back to love one another that
8:36simple as love and many people even
8:38including some priests said oh that is
8:40so simple it can't be from Heaven she
8:43cried and begged them if you don't
8:46believe what I'm saying at least believe
8:48what is in the Bible she showed the
8:50children people killing each other with
8:52machetes she showed them a river of
8:54blood and the children in front of about
8:5750,000 people I used to be there my
8:59parents used to be there and she showed
9:01them these people and they would scream
9:04and but they thought it can't happen but
9:07it was exactly happening she showed us
9:10many lessons of course really simple
9:13lessons forgive one another love one
9:15another take your faith seriously so we
9:19didn't listen and the genocide have just
9:21started but when my brother told me I
9:24thought that's it that what she was
9:26speaking about so I remember I came
9:28outside of the my room I went to see my
9:31parents
9:33outside and we found out that on radio
9:37that the leaders who were in power have
9:40already given the you know the
9:42announcement for everybody to stay home
9:45for no one to move they blocked the
9:47borders and the only job that was being
9:50done was actually killing people of My
9:52Tribe I remember about 2 hours later BBC
9:57Radio reported 18 families that were
10:00killed they would report things things
10:03like eight children and Mom and Dad 10
10:06children five children mom and dad and
10:09grandma and grandpa I remember my father
10:12who was a teacher a director actually of
10:15Catholic school that time and I remember
10:17he was listening to this and he stopped
10:19and he said wait this never happened
10:22before where they kill her family before
10:24they were killing somebody they were
10:26worried about in politics in who was
10:29against them but not a family but that's
10:32why they call it a genocide it was
10:34actually the attempt to eliminate the
10:37whole group of people they have gone to
10:39homes by homes they have taken the names
10:42and they knew what they were doing they
10:44were going to kill all of us so we sat
10:47there and we started to see people
10:48coming home asking my parents what to do
10:51I'm so grateful that I have had my
10:54parents now I can say that you know
10:56before when you have them you take them
10:58for granted granted you know you think
11:00that they I never disrespected my
11:02parents but um I never thought they
11:04would ever leave and um they were good
11:07people so people started to come home
11:10asking what to do and uh about the
11:14second day we had about 10,000 people
11:17and I remember last the last of the
11:19image I remember of my parents
11:20especially my father he had the Rosary
11:23in his hand and he spoke to everyone who
11:26was coming to him to ask him what to do
11:28and who was speaking to people from
11:30different religions but he just spoke as
11:33we come from a Catholic Family and he
11:35was Catholic but be trusted what he was
11:37saying talking to them he told them with
11:40a Rosary in his hand I will never forget
11:42that moment he said if it is a matter of
11:45a small group that want to kill us do
11:48not be scared fear is our worst enemy
11:52but he said however if it is the
11:54government that planned this I cannot
11:57lie to you they we they will kill us and
12:01then I remember thinking that you just
12:03don't tell people they going to die I
12:05was one good among three boys I was
12:07almost a little bit more protective you
12:09know towards my father and I thought
12:11people were just going to be scared and
12:13scream and he told them however even if
12:17there was a government that planned this
12:20they have the police they have the
12:21military and they're going to kill us
12:23let's not be scared again even then
12:27let's take this as the chance God is
12:30giving us to repent our sins so we can
12:32go to heaven how many people who know
12:35they're going to die this is our chance
12:37I'm like what you can be happy even when
12:39you dying and after that actually people
12:43got quiet everyone was hugging each
12:45other reconciling with one another
12:48reconciling to God Among the whole
12:5010,000 people I was they also praying
12:54and just asking God if anything I could
12:56have done please forgive me if this is
12:58my time to die after a few minutes
13:02everyone started to talk again my father
13:04came to me he gave me the rosary he had
13:07and asked me to go to hide to a neighbor
13:10who was from the other tribe I remember
13:12before I left my brother came to my dad
13:15and he said dad you sending her to
13:17somebody from the other tribe if things
13:20go bad they will kill her and my father
13:22said no I know that man even if things
13:26go bad he will not be able to kill even
13:29if he was from the other tribe I
13:31remember one big lesson my father was
13:33always teaching you know talking to
13:35people teaching and he was a teacher we
13:37didn't have things like this where you
13:39can be a speaker and give lessons but he
13:42was always you know giving lessons and I
13:45remember he
13:46said you know I know this man even if
13:49things go bad you know he will not be
13:51able to kill but I remember he used to
13:53tell us do not judge people and put them
13:55in
13:56boxes because somebody from that tribe
13:59have done you wrong because somebody
14:01from that country have done you wrong
14:03and he said if you do you will miss out
14:05many angels in your life because you
14:07don't know who God have will send you
14:10when you need it most so open your heart
14:12if somebody's does wrong to you take
14:15your space but don't put them in the
14:17boxes and I used to think my dad is
14:19teaching again but truly when he sent me
14:22to somebody who was supposed to be our
14:24enemy that's when I thought he really
14:27meant it and that moment of truly
14:30telling people not fear to hold on to
14:32God knowing even if we die it was maybe
14:34my first time I saw somebody's dying who
14:37still have
14:38belief that did something to my faith
14:42people will see from the experience you
14:45live they learn so much from that he
14:48have always taugh us about faith but
14:49when he was facing death he wasn't a
14:53doctor who is saying too B you are sick
14:55he was one of the people who are going
14:56to die and yet he was let's be happy we
14:59going to heaven after all that my father
15:03came to me he gave me the rosary he
15:04asked me to go to hide to this man and I
15:08left I remember when I got to this man
15:10he was a Protestant Pastor he showed me
15:13a tiny bathroom three by 4T I remember
15:16when I saw that I remember thinking this
15:18is too small what am I going to do 3x 4T
15:22I mean when I think about this today 3
15:25days before that I had a scholarship in
15:27college three 3 days before that I was
15:30paid to go to school 3 days before that
15:33I had my own room in my parents' house
15:37my brothers who protected me and now I
15:40have to sit in this 3x4 ft that taught
15:43me something you know things can change
15:46and it's true but we still have today
15:49let's enjoy it because we still don't
15:51know what is tomorrow and we don't know
15:53truly exactly what can happen but love
15:56the moment by moment as he was you know
15:59he told me to stay there thinking I'm
16:01alone and this tiny place he came back
16:05with five more women later he came back
16:08with three more two more women so we
16:11became eight people in 3x4 Ft he told us
16:14not to speak to one another not to make
16:17any noise not even to flush the water in
16:19the bathroom until somebody else is
16:21Flushing the water in the next bathroom
16:24he told us that he would tell his
16:26children that he lost the key of the
16:29bathroom which we realize he was trying
16:31to really protect us that he was even
16:34going to tell his own children he said
16:36you never know who you can tell one word
16:39can share with their friend it can be
16:41over so we sat there we didn't know each
16:44other but you know what in times like
16:46that you don't need the names all you
16:48need to know is you are a human being
16:50just like that person we cry for the
16:53same reasons we laugh for the same
16:55reasons so we sat there we felt like we
16:58were one person I remember the first day
17:01went by the second day he couldn't even
17:03give us food but the third day he was
17:05able to bring us food and the food he
17:07can afford to give us was the leftovers
17:10of his children they throw in a garbage
17:12and he would pick one plate and bring to
17:14us and we would share and that was the
17:18hunger was not the problem the biggest
17:20problem was just to to know that you can
17:22be killed any moment but hunger was very
17:25painful but it wasn't problem at the end
17:28of the week I remember I have started to
17:30develop so many emotions bad emotions
17:33anger that I felt I can die every bad
17:36emotion has levels so you feel bad a
17:39little bit you can feel really bad more
17:41to levels that it just can kill you I
17:43remember feeling so much anger I would
17:46be sweating out of anger and I remember
17:48thinking nobody's touching me but look
17:50how my body is acting just out of my
17:53thoughts and it started to scare me and
17:56the moment I would shift my world my
17:58thoughts to oh God please help us
18:01somewhere was Peace So what is this that
18:04this poisonous thoughts that were there
18:06in my in my mind so I got scared of that
18:09I had anger which was bad and then I had
18:12fear I would move from anger to fear and
18:15fear hurts differently than anger I will
18:18feel like my stomach shaking and I will
18:21think about so many things can happen
18:23they're going to catch me or they're
18:25going to rape me they're going to maybe
18:26keep me in their homes maybe going to
18:29cut me in pieces and with that it was
18:32another different of Agony pain and then
18:35I would removed to from that to
18:36impatience all these emotions were
18:39killing me alive and I remember thinking
18:42I'm dying anyway I need to talk I need
18:44to find out what is going on so at least
18:47I can be informed and see what is coming
18:49and get ready so when he came to give us
18:52food at night I grabbed his food and I
18:56dared to talk and I asked him tell us
18:59please put you know tell us what's going
19:01on or put the radio outside so at least
19:04we can hear what is going on in the
19:06country he was kind he put three
19:09different radios different channels I
19:12couldn't believe what was going on in a
19:14country the leaders of the countries who
19:17used to hide in private radios they were
19:20out on National Radio National TV
19:23calling everyone to kill everyone of My
19:25Tribe I remember one government minister
19:28he had a daughter who was my friend in
19:31high school who used to bring us
19:33chocolate in school he was just like a
19:35father he was on radio now saying do not
19:39forget children a child of a snake of a
19:41snake a child of a cockroach is a coach
19:44we had to cleanse the country and we are
19:46going to live in a paradise and for some
19:49reasons I knew that that was wrong but
19:52how come he doesn't see it and sometimes
19:55we think well maybe people are not so
19:56smart this one one of the smartest man
19:59in the whole country he was a man who
20:01has a PHD he got in France so they used
20:04to look up to him and now he was the one
20:06who is calling people but that was bad
20:10but what it was doing to me it started
20:12to give me a chance to listen to The
20:14Voice Within not to listen to the people
20:17I thought they have answers they must
20:19have made a mistake they don't know that
20:22I'm not an enemy they don't know that I
20:24haven't done anything wrong that I
20:26deserve to be here but when you hear
20:28when he was saying kill children that's
20:30when I said it's pure evil I need to
20:33think about what is going on what can
20:35what can I do few days after they gave
20:39order to start going in every home to
20:42see if anyone was hiding home by home
20:45you think it was bad to to be there for
20:47a week without sleeping really sitting
20:50on top of each other but to know that
20:52somebody is going to come to hunt for
20:54you it was the worst pain I've known a
20:57day
20:58came and by the second week I remember I
21:01was stretching and I saw outside of the
21:03tiny window of the bathroom something I
21:05thought was about you know maybe a th000
21:08people but later I found out there were
21:11actually 3 to 400 people came inside the
21:14house I remember they were dressed in
21:15banana leaves they had all kind of arms
21:18machetes guns grenades long spares you
21:22know all around them they were just like
21:23people scaring you some of them had God
21:26horns over their head to try to look
21:29like the devil that to scare you more
21:30and nobody was fighting them so they
21:33came inside and they started to search
21:35everywhere this was maybe the most
21:38painful moment of my life but also the
21:41most rewarding moment of my life the
21:44moment I met God truly I can say so in
21:48that moment I knew I was going to die
21:51there's nothing in me that could ever
21:52say to me maybe they might not find me
21:56it's a four bedroom 3 400 people were
21:59searching for it and they're looking for
22:01you to they know you these are neighbors
22:04and they started to search everywhere I
22:06started to even ask myself how am I
22:08going to die is my soul going to fly out
22:10of my body are they going to do this so
22:13many emotions came and so many things
22:15how I might die it was painful to wait
22:18for them it was like a thousand needles
22:21was going through my body like I was in
22:23fire but I I was not dying fully and
22:27then in that moment I started to feel as
22:29if I had two voices over my shoulders
22:32you know when they said that when people
22:34are dying that is when when your sword
22:36is you know is being fought over by the
22:39god or the devil is trying to take you
22:40away so in that moment I felt like there
22:43was two voices nothing too strange but
22:45voices that we face when we're facing a
22:47challenge so one voice was telling me
22:50open the door and the torture is too
22:54painful and that sounds like me being
22:56reasonable why wait
22:58why not just end this and actually
23:00wanted to do that however there was
23:03always another nice voice contradictory
23:05to the other one much more
23:08Kinder even if the hurs and I remember
23:11the nice voice in me said do not open
23:14the door ask God to help you remember
23:17who God is God is Almighty do you know
23:20what Almighty means it means he can do
23:23anything do you know what anything means
23:26it means if even if they find you they
23:29might not be able to kill you even if
23:31they open the door if God wants they
23:34might not be able to see you even if
23:37they shoot you the bullet might not go
23:39through you if God wants remember Daniel
23:42in the den of lions if that was possible
23:45so it's still possible and all that was
23:48really almost like fighting over either
23:51Keep Hope or give up hope if I thought
23:55about listening to this body voice I F I
23:57felt Frozen I feel like no life was in
24:00my body but when I listen to the nicer
24:02voice I literally could breathe so I
24:05remember in that second I had to choose
24:08what listen what voice to listen to the
24:10bad one that sounds like me being
24:12reasonable or the one that says no there
24:15is still hope do not give up do not open
24:18the door and I remember turning to the
24:21next voice with every set of my body I
24:24ask God if it is anyone who created me
24:28cuz in that moment I wasn't even sure if
24:30there was God there children dying
24:33innocent people are dying is there God
24:35but I remember asking if it's anyone who
24:38created me if it's anyone who put all
24:41this together this Earth I'm standing on
24:43the moon the stars the sun I am begging
24:46you just give me a sign that you exist
24:49at least even if I die I can die with
24:52hope that it doesn't end here because
24:55right now I'm not even sure you just
24:58live and then die in that moment I
25:01realize the God I'm talking to is not
25:04just going to answer me so I ask him if
25:06you can hear me Just Give Me A Sign you
25:08don't need to talk so I ask him if you
25:11can hear me don't let the killers find
25:13the door of the bathroom again this is
25:15four bedroom house with 3 400 people
25:19don't let them open the door just today
25:21I know good people die and I would die
25:24too everyone have died but just today
25:26don't let them open the door of the
25:28bathroom if they don't I will know you
25:30are there and I promise you I will seek
25:33you all my life I will find out who you
25:36are I will try your way and I will see
25:38it works but at least I will try you I'm
25:40not going to listen to the B one and
25:43after that I fed I think the good God
25:46knew I couldn't handle that conversation
25:49so I fed literally I didn't hear
25:51anything until about 4 hours 5 hours
25:54later the man who was hiding us he came
25:57in open the
25:58door I jumped I thought it was The
26:00Killers who have found us and then he
26:03told us what happened he told us they
26:06came in there were 3 to 400 people more
26:09than 200 actually big number made a
26:11circle around the house so that no one
26:13jumps out of the window CU that's what
26:15they did every day the government have
26:17hired that kind of group in every
26:19village just to go home by home they pay
26:22them give them drinks you know smokes so
26:25they can look so he told us make the
26:27made a big circle around the house so
26:29that no one jumps out of the window and
26:32then another number went inside the
26:33house under the beds they went in the
26:36closet they went in the ceiling of the
26:38house with flashlights to make sure no
26:41one was there they went on the roof of
26:43the house to see no one was laying there
26:46they even opened suitcases to make sure
26:48no babies were hiding at last he told us
26:52they came right to the door of the
26:53bathroom before they open one of the
26:56killers touched the handle he looked at
26:58him and he said you know what we trust
27:01you you are one of us you cannot hide
27:04this bad people he turned around and he
27:07left when he told us that what really
27:11strued me was not that we made it again
27:13I'm reasonable I'm think you know we
27:15would die people who lived in 1700 every
27:19Everybody died so we are going to die
27:21too but what really shocked me in that
27:23moment was oh my God God is rich God is
27:28here he heard me in the bathroom not
27:31been in the church then I start to think
27:33about everything I've read in the Bible
27:35I heard from our you know priest and
27:38saying that God can actually hear from
27:39inside I'm like so it's true he can hear
27:43everything now I was little bit scared
27:46because if you can hear everything that
27:48means we don't have much privacy you
27:51know they're looking at everything well
27:54what did that did to me I started to
27:57speak to to God as I'm talking to you
27:59now I told him about my anger I'm like
28:01okay God so I know you are there you can
28:03see everything you must be really good
28:06to watch everything happening and not
28:08strike you know but this is what is
28:11happening I believe you now I not I need
28:13to know why this is happening it was
28:16that time I truly needed wanted to know
28:19why what have gone
28:21wrong I asked the mom who was hiding us
28:24to give me the Bible so can I can read I
28:27can understand the word of
28:30God I can understand what went wrong and
28:33I remember I wanted to understand three
28:35things a little simple just a big
28:37picture of our life who are we where do
28:40we come from why are we here what are we
28:43supposed to do how long do we stay here
28:45and where do we go of course I can't
28:48know myself to Define that but I wanted
28:51to see it now from the perspective of
28:54God I feel like okay we were created
28:57from from God I started to read then I
28:59asked him since I know now that he's
29:02there but why did you create me why did
29:04you put me in this mess I feel like you
29:06was speaking back because I love you how
29:09many of us are parents look what I went
29:12through and I still have children I
29:14created you to share with you Paradise
29:17with life and if you you just accept to
29:20be laid by my my guidance I promise you
29:22even life here will be okay but what is
29:25more beautiful is Paradise it is what is
29:28in the Bible then I remember so how long
29:30do we stay here 100 years maybe I mean
29:33how many people who get to that so what
29:36about after that where do we go again
29:38remember I'm taking it completely now
29:40from the perspective of the god I accept
29:43as a Catholic and I truly respect every
29:45religion how we believe we just have to
29:47be honest with what we believe so I took
29:50it like so where do we go from that I
29:52went in the Bible well there's a choice
29:55of heaven and there's a choice of hell
29:57is it's up to you what do you choose to
29:58work for I didn't want to look at hell
30:01because oh it was bad and I felt like I
30:04was in Hell already but I wanted to read
30:07about heaven you know it's hard to work
30:09for a price if you don't know what the
30:11price is about so I wanted to read about
30:13heaven to actually see what is it is it
30:15worth working for so I look at Heaven oh
30:18I really encourage you by the way to
30:21work for heaven the roads are diamond in
30:24Gold no more pain okay diamonds and gold
30:28the road okay this is good I believe I
30:31told God I believe until you disappoint
30:33me so I'm reading everything I'm like
30:35this is good no more pain no more
30:37getting sick no more wors no more people
30:40tricking and lying I'm like this is
30:42really fun and then how long is it
30:46eternity it doesn't end I mean forever
30:49and ever okay again I'm going to trust
30:52God okay I want to go there how do you
30:54get there then I remember going back to
30:56the Bible
30:58uh look at my Commandments love one
31:00another it is really the whole sum of it
31:03love God above and love one another as
31:05you love yourself I mean I think I can
31:08do that until I started to read between
31:11the lines of all the Commandments I felt
31:14like every page I opened in the Bible
31:16was speaking to me about forgiveness and
31:19I didn't like it every page I will open
31:22like oh pray for those who hates you I'm
31:24like no no no close that page anything
31:26else but not that one and I would open
31:29another one uh forgive how many times
31:31it's 7 70 times I can't even forgive
31:34once I started to get scared that I
31:37might not make it the nice place so I
31:40closed the Bible because I didn't want
31:42to think about forgiveness I had so much
31:45anger towards the people who were
31:46killing us I had so much anger I thought
31:50about things that sometimes I felt like
31:52I was like you know Rumble you know just
31:55killing people and flying planes and
31:57throwing grenades all over the country
31:59and blowing people up and I'm like okay
32:02good I did it and the worst thing about
32:04anger it become obsessive it becomes
32:07like a like a sickness you think you are
32:10done with hating them no you start again
32:13from the beginning I'm like I'm tired
32:16now I can take a break but no I'm not
32:18done because the anger continue to go on
32:22have you seen that sometimes we even
32:24think about people we hate more than we
32:26think about people we love and that is
32:28so unfair so it was completely
32:31everything that was in my mind I'm like
32:33what do I do with this however because I
32:36knew about God now I put the Bible on
32:39the side now I truly truly have said I
32:42believe in you God I wanted to know what
32:44to do I can't forgive but what else can
32:46I do I remember the words I read pray
32:49pray unceasingly I remember I took the
32:52rosary my father gave me the rosary when
32:53I was separating with him and I took it
32:56and and I started to pray so one Rosary
32:59for those who don't know about this is
33:01really just like a be represent what
33:03prayer to say one Rosary takes about 20
33:06minutes 25 minutes I'm not kidding I say
33:09the first Rosary I feel like I moved
33:12from hell to a PR of air because now my
33:15mind was on something else was thinking
33:17about Jesus and his life it was actually
33:20a story oh he was born you know like the
33:23joyful you know you think about the joy
33:25he had he was BN in Bethlehem or what
33:28happened what Mary had what did she feel
33:31oh Joseph why was he standing so my mind
33:34completely went with them and then I
33:36thought about their sorrow the pain they
33:38went through the glory defeating death
33:41you know Resurrection I'm like this is
33:43good but it was it took me away from my
33:46pain cuz now I was thinking of their
33:48life meditating on their life then I
33:50thought let me say this prayer all day
33:54again for those who know about this one
33:56text 25 minute 25 minutes I said 27
34:00rosaries every single day from that time
34:02on because it was the only time I was
34:05able to have peace because my mind will
34:07be with them then after time I remember
34:10one part started to bug me a part of the
34:13Rosary our Lord is prayer many
34:16Christians share this prayer any time I
34:19reach to this part that said forgive us
34:22our trespasses as we forgive I'm like oh
34:26that again
34:27no I can't forgive them no there's no
34:29way I can forgive them no I don't want
34:31to lie to God who listen to my heart so
34:33I better be sincere from inside so I had
34:36a bad idea I started to skip that part
34:38of the prayer because I didn't want to
34:41lie to The God Who can hear from inside
34:43I mean if we lie to our friends what
34:45happened we risk to lose them and I
34:48don't want to lose my friend the only
34:50one who was there my parents who really
34:52were good parents my mom was that kind
34:55of person who still Tu you in bed when
34:57you are 20 so now she doesn't know where
35:00you are in some ways I was mad at her
35:03like you should have told me that you're
35:05not Almighty like you you can't do this
35:09my father I knew he can kill if somebody
35:11hurt me if he had the power but now you
35:14realize that Oh my he doesn't have all
35:16the power there was God and I think just
35:19God now what was inside you the prayers
35:22that I taught you the the the lessons of
35:25Life they have taught me it is what I
35:27was left with now I'm talking to God so
35:29I skipped that part I kept praying like
35:32that thinking I'm good with God now
35:34because I can't forgive until one day I
35:37remember I was about to skip that part
35:40you know what they say truly prayer from
35:42the heart can change you even your own
35:45character you can I love what I hear in
35:47this and I mean what I have heard so
35:49many times from Tony in his teachings
35:52but even just today you know to to be
35:55open to change to transform it's so
35:58important but but prayer is really what
36:01did it for me in that time I can't talk
36:04I can't talk to anyone even to the women
36:05who were together but I just wanted to
36:07be sincere because we have to be honest
36:10with ourselves too do I even believe
36:12this just question yourself so as I'm
36:15going through that I'm going you know
36:17without mentioning these words I felt
36:20actually that God was okay with me now
36:23because I'm talking to him the truth I
36:25can't lie to you that I forgive when I
36:26don't so I kept praying like that until
36:29one day I was about to skip that part
36:31and I felt as I felt as if somebody was
36:34touching me like hey I hope you know our
36:36Lord's Prayer is not manmade is Jesus
36:40himself who gave those words the one you
36:42believe he God the one you believe
36:44cannot make a mistake if I were you I
36:48will not change his
36:50prayer what am I going to do now because
36:53remember this is not halfway I truly
36:56believe in him and I was waiting let me
36:58see I'm going to do my part and let me
37:01see what you do are you going to keep
37:02your part too truly like ask shall be
37:06given you mean that you mean that if you
37:09really ask a mountain to move that can
37:11be possible but we have to do our part
37:14every relationship is two ways you know
37:16so with that I just wanted to do my part
37:19let me see what he does and all of a
37:21sudden I realized that I am changing his
37:24prayer for the first time
37:27in my life I understood the meaning of
37:32surrendering I remember I don't remember
37:34if I had any place to kneel but I felt
37:37as if I went on my knees and I put my
37:39hands up and I begged God if you know
37:42how to forgive help me out you are God I
37:47am not I make many mistakes but you
37:50never make a mistake at least from the G
37:53I'm reading from this Bible so I'm going
37:55to give this to you you said ask it
37:57shall be given I am going to give it to
37:59you change my heart and all of a sudden
38:03I realized that I've been fighting so
38:05hard all I needed was a little humility
38:08just to give it to him I don't have to
38:11figure out everything by myself just to
38:14be able to give it to him help me just
38:16to ask that it took so much so now I
38:20knew it was in God's hands and I put
38:22back the prayer as he said it every time
38:26I went through that I will say I still
38:28haven't forgiven I don't know how you
38:29forgive somebody who is trying to kill
38:31your mom your dad everybody who looks
38:33like you so please God you are God if
38:36you say so it must be like that I kep
38:39praying now putting back the whole
38:41prayer again haven't forgiven yet until
38:44one day I was meditating on a part of
38:47the Rosary the fifth sorrowful mystery
38:49when Jesus is dying on the cross and I
38:52just wanted to know what that means you
38:54died on the cross why I mean you are God
38:56God why would you not just save us in
38:58one word why would you come to live with
39:00us 33 years why would you choose the
39:03painful way why didn't you just the easy
39:06way you know come like the pope dress
39:08nice and just be and I felt as if I this
39:11was not joke it was truly with all my
39:13heart I feel like God was speaking back
39:15to me and I truly believe he speaks to
39:18all of us when we sincerely ask
39:20questions he really answers us if we are
39:23sincere so I feel like he was telling me
39:26well
39:27I went through this because I love you I
39:30did not want to teach you what life
39:33might offer by words by by action I went
39:38through this so that if you ever go
39:40through to anything close to what I have
39:42going through remember I was there
39:44before you learn from
39:48me in that moment I'm like you're right
39:52you you were God you went through pain
39:54and me I'm thinking this is the worst
39:55thing can ever ever happen but who am I
39:58if God can go through this and again
40:00he's showing me this is possible and
40:02it's true there is suffering in life is
40:05how we take it and then I remember what
40:07took me by surprise when he said I'm
40:10reading the Bible trying to understand
40:12what happened why when he said forgive
40:15them Father they don't know what they do
40:18I knew these words before I knew of
40:21course you know I prayed the rosary
40:22before I read the Bible about this but
40:25that time it just shocked me touched me
40:27in a place or my eyes were open it was
40:31like a thunder in my heart they don't
40:33get it that was the answer I've been
40:36looking for how do you forgive they
40:38don't get it and you trying to put your
40:41energy in hating them doesn't change
40:44anything pray for them don't hate they
40:48have succeeded to take you to their side
40:51all of a sudden it felt as if the world
40:53was divided it was like really clear
40:56like the world was divided in two parts
40:58a part of love and a part of hate and a
41:01part of hate there were people like
41:03Hitler people who those who were causing
41:06the genocide those who were killing but
41:08on the side of Love there were people
41:10like Mother Teresa people we know in the
41:13history of Love Like Gandhi you know
41:15people like Mandela a man goes in prison
41:17for 27 years and he comes out speaking
41:20about love let's forgive let's reconcile
41:24so these are the people and when I felt
41:27like my Lord my Jesus was showing me
41:29this two part we all belong to either we
41:32are on a side of hate either we on the
41:34side of love he showed me those who were
41:37in the side of love I realized that
41:39people on the side of Love are people
41:41who have known suffering who have known
41:43pain rejected betrayer all kind of pain
41:48but the difference between them and
41:50those who are in a sign of hate is they
41:53don't let hatred rule them they stand up
41:57for what they believe to be right they
41:59stand up for love they stand up for
42:01Justice For Peace no matter what
42:03happened to them and when I found these
42:06people it was like okay I'm not alone
42:09then let me go to their side these are
42:11the people I admire these are the people
42:13who are doing good so when I felt like I
42:16moved to their side of love it was like
42:18a huge luggage was lifted from my
42:20shoulders I truly F free and that was
42:24left with a huge obsession of anger that
42:27was continuously going through my mind
42:29even when I was not praying this time I
42:32wasn't thinking about the killers I
42:34start to feel like okay now that I have
42:37forgiven what am I going to do when I
42:39come out and what I realized when I was
42:41able to let go that anger it didn't feel
42:44what I thought was going to be because
42:46before I was like so if I forgive them
42:49that that's it they heard me and I give
42:51them a gift it was as if I felt I'm
42:53giving them something but this time like
42:55no
42:56it's you where you are in your heart be
42:59on the side of love and actually I felt
43:02much more clearer about who was wrong
43:04who was bad who was not how to protect
43:07myself if you read my book left to tell
43:10actually I started to learn English when
43:12I was in the bathroom everything changed
43:14but my mind was clear now after the
43:17anger was gone it felt like a ver was
43:19unveiled I can see now in the future
43:22because there's no bitterness now now I
43:24can truly say that I God can hear me
43:27because there was no anger our anger
43:30block us from God's
43:33blessings we ended up staying in that
43:35bathroom 3
43:37months since April since April until
43:40July I wish I knew how long it was going
43:42to be I didn't know for one even one
43:45hour that I was going to leave that one
43:47hour but we spent 3 months and the way
43:50we did we came out the world was over
43:54the people from My Tribe and people from
43:56the hudu tribe who were against the
43:58genocide they joined an army from Uganda
44:01and they fought day by day to capture
44:04the country to free the country and
44:06that's how we were able to come out when
44:08they captured the capital the very first
44:11night I came out I was truly hoping that
44:14maybe somebody in my family was still
44:16hiding as I was but the very first night
44:19I was in a refug camp and I found
44:21somebody to ask what happened if she he
44:24knows anything that have happened to my
44:26family and he gave me one by one
44:29everyone I left behind they were killed
44:32my mom was killed my dad my two brothers
44:36my grandma my grandpa a million people
44:40was killed in a period of 3
44:42months everywhere was dead bodies our
44:45homes were destroyed every memory those
44:49things you kept everything was
44:51completely destroyed and I remember
44:54throwing the rosary my father given me
44:56on his side have said I didn't even like
44:59anymore the prayers because the prayers
45:01had a way of like they put a shelter
45:03around me that was almost too good to be
45:05true I'm like forget about prayers now
45:08let me just be real I cried and screamed
45:11for like 5 minutes and after those five
45:14minutes I felt as if there was like
45:16giant hands of God around me and
45:19something was telling me hey the Journey
45:23of your loved ones is over here on Earth
45:26but not in heaven but your journey is
45:29not over yet and you don't know how long
45:32it's going to be it might be one more
45:34hour one more year 10 20 50 60 80 but
45:40whatever that is only God knows what is
45:43in your power is how you choose how to
45:46spend your day by day by your moment by
45:49moment just now and the truth is all of
45:53us nobody really have any guarantee to
45:56one more hour we hear tragedies all
45:58around the world we try to forget it and
46:00that's good we don't have to live by
46:02remembering every tragedy but really no
46:04one has a guarantee but if we knew we
46:06don't have that guarantee what would we
46:09do love one another ask for forgiveness
46:12today no don't wait for tomorrow if you
46:14have a chance to do it today apologize
46:17to those you need to apologize to I feel
46:19God was telling me so your life is your
46:23gift and you don't know how long it is
46:24can it be one hour is your gift is up to
46:27you you can choose to love or to hate to
46:30uplift or P down be kind or be mean but
46:34if you choose kind if you choose love I
46:36am with you ask me for anything you want
46:39I will give it to you Moment by moment
46:42and you don't have to ask for too much
46:45because if you are still alive tomorrow
46:47I will be there too so you can ask me
46:50for what you want that time I literally
46:52took a paper and I started to write down
46:55things I wanted to ask God and because
46:58he was my father now and I took that
47:01seriously and I would ask him okay God
47:03not for tomorrow just today I want
47:07clothes to change and I want a friend
47:11somebody I can just share my what is
47:13going on with a girlfriend somebody to
47:15love with and I want a bed and I want
47:19bed sheets and I want a blanket I didn't
47:21want to take anything for granted
47:23anymore you know sometimes we think if
47:25we ask house it would come with
47:27equipment and chairs and everything like
47:29no no no God I need also a blanket and a
47:33pillow and I would need actually h a
47:36sweater no two I need two so I will
47:38write to him everything and I can't
47:41believe the next chapter of my life was
47:45continuously even to this day to watch
47:47God doing what he does best to give you
47:51the joy to see your dream come true but
47:54when you have them and when you present
47:56them I remember one of the simple thing
47:59that happened in the beginning um so I
48:01had this list I just wanted close to
48:03change that time if you give me a house
48:05I would not even know how to deal with a
48:07house so I just wanted what I needed
48:09that time and again even today so I
48:12needed some clothes to change because I
48:14had one clothes for the past four
48:16months so I received an envelope few
48:19weeks after that this is how it happened
48:22the envelope was sent by a friend of
48:24mine we went to high school to together
48:26in she was she have gone to school in
48:28Belgium and she took a big envelope kak
48:31still remember that put a jeans a
48:34T-shirt and a dress and she put a note
48:37and she said I have heard many people
48:40who died in our school but no one have
48:44confirmed to me that you are dead yet in
48:47case you are still alive you must need
48:49some clothes to change she put this in
48:52an envelope went to the airport without
48:54an address just give it to a soldier
48:56anybody going to Rwanda so the soldier
48:59is like there's no address and she said
49:01well everybody knows each other in
49:03Rwanda you know just go give it to
49:04anyone around her age group they will
49:07find her and the soldier said okay fine
49:09this soldier end up in my refuge camp
49:13and he's like okay find this lady I'm
49:15like it's me it's me how is this
49:17possible so I found the envelope and I
49:20found the clothes and I went to the list
49:22I gave God I'm like okay thank you for
49:24sending the clothes
49:27literally I just lived day by day just
49:30like that and to telling the truth I
49:33still feel like it's the same today like
49:35I said I'm just to meet you to see you
49:39you know you're like okay God I actually
49:41I really love what they share I really
49:43love their hearts I just love the
49:45boldness and the truth in you and how
49:48you share I just love that I wish I meet
49:50them and God is like just wait a little
49:53patience how I wrote my book left there
49:56meeting when it was literally in letters
49:59of course I still like that to this day
50:01writing like dear God how do I publish
50:03my book I never knew when day before but
50:06I met him and and I don't know how to
50:08publish a book so I'm going to pray and
50:11I will see what you will do with it I
50:13literally met wend who literally
50:15published my book three days after I
50:18finished writing the book I thought it
50:20was going to be 3 years later and then I
50:22met him and in a ways that you never
50:25thought or was possible I was online
50:27actually I was in a conference and I saw
50:29him I didn't know who he was never met
50:32him before and he was online and there's
50:34a long line went to this man I'm like
50:37what is he telling people why is
50:39everyone smiling coming to see him some
50:42of them crying this is now like some
50:45years after after I have left Rwanda
50:47lived in in United States and I was
50:50working with United Nations until my
50:53first book came out and in in 2006 so I
50:57went online I just finished my book on
51:00March 31st and I'm writing to God every
51:03day praying loving and just doing the
51:06best I can and you know loving everybody
51:09you know helping other people because
51:11that is the way to God's heart is truly
51:13loving other people when you do you know
51:15that he's going to come back to you so
51:17I'm like okay God you know I don't even
51:19want anyone to thank me I just let me do
51:21this but I want you to thank me I want
51:24you to do something 3 days after I went
51:26to the the line and I met this man who
51:28was end of the line I mean went there I
51:31didn't know what they were doing going
51:33to do there so when I reach about 10
51:35people I just wanted to to know what is
51:37he telling people when I reach about 10
51:40people I realized that he was
51:41autographing his book to for them so I
51:44don't know he writes about who he is
51:46what am I going to do I wanted to run
51:49away but something's like just buy a
51:51book pretend to look like you know what
51:53you're doing okay fine let me just be
51:56like everybody I go to him and he got to
51:59sign my book I want to run after he
52:01signed it and uh he called me back he
52:04pulled me actually he's like how are you
52:06I say I'm fine and then he said where'
52:09that accent come from I'm like I don't
52:11have an accent but anyway I told him I'm
52:13from Rwanda and I remember his face lit
52:15up and he's like do you know what
52:17happened there I'm like yeah I know but
52:20everything is good now and truly the
52:22country is amazing now and then he goes
52:25he wanted to know what happened who am I
52:27and and I told him uh everything is good
52:29now and he's said where is your parents
52:31so I couldn't not tell him but I said
52:33like in a minute I'm like well they're
52:35in heaven you know what about your
52:37siblings oh they're all good but you
52:39know they're in heaven he's like what so
52:42where were you were you there or here I
52:44T him a little bit I was in the bathroom
52:47and you know was survived and he looked
52:49at me he said what makes you smile after
52:52what happened to you I'm like well you
52:54know life doesn't end here that is
52:56heaven I just hope I do my part you know
52:59and he looked at me again I said have
53:01you thought about writing a book I
53:03literally finished three days before I'm
53:05like I can't tell him like yeah three
53:07days ago I finished so I told him like I
53:09thought about that and he said uh I
53:13promise I mean I never heard those words
53:16I truly never met anyone who wrote a
53:18book before I have I was new in the
53:20country he's like I promise you if you
53:23find a way you can tell people how you
53:24can be yourself after what happened to
53:26you I'm sure there is a secret I will
53:29publish your book I'm like who are you
53:31how do you know have I published books
53:33so I had to go home and go to the Google
53:35and find out his name who is this man
53:37who is telling me he's going to show me
53:39to find out he have publish maybe 40
53:42books who became such a like a father to
53:45me truly but I left Randa in
53:481998 before I left I went to meet a man
53:51who killed my family I had peace all
53:53this time the time I I was able to let
53:55go I mean I still cry to this day I miss
53:58my parents and that will never change I
54:01think about my dad my bom my brothers
54:04but when I met the man who killed my
54:07family I wasn't sure what I was going to
54:09feel and the people thought oh you crazy
54:11to forgive it must be just a mechanism
54:14of surviving you going to go crazy after
54:16one time I'm like am I going to go back
54:19to that place without peace again and I
54:21went to him I truly when I saw him he
54:24used to be like a man like many of you
54:26here who used to have a beautiful family
54:28dressed nice had a good job but when I
54:30saw him in a prison I see remember his
54:33feet was swelling his clothes were
54:36teared up and he haven't shaved in six
54:39months he just was dirty he was
54:42desperate and I feel like that voice in
54:44my heart again do you remember what I
54:46told you they don't get it and it is not
54:50about them alone it is like all of us
54:52when we hurt when other people people
54:55when we Act without love we don't know
54:58what we do I'm a Catholic I go to
55:00confession every two weeks I go to
55:02confession I always find a way I could
55:05have loved better I could have been
55:07nicer I could have been Kinder I should
55:09have said that better because we are
55:12people but the most important thing is
55:14that we are able to change and God
55:16forgives so that man I offered him
55:19forgiveness I cried he was standing
55:21there I cried I cried for his family I
55:25cried for his children I cried for him
55:28for taking s decision that he would that
55:30we make him go to that place that his
55:33family will lose him too and I realized
55:35that if he cannot love himself how can
55:39he love
55:40me I want to end here but before I say I
55:44end I want to say you know anytime I
55:46speak to a group I feel like I'm talking
55:49to a big group but truly I'm speaking to
55:53individuals and I just want to to say
55:56from my heart to yours whatever you may
55:58be going through because we all have our
56:00own life experience we shared of the
56:03fear we you know we don't know what
56:05tomorrow we bring but whatever you may
56:07be facing please remember there is
56:10always hope hold on to God holding to
56:13good use your strength do the best you
56:16can to do and and just enjoy it and
56:19lastly if I can forgive anyone can
56:23forgive thank you so much
56:35so

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