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Eva Schloss: Holocaust Survivor, Anne Frank's Childhood Friend — Transcript

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0:01next we open the illinois channel
0:02archives for an encore presentation of
0:04our interview with holocaust survivor
0:06eva schloss
0:08as a child sauce was a playmate of anne
0:10frank and in 1944 schloss like frank was
0:13captured by the germans and sent to a
0:15concentration camp
0:16she shares her story of her family
0:18before world war ii how they tried to
0:20avoid being captured when the nazis came
0:22to power and finally what happened to
0:25the rest of her family after they were
0:26sent to a concentration camp this runs
0:29about 50 minutes
0:32please welcome terry martin
0:40thank you david
0:41and ladies and gentlemen thank you all
0:44for uh allowing us to be here today on
0:46what is
0:47really a very special program
0:50i uh
0:51use as a shorthand for telling people
0:54what i was going to be doing today as
0:56far as this interview i said
0:59you're all more or less familiar with
1:00the story of anne frank
1:02but
1:04what if
1:05you could have talked to anne frank what
1:07if she had lived
1:09and could have told us
1:11beyond the diary what had happened to
1:14her when she went to the camp
1:16how did she survive
1:18and how did she adjust to life
1:20afterwards
1:21that in fact
1:23is the story of our guest today eva
1:26schloss
1:27who knew anne frank whose life's
1:29paralleled and eva has her own story i
1:31only use anne frank as a reference point
1:33since we've all seen the movie
1:36but eva has a story that
1:38i think resounds through the decades
1:41and for the decades that come for those
1:43who will watch
1:45and hear her story
1:47in the decades and
1:48centuries to come via what we will do
1:51today and we thank her for being able to
1:53share her story let me introduce if i
1:55might even schloss
2:09uh
2:11ladies and gentlemen we start uh eva's
2:13story when she was born on may 11
2:17and grew up and had a
2:21wonderful life to begin with
2:24in austria
2:25and i wonder if we might even if i might
2:27have you just read from uh barb powers
2:30book who is with us today the promise
2:32this is the first paragraph of the
2:33introduction which i think just sets up
2:35how nice her life was prior to
2:38the nazis taking over
2:40as i look back more than 60 years to the
2:43early part of my life the pictures in my
2:46memory are crystal clear
2:48many reveal happy faces my family
2:51gathered around the supper table my
2:53friends in the game around us around us
2:56and the summer's afternoon my father in
2:59the mountains my brother hands with a
3:01paintbrush in his hands
3:03and grandfather at the piano with me on
3:06his lap i can see flowers in our garden
3:10presents on my birthday and new shoes
3:12for my growing feet i hear laughter
3:15wonderful music and my mother's
3:17comforting words
3:20and and you had eva uh so your father
3:22was eric and he ran a uh shoe uh
3:25manufacturing or shoe sales
3:27uh your brother heinz who was as you
3:30noted they're an accomplished painter
3:33uh and
3:35we will show some of those paintings in
3:37the course of our program when we
3:39televise this
3:40uh and your mother who
3:43was a wonderful woman and actually life
3:45was pretty good in austria yes before
3:48the war before he'd let him in
3:50we were well off we had a wonderful
3:52family
3:54many
3:55aunts and uncles and an extended family
3:58so
3:59i grew up there
4:01as a jewish family but not really
4:03religious
4:04and
4:05we didn't feel any anti-semitism so it
4:07was dormant of course
4:10one of the things i was going to say
4:11that your family enjoyed doing your
4:13father would like to take you hiking in
4:14the mountains
4:15yes he was one of the first people who
4:18had a car he came home one day and said
4:20to my mother look out of the window and
4:23there was this funny little vehicle
4:25standing
4:27and immediately went up into the
4:29mountains on dangerous
4:31bends my mother screaming
4:34you know because people were not used in
4:36the roads were not that good
4:38but
4:39so you know i remember all this this um
4:43sadness really
4:44because it all came to an end
4:48the
4:49you're right though at one point i
4:50believe you were in the mountains and
4:52and you saw the edelweiss flower and
4:54your
4:55father what did your father advice did
4:57you give as you were hiking
4:59well he said climb up there
5:02and you can get this very precious
5:04flower because it only grows really
5:07where a lot of rocks are and it's
5:09difficult to get
5:10and you shouldn't really pick them but
5:13we did pick one
5:16and as you were retiring as a young girl
5:19he he he told you that the goal that you
5:22how should you climb and not not focus
5:24on the
5:25the angle um yes never look down always
5:28look up and you'll be able to reach the
5:31top
5:32and this is what i've been doing all my
5:34life
5:35and i think those words came back to you
5:37many times in years to come it wasn't i
5:39mean it was almost as if the struggles
5:41that came
5:42your father
5:44definitely sustained me
5:46and then uh in march of 1938 they had
5:50what they called the onslaught
5:52what was the onslaught
5:54that was when hitler's army marched into
5:57austria there was no fighting the
6:00austrian people welcomed hitler
6:02everywhere from the windows flags this
6:05swastika was displayed
6:07and of course not in jewish homes
6:10and people
6:11were really happy to become part of this
6:15wonderful german race which hitler
6:17promised was going to conquer first the
6:20whole of europe and later even become
6:23the most powerful
6:25state in the whole world
6:27and of course they had
6:30been in their in the 30s that there had
6:32been a horrible depression across the
6:34world and and they were thinking that in
6:36part that they were going to have
6:37economic redevelopment or their economy
6:40was improved would improve right this is
6:42what happened in germany hitler promised
6:45things were going to get better and it
6:47did get better he was the first one who
6:49built
6:50autobahn the motorways
6:52so germany was the first country who had
6:54said and as well he promised everybody
6:57to have a car the beetle the volkswagen
7:00means car for the people
7:03and he delivered that and that's why
7:06people went along and austria was going
7:09to have the same thing
7:11but
7:13eventually or maybe not in too long
7:16attitudes began to change the people who
7:18you had known and were
7:21neighbors and people that were how did
7:24the attitudes of the
7:25austrians and those surrounding you
7:27begin to change um well it didn't take
7:29very long immediately the dormant
7:32anti-semitism came out
7:35and
7:36people immediately lost their businesses
7:38in germany it was a long process it took
7:41many years but in austria it happened
7:43immediately so in the next few months
7:46already
7:48we were attacked physically
7:50beaten up
7:52our houses were smashed
7:54windows were smashed in
7:56jewish shops were boycotted and life
7:58became really immediately very very
8:00dangerous and difficult to sustain
8:03anymore
8:04and then one day your brother heinz who
8:08again was just a a pretty sensitive
8:10young man a great painter a pianist
8:14could play rhapsody in blue which is one
8:15of my favorite pieces and pretty
8:17difficult piece i know
8:19but he was beaten up is that right when
8:20he was beaten up yes but
8:23in his own school by his own friends
8:25and the teachers just looked on and
8:28didn't interfere this was a policy it
8:30was
8:31you know from the government down it was
8:34a good thing to
8:36hurt jews and
8:38damage them in any way possible
8:42what was going on in your mind then
8:45i couldn't understand you know
8:47i was just nine years old and i couldn't
8:51understand the sudden change the
8:53attitude of
8:54my family's friends my own friends who
8:57had been friends since we were very
9:00little children suddenly i was not
9:02welcome anymore in their homes and as
9:05jews were boycotted and it was very
9:08difficult for me to understand that
9:10and
9:11my parents explained to me for as jewish
9:15people
9:16life is going to be really very very
9:18difficult and as i said we were going to
9:21try to leave the country as soon as
9:23possible
9:25and then
9:27eventually too your father's business
9:29began to suffer because people were
9:32no longer doing business with them yes
9:34it just didn't pay him anymore so you
9:37know he just couldn't function anymore
9:40so then in in about after about two
9:42years of this in february of 1940 you
9:45moved to amsterdam is that right um well
9:48we left actually austria at the end of
9:511938. first my father went to holland
9:54and then when we wanted to follow um we
9:57didn't get a permit to settle in holland
10:00so we went instead to
10:02belgium again the belgium government
10:05didn't give us a visa but we had to go
10:09illegally over the border
10:11and once you were there you were able to
10:13stay
10:15and then
10:16after the war had been already declared
10:18in 1939
10:19after hitler had invaded czechoslovakia
10:22and
10:23tried to conquer poland and england and
10:26france declared war
10:29then my father tried well he had tried
10:31all the time actually he tried to get a
10:33visa for us to be able to
10:36live in holland as well
10:38and eventually in february 1940 he was
10:42successful we got a visiting permit to
10:44stay for three months in amsterdam
10:47your grandfather uh immigrated to
10:50england
10:52why didn't
10:53why didn't your family go to england my
10:55father had no business contact in
10:57england
10:58and you know to make a living to keep a
11:01family alive
11:02um you had to have um an income
11:05and um and this is one of the reasons
11:07why so there are several jewish people
11:10in germany and austria who didn't have
11:12the courage to leave the country because
11:15they thought how can i make a living in
11:17a foreign country where we don't speak
11:19the language we haven't got connections
11:22and people we were not allowed to take
11:25anything out of germany or austria no
11:28money no belongings and so it was very
11:30difficult
11:32so in holland my father had business con
11:36connections so um and we thought our
11:39parents thought that even with poland's
11:42that
11:43german start to conquer the world that
11:45holland will
11:47be kept out of the war like it was in
11:49the first world war
11:51and we might say we all look through the
11:54prism of what we know eventually
11:55happened but when the war began in
11:58september of 39 when hitler went into
12:00poland and england and france then
12:03declared war on germany
12:06their
12:07view and probably everyone's view was
12:08that of the first world war where the
12:10allies were successful in keeping the
12:12germans at bay for for years
12:15no one expected the collapse of france
12:17in in six weeks and for all these
12:19countries to be overrun
12:21when that happened then in in roughly
12:24about may of 1940
12:27what happened under your family
12:29well holland was invaded there was only
12:32a very short war five days
12:35and the german armies marched in as well
12:37so they're not welcomed like it was in
12:39in austria but um anyway you know there
12:43was no dutch didn't have a big army they
12:45couldn't fight it
12:47and so um
12:48holland was occupied like
12:51later belgium and later france and
12:53norway
12:54so hitler really started to occupy
12:57already a great part of europe
12:59and the measures against jewish people
13:02were put into
13:04place very soon after occupation
13:07there were quite a number of dutch nazis
13:10but um from austria seize inquired which
13:13was a nazi he came to be the
13:17leader of the occupation army and he was
13:20a very very
13:22wicked person
13:25i i should say just to jump back in time
13:28a little bit one of the people that you
13:30met then when you moved to holland was
13:31the frank family and since many people
13:35and uh school children watching this
13:38have have read the diary of anne frank
13:40who eventually became your step-sister
13:42but that was after uh
13:44after the war
13:47but what was you played with anne frank
13:49as a child just tell us a little bit of
13:50what you recall for yes we moved to a
13:53square in amsterdam called the merveille
13:55plain
13:56and
13:58it was sort of a triangle with many
14:00apartments on both sides and the frank
14:04family lived on one side and we lived on
14:06the other side and what was customary at
14:09that time in holland after school all
14:12the children went out to play with each
14:14other and that is how i met anne who was
14:17the same age as me
14:1911 years old at the time
14:21if she had lived she would be now like
14:23me 79 years old she was just one month
14:27younger than me
14:28and we became friends
14:31and of course many people asked me how
14:33was she tell me more about her but of
14:36course she was at that time you know
14:38just one of my playmates
14:40but we were not best friends because she
14:42was i was a wild child a tomboy i had a
14:46brother we played games wild games
14:49tricks on the bicycle and things like
14:51that and anna was more a little
14:53sophisticated girl a real girl girl
14:57with some
14:58veins she was interested in her
15:00hairstyles and in clothes
15:03and but she was a leader you could see
15:05that already she always had a group of
15:07people
15:08sitting around her and she always
15:10decided what so we're going to do if so
15:13we're going to go there was a local
15:15ice parlor we were going to go to this
15:18oasis it was called or we were going to
15:20go to the movies or things like that so
15:23she was a leader but i certainly didn't
15:26suspect that she would be capable to
15:28write such a wonderful book that she did
15:31in hiding
15:34well and as we've
15:36many of us have seen and heard from her
15:38diary she went her family went into
15:40honey you your family tell us about how
15:43your family came to go into hiding and
15:45about what you had to experience during
15:47that period
15:48at the same time in july 1942
15:52many jewish teenagers
15:54sort of between the age of 16 and 25 got
15:58a call-up notice to be deported to
16:00germany
16:02and many parents
16:04didn't know what to do and so they did
16:06send their youngsters
16:08but they were all killed in mauthausen
16:11only after the war did we hear about
16:13that
16:14but the frank family and my father had
16:18decided if a danger would come up one
16:21day
16:22we would go into hiding so we didn't
16:24that's children we didn't know our
16:26parents protected us as much as possible
16:29of bad news
16:30but once his call-up notice came
16:34hence didn't want to go of course and my
16:36parents decided they wouldn't send him
16:38luckily
16:39and we would go into hiding hiding meant
16:43said you had to have connection with
16:45resistance people by that time in 42 so
16:49in holland there was a big organization
16:52as a resistance who blew up trains blew
16:55up bridges killed particularly
16:59dangerous nazis printed russian books
17:02because nobody would take you in in
17:04hiding without the russian book there
17:06was very little food even on the books
17:09but without said you couldn't sustain
17:11another family so the printed said later
17:14they did raids on the offices where
17:17those books were kept and so we were
17:19able to go into hiding with connections
17:23with the resistance recommended so those
17:26were all people who hated the germans
17:29the germans were the enemies but silva
17:31say whereas a hill is a heroes save as a
17:34people who risk their own life to help
17:38innocent people mainly jewish people but
17:41as well later people from the resistance
17:44or
17:44young german men who were picked up from
17:47the street to to were sent to germany um
17:50to work in factories who didn't want to
17:52go so they were so they were slave labor
17:54slave labor they went as well into
17:57hiding later people from the resistance
17:59who were
18:01identified went into hiding so
18:04many many people were in hiding all over
18:07holland when you were in hiding what
18:09kind of space did you have to live in
18:11and
18:13i believe you said you had to stay very
18:14still during the day yes for two years
18:18we went hiding and um
18:21and if you ever been in holland you know
18:22people don't live in houses they live in
18:25apartments which were usually quite
18:28small and i must say no no rich people
18:31at houses usually didn't help it was
18:34usually the working people who put us up
18:38and they had small accommodation so we
18:42were lucky if we had our own room
18:44and
18:46well the people who went out to work we
18:48were not allowed to move we were sitting
18:51down at the table we had prepared our
18:53lunch meal we had a potty next to us
18:56because we couldn't walk because the
18:58floorboards might creak and people
19:00downstairs might hear there are people
19:03upstairs
19:04they might not necessarily know that
19:06there are jewish people hiding but
19:08perhaps a burglar so they might call the
19:10police so um we had to sit still really
19:14the whole day
19:15and this went on for two years can you
19:16imagine a
19:18young
19:20very athletic young girl i mean sitting
19:22still for a year after the only company
19:25my mother we got on very very well i had
19:28a wonderful relationship with my mother
19:30but nevertheless you know our
19:32conversation was soon um well you know
19:36what do you talk for two years and i was
19:38at that time i didn't like reading i
19:40didn't like writing
19:42so um
19:44you know i didn't really know what to do
19:46with myself it was like being a prisoner
19:48it was
19:50and then in fact uh on on two occasions
19:52you were able you and your mother were
19:55were hiding and because your father
19:57thought that your family's chances of
19:59survival plus the space was so limited
20:01he had split the family up where heinz
20:04and him had gone off somewhere else but
20:06on two occasions you were able to join
20:08up yes and on one one of these occasions
20:10while you and your mother were gone
20:12didn't the nazis actually come into the
20:14place where you were staying and did a
20:16search oh they came all the time um at
20:19night their trucks came in front of
20:22doors because they knew jewish people
20:24were missing from their homes when they
20:26wanted to arrest them they were not
20:28there and so they were searching for
20:30those people
20:32and
20:32they just knocked on doors people had to
20:35open doors you know there was no freedom
20:38for people i mean can you imagine that
20:41and you're in your own home um police
20:43would come and knock on your door and
20:45you had to let them in to do house
20:47search but this is what you had to do
20:49you had to open your door to those nazis
20:53and they did house searches so in most
20:55hiding places where we were the
20:58resistance came looked over their
21:00apartment and found a place where they
21:03could build a false partition
21:05or perhaps under floorboards there might
21:07have been a space or a cupboard which
21:10they could
21:11camouflage so that they wouldn't be seen
21:13and at night when this happened very
21:16often we had to quickly go into this
21:19secret place
21:20and hope that they wouldn't search and
21:22find us
21:23so you were there for two years from
21:251942 to 1944 hiding
21:29and then on your 15th birthday may 11
21:311944 tell us what happened
21:34um we were just sitting down to
21:36breakfast we had just changed hiding
21:38place we were there perhaps
21:41several days only and i was knocking on
21:44the door and it was early in the morning
21:47so
21:48we didn't really the people didn't
21:49expect there would be a house search
21:51because as i say it usually happened at
21:53night so we were a bit frightened but
21:56anyway they opened the door and nazi
21:59stormed in
22:01and arrested us um they knew so we
22:03didn't wear a stars i didn't know we
22:06were jews we thought and my mother said
22:08we are not jewish we are just visiting
22:10but we had been betrayed
22:13through a dutch nurse
22:15who
22:16had my father and brother had just
22:18changed hiding places as well and it was
22:20this dutch nurse who took them to this
22:23safe house but she was a double agent
22:26and she betrayed them and we had been in
22:29touch with my father and brother the day
22:31before so they knew where we were and
22:34all four of us were arrested
22:36you're
22:37processed and they send you off to the
22:39camps and and tell us just the transport
22:42there you're traveling on a train for
22:44about three days
22:46so packed in that you couldn't even sit
22:48down
22:48it was not ordinary um
22:51trains it was cattle trucks which means
22:54like good strain with just a little
22:57opening with a little bit of air it was
23:00may so strains were metal
23:03and
23:04the air in it was just suffocating and
23:07not enough space and just we got two
23:09buckets one which we could use for
23:12toilets and the other one was with
23:14drinking water and
23:16once a day just were exchanged brett was
23:19thrown in like feeding wild animals
23:22and like this we traveled for three days
23:26not knowing where we were going to go
23:28but holland is of course in europe the
23:30most western country so obviously we
23:33were going east and that was bad because
23:37we knew about concentration camps and
23:40death camps which were in germany and
23:43poland we knew that through the bbc the
23:46bbc broadcasts
23:49i think twice a week to all the occupied
23:52countries
23:53so in holland there were dutch broadcast
23:56and i remember it very very clearly you
23:58were not supposed to listen to foreign
24:00broadcast but nevertheless when in
24:03hiding the people wanted to hear
24:06good news uplifting news because the
24:08germans only told about the battles they
24:11were winning how well the war was going
24:14by 44 of course it wasn't going so well
24:17anymore um
24:19the invasion was planned already and um
24:22the war in africa had been lost
24:25so um we heard all this from the bbc but
24:28as well they always warned about the
24:31death camps in germany in poland where
24:34people were being guessed when you were
24:36traveling just as you got off after
24:38these days then of transport your mother
24:40asked you to wear her coat
24:44and a hat and then the door opens and
24:47you get off and you see a man standing
24:49there wearing white gloves and a baton
24:52who did you later find out that person
24:54was
24:55dr mengele
24:57he was called as a nickname the angel of
25:00death because he decided who was going
25:03to die and who was going to live he was
25:06the one he was the one who
25:09selected people at the rival
25:12we had to stand in rows of five and
25:14march forward it was not just him
25:16standing behind him
25:18many ss with
25:20machine guns pointing at us and alsatian
25:23dogs on their leashes which we could see
25:26were ready to jump at us
25:29so
25:30so we marched in front of mangalab and
25:33like a conductor with a little
25:35button he
25:37looked us over and then he said this
25:40side and then this side at that time of
25:42course we didn't know what the different
25:44sites meant but we realized that all the
25:48young people and elderly people
25:51was perhaps 50 45 depending on how you
25:55looked and young was around 15 16
26:00and i was just 15 but through wearing
26:03the head which my mother had given me
26:05which had a limb
26:07he didn't really see my face he thought
26:09you were older um yes and it's one of
26:12the few there is a series of things that
26:13frankly it's a miracle you're sitting
26:15here today that was one of them
26:18that you were not separated with the
26:19other young people it certainly was so
26:22many mothers who entered the camp had
26:25lost their daughters already in the
26:26beginning
26:28tell us a bit then as
26:30about life in the camps
26:32well the first thing after this first
26:35election
26:36we were herded in everything had to go
26:38very quickly
26:40and
26:40we were herded into a huge barrack where
26:43administration administration was taking
26:46place
26:48we were all tattooed
26:51we were written in books with our name
26:53where we had come from and so on with
26:55our number and we were told you're not a
26:58human being anymore you have no name if
27:01ever we want you you're being called out
27:03by your number
27:04then all our hair was shaved and that
27:08took many many hours
27:10and
27:11well all this was going on again it was
27:14extremely hot we didn't have had any
27:16water to drink there were some people
27:18who had fainted and they told us don't
27:22faint because if you faint you'll be
27:24going to be killed immediately well how
27:26can you not faint on command so we kind
27:29of propped those people up between us
27:32and while all this was going on we took
27:35many many hours
27:36the couple those were the people who did
27:38the tattooing and writing in books and
27:42those were prisoners themselves mainly
27:45polish
27:46people who had been put into camps
27:48already at an early stage very often
27:50criminals out of prisons murderers as
27:53well
27:54and they had become i would say just as
27:58cruel and nasty as the nazis were and
28:01they told us with much pleasure
28:05that you know the family you've been
28:07separated from you know what has
28:09happened to them
28:10they were told to go into a shower
28:13and so people were very happy to get a
28:16wash and they were given a
28:18towel and a bar of soap and they were
28:21taken into a shower room it was a low
28:24building with pipes going and shower
28:27heads and people waited for water to
28:30come out
28:32and
28:32nothing happened
28:34and they started to have breathing
28:36difficulties they started to feel faint
28:40and within a few minutes people fell to
28:43the ground
28:44and within again another few minutes
28:46everybody
28:49had been suffocated and was dead
28:52and the germans looked through there
28:54were little peepholes on the roof they
28:56looked where nobody was standing anymore
28:59the doors were open
29:01and other inmates had to take away their
29:04dead bodies and they were taken to the
29:06crematorium to be burned
29:09and this was the first
29:11welcome this is what we were being told
29:14and they say when you go out you can
29:16smell
29:17and we had this terrible smell the whole
29:19time in our nostal the burning of flesh
29:22and
29:23she said if you see the smoke this is
29:26your family already
29:30your father and brother
29:32were separated from you
29:34and
29:35you would see them periodically
29:38your mother um at one point was also
29:41taken away and
29:43you thought she was done
29:45my brother i never ever saw again my
29:48father just again by luck because when
29:51i'm sitting here i must say there was a
29:53lack a lot of luck
29:56you know little instances like that i
29:58saw my father
30:01and knowing that he was still alive was
30:03of course a big boost for me
30:06but one day
30:07after having gone through a shower we
30:10came out naked again again mangales dude
30:13say i saw him many times
30:15and um
30:16a selection was taking place and so
30:19naked we had to parade in front of him
30:21and when i passed i was going to one
30:24side when my mother followed me
30:27she was taken with about other 40 women
30:30of our group at that time to the other
30:32side those 40 women were marched outside
30:36all naked
30:37and put into another barrack which was
30:41called the death block
30:43and there's a waited
30:45to be taken to the guest chambers
30:48through a miracle she was saved
30:50but i didn't know this
30:52and only after three months be very
30:55united again
30:56how is it that you did not give up
30:59in those three months
31:00when for all you knew your father and
31:03brother had been killed and you thought
31:05your mother was dead yes
31:07well
31:09again a miracle happened while i was
31:12working one day
31:14and a couple came
31:16and said you are wanted outside
31:19and i thought well that's it you know
31:21somebody wants me to be killed and very
31:24reluctantly i went outside
31:27and there stood an ss man with my father
31:32in a striped uniform a striped head a
31:35hat with some i could see his shift head
31:38underneath that
31:39and
31:40it was a miracle until this day and of
31:43course never ever will i find out how it
31:46was possible for my father first of all
31:49to be able to get permission to come to
31:51the women's camp and as well to find me
31:55with all those tens of thousands of
31:57people with all the different parts of
31:59the camp and he came two three times
32:03he was a very attractive man he
32:07told me that my brother was still all
32:08right at that time and he went to the
32:11kitchen
32:12you know he was quite amazing and he
32:16spoke to one of the
32:18inmates there and asked her to um he
32:21said his daughter is here to
32:24give me a little bit of extra food from
32:26time to time and he told me where i had
32:29to go and who had to ask for and i was
32:32able to do that and again this helped me
32:35to
32:36survive a little bit longer but
32:39as well
32:40unfortunately when my father asked me
32:43where is your mother where's my wife i
32:46had to tell him that she had been gassed
32:49which i thought might happen
32:52and i think
32:53this is why eventually he gave up
32:56because my brother probably died first
32:59he probably didn't think i could have
33:01survived so long on my own his wife was
33:03dead and i don't think he wanted to live
33:06anymore by himself
33:09and uh
33:11your father will jump ahead a little bit
33:14just uh we could certainly talk much
33:15longer but the thing is you you find out
33:18your mother did survive
33:20she had a cousin minnie who was a nurse
33:23who actually worked with uh
33:25dr mengele and so she had i guess the
33:28ability to intervene on both your mother
33:30and your behalf because at one point
33:33in fact you and she were both sick and
33:35in a hospital
33:37and then when the russians were
33:38approaching the nazis took all the
33:40prisoners and took them which i had been
33:43unfamiliar with took him on a death
33:44march
33:45which
33:46is how your father and brother
33:48eventually died but
33:50but the fact that you were left for dead
33:52back at the camp saved your life that's
33:54right um about 300 women who were sort
33:58of in a barrack where people were mainly
34:01too ill too but that time
34:04said it was relaxed already more in the
34:06camp the crematorium in october say um
34:10dynamite that's a hemoturn there was no
34:13guessing anymore because the news
34:15russians were approaching and they
34:17didn't want to leave any signs behind so
34:21you can still see the ruins are there
34:23in auschwitz in birkenau and
34:27so
34:29those people who were left behind nobody
34:31really wanted to stay behind because
34:34they were marching us out because the
34:36rumor had been spread that when the
34:38germans were going to leave they were
34:41going to lock up the barracks it was all
34:43wood and burn the whole camp down and
34:46nobody of course wanted to be burned
34:47alive but somehow
34:50my mother and me didn't go on this march
34:53we would never have survived that only
34:55later of course there were culture
34:56deaths marches tens of thousands of
34:59people perished
35:00and
35:02one morning we woke up and it was very
35:05very quiet and the germans had left
35:08and
35:09so you could call this liberation but it
35:12wasn't really because nothing had
35:15happened and we didn't know where we're
35:17going to survive what was going to
35:19happen where the germans going to come
35:21back where they're going to burn down
35:23the camp
35:24what would the poles do who lived around
35:27the camp where the russians coming where
35:30are they going to kill us we had no idea
35:32so you still didn't feel relaxed not at
35:34all women are still very scared i'm sure
35:37our audience is going to have want to
35:38leave a little time to have them ask
35:40some questions but what what then
35:41unfortunately you find out
35:44that was in january of 1945
35:48you don't hear anything about what
35:50became of your father and brother until
35:52that summer i believe and then your
35:54mother is informed by the red cross that
35:57your brother
35:58uh heinz uh had died in april
36:01of 1945 in the from exhaustion during
36:04the walk
36:05of march and your br your father
36:09died may 4th 1945
36:13one day before the camp that he had been
36:15in was liberated by the american army it
36:18was the americans who liberated mao
36:20thousand a camp in austria
36:23and three days later the war ended
36:26it must be very uh
36:29bitter that he came so close after such
36:31suffering to be free this was for me the
36:34hardest of all my suffering you know of
36:37my suffering i could overcome but the
36:40loss of my family that is something you
36:43know you just can never get over it
36:46after
36:47dur well before heinz died he told you
36:50that when he was in hiding with his
36:51father they had done some paintings and
36:53that he told you where they were hidden
36:55and eventually you found them
36:58when you went back to holland
37:00well we were on the journey on the
37:02cattle tracks heinz told me they hit the
37:05paintings 30 paintings which had created
37:08in hiding
37:10under the floorboards of their last
37:12hiding place
37:13and so after the war my mother and me
37:16went back there we were a bit afraid
37:18because a lady who lived there was the
37:21one who blackmailed my father and
37:23brother
37:24for more money and that is why they
37:27wanted to live there and were taken by
37:29as his
37:30dutch nurse into a trap and it was
37:33really through her action that we were
37:36found in the port and so we were a bit
37:39scared to confront her but luckily she
37:42had moved out and other people were
37:43living there
37:45and indeed we did find those paintings
37:48under the floorboard and um how many
37:50were there all together 30 paintings and
37:53two years ago
37:55because i thought what will happen when
37:57i'm not here anymore
37:58i donated them to the resistance museum
38:01in amsterdam which is a wonderful museum
38:04and they displayed the work with lots of
38:07pictures and history of
38:10what has happened
38:11let me if i might ask at this point
38:13we'll leave some time if anyone in the
38:16audience wants to ask a question i think
38:18there might have been a microphone there
38:20does anyone have a question that they
38:22want to ask yes sir over there
38:27could you could you ask one just she'll
38:28bring a microphone for you
38:31is a story that obviously needs to be
38:33kept on being told lest we forget
38:35because there's some people in the world
38:36today that
38:38don't believe this happened
38:40and but i but i do have a a personal
38:43question and a note i have a friend uh
38:46an acquaintance of mine in california
38:48that may know that
38:50spent some time at the same camp rose
38:52torn you know rose
38:54she also has written a couple of books
38:56on her experience and i got to know her
38:58quite personally read her books in a
39:00very similar story and and just
39:02different perspective i thank you for
39:04coming and and and sharing with us
39:08thank you sir
39:11uh while we wait if anyone else has a
39:13question one of the questions
39:15that someone asked me was
39:17did you lose your faith in god while you
39:19were in the camp
39:21yes
39:22a salty's question might come up because
39:24it's very important of course and i must
39:27admit
39:28while we were in the camp we prayed we
39:32begged god to interfere to stop
39:35those
39:37terrible terrible happening going on and
39:39on and on
39:40and there was no answer god didn't
39:43interfere didn't help
39:45and
39:46so the next question perhaps god
39:49is not all-powerful
39:51perhaps god is not a good god
39:54we didn't find an answer
39:56the only answer we conclusion we came to
39:59there can't be a god
40:01so many people including my mother and
40:04me came out of the camp
40:06atheists not believe not being believers
40:09anymore
40:10there were some very religious people
40:13who came out still believing
40:15but
40:16i must say we had lost our faith but
40:19i don't want to let you think that is
40:22how i am now
40:25after
40:26a slowly very very slow process i was
40:30able to shed my hate my suspicion my
40:34not being able to trust anybody
40:39and
40:40i got married
40:42and the birth of my first daughter in
40:451956
40:47i thought this was a miracle after
40:50having gone susie's after having been
40:53badly damaged mentally and physically so
40:56they was able to
40:58create again a human being
41:01perfect beautiful
41:04to continue to change the circle of
41:08judaism and humanity
41:10and as well
41:12i love nature and when i come out in now
41:15wonderful time here in chicago to see
41:18the trees and the blossom after nature
41:20had been dead and as well our own bodies
41:23how everything functions how we can
41:26overcome
41:28damage to the body
41:31i said you know there must be more to it
41:33than just being born and dying
41:36and i do see now
41:40god in
41:41everything around us
41:44is there another question from the
41:45audience
41:49uh
41:50well
41:52ladies and gentlemen let me if i might
41:53then um
41:55either we thank you for
41:57telling your story i know it's important
41:58and it was years before you were able to
42:01tell it yourself
42:03um
42:03there's there's a
42:05a quote i'll share with uh everyone here
42:07just to wrap this up i saw this the
42:09other night from
42:10henry fonda in the oxbow incident you
42:12might oh let me if i might before that
42:14yes sir i'm sorry
42:17when you were confined
42:20were you confined with uh
42:22were there gypsies there and other
42:25christians it was it was not a
42:27like
42:29what what was
42:30what was their reaction
42:33the uh the
42:35people that were say gypsies
42:38that were also
42:40put in
42:41did what sort of a
42:45accusation did they make against them
42:50well look are you asking what kind of
42:52accusation was made against the gypsies
42:54that they were in the case yes
42:56um just um yes we're gypsies so we're
43:00homosexuals there were um
43:04jehovah witnesses they're communists all
43:07kind of different groups
43:09and um on our stripes uniforms we had
43:14little triangles with different color
43:18jewish were yellow
43:20communists were red
43:22black was something else and so on so we
43:26one did know what different groups we
43:28belong to
43:29and
43:31against the gypsies was just that it was
43:33a race which the germans didn't value
43:36enough to let them live
43:39because the germans realized the nazis
43:41really wanted an aryan
43:43people blood and blue-eyed and healthy
43:47disabled people
43:49all the german disabled people were
43:51killed as well in germany
43:54i know one thing you were also asked so
43:56let me ask that have you forgiven
43:59the german people have you forgiven
44:01those who put you into the camps
44:04i haven't forgiven the perpetrators and
44:07i don't want to forgive some what
44:09somebody said to me i will pray for you
44:12that you can forgive and i said to him
44:14don't waste your time i don't want to
44:16forgive because those were not what i
44:19consider human beings and
44:23but i have no
44:25prejudice or qual or bad feeling against
44:28the german people in general
44:30or the austrians because we have moved
44:33on we have
44:34new two new generations of people who
44:37have met in many many places in germany
44:40itself in austria
44:42they are very very sorry
44:44what has happened
44:46sometimes they feel guilty and i said
44:47well you don't have to feel guilty you
44:50can be upset of what that happened but
44:52you don't have a guilt feeling
44:53and
44:54because otherwise if we would prejudice
44:57against the whole people we would do the
44:59main the same mistake as hitler's done
45:02and this is one of the purposes i speak
45:05out is sort of can
45:07stop prejudices and racism and
45:10discrimination against people who are
45:12not the same as us
45:17well ladies and gentlemen uh i promise
45:19we'll try to uh we could talk for hours
45:20more and go into more detail but i know
45:22uh all of you have to get back to your
45:24offices and we thank you for joining us
45:25i again i wanted to share you just i
45:27thought it was appropriate something
45:28that came from the oxbow incident of all
45:30things a movie
45:32where henry fonda
45:34says at one point
45:35there can't be any such thing as
45:38civilization
45:39unless people have a conscience
45:42because if people touch god anywhere
45:45where is it except through their
45:46conscience
45:47and what is anyone's conscience except a
45:50little bit of the conscience of all men
45:52who have ever lived
45:54yves lost you've shared with us some
45:56insights that have touched our
45:57conscience and we thank you for doing
45:59that and thank you ladies and gentlemen
46:00for hosting us
46:19terry thank you for a wonderful job and
46:22the questions that you asked and eva
46:24thank you for taking the time to be here
46:26we have a small memento of your visit
46:29and hope that you'll keep that on your
46:30desk thank you very much thank you thank
46:33you
46:35thank you all for being here today and
46:36we look forward to seeing you again next
46:38week
46:53did you get everything in well i think
46:57i could have gone up for hours long but
46:58i think in the time we have it's good
47:01hello i'm carol harris castillo coffee
47:03is proud to have sponsored the special
47:05broadcast of eva schloss's story through
47:08special arrangement with the illinois
47:10channel we will carry this program as a
47:12video stream on our website so that it
47:14may be viewed at any time in its
47:16entirety we hope you will share this
47:18special program with many others so they
47:21too will hear eva's story if you would
47:23like more information about the story of
47:25eva schloss and her family during the
47:27holocaust here are two books you may
47:29wish to read
47:31the promise by barbara powers
47:34and eva's story
47:37thank you again for watching
47:39you're watching the illinois channel an
47:42independent nonprofit corporation forum
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47:46illinois state government and other
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