BUILT DIFFERENT - Guitar Talk With Juha Ruokangas — Transcript

Full transcript

1. 0:00Hey guys, it's Rob here and welcome to
2. 0:02another video. Today we have a special
3. 0:04guest here and you might recognize these
4. 0:08guitars on my channel. There's another
5. 0:10one and he is the guy behind these
6. 0:14guitars. Welcome Mr. Yuharaka.
7. 0:17>> Thank you Rob for inviting me.
8. 0:19>> Yeah, good to have you here.
9. 0:20>> Awesome.
10. 0:21>> How are you doing?
11. 0:22>> Great. Great. Good.
12. 0:24>> Good.
13. 0:26uh short night last night uh thermally
14. 0:29aging tone wood for the next guitars or
15. 0:32not the next guitars but for next years
16. 0:34of guitars.
17. 0:35>> So you're still figuring out how to make
18. 0:36better guitars.
19. 0:38>> It never ends better. When when I figure
20. 0:40it all out, it's time to retire.
21. 0:43>> Yeah. I guess that's the endless road
22. 0:45that you need to follow.
23. 0:47>> Yeah.
24. 0:47>> So our our story goes back like a 15
25. 0:50years.
26. 0:51>> 50 years ago. Yeah.
27. 0:53>> Or 70 years. You were you were a young
28. 0:56man. Not a young man. Young boy.
29. 0:58>> Yeah. I was like 13 14 15.
30. 1:00>> Right.
31. 1:00>> And you were just moved.
32. 1:02>> Yeah.
33. 1:03>> My hometown. And you live nearby my
34. 1:06>> Yeah. Like a kind of like a really
35. 1:09close. Yeah. Yeah.
36. 1:10>> I spent a lot of times at your shop.
37. 1:13>> Yeah.
38. 1:13>> Back in the days. And
39. 1:14>> Yeah. I remember I remember very well
40. 1:16the first time you showed up at the door
41. 1:18>> and and you know
42. 1:20>> um well you were young boy teenager
43. 1:25coming and you you were as enthusiastic
44. 1:28and full of you know ideas for the
45. 1:31future as as you I the way I still see
46. 1:34you are and it was quite inspiring
47. 1:37>> then um to listen to you you told me
48. 1:42that I'm going to go to that school and
49. 1:44I'm going do this and I'm going to do
50. 1:46that and you know and this and and one
51. 1:48day I will order a guitar from you and
52. 1:50it's going to be like that and whatever
53. 1:52and you had all these plans. Sometimes
54. 1:55you know teenagers, kids show up and
55. 1:58talk about their future like that
56. 2:01>> but yours has unfolded
57. 2:05exactly like you kind of
58. 2:08envisioned it back then and even more.
59. 2:11So, it's it's been
60. 2:13>> uh quite a treat and and a joy to follow
61. 2:17your journey as a as a as a professional
62. 2:21uh guitarist. Uh likewise, when I was a
63. 2:24kid, I've felt that I was really welcome
64. 2:29to see see all of you guys and you took
65. 2:32the time for me to explain
66. 2:35everything that I asked. Even I I was
67. 2:38like a 14 years ago. 14 years old and I
68. 2:42didn't have any money basically.
69. 2:43>> Yeah. And it was a it was a really
70. 2:49like a important moment for me that
71. 2:53I can really see how the things are done
72. 2:56properly and and you you showed me how
73. 3:02to set up my own guitar back then and it
74. 3:06was a different brand guitar of course.
75. 3:07>> Yeah, of course. And then but that
76. 3:09doesn't matter. I mean it's like a
77. 3:10guitar. our our first years when that
78. 3:13you maintained my guitars. Yeah.
79. 3:16>> And changed the frets.
80. 3:18>> Yeah.
81. 3:18>> And then came the day that
82. 3:21>> you came to order your first guitar.
83. 3:24>> And it's actually here.
84. 3:25>> It's this guitar. It's this guitar.
85. 3:27>> Yeah.
86. 3:27>> And it's from 2015.
87. 3:30>> Yeah.
88. 3:31>> Yeah. And funny thing was that
89. 3:34>> when I asked you to build this guitar
90. 3:36>> Yeah.
91. 3:37>> You didn't back in the days have that.
92. 3:39>> We didn't have that. We didn't have a 24
93. 3:41fret.
94. 3:42>> Yeah.
95. 3:43>> Like an S style
96. 3:45kind of thing.
97. 3:46>> It was something that I wanted so bad,
98. 3:48but you didn't have.
99. 3:50>> One day you called me that.
100. 3:53>> We are.
101. 3:53>> Could you pay a visit at our shop
102. 3:56>> and I I went there and there was guitar
103. 3:59like this? It was the Mikas the green.
104. 4:02>> Yeah. Mr. Fast Finger. Yeah. the green
105. 4:04guitar that that we built
106. 4:07>> as part of. We also did the funny uh
107. 4:10>> cartoon movie
108. 4:11>> cartoon
109. 4:13film The Spirit of the Guitar Hunt.
110. 4:16>> Yeah.
111. 4:16>> Where where me and our whole shop team
112. 4:20got to be like
113. 4:21>> actors for a little bit
114. 4:23>> and then actually it's in on your
115. 4:25YouTube channel.
116. 4:26>> On on Mr. Fastinger YouTube channel. The
117. 4:28>> way you can find it on YouTube.
118. 4:29>> Yeah. The spirit of the guitar. Uh, the
119. 4:32spirit of the guitar hunt. It's on or
120. 4:35Okay. Yeah. Emma is here with me behind
121. 4:38the camera
122. 4:40uh watching watching my performance.
123. 4:43>> Yeah. [laughter]
124. 4:45>> Yeah. So, so uh yeah, it is on our
125. 4:49channel as well. So, look for that.
126. 4:52Spirit of the Guitar Hunt.
127. 4:53>> Yeah. It's fun. It's fun. A cartoon
128. 4:55character walks into our shop to order a
129. 4:57guitar from us. Yeah.
130. 4:58>> Sort of like, you know, the the
131. 5:01middle-aged elderly folk will know the
132. 5:04movie Roger Rabbit. It's kind of like
133. 5:08done in that style. Roger Rabbit movie.
134. 5:10Yeah. And and it was quite an actually
135. 5:12coincidence that that that whole 24 fret
136. 5:16guitar.
137. 5:17>> Yeah.
138. 5:18>> Unfolded the way it did and the timing
139. 5:21and everything with with your
140. 5:22>> Yeah, it was perfect timing actually.
141. 5:24>> Yeah. And then I ordered this one
142. 5:27>> which was the first ever made like you
143. 5:29know necro body this this this guitar.
144. 5:32>> Yeah.
145. 5:32>> Yeah.
146. 5:33>> There's serial number two.
147. 5:34>> Yeah. Yeah. [laughter]
148. 5:35>> You didn't give me the one.
149. 5:37>> No. I guess we didn't. Yeah.
150. 5:39>> But when when this was finished,
151. 5:42>> I guess it didn't have name back then.
152. 5:46>> No, it didn't.
153. 5:47>> Yeah. It didn't have the Eon name yet
154. 5:49cuz same with Migos guitar. It didn't
155. 5:52have it yet. Was it considered as to be
156. 5:55a SOP like your strat? I I I don't know
157. 5:57what it was.
158. 5:59cuz cuz the actually actually the like
159. 6:01the the uh the background story of the
160. 6:05Eon model that became the Eon model
161. 6:08>> uh comes from that the fact that we had
162. 6:12we have the S style guitar more
163. 6:14traditional
164. 6:15>> um not a replica of Strat but in that
165. 6:20archetype of guitar 21 frets 20 or 22
166. 6:23frets
167. 6:24>> um called the VSOP as as you But, you
168. 6:28know, for for others to know, we've had
169. 6:30that one for for uh since Wait a minute.
170. 6:341999, I think.
171. 6:36>> Was it your first model or was it the
172. 6:38Duke?
173. 6:38>> Uh, the Duke was the very first model
174. 6:40and the VSOP was the second one. So, we
175. 6:42had that for a long time. And then a
176. 6:44couple of years after that, we started
177. 6:47working on a like a more like a metal
178. 6:50guitar. This was also like another young
179. 6:52man that I got to know way before you
180. 6:55>> uh Matias Kupan and who also showed up
181. 6:58at our
182. 6:59>> door like as a teenager sort of like
183. 7:02really young and wasn't yet in
184. 7:04Stratavarius or anything and
185. 7:06>> wow
186. 7:06>> um and and we maintained his guitars
187. 7:09also and we did fret work for him and
188. 7:11his PRS the one that he plays young as a
189. 7:13young dude on on YouTube videos. Um uh
190. 7:17so we we did maintenance work for him
191. 7:19back then. Uh and and and
192. 7:22he kind of we had been working on a 24
193. 7:26fret metal guitar that then evolved into
194. 7:30a model we called the Hellcat.
195. 7:32>> Yeah.
196. 7:32>> And Matias owns one of the early
197. 7:35prototypes that didn't have a name at
198. 7:37the time.
199. 7:38>> Is it the black one which stock?
200. 7:40>> Yeah. Yeah. So it's kind of like a
201. 7:42hybrid of something. It wasn't yet quite
202. 7:44there. and and so that guitar. So for
203. 7:48for many many years we had we had the
204. 7:51VSOP and we had the Hellcat and so so
205. 7:54from time to time we get these guys who
206. 7:56are like that I want the VSOP but can it
207. 8:02have 24 frets?
208. 8:03>> Yeah. So, we made a few um custom
209. 8:06guitars like one of custom guitars like
210. 8:08that where we would put the the the
211. 8:10Hellcat body that that had
212. 8:14>> the design was like for 24 frets. So,
213. 8:16you had the like deep enough cutaway and
214. 8:19>> you know and um and and these guitars
215. 8:22didn't have a name. They were just
216. 8:24custom something whatever.
217. 8:26And we made a few of those and we all
218. 8:28always kind of thought that yeah that
219. 8:30there's kind of like there's there's one
220. 8:32missing link there that that that would
221. 8:37kind of fall into that super strat
222. 8:39archetype of 80s.
223. 8:41>> You know the magic word 80s, right? 24
224. 8:45frets 80s guitar. more more leaning
225. 8:48towards like, you know, hard rock and
226. 8:51and and power rock, whatever you call
227. 8:54that stuff, rather than metal.
228. 8:56>> Yeah.
229. 8:57>> And um
230. 8:59and so then Mika, Mr. Fastfinger, comes
231. 9:03along.
232. 9:03>> Yeah.
233. 9:04>> And we make the Spirit of the Guitar
234. 9:07Hunt movie and we make his guitar.
235. 9:10Doesn't have a name.
236. 9:11>> Yeah. But clearly it's kind of like
237. 9:13defining into something own
238. 9:16>> more concrete own
239. 9:20>> its own animal so or own breed
240. 9:23>> and uh then yours
241. 9:26came very soon after and um I can't
242. 9:29quite even remember
243. 9:32how many we made these guitars then
244. 9:34before it was named the Eon which is
245. 9:37sort of like a born as a hybrid of the
246. 9:39VSOP and the Hellcat. So it's like a
247. 9:42Hellcat and VSOP get married and got
248. 9:46children.
249. 9:47>> Yeah. Something like that. And and the
250. 9:49and the and the kind of like the bottom
251. 9:51line or the difference of the guitars is
252. 9:53that um the the the VSOP guitar is more
253. 9:58traditional in the sense of the the the
254. 10:00body um geometry and uh and the cutaway
255. 10:04and everything. So it's kind of designed
256. 10:05to be like 21 22 for a guitar. Um
257. 10:09whereas the Eon is then kind of the next
258. 10:12step the the Super Strat archetype.
259. 10:14>> Yeah.
260. 10:15>> Where um it's kind of it could be the
261. 10:20first guitars that came along like that
262. 10:24in the in the 80s would not maybe always
263. 10:27have Floyd Rose, but they were they were
264. 10:29still like, you know,
265. 10:31>> with like an non-locking
266. 10:32>> Yeah. whammy bar and and and that types
267. 10:36which needs if you have this this type
268. 10:39of whammy bar you can't really have like
269. 10:41a you know our Hellcat metal headstock
270. 10:44that is like pointing
271. 10:46>> whichever way and the strings are
272. 10:48spreading kind of
273. 10:50>> every which way and so which looks cool
274. 10:54looks very metal but with a non-locking
275. 10:56whammy it doesn't stay in tune at all so
276. 10:58you couldn't do that so you kind of need
277. 11:00the straight string pull Yeah.
278. 11:03>> Which then kind of was just like a
279. 11:06merger or like a hybrid. Then um yeah,
280. 11:10the Eon is that and then then the
281. 11:12Hellcat is kind of like going it.
282. 11:14>> Yeah.
283. 11:15>> The Hellcat is like basically uh by
284. 11:19default designed to be a Floyd Ro
285. 11:20guitar. Of course, the Eon can be also
286. 11:22done with like you have that one.
287. 11:24>> It's the first Eon made with the Floyd
288. 11:26Ro.
289. 11:26>> Yeah, it is. Yeah.
290. 11:27>> You have many firsts.
291. 11:28>> Cool.
292. 11:28>> In our shop. Yeah.
293. 11:29>> It started from this. started from this
294. 11:32>> and then it ended up like this.
295. 11:34>> And there's quite a few many guitars in
296. 11:36between that you don't have here now,
297. 11:38right? Isn't that right?
298. 11:38>> One on is at my home with my sofa
299. 11:41guitar.
300. 11:42>> Yeah. And that that one I remember.
301. 11:44>> Yeah.
302. 11:45>> We you you came by at her shop.
303. 11:47>> Yeah.
304. 11:48>> And we had a bunch of tops there.
305. 11:51>> Yeah.
306. 11:52>> And and we just laid those birds tops on
307. 11:56the floor. Right. I've heard that if you
308. 11:58order a guitar from a ua, you can really
309. 12:00choose your top boot.
310. 12:02>> Yeah.
311. 12:03>> And then
312. 12:04>> Yeah. So, we had these tops laid down
313. 12:06there and you look at the one top that
314. 12:08that's mine.
315. 12:09>> I need to just figure out what guitar it
316. 12:11will be on and and that it's pretty wild
317. 12:14top in there.
318. 12:14>> Yeah. It's sort of like a eyes. It's not
319. 12:17a typical flame.
320. 12:19>> No, no. It's it's quite quite unusual.
321. 12:21Really rare.
322. 12:22>> But you can see that guitar also on my
323. 12:24channel.
324. 12:25>> Yeah. So, go check it out. What about
325. 12:27the headstock? All your headstocks are
326. 12:30sort of like a 3D design.
327. 12:32>> That came really early on with the with
328. 12:34the first guitar, the Duke. Um, well, I
329. 12:37started my shop in uh in 1995. So, I've
330. 12:41been around for a long time. 30 31.
331. 12:43>> I was 2 years old.
332. 12:44>> Two years old. Yeah. So 31 years um in
333. 12:50this uh crazy business or maybe a
334. 12:52lifestyle more than business I would
335. 12:54call it for my like lifestyle of a
336. 12:57craftsman or or handcraft and um 1995.
337. 13:01Yeah. And I I was dreaming big like you
338. 13:04know
339. 13:05I I I
340. 13:07was adamant to be the the best guitar
341. 13:10maker on this planet to start with and
342. 13:13we go on from there like
343. 13:15>> you know so that was so that was like a
344. 13:18young man young guitar makers naive
345. 13:22>> belief to the you know big future which
346. 13:25>> that's the point you need to you need to
347. 13:28>> dare you need to dare to kind of dream
348. 13:30big and and So yeah, so I I I never
349. 13:33really like dreamed to be like, you
350. 13:34know, the second best guitar repairs guy
351. 13:37in town,
352. 13:38>> but it was something else for me, even
353. 13:40though hats off to all the repairs guys
354. 13:42cuz they are needed and they're so and
355. 13:44and I've repaired I've we've repaired
356. 13:46and we still repair. So it's like
357. 13:48nothing nothing against that of course
358. 13:50[snorts]
359. 13:50>> that's a very very valuable part of you
360. 13:53know learning the craft when you are
361. 13:54repairing other guitars maintaining
362. 13:56other guitars referring guitars so on
363. 13:59but yeah so 1995 I started and by 1997 I
364. 14:02had got my first guitar model prototype
365. 14:061996
366. 14:07the first prototype ready which was
367. 14:10basically the Duke except for two things
368. 14:14it had 24 frets
369. 14:15>> okay
370. 14:16>> the first prototype Yeah.
371. 14:18>> And and the headstock was as it is the
372. 14:21Duke has
373. 14:22>> but without the 3D
374. 14:24>> carve or the kind of like the step
375. 14:25carve.
376. 14:26>> Okay.
377. 14:26>> So that was the very first prototype. It
378. 14:28was green and I was so busy with repairs
379. 14:31that that prototype was there like you
380. 14:33know I had done the finishing and fret
381. 14:36work and everything. It was just kind of
382. 14:37waiting to be assembled and it was there
383. 14:40uh on the wall for probably 6 months and
384. 14:44I didn't have I didn't have time to work
385. 14:46on it. Then the day came and I, you
386. 14:48know, I I took it, I took it again and I
387. 14:51started looking at it and having had the
388. 14:56little break,
389. 14:58you know, not paying attention to the
390. 15:00guitar had kind of given me more
391. 15:02perspective somehow to see that, you
392. 15:05know, the design really sucked.
393. 15:07>> I didn't I didn't like it at all. I
394. 15:09think I think it was not a not meant to
395. 15:12be a 24 fret guitar because my heart was
396. 15:15less Paul and I I
397. 15:17>> I was somehow
398. 15:19because you can clearly see that you
399. 15:22know from that era when I grew up um and
400. 15:28I was a teenager like 80s late 80s
401. 15:33early 90s growing up um
402. 15:37PRS was up and me. Yeah. Poly Smith
403. 15:40guitars.
404. 15:41>> You had some other things, cool things
405. 15:43going on like Tom Anderson guitars. The
406. 15:46the first Shector guitars had come to
407. 15:48Finland um at that time and and um
408. 15:53>> and also uh Valley Arts was happening
409. 15:57>> and these cool kind of even though there
410. 16:00was no talk about there was no such
411. 16:01thing as boutique guitars. I mean it was
412. 16:04>> didn't exist. I mean, these were just,
413. 16:05you know, custom shops, little [snorts]
414. 16:07>> something. And and um so my Duke, you
415. 16:11can you can tell the references that
416. 16:15it has something from Pauly Smith. It
417. 16:17has something from these other other uh
418. 16:20other brands. But um but by heart it was
419. 16:25you know the short scale less Paul scale
420. 16:29length
421. 16:30>> carved top the the neck angle the same
422. 16:34as Les Paul and um double humbucker even
423. 16:38though double cutaway but for me it was
424. 16:42always a less Paul guitar. So I was
425. 16:43looking at that 24 fret guitar and then
426. 16:46I look looked at the headstock. It
427. 16:48looked too big for for starters
428. 16:50>> and
429. 16:52and I it just wasn't aesthetically
430. 16:55pleasing. And from somewhere I just got
431. 16:58the idea that what if I would just try
432. 17:01to carve the edge of the of the uh of
433. 17:04the headstock.
434. 17:06And so I started to do like drawings of
435. 17:08that like you know pencil drawing of how
436. 17:11would this look like as a kind of a 3D
437. 17:13shape that you have two shapes that are
438. 17:15then working together. Um, and then also
439. 17:19thinking of the 22 frets and all of a
440. 17:21sudden I would get the guitar looking
441. 17:23not only looking more balanced, but when
442. 17:26you're having it
443. 17:27>> Yeah.
444. 17:27>> on your lap it's like super
445. 17:29>> balanced. So I would
446. 17:30>> it's not any neck heavy or body heavy.
447. 17:32>> Yeah. It's just like you know there and
448. 17:34you don't need to kind of think about it
449. 17:36which is kind of like all my guitars
450. 17:38since that first. Exactly. So it's it's
451. 17:40like ergonomic
452. 17:42>> approach to the to the kind of playing
453. 17:44playing position whether doesn't matter
454. 17:46if you're sit down or have it you know
455. 17:48>> hanging on your shoulder it's like the
456. 17:50same. So yeah, what I happened what what
457. 17:52I did with the green guitar, my very
458. 17:54first Duke prototype is that I I went to
459. 17:56my band saw and
460. 18:00>> you cut it in two pieces. I cut it in
461. 18:02two pieces and you know burned burned it
462. 18:04>> in sa in s
463. 18:07that's what I did cuz I you know this
464. 18:09was something that I had learned from
465. 18:11from my teacher my mentor matalina
466. 18:13flying fing guitars he was a teacher in
467. 18:15guitar making school where I where I was
468. 18:17studying and it was a very valuable
469. 18:19lesson even though painful at the time
470. 18:21me as a as a basically a kid you know
471. 18:25there learning to be a guitar maker and
472. 18:28I had made my first neck and there
473. 18:30something had gone gone wrong and I was
474. 18:32trying there to fix it, you know, at my
475. 18:33workbench and I was trying to kind of
476. 18:35like fix something that
477. 18:38>> maybe was beyond fixing.
478. 18:40>> Okay.
479. 18:40>> But I I I
480. 18:42>> You didn't want to give up.
481. 18:43>> I I didn't want to give up.
482. 18:44>> No.
483. 18:44>> And so so Mati, my teacher, comes to my
484. 18:48bench and looks at it and and says, "You
485. 18:50come here. I'll show you what we can do
486. 18:52with this." And he takes me to the bando
487. 18:54and cuts the cuts the neck in two
488. 18:56pieces. And I'm there like nearly crying
489. 18:59because this is like you know this had
490. 19:01been for months months work for me.
491. 19:04>> Yeah.
492. 19:05>> But then he's there like um laughing and
493. 19:09saying that no worries just you know sit
494. 19:12down take a little breather. You will
495. 19:14get over this. But this is what you need
496. 19:17to learn. you know that you [ __ ] up with
497. 19:20the uh with a neck like that that you
498. 19:23know you could tell that it's it was
499. 19:25beyond repair and all you can do is that
500. 19:28you know you're going to try to mask it
501. 19:30up but somebody will notice.
502. 19:33>> Yeah.
503. 19:34>> And there goes your reputation.
504. 19:36>> Yeah.
505. 19:36>> You can't put out things like that.
506. 19:38>> Yeah.
507. 19:39>> You know, you need to you need to put
508. 19:40when you're a small builder, if you're
509. 19:42an individual guitar maker, the world is
510. 19:45brutal.
511. 19:46>> Yeah. for you. You put out one guitar
512. 19:49that is bad and the word goes out,
513. 19:51>> there goes your career, you know. Yeah.
514. 19:53Yeah. So, it's
515. 19:55>> and that was really valuable and and I I
516. 19:57just kind of thought of my
517. 20:00first Duke prototype that I don't want
518. 20:02to look at it anymore.
519. 20:03>> Yeah.
520. 20:04>> I want to make it right. And then I made
521. 20:06a batch of three guitars. One of them
522. 20:08ended up to legendary Finnish guitar
523. 20:10player Yukaton.
524. 20:12One of them ended up to Peter Le and one
525. 20:15to a local player uh a friend of mine.
526. 20:18>> Yeah.
527. 20:19>> So, you know, and this was then the
528. 20:22final design and it has been unchanged
529. 20:24since then.
530. 20:25>> Cool.
531. 20:25>> You know, and and and that 3D
532. 20:28>> step step two-step carve thing
533. 20:32>> uh that was born. Yeah. So, then it
534. 20:34became like a thing every time after
535. 20:36that
536. 20:36>> signature thing. I haven't seen this
537. 20:39this type of
538. 20:40>> It wasn't back then. I had I had never
539. 20:41seen it. So I I can't really tell.
540. 20:43Somebody asked me sometimes like from
541. 20:46time to time somebody had asked me that
542. 20:47where does it come from that what was
543. 20:49the inspiration but I I really can't
544. 20:52tell. It was one of those things that,
545. 20:53you know, sometimes you just, you know,
546. 20:56you take distance, you look at something
547. 20:58again and then figure out. Oh, yeah.
548. 21:00There was one thing that I was thinking,
549. 21:02you know, that I always uh had kind of
550. 21:05loved about um like acoustic rtop
551. 21:07guitars like, you know, Don Leeliko
552. 21:09guitars or guild guitars or these like
553. 21:11these gorgeous uh daquisto and and also
554. 21:15like the um
555. 21:19the the upper range Gibson guitars that
556. 21:21would have these like you know bindings
557. 21:23on the on the headstock which I I
558. 21:25thought always like an aesthetically
559. 21:26pleasing thing that it has like a
560. 21:28outline like that. So it's
561. 21:30>> and I that's that's I remember because
562. 21:33my first Duke prototype had that. So it
563. 21:36had a binding.
564. 21:37>> Okay.
565. 21:37>> Which made the
566. 21:39>> some sort of
567. 21:40>> I I I had hoped that it will be have
568. 21:42that kind of prestige
569. 21:44>> but for some reason for that shape I
570. 21:46don't think it did it. It was just like
571. 21:48too big looking. And then then uh the
572. 21:51idea of the three the two-step car was
573. 21:55like that I'll get an outline and it
574. 21:57will look like
575. 22:00it will look unlike anybody else's
576. 22:02outline.
577. 22:03>> Yeah.
578. 22:03>> On the headto
579. 22:04>> that's really unique
580. 22:06>> unique.
581. 22:06>> Yeah. So I later on I've seen many many
582. 22:09of course and nowadays there's so much
583. 22:11the boutique guitar uh there's so much
584. 22:13makers like hundreds I don't know
585. 22:15thousands maybe you know and and of
586. 22:17course you see things and and maybe
587. 22:19somebody has gotten an inspiration for
588. 22:21us and or somebody has figured it out on
589. 22:23their own and and so on but
590. 22:26>> at the time in the mid90s I had never
591. 22:28seen it anywhere. I want to point out
592. 22:31that you're a really small shop. You
593. 22:33have a really small team of master
594. 22:36looters. Yeah.
595. 22:37>> Who built this guitars by hand. So there
596. 22:40is no CNC or any
597. 22:43>> no
598. 22:44>> used used there. So it's
599. 22:46>> Yeah. It's it's a it's a sort of a like
600. 22:49typically when Yeah. Typically when when
601. 22:52a
602. 22:53>> when a you know you're like a one-man
603. 22:56operation.
604. 22:56>> Yeah. and and you know you do the
605. 23:01guitars from scratch
606. 23:03as a small shop. Um and if things pick
607. 23:07up and you get more work and you know
608. 23:09you hire someone and you hire maybe
609. 23:11third guy, fourth guy, typically this
610. 23:14goes like you know that okay you're the
611. 23:16luier.
612. 23:17>> Yeah.
613. 23:17>> And and you have helpers and and so you
614. 23:19have somebody there doing you know
615. 23:21spraying spraying or you know maybe
616. 23:23>> sort of like own department.
617. 23:25>> Yeah. Yeah. So, so, so the
618. 23:28even pretty small shops then
619. 23:32the the the
620. 23:34ethos or the kind of like the whole
621. 23:36concept of making a guitar from scratch
622. 23:39and playing that guitar and you know
623. 23:41owning it owning it.
624. 23:43>> Yeah.
625. 23:43>> And owning the pride of you know I have
626. 23:45built this guitar it changes into a
627. 23:48small scale serial production even even
628. 23:50if it's very small shop. And this is
629. 23:52something that I never really um
630. 23:55although let's that it would be wrong to
631. 23:57say I never thought of it. There was in
632. 24:00the early 2000s period of maybe four or
633. 24:04five years where we kind of were trying
634. 24:08to break on that small scale serial
635. 24:12production thing. But um but it became
636. 24:15very fast such a headache for me that I
637. 24:17I kind of realized through that that
638. 24:20okay this is starting to feel like like
639. 24:22work.
640. 24:23>> Yeah.
641. 24:23>> And I I never started making guitars to
642. 24:26work
643. 24:27>> to get a job as a guitar m get a job at
644. 24:31a factory.
645. 24:32>> I started making guitars. So it's, you
646. 24:34know, I I can do
647. 24:37the labor of love. Like it's the same
648. 24:39way I would imagine like for you, it's a
649. 24:41dream come true to be able to, you know,
650. 24:43make your living, you know, playing
651. 24:45guitar.
652. 24:46>> So this was every bit the same way for
653. 24:48me as like an artistic decision in a way
654. 24:50that
655. 24:51>> that um in in our shop even though
656. 24:53there's a few more guys. Um so we are
657. 24:57like uh every guitar is still built by
658. 25:01one person from beginning to end. So
659. 25:02they're sort of like a master.
660. 25:04>> Yeah. Every every guitar is like that.
661. 25:06There's there's a couple of sides to it
662. 25:08that
663. 25:10to me they are like meaningful and and
664. 25:12and make sense like common sense.
665. 25:15>> Yeah.
666. 25:15>> That when you when you make guitars like
667. 25:17that or when you make guitars this way
668. 25:22um think of it having been in the
669. 25:25business for 30 years. How is it to be,
670. 25:28you know, working on a on a serial
671. 25:30production line for 30 years? You're
672. 25:32gonna be super bored.
673. 25:34>> Yeah.
674. 25:34>> And if you if you become super or bored
675. 25:37to your work,
676. 25:38>> then your quality
677. 25:38>> are you going to be motivated to doing
678. 25:40it?
679. 25:40>> Yeah. And then your inquality goes.
680. 25:42>> Yeah. So, so it's kind of like
681. 25:46my best bet is that if you make guitars
682. 25:49and every time you make a guitar and
683. 25:50you're the guy who makes it from the
684. 25:52beginning till the end and you're the
685. 25:54guy who plays it and you kind of get to
686. 25:57own
687. 25:57>> Yeah. that guitar and the feeling that
688. 26:00and it's in we we try to be very
689. 26:03transparent about it also that you know
690. 26:05even though it's my name there
691. 26:06>> doesn't mean that I built guitars every
692. 26:09time
693. 26:10>> more often not than than that it would
694. 26:13be built by me
695. 26:14>> I have five of your guitars
696. 26:17>> and
697. 26:18from three different builders
698. 26:21>> and all the guitars the quality is same
699. 26:25I mean the fret work everything that I
700. 26:28can't say who is built.
701. 26:31>> Yeah, I I can say I can tell certain
702. 26:33little tiny things I can I can say that
703. 26:36they have their kind of signature
704. 26:39>> uh certain ways of rounding something or
705. 26:41doing this or that. But that would be
706. 26:43like
707. 26:44>> Yeah. Yeah. Like mag you need to
708. 26:46>> you need to know it inside out. And we
709. 26:48take great pride in in um you know that
710. 26:52every instrument needs to like like kind
711. 26:54of like you you you don't you can't
712. 26:56afford
713. 26:56>> put out anything
714. 26:58>> less than what you what what the
715. 27:00standard is. And if anything, I would
716. 27:03say that over the years, um,
717. 27:07even if my very early guitars, I still
718. 27:11get some of those, you know, maintenance
719. 27:14work and things, and I'm like every time
720. 27:16kind of it's not like impostor syndrome,
721. 27:19but it's it's it's a little bit like,
722. 27:20you know, you get that early guitar and
723. 27:23you're kind of a little bit nervous
724. 27:24that, oh my god, how is it going to be?
725. 27:27Yeah. and and and I look at the guitar
726. 27:29and play that guitar and I'm every time
727. 27:31like seriously every time happily like
728. 27:34surprised sort of that wow that this is
729. 27:38actually this is not a bad guitar. This
730. 27:40is a great guitar. Okay, I can tell some
731. 27:43aesthetic details that we have evolved
732. 27:45and developed and and now the guitars
733. 27:48are better than they were and it's kind
734. 27:50of like weird if they wouldn't be. I
735. 27:52mean,
736. 27:53>> you know, it you need to be pretty
737. 27:55thickheaded if if you don't [laughter]
738. 27:59>> uh develop any better in 30 years. So,
739. 28:02>> and that's the thing which keep up the
740. 28:04motivation that you always want want to
741. 28:07be better and make better.
742. 28:09>> Yeah, that's solutions.
743. 28:10>> Yeah. I I I still feel the same way as
744. 28:13like 35 years ago, 36 years ago when
745. 28:17when I got to know that I I I will I
746. 28:20will be studying guitar making.
747. 28:22>> Yeah.
748. 28:23>> You know, and my
749. 28:26my thought was that wow that
750. 28:29wouldn't be so cool
751. 28:31to make guitars for my living and I
752. 28:33would never need to get a job.
753. 28:34>> Yeah. [laughter] like you know
754. 28:37>> so it's kind of gone that way and
755. 28:40>> and I I still feel that way even though
756. 28:42of course it's like hard work and you
757. 28:44know entrepreneur and you have
758. 28:46>> responsibilities and all these things
759. 28:48everybody running small business know
760. 28:51>> that it's not like um
761. 28:53>> it's not a walk in the park but
762. 28:56>> um
763. 28:56>> but you're willing to do that.
764. 28:58>> Yeah. Because because it is like your
765. 29:01you own it and and um
766. 29:03>> and I don't mean like literally own it
767. 29:05but you have you have the
768. 29:07>> you have the feeling of of of ownership
769. 29:10in in the sense that um yeah it it it
770. 29:14gives joy.
771. 29:15>> Yeah. like it gives joy every time to
772. 29:20maybe you know sometimes somebody asked
773. 29:21me like you make this beautiful guitar
774. 29:23that isn't it isn't it horrible to give
775. 29:25it away or like you know send it away or
776. 29:27you know somebody picks it up and you
777. 29:29don't get to keep it yourself I've never
778. 29:30felt that way even from the very first
779. 29:32guitars maybe it's I'm I've never been a
780. 29:34collector type of anything I don't
781. 29:36collect guitars
782. 29:37>> how many guitars you
783. 29:38>> maybe 15 or something [laughter]
784. 29:39>> that's quite much
785. 29:41>> yeah but it's
786. 29:43but it's not
787. 29:47Yeah, I suppose there there's like
788. 29:49certain kind of let's say uh it's not
789. 29:52your typical kind of collecting
790. 29:54>> Yeah.
791. 29:54>> guitars. They're more like um I'm
792. 29:56looking after them.
793. 29:58>> Yeah.
794. 29:59>> Until they move on.
795. 30:01>> Okay. you know, yeah, it's I feel like
796. 30:03this way it's it's it's really it's hard
797. 30:06to say, but I I don't I don't need to
798. 30:09have a collection of stuff or
799. 30:10collections of guitars or anything, but
800. 30:13you know, I can look after them until
801. 30:16somebody else looks after them.
802. 30:17>> Yeah.
803. 30:18>> And and these instruments are, you know,
804. 30:21made for made for to last over
805. 30:25generations. Yeah.
806. 30:27>> And so in that way there's a there's a
807. 30:29saying, you know, that
808. 30:32we don't really own any of this stuff.
809. 30:34We just look after it.
810. 30:35>> Yeah. and and then then you know
811. 30:38>> our time ends and and somebody else and
812. 30:41and and that's I think you know when
813. 30:45>> thinking of uh [sighs and gasps]
814. 30:47>> it goes quite kind of like to the deep
815. 30:50end now but but um
816. 30:53thinking of the the the society and the
817. 30:55work world and the culture that we live
818. 30:57in it's like
819. 30:58>> um like I feel in a way that I've even
820. 31:02said it on some on some video that I
821. 31:04made few years ago that I think there's
822. 31:07you know enough guitars in the world
823. 31:09like there's already too much everything
824. 31:11in the world the world is like filling
825. 31:13up of stuff and the only kind of
826. 31:15meaningful reason for me to keep on
827. 31:17doing things that it's something that
828. 31:21inspires and makes sense and is um
829. 31:24ethical and and
830. 31:27you know longlasting. So it's,
831. 31:30>> you know, there's this thing about, you
832. 31:31know, recycling is cool, but recycling
833. 31:33is kind of like a plan B. You need to
834. 31:36recycle something when you can't fix it
835. 31:38anymore.
836. 31:39>> Yeah.
837. 31:39>> You you need to recycle your phone,
838. 31:41>> but
839. 31:43when do you recycle this? I mean, you
840. 31:45can always repair it and it will last,
841. 31:47you know, to to
842. 31:49>> to the next generation and to the next
843. 31:51generation if it's looked after well.
844. 31:53And
845. 31:54>> and um yeah, it's it's it's that kind of
846. 31:56things
847. 31:57>> for me. I don't somebody when I talk
848. 32:00with people with guitars and especially
849. 32:04the expensive guitars they see those as
850. 32:06a numbers but I see this as a tool for a
851. 32:11lifetime and then I have the same
852. 32:14>> ideology as you that when I'm gone or
853. 32:17something
854. 32:18>> somebody else
855. 32:21>> yeah it's it's it's just you know the
856. 32:23somebody says it's like a harsh reality
857. 32:25but I think there's a beauty to it as
858. 32:27Well, yeah. Yeah, sure.
859. 32:28>> I I think and and um and where I was
860. 32:32kind of going with earlier on that
861. 32:36>> that I've never felt bad about, you
862. 32:39know, shipping away a guitar or or that,
863. 32:41you know, the customer comes to pick it
864. 32:43up or, you know, that beautiful purple
865. 32:46guitar that, oh, I wish wish it was
866. 32:48mine. It's it's almost like the the the
867. 32:50opposite that that uh for me I I really
868. 32:54have to say that the biggest joy and and
869. 32:58sense uh sense of fulfillment in like in
870. 33:02in my profession as as a guitar maker is
871. 33:05that you know I get to um or we get to
872. 33:10>> solve a problem
873. 33:14for for an artist, for a musician, for a
874. 33:16player.
875. 33:17>> Yeah. um you know and like maybe remove
876. 33:22some little obstacle between you and
877. 33:24your music.
878. 33:26>> Yeah.
879. 33:26>> You know that that it inspires you
880. 33:28better or serves you better, it's easier
881. 33:30to play or
882. 33:32>> or whatever like that. And so the
883. 33:36highlight is always, you know, I've been
884. 33:38at at your band's concert number of
885. 33:40times and every time it's like, you
886. 33:42know, I'm there, I'm this I'm I'm
887. 33:45easily quite emotional in situations
888. 33:48like, you know, when when uh seeing
889. 33:51talent and and somehow feeling part of
890. 33:55it in some way. I'm kind of a weeper.
891. 33:58So, a couple of Brother Fire Tribe
892. 34:01>> gigs also I've been there like, you
893. 34:03know, wiping my the corners of my
894. 34:05corners of my eyes when I've been
895. 34:07watching you guys play. And it's just
896. 34:09like that that's the
897. 34:10>> that's for me like the the the whole
898. 34:12point
899. 34:14>> of doing it and and also the kind of
900. 34:16like the wonder and the magic of it
901. 34:19>> when you know seeing
902. 34:21>> wonderful artists you know or or or not
903. 34:24even like it it doesn't need to be a
904. 34:27performing artist. It could be someone
905. 34:29like, you know, uh, living room
906. 34:32guitarist or bass player or somebody
907. 34:34who's just,
908. 34:36>> you know, feels that he gets this done
909. 34:39and he he gets so much joy out of it and
910. 34:41sends me, you know, some home recording
911. 34:43or or whatever. And it's the same kind
912. 34:46of sensation, you know, to bring
913. 34:48>> joy to this world. I mean, to like like
914. 34:50like the and now we're going to the
915. 34:53really deep end, you know, talking about
916. 34:54the meaning of life. What is the meaning
917. 34:56of life? Well, to bring some joy to this
918. 34:59life and to to maybe if possible, you
919. 35:02know, when I leave this planet or leave
920. 35:05this place to to to for my part,
921. 35:08>> you know, uh leave it in some little way
922. 35:12better than it was before.
923. 35:13>> Like that I could have somehow uh helped
924. 35:17those people circle of people around me
925. 35:19that I I could like Yeah. So I mean what
926. 35:23else is there? Like it's like um
927. 35:26>> you got get to meet a lot of different
928. 35:28people all all over the world.
929. 35:30>> Yeah.
930. 35:31>> Your clients ordering direct from you.
931. 35:35>> Yeah, that's right. So that's that's
932. 35:36most of the times it's like it is direct
933. 35:39direct from us to players which is which
934. 35:41is really um
935. 35:43>> there aren't many places that you you
936. 35:46could go in in the shop and order guitar
937. 35:49from them. Usually there is a
938. 35:50>> there's like a
939. 35:51>> sort of like middle middle man.
940. 35:53>> That's right.
941. 35:54>> But I I really and that that that's also
942. 35:56kind of kind ties into it that that um
943. 36:01it wouldn't be possible if if the
944. 36:03operation would be let's say much bigger
945. 36:05than what we what we have
946. 36:07>> because then it becomes overwhelming.
947. 36:10But when it's like small um and and
948. 36:13manageable,
949. 36:15even if it's like most of the time me
950. 36:19>> Yeah.
951. 36:19>> communicating with every customer who
952. 36:21orders an instrument.
953. 36:23>> Um but I I like it that way because
954. 36:26there's that
955. 36:28>> um level of things getting personal in
956. 36:31in a in a good way.
957. 36:33>> Yeah. where uh somebody has a problem or
958. 36:36somebody has a vision or whether it's
959. 36:38has to do with sound or playability or
960. 36:41or some sometimes disability
961. 36:44>> you know or that requires a special
962. 36:46solution or you know what what what kind
963. 36:49of neck would be good for me because I
964. 36:51have this problem with my you know maybe
965. 36:53you know amputated finger or something
966. 36:55or this or that. So it could be anything
967. 36:59or or on the aesthetic side like when we
968. 37:02talk about guitars
969. 37:04uh which I primarily see as tools.
970. 37:08>> Yeah.
971. 37:08>> Tools for making music.
972. 37:11>> Uh but there's the when you talk about
973. 37:14pop music, rock music and the the whole
974. 37:16culture of it, it's also pretty
975. 37:18aesthetic thing.
976. 37:19>> Like you told me that you know purple
977. 37:21that's your purple.
978. 37:22>> Yeah, that's my color.
979. 37:23>> Yeah. And you had made your what? you
980. 37:25showed me your your your ear ear
981. 37:27monitors in the same color which is like
982. 37:29[laughter]
983. 37:31>> so yeah so so even that kind of things
984. 37:33like even if it might feel on first
985. 37:36glance like superficial that it's not
986. 37:39like
987. 37:39>> okay so but but those things do matter
988. 37:42when you're a performing artist I mean
989. 37:44>> it's a sort of statement
990. 37:45>> it's a statement and and sometimes it
991. 37:48can be get really um even intimate in in
992. 37:52a way that people won't you know inlays
993. 37:55or something.
994. 37:56>> Yeah.
995. 37:57>> U maybe in memory of a loved one or, you
996. 38:01know, it could be it could be anything.
997. 38:03Very recently, we we shipped a guitar to
998. 38:06um
999. 38:07to Belgium to a guy. He a Bolton guitar
1000. 38:11with a neck plate and and the neck plate
1001. 38:14he wanted an engraving with a heart.
1002. 38:18>> Yeah.
1003. 38:18>> And a date. And um I didn't ask him at
1004. 38:22the at the time what what was that four
1005. 38:25um until we got the guitar ready and
1006. 38:30uh I showed him a picture of the
1007. 38:32engraving that is this the way you want
1008. 38:35the engraving to be and then he told me
1009. 38:37when we were shipping the guitar that
1010. 38:40the date there was like three years back
1011. 38:42or something that's the day when he had
1012. 38:44like huge open heart surgery
1013. 38:48>> and he he was like like super bad
1014. 38:51condition and [snorts] nearly died and
1015. 38:54and it was a miracle that they could
1016. 38:56save him. So he got a second life.
1017. 39:00>> Yeah.
1018. 39:00>> And he wanted to celebrate that with the
1019. 39:02guitar that had the date of the
1020. 39:05>> Wow.
1021. 39:05>> Like and that kind of things is like
1022. 39:07what I mean those are the things that
1023. 39:10you remember like you know.
1024. 39:12>> Yeah. That's me.
1025. 39:13>> And and and all the all all that stuff
1026. 39:16people all the people because it's like
1027. 39:18>> I would say the that's the probably the
1028. 39:22most satisfying and and rewarding um
1029. 39:27part of working with musicians and
1030. 39:29artists that it's it's good people. It's
1031. 39:31like really nice people. Lots of people.
1032. 39:34I mean I I
1033. 39:35>> I haven't met many many uh [ __ ] in
1034. 39:39this.
1035. 39:40>> You know, you know what I mean? Yeah, I
1036. 39:42know.
1037. 39:42>> It's like uh it's quite remarkable and
1038. 39:46that's what life is. Life is
1039. 39:47relationships and life is like you know
1040. 39:49>> and I believe when you are
1041. 39:51>> when your job is to be creative and
1042. 39:55create something new you need to be
1043. 39:58really sensitive person
1044. 40:01>> that and mainly the sensitive person are
1045. 40:05they have a really good sense for
1046. 40:09emotions. M
1047. 40:11>> how they sort of like a feel the room
1048. 40:15and all the people there and how they
1049. 40:17feel.
1050. 40:17>> Yeah.
1051. 40:18>> And those people typically aren't the
1052. 40:20[ __ ]
1053. 40:21>> Yeah.
1054. 40:22>> Cuz they they see
1055. 40:25>> the whole room, not themselves.
1056. 40:27>> Yeah. Also kind of another aspect of is
1057. 40:30like um which hasn't always been I I
1058. 40:34haven't always thought the same way but
1059. 40:37when I was younger I took things easily
1060. 40:40very personally in the sense that if
1061. 40:42somebody didn't like a guitar that we
1062. 40:44made at a guitar show wherever you know
1063. 40:47or somebody wrote on like social media
1064. 40:50or well then wasn't social media this is
1065. 40:52long time ago
1066. 40:53>> some forum or
1067. 40:54>> yeah some forum somewhere somebody was
1068. 40:57saying that they don't No, it's not like
1069. 40:58and I I I could take that like really
1070. 41:00personally and like somehow feel hurt
1071. 41:03and feel that I've done something wrong
1072. 41:05because that person didn't like what I'm
1073. 41:08doing. So I I took things really hard
1074. 41:11>> and stressed out with these things and
1075. 41:13always tried to kind of like in a in a
1076. 41:15way like uh please as many people as
1077. 41:18possible in in a sense. Um but then over
1078. 41:22the years maybe it's growing up or
1079. 41:24whatever
1080. 41:26through some hardships
1081. 41:27>> and difficult times in life or whatever
1082. 41:30like learning maybe at the same time to
1083. 41:34accept myself better. And when you
1084. 41:38accept yourself better you you learn to
1085. 41:39like
1086. 41:41yourself yeah
1087. 41:42>> better. And when you learn to like
1088. 41:44yourself better, you become less needy
1089. 41:47of of uh pleasing other people. And and
1090. 41:52you also realize that I don't I don't
1091. 41:54need why would I need to with these
1092. 41:56guitars please everybody? Because I know
1093. 41:58that our electric guitars are not the
1094. 42:00most typical electric guitars in certain
1095. 42:03ways. I've
1096. 42:04>> I've had it for whatever reason. Maybe
1097. 42:07it's because I am just the way I am that
1098. 42:09I I've always wanted to build responsive
1099. 42:13uh electric guitar. the one that is like
1100. 42:16sensitive, the one that is dynamic, the
1101. 42:18one that reacts to your playing, whether
1102. 42:20be it like the the wood or the, you
1103. 42:23know, the and it's like ergonomically
1104. 42:26pleasing and and and and
1105. 42:29great to hold and all these things and
1106. 42:31and whether it's the pickups or all the
1107. 42:34aspects of it, I've just kind of strived
1108. 42:36towards that some kind of transparency.
1109. 42:38Yeah. the idea of that, you know, that
1110. 42:40when when when a player holds a guitar
1111. 42:43that it's like a continuation of your
1112. 42:47body at best, like in the sense that,
1113. 42:50you know, we're not listening to your
1114. 42:51amp, we're not listening to the speaker
1115. 42:53element, we're not listening to your
1116. 42:54pedals, we're not listening to the
1117. 42:56guitar, we're, you know, we're listening
1118. 42:58to the guy playing.
1119. 43:00>> Yeah.
1120. 43:01>> And that, you know, that would somehow
1121. 43:02translate through. And I know that these
1122. 43:05kind of like ideas to some rock
1123. 43:08musicians or think this this feels quite
1124. 43:10you know h out there esoteric or weird
1125. 43:14that you know just you know put the
1126. 43:16crank it up and
1127. 43:18>> you know and
1128. 43:20>> so so it doesn't speak to everyone the
1129. 43:22way I am
1130. 43:24>> and the what I'm looking for from the
1131. 43:27guitars and so yeah so it's kind of like
1132. 43:30it has become easier and easier to
1133. 43:32understand that we only need to um or
1134. 43:35let's say we need to connect
1135. 43:38with enough people that
1136. 43:41think the same way or or or or
1137. 43:45see and hear and understand the
1138. 43:48>> this what we do
1139. 43:50>> and maybe are on the same wavelength or
1140. 43:52whatever. um we only need very little
1141. 43:55amount of people a year so that it
1142. 43:57trickles down to enough guitar orders to
1143. 44:01keep us afloat, you know, and if the
1144. 44:04rest of the world doesn't like what we
1145. 44:05do, what's the difference? Why why would
1146. 44:07why should we care for that? So, I've
1147. 44:09kind of like then deliberately
1148. 44:13moved our kind of communications
1149. 44:16to the direction that let's just be very
1150. 44:19transparently who we are.
1151. 44:20>> Yeah. And let's not not try to kind of
1152. 44:23like you put on any mask or role or
1153. 44:26pretend to be bigger, pretend to be
1154. 44:28smaller, pretend to be anything that we
1155. 44:30than we what we are.
1156. 44:32>> Yeah.
1157. 44:32>> And we just, you know, it makes life
1158. 44:34easier for for one thing and and for
1159. 44:37second thing, the more we communicate
1160. 44:39that
1161. 44:41uh the better the chances are that
1162. 44:43somebody out there notices who that
1163. 44:46speaks to.
1164. 44:47>> Yeah. you know and and then maybe we
1165. 44:50find each other.
1166. 44:51>> Yeah. It feels more real then.
1167. 44:52>> Yeah. and and and that's the thing uh
1168. 44:55that is really cool that when then we
1169. 45:00find each other with someone for whom
1170. 45:02the instrument really speaks to and and
1171. 45:04and who feels that you know we have some
1172. 45:09kind of connection that that
1173. 45:12I I or we really understand
1174. 45:16what this person is looking for and what
1175. 45:18is the what is the problem that he's
1176. 45:20trying to solve.
1177. 45:21>> Yeah. which is not always easy because
1178. 45:23the players are different. Some players
1179. 45:25are more like uh
1180. 45:28um you know analytic. Yeah, some people
1181. 45:31are like very techsavvy analytic. They
1182. 45:34can analyze their you know scale length
1183. 45:37and fret size and you know pickup output
1184. 45:40and and all these things and string
1185. 45:43gauge and you know all the technical
1186. 45:45details of the signal chain. they can
1187. 45:47analyze that and they kind of end up to
1188. 45:49their conclusion of what they need
1189. 45:52through that analysis.
1190. 45:53>> But then there is then the other extreme
1191. 45:56and this is like a spectrum of people
1192. 45:57like all kinds of people. On the other
1193. 45:59end of the extreme there's this guy
1194. 46:01>> who just wants to [ __ ] play.
1195. 46:03>> Yeah.
1196. 46:04>> And who has like zero interest in tech.
1197. 46:07>> Yeah.
1198. 46:07>> Zero interest in what is the brand of
1199. 46:09the guitar? What is the what are the
1200. 46:11pickups? What is the output of the
1201. 46:12pickups? You know, no interest at all. I
1202. 46:16just want to play and and and at the
1203. 46:18same time that person can have like
1204. 46:21super sensitive ear and and super uh
1205. 46:25like u beautiful style in expressing
1206. 46:28what he does but he
1207. 46:30>> he doesn't have or she doesn't have
1208. 46:32words for how to communicate
1209. 46:35>> what he wants.
1210. 46:36>> Yeah.
1211. 46:37>> If he would order a guitar. Yeah. So, so
1212. 46:39then then my job is kind of like it can
1213. 46:41it can kind of like a
1214. 46:43>> scarving out
1215. 46:43>> you move anywhere on on that
1216. 46:48>> uh spectrum of people like
1217. 46:52>> that how am I going to how am I going to
1218. 46:54understand when this people doesn't have
1219. 46:55really words for what he's looking for
1220. 46:57but I but he can but it it's such a
1221. 47:01talent.
1222. 47:01>> Yeah. and and you know and sometimes
1223. 47:04then um sometimes we find a way and
1224. 47:07sometimes we don't find a way.
1225. 47:09>> Yeah.
1226. 47:09>> You know,
1227. 47:10>> it's it's great because you're
1228. 47:12full-fledged custom shop cuz every
1229. 47:15guitar basically based
1230. 47:17>> on orders.
1231. 47:18>> Yeah. Yeah, that's right.
1232. 47:19>> Uh you don't have any stock
1233. 47:21>> usually sometimes samples some samples
1234. 47:24that we make for shows but
1235. 47:26>> but yeah, pretty much everything is
1236. 47:28>> there is no fixed models. So it's it's a
1237. 47:31surprise for you and all the builders
1238. 47:34>> there that they every guitar is unique.
1239. 47:38>> Yeah, it is. Yeah.
1240. 47:39>> All the features are
1241. 47:41>> Yeah. It's say let's say that yeah we do
1242. 47:43have like the the basic model selection
1243. 47:45but there is a lot of
1244. 47:47>> room to move within that realm of of
1245. 47:50what we what we offer. Yeah.
1246. 47:52>> And there are like certain things that
1247. 47:54um which is surprising to some some
1248. 47:56people is that we we have even though we
1249. 47:58are very flexible in like crafting the
1250. 48:02the dream guitar for someone but on some
1251. 48:04specific aspects we have
1252. 48:07very limited and strict
1253. 48:10um
1254. 48:12choice.
1255. 48:13>> Yeah.
1256. 48:13>> That we offer and we refuse of going
1257. 48:16outside those boundaries. And this is
1258. 48:18mainly has to do with the materials the
1259. 48:20the wood that we use.
1260. 48:23>> So we have very very limited stuff we we
1261. 48:25use in the body bodies if it's like a
1262. 48:28Bolton guitar we use alder or we we use
1263. 48:31Spanish cedar which is another one of
1264. 48:34like a pioneering thing. Spanish cedar
1265. 48:37being like a species of of a wood uh
1266. 48:41related to mahogany. It's a funny funny
1267. 48:43thing. Spanish cedar it's a wood that is
1268. 48:45not from Spain and it's not a cedar. It
1269. 48:47comes from South America and it's uh
1270. 48:49it's uh related to mahogany closer than
1271. 48:51than cedar. The
1272. 48:54>> Spanish theater names comes from from
1273. 48:56trade, from business, from from the fact
1274. 48:59that uh Spanish guitar comes from
1275. 49:01actually from Spain. And uh
1276. 49:05>> and Spanish guitars have Spanish cedar
1277. 49:08cedar necks. And that that's probably
1278. 49:11the
1279. 49:11>> story
1280. 49:12>> story of why Spanish and and the cedar
1281. 49:14comes from the the odor the the
1282. 49:18>> the aromatic odor of the wood when you
1283. 49:20work it. It's it has this like u cedar
1284. 49:24like
1285. 49:25strong
1286. 49:27odor very recognizable. So the the the
1287. 49:31scientific name of of Spanish cedar is
1288. 49:33ceda odorata meaning the wood that
1289. 49:36smells like cedar.
1290. 49:37>> Okay cool.
1291. 49:38>> So so that's one one that I found. when
1292. 49:40I was apprenticing for classical guitar
1293. 49:42makers and and and they made their necks
1294. 49:45out of Spanish cedar and I got
1295. 49:47interested in in Spanish cedar because
1296. 49:48it's light it's very resonant like
1297. 49:51talking about again responsive guitar
1298. 49:53and so I got really interested in it
1299. 49:55because it was already then in the '9s
1300. 49:58difficult to get lightweight mahogany
1301. 50:00which also is beautiful resonating uh
1302. 50:04tone wood but uh but it's really
1303. 50:06difficult to get in any sort of
1304. 50:08quantities and so Spanish cedar became
1305. 50:10one and then we use a lot of local wood.
1306. 50:13We use we use birch and we use um yeah
1307. 50:16an older so so yeah so it is like and
1308. 50:18and the and the fretboards like your
1309. 50:22typical rosewood ebony would be there
1310. 50:25but the reason why we don't so let's say
1311. 50:27somebody comes to me and says that I
1312. 50:29want like whatever um paddock or or
1313. 50:31bubinga or you know this top or top or
1314. 50:34exotic wood something
1315. 50:36>> whatever and and we have lots of this
1316. 50:38stuff I mean I don't mean we have but
1317. 50:40the world has so much different species
1318. 50:43of wood. But um but that's where we draw
1319. 50:46the line. We don't do any of that. We we
1320. 50:48don't basically um build guitars with
1321. 50:52any other materials than the ones that
1322. 50:54we have. There has been like a a few
1323. 50:56exceptions when we know for 100% sure
1324. 51:00that now we have like this old piece of
1325. 51:02wood or maybe recycled piece of wood and
1326. 51:04it's going to be like a concept guitar
1327. 51:06or swords or something or we want to
1328. 51:08experiment with something.
1329. 51:11But but mainly we don't go with all the
1330. 51:14the exotic wood and all this stuff is
1331. 51:17that um I feel it's like a kind of like
1332. 51:20a responsibility or liability liability
1333. 51:24>> a matter of liabilities in a way that if
1334. 51:27if we give like 20-year warranty to this
1335. 51:29instrument
1336. 51:30>> that I really need to know what the wood
1337. 51:32is and I can't really give that guitar
1338. 51:3420-year warranty if if if I put put
1339. 51:36their piece of wood somewhere a part of
1340. 51:39it that somebody asked me to buy.
1341. 51:42>> Yeah.
1342. 51:43>> Or or I would I should then have, you
1343. 51:46know, t-fold
1344. 51:48storage of all these exotic materials in
1345. 51:51stock so I know that they have been aged
1346. 51:52and and and tried long enough and
1347. 51:54whatever. And then there's the other
1348. 51:56side of it. You know, there's the kind
1349. 51:57of the liability of the the longevity of
1350. 52:00the guitar like the the warranty and all
1351. 52:02that,
1352. 52:03>> but also there's the the sound signature
1353. 52:06in a way. You know, somebody asked me,
1354. 52:09"How is it going to sound like if you
1355. 52:10put, you know, booing a top and and you
1356. 52:12put like uh ka body or something and
1357. 52:17this and that exotic?" And I would say
1358. 52:18like, "I have no idea how it's going to
1359. 52:20sound. I never built a guitar like
1360. 52:21that."
1361. 52:22>> Yeah.
1362. 52:22>> You know, it it it it probably would
1363. 52:24look awesome, but I have no idea how
1364. 52:26it's going to sound. And if I'm going to
1365. 52:28buy some of that wood, it's going to
1366. 52:29weigh what it weighs. I don't have any I
1367. 52:32can't do any selection because I can't
1368. 52:33buy enough stock to choose
1369. 52:35>> a lighter piece if I don't like this
1370. 52:37piece. So
1371. 52:38>> So basically what we've done is that we
1372. 52:40you know we have really like narrowed it
1373. 52:42down to a few species that that we have
1374. 52:45then worked for for all these 30 years
1375. 52:48and
1376. 52:50we have a big stock of these species of
1377. 52:53wood.
1378. 52:54>> Yeah. And every time we know what we put
1379. 52:56into a guitar and we have like a we have
1380. 53:00lots of data about this wood. You know,
1381. 53:02if you make a solid body guitar, we're
1382. 53:05going to take this piece. So, it's not
1383. 53:06going to be too heavy. If it's going to
1384. 53:08be a semiholo guitar, we can't can't uh
1385. 53:11use the lightest the lightest because
1386. 53:13it's going to be too light. Yeah.
1387. 53:15>> It's going to be neck heavy and it's
1388. 53:16going to sound not sound right. So, you
1389. 53:18need to do these like, you know,
1390. 53:19educated choices.
1391. 53:21>> Yeah. Um and and that comes only with
1392. 53:24with experience and with with time
1393. 53:27making making
1394. 53:30guitars like making music. It's like
1395. 53:32>> two things actually I want to point out.
1396. 53:34One is the the neck joint. What I love
1397. 53:37about this
1398. 53:38>> guitars. It's it's a
1399. 53:41>> I've never seen anything like this and
1400. 53:43it's it's feels like that the ne neck
1401. 53:47continues
1402. 53:50behind the body and it's the
1403. 53:51accessibility is is amazing.
1404. 53:54>> So this is really unique.
1405. 53:56>> Yeah. It's like a deeper sculpt.
1406. 53:58>> Yeah.
1407. 53:59>> The way I feel it that is like you know
1408. 54:03going back to the 80s.
1409. 54:04>> Yeah.
1410. 54:05>> You know it's it's the Jackson soloist
1411. 54:07the way it was meant to be. Yeah,
1412. 54:09>> I would say like the curve. Yeah, I
1413. 54:12that's kind of like we we've
1414. 54:14>> we worked on it to to go to the extreme
1415. 54:17of it, you know, to keep it stable. So,
1416. 54:19it's like super
1417. 54:21>> uh sturdy.
1418. 54:23>> Yeah.
1419. 54:23>> But at the same time, you know,
1420. 54:25>> go as deep as we can. So,
1421. 54:27>> and especially
1422. 54:28>> you feel it when you are playing on live
1423. 54:32shows where the guitar hangs,
1424. 54:34>> right? So then then your arm is doing
1425. 54:38more tilt.
1426. 54:39>> Yeah.
1427. 54:40>> When you're sitting it's not it's not
1428. 54:42bad if there's a more wood or the joint
1429. 54:45is different but when you're standing
1430. 54:48>> Yeah.
1431. 54:48>> then you feel it that the accessibility
1432. 54:51on our frets are
1433. 54:52>> Yeah.
1434. 54:53>> really great.
1435. 54:54>> Yeah. It's um well talk about you know
1436. 54:57removing obstacles from between you and
1437. 54:59your music. like literally they removed
1438. 55:01some obstacle from there. But uh but I
1439. 55:04want to add to that
1440. 55:05>> you know that
1441. 55:07>> um for you that's the way.
1442. 55:10>> Yeah.
1443. 55:10>> But then there's the other guy who feels
1444. 55:14um lost with this because there's no
1445. 55:18familiar
1446. 55:20calibration point of a clunky neck joint
1447. 55:24that needs to be there.
1448. 55:26>> Yeah. So, still like, you know, some
1449. 55:28guys prefer the traditional Fender
1450. 55:31square
1451. 55:34bolt-on neck joint there. And I I mean I
1452. 55:38as as much as I like
1453. 55:41you know thinking of ergonomics and
1454. 55:43stuff but sometimes these guitar things
1455. 55:45are also like they are really like
1456. 55:48archetypal
1457. 55:50things in the sense that if someone is
1458. 55:53has used to playing a Bolton guitar for
1459. 55:5630 years
1460. 55:57>> and you put that guitar
1461. 56:00and it's going to feel like you know
1462. 56:02things are not where they're supposed to
1463. 56:04be and you get lost And and for that
1464. 56:06guitar guys, it's like, you know, you
1465. 56:09you bring your your hand up here and you
1466. 56:12and there comes the full stop and then
1467. 56:15you know that you're on that and that
1468. 56:17fret. So I I just come across to this
1469. 56:19that like I said, um this doesn't this
1470. 56:23isn't isn't a perfect solution to every
1471. 56:25player. It's I I'm I'm 54 years old and
1472. 56:28I have to say that I'm I'm so may maybe
1473. 56:32it's part of my diagnosis or something,
1474. 56:34but
1475. 56:36I'm I'm stuck to certain way like
1476. 56:39traditions and I've never gotten away
1477. 56:42from the fact that you know for for my
1478. 56:45guitar that I play
1479. 56:48>> I I kind of I kind of need that.
1480. 56:50>> Yeah.
1481. 56:51>> Even if it would be could be possible to
1482. 56:54sculpt it.
1483. 56:54>> Yeah. uh prettier or more ergonomic, but
1484. 56:57but it's
1485. 56:59>> and I I'm not ashamed to admit it that I
1486. 57:02I I feel home here.
1487. 57:04>> Yeah.
1488. 57:05>> Like that.
1489. 57:05>> Yeah. And there's no problem.
1490. 57:07>> Yeah.
1491. 57:07>> And second thing is the fret work. It's
1492. 57:10the best I ever ever seen. And
1493. 57:13>> thank you.
1494. 57:14>> This is the highest tier of fret work
1495. 57:17that you can really have in your
1496. 57:18guitars.
1497. 57:19>> Thank you. Thank you, Rob. Um
1498. 57:22>> there looks beautiful but the play is
1499. 57:24beautiful.
1500. 57:25>> Can I um tell the story or is it going
1501. 57:28to take too long time if I tell the
1502. 57:30story why the fret work in some extent
1503. 57:32is like that?
1504. 57:32>> Yeah.
1505. 57:34>> You know the especially the fret ends.
1506. 57:36>> Yeah.
1507. 57:36>> The way they are shaped and I think that
1508. 57:38along with it like certain other
1509. 57:40techniques that we then have developed
1510. 57:43um I have to thank Yuarislaki.
1511. 57:48Yuan Islaki used to work for Musma.
1512. 57:51>> Yeah.
1513. 57:53>> A company you know very well.
1514. 57:55>> Yeah.
1515. 57:56>> Um
1516. 57:58he used to be there
1517. 58:01guitar guy and and Yua um used to do a
1518. 58:05lot of maintenance work, a lot of
1519. 58:06reffret
1520. 58:08for Mama for example. Uh there was this
1521. 58:11guitarist called Alexo one one of them.
1522. 58:15>> Yeah.
1523. 58:15>> And Rob Bellatala both Yeah. Children of
1524. 58:17bottom uh players and um used to refract
1525. 58:22their ESPs.
1526. 58:24And so now this story goes back to when
1527. 58:27I was in a guitar making school and
1528. 58:29Uharislaki came there for one day to do
1529. 58:31like a master class of his work as a
1530. 58:36repairs guy for a distributor.
1531. 58:39>> Yeah.
1532. 58:40and was telling about whatever
1533. 58:43practicalities of his work and at some
1534. 58:47part of the day because he had brought
1535. 58:48some stuff. He he he worked on those
1536. 58:51Warmouth
1537. 58:52guitar necks and bodies at the time, put
1538. 58:55those together for for many known
1539. 58:57Finnish players that Warmouth was at the
1540. 58:59time like kind of
1541. 59:01>> uh and so anyways, at some point of the
1542. 59:04day, we got to see some of his work and
1543. 59:07I looked at his uh one guitar with frets
1544. 59:11that looked like
1545. 59:12>> like this.
1546. 59:13>> Yeah.
1547. 59:14>> Yeah. and and I paid attention to those
1548. 59:17frets there as a young guy. I was like
1549. 59:2121 years old and I was paying attention
1550. 59:23that I've never seen frets like that and
1551. 59:26I really liked it and I showed it uh to
1552. 59:32the other students and we were kind of
1553. 59:34looking at them and somebody was saying
1554. 59:36like that maybe they're like does it
1555. 59:38really need to be like like this dome?
1556. 59:41>> Yeah. And because it's like almost like
1557. 59:44jewels.
1558. 59:45>> Yeah.
1559. 59:45>> Every end of the fret is like a jewel.
1560. 59:48>> So it was for me it was just like like
1561. 59:50wow that's like really pleasing to look
1562. 59:52at. It's so beautiful
1563. 59:54>> that you can make it that well. Then
1564. 59:55years went by and and the kind of like
1565. 59:57the the influence from my actual
1566. 1:00:00teachers in the school was so um
1567. 1:00:04dominating I would say that that I
1568. 1:00:06forgot it.
1569. 1:00:07I had liked it but I I forgot it for
1570. 1:00:10years and years and years until I can't
1571. 1:00:12remember the year but let's say many
1572. 1:00:14years later anyways uh children of
1573. 1:00:17Bonum's at the time tech auntie Hara
1574. 1:00:20came by with a bunch of guitars Alexis
1575. 1:00:23and Robas guitars needed reffrets
1576. 1:00:26those same guitars [snorts]
1577. 1:00:28>> you know um that URL had worked on
1578. 1:00:32earlier these were with nickel silver
1579. 1:00:34frets and and now Alexi and Robert they
1580. 1:00:36wanted to try stainless red the guitars
1581. 1:00:40and auntie the tech brought these
1582. 1:00:42instruments to us and the moment I
1583. 1:00:44looked at Alex's guitar there I I saw oh
1584. 1:00:48you luck is frets
1585. 1:00:51>> you remember
1586. 1:00:52>> I remembered that it had made such a
1587. 1:00:55strong uh impression back then that it
1588. 1:00:57came back to me that I I hadn't seen
1589. 1:00:59these since I was in school 1993
1590. 1:01:03and I showed the Fred ends to the guys
1591. 1:01:06at my shop, Yuruki and Tommy Way.
1592. 1:01:08>> Yeah.
1593. 1:01:08>> And I showed the Fred ends to them. Um
1594. 1:01:11that look at these that it looks like
1595. 1:01:15you can you can do much nicer thread
1596. 1:01:17ends that we do.
1597. 1:01:18>> Yeah.
1598. 1:01:19>> That these are the finest thread ends
1599. 1:01:21that I've seen.
1600. 1:01:23>> Yeah.
1601. 1:01:24>> Uh and then Yuruki and Tommy were there.
1602. 1:01:28Um well, mainly I would say Yuruki was
1603. 1:01:31busy and Tommy was more paying attention
1604. 1:01:33to it. And Tommy is this guy like he he
1605. 1:01:37likes routines and and it's sometimes
1606. 1:01:41challenging for him to accept
1607. 1:01:44changes.
1608. 1:01:44>> Yeah.
1609. 1:01:46>> And and he shows it in a very northern
1610. 1:01:50Finnish direct way.
1611. 1:01:52>> Yeah.
1612. 1:01:52>> So he was cursing some very naughty
1613. 1:01:54Finnish words and saying to me something
1614. 1:01:57like that.
1615. 1:01:59I won't I I I don't want to do it like
1616. 1:02:01that. I I I I refused doing like that.
1617. 1:02:04Too too much too much work. It's going
1618. 1:02:06to take too much too long time.
1619. 1:02:08>> And I I kind of I kind of backed off.
1620. 1:02:11>> Yeah.
1621. 1:02:12>> And I I said to him that Yeah, fine. I I
1622. 1:02:15didn't even say anything. I just showed
1623. 1:02:17you guys that that you know, mirror
1624. 1:02:19mirror on the wall.
1625. 1:02:21>> How does it go? That
1626. 1:02:24>> the most beautiful of them all.
1627. 1:02:26>> Yeah. Who's the most beautiful of them
1628. 1:02:28all? Well, we are not anymore. I mean,
1629. 1:02:29we just found one that is more
1630. 1:02:31beautiful, you know.
1631. 1:02:33>> Uh, and u
1632. 1:02:35>> and that was that. I put the guitar on
1633. 1:02:37the wall
1634. 1:02:38>> and uh it was maybe a week later or two
1635. 1:02:41weeks later and Tommy comes upstairs to
1636. 1:02:44the office.
1637. 1:02:45>> Yeah. and you know hands over um one of
1638. 1:02:49our not Alex's guitar but one of our
1639. 1:02:53guitar necks and he had made the frets
1640. 1:02:57like that and he kind of showed to me
1641. 1:03:00sort of like angrily sounding that so is
1642. 1:03:03that how they are supposed to look like
1643. 1:03:05then?
1644. 1:03:05>> Yeah.
1645. 1:03:06>> Wow. [laughter]
1646. 1:03:08And and I was like uh I I kind of was
1647. 1:03:13hoping for it and and I and I
1648. 1:03:17was happy that that
1649. 1:03:20it had kind of gotten under his skin
1650. 1:03:22enough that you know
1651. 1:03:23>> he wanted to try and so we had the next
1652. 1:03:26coffee break. We had that guitar neck
1653. 1:03:28there laying on the table and we had a
1654. 1:03:30discussion with the guys
1655. 1:03:31>> that do we understand that you know if
1656. 1:03:34we take this step there's no stepping
1657. 1:03:37back because it's like you raise a
1658. 1:03:38standard you can't really
1659. 1:03:40>> lower a standard
1660. 1:03:41>> and and so this is like it's going to be
1661. 1:03:44you know triple amount of work to a
1662. 1:03:46normal fret ends but every fret end
1663. 1:03:48needs to be shaped like a dome
1664. 1:03:51separately.
1665. 1:03:51>> Yeah. with these like jewelers files and
1666. 1:03:54it's like a lot of work but as consensus
1667. 1:03:58all of us together decided that okay
1668. 1:04:00we'll move on to this we we'll start
1669. 1:04:03making the friends like that so it's
1670. 1:04:05thanks to you thanks to Alexio thanks to
1671. 1:04:08this kind of like chain of events
1672. 1:04:10>> that finally kind of uh made it
1673. 1:04:13>> wow
1674. 1:04:14>> I didn't know that
1675. 1:04:15>> yeah [laughter]
1676. 1:04:16>> wow I think this is a good point to
1677. 1:04:20close the video Now,
1678. 1:04:22>> thanks for
1679. 1:04:23>> coming by.
1680. 1:04:24>> Thank you.
1681. 1:04:25>> I put the email down in the description
1682. 1:04:27>> and your link to your website and there
1683. 1:04:30is you can see your guitars there and
1684. 1:04:33>> everything
1685. 1:04:33>> and pickups and all the great stuff. And
1686. 1:04:36>> remember to like his video, subscribe to
1687. 1:04:38his channel if you already haven't, and
1688. 1:04:41uh share to your friends.
1689. 1:04:42>> Yeah. You know,
1690. 1:04:43>> bye.