A Very British Cult 1080p HEVC BigJ0554 — Transcript

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1. 0:00[Music]
2. 0:15[Music]
3. 0:16so why did you get in touch someone said
4. 0:18the line if you really want to get to
5. 0:20the bottom of something contact a
6. 0:22journalist not the police we've had
7. 0:24private investigator reports um there's
8. 0:27been so much work done on this
9. 0:29organization and you can only ever go so
10. 0:32far so what did she say so she says that
11. 0:36her boyfriend isn't a
12. 0:37cult but it's not like any cult I've
13. 0:39ever heard
14. 0:43of I had had these Ambitions to do
15. 0:46something I've always wanted to build
16. 0:48business or be inspiring or do something
17. 0:50good in life what is Lighthouse
18. 0:53Lighthouse it's life coaching it's a
19. 0:56pioneering mentoring
20. 0:57organization he had this mentor
21. 1:00we exist to help people to develop
22. 1:03themselves I thoroughly enjoy the
23. 1:04conversations you and I had no wonderful
24. 1:06man I'm thinking I can achieve something
25. 1:08here it was brilliant phone calls all
26. 1:10day every day you may love her but she
27. 1:13doesn't love you and then that's when I
28. 1:14started worrying I started to feel as
29. 1:16though I couldn't think anything unless
30. 1:18my mentor said it's a healthy thing to
31. 1:19think he started becoming separated from
32. 1:22people they're still recruiting now I
33. 1:25did feel this feeling the whole time
34. 1:27like he was watching me everyone has
35. 1:30handed over so much money the total I
36. 1:32invested was £
37. 1:34131,000 I knew he was going to sell his
38. 1:36house you know people like you m woman
39. 1:39you there such a strong stereotype the
40. 1:41only Cults are in California where
41. 1:43people wear long orange robes there is a
42. 1:46cult in your
43. 1:47neighborhood it's as if my daughters
44. 1:50died they are brainwashing people I
45. 1:52didn't want him to end up and not being
46. 1:54him you told me remember we have all
47. 1:56your
48. 1:57secrets you're going to take that out
49. 1:59you're going to keep it in keep this ey
50. 2:00Come
51. 2:08Close wake up in mother coffee Jeffrey
52. 2:11she's not who you think she
53. 2:22is that's the S the camer up Oh I
54. 2:25thought there was a
55. 2:27fly okay um three two one so how did you
56. 2:32meet Jeff I met Jeff on a Friday night
57. 2:36very drunk in the pub in chida I
58. 2:39shouldn't say this on public TV really
59. 2:41but so I thought he was just a little
60. 2:42bit of a a Ruffian and he had his squash
61. 2:44nose so he looks like a boxer you know
62. 2:46think it was going to be anything and
63. 2:48then he's um yeah he's completely
64. 2:50different he's a sailor and he's will
65. 2:51into his adventure and I'm probably the
66. 2:53one that's more common out of the two
67. 2:55really
68. 2:59[Music]
69. 3:02how you feeling I'm okay I'm a bit
70. 3:05nervous I grew up in Sussex I used to
71. 3:09have have a lot of freedom I had a lot
72. 3:10of Adventure as a kid yeah we had a
73. 3:13tight a tight family one of my ambitions
74. 3:16which I've had since a kid was to go to
75. 3:19the South
76. 3:20Pole I needed I needed something more
77. 3:23than just myself to to make that happen
78. 3:26I needed some sort of other knowledge or
79. 3:28some people that were that were
80. 3:29successful
81. 3:33already Jeff's 34 I'm from Portsmouth he
82. 3:37was working as a skipper teaching
83. 3:39military personnel how to sail when in
84. 3:42late 2018 he joined an online book group
85. 3:45looking for help in making his Ambitions
86. 3:48come true I signed up to a webinar which
87. 3:52I found on meetup.com um and they're
88. 3:54studying The Seven Habits of Highly
89. 3:56Effective People
90. 4:00I thought well if I can learn them use
91. 4:02them in my own life I'll do well you had
92. 4:05to leave your number so a week later I
93. 4:08had a phone call from Jing ah cool cool
94. 4:12cool cool good evening CU When I first
95. 4:15met Jeff only within like a few months
96. 4:17he was talking about this Mentor Jay I
97. 4:20thought he was smart he could speak well
98. 4:22so we're reading the start of habit 7 so
99. 4:25right from the top habit s sharpen the
100. 4:27saw he was interested in you know the
101. 4:30same ideas I was interested in um we
102. 4:32read most of the book I really enjoyed
103. 4:34it saw it benefit in my life too that's
104. 4:37when Jay offered me the opportunity to
105. 4:40work with him one-on-one and have some
106. 4:42personal
107. 4:45mentoring you're very very teachable
108. 4:47you're very very open you have a work
109. 4:50epic that's very good you'll learn fast
110. 4:52and you grow fast it felt great I was
111. 4:55motivated I was inspired and I started
112. 4:57working hard I can speak better write
113. 4:59better I'm more in flow yeah I'm loving
114. 5:02it pretty phenomenal thing you got going
115. 5:05on all around me it feels like there
116. 5:07things happening no wonderful man I I
117. 5:10thoroughly enjoy the conversations you
118. 5:11and I had he said we run this discipline
119. 5:14program we found it to be the most sort
120. 5:16of basic thing that anybody needs you
121. 5:18said it a while ago your dream team by
122. 5:20this stage Jeff had been talking to
123. 5:22Jason constantly for more than 6 months
124. 5:25they were like best mates discipline
125. 5:27program was £10,000
126. 5:30um that was going to be a years worth of
127. 5:32mentoring I remember you said I like a
128. 5:35challenge I want to be
129. 5:36challenged many people who say that and
130. 5:38mean it that was one of the times when I
131. 5:40went there something different about
132. 5:42this guy I like I like this guy I
133. 5:44appreciate that man and these calls then
134. 5:47became more frequent longer more intense
135. 5:51um more about deeper parts of your life
136. 5:54what sort of things were you sharing
137. 5:55with him loads of stuff at first just
138. 5:59what I was I was doing all day every day
139. 6:00and I would share my ambitions my
140. 6:04desires insecurities if Dawn and I were
141. 6:07having trouble I Shar that in time began
142. 6:10to share traumatic things things I I
143. 6:13found deeply
144. 6:14painful so they would be on the phone
145. 6:17for like 4 hours he would check
146. 6:19everything off with him have a dispute
147. 6:22about something or he'd let me down and
148. 6:24I would send him a message upset about
149. 6:27it and the message I got back didn't
150. 6:30sound like Jeff because the language was
151. 6:31different they weren't messages from
152. 6:33Jeff they were messages from
153. 6:36Jay what is light housee Lighthouse was
154. 6:39something that just sort of grew in my
155. 6:41life I thought it was a a network of
156. 6:44entrepreneurs just to give you a little
157. 6:46bit background on lighthous we've been
158. 6:48going for about 16 years uh I've been
159. 6:50involved for 11 I think for my sins we
160. 6:54exist to help people to develop
161. 6:57themselves so that they can improve
162. 7:00themselves and improve the lives of
163. 7:01others around them mentoring coaching
164. 7:04counseling leadership development yeah
165. 7:06so I'm I'm Sor and
166. 7:09um yeah so I um well let me let's go
167. 7:13back to the
168. 7:14beginning got so many questions still um
169. 7:17I was going to a lot of networking
170. 7:19events at the time Tom kind of just came
171. 7:21over and kind of introduced himself that
172. 7:25was Tom hasker 10 years ago I got
173. 7:27involved with lighthouse Tom and Simon
174. 7:30got on really well and soon Tom was
175. 7:32Simon's Mentor I think it really helped
176. 7:35me to feel like seen and hurt if felt he
177. 7:39was someone I could share my experiences
178. 7:42with and my
179. 7:44aspirations for the
180. 7:47future Tom Husker and Jay sing are part
181. 7:50of Lighthouse a mentoring and coaching
182. 7:53organization led by a man called Paul
183. 7:56War who everyone calls paully
184. 8:00what we're doing is helping human beings
185. 8:02to actually gain control of themselves
186. 8:04not for us to gain control of you but
187. 8:07for you to gain control because that's
188. 8:09where your power is he is very
189. 8:11charismatic wonderful sort big warm
190. 8:15personality it's not in mentorship
191. 8:17coaching that you should be putting your
192. 8:18trust it's in who's behind the
193. 8:20mentorship and coaching you can talk
194. 8:22very well it's really tapped into
195. 8:24something there really draws your
196. 8:26attention and inspires you it's amazing
197. 8:29and it's beautiful it brings me to tears
198. 8:32sometimes hearing you you and poy talk
199. 8:33our responsibility is not only just to
200. 8:35help you think well feel well eat well
201. 8:38look well be well but to raise your
202. 8:41level of conscious awareness that you
203. 8:42own enough of yourself that you know
204. 8:44you'll never
205. 8:45lose how many here see tendencies in you
206. 8:48you're not happy with Paul would talk
207. 8:50about the millions he made as a
208. 8:52businessman in South Africa about his
209. 8:55close relationship with Steven cvy the
210. 8:58author of the bestselling Seven Habits
211. 9:00of Highly Effective People I used to
212. 9:03speak once a quarter do you know what
213. 9:05Steven cby said to Paul a while back
214. 9:08said you guys are taking on the torch
215. 9:10from me after almost a year of talking
216. 9:14to J Singh Jeff was invited to become
217. 9:16part of the Inner Circle at Lighthouse a
218. 9:19lighthouse associate elect so I had a a
219. 9:22meeting with Jay he said there's an
220. 9:24opportunity that's come up and the price
221. 9:26is £25,000 he said the store is going to
222. 9:28close and next opening will be uh 50,000
223. 9:32then 100 then 250 so there was a sense
224. 9:35of urgency around it he said it would be
225. 9:38the best opportunity for you to succeed
226. 9:42it a big risk to put in that much money
227. 9:45but I understood that you don't really
228. 9:46get PL places unless you take huge risks
229. 9:50after one year of mentorship with Tom
230. 9:52hasker Simon was offered the same they
231. 9:55didn't come straight up to me and said
232. 9:58hey like become a lighthouse partner it
233. 10:00was a lot more gentle steady approach it
234. 10:03was a big investment so it was £25,000
235. 10:06to become what they called an an
236. 10:10associate elect like a lighthouse
237. 10:12training mentor you know in layman's
238. 10:14terms so you had to pay to become yes
239. 10:17there nothing was never described as pay
240. 10:20as it was always you're making an
241. 10:21investment in
242. 10:23[Music]
243. 10:26yourself in June 2020 when the world
244. 10:29world had just gone into its first covid
245. 10:31lockdown Jeff joined Lighthouse fulltime
246. 10:35in November the same year Simon did too
247. 10:38Jeff wasn't working anyway because of
248. 10:40covid Simon quit his full-time job and
249. 10:43what did being full-time involve
250. 10:45involves being on these calls these were
251. 10:48like almost 30
252. 10:50people on the call mainly listening to
253. 10:54other people speaking waiting for po W
254. 10:56to
255. 10:57arrive morning morning morning morning
256. 11:05well done well articulated and well
257. 11:07Express with feeling and with care and
258. 11:09with consideration and how long would
259. 11:12they last in the beginning quite
260. 11:14short so I thought I'd just share a few
261. 11:17things they got longer and longer as we
262. 11:19went so within six months they they're
263. 11:22five to 6 hours um but you'd never know
264. 11:25when they they were going to finish I
265. 11:27think we went on to about 6:00 on one
266. 11:29call 10hour call Lighthouse has a team
267. 11:33of live transcribers working on every
268. 11:35call and they mustn't Miss A word of
269. 11:38what Paul says how does the transcribing
270. 11:41work yeah well um it's quite a
271. 11:46procedure and you're all mature enough
272. 11:48to hear this but believe you me
273. 11:50conscience is the the great Liberator
274. 11:52you're trying to get as much of Paul
275. 11:54War's words as you can as St cavy said
276. 11:57educating a conscience what you would
277. 11:58have is is two lead typers you'd have
278. 12:01two others come in behind them and
279. 12:03they'd fill in the abbreviations and the
280. 12:06typos you'd have others come in behind
281. 12:08them and they would highlight certain
282. 12:10words which were later made into a
283. 12:12summary I leave you with that by the end
284. 12:14of a call you'd probably have anything
285. 12:15between a 50 page or 100 page
286. 12:19transcript so so so so so so so with
287. 12:22that that's then sent out to a group of
288. 12:25maybe 10 who listen back to the
289. 12:28recording go through the written
290. 12:30transcript and fill everything in word
291. 12:32for word it's self regeneration nothing
292. 12:35new that's every day every day self love
293. 12:39self nature self understanding every day
294. 12:42seven days a week it just didn't make
295. 12:44any sense Saturday and Sunday Saturday
296. 12:47Sunday I had one Christmas day off one
297. 12:49New Year's Day off I went up to see Paul
298. 12:52War a couple of times so I had those
299. 12:54days off
300. 12:56too he started becoming like separated
301. 13:00from people we did go to his families um
302. 13:05he would find you'd find him sitting in
303. 13:06the car on the phone to Jay and it was
304. 13:09actually quite embarrassing at times so
305. 13:11you know my friends come around to see
306. 13:13me they be like where's Jeff and I'm
307. 13:14like oh it's just upstairs on the phone
308. 13:16call as as usual we meant to go on
309. 13:19holiday to Mexico for his Dad's 60th we
310. 13:21didn't go because they said he couldn't
311. 13:22go cuz there's a big launch
312. 13:24happening ask see
313. 13:28get team members are so busy that
314. 13:31they're often not questioning at least
315. 13:33out loud what the point of these calls
316. 13:36are or what anyone's
317. 13:38achieving the moment he'd get off the
318. 13:39phone calls he'd have me asking
319. 13:42questions he'd have his sister asking
320. 13:43questions his family asking questions is
321. 13:46it mentoring or is it business is are
322. 13:48you working for them or are they
323. 13:51mentoring you is it a pyramid
324. 13:56scheme around 20 Lighthouse team members
325. 13:59members live together in shared rental
326. 14:01houses in the Midlands we believe one
327. 14:03house near wolver Hampton has around
328. 14:05seven members living in it how did you
329. 14:08end up living with your Mentor Tom bro
330. 14:11the idea of whether did he come and live
331. 14:14with me and I don't know I just think
332. 14:16maybe it was persistent I don't know but
333. 14:18there was just something in me that just
334. 14:20went okay fine let's let's just do it I
335. 14:24kind of had the bedroom and then he
336. 14:26slept in was the small living room
337. 14:28stroke kitchen there a really tiny flat
338. 14:32no space no no sort of real privacy all
339. 14:35day every day just me and him
340. 14:38financially I was paying for the whole
341. 14:39flat and I was running out of
342. 14:42money I remember one evening I was in my
343. 14:45room quite late and i' actually turned
344. 14:47the lights out to try and get to see I
345. 14:49could hear him walking standing just
346. 14:51outside the door I did feel this feeling
347. 14:54the whole time like like like like he
348. 14:57was watching me
349. 15:00they asked Jeff to move up with them I
350. 15:02just felt like the moment he moves to to
351. 15:04them houses that's
352. 15:06it have you had any thoughts in relation
353. 15:10to what you do um and uh investment wise
354. 15:15and that kind of thing what is your does
355. 15:18mean what I
356. 15:19do like you've spoken about your house
357. 15:21you've spoken about different things so
358. 15:24Jeff start saying I think I'm going to
359. 15:26sell my house cuz money's you know
360. 15:28property's dead like there's no one no
361. 15:29one's you know no one invests in
362. 15:31property anymore I was like that's
363. 15:32rubbish the 80s and '90s and are gone
364. 15:37property's over what's it doing exactly
365. 15:39yeah exactly what's it doing it's just
366. 15:41just in Brick and water and you know
367. 15:43it's just it's just rubbish I fully
368. 15:46agree
369. 15:46[Music]
370. 15:49bro in June 2021 2 and a half years
371. 15:53after he first started speaking to Jay
372. 15:55Singh Jeff sold his house he gave
373. 15:59£28,000 to Lighthouse he'd already
374. 16:02remortgaged it and given them £ 32,000
375. 16:05of that money do you think you would
376. 16:08have sold your house had it not been for
377. 16:11Jason's encouragement no
378. 16:14chance I had no reason to sell that
379. 16:16house other than the reasons put in
380. 16:19front of me and the opportunities put in
381. 16:21front of
382. 16:22me um at Lighthouse why do you think
383. 16:25they wanted
384. 16:26Jeff oh he's a cash cow sounds awful
385. 16:30they realized there was money to to have
386. 16:33there how much money did you hand over
387. 16:36the total I invested was £
388. 16:40[Music]
389. 16:48131,000 key to the philosophy of
390. 16:51Lighthouse were the levels the idea that
391. 16:54everyone is at a different stage of
392. 16:56human Spiritual Development all the
393. 16:59levels level level one to four they came
394. 17:02from M Scott peek who's a
395. 17:04psychotherapist he's uh very
396. 17:08intelligent the majority of level one
397. 17:11they are terrified when you get a high
398. 17:13level four when you rise above that
399. 17:15level one chaotic childlike level two
400. 17:19institutionalized somebody that maybe is
401. 17:21religious but follows religious on Blind
402. 17:24Faith level three the skeptic so these
403. 17:27are scientist doesn't just follow things
404. 17:30on Blind Faith and level four Mystic
405. 17:33communal somebody that has really
406. 17:35transcended a lot of challenges in life
407. 17:37is able to take a quite a profound view
408. 17:39on the world see patterns patterns of
409. 17:41nature see
410. 17:43wisdom what were the various levels that
411. 17:46were in Lighthouse Well everybody's
412. 17:48level one for war was level four that
413. 17:51was it that was it why million reasons
414. 17:55he he said nobody there had had an
415. 17:57upbringing and so there were
416. 17:59in Lighthouse to get that upbringing
417. 18:01that they didn't get it home Paul said
418. 18:03once you got to level four you could
419. 18:05start achieving your
420. 18:06goals many people who don't know me very
421. 18:09well think I'm a Mystic because I'm able
422. 18:12to sort of feel things that no one else
423. 18:13can because quite simply I'm I'm able to
424. 18:16I'm in touch with this heightened sense
425. 18:19of extraordinary awareness that's
426. 18:20becoming more extraordinary all the
427. 18:22time I just increasingly it seems like
428. 18:27these people were under control under
429. 18:29his control as his presence and I felt
430. 18:33nervous around
431. 18:36him he's going to play golf with Paul
432. 18:39war and then um we're tearing up and uh
433. 18:42Paul War just sort of gets out the golf
434. 18:44caddy grunts at one of the seniors and
435. 18:47shakes his foot I look down at his foot
436. 18:49his shoelace Has Come
437. 18:51Undone but it's the way the senior
438. 18:54responded he sort of he dropped his golf
439. 18:57club he s moved so fast across the green
440. 19:00dropped on one knee and knelt there
441. 19:02tying up his shoelaces I looked at him
442. 19:04and thought is that where I'm
443. 19:07going so that I would listen in at times
444. 19:11and the types of topics they were
445. 19:13discussing which were Beyond mentoring
446. 19:15and coaching and business and was more
447. 19:18about beliefs and and how you should
448. 19:20live your life and and then that's when
449. 19:22I started worrying cuz I thought he's
450. 19:24literally being brainwashed all day
451. 19:25every day um and the the topics were
452. 19:27getting more sinister stuff it's about
453. 19:29narcissists you know toxic parents
454. 19:32families become dominant families
455. 19:33controlling families narcissistic
456. 19:35families become like H HIV that's what
457. 19:37it is I used to sit on these calls and I
458. 19:39would hear people speaking about their
459. 19:41families endlessly or their mothers
460. 19:44endlessly of course all families have
461. 19:47difficulties and Lighthouse would find
462. 19:50them find them in your journal or find
463. 19:52them in your personal
464. 19:54mentoring other people's families were
465. 19:56generally destructive narcissistic
466. 20:00cynical hateful didn't want to let their
467. 20:02family members go and would sabotage um
468. 20:06their potential and they were sabotaged
469. 20:08Lighthouse as a whole so other people's
470. 20:10families were dangerous what about your
471. 20:12family what did they say about your
472. 20:13family my mother and sister and
473. 20:15narcissistic my father's weak the worst
474. 20:18family at lighthouse my partner Dawn she
475. 20:21just got endless
476. 20:23Flack I won't repeat what he said I
477. 20:26think you've heard some recordings got
478. 20:27the recording yeah
479. 20:31a great and one of my enemies is some
480. 20:33[ __ ] chick called
481. 20:35D
482. 20:37toxic what are what are some of the
483. 20:39things you remember from it that he
484. 20:43said oh
485. 20:46well I don't
486. 20:49[Music]
487. 20:56know the whole thing is just is
488. 20:58incredibly
489. 21:00belittling I know how this works what a
490. 21:02one day you
491. 21:03st you know people like you murder
492. 21:05murder woman like you know
493. 21:08very you
494. 21:10step and you
495. 21:12m see meshing her
496. 21:16face he was sitting there all day
497. 21:18listening to quite unpleasant stuff some
498. 21:21of it insulting you
499. 21:24personally why did you stick
500. 21:27around I thought the
501. 21:29moment I you know I let this you know I
502. 21:31finish with him for my own self digity
503. 21:34and
504. 21:35worth he's just going to plow right into
505. 21:38it and we've lost him and I feel like I
506. 21:40was his the only glimmer of hope of not
507. 21:43him completely going into that so um so
508. 21:46I'm trying not to cry but um yeah so
509. 21:49part of it was like not wanting them to
510. 21:51win which sounds awful other part is cuz
511. 21:53I love him obviously loads and um we did
512. 21:57have such a nice time before he
513. 22:00joined that woman has a heart of gold
514. 22:04but I just cannot connect it to my work
515. 22:07here man it hurts right love it
516. 22:11man feel it bro you
517. 22:14know this of this trust yeah
518. 22:17yeah because I do really love him and I
519. 22:20didn't want him to end up in that that
520. 22:22shared house like all his money gone and
521. 22:24not being him and us all losing him for
522. 22:27good like Jay and like the rest of them
523. 22:33now
524. 22:36[ __ ] do you know why it drives you mad
525. 22:39CU I love her you may love her but she
526. 22:42doesn't love you no matter what she says
527. 22:44no matter what you say come on man wake
528. 22:47up and smell the [ __ ] coffee Jeffrey
529. 22:49This Woman's no good for you man she's
530. 22:51not who you think she is
531. 22:57[Music]
532. 23:01Jeff was part of Lighthouse for 3 years
533. 23:04Simon for four a little bit about my
534. 23:06family I've been working on this
535. 23:07investigation with a whole team and
536. 23:10we've tracked down more than 40 people
537. 23:12who've had experience of Lighthouse or
538. 23:14pool
539. 23:16War I had four years of mentoring my
540. 23:19company paid for it I'm an educated man
541. 23:22but I handed over tens of thousands of
542. 23:25pounds and got nothing would you be okay
543. 23:28if we use what you've told us they told
544. 23:31us about the history of Lighthouse
545. 23:34started in 2004 it had two previous
546. 23:37names Franklin War and the
547. 23:39entrepreneurial Club even 17 years ago
548. 23:42people were investing 25,000 and getting
549. 23:45bullied by Paul
550. 23:46war from the very beginning members paid
551. 23:50big money to become Lighthouse
552. 23:52Associates we kept hearing how so many
553. 23:55long-term members were in terrible debt
554. 23:58Paul War lives in a mansion but the
555. 24:00people below him live in shared houses
556. 24:03like students they don't pay bills take
557. 24:05out credit cards until their credit
558. 24:07rating is destroyed one of the things
559. 24:09that really stuck out to me from these
560. 24:11calls was just how terrified some people
561. 24:14were of Paul finding out they'd spoken
562. 24:16to us threatened he thought Paul was
563. 24:19dangerous please please don't use my
564. 24:23name I need to protect my family and
565. 24:26that long Lighthouse daily call was
566. 24:28transcribed every single
567. 24:30day we've been given 16,000 pages of
568. 24:35transcripts of exactly what was said on
569. 24:37them we also found a growing Reddit
570. 24:40Community highly critical of Lighthouse
571. 24:43let me tell you and the recordings
572. 24:44you've been hearing we have hours of
573. 24:47them everything Lighthouse does is
574. 24:52recorded in the past you know we've had
575. 24:54all sorts of narcissistic and
576. 24:57malignantly psychopath people that have
577. 24:59come through here people have come in
578. 25:00here for the wrong reason he sent 181
579. 25:03calls it's 90 hours of Jeff and J but it
580. 25:07charts their entire relationship Paul
581. 25:09War says it's because they've got
582. 25:11nothing to hide but ex-members know it
583. 25:13means ligh house have their deepest
584. 25:15Secrets recorded we record everything
585. 25:18and we cut nothing
586. 25:21out the recordings mean our team have
587. 25:23been able to verify the accounts of
588. 25:25former members and hear from those
589. 25:28inside lighthouse in their own words I
590. 25:31would put you and tuck you away like at
591. 25:33the J until we heard this recording we'd
592. 25:36heard J Singh being a mentor being
593. 25:39controlling described as a
594. 25:41perpetrator but J Singh has been in
595. 25:43Lighthouse for more than a decade and
596. 25:46now we learn something about the process
597. 25:48Jay's been through to become who he is
598. 25:50today you actually explain that that
599. 25:53experience J I couldn't be trusted to
600. 25:55because my negativity I was pouring it
601. 25:57into meetings I was um pouring on the
602. 26:00guys the clients and um so Paulie helped
603. 26:03me and I was with a a senior at all
604. 26:06times um if I wasn't I was by myself and
605. 26:09my text messages were checked to to
606. 26:12people because I I wasn't aware of how
607. 26:15much manipulation and toxicity there was
608. 26:18there in seemingly positive thing um and
609. 26:22yeah poy couldn't trust me I couldn't
610. 26:23trust myself and so he helped me go back
611. 26:27to square one and and rebuilding kept me
612. 26:30kept me here um and and love me through
613. 26:32it I was like that I was 25 26 27 um I
614. 26:36appreciate those times now as hard as
615. 26:38they were in some cases we have video to
616. 26:41this is J sing's brother Suk Singh also
617. 26:44part of Lighthouse here he is promoting
618. 26:47it to newer mentees when I started I was
619. 26:50I was 24 fresh out of uni um and just
620. 26:54really wanted to find some direction I
621. 26:56just was like I I'm I'm feeling lost I
622. 26:59don't know why I don't know what this
623. 27:00means but I just I need something we
624. 27:03think there are more than 40 people
625. 27:05still involved with Lighthouse people
626. 27:08like 28-year-old Mel in the beginning of
627. 27:132020 I received a call from dagma
628. 27:17Melissa's mother saying that she was
629. 27:20very worried that Melissa had got
630. 27:22involved with this organization and she
631. 27:25get a got a bank loan
632. 27:27£25,000 and she gave all this money to
633. 27:29the lighthouse group she had met uh her
634. 27:32Mentor through a dating app Chris
635. 27:35dler I would say that she found the
636. 27:39family that she thinks she never had in
637. 27:42Lighthouse they appeared to
638. 27:45scrutinize a lot of aspects of her life
639. 27:48we had a holiday booked it was just me
640. 27:50her and my wife we would the three of us
641. 27:52we were really close she was saying that
642. 27:55Lighthouse don't think it's part of her
643. 27:58development plan so when on Google the
644. 28:02first thing that stood out was there was
645. 28:03a lack of information on Paul uh the
646. 28:06leader he'd been built up as this super
647. 28:10successful entrepreneur it was just
648. 28:12weird to find no trace of a supposedly
649. 28:15prominent entrepreneur and business
650. 28:19coach when Martin found out that Mel had
651. 28:22left her job to go fulltime at
652. 28:24Lighthouse without telling her family he
653. 28:26called her up and so I had a phone call
654. 28:30with her and I said look all this
655. 28:31research I've done these guys are
656. 28:33absolute
657. 28:34Crooks the next day Chris and somebody
658. 28:37else in the group came and took her
659. 28:42away one feels so powerless in a
660. 28:45situation like that you feel what what
661. 28:48can I do I me you can write to the
662. 28:50police you nothing happens Mel writes a
663. 28:53lot online about being in lith house and
664. 28:56she says she's happy
665. 28:59how how do you feel about that do you
666. 29:00think she's happy the difficulty about
667. 29:02this whole process is that if Melissa is
668. 29:06watching this program she will think
669. 29:09that I am being hostile to her because
670. 29:12she is happy why do you think that all
671. 29:15of your family 99% of your friends and
672. 29:18things like that think it's a bad idea
673. 29:20surely doesn't that ring alarm bells are
674. 29:23we all wrong it is absolutely horrendous
675. 29:27what uh uh you know Paul war and his
676. 29:30cronies such an odious person how
677. 29:33intelligent people like my daughter can
678. 29:36fall victim of this I find it totally
679. 29:39incomprehensible what's it like having a
680. 29:42child in Lighthouse it's as if my
681. 29:46daughter's died because she's not my
682. 29:49daughter that I know is not there
683. 29:51anymore hi guys
684. 29:54so yeah it's been a while my bad I have
685. 29:57moved moved out of my room at
686. 30:00University um and I am now back in my
687. 30:03house in London which is a bit of a mess
688. 30:06but we can Overlook that and I've booked
689. 30:08my flights well my dad booked my
690. 30:13flights I'm
691. 30:19sorry and I just and it's just and it is
692. 30:22not Melissa this cannot be
693. 30:25Melissa and this Dreadful organ Iz ation
694. 30:28I mean it absolutely they should all be
695. 30:30in jail basically brainwashing people
696. 30:33and destroying
697. 30:34families why have you decided to go
698. 30:37public I think it's basically it's a
699. 30:39last resort Paul war is is you know says
700. 30:42he's going to sue everybody's ass and
701. 30:44you pe Bring It On Let's see him in
702. 30:46court the last place he ever wants to be
703. 30:48is in court I'm an old man I'm
704. 30:50self-employed I've got nothing to lose
705. 30:52so if I'm not going to speak out who is
706. 30:54going to speak
707. 30:55out can you hear me yes he you now yeah
708. 30:58I got my volume up higher awesome how
709. 31:01are you yeah I'm okay yeah I'm good
710. 31:03you're not allowed to use okay and good
711. 31:05remember oh yeah I'm feeling focused as
712. 31:11we learned more about the group we also
713. 31:13learned more about their damaging
714. 31:15Behavior are you feeling ready for your
715. 31:18interview yes I am yeah
716. 31:21yeah to T that in your pocket I'm
717. 31:23Anthony Church I'm 30 and I'm from
718. 31:28Peterborough so I struggled from when I
719. 31:31was at school with anxiety and then I
720. 31:34did a master's in applied
721. 31:36Computing and it was after I finished
722. 31:40that course when I had a
723. 31:43breakdown um
724. 31:45and um took an
725. 31:47overdose um making a suicide attempt
726. 31:52um and then later in that year I came
727. 31:56across like house awesome looking very
728. 32:00smart I like
729. 32:01it and then it was after that when I met
730. 32:04Jay and claiming that he'd be able to um
731. 32:09get me better that Lighthouse would be
732. 32:10the cure for
733. 32:12depression that's that's what he said
734. 32:15yeah that's yeah that's what
735. 32:17he yeah that's what he'd say
736. 32:21yeah Anthony Church worked as a
737. 32:23volunteer web developer for Lighthouse
738. 32:25for four years he was mentored by Jing
739. 32:28throughout yeah look even if you're not
740. 32:30doing the exercise oh yeah must do the
741. 32:33meditation should we take a few minutes
742. 32:36yep what made Antony's story worrying
743. 32:40was Jing's attitude to his
744. 32:43medication Anthony takes two types of
745. 32:45medication for his mental health
746. 32:46problems it's one of these medications
747. 32:49that Jay
748. 32:52um then suggested that I speak to um
749. 32:58my doctor about um reducing
750. 33:02it I know you're having a few of these
751. 33:05headaches and withdrawal symptoms and
752. 33:06stuff like that this is the you're
753. 33:08willing to suffer yeah yeah willing
754. 33:11willing to suffer to get healthy and not
755. 33:13so you're not you're not dependent on
756. 33:14medication for the rest of your life
757. 33:17yeah there's meaning in the pain man
758. 33:20search for meaning yes this is the next
759. 33:23level of suffering to get office
760. 33:25medication yes
761. 33:28Jay would prepare me for the calls with
762. 33:30the specialist and getting me to say
763. 33:34about how better I'm doing with
764. 33:37Lighthouse and um and they agreed to uh
765. 33:42reduce the medication gradually um he he
766. 33:45would tell you what to say in your calls
767. 33:48with a
768. 33:49specialist yes yeah you can tell them
769. 33:53I'm getting professional counseling and
770. 33:54mentoring every single day yeah I look
771. 33:57forward to the day where we raise a
772. 33:59glass and you're friend of your
773. 34:00medication I'd like to see you off both
774. 34:02of those set a set a time maybe even by
775. 34:06next spring ah yes yes yeah Jing is of
776. 34:10course not qualified to do
777. 34:14this Anthony eventually started
778. 34:17questioning Lighthouse asking things
779. 34:19like why he had no contract for the
780. 34:21money he'd handed
781. 34:23over so when I'd asked questions about
782. 34:26lighthouse Jay would blame the
783. 34:30medication and say I was being paranoid
784. 34:32because of the withdrawal symptoms and I
785. 34:35knew I wasn't experiencing withdrawals I
786. 34:38was just thinking about things that
787. 34:40didn't add up when Anthony eventually
788. 34:43left he sent messages to other members
789. 34:46with information about cults and mind
790. 34:48control he soon received an email from
791. 34:51Jay I don't think you have any idea what
792. 34:54you're doing Anthony if this is you just
793. 34:57having ay ological paranoid episode as
794. 34:59you've have had before and we can reason
795. 35:02with you then with sufficient evidence
796. 35:04we can present this to the lawyers and
797. 35:06in the police report take this very
798. 35:09seriously Anthony there are conin asked
799. 35:11questions about the legitimacy of
800. 35:13Lighthouse her mentoring calls turned
801. 35:16very nasty why do you think I want to
802. 35:19speak to you um I'm not going to
803. 35:21struggle here you going to struggle here
804. 35:22I'm telling you now are you ready for it
805. 35:24yeah I don't think you are they said
806. 35:26there needs to be some kind of way of
807. 35:28making my parents pay for not looking
808. 35:31after me better as a child there was
809. 35:33talk of seeking legal action taking my
810. 35:36parents to court getting money out of
811. 35:39anybody obviously to invest back in
812. 35:42Lighthouse I know know why aren't you
813. 35:45taking it out on them why aren't you
814. 35:46trying to get Justice You're so [ __ ]
815. 35:48up you owe your parents jack [ __ ] man
816. 35:51they owe you Paul Wall seemed obsessed
817. 35:54with talking about sexual abuse about
818. 35:57how
819. 35:58damaged I was you need to invest in
820. 36:00yourself because you're broken this
821. 36:02doesn't come from nowhere this comes
822. 36:03from the abuse you've got as a child you
823. 36:05come from a family of serpents and PRS
824. 36:07and cowards because of what had happened
825. 36:09to me I was a dangerous person to be
826. 36:11around are you mad or or narcissistic
827. 36:15are you mad or Psychopathic which one
828. 36:17are you they were just telling me how
829. 36:19awful I was how dare I you know question
830. 36:22anything about Lighthouse and I thought
831. 36:25my gosh perhaps I am damaged I'm telling
832. 36:29you now you got to stop doing it it's
833. 36:30not it's not acceptable okay treating as
834. 36:32if we're trying to do you over you know
835. 36:34what do you know what your biggest fear
836. 36:35ought to be not that we'll prot money
837. 36:37from you that we actually think that
838. 36:38you're too unhealthy to be here your
839. 36:40cical little witch and they said if you
840. 36:43leave if you turn against us remember we
841. 36:46have all your secrets every conversation
842. 36:49you've ever had is taped every conv
843. 36:52every Journal you've ever written is
844. 36:53stored are you helplessly so [ __ ]
845. 36:56stupid
846. 36:57[Music]
847. 37:00Erin did leave and her experience shows
848. 37:03just how much the group hates being
849. 37:06criticized they keep a close eye on
850. 37:09what's written about them especially on
851. 37:11Reddit and the reason we know about this
852. 37:14is because it was one of Simon's jobs my
853. 37:17role was to monitor this we had a
854. 37:19document for every post we took a
855. 37:24screenshot took a state what the Reddit
856. 37:26pseudonym they' posted something that
857. 37:30was crucial or critical mention that to
858. 37:32the right people so they could decide
859. 37:34how they were going to
860. 37:38respond and respond they did one of the
861. 37:42ex-members that's taken the most abuse
862. 37:44since leaving is a teacher called Joe
863. 37:47they wrote an email to my head teacher
864. 37:51basically saying that they had concerns
865. 37:53about me and my ability to do my job and
866. 37:57and that I was a threat to children and
867. 38:00then they also began to CC in senior
868. 38:04Executives at the local Authority oh my
869. 38:06gosh and one email had two um a 25 page
870. 38:11report and an 18 page report about me
871. 38:14with making various Furious claims one
872. 38:17of which was that I should be
873. 38:18psychologically
874. 38:21evaluated it's just laughable
875. 38:25really at some point after Jo posted her
876. 38:28experience on Reddit Lighthouse reported
877. 38:31her to the police the police looked at
878. 38:33it but took no further action but
879. 38:36Lighthouse wrote to her school to say
880. 38:38she was under criminal investigation and
881. 38:41this is just cuz you left because I left
882. 38:43and you wrote on Reddit and because I
883. 38:46asked questions because I wrote about my
884. 38:49experience on Reddit
885. 38:51yet if you've got that sort of pathology
886. 38:53Joe I'm telling you now people like you
887. 38:56should not be looking at off the little
888. 38:57children I'm telling you from me right
889. 38:59now and I will make sure that you get
890. 39:02out of that job as long as I live and
891. 39:05unless you reform or unless you get the
892. 39:07help you need because what you're doing
893. 39:08here is damn godamn
894. 39:11awful
895. 39:13[Music]
896. 39:17Hospital throughout history groups known
897. 39:19as Cults have led Ordinary People to
898. 39:21believe unbelievable things we came from
899. 39:25what some might call another di mention
900. 39:28the Raj Nishi describe themselves as
901. 39:30dropouts from the top of culture Charles
902. 39:33Manson is the mystical leader of the
903. 39:35hippie cult everyone you've heard from
904. 39:37that's been part of Lighthouse believes
905. 39:39it's a cult every person we've spoken to
906. 39:42who's had a family member inside
907. 39:44Lighthouse believes it's a cult but you
908. 39:47also wanted multiple expert opinions
909. 39:49from Specialists I've been doing this
910. 39:51work for about 30 years now we get more
911. 39:54calls about Lighthouse than any other
912. 39:56group in this country
913. 39:58Lighthouse International in my opinion
914. 40:01um meets the criteria for a cult I'd say
915. 40:04it's on the extreme end of the Continuum
916. 40:07it seems to me that Lighthouse group is
917. 40:09a cult they monopolize their members uh
918. 40:12time energy and uh are financially
919. 40:15exploiting
920. 40:21them when did you first hear about
921. 40:24Lighthouse I had someone come to my
922. 40:26practice to seek some help I consider
923. 40:30Lighthouse a very classic example of a
924. 40:32cult it fits all the criteria that I use
925. 40:35and what is that firstly Cults are
926. 40:37started and often continue to be led by
927. 40:40a charismatic and authoritarian leader
928. 40:43but they're also bullies so I kind of
929. 40:46refer to them as charismatic bullies the
930. 40:48structure is steeply hierarchical
931. 40:51everything comes from the leader but
932. 40:54importantly the structure is heavily
933. 40:56isolating then you have this process of
934. 40:58what I call brainwashing or we could
935. 41:00also call coercive control and then the
936. 41:02final point is that if you do this to
937. 41:05people you can then exploit them so we
938. 41:07see these phenomena like people selling
939. 41:09their houses giving all their money to
940. 41:12somebody they've gone through this
941. 41:13process they didn't do it CU they were
942. 41:16stupid how does Lighthouse compare to
943. 41:20other Cults are more famous Cults in
944. 41:22this country what I noticed is that
945. 41:24there's such a strong stereotype that
946. 41:26the only people in Cults and the only
947. 41:28Cults are in California where people
948. 41:31wear long orange robes and I really want
949. 41:35to say to people that there is a cult in
950. 41:37your
951. 41:41neighborhood and coera control is now
952. 41:44recognized by the UK government as being
953. 41:47a crime when it occurs in a personal or
954. 41:50family relationship as this exact same
955. 41:53Dynamic can happen in a group or in a
956. 41:56workplace or in a coaching business if
957. 41:58your boyfriend does that to you he might
958. 42:00go to prison but if your neighbor does
959. 42:03it to you that's legal so when we
960. 42:05started investigating Lighthouse it was
961. 42:09not a religious group but now religion
962. 42:11is a huge part of it yeah I found that
963. 42:14really fascinating when they seem to be
964. 42:15morphing a little bit and bringing a lot
965. 42:18more Jesus
966. 42:21talk which is not what I saw the first
967. 42:24time I looked into them at all
968. 42:29the belief system of Cults is very fluid
969. 42:33it's what works at any given time and
970. 42:36the ideology really is the kind of
971. 42:39advertising I I call it the um sheep's
972. 42:42clothing around the
973. 42:44[Music]
974. 42:46wolf does Lighthouse know that you're
975. 42:48aware of them yes they do and I know
976. 42:51they know because they've been trolling
977. 42:53me on Twitter and in fact I last week
978. 42:57made a complaint to the Met police about
979. 42:59it where I have 53 Pages that's not
980. 43:03tweets that's 53 pages of tweets the Met
981. 43:06police have decided that it's just a
982. 43:09disagreement about ideas but as one of
983. 43:12the things they said in one of the
984. 43:13tweets was you'll pay the price I don't
985. 43:16consider that a normal way of
986. 43:18disagreeing with somebody and also
987. 43:20contacting my previous
988. 43:22workplaces is also not the way people
989. 43:25usually disagree about ideas I've
990. 43:27genuinely not experienced the fear that
991. 43:30I see of poor War well cult leaders are
992. 43:33psychopaths they appear charming and
993. 43:35nice one minute and the next minute
994. 43:37they're terrifying I had to stare down a
995. 43:40murderer in my cult who was trying to
996. 43:43have my now ex-husband take full custody
997. 43:46of my children for me getting out of a
998. 43:49cult was the most frightening thing I've
999. 43:51ever
1000. 43:52done I knew that I couldn't tell anyone
1001. 43:55that I was having doubts and I thought
1002. 43:57if I can get away from Tom even for you
1003. 43:59know just a small window of time that
1004. 44:01will give me the opportunity to go not
1005. 44:03sure where I'd go but I'd go and I was
1006. 44:05walking away from the flat first thing I
1007. 44:08did was I I pulled out my phone and I
1008. 44:10called the police and I said I'm not
1009. 44:12sure what to do but I know that I can't
1010. 44:14go back there you know they said go to
1011. 44:15the police station we're going to tell
1012. 44:17them that you're coming and that you
1013. 44:18feel unsafe so I kind of put my phone on
1014. 44:20something and just stuck it in my bag
1015. 44:22cuz I knew that they would call me and I
1016. 44:24I kind of feel it
1017. 44:25vibrating oh Str like my anxiety never
1018. 44:28was off the
1019. 44:31chart Simon left Lighthouse less than a
1020. 44:34year ago he's never spoken to anyone
1021. 44:37even connected with the group
1022. 44:39[Music]
1023. 44:42since we obviously wanted to put our
1024. 44:45allegations to Lighthouse but before
1025. 44:47that we had a few more pieces of our
1026. 44:49investigation to put together firstly
1027. 44:52Paul's claims that he was a millionaire
1028. 44:54in South Africa it took me 10 years for
1029. 44:5714 to 24 before I made my first million
1030. 44:59and then took me 20 from 24 to 35 before
1031. 45:02I left the country to produce about 100
1032. 45:04million it's one reason people trusted
1033. 45:07him as a mentor as an
1034. 45:10inspiration so we had a South African
1035. 45:12investigative journalists look into
1036. 45:14those claims who found three businesses
1037. 45:16he ran there hello can you hear me hey
1038. 45:19his companies themselves there are no
1039. 45:23properties registered under them or any
1040. 45:26kind of assets their U business
1041. 45:30addresses are usually uh residential
1042. 45:33areas essentially uh flats that Paul
1043. 45:37rented out in Durban we were able to
1044. 45:39speak to anyone that knew him that met
1045. 45:42him yeah yeah his former land lady
1046. 45:45remembered uh you know Paul as a kind of
1047. 45:49colorful character he was always trying
1048. 45:52out this uh get rich quick schemes he
1049. 45:55ran one
1050. 45:57of his businesses out of her flat but
1051. 46:00she also remembered Paul was was
1052. 46:02struggling in fact to pay rent on time
1053. 46:05that's interesting so we have a
1054. 46:07recording of
1055. 46:09Paul saying between the ages of 24 and
1056. 46:1335 he produced about 100
1057. 46:17million that Katherine that is
1058. 46:20absolutely it it it can never be true it
1059. 46:23would not have been possible for someone
1060. 46:26running Millions to have not a single
1061. 46:30asset in South Africa none of these
1062. 46:33businesses have any kind of uh profile
1063. 46:36and this is a person who then you know
1064. 46:39struggles to pay his rent on time Paul
1065. 46:42seems to have been just an average Joe
1066. 46:44trying his luck in different kinds of
1067. 46:50businesses we've been told that those in
1068. 46:53Lighthouse are in terrible debt we were
1069. 46:55able to find evidence
1070. 46:57we found 17 County Court judgments
1071. 47:00against current members of the team for
1072. 47:02unpaid debts totaling over
1073. 47:0687,000 £20,000 of them are for J Singh
1074. 47:10Paul War well he has none of these kind
1075. 47:13of
1076. 47:14[Music]
1077. 47:16debts we found Paul's very nice
1078. 47:19five-bedroom house with a sauner half an
1079. 47:21acre and a Range Rover outside with a
1080. 47:24private number plate whilst he lives in
1081. 47:26the this rented Place many Lighthouse
1082. 47:29team members live all together in shared
1083. 47:31houses hi hi there is that better Juliet
1084. 47:35rented a six-bedroom house out to just
1085. 47:37poor War she was told he would have
1086. 47:39guests staying but ended up with around
1087. 47:42eight Lighthouse team members living
1088. 47:44there when they left she was flooded
1089. 47:46with letters they were all to do with
1090. 47:50these people who were living there who
1091. 47:52owed money they were just pouring in
1092. 47:55every single day when I was living back
1093. 47:58there I got a knock on the door from
1094. 48:01this guy they were tracking down guy
1095. 48:04called J
1096. 48:05Singh and he said to me he owes money
1097. 48:09and I said listen I rented this house to
1098. 48:12these people it was Wild West here every
1099. 48:16single bedroom had been turned into what
1100. 48:18I would deem as a bed sitting room there
1101. 48:20were things like kettles in the bedrooms
1102. 48:23uh chest freezer full of meat up in the
1103. 48:26the bedroom pots and pans in the main um
1104. 48:29bathroom I said they shouldn't have been
1105. 48:31living here I gave them Paul War's
1106. 48:33address I would suggest you contact
1107. 48:37[Applause]
1108. 48:37[Music]
1109. 48:40him we also looked into Paul's claims of
1110. 48:43being very close with Steven cvy author
1111. 48:46of The Seven Habits of Highly Effective
1112. 48:48People cvy called me a [ __ ] Mountain
1113. 48:52he said you got to patch some M say
1114. 48:53you're [ __ ]
1115. 48:54Mountain Steven cvy died in 2012 but I
1116. 48:58contacted his company Franklin cvy where
1117. 49:01many employees still there used to work
1118. 49:03with Steven every day they told us we
1119. 49:07are not aware of any relationship
1120. 49:09between Steven R cvy or Franklin cvy and
1121. 49:12Paul
1122. 49:14[Music]
1123. 49:16War something else that kept coming up
1124. 49:19we had multiple people who've been close
1125. 49:22to poor War tell us he liked to show
1126. 49:24people videos of him having sex with
1127. 49:27women I just said please I don't want to
1128. 49:29see that and he made me look at this I
1129. 49:32was horrified absolutely horrified I
1130. 49:35felt really
1131. 49:39[Music]
1132. 49:48violated and then something totally
1133. 49:51unexpected happened we found out about a
1134. 49:54secret investigation into light house
1135. 49:57ordered by the UK Secretary of State for
1136. 50:03business Lighthouse were being taken to
1137. 50:05court and this document gives the
1138. 50:08reasons government investigators say
1139. 50:10Lighthouse should be shut
1140. 50:13down one failure to cooperate lack of
1141. 50:17transparency failure to preserve
1142. 50:19maintain and or deliver up adequate
1143. 50:22accounting records the investigator has
1144. 50:24written to Mr W on a number of occasions
1145. 50:27he has failed to attend at least five
1146. 50:29scheduled
1147. 50:31interviews it really is and it'll be a
1148. 50:33waste of your resources to set deadlines
1149. 50:35based on your urgencies and not our
1150. 50:38situation please be advised that no
1151. 50:40amount of warnings and threats will
1152. 50:42change this that's that's an email
1153. 50:46to the investigators for the Secretary
1154. 50:49of State two lack of commercial proerty
1155. 50:52false and or misleading accounts they
1156. 50:56they've been able to find some stuff
1157. 50:57that we couldn't get to most
1158. 50:59significantly the
1159. 51:01money we could see that almost 2.5
1160. 51:05million had been paid into Lighthouse
1161. 51:08bank account and between March 2018 and
1162. 51:11July
1163. 51:122022 more than 1.1 million had been paid
1164. 51:16out to Paul War Paul argues this is
1165. 51:20because he put the most in
1166. 51:25[Applause]
1167. 51:28and then came ligh House's day in
1168. 51:31court Paul War arrived with another 22
1169. 51:34people from
1170. 51:36Lighthouse Jeff and Dorne came
1171. 51:39[Music]
1172. 51:40too and 5 hours later a judge shuts down
1173. 51:45lighthouse in the public interest by
1174. 51:48this stage we had invited poor war and
1175. 51:50joning for interview and sent the group
1176. 51:53120 allegations in writing it was time
1177. 51:57to talk to them Paul's there hi Paul how
1178. 52:00do you feel about being closed down shut
1179. 52:02down in the public interest it it is in
1180. 52:04my interest it's totally I've been
1181. 52:05trying to shut it down for a while so
1182. 52:06you've been trying to shut it down I've
1183. 52:08been trying to shut it down for a while
1184. 52:09not the court well the court too so we
1185. 52:11work it together on this right so so
1186. 52:13we've shut it down a court has said
1187. 52:15you're working against the public
1188. 52:16interest well well those are the issues
1189. 52:18we will deal with reputationally after
1190. 52:20this you going to carry on yes we are
1191. 52:21carrying on how do you feel Paul about
1192. 52:23the fact that so many people think
1193. 52:25you're running a cult we're not running
1194. 52:26a cult cuz they don't know what a cult
1195. 52:28is they don't know I tell you if you ask
1196. 52:30them what's the difference between a
1197. 52:31cult and a community that supports
1198. 52:34people they wouldn't be able to tell you
1199. 52:36why do you think so many people say it
1200. 52:37because they they're slurring us they're
1201. 52:38smearing us that's exactly what they do
1202. 52:40these parents are child abusers that you
1203. 52:42supporting and you supported Jimmy
1204. 52:44Seville you you okay supported Jimmy
1205. 52:47Seville and his pedophilia you're going
1206. 52:48to take that out you're going to keep it
1207. 52:49in Come Close why you Peter F
1208. 52:53supporter why Paul have you contacted
1209. 52:56people fo's employers who've criticized
1210. 52:59you why have you because because because
1211. 53:02of my people people that work with us
1212. 53:05we're going around on Reddit like the
1213. 53:07foul red outs they were on that
1214. 53:09pedophilia site I would want to know
1215. 53:11that that's how my people or people I
1216. 53:13work with or employee handles their
1217. 53:15problems and and and the companies are
1218. 53:16grateful for us telling them some people
1219. 53:18been fired for this who's been fired you
1220. 53:20go and find out I'm I'm not it's data
1221. 53:23protected I can't tell you I can't tell
1222. 53:25you that you could just tell me that not
1223. 53:27protected okay fine we've sent you all
1224. 53:30of our allegations in huge detail and
1225. 53:32you've not responded to any of them well
1226. 53:35that's well there's a reason for that
1227. 53:36why is that because I want to know the
1228. 53:38context of what those things are where
1229. 53:39do they come from a lot of it is just
1230. 53:40absolutely nonsense I am responding I'm
1231. 53:42responding I'm responding I'm responding
1232. 53:43with our own documentaries with our own
1233. 53:46videos we doing it do you think given
1234. 53:49the level of criticism and given the
1235. 53:52level of people who are deeply unhappy
1236. 53:55with their treatment at lighthouse
1237. 53:56it is how many people are deeply unhappy
1238. 53:58with the treatment of latas here they
1239. 53:59all are how many are deeply unhappy
1240. 54:02would you like to talk she said all
1241. 54:03these people that are deeply unhappy aw
1242. 54:05aw a go come on you will tell me tell me
1243. 54:09tell me what youd like to say you're
1244. 54:10here how many of you uny she really
1245. 54:14desperately wants one of you to be
1246. 54:15deeply
1247. 54:16unhappy okay please tell her for the for
1248. 54:19for for the god of Wales please ask her
1249. 54:22thank you we had enough no comment ful
1250. 54:24appreciate that the people currently in
1251. 54:26com like house yeah this is going
1252. 54:29nowhere this is going nowhere do you
1253. 54:30think it is right for us to investigate
1254. 54:33given the level of complaints there are
1255. 54:35about you of course but you must receive
1256. 54:37the facts and true and fair and compl
1257. 54:40you're getting them they're coming
1258. 54:42coming have a good time send us the
1259. 54:44facts Jay can I ask your reaction to the
1260. 54:47shutting down of Lighthouse it's not
1261. 54:49surprising do you agree it's working
1262. 54:51against the public interest then no
1263. 54:53because I'm standing here there's many
1264. 54:55many people standing here
1265. 54:57actually benefited and you guys have
1266. 54:58only spoken to the people who have got
1267. 55:01some a vendetta why did you tell Jeff
1268. 55:04that the price of being an associate was
1269. 55:06going to increase so much and that
1270. 55:08wasn't the case we were about to expand
1271. 55:11so you told Jeff we've got the recording
1272. 55:14share the got it as well share the
1273. 55:16recording with you the price of being an
1274. 55:17associate elect has never actually
1275. 55:19increased so do you agree that was a
1276. 55:21pressurized sales technique Jay no it
1277. 55:23wasn't was
1278. 55:24a now
1279. 55:27done would you like to say
1280. 55:29anything everyone's allowed to have
1281. 55:31their
1282. 55:46say being part of Lighthouse isn't
1283. 55:49something you forget that you can just
1284. 55:51move on from it changes you I'm nearly
1285. 55:5540 years old this is not how I imagined
1286. 55:58my life being but working hard each day
1287. 56:01to to recover to heal to to to to
1288. 56:03rebuild my life and I will well I think
1289. 56:06perhaps the average person let's say
1290. 56:08look at a group at lighthous and look at
1291. 56:09and think well that would never happen
1292. 56:11to me it can happen to
1293. 56:14anyone if you could speak to your
1294. 56:17daughter now what would you like to say
1295. 56:19to
1296. 56:20her uh forgive me for everything I'm
1297. 56:23saying if you think you know that I'm
1298. 56:25trying to do it hurt you because I'm not
1299. 56:28uh I'm doing it because I think it's the
1300. 56:30last my last chance to save
1301. 56:34you am I glad I stuck with him yeah 100%
1302. 56:37cuz he's back to being like Jeff we're
1303. 56:39trying to get everything back to normal
1304. 56:40the best we can we've just got a puppy
1305. 56:43and Jeff's back to sailing we've just
1306. 56:46got accepted on our first home together
1307. 56:49which won't be getting sold to be given
1308. 56:51to a
1309. 56:55cult are you telling people I was in a
1310. 56:58cult well me well this
1311. 57:02yeah um I do I find it hard cuz it's uh
1312. 57:06it's
1313. 57:07embarrassing the first person I
1314. 57:09told
1315. 57:12um was my was my friend James who at the
1316. 57:16time I didn't actually know James that
1317. 57:18well I was just waiting for a point with
1318. 57:20him and
1319. 57:22uh I just sort of came out with it I
1320. 57:25said I've been part of this weird thing
1321. 57:27and looks like it looks like a
1322. 57:28cult so yeah I do find it quite hard to
1323. 57:31say but I do say it
1324. 57:35[Music]
1325. 57:56[Music]
1326. 58:01walk in
1327. 58:04silence don't walk away