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Beyin Yorulur mu? - Olmaz Öyle Saçma Beyin - Dr. Kerem Dündar - B05 — Transcript

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0:03Hello, Kerem.
0:04Hello, İlker.
0:05How are you?
0:06I'm great, honestly. I feel like a
0:07million bucks, but I also feel like I
0:08need a vacation.
0:09Yeah. You're so sweet. I think everyone
0:11feels the need for a vacation. İlker,
0:13does the brain actually get tired?
0:15Bravo. That's one of the good questions
0:16, I think. The brain is an organ that
0:17gets very tired,
0:18but it is also an organ that never
0:19stops. I think we need to resolve this
0:21paradox now. Otherwise, we'll start
0:22questioning the necessity of a vacation
0:24too much. The brain works a lot and can
0:26never stop.
0:27Why? Doesn't it stop when we sleep at
0:28night? It doesn't even stop when you
0:29sleep at night. On the contrary, there
0:31are moments when it works much harder.
0:33There is actually an activity we
0:34observe in functional MRI called
0:35background activity. It's as if the
0:37brain is focusing on something. That
0:39region gets activated. The visual area
0:41activates, but other parts are working
0:42too, and so on. I mean, everything in
0:44the universe is constantly moving, but
0:46there's action in some places, right? I
0:48mean, social life continues constantly,
0:49but there is much more concentration in
0:51some places. Let's say there is a
0:52summit somewhere right now. Planes are
0:54landing and taking off there. Security
0:55guards are moving around more. But life
0:57is actually continuing everywhere.
0:59Information processing itself is like a
1:01routine thing. As our professor Türker
1:03often mentions,
1:04Who is Professor Türker?
1:05Türker Kılıç. A brain surgeon and
1:07one of the distinguished scientists
1:08raised by our precious country. That
1:10information theory he always talks
1:11about. We are talking about something
1:12that is constantly processing
1:13information. Now, processing
1:14information doesn't actually tire us
1:16out.
1:16On the contrary, isn't neural activity
1:18a beneficial thing? Neural activity is
1:20already essential. When we say neural
1:22activity, we mean the activities of the
1:23nervous system and cells. Let's not get
1:25scolded for this right away. I mean,
1:26foreign terminology was being used. I
1:29suppose everyone has learned about
1:30neurons, but there are many studies
1:32showing that experience-oriented new
1:34experiences trigger neural activity,
1:36increase synaptic binding, enhance
1:38interaction between synapses, or make
1:39us experts by thickening those
1:41connections. So, that's why neuronal
1:43activity is valuable. But there are
1:45some things, for example, overthinking,
1:47right? I mean, this is also neural...
1:48I know that very well.
1:49This is also neural activity. This
1:51means we need to distinguish this
1:53cognitively, intentionally. Let's
1:55translate "cognitive" that way as well.
1:57We need to distinguish some things
1:58intentionally. Some things are things
2:00we do without even being aware of them.
2:02We have nothing to do with those.
2:04Background activity is that hype. Do
2:05you mean things like breathing?
2:07Breathing is just like that. Our brain
2:09is in a state of constantly breathing
2:10as well. Breathing, for example, is
2:12very interesting. Sometimes it's done
2:14consciously, sometimes unconsciously.
2:16While almost all organs in the body are
2:18autonomous, we can control our lungs,
2:19but our lungs can sometimes continue
2:21even outside our control. So, it's
2:23something like this. How you breathe is
2:25actually important, but just because we
2:28gave you the authority to train on how
2:31to breathe doesn't mean you'll be
2:33deprived of it when you forget to
2:35breathe. So, the brain actually has
2:37exactly this kind of effect. In other
2:39words, the brain is very similar to a
2:40lung in this sense. It works both
2:42voluntarily and involuntarily. If you
2:44don't use your lungs voluntarily. Just
2:47like when we close our mouth and say, "
2:48I'm going to take shallow breaths now,
2:50I'll breathe very lightly," if that
2:52puts us in a difficult spot, voluntary
2:53actions in the brain can also put us in
2:55a bind. At the very top of these is,
2:57for instance, following an emotion
2:58wherever it leads. Now, emotion is a
3:00very interesting mechanism.
3:01But if you say that, I’ll ask, "What
3:03is emotion?"
3:04Good.
3:04What is emotion? What is a feeling?
3:06This subject often gets confused.
3:07Okay. Super. Intuition, for example,
3:09right? These things are always nested
3:10within one another. Let’s put it this
3:11way. The human brain has software
3:14levels. Thinking is not the first
3:16software level of the human brain. I
3:18mean, we don't start life by thinking.
3:20Actually, we don't even start by
3:22feeling. We start life by believing. We
3:24talked about this before. What did we
3:26say belief was there? Belief provided
3:27something to hold onto. It was such a
3:29blind faith that perhaps we can never
3:31experience it like that again
3:32throughout our lives. At the level of
3:34faith, you know.
3:35Believe in what?
3:35Have faith in what? That your mother is
3:37the most valuable living being for you,
3:38or that this woman will feed you very
3:40well.
3:40I would actually call that an
3:41assumption rather than faith.
3:42Bravo. So, the thing that separates
3:44assumption from faith. In one, you
3:46think you know. In the other, you are
3:48suspicious because you don't know. A
3:50human believing their mother is the
3:52most important living being is actually
3:53a fundamental condition of life when
3:55you look at it. Because when a human
3:58comes from the womb, where they were
3:59like a whole, into the outside world,
4:01they hold onto something. That is why I
4:03call the first software of the brain "
4:05belief." In the next stage, the brain's
4:07most important ability is realized. The
4:09brain can make comparisons. Is it this
4:11or that? Is it this or that? And we
4:13actually encode the outside world
4:15digitally.
4:16We say one or zero.
4:17Bravo. One or zero. But we aren't
4:19satisfied with just that one or zero. I
4:20mean, it's not just that something
4:21makes us cry or laugh; there's also "it
4:23makes me a little sad.""It doesn't make
4:25me that happy," and so on. We slowly
4:27start to diversify those ones and zeros
4:30. Meaning, we start to increase the
4:32resolution in between. And then,
4:34something more complex called "thought"
4:36follows. The brain accompanies this in
4:38terms of hardware, too. So, the
4:39hardware grows somewhere as well. From
4:41the brainstem to the limbic system,
4:42from the limbic system to the frontal
4:43lobe. These are actually just data
4:44processing when you look at it. That's
4:46why we referred to Professor Türker.
4:48That information processing actually
4:50never changes. Only the level of the
4:51information we process changes.
4:53But look, for example, there is Alper
4:54Hasanoğlu. You know, in our psychiatry
4:55department.
4:56Alper. Yes. He loves...
4:56He gets very annoyed by those computer
4:58analogies, for instance.
4:59We say, "Honestly, this isn't a
5:00computer analogy." Because computers
5:02are thought to only process information
5:04, this is perceived as an analogy. When
5:07we start saying "everything processes
5:09information," we stop that limited
5:10analogy—the one Alper is suspicious
5:12of and uncomfortable with—from being
5:13just an analogy.
5:15It becomes the reality itself.
5:16Bravo, we position it as reality, the
5:18very truth itself. That's why I don't
5:20like the computer analogy for the brain
5:21at all.
5:21Because, for example, the thing you
5:23call a sperm is actually something that
5:24transmits information.
5:25Of course, my dear, and what kind of
5:26information is in a sperm? I mean, a
5:27sperm might be the most effective and
5:29mobile USB device. It's going to be
5:31analyzed regardless.
5:32In the same way, the female egg......
5:34I personally think it also has the
5:36authority to make decisions. As if the
5:38sperm only carries information.
5:39Anyway, you were talking about levels.
5:41While talking about levels, this part
5:42about processing emotions is exactly
5:44the part where we are hedonistic
5:46creatures. I like this, so let me move
5:48towards it. I don't like this, so let
5:50me not move towards it. Look,
5:51self-consciousness actually starts to
5:53kick in here slowly. Meaning, I am
5:55different from the world outside. We
5:57describe self-consciousness as if it's
5:58something very spectacular. Since we
6:01have a defensive stance about being
6:02conscious creatures and feel valuable
6:04in this regard, this might actually be
6:05something we need to deal with. I mean,
6:08this is much better. Let's say all of
6:10modern physics has proven this today,
6:12and all philosophers are now forcing
6:14their brains to think this way. Because
6:16we are accustomed to it. We are subject
6:18to a physical understanding that is not
6:19supported by our knowledge, perspective
6:21, and empirical observation. Erkcan
6:22already explains that very well. And in
6:25return, how can philosophers
6:26reinterpret these things with a new
6:29perspective, getting rid of what we
6:31struggle to experience or what we
6:33mistakenly experience in our current
6:35framework? That's when such things come
6:38to the agenda. Actually, emotion,
6:40sensing, etc., create a feeling as if
6:41they are primitive things because they
6:43exist beforehand. No, it turns out it's
6:45not that primitive. We are actually
6:47deprived of an area we are very
6:48experienced in while trying something
6:50new. I mean, when thought comes into
6:52play, is there a possibility that we
6:53are eliminating or keeping something as
6:55powerful as emotion in the background?
6:57I didn't quite understand that part. Is
6:58what you call emotion an orientation,
6:59then? I mean...
7:00I haven't explained that part yet,
7:01you're right. That's why you are very
7:03right. Some things had a good, positive
7:05effect on me. Some things had a bad,
7:08negative effect on me. And I don't have
7:11much of this in my higher systems yet.
7:14We observe this a lot, especially
7:16starting from the age of 2, which is
7:17the maturation period of the brain; I
7:19feel this with my whole body: I felt
7:21good about this, so I approached it, my
7:22muscles relaxed and loosened. My blood
7:25vessels dilated. The sugar that needed
7:27to be pumped through the blood
7:28decreased. My blood pressure dropped.
7:30Look, notice that even when describing
7:32such a relaxed state, we call this
7:33parasympathetic activity. And we call
7:36the other side sympathetic activity.
7:38The terminology for this that is very
7:39famous these days is the vagus nerve.
7:41Vagal activation. Like vagal therapy.
7:44Now we are rediscovering it as humanity
7:46. We had experienced this during
7:48childhood. Perhaps people in primitive
7:49times were already living like this all
7:51the time. They were in much more
7:53interaction with the world they lived
7:55in than we are.
7:56By the way, the system you're
7:57describing also resembles AI. You know,
7:59this or that, it's similar to the
8:01training of AI.
8:03The training of the algorithm is
8:04similar to this. It is already a very
8:06algorithmic thing. That's why the
8:08answer cannot be yes or no when it
8:10comes to emotions. But, for instance,
8:12you might be a sadomasochist. You take
8:14pleasure in suffering. I wonder, how
8:15does that deviation occur?
8:16Nice. Okay. Let’s talk about that,
8:18for example. Great. Before the holiday,
8:20everyone should learn what they are
8:21fetishistic or psychopathic about.
8:23I mean, I asked for a reason. So, not
8:24everyone is the same.
8:25Of course not. Because something else
8:26is at work. I’m about to explain that
8:27. I believed in some things. Then, at
8:29the intermediate stage, I started to
8:30distinguish them with emotions. I want
8:32some things, I don't want others. I
8:34take a position with my whole body to
8:36approach what I want. I take another
8:38position with my body to move away from
8:40what I don't want, and my body is
8:41constantly preparing for this. This is
8:43called sympathetic fight or
8:45parasympathetic relief, relaxation, and
8:47staying in those states. If you notice,
8:49there’s something very dichotomous
8:51and digital there. But this is also
8:53something that can be improved. It’s
8:55not entirely black or white. For
8:57instance, I think it’s something that
8:58can be separated. It’s not very high
9:00resolution, but I’m not sure if
9:01it’s sufficient. Look, a lot of
9:03living things get by with this. You and
9:05I, for example, can have a very
9:06emotional communication. We walk
9:07together, we make progress together, we
9:08accomplish things together, and so on.
9:10But of course, these aren't enough for
9:11the civilization we’ve built today.
9:14Or let me put it this way: the current
9:16nature is not complex enough for a
9:17creature that goes beyond this. So what
9:20do we do? We start to get suspicious.
9:22We start asking questions. And that is
9:24the question. I approach this, but does
9:26it really do me good? That question
9:29moves us to the next step. This is
9:32called thought. Thought is something
9:34that emerged after experience. We
9:36already experience life first.
9:38You mention tabula rasa.
9:39Tabula rasa is a very philosophical
9:41definition, and I think it greatly
9:42improves our world of ideas. I don’t
9:44think it’s like that right now. I am
9:45aware that there is transmission in
9:47many directions. There is both
9:48biological transmission and a very
9:49serious social transmission. By social
9:51transmission, I don’t just mean
9:53learning. A person is shaped a lot by
9:55bumping into many things without even
9:57realizing it. I don’t think it’s a
10:00blank slate, but I also don’t think
10:01it’s as complicated as it is in
10:03adulthood. Our language of emotions—I
10:06value this a lot. This is a language,
10:08if you look at it. I mean...
10:10Yes. Even if we had never learned to
10:12speak or think after this, we would
10:14still feel things, and there are
10:15already examples of this in society.
10:17Even in individuals who couldn't speak
10:19or have intellectual disabilities, we
10:21can still clearly feel their affect.
10:23They can easily convey their emotions,
10:24and isn't that actually through that
10:26language? They communicate very closely
10:27with their families. They communicate
10:28with people who are in intense contact
10:30with them. They can both understand and
10:31make themselves understood. So, this
10:32must be a language.
10:33By the way, regarding the mix-up, I
10:34want to say something. I am very
10:36interested in Wittgenstein.
10:38Yes.
10:38Actually, without language, there would
10:40be no thought. Starting from our
10:42conversation, Wittgenstein's point that
10:44the limit of my language is the limit
10:46of my world is deeply related to my
10:47power of expression. What exactly is
10:50the minimum level of my communication
10:51skills, and how much of it would
10:53actually be enough for us? We don't
10:54know this. We opened the floodgates to
10:56this. I mean, the gates of hell have
10:58been opened. Speaking is truly a good
10:59thing, but was there really a need to
11:01speak this much? Now, this world of
11:02thought is very valuable, but as you
11:04can see, it is very complex. Now, here
11:06is the risk. Thought independent of
11:08emotions, and thought content that
11:11disregards emotions. I say this because
11:13it is a problem we are facing quite
11:14often with artificial intelligence. For
11:16instance, I work with the business
11:17world, you know, and they are surprised
11:19now that companies are hiring
11:21philosophers, neuroscientists, and
11:22behavioral scientists. Honestly, we
11:24have been working on this with
11:25companies for 10 years. This was
11:26already a problem for organizations
11:28anyway. But now, artificial
11:29intelligence—which we assume speaks
11:31very well and today speaks better than
11:3390%of society—is involved. We want
11:34emotion to be infused into that speech.
11:36Actually, we always think of emotion as
11:38something else, but emotion is also a
11:40language of its own. So, we use two
11:42languages to complement each other. I
11:44am telling you something, and at the
11:45same time, I am embedding emotion into
11:46it. Actually, that is another language.
11:48It runs in parallel. So, being able to
11:49speak that language well is very
11:51valuable.
11:51But isn't emotion something misleading?
11:53I mean, for example, a guy commits a
11:54murder and says, "I was overcome by my
11:55emotions." So, isn't that something
11:57that should actually be kept under
11:58control?
11:59Very good, very good question. If a
12:01person is going to progress in a
12:02positive direction, being overcome by
12:04emotions is a very useful thing. Then
12:06there is a lot of flow. Then there is
12:07passion. Boundless creativity can
12:10emerge. But the opposite of such a
12:11powerful thing is, of course, just as
12:13destructive and negative. A person's
12:15risk-taking threshold is very important
12:17there. Now, the question you asked
12:18shows that you are someone who likes to
12:20keep their risk-taking threshold a bit
12:21lower. But we, as a society, must
12:23consider this. When we ask whether
12:27thoughts, emotions, or beliefs are more
12:29important for managing the masses, the
12:32answer is that the deeper a language is
12:34, the harder it is for the brain to
12:36escape its influence. That is why
12:40communication based on beliefs is
12:42always very sharp. It is also very
12:44sharp if used in a positive direction,
12:46which many leaders throughout history
12:47have experienced.
12:48Let's remind ourselves of something.
12:49You are using "belief" in a broad sense
12:51. Not Islam or Christianity.
12:52Of course. Belief as the brain's tool
12:54for holding on.
12:55It comes down to what Harari calls a
12:57story.
12:57Therefore, a story is more of a place
12:59between our beliefs and our emotions.
13:01The thing being told does not have to
13:02be logical. I mean, we say "once upon a
13:05time,""long ago." When we hear that
13:08Cinderella's carriage was a pumpkin,
13:10nobody says, "What is this nonsense?"
13:12Nobody abandoned the story right there.
13:13Do you see? In reality, it was not
13:15something suitable for our ideas, our
13:16minds, or our daily life practices.
13:18The suspension of disbelief. It exists
13:20in cinema, too, you know. The
13:21suspension of disbelief. Especially in
13:22these futuristic works. Now, when this
13:25disbelief is suspended, Ilker, if there
13:27is knowledge there, the person might
13:28not even engage with the part that
13:30would make them question it. That is
13:32why faith at that level is important
13:34here. We already talked about that. But
13:36emotion also corresponds a lot to this
13:38in daily life. Because when you first
13:40make contact with a person in daily
13:41life, you don't ask, "Brother, what are
13:42the things that connect you to this
13:44life?" and so on. You don't have a
13:45conversation with that level of detail.
13:46As our relationships become more
13:48superficial, the power of beliefs is
13:50transferred to emotions there. Because
13:53I have known you for, look, how many
13:54years. I like you a lot, too. We chat
13:56every time I come over. We keep up with
13:57each other and such, but for example, I
13:59don't need to dig into the beliefs that
14:01Ilker holds onto in life and so on.
14:02Meaning, we might not even feel the
14:04need for that. Because we are people
14:05who linger a lot at the thought level.
14:08Maybe we like each other from there
14:09through emotion. Now, if it's someone
14:11you don't like—even if they were the
14:13greatest scholar—I won't give
14:14examples, just say it while it's just
14:15us. With a person I like, even if their
14:17ideas are absurd, there is a tolerance
14:19there. So, it means that the
14:21idea-emotion combination is something
14:23we use more in daily life. The
14:25belief-emotion combination is something
14:27we use more in fanaticism and the like.
14:29So, what do we do?
14:30Believing that Fenerbahçe is the best
14:31team, for example.
14:32I mean, for instance, isn't it like
14:33this? It is.
14:34That is an illusion, of course; belief
14:36is an illusion. Everyone's mother is
14:38the best person in the world. We cannot
14:39live without these illusions. Then we
14:41would have psychological problems.
14:43Because the entire psyche is something
14:45built upon that. Or it's something that
14:47clings to it if it exists. Some believe
14:48it exists and cling to it. When we
14:49believe it is being constructed, it
14:51grows as we build a relationship with
14:52it.
14:52So, should I understand it this way?
14:54You see thought as the lowest level—
14:55or the highest, but at the same time,
14:57the most insignificant level.
14:58For instance, because it is the most
15:00fragile, it is something new and
15:01inexperienced. Humanity's experience
15:02with belief is vast, while the
15:04experience with emotions is slightly
15:06less, though still quite large. But
15:07experience with thought is scarce, if
15:09you notice. That is why many people
15:10emerge who can sing emotional,
15:11arabesque songs, but not that many
15:12philosophers can emerge. I mean, that
15:14is the reason for it. Because we have a
15:16lot of influence over one another when
15:17it comes to affecting our emotions. But
15:19the ability of someone to transform the
15:20thoughts of others—especially if
15:22it’s going to affect societal
15:23thoughts, right? We attribute it to
15:25something like, "That guy became a
15:26philosopher." Very good philosophers
15:28hold onto both thought and emotion. We
15:30start to experience something
15:31completely different there. I think
15:33there are good philosophers in history.
15:35They are very good at thought and very
15:37skillful at clashing these thoughts
15:38with other philosophers. And then there
15:40are those who hold onto emotion. I
15:41think those are the ones who become
15:42those things. They become milestones. I
15:44evaluate the issue of faith completely
15:45separately. I think they become
15:46something else entirely. They start
15:48becoming much more spiritual leaders
15:49and so on. It is not easy for that
15:51leadership to exist solely on a hollow
15:54belief. But the leader is under the
15:55obligation to descend to the
15:57consciousness level of their followers.
15:58That is why, in fact, the philosophical
16:00skill is very high, the intellectual
16:01world is very good, and access to
16:03emotions is very high. It is possible
16:05to manage very large masses by telling
16:06very simple things at the level of
16:07belief. Like this, for example. I mean,
16:103-5 stories can sweep across the whole
16:12world, or other examples of spiritual
16:13leaders can be given.
16:15There is a risk in what you are saying,
16:16of course. The risk of leaning towards
16:18anti-intellectualism. I mean, the idea
16:20that thought is not actually that
16:22important, and that internal emotions
16:24and feelings—in quotes—are more
16:26important, is a bit dangerous. I
16:28understand you.
16:29Yes, exactly. It is very easy to make
16:31an anti-intellectual defense after such
16:33information. That is exactly where I
16:35stand as well. I mean, if I weren't a
16:37scientist, if I were just someone who
16:39is nature-friendly, having some
16:40education of my own but not caring
16:42about it at all, more
16:43experience-oriented, then it would be
16:45as you say. That is exactly why those
16:47people feel the need for intellectual
16:49reduction after a point. Because their
16:51daily practices serve no purpose for
16:52them, and they are living a life that
16:54is very enjoyable and comfortable
16:55without it, as if it were the life
16:57promised to humans, as if it were what
16:58God intended. So, that is why there
17:00seems to be no intellectual need here.
17:02I agree with that completely. We always
17:04need to add a disclaimer right there.
17:06If thought is not added to it, then we
17:08have no chance of experiencing the
17:10development, change, and much-praised,
17:11advertised things that we have achieved
17:13today, but which I believe is
17:15transformation. I think the real
17:17trigger for that transformation today
17:19is thought. I mean, thought definitely
17:22has a triggering power.
17:23You could also call it an idea.
17:25Bravo. An idea isn't exactly a product
17:26of thought anyway. Emotion and feeling
17:28are also very close to each other. I
17:29mean, maybe we communicate with emotion
17:31. A feeling is the name of the data
17:33coming to us. These are parts of that
17:35ecosystem there. I think thought and
17:36idea have exactly that kind of
17:38relationship. That is why I say it is
17:39about understanding some subjects
17:41partially. Humans are very skilled
17:43beings. And that is why being singular
17:45is very troublesome. I mean, alone,
17:48from where I see, at least two people
17:50—humans see nearly 180 degrees on
17:53average. If two people face each other,
17:55we can start seeing 360 degrees. I mean
17:57, that possibility is there now. That
17:59is why, I think, that duality of coming
18:02together is called 'tawhid' in divine
18:04fields. There is such a risk in that
18:06singularity of the human. Either we
18:08follow thought, saying this is the
18:10highest level, casting aside
18:11fundamental, extraordinary things, or
18:13on the other hand, when we follow that
18:15idea or thought, the interaction breaks
18:17down. We are creatures that survive
18:19through interaction. That is why
18:21something like this was not selected in
18:22evolution. Meaning, it didn't happen
18:23like, "let the thinkers survive and the
18:25suitable ones go." So, these must also
18:27be a part of this process already. But
18:29on the contrary, the thinkers were not
18:31eliminated either. There is something
18:32like this in history. It is often
18:33mentioned in evolutionary biology. The
18:34brain grew significantly at one point.
18:35The reason for it was unknown. Yes. It
18:37is said that it was meat and such.
18:38Yes. Meat is said to be the reason for
18:40the brain's current growth as well. We
18:41have a gastronomic side. Our fondness
18:43for food is perhaps also evolutionary.
18:45Of course, being able to consume
18:46protein. That is why it is said that
18:48because we cook over fire, we can
18:50consume more protein when it is cooked.
18:52Actually, there is plant protein there
18:53as well. These are assumptions, of
18:54course, but I think they are very
18:55interesting assumptions. The subject of
18:57evolutionary biology and evolutionary
18:58gastronomy are all worth reading about.
19:00There is this idea of a step backward
19:02in the whole process, suggesting the
19:03brain grew a bit too much and didn't
19:05really need to grow that large. Two
19:07main reasons are cited for this. The
19:09first is that it consumes a lot of
19:11energy; currently, the brain consumes a
19:12quarter of our energy, or one out of
19:14every four bites. Even though it is 2%
19:15of the body.
19:16So, Professor, would I lose weight if I
19:18thought a lot? Thinking a lot doesn't
19:19necessarily make our brain work harder.
19:21I was just joking, but anyway.
19:23Well, I think it's a good joke. Do you
19:24know who actually loses the most weight
19:26? Those who are very indecisive, stuck
19:28in the middle, and don't know what to
19:29do. The brain consumes a lot of energy
19:30then. Because that is the only time
19:32energy consumption increases. Of course
19:33, would this be enough to lose weight?
19:34Because it depends on how quickly you
19:36close the caloric deficit it creates. I
19:38mean, the biggest problem with weight
19:40today isn't that the body can't lose it
19:41. It is that we can very quickly regain
19:43the caloric deficit we created between
19:45yesterday and today. Access to food has
19:47become very easy.
19:48Yes. Both access to food is easy and
19:49the available foods, the industrial
19:51ingredients, are very caloric.
19:52High-calorie ingredients.
19:53So it consumes energy, right?
19:54It consumes energy. That was the first
19:56one, İlkar. The second is that the
19:58larger the brain, the longer and more
20:00intensive parental care it needs. By
20:03size, I mean the brain-to-body ratio.
20:04We don't have the largest brain. As
20:06you'd appreciate, whales have brains
20:07weighing about 9 kilos, but...
20:08but the ratio to the body...
20:09We have the largest brain relative to
20:12the body, and while upright chimpanzees
20:14need parental care for up to 10 years,
20:17I suspect that if our brain mass
20:19increased by another 10%—assuming it
20:21grew from the frontal lobe—our need
20:23for parental care might reach our 30s.
20:26And for some people, it already does.
20:27Well, their problem lies more with
20:30their parents. Biology has done its
20:32best, but if parents don't provide the
20:34experiential space needed by biology,
20:36that frontal lobe doesn't develop. You
20:38end up hanging around your parents more
20:40to take advantage of their frontal lobe
20:41. But on the other hand, there is
20:42another necessity. When a brain is more
20:44developed, its problem-solving ability
20:47increases. Meaning, its intelligence
20:48increases. But like any intelligence,
20:50the ability to create problems also
20:51increases. When people are smarter,
20:54they need more mentoring. We have
20:56increased the time we spend exposing a
20:58smarter brain to a more experienced
21:00brain in order for it to survive in
21:01this life. And I think this is a very
21:04important point that shouldn't be
21:05overlooked. I mean, this is one of the
21:07optimum points. We can also add a third
21:09speculation. The third one is this.
21:11When we started thinking this much and
21:13became this intelligent, would our
21:15communication be as good? If I
21:18understood everything about you, knew
21:19everything about you, saw your back,
21:20and you saw my back, would we be able
21:22to be such good friends?
21:23There would be no need for us to talk.
21:24Yeah. There would be no need for us to
21:26talk. Besides, there might not even be
21:27a need for what we would say if we did
21:28talk. Because we have a different kind
21:29of expectation. Can we fall in love
21:31just by being this intelligent? The
21:33problem of not being able to fall in
21:34love is also obvious. I mean, when you
21:35can't fall in love, when you can't
21:36build good relationships, when you
21:37can't experience that passion, right?
21:39It's a huge problem in terms of the
21:40continuity of the lineage. Could we
21:41fall in love, I wonder? Like, I'm
21:42looking for someone who matches my
21:44intellect. That, you know, everyone,
21:45especially in the white-collar
21:47community that I hear among friends so
21:48often, "I can't choose, teach, our
21:50criteria have increased, teach," and so
21:52on. I think this is also a problem.
21:53Thought has such a drawback. That's why
21:56perhaps a healthy zone for a person at
21:58this stage is a version of a questioned
22:01life that can be lived without ignoring
22:03emotions. That's why the door of
22:05emotion is very important. In child
22:06development, we tell parents that in
22:08kindergarten, you should talk to your
22:10child. Because the child is
22:11experiencing the outside world for the
22:12first time. They come home, and so on.
22:13You say to them, "How was school?" Is
22:15this a university student? I mean, what
22:16are you going to ask the child? What
22:17happened at school? What caught your
22:19attention the most, and how did you
22:20feel at that moment? What do you think
22:22your friend felt? What do you think
22:23your teacher felt? You told this. What
22:25did I feel? You told this. I felt this.
22:27What did you feel? Like that. Look, you
22:29need to talk to a child through that
22:30language. That's one of the problems of
22:32this century. You know, there was
22:33something called "neuron, my dear." I
22:35mean, even a rural mother, the best
22:36parent, would ask, "What are you
22:38feeling?" That, "Mom, I felt sad, I
22:39felt happy," and the child would answer
22:41their mother accordingly. Instead of
22:42just sitting down and saying, "Ayşe's
22:44mother did this," there would be a
22:45sharing based more on feelings. This
22:47was developing our language of feelings
22:49, İlker. Right now, unfortunately, our
22:50language of feelings remains a bit
22:52buried. I think one of the methods of
22:54developing it is definitely close
22:55relationships.
22:56Therapists are very ambitious about
22:58this. Bravo to therapists. What I like
23:01most in therapy, and which we sometimes
23:03tease about among therapist friends, is
23:05that some therapy methods start
23:07specifically with "What do you feel?"
23:09They even pause like this. You know.
23:11How did this make you feel?
23:12What did this make you feel, and so on.
23:13If that language isn't very common, if
23:15a person isn't very used to this
23:16questioning in their daily life,
23:18sometimes they don't even know what
23:19they are feeling.
23:20And it can also seem very effeminate.
23:21Yeah. Yes. Now, it's also related to
23:24being emotional, isn't it? Crying when
23:26seeing something, etc. Are you an
23:27emotional person, by the way?
23:28They claim so, but some also say I am
23:30completely emotionless. I don't know.
23:32There is a borderline situation.
23:33I am in favor of keeping my emotions
23:34under control.
23:35Let's talk about that, too. I am an
23:36emotional person, for example.
23:37Sometimes, while watching a movie or
23:39something, I get into these antique
23:40things, meaning affect is at the
23:41forefront. I don't know if one should
23:43control this or not, but I enjoy it. So
23:46, contact with emotion first of all
23:47increases experience in that area.
23:49Being emotional all the time could be
23:50something else. That could also be a
23:52mood disorder. It might necessarily
23:54require psychiatric treatment or
23:55psychological support. But asking each
23:57other "what are you feeling" from as
23:59early an age as possible, and caring
24:01about what they feel. Because "what are
24:03you feeling?" It actually strengthens
24:05that language. Like, if the person
24:06opposite is English, I would understand
24:07them better if I knew English. The
24:08person opposite has a feeling. I wonder
24:10if we would understand each other
24:11better if I knew that feeling? It
24:12creates a necessity like that. The
24:14essential thing for us is not emotion
24:16control related to controlling this. It
24:19is impulse control. This is one of the
24:22interesting topics now. What we call an
24:24impulse is the trigger for behavior.
24:26Behaving is a very difficult thing, I
24:27mean. Come on, I mean, let's behave,
24:29let's take action. Of course, in the
24:32modern age, those procrastination
24:33illnesses and such stem from the
24:34frailty of those mechanisms. But if
24:36this becomes too extreme, then it could
24:38be an impulse control disorder, or
24:39things we call attention-deficit
24:41hyperactivity disorder. But actually,
24:42at the beginning of childhood, we are
24:44generally in act-act-act mode until a
24:46certain age, and then at some point,
24:47it's like, "act but you can't do that
24:49while your mother is here,""you can't
24:51do that here,""you can't do that in
24:52public," right? We shouldn't do
24:54everything that comes to mind. The
24:55place we call "what comes to mind" is
24:56those impulses. The limbic system is
24:58constantly pumping. For example, right
25:00now, as you sit there, the urge to just
25:02get up comes to you. You're standing
25:04there, like, "let me shake this
25:05microphone," you know, there are those
25:07annoying types who walk around and
25:08immediately touch things, that's the
25:09impulse, but some people—we call them
25:11adults. Adults can control their
25:13impulses. I mean, the person we call an
25:15adult is actually a person who can
25:17control their impulses. Now I'm going
25:19to tell you something very interesting.
25:20One of our impulses is this: the urge
25:21to constantly jump from my belief to my
25:23emotion, from my emotion to my thought,
25:25from my thought to my emotion, and from
25:26my emotion to my belief.
25:27That's overthinking.
25:28Nice. Then that topic of overthinking
25:31evolves into an endless loop. That is
25:34the mechanism within overthinking. I
25:35think of something, it makes me
25:36emotional. Emotions bring out new
25:38thoughts. Those thoughts trigger some
25:40of my beliefs, and so on. Within myself
25:42, of course, it's more accurate to call
25:43those that know no bounds. These are
25:45now heading toward a psychiatric
25:46illness. These are a group of neurotic
25:47illnesses. These are not
25:49hardware-related disorders. The patient
25:50is not seeing something that isn't
25:51there. Their ability to assess reality
25:53is not impaired. They know too. That's
25:54why saying "don't worry about it" and
25:55such isn't very useful, is it? After a
25:57certain level, there needs to be
25:58something structured for this.
26:00Schizophrenia is not like that though,
26:01right?
26:01Not at all, of course. Schizophrenia is
26:03definite, yes. Structural autism is not
26:04like that. Let's call it
26:06hardware-related, let's call it
26:07structural. They have their own
26:08justifications too. There is actually a
26:10price for the function that our
26:12existing hardware tries to exhibit.
26:14There is a price for being conscious.
26:16There is also a price for having a mind
26:18. The price of being conscious, I mean,
26:20the price of being in contact with that
26:21existing consciousness, of having
26:23self-consciousness, is psychosis, of
26:24course. I mean, it's
26:26Yes. I mean, we might lose touch with
26:29reality, getting lost within and the
26:30price of having a mind—I mean, of
26:32having an executive function—well,
26:34there might be errors here. That's
26:36neurosis right there. I mean,
26:37well, can a person go into extreme
26:39neurosis, then into psychosis, and then
26:41structurally break themselves? I mean,
26:43it's said there are very exceptional
26:45cases of this, but it's never something
26:47we can prove.
26:48Or it could be said for certain drugs.
26:50Yes. Some drugs can cause hardware
26:52issues. Absolutely, narcotics trigger
26:54psychosis. They can cause psychosis. We
26:55say that a person cannot do this to
26:57themselves. We reassure people about
26:59this. If there's anyone claiming it
27:01exists or if such situations arise,
27:02then the assumption that there's an
27:03underlying cause is much more appealing
27:05. Because these things can be hidden or
27:07tolerated during certain periods. Since
27:08they won't all be of the same intensity
27:10, there is an underlying basis.
27:11Something like "this kid read too many
27:12books and lost his mind" is not
27:14something to be afraid of. Let's be at
27:15ease about that.
27:16Correct. Therefore, I was going to tie
27:17it back to the beginning. It came from
27:18exhaustion.
27:19Yes. Yes. Let's move on to vacation.
27:21Is it possible to tire the brain out
27:22and break it?
27:23It's possible to tire and break it, but
27:24not every breakdown is psychosis. So,
27:25let's not evolve into psychosis. It is
27:27possible to disrupt the brain's flow of
27:29thought. For example, overthinking is
27:31possible. Staying sleep-deprived. I
27:32mean, it's possible to disrupt the
27:33brain's ability to switch from one mode
27:35to another. Damaging our memory. These
27:38can be broken due to wrong practices in
27:40our daily lives. Now, you and I will
27:43talk about memory, sleep, and such in
27:45future episodes. Because we want to
27:47discuss them in detail as well. Because
27:48we've received great feedback about
27:50that. Let's state it in general terms.
27:51First of all, what we call emotion is
27:53temporary. The most important vacation
27:55a person can give themselves. Is the
27:58time they spend waiting for an emotion
28:01to pass when it arises. Then there is
28:03no emotional abuse. Ah, sometimes we
28:06all want to get carried away by an
28:07emotion—like something we love—and
28:09we want to follow it. I accept that,
28:11but if we make this a habit, it becomes
28:13a control issue. Well,
28:14to give an example, is it like this?
28:15An anger comes. A sadness comes. We
28:18wait. We experienced something, we wait
28:20. I think this waiting is the most
28:22important vacation a person can give
28:23themselves. That's one. Second, look,
28:25I'll tell you something interesting.
28:26Being able to wait within a thought.
28:30Our most intellectual vacation. If I
28:31wait for an emotion to pass when it
28:33comes, that's a vacation. If I wait for
28:35a thought to brew within that thought,
28:37that's a vacation. Because a thought is
28:39something that needs to be matured. An
28:40emotion is not like that. You see,
28:41emotion is actually effective but it's
28:43a superficial language. Thought seems
28:45to have relatively less impact, but as
28:47it deepens, it's a language we can use
28:50more effectively by incorporating the
28:52others. Also, I'll suggest one more
28:54vacation. When we experience a belief
28:57conflict, holding onto the knowledge
28:59that beliefs can change—that's also a
29:02very important vacation. Our brain has
29:04three vacations. Beliefs can change. An
29:07emotion can pass, a thought needs to
29:10brew. All of these require a vacation.
29:12That is what I call a vacation. You
29:13always tell me, Kerem, that you don't
29:14really like vacations and such. And for
29:16years, I've been telling myself, "Well,
29:17I don't really like vacations." Because
29:19when we think of vacation, our minds
29:21immediately go to five-star hotels,
29:22all-inclusive buffets, and things like
29:24that, so understandably, people might
29:26not enjoy such a routine, but if this
29:27vacation is offered throughout the day
29:30actually, doing something else might
29:32just be a vacation. That's a bit of
29:33what you're saying. Stepping out of the
29:34routine
29:35I don't think that's the kind of
29:37vacation we are asking for. Sometimes,
29:40being rooted, or routines, are actually
29:42a very good vacation too. People can
29:44sometimes rest in routine as well.
29:46You rest there.
29:46I mean. Yes. I mean, it doesn't have to
29:48be like "I have to do something
29:49completely different," but I'm sure
29:51doing something else has value too. I
29:53think it's necessary for transformation
29:54. It's not necessary for resting, but
29:56for transforming, it is. So, let's call
29:58it a real vacation, a transformative
29:59vacation. I hadn't thought of it, but
30:01let's make it up here. Yes, let's call
30:02this a transformative vacation. Let's
30:04call the others restorative vacations.
30:06We try to experience both together at
30:08an all-inclusive hotel. We want both to
30:09transform and to rest. Those two might
30:11not go well together. Our assumption in
30:13transformative vacations is trying
30:15something new. I think those vacations
30:17definitely require restorative rest at
30:19the end. I mean, a real transformative
30:22vacation must be very tiring. Because a
30:24new experience means something that our
30:26existing brain potential isn't enough
30:28for. So, what do we need to do? We will
30:30activate new neurons. We will activate
30:32new pathways. We will thicken some
30:34pathways. This is an exhausting thing.
30:35That's why it's beneficial for those
30:37things we call transformative vacations
30:39to be tiring. But not everyone might
30:40have the means for such a vacation.
30:42Waiting for a certain time of the year
30:44for this might not be appropriate
30:45either. Having a perception of vacation
30:48through new experiences in one's daily
30:50life. For example, I came here today
30:51with something else in mind. I always
30:52look at it like this. There is a
30:53constant update here as well.
30:55It is constantly changing.
30:56Yes. Yes. Your understanding of a
30:58transformative vacation has already
30:59been moved into the company. When this
31:02is so separated, employees waiting for
31:04a vacation, people waiting to rest—
31:07then I think it contradicts the
31:09sustainability of the current universe
31:11model we are experiencing, the fact
31:14that every moment is very meaningful.
31:17This disrupts the existing meaning.
31:19Meaning doesn't become a homogeneous
31:20thing; it causes us to experience a
31:22non-homogeneous life where some parts
31:24of our lives are full of meaning and
31:26others are very meaningless. Instead of
31:28evaluating it that way, sometimes I
31:29will pause, sometimes I will wait for
31:31it to brew, sometimes I will wait for
31:33it to pass, sometimes I will have
31:34patience for its changeability—that
31:36knowledge. These seem to me like things
31:39we can experience at any moment anyway.
31:41Let's include the transformative
31:42experience in this too. I am going to
31:44give a romantic example now. Taxi
31:46drivers are always the example for this
31:47. They might have a headache too.
31:48I was once stuck with the taxi driver
31:50example.
31:51Is that so? Then let's overcome that
31:53wretched fate and switch the example.
31:54Going and chatting with a taxi driver,
31:56for instance, can be a completely
31:57different experience. Because a new
31:59person and that completely different
32:00experience can have a transformative
32:01quality in your life.
32:02I mean, it won't happen 90%of the time,
32:04but it could.
32:04You hold such an endearing prejudice
32:06against our local shopkeepers; it's
32:08very sweet. Actually, I’m going to
32:10add a caveat here. I believe everyone
32:13possesses knowledge that could
32:14transform us, but do we open ourselves
32:16to the knowledge we have that could
32:18transform them? This is called having a
32:20conversation. Now, being able to hold a
32:23good conversation might be the best
32:25vacation tool a person can provide for
32:27themselves.
32:28Actually, instead of "sohbet," the word
32:29"muhabbet"
32:30is lovely. I liked "muhabbet" too. I
32:32call this "sohbet." I mean, muhabbet,
32:33sohbet.
32:34I separate the two. Yes.
32:35Tell me your distinction. Let me know
32:37which side I fall on.
32:38Yeah. "Muhabbet" feels like something
32:40closer. It’s something open in the
32:41sense you mean.
32:42Muhabbet is more heart-to-heart.
32:43Oruç Aruoba used to call this "
32:45murmuring."
32:46Like small talk? In English?
32:49Not to defeat the other side or to
32:51prove one's existence, but to truly
32:53talk and share.
32:55Yes. Then, let’s commemorate our dear
32:57Oruç teacher. If he says so, let it be
32:59a signal for us, too. One could call it
33:02something very soul-to-soul. Right now,
33:04we are talking about this as if it's
33:05very brain-oriented. I, too, admit I
33:07have evaluated it that way for years.
33:09This is what I am discovering now. This
33:11is much more experiential knowledge. We
33:13aren't ignoring our brains. Our brain
33:14is certainly part of the process.
33:16Because the brain increases the quality
33:18of that communication. And sometimes it
33:19ruins its quality. Perhaps the
33:21investment that needs to be made in the
33:23brain should be at a level that
33:24increases the quality of our
33:25conversations. If our thought content
33:28is at a level that increases the
33:30fluidity of our chats and "muhabbets"
33:33as you say, I think any kind of
33:35thinking might actually enhance human
33:37interaction. Experiencing life not just
33:40through our emotions, but through
33:42something we've thought through with
33:44our minds, will undoubtedly be richer.
33:47However, this has a learning process.
33:49Meaning
33:49our teacher is talking about a
33:50different kind of vacation concept. Of
33:52course, of course. When we say "let's
33:53take our brains on vacation," it’s a
33:55distinction like going to a five-star
33:57hotel or a boutique hotel in Göcek. I
33:58think that’s not bad either.
34:00Sometimes I crave the other side, you
34:02know, all-inclusive and such. Since my
34:03life has been accompanied by intense
34:05conversations, ever since I started
34:06going to those places, I’ve preferred
34:08boutique-style as much as possible. But
34:10we shouldn't forget that this is
34:11marketing. Let’s talk about marketing
34:13. At the risk of getting beaten up.
34:15Marketing finds the places you desire
34:18and where you’ll feel good. It
34:20immediately categorizes you as a
34:22customer. That’s why I won’t say
34:24those who go to five-star hotels are
34:25good, or the others are something else,
34:26or the others are very intellectual,
34:27and so on. Everyone has a marketer or
34:30an ad agency, and I can't feel
34:32comfortable saying, "I am the organic
34:34consumer customer corresponding to that
34:36." I mean, I say, "Someone is
34:38definitely courting me there right now.
34:39" I might even be spending too much
34:41money. Because I’m asking for special
34:42service.
34:43Anyway, let me ask something. It’s
34:44hard to answer, but it’s possible to
34:46be mistaken in thought. Most of the
34:48time, you are mistaken in your thoughts
34:49. You even move forward by making
34:50mistakes, right? But there is no being
34:52mistaken in emotion, I suppose. Could
34:53there be?
34:53I don’t agree with that. I think
34:55there is a lot of delusion in emotions.
34:56But it feels real. Or rather, the
34:58effects it creates in you are real.
35:01But let's state something accurate now.
35:03For instance, let's exaggerate this a
35:04bit so everyone understands. Take panic
35:06attacks, for example. Under normal
35:08circumstances, nothing will happen to
35:09them. They think if they cross the
35:11bridge, they will die. For example, the
35:121 million people who cross that bridge
35:14aren't a reference for them. They say,
35:16"I will be the 1,000,001 st."
35:18And they think, "I will be the one,
35:19I'll fall and make the news," and they
35:21get very emotional. They get angry,
35:23scared, panicked, feel a fear of death,
35:25and so on. We can't call these
35:26realistic now. We all have a more
35:28diluted version of this. That's why it
35:30wouldn't seem absurd to me to say that
35:32thoughts evolved because emotions are
35:34in need of such control. I mean, we
35:37could say the combination of emotion
35:39and thought is better than thought
35:40alone, and better than emotion alone.
35:43So, Professor, what should we do?
35:44Should we go on vacation? I mean,
35:45I think, especially with the holiday
35:47season approaching, for those going on
35:49vacation, let's definitely look at
35:51these, let's think about them. Because
35:53for a vacation to be a vacation, it
35:54must contain these qualities.
35:56Experiences where we develop insight or
35:59transform, but also moments where we
36:02don't shy away from just waiting or
36:05stopping. A vacation taken with the
36:07body will not replace a vacation within
36:09the mind. That's why I say let's keep
36:12talking about resting the mind.
36:15Like Csikszentmihalyi's flow, when I'm
36:17in flow, I'm actually resting. And as
36:19you said, you don't necessarily need to
36:21go somewhere for that.
36:22Ilker, shall I tell you something?
36:23Let's measure it together. Truly, most
36:25people who go on vacation might not be
36:27resting at all, in that sense. I'm not
36:29talking about physical fatigue. No
36:32place where our mind doesn't rest can
36:34be a place where our body resting makes
36:35us happy and peaceful. So, our
36:39understanding of vacation here
36:40shouldn't be nonsensical; it needs to
36:41be about a mental vacation. We've
36:44talked about a nervous system vacation.
36:45One last thing. Does social media tire
36:48the brain more? I mean, is the human of
36:50today mentally more tired than the one
36:5230 years ago? Excessive stimuli
36:54definitely tire our brains out a lot.
36:56But this excessive stimulus, for
36:57example, you like playing the drums.
36:59There is excessive stimulus there, too.
37:00I mean, the stimuli were wild there as
37:02well. If there is harmony there, then
37:04that excessive stimulus doesn't become
37:06"excessive" for you. Because it hits
37:09the right keys.
37:10A forest is also an excessive stimulus.
37:12But when we go to the forest, we don't
37:14get hammered like we do on social media
37:15. That's why I think there is a problem
37:17with imbalance there. Since you are a
37:20part of this balance, a balance you are
37:21included in, I don't think we have a
37:23problem with excessive stimuli. It can
37:26be richer, which might be good for a
37:27person. But social media is an
37:29unbalanced stimulus. We are constantly
37:31in motion. Things are constantly
37:33changing before our eyes, and these are
37:35things that are very relevant to us. We
37:37have a phone in our hand that
37:39constantly provokes, harasses, and
37:40defines us by looking at our likes and
37:42unlikes, and it feels as if we are
37:44under its surveillance. This feeling is
37:47already very exhausting.
37:48Then let's make a suggestion to our
37:49viewers. Close this video. Close
37:52YouTube. Turn off your phone and take a
37:54digital detox for a while, as is
37:55happening all over the world and in our
37:57country too—which I get invited to
37:58from time to time. Professor, we have a
38:01digital detox camp. You have shares in
38:02it, too.
38:02I did that camp in Silivri, Professor.
38:05You got it for free, of course, that's
38:08why.
38:08Jokes aside, it did me good.
38:10We have built a world where a digital
38:12detox has become a luxury. What is
38:14right or wrong is a separate
38:16conversation, but that's why one should
38:18make the most of that luxury when
38:20accessible. We should just say this
38:22video is over, close it, and go.
38:23I think it's time to say goodbye.
38:24See you.

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