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BONUS: Interview with Anthony Graves, death row exoneree #138. Anthony’s message of hope,... — Transcript

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0:00hi everyone this is your host Denis
0:03scatter good welcome to this very
0:05special bonus episode of positive
0:07forward motion today I am sitting with
0:09Anthony graves and his message of hope
0:13faith forgiveness and positivity at a
0:16time in his life that is filled with
0:18trials and tribulation is sure to make a
0:22positive impact in your life Anthony
0:24thank you so much for allowing me to
0:26come and meet with you here at TSU here
0:29in Houston hanging out in your office
0:31it's an honor and a blessing to meet
0:34with you and before we even get started
0:37I always love just for you to say hello
0:40to the listeners and tell them a little
0:42bit about Anthony graves well first of
0:44all Denise I like to say thank you for
0:46inviting me to be a part of your podcast
0:48I think what you're doing is amazing and
0:51to your fans hello my name is Anthony
0:55graves and I'm sitting here with Denise
0:57and I'm excited about this interview
0:59that we're about to do and I have to
1:01give a little disclosure because this
1:02interview almost didn't happen because
1:04when we sat down we talked football we
1:06realized oh I'm the Philadelphia Eagle
1:07fit
1:11we found some common ground positive
1:14forward motion yeah so perfect perfect
1:18so Anthony I just finished a book
1:21infinite hope to share with the
1:23listeners I think I learned about your
1:25story maybe six or eight years ago and I
1:28always thought in the back of my mind
1:30like wow how what you went through and
1:34how you continued in faith and hope and
1:38positive forward motion I mean there's
1:40there's not another way to share that
1:42but you know for the listeners who don't
1:44know who you are and what you went
1:49through maybe give them just a little
1:50insight there of yeah for the listeners
1:53that don't know who I am
1:54shame on you no I'm just kidding
1:58but my name is Anthony graves and I'm
2:00Texas death row exoneree no more 13 when
2:04I'm a 12 but overall I am the nation's
2:08death row exoneree number 138 I was
2:11wrongfully convicted
2:12and sentenced to death for crime I knew
2:14absolutely nothing about I spent 18 and
2:17a half years in prison twelve and a half
2:19of those on death row
2:21well total sixteen was in solitary
2:24confinement that's just because your
2:26house that way when you have a death
2:28sentence particularly here in Texas I
2:30wouldn't so 400 executions I had to
2:33execution base myself and after awaiting
2:37half years I was exonerated and ever
2:40since then I've been traveling the world
2:42sharing my story and hopefully making
2:45change and I'm coming to justice system
2:47Wow I can never say I can imagine
2:49because I can't imagine but when I first
2:52heard your story what amazed me was that
2:5518 years 16 of those years of solitary
3:01confinement you have every right to come
3:05out the other side being angry and
3:08bitter and upset and when I heard your
3:13story of hope and inspiration and how
3:16you've decided to help others and use
3:19your story for good but again for
3:21anybody out there listening I two days a
3:24week in solitary confinement and would
3:27break us and you kept moving forward and
3:30had such a belief so one of the things
3:34that when you and I are speaking earlier
3:35you talked about choices and how you
3:38made the choices for your mind and this
3:41is what kept that faith in kept going so
3:44maybe elaborate a little bit on the
3:45topic of choices well okay first of all
3:48I couldn't follow from what you said
3:50earlier about I had every right to come
3:52out and be angry I didn't have every
3:54right to come out and be angry because
3:56it didn't happen to me for me to come
3:58out and be angry it happened to me for
4:00me to come out and educate the people on
4:02why we need to change so no I didn't
4:04have every right to be angry
4:05that would have been going the wrong way
4:08so to speak but yeah choices I remember
4:12the first time I got an execution date
4:15the officers came to pick me up and take
4:18me down to the captain's office the
4:20state had called him and said that they
4:22was going to execute me on a certain
4:24and so they had to take me down there so
4:26that the captain could tell me and asked
4:28me what I wanted him to do with my body
4:30once after they execute me and what I
4:33wanted my last meal to be and I never
4:36forget how that changed my life totally
4:40that just just hearing them tell me that
4:43they was gonna kill me for something
4:45that I didn't know anything about the
4:48thought that came in my mind changed my
4:50whole life and they thought was I'm just
4:53gonna live till I die because I knew
4:55that's something they couldn't take from
4:57me no matter what they did to me
4:59physically they couldn't take the fact
5:01that I had a right and a choice as to
5:03how I want to respond to what I was
5:05going through and my response was I'm
5:07just gonna live til I die because that's
5:09something they can't take from me and if
5:11they can't take it from me I wasn't
5:13gonna give it to them and that began my
5:16life from existing on death row to now
5:19living on death row because that thought
5:22reminded me that no matter what
5:24circumstances I face in life I have a
5:27choice as to how I wouldn't respond to
5:29it I always remember that because when
5:32you know that thing you start thinking
5:34about the best way to respond to a
5:36situation that you think is chaotic in
5:38your life and the best way is is to be
5:40positive is to be positive because
5:42you're gonna get something out of it
5:44that's gonna teach you a valuable lesson
5:46that's gonna be your blessing one day so
5:48positive thinking was the only way for
5:51me because other than that they will
5:53kill me oh I would have killed myself
5:55before I even laid down so I chose to do
5:59positive thinking and move for positive
6:01Lee and today you know I have a platform
6:04where I'm around the country as you came
6:06people about our need for criminal
6:08justice reform so it's been a blessing
6:10for me well where would you say that you
6:14got that positive mindset was it
6:17something that was instilled in you as a
6:19young boy something you learned from you
6:22know family would you say you can well I
6:24I was first
6:26first and foremost say it comes from
6:28believing in God knowing that God is all
6:31things part of it
6:32and in those trenches where people are
6:37trying to murder you for something you
6:39know absolutely nothing about you have
6:42to find that one thing that you say you
6:44believe in and you have to grab it and
6:47you have to hold it and you can't let it
6:49go I believed in God before this
6:51happened to me and when I seen what man
6:54was trying to do to me
6:56I grabbed on the guard and I held on to
6:58him and I wouldn't let go
6:59and he brought me through it so you know
7:02my positive thinking came from my belief
7:05in God that's first and foremost and
7:08then it also came from my naivete in
7:11knowing that I'm innocent and not
7:13thinking that you could just execute me
7:15for something I don't even know anything
7:16about
7:17so naivete in God saved my life
7:20Wow I love that you mentioned in the
7:23book I remember that you know you
7:24started to read and you're reading
7:26westerns and you're reading the Bible
7:28and at one moment we were human you were
7:31so upset and you threw the Bible across
7:33yes the room in the cell yes and when
7:36you picked it up yes when I picked it up
7:39I too paraphrased message that I went to
7:43it said that God wasn't gonna put no
7:46more me than I come back and when I read
7:50that is just something just came over me
7:52like a a sense of calm okay now I need
7:56to figure out why are they doing this to
7:59me and I need to figure out what do I
8:01get out of this so that I can share with
8:03the rest of the world so that this just
8:05don't be for nothing so so understanding
8:08that God wasn't gonna put no more on me
8:10then I could bear
8:11I allowed me to start thinking outside
8:14the box allow me to start feeling a
8:18sense of calm and knowing that God was
8:20in control therefore I don't have to
8:22worry about it no more I can just try to
8:24figure out how to make this the best
8:27situation for me right now that belief
8:30in God gave me that comfort that I can
8:33get through this and opening up his
8:36Bible and reading his words and let me
8:38know that he was here for me and he
8:40wasn't gonna put me in no situation that
8:42I couldn't do
8:43wit it was very empowering to me and I
8:46never let they go well and for the
8:49listeners you know when they read your
8:51book infinite hope or you can find it on
8:53audible as well to the prison that you
8:58are in and a lot of us in life walk
9:00around in our own mental prison of
9:04negative thoughts and worries me in the
9:08whole bit so here you are in solitary
9:11confinement actually behind real bars
9:14people around you are being put to death
9:17so you know just so the audience can
9:20even understand that magnitude from the
9:22time that you were into the time that
9:23you were released from the time I went
9:26into the time I was released over 413
9:29men and women were executed around me
9:32here in the state of Texas you know I'm
9:35not talking nationwide I'm just saying
9:37people that I knew people that I watched
9:39it grow from behind those bars that what
9:41they came there when I was 17 and that
9:43was getting executed at 31 32 you know
9:47these are people who the numbers were
9:49removed and the faces were replaced in
9:53my life so when people hear about death
9:55row inmate they think of them as numbers
9:58and statistics but these are real people
10:00to me people that I seen laugh and smile
10:04and cry people who families would come
10:06down and visit them and would leave
10:08without them and then and you see the
10:10pain and you see all the chaos and the
10:13ripple effect that this is causing and
10:15you say how can I help how can I help
10:18this situation because no longer is it
10:21about me now this is about a system that
10:25has it's off the tracks and it's causing
10:28a ripple effect in families lives in a
10:30negative way how can we make this better
10:33I and that was my mind is how can I make
10:37this better and I always thought we're
10:40not going home I never said if because I
10:42believe in my god and I know he wasn't
10:44gonna put no more me did not come back
10:46yet already promised me that so I knew
10:48that when I went home I needed to be
10:50prepared to tell the rest of the world
10:53this store
10:53and so I paid attention to my life what
10:56was going on around me and I knew then
10:59that I was there for a reason this
11:01wasn't gonna be the end of my life I'm
11:03here for a reason and that's why today
11:05I'm very confident in traveling and
11:07sharing my story because I know that I
11:10was there for a reason and this was the
11:11reason I needed to let people know that
11:14what we're endorsing our criminal
11:16justice system is now become criminal
11:19and we need to pay attention so that's
11:22my message around the world and at the
11:24end of the day my message to any and
11:26everyone that no matter what you going
11:28through in life remember you have a
11:31choice as to how you want to respond to
11:34it ask me I was sitting on death row I
11:37lost six thousand six hundred and forty
11:40days of my life for something I knew
11:42absolutely nothing about and I watch
11:45young me and cave under that pressure I
11:47watch me and take their lives slitting
11:49their throats hanging themselves
11:51overdosing on their medication I watched
11:54all of this but I already knew that God
11:56had me and I knew this wasn't gonna be
11:58me it wasn't gonna be me I just needed
12:01to see this so that can go back and let
12:03everybody know what we're doing back
12:05here all right
12:06God had me that whole time absolutely
12:08and to recap when you said pay attention
12:13when you were in it you know it's dark
12:16and it's scary and it's awful and I find
12:20myself being the most positive person
12:21and I find the good in people in
12:24situations and things and as I listen to
12:26your story and read your book I don't
12:28know that I would have that wherewithal
12:30so that reminder of paying attention
12:33right where you are you aren't looking
12:37back and you weren't looking so far for
12:40you have that belief system but you paid
12:43attention right where you were and use
12:46that moment to collect that information
12:48and write those stories because you
12:50believed when you got out some day that
12:53paying attention now you're not looking
12:55back on I hope I wished I paid attention
12:58because I could do something with it you
12:59knew and you paid attention to that you
13:03mentioned
13:04something to me earlier that when they
13:06gave you your death sentence date you
13:10mention that the threat of death kind of
13:15got watered down
13:16yeah yeah reason why I say that threat
13:19of death sorta got watered down is
13:21because number one I had witnessed so
13:23many executions around me people that I
13:26had become to know and care about as
13:29human beings and individuals and I was
13:32watching them at young ages being
13:34carried off by the state and just being
13:36executed you know one after another
13:38sometimes it was doing it twice a day
13:39and then you everybody was down there
13:42with this thread of an execution hanging
13:44over their head and I stayed down there
13:46so long and seen so much debt as they
13:50call it that it became watered down to
13:52me
13:52I became immune to it because I had to
13:55go into survival mode cuz all the people
13:57that was around me I had grew to care
13:59about but they were being executed like
14:01animals and so I grew on a mum to this
14:03whole whole notion of depth and I start
14:07understanding better that it's not death
14:10it gotta be life because in order for us
14:14to get to heaven we have to die first so
14:17this whole threat of killing me to send
14:21me to heaven what am I gonna be afraid
14:24of that if I say I believe in God so
14:27once I understood the bigger picture I
14:31realized so he all this time you I've
14:34been threatening us whatever
14:36you can't thread me with heaven and I'll
14:38get afraid I love it you know no longer
14:42normally or threatened II would have
14:44them and that was empowering to know
14:47that all you're doing is sitting here
14:49threatening me whatever why am I afraid
14:52of that
14:53and once I understood that Oh I became a
14:57mighty force to reckon with because I
14:59knew at the end of the day whether I'm
15:01in here or what I'm out here I'm still
15:04preparing myself to go to heaven
15:05right through my good works so why we're
15:09in hearing you telling me that you
15:11feelin send me to heaven okay well just
15:13make sure I have my best suit on because
15:15I want to meet God and my best
15:16- okay because you can no longer
15:18threaten me with hell and I'm prepared
15:20for that
15:21even as you're sharing it again it's
15:24such an honor off oftentimes when we're
15:25doing a podcast or an interview it's
15:27through a computer and a way and I'm so
15:30honored to be able to sit here with you
15:31right now and as you're sharing that I'm
15:33just watching you just I can just see
15:36the brightness around you that that
15:38became it became your shield it became
15:41your warrior you were like you can't
15:43threaten me with heaven and I'm I'm
15:46gonna put that one in my back pocket and
15:48well well it's a good one to have
15:50because I remember when the last days
15:54that I was incarcerated the day that
15:56they was gonna tell me that I was being
15:57released I didn't know the officer came
16:00and got me out of my cell to take me to
16:02talk to my attorneys I didn't know they
16:04were up there but when I got there I
16:05remember my attorney standing up and she
16:09was trying to back back tears right and
16:11in my mind I'm saying this is just some
16:13more bad news but I don't care I got my
16:15shield in my swore they're gonna kill me
16:17are they gonna free me I'm not
16:19compromising the truth God got me that's
16:22it God got me so we're gonna keep this
16:24thing ongoing God saying and when I got
16:26there my attorney said you remember
16:28Anthony when you told me that God was
16:30good and I said yeah but I didn't know
16:33why she was gone you know and she said
16:35well I just want you to know that God is
16:36good afternoon because today the state
16:38is dismissed all charges against you and
16:40not because they saying that witnesses
16:43have died evidence that's gotten old
16:45they're dismissing the charges against
16:47you because they believe in your
16:48innocence and they're gonna tell the
16:50whole world tomorrow that you're
16:51innocent
16:52so I share that to say this that no
16:55matter how bad you think it is remember
16:58that is your thought process that's not
17:00the situation it is your perception in
17:03your life that makes things bad or good
17:06it's all about you and how you're
17:08perceiving your life to be in that
17:10moment and understanding that means that
17:13you have a choice as to how you want to
17:15respond to what you think is going on in
17:17your life and I would say to you respond
17:19positively because if you do you're
17:21gonna get something out of it it's gonna
17:23be called a lesson that's gonna
17:25eventually turn into your blessing that
17:27you
17:27maybe share with someone that you love
17:29one day that's what I do today that
17:32positive forward motion all the way yes
17:34sir absolutely and it's such a great
17:38lesson on choices and our mindset and I
17:42knew your story because I've seen it on
17:4548 hours and I've heard about it I read
17:47about it even on Wikipedia and and as
17:49I'm diving in and then I get into your
17:51book and even though I know the end
17:53result or the middle as I'm listening to
17:55your book I'm getting so wrapped up in
17:58every time you turned around where you
18:02believed in the system and had trust in
18:04the system trust in humanity trust in
18:07other people trust that everyone was
18:09doing the right thing when they actually
18:12weren't and each time you move forward
18:15and uncovered that again this was a lie
18:18and again I couldn't trust this person I
18:20went through so many emotions reading
18:22the book from just so mad and angry that
18:24I wanted to shake some of these homes so
18:26with all of those years of that and
18:29having that exposed to you and just
18:31right in your face you're so caring and
18:35trusting and honorable I know it's gonna
18:38tie in a little bit to the same
18:40questions I've had but I'm just
18:42overwhelmed and so moved how that didn't
18:47ruin you yeah because I knew through
18:50paying attention I started to understand
18:52that this was man and as men we fall
18:56short
18:57this was man doing it not God so I
19:00needed to gravitate more to our God and
19:02not rely on man so my trust was in God
19:05not man cuz I already seen what man
19:08would do to me but I knew that God
19:11already told me that he had me so all I
19:13wanted to do was move toward God I
19:15needed to trust him just a little bit
19:17more and as it's hard and difficult as I
19:19thought things were getting I gravitated
19:22toward God just a little bit more and
19:23that's why I always found my comfort
19:25because I knew if I continue to try to
19:28trust in man man has shown me time and
19:30time again that he would let me down so
19:34this is not working I need to trust in
19:36the right source and that is my god
19:38and once I figured that out I begin to
19:41live and I never looked back after that
19:44I knew everything was okay because I
19:47finally found my landing spot which was
19:49in God's hands that's why all my trust
19:52was was in God and that got me through
19:55what a great message because so many
19:57times in our lives we can be wronged yes
20:00and we hang on to that anger and regret
20:03and just revenge feeling that's in in
20:09your book it unfolds so many times where
20:11you take a step back especially when you
20:14were in the same cell area as Robert
20:19Carter and you faced him and had that
20:22moment and for everyone out there and
20:24you read the book you'll understand but
20:25Robert Carter is the one who who lied on
20:29you and he has proclaimed at times that
20:33you were innocent but the system was so
20:35corrupt no one was listening but the
20:37fact that he lied on you is what started
20:40this this whole thing and here you are
20:42how many years later in prison about at
20:46least ten years later ten years later
20:48and you are face to face with him in in
20:51a rec area yes so to speak I remember
20:54reading this part in the book but I'll
20:55let you share a little bit about how
20:57that meeting went because with most
20:59people what do we want to do a written
21:01ten years in prison because yo buddy you
21:03lied and Here I am now you were face to
21:06face and you had choices right then and
21:08there and many do an eye for an eye so
21:13so share with me well you know Robert
21:15Carter's got a light on me and because
21:18he lied
21:19I was now ten years in prison still
21:21facing death and at this time rival
21:25Carter had been reaching out to any and
21:26everyone that he knew come including my
21:29attorneys his attorneys the victim's
21:31family trying to tell them that he
21:33relied on the innocent man which was me
21:36so but this time they put us in the same
21:39red group together and we go out to Rick
21:43he's already out to the red group and
21:45when they bring me out there he sees
21:47and he wants to come up and say
21:49something to me so he approached me and
21:51he say man I just want to let you know
21:53that I'm sorry I apologize for hurting
21:55you and your family like this is how I
21:57told them that you were innocent but
21:58they never wanted to believe me
22:00he said the DA always knew you was
22:02innocent but he told me that's not what
22:04he wanted to hear and I just want you to
22:06know man that I just I really apologized
22:08and I said to him hey man I can forgive
22:12you right I can't forget this but I can
22:16definitely forgive you right but I have
22:17to forgive you for me right I was
22:20forgiving him for me because I couldn't
22:22hold on to that and try to live okay
22:25so I needed to let that go give that to
22:28God and I told him I forgave him right
22:30and people wanted to know how could you
22:33just forgive him like that
22:35I mean you watched your mom cry all
22:36these years behind a lot of this man
22:38told you watch your children had to grow
22:41up without you behind a lot of this man
22:43told you his manage took taking your own
22:45life and you witnessing murders around
22:47here because of the light of this man
22:49that told and then you forgiving him how
22:52can you do that and I said it's called
22:57the love of God man simply put you
23:02cannot say you love God and didn't hate
23:05the people that he created it doesn't
23:07make sense to me so it was easy for me
23:10to forgive a man that put my life in a
23:12position where someone was gonna execute
23:14me but something I didn't know anything
23:16about because I was refusing to allow
23:18him to take what God has given me away
23:24from me which was my peace which was
23:26love of humanity which was my respect
23:29and dignity of all people I was refusing
23:32to give that up just so I could be angry
23:34so I forgave I forgave and I stayed in
23:38this forgiving place and it gave me
23:40peace it gave me calm it allowed me to
23:42think because you can't think when
23:44you're angry
23:45so allowed me to think it allowed me to
23:47reach out to people and ask people
23:50around the world to help me save my life
23:52I started a whole organization behind
23:54walls because I was in that space where
23:57I could think and so I would reach out
23:59to people now share Meister
24:00and people would come on board from all
24:02the way from Switzerland and Sweden and
24:05Norway and Germany and Italy all over
24:07the world and I never been in those
24:08places I was behind bars and I was
24:11reaching out to people all over the
24:12world and people was learning my story
24:14and getting involved that was oh god
24:16that because I stayed true to who I was
24:19I was a child of God and I was not gonna
24:22let man turn me against the one person
24:25the one source that have always given me
24:27strength in comfort and so it was easy
24:30for me to forgive this man that lied on
24:32me
24:32because I know that God basically said
24:36in order to live you must forgive and so
24:40I wanted to live and that's why I'm able
24:42to live today oh it brings a quote to
24:45mind I may be misquoting it but I
24:46remember writing it once and it was to
24:50hang on to anger and regret and revenge
24:54is like taking poison and waiting on the
24:58other person to die yes it's exactly
25:01what it is our soul and ourselves and
25:03does not and to understand that as you
25:08mentioned you know this gentleman was
25:11created by God as well and things happen
25:14in the system and unjust things and the
25:16whole bit so to be able to forgive so
25:18that you could live I think that's a
25:20great reminder for everyone as you
25:22mentioned connecting with people around
25:24the world human connection we're in this
25:29day and age I believe even we've gotten
25:31so far away from it even in just at home
25:35I mean there's TV and there's the
25:37computer and there's the cell phone and
25:39we're not connecting with their own
25:40families let along our neighbors and our
25:42co-workers or complete strangers I
25:44always get teased and when I'm so happy
25:47to be in Texas because everybody says
25:48the Lord opens doors and say have a
25:50blessed day and I'm like yes the land of
25:52my people it's something I've always
25:53loved but as I shared with you earlier I
25:55used to get teased as a kid you're too
25:57friendly you're too outgoing it's gonna
25:58get you in trouble and that's what made
26:00me move to Texas in my teens because I
26:02was like off to land of my people and
26:05even where my office is located in
26:07downtown Ventura California I'm up and
26:09down the streets all day and I say hello
26:11to people and some say hello
26:13and some don't but it doesn't change me
26:15right I still give a smile and hello
26:18because that's how I was made so the
26:20human connection is so important and in
26:23your book you share how people from all
26:25over the world just through letters and
26:27that connecting back and forth some even
26:29came across the world to visit with you
26:31so share with the listeners of course
26:34how important that connection was to you
26:36while you obviously were in prison
26:39that's so important then also expand
26:41that when we're out of prison in our
26:43daily life yeah it's so important to
26:45remember let me just say this while we
26:48out here we find ourselves hugging
26:50shaking hands with people that we love
26:52and care about and and we find out that
26:55it's so easy to do that we take it for
26:57granted right if I don't shake your hand
26:59now I can shake your hand tomorrow when
27:01I see I learned that you can't think
27:04that way I always thought that you know
27:07if it was one thing that I could have
27:09done before they took me away like this
27:11what would it have been and where
27:13they've been to hug my mother one more
27:15time because for 18 and a half years I
27:17was at wasn't able to hug my mother grab
27:20the neighbor hug my children wasn't a
27:22bug anyone that cared about me for 18
27:24and 1/2 years and going through that I
27:27learned something I learned how we are
27:31built for human touch I learned that
27:35taking away someone's ability to touch
27:39another human being it's just like
27:41having a car with no gas in it we are
27:44built for human touch and just the mere
27:48fact that it was six thousand six
27:51hundred forty days that I never touched
27:52another human being unless they was
27:54putting handcuffs on my hands was
27:58probably the hardest thing that I had to
28:01do was that's the absence of the human
28:04touch we don't know how powerful that is
28:07until it's taken from us we are built
28:09for each other
28:10handshakes are universal for a reason no
28:13one created it it's just who we are not
28:17having the opportunity to touch your
28:21loved one to hug your loved one to watch
28:24your children grow
28:26it's more devastating than justice that
28:29you're suffering at the hands of the
28:30system so the human touch is so
28:35important I would just want someone to
28:37touch my hand when they came to put
28:39handcuffs on me because she just you
28:41feel another human being just imagine
28:45just walking around in the world all day
28:46and you never able to touch anyone just
28:49imagine how that would feel when you get
28:51excited about something that your child
28:54did but you can't hug him for it you
28:56can't hug your mom because something
28:58that just happened big in your life and
29:00you want to share it with them and
29:01everybody excited just imagine those
29:03feelings being removed from your life it
29:08is the hardest thing man can ever deal
29:10with the absence of human touch so I'll
29:14say to each and every one of your
29:15listeners that are out there today if
29:19you have not hug your mother if you have
29:23not hug your children today when you see
29:27them please do because you do not know
29:30what's happening tomorrow whatever plans
29:33you have God has other plans for you so
29:36when you get an opportunity to hug your
29:38mother and your children do it what I do
29:41now every day when I talk to my mom the
29:44one thing I tell her before we hang up I
29:46love you I tell us so much nothing she
29:49says it back and they're not used to
29:50that are you still asking her what's for
29:52dinner I'm always asking what's for
29:54dinner
29:55all my way down yeah because that's so
29:58important it is so important that we
30:00stay connected that way yes absolutely
30:03oh what a great reminder for everyone
30:05the topic of being humble when you
30:09received word you were listening to a
30:12baseball game right March the 3rd 2006 I
30:17had been in prison over 14 years already
30:21on death row I had I had two execution
30:23dates already I was laying in my bunk
30:26listening to the Astros play baseball
30:27and it's uh this female officer came
30:31through and she throws this note in
30:33myself and I asked I say what is this
30:36she said well I think this is from
30:38the inmate he said something about your
30:40case now I understand it on death row
30:42when you get information you're not so
30:44quick to jump up and and go see what it
30:46is because it could be an execution date
30:48it could be anything right but anyway I
30:51got up and I want to go and see what the
30:54note was talking about and I notice that
30:56hey man congratulations I just heard on
30:58the radio that the Fifth Circuit just
31:00overturn your conviction you know I'll
31:02see you out there in the free world and
31:03when he told me when I read this you've
31:07got to understand I've been here 14
31:09years waiting on this news and and I got
31:12it and and just I just felt so over when
31:14I did to scream and shout and and then I
31:17realize everybody around me as a death
31:20sentence and they're probably gonna get
31:22executed most of them are guilty some of
31:25my innocent medium are dealing with
31:28mental illness but they're gonna all be
31:30executed and I just got this news and I
31:34don't feel comfortable screaming and
31:37shouting about it so what I did is I
31:40walked back to my bunk and I laid down
31:42and I silently cried it pump my fish and
31:45thank God but it was because I just
31:48didn't feel right sharing good news with
31:53people who were facing execution dates I
31:56just feel like Who am I to get out there
32:00and shout for joy with so meeting around
32:03me or still in pain so I just humbly
32:08went to my bunk and I thank God and I
32:10cried it and I pray for everybody and
32:13I'm here today and as we were talking
32:16earlier you mentioned you know in our
32:18daily world to be humble and mindful of
32:22others and to remember that because we
32:26get so wrapped up in ourselves yeah ego
32:29takes over gosh I don't remember who
32:32said it but ego eg Oh is edging God out
32:37and sometimes we can forget to be
32:41mindful of those around us and what
32:43they're going through
32:44so being humble and kind and yeah and
32:47that's that's it that's a characteristic
32:49trait
32:50right that let's just say who you are as
32:52a human being you know when you can be
32:54mindful of others why you are on your
32:59highs on your lows just being mindful
33:01that you know number one when you're on
33:04your lows that it could be much worse
33:06right and when you're on your highs is
33:09that you give God the glory but don't
33:12get too high when your highs are high
33:14don't get too low when your lows are low
33:16just stay humble keep it even killed
33:19know that God is good nor that God got
33:22your back but I also know that God
33:24expects you to basically carry yourself
33:29in a god-like way and if we can do that
33:32we can make the world a better place we
33:34can start right there making the world a
33:35better place by developing better
33:37relationships with those that we love
33:38and those that are around us that look
33:41like us so I would say those are the
33:43things that I learned from Sid and
33:45solitary confinement and and looking at
33:48the world through a glass thing when I
33:50learned that we can do better and we
33:53must do better and it's up to us to do
33:55that and you are doing better and we and
33:58we are yes we are doing better and we
34:02have an opportunity every day to do
34:04better I mean you went through
34:06unbelievable nough said I can't even
34:10fathom but you did and you came out
34:12better and you're helping others for the
34:14listeners no matter what your struggle
34:17how little you may feel it is it is
34:20still your struggle yeah and to look at
34:24it and choose to find the good in it and
34:27to help others fills you more than it
34:31fills others it comes right back around
34:33so share a little bit about your
34:36foundation and the good that you're
34:39doing so the listeners can know where to
34:42go and and find you and well yeah you
34:46know I started a foundation and right
34:48now it's called Anthony Gray's
34:49foundation but we're gonna we're
34:51changing the names of brass facts dot
34:54o-r-g and this foundation for spra SS
34:57yes brass facts
34:59I got RG in the next two months we'll
35:03have that changed over but for right now
35:05it's still Anthony Gray's foundation
35:07that RG and the foundation is was
35:10created to help people get out of prison
35:12who shouldn't be there basically that's
35:14the nutshell and we try to remove the
35:17criterias that other organizations have
35:19for taking up such cases for example
35:22whether you have DNA or not if you're
35:25innocent we'll fight for you okay you
35:28know so I wanted to build a nonprofit
35:31that I felt that would serve all those
35:34who have been wronged by the criminal
35:36justice system when I was back there
35:38where I reached out to many nonprofits
35:41asked them for their assistance but they
35:43always had criterias do you have DNA etc
35:46etc I didn't have DNA in my case a lot
35:49of these institutions wouldn't help me I
35:51would have been dead
35:52based on their criteria so I wanted to
35:54come out and start a non-profit that
35:56didn't deal with those criterias the
35:57only criteria we deal with have you been
36:00wrongfully convicted and if you've been
36:02wrongfully convicted we want to help you
36:03right so that's why I started that
36:05foundation but then I also learned that
36:07in order to really enhance this work
36:10people need to know these stories so I
36:13also started a speaker's bureau for
36:17people who've been directly impacted by
36:18the criminal justice system and what I
36:20did is created a 12-week curriculum on
36:23training them how to tell their story
36:25and tell their story in different
36:27settings in front of legislative body
36:29from the media from legal entities non
36:32legal entities churches those stories
36:35need to be told everybody gets out and
36:38tell stories for other people who have
36:40been wronged by the system and that's
36:42okay we all this is all of our system
36:45but the stories need to be heard by
36:47those who've been directly impacted and
36:49so what I wanted to do because I see how
36:51people are responding to me I feel like
36:54if I could create a program where people
36:56tell these stories we can magnify this
36:58and so it has been a positive thing we
37:01have gotten our first graduate class and
37:03just last week they were speaking to
37:06state reps up at the Texas Legislature
37:08what it has done for them and they'll
37:10tell you it has empowered them
37:12it's giving their life back it has given
37:14them a voice out here where they never
37:16thought they could be heard and it has
37:18given them a reason to get up and fight
37:20every day it's an amazing program and
37:24these were things that I just felt like
37:26I wish would have been in place for me
37:28and so I created the things that I felt
37:31like if there have been in place for me
37:32I could have gotten help
37:34well and that ties right into you are
37:37somebody oftentimes people go I wish
37:38somebody with this or I wish somebody
37:40with that and one of the things we like
37:42to share with the listeners is you are
37:44somebody yes you can make a difference
37:47yes and no matter how small you may feel
37:51you may often times we feel I'm just one
37:54I'm not significant the power of
37:57accumulation and that power of that
37:59positive forward motion taking that one
38:01little step at a time and to help others
38:05and to help them have their voice again
38:07for the listeners I mean Anthony you you
38:11were one day just enjoying your family
38:14and your girlfriend and your brother and
38:15your home and the whole bit to the next
38:18day being brought down for questioning
38:21handcuffed and boom 18 years of your
38:25life just gone for anyone out there
38:27listening you may think well that could
38:29never happen to me well I'm sure before
38:31this happened I would do the same thing
38:33hey never happened to me I'm not a
38:35criminal
38:36I don't just homey anyone why would
38:38someone accuse me of something that like
38:40of this magnitude you know and so I
38:43never thought it would happen to me and
38:44then it knocked on my door
38:45it knocked on my door changed my whole
38:47life I went from a twenty eight twenty
38:50six year old kid to prison and come out
38:53of 45 year old man with a purpose that
38:56is greater than myself now and so this
38:59is when you talk about positive thinking
39:01and moving forward positively listen at
39:0326 when they took my freedom and talked
39:07about taking my life I could have given
39:08up I could have given up but I say this
39:11is not the end
39:13this can't be the way God wants my life
39:17to end it has to be more to it so I
39:19started questioning things
39:21it didn't it was it started making sense
39:23to me I'm being prepared for something
39:25bigger so I need to be prepared and
39:28that's the high went about my life I
39:30wrote letters I read I wrote my book I
39:33just needed to stay positive because I
39:35knew it was something bigger waiting
39:37around the corner I just have to be
39:40patient enough to wait for and I'm here
39:43and again in honor to be here with you
39:47today and thank you so much for sharing
39:49your story and doing so much good for
39:51others keep up the positive forward
39:54motion I have no doubt that you will
39:55that's that's the way I live thank you
39:59thank you wow what a great reminder of
40:03how our choices in our life can make all
40:05the difference in the world not only to
40:07us but also to others I want to thank
40:09you so much for listening in today and
40:11I'd love to hear your feedback so why
40:13don't you email me Denise at Denise
40:16scatter good comm and share with me
40:18maybe what you took away from this
40:20episode and also remember to please rate
40:23review and share this podcast I
40:26appreciate you listening in I hope
40:28you're finding value I'm wishing you
40:30continued success and happiness and
40:32remember to keep up the positive forward
40:35motion

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