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AI Agent Boom Has a Problem Nobody Is Talking About🔥@ConcordiumNet CEO Interview — Transcript

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0:00Let's get into AI today because agents
0:02are going to be making a lot of PLA
0:04payments out there and one of the things
0:05that could happen for Ethereum and other
0:08blockchains is how these developments
0:10will start to move into the market. Uh
0:13we're going to jump into it today with
0:14Boris who is the CEO of Concordium and
0:17really kind of just dive into what is
0:19happening in this space right now.
0:21Boris, how are you?
0:23>> I'm good man. Thank you very much for
0:25having me on. So, we're going to learn
0:27learn a little bit about Concordium, but
0:28I want to kind of get into the bigger
0:30picture right now. And part of that is
0:33just the AI cycle that we are entering.
0:36If you look at the advancement we've
0:38seen, the fact that we've got all the
0:40chains essentially racing to try to get
0:43their upgrades in, and you also have
0:46Meta and Sierra both building a standard
0:48for how agents are going to interact
0:50with businesses. So this is a very um
0:54front of tech story right now when you
0:57consider what big tech is doing and the
1:00possibility of where blockchain is
1:02whether it's X42 what we're seeing with
1:04with Ethereum's upgrades what we'll see
1:06most likely with Salana. Can you give me
1:09a frame of how fast is this going to
1:11come and how important are these
1:13protocols right now when it comes to
1:16getting this done for agents?
1:19>> [sighs]
1:19>> I mean, yeah, you you kind of you kind
1:21of said it very very rightly. You know,
1:23everybody is trying to kind of get on
1:25that train rather quickly and and and
1:27rightly so. Uh because I think it's a
1:29really good use case for why blockchains
1:30exist in the first place. Um Ethereum is
1:34doing a lot and I think we're going to
1:35talk about this um you know in and
1:38around Glamsterdam. I've I've read what
1:40ex like to a certain extent of like what
1:42it does. Um you know it brings a couple
1:44of things back to the protocol. Um I
1:47think it's EIP uh 777
1:50I kind of I think 7732. Um so there are
1:54several upgrades that kind of make
1:55sense. I think when you think of um the
1:59world racing towards this and it's
2:02happening rather quickly to be honest uh
2:03quicker than I actually anticipated when
2:06we started building this stuff about one
2:07and a half two years ago. Um there is a
2:11major piece missing which is the point
2:14of like having to deal with a completely
2:15new economic actor. Um you know from the
2:19from the payment side of things I I
2:21think you you you framed it quite nicely
2:23at the beginning. You know X42 when it
2:25comes to that part because you know when
2:27it comes to a agent activity X42 plays a
2:31pretty big role and and deserves a lot
2:34of credit there uh because it's a lovely
2:36piece of engineering. Um and what is
2:39also important to understand that this
2:41standard basically has been uh there for
2:44a while, right? Um you know uh 402 has
2:48been there since payment required has
2:50been there since the '9s. Uh um you know
2:53it was however just a parking space
2:55because nobody nobody ever parked in it.
2:57[laughter]
2:58Now agents hit that payw wall and and um
3:01you know when it gets an when it gets a
3:03402 it can pay in a stable coin. um you
3:06know gets the data and moves on. So
3:09there is no sign up, no credit card form
3:12to kind of fill out, you know, please
3:13verify your email and all that kind of
3:16stuff. It it's basically if you think
3:18about it like the internet finally got a
3:20cash register,
3:21>> right?
3:22>> But here's the thing, right, about cash
3:24registers, it it doesn't ask who's
3:26paying it. It it just doesn't do it. So
3:29for a human buying a coffee
3:31>> Exactly. you know, when it comes to a
3:33human just buying a coffee, you know,
3:34you walk rock up to Starbucks or
3:36whatever coffee you fancy. Um, that's
3:38fine. Nobody needs a background check on
3:40that, right? For that ordering of a
3:41cappuccino or a flat white. Now, for
3:43agents, it's a completely different
3:45story because agents don't buy one
3:47coffee, right? They buy a million
3:50coffees at 3:00 in the morning on behalf
3:52of someone nobody can identify. Mhm.
3:55>> And that really is where when you kind
3:58of you know make the distinction of like
3:59what to look at um there are several
4:02points that kind of kind of underpin it
4:05all and where a lot of the projects out
4:07there trying to kind of solve it in
4:09their own way and I think there is an
4:11overarching questions that need that
4:13needs to be asked in and around the core
4:15idea of blockchain's existence in and
4:18around anonymity and the
4:20differentiations to privacy but we can
4:23maybe get into that later So I think
4:25first and foremost uh um it's completely
4:28free to create an agent right there are
4:30there are loads of platforms you know if
4:33I can spin up an agent uh I can spin up
4:3510,000 agents before lunch if I if I'm
4:38keen right so a ban from also regulatory
4:41perspective and also from a merchants
4:43perspective means nothing right because
4:45you can block one and subsequently uh 10
4:48more show up just wearing a different
4:50hat
4:51>> so it's a whack-a- mole problem if you
4:53want to look at it that way except you
4:55know the moles are generated by a
4:57script. So the second problem that needs
5:01to be tackled uh um which you know a few
5:04try uh um is that nobody knows who to
5:09hold accountable if something goes wrong
5:12right if an a if an agent scams you or
5:15hammers your API or or I don't know uh
5:18uh moves money um for something dodgy
5:22who do you call right right now it's
5:25just an alpha numerical string so on
5:27most of the chains it's just alpha
5:28numerical string. So, but the wallet
5:30doesn't have a phone, right? So, that's
5:32a problem that needs to be solved. And
5:34the third part in in my opinion, which
5:37is I think the the big one uh um
5:41specifically with what's going on in the
5:42US are the regulators, right? The
5:44regulators are not and it's not just in
5:46America, it's also here in in in Europe.
5:48They don't they don't go away, right? So
5:51AML, sanctions, KYC, like those rules
5:55don't switch off because the customer is
5:58a software. So a bank basically can't
6:01say, well, it was a bot to a supervisor,
6:04nor will the regulator buy it. So and
6:07why payments get standardized first,
6:10which is also the important why there is
6:12excitement around it, is because
6:14payments are an engineering problem,
6:16right?
6:17>> Identity is a trust problem. when you
6:19deal with that type of actor, it's a
6:21legal problem. It's a who takes the
6:24liability if something goes wrong
6:25problem. And engineers, uh, which we
6:29have great ones in this world,
6:30specifically in our web 3 world, they
6:32very much love the first kind. Um, but
6:35everybody everybody avoids the second
6:37kind and that's the gap specifically
6:40that we close at Concordia.
6:42>> Well, you you've addressed a few things
6:43there, identity, uh, authority, and also
6:46accountability. I think to a certain
6:48extent this is going to be a question
6:49that everybody's going to be asking and
6:51when you get into payments I agree you
6:53have AI agents bringing shoppers now
6:55merchants are going to essentially have
6:57to close the sale to your point they're
6:59going to have to understand how to
7:01connect the dots here so with all that
7:03happening you've got Visa's agentic
7:05commerce lead saying that the industry
7:07>> hasn't figured out the agent identity
7:10yet kind of shows that there in this
7:12article is that merchants are still kind
7:14of having to do this when you guys are
7:16going into it. Um,
7:19this is something that I think first of
7:20all, how how is the tech work with
7:22Concordium? When you plug this in to an
7:26Aentic commerce engine, what is the
7:28primary thing that it's trying to do?
7:31>> Well, the first thing to understand is
7:32that identity is enshrined into the
7:34protocol layer. So, it's it's been there
7:36since Genesis. Um, and I've been saying
7:39this line quite a lot lately because due
7:41to what's going on in the world, we are
7:42getting some eyeballs on us right now.
7:44But for the first, you know, uh, uh, if
7:47you, if you wanted to talk about
7:49identity in 2020 and 2021 and 2022, it
7:53was a very fast way of standing alone at
7:56the bar during a conference because
7:57nobody wanted to have a chat, right?
7:59[laughter]
8:00>> Nobody wanted to.
8:01>> Um, and we basically built a solution
8:04for a problem that just, you know, uh,
8:07um, it was just too early. Um, but we
8:10kind of knew that eventually we would go
8:12there. So um you know to your question u
8:16um there is there is great things that
8:18for example Ethereum because he because
8:20he mentioned Amsterdam right um Ethereum
8:23is doing quite a lot on that front as
8:24well um and and I really want to be fair
8:27on that front you know u um ERC 804 is a
8:31genuinely good step right I'm I'm really
8:33glad the Ethereum ecosystem is taking
8:35agent identity seriously now it gives
8:38agent agents a onchain identity
8:42in the form of you being able to have a
8:45registry and a way to attach a
8:47reputation
8:48and validation to um the agent itself.
8:53Now, that's real infrastructure. Um but
8:56here's the gap and and what I've been
8:59using quite a lot is um a a analogy in
9:03and around a conference because I you
9:05know token 2049 uh um that's just is on
9:09um so ultimately ERC 80004 is a name tag
9:14right so it's a very nice temper proof
9:17name tag now the problem is you wrote
9:20your own name on it you know it
9:22basically says hello my name is
9:24Stephanie
9:25definitely legitimate bank
9:26representative. Now the tag is now the
9:30tag is permanent, right? It's on chain.
9:33It's beautiful and it tells you
9:34absolutely nothing about whether that's
9:37true.
9:39>> Now what we do at Concordium is we
9:42anchor the agent to a verified identity.
9:46The way that it works is that you
9:47basically just go to the uh if you want
9:49to be part if if you are going to be
9:51part of the ecosystem you basically go
9:53through a verification process once and
9:56from that point onwards uh can verify in
9:59a privacy preserving way using zero
10:01knowledge proofs. You maybe have seen
10:02what Hierers said from the SEC just a
10:05couple of like like a week ago that zero
10:07knowledge proof u um KYC and AML does
10:11make sense if implemented correctly and
10:13it also is the best from both worlds,
10:15right? because I said this initially,
10:16there is a mass massive difference
10:18between anonymity and privacy. Um, I
10:21would like to be able to prove that I'm
10:23over 18 without somebody knowing exactly
10:26what my birth date is and exactly where
10:28I live. That's is extra information that
10:30they don't need to know. And then
10:31suddenly on my birthday, even though I
10:33just pro had to prove that I'm over 18,
10:36I'm getting, hey, happy birthday. Here
10:37is 10% off in my email inbox, right?
10:40Surprisingly.
10:42So, I would like to stay private. So it
10:45at at the end of the day what we do at
10:48Concordium to kind of anchor it back to
10:50uh what I said is that we attach it to
10:53the verified identity that is yours and
10:56should only be yours. So our standard is
10:58called CIS 804 and the agent registry uh
11:03build on it works basically like this. I
11:05mean there is not much more to say.
11:07Behind every agent and every registered
11:11agent sits an entity in the form of a
11:13person or a company you know that has
11:16been verified once at the protocol level
11:18>> and the agent carries that zero
11:20knowledge proof
11:22forward with any interaction that it
11:24does. So a counterparty can check in
11:27very very simple terms this agent is
11:30backed by a verified party in this
11:32jurisdiction is not on a sanction list
11:35is old enough whatever the rules require
11:38right without learning of who the party
11:40actually is. So what you basically get
11:42on Concordium is you get privacy by
11:44default and accountability when it's
11:47legally required.
11:49>> Okay.
11:50>> And that coordination.
11:51>> Yeah. you're you're getting at something
11:52I think that our audience is very keen
11:54on and that is um the idea of privacy.
11:57So as we're getting into an agentic
11:59world this and we're already seeing this
12:01even with what Meta has been doing with
12:04Muse. Uh there's a lot of triggers
12:06within Muse that you can kind of turn on
12:08and off in terms of how much data is
12:10being shared, what's not being shared,
12:12mainly to try to keep it in control. If
12:14you have an agent out there that did
12:16does get authentic uh authenticated
12:19and does have that privacy connection
12:22whether it's through you know 804 or x42
12:25whatever protocols are going to be used
12:28how is the user the person who deployed
12:31that agent or agents how are they
12:34protected is this just creating another
12:37honeypot for potential an attack vector
12:41down the road for you know personal
12:42information or privacy uh down the road
12:46or not.
12:47>> No, because like we already in this
12:48horrible situation right now like to
12:51your listeners and anybody else like I I
12:53am that that's the reason why I'm I'm
12:55I'm I'm I'm I'm building Concordium,
12:58right? Is the fact that every single
13:00digital interaction basically now
13:02carries a copy of my of my passport or
13:05my driver's license, right?
13:06>> Those are databases that are and you
13:09just have to ask yourself, right? How
13:10often have you done this? Every single
13:12time you buy something online and you
13:13need to verify something, you need to
13:15send them a copy of your passport. And
13:17please, in good lighting, it's like it's
13:20just basically a PR release. Sorry.
13:22[cough and clears throat]
13:23It's just basically a PR disaster
13:25waiting to happen. And we see this more
13:26and more. Those databases are getting
13:28hacked. And also with AI, it's getting
13:30easier to hack things.
13:32>> So ultimately, my my core ethos is, and
13:36you know, there is there is there is the
13:38other side of the coin as well. And I
13:39really want to say this, you know, I've
13:40been in this industry now for 10 years
13:42and I got into this industry because of
13:44also that core belief. So I'm I'm I'm an
13:46absolute cipher punk at the core. But
13:49the matter of the fact is the people
13:51that are also screaming quite loud about
13:52this and are like, you know, riding the
13:54wave of Zcash and Monero and whatever,
13:56they still have a verified, you know,
13:58they go and buy the stuff wherever.
14:00Well, they're switching it off anyway on
14:01the exchanges because of the regulation,
14:03but ultimately it comes down to the fact
14:04that they felt very very comfortable in
14:06order to on board on Coinbase or on
14:08board on Kraken or on board on Binance,
14:10right? And it's the same issue. You have
14:12to go through that verification cycle
14:14and and and and that doesn't change,
14:16right? The world that I would like to
14:18live in is that I have the ability to
14:20only having to verify myself once,
14:22>> one time
14:23>> and from that point onwards interact in
14:25a complete privacy preserved way while
14:27staying compliant. Because to my point
14:29that I made earlier, the regulators are
14:31not going to go away. They're not going
14:32to go like, "Oh yeah, this is cool tech.
14:34Let's, you know, screw AML and KYC
14:37checks. Let's just yolo into this." It's
14:39that's not going to happen. And we've
14:41been we've been pushing this uh as an
14:43industry as a whole and didn't really
14:46focus on the core thing that I think was
14:48missing which is build cool tooling
14:51because otherwise you know
14:53I wouldn't say that our industry has
14:55been enormously successful. Just because
14:58just because the market cap is around 3
15:00trillion doesn't mean that we've been
15:01successful. If you ask your neighbor
15:03today um to what extent are you using
15:05blockchain technologies first and
15:07foremost you shouldn't have to explain
15:08it. That's the first problem that you
15:10have because blockchains the technology
15:12should be used rather than understood.
15:13But everybody now needs to sit there and
15:15needs to understand what a pneumonic
15:16seed phrase is. And if I lose those 24
15:19random words, my money is gone. Well,
15:21I'm not going to touch it, right?
15:22Meanwhile, I can just rock up to a place
15:25and click my button twice here, right?
15:28And then go beep and I paid for
15:30something. Ask the same people if they
15:32understand how the payment works behind
15:34the scenes. They've got no clue. Nobody
15:35does. It's all a trust question. So I I
15:39I basically take it from the privacy
15:42angle that you are also from
15:45Concordium's point of view and why we
15:47were like you know the kid with leprosy
15:48in the sand pit all by ourselves in the
15:50playground for a long period of time is
15:52because identity was the thing that was
15:54kind of pushed hard and that's the core
15:57of the blockchain. That's really what it
15:59comes down to. But what was not
16:01understood is like what privacy actually
16:03means and what it actually means in
16:06comparison to anonymity which all the
16:08other chains are built on
16:09>> right all the big ones it's just a
16:11wallet address you hold the private key
16:13it's yours but if you need to prove
16:15something you have a completely
16:17different problem at which point you're
16:18building apps but those apps are uh um
16:23what's the right word sorry I was
16:24speaking German earlier so um are
16:27optional and from a regulator's
16:29perspective an option
16:30is not good.
16:31>> Mhm. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. Well, and I
16:34think the the key thing here is that
16:36you're starting to see this being used
16:38mainstream. Uh and I think the real
16:41question is how mainstream is going to
16:43address this because they know it's
16:44coming. You guys did a partnership with
16:46Mastercard uh with their crypto partner
16:49program. When you look at this, where
16:51does your agent verification right now
16:53show up outside the ecosystem in places
16:56like this with the use of regular, you
16:59know, payment rails that are going
17:01through merchant services, companies
17:02like Mastercard, Visa, etc. How does
17:05that work for you guys?
17:06>> Yeah, I mean, we are we are um we are
17:09cozying up of course because the
17:10payments part is the thing that you
17:12know, payments make the world go around,
17:13right? At the end of the day, we just
17:15play the verification layer. This is in
17:17many ways extremely boring. Um but uh
17:21which was also why it kind of took a lot
17:22of time you know the registry and what
17:24we do with the agent IDP uh um which we
17:27are about to release um and the agent
17:30kit itself you know first and foremost
17:32um we've done this in a way where we're
17:34non-invasive we basically are rather
17:37quickly now and and there will be quite
17:39a lot of talk about Concordium very very
17:41soon is is is because of the fact of us
17:44having done it in a very non-invasive
17:46way. So we don't require you to, you
17:49know, move your building from Ethereum
17:52or Solana or or from anywhere to
17:55Concordium.
17:56>> We're just basically giving those
17:58ecosystems that verification leg in
18:01order to be whatever the use case is or
18:04the payments rail to be there. Now that
18:07works both and this is this was the not
18:10the hard bit but that's the way that we
18:12kind of build it over the course of the
18:13last you know year and a half
18:14specifically because the identity
18:16there's a lot of you know there were
18:17several steps in order to get to the
18:18point where we are but um it ultimately
18:21came down to the fact that it's not only
18:22web three it's also web two
18:24>> and the matter of the fact is when it
18:26comes to the payment specifically um if
18:29you think of rather large uh enterprises
18:32right now that we're speaking with
18:33they're not necessarily are going to
18:35switch their tradition traditional
18:36payment and banking rails off and go
18:38onto stable coins full stop, right? Um
18:41they will use also traditional payment
18:43rails and uh the verification standard
18:46that will be required um without having
18:49to be you know pushed into a specific
18:51camp is why we do things like with
18:54Mastercard, you know, why we are, you
18:56know, in the Linux Foundation. We we
18:57were building age verification payments
19:00seven months. I mean, you can just look
19:01it up. Um and Kevin Lefu actually uh um
19:05who was one of the co-authors of the
19:07paper of the white paper of the X42 now
19:09Linux foundation we were going live with
19:11this and and and actually you know
19:13showcased it and have it had it working
19:15five uh or seven months before the
19:18foundation actually was created the
19:19Linux Foundation. So um we've been in
19:22this game for a long time but it wasn't
19:24just necessarily the sexy part. Now
19:26things like with Mastercard and the
19:28partners that are in there um they
19:30require um you know the verification
19:32standard in order to stay compliant and
19:35ultimately you know increase
19:37transactions in whichever shape or form
19:38specifically geared towards the agentic
19:41side. So because the rule book um exists
19:44for humans and businesses um but
19:47suddenly we have an economic actor that
19:49actually overtook humans uh in internet
19:51activity already in April this year
19:54>> and you need to find
19:56>> Yeah. How do you guys track the the
19:58agent growth especially with uh I guess
20:02authenticated agents or registered
20:04agents right now? What's the size of
20:06that look like for the overall market?
20:09Yeah, for the over I mean right now
20:11there are there are about 25 million uh
20:14agents that are active globally. Our
20:17number right now is about three and a
20:18half thousand, right? Um but the great
20:21thing is you know the curve is which is
20:23which is nothing if you want to put it
20:24into that comparison. ERC 804 got about
20:27I think 200,000 agents that are
20:28registered there.
20:30>> But coming back to the problem of what
20:32this actually what that registration
20:33actually is, right? we go far beyond um
20:37and ultimately uh um it the only thing
20:41is you know I can kind of only showcase
20:43the curve right now um in we more than
20:46doubled in the last 3 four weeks so and
20:49it's a continuous growth rather quickly
20:51and there are quite a few partnerships
20:53coming out where also you know other
20:54ecosystems are not partnerships like
20:56collaborations with other ecosystems
20:58where they just use our verification
21:00standards because it's very non-invasive
21:03you know the use case is to do the
21:04payment over there but they need the
21:05verification leg that they bring via us
21:07or we bring to them via the concordant
21:10registry and subsequently you can take
21:11it a step further and give those
21:13specific attributes to your agent itself
21:16>> um and
21:17>> interesting
21:18>> but when you look at Ethereum's
21:20Glamsterdam up upgrade this of course is
21:22set to activate here on the test net
21:25later Tuesday that happened this week so
21:27with all this going on is this a
21:30positive it sounds like it doesn't
21:31really matter what happens here. You
21:34guys are going to be able to work with
21:35Glamsterdam and the upgrade on ETH with
21:38Salana with you know what's happening on
21:41base doesn't matter
21:42>> doesn't matter to us at all. So okay
21:44it's both it it's both web 3 as well as
21:46web two compatible so you don't
21:48necessarily need to set up agents on
21:50Salana or Ethereum you can also set up
21:52an agent within the Google workspace.
21:53The most important part for us is that
21:55you actually create an actual use case
21:57for or you answer the question of why
21:59blockchains because I think this hasn't
22:02that hasn't been answered yet. You know,
22:04it sounds cool in order to go, you know,
22:06RWA is doing quite well right now. Yes,
22:08it absolutely makes sense in order to
22:10tokenize Apple shares and everything
22:11else. But
22:13>> the reason of why you do it from a
22:15consumer perspective because right now I
22:17can just go to my brokerage portal and
22:19just buy Apple shares, right?
22:21>> Exactly. So the question is why do you
22:22actually do it and I think we I I
22:25mentioned this earlier from a from a
22:26tooling perspect I I I wholeheartedly
22:28believe that we will go there and you
22:30can see that already because it makes a
22:31lot of sense we can disintermediate
22:33prices are going to be better more money
22:35is it's just going to be more efficient
22:37right um but the core question when it
22:40comes to the blockchains itself uh is
22:43how do they operate within a regulated
22:46world and we've been all shouting you
22:48know I've you know been listening to you
22:50as when it came to like clarity and
22:52everything else and maybe we talk you
22:53mentioned that we talk about it later um
22:56we've been shouting that we need
22:58regulation and we want regulation and
22:59and and everything else um the cipher
23:02punk amig goes like no actually I don't
23:03want regulation you know it's one of the
23:05things I agree on with Charles Hoskinson
23:07he he was like no absolutely no to
23:08clarity because we can build better
23:10things right but then again what's more
23:13important that we get the underlying
23:15forget crypto for a second right I'm I'm
23:17not even keen to talk about crypto as
23:19such I'm interested in the underlying
23:21technology and you need to build tools
23:23and features that actually are worth
23:26implementing. And unfortunately, the
23:29vast majority even though you know the
23:32market caps look great, haven't really
23:34done that. Um or at least from a
23:37regulatory and compliance perspective
23:38miss major major building blocks. Um and
23:42this is not something that you can
23:43retrofit. you know, you can't retrofit
23:46the the foundation after you build the
23:48third floor,
23:49>> like if you build a house, right?
23:51>> So, uh um you need to either build it
23:53from the beginning, which we did, and
23:55like I said, we were like the kid in
23:56the, you know, corner of the playground
23:58in the sand pit with leprosy and and and
24:00dimples all over the face. Nobody wanted
24:02to play with us. That has changed rather
24:05dramatically now. Not because suddenly
24:07the world understood that compliance is
24:08important. Absolutely not. because that
24:10is uh um I can't I can't believe I'm
24:13saying compliance is important but do
24:14you do you understand what I mean?
24:16Suddenly you have new economic actor and
24:18the use case is there
24:20>> because for the traditional humans and
24:22businesses we sign contracts we have
24:24governance u um processes in place and
24:27if one of my employees is starting to
24:29transact with North Korea I'm the
24:30director I go to jail those are the
24:32rules right
24:33>> so for an agent that doesn't exist um
24:36and in a fully digital world that's
24:38exactly what we build it for
24:40>> well I think that the key is is this has
24:42to happen we're at a stage now where the
24:45speed of technology is now moving faster
24:49than and we see this in a lot of other
24:51industries but especially now in crypto.
24:53Crypto has been somewhat ahead of the
24:54game for the most part granted with
24:57outside you know the exploits that we've
24:59seen but in terms of advancements it's
25:01been very you know very consistent. What
25:04are your thoughts on the SEC and the
25:05CFTC moving forward without clarity and
25:09they're doing it through structural law
25:11making via these organizations? are you
25:15for that process and are behind it?
25:17Where do you guys stand?
25:20>> So I mean look, we are we we are
25:22definitely for that process because I
25:24think it's inevitable,
25:25right?
25:27It it comes to my initial point like
25:29under no circumstances will the
25:31regulator will the regulators say even
25:33if we take everything on chain that
25:34suddenly those AML and KYC rules don't
25:36exist anymore.
25:37>> Yeah.
25:38>> Or become an option. So on that point
25:41you know uh um you know the question
25:43would be you know several several like
25:47for example you know age verification
25:49>> right
25:50>> u um because that is you know you've got
25:52coopa in America right there is the um
25:56there is the age uh um age verification
25:59act here in the here in the UK um we've
26:02seen this this was all over the news
26:03about you know underageed um or or or
26:06underageed children using social media
26:08and all that kind of jazz
26:10having to go through that, right? So,
26:13um, stable coin rules specifically, if
26:16you kind of take it there, when you
26:17think of the the Genius Act, expect
26:19issuers to run proper anti-money
26:22laundering and sanctions checks and to
26:24be able to freeze funds when, you know,
26:26lawful all uh when basically an order
26:29arrives, they have to be able to do
26:31this.
26:32>> You can't do that on a chain where
26:33everyone is a stranger in a hoodie.
26:37>> Yeah. So, well, and I think we've
26:39already seen this happen, too. You know,
26:40you've seen uh, of course, Genius Act
26:43take place, but you've also seen a lot
26:44of these stable coin companies start to
26:47implement exactly what you're talking
26:48about. Is Concordium in a position where
26:50it's going to be able to offer these
26:51kinds of technology advancements across
26:55everything out there, whether it's
26:56social, banking, crypto, agent payments,
27:01all that. What? Okay. So, across all
27:04layers, doesn't matter.
27:05>> It's live. Yeah,
27:07>> you just need to go and use it.
27:09>> Yeah. So now it's a matter I think uh
27:11because use cases is coming fast as we
27:14see it especially with you look at the
27:16basically Wall Street tokenizing
27:18everything.
27:19>> The likelihood is that's going to create
27:21uh not only awareness but it's going to
27:23create the demand which is something
27:25that you guys have been obviously
27:26focused on. Now you're going to get a
27:28chance to see it in play. Yeah.
27:30[laughter]
27:30>> Yeah. Get it uh get it in action. Well,
27:33listen, Boris, I've learned a lot about
27:34what you guys are doing, and this is
27:36good timing because, of course, Aentic
27:38Payment is coming very fast. I'm still
27:41concerned about privacy. I'm glad that
27:43you guys are very uh consistent on how
27:46you're standing on building a privacy
27:47network there that that works because
27:49that to our audience is one of the
27:51paramount issues that could become a big
27:54problem down the road. So hopefully
27:56everybody's paying attention to how
27:58they're using crypto right now. But
28:00thanks for coming in today. We do
28:01appreciate it. Pleasure. Thank you so
28:03much for having me.
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