Death Row Exonerees Sunny Jacobs and Peter Pringle — Transcript

Full transcript

1. 0:02okay i think we are now live ready first
2. 0:05session with our special uh guest
3. 0:10hopefully
4. 0:11um so
5. 0:13i think we've got some people joining hi
6. 0:16jess big shout out to jesse thank you so
7. 0:18much for all the work today jess she's
8. 0:20really been behind a lot of the
9. 0:22postings and everything so
10. 0:24um thanks for that
11. 0:28got some more people hi everybody
12. 0:30come on in
13. 0:33just waiting for my special guest to
14. 0:34arrive
15. 0:38hi jess
16. 0:43okay i know it's a bit boring me
17. 0:46so yeah big shout out to the team today
18. 0:48team has done an amazing job everyone
19. 0:51behind the scenes i know that some of
20. 0:53the um
21. 0:54like pre-recorded videos have been a
22. 0:56little bit slow getting up onto the
23. 0:58platform but hopefully um sometime this
24. 1:02this evening you'll be able to see
25. 1:03everything
26. 1:05all the live sessions that we've done
27. 1:07today will be available on the instagram
28. 1:10tv on this channel
29. 1:12and so you should be able to catch up
30. 1:15with them i know that i've actually
31. 1:16missed a few so i'm looking forward to
32. 1:18catching up them as well
33. 1:21so hang on
34. 1:23sonny's done it the other way around
35. 1:24she's hold on a second
36. 1:27and
37. 1:29die uh okay
38. 1:33hold on a second i've got
39. 1:36she's gone live
40. 1:45hello
41. 2:03i'm just trying to get her done so
42. 2:06sonny's gone live on her own channel ah
43. 2:08there we are hi sunny
44. 2:10so sunny if you can um just request to
45. 2:13um join
46. 2:15yes here we go
47. 2:19there we
48. 2:20go so hopefully
49. 2:24uh
50. 2:25just sunny would be joining us now
51. 2:31oh
52. 2:32okay this is the beauty of
53. 2:37[Music]
54. 2:42hello hello hello hi guys so for those
55. 2:47who have
56. 2:48um been living under a rock and don't
57. 2:50know who you are
58. 2:51[Laughter]
59. 2:55they might have been in peterborough
60. 2:58i i don't know i don't know
61. 2:59[Laughter]
62. 3:02sonny peter oh um have been involved
63. 3:04with amicus for um as long as i've been
64. 3:07with amicus so that's quite a long time
65. 3:12i think so sure are we patrons i think
66. 3:14we're patrons
67. 3:16yes you are patrons you think you are
68. 3:21i think remember that we were made
69. 3:23patrons
70. 3:24hi everybody
71. 3:26i don't know how to i can't text and do
72. 3:28this i'm just saying hi to all the
73. 3:30people you can speak they can hear you
74. 3:33um yeah and so anyone you see that you
75. 3:36want to shout out you can yeah lots of
76. 3:38people that have given you some love so
77. 3:40throughout today actually
78. 3:41your names have been mentioned in many
79. 3:44of the live sessions that we've had
80. 3:45today
81. 3:47it's wonderful that you could join us
82. 3:48this evening um
83. 3:50from uh sunny
84. 3:52island
85. 3:54well thank you for inviting us it is so
86. 3:56hot it's unbelievable 30 degrees yeah
87. 4:00we're all melting we're all melting i
88. 4:02can't believe how composed everyone's
89. 4:03looking that's right that's right
90. 4:06if you know we do our sweat for justice
91. 4:08we were just saying that um
92. 4:10it's like this is gives a new meaning to
93. 4:12sweating for justice here yeah yeah yeah
94. 4:16we'll all just sit in the gardens and do
95. 4:18instagram lives to sweat faster i really
96. 4:21enjoyed the morning
97. 4:23session
98. 4:24watching um jane officer
99. 4:27that was really nice and listening to
100. 4:29her story from her own
101. 4:31uh perspective it was really nice
102. 4:34i i like that absolutely yeah i know i
103. 4:37talk about jane's story all the time but
104. 4:39it's great to have her
105. 4:42it gives it gives uh it gives
106. 4:45strength to the idea
107. 4:47that one person can change things
108. 4:50one person can do something that will
109. 4:52cause great change and she has done
110. 4:56with amicus and you know and the people
111. 4:58that amateurs have helped and and
112. 5:01impressed and who work with amateurs and
113. 5:03support amethyst
114. 5:05yeah
115. 5:06everybody who gets involved
116. 5:09is is a jane
117. 5:12yeah
118. 5:14i think you've coined a new phrase yeah
119. 5:18um
120. 5:19right now i i don't know how it is um uh
121. 5:22for people to the volunteers in the u.s
122. 5:24i just know it is so hot over there we
123. 5:28think it's hot here but it's even hotter
124. 5:30there
125. 5:31it's unbelievable
126. 5:33and i was actually i was just thinking
127. 5:35about um all of the people not only on
128. 5:38death row but who are
129. 5:41incarcerated with no air conditioning in
130. 5:43full plus degrees heat it's it's torture
131. 5:48unbelievable um yeah i was actually i
132. 5:51was talking with um
133. 5:54some of the um
134. 5:55we have exoneree groups that that we we
135. 5:58chat together you know to kind of give
136. 6:00each other um support and community and
137. 6:04i was saying oh july 4th what is what
138. 6:07was your favorite food treat on the
139. 6:09holidays you know because on the
140. 6:11holidays in prison they do give you some
141. 6:14sort of little treat um corn on the cob
142. 6:16was a big one
143. 6:17and
144. 6:18yeah
145. 6:19and well
146. 6:20and then um
147. 6:22then people started talking about what
148. 6:24did you do in the heat
149. 6:26and um
150. 6:28various um
151. 6:30innovations on the same theme mainly you
152. 6:33would get on the floor
153. 6:35and if you were in your own cell
154. 6:38you like death row you would um flood
155. 6:41the floor
156. 6:43with water and then lay in on the wet
157. 6:46floor
158. 6:47and put wet towels on you
159. 6:49and lay
160. 6:51yeah right by the door the crack in the
161. 6:53door so that maybe some air would come
162. 6:57in and cool you down
163. 6:59that's what you'd have to do yeah so i
164. 7:02didn't actually properly introduce you
165. 7:03guys so i
166. 7:05didn't quite get that
167. 7:06um
168. 7:07so not only are they amazing patrons and
169. 7:09um supporters of amicus and have been
170. 7:12amazing and generous supporters over the
171. 7:14years and also being a great friend of
172. 7:18mine as well and personal support for me
173. 7:20and my children so thank you
174. 7:22for the hope on a personal level um
175. 7:25but also
176. 7:27both peter and
177. 7:29spent long time a long time both of them
178. 7:32on
179. 7:33death low
180. 7:36respectively in ireland and um
181. 7:39for sunny in florida
182. 7:42and
183. 7:43are now um
184. 7:45both innocent as well
185. 7:47um and are now obviously free and living
186. 7:50together in ireland um
187. 7:54and i also i also always joke that um
188. 7:57sunny and peter's is our favorite love
189. 7:59story as well
190. 8:02they found each other it's mine too
191. 8:05it's our favorite love story as well
192. 8:09johnny just can you just maybe we could
193. 8:11tell that story actually because that's
194. 8:14sort of like often that comes at the end
195. 8:16okay yeah that'd be a change from all
196. 8:18that looks like
197. 8:19i'm doing stuff but you know we
198. 8:22especially during this pandemic time um
199. 8:26realized even more how blessed we really
200. 8:29are you know because
201. 8:31people who are on their own during this
202. 8:33time it's been very hard and we were
203. 8:36just so amazed that um
204. 8:39because of the
205. 8:40the
206. 8:41uh isolation
207. 8:43and the lockdowns and the quarantines
208. 8:45that our
209. 8:46experience being
210. 8:48locked up
211. 8:50had beca became relevant to like the
212. 8:52rest of the world it was just so amazing
213. 8:56it was almost like we've been trained
214. 8:58for this
215. 8:59and so and this is actually luxury for
216. 9:02us
217. 9:03because we're together and we like being
218. 9:05together with each other and we live in
219. 9:08a very beautiful place and we have our
220. 9:10animals about
221. 9:11uh we have our food and we have our food
222. 9:13we grow some of our own food and
223. 9:16uh yeah we're very happy
224. 9:18and one of the happiest things i have to
225. 9:20say about the pandemic for me personally
226. 9:23is we don't have to travel
227. 9:27which is partly what we make you do as
228. 9:29well
229. 9:32traveling to london it's not a big deal
230. 9:34but you know when when the pandemic
231. 9:37started
232. 9:39we cancelled the following flights
233. 9:42we canceled the flight to um
234. 9:44glasgow
235. 9:46to belgium
236. 9:47to london
237. 9:49to florida
238. 9:51to vancouver
239. 9:53and to new york
240. 9:55yes
241. 9:57yeah already booked it had to be
242. 9:58cancelled because we couldn't travel
243. 10:00but i i must um add that i i believe the
244. 10:04antidote
245. 10:06to
246. 10:10oh i think we might have pandemic
247. 10:14is gratitude
248. 10:16and hope we have hope that we'll see the
249. 10:19end of it because we have the
250. 10:21vaccinations that more and more people
251. 10:23are realizing that we really
252. 10:25have to take
253. 10:26and um
254. 10:28and and gratitude
255. 10:30uh that um we
256. 10:32for us you know that we have so much and
257. 10:35and if you look around you even if
258. 10:36you're on your own even even people um
259. 10:40that are on death row we give them hope
260. 10:43and we give and they have something to
261. 10:45be grateful for that there are
262. 10:47organizations like amicus and people who
263. 10:49are willing to put their life on hold to
264. 10:52volunteer and go and help the lawyers
265. 10:54who are so overwhelmed and so anything
266. 10:57that gives hope and gratitude is really
267. 10:59the solution even even if it turns out
268. 11:02that you don't end up saving their life
269. 11:05knowing that someone cared enough to do
270. 11:08that someone cared and gave them hope
271. 11:11that that that's big that's huge yeah
272. 11:15so
273. 11:16um i think that um in a way amicus is
274. 11:20the antidote to
275. 11:22the pandemic
276. 11:25i tell you i tell you another thing
277. 11:26about
278. 11:27that's helped us through as well is
279. 11:29we've done a couple of sessions with
280. 11:31sunny
281. 11:32um because um multi-talented
282. 11:35um
283. 11:36sunny is also a yoga teacher
284. 11:39and she's also led us through some
285. 11:41meditation sessions as well
286. 11:43and i'm really yoga teacher and also
287. 11:45everything else and everything else
288. 11:48everything else and yoga i'm i'm yoga
289. 11:51and everything else that comes first
290. 11:53yeah
291. 11:54um so so um it has been i don't know
292. 11:58we've been talking a lot about um
293. 12:00[Music]
294. 12:02you know self-care and
295. 12:04um
296. 12:06isolation and dealing with isolation as
297. 12:08well and and i think your sessions have
298. 12:11been amazing and we want to continue
299. 12:13thank you i'd love to learn
300. 12:15but i do also i remember coming to visit
301. 12:18you in ireland with hannah gorman who
302. 12:20was on the on insta live earlier on with
303. 12:23me um and um ruth armstrong from
304. 12:27cambridge university
305. 12:29oh yeah we we did a um we did a yoga
306. 12:33session we we took your yoga class in
307. 12:35wool island
308. 12:39a death penalty community yoga class
309. 12:43um over an island in sunny which was um
310. 12:47reflecting on it was quite surreal but
311. 12:50it felt like the most natural normal
312. 12:52thing to do at the time
313. 12:54[Laughter]
314. 12:56well it was of course it it is natural
315. 12:59well thank you that was very nice i i
316. 13:02love my we haven't been able to meet
317. 13:04actually for two years i know so we do
318. 13:07normally meet more frequently don't we
319. 13:09and
320. 13:10um it's been
321. 13:11yeah it's been because it the pandemic
322. 13:13kind of struck when you were just about
323. 13:15to come over and we we yours was one of
324. 13:17actually you did we i cancelled your
325. 13:20flight to london as well so you did have
326. 13:22a flight
327. 13:23as well so there's that as well
328. 13:26yeah yeah that was in the market but um
329. 13:29things are starting to open up a little
330. 13:30bit more
331. 13:32um people are traveling now
332. 13:36yeah we are still doing training online
333. 13:38for the moment though
334. 13:40yeah well that's wise
335. 13:42and that that's possible you know um and
336. 13:45a very interesting how lawyers
337. 13:49how lawyers have been able to uh meet
338. 13:52with their clients
339. 13:54because they can't go in person either
340. 13:57and that's been a big adjustment have
341. 13:58you talked to any lawyers of the have
342. 14:01been
343. 14:02yes how have they suggested
344. 14:04it's been really it's been really tough
345. 14:06obviously um
346. 14:08to meet with clients and people have
347. 14:09really struggled
348. 14:11um
349. 14:13and and also obviously there's no
350. 14:15it's impossible to do investigation
351. 14:18interview witnesses and things like that
352. 14:20um over the past year but yet trials are
353. 14:23pushing on ahead so we're seeing death
354. 14:26penalty trials coming through now at
355. 14:28some speed um
356. 14:30and
357. 14:32so the courts are haven't stopped
358. 14:34churning and working away at pushing
359. 14:37through the cases but at the same time
360. 14:39we're not able or allowed to prepare for
361. 14:42them properly so right and that would be
362. 14:45grounds i believe for appeal later on
363. 14:48you know anybody who's trial yeah you
364. 14:50know what we hope so but
365. 14:54it might not they might not allow that
366. 14:56kind of we we'll see anyway anyway we'll
367. 14:59see but let's get back to you guys let's
368. 15:01get right to you guys
369. 15:03so um
370. 15:04tell about our love story peter yeah
371. 15:07let's do that
372. 15:09go ahead
373. 15:09from how we met yeah
374. 15:12okay
375. 15:14i'm going to start actually i was
376. 15:16marching through texas
377. 15:18and
378. 15:19and you know with uh the journey of hope
379. 15:22from violence to healing
380. 15:24and the murder victims families for
381. 15:26reconciliation
382. 15:28and um i
383. 15:30um sister helen was scheduled to do a
384. 15:33talk in the church it was george bush's
385. 15:35church and but
386. 15:37i don't remember why but she wasn't able
387. 15:39to make it it's probably flights or
388. 15:42something so i was asked to speak
389. 15:44so that i'm not usually nervous about
390. 15:47speaking but a little nervous trying to
391. 15:49fill those shoes
392. 15:51and but then i realized i didn't really
393. 15:53have to fill her shoes i just hadn't
394. 15:54filmed my own so i was all right but um
395. 15:57uh and then there were some people from
396. 16:00um ireland that were part of amnesty
397. 16:02international that were there and after
398. 16:05my talk they invited me to go to ireland
399. 16:08um to their agm
400. 16:11well i was so excited because i hadn't
401. 16:13really been you know able to travel much
402. 16:15you know since i had been you know uh
403. 16:18locked up in all most of my adult life
404. 16:20so i was really excited about that and
405. 16:22our next step was our next stop was
406. 16:24tennessee
407. 16:26nashville
408. 16:27where our friend and fellow activist
409. 16:30steve earl was visiting now he's the one
410. 16:33who wrote the girl away girl which is
411. 16:35become very famous
412. 16:37so um
413. 16:38i told steve oh i'm invited to ireland
414. 16:41i'm going to be going to ireland he said
415. 16:43when you go to ireland you got to make
416. 16:46peter prank
417. 16:47i was like okay
418. 16:49peter pringle fine he didn't give me any
419. 16:52other contact information nor did he
420. 16:53tell me anything about peter
421. 16:56so
422. 16:57i i did end up going to ireland now here
423. 16:59you go peter you better talk about how
424. 17:01you could yeah
425. 17:02in the meantime so to speak
426. 17:05steve had been communicating with a man
427. 17:08on death row in texas texas
428. 17:10named jonathan noble
429. 17:13and jonathan orwell asked steve if he
430. 17:15would witness his execution because he'd
431. 17:18like to have somebody that one person
432. 17:20there who didn't hate him
433. 17:22and so steve did witness the execution
434. 17:25and was traumatized by it
435. 17:28and
436. 17:29came to ireland and to galway
437. 17:33basically
438. 17:34to recover from the experience
439. 17:37he began to frequent a cafe
440. 17:40owned by a friend of mine
441. 17:42and one morning i went in i was
442. 17:43introduced to steve and we told you to
443. 17:45the story and we became friends
444. 17:48and this is how when he said to sonny
445. 17:50you have to talk to peter pringle
446. 17:53um
447. 17:54so then
448. 17:56i was at home one day i had a landline
449. 17:59telephone
450. 18:00and i got a phone call
451. 18:03from this american woman who said to me
452. 18:05that her name was sonny jacobs
453. 18:08and that she was inviting me to come and
454. 18:09hear her speak the following friday that
455. 18:11was on a wednesday
456. 18:13and i she told me where she was going to
457. 18:15speak i asked her what she wanted to
458. 18:17talk about
459. 18:18she said the death penalty i said yes
460. 18:20i'm interested in that
461. 18:22and so i went along and i brought my two
462. 18:24two friends with me
463. 18:26i was was house-sharing with somebody i
464. 18:28brought her along and i brought the
465. 18:30owner of the cafe
466. 18:32chris
467. 18:33and when we went into the room above the
468. 18:35pub and gallery at one o'clock on a
469. 18:37friday
470. 18:38it was empty
471. 18:40and and a very large room was empty and
472. 18:43the lights were dimmed
473. 18:45and after a little while the door opened
474. 18:46at the far end of the room and this
475. 18:48little lady walked in
476. 18:50and i walked over to her and i said you
477. 18:52must be sonny jacobs
478. 18:54and i said you must be peter pringle
479. 18:58and that's how we met
480. 18:59and then she was going to tell her story
481. 19:02so
482. 19:03i i
483. 19:06listened carefully
484. 19:07and i was deeply affected by it but i
485. 19:10was emotional
486. 19:16and she uh when i was over i
487. 19:19wasn't over yet and so when i was
488. 19:21telling the story
489. 19:23you know um i saw and first of all he
490. 19:26said to me i'm going to i usually sit in
491. 19:28the back for these things but i'm going
492. 19:30to sit up front so that you'll have a
493. 19:32friendly face
494. 19:34to look at and i thought oh wow how
495. 19:37thoughtful you know how understanding
496. 19:39that's interesting and so but every time
497. 19:41i looked over at him he was crying this
498. 19:44big strong man was in tears i thought ah
499. 19:47you know i obviously was you know
500. 19:49touching a nerve and i i actually toned
501. 19:52down my talk that day because i could
502. 19:54see how deeply it was affecting him and
503. 19:56afterwards i i determined i definitely
504. 19:59needed to speak to him i felt
505. 20:00responsible and and i actually said to
506. 20:03suddenly i'd like to i i never thought i
507. 20:05was ever going to meet somebody
508. 20:08somebody else who had been wrongly
509. 20:10convicted and sentenced to death
510. 20:12and here i was listening to this little
511. 20:13woman telling her story
512. 20:15and so afterwards i said to her i'd like
513. 20:17to talk with you
514. 20:19and she said yes so would i but i have
515. 20:20to leave in an hour
516. 20:22and i said to her where are you going
517. 20:25so she told me she was going down to
518. 20:26court for the
519. 20:28the agm of amnesty the following evening
520. 20:31so i suggested to her that she'd stay
521. 20:34over with me in galway and i would
522. 20:36guarantee that i would bring her to the
523. 20:38meeting the following evening
524. 20:40so she said to me then oh i'd better
525. 20:42check with mary
526. 20:44was mary lala was the dens
527. 20:46secretary of amnesty in ireland
528. 20:48and she was she was
529. 20:51driving me around ireland at the time
530. 20:53she was my driver so i you see
531. 20:57it's it's not my strong suit okay
532. 21:00picking men and deciding to go with men
533. 21:03you know i
534. 21:04know i almost it almost killed me last
535. 21:07time so
536. 21:08i i didn't exactly trust my own judgment
537. 21:11in that and furthermore i'm on a strange
538. 21:13country a strange continent where i
539. 21:15don't even know anybody and i'm
540. 21:17contemplating going off with a strange
541. 21:19man that i just met so i thought
542. 21:22i don't want to be rude but um so that's
543. 21:25when i come up came up with the
544. 21:27thought well i have to ask mary because
545. 21:29she might be counting on me to keep her
546. 21:32company on the drive
547. 21:34so we went and found mary and um i said
548. 21:37um mary um you know uh peter has asked
549. 21:41me and anyway you tell this part no you
550. 21:43you tell what mary said oh so um i i
551. 21:47asked her you know if if it would be
552. 21:50okay you know for her and she said oh
553. 21:53yes oh peter oh thank you i'm so glad
554. 21:56because they felt bad they weren't going
555. 21:58to be able to take me sightseeing and
556. 21:59they didn't actually need me there until
557. 22:02the following evening so peter said he
558. 22:05would drive me and
559. 22:07um he would take me sightseeing and so
560. 22:09what we did was we transferred sonny's
561. 22:13case from mary's car to mine
562. 22:15and
563. 22:19sonny and i and my two friends
564. 22:22we
565. 22:23had oh yes i said to sonny uh would you
566. 22:26like to go for a swim
567. 22:28i said we like to go for a swim and some
568. 22:31sonny said oh that'd be lovely oh i said
569. 22:33great so we got i thought we meant in a
570. 22:36pool with cabanas now this was in the
571. 22:38moment
572. 22:39this was in the month of april in
573. 22:40ireland i've been swimming every day
574. 22:42winter and so on and so um
575. 22:45also my two friends
576. 22:46and so the four of us went down to
577. 22:48silver stand to the beach
578. 22:50and
579. 22:52the wind was blowing and it was it is
580. 22:54april
581. 22:55and so you know we we stripped off and
582. 22:57got a gear on and went into the water
583. 22:59and she was dilly dallying and
584. 23:02not not doing it very fast i was taking
585. 23:04my time because i don't even know these
586. 23:06people i just met these people and i was
587. 23:08supposed to take off my clothes
588. 23:10in a public place behind a rock in the
589. 23:13wind
590. 23:14like and and go swimming like oh my god
591. 23:17they had loaned me a bathing suit so um
592. 23:20finally after they you know kind of did
593. 23:22what they were going to do i did get
594. 23:25into the bathing suit and i went in the
595. 23:27water and when i got about up to my
596. 23:29knees it was so cold that it felt like
597. 23:33it was burning it was so cold and i was
598. 23:36i knew that i was gonna have to go to
599. 23:38the hospital because my legs were like
600. 23:40gone
601. 23:41but they were out there bobbing up and
602. 23:43down waving at me to come on and i
603. 23:45thought oh my god i'm not gonna that's
604. 23:47bad enough i'm gonna have to go to
605. 23:48hospital i'm not gonna let them say that
606. 23:50some american wimp couldn't come in the
607. 23:52water with them so
608. 23:54the damage is done anyway so and i went
609. 23:56and and finally thank goodness when i
610. 23:58was only about up to my chest they
611. 24:00decided to come in and i was splashing
612. 24:02around trying to make it look like i was
613. 24:04having fun
614. 24:05so then we get back to the beach and
615. 24:07then we're expected to dry off with this
616. 24:10towel in the wind and get dressed and um
617. 24:14anyway we got back in the car and they
618. 24:16took me to a really nice place um to
619. 24:19have something to eat
620. 24:21and i began to warm up having
621. 24:24hot soup yeah seafood chowder we got a
622. 24:27seafood restaurant yeah
623. 24:30and and it was very comfortable there
624. 24:32and they had a fire lightning and
625. 24:34and after a little while suddenly called
626. 24:36out
627. 24:37and we had a really nice meeting a nice
628. 24:39time together
629. 24:40and so um
630. 24:43she came and stayed overnight in my
631. 24:45house and our house rather because it
632. 24:48was two isn't it and the following
633. 24:50morning my friend chris
634. 24:52had invited us to come to his place for
635. 24:54breakfast
636. 24:55so we went there for breakfast
637. 24:58and while we were there he said to us he
638. 25:01said to me actually he said are you
639. 25:02going to drive sonny down the court
640. 25:04which would be about a four-hour drive
641. 25:06and i said yeah
642. 25:08i said you can't bring her in your old
643. 25:09jalopy here and he put his hand into his
644. 25:11pocket and took out the keys of his
645. 25:13mercedes
646. 25:15and he gave me the keys to the mercedes
647. 25:16take a decent car he says and give her a
648. 25:18nice time
649. 25:19and so that's what we did we we headed
650. 25:21off from the mercedes we drove down i
651. 25:23showed that all the beauty spots along
652. 25:25the way
653. 25:26and as we were crossing the shannon
654. 25:29eating a packed lunch that chris had
655. 25:31made for us
656. 25:32uh in the car ferry going across the
657. 25:34river
658. 25:35uh sunny turned to me and she said
659. 25:37what's your interest in all of this
660. 25:39because i hadn't said anything about my
661. 25:41background up to then
662. 25:44so i told her
663. 25:45and she asked me
664. 25:47what do you seem to have got through
665. 25:48very well she said how did you get
666. 25:50through
667. 25:51and i said yoga and meditation
668. 25:53and with that she lit up and i said
669. 25:56boing in my head because i knew then
670. 26:00that we were meant to meet that there
671. 26:02was something the universe had planned
672. 26:04this surreptitiously because
673. 26:07how 5 000 miles apart do we end up
674. 26:10meeting each other and find out that he
675. 26:13also used yoga meditation and prayer to
676. 26:16get through
677. 26:17his ordeal of being sentenced to death
678. 26:19and spending 15 years in prison
679. 26:22it was just
680. 26:23i couldn't believe it and um
681. 26:26then uh we did do the uh he took me to
682. 26:29the event and uh it was actually a great
683. 26:32day we laughed we cried we it was
684. 26:36comparing stories it was
685. 26:38it was an amazing time we have yeah it
686. 26:40was the most extraordinary car journey
687. 26:42i've ever made
688. 26:44because at times we were we were sharing
689. 26:46our stories
690. 26:47and at times we were laughing
691. 26:49hilariously of odd funny things that
692. 26:52happen that only we would think was
693. 26:53funny because a lot of times we were
694. 26:55weeping over the
695. 26:58trauma of it all in the emotion
696. 27:00but we got down to cork and
697. 27:04we went to the hotel where the
698. 27:06convention was
699. 27:08and sonny was um
700. 27:10to speak
701. 27:11and so again i sat up near the front and
702. 27:13i listened to her story and again i wept
703. 27:15because it's so dramatic
704. 27:17and afterwards um everyone was crowding
705. 27:20around you know they were all wanting to
706. 27:22talk to sunny and hug sunny and
707. 27:24everything else
708. 27:25and i waited a few minutes watched all
709. 27:26this and then i moved in and i said
710. 27:28excuse me sonny excuse me folks i said
711. 27:31she needs now to go for a cup of tea or
712. 27:33coffee so i brought it down and we had
713. 27:35tea together
714. 27:36and um
715. 27:38amnesty had booked a hotel two hotel
716. 27:40rooms for us in the hotel across the
717. 27:42road
718. 27:43and so when we went over there
719. 27:46we went to my room where there were two
720. 27:47beds
721. 27:48and we each of us sat on one of the beds
722. 27:52and we spent three and a half hours
723. 27:53discussing forgiveness
724. 27:56because forgiveness was the most
725. 27:57important things in our lives at that
726. 27:59time and still is
727. 28:01and so um
728. 28:03we grew to know each other better
729. 28:06and i left her back to her room then and
730. 28:08then the following morning
731. 28:10i i had to leave early to bring the car
732. 28:13back to galway
733. 28:14but she
734. 28:22and so i i left yeah and i told her i
735. 28:25said listen
736. 28:26i said i don't want you to think that
737. 28:28i'm not attracted to you about i said
738. 28:30but i'm in a relationship
739. 28:32and i i try to live an honorable life
740. 28:34and
741. 28:37perhaps sometimes later
742. 28:39and so we parted and made arrangements
743. 28:41to meet each other again and connect
744. 28:42with each other
745. 28:45and that was what when i decided i
746. 28:47actually was interested in peter because
747. 28:51the word honorable
748. 28:53was really important to me because at
749. 28:55that point in my life i didn't have time
750. 28:57for
751. 28:58any kind of anything else
752. 29:00you know life is too short and um
753. 29:04and our time and our energy is too
754. 29:06precious so
755. 29:07then i knew that i i didn't it wasn't
756. 29:10necessarily a romantic interest
757. 29:12although i wouldn't mind but um if i i
758. 29:15knew that
759. 29:16i definitely was interested in this
760. 29:18person because
761. 29:20of what he said i became a person of
762. 29:22interest as they say
763. 29:25and i've remained a person of interest
764. 29:27all these years on
765. 29:28yes yes
766. 29:30and then we had a sort of long-distance
767. 29:32relationship sunny in los angeles me in
768. 29:34ireland
769. 29:35and and neither of us any money
770. 29:38and so i organized um yoga weekend
771. 29:41workshops
772. 29:43and sonny would come over to ireland and
773. 29:44she'd do the workshops
774. 29:46and that's how we in the morning that's
775. 29:48how she got the money to be able to pay
776. 29:50we could pay her affairs
777. 29:52and
778. 30:00planes crashed into the twin towers new
779. 30:02york
780. 30:03sonny was actually in an irish prison
781. 30:05teaching yoga yeah
782. 30:07and um
783. 30:09we
784. 30:11she couldn't fly home then because all
785. 30:13the flights were stopped
786. 30:15and while that was great because we did
787. 30:16an extra week together
788. 30:19but um
789. 30:20yeah and so by that time of course we'd
790. 30:23become intimate and and
791. 30:25we discussed whether we could manage to
792. 30:27should we live together
793. 30:28because neither of us knew
794. 30:30you know on the time we spent in
795. 30:32isolation neither of us knew whether
796. 30:34we'd be actually able to share with
797. 30:35somebody else
798. 30:37but we decided to give it a shot
799. 30:39and so suddenly went back to the states
800. 30:43and she packed two big bags
801. 30:45and she let go our apartment and she
802. 30:48sold whatever she could of her
803. 30:49belongings
804. 30:50gave away what she couldn't sell
805. 30:53and flew back east to ireland
806. 30:56reversing what her ancestors had done
807. 30:59and so we've been together ever since
808. 31:02happily that was like over 20 years ago
809. 31:05yeah
810. 31:06that's so cool you know so that's why i
811. 31:08say we're pretty fortunate you know
812. 31:11and um
813. 31:12i think our time is up now
814. 31:15but uh so we just finished the story on
815. 31:17time we haven't actually even talked
816. 31:19about amicus much but
817. 31:21that's fun yeah well there's an
818. 31:22interesting thing here because um
819. 31:26[Music]
820. 31:27somebody
821. 31:28asked us if we could have the person
822. 31:31who'd been wrongly convicted an american
823. 31:33who was in a bit of trouble and so he
824. 31:35came and stayed with our and we were
825. 31:37living in a two-room cottage
826. 31:39and he stayed with us for a month and we
827. 31:40were able to help him
828. 31:42and
829. 31:43of course
830. 31:44we were invited to uh a talk
831. 31:48oh it's a crowd i forget in london
832. 31:50at which
833. 31:51um
834. 31:54who was there
835. 31:56we don't have time to do all of it okay
836. 31:58let's go time's up time's up okay yeah i
837. 32:01mean that we were introduced to two
838. 32:02hours diana's telling me that we can run
839. 32:04over by like five or ten minutes
840. 32:06actually oh good well that was actually
841. 32:08when we uh
842. 32:11found out about amicus yeah yeah i think
843. 32:13i'll tell you who was there i know who
844. 32:15it was it was annabelle timmon i think
845. 32:16annabelle that's right
846. 32:18yeah
847. 32:19is she here today
848. 32:21um i don't know i don't think i've seen
849. 32:23i think she's in court today actually so
850. 32:25she'll be catching up um online he's
851. 32:27pretty wonderful too yes
852. 32:32of of of amicus
853. 32:34and
854. 32:35from there then we connected with you
855. 32:37and
856. 32:38we've been connected with amigos and
857. 32:40amicus is our favorite organization
858. 32:45absolutely
859. 32:46for the work you do and for the efforts
860. 32:49you put into it and you marvel
861. 32:52certainly
862. 32:53are an incredible person it's a team you
863. 32:56know it's a team
864. 32:57yeah so much work yeah but somebody has
865. 33:00this yeah but you're you're the more or
866. 33:01less a director yeah
867. 33:03and it's your energy keeps the others
868. 33:05moving
869. 33:06and um
870. 33:10especially things like this i i would
871. 33:11never have done an instagram thing i i
872. 33:13had never used instagram hardly at all
873. 33:15except for to post a few pictures of the
874. 33:17cats
875. 33:19before today
876. 33:20so
877. 33:21um you know it really is you think of
878. 33:23all of those guys
879. 33:25in the office or the virtual office as
880. 33:27it is now um they are pushing this is
881. 33:30pushing this forward it takes a village
882. 33:32it takes a team
883. 33:34it really does yeah funny that you
884. 33:36mentioned a cats
885. 33:37because we have two
886. 33:39um
887. 33:41to feral cats
888. 33:43who adopted us
889. 33:46one of them joey came
890. 33:48in in a very severe storm last november
891. 33:51uh and he sheltered in one of the
892. 33:53outside kennels overnight
893. 33:55and in the morning ran away but i
894. 33:56brought him food and he came back and i
895. 33:58kept bringing him food and he's there
896. 34:00and about two weeks later
897. 34:02um
898. 34:03leah came and she lived in a different
899. 34:05candle at the other side of the house
900. 34:07and so i feed him and at first it's very
901. 34:10interesting the two cats couldn't get on
902. 34:13together they were scrabbling and
903. 34:14fighting with each other all the time
904. 34:16and and then she went into heat
905. 34:19and then they made it
906. 34:21kind of like us and now they're like an
907. 34:22old married couple the pair of them you
908. 34:24want to see them they're grooming each
909. 34:26other and and they've had kittens
910. 34:28they've fallen up beautiful kittens
911. 34:31and um extremely cute and he
912. 34:35joey is looking after the kittens as
913. 34:37well as the mother yeah and it's it's
914. 34:39wonderful yeah
915. 34:41actually and i
916. 34:42said love always at the sunny healing
917. 34:44[Laughter]
918. 34:46when we're finished here with this
919. 34:48actually it doesn't mean my next job is
920. 34:50to go out and feed the the four to six
921. 34:53of them and it's fascinating when i feed
922. 34:55them because i have one dish for a liar
923. 34:58one dish for joey and i go out and i say
924. 35:00the air force then joey then the kittens
925. 35:03so i put down one dish for
926. 35:05me and she has it one dish for joey and
927. 35:07he has it and then and of course all the
928. 35:09kittens wanted the two dishes
929. 35:11but then i put down the dish for the
930. 35:12kittens and i kind of rattled it on the
931. 35:14floor and i say come on kittens before
932. 35:15they'll turn around they are driving in
933. 35:17the food and they're on their own dish
934. 35:19so that's that's the way it is it's a
935. 35:21it's a happy place here
936. 35:23you know
937. 35:24and that is is your hearts that
938. 35:27bring that happiness
939. 35:32um
940. 35:33what
941. 35:34peter and sunny have put their efforts
942. 35:36into now today
943. 35:38is um helping those people who are um
944. 35:42exonerated or have spent a long time
945. 35:43wrongly convicted wrongly convicted
946. 35:46um people who have spent a long time
947. 35:49incarceration in incarceration and um
948. 35:54they provide a sanctuary
949. 35:56um to get those people
950. 35:58um
951. 35:59to a place that they can
952. 36:02to help them to heal
953. 36:04and to find their way into the world
954. 36:06again
955. 36:07it's a place
956. 36:09to overcome the deep sense of
957. 36:11disconnectedness
958. 36:13that released prisoners have when they
959. 36:14come back into society and not just in
960. 36:17america we do this in oh absolutely
961. 36:19everywhere everywhere that it's it's
962. 36:21needed everywhere but we're
963. 36:23currently working with six countries
964. 36:25that's right and only a few days ago we
965. 36:27were we had a zoom
966. 36:29with two people from pakistan
967. 36:31and they're they're working towards
968. 36:33opening a sunny center in pakistan
969. 36:35healing center because everywhere there
970. 36:37are wrongful convictions and most
971. 36:39especially when they've been sentenced
972. 36:41to death
973. 36:42yeah in fact we have the healing center
974. 36:44the uh community the living center in
975. 36:47tampa tampa florida and uh right now
976. 36:51there are uh two people there who were
977. 36:54uh wrongly sentenced to death
978. 36:57so um
979. 36:58it's so important you know what we've
980. 37:00got a couple of questions coming through
981. 37:02actually actually um good question oh
982. 37:04when when will the next yoga session be
983. 37:07with sonny
984. 37:09yes that's my question too
985. 37:11so
986. 37:12margo's gonna let us know and she's
987. 37:14gonna ready to sort it out don't we
988. 37:16we've talked
989. 37:17we have talked about it we've just not
990. 37:18got a date in the calendar yet have we
991. 37:20we just need to get some dates in the
992. 37:22calendar and do it
993. 37:24maybe we'll try it on instagram next
994. 37:25time i don't know now we've now we've
995. 37:27perfected it i don't know
996. 37:29oh like it's like live
997. 37:31yeah that's an idea well we do it live
998. 37:34on the zoom but it's just um yeah
999. 37:36yeah but instagram live everybody can
1000. 37:39come there
1001. 37:42yeah everybody can anybody who's and
1002. 37:45can get recorded
1003. 37:47it's a different thing
1004. 37:49yeah well anyway everybody this is great
1005. 37:52it's great to be able to connect like
1006. 37:54this
1007. 37:54um
1008. 37:56i hope that we've inspired a lot of
1009. 37:57people to volunteer you have so your
1010. 38:00names
1011. 38:02all the way through training every
1012. 38:04single training and we've you know
1013. 38:06you've been involved in training
1014. 38:09um hundreds of hundreds many hundreds of
1015. 38:12them
1016. 38:12of people who have gone through the
1017. 38:14training and heard you speak and say and
1018. 38:17thank you you are all inspired by you
1019. 38:19you can't help but be inspired by you
1020. 38:22and
1021. 38:23um well there's lots of hearts yeah lots
1022. 38:26of love for sonny and peter
1023. 38:29yeah thank you thank you and thanks
1024. 38:32again if if there are a couple of
1025. 38:34questions we can take some but yeah
1026. 38:36let's do the questions if there are any
1027. 38:39other questions
1028. 38:41that's a lovely um
1029. 38:43just giving love
1030. 38:44pencil drawing behind you that's that's
1031. 38:47that's
1032. 38:49yeah is that andrew no that's george
1033. 38:51stinney actually that's from um
1034. 38:55because i'm at home at the moment
1035. 38:56obviously as many people are and but my
1036. 38:59home has been turned into the office
1037. 39:01because we've closed our like everybody
1038. 39:04at the moment and
1039. 39:05everything from the london office has
1040. 39:08come to my house
1041. 39:10so there's a few things like this big
1042. 39:11board behind me
1043. 39:13um from an exhibition that we did in in
1044. 39:16a temple
1045. 39:17a few years back
1046. 39:18um but there is nowhere to put it so
1047. 39:21it's just become one of my backgrounds
1048. 39:23and i've got all of the i've also got
1049. 39:25all of these it's a good
1050. 39:30[Music]
1051. 39:36let's get to the questions because
1052. 39:37barney's telling me it's time i think
1053. 39:40we've i think the questions have gone
1054. 39:41now so um we can oh no
1055. 39:44yeah sorry
1056. 39:47oh you mean you can't you can't yeah no
1057. 39:50i think um i think anyone else got any
1058. 39:52questions i just stopped like just
1059. 39:54checking
1060. 39:55check in stick your questions in there
1061. 39:57again real quick whoever it was
1062. 39:59secret question it might have just been
1063. 40:00it might have just been about yoga
1064. 40:03which is totally fine as well
1065. 40:05okay well
1066. 40:07if anybody um if anybody would like to
1067. 40:09actually hear the sonny and peter's full
1068. 40:11story um first of all the complete story
1069. 40:15or most complete story is within the
1070. 40:17books so stolen time and about time are
1071. 40:20both available for sale through amicus
1072. 40:23at the moment
1073. 40:24please be patient and that helps
1074. 40:26advocates
1075. 40:27yes it does but be patient with our
1076. 40:29postal service because our postal
1077. 40:31service as well because of our lack of
1078. 40:33office at the moment is me
1079. 40:35so
1080. 40:36[Laughter]
1081. 40:37so be patient if you ordered books but
1082. 40:39please do um i would love to send you a
1083. 40:42book um
1084. 40:43and also at our training so if you come
1085. 40:46to training um then you will hear sonny
1086. 40:49and peter talk about their actual story
1087. 40:51and they get a sign i enjoyed
1088. 40:54yes and you were you we've got assigned
1089. 40:56bookmarks as well for anyone who buys
1090. 40:57books
1091. 40:58um
1092. 41:00and yeah so yeah so thank you very much
1093. 41:02and thank you sonny thank you peter for
1094. 41:04all your support over the years
1095. 41:06for being part of the amicus family
1096. 41:09and i'm getting i'm getting quite a few
1097. 41:11personal messages on my whatsapp that
1098. 41:13are saying i miss sonny and peter miss
1099. 41:15sunny and peter children
1100. 41:19well you know
1101. 41:20as i said you're the most important
1102. 41:22group of people that we know
1103. 41:24oh and and it's it's
1104. 41:26it's a privilege
1105. 41:28to be associated with you
1106. 41:31thank you well we'll end on that
1107. 41:33wonderful
1108. 41:34night i think so
1109. 41:37thank you both for taking the time a
1110. 41:39short notice okay talk to you again
1111. 41:41brilliant talk to you soon see you soon
1112. 41:43bye
1113. 41:44thanks everybody for
1114. 41:46participating longer phone how do you
1115. 41:48get