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Episode 9: Should People Still Get Married Despite Divorce Rates? | Master's Program | PragerU — Transcript

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0:00Would society improve if they took these
0:02ideas seriously?
0:05>> If most everybody got married, society
0:08would improve tremendously.
0:10Society can't function if a lot of
0:12people remain young. You can be young in
0:15spirit,
0:18but you've got to grow up.
0:50If I were to pose to you this question,
0:53what event in your life, including
0:56[music] your death, your funeral, will
0:59the most people attend?
1:02Now, let's think of the milestones in a
1:04person's life. Birth. Very few people
1:08attend your birth.
1:10Thank God for that.
1:12Christians might have baptism. For Jews,
1:16the famous bar mitzvah or bach mitzvah
1:18for the girl. your funeral. Almost by
1:21definition, since a fair number of
1:23people will have died in the meantime,
1:25[music] fewer people will attend your
1:27funeral.
1:30If you give it some thought, I think
1:31you'll come up with the same answer I
1:33did. The event that brings the most
1:37people together in your life is your
1:41wedding.
1:42You may have a small wedding, that's
1:44true. You may not be able to afford a
1:46big wedding. That's true. Maybe you can
1:47afford a very big funeral. I acknowledge
1:50that. But I'll tell you this. There is
1:53simply no event in your life that has
1:56the meaning [music] and is so widely
2:00felt by others as your wedding because
2:04it's [music] deemed the most significant
2:06thing you will do and even perhaps the
2:08happiest.
2:12Of all the talks I [music] have given
2:14for the master's program, I think in
2:17some ways for me this is the saddest. I
2:21don't think of any of them as [music]
2:22particularly sad. I think of this as the
2:25saddest because I have to give it the
2:30case for marriage.
2:32This would not have had to be given
2:3550 years ago. 150, 550, 1,50,
2:402,50 years ago. Something new has
2:44happened that people aren't marrying and
2:47it's [music] happening in all of the
2:49developed world from Asia to Europe to
2:52North America.
2:55It's a tragedy and I'll explain why
2:58because that's the [music] point of it,
3:00the case for marriage.
3:07So let me make the case for marriage.
3:11Understanding that a large percentage of
3:13marriages end up in divorce. Certainly
3:16in America they say 40%, [music] they
3:18say more. Whatever it is, let's say it's
3:21even half. That's not an argument
3:24against [music] getting married.
3:26I've always regarded that argument as
3:29analogous to,
3:31you know, almost everybody who drives
3:34gets into [music] an accident, many into
3:36a bad accident. I don't think I'll
3:39drive. The fact that
3:42divorce happens, it's a bad accident.
3:44You survive, but it doesn't lead to your
3:47death anymore than most accidents,
3:49[music] car accidents do. Or my parents
3:52divorce, that really shook me up. Well,
3:55I use the same analogy. Well, your
3:57parents had a bad car crash. Are you not
3:59going to drive?
4:01Yes. A lot don't work out. That is
4:04correct.
4:06I I don't I've never found that to be a
4:09compelling argument against the
4:10institution.
4:14For the record, I think it's important
4:16for me to say as passionately as I
4:19endorse marriage,
4:21I do not believe that divorce is always
4:24wrong.
4:25There are cases where it is the right
4:28thing to do. It is always tragic, but
4:31it's not always wrong.
4:34Everybody I know who divorced went
4:36through hell and tried to make it work.
4:39I'm not talking about Hollywood stars
4:41who, you know, trade in wives every few
4:43years, but that's a different world. And
4:46even they go through hell. There are
4:49very few happy divorces.
4:52By the time people have gotten to a
4:54divorce, they've [music] been in therapy
4:55for years and it just didn't work.
4:59The best idea is to [music]
5:01marry right the first time. I didn't I I
5:04admit it. I'm I'm not holier than now on
5:07this issue, but I do know how incredibly
5:10important marriage is. [music]
5:12And I am such a better man for being
5:15married. And having been married even
5:17and divorced, I have a topic for you
5:20today about men. And I told you I have
5:22this human laboratory known as a talk
5:24show. [music]
5:25I bounce ideas off literally millions of
5:28people. So I offered the proposition
5:31that it is better [music] to have been
5:33married and divorced than never to have
5:36been married. So a woman called me up
5:39and she said, "Dennis, I almost always
5:40agree with you, but I don't agree with
5:42you in this case in Los Angeles."
5:44[music] Hello.
5:45>> Hi.
5:46>> I am a single woman. I think it is
5:48better never to have been married than
5:50to have been married and divorced. So I
5:52said, "Okay, you're single [music] and I
5:53see on my board here that you're 40
5:55years old." And I said to her, "So I I'm
5:58going to pose a a theoretical question
6:01to you. Imagine that I have two men that
6:05I'd like to introduce you to. Each is 45
6:08years old. Same financial state, same
6:11everything. But you can only date one of
6:14them. And the only difference I am
6:17telling you about them is this. One had
6:20been married and one has never been
6:24married. Which one would you go on that
6:28blind date with?
6:30And then my favorite moment in talk
6:32radio, silence. I made my point. And
6:36that's exactly what she said. [music]
6:38You're right. I would sooner go out with
6:41the guy of 45 years of age who had been
6:45married than the guy who was never
6:46married. And why did I know that she
6:48would say that? Because women know that
6:52if a guy is 45 and never been married,
6:55it's usually a yellow flag. It's not
6:57necessarily a red flag, but it is a
6:59yellow flag.
7:01Hey, he hasn't grown up. Whereas the guy
7:04who was divorced, well, that's sad that
7:06he got divorced, but he grew up. He
7:09showed he's willing to be committed to a
7:12woman, to marriage, to be committed to a
7:15family, to even making a family
7:16presumably. It's something for you to
7:19think about. For those of you who argue
7:20that divorce argues against marriage.
7:22Okay. So then, do you disagree with me?
7:25Do you think it is better to never have
7:27been married than to have been married
7:29and divorced? I don't think so. [music]
7:31And again, I I've lived it.
7:35There are many reasons that marriage is
7:37a very good thing in your life, even if
7:40it ends up a failure. Now, there could
7:43be such toxic marriages and such
7:45horrible battles over children that you
7:48may regret ever having married to begin
7:50with. I understand that. I live in the
7:52same world as you do. But
7:54overwhelmingly, it is better to have
7:56been married and divorced than never to
7:58have been married.
8:03So, let me begin with specific benefits
8:06for men in the professional and
8:08financial arena.
8:11These are from various studies. This is
8:13from Brad Wilcox, a professor of
8:15sociology at the University of Virginia.
8:17[music]
8:18Men who get married work harder and more
8:21strategically earn more money than their
8:24single peers from similar backgrounds.
8:26Marriage also transforms men's social
8:29world. [music] They spend less time with
8:31friends and more time with family. They
8:33go to bars less and to church more.
8:36>> [music]
8:37>> Married men work about 400 hours more
8:40per year than single men with equivalent
8:43backgrounds. On average, married men
8:46earn almost [music] 20% more than their
8:48single peers. That's even after
8:51controlling for differences in
8:53education, race, ethnicity, and [music]
8:55other background factors.
8:58Now, let's talk about men's health.
9:00According to a report from Harvard
9:02University Men's Health Watch, based on
9:04a survey of 127,545
9:09American adults, marriage improves
9:12health indicators and decreases the risk
9:15of certain diseases. [music]
9:17Married men enjoy biological advantages
9:20which reduce their risk of certain
9:22diseases. In a Framingham Offspring
9:24[music] study, married men had a 46%
9:28lower rate of dying from cardiovascular
9:30[music]
9:31disease than unmarried men. Married
9:33patients received treatment for cancer
9:35in higher proportions, and they show
9:37greater survival rates after therapy
9:39than unmarried individuals. [music] A
9:41study by the University of Miami
9:43examined the survival rates of men who
9:45had been diagnosed with prostate cancer.
9:46[music]
9:47Findings show that married men survived
9:50longer over a 17-year period than men
9:53who had never been [music] married.
9:56Married men are more likely to receive
9:58regular checkups and medical care,
10:00maintain healthy diets, exercise, enjoy
10:03higher standards of living. In addition,
10:05married men benefit from lower levels of
10:07stress and fewer stress related [music]
10:09diseases. They also receive better care
10:11during times of illness. Overall
10:14marriage appears to improve the
10:15lifestyle of men and stabilizes their
10:18lives. Contrary to this, never married,
10:21divorced, and widowed [music] men are
10:23more likely to drink excessively, engage
10:26in dangerous behavior, [music] and
10:28smoke.
10:30Harvard Medical School 2019 study,
10:35marriage and men's health. Married men
10:38have a lower risk of depression [music]
10:40and a higher likelihood of satisfaction
10:43with life in retirement than their
10:46unmarried peers. Being married has also
10:49been linked to better cognitive
10:51function, a [music] reduced risk of
10:53Alzheimer's disease, improved blood
10:56sugar levels, [music] and better
10:57outcomes for hospitalized patients.
11:01So given all of these dramatic health
11:04benefits, where do they derive from?
11:07They derive from the fact that life
11:10[music] is better for a married man on
11:12average than for a single man. That's
11:14not how single men think. Single men
11:17think ah to be free to roam the world
11:21and conquer as many women as possible.
11:25But it doesn't work out that way.
11:28There is a lot more stability and joy
11:32and [music] calm and peace and all of
11:35that leads to better health.
11:43Now let's go to [music]
11:46women.
11:48Married women are healthier emotionally
11:50and physically. [music] They are less
11:52likely to be physically and emotionally
11:54abused. Less likely to be depressed and
11:56attempt suicide. less likely to get
11:59involved in drugs. They have much better
12:01relationships with children, have better
12:04and more satisfying sex, and are less
12:07likely to end up or remain in poverty.
12:10This is reported in Britain's Evening
12:12Standard in 2012.
12:15Being unmarried makes a woman a higher
12:17suicide risk. Single and cohabiting
12:20women, that's important. Not just
12:23single, single [music] and even
12:24cohabiting are increasingly much more
12:27likely to commit suicide than married
12:30women. A Whiteall report showed. It
12:33found that those who do not marry were
12:35killing themselves at three times the
12:37rate of wives. This is a much higher
12:40rate than 25 years earlier when single
12:42women were twice as likely to commit
12:44suicide as those who were married. The
12:46findings in a study by the government's
12:48Office for National Statistics, ONS,
12:52suggest [music] that the cohabitation
12:55has made a high proportion of young
12:57women more vulnerable to depression.
13:01Yes, believe it or not, though they
13:03won't say it, most women who are
13:06cohabiting [music]
13:07would like to marry. Not all. Many have
13:10bought the line fed to them at college
13:12that there's no need to marry [music] or
13:15it's even better not to marry. It's a
13:18big mistake for most.
13:20It added that since a lot more unmarried
13:22people are now cohabiting, quote, we
13:25might expect relative [music]
13:26differences in suicide rates between
13:28married and unmarried people to have
13:30become less clear-cut over the last 25
13:34years. [music]
13:34This has not occurred.
13:37Independent researcher Patricia Morgan,
13:39author of the marriage light study of
13:42the growth of cohabitation, [music] said
13:44of the report, "This is not a surprise
13:47except to the government, cohabitation
13:50is a route to [music] conflict,
13:52disappointment, and unhappiness." Women
13:55tend to think if they shack up with
13:56someone that is commitment.
13:59Men tend to think that [music] shacking
14:01up means they get sex and shopping.
14:04They are still free [music] to look
14:06elsewhere.
14:07Records show that overall numbers of
14:10suicides have gone down since the 1980s,
14:13but they have fallen much less sharply
14:15[music] among single women. The higher
14:18risk of suicide was a [music] result of
14:21remaining unmarried and not of other
14:24factors.
14:30So, let me make some other arguments
14:32that are less measurable, but to me are
14:35actually even more significant.
14:39Here's the big one.
14:41Do you want to grow up?
14:45Yep. Simple as that. Do you want to grow
14:47up or do you want to stay a kid? For the
14:50vast majority of people, nothing makes
14:52you grow up like getting married.
14:55It forces you for the first time in your
14:57life, literally the first time in your
15:00life, to be as preoccupied with someone
15:02else [music] as you are with yourself.
15:05So if you would like to abandon
15:06narcissism, which is a feature of youth,
15:09and [music] it's just inevitable,
15:11who does a baby think of? Himself,
15:13herself. Who's a child think of?
15:15Himself, [music] herself. Well, we don't
15:17stop thinking about ourselves unless
15:19we're forced to by life. Marriage forces
15:22you to. You can't stay the same
15:25narcissist you [music] were in most
15:27cases. There are exceptions to every
15:29rule once you [music] get married.
15:32I can more or less tell if somebody is
15:36married, especially a man, but not only
15:38men.
15:40Upon meeting them, I just need a certain
15:44time with them talking with them. And I
15:47could tell when I meet a man who is
15:49married, he radiates a maturity. and
15:53[music] a even a masculinity that I
15:55rarely find in men who are single for a
15:58long period of time. With women,
16:01likewise, I identify a maturity and a
16:05wisdom and and a stability
16:08that I don't see in women who have never
16:11[music] been married. I know there are
16:13exceptions to all of this. There are
16:15some terrific single people, lifelong
16:17bachelors, lifelong single women. I know
16:20that exceptions have nothing to do with
16:22rules
16:24for the vast majority of us and I am one
16:26of them. I grew up when I got [music]
16:29married. People don't want to grow up
16:32today. So this is not a big argument for
16:34a lot of people maybe even watching
16:36this. Not everybody wants to grow up.
16:39Isn't it the Peter Pan syndrome? Oh, I
16:41want to stay a kid forever.
16:44Today that is apparently quite
16:46appealing.
16:48And by the way, the argument, "Oh, I'll
16:50only get married when I'm financially
16:51stable," I never understood that
16:53argument. It was certainly not true in
16:55the past. If you're just beginning to
16:58earn a living, [music] why is it better
17:00to be single than to be married?
17:04If anything, it's it's actually [music]
17:05more feasible, more productive to get
17:08married than you might have two incomes
17:11that will help pay for this exact same
17:13apartment. I don't know. I don't
17:14understand the argument. Oh, I'll only
17:16get married when when I am financially
17:18stable.
17:22You know when you should get married?
17:24Soon as you meet a wonderful person,
17:27that's when you should get married.
17:31[music]
17:35Let me address women one more time here.
17:40Do you really want to spend the rest of
17:42your life
17:44without a partner, without a husband
17:46specifically?
17:48You might think you do, but I want to
17:52share with you something I actually
17:54published as a column of mine once. I
17:57transcribed a call from a single woman,
18:02a successful professional woman who
18:05called my show. Here is what she said.
18:08only slightly edited for time.
18:12Dennis, [music] I want to get right to
18:13it. I'm 50 years old with four college
18:17degrees. I was raised by a feminist
18:20mother with no father in the home. My
18:23mother told me, "Get an education to the
18:26maximum level so that you can get out
18:28into the world, make a lot of money."
18:31And that's the path I followed. I make
18:33adequate money. I don't make a ton of
18:35money, but I do make enough to support
18:37my own household. I want to tell women
18:40in their [music] 20s, do not follow the
18:42path I followed. You are leading
18:45yourself to a [music] life of
18:46loneliness. All of your friends will be
18:49getting married and having children, and
18:51you're working to compete in the world,
18:53and [music] what you're doing is
18:54competing with men. Men don't like
18:57competitors. Men want a partner. [music]
18:59It took me until my late 40s to realize
19:02this. And by the time you have your own
19:04household with all your own bills,
19:06[music]
19:07you can't get off that track because now
19:09you've got to make the money to pay your
19:11bills. [music] It's hard to find a
19:12partner in your late 40s because you
19:14also start losing self-confidence about
19:17your looks, your body. It's not the same
19:20as it was in your 20s. You try to do
19:23what you can to make your life
19:24fulfilling. I [music] have cats and
19:26dogs. But it's lonely when you see your
19:29friends having children, going on
19:31[music] vacations, planning the lives of
19:34their children, and you don't do
19:36anything at night but [music] come home
19:38to your cats and dogs. I don't want
19:41other women to do what I have done. Was
19:44[music] it hard for you to make this
19:46call? She responded, "It was. I want to
19:50be anonymous because I don't want people
19:52that I know to really know my true
19:54feelings. Because you do act like, "Oh,
19:57my career is everything. I love working,
20:00but it's a lie. It's a lie on the inside
20:03for [music] me. It's unfortunate. I
20:04didn't realize this until it's too late.
20:07I don't know if it's too late. I would
20:08like to find somebody to go on vacation
20:10with." You have other concerns when you
20:12get older and you live alone. [music]
20:14Who's going to take you to your medical
20:15appointments? If something should happen
20:17to you, there's no other income there to
20:19help you. These are things you don't
20:21understand when you're in your 20s
20:23[music] because you don't think you'll
20:24ever get old and have health problems.
20:27I'm stuck now because I go to work every
20:29day. I smile like I love it. But it's
20:32[music] very painful to not plan a
20:33vacation with someone. It's painful to
20:36not have a Thanksgiving dinner with
20:38someone. You sit home alone and you do
20:41nothing. I avoid my friends now that
20:45have children because I have nothing in
20:46common with them. Somebody asked me the
20:49other day, "Why did you stay single and
20:51never have kids?" [music]
20:53Their answers because I was brainwashed
20:55by my mother into this, but it's hard
20:58and it's shameful to tell people. I
21:01don't know. I ran out of time. There's
21:03not a good answer for it except I was
21:05programmed to get into the workforce,
21:07compete with men, and make money.
21:10Supposedly that would be a fulfilling
21:12[music] life. But I was told that by a
21:14feminist mother who was divorced, who
21:16hated her husband, my [music] father.
21:18She tried to steer me on what she
21:20thought was the right path. But feminism
21:22is a lie.
21:27>> In the name of feminism, I'm going to
21:30walk into men on the sidewalk. I'm not
21:31going [music] to make space for them and
21:32reduce my own space.
21:33>> You are not frustrated with feminism or
21:35women. You are [music] frustrated with
21:37latestage capitalism. I didn't realize
21:40this until late in life. I want to tell
21:43women, find someone in your 20s. That's
21:46when you're still very cute. That's when
21:48you're still amiable to working [music]
21:50out problems with someone. It's harder
21:52in your 50s when you've lived alone, to
21:54compromise with someone, to have someone
21:56in your home and [music] have every
21:58little thing about them annoy you
22:00because you're so used to being alone.
22:03It's hard to undo that. So, don't do
22:06what I did. Find someone in your 20s.
22:11I Dennis said, "I'm thinking of
22:13transcribing your call and making it
22:15into a column. Do that, Dennis. I want
22:19to help whoever I can." She said,
22:23"I've talked to so many women who have
22:25echoed that sentiment."
22:27Yep. They bought the idea that a woman
22:29without a man is like a fish without a
22:31bicycle, but it's not true.
22:35Fish don't need bicycles. Women do
22:37[music] need men. Men do need women.
22:40That's the way the world was created. We
22:43need each other.
22:45We live in the age of foolishness which
22:47denies [music]
22:48painful truths. And for some people, I
22:51don't find it a painful truth. [music]
22:52I'm a pretty strong guy. I need my wife.
22:58It's it's so obvious that it's better.
23:01And I know I I I acknowledge this at the
23:04outset. How many marriages end up in
23:05divorce? I understand that. But what is
23:08the ideal? We have to provide people
23:10with the ideal.
23:13The ideal is a good marriage. That is
23:15the ideal.
23:18And we're not we're not offering that to
23:21young people.
23:23I meet young women all the time through
23:26my work. And like anybody else at a
23:29restaurant, she might be my waitress
23:32in line at the airport sitting next to
23:34me on an airplane. And if she seems to
23:37be under 30 and we talk at all, I have
23:41no compunctions about saying, "Mind if I
23:43ask you a question?" Go right ahead. How
23:45old are you? Oh, 26. [music] Okay,
23:48great. 22, 28.
23:52Like to ask you a question.
23:54I'm offering you two [music] guarantees.
23:58You can only choose one, but please know
24:01it doesn't mean you cannot have the
24:03other thing in life. It's just [music]
24:05not guaranteed. Want to make that clear.
24:09So, which guarantee would you choose? I
24:11asked the young woman. A guaranteed
24:14great marriage or a guaranteed great
24:16[music] career. And I have learned a
24:19very interesting thing. I can almost
24:20never predict what their answer will be.
24:24I might be talking to a woman with a lot
24:26of tattoos and she'll say great
24:27marriage. I might be talking to a woman
24:30who looks [music] totally straight
24:32middle class and she'll say great
24:34career. There's no way to predict. And
24:37by the way, it has been 50/50.
24:41[music] Of course, I don't judge their
24:43answer. I don't even really react. I I
24:46[music] just take it in.
24:49It should be 100% great marriage.
24:52Ultimately
24:54in life that will bring you greater
24:57peace, satisfaction and [music] as I
24:59pointed out health,
25:02mental health
25:04and
25:05physical health.
25:12So as I draw to a [music] conclusion, I
25:15ask you, do you want to grow up? Do you
25:18want to live the fullest life you can
25:21live? That's that's the question. Do you
25:24want to die and have it written on your
25:28tombstone?
25:30He or she led as [music] painless a life
25:34as possible,
25:36as effortless a life as possible.
25:37[music] Is that what you want
25:40to be remembered for?
25:44Do you want to lead a full life or do
25:47you want to go home to your own [music]
25:49place till you die?
25:51or hope that your partner whom you never
25:54married will stay with you.
25:57But even then,
26:00remember what I said. The thing in your
26:02life the most people attend is your
26:04wedding.
26:06That's society's way of saying how
26:08important [music] it is.
26:11It's better for society if people marry.
26:15That's why such a big deal, such a
26:17premium [music] is placed on marriage as
26:19an institution.
26:21It is your announcement to the [music]
26:23world. I am formally, legally
26:27bound to this other person, committed to
26:31this other person. That's why I'm a big
26:33fan of wedding bands.
26:36I like wearing a wedding band. It is my
26:39statement to society. I am committed to
26:41a woman.
26:44A good marriage
26:47is difficult.
26:49Everything [music] worthwhile is
26:51difficult.
26:53Society has always known
26:57how good it is for people to commit
26:59[music] to one another legally,
27:02emotionally, contractually
27:05through marriage.
27:08One of the reasons
27:11is that it [music] knows that marriage
27:12made people better. And I have a proof
27:15for you.
27:17This is from the philanthropy
27:19roundtable.
27:22Compared to the unmarried,
27:25married households were 62%
27:28[music] more giving in 2011. That was
27:31when this was done. This was after all
27:34other factors like income, race, region,
27:37[music] etc. were statistically adjusted
27:40for. This is from the United States
27:42government's [music] consumer
27:44expenditure survey. In other words, the
27:47same exact income
27:50married [music] people gave 63% more
27:53charity.
27:55Among everything [music] else, it
27:58doesn't only make you more mature and
28:01usually less lonely
28:04and less depressed and more healthy.
28:08It even makes you a better person.
28:13It's not just a piece of paper.
28:16I'm Dennis Prager.
28:19[music]
28:28[music]
28:34[music]
28:54>> [music]
28:59[music]
29:11[music]
29:40[music]
30:03[music]
30:10[music]

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