Diane Downs: 1984 Interview (Remastered) — Transcript

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1. 0:01This is an Eyewitness News special
2. 0:03report.
3. 0:06In her own words, Elizabeth Diane Downs.
4. 0:12>> Good evening. I'm Ann Bradley.
5. 0:15What you're about to see is a
6. 0:16conversation with Elizabeth Diane Downs
7. 0:19in November. In the next 30 minutes,
8. 0:21we're going to try to give you the
9. 0:22inside story about what Elizabeth Diane
10. 0:25Downs is like in her own words. How she
11. 0:27feels about her life, her former
12. 0:29marriage, her children, and the events
13. 0:31that have happened over the past year.
14. 0:34You may be wondering why we haven't
15. 0:35aired this interview. Eyewitness News
16. 0:37waited until now [music] because of the
17. 0:39sensitivity of some of the things said,
18. 0:41and it does contain some graphic
19. 0:42language.
20. 0:44These comments represent Elizabeth Diane
21. 0:46Downs' thoughts and opinions and are not
22. 0:48necessarily shared by KEZI.
23. 0:51We've also been concerned about the
24. 0:52effect of this material on potential
25. 0:54jurors. Now that a jury has been picked,
26. 0:57we want to share some of the background
27. 0:59of the Downs case with you.
28. 1:01Let's start by taking a look back at
29. 1:02what happened May 19th, 1983.
30. 1:08A year ago this week, one of the most
31. 1:10horrendous crimes took place along the
32. 1:12stretch of Old Mohawk Road east of
33. 1:14Eugene. A 28-year-old woman and her
34. 1:17three small children were brutally shot.
35. 1:21Elizabeth Diane Downs says the family
36. 1:23was on a sightseeing trip when a
37. 1:25shaggy-haired stranger flagged her down
38. 1:27and demanded her car. She refused, and
39. 1:30the assailant shot Downs and her
40. 1:32children at close range with a .22
41. 1:34caliber gun.
42. 1:369-year-old Christie was shot first
43. 1:38through the hand into the chest as she
44. 1:39tried to protect herself.
45. 1:413-year-old Danny was shot in the back
46. 1:43and is now paralyzed from the waist
47. 1:45down.
48. 1:467-year-old Cheryl was shot twice from
49. 1:48behind and died on the way to the
50. 1:50hospital. Police searched the brush and
51. 1:52nearby river looking for the murder
52. 1:54weapon.
53. 1:55>> [music]
54. 1:55>> The gun was never found, and neither was
55. 1:57the shaggy-haired stranger.
56. 1:59Police started suspecting Downs [music]
57. 2:01as the culprit. The prosecution claims
58. 2:03her obsessive love for an ex-boyfriend
59. 2:06in Arizona was her motive.
60. 2:08The state says Downs felt her children
61. 2:10were getting in the way and preventing a
62. 2:12romantic relationship with that former
63. 2:14boyfriend.
64. 2:15And strangely enough, even the people
65. 2:17who knew Downs best questioned her
66. 2:19account of the shootings on the night of
67. 2:21the murder.
68. 2:22Downs' father, [music] Wes Frederickson.
69. 2:24>> Was there ever a time
70. 2:27from the beginning when you first heard
71. 2:30that you had any doubts about her
72. 2:32innocence?
73. 2:33>> Was there a time when I had doubts? Yes,
74. 2:36there was. The first night, as a matter
75. 2:38of fact. I had doubts. I felt Well, I
76. 2:43sat and I sized up the situation and I
77. 2:45saw at one point that Diane
78. 2:50had been shot in the And everybody knows
79. 2:52her as Elizabeth, but Diane had been
80. 2:54shot in
81. 2:55left arm
82. 2:57and she's right-handed, and I made the
83. 2:58comment to the police department there
84. 3:00that night.
85. 3:01Uh
86. 3:01it looks to me like Diane did it because
87. 3:03the children had been shot in the chest
88. 3:06and Diane has only been shot in the arm.
89. 3:09And I I says, "It really looks like she
90. 3:11did it."
91. 3:12Uh
92. 3:13that's That really is the thing that
93. 3:15spurred them to go and check
94. 3:17to do the Q-tips Run the Q-tips around
95. 3:19her finger to check for the powder
96. 3:21residue and to also spray her hands to
97. 3:23see if she held a gun. So, it was a good
98. 3:25thing that I expressed that, and I'm a
99. 3:27very open person. If If I think that
100. 3:30somebody did something, I'm not about to
101. 3:31hesitate to say they didn't, you know.
102. 3:34I'll tell them that I think they did.
103. 3:36I'd say the same thing again if I
104. 3:37believed it. I've had plenty of
105. 3:39opportunity to follow, and and that's
106. 3:41one of the main reasons, I guess, for
107. 3:43peace of mind. I've I've followed
108. 3:45through, and I know that my daughter
109. 3:47didn't do it.
110. 3:48>> I have been through that night so many
111. 3:50times. I've even been through it with my
112. 3:51psychologist. It's very hard. It's very
113. 3:54tearful. There are a lot of memories
114. 3:56that
115. 3:58um
116. 4:00I don't know.
117. 4:02A lot of people when something traumatic
118. 4:03happens to them, they suppress
119. 4:05immediately.
120. 4:07I
121. 4:08kept those memories
122. 4:09because I knew that I was the only
123. 4:11person that was going to be able to tell
124. 4:12them what happened when we got to the
125. 4:13hospital.
126. 4:15And when I got there, the first thing I
127. 4:16said was call the doctors. Second thing
128. 4:18was the blood type. Third thing was call
129. 4:20the cops because they've got to they've
130. 4:22got to find them.
131. 4:24And so I had to remember as much as I
132. 4:26could remember.
133. 4:28When this man shot my daughter, my first
134. 4:30reaction was to snap back to my
135. 4:32childhood, to the pain that had happened
136. 4:35to me back then, my marriage, my
137. 4:37entrapment by society. This man was
138. 4:40bigger than me. He was stronger than me.
139. 4:41He had more power because he had a gun.
140. 4:43He was in control and I was not. And I
141. 4:47had there was nothing I could do. And
142. 4:48[music] I stood there and I looked at
143. 4:50Christie reaching.
144. 4:51And
145. 4:53the blood that just kept gushing out of
146. 4:55her mouth. And and
147. 4:58what do you do?
148. 4:59You just stand there trapped. [music]
149. 5:02And then and then the gun kept firing
150. 5:05and firing and firing. And it it made It
151. 5:07was monotonous. It just kept going. It
152. 5:10was like a slow motion picture.
153. 5:13And then he swung around towards me
154. 5:15[music] and I
155. 5:17And this is something that I did not
156. 5:18recall when I was explaining to the cops
157. 5:20because there it was it wasn't like a
158. 5:22movie when I was telling them. I was
159. 5:24telling them what happened, the
160. 5:25important details. He shot my kids. I
161. 5:27pushed him. I ran.
162. 5:28And when he swung around, he was
163. 5:31pointing when he swung around. It hit
164. 5:33the tips of my fingers. The gun hit the
165. 5:35tips of my fingers. And that snapped me
166. 5:36and I went
167. 5:37Wait a minute. I'm not trapped by
168. 5:39society. I don't care if he is bigger.
169. 5:42If I stand here and I say
170. 5:45Yeah, here. Take the keys. I mean,
171. 5:47there's nothing I can do. You win
172. 5:48because you have the gun. My kids are
173. 5:50going to die.
174. 5:52And I'm not going to let my kids die.
175. 5:54And so, instead of giving him the keys,
176. 5:56I feigned throwing the keys.
177. 6:00He did not take time to point the gun
178. 6:02and shoot me, obviously, because he
179. 6:03would have shot me the same way he did
180. 6:05the kids. When he was swinging in the
181. 6:07direction of the keys, firing the gun,
182. 6:10he hit my arm.
183. 6:12Everybody says, "You sure were lucky."
184. 6:15Well, I don't feel very lucky. I
185. 6:16couldn't tie my damn shoes for about 2
186. 6:19months. It is very painful. It is still
187. 6:21painful. I have a steel plate in my arm.
188. 6:23I will for a year and a half. The The
189. 6:26scar is going to be there forever. I'm
190. 6:28going to remember that night for the
191. 6:29rest of my life, whether I want to or
192. 6:30not. I don't think I was very lucky.
193. 6:32I think my kids were lucky. If I had
194. 6:35been shot the way they were, we all
195. 6:36would have died, except maybe Danny.
196. 6:39>> What haunts you the most about that
197. 6:41night?
198. 6:42>> What I see most is blood coming out of
199. 6:45Christie's mouth.
200. 6:46Because that's what I see.
201. 6:48Um I I can't see Danny, and I can't see
202. 6:51Sheryl. Sheryl was laying on the floor,
203. 6:53and driving to the hospital, I don't
204. 6:56know the sounds that were made at the
205. 6:58initial shooting, because I was on the
206. 7:00outside, and all I could hear
207. 7:03I can't hear anything but gunshots. And
208. 7:07I can I can see things, you know, I
209. 7:09That's it. Driving to the hospital, I
210. 7:11can smell blood.
211. 7:13I can not hear Sheryl. Sheryl's not
212. 7:15making a sound. Danny is just crying
213. 7:18real, real soft. So, so that sound stays
214. 7:20in my mind, and the fact that Christie's
215. 7:22choking, and just
216. 7:24and then I'm yelling at her. I'm
217. 7:25screaming at her to to roll over on her
218. 7:27face, because
219. 7:30I was trying to keep her from choking on
220. 7:31her blood, and it just didn't dawn on me
221. 7:33that she was shot in the chest, and that
222. 7:35the blood was coming from her chest, not
223. 7:37going down into her chest.
224. 7:38>> Yeah.
225. 7:38>> Dawn says her childhood and marriage
226. 7:40flashed before her the night of the
227. 7:42murder. Diane is the oldest of four
228. 7:44Frederickson children
229. 7:46and she says her childhood is a great
230. 7:48source of pain in her life.
231. 7:50How did your childhood affect you?
232. 7:53>> Everything that happens to you as a
233. 7:54child contributes to how you turn out as
234. 7:56an adult.
235. 7:57Um
236. 7:58to be honest, it made me a better person
237. 8:00because I know all the mistakes. I know
238. 8:02not what not to do to my kids. I know
239. 8:04what to avoid.
240. 8:06Uh one thing is to not be married.
241. 8:09And that may seem very harsh, but I
242. 8:11honestly don't believe that children
243. 8:13need fathers.
244. 8:15And they're nice to have around
245. 8:17sometimes
246. 8:18when they can do things to help you, but
247. 8:20when they are mentally abusive, when
248. 8:22they are harsh and the way my ex-husband
249. 8:25was,
250. 8:26they're more a deterrent to the children
251. 8:28than a help. And unless you can find a
252. 8:30good father,
253. 8:31there is no need for them.
254. 8:35>> Did your childhood affect your attitude
255. 8:37toward men?
256. 8:39>> That has a lot to do with it. That had a
257. 8:41lot to do with it for many, many, many
258. 8:43years. I hated men with a passion.
259. 8:47But uh yeah, I hated men for a long
260. 8:49time. That's why I met Steve. [music]
261. 8:51That's why
262. 8:53I married Steve because Steve did not
263. 8:55seem to be that way. Um Steve was always
264. 8:57on his best behavior. He does He does
265. 8:59the thing that most people do when
266. 9:00they're dating and that's put their best
267. 9:02foot forward. They're every You're nice.
268. 9:04They're punctual. They're everything
269. 9:06they're supposed to be. And then you
270. 9:08marry them and it's, "Hey Diane, can you
271. 9:09let yourself in? I have to run down and
272. 9:12look at a car."
273. 9:13>> Yeah.
274. 9:13>> That's what he did on our wedding day.
275. 9:15Actually, I found it out the day I got
276. 9:17married and then within the next 2
277. 9:19months after that, I found out that
278. 9:20Steve was exactly like my father.
279. 9:23But it took me 2 years, 3 years to
280. 9:26finally say, "I can't take it anymore.
281. 9:28He really, really is He's not going to
282. 9:29change." I I'm a person that believes
283. 9:31that everybody's going to change the for
284. 9:33the better given the right
285. 9:34circumstances. If you be a good wife, if
286. 9:36you don't nag, if you love them, if
287. 9:38you're always there when they need them,
288. 9:39if the food's always ready, if the house
289. 9:40is always clean, they're going to
290. 9:42change. He didn't change.
291. 9:44>> [music]
292. 9:44>> And that's why even though we were
293. 9:46married for 8 years, only three of it
294. 9:48was not tolerable. It wasn't tolerable,
295. 9:50but that was the only three that I
296. 9:52tried. After that, I quit because I
297. 9:54didn't want to be married anymore.
298. 9:55>> Diane says her marriage with Steve Downs
299. 9:58deteriorated when friction arose over an
300. 10:00unexpected pregnancy.
301. 10:02>> Okay, after I had Christie and after I
302. 10:04had Sheryl,
303. 10:06Steve had a vasectomy.
304. 10:08It didn't work. And he never went back
305. 10:12to get checked to see if it worked. He
306. 10:14just figured doctors know what they're
307. 10:16doing. It must have worked. So, after I
308. 10:19think it's you're supposed to wait 10
309. 10:21weeks, be on some kind of contraceptive
310. 10:23for 10 weeks, and then you're safe.
311. 10:24>> And then you check again.
312. 10:25>> supposed to check, yeah. He never went
313. 10:28back because he was just too busy, and
314. 10:29the doctor probably knew what he was
315. 10:30doing. Well, I got pregnant, and I knew
316. 10:32that I wasn't messing around with
317. 10:33anybody. And then if I was pregnant,
318. 10:36because I know what being pregnant feels
319. 10:38like, I know how I got that way. And I
320. 10:41told him about it, and he gave me heck.
321. 10:43Oh.
322. 10:44>> So, is Danny or is Danny not
323. 10:46>> That was the child that I aborted. Steve
324. 10:48put me through hell with that one, and I
325. 10:50had an abortion. Sheryl was colicky,
326. 10:52Steve was bitching. We I made Steve go
327. 10:55back to the doctor or shut up. Don't
328. 10:57accuse me until you know. The doctor
329. 10:58said, "Yeah, you are fertile. I guess I
330. 11:00goofed up. Come on in, and we'll go
331. 11:02ahead and do it again." Well, I was
332. 11:04pregnant. So, I was 20 years old, had
333. 11:06two kids, Sheryl was colicky, my husband
334. 11:08was a bastard. I'm sorry.
335. 11:11And I had an abortion. And it was
336. 11:15something that did not bother me for 2
337. 11:17years. And then I was at a fair in
338. 11:19Arizona.
339. 11:20I walked past a [music] Right to Life
340. 11:22booth, and they told me at the time that
341. 11:24I aborted that I was 6 weeks. And I
342. 11:26figured 6 weeks, that is a condition.
343. 11:28You are not pregnant, that is a
344. 11:30condition. It's a a little ball of
345. 11:32slime, you know, no big deal. It's a
346. 11:34fetus is slime, I figured. I saw a
347. 11:366-week fetus.
348. 11:38>> [music]
349. 11:38>> That baby had arms, legs, fingers, toes,
350. 11:41a head, eyes. That was a baby. It was a
351. 11:43human being and I killed it. And [music]
352. 11:46I felt so horrible about it that I had
353. 11:49killed somebody like that. I didn't kill
354. 11:52it myself, but I hired a doctor to do
355. 11:54it. And
356. 11:56And so I asked my husband to have his
357. 11:58vasectomy reversed.
358. 12:00He refused. I asked him for a year. He
359. 12:03kept saying no. I said, "Fine. I will
360. 12:05find a suitable donor." I watched people
361. 12:08I worked with. I picked somebody that
362. 12:09was attractive, [music] that was
363. 12:10healthy, that was not abusive of drugs
364. 12:12and alcohol and such.
365. 12:14Was strong, you know, bone structure,
366. 12:16the whole bit. A good specimen. It was
367. 12:19really clinical. It was really terrible.
368. 12:21And
369. 12:22I [clears throat] seduced him. And I
370. 12:24know my cycle and it only took once and
371. 12:27I got pregnant. I went home and about a
372. 12:29week later I told Steve I was pregnant.
373. 12:31He goes, "How do you know?" I says,
374. 12:32"Well, I know my cycle. I know I'm
375. 12:33pregnant." And he was really upset. For
376. 12:36that whole 9 months he put me [music]
377. 12:37through hell. Every day, every night, it
378. 12:40was terrible. Just railed on me
379. 12:42constantly. Told me to get an abortion.
380. 12:45The whole bit.
381. 12:46And then after the baby was born,
382. 12:48he told me, "If you have a girl baby, I
383. 12:51might let you stay around. But if you
384. 12:54have a boy, I'm kicking you both out on
385. 12:56your butts and you're going to take
386. 12:57those two with you also. Cuz how do I
387. 12:59know they're mine?" That [music] kind of
388. 13:01attitude. Well, I lived with that for 9
389. 13:04months.
390. 13:06Then well,
391. 13:07when Danny was born,
392. 13:09Steve cuz okay, the reason it had to be
393. 13:11a girl was because Christie was supposed
394. 13:12to be a boy. I was so cruel and mean I
395. 13:15had a girl and Steve [music] just
396. 13:16couldn't stand it. Got one more chance,
397. 13:18Diane. Cheryl better be a boy. Well,
398. 13:20Cheryl turned out being a girl. He came
399. 13:22into the recovery room. He goes, "Well,
400. 13:24where is he?" I said, "He's a she." He
401. 13:25says, "How could you do that? You know,
402. 13:27we're not having any more kids." Crazy,
403. 13:29flipped out. [music]
404. 13:31So, if I was going to have another one,
405. 13:33I better darn sure have a girl. Well,
406. 13:35when Danny was born, he was a boy, and
407. 13:38my first thought was, "I'm dead. He's
408. 13:40dead. What's he going to do to that
409. 13:42baby?" And [music] then I didn't care. I
410. 13:43mean, that was my baby. That was
411. 13:46supposedly the baby that was going to
412. 13:47replace the one that I'd aborted.
413. 13:48[music]
414. 13:49And as soon as I looked at Danny, I
415. 13:50said, "You can't. That's That's a boy
416. 13:53baby. That's" And I just knew that the
417. 13:55baby I'd aborted was a girl. I'd named
418. 13:56her Carrie [music] and everything. It's
419. 13:58just a different human being altogether,
420. 14:00you know.
421. 14:01A whole lot of emotion on that delivery
422. 14:02table. And Steve standing there right
423. 14:04beside me looking at me like, "You
424. 14:06witch. How could you do this? You're
425. 14:08out." You know, and Dr. George hand
426. 14:11handed Daniel to Steve. And from that
427. 14:13point on, Steve spent the rest of the
428. 14:16the past 4 years trying to prove to
429. 14:19people that he was not biased and not
430. 14:22prejudiced, thereby becoming biased and
431. 14:24prejudiced.
432. 14:27>> We've talked to Steve Downs in the past
433. 14:29about some of these events. We attempted
434. 14:31to contact him again, but his attorney
435. 14:33wouldn't allow him to comment because of
436. 14:35the trial. Downs knew a lengthy murder
437. 14:38trial would make her private life
438. 14:40[music] public territory.
439. 14:42She's very frank about being a surrogate
440. 14:44mother. She ran a surrogate program in
441. 14:46Arizona and gave birth to another
442. 14:48couple's child.
443. 14:50Diane lost visitation rights to her own
444. 14:52two surviving children after the murder.
445. 14:54She was found guilty of contempt of
446. 14:56court for seeing them in a secret visit
447. 14:58set up by her ex-husband, Steve.
448. 15:01Police found out about the visit in a
449. 15:02letter Downs wrote to her former
450. 15:04boyfriend, Robert Knickerbocker, known
451. 15:06as Nick in Arizona.
452. 15:08>> You fought for Steve to get custody of
453. 15:10the kids, and then you wrote a letter to
454. 15:11your former boyfriend telling him that
455. 15:13Steve was an unfit father for your
456. 15:15children. A lot of people won't
457. 15:17understand that, Diane.
458. 15:18>> But Steve is different than most [music]
459. 15:20people. He can
460. 15:23Steve pointed an empty gun at my head at
461. 15:25one time and pulled the trigger. Do you
462. 15:27know why?
463. 15:28He wanted me to marry him.
464. 15:30That is crazy.
465. 15:33CSD, I believe, is very careful in
466. 15:36picking out the people that care for a
467. 15:37child that they think has been abused.
468. 15:39And right now, they believe that Christy
469. 15:41has been one of [music] the most abused
470. 15:42children in the world. Granted, she was
471. 15:44shot, but before that, she was never
472. 15:46abused. But they believe [music] that
473. 15:48that's probably true. And so, they're
474. 15:50going to put Christy in a very, very
475. 15:51good place. And so, I know that
476. 15:53Christy's in a good home.
477. 15:55And so, I just decided that it was
478. 15:57better that Christy be in a safe and a
479. 16:00state and mentally stable environment,
480. 16:03rather than to be with Steve. And
481. 16:06if I had walked up to Susan Staffel and
482. 16:09said, "Please, don't let them go to
483. 16:11Arizona." Or if I had called Fredrick
484. 16:13and asked the same thing,
485. 16:15they would have sent the kids, or they
486. 16:16would
487. 16:17Granted, they could not send the kids.
488. 16:18They make suggestions to the court as to
489. 16:20what happens to the kids.
490. 16:22And they would have suggested to the
491. 16:23court that
492. 16:25the kids go merely because I don't want
493. 16:27them to. That means Steve and I had a
494. 16:28falling out. What better place could
495. 16:30they be safe? Not realizing that they
496. 16:31aren't safe from Steve, even.
497. 16:34And emotionally. And so, I couldn't just
498. 16:38count on them to cooperate with me. They
499. 16:40haven't so far. I couldn't expect them
500. 16:41to now.
501. 16:43And so, I had to find another way to
502. 16:45tell them. And I know that my
503. 16:46ex-boyfriend was a fink.
504. 16:48He was taping for the cops. He admitted
505. 16:50that he was everything every
506. 16:52conversation that I had with him on the
507. 16:53phone was taped and sent immediately to
508. 16:55the DA's office.
509. 16:56And I knew that that letter, if I sent
510. 16:58it to him and he read it, would in fact
511. 17:00get to the DA's office.
512. 17:03And but all the other letters that I'd
513. 17:05been sending as of late were being
514. 17:06returned. And so, I knew that I had to
515. 17:09do something to make that letter so
516. 17:11enticing that he would open it.
517. 17:15>> Downstairs, she felt trapped in her
518. 17:17marriage with Steve and hoped a divorce
519. 17:19would solve their problems.
520. 17:21>> Was there ever a time when during that
521. 17:24that you thought about taking your own
522. 17:25life and
523. 17:26>> Oh, yeah.
524. 17:27>> went into the bathroom with the gun and
525. 17:29shot it. So, that is indeed
526. 17:31>> That is true. Only no, it it it's not
527. 17:35Uh that's a long one, too. It takes many
528. 17:37many years of being mentally harassed,
529. 17:40pushed into a corner. You can't go
530. 17:42anywhere. You're trapped. It comes It It
531. 17:45It stems from my childhood [music] of
532. 17:46being trapped. You know that you can't
533. 17:49go away. You can't go someplace else.
534. 17:50[music]
535. 17:51There's no place to escape to because
536. 17:53they'll take They'll find you. They'll
537. 17:55bring you back. You'll be punished
538. 17:56somehow.
539. 17:58Steve was the same type of person. He
540. 18:01was the kind of person that
541. 18:03And I At night time especially was his
542. 18:06best time for fighting and he would just
543. 18:07rail on me. Just fight and fight and
544. 18:09fight and I could There was no way to
545. 18:11escape. No way at all. Well, after I got
546. 18:13my divorce, I figured I was free of
547. 18:14that. And I wasn't. Steve would still
548. 18:16come to my house and still do the same
549. 18:18thing and this was 2 years after our
550. 18:20divorce and he came to my house and he I
551. 18:25had taken a gun. He had a handgun. It
552. 18:27was the handgun that he had put to my
553. 18:29head unloaded and fired and I took it
554. 18:32from him. I swiped it from him and I hid
555. 18:34it in my house.
556. 18:35And
557. 18:37it was in my bedroom. He was doing it
558. 18:39again and he was getting very very
559. 18:40physical. Steve had ne- had just beat me
560. 18:43up 2 weeks before that. Beat me up
561. 18:45terribly. There was blood all over the
562. 18:47place. The The sheriff's [music]
563. 18:48department came out and made a report on
564. 18:51it and my nose was all bruised. My face
565. 18:54was bruised. My chest was bruised. He
566. 18:55had choked me. It was I was terrified of
567. 18:57him. He had never done that before. And
568. 18:59for all I knew, this is 2 weeks later,
569. 19:01he was going to do it again. And I ran
570. 19:03in the bathroom and Well, I ran in the
571. 19:05bedroom and slammed the door and he
572. 19:07was coming through the door anyway, so I
573. 19:09grabbed the gun and I ran in the
574. 19:10bathroom and locked the door.
575. 19:13And my first thought was, I'll never
576. 19:15escape from him. I will never ever get
577. 19:17away. I divorced him and that is isn't
578. 19:19even getting away from him.
579. 19:20It doesn't matter what I do. I'll never
580. 19:22get away from the insanity except just
581. 19:24to be oblivious to it. And I considered
582. 19:27shooting myself, but it was a .22
583. 19:29handgun and Steve had said, you can't
584. 19:31kill anybody with a .22.
585. 19:34Surprise. There's no way you could kill
586. 19:36somebody. You would hurt them badly. And
587. 19:38then I thought,
588. 19:40besides, my kids need me. I can't die.
589. 19:44Then I thought, maybe I should kill him.
590. 19:46And then I said, same gun, same
591. 19:47situation. I would hurt him. He would be
592. 19:50furious. Then I'm really going to be in
593. 19:52trouble. And so I said, what do I do?
594. 19:54How do I tell him I'm serious? How do I
595. 19:57get Yes, I fired it to scare the hell
596. 19:59out of him.
597. 20:00I wanted him to know that I was serious
598. 20:02enough that if he kept this up, if he
599. 20:05kept doing what he was doing to my mind,
600. 20:07someday perhaps that would be pointed at
601. 20:09a person. Not now, but someday.
602. 20:12And he just
603. 20:14I fired the gun. He went, "Oh my god!"
604. 20:17And he broke the door down.
605. 20:19And I sat there and I handed him the gun
606. 20:20and I [music] said, "Now do you believe
607. 20:22me?"
608. 20:23And he took the gun and he said, "Yeah."
609. 20:24And he left.
610. 20:26>> According to police reports, Steve Downs
611. 20:28and Robert Knickerbocker told
612. 20:30authorities Diane left Arizona with that
613. 20:32gun in the trunk of her car. The gun
614. 20:35hasn't been seen since.
615. 20:38Downs kept a diary. It was a form of
616. 20:40solace for her. Her journal entries took
617. 20:42the form of unmailed letters to Robert
618. 20:44Knickerbocker.
619. 20:46She wrote of her love for him and the
620. 20:47day-to-day events [music] that happened
621. 20:49before the murder.
622. 20:50But May 19th, the night of the
623. 20:52shootings, is blank except for the date
624. 20:54sketched at the top.
625. 20:56>> I don't even cry in front of my family.
626. 20:58And I can go to my room and I can write
627. 21:00in this diary, this record book,
628. 21:03some of my fears. And And it's really
629. 21:06even sketchy. I don't write in a lot of
630. 21:08detail. There are days when I'm
631. 21:09overwhelmed with with emotion and the
632. 21:11book will be rather emotional, but but
633. 21:13very [music] few days. It's just sitting
634. 21:15in front of the book and and writing
635. 21:17down little sentences and then being
636. 21:19able to cry over it and and feel
637. 21:21emotionally everything that that I don't
638. 21:23physically write down. And it's a very
639. 21:26good release. It's uh it's therapy in a
640. 21:28way. It's also a way of keeping a record
641. 21:31because in the beginning so many things
642. 21:32were said to me
643. 21:34that were denied later. It's so sad.
644. 21:37>> Have you ever thought of the fact that
645. 21:39your writing these things could be used
646. 21:41against you or in your favor at any
647. 21:43future time?
648. 21:44>> No, I didn't because I never thought the
649. 21:46book would be [music] made public.
650. 21:48>> Police seized that diary as evidence in
651. 21:51the case.
652. 21:52Downs is now expecting another child.
653. 21:55She says her pregnancy takes away the
654. 21:56feelings of loneliness in prison.
655. 21:59>> I got pregnant because I miss Christie
656. 22:02and I miss Danny and I miss Cheryl
657. 22:03[music] so much. I'm never going to see
658. 22:05Cheryl on Earth again.
659. 22:07And I just you can't replace children,
660. 22:11but you can replace the effect that they
661. 22:12give you. And they give me love. They
662. 22:15give me satisfaction. They give me
663. 22:16stability. They give me a reason to live
664. 22:18and a reason to be happy and and that's
665. 22:20gone. They took it from me. But children
666. 22:23are so easy to conceive.
667. 22:26>> Obviously everyone is curious who the
668. 22:28father is and I know you probably don't
669. 22:29want to talk about that. Does the father
670. 22:31know who he is?
671. 22:33>> Yeah, and that's why I won't talk about
672. 22:34it because he feels as privately about
673. 22:36this child as I do.
674. 22:38>> What would you do given this current
675. 22:40situation if they said they took if they
676. 22:43took away your kids and then they went
677. 22:45one step further and said, "We think
678. 22:46you're an unfit mother."
679. 22:47>> We're going to take away this one? I
680. 22:49don't know how they're going to do it.
681. 22:51What if the I I'd like to see them try
682. 22:54to take this baby from me and
683. 22:57how?
684. 22:58How could they do it? They're going to
685. 22:59have to wait a long time to do it.
686. 23:01Hopefully this thing will be cleared up
687. 23:02by then.
688. 23:03I don't know that they could do this,
689. 23:05take it away after it's born. I don't
690. 23:08know. I've never even talked to my
691. 23:09attorney about it because it seems so
692. 23:12Let's put it the way the DA says, it's
693. 23:14laughable.
694. 23:16>> Downstairs, her parents were shocked
695. 23:18when they found out she was pregnant
696. 23:19again. [music]
697. 23:20>> My parents are the kind of people that
698. 23:22wish you would do everything by the book
699. 23:24in the order that it's
700. 23:26prewritten. You get married [music]
701. 23:28before you have a baby.
702. 23:30And being married is not and never
703. 23:33[music] has been I take it back. When I
704. 23:35was young, when I was 16, 17, 18, being
705. 23:37married was the most important thing in
706. 23:39the world to me. And I think it's
707. 23:40because I was raised that way. Most
708. 23:41girls are.
709. 23:43But since that time, since my divorce,
710. 23:44being married has been an iffy thing. I
711. 23:47can do it if I want, I don't have to if
712. 23:49I don't want it. And it's never been
713. 23:51uppermost in my mind. My children are,
714. 23:53my children always have been, and having
715. 23:55children is, [music] I think being a
716. 23:57mother is the most wonderful job that
717. 24:00that any woman could perform.
718. 24:03I die every day. When I go to bed, I cry
719. 24:06at night. Even now, I still cry. I dream
720. 24:08about Cheryl. I dream about Cheryl
721. 24:10reaching out with me with her arms and
722. 24:12always giving me a kiss and saying, "I
723. 24:14love you. I miss you. Where have [music]
724. 24:15you been?" It's almost as if she really
725. 24:17is coming back and saying, "How come
726. 24:20you're not here with me?"
727. 24:23One time, it was right after Christie
728. 24:24went to the foster home, I dreamed that
729. 24:26Cheryl came to me. Well, Christie came
730. 24:27[music] to me and I said, "Christie, how
731. 24:29did you find me?" And she said, "Cheryl
732. 24:32brought me." And Cheryl came walking out
733. 24:33of the shadows and there was blood on
734. 24:35her shirt and I just Yeah, it was really
735. 24:37spooky and I said,
736. 24:39"Cheryl, I thought you were dead." She
737. 24:40goes, "No, I was faking it. I knew they
738. 24:42were going to take Christie away and she
739. 24:43wouldn't be able to find you, so I
740. 24:44brought you." And then Cheryl showed us
741. 24:46how to sneak Danny out of the hospital
742. 24:48and everything. It was It was a
743. 24:49wonderful dream. It was wonderful cuz we
744. 24:51were We were the four musketeers and we
745. 24:53were together again and and But anyway,
746. 24:55my dad knows how much I was grieving for
747. 24:57the kids and
748. 24:58so he couldn't very well condemn the
749. 25:00fact that I was having a child because
750. 25:01it's like I said, it's it's not a a full
751. 25:04replacement. You can never replace a
752. 25:06child. I tried to do that with Danny.
753. 25:08Danny was a replacement for a child that
754. 25:10I had aborted many many years ago when I
755. 25:13was quite young and foolish and
756. 25:15and I found at that time when when Danny
757. 25:17was born that he is a person in himself.
758. 25:19You you cannot replace a child with a
759. 25:21child. They're individuals and this
760. 25:23child is not to replace Cheryl. Never.
761. 25:25Cheryl's always going to be with me. How
762. 25:27could I replace her? She's still here.
763. 25:29But it's somebody to keep me company
764. 25:32until Chris and Danny come home.
765. 25:34Somebody that I can love and feel and
766. 25:36talk to. It's not like you're talking to
767. 25:38yourself anymore. There is somebody
768. 25:40there and
769. 25:41and that's all this is. And so my dad
770. 25:43couldn't really condemn it even though
771. 25:44he doesn't condone it.
772. 25:46>> Over the 9 months that passed without an
773. 25:48arrest in this case, Downs lived with
774. 25:50her parents in Springfield.
775. 25:52Police reports claim Downs has changed
776. 25:54her story about what happened the night
777. 25:56of the shootings. They say she gave
778. 25:58several different stories about the man
779. 26:00who shot them when talking to her former
780. 26:02husband or ex-boyfriend.
781. 26:04Downs claimed afterward that two men
782. 26:06were there the night of the murder and
783. 26:08they knew her by name.
784. 26:10We asked her about those allegations
785. 26:11before those police reports [music]
786. 26:13became public.
787. 26:14>> Did you remember that there was more
788. 26:16than one person there that night? I mean
789. 26:18long after?
790. 26:19>> No.
791. 26:21That is another thing that
792. 26:23I suppose if you listen to the different
793. 26:25[music] tapes that were made, tapes by
794. 26:26my ex-boyfriend, tapes by the sheriff's
795. 26:28department, you would understand a
796. 26:30psychological pattern that was being
797. 26:32built up. It's something that I did not
798. 26:34even understand at the time because
799. 26:35first of all, I trusted the cops.
800. 26:36[music]
801. 26:37And even though I didn't trust the cops,
802. 26:39I was forced into a position of saying
803. 26:41they're the only people that really can
804. 26:42help me. They're the only people that
805. 26:44will try to find the person that did
806. 26:45this. And you're trapped in a position
807. 26:48of having to trust somebody even though
808. 26:49you don't know if you should trust
809. 26:50somebody.
810. 26:52>> Downs also says the children were shot
811. 26:54inside the car, but police reports claim
812. 26:56high-velocity blood spatter were found
813. 26:59on the outside of the car on the
814. 27:01passenger side.
815. 27:03The police found blood on the outside of
816. 27:05the car. Could one of the children,
817. 27:07perhaps Cheryl, have fallen out of the
818. 27:09car on the passenger side?
819. 27:11>> The DA has come up with this idea that
820. 27:13somebody was shot on the outside of the
821. 27:15car on the passenger side of the car. I
822. 27:18was on the driver side of the car when I
823. 27:20was shot. And that's why it was so
824. 27:23I'm going It was planted and and it just
825. 27:26seemed I mean, it can't be real because
826. 27:28they talk about blood spatter. And when
827. 27:30they say spatter, I think something
828. 27:32being shot out like the blood spatter in
829. 27:34the car, [music] you know, it was so
830. 27:36uniform. It was so regular. Same-size
831. 27:39droplets spread evenly in a pattern. And
832. 27:42when they say spatter, that's what I
833. 27:43thought of. And
834. 27:45we saw pictures of this so-called
835. 27:47spatter.
836. 27:49>> It's drops. When they took the kids,
837. 27:51they took Kristen Share out of the
838. 27:53driver side of the car.
839. 27:55And it's blood droplets. It's when they
840. 27:57picked the kids up [music] and carried
841. 27:59them over the threshold, there is blood
842. 28:01dripping down the side of the car.
843. 28:03>> But May 19th is an evening that will not
844. 28:05be forgotten by the survivors.
845. 28:08>> But the the thing that really really
846. 28:09haunts me the most is not even the sight
847. 28:11and the sound. I mean, the the sound and
848. 28:13the smell are fading.
849. 28:15But at night when I close my eyes, I can
850. 28:16see Christie reaching her hand out to me
851. 28:18while I'm driving.
852. 28:20And the blood just keep coming out of
853. 28:22her mouth. And that
854. 28:24maybe it'll fade too with time, but I I
855. 28:25don't think so. That haunts me the most.
856. 28:35>> Elizabeth Diane Downs is lodged [music]
857. 28:36in the Lane County Jail. She's charged
858. 28:39with murdering Cheryl Downs and
859. 28:41attempting to murder Christie and Danny
860. 28:43Downs.
861. 28:45>> Jim was talking in court about how Danny
862. 28:47points a gun at a family portrait and
863. 28:49shoots at people.
864. 28:51You did not read the part where it says
865. 28:53that Danny is shooting Mommy and Cheryl.
866. 28:55Simple to understand. He doesn't shoot
867. 28:57Christy cuz Christy's there with him. He
868. 28:59shoots Cheryl because everybody's told
869. 29:01him that Cheryl's dead. Therefore, if
870. 29:03Mommy doesn't come around, she must be
871. 29:05dead, too. And so he's shooting them
872. 29:07because he was shot, Christy was shot,
873. 29:09Cheryl was shot, Mommy was shot. They're
874. 29:10dead. It's It's a terrible what's
875. 29:13happening to Danny terrifies me because
876. 29:16maybe he's angry at Most children get
877. 29:19angry at their parents if their parents
878. 29:20die when they're young, and they hate
879. 29:22them for it, and it takes many, many
880. 29:23years to come out of it. And Danny's
881. 29:25probably very angry at Cheryl for
882. 29:26deserting him because, like I said, we
883. 29:28were a close family. He could depend on
884. 29:30Cheryl to [music] do anything. Danny
885. 29:31used to come running down the hall at
886. 29:33night and climb into bed and say and
887. 29:34announce, "I'm sleeping with you tonight
888. 29:36because my room's too dark."
889. 29:38And now he can't do that. He can't run
890. 29:40down the hall at all. He's trapped.