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DNA Finally Breaks Cold Case | Fred Frampton Interrogation — Transcript

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0:00You left your blood all over the place.
0:01You know it. I know it. She knows it.
0:04>> The DNA is already matched up.
0:05>> I don't think that you guys.
0:06>> How'd you get my DNA?
0:08>> No, you'll find out later.
0:10>> Disclaimer: This video is for commentary
0:12and educational purposes only. All
0:14individuals are presumed innocent until
0:16proven guilty in a court of law. Any
0:19footage used in this video is obtained
0:20through public records and falls under
0:22fair use for the purpose of reporting,
0:24analysis, and public interest. On the
0:27night [music] of February 2nd, 2010,
0:29police responded to a home on
0:31Williamsburg Lane in Odenton, Maryland
0:33for what was first described [music] as
0:35a home invasion robbery. Inside, they
0:37found Michael Anthony Temple [music]
0:39suffering from multiple gunshot wounds.
0:42Three others were present in the house
0:43at the time. Temple survived the attack,
0:46but was left paralyzed. What began as a
0:48violent robbery investigation would
0:50slowly evolve into something [music] far
0:52more complex. Years passed, leads
0:55stalled, the case went cold. Then in
0:582015, Michael Temple died from
1:00complications related to those gunshot
1:02wounds. The Maryland Medical Examiner
1:04ruled [music] the death a homicide,
1:06transforming an already serious case
1:08into a murder investigation.
1:10Investigators [music]
1:11turned to advancing forensic technology
1:13in an effort to identify the masked men
1:15responsible. Crime scene DNA,
1:18phenotyping analysis, and [music] later
1:20forensic genetic genealogy became
1:22central to the renewed investigation.
1:25Publicly released composite [music]
1:26imagery and a reward did not initially
1:28generate viable leads, but the
1:30scientific trail continued quietly
1:32behind the scenes. In November 2018,
1:35more than 8 years after the [music]
1:37shooting, authorities announced an
1:39arrest. Fred Lee Frampton Jr. of [music]
1:41Glenn Bernie. What happened inside that
1:44interrogation room after years of
1:45silence and technological pursuit is the
1:48focus of this case. This is the
1:50interrogation of Fred Lee Frampton Jr.
1:54>> All right.
1:56Anything else you think? I want to give
1:58this back to you. You can go ahead and
2:01put that in your jeans or your pants in
2:03your pocket cuz I don't want to get it
2:05lost or anything. Okay, Miss uh Fred,
2:08what we have to do is in order for me to
2:10talk to you about what's going on here,
2:12I have to read you your rights.
2:14>> Yeah, cuz I'm under arrest.
2:15>> Yes, cuz you're under arrest. Have you
2:17been under arrest before
2:24>> times?
2:24>> I've never been I've never been in
2:26prison
2:27>> or anything like that.
2:28>> But so you've had police interaction?
2:30>> Yes.
2:30>> Okay. Have you ever been read before or
2:32they just lock you up and never talk to
2:34you? No, they don't read you. They don't
2:36have You don't have to read me your
2:37rights. I already know that it's already
2:39mandatory.
2:42>> Yeah. Well, I have to.
2:43>> You don't have to [laughter]
2:44physically read me my Miranda rights.
2:46>> We have to.
2:47>> No.
2:47>> Oh, you do. Detectives, not police
2:50regular.
2:50>> Oh, yeah. When they arrest you, cuz if
2:52they're not going to talk to you, they
2:53just swear you write this out. So, at
2:55that point, they do. But, um,
2:57>> they write their main silent.
3:00>> Okay.
3:01>> Okay. Get ahead of her. She'll go
3:02through and if you have any questions
3:03for ask away to answer them.
3:06>> Okay. And as I said, I'm Detective Kier.
3:11Okay. And what I'm going to do is I'm
3:13going to read along with you. Once a
3:15person's been taken into custody, the
3:17following warning must be given and an
3:19affirmative answer received that they
3:21understand each of their rights. I, Fred
3:23Frampton, Jr., who is you have been
3:25advised of my constitutional rights by
3:27Detective Fowler who's me um who has
3:30identified themselves as a law
3:31enforcement officer. I understand that
3:33as you said number one you have the
3:35right to remain silent. Number two,
3:37anything you say can and will be used
3:39against you in court. You're not being
3:41pro number three you are not being
3:43promised anything to talk to us and no
3:44threats are or will be made against you.
3:48You have the right to talk to a lawyer
3:49or have him present with you at any time
3:52during the questioning. If you proceed
3:53to answer any questions without a
3:55lawyer, the questioning will stop if you
3:57change your mind and request presence of
3:58a lawyer. Basically, that says um we can
4:02if you want to talk to us, we can start
4:04to talk to you and then at any time
4:05during the interview that you were like,
4:07um I don't want to talk anymore, you
4:09just tell us. Okay? And we stop.
4:12>> Some people that kind of confuses some
4:13people. That's why I always explain it.
4:15If you cannot afford a lawyer, one will
4:17be furnished without charge before any
4:19question if you desire. Okay. Now,
4:21here's things. Do you understand your
4:23rights?
4:24>> Yes.
4:25>> Okay. Can I get your initial there?
4:28>> Okay. Have you been threatened or forced
4:30or promised anything to speak with us?
4:34>> Well, you locked me out, so that's
4:35technically forced, right?
4:36>> Well, besides being put in handcuffs and
4:38brought here, has anyone said promised
4:40you anything to talk to us? Okay.
4:43>> Valid point, though.
4:48Go ahead and sign initial.
4:52Are you under influence of any drugs or
4:54alcohol at this time before you send?
4:56>> I wish I was.
4:58>> There you go.
5:02Okay.
5:04Now, if I can just get you to sign right
5:06here is that I've registered your
5:08rights.
5:117:08 a.m.
5:12>> You want me to fill out the rest?
5:13>> Yes, please. Now, Mr. Franklin, now that
5:16we have read you your rights, are you
5:18willing to speak with us so we can
5:19discuss everything and then
5:22>> I'll talk as much as I'm willing able
5:24to, I guess.
5:25>> Okay. Okay. We appreciate it. Okay. As
5:28you know, you have been brought in here
5:30with an arrest warrant.
5:32>> Yeah. What's the warrant for?
5:34>> Okay. The the warrant is for murder.
5:37Yeah.
5:37>> For homicide. Did you know that this was
5:41going to be coming?
5:42>> No.
5:43>> Okay.
5:46Well,
5:47we want we want to talk to you because I
5:49don't I know that there's
5:53another side to everything going on.
5:56Okay. And this happened a few years ago.
5:59If you can think back to possibly 2010,
6:04what kind of things were going on in
6:05your life in 2010?
6:08>> It's a big drug fueled rate. Big
6:10drugfueled uh party.
6:12>> Okay. So you you obviously had a drug
6:14addiction at the time or drug you were
6:17playing with it.
6:18>> Yeah.
6:18>> Okay.
6:20Um why don't you tell us about what
6:22happened in Odenton?
6:27>> We're at
6:29um Williamsburg Lane in February of
6:322010.
6:39>> I can't really recollect it.
6:41You can't.
6:43Okay. Well, in February 2010, there was
6:46um a drug dealer who was um
6:50pulling big money back and forth, moving
6:53a lot of drugs back and forth. Well, his
6:55house was there was there's a home
6:57invasion and a shooting.
6:59>> Okay.
7:00>> Okay. Um
7:03so, think about that. Do you know
7:04Michael Temple?
7:06>> I know Mike Temple. Yeah.
7:08>> You know Mike Temple. And how do you
7:09know Mike? I work with him.
7:12>> You work with him?
7:13>> You work with Cuz there's two Mike
7:14Temples.
7:16>> I know a older Mike Temple.
7:17>> Older. We're talking about older Mike
7:19Temple's son.
7:20>> No, I never met the guy.
7:22>> You never met the guy?
7:23>> Never met.
7:24>> Okay. But you do know older Mike Temple.
7:26>> Yeah,
7:28I heard about that whole incident when I
7:31first start. It's probably there for
7:34It's probably a little there for a
7:36little while. labor and then they
7:37brought it up that somebody had shot
7:39him.
7:40>> Mhm. Okay. So, you were already at that
7:44time
7:44>> when I found out about it. Yeah.
7:46>> Mhm. And you don't remember working with
7:48the younger Mike Temple?
7:50>> Never met him before.
7:52>> Okay. He also worked
7:55>> Yeah.
7:55>> Does that come as a surprise to you?
7:56>> No, I knew he worked there, but I never,
7:58like I said, I never met him.
7:59>> Okay. If we showed you a picture, could
8:02you take a look at them and see if you
8:03recognize? Maybe you don't know him by
8:04name, but
8:05>> I saw a picture of him on the TV when
8:07they did the
8:09>> That's That's Young Mike right there.
8:11>> Right here.
8:12>> Mhm.
8:13>> Looks like the picture they showed on uh
8:15TV.
8:15>> Okay.
8:16>> Mhm. And so you're saying you've never
8:19met him?
8:19>> I've never physically met him.
8:20>> You've never seen him?
8:22>> I've seen him.
8:23>> Well, besides being on TV.
8:26>> Never physically met him.
8:27>> Never physically seen him. Never
8:28physically met him? No.
8:30>> You ever been to his house?
8:32>> No.
8:32>> You ever been on Williamsburg Lane?
8:35>> I couldn't tell you.
8:36>> Okay. Is it possible you're on
8:38Williamsburg? I know you said you're in
8:40like a drug.
8:42>> You were doing lots of drugs back then.
8:46>> I can't say yes or no.
8:48>> Okay. If you're not sure, you're not
8:49sure. That's fine.
8:49>> I'm not going to incriminate myself. Say
8:51yes, I was when I don't know if I was or
8:53not.
8:54>> Okay. Mhm.
8:54>> Not that it matters to you all cuz
8:56obviously you'll have something some
8:58information that I don't know about.
9:00>> Well, since all this happened, you know,
9:03have you seen about like on the news
9:05we've done like
9:06>> the DNA stuff?
9:07>> Well, the DNA stuff, but on top of that,
9:08offer reward money and stuff like that.
9:10>> Yeah.
9:11>> So, people tend to talk for money,
9:14>> right?
9:15>> So, people call in and say, "Hey, I know
9:17what happened on this crime." And they
9:18give us information and we take that
9:19information, we run with it.
9:21>> Yeah.
9:21>> And we talk to other people. There's DNA
9:23stuff. If we do, you're exactly right.
9:25So, um, but you don't ever recall being
9:29in young Mike? I'll call him young Mike
9:31since, you know, older Mike. Young
9:32Mike's house.
9:33>> Never been there as far as I can
9:35remember.
9:35>> Okay. All right.
9:36>> Mhm.
9:38Who um
9:41tell tell me about what was going on in
9:44early 2010. You said you were doing a
9:46lot of drugs. What was what was going on
9:48there?
9:49>> I uh I was working for a drilling
9:51company. Well, actually you were working
9:54at that time.
9:54>> Well, well, before that you told me
9:57around that area, right? Around that
9:59time. I was just trying to get lead.
10:02>> Yeah.
10:03>> Work for a drill drilling company. I had
10:05just had a child. My brother had just
10:08passed away
10:10and I found myself in the bottom of a
10:12bottle for a while.
10:17And I got fired from the drilling
10:18company
10:20for uh
10:24not being drunk, but
10:27I was I was drinking the night before
10:29and I woke up late for work and I still
10:31smelled like alcohol even though I
10:33wasn't drunk still.
10:35>> And the guy the guy fired me for it and
10:39whatever.
10:41And then I don't know, I just kept on
10:44drinking and drugging for a while. And
10:46then I just woke up one realized one day
10:49that if I keep on doing this, I'm going
10:51to lose my son. So I stopped.
10:52>> Mhm.
10:53>> When did you have that epiphany? Like I
10:57got to stop this.
10:59>> I guess he was like two or three.
11:01>> Do you remember what year that was?
11:03>> He was born in '08. So
11:04>> So around 2010.
11:06>> 2010. 201.
11:07>> Okay. 11ish.
11:08>> 11.
11:09>> All right. cuz I noticed that the
11:12interaction with the police just
11:14stopped.
11:15>> Yeah. I got I got stayed away from
11:17everything. I got clean, got away from
11:19people I used to hang out with all the
11:21time that were either constantly getting
11:23killed, going to jail,
11:25dying themselves from drug overdoses. I
11:28just got away from all of it.
11:30>> So, who was your
11:32during this time? Who was like your best
11:34friend that you were hanging out with?
11:37>> He's dead now.
11:38>> What did he die of? Heroin overdose.
11:41>> Okay.
11:43He died.
11:44>> When did he pass away?
11:46>> This year, I think.
11:47>> Was it
11:48>> earlier this year?
11:49>> I had a name. Does that sound familiar?
11:51>> Does anyone else Did you hang out with
11:53anyone else during that time?
11:55>> I ran out with uh
11:58a lot of
12:00>> Do any of these people hold any ill will
12:02against you? Mad at you? They should
12:06I work
12:09I thought to him the other day when I
12:10put my son trick-or-treating.
12:12>> Okay.
12:13>> But during that during that back in
12:14early 2010 who would the first guy you
12:18gave us was that the guy you hung out
12:20with the most or
12:22>> pretty much inseparable at the time.
12:24>> Okay. All right.
12:25>> Okay.
12:27Well,
12:29we we know you were there and whether it
12:32was your idea,
12:35I don't know.
12:38Um because you seem like you've really
12:41changed your life since all this
12:42happened and I think it was a
12:43life-changing thing for you besides this
12:45happening, realizing you are going to
12:47lose your son if you don't change your
12:49ways.
12:50So, I think that a lot took place in
12:53early 2018 that really made you open
12:56your eyes. I mean, 2010 that really made
12:58you open your eyes of what you want your
12:59future to be.
13:01And uh I don't
13:06I would I would I don't know whether
13:08what the what the main I think that the
13:10main thing in there you you were at the
13:13house. I can tell you that. We know
13:15that.
13:17Um,
13:18like I said, people do talk. You were
13:20there. Your truck was there.
13:23So, I know you were at the house and you
13:25know you were at the house.
13:28>> We got to figure out
13:29>> what was the issue? Why
13:30>> did you guys go in there planning to
13:32kill someone or did something happen
13:33once you got in that just made it, you
13:36know, self-defense or whatever could
13:37have happened. Did you
13:39>> turn something out the way you had
13:40planned when you went in there?
13:42>> Technically, it wouldn't be self-defense
13:43if it's home invasion, wouldn't it? It'd
13:45be something his part and I don't know
13:47whoever
13:48>> I mean here here's the thing
13:50>> people above us look they look at things
13:52very black and white right and wrong us
13:54we know in the real world people will go
13:57do A and something happens and then B
13:59happens right and that's the difference
14:01between good people and bad people good
14:02people makes a mistake bad people are
14:04just evil they don't really have that
14:06clear distinction up top you feel you
14:08know what I'm saying I know people who
14:11do drugs don't you know sometimes do
14:13things that
14:14>> they wouldn't normally do.
14:15>> They would normally do. But when I look
14:17at you honestly, here's a guy who was
14:20having issues back in You're exactly
14:22right. Back in 2000, something happened
14:24in 2010. Then all of a sudden, you've
14:26done a 180 and you you've progressed in
14:29your job. You've done well for yourself.
14:32You're taking care of your kid. You've
14:33got I mean, you haven't married her, but
14:35you've been with this girl for quite a
14:36while, right? So, there was a
14:38life-changing experience, and we all
14:40know what that was. What we have to
14:41figure out now is what happened that
14:44night,
14:44>> whether it's going to be destroyed or
14:46not. Pretty much
14:48>> I don't that's not a decision for us.
14:50But I mean, we all we have to figure out
14:53when you guys went in that night, what
14:55was your intention? Was it to kill
14:56someone or was it something else?
14:59>> Was it to to take the money and drugs?
15:06>> If I were to answer that question,
15:07either way, it didn't incriminate. blood
15:09left at the scene that you
15:11>> Oh, so you do have the DNA. So, see,
15:13they don't get information from you, I
15:15guess.
15:16>> On top of people, you know, telling us
15:18stuff.
15:19>> Probably
15:22give any names. All right.
15:23>> The only other person you Yeah. You're
15:26what? Sorry.
15:28>> The girl that probably readed us out was
15:31in on it also.
15:33>> Okay. So, what we have to figure out is,
15:36you know, people point us in a
15:37direction. and we take that direction.
15:39And unfortunately for you, something
15:42happened where you left your DNA all
15:44over the place that night. All right.
15:47So,
15:49let me ask you this. Let's talk
15:51hypothetically for a second.
15:53You you with me on that? Hypothetically
15:55speaking,
15:57>> good.
15:58>> Okay.
15:59Hypothetically speaking, if you were to
16:02go into that house, would it have been
16:04which one of the people it would have
16:05been with you that night? Hypothetically
16:07speaking,
16:09>> I guess whoever was stupid enough to do
16:11something that stupid.
16:13>> Was it the person that overdosed earlier
16:15this year that you were inseparable as
16:18you say?
16:19>> Could have been.
16:20>> Okay. And there could have been maybe a
16:22girl involved.
16:26Hypothetically speaking,
16:27>> hypothetically, somebody could have been
16:29setting it up.
16:30>> Okay. All right. So,
16:35hypothetically speaking, what would be
16:36the intention of going into the house
16:38that night? Was it to hurt someone or
16:39was it to rob the place to get some
16:41drugs and money?
16:48>> It's not really hypothetical, is it?
16:51You're just asking me what happened.
16:52Tried what supposedly happened in that
16:54house.
16:55>> We're trying what we're trying to figure
16:56out is what was the intention of you
16:57guys when you went in that night. It's
16:59not an issue of did you do it. Mhm.
17:03>> You left your blood all over the place.
17:05You know it. I know it. She knows it.
17:07>> The DNA is already matched up.
17:08>> I don't think that you guys.
17:10>> How'd you get my DNA?
17:11>> No, you'll find out later. But we have
17:13your DNA. So,
17:15>> going through my trash?
17:17>> No, not going through your trash. You
17:19got to watch where you threw your
17:20cigarette butts.
17:23But the thing is is that which detective
17:28depro was was uh getting at
17:31you went in there for for one reason. I
17:34don't think it worked out the way that
17:37you had envisioned it. I think things
17:39took a turn for the worse and things
17:41happened that you probably hadn't
17:46possibly not wanted to happen because
17:48you've changed your life right after
17:49that. Other
17:52people have it that we're involved in
17:54this.
17:55>> No, I know.
17:56>> So, there's a reason we're talking to
17:58you first.
18:01>> But the paper sign does doesn't matter
18:04what I say. I don't get any leniency
18:05anyway.
18:06>> That's not up to us. All we do is we
18:08take the facts and we present it to the
18:10bosses. They they figure that out from
18:12there.
18:13>> Joe for the rest of my life.
18:14>> You could,
18:16but that's why we're asking you these
18:18questions. There are there are certain
18:20things that could change that like did
18:22you act alone?
18:23>> Are you willing to work with us now?
18:25>> Are you willing to tell us what
18:28>> happened that night as far as what your
18:30intention was when you went in versus
18:32what actually happened? Those are
18:33decisions made above us, but these are
18:35things we can take to them saying,
18:37"Look,
18:38>> they look at the big picture. They look
18:40at these people are involved since this
18:42has happened. What have these three
18:43people been up to?" Right? You have done
18:46a 180 like I said. other people have it.
18:50So, I mean, if people other people are
18:54involved that are still amongst the
18:56living,
18:57I don't know why you want to stand there
18:59and hold the bag off by yourself. You
19:00know what I mean?
19:03>> Because someone who planned this, set it
19:05up, guided you guys is just as guilty
19:08and culpable criminal wise as the person
19:11conspiracy,
19:12>> that person could be charged with the
19:14exact same things you were charged with
19:15right now.
19:16>> Yeah. But not get it. Not what you mean.
19:18I get it.
19:20>> If they they they weren't even at the
19:22place where it happened just because
19:23they're talking over the phone.
19:26We still have the right to choose our
19:28own decisions and our own what we do.
19:32>> Well, let let Was this your idea?
19:35>> No.
19:35>> Okay. Whose idea was it?
19:39Okay.
19:42How what made you guys pick that night?
19:46Was there a particular day of the week?
19:48>> I don't know. He he he called me over to
19:51his house and I went over there just to
19:53hang out and then he he had the idea.
19:56>> Okay.
19:57>> It was just a spur of the moment thing,
19:58I guess.
19:59>> Who would who would?
20:02>> Both probably. I don't know.
20:03>> Both.
20:04>> Did you ever buy from him?
20:05>> Okay.
20:07>> I said I never met the boy personally.
20:09>> Okay.
20:10>> Which one of them would probably know he
20:12just reuped?
20:14>> Both of them most likely. And they both
20:16the pills hard.
20:18>> Mhm.
20:19Work with
20:21>> Mhm.
20:25>> go around flashing his money, talking
20:28about it. He wasn't shy when it came to
20:30that.
20:32>> I
20:37went through somebody else at work. So,
20:40we never actually physically worked with
20:41them.
20:45What was their relationship?
20:48>> Yeah, they were together on and off for
20:50a long time.
20:54>> So, it was both of their ideas for this
20:59>> as far as I know.
21:01>> Okay. The house
21:02>> they called you I'm sorry. They called
21:04you over their house and where did they
21:06live at the time?
21:09>> Some uh apartment complex. I don't know
21:12the specific name of it anymore, but
21:14it's
21:15figured right off.
21:20It's not
21:25I can't remember name when you go down.
21:31>> Was one once by the hospital?
21:34>> No, this is before that.
21:38>> Okay. own apartment.
21:39>> So obviously
21:41the hospital by the hospital
21:42>> and Bernie
21:45>> something
21:50just like we won't go and tell other
21:52people when we speak to them who tells
21:53us information.
21:54>> I know I put two and two together
21:56>> confirm anything.
21:59>> So can can you tell me what happened?
22:02>> Walk us through what happened when you
22:03guys went in that night.
22:05went in there, had a bad feeling, went
22:08to turn around.
22:09>> Mhm.
22:11>> Egged me on.
22:13I was alled up.
22:16Went there, asked for the money to safe,
22:20and then he started attacking me with a
22:21knife.
22:24>> Okay.
22:24>> And then I told him to stop stabbing me.
22:27He wouldn't stop stabbing me, so I shot
22:30him and I left.
22:32>> How many times did you shoot him? I only
22:34pulled the trigger one time as far as I
22:35remember.
22:36>> Okay. And where did he stab you?
22:38>> Stabbed me in my arm.
22:39>> Okay. Which arm?
22:42>> That's where he got you?
22:43>> That's where he got me. That's where the
22:45blood came from that you got found.
22:46>> Okay. It was a lot.
22:49>> Lot of blood.
22:50>> It's a deep cut.
22:51>> Yeah.
22:51>> Big blood.
22:52>> Blood the whole way out.
22:53>> Have to get stitches?
22:55>> No.
22:55>> Did you just How did you You didn't go
22:57to the hospital.
22:58>> Of course not. That'd be stupid.
23:00>> I know. But what how did you treat it?
23:01>> You'd be surprised. Some people do.
23:04>> Uh, got some antibiotics from somebody
23:07and then
23:09cut the clean. That's about it.
23:11>> Okay. So, you didn't stitch it up
23:12yourself or anything?
23:13>> No stitches.
23:14>> All right. Did you wrap it?
23:16>> Yep.
23:16>> I'm guessing. How long did it take to
23:18heal?
23:21>> A couple weeks.
23:22>> Okay.
23:24So, the person who gave you antibiotics,
23:26who's that person?
23:26>> I'm not going to tell you. Sorry.
23:29That doesn't mean
23:30>> they didn't know about the situation
23:31anyway. So it wouldn't matter and I'm
23:33not putting them in.
23:33>> Yeah, they were just helping you after
23:34the fact.
23:35>> Yeah, they didn't know anything. All
23:36they I told them I got jumped.
23:39>> Okay.
23:39>> Okay. All right. So, and whose vehicle
23:43did you guys used to get there?
23:44>> My truck, obviously.
23:46>> That's the same truck you still have.
23:48>> Yep.
23:48>> Okay. Um,
23:52what was the other guy doing when you
23:54were doing all this with with with Mike
23:57Jr.? Do you know?
24:00>> I don't know. He was in the other room.
24:02I was trying to get out.
24:04>> Okay.
24:04>> How many people were in there when you
24:05went in?
24:08>> Him and two girls. And there was a child
24:10outside in the car.
24:12>> Mhm.
24:13>> Cuz
24:13>> you saw the child when you went in?
24:15>> Yeah. The girl was in there buying drugs
24:17from him with a child in the car.
24:18>> Now, did you know the girl in there
24:19buying drugs? No.
24:22>> Okay.
24:24Whose idea was it to tie the uncle up
24:29with the duct tape?
24:31I think that was
24:33weren't even supposed to
24:36you supposed to go right to his room
24:39get have him open a safe and then leave
24:42that was the pro that was the deal.
24:44>> Were you guys going to divide it like
24:45what was the what's the divy going to
24:47be? Did you guys discuss that like half
24:50get half? No.
24:53>> What were you guys expecting to find in
24:55there? What type of drugs?
24:56>> Oh negative about drugs. There was
24:58supposed to be there's supposed to be 20
25:0030 grand in cash in there.
25:02>> Okay. All right.
25:04>> And there was a lot of cash in there.
25:06>> Oh, bet. Supposedly
25:09they opened a safe right before I left.
25:11I don't know cuz I ran out.
25:13>> Okay. Who tied the uncle up?
25:17>> It was a team effort, I guess you could
25:20say.
25:20>> What do you mean by that?
25:22>> You
25:25grabbed him easily. We didn't hurt him
25:28at all.
25:29>> No one said he did. No one said
25:30>> because they bull in the reports they
25:32saw they did on TV.
25:34>> They tried to say he got beat up and
25:36>> Okay.
25:37>> We know what what happened was [ __ ] up
25:40and what I did was [ __ ] up.
25:41>> But I did not hurt that old man.
25:44>> No, no one's saying don't worry about
25:45what the news says. Believe me, don't
25:47worry about the news. I'm
25:48>> incriminate myself, man. Anyway,
25:50>> so you're you didn't hurt him and no
25:53one's saying you hurt him. But who
25:54actually put the tape on him?
25:57It was a team effort. What do you mean?
26:00[clears throat] Put put held his legs
26:02put around his legs or something. I
26:04can't remember exactly where. See.
26:05>> Did you guys bring the duct tape
26:07yourself or did you use the tape already
26:08there?
26:11>> I couldn't tell you. I don't know where
26:13it came.
26:13>> No, that's okay. That's okay. If you
26:15can't remember, we appreciate it. Don't
26:19for
26:21>> the gun.
26:23You bought it the year before?
26:29>> I don't remember when I I bought as soon
26:30as I turned 21. I know that.
26:32>> Okay.
26:33Now, um do you still have the gun?
26:37>> Cuz you know we are doing warrants.
26:40>> Yeah, you already searched my house.
26:41Hope you all aren't hurting my child,
26:42hurting my cat.
26:44>> They're not.
26:44>> No, I told them about the cat ahead of
26:46time.
26:46>> Yeah, but if you leave the door open,
26:48the cat's not an outside door. Outside
26:50cat.
26:50>> Okay.
26:51>> Okay. They're they'll they'll do their
26:53best not to let the but the cat open and
26:55not the cat the cat out.
26:56>> With animals, they're usually very
27:00sensitive to that and we try to contain
27:01them in this in a room.
27:03>> But where's the gun right now?
27:09>> Cuz if we we can go through and just
27:12tear everything apart.
27:16>> Oh, they haven't found it yet. They
27:17>> Well, I don't know. I've been in here.
27:19>> They're not there. you know, like we've
27:20been in here. I haven't gotten any
27:22messages or anything on the phone, but
27:25if you want to just tell me where it is,
27:26I can tell them go here and get it
27:29instead of [clears throat]
27:32going through your whole house. Or they
27:33can go through your whole house to get
27:34it.
27:37>> It's a
27:39It's in a gun case sitting in my man
27:41cave.
27:42>> In your man cave?
27:43>> In my man cave? Is that the basement?
27:46>> No.
27:46>> Where's your man cave?
27:48>> What? It's a big It's a door. It says
27:51man cave. You all know it.
27:52>> Okay.
27:53>> Oh, so literally
27:54>> it is really open.
27:55>> To me, a basement or a shed is a man
27:57cave to me. So,
27:58>> okay.
27:59>> Like a tan tactical case sitting on the
28:02couch. It's in the front slat front
28:05opening.
28:08>> Why didn't you just get rid of the gun?
28:09Cuz I'm stupid.
28:11>> Okay.
28:17Can you um text Rob that? Thank you.
28:25>> Wouldn't have mattered anyway on the
28:26DNA.
28:27>> Well, yeah, you're right about that.
28:29>> And Fred, I
28:30>> you just wouldn't be able to prove I
28:31pulled the trigger, but now you can't
28:32since I admitted it.
28:33>> Well, no. No, we could.
28:35>> We have other witnesses there, too, that
28:37were actually there was another victim
28:40in this.
28:44No, the one of the females saw
28:46everything that happened.
28:48>> And it was reported at that time.
28:51>> Yeah.
28:52>> Well, in 2010,
28:54>> huh?
28:54>> In the house. Someone in there.
28:56>> Yeah.
28:57>> Well, you said when you went in there
28:58was two females.
28:59>> Yeah.
28:59>> Yeah.
29:00>> Just like we're talking to you now,
29:02there were full interviews done back in
29:032010, and all the actions that occurred
29:07in the house were documented at that
29:09point, too. Guess
29:13it's my time to pay my penants then
29:19>> people do things in life.
29:20>> It doesn't matter.
29:22>> Doesn't matter whether I did it now then
29:25>> whenever. I still eventually
29:27>> if you had caught me I wouldn't have
29:28paid for it. I wouldn't say anything.
29:30>> But this has this this been tearing you
29:32up. I
29:33>> have nightmares about it.
29:34>> Yeah. Because you're working with his
29:35dad and his dad is probably one of the
29:38nicest guys I've ever met in my life.
29:40I mean, for me, every time I would see
29:42him, it would tear me up inside.
29:45>> Yeah. What am I supposed to do to wrap
29:47myself out like I just did?
29:49>> Well, the difference between good people
29:51who make mistakes and evil people is
29:53when it's time to man up, you man up.
29:54>> And it doesn't matter in the court
29:56level, though.
29:56>> Well, that's not for decisions for us to
29:58make at our level.
30:01>> But things that we look for down the
30:02road is if you're willing to help us, I
30:06mean, with the girl that helped set this
30:08up.
30:08>> Mhm.
30:11to set this up and called you over.
30:15>> She was the one she was on the phone
30:17keeping tabs with him, letting us know
30:18where he was at and all that and when he
30:21would be there and what he had and all
30:23that.
30:23>> Who did she um talk with the male or
30:25female of the
30:29>> I don't know. I wasn't on the phone.
30:31>> I wasn't on the phone with him. She
30:33talked to you most likely she talked to
30:34him. I couldn't tell you.
30:40Did you see all the stuff we did like
30:42putting the composite out of
30:44>> Yeah, it was a bad composite obviously
30:45cuz I don't like that.
30:47>> Well, pretty close if you do a side by
30:49side.
30:51>> Really?
30:52>> Yeah.
30:53>> Pull it up.
30:55>> Yep.
30:58>> It's um
31:00very remarkable.
31:01>> Is there anything else you doing back in
31:03these days that we need to know about?
31:05Any other thing? It's the worst thing
31:07I've ever done in my whole life.
31:08>> Okay.
31:09>> Bam. Pull it down.
31:10>> So, the intention of you guys going in
31:12that day, was it to hurt anyone or just
31:14get the cash?
31:14>> Just to get the cash.
31:16>> Okay. And after you guys left there,
31:19where did you go?
31:21>> Back to
31:24rid of my bloody clothes.
31:26>> What did you do with them?
31:27>> They're in a dumpster.
31:29>> Okay.
31:29>> They're in some landfill now.
31:31>> Oh, I'm sure.
31:33Remember which dumpster?
31:35dumpster that was sitting out in front
31:36of his building door at his apartment.
31:38>> I'm sorry. What?
31:39>> The dumpster that was
31:41dumpster.
31:44>> What's the combo to uh your gun safe?
31:49>> Should be unlocked.
31:52>> Should be unlocked. And is there a key
31:54for another one?
31:57>> Oh, my digital fingerprint key. It work.
32:01It's [ __ ] up. You just got to push the
32:02put the finger on. There's nothing I had
32:04done.
32:05>> Okay.
32:09>> So, when you bought the gun, it wasn't
32:11for this. It was just You turned 21, you
32:13wanted the gun.
32:14>> You wanted shooting and hunting all my
32:16life.
32:16>> Okay.
32:17>> Well, obviously, I'll never do that
32:18anymore.
32:19>> And what type of gun is it?
32:22>> Pistol.
32:23>> Like semi-automatic revolver?
32:25>> Semi-automatic.
32:26>> All right. What's the caliber?
32:28What's the caliber y'all found in
32:30dental?
32:31>> Look, I got to ask you these stupid
32:32stupid questions.
32:35357. Okay.
32:37>> When you put them side by side, Fred,
32:40surprising
32:43how much you do look like that composite
32:47back in order 2010. You got to also take
32:50in account. It's been eight years.
32:56Made you freak out when you saw that or
32:58did
33:00>> you want to know what I thought?
33:02>> No, I did.
33:02>> We do. We wouldn't ask
33:04>> that. I wasn't going to let you all take
33:06me alive.
33:07>> Okay.
33:09>> Well, I'm glad I didn't.
33:10>> I don't want to go to jail for the rest
33:11of my life. Even though I did something
33:14I shouldn't have done,
33:16>> but I'm going lose my son.
33:20>> Lose everything.
33:21>> You'll still see your son.
33:23>> You don't know his mother.
33:24>> I mean, no one knows what
33:26I wasn't sure what your um
33:28>> you know child custody was cuz I saw
33:30that and then I was like I'm sure she's
33:31giving them a hard time with child
33:33custody as far as
33:35>> Were you with her at this time when this
33:37happened?
33:40>> No, I think I was single at the time.
33:43>> Is there anyone else you confided in?
33:45Obviously these two knew, but just to
33:48show that you didn't plan on going in
33:50there killing him. Is there anyone else
33:51you confided in to say this terrible
33:54knows?
33:54>> Okay.
33:56>> She doesn't know anything. I wouldn't
33:59put that weight on her.
34:00>> Okay.
34:04>> Does your um child's mother know?
34:06>> No one knows.
34:07>> No one knows.
34:08>> Well, besides,
34:13>> what do you want to do you have a
34:15message for?
34:19I mean, some people do, some people
34:20don't. I always ask. Some people say,
34:23"I'd like to write a letter." Some
34:25people say, "Hey, can you just tell him
34:26I'm sorry?" Some people say, "Uh, I
34:28don't have anything.
34:31It's a regrettable a regrettable mistake
34:33I can't take back." And
34:35>> if he wants to come take advantage of
34:37me, he's more than welcome to.
34:40>> Oh, I don't think he's that type of
34:41person. I think he's more the forgiving
34:43type.
34:44>> He deserves
34:46I deserve him. Oh.
34:50Is there anything else you can think of?
34:51Do you think we need to know that we
34:53haven't asked you? No,
34:55>> I read it myself out pretty good. So,
34:57>> how did you guys get in the house? Was
34:59it unlocked or
35:00>> door was unlocked?
35:01>> The door was unlocked and you just
35:02walked in which door to go through and
35:04all knew?
35:06>> They already knew.
35:08>> Been there before. That's why he knew
35:10exactly where the safe was.
35:12>> Yeah. I didn't know anything about any
35:14of it until that day they called me up.
35:16And do you remember what you were
35:18wearing that day?
35:22>> Black clothes. It's all
35:28>> Did you have a mask or anything covering
35:30your face?
35:32>> Yeah.
35:33>> What' you have?
35:37>> You remember?
35:38>> I think it was a bandana.
35:47just put the bullet in my head.
35:50>> Well, did you intend on when you went in
35:54there?
35:56>> I intend on hurting anybody.
36:00It doesn't matter what I intended. It
36:03matters what happened.
36:05I'm not stupid.
36:07I am stupid for doing what I did, but
36:09I'm not that stupid for not realizing
36:11the consequences of my actions.
36:19So, as far as this girl goes, no, when
36:21you guys walked in and you said there
36:23was a kid outside, where was the kid? In
36:26the running car in the parking in the
36:29driveway.
36:33You still
36:36>> I don't talk to any of
36:38>> Mhm.
36:42>> like he escaped
36:44his punishment.
36:48>> Did you guys talk about this at all with
36:49the funeral
36:51to anybody about anything?
36:53>> When you guys were talking
36:56about this after it happened?
36:59>> Yeah.
37:02talked to him. Got out. You shouldn't
37:04never went in there.
37:06You shouldn't have done it.
37:09But it's too late by then. It's already
37:11been done. Can't turn back on. Feel
37:14>> the same way. Or no,
37:16>> I couldn't tell you. He liked to talk a
37:19lot of, but
37:21he wasn't as cruelhearted as you would
37:24make people think he was.
37:26>> Mhm.
37:26>> But he he couldn't get away from the
37:27drugs, though. No,
37:28>> you did.
37:33Does it matter anymore?
37:36>> Fred,
37:36>> do you want a cup of coffee now?
37:37>> No.
37:38>> That's water or anything?
37:39>> No. Okay.
37:42So, what's going to happen now is we
37:44have to uh have take some photographs of
37:46you. Um they have to take your DNA,
37:48which is the swallow of your mouth
37:50again. They have to do that and then
37:52they have to take some um head hair
37:55samples, but it it goes real quick and
37:58it's not painful or anything like that.
37:59And then once it's done, like you've
38:01been arrested before, you'll get your
38:02fingerprints, photographs, all that.
38:04Then you'll see the commissioner um and
38:07go from there. Okay. Do you have any
38:08questions for us right now? Look, I
38:10don't know what the future's going to
38:10hold for you. I I don't.
38:13>> What's the chance of me getting a lawyer
38:14right now? Even though I already
38:16admitted everything,
38:17>> you can you could have you can ask for a
38:19lawyer anytime you want. I know.
38:22Don't think that wasn't running through
38:23my head.
38:24>> Okay.
38:25>> Doesn't really matter when you have my
38:26DNA though.
38:28>> Yeah, it's kind of a no-brainer at that
38:29point. So, do you have any questions for
38:33us besides that? So, when you you can
38:36ask for a lawyer at any time, but when
38:38you get to the commissioner's office,
38:39they'll ask you if you want to be
38:40represented during the hearing. And if
38:42you do, you just say, "Yeah, I do." And
38:43then there's attorneys right there. So,
38:46>> all right. I guess they'll be taking me
38:48up to what? Northern um
38:51>> uh probably Western I would guess.
38:53>> Western or something.
38:54>> Whoever whoever has a booking officer
38:55working. It just depends.
38:56>> No, I mean after they don't let me out
38:58on recon.
39:00>> Uh if that happens, you'd be going to
39:01Jennifer Road.
39:02>> Yeah.
39:02>> And then you'll have a bail review most
39:04likely either this afternoon or tomorrow
39:07>> in front of a judge.
39:09>> Can I make a phone call?
39:10>> Sure. Who do you want to call?
39:11>> I want to call my girlfriend.
39:13>> Your girlfriend? Yeah. I'll get you a
39:14phone. Okay. Um, you want to see if she
39:16has a phone with her right now?
39:19>> Yeah,
39:20>> I'll get her a phone.
39:22>> Is it in your phone?
39:24>> Yeah, it's all on my phone.
39:26>> Yeah, we can get You want to get your
39:27phone and then
39:28>> Yeah, it should be.
39:29>> Okay.
39:30>> Okay. And what is the code to your
39:32phone? Your iPhone.
39:35>> So, the little dots and you just do that
39:37on the outside.
39:38>> No, only on first line and then down.
39:42>> Let's get the phone. You can show me.
39:44Mhm.
39:45>> I'm not very techsavvy.
39:48>> Where is this phone anyways?
39:50>> In the box. I put it in a envelope.
40:02>> Technically, he's not considered to die
40:04at the scene.
40:06No, he died later from complications due
40:08to the injuries
40:11inflicted on the scene.
40:13>> That equates to the medical examiner.
40:16>> What have you been told?
40:17>> He overdosed on his drugs that he was
40:20given.
40:22>> Well, the I could tell you the autopsy
40:24from the medical examiner. They ruled it
40:26a homicide and that it was due to the
40:28complications
40:31from the shooting.
40:42And uh
40:44the one female when
40:48she came out
40:51you to shoot her.
40:53>> Do you remember? I didn't shoot anybody
40:57as far as I can remember.
40:58>> I remember. Do you remember shooting at
41:01the other female?
41:04Never shot at anybody but I shot that
41:06shot the one boy once cuz he was
41:08stabbing me. So as far as I know
41:11>> Yeah.
41:12>> I shoot
41:17I don't want to mess up your phone. As
41:19far as you say you phone. That's not
41:21your phone.
41:22>> No, his is an evidence bag.
41:23>> Oh, sorry.
41:24>> With the work phone.
41:25>> My bad.
41:32I guess no good is me being straight cuz
41:33once I go to jail, I'm might have to be
41:35a mean piece of mother again
41:38just to survive.
41:49I'm sorry it seems you put all that
41:50behind you. Was this the Was this the
41:55camel that broke the stroll that broke
41:56the camel's back that decided to make
41:58you really decide to do that?
42:00>> Got it.
42:00>> That's it.
42:01>> All right.
42:03>> That really made you decide to change
42:04your life or just the fact that you you
42:07knew you were going to lose your son.
42:08What was that code?
42:09>> It was um I saw it.
42:11>> Oh, so you saw it?
42:12>> I'll tell you. Give me a second.
42:14>> Okay.
42:16Um,
42:18how long? About
42:20>> since I was in high school.
42:22>> All right. So, if you saw a photo of
42:24her, just to make sure we're talking
42:26about the right.
42:26>> Let me get it.
42:27>> You want to go ahead and call your
42:28girlfriend?
42:29>> No. No.
42:30>> Okay.
42:30>> Okay.
42:32You want some privacy?
42:34>> It doesn't matter. You got this room
42:36recorded in.
42:36>> Yeah. But I mean, I'll close a little
42:38bit.
42:40More than eight years passed between the
42:42night Michael Anthony Temple was shot
42:43inside his Odenton home and the arrest
42:45of Fred Lee Frampton Jr. Temple survived
42:48the initial attack but remained [music]
42:50paralyzed until his death on June 18th,
42:532015 when the Maryland Medical Examiner
42:55ruled [music] the manner of death a
42:57homicide due to complications from the
42:59gunshot wounds. Investigators relied on
43:02preserved crime scene [music] DNA, later
43:04combining traditional forensic testing
43:06with phenotyping and genetic genealogy.
43:09After a genealogy report in July 2018
43:11[music]
43:11narrowed the search, detectives
43:13conducted covert collection of discarded
43:15items and [music] obtained a
43:17confirmatory DNA match before making the
43:19November 1st, 2018 [music] arrest. On
43:22July 1st, 2019, Fred Lee Frampton Jr.
43:25pleaded guilty to first-degree murder.
43:27[music] On September 19th, 2019, he was
43:30sentenced to life imprisonment,
43:32suspended except for 55 years to serve.
43:35Prosecutors publicly stated [music] that
43:37a second suspected participant, Jonathan
43:39Ludwig, died of an overdose in March
43:41[music] 2018 before charges were filed.
43:44The case ultimately became one of
43:46Maryland's early examples [music] of
43:47forensic genetic genealogy contributing
43:49to a homicide conviction. An
43:51investigation built not on a single
43:53breakthrough, but on preserved [music]
43:54evidence, advancing technology, and a
43:57delayed but documented path through the
43:58courts. If you found this video
44:00informative, please consider leaving a
44:03like and subscribing to the channel as
44:04it really helps support our work and
44:06allows us to continue covering important
44:08stories like this one. Thank you.

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