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CELLMATE SECRETS LIVE DISCUSSION - Do you think Chris Watts is innocent? — Transcript

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0:00hey guys thanks so much
0:03to all of you for waiting i know some of
0:05you thought i would be on
0:07hours earlier i did put up a
0:11[Music]
0:13video earlier it was on a different link
0:15to this one and
0:16uh with the right time and then
0:19unfortunately i do
0:20get rid of that one and so when i
0:23updated it i didn't put the
0:25the updated time so anyway thank you a
0:28lot to you guys for your patience
0:30mary rose good to see you rhonda
0:32henderson
0:34i didn't get to see selma secrets
0:36obviously i didn't miss
0:37much um
0:40donnie springer i just
0:44good to see you rosebud silver bullet
0:49caroline k from the outback what time is
0:52it there caroline
0:55so good to see you guys um i've made a
0:58lot of notes
0:59um how many of you guys have watched
1:03uh some mate secrets are there any of
1:06you who've actually seen it
1:08kitty witty hi there
1:11teresa bria thanks for being here thanks
1:15for making it i know it's quite late in
1:17france
1:18it's one o'clock in the morning where i
1:20am so
1:21and it's pretty cold as you can see
1:24apparently going to be
1:25below zero tonight so i've actually
1:28covered some of the plants in my garden
1:29with
1:30netting mary rose says sword
1:34unfortunately
1:37silver bullet does he really expect to
1:39appeal this
1:40good question i don't think he's got a
1:44chance but you know he's got nothing
1:46else to think about really
1:49chats has not seen it looks a bit trashy
1:54brian says it's all good we're on the
1:56exact same time it's one amy
1:58and france so i really appreciate you
2:00being on bria
2:01i'm gonna try and make this quick uh
2:03actually wanted to talk about
2:05the summer wells case i wanted to talk
2:08about
2:09uh the derrick strauben sentencing i
2:11don't know if we're going to
2:12get to that because there's a lot to get
2:14through
2:17i was actually quite surprised that
2:20the self-made secret thing was as good
2:22as it was i thought it was a lot better
2:24than
2:24than what i expected but we'll get to
2:26that in a moment
2:29rosebud have it recorded to make notes
2:32it wasn't good
2:34okay barbara says my screen is buffering
2:37is it normal
2:39well i'm not sure is anyone else's
2:41screen buffering
2:42billy nomads is streaming fine here liz
2:45graham after midnight
2:46here hi from scotland great to see you
2:48again it's unusual
2:50for me to be on a saturday i don't
2:51normally do saturdays
2:53but there's quite a lot happening on
2:55lifetime there's also lori velo that's
2:57showing
2:58about i think an hour from now the lorry
3:01velo
3:02doomsday mom is showing um so that's
3:05something else i also want to
3:07to cover i would normally have written a
3:09book about
3:11such a high profile case at this time so
3:14i'm sort of
3:15i feel a little bit um
3:18bad that i'm that i'm sort of so slow in
3:21that respect
3:23i mean i'm right now i'm working on
3:24another book i'm editing another book
3:26i'm narrating another book
3:27but the other me the the super author
3:33uh would have been at this point already
3:35brought out a book on lori valo and
3:38part of me feels quite bad about it but
3:40another part of me is trying to
3:42um not write every
3:45every month and and you know sort of do
3:47other things
3:49and what is quite interesting in the
3:51documentary self-made secrets
3:53is how much time is spent talking about
3:56the idea of chris watts writing a book
3:59christia i guess
4:01managing that process of writing dylan
4:03wanting to write a book
4:05and and then kadel eventually writing a
4:07book and then writing another book
4:10so we actually got probably the most
4:12airtime
4:14sherilyn cadel got i don't know if you
4:16noticed that most of the story was
4:18really her story
4:20so it's like soulmate secrets with
4:24someone who wasn't a soulmate you know
4:27half ratchet good to see you
4:30um little star
4:34happy surprise to catch a live stream
4:37okay so oh this dog can you show he's
4:40licking me look at this
4:45he always wants full attention when i'm
4:47on here
4:48then he suddenly once it's like it's
4:51like i know you're not going to be
4:52available for an hour so now
4:54give me attention kind of thing louise
4:57oh dear
4:58hi from toronto i presume toronto's
5:01quite warm
5:02angel harmony
5:05um colleen silic hi from north central
5:09texas uh colleen i take it it's pretty
5:11hot where you are i believe they're heat
5:13waves
5:14going through america right now
5:16especially seattle area especially the
5:18north
5:24what's the weather like in france is it
5:26as hot in france as it is
5:28in other places unless it's not
5:31uh although it's cold where i am it's
5:34not as cold as it can get
5:35definitely not but touch wood
5:41um gayla dennison hello from sacramento
5:46rosebud says super hot here in southeast
5:49usa
5:51and charmelhot nick are you going on
5:55another trip soon
5:57those videos were intriguing and fun uh
5:59i
6:00am i am getting on the trip soon soonish
6:04i'm actually looking forward to trying
6:06to do a trip to the states but
6:09we'll have to see how this pandemic
6:12unfolds
6:13although it looks like america is going
6:15to be one of the safer countries to
6:16travel to
6:18frankie pilloquin praying for the
6:20families of the collapsed building in
6:22florida yeah that is quite a
6:24strange thing happening there denise
6:27ecker hi from
6:28ottawa canada
6:32uh eddie bell nice weather here in
6:36scotland oh that's good
6:40jennifer dameron come to tennessee
6:44yeah well there's a lot happening there
6:45i really would like to talk about the
6:47summer wells case stuff that i haven't
6:49actually communicated yet
6:51um but there's just so much going on at
6:53the moment
6:54bria says hi fellow canadians melanie
6:59b elec probably mispronouncing that hi
7:02from buffalo new york
7:06paul morgan toots
7:09hi from norwich is that norwich in the
7:11uk
7:12if it is you you up late
7:16janae and so hot in portland oregon okay
7:19i believe it's a hot day that sort of
7:21area
7:21seattle washington so on
7:24um melee mel hey from montreal
7:28okay good to see you
7:32uh pavel sirsky
7:35hey from warsaw poland quite a quite a
7:37mixed group
7:39um i'm just waiting for us to hit 100
7:42then we can oh so it's 105. okay so i'm
7:45gonna get started to me
7:47do you mind if i get started tell me can
7:49i get started
7:53he's quite smelly he definitely needs a
7:56bath
7:58okay guys so i've got quite a few notes
8:01here
8:03um
8:07pages and pages actually um
8:12the first thing that i've written down
8:13is do you think that
8:17christa rachella regrets doing this do
8:19you think she regrets
8:22appearing in seoulmate secrets now i
8:24must say before i watched it
8:27looking at the comments on certain
8:30on twitter and other places i was
8:33i sort of had a particular opinion on
8:34that but having watched it
8:36i i think i've changed my mind i think
8:38she
8:40she's loved the attention i think she
8:41really enjoyed the attention if you've
8:43watched some mad secrets right at the
8:44end
8:45they actually show her being made up
8:49i don't know if you caught that they
8:51showed they show her getting makeup and
8:53she just seems to
8:54she doesn't seem to be enjoying it and
8:57that comes up right at the end of the
8:59sort of documentary where
9:01her boyfriend or ex-boyfriend who
9:03ex-fiance basically says something like
9:06something like i think she really
9:07enjoyed the attention and and he's not
9:10very happy about that and so i don't
9:13know i first thought that maybe she
9:14regrets doing it but
9:16but now i don't i don't think i think
9:18for some people
9:19even sort of you know if it's in a
9:23context that that's maybe questionable
9:26it's nevertheless attention
9:27and so that's what matters
9:35these are all notes i actually made it's
9:37not a lot though i made before i watched
9:39it so i'm going to get you the notes i
9:40made after but
9:42um it's something i saw in the preview
9:44where cheryl and cadill said
9:46chris watts eyes would turn black when
9:48he spoke
9:50about what happened do you think that's
9:51true do you think i mean you're looking
9:53at me now
9:55do you think that your eyes can like
9:57literally
9:58turn totally black almost like an alien
10:00do you think that that is
10:03um factually correct what do you think
10:06about that
10:10greg brown says life is good int she did
10:13an interview in the daily mail not long
10:16ago that's true she then
10:17i think a couple
10:22so i just wanna let you guys knows
10:27especially bria just so that the mods
10:30know
10:30this as well this video is not not
10:33an attack on anyone i'm not yet to
10:36attack anyone
10:37what we have to do is talk about the
10:39documentary
10:41and then also what what information came
10:44out of that documentary that
10:46that that's sort of insightful and i
10:48kind of made a note here
10:50that
10:53that you know were there any insights
10:56that came out of some
10:58soulmate secrets what do you guys think
11:01like
11:01did any of you watching cellmate secrets
11:03go wow i didn't know that
11:05like while i learned something
11:12jamaica
11:16uh melanie says no mary rose no no no
11:20and no
11:21um so
11:26i've i thought that there was quite a
11:28big insight
11:30that i didn't expect to see i i think
11:32because
11:33in my mind i thought some mate secrets
11:35is going to be about
11:36the cellmate and about christa i thought
11:39that was going to be the bulk of the
11:40show and it ended up being more about
11:42cheryl and cadill right and
11:46then you got that thing about the oxy
11:50right that to me was kind of the big
11:53reveal where she said he told me things
11:57that he didn't even tell the fbi but
11:59that is like old news going back to like
12:01october
12:04october 2019 i think i'll verify that in
12:07a second
12:08and i'll when we get to that i'll talk
12:10to you about the
12:12true crime rocket science part of that
12:15narrative because that's definitely
12:16quite an interesting narrative
12:18so that information is quite interesting
12:20but it's certainly not
12:21new it's not it's it's not um
12:24if you know about this case it's
12:26absolutely not new
12:28right um melee mel thanks very much
12:32first time enya and i wanna say thanks
12:34everyone for your kindness
12:36we like to be a a well-mannered nice
12:41um community that focuses on
12:44on the facts right um
12:47how do the uk get to see it i'm not sure
12:51toots you're gonna have to go on to
12:53lifetime to
12:55to see what the programming's like um i
12:58think it's often released there a little
12:59bit later on
13:01so okay so i'm gonna go to my notes now
13:03these are
13:05quite a few notes from from
13:08from just watching it a couple of
13:09minutes ago um
13:12the first thing that i've written is is
13:15this the first page
13:18the first thing that i've written is
13:20that the best stuff is about
13:22sheryl and cadill not dylan and not
13:25christa
13:26and and funnily enough dylan is almost
13:27like a footnote in the whole story
13:30he makes you know if you add the total
13:33amount of time
13:34that dylan that you hear anything from
13:36dylan it's maybe
13:38five minutes maybe a little bit longer
13:41um
13:41it's cadal about eighty percent of the
13:44time
13:45christa maybe or maybe 70 percent of the
13:48time chris did 20
13:49of the time and then five percent of the
13:52time dillon and then the rest sort of
13:53back story
13:54and then there's a tiny little bit of um
13:58acknowledging or mentioning the
14:02other youtube channel i think you know
14:03we're talking about
14:05sort of if you put it all together it's
14:07maybe one minute
14:09where you actually see him it'll be
14:10interesting to see how his channel
14:13um what happens to his channel based on
14:16being associated with this particular
14:18show
14:20um so some might secret starts
14:23so we almost 15 minutes into this live
14:26now we're really hitting
14:28the discussion it starts with viewer
14:31discretion his advice is based on a
14:34true story and there's a little bit of
14:36um a moment
14:38i know when i sort of saw that thinking
14:40you know what this is
14:42it's like a tabloid thing but you know
14:45people this is really really about real
14:47people and
14:48real events and one's got to pause a
14:50little bit and let that sink in
14:53that whatever circus is going on around
14:56the reality
14:57this something something did happen here
15:01and whatever that was
15:05was pretty tragic to put it mildly
15:08and what's happening after that is is
15:11pretty crazy
15:12just the aftermath of the watch case is
15:14one of the
15:16craziest aftermaths i've ever seen and i
15:18think part of that is because there was
15:19no trial
15:20and that topic is brought up quite a few
15:22times in
15:24the in the documentary that because
15:26there's no trial there's this
15:27uncertainty and it's within this vacuum
15:29of uncertainty
15:31that characters like krista come forward
15:33and to some extent cradle and to some
15:35extent
15:36certain channels um in any event they
15:39sort of started off
15:40saying the whole thing about the
15:43all-american family you actually hear
15:44christus saying that there's a voiceover
15:47you know there with the all-american
15:48family i think the opening clip is of
15:50shanann doing that saturday morning
15:53video you know the one that is half an
15:55hour that's sort of how it starts
15:57right roosevelt says uh-oh
16:00now i'm buffering i don't know if i'm on
16:03if i've set it to like what do you call
16:06it um
16:08hd or something i don't know if that's
16:09what's going on but
16:13maybe you must just refresh anyway um
16:18then some of the very early notes i've
16:20got here is that
16:21and i guess they do this lifetime does
16:24this to
16:25to hook in the viewer right so
16:29some of the first things you hear is
16:35i think it's sheryl and cadill saying he
16:37was possessed
16:39and he was talking way too much of
16:42demonic things or something like that
16:45and so this is giving you the sort of
16:47titillating
16:48idea of what the rest of the episode's
16:51going to be about and
16:52it really wasn't that aspect's not
16:55really touched on
16:56very heavily now if you if you've
16:59watched some of
17:00christa's appearances on that other
17:04youtube channel um the letters are just
17:08saturated with that stuff it's just all
17:10about god and this and that and
17:13basically
17:14well as far as i'm concerned it's
17:16nonsense um
17:18it's trying to pass the bug to
17:21something else you know like i didn't
17:22commit the crime satan did kind of thing
17:25then also this thing about he didn't
17:28like to be called a monster but he is
17:31um i i kind of get this weird sense
17:34you know it's like christa played chris
17:36watts but
17:37what about kadel didn't kaydel
17:42um did the chris watts get a
17:46certain impression from cable that she's
17:48gonna write a certain kind of story and
17:50then did he
17:51well the fact is i don't think chris
17:53watch is talking to kadel today
17:55and i don't think i mean as soon as she
17:58published the book even before she
17:59published a book i don't think they were
18:00talking anymore
18:02um the same thing with christa or
18:04christine chris watts still talking
18:08so as much as they had this intimate
18:11relationship and that they knew one
18:13another so well
18:14did they um
18:17so right at the beginning of the
18:21documentary and it's you hear it in the
18:25in the sort of previews as well christa
18:28says
18:29i'm standing up for chris watts right in
18:31the beginning and that does seem to be
18:33her position throughout she seems to
18:34be of the opinion that he was uh
18:39a sideshow or sidekick in his own crime
18:44and and somehow he took a plea deal as
18:47part of that that somebody was
18:48manipulated
18:50by his accessories into taking a plea
18:52deal and not even mentioning them
18:54you know there was a moment during the
18:56sentencing
18:58on uh november 19th where the judge was
19:01asked do you want to say anything
19:03and that was a moment where chris watts
19:05could have said you know what
19:07the version that that the dna is just
19:09given
19:10you know this version that you did this
19:12you did that you did that why didn't you
19:14just get a divorce
19:15um you know this it was it was coolly
19:18calculated
19:19um and he did he did it because he
19:22wanted another life
19:24that was his chance to say well it's
19:26actually not true
19:27i had help or whatever and he didn't
19:30so one thing that i think is quite
19:33interesting is i think
19:34certain people thought that this
19:37documentary would be all about
19:40showing the other side of the narrative
19:41i certainly caught a little bit of that
19:43on
19:44on his channel on that channel that's
19:46been covering
19:47the the side of of things where he said
19:50something about at last the truth is
19:51going to come out the other side of the
19:52story is going to come out
19:54where you know chris watts didn't act
19:55alone and the
19:58the impression i get from watching the
20:00documentary was that he did act alone
20:03in other words from the narrative
20:05perspective of the documentary was
20:07to say basically what kaidel said right
20:12um johnny springer he never threw nk
20:16under the bus cleopatra you should talk
20:19about the churches and government
20:21regarding residential schools
20:25bria as where are you from denise gayla
20:27i think what's viewed cadilla as a
20:28mother figure
20:29that was also brought up where she said
20:33they had kind of like a mother-son
20:35relationship which i think is quite
20:36interesting because
20:37i don't know if his relationship with
20:39his own mother is that great
20:40and i think it's quite interesting how i
20:44think chris watts did try to manipulate
20:46cable to some extent
20:48um because i think cadal is someone who
20:53who is a christian person and who
20:57the christianity features in her life
20:59and so they probably had
21:01some conversations about that that
21:03actually went somewhere
21:04um but i think he thought he could
21:07mislead her
21:08in terms of the spiritual side
21:12and and then what ultimately happened
21:14you know
21:18mary rose says the whole cable book was
21:20him throwing enkei under the bus
21:25i don't know if that's true um i don't
21:28does he implicate cadal in
21:30does he implicate kessinger in
21:33in his book
21:40so let's see what else i've got on this
21:43page
21:44so she says something like he told me
21:46things that he didn't tell the fbi
21:49um something that i thought was a little
21:51bit strange just a note i made you
21:53the narrator of soulmate secrets her
21:56name's angie
21:57harmon i think i hope i'm saying that
21:59right i think she's got 330 000
22:02twitter followers and while the
22:05documentary was showing she was live
22:07tweeting and she was saying
22:10krista and and krista got engaged to
22:13this guy
22:13and so i don't know i just found it a
22:16bit weird
22:17while the documentary is actually going
22:19on i sort of felt like
22:21um the producer or the narrator
22:26the overall narrator of the thing was
22:28sort of it seemed like she was
22:29criticizing
22:30christa and i've actually had that
22:33happen to me i once went on to
22:35i think it's called the opperman report
22:37in the middle of talking about the
22:39madeleine mccann
22:40case i mean i found about out about this
22:42later on in the middle of
22:45they he wanted me to talk about
22:47pizzagate and all sorts of
22:49conspiracies and when i didn't he
22:52started
22:53criticizing me it's his show and he was
22:56criticizing me on his show
22:58while i was giving the show and i don't
23:01know i just find something like that
23:04um is it is a nice thing to do
23:08right um at least if you're going to
23:10interview someone
23:11let them tell their story without
23:14undermining them at the same time you
23:16know i don't know
23:18so um let's go to the next page
23:22unless it's difficult to to deal with
23:24the subject matter without
23:26it seeming like you throwing stones
23:29and i don't want to do that i i don't
23:31want to
23:34have this sort of shallow commentary
23:36where you
23:37you pointing the finger i know it's
23:39popular on youtube
23:40where people want to hear you know um
23:44you know look at this and look at that
23:46and whatever
23:48um but i don't really want it to be
23:49about that
23:51um one thing i didn't notice that that
23:53stuck out at me
23:55was krista's nails got really really
23:58long nails did any of you notice that
24:00and i guess that gives you a certain
24:03kind of impression
24:04of a person they're not like long
24:07they're like super long
24:08super super long so anyway coming back
24:11to my notes
24:12um kadel says he screamed guilty to me
24:15in his body language and his face
24:19and to her credit she actually said this
24:22to him i think in her letter
24:23that you screamed guilty to me so you
24:26know
24:27there was a degree of authenticity
24:29between her and him
24:32but you know do you think that when she
24:36sat with him
24:37she kept saying i think you're guilty i
24:40think you
24:41a monster because that's what she
24:42thought or do you think she
24:45nurtured him and other things did you
24:47think she was
24:49genuinely nice to him was it a narrative
24:51that came out of
24:53a genuine exchange or was it something
24:56else
24:57right so the other thing is
25:01that is brought up here which is a fact
25:04is
25:05without a trial there's a lack of public
25:07transparency
25:09and that lead that has led to suspicions
25:11that is
25:12in a weird way why are we all here right
25:15in a weird way we all hear almost three
25:18years later
25:19because there wasn't a trial and there's
25:22a sense of no closure in a sense of
25:25you know there are some details we just
25:27don't know the truth about
25:28and that's the intriguing part of the
25:30chris watts case i think one of the
25:32biggest
25:32parts that we don't know about is nicole
25:35kissinger
25:36you know who was she really what what is
25:39her role
25:40the scale and scope of it but to some
25:42extent we just don't
25:44know what kind of person chris watts
25:45really is who is he really
25:47and you know i i called my the name of
25:50my book
25:51is the name of my my nine part
25:55book series is two-face and i think it's
25:58a
25:59simple way of saying something that has
26:00been obvious all this time is that
26:02that we we are with chris watts we're
26:05dealing with a two-phase someone who
26:07has two faces somebody wears a mask
26:09right
26:11but isn't that true of everyone isn't
26:14that true of all of us
26:16isn't that true of you and me um isn't
26:18that true
26:20just in a genuine way that that we we
26:22keep a certain part of ourselves private
26:24but even more so if you go into this
26:27documentary
26:28boo says it's 12 28 a.m here in the uk
26:32well it's 129 here so
26:36it's even later where i am so thanks for
26:38those of you
26:39in britain who are um listening in
26:43really late past your bedtimes um
26:48mary rose is three face or more patricia
26:51burns is not actually making
26:53light of his role
26:58so some of the some people are saying
27:02three phases or whatever but it's
27:03basically
27:04there's the truth of who we are
27:07the the absolute truth the authentic
27:10self
27:11you know who you really are and then
27:13there's the other side
27:14and you can say the ten masks or 20
27:17marks whereas basically that other mask
27:19is
27:20who you how you present yourself to
27:21other people and
27:24um on social media and so on but you
27:26know there's a
27:28what i i don't want to say that you know
27:30and i remember when i was an idealistic
27:32young man thinking
27:33that the way that we need to present
27:35ourselves is absolutely honest like
27:37absolute honesty is the highest way that
27:39we can be but i don't know if it is
27:42meaning you know if you're with someone
27:44you you can't
27:46necessarily be absolutely honest with
27:47them you know about everything
27:50about things that you don't like about
27:51them about things that they say that you
27:53disagree with about
27:55certain things you you sort of do hold
27:57things back and
27:58in in one movie i think it's um
28:02interstellar the the robot says
28:05something like um absolute honesty
28:09isn't advisable with emotional beings
28:11you might think that's funny but it's
28:13nevertheless true
28:15what i'm saying is there's a aspect to
28:19having a mask and having your authentic
28:21self that is
28:22absolutely natural because let's face it
28:26in your private life your
28:29for example your sexuality when you
28:33visit the bathroom just out of human
28:37decency and out of just
28:38normal how we conduct ourselves that
28:41sort of thing needs to
28:42needs to be private right so
28:45so there is a natural requirement that
28:49certain parts of your
28:50life are private so
28:53i don't want to say that it's absolutely
28:56you know it's just just a criminal
28:57that's got a two-phase
28:59but it's when that two-facedness goes to
29:01an extreme level
29:03where part of what's happening in this
29:05two-phase thing is hiding
29:06behind a crime and hiding behind
29:10what what was what was buried at
29:13survey319 i mean that's obviously the
29:15extreme version of it
29:16and obviously many of us aren't quite as
29:20two-faced as that right i'm just saying
29:22i'm not saying that
29:24being having these two faces is
29:27is evil or unnatural or even unhealthy
29:30it's just that um although there needs
29:34to be a bit of a separation between the
29:36private self and the public self
29:38there can nevertheless be congruency and
29:41continuity
29:42and to the extent that there is you're a
29:44you're a healthy person you're a
29:47authentic person and i think
29:50to the extent that there's this schism
29:52between who we are inside and who we are
29:54outside you're going to have an
29:56existential crisis you're going to
29:58perhaps need to tell lies coming back to
30:01my notes here
30:03um something that christus said early on
30:07and she must be a fairly intelligent
30:09person
30:10to have gotten a degree as a
30:12psychologist
30:14she says i've never seen a case
30:18with a plea agreement and the whole
30:20thing wrapped up so quickly
30:22and i think she's got a point i think
30:25that's
30:26partly true in the sense of
30:30that did happen with the chris watts
30:31case it did wrap up
30:34unusually quickly so so that commentary
30:37is valid
30:38that criticism is true but
30:41it's not um legally speaking it's not
30:45as true as maybe she thinks
30:49she says you know i've never seen a case
30:50wrap up with a plea agreement this
30:52quickly well
30:53right up the road from frederick was
30:58um crystal lee kenny right
31:02the mistress of patrick frazee and she
31:04got a plea deal
31:05i think within two months and
31:10and and i think she's already been
31:12released from her
31:14i think she got she ended up getting
31:16something like
31:17a year and a half in prison and it's
31:20just crazy how
31:22people just aren't interested in that
31:23case it's
31:25in some ways it's ten times worse
31:26certainly the mistress in that case
31:28is someone to behold
31:31and what we know she knows what she
31:33admitted on camera
31:35to the cbi is
31:38you know it's incredible and people just
31:40don't simply don't pay attention to it
31:42in part because the media weren't
31:43allowed to because the district attorney
31:46wouldn't allow
31:47photos and so on and i think because he
31:49wanted the plea deal to go ahead
31:51and the same thing happened with the
31:52watts case the media
31:55had nothing to say to couldn't say
31:57anything about nicole kessinger
32:00and
32:04we heard nothing from the district
32:05attorney kind of until the sentencing
32:07happened and even that was a surprise
32:09because they didn't want to jeopardize
32:11the plea deal and if you remember
32:13between
32:14november 6th and november 19th
32:18um cindy watts kind of
32:21made all these appeals to the media she
32:22suddenly woke up and
32:24wanted to stop everything from happening
32:26well that just what the district
32:27attorney was afraid of
32:29so if the plea deal was announced right
32:30in the beginning cindy
32:33and the and ronnie and the watson
32:35probably would have had time
32:36to talk sense into their son i mean he
32:39does regret the plea deal now doesn't he
32:42so to say that you know i've never seen
32:44a case with a pee agreement
32:46it's not it's not really that um
32:50unique it's it's unusual but
32:53i mean as i say you had it with the
32:55patrick freizy case
33:02the difference with patrick facey was
33:04that he never admitted to what he did so
33:06it wasn't as open and shut
33:10although he also didn't testify they
33:12didn't bring any witnesses in his
33:14defense
33:14that was quite interesting um
33:18then something that i think was is kind
33:21of just
33:22worth pointing out is krista's mother
33:24was going to live with the manson family
33:27um not just that she was a fan that she
33:30she was actually going to
33:32stay with them and i think that says a
33:35little bit about
33:36christa in the sense of someone who gets
33:39caught up
33:40in in things right
33:44um and i think her mother wanting to
33:47live with the manson family is a little
33:48bit like
33:49christa living with
33:52this whole story of the chris watts
33:54thing i think
33:55there may be some kind of nostalgia even
33:58involved in that
34:00and someone on patreon lives 20 minutes
34:03from christa
34:05we're hoping to see her a little bit
34:06later i think she's having dinner
34:08uh but we might see in a couple of
34:10minutes we'll get a little bit of
34:11input from her about about krista i
34:15don't want to talk too much about
34:17about her rather than someone who's
34:19actually
34:20you know had direct contact say
34:23something
34:24then um at about five minutes 44
34:29seconds into the documentary they talk
34:31about
34:32kicking around theories in chris watts
34:35defense
34:36and all of this is happening on that
34:38channel you know you all know which one
34:40it is
34:41but think about what we're talking about
34:43someone going onto a youtube channel
34:46defending chris what saying you know
34:48what i don't think he did this
34:50and so obviously chris watts then once
34:54is sort of being um
34:58tempted to communicate because someone
35:01is saying on social
35:02media i don't think he did this i think
35:04he's innocent
35:05in other words they are acting as his
35:07defense
35:09now think about what you're talking
35:11about someone who
35:13killed his children and his wife
35:16and then blamed his wife for what he did
35:18and now you've got someone
35:20actually defending him
35:23right as a way to keep everything going
35:27to keep the circus going to keep the
35:29viewers
35:30coming back i think just think about
35:32that
35:33and think about what i said about a
35:35two-face
35:37let's just look at some of your comments
35:39um
35:40gayla dennison some woman attracted to
35:42bad boys
35:46mary rose yeah i agree um
35:52so the voice over at this point in the
35:55documentary now they've kind of finished
35:58with a backstory they now give
36:00the sort of what's happening from this
36:03point onwards
36:04and then they say that krista then had a
36:06life-changing
36:07union and you think okay so i guess this
36:10means with dylan
36:12because didn't they get engaged and
36:14that's changed the rest of her life
36:17but i mean we know that we know that
36:19ultimately
36:21her life hasn't changed because she's
36:23not even with dylan anymore
36:25so i don't know so then we see dylan at
36:2906 38 where he
36:32kind of introduces chris watts as my
36:34brother my co-author
36:36and he says i think he met chris watts
36:40in 2020 on january the 9th
36:43and he'd never heard of watts so a
36:45fairly uninformed fellow
36:49and they talk about it being against the
36:51prison code to say
36:53i didn't really know this as actually
36:55against the prison code to say
36:57what you got got up to or what got you
36:59locked up so
37:01i think you're allowed to say what
37:02you're accused of but it's quite weird
37:05that
37:05there's a kind of a prison code and one
37:07wonders what that's all about is that
37:09to prevent the prisoners from getting
37:10emotional themselves
37:13and being you know i don't know one
37:15wonders what that's all about
37:16what i'm going to do now i've got a lot
37:19of pages here to go through
37:21just taken from notes from the
37:23documentary what i'm going to do now is
37:24i'm going to read
37:26sheridan cadel's letter to chris watts
37:29on the 14th of march
37:322019 just because i think it's quite
37:34interesting
37:35how she engaged with him right in the
37:37beginning i'm also going to read
37:39chris watts letter to her right
37:42and this was provided in the documentary
37:45so
37:46he writes hello cherylin
37:49i'm sorry i haven't written you back
37:51when you wrote me the first two letters
37:54so i think
37:59that means that cherylin had written to
38:01him three times
38:03trying to engage him right repeatedly
38:05trying to engage him and then on the
38:07third letter he responds
38:09and then he says you have to imagine i'm
38:11very skeptical about who i write back
38:13and when i saw you i started to write i
38:16wanted to write a book
38:18i said no oh when sorry i got that wrong
38:21he says
38:25i'm very skeptical about who i write
38:27back and when i saw you wanted to write
38:29a book i said no
38:31exclamation mark right
38:34um that kind of reminds me of what he
38:37said about
38:39nicole kissinger in those disputed
38:41letters where he said see ya
38:42that she said see you gotcha exclamation
38:46marking quotes is the same kind of thing
38:49um way that he writes so anyway so
38:54she tells him that she wants to write a
38:55book and
38:57and then he doesn't respond now bear in
38:59mind
39:01on in march this is about a month after
39:04the
39:05second confession where he spilled the
39:07beans to
39:09to bomb over um
39:12coda and tammy lee remember i think he
39:16had a bad feeling after that i think he
39:18felt
39:19he felt played i think he didn't know
39:21that they were going to release that to
39:22the public
39:24and then they did and so now he wanted
39:25to he wanted control
39:28over his own story and he thought he
39:29could get that with sherilyn
39:31big mistake but he kind of wanted
39:35to answer all of that
39:38and sharon sort of was approaching him
39:41at the
39:42an opportune time and and that's that's
39:44what prompted this letter
39:45then he said although this letter you
39:48just sent me felt like god was giving me
39:50an
39:50ultimatum to write you back i didn't
39:53know you asked for a ministry so that
39:58so that changed my perspective on
40:00everything so i think
40:01um chris watts there's a part of him
40:04that's genuinely i mean he's reaching
40:06for some kind of
40:08guidance and he feels like he's getting
40:09some from god
40:11and so god is basically the
40:14the common area between watts and
40:17cadal and he feels like this is a sign
40:20from god
40:21and i think part of that i think kadel
40:24is
40:24is is through i don't know whether she's
40:26running with it or
40:28maybe she felt led by god genuinely i
40:30don't know but
40:31that's certainly a way that she gets
40:33into
40:34um his good books to put it that way i
40:37wish i could move this
40:39screen because because this screen's in
40:41front of that screen
40:42and then he says um maybe i must just do
40:45this
40:47he said when the fbi and cbi spoke to me
40:50i had no idea they were coming i felt
40:53like
40:54it was god telling me to clear my wife's
40:56name
40:57since so many people were confused about
40:59and then that's the end of the exit but
41:01so chris watts at this point is
41:03functioning on what he thinks god wants
41:05him to
41:06do he's sort of he's not thinking for
41:08himself he's
41:09although he sort of is he's sort of
41:11thinking whoa
41:12um uh does god want me to do this right
41:16and so um he thinks sherilyn coming up
41:20to him
41:21is also part of god's plan for his life
41:23kind of thing
41:24and then look how that turned out do you
41:26think do you think ultimately it was
41:28i mean what do you guys think of that do
41:30you think cadil coming into his life
41:32was god's plan for him
41:36let's just read some of your comments
41:38watch the shadow proven
41:42teddy skull chris admitted to planning
41:44and thinking about the crime for weeks
41:45before so
41:46not a moment of insanity absolutely um
41:50something that was brought up was chris
41:52fantasizing about
41:54what he's going to do to shanann and
41:57that doesn't surprise me at all in a
41:59premeditated scenario you might
42:02not like the word fantasizing you might
42:04think that that is
42:06um sick or crazy or whatever but i think
42:09it's absolutely par for the course
42:11in in a premeditated scenario i think
42:13scott
42:14peterson had the same thing going on i
42:17think
42:18right next to it's like a mirror image
42:20right next to
42:22the the fantasy of being with in
42:25scott peterson's case amber frey is the
42:28fantasy of getting rid of the
42:30obstacle to that right i think
42:33right next to the fantasy of being with
42:35nicole kissinger that is
42:38for him is the fantasy of getting rid of
42:41the obstacle to that and for him it was
42:44i think the number one target was
42:48hi stephanie good to see you here i
42:50think his number one target was actually
42:52nico it's quite important to bear that
42:53in mind
42:54chris what's his number one target was
42:56nico and i think if he could have
42:58gotten rid of nico and somehow just made
43:00nico
43:01disappear then his family would still be
43:03here i think that's something worth
43:05bearing in mind but then because he
43:08couldn't get a
43:09rid of nika the way he did and we'll get
43:11to that with the oxy
43:12narrative which i think is something
43:15worth talking about
43:16in this documentary that's certainly of
43:18value
43:20to discuss um something that's not
43:22really been discussed in the mainstream
43:24media you don't really see
43:26the oxy part in the mainstream media
43:29it seems like the mainstream media
43:31dismissed that as
43:33part of the fluff and nonsense of the
43:35watts case right
43:39but then he also saw thought well you
43:41know the kids are also
43:42if shenan's not going to be around then
43:44the kids are also
43:46an obstacle and so it does become a
43:49fantasy
43:49in in a criminal psychology to
43:53do what they're doing in other words
43:55something that you might think
43:56of as of in an unpleasant way
43:59planning this horrible crime does become
44:02kind of a fantasy because
44:03what's the reward at the end of that
44:05action
44:07well there's there's the sexual reward
44:10there's the the reward of
44:13kind of a happily ever after do you know
44:15what i'm saying
44:16so we're gonna speak to stephanie in a
44:19moment just get
44:20some of her comments in a moment because
44:22she's had some direct communication with
44:25christa
44:26i'm also going to ask stephanie in a
44:27moment what stephanie thinks about that
44:30do you think that christa regrets going
44:33on to this show
44:37one thing that i think supports the fact
44:38that she may regret it is
44:40we haven't really heard from christa we
44:42haven't heard of giving interviews about
44:44going on the show i read an article
44:48on fox news and then at the end of it it
44:51said
44:52um something about christa
44:55um refused to comment on the story or
44:59something like that
45:00christa um didn't wish
45:04to participate in a story that seems to
45:07suggest to me that
45:08she may have changed her mind after
45:11participating in it
45:17so um let's go back to
45:22so i hope you got that uh stephanie
45:24we're going to be
45:25engaging with you a little bit later on
45:28this
45:29um so let's go into the next page here
45:37uh i think i've got a letter from
45:43from christa that's what i actually want
45:45to show you it's a letter it's the first
45:46letter
45:47christa writes to chris watts and it's
45:50it was shown fleetingly in the
45:53documentary
45:54it was dated wednesday may 6
45:572020 and i don't actually know how many
46:01times she wrote to him but this is what
46:02she wrote
46:04dear chris i hope it's okay to call you
46:05chris please let me know if you
46:07rather want to be called christopher my
46:10name is christa however
46:11everyone calls me chrissy i've been
46:13waiting a long time to write to you
46:15and i hope that you will write back and
46:17we can be friends i'm sure that
46:19you have a lot of friends but i can
46:21really use a friend
46:23and maybe you can use a friend too i
46:25want to start off by saying i'm aware of
46:27your case and i'm truly sorry
46:29for the loss of your family and all the
46:32suffering you may be going through
46:34i won't ask you any questions regarding
46:36what happened however i'm here
46:37if you need a friend and someone to talk
46:40to i'm hoping that we will tell each
46:42other
46:44that what we tell each other will remain
46:45between us
46:47right so what do you think of that
46:51opening you know i'm here for you i want
46:53a friend
46:54and don't worry everything that's
46:57between us is going to remain between us
47:00and then you know the next thing she was
47:02on okay magazine the daily mail and
47:04now on this so you know what do you
47:08think about that
47:10um so before the the whole thing even
47:15showed
47:15i thought well you know wasn't
47:19one or two people played in this this
47:22thing and
47:23that is actually brought up right at the
47:24end of the
47:26um of the documentary of the self
47:29some made secrets documentaries actually
47:31brought up
47:32you know dylan's not very happy um
47:35and so on you can watch it yourself to
47:38get that
47:39that aspect of it um
47:42they they also showed that the picture
47:44that
47:45krista put of herself in her letter
47:49but it's just like one of a lot of fan
47:51mail that he's getting so
47:53whether you want to point your finger at
47:55crystal or anyone else um
47:57thousands if not more maybe tens of
48:00thousands of people
48:01wrote to chris watts probably trying to
48:03do the same thing
48:05[Music]
48:07and what are we talking about well isn't
48:08it trying to make money or trying to
48:11get some benefit out of um
48:16getting direct access to chris watts and
48:18then being his mouthpiece
48:20but then also
48:24kind of interpreting what they think is
48:27the real story and then getting
48:29getting attention getting prestige
48:31getting kind of a sense of credibility i
48:34guess
48:35from that right um
48:39a lot of people ask me you know
48:42would i want to speak to chris watts and
48:44what would i ask him and
48:47you know am i going to speak to him and
48:50um
48:52i i find it a bit of a funny question
48:54because
48:56i wouldn't expect him to be honest with
48:57me it would be the same thing with
48:59everybody else i mean
49:00it would be a version um but i think
49:04i think he wouldn't want to talk to me
49:05because if he's reading in my books he
49:07would know
49:08what i think of him and what i know and
49:11what i've analyzed and what i've said
49:13so i don't think he would um i don't
49:16think he would want to talk to me
49:18if he approached me and he said i want
49:19you to tell my story
49:23that would be a little bit different and
49:25i certainly wouldn't be opposed to
49:27a kind of a thing of well
49:31provide your version of events and i'll
49:33provide it verbatim
49:34but then i also reserve the right to
49:36interpret it and i don't know if he
49:38would like that but
49:39certainly what i expected cadal to do
49:42was basically provide his narrative as
49:45is meanwhile i don't think she quite did
49:48that
49:49um also i think he thought it was going
49:52to be a spiritual narrative and
49:53really wasn't um so what is quite
49:56interesting is
49:58um so chris is saying you know i'm not
50:01going to ask you any questions well i'm
50:02sure that suited
50:03chris chris watts very well but
50:06interestingly he
50:07passed on so for chris watts he sort of
50:11thought you know what i don't really
50:13for whatever reason i don't really want
50:15to handle this person so he gave
50:18um christa's letter to dylan and then
50:21dylan
50:22took it further and then
50:26immediately said you know wow you said
50:28his name seven times in the letter
50:30and mine twice quite astute from dylan
50:33you know
50:34you're writing to me but everything's
50:36about chris
50:38and so he was actually right in his
50:40early
50:41things and then and then um things
50:44developed from there
50:45you know crystal realized wow this guy's
50:47quite sensitive i better be careful
50:49and so um she had to be careful
50:54talking all the time about chris watts
50:56and and trying to show a bit of interest
50:58in dylan
51:00um dylan was apparently doing time from
51:022007
51:04um and then it just says that he studied
51:06every scripture in the bible
51:09so so a little bit of information about
51:12him
51:15and then i think christa said religion
51:17is so powerful
51:18there's no way he could have committed
51:20these crimes
51:22that's what krista said that the
51:25religion that she
51:26experienced in these letters was
51:29convincing to her so i think in in the
51:32same way that
51:34religion formed a bit of a common ground
51:37in a genuine way
51:39with christa and dylan and chris watts
51:42as genuine as i guess you can expect
51:45um i think it was also there with cadal
51:49but perhaps in a somewhat less genuine
51:51way
51:54let's just look at some of your comments
51:55stephanie she wrote what she did
51:57to get him to write to her and he still
52:00didn't
52:01stephanie i'm glad i made it i enjoy our
52:04lives okay
52:05uh kitty the only thing with nk i don't
52:08get is
52:09her looking up shenan water here earlier
52:13she hadn't even met chris watts yet
52:15kitschy there some theories on that one
52:17theory is that
52:18that was from an old work phone and that
52:21that phone actually belonged to someone
52:22else at the time
52:24um another theory is that um nicole
52:27kissinger was originally
52:29working in i've heard this i don't know
52:32if it's proved
52:33but working in multi-level marketing
52:35should be only natural to look up a
52:37competitor
52:38in the wellness industry heather west
52:40thanks a lot for that
52:42thanks for being up so late it must be
52:44about one o'clock in the morning
52:46there in the uk thanks a lot for that
52:50um
52:53kadal says actually christopher is a
52:55very good writer
52:56i can kind of agree with that he his
52:59writing is
53:00is pretty um
53:04clear it's pretty cohesive in a way
53:10but bear in mind he probably is it's not
53:13like he's
53:14writing off the cuff and then just sends
53:17off the letter i get the feeling that he
53:19does this quite meticulously that he he
53:22thinks about what he's going to write
53:23writes it down
53:24then rewrites it rewrites it again
53:27perhaps edits it
53:28and then gets it exactly the way it
53:30wants it because there's no there's no
53:31spelling mistakes there's no
53:33scratching out and of course she's got
53:35all day to write one letter
53:37bear in mind shenan did the same thing
53:39when shenan wrote her love letter
53:41she also
53:44wrote a draft and then you know
53:48changed it so one would almost get a
53:50sense that maybe
53:51he was like shenan in that respect
53:53careful
53:55in that way right but
53:58another way just of comparing it and i'm
54:00not going to do it here
54:01you know if you want to do it on your
54:03own time um
54:06compare the letters that chris watts
54:08wrote to the letters that dylan wrote to
54:10chrissy
54:11you know how readable are they what
54:13what's the subject of their
54:16correspondence how grammatically sound
54:20is dylan's letters and and then get the
54:24sense of which one
54:25can you translate to a book um which one
54:29you know does that more seamlessly
54:32um ice queen
54:36in ireland oh you're in ireland okay
54:39well people from all over the world it's
54:41it's quite amazing that what techno
54:43what technology allows you to do old old
54:46woman well what a name
54:48what a avatar i've just moved to the uk
54:50from the states
54:51it's easy to stab late okay head the
54:54west up late because my daughter gave me
54:56her old
54:57ps4 so i've been playing a game at my
55:00age what game are you playing
55:02heather queenie i think you
55:06are in australia
55:09alyssa hodgkin's high from the uk okay
55:13um
55:15[Music]
55:17so i don't know i get a bit of a funny
55:20feeling
55:21from kadel where she says i just knew
55:24christopher was guilty
55:27um and then
55:30you know when she was talking to him as
55:33this mother
55:34figure was she sort of saying that to
55:36him all the time you know i know you're
55:37guilty i know you're guilty
55:38tell me what you did or was it more like
55:41i'm sure god forgives you and um people
55:44understand
55:46you know i don't know you know um
55:49you know i think if you are trying to do
55:53what you know if you're trying to
55:56extract a narrative from chris watts you
55:58are going to
55:59have to have two faces you're gonna have
56:01to be nice to him
56:02just like the investigators were just
56:05like
56:06i mean don't point the finger to anyone
56:08and just say
56:09look coda and kaydel
56:12coda and and lee did the same thing
56:14they're all so nice to
56:16him were they nice to him because they
56:18liked him or they liked him
56:19with a nice team because they thought he
56:21was a nice guy or they were nice to him
56:23because they wanted to get something out
56:25of him or obviously the letter
56:28and the amazing thing is watches fall in
56:30for that again and again and again and
56:32again
56:33um
56:37something that um sheridan says in the
56:41show
56:41now what i find a little bit odd with
56:43sherlin kadel is
56:45she's got some useful first-hand
56:48information
56:49from chris watts but i'm not sure if i
56:52agree with it
56:53and you might say well so what you
56:57weren't there or something like that how
56:59would you know indirectly but i'll give
57:00an example
57:01she says that he said the d.a
57:04came there or
57:08the d.a came to them so so raw came
57:11to him and offered the plea deal that's
57:14his story
57:16and i know that that's not true because
57:19i've got an email with um
57:23deputy district attorney name on it
57:27it's dated and it is basically from
57:30chris watts defense lawyers saying
57:35that they prepared to admit guilt on all
57:38charges
57:40in exchange for not not getting the
57:43death penalty
57:44now i don't know whether that that email
57:46that i've seen i've got a screen grab of
57:48it
57:48those of you know me know about it and
57:51that that email i think stated
57:5426th of august really really early on
57:57somewhere around the 26th of august
57:59maybe 27
58:00but very very early on one wonders
58:04was that purposefully put on television
58:07to mislead
58:08to mislead us so in other words because
58:12um
58:13[Music]
58:15in a way i think it makes sense given
58:18what we know that that the d.a
58:20would approach him and ask for a plea
58:22deal
58:24knowing what kind of person he was and
58:26that he is an introvert and he would
58:27want to
58:28avoid trial but i mean that's another
58:31area where
58:32i think there's a little bit of
58:33uncertainty that email shows that the
58:36his defense asks for the plea deal
58:39but i think there's another possibility
58:41and this possibility is
58:42quite complicated and goes like this
58:46weld county don't want this case to go
58:48to court
58:49while county employs the district
58:51attorney but also
58:53the public defenders right
58:57in other words the people employed to
58:58defend chris watts
59:00and so it's in their interests
59:04world count is interest to
59:08it or isn't it in the in wild county's
59:10interest to nudge the public defenders
59:12to say
59:13we need to put this case away kind of
59:15thing
59:16and i've got a feeling chris watts may
59:19have admitted what he did to his own
59:21attorneys once that happened
59:22they said you know we obviously can't
59:24defend you in court
59:26on this charge of what you did to your
59:28children based on what you've told us
59:30um you have to get a different attorney
59:33for that to happen
59:34so i just wonder whether it didn't
59:36happen like
59:38the district attorney
59:41went to the defense
59:45and said you know is there a way that
59:47that we can get a plea deal here
59:49and then they got that and then
59:53and then they the defense sent the email
59:55and then it looks like it went from that
59:57point to the other
59:58but i do think even us having this
1:00:00conversation even us
1:00:01saying where did this plea deal the idea
1:00:04for the plea deal originate
1:00:07um
1:00:10i think the fact that chris watts took
1:00:12the p deal shows that he is not a very
1:00:14smart man but i think the
1:00:18the fact that it was actually carried
1:00:20off is quite clever forever
1:00:22did that and who do you think it
1:00:24benefited
1:00:25to do that
1:00:29uh donny spring and nicky told his
1:00:31lawyers about his guilt within two weeks
1:00:35yes that's true
1:00:38i don't know if you follow what i'm
1:00:39saying if he tells his lawyers what he
1:00:42did
1:00:42they can't represent him in a proper
1:00:44defense
1:00:46right they can't say okay so he didn't
1:00:49do that
1:00:50they're not allowed to so the only way
1:00:52he can do that is if
1:00:53he um gets different representation
1:00:58um they may also have said okay just
1:01:01tell us what happened and then he did
1:01:04you know maybe that's also what happened
1:01:06i mean
1:01:07he did something like that with with the
1:01:09fbi
1:01:10so
1:01:14but he no mate says it did when anadarko
1:01:17were being sold off yeah i mean that was
1:01:19something that
1:01:20that was definitely happening there was
1:01:22also a lot of politics going on at that
1:01:24time
1:01:24a lot of people forget that the day that
1:01:27chris watts
1:01:28um the plea deal was announced was the
1:01:30same day
1:01:31that colorado voted on those setbacks
1:01:34those that those midterms were that
1:01:37exact same day
1:01:38and i think a lot of the media were
1:01:40watered down and diluted
1:01:43the amount of media that would have been
1:01:44present in court were now
1:01:46scattered covering other things like the
1:01:49midterms right
1:01:51and i think that was done intentionally
1:01:54another question to ask is whether the
1:01:55whole trend bulb thing
1:01:57wasn't also by design someone trying to
1:02:01mislead the public not
1:02:05just randomly but actually organized
1:02:08i i don't like to talk in that area
1:02:09because it i'd rather talk about what we
1:02:12know for a fact than conspiracies you
1:02:14know
1:02:14um then so
1:02:19so that's that that's right then um
1:02:23sherilyn says he needs the stability
1:02:26he needs the stability of being told
1:02:31i didn't finish the quote that i was
1:02:33writing about i think i think what i
1:02:34wrote was
1:02:35he needs the stability stability of
1:02:38being told
1:02:40that it's okay to talk about what he did
1:02:44and that's something that is
1:02:47probably the the worst advice that he
1:02:51can be given
1:02:51you know um for any criminal
1:02:55just from a criminal's perspective um
1:02:58any defense lawyer will say
1:03:00don't talk to anyone except me
1:03:03but don't talk about what happened say
1:03:06the least say the minimum a lot of
1:03:07defense attorneys advise
1:03:09their clients not to
1:03:12testify at their own trials patrick
1:03:14frazee didn't
1:03:16um chris watts wants to know
1:03:20um o.j simpson didn't and some people
1:03:24who did
1:03:24made a mess jody arias oscar stories
1:03:27look where they are now
1:03:29um so she says he needs the
1:03:32stability of being told that it's okay
1:03:35to talk about what you did
1:03:39but it's not it hasn't been good for him
1:03:41i don't think
1:03:42him talking about what's been happening
1:03:44has created stability in the least
1:03:47but i think what he needed he was being
1:03:50given in a sort of artificial way
1:03:53talk about what you've done i'm sure god
1:03:54will forgive you you know it doesn't
1:03:56matter what you've done
1:03:57there's no unforgivable sin kind of
1:03:59thing
1:04:00um in terms of criminal acts kind of
1:04:03thing
1:04:04and and then that's going to be
1:04:05reassuring i think he desperately wants
1:04:07to hear that
1:04:08so you know in the same way chris watts
1:04:10is telling people what they
1:04:12want to hear he's also been told what he
1:04:13wants to hear so
1:04:15sheridan visits watch in april 2019 and
1:04:18bear in mind the timing of that
1:04:20so she wrote letters to him eventually
1:04:23answered in mid-march and then she
1:04:25eventually visited him in april 2019
1:04:27and all of this is kind of he wants to
1:04:30get back at what happened
1:04:32he feels like his lost face as a result
1:04:34of that
1:04:37interview with coda and and lee
1:04:41and it going public you know he wants to
1:04:45and he kind of undermines that in in in
1:04:48a way you know he says you know
1:04:50somebody said to her i never said to the
1:04:52fbi
1:04:54he's trying to sort of undermine that in
1:04:55a way anyway
1:04:57kadel says i was so nervous i was
1:04:59shaking inside
1:05:00talking about the first meeting shanann
1:05:03was
1:05:05the first girl he ever dated i think
1:05:08that
1:05:09speaks volumes you know if she's the
1:05:11first girl
1:05:12he's ever dated then then meeting
1:05:16someone else is going to be
1:05:17is going to be quite exciting and i
1:05:19think a lot of people don't realize that
1:05:21a lot of people
1:05:22say you know what why didn't you just
1:05:24get a divorce why didn't you know why
1:05:26was nicole kissing just such a big deal
1:05:28because it had so little experience
1:05:33and besides that because
1:05:37shenan was the first girl he dated he
1:05:39didn't know what being broken up with
1:05:41was like and he didn't know what to
1:05:42expect from shanann
1:05:44notgate it just happened um and and
1:05:47i think he was fully aware of what he
1:05:48was doing he was cheating on his
1:05:50pregnant wife
1:05:51what pregnant woman wouldn't go um
1:05:55wouldn't wouldn't uh be extremely upset
1:05:58and extremely volatile under those
1:06:01circumstances
1:06:02he knew it
1:06:06something that kaydel also says is that
1:06:08he said the best
1:06:09of his life was his wedding day was it
1:06:13do you agree with that do you think the
1:06:15best day of his life really was his
1:06:16wedding day i mean
1:06:17that's a sort of thing you might say to
1:06:19your mother or to a mother figure but
1:06:21do you really think the best day of his
1:06:23life was his wedding day
1:06:25his own parents weren't there shanann
1:06:27was upset about
1:06:29the food that that his mother was going
1:06:32to provide
1:06:34you know because she was i think glucose
1:06:35intolerant or something
1:06:37and so you know his own family
1:06:41didn't attend and i think they were in
1:06:43debt after that wedding day
1:06:44do you really think that was the best
1:06:46day of his life
1:06:48do you really think he thought about it
1:06:50that way
1:06:59and so you know you've kind of got to
1:07:01ask
1:07:02so if it wasn't the best of his life
1:07:04what was the best of his life well
1:07:06maybe a day like when they went to the
1:07:09great sand dunes together maybe that had
1:07:11become his new best day what do you guys
1:07:14think
1:07:15so now we're gonna get you quite a um
1:07:18[Music]
1:07:20i've thrown some of my notes on the
1:07:22ground
1:07:23sorry guys
1:07:27um now we're going to get you some
1:07:31quite interesting uh quite an
1:07:34interesting area i found this quite
1:07:35interesting
1:07:36in terms of the documentary
1:07:39cadal says there's a quote you're
1:07:41watching a person who has no control
1:07:43over his life anymore so she's basically
1:07:46saying
1:07:47you know she's visiting watts and has
1:07:50the sense that
1:07:51that he's very vulnerable he's lost
1:07:55everything he's got no
1:07:56control right meaning
1:07:59he doesn't even have control over his
1:08:00own story
1:08:02he's lost his freedom he's totally
1:08:05vulnerable and then she goes into that
1:08:08situation
1:08:09what do you think happens i'm just
1:08:11saying think about those words
1:08:13and then ultimately what happened she
1:08:16says you're watching a person who has no
1:08:17control
1:08:18over his life anymore and so what is
1:08:21cadal able to do within that situation
1:08:25whatever youtube has been able to do
1:08:27within that situation
1:08:29now as i say the whole thing about
1:08:34the oxy the oxy story
1:08:37it's presented here as news and
1:08:40and something that is part of this
1:08:43documentary
1:08:44um but i posted it on prime
1:08:47rocket on october 5th 2019. so
1:08:51it's a little bit less than a year and a
1:08:52half ago it's um
1:08:55you know it's over a year ago
1:08:58and um you know i actually contacted
1:09:01crime online at the time
1:09:04i'll give you a little bit of backstory
1:09:05camille as a former corrections officer
1:09:08i want to say that inmates very often
1:09:10told stories to each other until the
1:09:12story sounded believable
1:09:14just like an audience that makes sense i
1:09:16mean that's a really interesting point
1:09:18that they would
1:09:19test their stories on
1:09:22fellow inmates and then get a sense of
1:09:26what
1:09:26makes sense i think what i picked up
1:09:29very early on from chris watts
1:09:31especially in the
1:09:32second confession at dodge correctional
1:09:35was that
1:09:37he was talking about i wasn't in control
1:09:39and of course that's a legal
1:09:41standard i mean we've got that a little
1:09:43bit with uh
1:09:45jimmyka let me just get rid of this dog
1:09:51i'm just struggling a little bit to
1:09:52concentrate while he's licking my hand
1:09:54and
1:09:55um anyway he's not lying on his bed
1:09:57there can you see him
1:10:02so that's i think a better place for him
1:10:04okay so
1:10:05um
1:10:09so what i picked up during the second
1:10:12confession was him saying you know i had
1:10:14no control
1:10:16i didn't know what i was going to do
1:10:17when i woke up and so what he's trying
1:10:18to do is
1:10:20in a narrative sense take away the
1:10:22premeditation aspect the planning aspect
1:10:25the intentions aspect he's trying to
1:10:27minimize what he's doing
1:10:29and by saying he had no control it's
1:10:30like i wasn't acting with deliberation
1:10:33that was all done intentionally
1:10:35right um and i think he's getting that
1:10:40from i mean by that time he'd been in
1:10:42prison
1:10:43basically december january february
1:10:47three months and and in that time he's
1:10:50gotten a chance to interact with some
1:10:52some prisoners right cargo tran
1:10:56regular on patreon she says the best day
1:10:58for most people
1:11:00that have children is when their
1:11:02children are born okay
1:11:06good point i wonder whether he felt that
1:11:10way i mean i wonder whether there was a
1:11:12point where he thought
1:11:13that that the day that bella was born
1:11:15was his best
1:11:16his best day um
1:11:20i wonder if things had had ended
1:11:23okay in an alternate universe
1:11:26and he'd gotten together with kissinger
1:11:28and she'd
1:11:30given birth to a son would that have
1:11:31been his best day
1:11:38so so yeah so
1:11:42i contacted crime online because what
1:11:45had happened was
1:11:46at that point i don't if you remember i
1:11:48was blogging every day on crime rocket
1:11:50i was sort of setting myself up as a
1:11:54credible true crime channel someone who
1:11:56is
1:11:57very current with the news which is also
1:12:00around the time that
1:12:01you know ashley banfield had fallen away
1:12:03that actually happened about a year
1:12:05earlier
1:12:06and so i was trying to set up myself as
1:12:09the most credible
1:12:11what's channel right and it was really
1:12:14using the blog i wasn't really on
1:12:15youtube
1:12:16and then i contacted
1:12:19sorry about that
1:12:27i contacted crime online to share with
1:12:30them
1:12:30the fact that
1:12:34chris watts watson contacted me or left
1:12:37a voice recording
1:12:39uh for me to put out there about
1:12:42the the oxy right and it was within the
1:12:46context of
1:12:48um he may be in contact with sheryl and
1:12:50kadel and then her book coming out and
1:12:53the letters being released to the daily
1:12:54mail
1:12:56the us media didn't really want to touch
1:12:58that at the time
1:13:00and then these disclosures about oxy and
1:13:02then what happened almost
1:13:04immediately based on the conspiracy
1:13:07theories that were going on
1:13:08people said okay so there's oxy who gave
1:13:11him the oxy
1:13:12and so some of the early conspiracies
1:13:14were that
1:13:16that his sister jamie who i think is a
1:13:21um what's it a respiratory therapist but
1:13:25she's sort of
1:13:25involved in the medical field one of the
1:13:28first conspiracies was that she'd given
1:13:30him
1:13:31the oxy in north carolina you know she
1:13:34was like okay we're going to do this
1:13:35here
1:13:36take the oxy another one was that
1:13:39potentially
1:13:39nicole atkinson had given it to him
1:13:42another one was that his parents could
1:13:44have given it to him or even her parents
1:13:46or something like that
1:13:47and so there are all these conspiracies
1:13:49flying out and
1:13:51i've put a link to all of this current
1:13:53stuff that just going on
1:13:55in the description something i posted on
1:13:57crime rocket
1:13:59and i actually uh while i was using
1:14:01facebook at that point i put up a notice
1:14:04just saying
1:14:05anybody who talks on the subject about
1:14:09like implicating someone else you're
1:14:11going to be banned from
1:14:12the site just just taking a no-nonsense
1:14:14approach
1:14:15don't implicate anyone else chris watts
1:14:18committed this crime
1:14:19but it was this ravenous fever of who
1:14:22gave chris what's the oxy
1:14:24and there was such a furory around this
1:14:28that um i think his own parents
1:14:31contacted him and said
1:14:33you've got to set a record straight on
1:14:34this it's not fair on your sister
1:14:36it's not fair on us you need to set the
1:14:39record straight on this and
1:14:41in his letter to cable he said you know
1:14:42i'm going to go to the grave with this
1:14:44information i'm not going to
1:14:45i'm not going to say anything more about
1:14:46it and then he quickly had to
1:14:48make a u-turn on this because can you
1:14:51imagine if his own parents say you know
1:14:53you have this is unacceptable what
1:14:55you've done we're not going to visit you
1:14:56in jail
1:14:57right and then basically he
1:15:00he recorded um well first of all he
1:15:03recorded the statement which was sent to
1:15:05me and i said
1:15:06people aren't going to believe that this
1:15:07is from him i said you need to record
1:15:10his voice saying where he got the oxy
1:15:13from
1:15:14and then obviously there are people who
1:15:15didn't believe that either
1:15:17but he basically said i got the oxygen
1:15:19it was me i got it from the basement
1:15:22and a lot of people didn't know had no
1:15:24idea what
1:15:25that even meant so what was the oxy
1:15:28coming from well oxycodone is a
1:15:30oxycodone or oxycontin um
1:15:35is the classical treatment for lupus now
1:15:38even lupus sufferers will argue with you
1:15:40and say no it's not true i have lupus
1:15:42and i don't use it
1:15:43well you can google it and look at what
1:15:46some of the typical pain relieving
1:15:49drugs used to treat lupus and oxycodone
1:15:52is one of the obvious ones
1:15:55and so um i was because i
1:15:58knew the case really well i
1:16:01contacted crime online with this i
1:16:03thought it would be quite a big scoop
1:16:05in 2019 and the reporter didn't know
1:16:09what i was talking about she's like
1:16:10what what's this about oxy and i do tell
1:16:13you i said
1:16:14don't you know about you know people
1:16:17being worried about being implicated as
1:16:19and i do
1:16:21i spent like half an hour bringing her
1:16:24up to speed on the watts case this is
1:16:26someone from a
1:16:27crime channel and then
1:16:30between all of that she was sort of
1:16:32criticizing me saying something like
1:16:34why would why would he come to you like
1:16:36why would chris watts come to you
1:16:38why would they approach you who you and
1:16:41um i felt quite insulted by it because
1:16:44just like
1:16:45don't you know who i am don't you know
1:16:48about
1:16:48my work don't you know that i've written
1:16:50books and i kind of got the feeling
1:16:52she had the sneering approach of you're
1:16:55a freak
1:16:56you're a oddball you're you you're one
1:16:58of the crazy people associated with this
1:17:00case
1:17:01and i've got this very clear sneering
1:17:03snotty
1:17:05uh you know whatever but i sort of
1:17:08swallowed my pride and i just sort of
1:17:11said let's just
1:17:12deal with what the truth is here and um
1:17:15you know she said yeah but i don't
1:17:17believe you i just don't believe that he
1:17:18would do it so i said well i can play
1:17:20the recording if you don't believe me i
1:17:22can play you the recording you can
1:17:23decide for yourself what you believe
1:17:25and i said i'm just telling you the
1:17:27story and and you can decide whether you
1:17:29believe it or not and decide whether
1:17:31you're gonna
1:17:32and then she just kept sort of over and
1:17:35over again
1:17:35saying but why would he give this to you
1:17:38and eventually after about an hour i
1:17:40just said listen
1:17:41i'm pulling the story you're wasting my
1:17:44time and then she got really angry and
1:17:46said you wasted my time for an hour
1:17:48and you could actually hear her sort of
1:17:51typing in the background you could sort
1:17:52of hear
1:17:53you know that that was happening so she
1:17:55was busy writing the story
1:17:57while i was um
1:18:01while i was uh talking to her so
1:18:05in the middle of me talking to her she's
1:18:06actually writing the story
1:18:08and what i actually needed her to do was
1:18:09first listen to what i'm saying get an
1:18:11understanding
1:18:12grasp what i'm saying get past this
1:18:14thing of but why would he contact you
1:18:17and then and then you know once she's
1:18:20figured out what's going on
1:18:21then put it all together and eventually
1:18:23i just got so impatient i was just like
1:18:25look uh
1:18:26just drop it just leave it and so it
1:18:28never really made it into the mainstream
1:18:30media
1:18:30basically until now right it's not as
1:18:34though you guys didn't know about
1:18:35it people have spoken about it on social
1:18:37media about the oxy side
1:18:39and it's been a little bit on youtube
1:18:42and of course it's been in sharon
1:18:43cadel's book
1:18:44but i mean i think um
1:18:49i think that's that is certainly an
1:18:50interesting part of the
1:18:53of the narrative that comes out in seoul
1:18:56made secrets
1:18:57the thing is none of that really had to
1:18:59do with um
1:19:01dylan or christa then they don't really
1:19:03have any commentary on that either of
1:19:05them
1:19:06so that isn't really a soulmate secret
1:19:09story is it
1:19:12um beverly lawyer
1:19:15beverly um i don't know if you can hear
1:19:18me
1:19:18i've been meaning to say this to you for
1:19:20a long time
1:19:22all your comments are in all caps like
1:19:25every single comment you ever leave
1:19:27is in all caps and you're the only one
1:19:29who does that
1:19:30are you able to not do that
1:19:37patricia burns i have lupus and i would
1:19:39never use oxy
1:19:40so that's a comment i've heard a lot
1:19:44i've heard people say um
1:19:47so it's almost like he's saying i don't
1:19:50think shenan
1:19:51had oxy right i don't think shenan kept
1:19:54oxy
1:19:55or maybe ox is totally irrelevant to
1:19:57this case
1:19:59um and i guess my only
1:20:02the only thing i can kind of say to you
1:20:03that is patricia you not
1:20:05shenan um but i guess you could make the
1:20:08argument you could say
1:20:10um the oxy didn't happen it's a lie it's
1:20:14irrelevant
1:20:16and all those things you could do it um
1:20:18[Music]
1:20:20but you know the oxy does explain quite
1:20:24a few things that explains how
1:20:26he tried to go about bringing about a
1:20:28miscarriage i think twice
1:20:30we'll come back to that in a moment um
1:20:34thanks beverly i appreciate that i i
1:20:36have been meaning to say this to you for
1:20:38quite a while so i'm glad you
1:20:40um raoul sharp says oxy's nickname poor
1:20:44man's heroine
1:20:45in australia she had neck surgery
1:20:49you know
1:20:55thanks stephanie for uh for saying that
1:20:58to
1:20:58to beverly i did actually mention to
1:21:00beverly earlier
1:21:02and then nothing happened so i wanted to
1:21:04deal with it
1:21:06here so patricia says i i think she did
1:21:09not have lupus i've also heard that
1:21:11argument
1:21:12i think you're missing the point is she
1:21:15thought she had lupus so
1:21:16so whether you think she didn't have it
1:21:20i think she thought she did have it and
1:21:22you might say no i actually don't think
1:21:23she did think she had it well
1:21:25if you look at her twitter account she
1:21:27had she was following a lot of lupus
1:21:30foundations her family thought she had
1:21:33it so the reality is
1:21:35everyone thought she had it whether she
1:21:37had it or not that that was the reality
1:21:40and if you accept that then you say
1:21:42because of that there was a lot of
1:21:43anxiety
1:21:44about health about i can't eat this i
1:21:47can't eat that
1:21:49and as soon as you say i don't think she
1:21:51had lupus
1:21:52you you take away that whole narrative
1:21:54that shenan
1:21:55was justifiably to some extent worried
1:21:59she was justifiably stressed about the
1:22:01pregnancy more than
1:22:03another woman would be in that situation
1:22:06she was justifiably stressed about the
1:22:08first child that she would have or that
1:22:09you could have chore
1:22:10at all right
1:22:14stephanie says it's possible there was
1:22:16oxy in the basement
1:22:18but they'd have the remaining meds in
1:22:19containers from the
1:22:21the basement i agree with that
1:22:24that would have come out in a trial the
1:22:26contents that's in the basement a lot of
1:22:27people have
1:22:28speculated what is in all those
1:22:30containers in the basement some people
1:22:31have said
1:22:33thrive products some people have said
1:22:34other mln products some people have said
1:22:36medications
1:22:38but there's a heck of a lot of product
1:22:40in those
1:22:41um in those
1:22:45containers
1:22:46[Applause]
1:22:50then
1:22:52what did i write you her public support
1:22:54of what's on
1:22:56a d drives a wedge between her and
1:22:59her new love so
1:23:03so this is a comment i think from a
1:23:05voiceover and what what this is saying
1:23:06is
1:23:08um krista going onto
1:23:11this youtube channel repeatedly
1:23:13supporting chris watts
1:23:16started driving a wedge between christa
1:23:18and
1:23:19dylan meaning dylan started to
1:23:23not feel very good about christa
1:23:26going on to archer detective and just
1:23:29talking about chris watts the whole time
1:23:32so he was thinking i thought you loved
1:23:34me i thought you
1:23:36in a relationship with me and yet you're
1:23:37going onto this channel
1:23:40quite often just and you just
1:23:43fixated on chris what you're just
1:23:44talking about chris watch what about me
1:23:47and and of course uh dylan's a vital
1:23:50link in the chain because
1:23:52christa can only get to chris watts via
1:23:54dylan
1:23:55right so christa finds out about chris
1:23:57watts via dylan because chris watts
1:23:59isn't writing to her directly
1:24:01chris watts can talk to her on the phone
1:24:03when he's in the area
1:24:05when she's speaking to dylan so she
1:24:07needs dylan to be part of this
1:24:10this relay does that make sense and
1:24:14um
1:24:18i think chris watts liked the public
1:24:20support at that point i think he liked
1:24:21the fact
1:24:22that that they are saying that he's
1:24:25innocent
1:24:26and so that is essentially what was
1:24:28happening with that channel
1:24:30at the time is that channel was um
1:24:34appearing as chris watts's
1:24:37de facto defense in
1:24:41in lieu of no no defense lawyer right
1:24:44so chris watch's best support was coming
1:24:48from christa
1:24:49and christa had a platform on this
1:24:51particular youtube channel
1:24:53basically defending a triple murderer
1:24:55and this channel was
1:24:56giving her all the airtime because you
1:24:59know
1:25:00you can now get your you can main line
1:25:03into the chris watts story
1:25:04through this and of course the story is
1:25:06that he's innocent right
1:25:08and of course this channel is giving you
1:25:11the truth
1:25:12right um anyway
1:25:15kayla goes on to say that they're the
1:25:17mother-son type relationship
1:25:19and then she'd say he's a monster
1:25:22right she'd say our relationship was
1:25:25like a mother's son relationship but
1:25:27and then like in the next moment he's a
1:25:30monster that's i've got it written down
1:25:32in these notes
1:25:34so they sort of juxtapose we've got a
1:25:36mother-son relationship but he's a
1:25:38monster and
1:25:40[Music]
1:25:42in a in a weird way i think that's
1:25:44that's sort of how chris watts saw his
1:25:45own family
1:25:46in the sense of a father-daughter
1:25:50relationship for the
1:25:52unborn son relationship but he's a
1:25:54monster and so he gets rid of them
1:25:57i think there's a weird echo a weird
1:26:01parallel universe to the way chris watts
1:26:05[Music]
1:26:06got rid of his family because he wants
1:26:10that
1:26:11and the way people in the real world
1:26:14have been
1:26:15using the chris watts case
1:26:18to get what they want and also kind of
1:26:20flushing down their own
1:26:22integrity or flushing down their own
1:26:24just like
1:26:26um in a weird way they are there are
1:26:28many chris watsos
1:26:29themselves where you're willing to
1:26:33annihilate
1:26:34a person someone who's a criminal in
1:26:37this case
1:26:38in order to get your thing but i mean
1:26:41it's not
1:26:42actual annihilation it's social
1:26:43annihilation you you're going behind his
1:26:45back to
1:26:47to say what a monster he is
1:26:50right so what i'm trying to say is if
1:26:52you'd gone to chris watts and said you
1:26:54know what
1:26:55five months from now i'm going to go on
1:26:56television and tell people what a
1:26:58monster you are
1:26:59knowing that you don't like that term do
1:27:01you think you would have wanted to talk
1:27:02to that person
1:27:03right and this is the kind of world
1:27:06we're living in
1:27:08and that's what i'm trying to sort of
1:27:10bring your attention to is
1:27:11we we tend to point the finger and say
1:27:14chris watts is a monster psychopath
1:27:16um and and all these labels
1:27:19didn't have lupus and this is alternate
1:27:21reality
1:27:22but if you can't tell the reality of the
1:27:24watts case how can you tell the reality
1:27:26of your own life just of
1:27:27people who aren't trying to deceive you
1:27:29or people who are maybe not being
1:27:31totally honest
1:27:32but they're not being totally
1:27:34transparent but are you aware of that
1:27:35are you aware of these sort of games
1:27:37going on
1:27:38are you able to tell the difference
1:27:39between what you want to believe in
1:27:42what's actually happening
1:27:44or other people able to till that with
1:27:46you
1:27:52stephanie says please keep the language
1:27:54clean and refrain from mentioning other
1:27:56channels
1:27:56on this channel we don't like to sort of
1:27:59say
1:28:00that person is horrible and that person
1:28:03that channel is terrible
1:28:05because it's not true crime needs to be
1:28:08about true crime
1:28:09not about bad mouthing other people
1:28:12right and although this episode may feel
1:28:16like that what you're actually trying to
1:28:17do is
1:28:19address the narrative that's happening
1:28:21in terms of the chris watts case but
1:28:23without
1:28:24getting personal about it which is quite
1:28:27hard to do
1:28:28given the subject matter
1:28:31so something that sharon cadle said that
1:28:35i really agreed with or she said
1:28:37he'd now been pursue he'd never been
1:28:40pursued before
1:28:41it fed his ego right so this is all
1:28:44um dealing with kessinger and i think
1:28:47that's 100
1:28:48true i think it was a massive ego boost
1:28:51to him
1:28:52that kissinger kind of chose him out of
1:28:54all the
1:28:55all the other guys in the in the office
1:28:57between all the
1:28:58operators in this male dominated
1:29:00environment kissinger
1:29:02noticed him and felt a certain way
1:29:04towards him
1:29:06right i see quite a few
1:29:09um uh people's messages are being
1:29:12deleted guys just keep your language
1:29:14clean guys
1:29:16nikki i believe he's guilty and he had
1:29:18help
1:29:20teresa looking for what makes people
1:29:23think that they think
1:29:27some people become addicted to oxy then
1:29:30can't afford it so they turn to
1:29:32okay i've seen that hundreds of times
1:29:34coron engelhardt i'm going to admit that
1:29:36it's the accent there i said it
1:29:42the accent what do you mean
1:29:46okay teresa you're so right nick we do
1:29:48not have the right to judge
1:29:50but for the grace of god walk i
1:29:53you know on that old topic of judgment
1:29:55they say you shouldn't judge a book by
1:29:57its cover well you should
1:29:58you should judge your book by its cover
1:30:00and its content so
1:30:02i think we should judge and we
1:30:05and but we should be discerning in our
1:30:08judgment so judge based on
1:30:10knowledge not ignorance i don't think
1:30:12it's
1:30:13true to say we shouldn't judge i mean
1:30:15don't judge shallowly based on
1:30:17stereotypes and don't
1:30:18just be judgmental all the time but you
1:30:22do need to
1:30:22exercise your judgment in terms of your
1:30:25discernment i prefer the word
1:30:26discernment
1:30:28i don't think we use our discernment
1:30:30enough
1:30:31and maybe a reason for that is because
1:30:33people are told don't judge
1:30:35we should judge but not judge discern
1:30:38use your discernment
1:30:40use your knowledge educate yourself pay
1:30:43attention
1:30:44um you know does that make sense
1:30:48so he'd been pursued he'd never been
1:30:51pursued before
1:30:53and it fed his ego you know and so
1:30:55getting all these messages from
1:30:57ginger and we know the kind of messages
1:31:01they went you've got a again a kind of a
1:31:03weird parallel
1:31:04i think in the same way that his ego was
1:31:07massaged
1:31:08and the sort of content he was getting
1:31:10on his phone from kissinger
1:31:12i wonder whether that wasn't the same
1:31:13between christa and dylan
1:31:18i mean that is referenced in soulmate
1:31:20secrets the kind of
1:31:22letters that they were writing to one
1:31:23another right
1:31:26and in that area dylan then gets caught
1:31:28up thinking that she really likes him
1:31:30and it's quite exciting right
1:31:32i think that's kind of a kindergarten
1:31:35101
1:31:36way of manipulating a man is to that
1:31:40way it's effective but it's also
1:31:43kind of a shallow way you know it's not
1:31:44necessarily genuine
1:31:46um big sigh from timmy
1:31:52how many pages have you got one two
1:31:54three
1:31:55four five
1:31:59six seven eight
1:32:02pages to go but they there's not really
1:32:06much written on each of them so don't
1:32:07worry too much
1:32:09so something else that cherylin said
1:32:12chris uses religion in an attempt to
1:32:14manipulate
1:32:15her um so i don't think that was
1:32:19cherylin's words i think that was
1:32:22the narrator of the show saying
1:32:25chris uses religion in an attempt to
1:32:27manipulate her
1:32:29and i think that's true but i also think
1:32:31it's used the opposite way as well
1:32:33that other people used religion to try
1:32:36and manipulate him
1:32:39so i wrote here she wasn't manipulating
1:32:42him question mark
1:32:44and then he was blaming the dark spirits
1:32:47it almost worked at times that's
1:32:49something that sherlin
1:32:50said so chris watts is trying to
1:32:56control the narrative but also recast
1:32:58the narrative where
1:33:00he didn't premeditate he didn't plan
1:33:03he didn't have a motive and
1:33:06all of this is just because of dog
1:33:08spirits and
1:33:10she says it almost worked i think it has
1:33:11worked with some people where people
1:33:13think
1:33:14i can't understand chris watts this must
1:33:15be diabolical and and
1:33:17wasn't this person involved in their
1:33:19cult and this and that and the next
1:33:20thing
1:33:21and then they get they totally get lost
1:33:23from the whole true crime thing
1:33:27so just a question i've written here he
1:33:30trusted cadal to tell his story
1:33:32did she and i think you can answer that
1:33:36in two ways
1:33:36you can answer that in a sort of naive
1:33:39way and say
1:33:40um chris watts trusted cadal to tell his
1:33:44story
1:33:45did she know but you can also say
1:33:48it from another perspective of um did
1:33:51she tell his story while she did it
1:33:52she she told kind of her version of his
1:33:56story which
1:33:57which um i mean i think one
1:34:00the only thing let's put it this way
1:34:04worse than sheridan cable um
1:34:07telling just telling his story the way
1:34:10it is
1:34:11which i think wouldn't have been a very
1:34:13good book i'm talking about
1:34:15with all the spiritual nonsense in it
1:34:19um that would have been the worst
1:34:22possible
1:34:22book on this case it's just you know
1:34:25that kind of thing and
1:34:27we'll see if this book from chris watts
1:34:29and and dylan is going to see the light
1:34:31of david devotional
1:34:32do you think people are going to buy
1:34:34that book
1:34:35maybe they will you know out of a
1:34:37curiosity value i mean
1:34:39you know shane day bell wrote books
1:34:42about
1:34:43certain religious topics and how well
1:34:46did they sell
1:34:48um something that did come out of
1:34:51somewhat secrets that i thought was
1:34:53somewhat interesting
1:34:55was in terms of like what was
1:34:58what is his life actually like behind
1:35:00bars what
1:35:02what do we actually learn about
1:35:05the reality like what insights do you
1:35:08actually get from the show
1:35:09was just a little bit of info about
1:35:14them playing basketball together
1:35:17and apparently they kind of won the
1:35:19dodge basketball championship so dylan
1:35:21and
1:35:22chris watts formed this team and i think
1:35:24dylan was a better
1:35:25basketball player i think he's also
1:35:27younger
1:35:28than um chris watts i think he's
1:35:32just a younger guy and i think he said
1:35:35something but he scored 23 points and
1:35:37what scored 11 but they basically
1:35:39won the dodge basketball championship
1:35:43um i find that that whole thing a little
1:35:45bit difficult to imagine because
1:35:47on the one end they're sort of sketching
1:35:49these inmates as
1:35:51their lives are at risk certainly chris
1:35:53watson's life is at risk
1:35:54and then the next thing they're playing
1:35:55basketball together so i don't know
1:35:59just just my analytical mind working
1:36:02over time
1:36:03cassio says introverts live in their own
1:36:05world stephanie has just put
1:36:07a link to i think it's the two facebooks
1:36:10thanks a lot for that
1:36:11renee buyer's remorse chris watch
1:36:13learned a valuable lesson keep your
1:36:16okay theresa payne
1:36:26james is a 12 did you ever think about
1:36:29doing a podcast
1:36:31um james at this point i'm narrating
1:36:35audio books on patreon and it's
1:36:38you know after this show i'm going to be
1:36:41doing
1:36:42a seven page chapter and it just chews
1:36:45up my
1:36:46my voice
1:36:50so i mean i've come close to doing that
1:36:52with my almost daily youtube videos
1:36:56and then narrating the chapters on
1:36:58patreon
1:36:59on like the the five dollar tier's got
1:37:01slightly shorter audio books and the
1:37:04ten dollar tier longer audio books
1:37:11um justine myers joyner i think people
1:37:14hear story in a different perspective i
1:37:16don't believe anything he says
1:37:18justine i think it's good to
1:37:22sort of have that mindset of think
1:37:24critically about everything he says but
1:37:26i do believe some of the things he says
1:37:28i think
1:37:29for example the oxy narrative makes
1:37:32sense
1:37:32for quite a few reasons i think there
1:37:34was oxy in the basement
1:37:35i think he people um
1:37:39probably will find this weird to say but
1:37:41i think
1:37:42he was a gentle murderer meaning
1:37:45he didn't want to um
1:37:49hurt his family when he killed him
1:37:53that might and so you say he's a monster
1:37:56but you know if you keep that mindset
1:37:58that is a monster i'm not saying it's
1:37:59not a monster but i'm saying
1:38:01the label is not very helpful so if you
1:38:04take this whole idea of
1:38:06that he wants to commit this crime he
1:38:09wants to commit the crime but he doesn't
1:38:11want to
1:38:12hurt them unnecessarily you know at the
1:38:15end of it they're
1:38:15not going to be alive but he doesn't
1:38:17want to unnecessarily hurt them
1:38:19and so what's the best way in his mind
1:38:21his criminal mind
1:38:23of bringing this about it's using a
1:38:26sedative
1:38:27a pain killer and you know his first use
1:38:31of that is with chennai that's his
1:38:32original target
1:38:34and the target isn't actually shenan it
1:38:36is
1:38:37nico right and then it escalates from
1:38:41there
1:38:42so you know i think if you if you want
1:38:44to get the proper story of chris watts
1:38:46you've got to
1:38:47a lot of people just see it at the end
1:38:49game they see
1:38:50what happened to shenanigans it's
1:38:52horrific and
1:38:54what happened at the well side and it is
1:38:55horrific but
1:38:57that's not um that's not the whole story
1:39:00it it slowly escalated over time it
1:39:03started with
1:39:04that nico's the problem that that
1:39:06shenan's pregnant and nico's a problem
1:39:08how do i get rid of nico
1:39:10shenan doesn't want to terminate her
1:39:12pregnancy so now
1:39:14now what do i do and so now must he
1:39:17terminate shanann to get rid of nico
1:39:19that's kind of how it progressed right
1:39:21and we come after us and say
1:39:23why didn't he just get a divorce he was
1:39:25trying to
1:39:26he's trying to and then he made the
1:39:28decision to
1:39:30take the route that he took
1:39:38so the whole thing about blaming the dog
1:39:40spirits i mean
1:39:42when you look at the fun data review
1:39:43that wasn't going on at all he doesn't
1:39:45say
1:39:46anyway let's forget about that um
1:39:54unaware or don't believe um
1:39:57i think that's a reference to dylan that
1:40:00he was either unaware or didn't believe
1:40:02that chris watts did
1:40:04commit the crime or something like that
1:40:06so until
1:40:08the present day dylan believes that
1:40:10chris watts is
1:40:12innocent um and
1:40:15doesn't want to talk about anything so
1:40:17this is the to me the
1:40:18the huge irony of still made secrets
1:40:22the the cell mate so christ is not
1:40:24technically
1:40:25the cell mate cheryl and cadilla even
1:40:28less so
1:40:29so the actual cell mate and this is
1:40:31disclosed right at the end of the
1:40:32document you basically says
1:40:34i don't really want to talk about
1:40:35anything we spoke about
1:40:38i don't want to you know it's kind of
1:40:41private between chris watts and me
1:40:42i'm not going to talk about what he so
1:40:45you've got this weird
1:40:46honor amongst thieves in a sense where
1:40:50um he wants to
1:40:54maintain his friendship which he thinks
1:40:57is genuine which he believes is real
1:41:01with chris watts he wants to maintain
1:41:03this
1:41:04thing bear in mind he's probably also
1:41:06sent things to chris watts about
1:41:08himself and so he wants to maintain his
1:41:10privacy this confidentiality
1:41:13and just think of the irony of that and
1:41:16then
1:41:16nobody else does everyone else wants to
1:41:19talk about
1:41:20what was perhaps confidential and let
1:41:23everyone know let's tell the world about
1:41:25it
1:41:26um so this was
1:41:30narrated by sheridan cadill in the
1:41:32documentary and
1:41:34see what you think about it i wrote my
1:41:36own thoughts
1:41:37he says and this is sort of going
1:41:39through the facts of the case from
1:41:41kadal's perspective she says she says
1:41:43that he said that
1:41:45he put bella and cece to bed and then
1:41:48waited
1:41:48and and then she sort of refers to
1:41:51something that he said
1:41:52i don't know whether he said this to her
1:41:54whether she's just
1:41:56citing the discovery but she said you
1:41:58know i knew that was the last
1:42:00time i was going to put them to bed that
1:42:01night and i think he even said that on
1:42:04the sermon on the porch
1:42:05i'm talking about it was traumatic
1:42:08having to put them
1:42:09to bed tonight or whatever right um
1:42:14do you think he did do you think chris
1:42:16watts put
1:42:17his children to bed that night that the
1:42:20night of
1:42:22august 12th do you think bella and cece
1:42:25were put to bed
1:42:27do you think they were sort of bathed
1:42:29and
1:42:30and then he put them to bed did you
1:42:32think that happened
1:42:35good night kitty um they had insurance
1:42:40barbara you're right oxycodone isn't a
1:42:42good way to
1:42:43induce a miscarriage and and he did fail
1:42:47so no one's saying that that that was
1:42:49and that i think is a good
1:42:51indicator for you know
1:42:54not the not a very clever criminal you
1:42:57know he wasn't
1:42:58using a very good system he was using
1:43:00something that was accessible and
1:43:01available
1:43:03um but i think it shows you you're
1:43:05dealing with a fairly clumsy character
1:43:07and that
1:43:09plays out in the later events here
1:43:15stephanie says they may have been
1:43:16unconscious that's what i i think i
1:43:18think that
1:43:20so you've got to ask um during the 111
1:43:23minute conversation with nicole
1:43:25kissinger
1:43:26from nine o'clock relatively early till
1:43:2811 o'clock
1:43:31what was going on with the children
1:43:36he says he put them to bed i don't think
1:43:37that's true if he was talking on the
1:43:39phone with kessinger for
1:43:40111 minutes that you would imagine that
1:43:44would
1:43:45have disturbed them and also
1:43:48you can imagine that he didn't want to
1:43:49be disturbed during this 111 minute
1:43:51conversation
1:43:53you know you can kind of imagine what
1:43:56happened during that conversation um you
1:43:58know
1:43:59he can't take the risk of bella or cc
1:44:02overhearing him speaking on the phone
1:44:06and then telling chenette about it
1:44:10you know he can't have a risk like that
1:44:12going on
1:44:17and kissing just said that she heard the
1:44:21television on
1:44:22loudly in the background now you've also
1:44:24got to wonder what's that all about
1:44:26the televisions on the children couldn't
1:44:28have been asleep
1:44:30i mean that's even worse so
1:44:33how do you account for them not being
1:44:35ambulant and i think the answer is
1:44:37they were sedated at that point you know
1:44:39we didn't see them running around in the
1:44:41balcony
1:44:42if they were sedated at that point were
1:44:43they in bed sedated or were they
1:44:45somewhere else
1:44:46the problem is when shenan asked for
1:44:50pictures of the children in bed asleep
1:44:52he didn't send them to her
1:44:53and i think he didn't send them to her
1:44:55because they weren't in bed asleep
1:44:58they may have been in the basement or
1:45:01they may have
1:45:02just fallen asleep in front of the
1:45:03television having been sedated and he
1:45:04just left him there
1:45:06and he would deal with him later right
1:45:08bear in mind at this point he'd already
1:45:10tried to poison shanann once already
1:45:13on the 31st of july so doing this again
1:45:17wouldn't have been so out of the
1:45:19ordinary the next step would be to wait
1:45:21and see what happened
1:45:23and and what would happen they would
1:45:25pass out that
1:45:26it would be like they were sleeping and
1:45:28it's possible one of the children
1:45:30turned blue because that is a classic
1:45:31symptom of
1:45:33opioid overdose let me say that again a
1:45:36classic symptom of opioid overdose is
1:45:39turning blue it's possible one of the
1:45:40children did
1:45:46teresa says the children were light
1:45:48sleepers absolutely right
1:45:51then a lot of you will say okay but
1:45:52there's no evidence of that
1:45:55if the children were sedated there's no
1:45:56evidence of it
1:45:58and then my attitude that is while
1:46:01there's no evidence that shanann was
1:46:03poisoned either you know her autopsy
1:46:06then you say so then they won't the
1:46:08oxycodone thing is a myth
1:46:10but then chris watt says um the reason
1:46:14the oxycodone appears in the
1:46:17medical report is because i put it there
1:46:20i put it into her you know and so
1:46:24that seems to suggest that we haven't
1:46:26been given access to the full
1:46:29discovery that makes sense as well
1:46:31that's something else that the
1:46:33uh district attorney is keeping close to
1:46:36his chest and maybe it was part of the
1:46:38plea agreement
1:46:39so maybe it's okay we'll give you the
1:46:42pre-agreement and then there's some
1:46:44deal we're not going to say this and we
1:46:46won't say that
1:46:48and then chris watts goes beyond the
1:46:49back and mentions this to undermine
1:46:52what they've said um
1:46:56and i think um the reason you don't see
1:47:00find oxy in the um
1:47:03[Music]
1:47:04bella system or cc system is because
1:47:08opiates break down very very quickly
1:47:10even in a person who's alive
1:47:12you know breaks that's why it's so
1:47:13effective it breaks down very very
1:47:15quickly
1:47:16and it's not just that they were in a
1:47:19chemical scenario and
1:47:22and it was very hot and a lot of time
1:47:25went by so that's another aspect
1:47:28but i must say i find it hard to believe
1:47:30that you're not going to pick something
1:47:31like that up in
1:47:32human hair right for example shenan's
1:47:35here if shenan was tested
1:47:37so donnie says that's wrong
1:47:40what's wrong
1:47:46so um what she also mentioned
1:47:49now it's quite hard to know what
1:47:51sherilyn's thinking and
1:47:52how much she's just relating what's in
1:47:54the discovery but she said
1:47:57after um he put cece and bella to bed
1:48:01he had sex with shanann i don't believe
1:48:03that happened i don't believe he spoke
1:48:05to shanann and i don't believe
1:48:07that they had sex and he said that or
1:48:10she said that
1:48:11actually i'm not sure if he said this to
1:48:13her or whether she's saying it but
1:48:15apparently the idea is that
1:48:20he had sex with her duplicator to
1:48:23manipulate her right i just don't think
1:48:26that happened because
1:48:28there's no evidence of that on
1:48:31the bed or the bed sheets you know
1:48:34there's usually evidence
1:48:35in that respect and there wasn't any
1:48:38also
1:48:38the way that shenan was found
1:48:43the clothing that she's wearing and so
1:48:44on i just don't think so
1:48:46also he hadn't slept with her for six
1:48:49weeks and when she wanted to sleep with
1:48:52him in north carolina he'd rejected her
1:48:53and she was quite careful about that so
1:48:55why would he
1:48:56do it then it doesn't make any sense he
1:48:58was totally obsessed with nicole
1:49:00kissinger and in that sense his wife was
1:49:03almost a turn-off right
1:49:09um trying to look at some of your
1:49:11comments patricia
1:49:13it happened on that particular day
1:49:14because you did not want to pay the
1:49:16school fees
1:49:18i think that's part of it yeah
1:49:22justine i agree no sex i think some of
1:49:24you don't agree
1:49:26um barbara says i'm sorry i'm not
1:49:29understanding
1:49:30were drugs found in the children no
1:49:35cassia how else could he have been on
1:49:38top of her without her defending herself
1:49:40well quite simply he could have been on
1:49:42top of her with her facing down
1:49:45right he could have been on top of her
1:49:48from behind and in his very first
1:49:51version
1:49:52that's why i say you've got to when he
1:49:55says something
1:49:56you don't dismiss all of it and say it's
1:49:58all nonsense it's little fragments that
1:50:00are true um people when they lie they
1:50:03try and tell as much of the truth as
1:50:05they possibly can
1:50:06and still lie lie about the the details
1:50:09so
1:50:10in his very first version that he gave
1:50:12to
1:50:13code and tammy lee on that wednesday
1:50:16evening he said you know he came up to
1:50:19shanann from behind
1:50:21and shanann was like on the bed on
1:50:23cece's bed and came up from behind
1:50:26but basically shenan had her back to him
1:50:29and she was
1:50:30lying on a sort of
1:50:34uneven surface the bed with cece on it
1:50:37and i think that
1:50:38that body is true that he did come up to
1:50:40her from behind
1:50:42because he didn't want the confrontation
1:50:50um i can't i'm just looking at some of
1:50:52your
1:50:54so donnie says there's an unfortunate
1:50:56lack of scientific understanding
1:50:57about what
1:51:00karen engelhard i haven't been able to
1:51:03reconcile what he says
1:51:04he did to them i think as a parent i'm
1:51:06absolutely baffled
1:51:08that a father mother could end their
1:51:10little life so easily
1:51:12coroner i think um if you just imagine
1:51:14from the perspective of
1:51:17that his addiction to kissinger wasn't
1:51:20that different
1:51:20to a drug addiction drug addicts do
1:51:23operate a little bit like psychopaths
1:51:25they
1:51:26will do anything for the next hit and i
1:51:28think chris watts in that respect was
1:51:30like that but i think it's different to
1:51:32say
1:51:34that someone is addicted in that sense
1:51:37it's a psychopath anyone
1:51:41any person is capable of being addicted
1:51:43so if you're addicted to your phone
1:51:45if you're on your phone constantly and
1:51:46someone's trying to get your attention
1:51:48your own children
1:51:49your own husband your partner's friends
1:51:51but you're just constantly on your phone
1:51:55the experience of you is gonna be that
1:51:57you are like a psychopath you just can't
1:52:00give you you just don't care about how
1:52:03they feel and you just want to do what
1:52:05you want to do
1:52:06but it doesn't mean you are a psychopath
1:52:08it just means that is
1:52:10leading to that tendency and so in a
1:52:12very extreme way with a lot of other
1:52:14things going on
1:52:16a lot of serious anxiety a lot of debt
1:52:20certain personality dynamics that is
1:52:22what's driving
1:52:23this behavior ice cream says great chat
1:52:28it's late i'm off to bed um
1:52:31coron good point stephanie uh you've
1:52:33been separated from them
1:52:35already for over a month bear in mind he
1:52:36was fantasizing about it for quite a
1:52:38long time
1:52:39[Music]
1:52:42right
1:52:46donnie what syria are you talking about
1:52:51um
1:52:55donna stone why did the dogs not hit on
1:52:57the stairs if he pulled it down the
1:52:59stairs in the street
1:53:01so donna hart works is you only have
1:53:04that odor if someone's lying in that
1:53:07place for like an hour or two
1:53:09right i think a lot of people just don't
1:53:11understand that so
1:53:12you don't have that cadaver odor based
1:53:15on
1:53:16so someone's just died and then if you
1:53:18carry them off
1:53:20from that position it's not going to
1:53:21leave behind cadaver do they need to be
1:53:24lying in a particular spot for quite a
1:53:26long time like an hour at least
1:53:28right so cadaver
1:53:32isn't telling you where someone has been
1:53:34killed it might be telling you where
1:53:37the body was left for a while it could
1:53:39be where they were killed but
1:53:40in this case i don't think that's the
1:53:42case i think
1:53:44i think there may have been a cadaver
1:53:46trace
1:53:47in the basement because it makes sense
1:53:49that she'd be transferred there
1:53:51temporarily i think they also found a
1:53:53trace
1:53:54on the steps on the carpet above the
1:53:57steps
1:53:58um going into the basement because i
1:54:00think that's where he
1:54:02carried her from there to the garage
1:54:04right the other thing that i think
1:54:05is dumbly misrepresented
1:54:08in the lifetime documentary is you see
1:54:11and this is quite interesting
1:54:13because what i find useful with the
1:54:15lifetime documentaries is
1:54:17it dramatizes things and then you see
1:54:20why
1:54:21that's not likely so it's a
1:54:24like a lot of people get upset watching
1:54:26it and saying
1:54:28that's just lifetime movie bad or
1:54:29whatever i find it useful because
1:54:32it gives you a dramatic portrayal of why
1:54:36that makes no sense and and
1:54:39there's an exam an example of that where
1:54:41you actually see
1:54:43the children carried out sorry shenan
1:54:46carried out
1:54:47and chris watts is like carrying her
1:54:49sort of like this let me just
1:54:51show you like this right in his arms
1:54:55and i don't think that is how it
1:54:57happened i think she was dragged
1:55:00by her feet or by her arms so most of
1:55:02her body was on the ground
1:55:04and he would need to do that so that he
1:55:07couldn't be
1:55:07she couldn't be seen and he couldn't be
1:55:09seen doing that carrying
1:55:11out from the camera that stay but
1:55:13there's no sense of that from the
1:55:15makers of this documentary because they
1:55:17they don't think
1:55:18of it they just want to quickly tell
1:55:20their story and get their
1:55:22tabloid heads kind of thing they're not
1:55:25really thinking of it
1:55:26from a authentic perspective right
1:55:30um
1:55:32then um so let me just come back to what
1:55:35i was saying earlier
1:55:36you've got um sheridan cadill
1:55:40providing this version of events i don't
1:55:41really know if this is what she believes
1:55:43but this is what she says
1:55:45in on the documentary she says he puts
1:55:47bella and cece to bed
1:55:49and then sleeps with shanann
1:55:53then after he slept with shenani goes to
1:55:55their room
1:55:56after obviously english
1:56:00and then and then smothers them while
1:56:02shanann is in the house
1:56:04so walton is in the house while she's
1:56:06kind of next door
1:56:07and i guess she's asleep and and
1:56:09obviously still alive
1:56:12this is the version cable is telling on
1:56:16this documentary
1:56:17and just beggar's belief absolutely
1:56:19biggest belief that
1:56:21that you know why on earth would he do
1:56:24something like that with shenan
1:56:28in the house and alive it just
1:56:31doesn't make any sense from a criminal
1:56:33psychology perspective doesn't make any
1:56:35sense
1:56:37um and then and then there's this
1:56:41version that they
1:56:42argue um i don't believe that that
1:56:45happened either
1:56:46in this version after that they had sex
1:56:48after he kills the children he then
1:56:50argues with shannon then he kills the
1:56:52children
1:56:52and guess what the argument is about
1:56:55shanann says you're not gonna see the
1:56:57kids
1:56:59um you know um what if he leaves if you
1:57:02leave me you'll never see the kids again
1:57:04but now panties just killed them
1:57:06and so he gets upset by that and then he
1:57:08kills her it's just you know like you
1:57:10sort of wonder
1:57:11when lifetime made this did they watch
1:57:14it back themselves and go
1:57:16this this is actually nonsense like what
1:57:19we are saying is actually nonsense
1:57:21and they don't seem to interrogate their
1:57:23own nonsense
1:57:24it's left to us to do that as you know
1:57:27who are
1:57:28let me put it on to myself um
1:57:31you know i approach crime online with my
1:57:34analysis
1:57:35who are you anyway and then this
1:57:38ends up on lifetime and
1:57:41and and then what can you say about that
1:57:44okay um so anyway so the version is
1:57:49watch becomes angry
1:57:50kill shannan even though
1:57:53he doesn't want to see his kids anyway
1:57:56um what what i did highlight here which
1:57:59i think is
1:58:00uh important thing i mean it's important
1:58:03to
1:58:03between all the nonsense and all the
1:58:05rubbish and all the noise
1:58:07to see some reality and i think the
1:58:10reality is this and i've highlighted it
1:58:12here
1:58:14can you see that his primary target was
1:58:18nico
1:58:21and i you know the full story is that
1:58:23having nico was his idea
1:58:27right having nika was his idea and then
1:58:30he changed his mind
1:58:33the other thing that i don't agree with
1:58:35is that it's in this version he kills
1:58:37shanann in bed
1:58:39um because that means that shanann is
1:58:42allowed to
1:58:43come upstairs and allow to talk to him
1:58:47and what is shenan gonna talk to him
1:58:49about except
1:58:50did you answer my love letter um
1:58:54what was that alert from on your credit
1:58:57card
1:58:59last night on saturday night why didn't
1:59:01you return
1:59:02my calls you know because he was
1:59:05actually speaking to nicole kessinger
1:59:06while shanann was trying to tell him
1:59:09that she would be late why didn't you
1:59:11return my calls well he didn't want to
1:59:12have that conversation
1:59:18something that um cadal
1:59:21says that he told her which i think is
1:59:24possible
1:59:25is where he said that chris watts knew
1:59:28how to cut off the jugular vein
1:59:31right that if you cut off the jugular
1:59:34vein
1:59:34of a person i guess on both sides very
1:59:38suddenly and very quickly and very
1:59:39effectively
1:59:41then um you can lose consciousness very
1:59:45quickly
1:59:46so i think that's possible but i think
1:59:47the other possibilities as well
1:59:49which is he could have used a plastic
1:59:52bag
1:59:53um he could also have you know she had
1:59:57neck surgery so neck was quite
1:59:59vulnerable anyway he probably would have
2:00:01known that
2:00:02um i think he could also have used a rag
2:00:06soaked in ethanol and
2:00:09the reason i think that that's a
2:00:11possibility is because he's so familiar
2:00:13with the chemicals used
2:00:14in his workplace also
2:00:17besides having access to these chemicals
2:00:20what is one of the things he loads into
2:00:22the
2:00:23back of the truck it's the the gas can
2:00:26the gas can isn't in the truck the gas
2:00:28cans not in the truck
2:00:30and so did he use that gas can as part
2:00:33of
2:00:33what he was doing i think it's
2:00:36definitely worth thinking about
2:00:39donna said i have to go now we'll finish
2:00:41watching tomorrow was a good chat thanks
2:00:43donna
2:00:45um
2:00:49so what chris watch is trying to say is
2:00:51that
2:00:52that he um the the
2:00:56the murder of shanann was effective that
2:00:58he did he cut it for jugular
2:01:00and he and that's why it went the way it
2:01:02did but if that's true
2:01:04why didn't he do the same with bella if
2:01:06he knew how to effectively do this
2:01:09why couldn't he do the same with bella
2:01:13um then she also talks about
2:01:17drugging shenan a second time but she
2:01:20doesn't know when that happened
2:01:22i'm pretty sure i know when that
2:01:23happened i think he drugged her
2:01:25on the friday morning i think it was
2:01:28august
2:01:2910th the morning that she went to north
2:01:31carolina
2:01:33arizona the morning that she left early
2:01:37with nicole atkinson to go to
2:01:40arizona on that thrive trip
2:01:43um i think he drugged her as well
2:01:45because she actually
2:01:46said in a text it's all in a fun data
2:01:49review
2:01:51as early as i think six am she said
2:01:53something to him like
2:01:54i'm feeling dizzy i'm um
2:01:59yeah i'm feeling dizzy and
2:02:03i can barely stand and he said something
2:02:05about maybe you haven't had enough sleep
2:02:07right
2:02:11we're getting there we're getting there
2:02:16um
2:02:18how i feel is shannon never made it
2:02:21upstairs at least one of the girls was
2:02:22still alive or both
2:02:24when he left that morning i agree with
2:02:25you i believe chris watts used ethanol
2:02:28barbara henninger
2:02:32sandy beach yes that timing makes sense
2:02:37renee says right next you felt bad all
2:02:39weekend nauseous
2:02:41nauseous yeah shane bria
2:02:44it must be three o'clock in the morning
2:02:47there as well where you are and that is
2:02:48where i
2:02:49am if any of you want to do a super chat
2:02:52um i'm really going beyond the call of
2:02:55duty here
2:02:56in terms of time you're welcome um
2:02:59i almost finished i think i've got one
2:03:01two three
2:03:02well five pages while trying to get
2:03:04through them quickly
2:03:06so kadal says um
2:03:10she's not sure why shenan didn't fight
2:03:13back i think it's because he drugged her
2:03:16but i like i don't think shanann was
2:03:19drugged that
2:03:21that morning or that night i think
2:03:24on friday yes but that's not why she
2:03:27didn't fight back
2:03:28it was the way that he um
2:03:31approached her from behind it was the
2:03:33stealth way approached her from behind
2:03:35that
2:03:36that helped create a situation where she
2:03:38couldn't fight back bear in mind if
2:03:40she's
2:03:40lying on her stomach and he's on her
2:03:43back
2:03:44it's very difficult to fight back like
2:03:46this right
2:03:48um i do think he made a mess of the
2:03:51crime
2:03:52especially of the of the girls i think
2:03:54he really made a mess
2:03:56um i think he made meant to sedate him
2:03:59in the same way he made a mess with
2:04:01trying to bring about a miscarriage he
2:04:02made a mess with
2:04:05the way that he trying to kill the girls
2:04:06i think it's possible
2:04:08cc died of an overdose
2:04:11i don't think that happened to bella
2:04:13based on that little shadow we've seen
2:04:15you know it's possible bella um came
2:04:18to but she still remained groggy she was
2:04:21she wasn't quite sure where she was and
2:04:24in that respect he sort of had
2:04:26a um sort of head under control the fact
2:04:30that she
2:04:31was slightly away and awake but
2:04:35but not fully conscious little star says
2:04:37do you think shenanigan
2:04:39munchausen by proxy i've heard that a
2:04:41lot
2:04:43um wow stephanie that's uh that's
2:04:46that's a i love that um
2:04:50what you've done there i've had a good
2:04:53um
2:04:54i've had a good uh dinner stephanie
2:04:57and i still need to ask you about
2:04:58christa i'll try and get you that quite
2:05:00soon
2:05:01thanks a lot christa and yeah thanks to
2:05:03the guys who subscribed
2:05:05in the last couple of videos uh welcome
2:05:07to all the new people
2:05:09i think i've actually set this video to
2:05:11you can only chat if you a subscriber
2:05:15so um that may have some some
2:05:18um influence um
2:05:20[Music]
2:05:25so i do think it's possible that bella
2:05:26woke up subsequently
2:05:28but but he sort of had her under the
2:05:31control that she was um
2:05:35very groggy and then i think he thought
2:05:38he would
2:05:39perhaps do it later i've never liked
2:05:42that explanation because it doesn't make
2:05:43sense
2:05:44going to the work side and having to
2:05:46text
2:05:47his colleagues while he's on the way
2:05:49there with a child still awake and
2:05:51the distress and having to deal with it
2:05:54but
2:05:55um that shadow is a problem for
2:05:58for an explanation where you say that
2:06:00that's not the case
2:06:02patricia burns is probably working out
2:06:04so
2:06:04[Music]
2:06:08yeah i know he was definitely strong
2:06:10enough
2:06:14zj hello all wow zj's just joined us now
2:06:18liz graham can anyone tell me if they
2:06:20saw that shadow because i didn't see it
2:06:22at all
2:06:30kitty witty i saw shadows we can't make
2:06:32out what they were
2:06:33so i am i deal with the shadows
2:06:36in my very last book of the twelve i've
2:06:39written
2:06:40um in i think a way that surprised some
2:06:43people
2:06:44may even have disappointed some people
2:06:46so in the very last book
2:06:48post-truth i provide my final version of
2:06:52what i think happened
2:06:56um what did i write here so i think he
2:06:59tried to sedate everyone
2:07:02um he failed with everyone except
2:07:05i i'm speculating but i think he may not
2:07:08have failed with cece
2:07:10um you know if you know bella's story
2:07:13she actually said to the babysitter you
2:07:14know i'm scared that if i go to sleep
2:07:18um when i wake up cece
2:07:22won't wake up now i'm scared that if i
2:07:25go to sleep
2:07:27cece won't wake up from her sleep do
2:07:30any of you remember that that's
2:07:31something the babysitter said
2:07:33so bella was quite anxious and
2:07:36struggling to sleep even the babysitter
2:07:38said it was difficult
2:07:40getting bella to settle
2:07:43um but i do get the sense that is
2:07:46ultimately what happened to cece and i
2:07:47wonder whether
2:07:48the whole nut gate thing gave chris
2:07:50watts an idea
2:07:51you know in the same way that shenan was
2:07:53terrified that a chemical
2:07:56in a nut could do something to cece i
2:07:59wonder whether chris watts didn't think
2:08:01hmm that's that's maybe a useful idea
2:08:04there or something like that
2:08:06in other words use their vulnerability
2:08:09against them
2:08:10and i mean some of the things been
2:08:11happening with chris watts he uses
2:08:13social vulnerability against him
2:08:16so um so i mentioned that
2:08:20i think bella may have been half
2:08:22conscious if she was sedated
2:08:24um i don't agree with kadel where she
2:08:27says that
2:08:28that that he said he was angry
2:08:31um i don't know what you guys think
2:08:33kayla was saying that that chris watts
2:08:35said he was angry and
2:08:37and whatever i don't see that at all i
2:08:40think he was scared and in love
2:08:43i think he was he was motivated by fear
2:08:46of shenan fear of confrontation
2:08:48fear what kissinger was going to say
2:08:50fear of the whole thing
2:08:52right and
2:08:56being in love being wanting to repeat
2:08:59bear in mind he had this
2:09:00wonderful honeymoon with kissinger then
2:09:02suddenly
2:09:04that was under threat and it wasn't
2:09:05going to continue if shanann got back
2:09:08and if she found out
2:09:10subrosalite thanks so much
2:09:13really appreciate that thanks for that
2:09:16and thanks for your contribution thanks
2:09:17for that comment there
2:09:19um so but what do you guys think do you
2:09:23think that chris watts was angry that
2:09:25morning
2:09:26bear in mind when his co-workers saw him
2:09:28he didn't sound angry or didn't look
2:09:30angry
2:09:30do you think he was angry when you see
2:09:32him walking to and from the truck do you
2:09:34think he was angry
2:09:37melanie bannel says fear and lust agree
2:09:39with that
2:09:41sarah shear bella bellas was anxious
2:09:44yeah bella was anxious um
2:09:48black swan he didn't drug cece at all
2:09:51and gave her nuts i don't think that he
2:09:53did give her nuts
2:09:55um i think that's got an interesting
2:09:57counter is if he did give him that's
2:09:58what do you think would have happened
2:10:00bambi maine um thanks very much bambi
2:10:05thanks a lot quite an interesting avatar
2:10:09there you look like kind of a
2:10:12um some kind of
2:10:15medieval uh
2:10:18you know someone like someone from the
2:10:20lost kingdom
2:10:23um let's just read some of your comments
2:10:25teresa payne he didn't seem angry just
2:10:27seemed determined
2:10:30i think chris watts looked quite
2:10:32confused and rattled
2:10:34and erratic on the driveway
2:10:38you know he wasn't on the driveway once
2:10:40or twice he was repeatedly going
2:10:42back and forth and around this side of
2:10:44the truck and that side
2:10:45you kind of get the sense that he didn't
2:10:48he knew what he was
2:10:50he knew what he wanted to do but he
2:10:52didn't know what he was doing
2:10:53and you get the same impression with
2:10:56chris watts doing the polygraph and
2:10:57taking the plea deal and everything else
2:10:59you know what he wants to do you know
2:11:00what he wants to achieve
2:11:01he doesn't really know how to go about
2:11:03that
2:11:07something else just that kadel mentioned
2:11:10in the documentary you're probably going
2:11:11to say this is
2:11:12being pedantic or um what do you call it
2:11:16arguing over little details but she says
2:11:19the thief hatch was eight inches or
2:11:21actually eight and a half inches and you
2:11:23might you might say that doesn't matter
2:11:25but it does when it when you're dealing
2:11:27with the
2:11:28mechanics of getting someone through
2:11:30that space
2:11:31i think it's important to be accurate
2:11:33about those details and those
2:11:35measurements
2:11:36because those measurements do matter
2:11:39based on um the measurements of ccn
2:11:43and bella right i'm not going to go into
2:11:45that in a lot of detail but
2:11:47that's just something that i i noticed
2:11:49as well and then he said
2:11:51i've never really understood this
2:11:53question and it comes up over and over
2:11:55again
2:11:55why did he want to separate
2:11:59them from her mother from their mother
2:12:01why did chris watch want to
2:12:03what did he bury shenandoah put the
2:12:05chore in there i've never really
2:12:07understood
2:12:08that question like to me it's quite
2:12:11simple
2:12:11he wanted to use those tanks there were
2:12:13two tanks he wanted to use those
2:12:15tanks to put the children in so
2:12:18that was always going to happen so he
2:12:21was always thinking
2:12:22you know i want i want i want my family
2:12:25to vanish i want them to disappear i
2:12:26want them to
2:12:28literally you know be nothing
2:12:31nothing left of them i want that but
2:12:35i don't think he's thinking of it in a
2:12:36practical way thinking of it almost in a
2:12:38way of
2:12:39i just don't want i just want them to be
2:12:41gone
2:12:42right but then that's how he brings it
2:12:45about
2:12:47and because of that that's how it's
2:12:49going to get rid of the one and i'm
2:12:51apologizing this is quite a um
2:12:55the reality of it is quite troubling to
2:12:58say the least but he's trying to get
2:13:02rid of the traces of of people
2:13:06and shenand isn't going to fit into the
2:13:09oil tank and that's why
2:13:10she's not in the oil tank so the whole
2:13:13thing of why did he not keep them to
2:13:15what was he supposed to do go to this
2:13:17well side where the oil tanks
2:13:19and bury them all three alongside one
2:13:22another
2:13:23like i don't know i just find that whole
2:13:25line of questioning weird
2:13:28i don't know what you guys think um
2:13:35i i i agree with stephanie i do think
2:13:38that he
2:13:39was resenting shanann towards the end of
2:13:41it and he was
2:13:43in the same way he was afraid of
2:13:44confrontation i think he resented what
2:13:46was happening with his with his money
2:13:48that he had to hand his paycheck over he
2:13:51said as much to kissinger that
2:13:53they were house broke constantly and i
2:13:56think he just
2:13:56you know when you look at the foundation
2:13:58review and her
2:14:00giving him a hard time about not
2:14:02catching an uber and wear miss
2:14:03park and fix the vivint and all this
2:14:06kind of thing you get the sense that
2:14:08she's ordering him around and although
2:14:11he's not
2:14:13fighting back and he's not being he's
2:14:15not sort of
2:14:16countering her you get a sense that
2:14:19there's
2:14:20there's a calculated resentment going on
2:14:23there
2:14:23that he hides away his resentment that
2:14:25he doesn't when he's upset he doesn't
2:14:27say anything it cooks
2:14:28inside of him so i think that was
2:14:30certainly there but
2:14:31the reason he doesn't say anything is
2:14:32he's scared of chanel he's scared of her
2:14:38temper
2:14:41so rel says he needed to have 100
2:14:43control of the situation i agree
2:14:46he just went about getting control in a
2:14:48really bad way i think a lot of
2:14:50and this is a takeout from the watts
2:14:53case that i think is quite useful
2:14:55to think about is if you think of in a
2:14:58very basic way it's about
2:15:00someone is very very anxious about a
2:15:03particular um
2:15:09that someone is very scared intimidated
2:15:13frightened about something that is
2:15:16happening
2:15:17right it's a very basic way of looking
2:15:20at it
2:15:21there's a particular dynamic that's
2:15:23playing out and this person is
2:15:25feeling um worried about it very very
2:15:28worried about it and they've got every
2:15:30reason to be worried
2:15:32and then how do you take control of that
2:15:35situation
2:15:36and i did a live i think last week
2:15:39about managing your fear
2:15:42and that is the answer to that question
2:15:45so
2:15:45you've got this dynamic it's in place
2:15:48how do you manage your fear
2:15:50and chris watts managed it very badly
2:15:54and we but i think the part that's
2:15:56useful to us is we
2:15:57look into the case and you can say um
2:16:01he manages here very badly this is the
2:16:03situation playing out
2:16:04he managed it very badly but then the
2:16:07question is
2:16:08okay how do you manage your fear
2:16:12how do people around you manage their
2:16:14fears
2:16:15and that's a that's a very useful take
2:16:18out to
2:16:18take into your life and into your
2:16:21relationships
2:16:22and ask yourself constantly how am i
2:16:24managing my fear
2:16:26because you might say it's a really dumb
2:16:28way you know you should have just gotten
2:16:29a divorce okay
2:16:30fine you shouldn't have done that but
2:16:33are you
2:16:33making smart choices in your situation
2:16:36where you fear for people you know
2:16:38because often when you're scared you're
2:16:40compromised
2:16:42there's a scene in a star trek movie
2:16:44where spock's
2:16:45world is just blown up and
2:16:50another version of spock tells captain
2:16:52kirk
2:16:54the way to undermine me is
2:16:58i am emotionally compromised you know
2:17:01bring that
2:17:02to people's attention so the the
2:17:05alternate spock
2:17:06wants captain kirk to undermine his
2:17:09other self in order for a particular
2:17:10thing to happen so he says i'm
2:17:13emotionally compromised even though
2:17:15everyone thinks i'm an unemotional
2:17:17person i'm emotionally compromised
2:17:19the same applies to us in our lives when
2:17:21we fearful we
2:17:22emotionally compromise does my father's
2:17:2480th birthday
2:17:27um this week and i i had dinner with my
2:17:30family and
2:17:31my brother's very afraid of coronavirus
2:17:36and even when he was he had dinner with
2:17:39us sorry
2:17:40lunch he had lunch with us but he was
2:17:43very afraid
2:17:44he was afraid i was going to infect him
2:17:46and so on and so on i mean
2:17:48my father is turning 80 he's been
2:17:50vaccinated once
2:17:52he's got a much better reason to be be
2:17:55cautious
2:17:59i'm just saying my brother wasn't
2:18:01managing his fear
2:18:05um you know you're gonna think this is
2:18:08absurd
2:18:09i suppose it is when
2:18:12we were dishing up food um my brother
2:18:16would walk
2:18:17right around like so instead of walking
2:18:19just past me or just asking me to hand
2:18:21him
2:18:22food he would walk right behind kind of
2:18:25an island
2:18:26of walls and stuff that is next to the
2:18:29table
2:18:30and come around the other side where the
2:18:31kitchen is the kitchen doorway
2:18:34so that he could avoid walking past me
2:18:36and then get the food that you want to
2:18:38scoop into his plate and then walk back
2:18:39around
2:18:41that way and i'm just using that as an
2:18:43example of
2:18:44that's an example of someone failing to
2:18:46manage their fear
2:18:48right and i think coronavirus is a great
2:18:52example of
2:18:53to just say you can say well
2:18:56is our anxiety misplaced
2:19:00well then we mismanaging our fear is our
2:19:04anxiety rational well then how should we
2:19:06manage our fear
2:19:08it's a very important question and the
2:19:10answer is not so easy
2:19:17okay um
2:19:20why did he separate them okay we could
2:19:23go through that
2:19:26so coming back to soulmate secrets um
2:19:30what is quite interesting from christa
2:19:33and from dylan is they talk about this
2:19:36incident in july 2020
2:19:38well i think dylan ended up in solitary
2:19:40confinement i think for two weeks
2:19:42because they traded
2:19:43personal items and amongst them were
2:19:47vaseline with chris watts name on it and
2:19:49underwear
2:19:50that was chris watts as well which is
2:19:51found in dylan's cell
2:19:53and it's interesting that krista
2:19:57responds on tv saying ah i just laughed
2:19:59i just laughed about that
2:20:00she told the daily mail about it and
2:20:03okay magazine about it
2:20:05she this was sort of a breakthrough
2:20:07moment to everyone who heard about her
2:20:10i don't think it was really funny for
2:20:11them i don't think it was very funny for
2:20:13dylan or
2:20:13for chris watts i think it was funny
2:20:16being in solitary
2:20:18it also raises other questions which i'm
2:20:20not going to go into yet but if you
2:20:22think about it vaseline and underwear
2:20:24where is that taking you
2:20:29and then at this point i think the
2:20:31narrator i'm not sure
2:20:32actually you said this i think it's the
2:20:34narrator says
2:20:36he's the spacer chris t christa
2:20:39is exploiting the relationship meaning
2:20:42delin suspects that chris
2:20:44christa at this point is exploiting
2:20:47his relationship with chris watts
2:20:51that's what i've sort of highlighted
2:20:53there
2:20:56right
2:20:59and looking back isn't that exactly what
2:21:01happened isn't that what happened that
2:21:03that christian did exploit
2:21:07dylan's relationship with chris watts by
2:21:10embracing
2:21:10herself with dylan
2:21:16he knows i'm writing books about him if
2:21:21so i just wanted to address this
2:21:24people have asked why did i contact
2:21:26chris watts why haven't i written to him
2:21:28and i can tell you now i've never
2:21:29written to chris watts
2:21:30i've had contact with
2:21:35someone from the
2:21:38watts family not that i reached out to
2:21:40them they reached out to me
2:21:42um just because i'm quite cynical i'm
2:21:46cynical about
2:21:47being used as a author
2:21:51i'm cynical about what i'm going to be
2:21:53told
2:21:55and i know what i want to say i know
2:21:58what what narrative i want to say about
2:22:00i want to do my true crime
2:22:01analysis without being manipulated or
2:22:05without being
2:22:06you know um but i wouldn't mind
2:22:09being um provided with
2:22:12someone saying you know i'm now ready to
2:22:15tell the truth
2:22:16i wouldn't mind seeing that but i just
2:22:18don't believe that that's gonna happen
2:22:20i don't believe it's going to be the
2:22:21truth and i don't believe it's going to
2:22:23happen
2:22:24so my perspective was basically
2:22:28he knows chris watts knows i've written
2:22:30books about him
2:22:32he may have read them
2:22:35he knows what i think about him he knows
2:22:37what i think about what happened
2:22:39and he can contact me if he wants to and
2:22:42he hasn't
2:22:42and i think that that says it all
2:22:46if i was chris watts i wouldn't contact
2:22:48me
2:22:49um i'm not yet to sing his praises or to
2:22:53to do that whole dance that that these
2:22:54other creators are doing
2:22:56i've yet to to deal with true crime do
2:22:59my job
2:23:00do it honestly do it transparently and
2:23:03that's it
2:23:04i don't really have time for the the
2:23:06circus that everyone else wants to be
2:23:08this sort of double dealing game i don't
2:23:09have time for that
2:23:11for some people it's second nature for
2:23:13me it's not
2:23:14i don't think you can be in true crime
2:23:16and act that way and
2:23:18i don't even have much of a reputation
2:23:20that's just my
2:23:21feeling about it um
2:23:25so my question is did they ever publish
2:23:27a devotional book
2:23:29will it ever be published interestingly
2:23:31christa is referred to as the other mary
2:23:34i think it's quite interesting the way
2:23:36that both chris watts
2:23:38and dylan thought of
2:23:41both cherylin and mary not mary christa
2:23:45i think the attitudes to women how do
2:23:48you think
2:23:49they are today that they
2:23:52are criminals so they're not certainly
2:23:54not the pick of the crop
2:23:56they're not the most eligible bachelors
2:23:57but how do you think women have treated
2:23:59them
2:24:00how do you think they think about women
2:24:02based on
2:24:04everything that's happened um
2:24:06interestingly in the show
2:24:08christa says i feel safer with dylan she
2:24:11said something like
2:24:12of all the relationships i've had with
2:24:15men i feel safer with dylan
2:24:18and i think it's god's will or something
2:24:21um
2:24:22and and but she'd never actually met him
2:24:24that never
2:24:25this is all based on through
2:24:28what you call it through
2:24:31through correspondence and so once again
2:24:34you've got this weird thing of
2:24:36is this real are people able to live in
2:24:39the real world
2:24:42you just make up the reality in a way
2:24:44that
2:24:45benefits yourself how's that different
2:24:47to what chris watts was doing you commit
2:24:48a crime
2:24:49because you want to live this fairy tale
2:24:52um
2:24:54something that i brought up um just in
2:24:57my own commentary uh
2:24:58i said where's ad so in this cellmate
2:25:02secrets
2:25:03where is ad um
2:25:09i thought it was going to be quite a lot
2:25:10about him certainly based on his
2:25:12own cheerleading of the show
2:25:16um i thought there was going to be a lot
2:25:18about him
2:25:20um something else it was quite an
2:25:23authentic
2:25:24moment was where kadel apparently asked
2:25:28chris watson
2:25:28and i give her credit for this because i
2:25:30think this was a genuine moment she said
2:25:33um chris watts said will you let me look
2:25:36after your grandchildren
2:25:38like like in a hypothetical scenario
2:25:40would you ever let me babysit your
2:25:42grandchildren
2:25:43and kadel said no
2:25:46and i think that was quite an important
2:25:48reality check for chris watts
2:25:51where he realized she actually doesn't
2:25:54like me or trust me
2:25:57right i think that was quite a and
2:25:59that's probably near the end of their
2:26:01relationship
2:26:02when that question came up
2:26:06um the other thing that i think is quite
2:26:08interesting is
2:26:10the promotional stuff for
2:26:13this show a lot of what you get in the
2:26:16promotional stuff
2:26:18is eventually only showed right at the
2:26:19end like in the last two three minutes
2:26:22and one of that one of those things is
2:26:23where she talks about this platform that
2:26:25she's on
2:26:26and then she says what that need is i
2:26:28don't know in other words
2:26:30krista was saying you know what
2:26:33may have used me and it really hurts but
2:26:36what that need is i don't know well
2:26:39isn't the need that he wanted to
2:26:43spread the news that that is is innocent
2:26:45or that is less guilty than he really is
2:26:47i don't think it's rocket science to say
2:26:49that
2:26:50you know what that need is that chris
2:26:51watts has communicating well he's trying
2:26:53to communicate
2:26:55a narrative that minimizes his
2:26:56involvement that
2:26:58that helps him i don't think that that's
2:27:00a mystery
2:27:01and she's a psychologist i don't know
2:27:03how hard it would be to say
2:27:05what need has he had that he wants to
2:27:06communicate
2:27:08to the outside world well the need that
2:27:10is not as guilty as people think or that
2:27:12he's not as
2:27:13culpable as people think that is not as
2:27:16much of a monsters people think i don't
2:27:17think that's rocket science
2:27:18i think that's very hard to to do
2:27:29so what else have i got here
2:27:33so what's quite interesting also in the
2:27:36documentary is
2:27:37they sort of gloss over some of the
2:27:39details from kadle i'm not going to
2:27:42highlight them here people will say that
2:27:44i'm
2:27:45jealous or spiteful or something i think
2:27:47you know what i'm talking about but they
2:27:49just say
2:27:50kayla releases the book letters from
2:27:51christopher then updates the book
2:27:53that's how they frame it they don't sort
2:27:56of say
2:27:57why exactly there is that second book
2:28:00um i just think that you know while
2:28:03we're talking about this
2:28:04you know it's all about only massaging
2:28:06the information well the show does it as
2:28:08well
2:28:09um after publishing the book what stops
2:28:13communicating with cadilla
2:28:15big shock big shock
2:28:19kadel says you know she'd like it if
2:28:20chris what would still speak to her do
2:28:22you think he will
2:28:26um
2:28:33i i sort of mentioned you that that a.d
2:28:36is mentioned in the show
2:28:37right at the last minute like at the
2:28:39very last point you sort of
2:28:41see one or two
2:28:44um images of of a.d
2:28:48and um i don't actually know if you ever
2:28:51hear him speaking i don't even actually
2:28:53hear his voice
2:28:55um
2:28:58and then christa's comments about nicole
2:29:00kissinger also left for right at the end
2:29:03i actually thought that that was going
2:29:04to possibly be quite interesting
2:29:06what christa says about nicole kissinger
2:29:08but there's virtually nothing in the
2:29:10acceptors saying
2:29:11that she should have said sorry and
2:29:13asked for help that's it
2:29:14there's nothing more than that i mean
2:29:16that's it that's my
2:29:18that's my analysis i would have liked to
2:29:21have done
2:29:22summer wells but i mean this has been a
2:29:24lot longer than i thought it would be
2:29:27it's now half first three in the morning
2:29:29let me look at some of your comments
2:29:31kesia why should he bother
2:29:35what outside people are thinking of them
2:29:37i think that's a great question that's
2:29:39actually a really really good question
2:29:41and i think you and a lot of people and
2:29:44it's not it's not weird to think that
2:29:47way
2:29:48but i think you forgetting that he's a
2:29:49human being and that
2:29:52it's very hard you know he may know
2:29:54intellectually
2:29:56what he's done and he may know
2:29:58intellectually
2:29:59that he's going to be in jail for the
2:30:02rest of his life but that's quite hard
2:30:03to accept
2:30:04day to day hour by hour minute by minute
2:30:08emotionally now you wake up and you're
2:30:11in jail
2:30:12the next day you're in jail it's
2:30:13christmas and you're in jail it's
2:30:15eastern
2:30:15in jail it's your birthday and you're in
2:30:17jail another year goes fine
2:30:19and part of you knows why and accepts
2:30:22why but another part of you
2:30:25is resisting that and doesn't want this
2:30:27to be the rest of your life right
2:30:30and so his only um
2:30:33option is to find some way to change the
2:30:36narrative about him
2:30:38his only option is to try and change the
2:30:39story and the only way he can do that is
2:30:42by
2:30:42trying to make it seem like what he did
2:30:45you know
2:30:46you know if you like waver one two
2:30:48exponents
2:30:50wave a one and then suddenly there's a
2:30:52slightly different
2:30:54everything changes slightly oh it was
2:30:56demonic position oh
2:30:58um that person was involved oh
2:31:02i wasn't in control um weirdly enough
2:31:05i think his best defense he hasn't even
2:31:08thought of like
2:31:09um which i think was somewhat valid
2:31:12i don't know if it changes anything but
2:31:14the thrive patches i think made him very
2:31:16sleep deprived
2:31:17and changed changed him a little bit
2:31:21i'm not saying it it's the same as being
2:31:23intoxicated but
2:31:25it certainly would have had an impact on
2:31:27it if he
2:31:28if they did take uh if he did do a drug
2:31:31test
2:31:32that could have been potential evidence
2:31:34that he could have used in a defense but
2:31:36of course he didn't i think that
2:31:40could be a potential mitigating argument
2:31:43but
2:31:43for what it's worth how much it would
2:31:46achieve
2:31:46i don't know if it would achieve very
2:31:48much
2:31:53teresa says excellent live thank you so
2:31:55much to me you're a good boy
2:31:57to me is over there
2:32:01still
2:32:06every now and then i hear deep sigh from
2:32:08him you know it's like are you still
2:32:10talking um
2:32:13stephanie yeah bria you are rockstar for
2:32:17being out tonight thanks very much
2:32:19wow i've actually forgotten one of the
2:32:22most important things i meant to do
2:32:24um stephanie can you tell us
2:32:27what you think do you think that
2:32:30do you do you think christa regrets
2:32:34going on to
2:32:35soulmate secrets what do you think about
2:32:37that
2:32:46what do you guys think so let's let's
2:32:47get a one for years
2:32:50and a two for no do you think christa
2:32:53regrets going on to
2:32:54sell mate secrets
2:32:58one yes two no patricia burns thanks for
2:33:01your time thank you
2:33:05stephanie says yes stephanie says i
2:33:08think she does regret it
2:33:11most of you are saying no i must i mean
2:33:13two minds about i first
2:33:15thought um
2:33:18yes she regrets it because she's been
2:33:19quite silent now
2:33:21i mean has she gone on to this other
2:33:24channel to talk about it i think that if
2:33:27she had
2:33:28that would be a sign that she wants to
2:33:31talk about it and that she's happy
2:33:33but i don't think she has i don't know
2:33:35what's happening tonight but
2:33:37you know the other side is
2:33:41in the show itself she does look pretty
2:33:43happy she just look happy to be talking
2:33:45about what she's talking about and
2:33:46when they show being made up she looks
2:33:49like she's happy doesn't she
2:33:55um stephanie what do you
2:34:00can you tell us a little bit about
2:34:03how you know christa and
2:34:06what you think about like can you tell
2:34:08us here
2:34:14serious sheer yes dude this is a very
2:34:16considerate and thoughtful forum i like
2:34:18how you engage the ideas of your
2:34:20listeners
2:34:20and you are exhausted in your
2:34:22considerations a nice way to pass the
2:34:24evening thanks sarah
2:34:25by the way um do you guys know that
2:34:28doomsday mom has
2:34:29been showing on lifetime i think for
2:34:33possibly the past hour and a half
2:34:36probably i think it ended maybe half an
2:34:38hour ago
2:34:42you have to have personal insight to
2:34:44regret not seeing it from her
2:34:57rose but i'm watching it now rose but
2:34:59what did you think of
2:35:01um doomsday mom i might be covering that
2:35:04tomorrow
2:35:05um
2:35:09stare i'm not a dog person or an animal
2:35:12person
2:35:14okay oh okay
2:35:21so who've you listened to most rose but
2:35:23me or or
2:35:24the show doomsday mom
2:35:31it is really really upsetting
2:35:38to me is smart asleep in his little
2:35:40basket okay
2:35:42does your brother have ocd or anxiety
2:35:45traits
2:35:46um i think he's got a bit of ocd
2:35:50um if we take part in an
2:35:53athletic event he's always got to have a
2:35:55certain kind of bar
2:35:57before the time he definitely is quite
2:35:59ocd
2:36:01he is quite an anxious guy
2:36:04i'm i'm definitely more anxious than
2:36:07average i think about corona but i'm
2:36:09definitely not
2:36:10at the level that he is but
2:36:13you know i'm not trying to point the
2:36:14thing at him i'm just trying to say
2:36:18one must learn to manage your fear in
2:36:21terms of everything
2:36:22you need to manage your fear so
2:36:25stephanie says i'm sure she does me
2:36:28meaning regret going on the show
2:36:30she says stephanie says krista lives
2:36:33literally 20 minutes away from me
2:36:36in connecticut we connected on facebook
2:36:39before all this crazy
2:36:41she took part in she left her job
2:36:43because of lupus flare up so
2:36:45i think that's quite interesting as well
2:36:47is that um
2:36:50she had that in common with with um
2:36:53shenan that that she also had lupus
2:36:56but i think what is weird is how she
2:37:00supports chris watts that she she
2:37:03literally seems to think chris watts is
2:37:04innocent
2:37:08so what i think is quite sad
2:37:11quite tragic is that christa's mother
2:37:14recently passed away
2:37:18just before krista made the decision to
2:37:20be part of the show
2:37:22and so stephanie says she's jumped from
2:37:24one relationship to the next definitely
2:37:26looking for a man to fill the void but
2:37:28basically
2:37:30what i think happened is that krista was
2:37:32quite vulnerable
2:37:34when she made the show and i think she
2:37:36was quite emotionally vulnerable
2:37:38based on what happened to her mother
2:37:43stephanie says she's no longer engaged
2:37:45to dylan and has since been in a
2:37:47relationship
2:37:48with the bodyguard who looked after her
2:37:50during the filming
2:37:51of this stephanie says her mom was her
2:37:55best friend she was in her mid-50s
2:37:58and christa as a young teen when she
2:38:01lost her mom suddenly she found
2:38:03comfort in 80s channel i think that's a
2:38:06whole another side to it is
2:38:08um kristen finding comfort
2:38:12in kind of social media getting the
2:38:16um not sure what one wants to call it
2:38:20some kind of soothing or support or
2:38:22reinforcement
2:38:24through social media do you think social
2:38:25media is a good place to get
2:38:29you know if someone close to you has
2:38:30died you think social media is a good
2:38:32place to get
2:38:33reinforcement to get sympathy to get
2:38:36or sympathy i think you can get on
2:38:37social media but to get um
2:38:42be sort of counseled and to be healed i
2:38:44think that's the word i'm looking for
2:38:46do you think social media is the place
2:38:47to go to for healing
2:38:52beverly says wish my mom were here same
2:38:55here
2:39:01chrissy felt a connection to her mom
2:39:03through
2:39:04that channel that's true
2:39:07she made it her mission to honor her mom
2:39:09by pursuing chris watts to find
2:39:11answers and justice for others involved
2:39:13so i think you have this weird
2:39:15psychology actually going on
2:39:17that krista did what she did
2:39:20out of kind of love for a mother
2:39:24right and i think part of the love for a
2:39:27mother is you know
2:39:28her mother's past and
2:39:31and then she has her beliefs also
2:39:33soothing her and chris watts also has
2:39:35those beliefs
2:39:36and there's quite a weird thing that's
2:39:38going on isn't it
2:39:45stephanie says chrissy was vulnerable
2:39:47and in my opinion
2:39:49that channel's influence had a huge
2:39:51impact on the choices she made
2:39:54so i do think you've got to ask the
2:39:56question it would be interesting if
2:39:58chrissy could leave a message in the
2:39:59comment
2:40:01you know do you feel bad about
2:40:04what's happened do you do you regret
2:40:08going on to
2:40:09sell made secrets it would just be
2:40:12interesting to know that
2:40:14um i think the some people
2:40:17who very happy that it happened
2:40:20um the impression i got and this is
2:40:24probably quite a good note to end on the
2:40:25impression i got from that channel
2:40:27was that he thought some made secrets is
2:40:30going to
2:40:31boost his position that chris watts
2:40:33didn't act alone
2:40:36sound my secrets is going to boost the
2:40:38narrative that
2:40:39there was some other accessory and and
2:40:42let me ask you
2:40:44if you've seen soulmate secrets did you
2:40:46ever get
2:40:47that sense anywhere in in that
2:40:50documentary so in
2:40:52other words is there any moment anywhere
2:40:54in that documentary
2:40:55that the documentary um reinforces
2:40:59that channel's conspiracy theory in
2:41:01other words did you ever hear them
2:41:03saying
2:41:04we think there's an accessory involved
2:41:05and it could be
2:41:07this person or that person or that one
2:41:11from what i remember and i watched it
2:41:13like literally an hour or two ago a
2:41:15couple of hours ago
2:41:19i watched it just before i did this live
2:41:22um i think sheryl and cadill says you
2:41:26know he's the monster he's the only one
2:41:28who did this
2:41:29so so um you know i don't know i don't
2:41:33know whether
2:41:34he can sort of high-five himself and say
2:41:38the truth is now out there the truth
2:41:41that he's been trying to
2:41:42you know put out there i don't think
2:41:43that's out there is it out there i don't
2:41:45i don't think it is
2:41:47in any event those of you who are here
2:41:49now
2:41:50who believe that there was an accessory
2:41:52involved or
2:41:53believe chris watts chris watts couldn't
2:41:56have acted alone
2:41:58um you should watch my um
2:42:01the live stream i did where i deal with
2:42:04that in detail
2:42:05or deal with how chris watts has been
2:42:08behaving in an independent way
2:42:12uh you know in terms of his fitness
2:42:14journey but many other things as well
2:42:15just having an affair
2:42:17as well i go through that in that live
2:42:20stream if you're not sure how to find it
2:42:22i'll provide you
2:42:23the link for that so let me know in the
2:42:24comments but i basically
2:42:26debunked that whole myth that he didn't
2:42:29act alone
2:42:30but are there any of you here who still
2:42:32think that he had help
2:42:34because i hope the this documentary is
2:42:38i hope you've seen how clear it has been
2:42:40in this documentary that
2:42:42that that narrative doesn't have any
2:42:44legs certainly it hasn't had enough legs
2:42:46for for the
2:42:48soulmate secrets to to um you know
2:42:51breathe any
2:42:52fire into it right liz graham says i
2:42:55think he
2:42:56acted totally alone
2:42:59beverly lawyer from what i've heard i
2:43:01think watts did everything justine myers
2:43:06kitty witchy yes please stephanie
2:43:10he did it all okay so kitty i'll put a
2:43:13link
2:43:14in the description um it's actually if
2:43:16you go to my channel
2:43:18to the home page on my channel it's the
2:43:21it's the it's the main video
2:43:23it's the main sort of you know if you go
2:43:26to my
2:43:27youtube channel home page then that's
2:43:30the
2:43:30the main video that that deals with did
2:43:32he act alone
2:43:34so bruce light he didn't have help
2:43:40kitty whitney says don't know not sure
2:43:47barbara henninger do you get a lot of
2:43:48money to go on that show i don't know i
2:43:50presume
2:43:51you do
2:43:57rosebud said that is a great video
2:43:59you've made i actually thought it was
2:44:01important to
2:44:02go to quite a lot of trouble and answer
2:44:05what what's ostensibly to me a dumb
2:44:08question
2:44:09but to go to quite a lot of trouble to
2:44:11say to what extent
2:44:13was chris what's capable of acting
2:44:15independently and i think when you
2:44:17seriously ask that question and you go
2:44:19through different areas of his life it
2:44:21is quite a fascinating narrative
2:44:23because i think in some ways he is very
2:44:26naive and he's
2:44:27gullible and and and all that but
2:44:30there's another part of him that's not i
2:44:31mean
2:44:32you know he was able to get a job
2:44:35leaving his job as a mechanic who's able
2:44:37to get a job at anadarko
2:44:39out of all the guys in anadarko
2:44:41kessinger chose him
2:44:43must mean that he's capable of something
2:44:45you know he's able to
2:44:48um mislead or you know
2:44:51lie for quite a while to code this fbi
2:44:54agent
2:44:55they actually struggle to get
2:44:56information out of him you know
2:44:59it's only when they confronted him with
2:45:01the affair
2:45:02thanks to kessinger coming forward and
2:45:04telling them
2:45:06when they knew this about him you know
2:45:09and they were able to say well you
2:45:11haven't been telling us the truth that
2:45:12they were able to
2:45:14crack him in a way they didn't crack him
2:45:15totally it wasn't as though he's ever
2:45:18confessed to everything he sort of
2:45:20confessed
2:45:22but then he you know tries to get
2:45:26out of it as well he confesses and tries
2:45:28to wriggle out of it
2:45:34sarah she i can't believe you read my
2:45:36input interesting i feel relevant
2:45:39with a damaged sim card which never
2:45:41happens because they are protected and
2:45:42so small why do you think nk is not
2:45:44hiding something
2:45:49i think nk is hiding something she's
2:45:51hiding the scale and scope of their
2:45:53relationship but
2:45:55you know in other words the the lurid
2:45:57stuff
2:45:59but if you want to take it much further
2:46:00than that are you saying
2:46:03that the entire justice department are
2:46:05corrupt or whatever
2:46:07it's possible that she has a plea deal
2:46:09as well it's possible that there's
2:46:10something similar to
2:46:12crystal kenny but if you want to take it
2:46:14further than saying that
2:46:15she actually was involved she was there
2:46:18that night i don't believe that i mean
2:46:20that's
2:46:21why would you know why would you want to
2:46:23be with someone
2:46:25you know why would you want to be with
2:46:26someone who is going to do that
2:46:28you know what what in other words you
2:46:31know like
2:46:32think about it just in a practical way
2:46:34you're in love with someone
2:46:36now why on earth would you still be in
2:46:38love with that person
2:46:39if you knew that they wanted to do that
2:46:42and that to their own family
2:46:43why would you want to start a family
2:46:45with someone like that
2:46:48people don't seem to think about it that
2:46:50far
2:46:55liz graham
2:46:59okay
2:47:02well we're approaching the three-hour
2:47:04mark and it's ten to four in the morning
2:47:06i think i need to
2:47:08say goodbye i hope you guys have found
2:47:10this live
2:47:11interesting i really didn't think it
2:47:13would be this long i thought it would be
2:47:15like one hour
2:47:16right you know i thought it would be
2:47:19quite a short video so let's just hear
2:47:23it from you guys
2:47:24thanks a lot stephanie um
2:47:27helen is anyone here from the uk that's
2:47:29still awake
2:47:31i know it's not quite as late there as
2:47:33it is here i think it's it's
2:47:342 a.m in the in the morning there
2:47:39good night melanie good night bria
2:47:42thanks a lot for being up
2:47:43this late i hope i haven't messed up
2:47:45your weekend
2:47:47thanks a lot to lula
2:47:50awesome live thanks thanks rose but
2:47:52thanks guys
2:47:53um in terms of tomorrow i'm going to be
2:47:56doing a live at the usual time two
2:47:57o'clock eastern standard time
2:47:59do you want me to talk about summer
2:48:01wells i think we can talk about summer
2:48:03wells
2:48:04quickly talk about the sentence derek
2:48:06shawn got
2:48:07and then and then i hope i can talk
2:48:10about the
2:48:11doomsday uh movie
2:48:14on doomsday mom movie on lifetime
2:48:17hopefully we can talk about that i don't
2:48:19know how much
2:48:19they'll be on it but we'll see but i
2:48:22actually want to talk about summer wells
2:48:24tomorrow so for those interested in that
2:48:27case it's
2:48:28uh two o'clock eastern standard time
2:48:30tomorrow
2:48:31good night guys um thanks everyone for
2:48:34being here
2:48:34and thanks to those of you who've
2:48:37subscribed if you haven't subscribed
2:48:38please do
2:48:40and i'll see you guys next time
2:48:43thanks again to the moderators thanks a
2:48:54lot

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