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EMERGENCY DEBATE: They Lied About The Economy Recovering! Is A Financial Apocalypse Coming? — Transcript

by The Diary Of A CEO · 31,433 words · 4,323 segments · language en · Watch on YouTube

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0:00I'm I'm sick of multi-millionaires
0:02telling kids who can't afford to turn
0:03the heating on you just need to be more
0:05entrepreneurial it's sick Dan it's sick
0:07well your video where you talk about if
0:09you don't have a rich dad you're screwed
0:10well to me if I had have come across
0:12your content at 19 20 years old I would
0:14have been screwed my friends can't feed
0:17their kids okay if it was that easy why
0:19is everybody not doing it I'll tell you
0:20why people aren't doing it it's because
0:23you like to say one thing back on
0:25that today's debate is fiery to say the
0:29least but important nonetheless as I sat
0:31down with two leading experts in wealth
0:33and Entrepreneurship and the economy to
0:35discuss the state of the US the state of
0:37the UK and the Western World do you
0:39think the reason the average Brit
0:41American are getting poorer is because
0:42they don't know how to create wealth no
0:44the reason people are getting poorer is
0:46because of big governments record levels
0:48of taxes an outdated schooling system
0:50technology and remote working you sure
0:52about that how do you disagree with
0:54those opinions living standards are
0:55falling because of growing wealth in
0:57equality if you allow the rich to get
0:58richer they squeeze the middle class and
1:00the poor class out of things like
1:01housing let's cut tax on people who are
1:03working hard and let's raise tax on the
1:05richest and most powerful people in the
1:06world that's an overly simplified view
1:08of things we now have a th000
1:09millionaires a month leaving which means
1:11every ordinary person who pays 10 grand
1:13a year in tax will now have to pay 20
1:15grand a year in tax you end up cutting
1:17off your nose to spite your face if we
1:19are a country that don't try and do
1:20things which are necessary because they
1:22are hard then our kids will live in
1:24poverty what do you want people to do
1:26there's a lot of different ways Backle
1:28up this has always blown my mind a
1:31little bit 53% of you that listen to the
1:33show regularly haven't yet subscribed to
1:35the show so could I ask you for a favor
1:38before we start if you like the show and
1:39you like what we do here and you want to
1:40support us the free simple way that you
1:42can do just that is by hitting the
1:43Subscribe button and my commitment to
1:45you is if you do that then I'll do
1:47everything in my power me and my team to
1:49make sure that this show is better for
1:50you every single week we'll listen to
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1:54you want me to speak to and we'll
1:55continue to do what we do thank you so
1:57much
2:01Gary
2:03Daniel Daniel you've been on the show a
2:05few times before so I want to start with
2:07Gary and understand a little bit about
2:08your backstory and who you are and
2:10having been through the trading game and
2:12read and watched many many of your
2:13videos over time I have a a sort of deep
2:15understanding of that but for anyone
2:16that doesn't know you can you give me a
2:18picture of the context that um has
2:21brought you to where you are today
2:22writing about the things you're writing
2:24about today and running the YouTube
2:25channel and speaking to the subject
2:26matter that you're speaking about today
2:27take me right back and give me as much
2:29as you possibly can okay so my name is
2:32Gary Stevenson uh I was born in a place
2:34called ilford which is in outer East
2:36London quite a poor family little
2:39Terrace House by the railway you know
2:40playing football in the streets kind of
2:42stuff
2:43um always very good at maths since I was
2:46a kid very talented Master student
2:48eventually able to get into the London
2:49School of Economics which is an
2:51extremely Elite University economics
2:54University in the center of London which
2:57is basically a kind of investment
3:00banking boot camp got a job as a Trader
3:03started working full-time as a
3:06short-term interest rates Trader at City
3:08Bank in London in June
3:112008 when I was 21 obviously yeah
3:13exactly that's just before the big
3:15credit crash the big Leman crisis and I
3:17watched the Leman Crisis happen in front
3:19of my eyes I was um short-term interest
3:21rate trading is basically like
3:23short-term loans and during the credit
3:25crisis what credit crisis is is nobody
3:27can borrow any money so like short-term
3:28loans become really really important
3:29important my desk which was like
3:31historically an unfashionable area of
3:32trading became like the center of the
3:35crisis or one of the centers of the
3:36crisis people started making tons of
3:38money um I was working with all these
3:40crazy people and you can imagine me like
3:42I turn up 21 years old and then like
3:44within three months like everyone around
3:46me is making a ton of money during the
3:48credit crisis but what really interested
3:50me was what happened after the crisis
3:53itself which was so we're betting on
3:56interest
3:57rates long story short interest rates
4:00come down when the economy is weak and
4:02they go up when the economy is strong or
4:04when the economy is overheating from an
4:05inflation perspective in 2018 all the
4:08interest rates go to zero so suddenly
4:10our job is basically predicting and
4:13betting on when will those interest
4:15rates go back up which is when will the
4:17economy recover and this is super
4:20interesting right in
4:222008 because all the interest rates went
4:24to zero so quickly like before 2008 it's
4:26important to remember rates would move
4:27from like five and a half to five and a
4:29quarter and then here in 2008 everywhere
4:31in the world slashing to zero Bo half a
4:33percent exactly and everybody all the
4:35economists were like wow this is going
4:36to cause a massive recovery because they
4:38thought that interest rates were
4:39powerful and everybody predicted that
4:42rates would come back up in 2009 which
4:44of course we knowed they didn't then
4:46everybody predicted that rates would go
4:47up in 2010 which we now know they didn't
4:50and then at the beginning of 2011
4:53everybody was predicting rates would
4:54definitely go up this year and this to
4:56me was so interesting so interesting
5:00because you know I studied master and
5:02economics at one of the best economics
5:04universities in the world and now I'm
5:06working with these traders who are
5:07getting paid millions of pounds a year
5:09million pounds a year to predict the
5:10economy to predict the interest rates
5:12and everybody is wrong year after year
5:16after year and this
5:18was I was so amazing to me for a couple
5:21of reasons first of all it's like wow
5:23like this is a big thing that we as a
5:25society should understand and like we're
5:27getting it wrong but secondly
5:30if all of the best guys in the world are
5:31getting this wrong then if I can figure
5:33this out I can make a ton of money here
5:37G how much money did you make for City
5:39Bank at the age of 24 years old that
5:42year so that year 2011 I put this big
5:46bet on that it would get worse forever
5:48and I was City bank's most profitable
5:50Trader in the world that year and I made
5:52them just over $ 35 million you made
5:54them $35 million you eventually decide
5:56to leave City Bank yeah why
6:00I mean I think that's an interesting
6:01question right you know in the sense
6:03that I've just explained to you what
6:05happened which is I made a ton of money
6:08by betting on the collapse of Western
6:13Society uh I did it in 2011 I did it
6:16again in 2012
6:19um I would prefer for it not to collapse
6:23step and I'm trying to stop it from
6:27collapsing when you say it collapsing
6:29what exactly you're referring to that
6:31you you don't want to
6:32collapse so you you born in Botswana
6:35right yeah do you still have family
6:36there um I've got family in Nigeria
6:39which is where my my family are from I
6:40was born in Botswana because we were
6:41visiting there but got family in Africa
6:43do you go to Nigeria much no I I've got
6:45home in Cape Town in South Africa so I
6:47see the it's a great place if you want
6:49to see inequality I think there
6:53is a naivity in in in this country in
6:56places like the US that the kind of
6:58inequality the kind of broad poverty
7:02that you see in places like South Africa
7:04in places like Nigeria in places like
7:06India can't happen
7:08here it will happen here that is the
7:11future of this country that is the
7:12future of the US and I'm not just saying
7:14that I'm betting on it and I've been
7:15betting on it for 15 years and I've been
7:17right for 15 years that is what I'm
7:19trying to avoid
7:21Daniel where did you come from yeah so I
7:24grew up in Australia um and I was born
7:27to low-income family I grew up in a
7:29place that had 24% Unemployment uh
7:32pretty much the only jobs or
7:34opportunities around me were things like
7:37uh the trades building construction Pest
7:40Control um hospitality and tourism um so
7:44uh at 14 I got a job at McDonald's and
7:46then I'm got a job in a bar and Pizza
7:48Hut delivery driving and I discover
7:51entrepreneurship so I discover books
7:52about entrepreneurship and I discovered
7:54that some people make millions similar
7:55to yourself you saw Canary WF I read a
7:57book about business ownership and as we
8:00sit here today can you give me the
8:02overview of your business success since
8:04then yeah so I now have a group of
8:07companies that I've either started or
8:08bought um there's I've just sold a
8:09company so there's seven companies in
8:11the group um I've started a couple of
8:13software companies one of our companies
8:15is now the fastest growing one of the
8:16fastest growing companies in the UK um
8:19we you know we're a software business uh
8:21I've got a couple of agencies I've got a
8:24Education and Training business and
8:26where when you think about the UK and
8:28broadly the Western world today
8:29what is your assessment of where we're
8:31at as a country and what's concerning
8:33you because Gary expressed quite
8:34articulately that his big concern is
8:36that because of wealth INE equality
8:37we're going to end up in a similar
8:39position to the likes of India what are
8:41you concerned about I agree that it
8:43wasn't that long ago that we had real
8:46serious wealth inequality in this
8:47country there are amazing photos from
8:50like a 100 years ago of kids working in
8:52mines and kids doing oyster shocking and
8:54all this horrible work and um you know
8:57there's a there's a book Charles Dickens
8:59wrot wrote called The Tale of Two Cities
9:01and the opening line of the book is it
9:03was the best of times it was the worst
9:04of times and I think we've actually
9:06gotten to that point here where some
9:08people in the UK it's the best of times
9:10if you uh like in your situation you're
9:12you know you're booming you're a
9:13globally successful business um I've got
9:16a globally successful business and then
9:18there are a lot of people who completely
9:20cannot relate to this their you know
9:22Energy prices are now the most expensive
9:24in the Western World house prices are
9:26completely unaffordable it used to be
9:28used to take 3 years to for a deposit
9:30it's now 20 years if you you know
9:31theoretically 20 years if you can save
9:33for a deposit food prices are through
9:35the roof so we're we're in a really diff
9:37like for anyone who is not tapped into
9:40digital economy fast growth and all of
9:41that sort of stuff life is getting
9:43harder and worse um and things are
9:46collapsing um if you if you would um go
9:49with that the there is a predictable
9:52path countries go on and there's this
9:54thing called the economic freedom index
9:56and the economic freedom index basically
9:57says how economically free are you how
9:59how much access do you have to free
10:01markets um do can you start a business
10:03can you scale a business um does
10:05anything inhibit your ability to run
10:07your own life countries that have high
10:10degrees of economic freedom have very
10:12low poverty they have widespread
10:14affluence and countries that have low
10:16economic freedoms have high poverty and
10:18it can be the difference between less
10:20than 10% right up to 70% poverty rates
10:24um and when countries go on a path
10:26towards economic freedom poverty just
10:28drops so India for examp example has
10:29been on that path and they announced
10:31today that they've almost eradicated uh
10:33abject poverty or extreme poverty um the
10:36UK went on that path of low economic
10:38freedom to high economic freedom and we
10:40saw poverty rates come right down but in
10:432008 when the global financial crisis
10:45happened one of the things that happened
10:47is the government said we need to step
10:49in and we need to take charge and
10:51everyone said please do um so they came
10:53in and they said all right we're going
10:54to ramp up debt ramp up taxes uh to pay
10:57for the debt and we're also going to put
10:58it all regul in and unfortunately that
11:01starts to reduce economic freedom then
11:03the pandemic happens and they say oh
11:05we're going to spend more money again
11:07through debt we're going to have more uh
11:10taxes more regulations less economic
11:12freedom so the UK we went from an 82
11:15when I arrived in 2006 went from 82 out
11:18of 100 down to 68 out of 100 so we're
11:20less economically free and predictably
11:23what we will always see happen if you
11:25lower people's economic freedom more
11:28poverty
11:29uh less affluence uh the Millionaires
11:32and the wealth creators leave uh the
11:35people who are stuck in um dead end jobs
11:38uh or no jobs get incredibly frustrated
11:41everyone starts looking for someone to
11:43blame people are angry and they're like
11:44who do we blame and who do they blame
11:48it's very different because in the US we
11:50blame us blam someone different to the
11:52UK so we have a historical cultural
11:54memory in the UK we have a cultural
11:56memory that the people to blame are the
11:58rich so so uh we have landlords and uh
12:01aristocracy and the landed gentry those
12:04guys are to blame right so blame the
12:06rich is what we say in the UK in the US
12:09they have a very different view their
12:11cultural memory is that they're
12:12anti-government they want limited
12:14government in 2023 there was this song
12:17that came out called uh rich men north
12:19of uh Richmond and it was the number one
12:21song in America and the lyrics of the
12:24song basically says people in Washington
12:26do not care about working people um they
12:28ATT taxing everything we touch you can't
12:31earn money they depreciate the dollar um
12:34they tax tax tax tax tax and they want
12:36to control Our Lives those are the
12:37lyrics of the songs controlling our
12:39lives and taxing us so the American uh
12:43reaction to this is who's to blame
12:45government so we want smaller government
12:47we want a department of government
12:49efficiency to come in we want someone as
12:51a wrecking ball who will come in and
12:53smash government the British instinct is
12:56hate the rich it must be the Rich's
12:58fault so when we look for like all all
13:01of the Western countries that
13:02implemented lower economic
13:04freedoms created more poverty less
13:07affluence and more disruption to their
13:10economies so both us and UK for example
13:13and Australia as well but both sides of
13:16the pond want someone to blame it's just
13:18that the Americans blame government and
13:20we blame the rich Gary I'm sure you you
13:22have a lot to to say there I know you
13:25both use the word collapsing so you
13:26agree that there's a problem here but I
13:28think you from studying both of your
13:30sort of perspectives you think that this
13:34the solution and the cause of the
13:35problem is different I mean I put bets
13:37on I put bets on I put bet that's what I
13:40do I put bets on um at the beginning of
13:44covid we knew the government was going
13:45to give enormous amount of money out um
13:48total amount of money now UK government
13:49deficit since the beginning of Co is is1
13:51trillion pounds US number is $4
13:54trillion that's you know £20,000 per UK
13:58adult
13:59my background is I understand that when
14:02the distribution gets worse when
14:04inequality gets worse living standards
14:05full so when when the UK government was
14:09going to give a trillion pounds out all
14:10I wanted to know was who's going to end
14:12up with that money that's all I wanted
14:14to know and um I mean the US number 13
14:16trillion 14 trillion is just outlandish
14:19but I think the most amazing thing I've
14:21ever seen in my whole
14:23life was that at the beginning of Co the
14:26very beginning of Co we knew governments
14:28across the world we're going to be
14:29giving out tens of trillions of pounds
14:31dollars
14:32Euros nobody even thought to ask who's
14:36going to get tens of trillions richer
14:38nobody in the conservatives nobody in
14:40labor nobody in the Republicans nobody
14:42in Democrats nobody in the media nobody
14:44in Academia nobody the central banks
14:46nobody asked this it's
14:48it's it's it's almost beautiful it's
14:51it's unbelievable it's unbeliev so I I
14:53sat down and I did I did the analysis at
14:54the beginning because lockdown is
14:57essentially Banning the spending of the
14:58rich
14:59and replacing that spending of the rich
15:01with printed money from government what
15:03happens is the government gives workers
15:05money they use that money to pay their
15:07bills to pay their rent pay their
15:08mortgage it goes to the rich the rich
15:10can't spend it because they're locked
15:11indoors and what you get is essentially
15:14an enormous amount of money from the
15:15government to the poor to the rich and
15:17this massive massive transfer of wealth
15:19um that was obviously going that was so
15:22obviously going to happen at the
15:23beginning of Co nobody discussed it
15:25which I think is itself
15:27amazing let me ask you a question right
15:29if we were now to pause the economy for
15:322 years and during that pause massively
15:35increase wealth inequality what do you
15:37think would happen to Broad living
15:39conditions when we
15:41unpaused see one of the things that I
15:43think happened during the pandemic is
15:47everything went digital and um
15:50entrepreneurs and investors did actually
15:52think about what would happen the
15:53investors immediately boomed stocks like
15:56zoom and uh Microsoft and we ended up
15:59with the Magnificent 7 um I don't know
16:02if you you know there's seven big tech
16:04companies in the USA market and those
16:07big seven companies have gone from five
16:09trillion valuation to 17 TR trillion
16:12valuation uh in the time of the pandemic
16:15and if you think about what did the
16:16pandemic do uh everyone had to work from
16:19home so we all had to have Microsoft
16:21subscriptions everyone went onto website
16:23so we all went to AWS uh Amazon we all
16:26started buying and learning how to buy
16:27from Amazon rather than buying from from
16:29our local high streets every business in
16:31the world figured out how to run their
16:32business remotely uh we had this massive
16:35transformation it wasn't it was like
16:37it's actually a wholesale transformation
16:38of society that we all learned how to
16:40live and work differently um I saw a
16:43boom in entrepreneurship so what I saw
16:45as an entrepreneur accelerator um
16:47someone who runs an entrepreneur
16:48accelerator is just there was this
16:50sudden boom in people launching
16:52businesses uh setting up Shopify
16:55accounts setting up YouTube uh
16:57businesses so the money really has moved
17:01from the traditional economy the 2019
17:04High Street economy over to the digital
17:06economy and what we see is that the
17:08investors know what's going on and they
17:10just invest in This Magnificent Seven
17:11company I think 50% of the gains of the
17:13S&P 500 is tech companies um so all the
17:16money just goes flooding into the the
17:18technology companies my my belief is
17:20that technolog is really dividing people
17:22that essentially if you take anyone from
17:24any background if they work in
17:26technology uh if they're in Media Tech
17:28Finance any of that stuff that operates
17:30online they tend to actually do pretty
17:33pretty well after the pandemic I ask you
17:34a question yeah go for do you think the
17:37average Brit American Australian whoever
17:40the person out there is watching if they
17:41quit their job and go work in Tech do
17:43you think they'll be able to get
17:44Financial Security relatively
17:48easily depends when you defi Define
17:50Financial Security the issue with house
17:52prices the ability to raise a family
17:54have a home yeah so having a home is a
17:56big issue right so here's here's what I
17:59here's what I see with houses cuz houses
18:01annoy me as well my dad bought a house
18:03for
18:04$188,000 which is about £10,000 or less
18:06than £10,000 and it's probably worth
18:08over a million dollars um uh today so
18:11something went wrong and and this by the
18:13way is not UK specific uh the socialist
18:16countries had house prices go through
18:18the roof if you go to Norway or Sweden
18:19their house prices grew by 600% uh in
18:22then it's happening everywhere it's not
18:25specific to anywhere it's happening
18:26everywhere but but what happened what
18:27what has definitely in the UK is we
18:30actually have um a housing traffic jam
18:32so in this country in the UK we have 9.5
18:37million homes that have two or more
18:39spare bedrooms big family homes have two
18:42or more spare bedrooms and when you look
18:43into who owns those houses 78% of
18:45housing wealth is Baby Boomers um and
18:48now anecdotally I take my kids
18:49trick-or-treating at uh Halloween and we
18:52go down a street that is big family
18:54homes and you go knock on the doors and
18:55it's all people over 65 right and living
18:59in a big family home with empty spare
19:01bedrooms we you think the average
19:02American over 65 is living luxuriously
19:05the average American over 65 so more
19:08than half of the US economy is in the
19:09hands of baby boomers right so they own
19:12all the houses the the houses got bought
19:14up cheap baby boomers still own those
19:17houses to this day the big family homes
19:19with multiple spare bedrooms are empty
19:22um and now that creates this traffic jam
19:25people my age my grandparents yeah they
19:27all owned property
19:31all four of
19:32them died with
19:34nothing um because that wealth which
19:37they had in in property was was used in
19:41equity release schemes they they it was
19:43used in paying through their retirement
19:45it was used in End of Life Care um do
19:48you think when those old people die
19:49young people today will be rich there is
19:53half the economy held by baby burus it's
19:55either going to be passed down or passed
19:59into the age care industry or passed
20:01into the but the issue of why we can't
20:03get homes two things government
20:06massively inflated the value of homes
20:08through debt so they just in injected
20:10like low interest rates that you
20:11involved in who who is the debt to well
20:13the debt is to anyone who can take out
20:14Al loan because if a 0% interest rates
20:16or 2% interest R you think it's the debt
20:18is the ordinary families do you think
20:19ordinary families are the creditors when
20:20you say ordinary families you mean
20:23bottom third so if your average British
20:24or American family now has half a
20:26million pounds of debt crit it's anyone
20:29who could get their at that particular
20:31time anyone who could get their hands on
20:33a loan to buy a house but who has the
20:35credit who has who is on the other side
20:36of the debt so if the average British
20:38family million P banking license does
20:40the average British family have half
20:41million pound of credit well a lot of
20:43people have got a lot of equity in their
20:44home now you think the average British
20:46family is sitting on half a million
20:47pound cash I'd love to look at the what
20:48the actual number is but it's a couple
20:50hundred thousand worth of equity 78 what
20:52about the credit on the line credit on
20:54the line owns the credit on the line in
20:56mind it's disproportionately older
20:57people so
20:59think the average British old person is
21:00sitting on million millions of pounds of
21:02cash not millions of cash no equity well
21:04someone is on the other side of just one
21:05say the difference the difference is if
21:07you inflate the value of a house you
21:08don't have cash you have a house that's
21:10worth a lot of money so 78% of home
21:13ownership wealth is in the hands of
21:14people over 65 now it's baby boomer
21:16generation and they got a great gift
21:19from the government which is the
21:20government said we're going to just give
21:22free loans away if someone previously
21:25could have only afforded to take out a
21:26200 Grand loan with low interest rates
21:28they can afford a 300 Grand L do you
21:30think it's okay that the average British
21:33or American young person will never own
21:35any wealth the issue is not whether it's
21:37okay or not the issue is what do you do
21:38about it I do you own wealth I've got
21:40wealth yeah you own wealth but depends
21:42what you call Wealth I do so do we three
21:45multimillionaires do we think it's okay
21:47that the average Brit or American young
21:49person will never own any wealth that to
21:51me that's because I don't think that's
21:52okay to me that's not the debate is it
21:54okay it's not well it it's not okay no
21:57we want widespread would you rather that
21:59the people who currently are
22:01multi-millionaires would you rather that
22:02all of the world was owned by their kids
22:04I think that the way you see the world
22:07as a Trader is that the world is a zero
22:09sum game and that there's basically the
22:12pi is a fixed pi and it gets sliced up
22:15how fast is the growing now there's
22:16something like this what's UK GDP growth
22:18at the moment yeah it's not it's not
22:20high right 1% how much did your wealth
22:22grow in the last year uh exponentially
22:24okay so if our weals my wealth probably
22:26grew about 20% in the last year maybe 30
22:28okay okay if our worlds are growing 30%
22:31and the economy is growing at 1% where
22:33is it coming from if it's not coming
22:34from our viewers so I'll tell you where
22:36my wealth comes from my wealth comes
22:38from building technology companies and
22:40the way it works is pretty weird which
22:43is that I invent something out of my
22:46head and I go to investors and I say to
22:49the investors here's what we're going to
22:51create and I give them a spreadsheet and
22:53then they say we'll give you a couple
22:55hundred grand to get started which is
22:56called seed Capital but on paper makes
22:59me worth a couple of million right but
23:02there there's nothing has been taken
23:03from anyone at this point uh the
23:05investors have said okay we'll invest
23:07some money then as the business succeeds
23:09some more investors come along and they
23:11say we'll give you a little bit more
23:12money to keep growing it um and I'm
23:14innovating something new and let's say
23:17investors come in and give me a million
23:19pounds and for 10% of the company and
23:21the rest of the company's worth 9
23:22million or $9 million right so I'm not
23:26stealing something from the existing
23:27economy I'm bringing something from
23:29outside of the economy into the economy
23:31um and my quote unquote net worth is
23:34growing exponentially because investors
23:38say we'll give you a little bit of money
23:40that values the rest of the pie at a lot
23:42of money but there's everyone's getting
23:45richer in the in the wealth create
23:48there's where there's wealth extraction
23:49which is what Traders do they extract
23:51from the existing economy um and they
23:53bet on uh the economy and then there's
23:55wealth creation which what entrepreneurs
23:56do they come up with new ideas better
23:58ways of doing things and they build
24:00wealth so do you think the reason our
24:03viewers the average Brit American are
24:05getting poorer is because they don't
24:07know how to create wealth no the reason
24:09people are getting poorer is because
24:11economic freedoms are being eroded when
24:13we have high economic that with taxes
24:15well anything that imp it could be
24:16anything that impacts economic freedom
24:19so uh taxes and regulations are big was
24:21economic freedom higher in the 50s uh
24:2450s was okay so 50s was a interesting
24:28time we we were in food Russians in this
24:31country till uh 1956 so we had 10 years
24:33of food rations after the war um we had
24:36a labor shortage uh because only really
24:39men worked women hadn't entered the
24:40workforce in Mass um there had been
24:43three or 400,000 men killed in war so we
24:46actually had this big labor shortage the
24:48whole country needed to rebuild because
24:50of the blitz had bombed it so we had
24:51this huge need for economic activity and
24:54not enough people to do it we only had
24:552% unemployment people who had had their
24:58blown off were put to work at that
25:00particular time so we had this boom this
25:03postwar boom and we also had the postwar
25:05baby boom which drove consumption uh and
25:07then when we got to the 60s we had the
25:09Roaring 60s or the um The Swinging 60s
25:12right pretty amazing time in Britain and
25:14Along Comes high taxes uh and they put
25:17up the taxes massively at the end of the
25:2060s um and it pretty much crashed the
25:22economy one of the things that happened
25:23so what were the tax rates in the 50s
25:25well they went up as high as 80 to 90%
25:28uh for the top for the top ear I think
25:29it was in the 60s you sure about that I
25:32think the 50s are unique what is the
25:33answer feel like you they went up off
25:35the wall they went up after the war well
25:37in the US actually tax rates started got
25:38before the war but also the size of
25:41government as a percentage of GDP was
25:43like 30% it was a tiny like we're we're
25:45now 45% of the UK economy is government
25:48spending we have got a mass who funds
25:51that spending debt they the bank of
25:54England allows them to print endless
25:55amounts of debt which deflates Gary I
25:58want to get your opinion here cuz you're
26:00asking a lot of questions but I actually
26:01don't know your opinion I just want to
26:03know what Daniel thinks and I want our
26:05viewers to be able to research Daniel's
26:06opinions but how how do you disagree
26:08with those opinions listen Daniel's a
26:10businessman he's obviously a very
26:12successful businessman you know I I've
26:13not been any I'm not a businessman I'm
26:15not going to pretend to be a businessman
26:16I'm an economist I make money by being
26:18right on the economy Daniel's a good
26:19businessman and I'm right on the economy
26:21you know it's a simple as that basically
26:23you know I'm not a good businessman but
26:24I've got 15 years of being right on this
26:26on the economy and look and I know
26:28you're probably a wealthy man you
26:30probably don't want to pay high taxes
26:31you probably don't want your kids to pay
26:32high taxes but we exist in an economy
26:35where wealth is being extracted out of
26:37the middle class out of the working
26:39class very very rapidly it's benefiting
26:41people like the three of us at this
26:42table it will benefit our kids you know
26:45our kids will be rich their kids will be
26:46poor and I just think we should be
26:48honest with them capitalism's finished
26:50we won well done Stephen well done
26:53Daniel well done Gary it's over now our
26:55kids will be rich their kids will be
26:57poor they'll pay the tax taxes we won't
26:59pay the taxes we'll avoid it I'll make
27:01money betting on it year after year why
27:03are we lying to them why are we lying to
27:06them yeah I I think that's an overly
27:08simplified view of things I don't an
27:09overly simplified view of things that
27:10has made me a multimillionaire yeah well
27:12look entrepreneurs take bets on the
27:13economy as well we take bets differently
27:16um when we start a company we're betting
27:18on how the econ the average British and
27:20American worker at the 50th percentile
27:23do you think their kids will be richer
27:24than they are it depends if we have
27:26economic freedom or not right we're
27:28going to have a split test on this right
27:30we're going to have a split test we're
27:31going to have the UK seems like we're
27:34going to have more taxes more
27:36regulations and it seems like the us is
27:38going to have less taxes and less
27:39regulations here's what I've noticed
27:41I've noticed that places like Singapore
27:43that have small governments um have got
27:46widespread affluence there's not a lot
27:47of poverty in Singapore yeah except for
27:49the cleaners living in the closets yeah
27:51you know uh look but we don't count them
27:53in the statistics just like we don't
27:55count our viewers that that's not
27:57widespread in well there's a lot of
27:59people W I've seen them in the closets
28:01I've seen them in the closets there are
28:03there are some but they're not
28:05singaporeans well also you only count
28:07the rich ones look the the also the
28:10issue is is that they've come from even
28:13worse conditions in many cases people
28:15mve to Singapore for an increase in
28:17lifestyle right the um you could take
28:21Ireland or Switzerland right
28:23economically free places Ireland was
28:24economically in a disaster in think the
28:26average Irish person lives well well the
28:29their
28:30economy their economy almost collapsed
28:33in 2011 and they went down the road of
28:36lower taxes lower regulations and they
28:38attracted all sorts of businesses into
28:40the economy and do you think that works
28:41well for the average Irishman who
28:43doesn't own a home in Dublin the the if
28:45you measure everything by Home Ownership
28:47I'm measuring people by the average I
28:49want to know what the average man or
28:51woman today lives that by the way I I'm
28:54also Furious about the home ownership
28:55thing everyone is um I think it's
28:59utterly ridiculous the way like the idea
29:02that homes are now worth 10 times the
29:03average wage all of that difference is I
29:06blame government for that uh I blame
29:08high taxes where they've because of high
29:10taxes they can take out more debt they
29:12can then inflate the economy do you
29:14think if we shrink the government if we
29:16start to slash government spending do
29:17you think that would improve living
29:19conditions well the UK government is 45%
29:21of the economy like that's a huge
29:23government it's think using additions
29:25will increase in the next few years
29:27because we have US Government now that's
29:29planning to slash the US government well
29:31that's what the US voters have asked for
29:33do you think it would improve living
29:34conditions uh do I think it'll improve
29:38the average American if they're smaller
29:39government yeah I trust market so you
29:41think the average US American will be
29:42rich in years than the here what I trust
29:44I trust economic freedom if people have
29:46freedom they create better decisions for
29:48their own life there's two ways to make
29:50decisions right there's two ways you
29:51have freedom I got less freedom than I
29:53did when I ared just because my sister
29:55can't pay the rent is that freedom the
29:58if you're living in a country she can't
29:59to live in the city that she was born in
30:02I I agree you and I agree on the problem
30:04you keep bringing back to the problem I
30:06keep bringing it back to people because
30:07the people who watch We're millionaires
30:09okay the people who watch us are mostly
30:10not
30:11millionaires is life going to get better
30:13for them they life will get better if
30:16you are connected to the most productive
30:18parts of the economy um if you pretend
30:21that it's 1955 and you recreate the
30:23postwar era conditions if you try to go
30:26back to 1955 I don't think that's going
30:28to work so so let me ask on that then
30:29the point about if you're connected to
30:31the most productive parts of the economy
30:32I was quite um quite surprised when I
30:35was doing some research on this to find
30:36that there's quite big differences
30:37between the UK and the US in terms of
30:39GDP growth in Q4 2024 the US economy
30:42grew by 6% while the UK growth was 0.1%
30:46so they're doing significantly better in
30:48that regard US GDP per head stands at
30:51$82,000 per head whereas the UK stands
30:53at $49,000 per head and stock market
30:56performance which is an indication of I
30:57guess what ever Rose by 300% in the US
31:00whereas the footsy 100 declined by 20%
31:03Which is the UK stock market
31:05productivity growth since 2018
31:07productivity increased by 30% in the
31:10United States which has outpaced the the
31:12UK and lastly income growth since 2007
31:15American income per head has increased
31:17by 72% while it has decreased in by 2%
31:22in the UK in dollar terms so they seem
31:24to be doing better from if you just look
31:26at the economy um why is that is that
31:30because they lean more into technology
31:32and Innovation and Entrepreneurship and
31:34is it because of the things you were
31:35saying earlier about their attitude
31:36towards the Govern like reduced
31:39government spending versus tax the rich
31:41why I'm Keen to hear Gary's view on this
31:43because I understand yours because
31:44you've just said it yeah I think these
31:46are great statistics um and of course
31:48the US has a strong reput reputation for
31:51being very free markets and being very
31:53small states in the last 5 years 10
31:56years 15 years
31:58we've had a UK government that has been
31:59aggressively slashing the state and the
32:02US State's bigger than ever it's 45% of
32:04the economy and the us we had a
32:07government in the last four years which
32:08has been running a massive massive
32:10deficit so in that period of
32:14time it appears the government which has
32:16been aggressively increasing its deficit
32:19has massively overperformed the
32:21government which has been aggressively
32:22slashing the
32:23state that's what it looks to be from
32:25the last I mean b Joe Biden in
32:27enormously increased the deficit
32:29enormously and the conservatives were
32:30austerity government for 14 years which
32:33one seems to have given the better
32:35numbers well I mean there were austerity
32:37in name only they went from 30% uh the
32:40state was 30% of GDP to 45% of
32:43government services haveed now they're
32:45the government is terrible at doing most
32:47things that's the problem you you you
32:49don't want you don't think that spending
32:51on government service has been slashed
32:54let me let me zoom out a little you
32:55think the police spending has been
32:56slashed OH police spending is definitely
32:58do you know where it ends up it ends up
33:00with like big corporates uh big
33:03Consulting who get paid $50 million to
33:06produce a report to tell government some
33:08thing right all of these big I won't
33:10name names but all the big consulting
33:12firms they're all blood suckers to
33:14government they they know that the money
33:16is in the government and they set up
33:19business models to extract that money
33:20from government uh and it also is in the
33:23financial trading side of things the one
33:26of the issues that we've got right and
33:27this is a big big issue as well cuz you
33:29care about wealth inequality one of the
33:30biggest issues I see is that during the
33:32pandemic we all learned to work remotely
33:35and remotor became the norm and what I
33:37see at the moment is huge amounts of
33:39what would have been normal British jobs
33:41are going to the Philippines going to
33:43India going to uh Vietnam people who
33:45work remotely now we now have a thousand
33:48millionaires a month leaving to go to
33:50Dubai we have 120,000 British people
33:53living in Dubai uh in in that economy
33:56the world's become incredibly mobile and
33:59one of the things that's happening is
34:01that what would have previously been
34:03good British jobs uh are getting moved
34:06overseas to lower cost countries and
34:08that's technology that drives that wedge
34:10the US is very smart in that they've
34:12built a technology Powerhouse and the UK
34:15has completely lost our technology
34:16industry our tech industry is in Decline
34:18same same across Europe China and the us
34:22know that the game is Tech and they've
34:24basically pulling all the tech company
34:26into the into their uh borders and
34:29what's happening a lot is the erosion of
34:31good jobs and the erosion of of just
34:33normal well-paying uh jobs because they
34:38they're going and it's a bit of a
34:39self-fulfilling Loop that the more we
34:42lose millionaires the tax burden falls
34:44on everyone else so they put the taxes
34:46up and then the millionaires say oh the
34:48taxes are too high so they leave um I've
34:50watched some of the most incredible
34:51entrepreneurs that you would want here
34:53that would employ your sister at a high
34:54rate um and they've picked up and left
34:57cuz the taxes are too high so you saying
34:58we should tax working people less well
35:02the the the overall government has to be
35:05smaller uh you can't whoever what do you
35:07want to cut in the government if you uh
35:10yeah I mean you'd have to Child Services
35:12we'd have to no police no education NHS
35:16all I know is this pensions you go to
35:18Switzerland they SP single mothers 25%
35:21disabled benefits what do you want to
35:22cut hold up all I know is in Switzerland
35:24I tell you what I want the government is
35:26TA on those entrepreneurs and raise the
35:29taxes on the billionaires because I
35:31worked my tits off how many billionaires
35:33are in the UK there's a lot of
35:35billionaires in the UK 150 yeah so tax
35:37them more what do they pay listen I went
35:39my tits off and I paid it was 50% top
35:41rate tax 50% top rate tax plus National
35:44Insurance 60% million to bring my family
35:46out of poverty at the same time the Duke
35:48of Westminster inherited 10 billion and
35:51paid nothing do you think that's fair
35:52that's not true okay why is it not true
35:55because the Duke of Westminster is one
35:57of the highest tax payers in the country
35:58what does he pay well on the trust the
36:00groer estate uh they don't pay
36:02inheritance tax because trusts can't die
36:05they pay something called periodic taxes
36:07which how much 6% every 10 years 6% so
36:10they pay 0.6% so I paid 16% and this guy
36:13pays 0.6% apples with apples inheritance
36:16tax is 40% across the course of your
36:18life if a trust is uh if a person lives
36:21who owns a trust for 70 years then 6%
36:25time 7 would be 42 so they actually pay
36:28more so he pays 0.6% a year Pro 0.6%
36:33that would be the same as what percent
36:34did I pay per no no no but that's 60% so
36:36you're saying I pay what 60 of a 0.6
36:39what 100 times the tax not comparing
36:41apples with apples wait why is it not
36:43apples with apples this guy pays 0.6% a
36:45year I paid 60% a year that's
36:47inheritance tax I paid that 60% every
36:49year Daniel every year I paid you're pay
36:51income tax so why have I du P more than
36:55the Duke of Westminster pays income tax
36:56he probably he probably makes your bill
36:59blush yeah think can pay his income tax
37:01yeah well if he's going to live he has
37:03to withdraw money to have his income he
37:05also let me give you a list of all the
37:07taxes he would pay he'd pay income tax
37:09corporate tax he'd pay stamp Duty when
37:11he buys a building he pays uh uh any of
37:14the other taxes vat when he spends money
37:16all the same taxes apply to a duuk as
37:18they apply to anybody else so you think
37:20he pays income tax on on the income on
37:21that any income he draws okay well our
37:23viewers can research whether he pays
37:24income tax on his income because I don't
37:26think he does
37:28it's in a trust but the only difference
37:30with the trust versus income is that the
37:33trust pays periodic tax versus
37:36inheritance tax 0.6% but we're only
37:38talking inherit that that's just one
37:40type of tax you think he's paying 60% on
37:43his income he's one of the highest
37:44taxpayers in the UK I'm not like his big
37:46fan club but the truth is he's one of
37:48the highest taxpayers in the UK um he's
37:50one of the biggest Employers in the UK
37:51he's one of the like one of the biggest
37:53land owners in the UK land owners in the
37:54UK right uh so uh the the issue is is
37:58does he pay tax all the same taxes that
38:00apply to you apply to him uh and if you
38:02want to set up a trust you can also pay
38:03periodic taxes as well um which would be
38:06on top of all the other taxes so what
38:08would you say but it's just not true
38:10that he doesn't pay tax no what would
38:11you say this guy has inherit 1010
38:13million P so he's worth 10 billion PS
38:16what would you say will be the total
38:17amount of tax he will pay in his
38:18lifetime well I know that just the
38:20smallest if I make 10 million I pay 60%
38:23just one sec you're not you're talking
38:26about income versus the transfer of an
38:29estate so why why is it that the be 10
38:32million P just you're comparing your
38:34income yeah versus the amount he
38:36inherited which is not a fair thing
38:38that's not income that's his income he
38:40inheritance is not income so wait wait
38:42wait wait wait wa so if I get given1
38:44billion I don't pay any tax but if I
38:46work for10 billion I pay 60% well if you
38:49inherit this is the tax system that you
38:50want you'll end up in a system where the
38:53kids of the richual own everything
38:55that's what I'm saying that's what I'm
38:56saying and that's fun because that's our
38:58kids you're not telling the truth about
38:59his let's support it let's have a tax
39:01system where your kids and my kids and
39:03Steven's kids are multimillionaires and
39:05these guys out there can't afford to
39:06feed their kids and put the heat in
39:08that's not what I'm saying but that's
39:09what you will get that is what you will
39:10get that's listen that's what I'm
39:12betting on that's fine because I'll make
39:14money in the markets it's fine and
39:15you'll make money and you'll make money
39:16it's our viewers who will be poor and
39:18that's fine that's fine that's fine for
39:19us let's let's explore the other
39:21alternative right so let's say tax the
39:22rich right so let's play the game of tax
39:24the rich tax the owners not the workers
39:26the owners
39:28so the issue that we have with the rich
39:31is that is the number one most valuable
39:33Assets in the economy now in tangible
39:35assets so there's this chart called the
39:37S&P 500 of the 500 richest countries in
39:40the country uh in the world in the US
39:42sorry um in
39:451970s 75% of the value of the S&P 500
39:49was physical assets like property um and
39:52today it's less than 10% uh it's closer
39:54to 5% you think that housing is not
39:56particularly important just just let's
39:58stick stick with what I'm saying okay
40:00the the the PowerHouse the engine room
40:02of the economy is digital assets and
40:05that's reflected in uh the S&P 500 for
40:07example which is 95% intangible assets
40:11one of the issues that we have is that
40:12the richest people are completely mobile
40:14now so they can be absolutely anywhere
40:16in the world so if you come up with this
40:18idea of let's tax richest people 1% if a
40:22tiny proportion of them leave we're all
40:24in trouble so this really rich guys
40:27M what do they own companies and why are
40:32those companies worth money because
40:34investors say they are and where do the
40:36revenues come from globally okay the
40:38issue is is that these companies operate
40:40globally now so take my company for
40:42example my company has 8,000 customers
40:45in 150 countries okay we could be
40:48anywhere if you P what country is your
40:50biggest single Revenue Source probably
40:51the US now let's say you move to Cayman
40:55Island and the US says we're going to
40:57tax your Revenue at point of sale M what
41:01can you do well that's different right
41:04because that's not taxing billionaires
41:05that's taxing
41:07companies see when you say tax the rich
41:09on their wealth yeah that's different to
41:12saying tax companies a consumption tax
41:14oh but you just said the're Rich owned
41:15companies you said that's what they own
41:16yeah but you're saying how do you tax
41:18them right so do they do you tax their
41:20wealth which is what they own or do you
41:23tax the companies where they trade um
41:25typically consumption taxes get passed
41:27on to Consumers it's not consumption tax
41:29it's the tax on the ownership yeah but
41:31if you simply say when you're doing
41:32revenues then that's a consumption we
41:34start to tax if we start to taxit by the
41:38way I'm not exactly against you on on
41:40companies I think it's disgusting that a
41:43British company can can take out a
41:45Facebook ad to sell to a British
41:48consumer a British product and Facebook
41:51pretends to be in Ireland on that
41:52transaction um and Amazon you can buy
41:55something on Amazon in Britain from a
41:56British supplier from a British
41:57warehouse and Amazon pretends to be in
41:59Luxembourg in that situation and that
42:01sucks right like that that does not seem
42:04fair and it strikes me as very strange
42:06that the government is okay with that
42:08right now the government is chasing down
42:10moms and dads who sell a few things on
42:12eBay uh and chasing them for taxes but
42:15they don't talk to eBay uh they they
42:18they're paranoid about someone doing a
42:20little bit of a side hustle on Facebook
42:22but Facebook's fine to pretend to be an
42:23Ireland so I don't agree with all of all
42:25of that right like I think where missing
42:27some serious tricks here but the idea
42:30with taxing billionaires at wealth
42:33billionaires will just leave they just
42:34get up and leave and and not just
42:36billionaires but what the billionaires
42:38own what the billionaires own companies
42:40and where do companies get their money
42:41from revenues and where do the revenues
42:43come from purchasing people purchasing
42:46where do those people live all over the
42:49world we can tax them at that point
42:50that's consumption tax this is the thing
42:52that's a consumption tax no it's not
42:54it's V is a tax on Revenue tax these
42:56guys on profits based on where the
42:57revenues come from so it's very easy to
42:59move profits internationally see Steven
43:02had a uh Starbucks cup when he buys that
43:04Starbucks yeah it's bought from a
43:06British company who licenses the
43:09Starbucks logo from Luxembourg or
43:12somewhere like that so 15% so here we
43:15are saying oh we're going to tax their
43:16profits they say ah I wish we were
43:18profitable sorry unfortunately we had to
43:20do that licensing deal with that
43:21International I know how profit shifting
43:23works okay so are you you think are you
43:25telling
43:26me compan selling to the UK the US
43:30enormous amount of of profit in the US
43:32and they turn around and say actually
43:33our profit is not in the US the
43:35difference you think the US is in is is
43:37incapable of going and looking if that's
43:38seeing where they really where the
43:39profit is I'm not saying that you can't
43:41do this I'm saying that the benefits of
43:43doing it it's so hard to tax wealth for
43:46example or it's so hard to tax uh
43:49Millionaires and billionaires that that
43:51you end up cutting off your nose despite
43:52your face um for every like if we
43:57Britain for example and we build a brand
43:59which is that we're anti- wealth we
44:01don't want you to ever have more than 10
44:02million if you've got more than 10
44:04million we punish you every young
44:06entrepreneur who comes to me and says
44:07dan do you think I should start a
44:08company here in this country I'm going
44:10to say well if you do uh they'll take it
44:14as soon as you start to make it they'll
44:15take it as soon as if you're successful
44:17if you get investment they're going to
44:18tax you at your wealth if you sell the
44:21company they're going to take it off you
44:23I'm going to basically say to that young
44:24entrepreneur don't build your business
44:26in brit go start it somewhere that
44:28they're more proactive and positive
44:30towards entrepreneurs are we seeing that
44:32now with this they call it the
44:33millionaire Exodus which is for people
44:35that don't know the UK has set to lose
44:37the greatest proportion of millionaires
44:38in the world um this Parliament I'll put
44:40a graph on the screen which is this one
44:42here this one here and that little red
44:46line here is US losing all of our
44:49millionaires at the moment and in 2024
44:51it's an estimated that 10,800 high net
44:54worth individuals left the UK which is
44:5757% increase from the previous year
44:59which means that 1 millionaire is
45:01departing every 45 minutes the UK
45:03millionaire Exodus is equal to losing
45:06530,000 average taxpayers and another
45:10stat the top 10% of earners in the US
45:12account for nearly half of all consumer
45:14spending the top 1% of income taxpayers
45:16in the UK are projected to contribute
45:18about 30% of total income tax from 2024
45:21to
45:222025 why are all these millionaires
45:24running away well it's not because
45:26they're taxing their world because we
45:27don't have any wealth taxes why why do
45:29you think they're leaving I think the
45:31reason they're leaving is because the UK
45:32economy is is really really weak because
45:34the UK consumer is really really weak
45:36because you've absolutely crushed the
45:37spending power of your average British
45:39family your average British family can
45:41barely afford to feed the kids and turn
45:43the heating on so why are you going to
45:44start a business here when the customers
45:46are absolutely impoverished look it
45:47corresponds with a new tax that we
45:49brought in which was um we ended the
45:51non-dom scheme so the non-dom scheme
45:54basically said if you're living in the
45:55UK but you've got businesses all over
45:57the world uh then we only tax you on
46:00what you've got in the UK um and if you
46:02die in the UK uh we'll only tax you on
46:05your UK assets for inheritance tax if
46:07you're a non-dom uh but if you die in
46:09the UK and you've got uh wealth in India
46:12once that nonon scheme ended they
46:14basically said we will tax you on
46:16everything globally if you're an
46:17economic uh if you're a tax resident in
46:19the UK everything you've got globally we
46:21want 40% of it so unfortunately every
46:23wealth manager contacted their clients
46:25and said you can't stay here you're
46:27going to have to get out um it's it's
46:29gotten really bad a th000 people a month
46:30are leaving and in the UK 1% of people
46:33pay 30% of the taxes 10% of people pay
46:3660% of the taxes and you imagine if
46:38we're sitting out at dinner and there's
46:4010 of us out to dinner and one person
46:42says hey I've got this I get I'll get
46:4460% of the bill tonight we say to them
46:47no it should be 70% should be 80% and
46:49they say you know what I'll get up and
46:51leave so they leave everyone else's bill
46:54just doubled so what's going to happen
46:56is if we drive the millionaires out of
46:57this country everyone every ordinary
47:00normal person who pays 10 grand a year
47:02in tax will now have to pay 20 grand a
47:03year in tax so the reason they left
47:05because we used to allow them to not pay
47:07tax and we Ta on their Global incomes on
47:10their Global isn't it a bit more like if
47:11we were 10 of us at dinner and there was
47:13one guy who came on to dinner on the
47:15condition he wouldn't pay their leaves
47:17because these guys weren't paying tax
47:18anyway the reason they left is because
47:20they weren't paying tax it's like saying
47:22um it's like saying hey I'll pay 60% of
47:25this table and they say at the table hey
47:27wait a second we also want you to pay
47:29for everything that's happening at other
47:30restaurants as well isn't it a bit more
47:33like these guys we're stretching on a
47:36condition you you yourself said the
47:38reason why they left is because we let
47:40them live here on the condition that
47:42they didn't have to pay taxes on their
47:43Global yeah taxes matter right so why
47:46why is everyone going to Dubai Dubai
47:48they're going there because there's no
47:49tax these guys they live in Dubai their
47:51money comes from the West they are
47:53making money from the West while your
47:55average Western ordinary person watching
47:57this show now cannot afford to buy a
47:59house cannot afford to have a family we
48:01can tax those revenues at the point of
48:04sale why do we allow these it's a called
48:06a consumption tax no it's not it's a tax
48:08on tax on profit not tax on consumption
48:10you just said at point of sale which
48:11means it's a consumption tax based on
48:13the profits you look at how much profit
48:15they where the profits exactly it's not
48:17consumption tax what I'm saying so no so
48:19if you tax profits yeah right then those
48:23profits have to accumulate in that
48:25country and because of the digital
48:27ecosystem that we now have the world we
48:29now live in I can lease the database off
48:32of my company in Luxembourg I can uh
48:35license the I can license my logo from
48:38understand how profit
48:39shifting listen these guys are not
48:41gandal you just say we don't accept
48:43profit shifting we don't need to accept
48:46profit shifting China does not accept
48:47profit shifting we did not accept profit
48:49shifting 50 years ago we do not have to
48:51accept profit shifting but you have a
48:54government class who are extremely
48:55wealthy and a media class are extremely
48:57wealthy saying it's impossible to tax
48:59rich people and I would like to say I
49:00will agree 100% it is difficult to tax
49:03rich people it is very very very
49:06difficult to tax rich people I don't I
49:07don't come here saying I want to tax
49:09rich people because it's easy I know
49:11it's hard I know probably I'm going to
49:13lose I know our viewers kids will live
49:15in Desperate poverty I know that I do
49:17this because it is hard if we are a
49:19country which says to ourselves we don't
49:21try and do things which are necessary to
49:24keep our kids out of poverty because
49:25they are hard then our kids will live in
49:28poverty I don't need to be here I'm a
49:29multimillionaire just like you I could
49:31be in the Philippines drinking panac
49:32laders I come in here because I come
49:34from a poor background and it's ordinary
49:36families like my family like the kids I
49:38grew up with whose kids are going to be
49:40in poverty it's difficult but it is
49:42necessary sometimes we have to do things
49:45not because they're easy but because
49:47they are hard that is what makes a rich
49:50country rich and that is what protects
49:53ordinary people listen our grandparents
49:55lived in poverty did they say let's not
49:57change it because it's hard no they
49:59didn't they fought and they demanded
50:01they demanded Health Care education
50:03housing food and they got it they got it
50:06that's why my parents could live a good
50:08quality life they got those things they
50:10got those things and they were aware
50:12that in order to do that you could not
50:14allow the super rich who have been
50:16living lives of luxury for hundreds and
50:17hundreds of years to eat everything
50:19while ordinary families couldn't afford
50:21to feed their kids I know it's difficult
50:23I know it's difficult and I know I'm
50:24probably going to lose I know that I
50:25know I'm probably going to lose and that
50:26means our viewers will be poor but I do
50:28it anyway because I do not want this
50:30country that I grew up in to fall into
50:32desperate poverty I agree with you on
50:34the passion and I agree with you on the
50:36problem I don't agree with you on the
50:39solution because in 2019 we be kids in
50:432020 and that's not what I'm saying in
50:452020 we made a decision globally to shut
50:48down the economy and we taught everyone
50:50that they can live and work from
50:51anywhere the biggest threat to
50:52everything you're saying is remote
50:54working the fact that we can live and
50:56work work from anywhere our grandparents
50:59their boss if their boss owned a company
51:01that company had to physically be in the
51:02country and the boss had to physically
51:04be in the country if we look at today
51:07there are plenty of fitness trainers who
51:08work for a gym and the owner of that gym
51:10is somewhere overseas plenty of people
51:12work in live work in a restaurant and
51:14the owner of the restaurant lives
51:15overseas you can live in you can run a
51:17business from anywhere in the world
51:18right now so the problem that we face is
51:21that you're describing on one hand you
51:25say we need to tax it at the point of
51:27sale which is a consumption tax and not
51:29tax on profit okay and then you say a
51:31tax on profit and then you say oh but
51:33then we'll stop profit shifting by the
51:35way I'm also actually all for this idea
51:37of stopping profit I I've already said I
51:39think it's utterly ridiculous the way
51:42that many of these global companies are
51:44treated and if we don't stop that then
51:46all the money just flows out to the tech
51:48companies um so I'm I'm with you on that
51:50but when you say tax the rich the actual
51:53people who own the companies those
51:55people can be anywhere right now so but
51:58but their revenues can't their customers
52:00their customers are where their
52:01customers are their customers are where
52:03their customers are listen Amazon
52:05doesn't pay any UK tax doesn't pay any
52:07us tax where are the customers in the UK
52:08and Us in UK US do you really think it's
52:11impossible for us to tax that well
52:12you're talking about taxing people at 10
52:14million plus right so this is a lot of
52:16startup entrepreneurs Jeff Bez is a lot
52:18more than 10 million jez Jeff worth a
52:20lot more than you talk about anyone
52:23above 10 million is on your radar you
52:25don't want people worth 11 million
52:27pounds we pay more I'm not just talk
52:28it's not that Dan if you you you're
52:30worth more than 10 million pounds so if
52:32we tax people
52:33on as Gary says that have more than 10
52:36million what are your options to avoid
52:38say if your objective was to avoid that
52:41what options do you have look if if my
52:43objective was to avoid it I pass a board
52:45resolution that we're moving the head
52:47office somewhere else yeah um we move
52:49the intellectual property somewhere else
52:51I pick up and move my family somewhere
52:53else and within about a week or two
52:55we've got a we work office somewhere
52:57else I've got a new house on Airbnb
52:59somewhere else and I cut ties with the
53:02UK and I'm non- tax resident here and I
53:05can I have a digital business I can
53:07literally make my head office anywhere
53:08in the world if there was a particular
53:10country that turned hostile towards uh
53:13our operations they not have to withdraw
53:15service from that thing you know so that
53:17that's possible but it's unlikely that
53:19that would actually happen but
53:21ultimately if I choose to get up and
53:22leave then I get up and leave now the
53:25the the bigger issue is would I have
53:26even come here in the first place and
53:28then there's another issue and here's
53:30the other issue Gary for you you've just
53:32had 750,000 subscribers to your YouTube
53:35channel 820 it's 8:20 right so it's
53:38going up fast I could have one of my
53:41analysts at a consulting company do
53:44valuation of your brand and do valuation
53:46of your YouTube channel we could say
53:48this is a fast growth media company and
53:50it's worth 11 million right so we could
53:53come up with a forecast and a projection
53:55and we say Gary's economics is actually
53:57a new Fast growth media brand it's worth
54:0011 million now your channel now you have
54:02to pay 100 Grand a year in extra taxes
54:04because you're a millionaire sorry 1% on
54:06wealth above 10 million on 11 million is
54:09going to be 10 grand taxes oh you're
54:11saying only on the part above that's how
54:13taxes work so it's not on everything
54:14it's okay so it's a it's a marginal tax
54:16that's how taxes work it's so okay so
54:20but is it fair that like who gets to
54:22decide what wealth Is wealth and what
54:24it's worth because wealth let's just hit
54:26me out wealth is a a technical term for
54:28unrealized gains right it's not real uh
54:32you know someone buys a house for 20
54:34grand and it's worth 200 Grand uh
54:37they've still got the same house but now
54:38they've got wealth um if someone starts
54:41a business and a tiny little seed
54:43investor puts in a little angel
54:45investment uh now they've got wealth on
54:47paper but who gets to say what is wealth
54:50um like for
54:52example if you introduce wealth taxes
54:54theoretically that will actually reduce
54:56the value of wealth of things anyway
54:58because things in inside that economy
55:00are now subject to a disadvantage so
55:03therefore investors will be unlikely to
55:05invest in them to a certain point and
55:07also people start cutting and dodging
55:10and weaving and ducking and weaving so
55:11they say oh our UK operations worth 10
55:13million so we're now going to start a
55:15second company over in some other
55:17country and make sure that that's where
55:19the wealth accumulates so it's
55:20incredibly difficult because it is just
55:22unrealized gains I know I know it's
55:24difficult yeah I know I know these guys
55:26have the best accountants I I know it's
55:27difficult I know so what if there was an
55:28easier solution if there was an easier
55:31solution I would support that you know
55:32what I mean it's called it's called
55:34economic freedom the economic freedom
55:35index okay well just tell the viewers
55:38that give them more economic freedom and
55:39then they'll be rich yeah so this this
55:40diagram here basically says the most
55:42free countries have less than 10%
55:45poverty in fact less than 7% poverty as
55:47soon as you reduce economic freedom it
55:49jumps to 30% poverty you reduce economic
55:51freedom again and it jumps up to huge
55:54huge amounts of poverty so the these
55:56countries here are the least
55:57economically free and these countries
55:59are the most economically free the
56:00countries that get in the way of your
56:02economic freedom have more poverty and
56:05the countries that let people make
56:06decisions for their own life what you're
56:08saying is if the governments of our
56:10countries cut taxes on us the three
56:12multimillionaire sitting at this table
56:14that will improve the lives of the
56:17ordinary British and American give a
56:19real life example to feed their kids
56:20I'll give you a real life example uh I
56:22know of a company that was going to give
56:24pay Rises to its employees and then
56:25National Insurance went up and instead
56:27of National Insurance is a tax on
56:28employment yeah I'm saying to reduce
56:30that I'm saying to reduce tax on I want
56:32your viewers the viewers here to be
56:34paying less tax while multimillionaires
56:36pay more tax good in theory but of if
56:40you could tax rich people 1% of their
56:42wealth above 10 million uh I did a back
56:45of a napkin cap calculation you might be
56:47able to get 20 billion yeah right that's
56:49if they don't leave that's if they don't
56:51respond to it if they just happily pay
56:52it you get 20 billion that's less than a
56:54week worth of current government
56:55spending
56:57so the government's out of control 1.2
56:59trillion a year of government spending
57:01is now what they spend okay so let's cut
57:03that get that 20 billion and cut the
57:05taxes for the viewers cut their income
57:08tax so that works out about 250 a year
57:11okay so let's do more let's make it 60
57:13billion so then you tax 3% above wealth
57:16yeah do that right and then you also
57:18bring it down this is what governments
57:19do make five or six yeah and then and
57:22that's what they did that's what they
57:23did in the second world war and that's
57:24why my dad could afford a house actually
57:26that's not why you could afford a house
57:28okay well who's buy if Ordinary People
57:30are losing their houses and the wealth
57:31which they are yeah and we're getting
57:33richer yeah who is it who is now owning
57:35the houses if it is not us the
57:37government used to own the houses and
57:38then they sold the government wealth is
57:40collapsing government wealth is
57:41collapsing but what they did is they
57:42sold the houses to the people okay but
57:44but ordinary middle is also you can only
57:47do that once and they did it for the
57:48baby so you think it's our viewers who
57:50have got my houses now who where is the
57:52wealth going Daniel where is the wealth
57:54going who has the wealth now who is
57:56getting rich who is getting the wealth
57:57that is lost by our viewers I'll tell
57:59you where the biggest amounts of money
58:00are going the biggest amounts of money
58:02uh since the pandemic uh 11 trillion
58:05went just to the value of seven
58:07companies that own te technology so the
58:09biggest seven companies in the USA 11
58:12trillion has and you don't want their
58:14billionaire owners to pay more tax well
58:16would that help the UK well if you use
58:18that money to reduce tax on working
58:20people then it it would help yeah they
58:22own shares in the USA they're US
58:24citizens so that doesn't help us here
58:27but it will help the American Consumer
58:28and then we can export the American
58:30Consumer and it will mean the American
58:31Consumer has money and then it will show
58:32British people how much you can achieve
58:34by taxing Super Rich we can raise tax on
58:36our Super Rich here and then what I want
58:39is these guys to be taxed so much that
58:40they start to sell assets and then
58:42ordinary British people can buy assets
58:44again because what I want is our viewers
58:46to be able to own things to be able to
58:48own their own homes I when I hear this
58:51um I admissibly don't know as much about
58:53these issues as you guys do but when I
58:54hear that there's these seven tech
58:56companies in the US my brain goes can't
58:59we have one here yeah yeah can't we
59:02start and then so my brain goes how what
59:04conditions do we have to create ones
59:06that we had yeah what conditions do we
59:07have to create to have one of those
59:09seven tech companies here especially in
59:10this sort of AI World we're heading
59:12towards where when I was reading through
59:13the stats most of the investment in AI
59:16which is going to be hugely
59:17destabilizing across every industry from
59:19driving to to any form of knowledge work
59:22even podcasting I can play your podcast
59:24now yeah which sounds exactly like me
59:26which has a 4.6 star rating on Apple
59:29which was written by AI in my voice
59:31published by AI Wild and the and who's
59:34acing the value there well it's a
59:35company in America called 11 labs and
59:37it's bloody open Ai and I why why can't
59:41we have those companies here we need
59:42them here because China and the US are
59:44dominating this next
59:45Revolution um and I I worry as a
59:49bystander that if we don't create
59:51entrepreneurship friendly environments
59:53here we're going to we are going to
59:55become Indian yeah M so you if you want
59:58businesses that to thrive you don't need
1:00:01just a good environment for
1:00:03entrepreneurs you also need people to
1:00:06have money that they can spend MH and we
1:00:09are in a country where
1:00:10increasingly most of the people out
1:00:12there have almost nothing left over at
1:00:14the end of the month they can barely pay
1:00:16the bills those companies are selling
1:00:17globally right so they don't need any
1:00:19particular company to do well they just
1:00:21they sell to anywhere so like open AI
1:00:23chat GPT we're all using that Bloody
1:00:25product and pay our 20 $30 a month yeah
1:00:27where do they actually get their money
1:00:28from right they get their money from
1:00:29selling data to to to the rich right my
1:00:32point was making the environment more
1:00:34friendly for entrepreneurs because when
1:00:35I start a company I am at a I can't
1:00:37explain the disadvantage I'm at at the
1:00:39moment if I start that kind of company
1:00:40here in the UK there's no investors and
1:00:43then all the talent seems to flock over
1:00:44to San Francisco so the the guys that
1:00:46built the British guys that built an AI
1:00:49company called fixer which I was going
1:00:50to invest in all British Lads from
1:00:51London they went over to San Francisco
1:00:53they're like 25y olds they've just
1:00:55raised at a 60 million valuation they're
1:00:57in this room this building in San
1:01:00Francisco full of entrepreneurs and
1:01:02they're pumping knowledge and capital
1:01:03into this room with all due respect
1:01:05Stephen you're not a great example for
1:01:07the fact that it's impossible to start a
1:01:09successful online brand in the UK facts
1:01:11um but I also realized that the problem
1:01:13of of but he started when things were
1:01:16different but I I also realized I don't
1:01:17like using personal examples because
1:01:19there's a huge amount of privilege and
1:01:21okay is there a chat gbt in Germany No
1:01:24is there a chat gbt in in France no is
1:01:27there a chat GPT in Australia no no is
1:01:29there a chat GPT in ja it's China and
1:01:31one sec SEC yeah exactly what you have
1:01:33here is an extremely low labor extremely
1:01:36high Capital model which employs
1:01:37extremely few people across the entire
1:01:39world that is focused in basically two
1:01:41cities yeah good luck competing with
1:01:44that H how do we create an environment
1:01:46where the UK can start to build some of
1:01:48these companies which are going to
1:01:49capitalize on this next technological
1:01:51Revolution how if you were prime
1:01:52minister what would you do I think you
1:01:55need to look realistically about what
1:01:56companies do we have a chance of growing
1:01:57you know I'm not an expert in AI but I
1:01:59think trying to compete with San
1:02:01Francisco in London would will probably
1:02:03not work why try try and do it you know
1:02:06try and do it and listen I know that you
1:02:08can get a lot of likes saying let's just
1:02:10invest in AI let's just invest only one
1:02:11city in the world outside of China has
1:02:13Managed IT China has Managed IT by
1:02:14basically State capitalism you know this
1:02:16is very similar in a sense to what we
1:02:17had with micro Electronics in Japan in
1:02:19the 8S right when you have a new
1:02:21industry especially these industries
1:02:22which are very Capital intense and don't
1:02:24employ many people you get a first move
1:02:26Advantage they tend to win eventually
1:02:29often they get undercut by cheaper
1:02:30Rivals and that does happen you know
1:02:31that does happen and you might stand in
1:02:33AI I don't think AI is going to become a
1:02:35massive massive employer of course you
1:02:38know a lot of countries are going to be
1:02:39like because basically it sounds good
1:02:41we're going to invest in I we're going
1:02:42to invest in AI personally I think we
1:02:44should be looking at what does the
1:02:45British person need you know we live in
1:02:47a country where the housing stock is
1:02:49falling apart if if we say AI when we
1:02:52talk about AI I think we're actually
1:02:53talking about technology because even a
1:02:56podcast like a podcast like this you
1:02:57don't think this of this as an AI
1:02:59company but actually now the editing
1:03:01process the scripting process the
1:03:03transcription process even YouTube
1:03:05itself is an AI company so it's it's
1:03:08really technology we're speaking about
1:03:09here and I'm wondering why we can't
1:03:10create a better environment in the UK to
1:03:13start launching and building some of
1:03:14these technology companies we've even
1:03:16seen I think we should and I think we
1:03:17should be looking we should be look at
1:03:18reducing taxes on people who who work
1:03:21and make money this is what I've been
1:03:22saying for the whole time what about
1:03:24people what about people who start
1:03:25companies
1:03:26yeah we should reduce their taxes on the
1:03:27income that they make but then if they
1:03:29start owning A50 million pound company
1:03:31are you telling me if you come to me and
1:03:32I say all right you want to start a
1:03:34company we we tax you very very little
1:03:36on a company that you start if that
1:03:37company becomes worth 20 30 40 million
1:03:39quid then we're going to start taxing
1:03:40you you're going to come and say to me
1:03:42oh no sorry 50 million is not enough for
1:03:43me so can I ask a question on that so um
1:03:46my company was was valued at x 50
1:03:49whatever 100 Millions um congratulations
1:03:52I still had because I hadn't had an exit
1:03:54event yeah I still had 101,000 20,000 in
1:03:59my bank account are you saying at the
1:04:01point when I sell the company or are you
1:04:02saying just because I have shares from
1:04:04the company I think you can structure it
1:04:06a number of ways you can structure a
1:04:07number of ways my preferred way is to
1:04:09stop people from hoarding enormous a of
1:04:11wealth for enormous amounts of time
1:04:13that's my that's basically my preferred
1:04:15method there's also the wealth tax
1:04:16method there's also capital gains as a
1:04:18method there's a lot of different ways
1:04:19it there's a lot of different ways but
1:04:21you have to deal with the problem of if
1:04:23you do not do not tax very wealthy
1:04:24individuals and very wealthy families
1:04:26their share of the pie will obviously
1:04:28goow over time and they will and they
1:04:30are as we are watching squeezing our
1:04:32ordinary families you have to deal with
1:04:34that my friend sold his company in the
1:04:35UK it's a company everybody knows um and
1:04:38he I remember him saying to me at the
1:04:39time it was in the middle of the
1:04:40pandemic he got this big exit event I
1:04:42think he'd made 300 million and he goes
1:04:44I'm off I go where you going he goes I'm
1:04:46going to go to Dubai in Monaco and live
1:04:48between the two and I I said explain to
1:04:50me why he goes well the amount of tax
1:04:51I'd have to pay in the UK is equivalent
1:04:53to me paying 20 million rent in the UK
1:04:55for the next six or seven years which
1:04:57he'd have to stay here for so he he went
1:05:00and he pops back in every now and then
1:05:02but it meant that he could keep that 150
1:05:05million whatever tax he would pay never
1:05:07had to pay it to the UK is living this
1:05:09highflying life now in Dubai drops into
1:05:12Monaco every now and then um and I
1:05:14remember him saying to me well Steve I'd
1:05:16have to pay 20 million rent a year to
1:05:18live here and he went on to say the UK
1:05:20product is just isn't worth it he goes
1:05:21crime I'm going to get my Rolex robbed
1:05:23off me he goes um the healthare system
1:05:26isn't the best the education system
1:05:27isn't necessarily the best and the
1:05:29particular one was crime which is I'll
1:05:31get I'll get i'll get mugged walking
1:05:33through yeah London streets Stephen if
1:05:36you allow British people who own 300
1:05:38million pound of British assets to
1:05:40technically live in Monaco and not pay
1:05:42tax then you will get crime and you will
1:05:44have dirty streets and you will have a
1:05:46bad Health Care system and you will have
1:05:47education because if you give all of the
1:05:49wealth to a group of people who do not
1:05:51tax there will be nothing left to
1:05:53provide things like healthcare and
1:05:54education for ordinary people it's not
1:05:56unconnected these people are not
1:05:57technically living there they're moving
1:05:59out my friends have moved out of the
1:06:01country they don't come back to the UK
1:06:03they've left and they leave with their
1:06:04they built a company here they glob P
1:06:08tax they typically build globally
1:06:09business it's not that they P it was a
1:06:11global they don't pay no tax they pay
1:06:14extortionate amounts of tax right anyone
1:06:16who's here is paying extraordinary taxes
1:06:18more than they've ever paid before 1%
1:06:21pays 30% 10% pays 60% of 1 trillion a
1:06:26year gu 300 million how much tax Rec
1:06:28he's paid in his life I have no idea I
1:06:32have no idea his business was Global
1:06:33that his biggest customer was the US
1:06:35it's I pay 60% and our viewers will pay
1:06:3730 40 50% do you think it's fair that
1:06:39your 300 million guy pays his two or
1:06:41three I have no idea what he pays well
1:06:43it sounds like he didn't pay 50% well he
1:06:46dashed when before he got the tax bill
1:06:48but why did we allow it why did we allow
1:06:50I I'm not allowed to not pay my tax what
1:06:51could you have done to you are allowed
1:06:53to when you were in Japan you wouldn't
1:06:54have paid UK taxes
1:06:56yeah because I was working in Japan and
1:06:58I pay Japanese taxes because you're
1:06:59living in Japan this is the thing people
1:07:01can live wherever they want now so but
1:07:04we're talking about this is I think we
1:07:06should stop obfuscating tax on people's
1:07:09work from tax on the ass they uh so I'm
1:07:12talking about entrepreneurs work
1:07:13generates wealth so when if I if I ear a
1:07:16billion pound of British houses yeah and
1:07:19then I say I live in Dubai yeah and I'm
1:07:22getting the rent on a billion pounds of
1:07:24houses which would probably be something
1:07:25like like that's going to be something
1:07:27like 50 million a year so I'm getting 60
1:07:3050 60 million a year of rent from
1:07:32British people yeah and that gets paid
1:07:34to me from British people yeah and I pay
1:07:36and I don't pay tax I live in Dubai do
1:07:38you think that's fair no all right so
1:07:40let's change that let's let's make
1:07:41people pay tax on on their world
1:07:44regardless where they live yeah the
1:07:45question would be though how would you
1:07:47tax people right and how would you
1:07:49actually structure it because regardless
1:07:51of what you feel like is fair this is
1:07:52the thing it's not about fairness it's
1:07:54about what you can pragmatic and
1:07:55practically do in the modern economy you
1:07:58might say oh I actually like for example
1:08:00if we said what's fair a lot of people
1:08:02would say a flat tax is fair you make
1:08:03one pound you pay 20% you make a million
1:08:05pounds you pay 20% make 100 million
1:08:07pounds you pay 20% so a lot of people
1:08:08would say the fairest tax system would
1:08:10just be a flat tax on everything right
1:08:12that would be a fair thing it's
1:08:13pragmatically can you do it is it
1:08:15actually good for society should people
1:08:17be excluded from that so it's not about
1:08:19fairness it's about pragmatically what
1:08:21can you get away with all right well
1:08:22pragmatically what we can get away with
1:08:23is desperate poverty for our viewers
1:08:25kids if you want to have can we zoom out
1:08:28just a minute right I want to zoom out
1:08:29let's Zoom away from our viewers kids
1:08:31forget about them they're not I got I'm
1:08:33a dad right I got three kids you're you
1:08:35are a multimillionaire dad you probably
1:08:37don't have the same problems as our
1:08:38viewers do you know that do you know
1:08:40that kids born into the top have a 60%
1:08:42chance of dropping out of the top right
1:08:4460% that's the number it's called
1:08:46persistence you can Google it um the
1:08:48persistence rates is actually only 40%
1:08:51for the richest so which means 60% drop
1:08:53out in the second you think kids have a
1:08:5560% chance of living in poverty POS not
1:08:57poverty do you know what's interesting
1:08:59we're all trying to aim at the same goal
1:09:01I think here I'm not sure we are but
1:09:03well that's fair that's fair maybe we're
1:09:04not I suspect some of us are maybe
1:09:06trying to protect our kids I want
1:09:08widespread affluence through the
1:09:09technological Revolution that's
1:09:10happening and I don't want the people
1:09:12who create that to want to go somewhere
1:09:14else so you agree with me that we should
1:09:16cut tax on wealth creators and raise tax
1:09:18on wealth
1:09:20orders uh well broadly okay so let's do
1:09:23it let's cut on people who are making
1:09:25let cut tax on people who are working
1:09:27hard creating a good product making a
1:09:29good income and let's raise tax on
1:09:31people who are sitting there on 20 30 40
1:09:33100 200 500 million pounds of assets
1:09:36that they're going to give to their kids
1:09:37and they're going to use to dominate
1:09:38society and squeeze out the middle class
1:09:39so who's an example of someone who's
1:09:41hoarding wealth she so his family owns a
1:09:45tech company
1:09:46his wife's dad owns a tech compan which
1:09:49he will inherit and his kids will
1:09:50inherit his net worth that is quoted is
1:09:53based upon his wife's but that company
1:09:55already exists yeah it's created now
1:09:58yeah it's worth billions but they they
1:10:00have to reinvent that business every two
1:10:01years like it's a so you think that the
1:10:04reason you think that if R's
1:10:06father-in-law stopped managing the
1:10:08company it would be valueless no I think
1:10:10it it it hires hundreds of thousands of
1:10:13people and it's you know it's a big
1:10:14company I don't know a lot about that
1:10:15particular company but I know it's a
1:10:17tech company Steve Jobs died okay is
1:10:19Apple valueless no let's not pretend
1:10:22that these creators are the sole reason
1:10:24these companies are are valuable sure
1:10:26you know and what we're talking about in
1:10:27many cases you know I was a Trader okay
1:10:32and I'm worth a millions of quid and you
1:10:33know now that is just assets I just own
1:10:35the assets I own the assets and that
1:10:37will grow and it will grow and it will
1:10:38grow and it will grow and that will
1:10:40squeeze out and squeeze out and squeeze
1:10:41out and squeeze out our viewers and I'll
1:10:43give that to my kids they don't even
1:10:44need to work they wouldn't even have
1:10:46even have to work they could just live
1:10:47on I could live on off the wealth is
1:10:49that what you want do uh do you think
1:10:52there are any opportunities for people
1:10:54today like if you're born into a poor
1:10:56family do you think it's possible that
1:10:59housing being and we can both agree
1:11:02agree on that but do you think there are
1:11:04new opportunities that didn't exist for
1:11:05our parents or grandparents but they do
1:11:07exist for people today I think the
1:11:09reality is for kids from poor
1:11:11backgrounds it is almost
1:11:14impossible to realistically get even
1:11:16Financial Security never mind wealth but
1:11:18why do you think you could do it I could
1:11:20do it he could do it but you don't think
1:11:22other people could do it well the first
1:11:24thing is I'm 38 now so I'm not not a kid
1:11:26nowadays um listen I want every Mass
1:11:29competition I've ever been in you know
1:11:30what I mean since I was a little kid I
1:11:31didn't even have a desk in my house you
1:11:33know I was one of the top students at
1:11:35LC and I still had to win my job by
1:11:38cheating in a card game you know that's
1:11:39the world that we live in I don't think
1:11:40that's a very replicable strategy and
1:11:42it's very easy for People Like Us who've
1:11:44made money to say oh AR we did it aren't
1:11:46we great go out and you know you've said
1:11:47that you think if young people go and
1:11:49work in Tech business they can get
1:11:50Financial Security if it was that easy
1:11:52they'd all be doing it you know they're
1:11:53not idiots our viewers are not idiots
1:11:54they're trying trying they're trying
1:11:56they want to find the good opportunities
1:11:58and they work listen I speak I'm the one
1:12:00saying they're idiots you're the one who
1:12:02says that they can't do it anymore I I
1:12:04see people do it all the time like I'm
1:12:06working in entrepreneurs people from
1:12:07poor backgrounds and so so then so but
1:12:10then why are I VI you think all of our
1:12:12if it was that easy why is everybody not
1:12:14doing it I'll tell you why people aren't
1:12:15doing it we went through a schooling
1:12:16system that taught us how to get an
1:12:18office job okay right we went through a
1:12:20schooling system to prepare us for a uh
1:12:22a world that doesn't really exist
1:12:24anymore which is the Industrial
1:12:25Revolution world and you have to go
1:12:27through a process of figuring out how it
1:12:30really works so what what I see is the
1:12:33most often the people who do really well
1:12:35financially who are young they dropped
1:12:37out of school they dropped out of
1:12:38University they started learning how to
1:12:40do things uh by doing their own research
1:12:42they start their own business or
1:12:43co-found a business they take a very
1:12:45alternative path uh none of that was
1:12:48taught to us at school none of it's
1:12:50taught to us in normal society we have a
1:12:52school system that manufactures people
1:12:54for a set of skills that are not
1:12:56particularly valuable anymore and we
1:12:57also get them in debt for those skills
1:12:59um when people Sid step that and say
1:13:03okay I'm not going to get into
1:13:03University debt I'm just going to go off
1:13:05and actually figure out how the world
1:13:07works there's actually loads of
1:13:09opportunities okay so I guess we've
1:13:11sorted it then all our viewers need to
1:13:13do is go and buy Dan's book become an
1:13:16entrepreneur and become a millionaire
1:13:17it's that easy why W you guys doing it
1:13:19to begin with they're idiots the viewers
1:13:21are idiots they should be just being
1:13:22more entrepreneurial it's as simple as
1:13:24that more entrepreneurial start a
1:13:25business listen I come from East London
1:13:27okay my friends can't feed their kids
1:13:30okay and if it was as simple as going
1:13:32out and be an entrepreneur I can bet you
1:13:35they would do it I can bet you they
1:13:36would do it let us I'm sick of
1:13:39multi-millionaires telling kids who
1:13:41can't afford to turn the heating on you
1:13:42just need to be more entrepreneurial
1:13:44it's sick Dan it's sick I this gives
1:13:46people mental illness it gives people
1:13:48mental illness tell them the truth okay
1:13:50we your older generation we took the
1:13:52opportunities and now is almost
1:13:54impossible to out of poverty and don't
1:13:56just don't just stand up and wave you
1:13:57know your millions of pounds in front of
1:13:58them and say if you entrepreneurial like
1:14:00me you could do it you could have it
1:14:02because it's sick because they can't
1:14:03they can't feed their kids down they
1:14:05can't turn the heating on don't tell
1:14:07them to be more entrepreneurial fix the
1:14:09system that drives more and more and
1:14:11more of them into poverty every
1:14:13generation I find it very strange that
1:14:15you think it would be easier to fix the
1:14:17entire global economic system than to
1:14:19start a business and fix your own
1:14:20personal economics the the thing that
1:14:23the thing that I know that gives people
1:14:25mental health issues is feeling that
1:14:26they have no agency in their life that
1:14:28they can't do anything your video where
1:14:30you talk about if you don't have a rich
1:14:31dad you're screwed there's no such thing
1:14:33as meritocracy you're never going to be
1:14:35successful to me if I had have come
1:14:36across your content at 19 20 years old I
1:14:39would have been screwed I was so I'm so
1:14:41glad that I came across people who said
1:14:45Daniel you weren't born into a a rich
1:14:47family you don't have any Bank of mom
1:14:48and dad but it's cheap and easier than
1:14:51ever to start a business start by
1:14:53working for someone who's got a business
1:14:55then figure out what's your opportunity
1:14:58and there's a way there is a way I've
1:15:01actually worked with a lot of teenagers
1:15:03from poor backgrounds and one of the
1:15:05things we do is we tell them if it's
1:15:07possible for someone else it is possible
1:15:08for you um I also worked in rural Uganda
1:15:11um with a charity that did uh work with
1:15:14the poorest of the poor um one of the
1:15:16most incredible things I ever saw was a
1:15:18woman who started
1:15:20out literally picking food out of a
1:15:22trash uh pile um and she was basically
1:15:27sh they they shared with her how to
1:15:29start a chicken business which then
1:15:30ended up as a pig business which then
1:15:31ended up as a cattle business and she
1:15:33ended up uh making uh hiring 15 16
1:15:38people in her local community the power
1:15:40of Entrepreneurship is that starting
1:15:42with nothing you can
1:15:43actually make improvements I'm not
1:15:45saying everyone ends up as a millionaire
1:15:47and I'm not saying everyone ends up uh
1:15:49equal but I'm saying you can make
1:15:50improvements in your life and the thing
1:15:52that causes mental health issues is the
1:15:54feeling of having no agency or no
1:15:55control over your circumstances until
1:15:57the world changes the whole economic
1:16:01system I never told people don't work
1:16:03hard I never once said that never once
1:16:05said that never said that you said if
1:16:06your dad wasn't Rich you'll never be
1:16:07rich which is true in 99.9% of cases
1:16:10I've never told people don't work hard
1:16:12true 99% I've never told people don't
1:16:14work hard okay and listen if you think
1:16:16that ugandans should be more
1:16:17entrepreneurial I've never been to
1:16:18Uganda maybe that's the problem out
1:16:20there maybe that's the problem in
1:16:21Nigeria maybe that's the problem in
1:16:22India listen I've never said don't work
1:16:24hard okay when I brought my book out
1:16:26last year the hardback I was at some
1:16:28event and I come out I was drinking
1:16:29London Bridge and uh I come out late it
1:16:31was like it was like 1:00 a.m. and um
1:16:35some guy come up to me when I was
1:16:36unlocking my bike some guy from
1:16:39Newcastle which is the northeast of
1:16:41England it's this quite a poor town
1:16:42there's a lot of workingclass people
1:16:44there and um he said I've been watching
1:16:47you on
1:16:48YouTube and um I love your stuff and um
1:16:52this guy started crying this guy start
1:16:54crying on the street right in front of
1:16:56me he's like I work so hard Gary I work
1:16:59two jobs um my mom's sick and I'm trying
1:17:03to help I'm trying to support and and I
1:17:04don't understand why and and I'm sorry
1:17:07that I'm
1:17:08crying but nobody ever told me that it
1:17:11wasn't my fault before that's what he
1:17:13said to me okay and listen listen I
1:17:16believe 100% aspiration ambition
1:17:19entrepreneurial spirit I would never say
1:17:21see a kid that has that and say turn it
1:17:22off okay but the flip side of your if
1:17:25you just work hard enough you can make
1:17:26it is if you didn't make it it's because
1:17:29you didn't work hard enough and it's
1:17:30your fault and I would like you to sit
1:17:32and think very hard before you send that
1:17:34message to young men and young women in
1:17:35our
1:17:37society meritocracy doesn't mean that
1:17:40everyone uh ends up with the same result
1:17:44what what I'm trying to what here's what
1:17:45I'm trying to achieve I'm trying to
1:17:46achieve the people who have ambition who
1:17:48can go for it are incentivized to do it
1:17:50and incentivized to build jobs and build
1:17:52companies about the ones that just want
1:17:54to work hard and have a good family and
1:17:55take care of them and have a home and be
1:17:57able to turn the heating on and be able
1:17:58to Financial Security they need to work
1:18:00for business don't they they need to
1:18:01work for you yeah P they need to work
1:18:03they need to work for a business some
1:18:05business right if someone doesn't create
1:18:07that business then where do they work
1:18:08for we now have by the way we now have
1:18:1011% of 11% of working age people are now
1:18:13declared too sick to work right we have
1:18:16a huge problem in the UK we also have
1:18:1825% of uh people who are working age
1:18:21don't work uh it's one in seven men
1:18:24don't work work at all do you think
1:18:25they're lazy Dan I think the system is
1:18:27collapsing do you think think the system
1:18:29is average British American working is
1:18:31lazy what I think is happening is that
1:18:33the technology companies are totally
1:18:35transforming and disrupting everything
1:18:37um and what happened is around the
1:18:39post-war era we had good jobs we had um
1:18:43you could work in a local thing what's
1:18:45happening now is that jobs are going to
1:18:47the Philippines they're going to uh
1:18:49techn technology does three things it
1:18:52makes jobs more simple which makes them
1:18:54replaceable
1:18:55it makes jobs Global where you can move
1:18:57them to anywhere else and then
1:18:58ultimately it automates the job Al
1:19:00together and gets rid of it uh through
1:19:02code and software and what's really
1:19:04going on in the last especially 5 years
1:19:06since the pandemic is technology has
1:19:09decimated the existing systems uh that
1:19:12we all relied upon when we grew up and
1:19:14when I say the uh education system isn't
1:19:17really working it's still pretending
1:19:19that there are office jobs available for
1:19:21people when they graduate and it's still
1:19:22pretending that there's like 1950
1:19:25scenarios available when actually my
1:19:28kids are going to be disrupted by AI
1:19:30everyone's kids are going to be
1:19:31disrupted by AI um you know these sorts
1:19:33of things are the are the things that
1:19:35really we we also need to be talking
1:19:37about to all the founders and small
1:19:39business owners listening I think you
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1:20:43I want to take this back to a point you
1:20:44were talking about earlier which is
1:20:45about personal agency because I would
1:20:47like you Daniel to give the counter to
1:20:49your own argument because I want to make
1:20:51sure when we're talking about solutions
1:20:53to this problem start a business be
1:20:57entrepreneurial you can also understand
1:20:59how that might that works for people
1:21:02with our brains and our mindset and
1:21:04whatever we had that made us do that our
1:21:05risk appetite our trauma whatever it
1:21:07might be but not everybody is wide in
1:21:10such a way so that's not necessarily the
1:21:12best solution for and also we sit here
1:21:14with a bit of hindsight bias where we we
1:21:15were lucky and it worked out for us but
1:21:18when you look at the stats around
1:21:19businesses succeeding what you know the
1:21:20stat it's like 90% of businesses fail so
1:21:23most of them are failing
1:21:25the ones that emerge from that people
1:21:26like me then we have a bias where we go
1:21:28well it work for us you do it too I
1:21:30don't come from money so I have the same
1:21:32bias like I watched well I've I've built
1:21:34I've built from scratch several times
1:21:35because I got disrupted several times so
1:21:37I've had to start with nothing several
1:21:38times and build but you started type of
1:21:41person right and when we say start from
1:21:42nothing you actually started with a
1:21:43wealth of information and the whole game
1:21:45in building building Capital
1:21:47intellectual Capital having been through
1:21:48it before being around that Mentor that
1:21:50gave you the information also having
1:21:51access to a great market like having
1:21:53access to a free market is is a big
1:21:54thing I was born in Australia and I
1:21:56moved to London at the peak of London's
1:21:58economic freedom so this can't be
1:21:59broadly applicable advice can it uh well
1:22:03I think personal agency is broadly
1:22:05applicable the idea I got this friend of
1:22:07mine who woke up one day he went out
1:22:09clubbing went out to a nightclub felt
1:22:11sick collapsed woke up and they had
1:22:13chopped off all four limbs right so uh
1:22:16he had quadruple ampute um he was 19
1:22:19years old so he wakes up in bed and he
1:22:21basically says I'm a quadruple ampute I
1:22:23was I was fine 48 hours ago and now I'm
1:22:26a qu quadruple amputee and he decides to
1:22:28make this decision in the in the
1:22:30hospital room um that this is going to
1:22:32be the best thing that ever happened to
1:22:33him and he makes that decision right
1:22:35even that is a consequence of his him
1:22:38and his wiring what I'm trying to
1:22:40understand but he ended up he ended up
1:22:41starting a clinic and it's a
1:22:42multi-million dollar Clinic I mean it's
1:22:44incredible what can do the rule it's
1:22:47incredible what people but you only need
1:22:49a few people to succeed and the whole
1:22:50economy starts to improve we we actually
1:22:53in this UK we only at the peak of our
1:22:55entrepreneurial like blitzing it where
1:22:58we're doing so well there was only
1:23:0040,000 scale UPS 40,000 companies were
1:23:03creating jobs growth higher wages um
1:23:06investment into the company into the
1:23:08country you know it's only 1% of people
1:23:11who pay 30% of the taxes and 10% of
1:23:14people who pay 60% of the taxes so you
1:23:15only need one in a 100 to actually
1:23:18create something that's valuable and you
1:23:20get an extra 30% of taxes but so so that
1:23:23again is we need this one that advice
1:23:24for the what the people that end up
1:23:25getting into that 1% but who does
1:23:27everyone else work for like all jobs
1:23:29growth comes from entrepreneurs so what
1:23:31are you saying to those the 199% there
1:23:33are you saying go get a job well you you
1:23:35need wealth creators in the economy who
1:23:37are building something like you take um
1:23:41gym shark people who work at gym shark
1:23:44they're super glad that this guy started
1:23:46the company they're really happy that
1:23:47there's a company otherwise where would
1:23:49they go what would they work where would
1:23:51they work so if Ben decides that he
1:23:53doesn't want to start that company in
1:23:55the UK um or if he gets to 10 million
1:23:58and
1:23:58stops uh then all of those additional
1:24:01jobs are are toast they're all gone so
1:24:03you encouraging the entrepreneurial
1:24:05you're not encouraging everyone to
1:24:06become an entrepreneur you're saying
1:24:08those that have those that bias or that
1:24:11I'm saying we need a system that
1:24:13encourages the people who can to do um
1:24:15and what about everybody else well every
1:24:17the flow on effect is that that creates
1:24:19jobs that creates wealth in the economy
1:24:22um and free markets lift everybody up
1:24:25um free markets just means that
1:24:26everyone's trading with everyone um you
1:24:29know it starts to like the whole thing I
1:24:30mean it's it's just a tail as oldest
1:24:32time as soon as economies are free and
1:24:34there are entrepreneurs starting things
1:24:36and growing things everyone's life
1:24:38improves everyone life get better um and
1:24:41what's your what part of that do you
1:24:42disagree with Gary I think it's it
1:24:45doesn't work it doesn't work the only
1:24:48period listen the last 70 years are not
1:24:50normal Stephen the last 70 years are not
1:24:52normal the last 70 years in Europe and
1:24:53the US where ordinary people like my dad
1:24:56could work for the post office on less
1:24:57than average wage and buy a house and
1:24:59support family it's not normal it's not
1:25:00normal in the world and it's not normal
1:25:02in history most countries in the world
1:25:04do not like that most countries have a a
1:25:07small Super Rich Elite and a very large
1:25:09group of extremely poor people that's
1:25:11most of the country and it's most of
1:25:13history in this country and it's most of
1:25:14history in the US you know yeah we talk
1:25:17about Charles Dickens I read hard times
1:25:20I read hard times and this is written in
1:25:21the 19th century when Britain was like
1:25:23the industrial super of the whole world
1:25:25and at the time the government was
1:25:27talking about should we tax these
1:25:28industrialists and the industrialists
1:25:29were saying if you tax us we'll throw
1:25:31our factories into the sea and it just
1:25:34reminds me you know the only time we've
1:25:37ever really been able to provide decent
1:25:39living conditions for ordinary working
1:25:41people was the period after the war
1:25:43where we massively redistributed wealth
1:25:44and and now we're losing that that
1:25:47holding of wealth in of the middle class
1:25:49can you acknowledge though that that was
1:25:50a completely different time as it
1:25:51relates to being able to it was a
1:25:53different time but you
1:25:54I could you know of techy Nigeria today
1:25:57Brazil today the UK 300 years ago France
1:26:00200 years ago there is only one specific
1:26:02time that we have ever successfully
1:26:04provided broad living standards for
1:26:06ordinary people and it was a period of
1:26:08time we protected a broadly equal wealth
1:26:11distribution and tax the rich at very
1:26:13high rates and you can acknowledge that
1:26:14that's extremely hard to do because the
1:26:16nature of the economy 100% 100 that's
1:26:19the reason why all of our grandparents
1:26:20and our great-grandparents and our great
1:26:22great grandparents lived in poverty and
1:26:23that's why I know I'm probably going to
1:26:24lose and that's why I bet on the economy
1:26:27getting worse and that's why I know
1:26:28poverty is going to increase because it
1:26:29was extremely difficult to get the
1:26:31unusually fair share for ordinary
1:26:33working people and I know we're losing
1:26:35the argument and I know that farage will
1:26:37win and I know that Trump will win and I
1:26:38know that and I know that things will
1:26:40get worse I don't think I'm going to win
1:26:41so if you if you know you're promoting a
1:26:44a strategy that is not going to work and
1:26:47it sounds like you think is
1:26:48incredibly almost impossible then why
1:26:52would you not be more practical in your
1:26:54solution Stephen if it was impossible I
1:26:56wouldn't be here think it's possible of
1:26:59course it's possible of course it's
1:27:00possible but you believe you're not
1:27:01going to win I'm a betting man Steve I'm
1:27:03a betting man I put my bets on you know
1:27:05I am if I get okay look okay so my
1:27:08YouTube channel is growing really really
1:27:09quickly and you know I'm obviously like
1:27:10starting a bit of a movement and there's
1:27:12a lot of political support and if it
1:27:13keeps growing we'll get more political
1:27:14support at the end of the day I'm trying
1:27:16to tax the richest and most powerful
1:27:17people in the world and most of these
1:27:20people will come out and attack me and
1:27:21they'll try and stop me and I do not
1:27:23have billions of pounds hundreds of
1:27:25millions of pounds to use to support my
1:27:26YouTube channel I'm counting on ordinary
1:27:29people like your viewers to support and
1:27:30share my message now listen for most of
1:27:32history that has not worked and for most
1:27:34of History ordinary families live in
1:27:36poverty I don't think it's impossible
1:27:38that we Ordinary People can win and get
1:27:40a fair share but I think it's worth
1:27:42fighting for Steve so I fight for it
1:27:43anyway he's he's right that for most of
1:27:45History you've had the super Elite and
1:27:47then everyone else is down here and it's
1:27:50massive wealth inequality is almost the
1:27:52normal uh for the last five thousand
1:27:54years and almost everywhere uh you've
1:27:57got kings queens dukes and peasants and
1:28:00surfs down there there have been
1:28:02economic situations that have been
1:28:04different uh Dubai is a really strange
1:28:06situation it's a desert it's in
1:28:09inhospitable to live in it's the last
1:28:11place in the world most people would
1:28:12think or choose that they would want to
1:28:14be and yet it's one of the most
1:28:15economically rich places in the world
1:28:17right now they actually didn't start
1:28:19with oil wealth they were able to borrow
1:28:20money to build Dubai but the low tax
1:28:23environment has now attracted raed some
1:28:24of the world's most talented people to
1:28:26go and build technology companies there
1:28:27and if you I don't know have you been
1:28:28there recently I've been to Dubai few
1:28:30years AG now but I've been so at the
1:28:32moment it is the most thriving
1:28:34entrepreneurial community on Earth
1:28:36outside of the US but probably even
1:28:38rivaling the US that there are investors
1:28:40there's entrepreneurs and the wealth is
1:28:42going through the roof um I've got two
1:28:45friends who are personal trainers
1:28:46fitness trainers one fitness trainer has
1:28:48decided to stop working uh more hours
1:28:51because he's hit 50 Grand a year and he
1:28:53now gets taxed at 40% so he's basically
1:28:55decided he's going to earn right up to
1:28:5750,000 and then stop working and then
1:29:00the other fitness trainer went to Dubai
1:29:02launched an online uh Fitness uh
1:29:04community and has just bought a $350,000
1:29:07Ferrari uh and one entrepreneur is super
1:29:11pumped and super excited about building
1:29:12a business because he's not over taxed
1:29:15the other entrepreneur has literally
1:29:16said I'm not willing to do this because
1:29:18of how much I have to pay just want to
1:29:19be clear I've always campaigned for
1:29:20lower taxes on rich on working people
1:29:22always always so but here's but here's
1:29:24the thing right if I was ask you you've
1:29:26just become one of the best selling
1:29:27authors in the country if your publisher
1:29:30came to you and said because you're in
1:29:31the top 1% of our authors we're going to
1:29:34Harve your royalties uh if you sign a
1:29:36second book with us you wouldn't sign a
1:29:38second book with them you go to another
1:29:39publisher who says we'll pay you more
1:29:41royalties because you're so successful I
1:29:43would have written this book for free
1:29:44then I would have written this book for
1:29:45free in fact the first time I got off of
1:29:47a deal I said I said don't pay me an
1:29:49advance then give you royalties away why
1:29:52well because if what I'm saying all
1:29:54right fine I'll give my royalties away
1:29:55I'll shut my YouTube channel down I'm
1:29:58saying we respond to incentives that if
1:30:00your publisher if penguin came to you
1:30:02and said book number two you get half
1:30:04royalties because you're in the top 1%
1:30:07would you sign with penguin or would you
1:30:08go someone El from a 2 million job a
1:30:10year to run a YouTube channel do you
1:30:12think I do the work that I do for money
1:30:14I'm not talking about that you do it for
1:30:16money I'm just saying if you had the
1:30:17option to sign between two publishing
1:30:19contracts right and all things being
1:30:21equal one's going to penalize you for
1:30:23being in the to 1% and the other one's
1:30:25going to reward you for being in the top
1:30:261% would you you of course you would go
1:30:28with the normal like if all things being
1:30:30equal you want to write a second book
1:30:31anyway it's the same for entrepreneurs
1:30:34when entrepreneurs start companies we
1:30:36can either start them in high tax
1:30:37economies or with a stroke of a pen
1:30:39start them in low tax I think the rich
1:30:42world is going to have to start
1:30:43rethinking the fact that it allows
1:30:45people to very very wealthy people to
1:30:48own enormous amounts of their physical
1:30:50wealth go live overseas and not pay tax
1:30:52I think that has to be Revisited for
1:30:53sure because what you're saying is I
1:30:56want the benefit of being able to sell
1:30:57to the US market and the UK Market but I
1:30:59don't want the obligation of having to
1:31:00pay us and UK taxes and you are correct
1:31:02that at the moment the US and UK
1:31:04governments allow that and I think
1:31:05that's US taxes you on worldwide income
1:31:07well only a small amount right so I
1:31:09think that realistically I think that
1:31:12the US and UK governments have to stop
1:31:13that but the way I see it the US and UK
1:31:16governments and increasing a lot of
1:31:17global governments are kind of being
1:31:19bought up by the elites and you know we
1:31:21have ELO musk is basically the President
1:31:23right and we had richy sunak who father
1:31:24was one of the richest men in the world
1:31:25like if you're richy sunak who for our
1:31:28American viewers was our prime minister
1:31:29until very recently his father is one of
1:31:31the richest men in the world he's got
1:31:33700 million personal wealth he's going
1:31:34to be making 3040 million pound passive
1:31:36income and you're getting paid 130 Grand
1:31:39de to be prime minister when you're
1:31:40making policy do you think maybe I'll
1:31:43ask my father-in-law at once you know
1:31:46the fact is what you're seeing here is
1:31:48if you allow the rich I'm I'm never ever
1:31:50against entrepreneurship I'm not against
1:31:52people getting rich if you allow the
1:31:53rich to get richer and richer and richer
1:31:55they squeeze the middle class and they
1:31:57squeeze the poor class out of things
1:31:59like housing of things like space in
1:32:00cities of things like energy and of
1:32:02things like owning a sharing government
1:32:04and media do you acknowledge that
1:32:06countries that adopt a anti-ri big
1:32:09government approach tend to collapse
1:32:12what like like this country in the
1:32:1460s we needed a US bailout we needed an
1:32:17IMF bailout in 1976 but the US did the
1:32:19same thing the US had even higher taxes
1:32:20than us we we basically like you take
1:32:23you take all the countries that where
1:32:25the government becomes big they meddle
1:32:26with your life they're involved in every
1:32:28decision right half the economy I mean
1:32:30here's one other the things this period
1:32:31is known as the Golden Age of capitalism
1:32:33it's the period of time when which
1:32:36period thisi 50 years off the second
1:32:38world war oh it's the Golden Age of
1:32:39middle class to be middle class you
1:32:42don't care about the middle class no no
1:32:43of course I do the the but the 70 years
1:32:46after the World War II yeah where the
1:32:49government sold off all of its houses to
1:32:50middle class people so we got housing
1:32:52wealth but you can only do that trick
1:32:54once right so you can only sell off all
1:32:56the houses to everyone once which is why
1:32:58all the Baby Boomers own them well the
1:33:00living s is collapsed after the houses
1:33:02were sold there was a long period where
1:33:04the houses weren't sold between the
1:33:05second world war and the 80s pinpo
1:33:07living standards collapsing well I think
1:33:09there's a few obviously big moments I
1:33:11think 2008 is a big moment I think Co is
1:33:13a big moment I think it's the 80s where
1:33:15you start to see the wealth distribution
1:33:16go what matters is actually the
1:33:18distribution itself so once you change
1:33:19the tax system it takes a bit of time
1:33:22for the wealth distribution to change
1:33:24but once you start for me the big thing
1:33:25is is the loss of wealth holding I want
1:33:27ordinary families to be able to hold
1:33:29wealth and once you lose that you lose a
1:33:31middle class and you will not find me a
1:33:33single country in in the world now or
1:33:35the history of the world that has
1:33:37provided good broad living standards
1:33:39without allowing ordinary families to
1:33:41own assets yeah I agree and take
1:33:44Singapore for example where everyone's
1:33:45encouraged to own properties they've got
1:33:47an amazing system in Singapore they've
1:33:48taken this a massive government by the
1:33:50way enormous government 25% of GDP they
1:33:53they own they own the houses they have a
1:33:55weal f they own all the houses they
1:33:57don't own all the houses they have a a
1:33:58sovereign wealth fund that circulates
1:34:00houses through they've they own the hous
1:34:02they' solved they've solved Singapore
1:34:03owns the house they own the Singapore
1:34:05government owns an enormous share of the
1:34:06houses so do you think we should own
1:34:09pension Pension funds people uh they
1:34:11force not force their citizens but they
1:34:14uh direct their citizens into Home
1:34:16Ownership you don't think Singapore and
1:34:17government owns a large sh I just know
1:34:19that the Singaporean government's only
1:34:2025% of the economy but big sh of the
1:34:22housing stock 75 the economy is I would
1:34:24like to say by the way just to be really
1:34:26clear I've never ever once advocated for
1:34:28big government never a single time big
1:34:31government I want higher taxes on the
1:34:33wealth orders so we can tax wealth
1:34:35creators and working people less I don't
1:34:37want to Big A government I want our
1:34:38viewers to have more money I want our
1:34:40viewers to have more money and also I
1:34:42want to tax those super rich so that
1:34:44they stop squeezing ordinary families
1:34:46out of asset ownership it just yeah it
1:34:48see it it seems like an obvious solution
1:34:51it seems like yeah it's good solution it
1:34:53seems like like hey who's got the money
1:34:56rich people not the money the assets the
1:34:58asset who's got the assets rich people
1:35:00then let's just take them off them and
1:35:02no no no I don't want I don't want to
1:35:03redistribute I'm I'm I am the only
1:35:05person in this table anti-
1:35:06redistribution because the
1:35:07redistribution is happening in front of
1:35:09our eyes the middle class is losing its
1:35:11assets government is losing its assets
1:35:13those assets are being accumulated by
1:35:14the rich I want to stop the
1:35:16redistribution please please I'm I am
1:35:19the most anti- rist redistribution
1:35:21person in this game we need to stop the
1:35:23redistribu of wealth away from ordinary
1:35:25British and American families so the
1:35:28difference is for me it's very simple
1:35:30which is I really truly believe that
1:35:32free markets and low governments and
1:35:35less taxes creates more wealth in the
1:35:36middle and freedom for the Heron is
1:35:38death for the fishes if we have complete
1:35:41Freedom multi-millionaires like you and
1:35:43me will get richer and richer and richer
1:35:44every year and we will squeeze out and
1:35:46we will eat the middle class ask you
1:35:48though if wealth inequality could be
1:35:50solved but everyone does worse is that a
1:35:53good solu obviously not the whole reason
1:35:55I do this because I don't want Ordinary
1:35:56People toap into public this is about
1:35:58people being able to feed their kids so
1:36:00wealth inequality is not the problem
1:36:01it's collapsing living stand that's
1:36:03quite contorted I mean quite contorted
1:36:07Logic the problem isaps living standards
1:36:09I am somebody who has made millions of
1:36:11pounds by understanding the simple fact
1:36:13that living standards are falling
1:36:14because of growing wealth INE equality
1:36:16so living standards if they were to
1:36:18increase but they were super rich yeah
1:36:21is that a problem I think you do need to
1:36:23be worried about us extremely wealthy
1:36:27Elites yeah I think what's interesting
1:36:29you look at the the founding of the
1:36:30United States these guys the founding of
1:36:33the United States conceptually is really
1:36:34based on these ideas of distribution of
1:36:36power that's why you have the president
1:36:38and the house and the Senate and you
1:36:39have this independent Judiciary they're
1:36:41like we cannot allow power to become
1:36:43concentrated because they came from a
1:36:45Europe which had extremely concentrated
1:36:47power and extremely wealthy Elites and
1:36:49extremely broad poverty so I think that
1:36:52allowing a small group of Society to
1:36:54increasingly monopolize power and wealth
1:36:56over time is obviously something we
1:36:58should be worried about but primarily
1:37:00the reason I worry about wealth
1:37:01inequality is because I see and I bet on
1:37:04and I make money on the fact that it
1:37:06causes living standards to Fall by the
1:37:08way I I actually really agree with you
1:37:09and the founding fathers of the US they
1:37:11did um especially around the 1900s they
1:37:14did want to break up monopolies and
1:37:15break up monopolies was one of the big
1:37:17things that um they did trust busting uh
1:37:19where they broke up Standard Oil and all
1:37:21of those sorts of things one thing I do
1:37:23really really see happening at the
1:37:24moment is that we have a stupid outdated
1:37:27definition of monopolies where we use
1:37:30monopolies the same way they used it
1:37:32when they had the oil uh companies that
1:37:35owned all the oil in the technology
1:37:38World a monopoly is formed through an
1:37:39ecosystem so Amazon for example owning
1:37:43AWS and Audible and this and this and
1:37:46this and Whole Foods it creates a a
1:37:49fortress that's almost impossible to um
1:37:52to compete with and Google owning
1:37:54YouTube and Gmail and all of this they
1:37:57create these fortresses through
1:37:58ecosystems one of the things that I do
1:38:00think we need to look at is compulsory
1:38:03breakup of big Tech once you hit a
1:38:05certain time because it's very difficult
1:38:07because do you know billionaires have
1:38:10two big fears right keep them up at
1:38:12night uh having nightmares number two is
1:38:14high taxes number one is that startup
1:38:17entrepreneur who disrupts their business
1:38:18and they want to kill that early you
1:38:20know Steve Jobs at 24 years old
1:38:22disrupted IBM um and Jeff Bezos
1:38:26disrupted Walmart so they are terrified
1:38:30of entrepreneurs in the middle um and
1:38:32they want to create government
1:38:33regulations to say hey you know what
1:38:35let's cap entrepreneurs at 10 million
1:38:37you can get to 10 million it's okay for
1:38:39us we're way past that point but Gary's
1:38:41our guy because he's going to cap
1:38:42everyone I never said cap anyone at 10
1:38:44million by the way what do you think
1:38:45will happen people stop as soon as you
1:38:47have wealth taxes people just give up
1:38:49they just don't want telling me our
1:38:50viewers if if they said if they knew
1:38:51they could build a 20 30 million SS
1:38:54ridiculous they knew they would have to
1:38:55pay 20 if you if you're if you're worth
1:38:5730 million 1% above is 200 Grand a year
1:38:59so if I said if you you can have a 30
1:39:01million pound company TR just bear in
1:39:03mind right you make 5% a year on your
1:39:06wealth right so if you got 300 million
1:39:07pound company you're going to be making
1:39:0815 million pound a year and I'm turning
1:39:10to you and I'm going to say you know
1:39:11you've got to pay 200 Grand a year on
1:39:13your 50 million pound revenue and
1:39:14they're going to say you know what I'm
1:39:15not going to start a business I don't
1:39:16want to be worth 30 million quid this is
1:39:18you know this is ridiculous you know
1:39:20nobody is going to say oh my God I don't
1:39:22want to be multi multimillionaire
1:39:24because in 20 years time I'll have to
1:39:26pay 1% taxes but most Traders most
1:39:29Traders are earning what most people
1:39:30earn in lifetime Traders can earn in a
1:39:32year most Traders don't stop talk about
1:39:36that a lot in my book right so most
1:39:37Traders just keep going entrepreneurs
1:39:39are the same that they're motivated to
1:39:42keep going but when you have Wealth
1:39:44Advisors and investors saying do not
1:39:46build a company in the UK because
1:39:48they're anti- wealth L I'm not trying to
1:39:51make the UK anti- wealth I'm not trying
1:39:52to make the UK and anti wealth I think
1:39:55the UK and the US need to be looking at
1:39:57a situation where you cannot allow
1:39:59people who own enormous businesses that
1:40:01sell to your country to live in Dubai to
1:40:04live in the Cayman Islands and not pay
1:40:05tax and I I don't think that's a
1:40:07controversial position I've got a
1:40:08question for both of you which is if you
1:40:10are a young person and you're 18 years
1:40:12old now and that you're listening to
1:40:14this but your objective really is an
1:40:15individualistic one you want to get rich
1:40:17and you have a great future for you and
1:40:18your family like all all of us have been
1:40:20able to do what would your advice be to
1:40:22them Gary at this moment in time this is
1:40:26such a hard question I know Dan's angry
1:40:28at me for what I put in my video how to
1:40:29get rich um somebody came around to my
1:40:31house and asked me this other day
1:40:32obviously I get asked it a lot because
1:40:35stupidly I'm very public about the fact
1:40:36that I'm rich um what I did is not
1:40:39replicable what I did is not replicable
1:40:41it's not I'm sorry I'm sorry but it's
1:40:43not people always say why don't you
1:40:44teach me to trade like it's hard it's
1:40:47hard trading and it's dangerous and I
1:40:48think a lot of young men are getting
1:40:49sort of sold into trading and becoming
1:40:51gambling addicts um
1:40:54you know work hard and I would I
1:40:56wouldn't even say don't become an
1:40:57entrepr I've never ever said these
1:40:59things work hard you know if you think
1:41:01that you have an opportunity in Tech
1:41:02entrepreneurship go for it understand
1:41:04it's risky I think that sometimes this
1:41:06message just become an entrepreneur and
1:41:07you make it is a bit dangerous because I
1:41:09think most people who try to become
1:41:10entrepreneurs fail and I think it's
1:41:12super super dangerous the reality is and
1:41:14you know maybe D like this maybe you
1:41:16won't like this I think it is very very
1:41:18difficult for a young man or a young
1:41:20woman from a poor family to become rich
1:41:24and I think it's increasingly hard even
1:41:26to just get those basics of Financial
1:41:27Security so listen obviously reduce your
1:41:30spending if you can don't buy into this
1:41:32like Balenciaga stay away from
1:41:34that
1:41:36but work hard study hard try to get a
1:41:38good job but also understand we are
1:41:41shrinking the seats on the Lifeboat
1:41:42that's what we're doing we used to allow
1:41:4450% to be secure then it's 40% then it's
1:41:4730% then it's 20% you know you got
1:41:49family in Nigeria if a young person from
1:41:52like shanty town in Nigeria I came to
1:41:53you and said Stephen what could I do to
1:41:55get rich you would have to say to him
1:41:57realistically listen you are in a
1:41:59difficult situation here you need to
1:42:01work really really hard but if you are
1:42:03able to make enough money to to support
1:42:05a family be proud of yourself what I
1:42:07would actually say to them so yeah I
1:42:08have got family in Nigeria um for people
1:42:10that don't know I'm by Blood half
1:42:12Nigerian I would say to them that
1:42:15knowledge is really your life raft so
1:42:18obviously there's a big Tech boom
1:42:20happening in Nigeria which is liberating
1:42:21a lot of people from that situation so I
1:42:23would try and tell them to get on the
1:42:25life raft that is like knowledge of this
1:42:28new Revolution so from Nigeria you can
1:42:30learn to code and then the the great
1:42:32thing now is that we're we literally
1:42:33have actually this is quite interesting
1:42:35we're building a tech company in San
1:42:36Francisco called flight cast it's live
1:42:38everyone can go look at at flight.com
1:42:39and the lead developer oh and guest
1:42:42radar the lead developer of guest radar
1:42:44is a Nigerian guy but how many of those
1:42:46jobs in the Nigerian Tech sector are
1:42:49going to kids that grew up in the shanty
1:42:50towns I have no idea cuz I worked in
1:42:54people ask me tell me how to do what you
1:42:56did all right I worked in Canary Warf
1:42:58it's in East London I could see the
1:42:59building from my house going up there
1:43:02was not a single other kid from East
1:43:04London the whole time I was there do you
1:43:07know to Dan's point about this remote
1:43:09work Revolution where like work now has
1:43:12you can work from anywhere and in our
1:43:13company third web San Francisco me some
1:43:16of the stuff that we now have are in the
1:43:18Philippines because they just have like
1:43:19great creatives there it's obviously
1:43:21more cost effective isn't this a huge
1:43:23part of what's going on in our economy
1:43:25this this digitalization and this
1:43:34remotify B your workers in the
1:43:35Philippines very very well
1:43:39um most of these people they used to
1:43:43have a half decent wage on office and
1:43:46now they're locked in their bedrooms
1:43:47barely paying the bills yeah um in the
1:43:49Philippines not in the Philippines the
1:43:51Philippine guys are balling out control
1:43:53no I'm saying the Philippines is booming
1:43:55at the moment so you think the average
1:43:57person in the Philippines is living a
1:43:58luxurious life have you if you uh what's
1:44:00happening at the moment do you think the
1:44:02average person in the Philippines is
1:44:03living a luxurious life there is there
1:44:05is this thing called remote foreign
1:44:06workers and this is a huge boom and the
1:44:10economic the kidchen move to the
1:44:11Philippines then it's great you get
1:44:13great quality of life in the Philippines
1:44:15you know when I looked at the thums of
1:44:16Manila they should just get J they I
1:44:18don't know why they're not getting the
1:44:18laptops out uh the the poverty in the
1:44:21Philippines is horrific I'm listen
1:44:23Philippines a beautiful country an
1:44:24amazing country I love the Philippines
1:44:26number in there at at a rate that's
1:44:28never what is the life like for your
1:44:30average Filipino well would you agree
1:44:32though that their economy is just
1:44:33getting flooded with money at the moment
1:44:35like money is flowing in there money is
1:44:36flowing in but it is not giving a good
1:44:38quality of life your average Filipino
1:44:40that's not true remote foreign workers
1:44:42well we can remote foreign workers
1:44:44Filipino viewers to tell us
1:44:46what's can actually support the often
1:44:48support their en a look I don't know
1:44:50what the average wages in the phili just
1:44:51to bring it back to this point though so
1:44:52I wanted to know from Gary he said work
1:44:55hard if you're a young guy listening to
1:44:57this now um I was reading this really
1:44:58interesting article yesterday from the I
1:45:00think it was from major newspaper
1:45:01talking about the lost boys and it goes
1:45:03to show that I think it's one in seven
1:45:05young men that is at a working age now
1:45:07are out of work so there's lots of talk
1:45:10around young men in particular and how
1:45:11they're struggling you'd say work hard
1:45:12Gary You' say work hard no blena but the
1:45:15big thing the big thing is recognize the
1:45:19situation that you're in and I would
1:45:20encourage them to support my work and
1:45:23follow my channel because the lifeboats
1:45:25are shrinking and trust me we're going
1:45:28to get out kids in the lifeboats and we
1:45:30all know that all right and if those
1:45:31life boates are shrinking if you don't
1:45:34if you don't stop the from going
1:45:35down it is not you and you and me who
1:45:38are going to go down we will be fine if
1:45:40you don't fight the political fight I
1:45:41guarantee you people like Daniel will so
1:45:43you're saying that they should also get
1:45:45involved in the political fight you have
1:45:46to you have to that's what our
1:45:47grandparents did Grand if they want to
1:45:50become millionaires like you and me and
1:45:51Dan well it sounds like Dan's got better
1:45:53advice for that than I do okay well I'm
1:45:55going to ask Dan as well but I just
1:45:56wondering I'm wondering how your your
1:45:58advice ties into sort of
1:46:01like the young the young person who's
1:46:03trying to liberate themselves from where
1:46:05you came from or where I came from you
1:46:07know what I don't think I'm the guy to
1:46:08say that man because you know I had this
1:46:11unusual gift from a young age I was very
1:46:13very very good at maths and I just
1:46:14followed that um and you know you know
1:46:17my sister she's a poet and she wrote a
1:46:20really successful Grime of musical about
1:46:22DIY R's first album all right she comes
1:46:25from obviously the same family as me
1:46:26poor family she works so hard she works
1:46:29so so hard two degrees she can barely
1:46:33pay the rent all right so I don't want
1:46:35to turn around to our young kids and say
1:46:37well I've got this Talent follow your
1:46:38talent because it doesn't work Stephen
1:46:41true it doesn't work yeah wait my sister
1:46:44does great work but financially for
1:46:46young people following your passion
1:46:48following your talent unless you come
1:46:49from Rich family realistically very very
1:46:52really works and I know it worked for
1:46:54the three of us at this table but let's
1:46:55not pretend that everyone experiences
1:46:58the same things that we experienced what
1:46:59would you say to that D and what's your
1:47:01answer I think there's two economies
1:47:02going on at the moment there's a dying
1:47:04economy which is the Industrial
1:47:05Revolution economy um and that is all
1:47:08the office jobs and the factory jobs and
1:47:10all of that sort of stuff which is very
1:47:11much being automated away and moved
1:47:13globally um and at the same time there's
1:47:15this new bubbling up digital economy um
1:47:18which I'd call the entrepreneur economy
1:47:19or the digital economy um both of these
1:47:22economies are kind of Co coexisting
1:47:23one's going like that one's going uh
1:47:25like that um and if you want to be
1:47:29economically successful you need to
1:47:31stand next to the biggest piles of money
1:47:33that you can um you know unfortunately
1:47:35being a poet uh doesn't pay a lot of
1:47:38money and we all know that that's not a
1:47:39surprise if you came from a very rich
1:47:41family and you were a poet you'd
1:47:42probably be one of the 60% who fell out
1:47:44of a rich family uh as well um if you
1:47:48want to be economically successful you
1:47:49need to say what is the thing that's
1:47:51economically booming right now Gary saw
1:47:54the finance industry at that particular
1:47:56time but if we actually look at the
1:47:58finance industry now it's in Decline um
1:48:00and trading is being rep uh replaced by
1:48:02AI robots um people who worked in your
1:48:06career are going to be replaced by uh it
1:48:10systems that basically do similar jobs
1:48:12it's going to be you know these things
1:48:13happen we're going through a massive uh
1:48:16technological change but at the same
1:48:18time it's never been easier to learn
1:48:22skills for free uh on YouTube it's never
1:48:24been easier to join communities where
1:48:26you can get mentoring and get support
1:48:28there are communities of angel investors
1:48:30who do invest in in startups uh it's
1:48:33never been cheaper or easier to start a
1:48:35company there's never been more software
1:48:37and Technology to scale and grow you
1:48:39know in just a in a short space of time
1:48:41I would say do what Gary's done Gary
1:48:43publishes online he's built a personal
1:48:45brand he's attached it to a recurring
1:48:47Revenue model uh he's got yeah I also
1:48:49worked for three for free for four years
1:48:51I'm not sure how replicable that is you
1:48:53know so build a personal brand attach it
1:48:56to a business model that is that is
1:48:58where money is Flowing um these are
1:49:00these are positive things you can do we
1:49:02all have to play the cards we're dealt
1:49:04you can always find someone who's done
1:49:05better with better cards or someone
1:49:07who's been dealt better cards and you
1:49:08can always find someone who's been dealt
1:49:10worse a cards no matter who you are on
1:49:11the planet there's someone better
1:49:12there's someone worse you have to play
1:49:14the cards that you dealt you cannot sit
1:49:16around waiting for the economic system
1:49:18of the world to be changed you have to
1:49:20say you know what these are the cards I
1:49:22was born at this particular time in this
1:49:24these circumstances these are my
1:49:26strengths these are my weaknesses I'm
1:49:27going to play the cards that i' I've
1:49:28dealt um personal agency is what gets
1:49:32people to feel good about their life to
1:49:35make progress and as soon as you play
1:49:37the victim mindset soon as you say oh
1:49:39you know what the answer to all my
1:49:41prayers is Gary's going to change the
1:49:43system uh you're in serious trouble can
1:49:45I just say one thing back on that um if
1:49:48we become a society of of individuals
1:49:50who think only individually and and
1:49:52never consider broader societal problems
1:49:55we will become a society that becomes
1:49:57unable to fix societal
1:50:00problems I'm somebody who has made
1:50:02millions of pounds betting on the
1:50:04collapse of society the collapse of the
1:50:05middle class um I don't want to be
1:50:08giving stock tips on the Titanic okay I
1:50:12I understand I understand that we live
1:50:14in individualized societies and and it's
1:50:15not popular to say hey you need to
1:50:16protect your Society um if you don't
1:50:19protect your Society your Society is
1:50:20going to collapse and and the British
1:50:22public the American public have a choice
1:50:24to make here here to protect these what
1:50:26do you want people to do I want them to
1:50:27get involved with watch my channel
1:50:29subscribe to my channel content on
1:50:31YouTube Instagram Tik Tok share it with
1:50:33your friends share it with your mom
1:50:35understand and then push for change push
1:50:37for change like our grandparents did
1:50:39push the politicians to tax working
1:50:42people less and tax extremely wealthy
1:50:44wealth orders more so vote for the
1:50:46greens vote for whoever gives you that
1:50:48whoever gives you your share of the PIP
1:50:50basic listen this is not football okay
1:50:51I'm not here M of the GRE I'm here to
1:50:54protect the working class so that's
1:50:56their sort of that would be their social
1:50:57and sort of um political energy would be
1:51:01to stand up and fight but in their in
1:51:03their personal lives are you telling
1:51:04them to start businesses take big risks
1:51:06work really hard go for it because they
1:51:08can also I would defer to you guys on
1:51:10that you know I'm not a businessman I'm
1:51:11an economist that's what I am you know I
1:51:13made my money by being an economist I'm
1:51:15a very very good Economist my
1:51:16predictions will be right people can go
1:51:18and watch my predictions at the
1:51:19beginning of covid I predicted the
1:51:21entire Co crisis exactly correctly in
1:51:23May 2020 you know this is you know I'm
1:51:26good at this I'm and listen I'm never
1:51:28going to come here and say I'm a better
1:51:29businessman than you and I don't I'm
1:51:30pretty sure that I'm not I'm a very very
1:51:33very good Economist this will happen is
1:51:35there something that I can do if I'm sat
1:51:37here listening at home I understand
1:51:38everything you said I believe everything
1:51:39you said I I I believe that it's going
1:51:41to get worse for me do you think I
1:51:44should still take responsibility of my
1:51:46situation and fight to make my life
1:51:49richer better moreful 100% 100 100% cuz
1:51:53you you know and I'm sure you know if
1:51:55you're average British or American if
1:51:56you don't do that you're not going to be
1:51:58able to turn the heating on you have to
1:52:00do it you have to do it and I've never
1:52:01once you I think my opinions are often
1:52:03mischaracterized to being anti- ambition
1:52:05you've read my book do you think I'm
1:52:06anti- ambition no I work my tits off to
1:52:08make money and I want every single young
1:52:10person in this country to be able to
1:52:11make money if they want to if that's
1:52:13what they want to work towards but we've
1:52:14created a society where it's almost
1:52:16impossible for young listen I've been
1:52:18there I've been at LC I've been at
1:52:19Oxford I've been in the city I've been
1:52:21in the media I've been in politics all
1:52:22all of the guys at the top are a bunch
1:52:24of Rich idiots we are not allowing these
1:52:27smart kids from ordinary backgrounds to
1:52:29get into those spaces why why do we
1:52:31pretend we're not doing that do that I
1:52:32disagree with that you're talking about
1:52:34two types of elite spaces Elite space of
1:52:37elite universities yeah and you're
1:52:39talking about the elite space of
1:52:41derivatives trading there's the real
1:52:43economy yeah where entrepreneurs do
1:52:45their work then there's the first
1:52:46derivative which is the banking system
1:52:48and then there's the second derivative
1:52:50which is rates Traders like yourself
1:52:52right these are these These are places
1:52:54that normal people don't want to end up
1:52:57most normal people who grow up in normal
1:52:59households don't uh wake up one day and
1:53:01say I want to be a rates Trader on a
1:53:04double derivative of the economy making
1:53:05bets most people want to start a
1:53:07business that employs people and they
1:53:08want to grow that business and be
1:53:10successful do you think that starting a
1:53:12business is a realistic High success
1:53:16probability chance of ordinary poor
1:53:18people becoming rich I I know that
1:53:20economies Thrive when entrepreneurs are
1:53:22active
1:53:23and it's not just the entrepreneurs they
1:53:25create is our viewers can do and most of
1:53:28them will end up rich you only need 1%
1:53:30to improve the whole economy there's a
1:53:31really interesting stat that says
1:53:32globally around 65% of ultra high net
1:53:34worth individuals are
1:53:36self-made approximately 19% primarily
1:53:39primarily inherited their wealth and
1:53:41about 16% inherited wealth but
1:53:43significantly grew it through their own
1:53:44Ventures so 65% of the ultra high worth
1:53:47individuals globally are self-made does
1:53:50that not mean that if I want to become
1:53:52an ultra high Networth person it's going
1:53:54to come down to listen we are just come
1:53:56off the back of the golden age of
1:53:58capitalism when ordinary people like my
1:54:00dad you know I grew up in ilford it's in
1:54:01East London it's a very immigrant area
1:54:03most of my friends I grew up with come
1:54:04from Pakistani Indian immigrant
1:54:06backgrounds they come over with nothing
1:54:08they worked really hard they made money
1:54:10they had their own assets we had a
1:54:11period where Ordinary People could make
1:54:14money and could make wealth so obviously
1:54:15we are now in a period where there are
1:54:17rich people who made money during that
1:54:19period but it's over now I'm seeing
1:54:20ordinary people making money all the
1:54:22time okay so you're telling our viewers
1:54:23they're idiots why are they not making
1:54:24money I'm not telling anyone they're an
1:54:26idiot I'm saying that if it's that easy
1:54:28okay all right fine go and buy Dan's
1:54:30book read it and become a millionaire
1:54:31because Dan thinks it's easy to become a
1:54:34millionaire being an entrepreneur but I
1:54:36suspect having not been an entrepreneur
1:54:38that most of the people who've read your
1:54:39book are not millionaires everything
1:54:40you've touched has turned to Gold you
1:54:42turned yourself to Academia you got an
1:54:45amazing qualification you turned
1:54:47yourself to banking you became 2 million
1:54:49a year you turned yourself to being a
1:54:50writer you become Sunday Times
1:54:51bestseller you turn yourself to content
1:54:53creating you get 800,000 followers and
1:54:56you and now you sit there after all of
1:54:58that evidence and say oh no it's all
1:55:00over guys it's all I'm smart enough to
1:55:02do it but you guys are not smart enough
1:55:03to do if if you think you can teach
1:55:05you've got your book if you think you
1:55:06canach you say you're smart enough but
1:55:09they're not smart enough I I wonder if
1:55:11um we do have a bit of an education
1:55:13problem at the at the heart of this
1:55:15because I was thinking about your sister
1:55:16and I was like right if I was the CEO of
1:55:17Gary's sister what would I do there's
1:55:19two things I do right now the first is
1:55:21okay where's where what what Marketplace
1:55:24is really valuing an ability to write
1:55:26and write an impactful way I go write
1:55:27you need to start an Instagram page
1:55:29because I've seen what happened with J
1:55:30sh this guy's pulling in tens of
1:55:31millions a year because he took like you
1:55:33know nice words that were motivational
1:55:36poetic put them on there and I also
1:55:37YouTube needs to get to YouTube because
1:55:40if she can talk like you then she's
1:55:42going to do exceptionally well on
1:55:43YouTube as well um but the old there's
1:55:46not going to be a great economy
1:55:48necessarily for someone who's doing
1:55:50poetry in many other places other than
1:55:52one I'm saying is the internet but in
1:55:53school we don't teach this there's no
1:55:55YouTube class for YouTube and and it's
1:55:58such a huge part of the economy I mean I
1:56:00mean me and you have seen that it's
1:56:01there's been this decentralization of
1:56:03media where the megaphone was growing at
1:56:0520% a year the me the megaphone was
1:56:07people watching start a YouTube become
1:56:09ENT it's the Internet isn't e I'm not
1:56:11say works for most people stepen for
1:56:13most people no it doesn't work it
1:56:15doesn't work why are we pretending it
1:56:17does but I what what I what I would say
1:56:19is if in school we taught young kids a
1:56:21couple new things and we stopped
1:56:23teaching them about Pythagoras's Theorem
1:56:25which by the way chat gbt is going to do
1:56:26for you with your eyes closed and we
1:56:28taught them about the new economy of the
1:56:30internet about the ability to start a
1:56:32shop and I it's crazy that I the school
1:56:36system was designed in such a way where
1:56:37they put me in exclusion unit because I
1:56:38was so preoccupied with doing business
1:56:40deals at school and my Headmaster came
1:56:42on T National TV on what I lied to and
1:56:44said yeah we unexp beled him eventually
1:56:46because he made the school so much money
1:56:47but the system was punishing me for
1:56:49Entre for entrepreneurship and it wasn't
1:56:52teaching me anything about the the new
1:56:54economy which is which is technology St
1:56:56do you think it matters if the
1:56:58percentage of young people who are able
1:56:59to Achieve Financial Freedom and have a
1:57:02family is shrinking so do I think it
1:57:04matters if the percentage of young
1:57:05people that are able
1:57:07to are you saying attain wealth and have
1:57:09a family yeah Achieve Financial Freedom
1:57:11and have a family I think that's a
1:57:12really big problem listen I think that's
1:57:14a really big problem I agree I know
1:57:16listen and I know you've got this
1:57:18podcast and I know you inspire young
1:57:19people and I think that's a good thing I
1:57:20think it's a good thing that you inspire
1:57:21young people to go out and work hard and
1:57:23try and Achieve something but I'm an
1:57:25economist and what I see is the
1:57:27percentage of young people who make it
1:57:28shrinking and I think if you combine
1:57:29those two things you reach a really
1:57:31dangerous place because we go and tell
1:57:33the young people it's there for you to
1:57:34start a business and at the same time
1:57:36the number of people who make it is 10%
1:57:385% 2% 1% and there will always be that
1:57:41one person who makes it there will
1:57:42always be that Steven Bartley in every
1:57:43country in the world who's making it
1:57:44through you know what I'm saying but the
1:57:46systematic issue matters Stephen C can
1:57:48we can we not change the education
1:57:50system so that when I was 16 and they
1:57:53threw me in the exclusion unit which
1:57:54made me which would could so easily have
1:57:56made me think that I was a failure
1:57:58because my brothers who went Jason went
1:58:00to LSC okay and became very much like
1:58:02you and now works in my company um
1:58:05managing my investments he in that
1:58:07education system was rewarded so I sat
1:58:10there as a kid thinking rich and
1:58:11successful my older brother Jason
1:58:13because he can do maths and I thought
1:58:14I'm going to be a failure because I like
1:58:16this thing called entrepreneurship and I
1:58:17have ADHD so I can't pay attention in
1:58:19lessons what I'm saying is if the
1:58:20education system was designed in such a
1:58:21way where people like me who were
1:58:23entrepreneurial who were interested in
1:58:24the internet and couldn't stop playing
1:58:26video games were clapped for and said oh
1:58:28my God double down on that yeah um I
1:58:31think the net benefit when you think
1:58:33about what the backbone of the economy
1:58:35is which is entrepreneurs starting
1:58:36businesses would be profound for this
1:58:39country here yeah but that but but I I
1:58:41think that I believe there needs to be
1:58:43such a radical overhaul of our education
1:58:45system if we want to stand a chance of
1:58:47capitalizing on what the economy is
1:58:49today yeah I I think I think you could
1:58:51probably change the education system in
1:58:53a lot of ways that could improve it but
1:58:54you're kind of changing the education
1:58:56system on the Titanic what my my
1:58:58perspective is I can tell you with a
1:58:59very very high rate of certainty if you
1:59:01don't fix this problem of the wealth
1:59:02being sucked out of the middle class 95
1:59:0598% of people will be in poverty in this
1:59:07country in 70 years I agree with you
1:59:09this is the thing I agree that you can't
1:59:12have a group of people at the very top
1:59:13that own all the assets and all the
1:59:15money or else I mean it's going to come
1:59:16from somewhere and I remember the day
1:59:18that I printed off the jobseekers
1:59:20allowance form when I was stealing
1:59:21Chicago town piz 10 years ago in my room
1:59:23in Mosside in Manchester I remember what
1:59:25it feels like to not have my parents
1:59:27speaking to me to be have all these ccj
1:59:30letters and baith letters on my desk and
1:59:32really have no answer how how to get out
1:59:35of the situation to the point that I was
1:59:36like shoplifting I'd call the justy
1:59:38driver and then trying to persuade him
1:59:39just to give me the food that was that
1:59:41was that was 10 years ago for me so I I
1:59:43it's not I've not forgotten the the
1:59:45those years of my life so I understand
1:59:47what it is to be in that situation and
1:59:50on an individual level I need need some
1:59:52answers because I'm not going to wait
1:59:54for these people in the
1:59:56parliament to fix my life for me so I
1:59:58need some individual answers and then I
1:59:59do also care about the bigger picture so
2:00:01I'm not like here as someone that just
2:00:03wants to acrew loads of wealth myself of
2:00:06course listen let's be honest no one
2:00:08like there's not many human beings that
2:00:09wouldn't like more money so I try and
2:00:11acknowledge that bias but what I'm the
2:00:14the the the big issue I have is is is
2:00:17how and from my personal experience as
2:00:20someone that now employs hundreds and
2:00:22hundreds and hundreds of people here in
2:00:23London up in Manchester in our offices I
2:00:26there are a set of things that would
2:00:28make me leave this country if it became
2:00:30increasingly less uh friendly to
2:00:32entrepreneurs I reckon if we come back
2:00:34here in 5 years time I reckon I'll
2:00:36employ 500 more people in the UK and
2:00:39actually as you look around this room
2:00:40you can see the age of them these are
2:00:41young people yeah um there are things
2:00:44you could do to make me not do that I
2:00:45mean it's probably worth pointing out
2:00:47that we're not taxing wealth and you're
2:00:48leaving the country anyway Stephen no I
2:00:50haven't left the country okay you're
2:00:51going I'm I'm a tax resident here I pay
2:00:53my taxes here and I have zero intent in
2:00:55changing that I'm also on Dragon you
2:00:57know so we're investing a lot of money
2:00:58in UK businesses but listen I want to
2:01:01raise I want to tax only high levels of
2:01:04wealth only high levels of wealth and
2:01:06listen don't get me wrong I understand
2:01:07very rich people will complain and very
2:01:08rich people will say just like they did
2:01:10in Dickens I'm going to throw my
2:01:11businesses I'm going to throw my taxes
2:01:13my my businesses and my factories into
2:01:15the sea Stephen your viewers are here
2:01:18you listen Steven your viewers are here
2:01:20you are a very wealthy person they are
2:01:21are paying 20 30 40 50% you should be
2:01:24paying your fair share Stephen you
2:01:26should I think that I should
2:01:30pay more tax especially when um I don't
2:01:34think my kids should get should should
2:01:36benefit from my wealth and maybe this is
2:01:37a controversial opinion but I actually
2:01:38don't I don't think I should be able to
2:01:41pass down my assets to my children you
2:01:43can't it's 40% tax I think it should be
2:01:45more 4 yeah let's not pretend rich
2:01:48people don't successfully pass their ass
2:01:49their children I'm just telling you now
2:01:51I do think I'd be robbing my children of
2:01:53something from the background that I
2:01:54came from if my CH my child gets
2:01:57if my child has gets tens of millions
2:01:59let's say even when I die I don't think
2:02:01that should happen well I agree people
2:02:03say when I talk about my sister people
2:02:04like why don't you just give your sister
2:02:05a load of money listen my sister works
2:02:07hard she's a smart person she works hard
2:02:09she produces good work I want to live in
2:02:11a society where people like my sister
2:02:14are able to support themselves with the
2:02:15work that they do but we we're
2:02:16destroying that Society who would pay
2:02:18her the the customers you know this the
2:02:22situ so you want her to start a business
2:02:24she is a business yeah yeah and I want
2:02:26people like her to be to be taxed less
2:02:28so that what I want is ordinary working
2:02:30people to be tax less so they have more
2:02:32money in their pocket listen the reason
2:02:34we had the thriving art scene in the 60s
2:02:36is because we had a thriving middle
2:02:37class that could go and buy the new
2:02:39fashions and buy the new records and
2:02:40then that created this thriving art
2:02:42scene now we have a middle class which
2:02:44is struggling to pay the bills so they
2:02:45can't they can't buy stuff they you know
2:02:48my syst makes theater shows the only
2:02:49people who go to the theater are rich
2:02:51people now but back back in the day you
2:02:52know theater was something that was more
2:02:53accessible you want you want the Arts
2:02:55I've got to mate use a fashion designer
2:02:57right nowadays there's all of the
2:02:59business is super fast super cheap super
2:03:02disposable fashion or unbelievably
2:03:04expensive high-end because that's the
2:03:05economy we've created I want you go to
2:03:07Japan which is a less unequal Society
2:03:09the restaurants are good quality
2:03:10restaurants for ordinary people because
2:03:13a good capitalist Society will produce
2:03:15things for the people with money in the
2:03:17case of theater where have the theater
2:03:19consumers moved to where are they
2:03:21getting their entertainment now well
2:03:23what you have is a very rich group of
2:03:25people who will still go to the theater
2:03:26and they will pay a lot but then you
2:03:27have a large group of people who are
2:03:29relatively cash scarce and they will try
2:03:32to get their entertainment in cheaper
2:03:33ways of course you know what I mean
2:03:35they're spending their time watching
2:03:36your YouTube channel well exactly my you
2:03:38which is Free by the way yeah but you
2:03:39get paid from it you get the YouTube
2:03:41Honest it's only in the last couple of
2:03:42months that I started to make any money
2:03:44because I don't do my own um editing so
2:03:46and you I mean you'll know but in the
2:03:48first few years you're paying yourself
2:03:49to do it you know what I mean like I
2:03:51think people some times massively
2:03:53overestimate the amount of money this is
2:03:54entrepreneurs entrepreneurs go through 2
2:03:56three four 5 years worth of struggle to
2:03:58get to the point where they're
2:03:59successful and it feels pretty horrific
2:04:02that you say oh finally when I make it
2:04:04you take it um and then the advisers to
2:04:07entrepreneurs just 10 million is quite a
2:04:10lot of money so you know you can be
2:04:12worth 9 million and not be paying
2:04:14anything more but what if I just raise 1
2:04:16million for investment into my company
2:04:18but that then like I do if I'm if if I'm
2:04:21raising money all the way along and my
2:04:23investors are saying I'm sorry I don't
2:04:25invest in the UK economy because it's
2:04:26wealth taxes and all that sort of stuff
2:04:28it's anti- wealth uh and then I just
2:04:30have to move my company overseas well I
2:04:32want to create a situation where the UK
2:04:33consumer is so strong that you have to
2:04:35invest in the UK you don't have to be
2:04:37here to sell to
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2:06:46CEO let me know how you get on so so do
2:06:49we all agree on this premise though that
2:06:51Gary's saying which is the very the
2:06:52ultra Rich which we can classify as
2:06:55being worth more than you're saying we
2:06:57say 10 10 million is the line that we
2:06:58campaign for okay we we think that they
2:07:01should pay a greater share of the tax
2:07:04and then the qu if you agree with that
2:07:05premise the question then becomes yes
2:07:07but how yeah well they already do 1% pay
2:07:1130% I want to be clear that's the top 1%
2:07:14of taxpayers which is not the top 1% of
2:07:16richest people mind you I'm also not
2:07:19necessarily saying um what's fair I'm
2:07:21saying what's practically possible right
2:07:23so like you could you could come up with
2:07:26the world's most Fair on a back of a
2:07:28napkin this is what's fair but whether
2:07:30you can implement it is a very difficult
2:07:31thing the problem is wealth is
2:07:33completely mobile now it's really you
2:07:35can live work from
2:07:36anywhere the houses Dan yeah it's land
2:07:40is that mobile you going rip you can't
2:07:41rip the country out of the out of the
2:07:43sea there's very few I've never met any
2:07:45seriously wealthy people who own a lot
2:07:47of houses you honestly think that the
2:07:49entire housing stock of the UK is not
2:07:52valuable yeah no it is but 78% is owned
2:07:55by Baby Boomers they just own they've
2:07:57they've bought a house in 1992 they own
2:07:59the house personally I think that that
2:08:01house ownership especially when you
2:08:02consider mortgages is relatively
2:08:04unequally distributed that is by the way
2:08:06the most equally distribut young people
2:08:08have now had the commercial property the
2:08:09land the natural by Pension funds so
2:08:12you're the viewers own it do they no
2:08:13they're owned by if they own a pension
2:08:15fun most of those commercial what the
2:08:17distribution of Pion what is the
2:08:18distribution of Pensions what percentage
2:08:20of Pensions is owned by top 1% the I
2:08:23wouldn't know off the top of my head but
2:08:24with pensions but I know I know that OB
2:08:26obviously wealth concentrates at the top
2:08:29but here's the one thing keep in mind
2:08:31wealthy group are not necessarily a
2:08:32static group there was a study of the
2:08:35richest people in 1900 and most of those
2:08:39families are poor today or they they've
2:08:41gone down in value today uh if the
2:08:44richest people in 1900 had have just
2:08:45simply kept their wealth there'd be
2:08:4716,000 more billionaires but but they
2:08:50they don't um you know in Wealth
2:08:52Management in Banks yeah they have this
2:08:54thing called the um succession planning
2:08:56so succession planning is where they try
2:08:58and figure out how to not to screw it up
2:09:00across generations and they're they're
2:09:01notoriously bad at it it's very hard to
2:09:04keep wealth in Generations down in the
2:09:0620th
2:09:07century we had two world wars and a
2:09:10holocaust that redistributed
2:09:13wealth I would prefer not to have that
2:09:15again yeah yeah yeah I'm with you I want
2:09:18a affluent middle class I I really do so
2:09:20where's the we going to come from you
2:09:21want to just you're going to create your
2:09:22entrepreneurs
2:09:24entrepreneur entrepreneur economies that
2:09:26are friendly towards wealth creation and
2:09:28Entrepreneurship was the last time you
2:09:30had a government that wasn't let's grow
2:09:32let's grow let's
2:09:33grow it's not working for the people
2:09:35Daniel no the problem is is that they
2:09:37need to step back they need to let
2:09:38shrink let shrink let shrink our viewers
2:09:41should keep close ey on Donald Trump and
2:09:43Elon Musk because they're doing what
2:09:44you're asking it'll be interesting to
2:09:45see what happens right it's too soon to
2:09:47tell if you were trying to grow the UK
2:09:49economy would you not take America
2:09:51approach because they seem to be much
2:09:53more successful at growing growing their
2:09:54economy I think I mean of course when we
2:09:56talk about slashing of the state they're
2:09:58going to use these examples like oh
2:09:59there's this wasteful government
2:10:00building everybody wants to slash
2:10:02government waste of course I'm not going
2:10:03to fight against slashing government
2:10:05waste um I'm from the UK you know I saw
2:10:08the austerity years I've seen what's
2:10:10happened to local Services I've seen
2:10:11what's happened to things like the
2:10:12police like like education you know
2:10:14especially things like Youth Services um
2:10:17you slash the state you fire a load of
2:10:20people you know
2:10:22what does the state okay yeah if you can
2:10:24get rid of State corruption yes 100% if
2:10:26you can get rid of State waste 100% you
2:10:29know this is how single moms feed their
2:10:31kids
2:10:32Stephen you want to stop that no I'm
2:10:35saying that slashing the
2:10:37state I don't think it's going to work
2:10:40um to be honest I think tariffs is is
2:10:42not an uninteresting discussion I think
2:10:44yeah of course tax avoidance is
2:10:46something you need to get rid of really
2:10:48I would like to take a step back look at
2:10:50the country and say what is the state of
2:10:52the country what what the people need
2:10:55you know we have a country here where
2:10:57the housing stock is falling apart and
2:10:58we're letting it fall apart because
2:10:59those houses are owned by ordinary
2:11:01people who don't have any money if you
2:11:04want the country to work for ordinary
2:11:05people you need Ordinary People to have
2:11:07money I'm always reminded of Mr Beast he
2:11:09goes to places in Africa and he spends
2:11:11500 quid and he gives a kid eyesight who
2:11:13would have been blind for the rest of
2:11:14their life for 500 quid why are kids in
2:11:17Africa blind who could be given sight
2:11:20for 500 quid because they don't have any
2:11:23money this is what happens when you
2:11:25drain your middle class you this will
2:11:27end up like that you know you know I've
2:11:29got a friend who went to India last week
2:11:31he said there were people lying on the
2:11:33street outside with rotting limbs you
2:11:35know that is what happens when you when
2:11:36you disempower when you take the money
2:11:38away from your middle class you've got
2:11:40to protect the middle class if the
2:11:41middle class had money then there would
2:11:44be unbelievable business opportunities
2:11:46for selling goods and services like your
2:11:48business to the middle class so would
2:11:50you tax Daniel more
2:11:51I don't know if Daniel's worth more than
2:11:5310 million pounds it sounds like he is
2:11:54um is I mean I think I want to make it
2:11:57clear right you people you make 5% on
2:11:59your wealth so if Daniel's worth 100
2:12:01million he's making £5 million we're
2:12:03only trying to tax you 1% I think if you
2:12:04are worth 100 million you're making 5
2:12:06million pound passive income you can
2:12:08afford to pay a million pound tax a year
2:12:09you're going to still keep getting rich
2:12:11the truth is even if we were to tax
2:12:13these billionaires 1% a year they would
2:12:15still squeeze the rest out this is not
2:12:17this is not about morality this is just
2:12:19cold hard economic analysis that I have
2:12:21made a lot of money betting on so
2:12:22closing arguments then chaps um I'll
2:12:25start with you Gary based on everything
2:12:27we've discussed today um what is I'm
2:12:30going to ask you to to give me two
2:12:31perspectives which is if I'm a young
2:12:34individual in this country right now
2:12:36what should I do to protect myself and
2:12:37my family and to feed my family what
2:12:39kind of behaviors what strategy should I
2:12:41drop there but also then from a
2:12:43government level I know we have some
2:12:44politicians that listen because they
2:12:45message me what should politicians be
2:12:47doing to to fix the issue that we're all
2:12:50clearly identify which is the collaps of
2:12:52the middle class the collaps of sort of
2:12:53working-class people and the the the
2:12:55increased wealth of the rich I think
2:12:58what I would like young people to
2:13:00understand is that this gets worse this
2:13:03getss much much worse it will get much
2:13:05worse um relatively quickly uh poverty
2:13:08will increase relatively quickly it will
2:13:10become
2:13:11increasingly difficult almost impossible
2:13:13to make any serious money prepare
2:13:15yourself for that prepare yourself when
2:13:17you consider your finances when you
2:13:18consider your plans for having a family
2:13:20um
2:13:21this gets worse and it's going to be
2:13:23really really hard it's going to be a
2:13:24big mental health problem for a lot of
2:13:26young people um so speak to people and
2:13:28understand that um my YouTube videos are
2:13:30there G's economics people don't
2:13:31understand what's happening um after
2:13:34that you've got to do all the right
2:13:36things yeah I mean I don't disagree with
2:13:37you you've got to work hard you've got
2:13:39to study the right things um I I think
2:13:40it's a great shame we have made subjects
2:13:43like the Arts um a thing which you
2:13:46you're not allowed if you come from po
2:13:47poor backgrounds you cannot work in arts
2:13:49I'm sorry you can't pay the bills you
2:13:50can't so you have to go and study Ai and
2:13:54Computing and you know maybe social
2:13:55media although we have to be honest
2:13:57social media doesn't pay for most people
2:14:00um you have to realize the reality of
2:14:02your situation it's very very very very
2:14:06bad that doesn't mean you don't work
2:14:08that doesn't mean you don't Aspire you
2:14:09work damn hard because you have to but
2:14:11if you manage to make enough money to
2:14:12even support a family you should be
2:14:13proud of yourself that that's the number
2:14:15one thing um but
2:14:18recognize this can be changed this can
2:14:20be changed our grandparents our
2:14:22great-grandparents fought for our
2:14:24biggest share of the pie and they got it
2:14:26they got Healthcare they got education
2:14:27they got housing they got food our young
2:14:31people can have that as well but they
2:14:32won't get it unless they fight for it so
2:14:34I would encourage people
2:14:36to educate themselves support my work
2:14:39get involved politically but also work
2:14:41hard support your friends and family try
2:14:43and make money because you'll have
2:14:45to if you don't play politics I
2:14:47guarantee you the other side will play
2:14:49politics and that means your kids and
2:14:52your grandkids live in poverty so you
2:14:54have to do both with regards to
2:14:56politicians um I got mixed feelings
2:14:59about a lot of politicians the truth is
2:15:01I think a lot of politicians are very
2:15:02rich and and ultimately they don't care
2:15:04they're protected a crisis of inequality
2:15:07looks fantastic from the top and I think
2:15:09that's why the three of us can sit here
2:15:10and say things will be fine because for
2:15:12us they will be fine and for our kids
2:15:13they will be fine but for our viewers
2:15:15kids they won't be fine um the
2:15:16politicians are not going to try and
2:15:17save you I'm going to try and make sure
2:15:20they do it but I don't think they will
2:15:21listen my plan is not to get concessions
2:15:24from politicians my plan is to get 5
2:15:27million followers on the internet and
2:15:28Bully the politicians so that they have
2:15:30to give us what we need so I would
2:15:32support people to get behind me get
2:15:35behind my campaign but also understand
2:15:37what's happening educate your friends
2:15:39and your family and just crucially to
2:15:41understand this is going to be a long
2:15:43fight so be strong keep your people
2:15:46around you but be ready for what's to
2:15:48come I am I see hint and some of the
2:15:51things you've said recently of you going
2:15:53into politics yourself at some point
2:15:55Stephen I'm in politics but I me
2:15:57politics actively listen I I do not want
2:15:59to be an MP I do not want to be
2:16:01Chancellor I do not want to be prime
2:16:03minister if we get to a point where I
2:16:05feel that that is something that is
2:16:06achieved when is the best way to fix
2:16:08this problem I will be open to it this
2:16:11is not plan a this is not you know would
2:16:14you like to be prime minister I suspect
2:16:15probably not right like this is I'll be
2:16:17honest I I am quite uncomfortable with
2:16:20even the level of um public profile that
2:16:22I have at the moment which is you know
2:16:23it's much less than what you have but it
2:16:25stresses me out and it's weird we spoke
2:16:26about it before we were shooting um I
2:16:29don't want to can you imagine I I don't
2:16:31want to be prime minister I don't want
2:16:32to be an MP um but I'm serious about
2:16:35this work that I do and if we reach a
2:16:36point that I think that is the best way
2:16:39to do it I will consider it but I would
2:16:41much rather be able to influence the MPS
2:16:44from the sideline to influence the
2:16:45politicians from the sidelines and for
2:16:46that person you just gave advice to who
2:16:47should they be voting for well we don't
2:16:49have an election for listen
2:16:51politics is not football politics is not
2:16:53football okay this is not about I'm
2:16:55labor I'm conservative I'm Republican
2:16:57I'm Democrat you're losing your houses
2:16:58here you you're losing your houses your
2:16:59kids will be in poverty and you're going
2:17:01to see both Trump and the Republicans
2:17:03and Karma and labor who are supposed to
2:17:06be on the opposite side of the political
2:17:07spectrum they will both fail because
2:17:09they will not take action on growing
2:17:11wealth inequality and I'll be right on
2:17:12that you know bring me back in a few
2:17:14years I'll be right on that and um that
2:17:16shows you it's not about I think this
2:17:19factionalism is unbelievable damaging to
2:17:21our societies especially in the US where
2:17:23there's so much hatred behind it where
2:17:25suddenly I'm on this side you're on that
2:17:26side we're going to shake hands after
2:17:28this nothing we will you know it's
2:17:29there's no hatred here but if you allow
2:17:31yourself to be divided from half of your
2:17:33country and you allow we're seeing it
2:17:35growing tensions racial tensions gender
2:17:37tensions if you allow yourself to be
2:17:40divided they will win they will win so
2:17:42you need to vote for whoever is going to
2:17:44protect your houses and if you want to
2:17:46know who that is come and check Gary's
2:17:48economics before the election and I will
2:17:49tell you who it's going to be
2:17:51Daniel nice closing arguments personal
2:17:54and social a a few things um I read
2:17:57Gary's bookin it's brilliant and
2:17:59regardless of um regardless of whether
2:18:02you actually like economics it's a
2:18:04brilliant story it's a really I read it
2:18:05in about two or three days um and it'll
2:18:08it'll eventually be a good movie as well
2:18:10um I agree with a lot of what Gary's
2:18:12saying um there is a collapse of the
2:18:13middle class uh and it probably will get
2:18:16worse uh and the traditional middle
2:18:19class jobs that came out of the back of
2:18:21the Industrial Age mature Industrial
2:18:23Revolution system th those are
2:18:25collapsing and it's globalizing we're
2:18:27seeing technology move opportunities all
2:18:29over the world um and wealth inequality
2:18:33it has a cause uh wealth inequality
2:18:36itself is a scoreboard and there's a
2:18:38cause for what led up to wealth
2:18:39inequality and the cause in my mind is
2:18:41technology technology is moving the
2:18:44those opportunities around and it's
2:18:45changing things we already have big
2:18:47governments we have huge amounts of
2:18:49taxes we're at record levels of tax taes
2:18:51um uh wealth has never been more mobile
2:18:55it's not about what's fair it's about
2:18:56what you can practically get away with
2:18:58it's about what you can actually
2:18:59Implement um and uh it's going to be
2:19:02very very as Gary said it's going to be
2:19:04very very very hard to tax people who
2:19:06have digital businesses who can live and
2:19:07work from anywhere I know that firsthand
2:19:10um that it's incredibly mobile with that
2:19:13said at a micro level oh sorry at a
2:19:15macro level big picture we do know that
2:19:18there is a correlation between economic
2:19:20freedom where the government gets out of
2:19:21your way and low poverty rates and we
2:19:24know that as soon as governments become
2:19:26big uh high taxes High regulations it
2:19:29actually drops down a category and we
2:19:31see poverty goes up from 10% to 30% so
2:19:34triples um so constricting economic
2:19:37freedom is never a good idea uh if you
2:19:39look at the data at a micro level
2:19:42there's never been a greater opportunity
2:19:44for anyone who's ambitious and
2:19:46entrepreneurial to go and start a
2:19:47company it's cheaper than ever to start
2:19:49a company you can do what Gary's done
2:19:52which is publish content build a
2:19:54following uh figure out how to monetize
2:19:56it uh you can create products and
2:19:58services and sell them to anywhere in
2:20:00the world um you're an example of
2:20:02someone who started with nothing and
2:20:03became a millionaire in your 20s and
2:20:05then again in your 30s with a completely
2:20:06different thing he became a millionaire
2:20:08in his 20s and then again in his 30s
2:20:10is's a bestselling author and a content
2:20:12creator I did it in my 20s my 30s and
2:20:14now my 40s um starting from scratch so
2:20:18it's it's not normal that three guys our
2:20:20agage could have done that over and over
2:20:22again it's because we are living in a
2:20:24time where there is incredible
2:20:26opportunities but you have to be tapped
2:20:27into those opportunities you never heard
2:20:29about it at school you never heard about
2:20:31it at University you're going to have to
2:20:32learn the skills to get tapped into
2:20:34those OPP opportunities but there are
2:20:37definitely ways that you can succeed in
2:20:39the world that we're living in and on
2:20:40that macro Point who should we be voting
2:20:42for because some of your thinking in
2:20:44policy suggestions through this
2:20:45conversation align more with Trump Elon
2:20:48the American Mission now where they're
2:20:50welcoming millionaires they're trying to
2:20:51create a really entrepreneurship
2:20:52friendly environment they're doing the
2:20:54Doge dismantling of sort of government
2:20:56waste I I agree with Gary it's not
2:20:58football you don't have a team you swing
2:21:00you should be a swing voter you should
2:21:01vote every single election you should
2:21:04make them work hard for your vote and
2:21:06you should is Trump going to succeed
2:21:07though you should see it's too soon to
2:21:09tell but he made a prediction so I'm
2:21:10inviting you to make a prediction he
2:21:12said five years time we come back here
2:21:13we're going to see that Trump I think I
2:21:14think a lot of very wealthy people are
2:21:16going to move move to the USA um you're
2:21:18going to get a lot of people from all
2:21:19over the world he's playing to win and
2:21:21he wants rich people and entrepreneurs
2:21:23and investors to come into the US and be
2:21:25based there he's creating golden visas
2:21:27and open visas and the success metric
2:21:29here is the middle class get richer and
2:21:32more affluent what I actually think will
2:21:35happen as a result of all of that you
2:21:36will see Rising living standards in the
2:21:38USA and you'll see a detriment to the
2:21:42places where those people live it's not
2:21:44a good thing to have the people who pay
2:21:47the majority of the taxes which is 1% of
2:21:49people paying 30% of taxes if those
2:21:51people leave the bills get spread across
2:21:53everybody else well we'll have to do a
2:21:55part two and we shall see um I want to
2:21:58thank you both for the work that you do
2:22:00because I'm a big fan of both of you I
2:22:01watch Gary's videos all the time helps
2:22:03me to understand another perspective on
2:22:05what I'm typically hearing out out on
2:22:06the Internet or that I hear on Twitter
2:22:08about what's going on in the world and I
2:22:10think I really respect and admire people
2:22:12that can do what both of you have done
2:22:13today which is to exchange and listen to
2:22:16ideas in the pursuit of answers uh and
2:22:18that's why I'd highly recommend anybody
2:22:20regardless of whether you agree with
2:22:21everything or some things or or or just
2:22:23a little bit to go and follow Gary's
2:22:26Channel on YouTube called Gary's
2:22:27economics because it's a great source of
2:22:30information from someone who has done it
2:22:32from understands the world from another
2:22:33perspective but also someone who's
2:22:35providing a narrative which I actually
2:22:37think there's we kind of talked about
2:22:38before you started there's a big gap in
2:22:40the market for there are a lot of people
2:22:42like me and Dan out on the internet that
2:22:43are talking about entrepreneurship and
2:22:44finance and how to make money but there
2:22:46aren't enough people talking about
2:22:48wealth inequality from the perspective
2:22:49as Gary sees
2:22:51um and that are providing more sort of
2:22:53uh collectivist and sort of society
2:22:56wide Solutions and answers and sort of
2:22:59explanations as to why that's ultimately
2:23:01happening I do think I do think because
2:23:04I know you Dan I hope I know myself I do
2:23:07think that we we all want the UK to
2:23:11survive and I think we all believe that
2:23:13the way that the UK survives isn't
2:23:15necessarily a couple of ultra rich
2:23:16people getting more money it is sort of
2:23:19social mobility and it's allowing people
2:23:21that are at the very bottom to create
2:23:23opportunities and to succeed we all
2:23:24agree upon that even if we agree
2:23:26disagree sorry on the causes and the
2:23:28solutions to that um I'd also highly
2:23:31recommend everybody to go check out the
2:23:32trading game because everybody's talking
2:23:33about this this book and I think it's
2:23:35what four weeks at the moment on the
2:23:37Sunday Times besteller list four weeks
2:23:38number one number one four weeks number
2:23:40one which is an incredible achievement
2:23:42but it speaks to what's in this book the
2:23:44way that the story is told but also the
2:23:46timeliness of this message so I'd highly
2:23:48recommend everybody to go check it out
2:23:49I'm going to put a link below so that
2:23:51everybody can go and do it and if you
2:23:52just look at some of the um the the
2:23:54testimonials for this book it's profound
2:23:56I hear people describe it as like
2:23:58Unforgettable on one end and then sad on
2:24:00the other end because that's the nature
2:24:02of the reality it speaks to and I highly
2:24:03recommend everybody to go check out Dan
2:24:05priestley's entreprene Revolution but
2:24:07also your website has all of your
2:24:09resources and tools on it so I'll link
2:24:10that on the screen what's the uh Danel
2:24:13priest.com Danel priest.com thank you
2:24:15both for your generosity really really
2:24:16appreciate it thanks for bringing us
2:24:18together no matter where in the world it
2:24:21seems like everyone is drinking matcha
2:24:23and there's a good chance that that
2:24:24matcha you're drinking is made by a
2:24:26company that I've invested more than
2:24:27seven figures in who are a sponsor of
2:24:29this podcast called perfect Ted because
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2:24:57those people that have told yourself you
2:24:59don't like matcha it's probably because
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2:25:19Steve even
2:25:2240 this has always blown my mind a
2:25:24little bit 53% of you that listen to
2:25:27this show regularly haven't yet
2:25:28subscribed to the show so could I ask
2:25:30you for a favor if you like the show and
2:25:32you like what we do here and you want to
2:25:33support us the free simple way that you
2:25:35can do just that is by hitting the
2:25:36Subscribe button and my commitment to
2:25:38you is if you do that then I'll do
2:25:40everything in my power me and my team to
2:25:41make sure that this show is better for
2:25:43you every single week we'll listen to
2:25:45your feedback we'll find the guest that
2:25:46you want me to speak to and we'll
2:25:48continue to do what we do thank you so
2:25:50much much
2:25:53[Music]
2:26:10[Music]

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