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Andy Ngo - Unmasked: Inside Antifa's Radical Plan to Destroy Democracy. — Transcript

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0:00[Music]
0:17[Music]
0:20hello and welcome to
0:21so what you're saying is i'm peter
0:23whittle now before i introduce our guest
0:26this week just want to say again
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0:46much
0:47now my guest today i'm delighted to say
0:50is
0:51one of the best-known journalists now in
0:54america
0:55andy noe became famous for chronicling
0:59the progress and the rise of antifa
1:02which is a movement we hear an
1:03awful lot about but actually know very
1:06little about
1:08andy has written for the wall street
1:09journal for the
1:11spectator and the new york post and he
1:13is currently editor at large of the post
1:15millennial
1:16he's got a new book out which is in fact
1:18coming out next week
1:20which is called unmasked inside
1:24antifa's radical plan to destroy
1:27democracy um thank you very much for
1:30joining us
1:31it's a pleasure thank you um before we
1:33sort of talk
1:34more thoroughly about antifa
1:37uh they've actually tried to have your
1:39book banned haven't they all they've
1:41really caused some problems
1:42yeah in in portland where i'm based out
1:46of
1:46uh the largest bookstore they're pals uh
1:48it's such it's
1:50so big that it's a tourist attraction on
1:51its own
1:53and last week there were
1:56days and days of protests it calls to a
1:59bookstore to shut down onto those days
2:02in addition to the people who surrounded
2:04the business there was
2:05the online component of it and
2:08immediately the bookstore caved and said
2:11that the
2:13unmasked would not be sold on its
2:14shelves
2:16but it could still be available it's
2:18still available online and that wasn't
2:20good enough to the
2:21protesters um but it's sort of
2:24i mean you've become it's right to say
2:27that for auntie for you are
2:29probably number one hate figure are you
2:30not yes
2:32no and that is an extraordinary thing to
2:36live with isn't it
2:38yeah i think if they um
2:42well i used to think that they were just
2:46ragtag group of people street hooligans
2:50and i was naive in 2019
2:53in my coverage of them
2:56in the summer i was beaten by them and
3:00given a brain hemorrhage they could have
3:02killed me that day
3:03and ever since then they've been really
3:05trying to
3:06finish the job that they started before
3:09just
3:10relentless intimidation criminal
3:13harassment
3:14showing up at my home releasing
3:17where i can be found in real time um and
3:20that's part of the reason that um i've
3:23left portland it's just all these
3:26instances are reported to
3:28the local authorities and nothing's done
3:30even when names of suspects are provided
3:33nothing's done and this is just the
3:36breakdown of the rule of law that's been
3:38happening in
3:39many major american cities it's not just
3:41portland
3:43i think portland's an example i
3:45understand best just because we've had
3:48so many right arrests throughout 2020
3:52and over 90 percent of them get their
3:55charges dropped
3:56and they get released immediately from
3:58jail they don't have to pay bail if they
4:00do have to pay bail there are these
4:02sources of funding that will pay for
4:04them and
4:05will provide legal aid as well so
4:09um unfortunately our elected officials
4:12have failed
4:13in not viewing and not recognizing this
4:16violent extremist movement as the threat
4:18that they are
4:19and now they've been able to build up a
4:22system
4:22and apparatus networks to
4:26sustain and maintain and embed
4:30the political violence yes
4:34i should explain that you grew up in
4:37portland didn't you this is your
4:38hometown
4:39yes right we've seen images obviously
4:42over the
4:43past year of what's been going on there
4:45and indeed
4:46you know obviously after the uh george
4:49george
4:49george floyd uh death uh obviously it's
4:52spread all over america but
4:54in in portland in particular um
4:58can you just paint a picture of how the
5:00city has changed from the one
5:03that you grew up in sure
5:06so well let me just start with something
5:09that happened recently so
5:11on the 6th of january the international
5:14community
5:16recoiled in horror at the riot that
5:18happened in capitol
5:19hill when rioters had sieged a capital
5:23building for a couple
5:24hours all that was done that day
5:28and worst was done every night
5:31in portland in the targeting of
5:35local businesses citizens um
5:38county and city property as well as as
5:41federal property
5:43so um the people now who are calling
5:47what happened on the 6th of january the
5:48darkest day in america i just i wonder
5:50why they were
5:52silent when my city was under siege last
5:55year
5:56when blm and antifa actually
5:59sieged territory in seattle washington
6:02for more than three weeks
6:03and that zone that they claimed zone of
6:06terror
6:07led to several homicides and shootings
6:11the change in portland i would say is
6:13just that
6:16poland has always for decades now has
6:18been a left-wing political monoculture
6:21and it's um people they're really proud
6:23of that tradition of being
6:26hard left and very progressive and weird
6:29for the
6:30sake of being weird and different i
6:32think
6:33since 2016 what's changed though is that
6:38the fringe far left in portland which
6:41has
6:41existed for decades was able to
6:45go into the mainstream and operate
6:48violently in the open with the tacit
6:53support of those on city council as well
6:55as the mayor
6:56and the local media and the
6:59pre-tax that they use for their violent
7:02extremism
7:04at that time was because of the election
7:05of donald trump
7:07but we have a new administration now for
7:09fast forward four years and
7:11they're still writing yes because i've
7:13seen images you know
7:15the past over the past week of them
7:17smashing up places in fact
7:19interestingly smashing up democrat local
7:23headquarters correct that was in
7:25portland on
7:26inauguration day so
7:30the irony is that thousands and
7:32thousands
7:33of national guard troops poured into the
7:37nation's capital
7:38because there was this fear that trump
7:40supporters would
7:42try to interrupt the transfer peaceful
7:44transfer of power
7:46that violence didn't materialize there
7:48but the violence that did happen
7:50which was pre-announced and shared
7:53publicly on twitter for weeks now happen
7:56in
7:57seattle in portland and denver and in
8:00portland
8:00the about 150 masked
8:03black bloc militants march
8:07unimpeded to the headquarters of the
8:10democrat party of oregon and destroyed
8:12it one by one just smashing every window
8:16law enforcement arrested only eight
8:18people in that rampage and
8:20the weapons that they confiscated were
8:22knives
8:23hammers crowbars homemade fire bombs
8:28etc but as shocking as that
8:31may sound that is normal for portland
8:34now we had that go on for
8:37more than 120 days in 2020 and it's
8:39going to continue
8:41because it was never really about trump
8:43it was about
8:44opposition to violent opposition to
8:48america itself and
8:50what it stands for well that's just a
8:52that's that's the
8:53the number of it really isn't it what
8:55you know because people say
8:56we hear it now as i said in the
8:58beginning antifa
8:59we know this name how would you
9:03characterize
9:04what do they want what are they trying
9:06to do what it
9:07you know what is the basis of their
9:09movement
9:10so i'm glad use the word movement rather
9:12than organization because
9:14when organization is used in singular it
9:17makes it sound like it's a single entity
9:19when it's not
9:20so it is an ideology also
9:24movement and organizations um that
9:27are connected to one another networks
9:29and so
9:31broadly it's a coalition of anarchists
9:33and communists
9:34who are revolutionary and believe in the
9:37overthrow
9:38of not just the u.s governments but all
9:41governments through the use of violence
9:43and they believe that they can or they
9:44can create a new world
9:46a new utopia and actually at the
9:48inauguration day portland riot
9:51one of the banners that they held would
9:52say um
9:54something like create a new world from
9:55the ashes so
9:58they really believe that nothing can be
10:00reformed about
10:03america or any liberal democracy in
10:05particular
10:08and that society should be organized by
10:12into communist communes free of
10:15government
10:16and that sounds
10:19may sound just entirely theoretical but
10:21they actually have
10:23put that belief into practice when they
10:26have claimed territories that they claim
10:29were
10:30sovereign from american jurisdiction
10:33such as in seattle and
10:34the capitol hill autonomous zone
10:36otherwise known as charts
10:39in portland in december they claimed
10:40territory for nearly a week in a
10:42residential area
10:44and both times what happens as
10:47whenever you have violent far-left
10:50coups essentially is it devolves into
10:55violence terrorism um
10:58the either
11:02so in charge for example they actually
11:05had and i write about this in the book
11:07because i spent a week there undercover
11:09so even though they said they didn't
11:12have that they were
11:13didn't have a government naturally they
11:16did have leaders rise up
11:17and fulfill sort of government rules
11:20and they were totalitarian they had in
11:23the mexican restaurant that was
11:25um in the center of the chas
11:28they set up this operations base that
11:30was a tent
11:32there was also an interrogation area so
11:35there's an
11:35independent journalist i knew who was
11:37also undercover and he
11:39got busted when he was trying to record
11:41some of them secretly
11:43and they tried dragging him into this
11:45tent to interrogate him and to
11:47look at his video footage so
11:50you can just imagine if they were given
11:53if they have more opportunity for power
11:55what they do
11:56um but you don't have to just imagine
11:58you can just look
11:59historically wherever communist regimes
12:03come into power they put
12:05they kill the opposition and the ones
12:08who aren't killed are put
12:09into prison camps so
12:14to see this movement
12:17of people not just in america but also
12:20in western europe and britain
12:23just excuse the accesses of
12:29the far left historically but to
12:31actually really rebel
12:32in that violence
12:36i i'm shocked that more people aren't
12:39disturbed and recognizing them for the
12:41threat that they are
12:42i think don't they sort of have a kind
12:45of
12:46cover i think you you you mention this
12:49in the book that
12:50they have fair weather for not fair
12:53weather friends actually fellow
12:54travelers
12:55in various branches of what we might
12:58call our
12:59professional establishment i mean
13:01whether it's the media or
13:02maybe the law people who sympathize with
13:06them or feel that they
13:07should sympathize with them yeah so i
13:10think
13:11um what makes them particularly powerful
13:13is that people don't
13:15really recognize them as the anarchist
13:17communists that they actually are they
13:19think that
13:20antifa are merely anti-fascists who are
13:23opposing
13:24white supremacy neo-nazis in the far
13:27right
13:27they think that people who are part of
13:31black lives matter are just fighting for
13:34racial justice rather than actually
13:37agitating for
13:39revolutionary marxist politics which by
13:42the statements of those who founded blm
13:44is what they want so there's just
13:48this this basic ignorance of these
13:51really powerful political movements that
13:53have been able to
13:57gain so many liberal followers
14:00in respectable institutions and fields
14:03such as academia
14:04and entertainment and media and
14:06journalism
14:08because they they're cloaking themselves
14:10with this banner
14:12of fighting for social justice yeah
14:17and what sort of started you on this
14:22on this particular trail with
14:25antifa i mean you you have you know
14:28become a very
14:30very well-known name i know it's got a
14:33big downside for you obviously as you
14:36told us at the beginning but
14:37essentially it is you know you've been
14:40going to these demonstrations you have
14:41been going to these
14:42very stre you know street protests and
14:45obviously
14:46being in huge physical danger yourself
14:48and indeed what as you said wasn't
14:50attacked but
14:52how did you get there and why did you
14:55decide to do that sort of reporting what
14:59what motivated you so
15:02back in 2016 i was just a student
15:04journalist when i was
15:06doing my graduate studies at portland
15:08state university
15:09and one of my instincts at that time
15:13as a nascent student journalist is that
15:15i should be pursuing stories that
15:19people aren't being told
15:22and one of them was that there was far
15:25left extremism in portland that was
15:27being
15:28presented in the media by my colleagues
15:32by my peers as merely people fighting
15:35for justice
15:38and so what was particularly eye-opening
15:41in november 2016 was seeing the reaction
15:45in my city and across america to the
15:49electoral win of donald trump and the
15:51response
15:53from the public at that time in portland
15:56was to write
15:57and that was the first time while on
15:59assignment that i saw
16:01organized marauding groups of people in
16:04black uniforms and mass carrying weapons
16:07and destroying property businesses and
16:10starting fires in the streets
16:12and that happened for three days um that
16:14was a very shocking 72 hours of course
16:17looking back on that now we had that
16:19times much much more in 2020
16:22but the response the collective response
16:25from the public at the time was that
16:26that anger was righteous
16:28because this was people fighting against
16:31the um the electoral win of
16:36an incoming fascist regime and
16:40um i knew and talked to a lot of
16:44trump supporters and just this cartoony
16:47caricature that was being presented
16:49in progressive cities in progressive
16:52media of
16:54trump's base was not the reality that i
16:57was seeing
16:58so unfortunately what continued happened
17:03then was
17:04just the political violence in the
17:06streets of
17:07portland and other cities northern
17:09california berkeley
17:11san francisco seattle new york
17:13philadelphia
17:14pittsburgh minneapolis um
17:20it just started to become routine and
17:23every time it was
17:24just driven by this rage from the far
17:26left
17:27and that most of these protests turn
17:29right so
17:30this antifa organized antifa element and
17:33i just wanted to
17:34find out more about who are the people
17:38behind the maps
17:39because for um
17:42unsurprisingly the journalists who are
17:44normally so curious about these things
17:46weren't really interested in finding out
17:48who these people were
17:50and what are their political views and
17:52the more i dived into it the more
17:54i was
17:57really shaken to the core that there
17:59could be
18:01such a extremist fringe
18:04movement operating openly in the
18:05mainstream with
18:07no opposition no opposition from big
18:10tech in that
18:10they could actually create crowdfunds on
18:14gofundme venmo cash app they have
18:17accounts on twitter
18:18on facebook so a lot of their organizing
18:21wasn't even clandestine it was out in
18:23the open
18:25but also i wanted to dig deep into the
18:27ideology because
18:28in talking to some of them before i
18:30became a target for violence
18:33it was clear that they had a certain
18:35coherent ideology that wasn't just
18:38anti-fascist opposing the far right
18:42they were talking about burning down
18:44system creating a new world
18:46cap linking capitalism property rights
18:50with white supremacy fascism racism
18:53talking about how america can not be
18:55reformed in any way that it must be
18:57destroyed
18:58and so that's what caused me to dig
19:01deeper and deeper
19:02and unfortunately i've been
19:06i've been warning about antifa for
19:09several years now
19:10to local officials in portland and my
19:12warnings weren't heated and
19:14um portlanders suffer and continue to
19:17suffer because of the inaction
19:20of those who are meant to protect the
19:23public
19:24in portland and seattle and other cities
19:28you've obviously now written their book
19:30and
19:31i i imagine that basically the pressure
19:34from them
19:36will probably just get worse
19:39won't it but um i wonder
19:42could you paint a sort of picture of the
19:44kind of people i mean there are
19:46a couple of description one in your book
19:49something you say in your book and also
19:52something else i've come across i
19:53i just wanted to read these if i can
19:56it's i'm just
19:57trying to get a picture of the kind of
19:58people i think we know who they are
20:00but i mean just for the audience you
20:03know
20:05antivirus have been called the revolt of
20:07the over-privileged
20:09right i mean i think that's fantastic
20:12but you've also
20:13said in in your book that in fact
20:16basically the hatred that antifa
20:20feel towards their society and fellow
20:23citizens
20:24comes from pain and resentment of their
20:26own lives
20:28which i think is a very interesting
20:30observation can you expand on those
20:34two statements um
20:37there are broadly i would say two
20:40types of people that get drawn into
20:42militant antifa activism
20:45one is as i quote about these
20:48people who represent who are from
20:52an educated middle class background many
20:54of them are white collar jobs and
20:56actually when i chronicle the arrests in
20:59portland because there's been so many i
21:01look into what kind of work are these
21:02people doing and shockingly many of them
21:04are
21:05work as professors as teachers people
21:08who work
21:09in the medical field people who are
21:12training to be doctors
21:13and they're attorneys they're lawyers
21:17and so many of them come from
21:20you know having master's degrees having
21:22phds
21:24and having a unit the privilege of the
21:26university back
21:27education background these are the
21:29people who
21:30have been who are heavily influenced by
21:35the ideology and theories that are
21:39quite intellectual by antifa actually
21:41and
21:42um you know they they cite in
21:45inspired by a lot of uh radical
21:48left-wing
21:49um communist and anarchist thinkers of
21:51the 20th
21:53and 19th centuries um
21:57but then there's another type of antifa
22:00and
22:00in the quote you mentioned from the book
22:03you know it's
22:04i didn't want to create the same fallacy
22:06uh or mistake
22:08rather of creating a caricature
22:11of these people that i have been vocal
22:13and opposing
22:14um and being on the ground and
22:18covering that near being very close to
22:20them now for many years
22:22and many times undercover you see a
22:25human side of them
22:27and
22:30many of the antifa who are carrying out
22:34some of these street criminal activities
22:36that activities that will lead
22:39most likely to to them being arrested
22:42and charged these are often
22:45people who are many of them are vagrants
22:50they're dealing with mental health
22:52issues and that
22:54recently have just transitioned from
22:57one gender to another and to another one
23:03unemployed so
23:09i have like this is a certain
23:13like i guess sympathy and pity for them
23:15that
23:16people who are vulnerable and need
23:19protection have instead been
23:21pulled until this extremist cult
23:25who has really no
23:28issue with using them as sort of their
23:31henchmen
23:31in carrying out these criminal
23:32activities and
23:35on the off chance that they get
23:38convicted and sentenced to jail
23:40it's just a drop in the bucket because
23:42there's so many of them
23:43quite often you you see these uh
23:45pictures the mug shots
23:47of people who've been charged uh they
23:49appear you know
23:50on on social media and they look like
23:53you know
23:53very disturbed people actually or or you
23:56know something
23:57usually looks like drugs i mean nine
23:59times out of ten
24:00you know but i mean people who are if
24:03you like
24:05not at peace with themselves yes
24:08so um
24:12yeah this is an aspect of my reporting
24:15that i don't get
24:16to talk about very much it's just like
24:18who
24:19who are these people really and i think
24:22they've been they've been radicalized
24:25through
24:26the literature that they're exposed to
24:28by antifa whenever you go to their
24:29rights any of their events their
24:32mutual aid events in addition to them
24:34doing
24:35quote-unquote charity work such as
24:37giving out free
24:38food and other supplies they always have
24:42a table
24:42where the literature is available and
24:44these tables are usually very popular so
24:47all these grand theories uh against
24:49capitalism
24:50against america are compressed into
24:53these pamphlets that are much more easy
24:56for the average reader
24:58to just read in a setting and get
25:00through and they introduce really
25:01radical
25:02extreme ideas uh one of them is called
25:05for example why we break windows
25:07and that gives the intellectual argument
25:10for the meaning and purposes
25:12behind shattering
25:15the windows on businesses and properties
25:19but it's these literatures that
25:22incrementally introduce them to
25:24these more and more extremist ideas and
25:26there's a whole
25:27library of them and they're available as
25:29pdfs online that can be printed out at
25:31home
25:32and easily disseminated and this was
25:36in the book some of the shocking new
25:39information that's published for the
25:40first time is
25:41the curriculum of one of the uh formal
25:45antifa groups called rose city antifa
25:47which is
25:48the antifa group in portland and they're
25:50the largest and oldest
25:52and i had documents leaked to me by
25:54somebody who tried to apply for
25:56membership in there
25:57and it is as far more of an organization
26:00as
26:01as it can get despite them claiming to
26:03not really exist as
26:04an organization so it's a vetting
26:07process
26:08um a training process a curriculum uh
26:11literature that they have to read
26:12discussion groups and they do this all
26:14secretly of course
26:16um and so you know it
26:19there are a lot of steps in between
26:23um a hot somebody who's on the hard left
26:26she's somebody who dawns
26:27the uniform and costume and takes knives
26:30and guns and explosives to rides
26:34i mean is it sort of right to to make a
26:37link between what you might call
26:39the woke and antifa
26:42i mean because there is a kind of
26:44natural progression
26:45there isn't there but but being woke is
26:49an entirely establishment thing
26:50particularly now
26:52in america it's sort of almost like the
26:53establishment uh
26:55ideology but there is a link isn't there
26:58was
26:59there's a link and that link was made
27:01more explicit in 2020 with a lot of
27:03cross-pollination between
27:05antifun blm in that blm
27:08excuse me antifa as an ideology is going
27:11back
27:12decades the original antifa group was
27:14the paramilitary of the german communist
27:16party and in two years of germany
27:19at that time they didn't have these
27:20these theories about intersectionality
27:23and um and trends
27:27and being people of color being above
27:30these other
27:31categories that are ranked in in a totem
27:33pole
27:35whereas the american manifestation of
27:37the anti-fun recent years has really
27:39incorporated a lot of these
27:41vogue theory vogue theories coming from
27:44critical race theory and and because of
27:48that it's
27:48made them more broadly appealing and
27:52allowed them to build
27:53many allies um blm is an explicit ally
27:57of the antifa
27:58to the point of where i really
27:59considered them kind of the same entity
28:02in the u.s really yeah in that anti-fur
28:06militants will provide
28:08violent act as volunteer armed security
28:11at blm
28:12events um antifa node to go to
28:15blm protests and can at a moment
28:18transform them into riots as i happen in
28:21minneapolis
28:23and other cities they know they chant
28:26the same thing
28:27so they have differences in their
28:30ultimate agendas i mean
28:32the alumni is much more of a classic
28:34revolutionary marxist whereas
28:36um antifa reject the idea of gov
28:40governments however they share enough
28:44in the mutual hatred of the us and its
28:46ideas
28:47um that for now their allies and
28:50partners
28:51i mean we have that here in in britain
28:54and europe
28:55in the sense that it runs through the
28:57culture a form of self-loathing
29:00right um this has been the
29:03terribly upsetting thing someone like me
29:05who's loved america and lived there
29:07is that america seemed to not have that
29:10so much this is something we accept
29:13about
29:13europe now it's so ingrained that it's
29:17almost like
29:17we think it's the natural order of
29:19things america didn't have it
29:21but there is this kind of red in tooth
29:23and claw
29:25self-hatred isn't there or hatred for
29:27the country
29:28that has come far more to the fore in
29:31america isn't it
29:33yeah and that hatred manifests itself
29:36in not just virtual but
29:39violence i think the intentional
29:43targeting for example
29:45of the federal courthouse in portland
29:47last year for
29:48weeks on end where writers were
29:50returning every night with
29:52power tools to try to cut into the
29:53building they brought explosives with
29:55them
29:56they had they divided into essentially
29:59into different
30:00units like an army in one unit was
30:03tasked with bringing these lasers that
30:05would blind
30:06and injure the eyes of the federal
30:08officers protecting the courthouse
30:10they also then after that went on to try
30:13to burn down
30:14police stations attack other courthouses
30:18like all this is meant to
30:23i mean it's a literal attack on
30:26institutions that represent
30:28buildings that represent the rule of law
30:31which is what they reject and so
30:34when they are calling for things like
30:37abolishing
30:38police abolishing the criminal justice
30:41system
30:43they really mean that they don't their
30:46entire
30:47they advocate for justice but their
30:49understanding of justice is
30:50entirely different and this has been
30:54this is i guess what makes them so
30:57brilliant is that they
30:58remake not just like change the meaning
31:01of words but really remake them from the
31:03ground
31:04up and introduce really radical
31:06ideologies into the mainstream
31:08so for example
31:11this how they define violence they don't
31:14actually consider what they're doing
31:16violence they consider it self-defense
31:19and how they consider
31:20and understand self-defense is not a
31:23risk
31:24a response to somebody actually actively
31:26assaulting you for example
31:28it's that somebody or the state has the
31:31wrong opinion
31:32and that opinion is an attack on you
31:34therefore
31:36you can you're defending yourself by
31:38attacking them
31:39um they mainstream the idea that
31:43uh people over property which
31:46sounds like a benign noble thing to say
31:49but what it means is then it provides
31:51the
31:52uh legitimate legitimization
31:55of things like looting and destroying
31:57businesses
31:59um that this is all a form of
32:01reparations
32:02so yeah
32:05there's been a sort of you know as i
32:08think you alluded to earlier a kind of
32:09denial
32:10i mean not just help from people
32:14but when it comes to politics i think
32:16famously
32:17one congressman said there's no such
32:20thing
32:20uh antifa is just an idea isn't it this
32:24is
32:24kind of soft soaping of the whole
32:28thing i just wonder andy where do you
32:30see it going because people say
32:32people looking now from a position of
32:34not really knowing that much about them
32:36say oh we've got president biden now
32:38and such and such these people
32:40presumably
32:42operate entirely in a different kind of
32:44plane um
32:45and biden is just as much an enemy
32:48surely as trump would be
32:50because they're right they want to pull
32:52the whole thing down
32:54correct um one of the banners that was
32:56held
32:57the very large banner at the
33:00portland riot on inauguration day
33:04said um f biden
33:08right it's excuse sorry it said um we
33:11don't want biden we want revenge
33:13in a large banner and there was a
33:15drawing of a clash and a cut of rifle
33:18on it so i mean they're broadcasting
33:21very
33:22clearly the violent extremism
33:26but the coverage from the media the
33:28headlines would be
33:30protesters stage uh nc biden pro
33:34protests yeah yeah and i was reading the
33:37responses
33:39from people who were just reading the
33:41headlines and they just automatically
33:42assumed that these were trump supporters
33:44who were
33:45trying to riot against biden so
33:50antifa been so powerful because they
33:51have so many
33:54not just allies and sympathizers
33:58in the in in journalism and
34:01that's at best and that worse they
34:03actually will have antiphon members who
34:06are who work in mainstream journalism
34:08and i write about that in the book and i
34:09name names as well you do yeah there's
34:12quite a lot of new
34:13material isn't there in your book yes
34:15about it which is fascinating
34:18do you think as well only the
34:21the haters they have for you
34:24isn't just because you try to you know
34:27investigate them and expose them
34:29but also because you are the son of
34:33immigrants to america you're a gay man
34:37doesn't that mean therefore that somehow
34:39rather
34:40you should be automatically in their
34:42universe on their side
34:45i know they are very frustrated that
34:47they haven't been able to
34:49take me down in the same ways that they
34:54have done to other people for example
34:56spurious accusations
34:57of being a white racist or white
34:59supremacist
35:01don't really stick on me but they i mean
35:05they still try they would throw anything
35:07and everything and hoping that something
35:09sticks
35:09and because they have lots of allies in
35:12journalism
35:13i've come to realize actually there's
35:15this
35:17this system that gets established where
35:21extremely biased journalists
35:24will write hit pieces some of them
35:27are masters reports and some of them are
35:30just pure
35:30opinion columns that get published
35:33and then these are then cited
35:36to represent my character in the
35:38wikipedia and then when you google me
35:40what you see is the wikipedia and these
35:42hit pieces
35:43so
35:46fortunately i've been able to rise all
35:48that i still work and write
35:49and contribute to mainstream
35:51publications but there's been so many
35:52people that i've seen
35:56cancelled and how their lives destroyed
35:58based on
35:59on these how these lies get repeated
36:03so i'm motivated to do what i do in part
36:06because
36:06i feel like i'm providing some voice
36:10for other people who don't have the
36:12privilege of a large platform
36:15and um i
36:20yeah i was very touched by something
36:23that you actually wrote in your book
36:24actually
36:25which i think says a lot about you and
36:28your voice i want to
36:29read it out again it says as much as
36:32this book is about
36:33antifa it's also a letter of gratitude
36:37to the nation that welcome my parents
36:39penniless refugees
36:41from the socialist republic of vietnam
36:44to become
36:44equal citizens um
36:49that shows to me you know the kind of
36:52man
36:52that you are i mean that is you know
36:54basically
36:56you love the country that your parents
36:59essentially
37:00adopted you know and came to um and yet
37:03the people who
37:04are fighting against you or fighting
37:06against us i would say
37:08um are people who just hate it almost
37:12out of a kind of resentment
37:16and a kind of possible as you say over
37:18privilege or
37:19overindulgence whatever it might be um
37:22and i think
37:23you know i wonder when you look at a
37:25statement like that i should think well
37:28how do you feel about the future going
37:30forward do you
37:32do you fear for america going forward do
37:35you fear for the america that your
37:36parents presumably are very proud of
37:40i do fear for it um i have always been
37:44a very strong defender of law
37:47enforcement
37:48and but
37:51like seeing how
37:54over and over when i'm reporting death
37:56threats to police
37:58in even the sbi and nothing getting done
38:01it's really
38:02on a personal level kind of rattled this
38:04um
38:06confidence that i had in that but still
38:09um i think the rule of law in america
38:15um still
38:18it's still there it's heavily being
38:20challenged right now
38:21um i think because ideas that undergird
38:23it are being fundamentally
38:26um damaged um
38:29uh with that quote thank you for reading
38:31that from the book yes i
38:32the the thing the trait or quality that
38:35i
38:36see missing from all these antifa
38:39extremists is that they don't have
38:40gratitude
38:42it's always they are driven by grievance
38:46that manifests
38:47into violent hatred um
38:51and you know if
38:55my fate could have been
38:58if the u.s didn't take in my parents as
39:01uh political refugees after they taught
39:03their time in um prison camps after the
39:07the fall of vietnam south vietnam
39:10um you know i could have been brought up
39:13in a society
39:14where i didn't have the rights that i
39:16currently have
39:17now by merely by
39:20luck of where i was happening to be born
39:23in the passport that i hold
39:25so it's
39:28with all these attacks on the us that
39:30have come and have been intensified
39:32in attacks not just like on the us but
39:35like
39:36very fundamental
39:39um ideas to liberal democracy yes
39:43i it's it's like a personal attack to me
39:46like this is
39:47the this is the society that took in
39:50not just my family but hundreds of
39:53thousands
39:54of millions of refugees who have fled
39:59um communist revolutions and have
40:02prospered and found not just acts not
40:05have access to new
40:07new um rights where they settled but
40:11their ability for them and their
40:13children to pass prosper
40:15and to get an education and go to
40:18university
40:20and so um
40:23i'm warning about the threat of antifa
40:27because america
40:30as an idea as a nation state
40:34should be defended and should be
40:35preserved and the vision
40:38the so-called utopia that antifa
40:41are fighting for i've seen with my own
40:44eyes leads to death destruction and
40:47violence
40:49indeed but very profound
40:53observation uh there andy i mean i think
40:57um it's extraordinary what you do is
40:59extraordinarily brave
41:00actually i just wonder it was one thing
41:03uh when you were physically attached in
41:062019
41:08and you were actually covering another
41:10street protest if
41:11if i'm right and anti-five people
41:14attacked you
41:15um you know they
41:18it was a serious attack wasn't it you
41:20were hospitalized you
41:22had a brain hemorrhage yes did you at
41:25one moment think
41:27this is crazy that's it for me
41:30i'm not doing this anymore
41:34yes and actually many mentors in
41:37journalist mentors who uh i highly
41:39respect and
41:40speak to just told me like andy
41:44you've been covering them for a while
41:48what's the point of going forward you're
41:49putting yourself at risk you're putting
41:51people around you at risk it's
41:56politicians officials in your city
41:58aren't listening to you
42:00so there's so many other things that you
42:02can write about
42:04um but then i just and so that was the
42:07thought i entertained but then i just
42:09thought about
42:09like all the other people who
42:12before me in that day who were beating
42:14during that riot
42:16and attacked and had no voice or
42:18platform
42:19to voice what happened to them and that
42:22many people
42:23since who have been attacked assaulted
42:26i just like it you know i had to
42:30remove myself from this and that
42:34it's not just me that i'm fighting for
42:36i'm fighting for
42:38all these other people who have not had
42:39justice
42:41um i'm fighting for the american public
42:44for them to have access to facts about
42:47what is actually happening in major
42:49american cities
42:51so that's why i keep going
42:55well and also dousing as well because
42:57people say oh you can write about other
42:58things you
42:59think well you've got to write about the
43:00most important thing haven't you
43:02yes you know well look i'm glad you have
43:05and the book is out actually on which
43:08you can see the cover again here the
43:10book is out
43:11uh this tuesday february the 2nd now we
43:14will put a link actually on under the
43:16video andy but presumably it's obviously
43:18on amazon
43:19um you know as he used to say as well
43:21awkward bookshops but bookshops are
43:23closed
43:24um but uh so they can order it from that
43:27um i really hope it does well deserves
43:30to uh
43:31and thank you very much for you know
43:34sharing your time with us today and um
43:37we'll stay safe
43:38all right thank you for having me on
43:39it's a pleasure uh
43:41that's it for so what you're saying is
43:43this week we shall see you
43:44next time and as i say please don't uh
43:47don't forget to subscribe will you thank
43:49you
43:52bye
43:56[Music]
44:01you

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